April 5, 2025 • 30 mins
What happens when the wine you use to take the edge off becomes the very thing keeping you on edge? Julie Lively, alcohol freedom coach and This Naked Mind coach, shares her powerful journey from being caught in mummy wine culture to discovering true freedom beyond the bottle.
With four children in six years and a frequently-traveling husband, Julie's nightly wine ritual seemed like the perfect escape—until it wasn't. Without experiencing a dramatic "rock bottom" moment, Julie recognised something more subtle but equally powerful: the drinking she used to alleviate isolation was actually deepening it. After two years on what she calls the "drinking-no-drinking rollercoaster," she finally found her lasting day one.
This conversation goes beyond the typical sobriety narrative to explore what truly happens in our bodies and brains when we use alcohol as our primary relaxation tool. Julie shares practical, science-backed techniques for regulating your nervous system without alcohol, from the powerful 4-7-8 breathing method taught to Navy SEALs to simple sensory grounding practices that take just minutes.
Whether you're questioning your relationship with alcohol or simply curious about more effective relaxation techniques, this conversation offers practical tools for creating a life where you don't need to take the edge off—because you're no longer living on edge.
Jullie's website: https://julielivelycoaching.com/
MEG
Web: https://www.meganwebb.com.au/
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Unwined Bookclub: https://www.alcoholfreedom.com.au/unwinedbookclub
ConnectAF group coaching: https://www.elizaparkinson.com/groupcoaching
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Web: https://isabellaferguson.com.au
Insta: @alcoholcounsellorisabella
Bi-Yearly 6-Week Small Group Challenges: Learn more: https://www.isabellaferguson.com.au/feb-2025-challenge
Free Do I Have A Drinking Problem 3 x Video Series: https://resources.isabellaferguson.com.au/offers/JTFFgjJL/checkout
Free HOW DO I STOP DRINKING SO MUCH Masterclass: https://resources.isabellaferguson.com.au/offers/7fvkb3FF/checkout
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi guys and welcome to Not Drinking Today podcast.
Today I have Julie Lively withme.
Julie's an alcohol freedomcoach and a fellow this Naked
Mind coach.
It's so cool to have you here,julie, welcome.
Thanks so much for having mehere today, pleasure.
Would you be able to start bytelling everyone about how you
got to where you are now?
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Yeah, absolutely, I think, like a lot of women who
find themselves drinking alittle bit more than they would
like.
You know, I started out, youknow, in college just kind of
normal, you know party ordrinker, and then just kind of
got really sucked into in thatwhole mommy wine culture.
I have four kids in six yearsand my husband was always
traveling and so I was always onmy own and I could not wait
(00:44):
till the end of the day where Icould relax with that glass of
wine.
And one turned into two and um,and sometimes three, and uh, it
just, it just kind of becamejust part of my life and it it
would just, it also just seemedreally normal because that's
what we moms did, right,everything is revolving wine.
It's five o'clock and I'mcooking dinner and I crack open
(01:06):
that bottle of wine and I pourthat glass and I send a picture
of it to my friend.
I'm like cheers, hey, do you,do you have your glass of wine?
And again, it just seemedreally really normal.
And, um, you know, then thenkind of fast forward, my husband
and I we split up about 10years ago and so, uh, you know,
I was in a situation where, youknow, I often was with my kids
alone a lot anyway, and thenwith the separation of us I
(01:29):
didn't have that.
You know, daddy walked in thedoor the kids are yours, I can
relax.
Then I really really was like,wow, I need something to really
help me relax and unwind at theend of the day.
And you know, we didn't havekind of that traditional
schedule the Wednesday, everyother weekend kind of thing,
because he did travel so much.
So my times that were my ownwere kind of last minute like oh
(01:50):
, by the way, I'm here, I cantake the kids, and I would find
myself going, oh gosh, thankgoodness, and I would get my
bottle of wine and I would drinkit and I'd be like, you know,
the next day I'd wake up and Ididn't sleep well and I over
drank and I'm like what, what amI doing?
This really isn't working.
But that cycle just kind ofcontinued.
And I think you know, for me Inever had any rock bottom
(02:12):
moments, but I had these rockbottom feelings there were.
There were two in particularthat I could really think of.
That that changed thetrajectory of like this is not
sustainable.
One was it was kind of towardsthe end of the pandemic.
As I mentioned, I've got.
I have four kids and six yearsand my youngest daughter has
Down syndrome and so my threeolder kids.
They were, you know, kind ofout and about and starting to
(02:34):
get back into society and doingthings and working and seeing
their friends.
And my youngest daughter and Iwe were home alone again and
very isolated and it was one ofthose things where it's like,
well, I guess it doesn't reallymatter if I have another glass
of wine, Like we've got nothinggoing on tomorrow anyway.
It doesn't really matter how Ifeel.
And I just kept on looking atmyself like this is your life,
(02:56):
like is this really how you wantto spend your life?
Thinking I don't have anythinggoing on tomorrow, anyway, I
might as well have some morewine.
It doesn't matter how I feel.
And you know, as my nest startedto empty more and I didn't have
those built-in cushions where Ihad to drive my kids and pick
them up at nine o'clock at nightand do all these different
things Again, all those built-inbumpers that we have, that so
(03:18):
many of us women have around ourdrinking, started going away.
And you know, again sitting onthat couch again like having
another glass of wine, thinkingas my nest is emptying like this
is my life, is this really howI'm going to spend my life?
And what I noticed for me wasthe isolation that I was feeling
(03:42):
by.
You know, my nest is emptying alittle bit, but I have my one,
my special needs daughter, homewith me and so I'm just going to
drink through it.
The drinking was causing.
The drinking that I was doingto help alleviate the feeling of
isolation was driving thefeeling of isolation, and so I
was just kind of stuck in thiscycle and I just realized, like
(04:02):
this is this, this is notsustainable, this is not who I
am, this is not who I want to be, and it was time for for a real
, real change.
And so, you know, for two yearsI was kind of on the drinking
no drinking roller coaster.
I did a bunch of, you know dryJanuaries and you know free,
freebie, 30 day alcoholexperiments, and I did programs
(04:22):
with Laura McC, programs withLaura McCowan and Rachel Hart
and Annie Grace and all the, allthose different things.
Read all the quit lick, listento the podcast and you know,
after nearly two years of that,I'm like, okay, this is it, I'm
done.
And so signed up for another,the Snaked Mind program, and I
decided at that time that mylast and final day one was
(04:45):
November 28th, and it was theSaturday or I'm sorry, it was a
Sunday after the Saturday, afterthe Thursday of Thanksgiving,
and I purposely picked it.
Then that whole week ofThanksgiving, I'm like this is
it, this is it.
This is my last wine.
And I was a Chardonnay drinker.
This is it, this is my lastwine.
(05:05):
And I was a Chardonnay drinker.
And it was interesting becausethe more I was, you know, kind
of trying to wean off of this,the more I was realizing.
And when you read all thequitlet and understand, like, do
I really even like the taste ofthis?
And I'm like, yeah, I don'tlike this one.
And so I buy another bottle,yeah, I don't really like this
one.
And so I found myself reallydrinking a lot that last week to
get it all in.
And so, by you know.
(05:26):
So Thanksgiving came and went.
I went out for dinner with somefriends on a Saturday night,
shared my last bottle of wine,and then Sunday I was off to the
races, and so that was, youknow, three years and almost
three months ago, to the date ofthe recording of this podcast.
And yeah, there was, there wasjust no looking back
Congratulations.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
And yeah, there was just no looking back
Congratulations, and I relate toeverything you just said.
You know the kids, the relaxing, having a drink after that day
like a reward and just to numbout.
You know it's exhausting havingthe kids and it's so common,
(06:01):
it's that mummy wine culture.
And you know when you saidafter you'd split up with your
husband and he'd have the kids,it was like a yes.
When my kids weren't here, likemine, didn't go to my exes, but
if they stayed at grandma's orsomething, to me that was like
celebrate, no one can watch me.
(06:22):
I can do what I want, but justlike you, celebrate, no one can
watch me.
I can do what I want, but justlike you, that isolation just
grew.
You know, the drinking to escapethe loneliness actually brought
it on, which happens to a lotof us.
But I did have that mentalityas well of in COVID.
But also, if I didn't have thekids, it doesn't matter.
If I feel like crap tomorrow,just doesn't matter.
(06:43):
I mean, I had that as well andit's just thinking back.
I just think, oh, I think thatwas a big thing for me as well,
to realize that this is not whatI want from my life.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Exactly.
And it was interesting becausefor those two years, whenever I
do these dry challenges and havesome success, and I always felt
so much better when I didn'tdrink, but I always went back to
it.
And so, like so many people, Idid all the rules, like, okay,
I'm not going to drink on theweek, I'm only going to drink on
weekends, which actually workedreally, really, really well
until 4th of July was on aMonday and I had a firm rule
(07:15):
like I don't drink during theweek.
So then I'm like, okay, so 4thof July is on a Monday, so maybe
if I drink Sunday and Mondayinstead of Friday and Saturday,
but there's something going onFriday, so now what do I do?
And so again, those rulesstarted messing with me.
And then I went away to awedding and it was a, it was a
four day party during the weekand I totally broke it.
And then I just, I, just I cameback and I just continued on
(07:37):
drinking, like rules work really, really, really, really well
until they don't.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
Oh yeah, yeah, I totally hear you.
I had the same rules and thenexactly, and once you did it, in
my mind it was like, oh well,free for all you know.
So yeah, and I think that's thething about moderating or or
keeping it, you know, to acertain day is you just think so
much about it?
It's so the thinking aboutdrinking is more painful than
(08:04):
anything, you know.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Yeah, and that was one of those things I didn't
realize until I was on the otherside of alcohol, how much my
life was consumed about.
Am I drinking tonight or notdrinking tonight?
If I am, how much am I drinking?
You know, then, that I don'tknow.
If you did that like I woulddrink at night and then the next
morning I would open the fridgeand I would see the bottle of
wine and there'd be a little bitleft, and if I felt kind of
(08:28):
funny and I looked at him likeoh, why did I have that last bit
of wine?
And then you pour it outToday's the day, and then at
five o'clock I'm back buyinganother bottle of wine and again
, like you know, we're just likenormal people.
No DWI, no, you know, not, notthat, not that that.
Only normal people don't haveDWIs.
But you know you know what Imean.
(08:48):
Like like there was no rockbottom.
No, um, you know, brush withthe law, no brush with, like you
know, julie, you're going tolose your family, your kids are
really like none of that.
It was just like this normal um, you know, I was in a
relationship with somebody, um,kind of by the run of the time
that I was looking at changingmy relationship with alcohol and
(09:11):
he said you know what?
You don't drink a lot, but youdrink a lot Meaning.
I drink every single day two tothree glasses of wine.
And if I'm cooking dinner andhe'd be like, well, there's a
lot, a lot of wine gone, I'mlike, oh yeah, I had that dish
really, really quick, required alot, of a lot, a lot of wine to
make.
It was actually I was the onethat required a lot of wine to
make that dish.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Oh yeah, I'd have the excuse oh I need wine for
cooking, and I'd put a dash inand then, well, the bottle's for
me.
Yeah, totally Well, I drank alot, a lot, but towards the end,
but I still.
I didn't have that rock bottom,but I feared it.
I feared getting caught.
My biggest fear actually wasthat I'd be driving the kids to
(09:49):
school in the morning.
I didn't drink in the morning,but I'd be over the limit from
the night before and my biggestfear was that I'd be caught and
it would be public.
And then I was thinking aboutthe other day.
Actually, you know, that was abig reason I stopped.
And then I thought I juststopped trusting what was going
to happen.
I couldn't trust it wasn't evenso much myself.
(10:09):
I couldn't trust.
It wasn't even so much myself.
I couldn't trust the alcohol, Icouldn't trust.
And so I had to, I had to stop.
That was enough for me.
I didn't have to hit that rockbottom.
And I think it's important,especially for the mummy wine
culture, is to know that youdon't have to be an alcoholic,
you don't have to hit rockbottom it.
But it also grows with thetolerance grows.
(10:32):
So it's something that a lot ofpeople might think, oh, I don't
drink that.
You know I have a couple ofdrinks a night.
But if that doesn't feel rightto you, that's when you have a
look at it, because you wouldhave had the same as me, that
niggling voice.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
Yeah, it's just that voice in the back of my mind
like, yeah, there's something,this is not, even though it's
normal.
This isn't feeling normalanymore.
And it's interesting because Iwork with so many of my clients
are, you know, in that similarspace where you know they're
just drinking wine every night,like two to three glasses of
wine, and nobody would everthink that they are having a
problem or struggling.
But they just can't stop.
(11:09):
They might do a dry January,they might take a week off here
or there, they might reallyintentionally do that, but they
keep on going back and it's thatwhole thing.
It's like what is wrong with me?
And I'm not, I'm not gonna, I'mnot gonna go to, you know,
these AA meetings and declarethat I'm an alcoholic, like I'm,
it's in, it is.
It can be a really, reallytricky place.
(11:29):
And so I love working withthese women who was like, okay,
no, there's, there's nothingwrong with you, you are not an
alcoholic, you are just you, youare.
You know, we have justassociated those hardwired
associations between relaxationand alcohol and we just drive
that pathway deeper and deeperand deeper Every time.
We open up that bottle and pourit at the end of the day and go
(11:49):
ah, and it's so supported bysociety.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
And one of the things I've spoken about before was
because I work with childrenwith autism and it's emotionally
stressful, physical, all ofthat, and so it's a real thing
for people to say, oh, I need adrink, I'll go home and have a
drink, and that's absolutelyfine.
But for someone like me, thatwas a green light.
Oh, everyone's doing it, I'lldo it.
I'm the one that would come inhungover each day, though, you
(12:19):
know, but it it's.
It might for some people itmight be something.
They just say they might noteven go home and have that wine,
but for me it was like, well,there you go, it's normal, I'm
going to do it because I work ina hard job, you know, and it's
very supported by society.
I saw on Facebook we havevisuals for our kids and it
(12:41):
might say desk work first andthen choice.
It was one for adults Workfirst, then wine, and I just I
look at them now and I just go,ooh, that was an enabler to me.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Yeah, I know you.
Just you just think about howthe alcohol industry just has
marketed the hack out of mommywine culture drinking yeah,
holly Whitaker talks about it alot in her book Quit Like a
Woman.
If you recall that, love howthey took what they did with the
tobacco industry and gettingwomen to smoke.
(13:14):
They took that same methodologyto get women to drink.
And when I read that I'm likeyou get angry.
Like we're just a bunch ofpawns.
Yeah, and now we're pouringthis toxic, addictive substance
into our body.
Yeah, yeah, and now we're stuckwith it.
And now what's wrong with me?
How do I, how do we get rid ofit?
(13:35):
Like I've been using alcohol torelax for so long.
I've been using it as myrelaxer, my connector, my
soother, my all these things.
You know, I remember, and youmight remember this like you.
You, you get home again.
I'm four kids.
I've been at a school.
You know a school function andit's crazy, it's chaotic, like
my kids are all over, I geteverybody in and I walk and I
remember I'd walk in the doorand it's like seven o'clock at
night and I cannot get that winedown myself fast enough.
(13:57):
Oh, yeah, because I know thatthat is going to take the edge
off.
Now, not every night wasobviously like that.
Sometimes it's just like thatslow drip, just taking the edge
off, just taking the edge off,just taking the edge off.
And then, even on those nightswhen I don't need to take the
edge off because my body is justhabitually used to that,
because there's wine left overin the bottle from yesterday,
(14:18):
I'm pouring it to take the edgeoff, whether I needed it or not.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Yeah, exactly.
So what can I ask?
What do you do now forrelaxation?
Because this is a big thing.
You know my clients, ourlisteners worry about you know I
need it to switch off, I needit to relax.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
Yeah, that's a great question, that is such a great
question.
So so part of it is for for meand for a lot of people.
You know, we, we want thattransition, drink that five
o'clock something, but reallystarts with that.
So what am I going to drinkinstead?
And understanding that, that,that association that we have
with alcohol, some of it is justthat whole setting, like we see
(15:00):
, let me back up a little bit sothat that hardwired kind of
animal part of our brain, itdoesn't understand language, it
only understands sensations.
So our body is feeling, youknow, we're feeling anxiety,
we're feeling overwhelmed, we'refeeling all of're feeling
overwhelmed.
We're feeling all of that stuffand it's sending signals to our
brain and our brain goes oh, Iknow the answer, it's alcohol
(15:21):
and it's all hardwired.
So our logical thinking brainmight have said I'm not drinking
today.
But your, your hardwired,automated part of our brain,
says, oh, you're, I'm feelingthese sensations and this answer
, this is the answer and and atall costs, we are going to go
with that answer.
But the reality is part of thatrelaxation is, visually, your
body's seeing.
You're opening the cupboarddoor, you're pulling up that
(15:43):
glass of wine and your brain isalready going oh, here we go.
Here's relaxation.
Then you pour the bottle in andthen you drink that wine, you
drink the alcohol and thenalcohol does have that numbing
effect.
Your body's going, ah.
So you know, one of the firstthings that I always talk about
(16:03):
with my clients is like, okay,what are we going to put in our
glass instead?
Because we still want atransition drink, we still want
our body visually, we want tosee that glass, we want to pour
something, we want to tastesomething.
It just doesn't need to havealcohol in it.
So that's part of it and theother part of, in terms of
(16:23):
relaxation, there's so many likeamazing, beautiful adaptogenic
herbs, you know ashwagandha,althene, lemon balm.
You know, in the evening I usedto always have a glass of wine
and I'll have a nice cup of tea.
And again, because it issending messages to my brain
when I'm holding that cup, thecup is warm, I smell the tea,
the tea smells good, I taste thetea and it has just some nice
adaptogenic herbs, you know.
(16:44):
And then the other thing isjust like taking a look at what
is my life like during the dayand how can I put some things in
place to relax my nervoussystem that doesn't include wine
.
So so I don't get to thatpushing that, that, that tipping
point that says F, it, I don'treally care, I know the answer.
And so a lot of that is justreally starting our day with a
(17:07):
grounding, orienting, centering.
Like there's so many beautifulapps, like right now I'm using
the app called calm.
Yeah, and every day there's thedaily J and the daily calm and
um.
So just starting out ournervous system in a relaxed way
and then for me, understandingum, okay, as my nervous system
is getting over activated.
Okay, what do I need to do?
(17:28):
I need to bring it back in umthrough through breath work,
through just getting outside andthrowing a ball with my dog,
just moving into a differentroom, just changing the state
that we are in, because thereality is we're using alcohol
to change our state and we canuse our senses to change our
state.
We can use our breath.
Our breath is one of the mostpowerful tools that we have and
(17:51):
you might be familiar with thefour, seven, eight breath, where
you breathe in for four counts,you hold for seven, you exhale
for eight.
That was developed by Dr AndrewWeil and he teaches this to the
Navy SEALs to remain calm,focused and clear headed in the
heat of a mission.
So when you think about it, youknow, think about like we get
(18:12):
really over activated.
Our nervous system is on likehigh alert and we have trained
at that.
Alcohol brings it back down.
We can use that.
We can use that 478 breath fortwo or three minutes that takes
us from high alert to calmingourselves down and think about
it.
If you know you've got you'vegot these Navy SEALs.
They are on a mission and theycould be thinking and spiraling
(18:35):
about everything that could gowrong and be nervous and anxious
.
And you know their breathing isall over the map, their head is
all over the map, right, butthrough our breath that really
opens up that right side of ourbrain, our wise part of our
brain.
It settles down our nervoussystem so that they can stay in
laser focus action.
And that's the same type ofthing that we can do to stay in
(18:57):
laser focus action where ourright brain, our wise brain,
that prefrontal cortex that saysI'm not drinking today, that
prefrontal cortex that said wepoured the bottle of wine out
this morning and we are notgetting more, stays online.
Because what happens when we doget over activated.
When we do get completelyoverwhelmed, our prefrontal
(19:18):
cortex, our logical thinkingbrain, goes offline because it's
not required.
Our body is in like this, fightflight mode and the only thing
our body needs to do is, youknow, sending stress hormones to
either run, fight or collapse.
And there may not be theproverbial saber-toothed tiger
in our midst, but our body isfeeling like it is.
(19:40):
So breathwork is one of themost powerful things we can do.
So I guess, getting back to yourquestion of you, know what are
some of the key things.
First of all, it's juststarting out.
My day, calm, grounded In myevening routine is my wine down,
tea having, and I don't do itanymore.
But when I first started, youknow, every day, at you know
(20:03):
five o'clock or whatever time,that I was cooking dinner or
would have normally reached fora glass of wine, I grabbed that
same wine glass, I poured clubsoda, cranberry, some limes and
um, and that was my treat.
Right, because I still deserveda treat, I still deserved a
transition, right and um.
And then just making sure, likeI'm getting out in nature, I'm
(20:24):
moving all those ing anythingbut anything, ing any of the ing
activities except for drink ingyeah is so good for your
nervous system, so it again.
It's all about the nervoussystem.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Yes, I love all that and I do all of it.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
And the breathing is something I've really
incorporated into my life,exactly Because we need to.
You know, when we are stressingand overwhelming and all that
stuff is happening, we are outof our body.
Right, we are out of our body,we are spiraling on the past, we
are stressing about the futureand we are nowhere near anything
.
That's going on today.
And by taking that breath andnoticing that breath, noticing
(21:02):
how it feels, calms our heartrate, we can get back into our
body.
And so my favorite thing to dowhen I am in overwhelm, when I
am in a stress response is likeokay, take a deep breath.
Okay, what would a wise adultdo here?
I got a shift out of my leftside of my brain that is just
spiraling.
Take a breath.
And then I asked myself whatwould a wise adult do here?
(21:24):
And I think about that Okay,what's a wise adult do here?
All right, take another breath,settle in, get into the present
, settle, settle in.
What would a wise adult do here?
Speaker 1 (21:35):
okay, now go, be that wise adult yeah, love it, I
love that and it does.
It gives you that presence totune into that, you know.
So, yeah, so effective.
I love that.
I love the tea, I love the calmapp and and exercise like I'm
really into my pilates now, whenI was was drinking, this would
(21:56):
all make me go.
Oh, I can think of nothingworse, but honestly, I can think
of nothing better.
Now, and you and I are here tosay that's what happens, this
becomes it's my dopamine, it'smy.
It excites me, you know.
So there is a great, great lifeafter alcohol, because I just
(22:17):
know for people listening when Iwas drinking, I would just
cringe at everything, but it'sso good on this side.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
Oh, completely.
And the reality is like earlyon, when I wasn't drinking, when
people were saying, oh you know, just spend a couple minutes
and breathe, I'm like there'snothing, that two minutes of
breathing is going to do for me,because I'm like a go big or go
home type person.
Two minutes is going to donothing.
And it took me a while tounderstand, like, okay, it
actually is very, very powerful.
Just a couple of minutes, justa couple of minutes.
(22:48):
And now I've got in my office,I've got a little chase lounge
and I've got a weighted blanketand if I get really over
activated, I'll sit there, I'llput my weighted blanket on, I'll
just listen to just you know alittle five minute thing on the
call map.
Or just breathe, maybe makeyourself a cup of tea.
Just, I got to get back into mybody.
I got to get out of thatspirally thought pattern that is
(23:08):
really amping me up.
Get into my body, get into mybody, cause you know our where
we have the opportunity to takethat next best right step, to
take the best action is in thepresent, in our body, and most
of the time when we arespiraling and spinning, we are
in the past or we are in thefuture and we are nowhere near
(23:30):
today.
So by using those bodyexperiences of breathing, you
know there's I'm familiar withhavening.
Havening is that, that wholetouch, like when we start, we
start on our forehead and gothrough our cheeks and cross
over our collarbone and, youknow, like giving ourselves a
hug.
You know, for most people thesense of touch is really, really
(23:51):
calming to our nervous systemand to that that havening
practice is such a beautiful wayagain, just within a couple
minutes, to calm us down.
Because, again, remember, weuse alcohol to take the edge off
, just to take the edge off.
So if we can use a little bitof touch to take the edge off, a
nice little bit of tea to takethe edge off, a little bit of
breathing, just to take the edgeoff, enough to go, ah, okay now
(24:16):
I can face the rest of the day.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
Oh, totally, I love that.
Before I stopped drinking I wasreally into well, I wasn't into
it, but I kept telling myself Ihave to be able to meditate
Like I did meditation courses.
I hate meditating for an houror whatever.
These things are meditation.
Everything you're saying is aform of meditation.
It doesn't have to take long,and that's been the best thing
(24:40):
for me, because it is.
You know, that's exactly whatwe're doing.
We're calming our mind and thenour vagus nerve calms and it's
literally changed my life.
So I just love everything thatyou're saying.
It's so valuable and it works,it works, it does work.
Give it time as well.
Give it time Because, as I said, as you said, the deep breath,
(25:03):
it's like oh, come on, that'snot going to work, it's not
enough.
But when it becomes a practice,right, yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
And you use, it's like, oh, come on, that's not,
that's not going to work, it'snot enough.
But when it becomes a practice,right yeah, and you use it just
like, just just enough to takethe edge off Again.
Think about I'm using alcoholto take the edge off.
What do I need?
I just need to take the edgeoff just a second so that I can
take it.
Take a breath, okay, what, what, what's what's important now?
There's this acronym win.
What's important now?
There's this acronym WIN.
What's important now, what'sreally important now?
What's the next best?
(25:29):
Right, step, right.
And I totally get you with thatwhole thing of meditation,
because everybody's like, oh,you got to meditate, you got to
meditate, and like, after me,sitting here for 20 minutes to
think of nothing is never goingto happen and I'm not even going
to try.
But when we do these like shortlittle things, again, it's just
just to take the edge off, justto center us, just ground us a
little bit.
Meditation is not.
(25:51):
For some people it is, but forme it is not sitting there for
20 minutes not thinking aboutanything.
Mindfulness, for me it's takinga breath, it's listening to the
sounds.
What am I hearing?
It's feeling my fingertips.
It's wiggling my toes.
What do I smell?
What do I taste?
Visually, you know, lookingoutside.
(26:11):
Okay, let me find threeinstances of a color blue in my
room.
We got to use our body, oursenses, to tell our body that we
are safe.
And when I can look around inmy room and say there's three
different colors of blue, I cantouch my desk, I can touch my
chair and your body's like okay,you're okay, I know where you
(26:35):
are in space.
We're out of that spirally loop.
I'm in my body and it soundsreally kind of woo-woo or
whatever, but it but it's and Ithought it was, but it's
actually it's.
It's not, it works Like itreally, really works.
So anybody listening to herewho is like ready to shut this
off, saying this, this has gonea completely different direction
.
I really encourage you.
Um, you know these apps.
You know um, calm headspace,happier, all of these.
(26:56):
I think they most have like alike a seven day trial.
Download it, listen to threeminutes, just notice what you
know, um, cause it does make adifference.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Oh, absolutely, it does.
So, julie, where can peoplefind you and what do you offer?
Speaker 2 (27:11):
Yeah, so I have a private one-on-one coaching
practice.
You can find all theinformation about that at
julielivelycoachingcom, andlively is just like it's spelled
sounds L-I-V-E-L-Y,julielivelycoachingcom.
I also have recently launched agroup coaching program for
anybody that might be coming outof this Naked Minds Path
program.
You, if if that is you, you'llknow what I'm talking about.
(27:34):
If it's not you, that's OK, butit is an alternative for Path
Year Two and some, but it's areally great program for people
to find a place to land.
It's a great community.
We do a lot of really coolcontent and a lot of great work
and and yeah, that's it.
Oh, and one other thing, I dohave a special download for
(27:54):
anybody, if you're interested.
It's how the heck do I relaxwithout wine, and it's some
specific tips, tricks andtechniques on how to do that,
some of the things that I'vetalked about today, and it will
go a little bit deeper for you,because the reality is, if we
are removing something that hashelped us relax, we have to
replace it with things thatreally do help us relax.
(28:16):
Otherwise, we are just like inthis netherland, going, oh my
gosh, what just happened?
And then you and you will bemuch more predisposition to go
back to drinking.
So we've got to look at ways toreplace what that drink was
doing for you.
So if you're interested, it'llbe in the show notes.
How the heck do I relax withoutwine?
Speaker 1 (28:34):
Click on that and we'll send that to you.
That's so cool.
Thanks so much, Julie.
It's been really lovely havingyou on and having a great chat
with you.
Thank you Likewise.
Thanks so much too.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
We'll talk to you soon.
Bye.
Hi guys and welcome to Not Drinking Today podcast.
Today I have Julie Lively withme.
Julie's an alcohol freedomcoach and a fellow this Naked
Mind coach.
It's so cool to have you here,julie, welcome.
Thanks so much for having mehere today, pleasure.
Would you be able to start bytelling everyone about how you
got to where you are now?
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Yeah, absolutely, I think, like a lot of women who
find themselves drinking alittle bit more than they would
like.
You know, I started out, youknow, in college just kind of
normal, you know party ordrinker, and then just kind of
got really sucked into in thatwhole mommy wine culture.
I have four kids in six yearsand my husband was always
traveling and so I was always onmy own and I could not wait
(00:44):
till the end of the day where Icould relax with that glass of
wine.
And one turned into two and um,and sometimes three, and uh, it
just, it just kind of becamejust part of my life and it it
would just, it also just seemedreally normal because that's
what we moms did, right,everything is revolving wine.
It's five o'clock and I'mcooking dinner and I crack open
(01:06):
that bottle of wine and I pourthat glass and I send a picture
of it to my friend.
I'm like cheers, hey, do you,do you have your glass of wine?
And again, it just seemedreally really normal.
And, um, you know, then thenkind of fast forward, my husband
and I we split up about 10years ago and so, uh, you know,
I was in a situation where, youknow, I often was with my kids
alone a lot anyway, and thenwith the separation of us I
(01:29):
didn't have that.
You know, daddy walked in thedoor the kids are yours, I can
relax.
Then I really really was like,wow, I need something to really
help me relax and unwind at theend of the day.
And you know, we didn't havekind of that traditional
schedule the Wednesday, everyother weekend kind of thing,
because he did travel so much.
So my times that were my ownwere kind of last minute like oh
(01:50):
, by the way, I'm here, I cantake the kids, and I would find
myself going, oh gosh, thankgoodness, and I would get my
bottle of wine and I would drinkit and I'd be like, you know,
the next day I'd wake up and Ididn't sleep well and I over
drank and I'm like what, what amI doing?
This really isn't working.
But that cycle just kind ofcontinued.
And I think you know, for me Inever had any rock bottom
(02:12):
moments, but I had these rockbottom feelings there were.
There were two in particularthat I could really think of.
That that changed thetrajectory of like this is not
sustainable.
One was it was kind of towardsthe end of the pandemic.
As I mentioned, I've got.
I have four kids and six yearsand my youngest daughter has
Down syndrome and so my threeolder kids.
They were, you know, kind ofout and about and starting to
(02:34):
get back into society and doingthings and working and seeing
their friends.
And my youngest daughter and Iwe were home alone again and
very isolated and it was one ofthose things where it's like,
well, I guess it doesn't reallymatter if I have another glass
of wine, Like we've got nothinggoing on tomorrow anyway.
It doesn't really matter how Ifeel.
And I just kept on looking atmyself like this is your life,
(02:56):
like is this really how you wantto spend your life?
Thinking I don't have anythinggoing on tomorrow, anyway, I
might as well have some morewine.
It doesn't matter how I feel.
And you know, as my nest startedto empty more and I didn't have
those built-in cushions where Ihad to drive my kids and pick
them up at nine o'clock at nightand do all these different
things Again, all those built-inbumpers that we have, that so
(03:18):
many of us women have around ourdrinking, started going away.
And you know, again sitting onthat couch again like having
another glass of wine, thinkingas my nest is emptying like this
is my life, is this really howI'm going to spend my life?
And what I noticed for me wasthe isolation that I was feeling
(03:42):
by.
You know, my nest is emptying alittle bit, but I have my one,
my special needs daughter, homewith me and so I'm just going to
drink through it.
The drinking was causing.
The drinking that I was doingto help alleviate the feeling of
isolation was driving thefeeling of isolation, and so I
was just kind of stuck in thiscycle and I just realized, like
(04:02):
this is this, this is notsustainable, this is not who I
am, this is not who I want to be, and it was time for for a real
, real change.
And so, you know, for two yearsI was kind of on the drinking
no drinking roller coaster.
I did a bunch of, you know dryJanuaries and you know free,
freebie, 30 day alcoholexperiments, and I did programs
(04:22):
with Laura McC, programs withLaura McCowan and Rachel Hart
and Annie Grace and all the, allthose different things.
Read all the quit lick, listento the podcast and you know,
after nearly two years of that,I'm like, okay, this is it, I'm
done.
And so signed up for another,the Snaked Mind program, and I
decided at that time that mylast and final day one was
(04:45):
November 28th, and it was theSaturday or I'm sorry, it was a
Sunday after the Saturday, afterthe Thursday of Thanksgiving,
and I purposely picked it.
Then that whole week ofThanksgiving, I'm like this is
it, this is it.
This is my last wine.
And I was a Chardonnay drinker.
This is it, this is my lastwine.
(05:05):
And I was a Chardonnay drinker.
And it was interesting becausethe more I was, you know, kind
of trying to wean off of this,the more I was realizing.
And when you read all thequitlet and understand, like, do
I really even like the taste ofthis?
And I'm like, yeah, I don'tlike this one.
And so I buy another bottle,yeah, I don't really like this
one.
And so I found myself reallydrinking a lot that last week to
get it all in.
And so, by you know.
(05:26):
So Thanksgiving came and went.
I went out for dinner with somefriends on a Saturday night,
shared my last bottle of wine,and then Sunday I was off to the
races, and so that was, youknow, three years and almost
three months ago, to the date ofthe recording of this podcast.
And yeah, there was, there wasjust no looking back
Congratulations.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
And yeah, there was just no looking back
Congratulations, and I relate toeverything you just said.
You know the kids, the relaxing, having a drink after that day
like a reward and just to numbout.
You know it's exhausting havingthe kids and it's so common,
(06:01):
it's that mummy wine culture.
And you know when you saidafter you'd split up with your
husband and he'd have the kids,it was like a yes.
When my kids weren't here, likemine, didn't go to my exes, but
if they stayed at grandma's orsomething, to me that was like
celebrate, no one can watch me.
(06:22):
I can do what I want, but justlike you, celebrate, no one can
watch me.
I can do what I want, but justlike you, that isolation just
grew.
You know, the drinking to escapethe loneliness actually brought
it on, which happens to a lotof us.
But I did have that mentalityas well of in COVID.
But also, if I didn't have thekids, it doesn't matter.
If I feel like crap tomorrow,just doesn't matter.
(06:43):
I mean, I had that as well andit's just thinking back.
I just think, oh, I think thatwas a big thing for me as well,
to realize that this is not whatI want from my life.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Exactly.
And it was interesting becausefor those two years, whenever I
do these dry challenges and havesome success, and I always felt
so much better when I didn'tdrink, but I always went back to
it.
And so, like so many people, Idid all the rules, like, okay,
I'm not going to drink on theweek, I'm only going to drink on
weekends, which actually workedreally, really, really well
until 4th of July was on aMonday and I had a firm rule
(07:15):
like I don't drink during theweek.
So then I'm like, okay, so 4thof July is on a Monday, so maybe
if I drink Sunday and Mondayinstead of Friday and Saturday,
but there's something going onFriday, so now what do I do?
And so again, those rulesstarted messing with me.
And then I went away to awedding and it was a, it was a
four day party during the weekand I totally broke it.
And then I just, I, just I cameback and I just continued on
(07:37):
drinking, like rules work really, really, really, really well
until they don't.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
Oh yeah, yeah, I totally hear you.
I had the same rules and thenexactly, and once you did it, in
my mind it was like, oh well,free for all you know.
So yeah, and I think that's thething about moderating or or
keeping it, you know, to acertain day is you just think so
much about it?
It's so the thinking aboutdrinking is more painful than
(08:04):
anything, you know.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Yeah, and that was one of those things I didn't
realize until I was on the otherside of alcohol, how much my
life was consumed about.
Am I drinking tonight or notdrinking tonight?
If I am, how much am I drinking?
You know, then, that I don'tknow.
If you did that like I woulddrink at night and then the next
morning I would open the fridgeand I would see the bottle of
wine and there'd be a little bitleft, and if I felt kind of
(08:28):
funny and I looked at him likeoh, why did I have that last bit
of wine?
And then you pour it outToday's the day, and then at
five o'clock I'm back buyinganother bottle of wine and again
, like you know, we're just likenormal people.
No DWI, no, you know, not, notthat, not that that.
Only normal people don't haveDWIs.
But you know you know what Imean.
(08:48):
Like like there was no rockbottom.
No, um, you know, brush withthe law, no brush with, like you
know, julie, you're going tolose your family, your kids are
really like none of that.
It was just like this normal um, you know, I was in a
relationship with somebody, um,kind of by the run of the time
that I was looking at changingmy relationship with alcohol and
(09:11):
he said you know what?
You don't drink a lot, but youdrink a lot Meaning.
I drink every single day two tothree glasses of wine.
And if I'm cooking dinner andhe'd be like, well, there's a
lot, a lot of wine gone, I'mlike, oh yeah, I had that dish
really, really quick, required alot, of a lot, a lot of wine to
make.
It was actually I was the onethat required a lot of wine to
make that dish.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Oh yeah, I'd have the excuse oh I need wine for
cooking, and I'd put a dash inand then, well, the bottle's for
me.
Yeah, totally Well, I drank alot, a lot, but towards the end,
but I still.
I didn't have that rock bottom,but I feared it.
I feared getting caught.
My biggest fear actually wasthat I'd be driving the kids to
(09:49):
school in the morning.
I didn't drink in the morning,but I'd be over the limit from
the night before and my biggestfear was that I'd be caught and
it would be public.
And then I was thinking aboutthe other day.
Actually, you know, that was abig reason I stopped.
And then I thought I juststopped trusting what was going
to happen.
I couldn't trust it wasn't evenso much myself.
(10:09):
I couldn't trust.
It wasn't even so much myself.
I couldn't trust the alcohol, Icouldn't trust.
And so I had to, I had to stop.
That was enough for me.
I didn't have to hit that rockbottom.
And I think it's important,especially for the mummy wine
culture, is to know that youdon't have to be an alcoholic,
you don't have to hit rockbottom it.
But it also grows with thetolerance grows.
(10:32):
So it's something that a lot ofpeople might think, oh, I don't
drink that.
You know I have a couple ofdrinks a night.
But if that doesn't feel rightto you, that's when you have a
look at it, because you wouldhave had the same as me, that
niggling voice.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
Yeah, it's just that voice in the back of my mind
like, yeah, there's something,this is not, even though it's
normal.
This isn't feeling normalanymore.
And it's interesting because Iwork with so many of my clients
are, you know, in that similarspace where you know they're
just drinking wine every night,like two to three glasses of
wine, and nobody would everthink that they are having a
problem or struggling.
But they just can't stop.
(11:09):
They might do a dry January,they might take a week off here
or there, they might reallyintentionally do that, but they
keep on going back and it's thatwhole thing.
It's like what is wrong with me?
And I'm not, I'm not gonna, I'mnot gonna go to, you know,
these AA meetings and declarethat I'm an alcoholic, like I'm,
it's in, it is.
It can be a really, reallytricky place.
(11:29):
And so I love working withthese women who was like, okay,
no, there's, there's nothingwrong with you, you are not an
alcoholic, you are just you, youare.
You know, we have justassociated those hardwired
associations between relaxationand alcohol and we just drive
that pathway deeper and deeperand deeper Every time.
We open up that bottle and pourit at the end of the day and go
(11:49):
ah, and it's so supported bysociety.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
And one of the things I've spoken about before was
because I work with childrenwith autism and it's emotionally
stressful, physical, all ofthat, and so it's a real thing
for people to say, oh, I need adrink, I'll go home and have a
drink, and that's absolutelyfine.
But for someone like me, thatwas a green light.
Oh, everyone's doing it, I'lldo it.
I'm the one that would come inhungover each day, though, you
(12:19):
know, but it it's.
It might for some people itmight be something.
They just say they might noteven go home and have that wine,
but for me it was like, well,there you go, it's normal, I'm
going to do it because I work ina hard job, you know, and it's
very supported by society.
I saw on Facebook we havevisuals for our kids and it
(12:41):
might say desk work first andthen choice.
It was one for adults Workfirst, then wine, and I just I
look at them now and I just go,ooh, that was an enabler to me.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Yeah, I know you.
Just you just think about howthe alcohol industry just has
marketed the hack out of mommywine culture drinking yeah,
holly Whitaker talks about it alot in her book Quit Like a
Woman.
If you recall that, love howthey took what they did with the
tobacco industry and gettingwomen to smoke.
(13:14):
They took that same methodologyto get women to drink.
And when I read that I'm likeyou get angry.
Like we're just a bunch ofpawns.
Yeah, and now we're pouringthis toxic, addictive substance
into our body.
Yeah, yeah, and now we're stuckwith it.
And now what's wrong with me?
How do I, how do we get rid ofit?
(13:35):
Like I've been using alcohol torelax for so long.
I've been using it as myrelaxer, my connector, my
soother, my all these things.
You know, I remember, and youmight remember this like you.
You, you get home again.
I'm four kids.
I've been at a school.
You know a school function andit's crazy, it's chaotic, like
my kids are all over, I geteverybody in and I walk and I
remember I'd walk in the doorand it's like seven o'clock at
night and I cannot get that winedown myself fast enough.
(13:57):
Oh, yeah, because I know thatthat is going to take the edge
off.
Now, not every night wasobviously like that.
Sometimes it's just like thatslow drip, just taking the edge
off, just taking the edge off,just taking the edge off.
And then, even on those nightswhen I don't need to take the
edge off because my body is justhabitually used to that,
because there's wine left overin the bottle from yesterday,
(14:18):
I'm pouring it to take the edgeoff, whether I needed it or not.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Yeah, exactly.
So what can I ask?
What do you do now forrelaxation?
Because this is a big thing.
You know my clients, ourlisteners worry about you know I
need it to switch off, I needit to relax.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
Yeah, that's a great question, that is such a great
question.
So so part of it is for for meand for a lot of people.
You know, we, we want thattransition, drink that five
o'clock something, but reallystarts with that.
So what am I going to drinkinstead?
And understanding that, that,that association that we have
with alcohol, some of it is justthat whole setting, like we see
(15:00):
, let me back up a little bit sothat that hardwired kind of
animal part of our brain, itdoesn't understand language, it
only understands sensations.
So our body is feeling, youknow, we're feeling anxiety,
we're feeling overwhelmed, we'refeeling all of're feeling
overwhelmed.
We're feeling all of that stuffand it's sending signals to our
brain and our brain goes oh, Iknow the answer, it's alcohol
(15:21):
and it's all hardwired.
So our logical thinking brainmight have said I'm not drinking
today.
But your, your hardwired,automated part of our brain,
says, oh, you're, I'm feelingthese sensations and this answer
, this is the answer and and atall costs, we are going to go
with that answer.
But the reality is part of thatrelaxation is, visually, your
body's seeing.
You're opening the cupboarddoor, you're pulling up that
(15:43):
glass of wine and your brain isalready going oh, here we go.
Here's relaxation.
Then you pour the bottle in andthen you drink that wine, you
drink the alcohol and thenalcohol does have that numbing
effect.
Your body's going, ah.
So you know, one of the firstthings that I always talk about
(16:03):
with my clients is like, okay,what are we going to put in our
glass instead?
Because we still want atransition drink, we still want
our body visually, we want tosee that glass, we want to pour
something, we want to tastesomething.
It just doesn't need to havealcohol in it.
So that's part of it and theother part of, in terms of
(16:23):
relaxation, there's so many likeamazing, beautiful adaptogenic
herbs, you know ashwagandha,althene, lemon balm.
You know, in the evening I usedto always have a glass of wine
and I'll have a nice cup of tea.
And again, because it issending messages to my brain
when I'm holding that cup, thecup is warm, I smell the tea,
the tea smells good, I taste thetea and it has just some nice
adaptogenic herbs, you know.
(16:44):
And then the other thing isjust like taking a look at what
is my life like during the dayand how can I put some things in
place to relax my nervoussystem that doesn't include wine
.
So so I don't get to thatpushing that, that, that tipping
point that says F, it, I don'treally care, I know the answer.
And so a lot of that is justreally starting our day with a
(17:07):
grounding, orienting, centering.
Like there's so many beautifulapps, like right now I'm using
the app called calm.
Yeah, and every day there's thedaily J and the daily calm and
um.
So just starting out ournervous system in a relaxed way
and then for me, understandingum, okay, as my nervous system
is getting over activated.
Okay, what do I need to do?
(17:28):
I need to bring it back in umthrough through breath work,
through just getting outside andthrowing a ball with my dog,
just moving into a differentroom, just changing the state
that we are in, because thereality is we're using alcohol
to change our state and we canuse our senses to change our
state.
We can use our breath.
Our breath is one of the mostpowerful tools that we have and
(17:51):
you might be familiar with thefour, seven, eight breath, where
you breathe in for four counts,you hold for seven, you exhale
for eight.
That was developed by Dr AndrewWeil and he teaches this to the
Navy SEALs to remain calm,focused and clear headed in the
heat of a mission.
So when you think about it, youknow, think about like we get
(18:12):
really over activated.
Our nervous system is on likehigh alert and we have trained
at that.
Alcohol brings it back down.
We can use that.
We can use that 478 breath fortwo or three minutes that takes
us from high alert to calmingourselves down and think about
it.
If you know you've got you'vegot these Navy SEALs.
They are on a mission and theycould be thinking and spiraling
(18:35):
about everything that could gowrong and be nervous and anxious
.
And you know their breathing isall over the map, their head is
all over the map, right, butthrough our breath that really
opens up that right side of ourbrain, our wise part of our
brain.
It settles down our nervoussystem so that they can stay in
laser focus action.
And that's the same type ofthing that we can do to stay in
(18:57):
laser focus action where ourright brain, our wise brain,
that prefrontal cortex that saysI'm not drinking today, that
prefrontal cortex that said wepoured the bottle of wine out
this morning and we are notgetting more, stays online.
Because what happens when we doget over activated.
When we do get completelyoverwhelmed, our prefrontal
(19:18):
cortex, our logical thinkingbrain, goes offline because it's
not required.
Our body is in like this, fightflight mode and the only thing
our body needs to do is, youknow, sending stress hormones to
either run, fight or collapse.
And there may not be theproverbial saber-toothed tiger
in our midst, but our body isfeeling like it is.
(19:40):
So breathwork is one of themost powerful things we can do.
So I guess, getting back to yourquestion of you, know what are
some of the key things.
First of all, it's juststarting out.
My day, calm, grounded In myevening routine is my wine down,
tea having, and I don't do itanymore.
But when I first started, youknow, every day, at you know
(20:03):
five o'clock or whatever time,that I was cooking dinner or
would have normally reached fora glass of wine, I grabbed that
same wine glass, I poured clubsoda, cranberry, some limes and
um, and that was my treat.
Right, because I still deserveda treat, I still deserved a
transition, right and um.
And then just making sure, likeI'm getting out in nature, I'm
(20:24):
moving all those ing anythingbut anything, ing any of the ing
activities except for drink ingyeah is so good for your
nervous system, so it again.
It's all about the nervoussystem.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Yes, I love all that and I do all of it.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
And the breathing is something I've really
incorporated into my life,exactly Because we need to.
You know, when we are stressingand overwhelming and all that
stuff is happening, we are outof our body.
Right, we are out of our body,we are spiraling on the past, we
are stressing about the futureand we are nowhere near anything
.
That's going on today.
And by taking that breath andnoticing that breath, noticing
(21:02):
how it feels, calms our heartrate, we can get back into our
body.
And so my favorite thing to dowhen I am in overwhelm, when I
am in a stress response is likeokay, take a deep breath.
Okay, what would a wise adultdo here?
I got a shift out of my leftside of my brain that is just
spiraling.
Take a breath.
And then I asked myself whatwould a wise adult do here?
(21:24):
And I think about that Okay,what's a wise adult do here?
All right, take another breath,settle in, get into the present
, settle, settle in.
What would a wise adult do here?
Speaker 1 (21:35):
okay, now go, be that wise adult yeah, love it, I
love that and it does.
It gives you that presence totune into that, you know.
So, yeah, so effective.
I love that.
I love the tea, I love the calmapp and and exercise like I'm
really into my pilates now, whenI was was drinking, this would
(21:56):
all make me go.
Oh, I can think of nothingworse, but honestly, I can think
of nothing better.
Now, and you and I are here tosay that's what happens, this
becomes it's my dopamine, it'smy.
It excites me, you know.
So there is a great, great lifeafter alcohol, because I just
(22:17):
know for people listening when Iwas drinking, I would just
cringe at everything, but it'sso good on this side.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
Oh, completely.
And the reality is like earlyon, when I wasn't drinking, when
people were saying, oh you know, just spend a couple minutes
and breathe, I'm like there'snothing, that two minutes of
breathing is going to do for me,because I'm like a go big or go
home type person.
Two minutes is going to donothing.
And it took me a while tounderstand, like, okay, it
actually is very, very powerful.
Just a couple of minutes, justa couple of minutes.
(22:48):
And now I've got in my office,I've got a little chase lounge
and I've got a weighted blanketand if I get really over
activated, I'll sit there, I'llput my weighted blanket on, I'll
just listen to just you know alittle five minute thing on the
call map.
Or just breathe, maybe makeyourself a cup of tea.
Just, I got to get back into mybody.
I got to get out of thatspirally thought pattern that is
(23:08):
really amping me up.
Get into my body, get into mybody, cause you know our where
we have the opportunity to takethat next best right step, to
take the best action is in thepresent, in our body, and most
of the time when we arespiraling and spinning, we are
in the past or we are in thefuture and we are nowhere near
(23:30):
today.
So by using those bodyexperiences of breathing, you
know there's I'm familiar withhavening.
Havening is that, that wholetouch, like when we start, we
start on our forehead and gothrough our cheeks and cross
over our collarbone and, youknow, like giving ourselves a
hug.
You know, for most people thesense of touch is really, really
(23:51):
calming to our nervous systemand to that that havening
practice is such a beautiful wayagain, just within a couple
minutes, to calm us down.
Because, again, remember, weuse alcohol to take the edge off
, just to take the edge off.
So if we can use a little bitof touch to take the edge off, a
nice little bit of tea to takethe edge off, a little bit of
breathing, just to take the edgeoff, enough to go, ah, okay now
(24:16):
I can face the rest of the day.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
Oh, totally, I love that.
Before I stopped drinking I wasreally into well, I wasn't into
it, but I kept telling myself Ihave to be able to meditate
Like I did meditation courses.
I hate meditating for an houror whatever.
These things are meditation.
Everything you're saying is aform of meditation.
It doesn't have to take long,and that's been the best thing
(24:40):
for me, because it is.
You know, that's exactly whatwe're doing.
We're calming our mind and thenour vagus nerve calms and it's
literally changed my life.
So I just love everything thatyou're saying.
It's so valuable and it works,it works, it does work.
Give it time as well.
Give it time Because, as I said, as you said, the deep breath,
(25:03):
it's like oh, come on, that'snot going to work, it's not
enough.
But when it becomes a practice,right, yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
And you use, it's like, oh, come on, that's not,
that's not going to work, it'snot enough.
But when it becomes a practice,right yeah, and you use it just
like, just just enough to takethe edge off Again.
Think about I'm using alcoholto take the edge off.
What do I need?
I just need to take the edgeoff just a second so that I can
take it.
Take a breath, okay, what, what, what's what's important now?
There's this acronym win.
What's important now?
There's this acronym WIN.
What's important now, what'sreally important now?
What's the next best?
(25:29):
Right, step, right.
And I totally get you with thatwhole thing of meditation,
because everybody's like, oh,you got to meditate, you got to
meditate, and like, after me,sitting here for 20 minutes to
think of nothing is never goingto happen and I'm not even going
to try.
But when we do these like shortlittle things, again, it's just
just to take the edge off, justto center us, just ground us a
little bit.
Meditation is not.
(25:51):
For some people it is, but forme it is not sitting there for
20 minutes not thinking aboutanything.
Mindfulness, for me it's takinga breath, it's listening to the
sounds.
What am I hearing?
It's feeling my fingertips.
It's wiggling my toes.
What do I smell?
What do I taste?
Visually, you know, lookingoutside.
(26:11):
Okay, let me find threeinstances of a color blue in my
room.
We got to use our body, oursenses, to tell our body that we
are safe.
And when I can look around inmy room and say there's three
different colors of blue, I cantouch my desk, I can touch my
chair and your body's like okay,you're okay, I know where you
(26:35):
are in space.
We're out of that spirally loop.
I'm in my body and it soundsreally kind of woo-woo or
whatever, but it but it's and Ithought it was, but it's
actually it's.
It's not, it works Like itreally, really works.
So anybody listening to herewho is like ready to shut this
off, saying this, this has gonea completely different direction
.
I really encourage you.
Um, you know these apps.
You know um, calm headspace,happier, all of these.
(26:56):
I think they most have like alike a seven day trial.
Download it, listen to threeminutes, just notice what you
know, um, cause it does make adifference.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Oh, absolutely, it does.
So, julie, where can peoplefind you and what do you offer?
Speaker 2 (27:11):
Yeah, so I have a private one-on-one coaching
practice.
You can find all theinformation about that at
julielivelycoachingcom, andlively is just like it's spelled
sounds L-I-V-E-L-Y,julielivelycoachingcom.
I also have recently launched agroup coaching program for
anybody that might be coming outof this Naked Minds Path
program.
You, if if that is you, you'llknow what I'm talking about.
(27:34):
If it's not you, that's OK, butit is an alternative for Path
Year Two and some, but it's areally great program for people
to find a place to land.
It's a great community.
We do a lot of really coolcontent and a lot of great work
and and yeah, that's it.
Oh, and one other thing, I dohave a special download for
(27:54):
anybody, if you're interested.
It's how the heck do I relaxwithout wine, and it's some
specific tips, tricks andtechniques on how to do that,
some of the things that I'vetalked about today, and it will
go a little bit deeper for you,because the reality is, if we
are removing something that hashelped us relax, we have to
replace it with things thatreally do help us relax.
(28:16):
Otherwise, we are just like inthis netherland, going, oh my
gosh, what just happened?
And then you and you will bemuch more predisposition to go
back to drinking.
So we've got to look at ways toreplace what that drink was
doing for you.
So if you're interested, it'llbe in the show notes.
How the heck do I relax withoutwine?
Speaker 1 (28:34):
Click on that and we'll send that to you.
That's so cool.
Thanks so much, Julie.
It's been really lovely havingyou on and having a great chat
with you.
Thank you Likewise.
Thanks so much too.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
We'll talk to you soon.
Bye.
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