From Leanne and Susie on The Nutrition Couch this episode:
- We chat about a media article which asks: What’s more influential, diet or exercise for weight loss?
- Our 'Client Case Study of the Week' is about peri-menopause;
- Our 'Supermarket Product of the Week' is a sugar free cake mix; and
- Our listener question is all about how to approach nutrition for young girls as they go through puberty.
So sit back, relax and enjoy this week’s episode!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hi, I'm Leanne Ward and I'm Susie Burrow and welcome
to the Nutrition Couch, a weekly podcast from two of
Austraias leading dietitians, bringing you everything that is new in
the world of nutrition, diets and good food from the
Nutrition Couch. Today, we're chatting about a media article which
asks what is more influential diet or exercise for weight loss.
(00:21):
Our client case study of the week is about perimenopause,
and on our most popular segment, this supermarket Product of
the Week, we discuss the new sugar free cake mixes
in our supermarkets. And in our final segment, one of
our listeners has asked us how to approach nutrition for
young girls as they go through puberty. But before we
kick into this week's episode, Susie, how are you going?
Speaker 2 (00:42):
I'm struggling a little bit leand right in lockdown, I
find everyone is really cranky. And an observation I've had
in this really intense COVID period that we're going through
is that whatever people's underlying personality is, it seems to
be exaggerated. So if you're anxious, you become more anxious.
If you're depressive, you tend to become lower in your mood.
(01:03):
And I'm struggling a little bit. I've got kids at
home trying to teach the maths, trying to get them
to add up dollars and cents. I don't think it's
that difficult, but my children are really struggling, and so
this is nice to come and talk something positive. And
I made my husband take the children away instead, don't
bring them back for at least two hours, just so
I can have a minute to myself. So this is
(01:25):
the highlight of my week.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Love it. So if the adult conversation on the nutrition
couch is the highlight of your week, thank you for
being with us, DA can I agree it's tough for
especially our Sydney siders. So we're feeling you. Guys, Sydney
stay strong and we hope that the nutrition Couch every
Sunday gets you through a tough week.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
And I do have some exciting news.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
I finally managed to get you to send me a
bump picture and so I'll pop that up for our
listeners as well, so we've got something to look at
and I like to see those photos.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
I think it's nice.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
It's a reminder that there's bigger, more important things. Out
there when people are having new babies and things. So
that's a nice, nice addition to this week's.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Episode getting to the halfway markness getting harder at a hide?
All right, Susie, So what was trending in the media
this week was an article that you found in The
Times and it was titled what is more influential for
weight loss? Is it dart or is it exercise? And
I think it's a really interesting conversation because I personally
know a lot of my followers try to, for lack
(02:23):
of a better word, out exercise a poor diet, right,
So a lot of people over emphasize exercise and underemphasize
how important nutrition is from a bat loss perspective. So
I've got my own thoughts around this. But Susie, how
do you feel about this? Is it dart or rix's exercise?
Just when we're talking about weight loss.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
This is a really common question that we're asked, you
know what is more important? And indeed, I think we've
all been guilty of thinking that if we've indulged a
little bit over the weekend, we'll simply do a bit
more exercise to buffer it out. I know that each
day I tend to do a bit of a mental
calculation when it comes to dolling out the treats at night,
so it's not necessarily a healthy way to think of it,
but it is a common question that comes up, and
(03:00):
hence the headline that I saw. And I also thought
when I picked it for our chat today that we'd
probably have slightly different opinions on this, So I thought
it was it was always nice for a chat to
get some different perspectives of two different clinicians working with
different people. So I do have some fairly set thoughts
on it, and the way I describe it to people
when they ask or in the media or with clients
is that I say, when we start with a weight
(03:22):
loss journey, so you may have a goal of losing
five kilos or ten kilos in the initial stages. In
my experience, I like to focus on diet, so for
the first four, six, eight, even twelve weeks, I tend
to give a lot of attention to developing a strong
eating plan with very set calorie and macro nutrient targets
(03:46):
because I know that if the client is if the client,
if my client is adherent to that program, and for
that first week or two or three can be relatively
strict and keep calories tightly trolled and not be lured
by a weekend.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Of wine and extras.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
That I'm going to get at least a couple of
kilo's weight loss on the scales, and I know psychologically
that that is one of the most significant predictors of
long term weight loss success. It's getting initial results now.
The reason that I tend to say it's more important
initially is that if we're talking about calories, and specifically
women and smaller women, which is ninety percent of the
(04:24):
group that I work with, I'm only dealing with calories
between say twelve fourteen hundred and maybe up to eighteen
hundred for my most active females. That's a pretty small
number overall really, So they may start on twelve hundred
calories or fourteen hundred calories, and then inevitably they're probably
going to increase that as they become more metabolically efficient
(04:46):
and better at burning calories and hopefully over time becoming
more active.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
But they're never going to.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Be eating eight hundred calories. They're never going to be
eating two and a half thousand calories. So I've only
got a set period of time to get that calorie
load control and right for them, and then eventually when
they've lost a little bit, might be five, might be ten,
and of course depending on how long or how much
weight they've got to lose. Eventually, the only thing that
I can really change around is how much they're moving
(05:14):
or how much activity they're doing or specifically training in
a way that's going to make their body more efficient
at burning or build more muscle tissues so.
Speaker 3 (05:22):
They can build more calories.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
So I'm not dealing with a group of women who
are doing physique changing significantly in the sense of really
getting into the gym, and then also not working on
overly strict body fat goals of getting it, say below
twenty percent.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
I'm working with the average.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Woman whose age say, late thirties, mid forties, who is
going to do a little bit of exercise and she
wants to lean up, but she's not wanting to be
a fitness physique model, and hence, if I can get
her to focus on the diet and getting that really
strong and a really strong foundation for a period, so
that becomes the default. Eventually when it comes to those
bigger weight loss, that's when for me the exercise becomes
(06:01):
more important. But I know your position is a little
bit different, and I think that that's great for us
to sometimes have different positions on that. So I say,
initially for that first weight loss diet absolutely more important
for me because that's where people either are really adherent
or go off the rails very quickly, and then it
becomes more about getting your body more metabolically efficient and
really looking at the training over time.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
I agree with you there and what I tend to
do with my clients. I work with mostly active females,
so they're already quite active. A lot of them are
potentially even too active. I think they're trying to out
exercise abo our diet. Like a lot of people who
sign up to my coaching services, you know, are working
out seven times a week, sometimes twice a day, and
they're still gaining weight and the nutrition scrap. So really
what we do is we taper back the exercise and
(06:46):
really focus on nutrition because purely for fat loss one
hundred percent, nutrition is is King. I always say that
nutrition is King exercises Queen together they make it Kingdom
set up before multiple times on my own podcasts and others,
I've been interviewed on and it really resonates with people
because most people do have too many treats, and then
what we tend to do as humans is underestimate our
nutrition and overestimate our exercise. So I've seen so many
(07:08):
clients who are like, oh, I burned eight hundred calories
in my gym session. Because when fitness Watch tells me,
I'm like, I can promise you you're not burning knowing
what they've done and the intensity that they did it at,
they have not burned eight hundred calories in that session.
I can promise you that. So then what they do
is they go and supplement that with like four glasses
of one on a Thursday night or something like that.
So I really think trying to match, you know, the
calories burn to the calories that you're eating is just
(07:30):
a really inaccurate way for a lot of people. So
I one hundred percent prioritize nutrition for my clients from
a fat loss perspective. And then if clients have a
goal of getting lean, a tone of stronger, you know,
squatting seventy eighty ninety one hundred kilos, that's where, of
course exercise becomes incredibly important. But not just exercise the
right type of exercise for the goal that the client has,
(07:51):
and also to keep us metabolically strong. So if we
have a significant amount of weight to lose ten twenty
thirty kilos, we have to be doing some sort of
exercise in order to keep us metabolically strong, in order
to allow us to continue to be in a deficit
for longer and longer, because you know, twenty thirty kilos
could take six months plus to really get off. And
if we're just low calorie, low calorie, low calorie, sure
(08:12):
we're going to lose, but we're going to come to
the point where we stall and we plateau, and that's
where the exercise component does become really important. But I
get my clients to put ninety percent of the focus
into nutrition because most of them are already exercising, and
then we just use exercise as that mental health component.
It helps us sleep better, it helps us to reduce
stress and anxiety, it makes us feel good, it gives
us more energy. So that's how I like my clients
(08:34):
to think about exercise, which I'm sure you do as well, Susie.
I just think that you know, most people over emphasize
exercise So from my point of view for fat loss,
nutrition is one hundred percent key, and you can lose
body fat without doing any exercise. Sure, exercise is going
to make a lot easier, and we of course encourage
exercise from a mental health and a general health point
(08:54):
of view, but you can purely use lose body fat
from a nutrition side of things only.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
And I think two things that have come up for
me just as we're chatting. The first is that probably
one of the other reasons I tend to focus purely
on diet initially is that I find a lot of
my clients are overwhelmed in their lives. They're very busy,
they're working full time, they're juggling kids, they're single parents,
and to just lay out more and more and more
onto their to do list sometimes can be a bit overwhelming.
(09:20):
So my clients tend to be a little bit older
than yours, so they do tend to have a few
more of those variables to be dealing with.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
So we all have to eat.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
So I often say to them, look, let's just start
with getting the diet structured and some meal planning and
some food prep.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
Going, because that's a big job in itself.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
If you're not used to it, and then let's build
from there and just start with some basic movement because
that doesn't add too much stress to them. So I
think that's the first thing. And I think the other
thing is that people tend to be either on or
off in their mind. So a big part of any
intervention is really coming to an understanding and a sense
(09:57):
of peace with the fact that this isn't a plan
that you're on now, this is the way forward forever.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
And still I think it's a common thing that people
are confused of.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
They think they're going to be on the diet, and
then they're often as opposed to thinking of this is
actually long term the way to get the foundation of
the diet. This isn't a short term thing. The only
thing that might change is you might start eating a
little bit more at night as you've lost weight, or
you might have two meals off a week rather than
one when you're actively trying to lose weight. But really
this is the way of eating moving forward, because this
is what's ticking the box and all of your key
(10:28):
nutrients as well as at the moment supporting weight loss.
So I think that's a big psychological hurdle to get
over to think this isn't what I'm just doing now,
this is what I'm going to be doing forever. And
it's sometimes approached I guess with a minimalistic attitude as well,
because people think, right, I can be really strict with
the diet, or I can do this much exercise now,
knowing that eventually they're going to stop. And again, I
(10:49):
prefer to build and build the habit, starting with the
food of things that people are going to be able
to do long term, then throw everything at the problem,
all the exercise, all the diet at once, and know
that they're probably going to get tired and over it
within a few weeks. So I'm always planning for the
long term, particularly when someone presents who's wanting to lose
twenty thirty kilos.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
One hundred percent, and that mindset's so key. And if
you're going to go one hundred percent gung ho in
week one and you're going to lose the weight in
week two, three, four, and everything's fine and dandy, but
why a week five and six you then hit a
platter and you're like, man, I'm exercising seven days a week,
emating nothing but bloody veggies and you know, steam fish.
Where do I go from here? And I haven't lost
any weight this week? You get so in your head
(11:28):
about this that you're totally off the dit. You're like,
what's the point? I'm trying so hard, I can't give
anything more. I'm off the diet. So that's why as
dieticians we always recommend like slow and steady wins the race.
So sustainable change is long term, not going one thousand
miles an hour from the very beginning. So once you
hit that wall, then you've got nowhere to go, and
then all of the you know, the good work that
you've done becomes undone when you fall off the diet.
(11:50):
So one hundred percent slow and steady. But I think
we can both agree, Susie. Nutrition is absolutely key from
a fat loss perspective.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Ultimately, it always comes back to calorie control and not
going from fourteen hundred calories to two and a half
thousand and back again. It's about keeping it as tight
as you can most of the time, and then you'll.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Keep in control of your weight absolutely all.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
Right, So we'll have some feedback on that, I'm sure,
but that's where we're sitting on is diet or exercise
more important at different stages. But a topic that we
were going to talk about today that came from some
of our work with clients, and specifically, I've been seeing
this a huge amount in the media over the past
few months, and I think it's because some of the
key journalists are going are in their late forties and fifties,
(12:32):
and so they're going through what we're going to talk about,
which of course is menopause, right, and their bodies are
getting ready for that now. The thing about perimenopause, which
is the period sort of up to ten years before
actual menopause when you stop ovulating completely, and the huge
number of symptoms you can present with, whether it's hot
flushes or weight gain, or fatigue, or irritability or depression,
(12:57):
is that it really links in very power flee to
our nutrition. And I actually haven't seen a huge amount
discussed about the role of nutrition and diets in terms
of perimenopause and menopause, but when we take a really
close look at what's happening physiologically, they're very closely linked.
And there's actually some good science as well around managing
(13:17):
some of these premenopausal and menopausal symptoms. And also perhaps
from our perspectively and the weight gain which is so
incredibly common. So I thought today, rather than target an
individual client, which is what we normally do, we're going
to talk about it as a general theme of perimenopause
and menopause and the role of our diets, because I
think a lot of people in their sort of mid
(13:38):
to late forties and fifties will really this will resonate
with them. So a few of the key physiological variables
that we're dealing with that profoundly impact our nutrition. It's
basically a drop in estrogen over time, and our hormones
often talk about hormones are are everything and absolutely in
this stage, very profound effect on specifically the way we
(14:00):
metabolize a number of things and are very close link
to weight gain because basically estrogen, which reduces as we age,
is very protective against weight gain and specifically weight gain
around that abdominal area.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
So basically, as our estrogen levels reduced.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Which is linked to a number of other issues like
the hot flushes, we are just much more likely to
gain weight centrally. And that's where we hear about women
who never had issues with a waste before all of
a sudden they're coming in with waste measurements at eighty
ninety centimeters, and this is weight that they've never carried
around in their tummy. And sometimes I'll anecdotally hear my
female clients talk about it being related to their wine intake,
(14:37):
but probably more important, it's likely linked to a reduction
in estrogen over time. Now, estrogen is such a powerful hormone.
It has such a profound effect over our mood. Also,
calcium metabolism, and so we're at much higher risk of
developing bone issues osteopenia or osteoporosis because we're not as
good as metabolizing calcium, which of course is crucial for
(15:00):
healthy bones. The other issue is if you're going through
perimenopause or menopause and bleeding sporadically, or perhaps bleeding much
more often than every four weeks, of course you're losing
a lot more blood, which means that you're at risk
of low iron levels, which again can make you incredibly tired.
It can and if your sleep is already disrupted because
of these hormonal changes. So in summary, I would say
(15:22):
that preventing any weight gain that is coming as a
result of perimenopause and menopause is one of the most
powerful things women in their forties and fifties can do
to ensure that they do not have long term weight issues,
because if you start to gain weight centrally in your
forties and fifties, and instead of being five kilos overweight,
(15:43):
then suddenly you're ten or even twenty kilos overweight. It
is so profoundly difficult to get weight off centrally once
it's been there for a while. If you've noticed that
your waist is starting to creep up, taking active steps
to prevent that weight gain, and we'll talk about some
strategies in a minute, is incredibly, incredibly important. Now, when
we take a look at what the science says, it's
(16:06):
quite interesting because there has been quite a few studies DOTA,
and you're going to talk about one in a minute,
specifically about hot flushes, but I'll talk about the main
data that's coming out around weight gain and preventing weight gain,
and that actually, interestingly enough, comes from a Mediterranean style
of eating. So if we take a look at what's
happening with a Mediterranean style of eating, it's not an
overly technical diet, it's not overly special, But what it
(16:27):
does do. It slightly reduces carbohydrate intake because there's a
much greater focus on fruit and vegetable intake as opposed
to grains and cereals. And it's also very very rich
in amiga three fats, so they, as we know, are
very strongly associated with a reduction in inflammation in the body.
And what we also know is that when we're gaining
weight centrally, it's probably linked to insulin levels over time.
(16:49):
So insulin is one of the main hormones that regulates
glucose and fat metabolism in the body, and it actively
blocks fat loss when insulin levels are high. So if
I take the standard female that I'm seeing of these
ages in their forties and fifties, inevitably they sit down
quite a lot because they're working long hours and they're
perhaps not sleeping overly well, particularly if they're going through
(17:11):
some of these hormonal shifts. They don't have a lot
of time to exercise, so they're probably not doing a
lot of weight bearing activity, so their bones aren't.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Looking overly healthy.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
They may even have swapped to plant based eating where
they're having almond milk that's not fortified with calcium, so
their calcium intake tends to be low. That's a really
important factor. And then inevitably and a lot of clients
we see eat a lot of carbohydrate, way too much
for what's happening in their body in the case of
perimenopause and menopause, and they're sitting down and not burning
it off. So they're having cereal or toast for breakfast,
(17:40):
they're grabbing sandwich or sushi for lunch, they're snacking on
rice cakes and fruit because they think it's healthy or
healthy baked goods. And then at night they might have
some wine but also some rice some pasta. Now, that
is a high carbohydrate diet that is not a Mediterranean diet.
That is fifty to sixty percent carbohydrate. And I guarantee
if you have got reducing estrogen OVA time and abdominal
(18:01):
weight gain, that will be writing your insulin levels up
and you are in a cycle towards pre diabetes and
type two diabetes, which can easily be reversed early if
you keep on top of that menopausal weight gain and
reduce your carbohydrate slightly and focus your diet around more
of a Mediterranean eating so it's not an overly sexy
or flash diet, but the research is strong in terms
(18:23):
of reducing inflammation, reducing some of these symptoms which you'll
talk about in a second, and basically preventing this terrible
weight gain that happens to a significant number of menopausal women.
And not only does it make you feel terrible, it's
really really hard to get off. So the take home
message is that if you know that you've got some
perimenopausal menopausal symptoms, you're not feeling great, probably your estrogen's
(18:45):
shifting around. The doctor said, you're in perimenopause or even menopause.
Getting your macronutrient, intaking your carbohydrate and preventing and getting
that weight off will be one of the most powerful
things you can do to preserve your health as you
move into your sixty seventies.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
You get it off. Now, that was a big cut
of seal.
Speaker 1 (19:03):
Love it, love it, and I'm going to summarize that
in full key points. So firstly, Mediterranean diet. If you
have no idea what that is, booking one on one
with the dietitian it will be very beneficial. Weight training.
Weight training is so incredibly important for pery and metopause.
I cannot stress that enough. It's the time in our
life when you know, we come out of you know,
I think strength training and resistance training is becoming a
(19:23):
lot more popular within the twenties and thirties and forties
age group. But then I think life just gets busy,
things get in the way, you know, we swap that
for longer walks and that sort of thing. So I
just think that it's something that drops off. So weight
training is so incredibly important, not only for bone heals,
but for your metabolism as well. After forty every year,
I think the research is something like you lose two
(19:44):
percent of your bone mass or you lose two percent
of your muscle mass every year, so your body is
working against you. You really need to focus on that
resistance training two to three times a week. If you
have no idea what you're doing, higher trainer, Higher a professional.
So weight training for bone health, some metabolism. Calcium so
incredibly important for menopause, particularly if you don't eat dairy.
(20:05):
You need thirteen hundred milligrams of dietary calcium a day
for menopause. This is for you know, healthy adults, and
that's how many serves susy.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Oh a lot at least three to four, and this
where some of those super foods.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Like the tuna we've mentioned before, which is very high
in calcium. But check your plant based milks. If you're
a plant based milk person, you have to make sure
one's fortified, because often the ones that the briwsters are
using at the cafes are not, so you think you're
having milk and you are not getting any of the
protein or the calcium that you think you are.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
One skin milk is probably one of our top recommendations
for menopause. So if you don't, or you choose not
to drink dairy products or eat dairy products, that's absolutely okay.
You may or may not need a supplement or you're
going to eat need it. You know, eat a lot
of other bony fish and that sort of thing, dark
green leafy vegetables, and also consider an iron supplement if
you are bleeding heavily or if your bleeds have become
(20:56):
a lot more regular. I've talked to clients who you know,
have been bleeding for six to eight weeks, So not
only have I sent them to their GP, I've just
started them straight on an iron tablet. Because if you've
got to bleed for six to eight weeks straight. You
can rest assured that you're going to feel pretty crappy
after a couple of weeks, so really monitor your iron
levels if that bleeding is, you know, anything more than
sort of that four or five quote unquote normal period.
(21:16):
And then finally, Mediterranean diet has been shown in the
research to really help with hot flushes. So there was
a big study in I think it was Australia, SUSI
where research is actually found that menopaus are women who
ate diets high in fruit, fruits, certain veggies, pasta, and
even a little bit of red wine aka and Mediterranean
(21:37):
style eating pattern were up to twenty percent less likely
to have hot flushes and night sweats. And on the
flip side of that, you might think of twenty percent
doesn't sound like a lot, but you know, if you're
someone who's going through hot flushes, it's absolutely worth a trial.
But on the flip side of that, menopause are women
who ate high sugar, high fat diets were twenty three
percent more likely to experience hot flushes and night sweats.
(21:59):
So I think that that's a great study. And researchers
also noted that women who adhered to the low fat,
high fiber diet trend had lower and more stable istugen
levels overall as well. So there's absolutely things that we
can do from a nutrition perspective, but there's a lot
of things that you need to think about. So this
is confusing to you if you're not sure how to
focus on your calcium and your iron and implement an
(22:19):
intimate Mediterranean style diet and stabilize that your hormones. This
is a perfect time to book in with a dietician
one on one to really optimize your health during a
really important time of your life.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
It is, and I think some simple tips that they
can take away. You've got to get the oily fish
three times a week, and if you're not a fish eater,
look at potential supplementation to get that amiga three fat
up there. And of course what we would also say
leanne is a Mediterranean diet doesn't include processed snack food.
There's no biscuits, there's no cakes, there's no rice crackers.
(22:51):
You know, it really is more about well balanced meals
through the day and not this frequency of eating that's
pack full of sugars and vegetable oils in processing. So
keeping that as minimal as possible in the diet is
a really important part of achieving the balance.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
That the Mediterranean diet.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
Supports absolutely whole foods first, and don't forget the wine
recommendations that come with the Mediterranean DIT. A standard glass
of wine I think, as per the Mediterranean DIT is
probably about one hundred meals. Most people would pour about
three hundred meals is one glass, And most people struggle
to stick to one glass, don't they looozy.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
But they maybe a glass all of a sudden. It's
not our fault.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Those glasses are like goblets, and they pour one hundred
mel and charge you seventeen dollars.
Speaker 3 (23:29):
It's devastating, But that's the standard serve.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
So that red wine is not a daily thing. It
perhaps doesn't even need to be a weekly thing. Just
very much mine your intake because you will find that
you get that additional abdominal fat if your intake, particularly
of alcohol, is getting up there.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Well, the food that you eat when you're drinking stores
and that's why we get that very pronounced abdominal weight.
So people think it's not the wine necessarily, it's the
mix of what we're having. The potato chips, and then
fried food at the pub when we're all to go there.
So one hundred percent it's the overall pattern of eating.
But you know, it's a very positive diet and an
(24:05):
easily sustainable one too, But it will really make a
big difference. So if you have any of those symptoms
and know that your body is not feeling as good
as it once did, definitely invest some time and getting
your diet sorted by the right professional, someone who has
a dietetics degree, who is qualified in the science of nutrition.
It will go a long way in paving the way
to a much more positive health position as you get older.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
And absolutely we're going to plug personal trainings here as
well and invest in a good trainer. Now, if you
haven't before, is the time to start or really get
into your weight training. And I mean it's not enough
to just do sort of simple exercises. We really want
to be actually lifting some load and lifting some weight,
whether that's dumbbells or kettlebells, or you know, you're getting
into a squad rack, or if you're at home in lockdown,
(24:49):
you know, order some weights online, get them delivered. Now
is the time to start doing some sort of resistance training.
Your bone health is absolutely going to thank you, as
will your metabolism long term. So now, Susie most popular segment.
We know our listeners love this one, and we thought
this week we would chat about cakes. So I'm not
actually even sure have to pronounced this is it?
Speaker 2 (25:08):
No shoe?
Speaker 3 (25:10):
I like that we're gonna talk about cakes.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
New shoe after telling you not to eat cakes because
it's terrible for metopaors.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
Cakes. Well, a lot of us are at home cooking,
I think which cooking, so it's relevant.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
So this is the ninety nine percent sugar free range.
We're getting a lot of questions, a lot of dms
and messages throughout our Instagram account, which is the Nutrition
Capped podcast. They also have a range of the sugar
free chocolate chips as well, but we chose the rich
chocolate cake to chat about today. Just on the front
of pack labeling which we always tell you guys just
to ignore because it's fancy marketing. It's got four stars,
(25:41):
it's there's fifty percent lower carb, there's a non dairy option,
and it uses natural sweetness. But Susie, let's flick over
to the back of the packet and do you want
to chat our listeners through the nutritionals of this ninety
nine percent sugar free cake mix and let us know
your thoughts.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
They've got a really great website. I will it's a
disclaimer here.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
I haven't tried these products, but like you, I have
been asked a lot about them, I guess because I
like to bake, and I like to bake fairly traditionally
occasionally to get blends. I haven't had a goal of
this product. But the serving size is eighty six grams
per slice. Now correct me if I'm wrong, but that
is a pretty small piece of cake, because my understanding
(26:18):
would be that a cake that you would see if
you're buying a piece from a cafe, would be close
to two hundred grams. I'd say, so this is a
slither that this is nutritionals have been calculated on.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
No normal adult human would have an eighty six gram slice.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
It's very small. So what's eighty six grams?
Speaker 2 (26:34):
It's like, well, it's like three, you know, if you
have a slice of cheese that's like twenty, So it's
like a cheese like it's very little.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
It's twelve slices if you would to slice up a
normal cake. They're saying you should get twelve slices out
of that, and I think most people would get six
to eight slices out. I think that's a reasonable or something. Yeah,
I think twelve is is very very slim.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
He's pushing it. So the energy is seven forty six kilodels,
which is just shy. Have two hundred calories.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
Four point five grams of protein, which I'd say is
coming from the high proportion of wheat flour. Nine point
nine grams are fat and total and two point nine saturated,
so it's still relatively low saturated fat, fourteen point six
grams of total carb ten grams of fiber because it's
got a tapioca fiber bulking it up. The sweetness coming
from erythrotol seven point nine grams, so that's not metabolized
(27:18):
the way normal sugar is, and hence the overall low
sugar content of what they're calculating.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
And the ingredients austraight and wheat.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
Flour isomultole ligasacharides, which is the tapioca flour, erythrotol, cocoa powder, polydextrose,
cornflour dextra and fiber thickner xylotoal baking powder Stevia natural flavors.
Speaker 3 (27:38):
So it does contain gluten. It is not gluten free.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
It's also got milk and soy, so it's not appropriate
for those who are looking with food alerga and tolerance there.
It does say dairy free on the label, but it
says maybe present, so it's must be made in a factory.
And it's got a four health star ratings with fifty
percent lower carbs and market it is using natural sweetness. Now,
people who like sweet food in my experiencely and love
(28:03):
this product. I know a couple of my friends who
enjoy cakes and sweet food.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
They love it.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
I know it's very popular in the supermarket. I have
to be honest with you, it's not something that I recommend,
and there's a reason why.
Speaker 3 (28:18):
Probably a few reasons.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
The first is that I think it's heavily processed, and
if I am having someone make a cake, I would
much rather it be a natural cake with natural ingredients.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
And you know, I often use a wholemeal flower.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
I tend to use some of the sweetness like the
monk fruit as to reduce their overa sugar content on
my baking, or olive oil or some pain butter in it,
and I can sort of make a pretty good cake
with not too much of those ingredients. And also I
find they're quite expensive. They're like seven or eight dollars
a box, So eight dollars. Yeah, I'm not gonna usually
recommend a client goes and buys that and thinks it's
(28:55):
healthier because for me, it's quite processed. Now, I wouldn't
stop someone buying it. I would give recommendations on how
they can enjoy it if they want to, but it
wouldn't be top of my list of recommendations because as
a dietitian, I think it's using a lot of process ingredients,
and I don't want a lot my clients to think
that eating cake is okay just because it appears slightly healthier.
I want them to keep cake as a very occasional
(29:16):
thing they include in their diet, you know, for a
birthday or a special occasion, or if they're really feeling
like it. But I wouldn't be encouraging them to make
cake as part of their normal weekly meal plan, because
if you make a cake, you're probably gonna eat it,
and that's a problem because it's still these calories and
most of us can't deal with eating three or four
pieces of that kind of cake in our meal plan
on a daily basis. So you know, I think it
(29:38):
can have a role if people like it, but it
definitely isn't the top of my list when I'm recommending
products because I like to keep the diet as sort
of unprocessed and natural as possible.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
I don't know, what do you think?
Speaker 1 (29:48):
I agree, I wouldn't recommend this to my clients. I mean,
if they came to be in there said I love it,
it's one of my soul foods. Can we include it,
I'd say, yeah, absolutely, But this isn't something that i'd recommend,
particularly because I mean, if we're being honest, like an
ad verage serving size, no one's going to cut that
cake into twelve slices. Let's be real. Then average serving
size is at least three hundred calories, So from a
calorie perspective, it's probably very similar or maybe slightly less
(30:10):
than just a normal piece of cake. I agree it's
overly processed. The fiber content's pretty good, but at the
same time, maybe too much for some people who don't
tolerate fiber that well. You may get a few excessive
bits of gas or wind after a product like this,
and I mean the ratio is of you know, it's
high fat, low car or lociuer should I say so?
For some people that might fit their macros a little
bit better, but overall, I really don't think. I think
(30:32):
for eight dollars a pop, you'd be much better making
it yourself. And I agree with you. I personally don't
bake a because I don't have kids. So if I
bake David and I have an entire cake, well the
hell we're gonna do with the whole cake. And you know,
I don't work at the hospital anymore. We're not really
going out, you know, we're not here lockdown in Brisbane.
But I'm also not going out and about on purpose either,
just because being pregnant, I'm a little bit worried, and
you know, I'm not going to too many places. So
(30:54):
I'm not going to friends' houses and going to big
parties and barbecues where I'm taking cakes and that sort
of thing with me. So I don't the bake, and
so I agree. I haven't tried this either. I'm not
sure if the texture or the mouth feel or there's
a hell of a lot of artificial sweetness in there,
and at fiber as well. I don't really know what
the texture of that would feel like. I think they're
in human and natural sweetness. But you're right, there's still
(31:14):
sweetness in there. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah sweetness, but yeah, no,
I agree with you, and there is a difference between
artificial and natural sweetness. But I agree with you that
when you're having product with sweetener and specific ingredients like
the tapioca, it changes the mouthfeel.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
So if you think about a high fat product, whether
it's even avocado.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Or cake or baking, you know, rich brownie or a
rich cake.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
It's got a real texture to it, and that gives
a lot of satisfaction, a lot of pleasure. The issue
I have with some of these heavily processed products is
that they don't give that same mouth feel, and it's
almost too sweet. It's not a natural sweetness. So it
sort of changes the way we process and enjoy that product.
And I think that sometimes if you don't get that
same satisfaction load that you would normally get with cake,
(32:00):
actually eat more of it.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
And I was thinking, because you.
Speaker 2 (32:02):
Said that there's twelve serves, that means that in the
half of a cake, I'm trying to visualize it. That's
six pieces in half a cake. Now most of us
wouldn't cut that, we'd cut it into four, I think. So, yeah,
you're right, you're probably getting more like two fifty even
up to three hundred calories in the serve that should
be described, and that doesn't make it that much lower
than regular cake. So to put it in perspective, if
(32:23):
you cut your cake, probably eight pieces is how we
normally cut it, not twelve.
Speaker 1 (32:29):
Absolutely, and I mean the boxes it's eight bucks a pop.
You still need to add milk, three eggs, some sort
of non dairy spread or butter into it, and then
you've got to add frosting to that as well.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
Yeah, so we haven't calculated that either.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
No, No, that's preparing the cake like normal. But you're
in a light non dairy spread. So again, if you
would have stuved that for butter, the calorie content would
go over or increase. And that's also using water. So
again if you were to use a milk, which they
could actually recommend they say a cup of milk, slush
nut milk, or water, so they've calculated the nutritional is
using a light non dairy spread and water. So the
(33:02):
overall calories of that. If you were to use a
skim milk plus some butter, would probably be over two
hundred cows a slice. And again let's talk about it.
Let's be real about the serving size. It's probably going
to be three hundred calories upwards of that. My view
has always been with these types of things I call
salt food sushi, have what you want and get the
maximum benefit out of it and move on. Like if
I felt like a piece of cake, I would go
(33:23):
to my local cafe, buy a piece, whether I ate
a few spoons of it, half of it, shared it
with David, whatever it was, and then I'd move on.
I wouldn't then have three quarters of a cake sitting
in my fridge begging me to eat it for the
next couple of days. So I really do think, particularly
if your goal is around fat loss, it's just that temptation.
You can't you can't bake a whole cake and not
expect to eat the whole cake within a couple of days.
(33:44):
So I think reducing that temptation, particularly if you're at
home and lockdown, is probably a good idea. And I
definitely think you can do a much better version yourself
at home. As you mentioned, some of my favorite natural
type of sweetness are monk fruit to bake with as well.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
And I think it's really bad form to suggest people
use those spreads to mix a cake. Like, not only nutritionally,
is that introducing really processed fat. It won't mix well
in a cake, nor will unsweetened almond milk. So you're
gonna end up with an interesting product and definitely not
be my recommendation ever to use a process plant spread.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
That just to keep it vegan, I think, because there's
option on the label. So they're suggesting a non dairy
pet plant spread which is highly processed, and some sort
of plant based milk as well. Yeah, so who knows
what product is going to come out, Like.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
I can't imagine what it's like.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
So yeah that we don't want to be too negative,
but if we're being honest, yeah, I would definitely not
be making it using the recommended If I did make it,
I would absolutely use butter. I don't I think olive
oil would taint it too much flavor wise. Perhaps a
light olive oil you could try, but I definitely would
not be doing it on an unsweetened milk. I would
absolutely use a dairy to at least get some thickness
(34:51):
to it. So yeah, interesting product and but very popular.
People seem to like them, but it's definitely not on
my prescribed list for my clients.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
I think people like them because, like we talked about,
correct me if I'm wrong. Last week's episode was on
health Halos. This is one hundred percent of health Halo.
But then the perception is you're making a healthier sugar
free cake. So what do you do. You go and
you eat two or three slices of it instead of
just one, because there's that perceived benefit that this is healthier.
And this is my whole gripe, but the whole marketing industry, Susie,
And what people forget is because they think it's healthier,
(35:20):
then they go and eat a little bit more, and
a little bit more and a little bit more, and
before you know, you've had five hundred calories of your
sugar free cake, which who cares if there's no sugar
in it, it's still five hundred calories, which contributes to
your calorie load overall. So my view has always been,
if you're going to have some sort of treat, have
to treat that you want the most enjoy the heck
out of it mindfully and just move on after that.
And I think for a lot of people, were best
(35:41):
not to bake an entire cake unless we've got twelve
kids at home who may be able to help us
adam eat it. If not, if it's just you at home,
or it's you as a partner or something, you're better
off probably just going to buy a small piece from
a local cafe and supporting them, or you know, maybe
even just a quartering the recipe and making it a
little tin instead of using the entire box. Perhaps is
it better idea as well? We don't have to bake
(36:01):
the entire cake. We can make those little tiny rumik
and one two serve cakes could be a better option.
Speaker 3 (36:08):
But if it looks like cake, it's probably cake.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
We always say, health ha los health alas.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
All right, Well, that is leading us to our final segment,
and we had a lesson to question come up, and
we do go through all of your questions that come
through on Instagram at the Nutrition Couch podcast, so feel
free to send them through. And this one was about
how do we approach nutrition for young girls, so adolescent
girls as they are starting to go through puberty, because
of course their bodies are going through some changes. Sometimes
(36:36):
they stop doing their regular exercise, they're not doing as
much sport, they might gain some weight, or they might
becoming quite obsessed or focused on food. So someone asked,
you know, how do we broach that with teenage girls?
And I'll kick us off because I have worked with
adolescents for my entire career, and it can be a
really challenging time, given that there's a lot of social
(36:56):
media modeling around diets and food, and it can become
quite a focal point. I think the thing that I
really try and focus on as a starting point is
maintaining some sort of physical activity. I think one of
the most profound thing that changes with teenage girls, particularly
as they move through their senior years of high school,
is they often become really sidentary. So if they're not
naturally into a big sport, they'll suddenly give up any
(37:18):
other weekend sport, and all of a sudden, they're online
all the time, which inevitably means they're sitting. And so
if they're prone to weight game because of their changes
of going through puberty and then also having a lot
of teenage snack food or eating out with their friends
at shopping centers and starting to auto uber eats and
all the things that teenagers do. For example, we know
that teenagers are one of the greatest consumers of soft drink. Inevitably,
(37:39):
that's a recipe for disaster for a lot of a
lot of teenagers because they gain weight, they're sitting around
a lot more, they're not doing any exercise. So factoring
in regular movement and activity, even if it's walking with
friends or a gym membership. A number of the gyms,
including Fitness First when things open up again, have a
special teenage membership that they can utilize in holidays, and
just making sure that physical activity becomes a regular part of.
Speaker 3 (38:00):
The family environment.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
And that's really important for parents who work full time
and don't get home till after the kids are home
from school. You can then safely assume they've been sitting
down on their devices or computer or doing homework for
three to four hours a day. So just making sure
that that movement becomes a regular pant of family life
is really important. I think, be really focused on what
foods you stock at home. So it never ceases to
(38:22):
amaze me that parents will bring kids in and young
kids as well, and they'll be winging about their food
habits and their snack food behavior, but at the end
of the day, someone is keeping that process snack food
or white bread in the house. So if you want
your kids to be healthy, making sure that the bulk
of the food in the house is healthy and they
don't have access to as much of that package process
food goes a huge way in cementing these really positive behaviors.
(38:45):
And the other thing, I guess it's becoming a family
project where everyone's eating pretty well. Like it's really difficult
to ignite change if you've got a dad who is
eating really poorly and not exercising, or a mum who
gets home laid and perhaps isn't having proper meals. More
that the family can demonstrate and give good health examples
as part of their day to day, the better that's
(39:05):
going to be for especially younger teenagers, say age between
ten and fourteen. Of course, once girls get a little
bit older, they're a lot more self sufficient, but in
those really dominant years, say ten to fourteen, maintaining really
healthy habits within the household, stocking the foods that you
want them to eat, not having soft drink and juice
around and keeping at a certain level of physical activity
or goes a really long way in cementing some of
(39:26):
these positive health habits.
Speaker 1 (39:28):
And I think you mentioned a good point. You have
to be the role model. And that's the thing. Like
clients used to come into the hospital and say, you know,
talk about their own, you know, their own nutrition concerns,
but then bring their teenage kids into it as well,
and it's like somebody is either buying that food, and
I mean once they're you know, sixteen seventeen, they're earning
their own income, that's a different story. But in their
younger teens, if you're going to supply that food, chances
(39:49):
are those kids are going to eat it. So it's
really around what you're buying and supplying and how you're
being a role model. If kids are like sponges, if
they're going to grow up and seeing mom start a
new diet every four weeks, or mom never eats carbs
at dinner, those things are gonna rub off on teenagers.
And teenagers there's so much fear around carbohydrates and fear
around sugar, and they just we want to focus on
(40:12):
nutrition positively, So seeing nutrition as fuel for our body,
focus on exercise and movement that they enjoy. Talk about
fueling their bodies for energy, eating for health, eating for energy,
eating and listening to their bodies. Learning those skills of
mindful and intuitive eating regular meal patterns as well is
a really important thing, especially for teenagers. They're going through
(40:32):
some of them really really large growth berts. I know
that when I was a I think i've been about
six foot Torson is about fourteen years old, Suzi Like,
I was a big kid, like tightwise, and I used
to eat, you know, sometimes more than my dad. And
my mum never said anything. She was like, as long
as you're hungry, you can have more. And it was
always within my control to learn to regulate that. And
kids are really great regulators of their own appetite and
(40:54):
fullness levels. We want to continue to carry that into
you know, our teenage years as well. So be that
really good good role model for your child, allow them
to build their own plate. Don't always serve them what
you think is an appropriate portion, because teenagers are hungry
as some days and they're not as hungry other days.
But I really do think that young girls in particular
go through so many changes in puberty, we get stretch marks,
(41:16):
we have bloody periods, and we have acne, and it's
a really tough time. But the more you talk about
that and are open with your kids, I think the
easier that becomes for them, and just monitor their movements online,
be really really worry about who they're following on social media.
A lot of these celebrities are airbrushing their photos and
they're just doing ridiculous things for their photos and distorting
(41:36):
their bodies through photoshop in a way that that's not
even real. And if teenage girls are growing up thinking
that sailor isn't normal, or acne isn't normal, or bloating
isn't normal, then that's not a good thing. So really
be wary that they're following some good positive role models online,
and honestly, there are so many these days on social
media good positive role models. Just go through their feed
(41:56):
and talk to them about you know, who they should
be following, because this this is real life, and this
is the Instagram glamorize I look perfect in every photo,
which just isn't the real deal. So when teenage girls
start to get some stretch marks, and I had quite
a few stretch marks because I had huge gross berts
during puberty, you know, and they start to see a
little bit of cellulart on the back of their legs
and they freak out and they think, oh, my goodness,
(42:17):
I'm the only one who has this, and they try
to cover it up. It's really nice to be following
people on social media who normalize that and say, you know,
the majority of people have stretch marks and cellulart and
that sort of thing, not the minority, which is what
we think because of social media. So I really do
think monitor their social media accounts and put them in
touch with really positive role models on social media as well,
(42:40):
and focus on change as a normal part of growing up,
like try to normalize it as best as you can.
And in terms of nutrition, get them into the kitchen,
get them cooking, teaching them to eat as much color
and as much diversity as possible. Take them into the
shops and let them choose different types of fruits and veggies,
and get them involved in the meal planning, and once
or twice a week, get them into the kitchen cooking
with you. Because young girls, most of them, love cooking,
(43:03):
they love being creative. Allow that to happen and You'll
find that nutrition is a lot easier for them as
they grow up if they're learning about foods and learning
how to nourish and fuel their body versus seeing mom
do every single diet and never eat carbs at dinner time.
There's a lot we can do in terms of supporting
young girls from a nutrition perspective.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
One hundred percent and a shift away from teaching them
to order in as a routine part of the diet,
because I find a lot of busy families will be
ordering dinners in three four times a week and that
has a really strong follow on effect to kids thinking
it's normal to be eating takeaway and fried home delivered
meals regularly when you're busy. So definitely use their skills
getting them in the kitchen. They're very capable, particularly girls
(43:44):
as they get a little bit older, and probably the
last take home messages. Also, if you have a teenage
girl who decides to become vegetarian or even vegan, get
them to a dietitian and a crediting practicing dietitian to
balance their diet early and make sure they don't become
risk of disordered eating and risk eating patterns and ticking
the box on their essential nutrients like their protein, calcium, iron,
(44:04):
incredibly important for that target group.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
Absolutely. I mean I used to work with a lot
of we'd had a lot of eating disorder clients at
the hospital, and it broke my heart to see twenty
year olds with backgrounds and disordered eating since they were
teens have problems with their bones at twenty years old,
like multiple fractures and being told that you will probably
always be osteoporotic and you're twenty years old, So we
don't want that to happen. So absolutely, if your teenagers
are coming to you saying I'm vegetarian, I only drink
(44:29):
almond milk, I won't touch sugar, there are some red
flags in terms of disordered eating. Not saying that your
teenager might have an eating disorder, but it can very
quickly go from a disordered eating pattern and wanting to
be quote unquote healthy, and that healthy takes a couple
of steps too far, and that goes down the path
of disordered eating, which goes down the path of an
eating disorder. So absolutely get a professional such as a
(44:51):
dietician involved early to teach your children how to narish
and fuel their bodies and not restrict them or diet
them or follow other online social media influences. And there
is a very big vegan and plant based push online
at the moment. I'm not saying that it's a bad
thing to be plant based, but you can absolutely do
it wrong and cause more harm than good. So do
not let your teenage girls in particular cut out a
(45:13):
lot of nutrients without the support of a professional. So
incredibly important, one hundred percent. What aful? All right, well, Susie.
That brings us to the end of the Nutrition Catch
for another week. It's sad, but we'll be in your
inbox next week, guys, So if you haven't done so already,
please don't forget to subscribe. So a lot of the
rankings in the charts are actually based on subscription, So
if you love us and you listen to us every week,
(45:35):
please make sure you a subscribe to the podcast because
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Shoot us through any questions, make sure you comment on
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(45:55):
what your favorite part is, and if you've got any
suggestions for future episodes, please let us know and we
will be in your inbox Sunday morning next week, and
thank you for listening.
Speaker 3 (46:05):
Have a great week.
Hi, I'm Leanne Ward and I'm Susie Burrow and welcome
to the Nutrition Couch, a weekly podcast from two of
Austraias leading dietitians, bringing you everything that is new in
the world of nutrition, diets and good food from the
Nutrition Couch. Today, we're chatting about a media article which
asks what is more influential diet or exercise for weight loss.
(00:21):
Our client case study of the week is about perimenopause,
and on our most popular segment, this supermarket Product of
the Week, we discuss the new sugar free cake mixes
in our supermarkets. And in our final segment, one of
our listeners has asked us how to approach nutrition for
young girls as they go through puberty. But before we
kick into this week's episode, Susie, how are you going?
Speaker 2 (00:42):
I'm struggling a little bit leand right in lockdown, I
find everyone is really cranky. And an observation I've had
in this really intense COVID period that we're going through
is that whatever people's underlying personality is, it seems to
be exaggerated. So if you're anxious, you become more anxious.
If you're depressive, you tend to become lower in your mood.
(01:03):
And I'm struggling a little bit. I've got kids at
home trying to teach the maths, trying to get them
to add up dollars and cents. I don't think it's
that difficult, but my children are really struggling, and so
this is nice to come and talk something positive. And
I made my husband take the children away instead, don't
bring them back for at least two hours, just so
I can have a minute to myself. So this is
(01:25):
the highlight of my week.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Love it. So if the adult conversation on the nutrition
couch is the highlight of your week, thank you for
being with us, DA can I agree it's tough for
especially our Sydney siders. So we're feeling you. Guys, Sydney
stay strong and we hope that the nutrition Couch every
Sunday gets you through a tough week.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
And I do have some exciting news.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
I finally managed to get you to send me a
bump picture and so I'll pop that up for our
listeners as well, so we've got something to look at
and I like to see those photos.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
I think it's nice.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
It's a reminder that there's bigger, more important things. Out
there when people are having new babies and things. So
that's a nice, nice addition to this week's.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Episode getting to the halfway markness getting harder at a hide?
All right, Susie, So what was trending in the media
this week was an article that you found in The
Times and it was titled what is more influential for
weight loss? Is it dart or is it exercise? And
I think it's a really interesting conversation because I personally
know a lot of my followers try to, for lack
(02:23):
of a better word, out exercise a poor diet, right,
So a lot of people over emphasize exercise and underemphasize
how important nutrition is from a bat loss perspective. So
I've got my own thoughts around this. But Susie, how
do you feel about this? Is it dart or rix's exercise?
Just when we're talking about weight loss.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
This is a really common question that we're asked, you
know what is more important? And indeed, I think we've
all been guilty of thinking that if we've indulged a
little bit over the weekend, we'll simply do a bit
more exercise to buffer it out. I know that each
day I tend to do a bit of a mental
calculation when it comes to dolling out the treats at night,
so it's not necessarily a healthy way to think of it,
but it is a common question that comes up, and
(03:00):
hence the headline that I saw. And I also thought
when I picked it for our chat today that we'd
probably have slightly different opinions on this, So I thought
it was it was always nice for a chat to
get some different perspectives of two different clinicians working with
different people. So I do have some fairly set thoughts
on it, and the way I describe it to people
when they ask or in the media or with clients
is that I say, when we start with a weight
(03:22):
loss journey, so you may have a goal of losing
five kilos or ten kilos in the initial stages. In
my experience, I like to focus on diet, so for
the first four, six, eight, even twelve weeks, I tend
to give a lot of attention to developing a strong
eating plan with very set calorie and macro nutrient targets
(03:46):
because I know that if the client is if the client,
if my client is adherent to that program, and for
that first week or two or three can be relatively
strict and keep calories tightly trolled and not be lured
by a weekend.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Of wine and extras.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
That I'm going to get at least a couple of
kilo's weight loss on the scales, and I know psychologically
that that is one of the most significant predictors of
long term weight loss success. It's getting initial results now.
The reason that I tend to say it's more important
initially is that if we're talking about calories, and specifically
women and smaller women, which is ninety percent of the
(04:24):
group that I work with, I'm only dealing with calories
between say twelve fourteen hundred and maybe up to eighteen
hundred for my most active females. That's a pretty small
number overall really, So they may start on twelve hundred
calories or fourteen hundred calories, and then inevitably they're probably
going to increase that as they become more metabolically efficient
(04:46):
and better at burning calories and hopefully over time becoming
more active.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
But they're never going to.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Be eating eight hundred calories. They're never going to be
eating two and a half thousand calories. So I've only
got a set period of time to get that calorie
load control and right for them, and then eventually when
they've lost a little bit, might be five, might be ten,
and of course depending on how long or how much
weight they've got to lose. Eventually, the only thing that
I can really change around is how much they're moving
(05:14):
or how much activity they're doing or specifically training in
a way that's going to make their body more efficient
at burning or build more muscle tissues so.
Speaker 3 (05:22):
They can build more calories.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
So I'm not dealing with a group of women who
are doing physique changing significantly in the sense of really
getting into the gym, and then also not working on
overly strict body fat goals of getting it, say below
twenty percent.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
I'm working with the average.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Woman whose age say, late thirties, mid forties, who is
going to do a little bit of exercise and she
wants to lean up, but she's not wanting to be
a fitness physique model, and hence, if I can get
her to focus on the diet and getting that really
strong and a really strong foundation for a period, so
that becomes the default. Eventually when it comes to those
bigger weight loss, that's when for me the exercise becomes
(06:01):
more important. But I know your position is a little
bit different, and I think that that's great for us
to sometimes have different positions on that. So I say,
initially for that first weight loss diet absolutely more important
for me because that's where people either are really adherent
or go off the rails very quickly, and then it
becomes more about getting your body more metabolically efficient and
really looking at the training over time.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
I agree with you there and what I tend to
do with my clients. I work with mostly active females,
so they're already quite active. A lot of them are
potentially even too active. I think they're trying to out
exercise abo our diet. Like a lot of people who
sign up to my coaching services, you know, are working
out seven times a week, sometimes twice a day, and
they're still gaining weight and the nutrition scrap. So really
what we do is we taper back the exercise and
(06:46):
really focus on nutrition because purely for fat loss one
hundred percent, nutrition is is King. I always say that
nutrition is King exercises Queen together they make it Kingdom
set up before multiple times on my own podcasts and others,
I've been interviewed on and it really resonates with people
because most people do have too many treats, and then
what we tend to do as humans is underestimate our
nutrition and overestimate our exercise. So I've seen so many
(07:08):
clients who are like, oh, I burned eight hundred calories
in my gym session. Because when fitness Watch tells me,
I'm like, I can promise you you're not burning knowing
what they've done and the intensity that they did it at,
they have not burned eight hundred calories in that session.
I can promise you that. So then what they do
is they go and supplement that with like four glasses
of one on a Thursday night or something like that.
So I really think trying to match, you know, the
calories burn to the calories that you're eating is just
(07:30):
a really inaccurate way for a lot of people. So
I one hundred percent prioritize nutrition for my clients from
a fat loss perspective. And then if clients have a
goal of getting lean, a tone of stronger, you know,
squatting seventy eighty ninety one hundred kilos, that's where, of
course exercise becomes incredibly important. But not just exercise the
right type of exercise for the goal that the client has,
(07:51):
and also to keep us metabolically strong. So if we
have a significant amount of weight to lose ten twenty
thirty kilos, we have to be doing some sort of
exercise in order to keep us metabolically strong, in order
to allow us to continue to be in a deficit
for longer and longer, because you know, twenty thirty kilos
could take six months plus to really get off. And
if we're just low calorie, low calorie, low calorie, sure
(08:12):
we're going to lose, but we're going to come to
the point where we stall and we plateau, and that's
where the exercise component does become really important. But I
get my clients to put ninety percent of the focus
into nutrition because most of them are already exercising, and
then we just use exercise as that mental health component.
It helps us sleep better, it helps us to reduce
stress and anxiety, it makes us feel good, it gives
us more energy. So that's how I like my clients
(08:34):
to think about exercise, which I'm sure you do as well, Susie.
I just think that you know, most people over emphasize
exercise So from my point of view for fat loss,
nutrition is one hundred percent key, and you can lose
body fat without doing any exercise. Sure, exercise is going
to make a lot easier, and we of course encourage
exercise from a mental health and a general health point
(08:54):
of view, but you can purely use lose body fat
from a nutrition side of things only.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
And I think two things that have come up for
me just as we're chatting. The first is that probably
one of the other reasons I tend to focus purely
on diet initially is that I find a lot of
my clients are overwhelmed in their lives. They're very busy,
they're working full time, they're juggling kids, they're single parents,
and to just lay out more and more and more
onto their to do list sometimes can be a bit overwhelming.
(09:20):
So my clients tend to be a little bit older
than yours, so they do tend to have a few
more of those variables to be dealing with.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
So we all have to eat.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
So I often say to them, look, let's just start
with getting the diet structured and some meal planning and
some food prep.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
Going, because that's a big job in itself.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
If you're not used to it, and then let's build
from there and just start with some basic movement because
that doesn't add too much stress to them. So I
think that's the first thing. And I think the other
thing is that people tend to be either on or
off in their mind. So a big part of any
intervention is really coming to an understanding and a sense
(09:57):
of peace with the fact that this isn't a plan
that you're on now, this is the way forward forever.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
And still I think it's a common thing that people
are confused of.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
They think they're going to be on the diet, and
then they're often as opposed to thinking of this is
actually long term the way to get the foundation of
the diet. This isn't a short term thing. The only
thing that might change is you might start eating a
little bit more at night as you've lost weight, or
you might have two meals off a week rather than
one when you're actively trying to lose weight. But really
this is the way of eating moving forward, because this
is what's ticking the box and all of your key
(10:28):
nutrients as well as at the moment supporting weight loss.
So I think that's a big psychological hurdle to get
over to think this isn't what I'm just doing now,
this is what I'm going to be doing forever. And
it's sometimes approached I guess with a minimalistic attitude as well,
because people think, right, I can be really strict with
the diet, or I can do this much exercise now,
knowing that eventually they're going to stop. And again, I
(10:49):
prefer to build and build the habit, starting with the
food of things that people are going to be able
to do long term, then throw everything at the problem,
all the exercise, all the diet at once, and know
that they're probably going to get tired and over it
within a few weeks. So I'm always planning for the
long term, particularly when someone presents who's wanting to lose
twenty thirty kilos.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
One hundred percent, and that mindset's so key. And if
you're going to go one hundred percent gung ho in
week one and you're going to lose the weight in
week two, three, four, and everything's fine and dandy, but
why a week five and six you then hit a
platter and you're like, man, I'm exercising seven days a week,
emating nothing but bloody veggies and you know, steam fish.
Where do I go from here? And I haven't lost
any weight this week? You get so in your head
(11:28):
about this that you're totally off the dit. You're like,
what's the point? I'm trying so hard, I can't give
anything more. I'm off the diet. So that's why as
dieticians we always recommend like slow and steady wins the race.
So sustainable change is long term, not going one thousand
miles an hour from the very beginning. So once you
hit that wall, then you've got nowhere to go, and
then all of the you know, the good work that
you've done becomes undone when you fall off the diet.
(11:50):
So one hundred percent slow and steady. But I think
we can both agree, Susie. Nutrition is absolutely key from
a fat loss perspective.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Ultimately, it always comes back to calorie control and not
going from fourteen hundred calories to two and a half
thousand and back again. It's about keeping it as tight
as you can most of the time, and then you'll.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Keep in control of your weight absolutely all.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
Right, So we'll have some feedback on that, I'm sure,
but that's where we're sitting on is diet or exercise
more important at different stages. But a topic that we
were going to talk about today that came from some
of our work with clients, and specifically, I've been seeing
this a huge amount in the media over the past
few months, and I think it's because some of the
key journalists are going are in their late forties and fifties,
(12:32):
and so they're going through what we're going to talk about,
which of course is menopause, right, and their bodies are
getting ready for that now. The thing about perimenopause, which
is the period sort of up to ten years before
actual menopause when you stop ovulating completely, and the huge
number of symptoms you can present with, whether it's hot
flushes or weight gain, or fatigue, or irritability or depression,
(12:57):
is that it really links in very power flee to
our nutrition. And I actually haven't seen a huge amount
discussed about the role of nutrition and diets in terms
of perimenopause and menopause, but when we take a really
close look at what's happening physiologically, they're very closely linked.
And there's actually some good science as well around managing
(13:17):
some of these premenopausal and menopausal symptoms. And also perhaps
from our perspectively and the weight gain which is so
incredibly common. So I thought today, rather than target an
individual client, which is what we normally do, we're going
to talk about it as a general theme of perimenopause
and menopause and the role of our diets, because I
think a lot of people in their sort of mid
(13:38):
to late forties and fifties will really this will resonate
with them. So a few of the key physiological variables
that we're dealing with that profoundly impact our nutrition. It's
basically a drop in estrogen over time, and our hormones
often talk about hormones are are everything and absolutely in
this stage, very profound effect on specifically the way we
(14:00):
metabolize a number of things and are very close link
to weight gain because basically estrogen, which reduces as we age,
is very protective against weight gain and specifically weight gain
around that abdominal area.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
So basically, as our estrogen levels reduced.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Which is linked to a number of other issues like
the hot flushes, we are just much more likely to
gain weight centrally. And that's where we hear about women
who never had issues with a waste before all of
a sudden they're coming in with waste measurements at eighty
ninety centimeters, and this is weight that they've never carried
around in their tummy. And sometimes I'll anecdotally hear my
female clients talk about it being related to their wine intake,
(14:37):
but probably more important, it's likely linked to a reduction
in estrogen over time. Now, estrogen is such a powerful hormone.
It has such a profound effect over our mood. Also,
calcium metabolism, and so we're at much higher risk of
developing bone issues osteopenia or osteoporosis because we're not as
good as metabolizing calcium, which of course is crucial for
(15:00):
healthy bones. The other issue is if you're going through
perimenopause or menopause and bleeding sporadically, or perhaps bleeding much
more often than every four weeks, of course you're losing
a lot more blood, which means that you're at risk
of low iron levels, which again can make you incredibly tired.
It can and if your sleep is already disrupted because
of these hormonal changes. So in summary, I would say
(15:22):
that preventing any weight gain that is coming as a
result of perimenopause and menopause is one of the most
powerful things women in their forties and fifties can do
to ensure that they do not have long term weight issues,
because if you start to gain weight centrally in your
forties and fifties, and instead of being five kilos overweight,
(15:43):
then suddenly you're ten or even twenty kilos overweight. It
is so profoundly difficult to get weight off centrally once
it's been there for a while. If you've noticed that
your waist is starting to creep up, taking active steps
to prevent that weight gain, and we'll talk about some
strategies in a minute, is incredibly, incredibly important. Now, when
we take a look at what the science says, it's
(16:06):
quite interesting because there has been quite a few studies DOTA,
and you're going to talk about one in a minute,
specifically about hot flushes, but I'll talk about the main
data that's coming out around weight gain and preventing weight gain,
and that actually, interestingly enough, comes from a Mediterranean style
of eating. So if we take a look at what's
happening with a Mediterranean style of eating, it's not an
overly technical diet, it's not overly special, But what it
(16:27):
does do. It slightly reduces carbohydrate intake because there's a
much greater focus on fruit and vegetable intake as opposed
to grains and cereals. And it's also very very rich
in amiga three fats, so they, as we know, are
very strongly associated with a reduction in inflammation in the body.
And what we also know is that when we're gaining
weight centrally, it's probably linked to insulin levels over time.
(16:49):
So insulin is one of the main hormones that regulates
glucose and fat metabolism in the body, and it actively
blocks fat loss when insulin levels are high. So if
I take the standard female that I'm seeing of these
ages in their forties and fifties, inevitably they sit down
quite a lot because they're working long hours and they're
perhaps not sleeping overly well, particularly if they're going through
(17:11):
some of these hormonal shifts. They don't have a lot
of time to exercise, so they're probably not doing a
lot of weight bearing activity, so their bones aren't.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
Looking overly healthy.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
They may even have swapped to plant based eating where
they're having almond milk that's not fortified with calcium, so
their calcium intake tends to be low. That's a really
important factor. And then inevitably and a lot of clients
we see eat a lot of carbohydrate, way too much
for what's happening in their body in the case of
perimenopause and menopause, and they're sitting down and not burning
it off. So they're having cereal or toast for breakfast,
(17:40):
they're grabbing sandwich or sushi for lunch, they're snacking on
rice cakes and fruit because they think it's healthy or
healthy baked goods. And then at night they might have
some wine but also some rice some pasta. Now, that
is a high carbohydrate diet that is not a Mediterranean diet.
That is fifty to sixty percent carbohydrate. And I guarantee
if you have got reducing estrogen OVA time and abdominal
(18:01):
weight gain, that will be writing your insulin levels up
and you are in a cycle towards pre diabetes and
type two diabetes, which can easily be reversed early if
you keep on top of that menopausal weight gain and
reduce your carbohydrate slightly and focus your diet around more
of a Mediterranean eating so it's not an overly sexy
or flash diet, but the research is strong in terms
(18:23):
of reducing inflammation, reducing some of these symptoms which you'll
talk about in a second, and basically preventing this terrible
weight gain that happens to a significant number of menopausal women.
And not only does it make you feel terrible, it's
really really hard to get off. So the take home
message is that if you know that you've got some
perimenopausal menopausal symptoms, you're not feeling great, probably your estrogen's
(18:45):
shifting around. The doctor said, you're in perimenopause or even menopause.
Getting your macronutrient, intaking your carbohydrate and preventing and getting
that weight off will be one of the most powerful
things you can do to preserve your health as you
move into your sixty seventies.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
You get it off. Now, that was a big cut
of seal.
Speaker 1 (19:03):
Love it, love it, and I'm going to summarize that
in full key points. So firstly, Mediterranean diet. If you
have no idea what that is, booking one on one
with the dietitian it will be very beneficial. Weight training.
Weight training is so incredibly important for pery and metopause.
I cannot stress that enough. It's the time in our
life when you know, we come out of you know,
I think strength training and resistance training is becoming a
(19:23):
lot more popular within the twenties and thirties and forties
age group. But then I think life just gets busy,
things get in the way, you know, we swap that
for longer walks and that sort of thing. So I
just think that it's something that drops off. So weight
training is so incredibly important, not only for bone heals,
but for your metabolism as well. After forty every year,
I think the research is something like you lose two
(19:44):
percent of your bone mass or you lose two percent
of your muscle mass every year, so your body is
working against you. You really need to focus on that
resistance training two to three times a week. If you
have no idea what you're doing, higher trainer, Higher a professional.
So weight training for bone health, some metabolism. Calcium so
incredibly important for menopause, particularly if you don't eat dairy.
(20:05):
You need thirteen hundred milligrams of dietary calcium a day
for menopause. This is for you know, healthy adults, and
that's how many serves susy.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Oh a lot at least three to four, and this
where some of those super foods.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Like the tuna we've mentioned before, which is very high
in calcium. But check your plant based milks. If you're
a plant based milk person, you have to make sure
one's fortified, because often the ones that the briwsters are
using at the cafes are not, so you think you're
having milk and you are not getting any of the
protein or the calcium that you think you are.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
One skin milk is probably one of our top recommendations
for menopause. So if you don't, or you choose not
to drink dairy products or eat dairy products, that's absolutely okay.
You may or may not need a supplement or you're
going to eat need it. You know, eat a lot
of other bony fish and that sort of thing, dark
green leafy vegetables, and also consider an iron supplement if
you are bleeding heavily or if your bleeds have become
(20:56):
a lot more regular. I've talked to clients who you know,
have been bleeding for six to eight weeks, So not
only have I sent them to their GP, I've just
started them straight on an iron tablet. Because if you've
got to bleed for six to eight weeks straight. You
can rest assured that you're going to feel pretty crappy
after a couple of weeks, so really monitor your iron
levels if that bleeding is, you know, anything more than
sort of that four or five quote unquote normal period.
(21:16):
And then finally, Mediterranean diet has been shown in the
research to really help with hot flushes. So there was
a big study in I think it was Australia, SUSI
where research is actually found that menopaus are women who
ate diets high in fruit, fruits, certain veggies, pasta, and
even a little bit of red wine aka and Mediterranean
(21:37):
style eating pattern were up to twenty percent less likely
to have hot flushes and night sweats. And on the
flip side of that, you might think of twenty percent
doesn't sound like a lot, but you know, if you're
someone who's going through hot flushes, it's absolutely worth a trial.
But on the flip side of that, menopause are women
who ate high sugar, high fat diets were twenty three
percent more likely to experience hot flushes and night sweats.
(21:59):
So I think that that's a great study. And researchers
also noted that women who adhered to the low fat,
high fiber diet trend had lower and more stable istugen
levels overall as well. So there's absolutely things that we
can do from a nutrition perspective, but there's a lot
of things that you need to think about. So this
is confusing to you if you're not sure how to
focus on your calcium and your iron and implement an
(22:19):
intimate Mediterranean style diet and stabilize that your hormones. This
is a perfect time to book in with a dietician
one on one to really optimize your health during a
really important time of your life.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
It is, and I think some simple tips that they
can take away. You've got to get the oily fish
three times a week, and if you're not a fish eater,
look at potential supplementation to get that amiga three fat
up there. And of course what we would also say
leanne is a Mediterranean diet doesn't include processed snack food.
There's no biscuits, there's no cakes, there's no rice crackers.
(22:51):
You know, it really is more about well balanced meals
through the day and not this frequency of eating that's
pack full of sugars and vegetable oils in processing. So
keeping that as minimal as possible in the diet is
a really important part of achieving the balance.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
That the Mediterranean diet.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
Supports absolutely whole foods first, and don't forget the wine
recommendations that come with the Mediterranean DIT. A standard glass
of wine I think, as per the Mediterranean DIT is
probably about one hundred meals. Most people would pour about
three hundred meals is one glass, And most people struggle
to stick to one glass, don't they looozy.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
But they maybe a glass all of a sudden. It's
not our fault.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Those glasses are like goblets, and they pour one hundred
mel and charge you seventeen dollars.
Speaker 3 (23:29):
It's devastating, But that's the standard serve.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
So that red wine is not a daily thing. It
perhaps doesn't even need to be a weekly thing. Just
very much mine your intake because you will find that
you get that additional abdominal fat if your intake, particularly
of alcohol, is getting up there.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Well, the food that you eat when you're drinking stores
and that's why we get that very pronounced abdominal weight.
So people think it's not the wine necessarily, it's the
mix of what we're having. The potato chips, and then
fried food at the pub when we're all to go there.
So one hundred percent it's the overall pattern of eating.
But you know, it's a very positive diet and an
(24:05):
easily sustainable one too, But it will really make a
big difference. So if you have any of those symptoms
and know that your body is not feeling as good
as it once did, definitely invest some time and getting
your diet sorted by the right professional, someone who has
a dietetics degree, who is qualified in the science of nutrition.
It will go a long way in paving the way
to a much more positive health position as you get older.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
And absolutely we're going to plug personal trainings here as
well and invest in a good trainer. Now, if you
haven't before, is the time to start or really get
into your weight training. And I mean it's not enough
to just do sort of simple exercises. We really want
to be actually lifting some load and lifting some weight,
whether that's dumbbells or kettlebells, or you know, you're getting
into a squad rack, or if you're at home in lockdown,
(24:49):
you know, order some weights online, get them delivered. Now
is the time to start doing some sort of resistance training.
Your bone health is absolutely going to thank you, as
will your metabolism long term. So now, Susie most popular segment.
We know our listeners love this one, and we thought
this week we would chat about cakes. So I'm not
actually even sure have to pronounced this is it?
Speaker 2 (25:08):
No shoe?
Speaker 3 (25:10):
I like that we're gonna talk about cakes.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
New shoe after telling you not to eat cakes because
it's terrible for metopaors.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
Cakes. Well, a lot of us are at home cooking,
I think which cooking, so it's relevant.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
So this is the ninety nine percent sugar free range.
We're getting a lot of questions, a lot of dms
and messages throughout our Instagram account, which is the Nutrition
Capped podcast. They also have a range of the sugar
free chocolate chips as well, but we chose the rich
chocolate cake to chat about today. Just on the front
of pack labeling which we always tell you guys just
to ignore because it's fancy marketing. It's got four stars,
(25:41):
it's there's fifty percent lower carb, there's a non dairy option,
and it uses natural sweetness. But Susie, let's flick over
to the back of the packet and do you want
to chat our listeners through the nutritionals of this ninety
nine percent sugar free cake mix and let us know
your thoughts.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
They've got a really great website. I will it's a
disclaimer here.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
I haven't tried these products, but like you, I have
been asked a lot about them, I guess because I
like to bake, and I like to bake fairly traditionally
occasionally to get blends. I haven't had a goal of
this product. But the serving size is eighty six grams
per slice. Now correct me if I'm wrong, but that
is a pretty small piece of cake, because my understanding
(26:18):
would be that a cake that you would see if
you're buying a piece from a cafe, would be close
to two hundred grams. I'd say, so this is a
slither that this is nutritionals have been calculated on.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
No normal adult human would have an eighty six gram slice.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
It's very small. So what's eighty six grams?
Speaker 2 (26:34):
It's like, well, it's like three, you know, if you
have a slice of cheese that's like twenty, So it's
like a cheese like it's very little.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
It's twelve slices if you would to slice up a
normal cake. They're saying you should get twelve slices out
of that, and I think most people would get six
to eight slices out. I think that's a reasonable or something. Yeah,
I think twelve is is very very slim.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
He's pushing it. So the energy is seven forty six kilodels,
which is just shy. Have two hundred calories.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
Four point five grams of protein, which I'd say is
coming from the high proportion of wheat flour. Nine point
nine grams are fat and total and two point nine saturated,
so it's still relatively low saturated fat, fourteen point six
grams of total carb ten grams of fiber because it's
got a tapioca fiber bulking it up. The sweetness coming
from erythrotol seven point nine grams, so that's not metabolized
(27:18):
the way normal sugar is, and hence the overall low
sugar content of what they're calculating.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
And the ingredients austraight and wheat.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
Flour isomultole ligasacharides, which is the tapioca flour, erythrotol, cocoa powder, polydextrose,
cornflour dextra and fiber thickner xylotoal baking powder Stevia natural flavors.
Speaker 3 (27:38):
So it does contain gluten. It is not gluten free.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
It's also got milk and soy, so it's not appropriate
for those who are looking with food alerga and tolerance there.
It does say dairy free on the label, but it
says maybe present, so it's must be made in a factory.
And it's got a four health star ratings with fifty
percent lower carbs and market it is using natural sweetness. Now,
people who like sweet food in my experiencely and love
(28:03):
this product. I know a couple of my friends who
enjoy cakes and sweet food.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
They love it.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
I know it's very popular in the supermarket. I have
to be honest with you, it's not something that I recommend,
and there's a reason why.
Speaker 3 (28:18):
Probably a few reasons.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
The first is that I think it's heavily processed, and
if I am having someone make a cake, I would
much rather it be a natural cake with natural ingredients.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
And you know, I often use a wholemeal flower.
Speaker 2 (28:34):
I tend to use some of the sweetness like the
monk fruit as to reduce their overa sugar content on
my baking, or olive oil or some pain butter in it,
and I can sort of make a pretty good cake
with not too much of those ingredients. And also I
find they're quite expensive. They're like seven or eight dollars
a box, So eight dollars. Yeah, I'm not gonna usually
recommend a client goes and buys that and thinks it's
(28:55):
healthier because for me, it's quite processed. Now, I wouldn't
stop someone buying it. I would give recommendations on how
they can enjoy it if they want to, but it
wouldn't be top of my list of recommendations because as
a dietitian, I think it's using a lot of process ingredients,
and I don't want a lot my clients to think
that eating cake is okay just because it appears slightly healthier.
I want them to keep cake as a very occasional
(29:16):
thing they include in their diet, you know, for a
birthday or a special occasion, or if they're really feeling
like it. But I wouldn't be encouraging them to make
cake as part of their normal weekly meal plan, because
if you make a cake, you're probably gonna eat it,
and that's a problem because it's still these calories and
most of us can't deal with eating three or four
pieces of that kind of cake in our meal plan
on a daily basis. So you know, I think it
(29:38):
can have a role if people like it, but it
definitely isn't the top of my list when I'm recommending
products because I like to keep the diet as sort
of unprocessed and natural as possible.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
I don't know, what do you think?
Speaker 1 (29:48):
I agree, I wouldn't recommend this to my clients. I mean,
if they came to be in there said I love it,
it's one of my soul foods. Can we include it,
I'd say, yeah, absolutely, But this isn't something that i'd recommend,
particularly because I mean, if we're being honest, like an
ad verage serving size, no one's going to cut that
cake into twelve slices. Let's be real. Then average serving
size is at least three hundred calories, So from a
calorie perspective, it's probably very similar or maybe slightly less
(30:10):
than just a normal piece of cake. I agree it's
overly processed. The fiber content's pretty good, but at the
same time, maybe too much for some people who don't
tolerate fiber that well. You may get a few excessive
bits of gas or wind after a product like this,
and I mean the ratio is of you know, it's
high fat, low car or lociuer should I say so?
For some people that might fit their macros a little
bit better, but overall, I really don't think. I think
(30:32):
for eight dollars a pop, you'd be much better making
it yourself. And I agree with you. I personally don't
bake a because I don't have kids. So if I
bake David and I have an entire cake, well the
hell we're gonna do with the whole cake. And you know,
I don't work at the hospital anymore. We're not really
going out, you know, we're not here lockdown in Brisbane.
But I'm also not going out and about on purpose either,
just because being pregnant, I'm a little bit worried, and
you know, I'm not going to too many places. So
(30:54):
I'm not going to friends' houses and going to big
parties and barbecues where I'm taking cakes and that sort
of thing with me. So I don't the bake, and
so I agree. I haven't tried this either. I'm not
sure if the texture or the mouth feel or there's
a hell of a lot of artificial sweetness in there,
and at fiber as well. I don't really know what
the texture of that would feel like. I think they're
in human and natural sweetness. But you're right, there's still
(31:14):
sweetness in there. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah sweetness, but yeah, no,
I agree with you, and there is a difference between
artificial and natural sweetness. But I agree with you that
when you're having product with sweetener and specific ingredients like
the tapioca, it changes the mouthfeel.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
So if you think about a high fat product, whether
it's even avocado.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Or cake or baking, you know, rich brownie or a
rich cake.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
It's got a real texture to it, and that gives
a lot of satisfaction, a lot of pleasure. The issue
I have with some of these heavily processed products is
that they don't give that same mouth feel, and it's
almost too sweet. It's not a natural sweetness. So it
sort of changes the way we process and enjoy that product.
And I think that sometimes if you don't get that
same satisfaction load that you would normally get with cake,
(32:00):
actually eat more of it.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
And I was thinking, because you.
Speaker 2 (32:02):
Said that there's twelve serves, that means that in the
half of a cake, I'm trying to visualize it. That's
six pieces in half a cake. Now most of us
wouldn't cut that, we'd cut it into four, I think. So, yeah,
you're right, you're probably getting more like two fifty even
up to three hundred calories in the serve that should
be described, and that doesn't make it that much lower
than regular cake. So to put it in perspective, if
(32:23):
you cut your cake, probably eight pieces is how we
normally cut it, not twelve.
Speaker 1 (32:29):
Absolutely, and I mean the boxes it's eight bucks a pop.
You still need to add milk, three eggs, some sort
of non dairy spread or butter into it, and then
you've got to add frosting to that as well.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
Yeah, so we haven't calculated that either.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
No, No, that's preparing the cake like normal. But you're
in a light non dairy spread. So again, if you
would have stuved that for butter, the calorie content would
go over or increase. And that's also using water. So
again if you were to use a milk, which they
could actually recommend they say a cup of milk, slush
nut milk, or water, so they've calculated the nutritional is
using a light non dairy spread and water. So the
(33:02):
overall calories of that. If you were to use a
skim milk plus some butter, would probably be over two
hundred cows a slice. And again let's talk about it.
Let's be real about the serving size. It's probably going
to be three hundred calories upwards of that. My view
has always been with these types of things I call
salt food sushi, have what you want and get the
maximum benefit out of it and move on. Like if
I felt like a piece of cake, I would go
(33:23):
to my local cafe, buy a piece, whether I ate
a few spoons of it, half of it, shared it
with David, whatever it was, and then I'd move on.
I wouldn't then have three quarters of a cake sitting
in my fridge begging me to eat it for the
next couple of days. So I really do think, particularly
if your goal is around fat loss, it's just that temptation.
You can't you can't bake a whole cake and not
expect to eat the whole cake within a couple of days.
(33:44):
So I think reducing that temptation, particularly if you're at
home and lockdown, is probably a good idea. And I
definitely think you can do a much better version yourself
at home. As you mentioned, some of my favorite natural
type of sweetness are monk fruit to bake with as well.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
And I think it's really bad form to suggest people
use those spreads to mix a cake. Like, not only nutritionally,
is that introducing really processed fat. It won't mix well
in a cake, nor will unsweetened almond milk. So you're
gonna end up with an interesting product and definitely not
be my recommendation ever to use a process plant spread.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
That just to keep it vegan, I think, because there's
option on the label. So they're suggesting a non dairy
pet plant spread which is highly processed, and some sort
of plant based milk as well. Yeah, so who knows
what product is going to come out, Like.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
I can't imagine what it's like.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
So yeah that we don't want to be too negative,
but if we're being honest, yeah, I would definitely not
be making it using the recommended If I did make it,
I would absolutely use butter. I don't I think olive
oil would taint it too much flavor wise. Perhaps a
light olive oil you could try, but I definitely would
not be doing it on an unsweetened milk. I would
absolutely use a dairy to at least get some thickness
(34:51):
to it. So yeah, interesting product and but very popular.
People seem to like them, but it's definitely not on
my prescribed list for my clients.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
I think people like them because, like we talked about,
correct me if I'm wrong. Last week's episode was on
health Halos. This is one hundred percent of health Halo.
But then the perception is you're making a healthier sugar
free cake. So what do you do. You go and
you eat two or three slices of it instead of
just one, because there's that perceived benefit that this is healthier.
And this is my whole gripe, but the whole marketing industry, Susie,
And what people forget is because they think it's healthier,
(35:20):
then they go and eat a little bit more, and
a little bit more and a little bit more, and
before you know, you've had five hundred calories of your
sugar free cake, which who cares if there's no sugar
in it, it's still five hundred calories, which contributes to
your calorie load overall. So my view has always been,
if you're going to have some sort of treat, have
to treat that you want the most enjoy the heck
out of it mindfully and just move on after that.
And I think for a lot of people, were best
(35:41):
not to bake an entire cake unless we've got twelve
kids at home who may be able to help us
adam eat it. If not, if it's just you at home,
or it's you as a partner or something, you're better
off probably just going to buy a small piece from
a local cafe and supporting them, or you know, maybe
even just a quartering the recipe and making it a
little tin instead of using the entire box. Perhaps is
it better idea as well? We don't have to bake
(36:01):
the entire cake. We can make those little tiny rumik
and one two serve cakes could be a better option.
Speaker 3 (36:08):
But if it looks like cake, it's probably cake.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
We always say, health ha los health alas.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
All right, Well, that is leading us to our final segment,
and we had a lesson to question come up, and
we do go through all of your questions that come
through on Instagram at the Nutrition Couch podcast, so feel
free to send them through. And this one was about
how do we approach nutrition for young girls, so adolescent
girls as they are starting to go through puberty, because
of course their bodies are going through some changes. Sometimes
(36:36):
they stop doing their regular exercise, they're not doing as
much sport, they might gain some weight, or they might
becoming quite obsessed or focused on food. So someone asked,
you know, how do we broach that with teenage girls?
And I'll kick us off because I have worked with
adolescents for my entire career, and it can be a
really challenging time, given that there's a lot of social
(36:56):
media modeling around diets and food, and it can become
quite a focal point. I think the thing that I
really try and focus on as a starting point is
maintaining some sort of physical activity. I think one of
the most profound thing that changes with teenage girls, particularly
as they move through their senior years of high school,
is they often become really sidentary. So if they're not
naturally into a big sport, they'll suddenly give up any
(37:18):
other weekend sport, and all of a sudden, they're online
all the time, which inevitably means they're sitting. And so
if they're prone to weight game because of their changes
of going through puberty and then also having a lot
of teenage snack food or eating out with their friends
at shopping centers and starting to auto uber eats and
all the things that teenagers do. For example, we know
that teenagers are one of the greatest consumers of soft drink. Inevitably,
(37:39):
that's a recipe for disaster for a lot of a
lot of teenagers because they gain weight, they're sitting around
a lot more, they're not doing any exercise. So factoring
in regular movement and activity, even if it's walking with
friends or a gym membership. A number of the gyms,
including Fitness First when things open up again, have a
special teenage membership that they can utilize in holidays, and
just making sure that physical activity becomes a regular part of.
Speaker 3 (38:00):
The family environment.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
And that's really important for parents who work full time
and don't get home till after the kids are home
from school. You can then safely assume they've been sitting
down on their devices or computer or doing homework for
three to four hours a day. So just making sure
that that movement becomes a regular pant of family life
is really important. I think, be really focused on what
foods you stock at home. So it never ceases to
(38:22):
amaze me that parents will bring kids in and young
kids as well, and they'll be winging about their food
habits and their snack food behavior, but at the end
of the day, someone is keeping that process snack food
or white bread in the house. So if you want
your kids to be healthy, making sure that the bulk
of the food in the house is healthy and they
don't have access to as much of that package process
food goes a huge way in cementing these really positive behaviors.
(38:45):
And the other thing, I guess it's becoming a family
project where everyone's eating pretty well. Like it's really difficult
to ignite change if you've got a dad who is
eating really poorly and not exercising, or a mum who
gets home laid and perhaps isn't having proper meals. More
that the family can demonstrate and give good health examples
as part of their day to day, the better that's
(39:05):
going to be for especially younger teenagers, say age between
ten and fourteen. Of course, once girls get a little
bit older, they're a lot more self sufficient, but in
those really dominant years, say ten to fourteen, maintaining really
healthy habits within the household, stocking the foods that you
want them to eat, not having soft drink and juice
around and keeping at a certain level of physical activity
or goes a really long way in cementing some of
(39:26):
these positive health habits.
Speaker 1 (39:28):
And I think you mentioned a good point. You have
to be the role model. And that's the thing. Like
clients used to come into the hospital and say, you know,
talk about their own, you know, their own nutrition concerns,
but then bring their teenage kids into it as well,
and it's like somebody is either buying that food, and
I mean once they're you know, sixteen seventeen, they're earning
their own income, that's a different story. But in their
younger teens, if you're going to supply that food, chances
(39:49):
are those kids are going to eat it. So it's
really around what you're buying and supplying and how you're
being a role model. If kids are like sponges, if
they're going to grow up and seeing mom start a
new diet every four weeks, or mom never eats carbs
at dinner, those things are gonna rub off on teenagers.
And teenagers there's so much fear around carbohydrates and fear
around sugar, and they just we want to focus on
(40:12):
nutrition positively, So seeing nutrition as fuel for our body,
focus on exercise and movement that they enjoy. Talk about
fueling their bodies for energy, eating for health, eating for energy,
eating and listening to their bodies. Learning those skills of
mindful and intuitive eating regular meal patterns as well is
a really important thing, especially for teenagers. They're going through
(40:32):
some of them really really large growth berts. I know
that when I was a I think i've been about
six foot Torson is about fourteen years old, Suzi Like,
I was a big kid, like tightwise, and I used
to eat, you know, sometimes more than my dad. And
my mum never said anything. She was like, as long
as you're hungry, you can have more. And it was
always within my control to learn to regulate that. And
kids are really great regulators of their own appetite and
(40:54):
fullness levels. We want to continue to carry that into
you know, our teenage years as well. So be that
really good good role model for your child, allow them
to build their own plate. Don't always serve them what
you think is an appropriate portion, because teenagers are hungry
as some days and they're not as hungry other days.
But I really do think that young girls in particular
go through so many changes in puberty, we get stretch marks,
(41:16):
we have bloody periods, and we have acne, and it's
a really tough time. But the more you talk about
that and are open with your kids, I think the
easier that becomes for them, and just monitor their movements online,
be really really worry about who they're following on social media.
A lot of these celebrities are airbrushing their photos and
they're just doing ridiculous things for their photos and distorting
(41:36):
their bodies through photoshop in a way that that's not
even real. And if teenage girls are growing up thinking
that sailor isn't normal, or acne isn't normal, or bloating
isn't normal, then that's not a good thing. So really
be wary that they're following some good positive role models online,
and honestly, there are so many these days on social
media good positive role models. Just go through their feed
(41:56):
and talk to them about you know, who they should
be following, because this this is real life, and this
is the Instagram glamorize I look perfect in every photo,
which just isn't the real deal. So when teenage girls
start to get some stretch marks, and I had quite
a few stretch marks because I had huge gross berts
during puberty, you know, and they start to see a
little bit of cellulart on the back of their legs
and they freak out and they think, oh, my goodness,
(42:17):
I'm the only one who has this, and they try
to cover it up. It's really nice to be following
people on social media who normalize that and say, you know,
the majority of people have stretch marks and cellulart and
that sort of thing, not the minority, which is what
we think because of social media. So I really do
think monitor their social media accounts and put them in
touch with really positive role models on social media as well,
(42:40):
and focus on change as a normal part of growing up,
like try to normalize it as best as you can.
And in terms of nutrition, get them into the kitchen,
get them cooking, teaching them to eat as much color
and as much diversity as possible. Take them into the
shops and let them choose different types of fruits and veggies,
and get them involved in the meal planning, and once
or twice a week, get them into the kitchen cooking
with you. Because young girls, most of them, love cooking,
(43:03):
they love being creative. Allow that to happen and You'll
find that nutrition is a lot easier for them as
they grow up if they're learning about foods and learning
how to nourish and fuel their body versus seeing mom
do every single diet and never eat carbs at dinner time.
There's a lot we can do in terms of supporting
young girls from a nutrition perspective.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
One hundred percent and a shift away from teaching them
to order in as a routine part of the diet,
because I find a lot of busy families will be
ordering dinners in three four times a week and that
has a really strong follow on effect to kids thinking
it's normal to be eating takeaway and fried home delivered
meals regularly when you're busy. So definitely use their skills
getting them in the kitchen. They're very capable, particularly girls
(43:44):
as they get a little bit older, and probably the
last take home messages. Also, if you have a teenage
girl who decides to become vegetarian or even vegan, get
them to a dietitian and a crediting practicing dietitian to
balance their diet early and make sure they don't become
risk of disordered eating and risk eating patterns and ticking
the box on their essential nutrients like their protein, calcium, iron,
(44:04):
incredibly important for that target group.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
Absolutely. I mean I used to work with a lot
of we'd had a lot of eating disorder clients at
the hospital, and it broke my heart to see twenty
year olds with backgrounds and disordered eating since they were
teens have problems with their bones at twenty years old,
like multiple fractures and being told that you will probably
always be osteoporotic and you're twenty years old, So we
don't want that to happen. So absolutely, if your teenagers
are coming to you saying I'm vegetarian, I only drink
(44:29):
almond milk, I won't touch sugar, there are some red
flags in terms of disordered eating. Not saying that your
teenager might have an eating disorder, but it can very
quickly go from a disordered eating pattern and wanting to
be quote unquote healthy, and that healthy takes a couple
of steps too far, and that goes down the path
of disordered eating, which goes down the path of an
eating disorder. So absolutely get a professional such as a
(44:51):
dietician involved early to teach your children how to narish
and fuel their bodies and not restrict them or diet
them or follow other online social media influences. And there
is a very big vegan and plant based push online
at the moment. I'm not saying that it's a bad
thing to be plant based, but you can absolutely do
it wrong and cause more harm than good. So do
not let your teenage girls in particular cut out a
(45:13):
lot of nutrients without the support of a professional. So
incredibly important, one hundred percent. What aful? All right, well, Susie.
That brings us to the end of the Nutrition Catch
for another week. It's sad, but we'll be in your
inbox next week, guys, So if you haven't done so already,
please don't forget to subscribe. So a lot of the
rankings in the charts are actually based on subscription, So
if you love us and you listen to us every week,
(45:35):
please make sure you a subscribe to the podcast because
that actually helps boost us in the charts, and the
higher we are in the chants, the more people that
we can reach and the more we can continue on
with this podcast. So make sure you give us a
follow at the Nutrition Cap podcast on Facebook and Instagram.
Shoot us through any questions, make sure you comment on
our posts and let us know if you're enjoying the episodes,
(45:55):
what your favorite part is, and if you've got any
suggestions for future episodes, please let us know and we
will be in your inbox Sunday morning next week, and
thank you for listening.
Speaker 3 (46:05):
Have a great week.
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