November 4, 2025 • 59 mins
What if a single “yes” could reroute your life and bring hope to millions?
In this episode, we sit down with Pat Bradley, founder of Crisis Aid International, to trace his unlikely journey from alcoholism and divorce to a global mission feeding the hungry and rescuing girls from trafficking.
What began as a broken heart and a yellow post-it note became feeding centers across Africa, trauma-informed safe homes in the U.S., and a model for faith-driven, sustainable aid.
Pat shares the night a famine headline sent him halfway around the world with nothing but conviction and the moment a spontaneous rescue in a red-light district grew into a full anti-trafficking network. Along the way, he opens up about failure, reconciliation, and the faith that fuels impossible steps.
If you’ve ever felt unqualified, uncertain, or overwhelmed by injustice, this conversation offers a new roadmap: start small, act on compassion, and let provision meet you in motion.
Because sometimes, redemption begins where comfort ends and your yes might just lead to the purpose you are searching for.
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
What if one single moment could change everything
in your life?
In today's episode, we sit downPat Bradley, a man who went from
being a broken alcoholic whosemarriage fell apart to founding
Crisis Aid International, anonprofit that's brought hope to
millions around the world.
You see, Pat's story isn't justabout recovery from alcoholism.
(00:22):
It's about how faith, courage,and one life-changing decision
can rewrite your story to.
In this episode, you're gonnalearn how to find purpose even
in your greatest pain, how tostep boldly into your calling,
even when you can't see the pathahead.
Pat also shares some of thewildest stories you'll ever
hear.
From standing in war zones totrusting God in the most
(00:45):
dangerous places on earth.
If you have ever felt likeyou've gone too far to turn back
or too broken to be used, pleaseallow this episode to be your
reminder that redemption is realand your breakthrough might just
be one moment away.
Pat Bradley, welcome to the OnceAre Dare podcast.
(01:06):
I'm so honored to have you onhere.
SPEAKER_00 (01:08):
It's an honor to be on here.
SPEAKER_01 (01:10):
You have such an incredible story.
I've from my perspective andreading your book, reading your
work, it just shows of how muchof a difference one life can
make.
But you weren't always involvedin what you're doing, you
weren't always saving lives.
And what was your pivotal pointor what happened prior to you
(01:31):
getting involved in helping somany people?
SPEAKER_00 (01:34):
Well, um, the story begins with um our marriage.
Let's start with that, my firstmarriage.
And uh I was an alcoholic.
I would just get to the point.
I was an alcoholic, afunctioning alcoholic.
Uh I held down my job, and uh,but I drank too much.
And so my wife, after six years,six and a half years of being
(01:56):
married, we had two youngchildren, three and five years
old.
Um, she decided to divorce me.
And that literally made my worldcrash.
So up until that point, youknow, I was all about partying
and having a good time and anduh just enjoying life as the way
I saw fit, but not the way shesaw fit.
(02:17):
And uh so my world came crashingdown.
And so the uh she actually shecalled me at work and and she
said, You need to come home now.
And I said, I don't want to comehome now, I'm going out with my
friends.
And she said, No, you need tocome home right now.
And I just something in methought, hmm, I better go home.
And so I went home and I walk inthe front door, and there she's
(02:38):
standing here with two blackplastic trash bags and a piece
of paper in her hand, and uh allmy worldly possessions were in
those trash bags, and the paperwas a uh court order telling me
I had to vacate in 30 minutes orI'd be thrown in jail.
So I pleaded and tried.
She wouldn't, you know, shewouldn't change her mind.
So um that night is the lastnight I drank.
(03:01):
And the next morning I woke upin my mom and dad's bed
basement.
I can't tell you today how I gotthere.
I have virtually no recomm youknow recollection.
And so um that led me to um seekhelp.
Like, what do what can I do?
And I tried to call her and begher and plead with her, and she
wouldn't even talk to me.
(03:21):
Um and so somewhere I rememberhearing that you know Alcoholics
Anonymous is a program, and shetold she told me you need to go
into a treatment center.
I said, Well, I can't go into atreatment center.
I got a job, and I can't be gonefor 30 days.
And uh anyway, long story short,she um hung up on me again, and
so I decided to seek outAlcoholics Anonymous, and I went
(03:43):
to my first meeting the nextnight, and I had learned from
that first meeting that shesaid, if you come 90, 90
meetings in 90 days, it's equalto the kind of uh therapy or
whatever you get from uh beingin a treatment center.
So I thought, okay, I can dothis, and I did it.
And on day 91, I called her upand then I said, Hey, guess
what?
(04:03):
I completed 90 days and she hungup on me again.
So the divorce went through, andshortly after the divorce, um, I
took a new job.
And so back then, when I wasduring my drinking days, I got
am I saying your name right?
It's bad guy.
SPEAKER_01 (04:19):
Yeah, yeah, you got it.
SPEAKER_00 (04:21):
Um, like we had to borrow money to feed my kids
every week.
Like I wasn't making much money.
Um, and so um we were poor.
We just were poor.
I don't know what else to say.
So anyway, I took this new job,and I it was a new company, a
startup, and I mean, I Godblessed me, but I didn't know it
was God at the time.
I thought it was me, and um Istarted making, you know, within
(04:45):
six months more money than I hadever dreamed possible.
And, you know, I thought I washappy, I bought a new car, I
bought a condominium, everythingwas going great.
But, you know, late at nightthere was that ache in my heart
knowing my wife and my kids.
And uh in my mind, I said Ihated my wife for divorcing me
and how she ruined my life.
But in all sincerity, in myheart, I still loved her with
(05:10):
everything in me.
And um, and so my children,after about a year and a half,
they start talking about thisTuesday school.
And I'm thinking, this soundsreally weird.
What is Tuesday school?
What's Tuesday school?
Yeah, and so um I was born andgrew up in a Catholic church
until I was old enough to um notgo on my own.
(05:32):
And so that was my background.
No, um, so I decided I'm gonnago check on what Tuesday school
is, and so I couldn't make it ona Tuesday, but I thought, okay,
I'm gonna go on a Sunday.
So I had the kids, I called myex-wife and I said, Hey, I'm
gonna bring the kids to thechurch, and then you can take
them from there, but I want tocome and sit in the service and
see what's going on.
(05:53):
And she said, Well, okay.
I said, but I'd like to sit withyou.
And so what I was planning ondoing was um I was convinced
this was a cult.
And um so I met my wife on thechurch steps, uh, and that that
was that was an experience.
It was hot, I was covered insweat.
(06:13):
It was we pulled into thisparking lot, and it was like a
mile-long back like traffic jamto get into the parking lot to
go into the church.
I had never seen anything likethis.
And I'm going, this is a cult.
This is a cult.
Look at all these people.
And so we walked in and walkedinto the church, and there were
thousand thousands of people,but there were TV cameras, and
(06:35):
but and I'm as soon as I saw thecameras, this is a cult, this is
a cult, I'm gonna get my kidsback.
I can so I'm making mental notesof what I'm seeing.
Um, but that day something crazyhappened, and um I heard the
voice of God speak to me duringthat service, and he said, How
many times must I call you?
And I heard that three times.
(06:57):
And when I heard that, I waslike in this, like this fog, and
it was right after the worshipservice, and so it was and I'm
not describing it very clearly,but it was just so bizarre.
And when I think back on it, itstill is bizarre.
But um, so I'll just tell youhow it went.
(07:18):
This guy gets up at the end ofworship, starts speaking real
loud, whatever's what how I howI knew this, I don't know.
I knew it was a message intongues, and so that you know
that was weird, and I thought,oh, confirmation, more more
ammunition for getting the kids.
But when he got done, and thepastor got up and explained what
happened, and he gave thisinterpretation, and that's when
(07:42):
I heard God speak to me.
How many times must I call you?
And he said it three times.
And then after the third time,like this fog went away, and I
literally found myself sobbinguncontrollably.
I could not stop.
And then my brain started, I'mgoing, You have lost your mind.
What is wrong with you?
(08:02):
And people like looking at me,and my ex-wife is who's sitting
next to me, is like trying toscoot away and look at me like
I'm insane.
I'm thinking I'm insane.
I didn't know what happened.
Um, and I didn't uh and so theygave an altar call.
You know, I'm like, Do you wantto give your life to Christ, to
Jesus?
And I wanted to, but I didn't gobecause I was too embarrassed,
because I was crying so hardthat I couldn't stop.
(08:25):
But I was also afraid I mightsee somebody that knows me, and
I don't want them to see mereacting this way.
So um Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (08:32):
So you came there to investigate.
unknown (08:34):
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (08:35):
I came there to say, Oh, this is a cult.
I'm gonna prove that my wife isinvolved in some weird stuff so
that I can have you know custodyof the kids or whatnot.
And then you come there and youhave this encounter.
SPEAKER_00 (08:46):
Uh yes.
Wow.
I had this encounter.
So we left, and uh and so umtrying to think, so it was a
friendly party.
Parking lot said goodbye tokids, said goodbye to my
ex-wife, and so uh later thatday I started feeling like very
bad about not going forward.
That like now they we call itthe conviction of the Holy
(09:08):
Spirit.
I mean, I know exactly what thatwas, and it that was Sunday, and
then Monday it continued and andit got stronger and stronger,
and then Tuesday even gotstronger.
They had a service on Tuesdaynights, like I mentioned
earlier, Tuesday, Tuesdayschool.
And so I told my for somereason, I don't know why, I
called my wife and I said, Areyou taking the kids to the
church tonight?
She said, Yeah, I go, Well, I'mgonna come too.
(09:29):
I go, can we sit together?
And she said, Well, I guess shestill was keeping me at 100
yards away.
And uh, so I went and they gavean altar call, and I mean I ran
down to that altar, and uh andI, you know, I just I knelt down
and I gave my life to Jesus.
And that night got everythingchanged for me for the best, but
(09:54):
I had no idea what was coming.
Um after the service was over, Iwent, there was a bookstore, and
so I went in the bookstore andthere was this book called God
Smuggler.
It was on like an end aisle, andit did um title kind of caught
my attention.
So I bought it, and I didn'thave a Bible, and I went home
and I started reading it.
I mean, I couldn't put that bookdown, and I quit like three or
(10:15):
four in the morning, and thenthe next went to work, and then
the next day, uh the next nightI finished it, and I just prayed
a simple prayer.
I said, God, if you can ever useme to help people that are being
persecuted like this, I'm justmaking myself available.
And uh that's how it allstarted.
And then um, so my wife and Iwere having starting to talk a
(10:36):
little bit more and a little bitmore, and then I in my business
I went to the company she workedfor.
I was in marketing advertising,and uh her boss wanted to have a
meeting with me about acampaign, and so I'm standing in
a lobby, and uh receptionistsaid, Oh, her assistant will
come get you.
And so I'm standing looking outthe windows, and I heard this
door open.
I turned around.
There's my ex-wife standingthere.
Now I'm I'm at that point, I'mnot hating her, but I wasn't
(11:00):
liking her a lot.
Right.
I took a look at her and she hasthis auburn hair.
I'm like, oh my god, she'sgorgeous.
You know, I'm seeing her, I'mlike, wow, she's beautiful.
And so we walked to her boss'soffice, had a little chat, and
then she walked me out, and uhwe had even a nicer
conversation, and then we agreedto meet for a coffee, and we met
for coffee and um started seeingeach other very carefully.
(11:24):
I mean, I'm kind of kind oflike, if we're gonna do it,
let's do it, let's jump in andfigure it out as we're going.
And she's a little bit morecautious.
And uh, but six months later wegot remarried for the second
time.
SPEAKER_01 (11:35):
Wow, that's so beautiful.
Yeah, yeah.
In your book, um, Born toRescue, you write about a
life-changing moment in EastAfrica.
I'm curious to how you got thereand what that moment was.
SPEAKER_00 (11:49):
So, how we got to East Africa was um, again, this
is gonna sound crazy, but I'msitting in my office in the ad
agency at lunch, and I'm comeacross the internet headline
that said 14 million Ethiopiansat risk of death by starvation.
And this no sooner than I readit, I knew that God just said
go.
(12:10):
And I didn't know anybody, um, Ididn't know anybody that knew
anybody in in Ethiopia.
I contacted a friend who'd madesome connections and uh he ended
up getting back to me with aphone number, which I put it on
a yellow post-it note, and 30days later I go to Ethiopia with
the yellow post-it note and aphone number, not knowing what
(12:31):
was going to come out of this.
I just knew God said go, andbased on what had happened in uh
Sudan and Afghanistan, um, Ijust knew God would show us.
And so we spent the next sixdays driving around the
countryside and uh looking attherapeutic feeding centers and
seeing firsthand visually thestarvation, literally people
(12:55):
literally dying of starvation,men, women, children.
And it was horrible.
Um but it was one of thosemoments to where we pulled up
after six days, pulled in thisvillage that they knew we were
coming, and there was 250mothers sitting on the side of
this hill, and they um theelders came out and talked to
us, and they said, you know, yousee all those children up there,
(13:17):
and each mother had at least onechild, and they were obviously
they were severely malnourished.
I had never really experiencedany of this until this trip
about severe malnutrition andyou know, like kids that look
like skeletons or people, iswhen I say that term, that's
what I'm referring to.
Um but I knew we needed to buildwhat was called a therapeutic
feeding center in order to treatthem properly, and so and I also
(13:41):
knew it would cost$100,000 to dothat, plus you have to staff
one.
And we didn't, you know, I justthey asked me, they begged me,
would you please do something?
And I said, Okay, I'm comingback.
We'll we're gonna build atherapeutic feeding center and
do what we can to help thesechildren.
And so they were thankful.
And um the next day I left andflew home.
(14:02):
And as I'm flying home, I'mthinking to myself, what is
wrong with me?
We had our mailing list, it waslike 40 people, and it was
mainly friends and relatives whowere you know tired of getting
my mail and giving me money.
SPEAKER_01 (14:15):
Right, same people, right?
That you're kind of like, hey,here I am.
SPEAKER_00 (14:19):
Yeah, I'm like, how can I ask them again?
And then I knew we had$350 inour bank account.
And I came back and I told mywife who wasn't thrilled.
She's like, What did you tellthem?
What is wrong with you?
Don't you know we only got thismuch and we can't?
And I called my board togetherand I said, Okay, guys, this is
you know, this is what I'mthinking, this is what I think
God told us.
(14:39):
And uh, four of my board memberswere on, two of them weren't.
Um, they said, You know, you'regonna kill these kids, you don't
know what you're doing, andwe've never done this before,
and where's the money gonna comefrom?
And where are you gonna findpeople?
And I'm like, I don't know.
God said, Do it.
He showed me them.
How could I not do something?
I said, We're doing this, and soum, over the next six weeks, a
(15:02):
hundred thousand dollars camein.
Wow, I to this day my wife and Istill can't tell you how that
happened.
But people start hearing andmoney started coming in from
people we never even knewexisted, and so we went over
there, uh, got got everythingset up and built, but we needed
help, we needed workers, and umagain, we were ready to go, but
(15:25):
no one to work.
And so that afternoon, this wasin a very remote part of the
country, and there was no cellservice, there never was cell
service, but my guide, mytranslator, friend, the East
African guy, um, has a cellphone to start ringing.
And I looked at him and helooked at me and I go, Well,
answer it.
And he answered it, and he'slike, he's I mean, he's African,
(15:49):
and I teased with him, I said,You turned white on that phone
call.
What happened?
And and he said, he puts a handover me, he goes, This is my
office.
He said, There's two a doctorand two nurses, two pediatric
nurses, a pediatrician.
They just showed up, they weresupposed to go spend three
months working with anotherorganization that just were told
they were not needed and they'regetting ready to go home unless
(16:11):
we can we use them.
I go, Yeah, we can use them.
And so the next day we had ourmedical staff free of charge.
And what the beauty of it waswas that this doctor and these
nurses have spent over 20 yearsworking at therapeutic feeding
centers in third worldcountries.
So they have all the experiencewe ever could possibly dream and
(16:32):
hope for just landed right in mylap.
And all I did was show up with alittle yellow post-it.
SPEAKER_01 (16:38):
Wow, that I'm just thinking over what you just
said.
That is so incredible.
I mean, going there to beginwith without having no plan.
And you, you know, coming from aplace of marketing and business,
you know that's not really theway that things should be done,
right?
And and then making thiselaborate promise to these
(17:02):
people that are desperate forhelp.
And you're like, I'll figure outa way.
Like, what was going throughyour mind at that time?
Like, how do you just jump withthe leap of faith and then just
like, okay, we'll just do it?
SPEAKER_00 (17:14):
Um, I don't know.
I just it's kind of I guess I'mwired that way.
God has wired me to be that way.
Um you know, it's just like ifwe're trying to figure out what
God wants us to do and we haveto have everything planned out
and we make all of our plans andstuff, what I've learned is that
you kind of remove God from theequation because you just put
(17:36):
what you think in there.
And so, yeah, you we can makeplans, but I when I do it even
to this day, they're very loose.
They're very loose.
It's like, okay, we're here, weknow we want to get here in the
next year.
I think these are the steps.
Let's begin walking to see whereit ends up.
And God always, a hundredpercent of the time, comes
(17:57):
through so much more than I hadever dreamed possible.
It's like one example we werewent into the can I tell you
this story?
Yeah.
Okay, we went into, I wasstanding in this same country,
and it was a Saturday afternoon,and we're standing in a corner.
I was talking to a guy that hada ministry work to street kids,
homeless kids living on thestreet.
(18:18):
And I'm standing there and we'retalking, and then I hear this
voice say to me, Ask him aboutprostitution.
And I thought, this is strange.
I'm not asking him aboutprostitution.
He's like he's like a pastor,and he's helped.
I just ignored it, and then likeit happened again a couple
minutes later.
And so again, the experience Ihad in Sudan and Afghanistan,
(18:39):
and then this country, I knewthat I knew that God was saying
something.
So I stopped him.
I go, Can you tell me aboutprostitution?
And uh excuse me?
I'm telling you about myministry.
I know I love your ministry, butI gotta ask you this.
And so he tells me about thisred light district.
And uh I said, Okay, I said, Canyou take us down or I'd like to
(19:00):
see this?
And he um gave me another weirdlook, but he said, sure, we can
go down.
He goes, When do you want to go?
I go, I want to go at night.
I'm gonna see it at night whenit's really, you know, doing its
thing.
And um he said, Okay, so wentback to my hotel and called my
wife and she said, Well, whatare you doing tonight?
And I said, Well, we're gonna gohang out with the prostitutes.
SPEAKER_01 (19:20):
And she goes, She's like, Yeah, that sounds like a
plan.
SPEAKER_00 (19:24):
Exactly.
She's like, that's a reallyinteresting thing to tell me
when you're on the other side ofthe world.
But she knew at that point thatthe last few years of of some of
the crazy stories and stuff, shewas like, Okay.
And so we went there and um andI just walked through there.
I just didn't expect anything, Ihad no plans.
And so we start this startedthis conversation um with these
(19:48):
with these girls.
There's five of them, and theytold us, like, and I don't mean
this to be racist in any way,shape, or form, but they said,
you know, you're the first whitepeople that ever come down here.
I mean, there are thousands ofgirls.
They live in these little tinsheds that are like six feet by
eight feet, enough room for abed and a table, no running
water, no s no open sew, it'sstunk.
(20:08):
It was uh it was it was hell onearth.
It was like you can't imagineanything so bad.
I've seen horrible things inmany countries, but this topped
it all.
SPEAKER_02 (20:18):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (20:19):
And so we were getting a big crowd around um
because you know, who are thestrangers?
What do they want?
And they're talking to thesegirls, and and and I said, Hey,
can we go in and talk in one ofyour rooms so we can kind of get
out of here and they go, sure,we can go in this room.
And so as we were walking in, Ilooked over my shoulder and I
saw this one young girl walkingdown, and she just had this
white outfit on, which was kindof strange.
(20:40):
Um, but she was walking down,and I just told asked our
translator, I said, Ask her ifshe wants to come in with us.
And she she went back and askedher, and and um she said, sure.
So she came in.
I assumed she knew the otherfive, but she did not, they
didn't know each other.
And so we're sitting in there,we're talking, we're gonna
listen to their stories, and um,you know, then he asked, Why are
(21:02):
you here?
And I'm like, Um, I'm not surewhy I'm here, but I know this
much.
God has a much better plan foryour life than what you're
living through.
Are you interested in hear aboutthis?
They go, sure, what do you tellus about it?
And I'm like, Well, you know, Italked about how much God loved
them, and it breaks his heart tosee what they're living through,
and we understand, but we didn'tunderstand, I didn't mean to say
it that way, that we can'tunderstand what you're going
(21:24):
through, but we think we may beable to do something to help.
And then in my mind, I'm going,What are you doing?
What are you doing?
You're walking into it again.
SPEAKER_01 (21:32):
Yeah, making promises again.
SPEAKER_00 (21:34):
Yeah, making promises.
And so um we we uh and but allthe while this one young girl
was sitting on the edge, kind ofa little away from them.
And uh so, you know, I said, Doyou want, you know, give your
life to Christ?
Because, you know, somethingcould happen to you night.
So we talked about salvation andwhat it meant and stuff.
And so they all agreed and theyall prayed and gave their life
(21:56):
to Jesus.
But when we were done, thesecond we were done, I felt so
laser focused on the one girl,just the one girl.
And so I was talking to her, andit was so long ago now, it was
in 2006.
It was in 2006 of December.
I didn't know what it was abouther, but I just felt like God
(22:17):
has a special plan for yourlife, and I don't know what it
is, but you need to, you know,seek God for what's what He has
for you.
And we just talk, then I heardthis crazy thing say, baptize
her.
I'm like, there's no water.
I've never baptized a soul, Idon't even know what you say to
baptize somebody, and so I justkind of got quiet, and um, then
(22:39):
I heard it again, like baptizeher now.
So I had a friend with me, and Ilooked at him like this is what
I feel like God said.
And he goes, Okay, let's do it.
So I told the girls, I said,Somebody get a pot of water, we
need to baptize her.
They all kind of looked at mekind of weird, and they were
like, who is this guy?
We are weird, we get it.
But so we got the water and wewent out in the alley, and uh
(23:00):
again it got crowded.
Um, and I had her bend over atthe waist, and I'm like, okay,
let's start pouring water on.
I don't remember what I saidother than that.
I said something, I guess Iprayed something appropriate.
I hope I did.
But I said, and I baptize you inthe name of the Father, Son, and
the Holy Spirit.
And then I like you can standup, and then water is dripping
(23:21):
down her hair onto her face,onto her clothes, and everything
got quiet.
And I looked at her and she hada smile that like lit up this
whole alleyway.
There was such a physicaltransformation in this young
girl, and everybody there sawit, and nobody said a word.
It was one of those God moments,like I'm getting goosebumps
(23:44):
right now, thinking about thatmoment and what what happened to
her and what everyone saw.
And so after about a couple ofseconds, I looked at her and I
go, Would you like to leave heretonight?
And she looked at me, she said,Yes.
And I said, Is it safe?
Is it can you leave with ustonight?
(24:05):
She said, My owner is not heretonight, so yes, I can come
tonight.
SPEAKER_02 (24:10):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (24:11):
Okay, run back, get all your stuff, and come get
get, you know, come back, we'llwait for you.
And now I'm starting to think,like, what are we gonna do with
her?
Like, okay, here we go again.
I don't open my mouth.
But it's like, you know, and myfriend, like, what are you doing
with her?
And then the guy at the head ofthe street man came up to me,
like, what are you gonna do withher?
What's your plan?
(24:32):
I go, I don't have a plan, but Iknow this much.
We can't leave her here.
God, God brought us here.
This was a divine.
We can't leave her here.
And so she came back about 10minutes later, and she had like
this Walmart-sized shopping bagwith all her worldly
possessions.
That's all she owned.
And as we're walking out, I'mtrying to think, what are we
gonna do?
(24:52):
I have no plans, no ideas.
Um, so I so I start asking her,I was like, Oh, tell me, how old
are you?
She was 16, she had no livingfamily that she knew of, and
she'd been there five years.
But the thing that really brokemy heart is she said, the
thought of ever leaving therehad never occurred to me.
And I thought, you're 16 yearsold, you have no family, and in
(25:13):
your mind, this is where youwill spend the rest of your life
in this horrific red lightdistrict being raped multiple
times every night, seven days aweek.
Wow.
And I was like, we can't wewe'll figure this out.
And so we put her in an office,let her sleep on the floor for a
night or two, and then we foundan apartment.
But what that began unplanned,that began our work in what we
(25:36):
you know in sex traffickingwork.
And back then the word sextrafficking did not exist.
No one ever heard that term.
I had never heard this term, andso that girl, her her agreeing
to come out has led us into thisum uh work in rescuing victims
of sex trafficking, and nowwe've moved into the prevention
(25:59):
side.
We've got 23, 22 full-time staffin America that work on nothing
but sex trafficking and sextrafficking um prevention.
Uh we have a lot of work in thatcountry.
So, to date, since then, we'vehelped over 9,700 girls get out
and be rescued from beingvictims of trafficking.
(26:21):
And then when we do that, wedon't just like dump them
somewhere.
It's like they come into ourprogram and we train them, we
educate them so that they can goout and live and be a success.
SPEAKER_01 (26:31):
Yeah, and you have homes in the states as well, is
that correct?
SPEAKER_00 (26:34):
Yes, we do.
We have one in Grand Rapids andit'll house 20 girls.
Uh, we just opened it a yearago, and I mean, this is a
beautiful, beautiful home.
The pastor of the church thatwe're partnering with, um, and
when we were done, he looked atme and the price tag was like
8.5 million.
And he looked at me and goes,This is what I get for letting
(26:55):
my rich congregation membersdesign this home.
But it is a it is a premierhome.
It was it's been so well thoughtout, you know, triggered.
Like you got two wings, and thewings are staggered, so there's
not one long hallway, so they'restaggered.
Because a lot of times the girlsworking in a in a hotel, they s
(27:17):
see this long hallway and itjust triggers things in them.
And so there's like there's nodark corners in any anywhere.
There's not a dark corner.
When you go down a stairwell,automatic lights kick on, so
there's not even a second ofdarkness.
So just you know, all theseyears we've learned a lot of
things of how to employ it toget the best success.
SPEAKER_01 (27:34):
And wow, so everything was intentionally
designed in the place.
SPEAKER_00 (27:39):
Yes, very much so.
Yeah, for the girls and youknow, for the victims.
SPEAKER_01 (27:44):
Wow, that is so incredible.
I mean, there's so manydifferent pillars that you do
besides you're feeding thehungry, you're rescuing uh, you
know, people that are involvedin sex trafficking, having homes
for them.
Do you also do some preventativecare as well?
SPEAKER_00 (28:02):
Um yes, we do.
In fact, we um so we kind ofshifted our model back in 2017,
I think.
Um there was uh we were at oneof our food distribution sites,
and I'm turning around, I meanthere's hundreds of people
there.
And so up until that time, ourour struggle was keeping keeping
(28:24):
children alive, and there wereso many, we didn't we didn't
have enough, so we did the bestwe could with what we had for as
many as we could.
But I turned around and thisfather hands me this not like
shoves this child into my arms.
And I mean I had never seen achild this bad.
She was four years old, weighedless than I think weighed less
(28:45):
than it's in a book how much sheweighed, like six pounds.
Um and you took one look at herand it's like she's hours from
dying.
She's not, you know, there's umyeah, so anyway, just trying to
think about how that felt.
She uh we got her to a hospitaland she died the next day.
(29:08):
And it just like it was one ofthose things where we've seen
that happen before, but this onewas special because A, she was
the worst we ever seen.
But B, when the father put herin my arms, felt good, the
desperation in his eyes waspalatable.
So it just so palatable, and andit it we couldn't speak, but you
(29:29):
could understand his heart.
And what I learned was he hadlost his wife a year before to
something, uh, some kind ofinfection that was easily
treatable with uh an antibiotic.
And he had lost two otherchildren to starvation uh
several months about threemonths before this day that he
handed this daughter to me.
And this was his last child, andthere she was ready to die.
(29:52):
And the desperation waspalatable, and I'll never forget
what that what that looked like.
And so the next day, when weFound out she passed away, I
turned around to my countrydirector and I said, you know
what?
I said, we have to learn to askbetter questions.
I heard Tony Robbins say thatone time.
I thought it was such abrilliant statement.
And so it was like, what are wegonna?
(30:15):
We've been struggling to keepchildren alive.
But what can we do different tostart to prevent them from
getting into this?
And it all went back to thatfather.
And what God showed us was thisman was a hard worker.
He tried to hire himself out forday labor.
His clothes literally were soold and dirty, they were
literally falling apart on him,but that's all he had.
(30:37):
And he did his darn but he didhis best.
He didn't, he didn't have thething is that there's no
opportunities for people.
So it's like we don't want to,we can't go over, you know,
teach them how to do thingsbecause you gotta be culturally
sensitive and just a lot ofreasons.
There's there's a good way to doit and there's a wrong way to do
it.
And so what God showed us wasthat it's not just demonstrating
(31:02):
to them how to grow bettercoffee trees, but it's to show
them the opportunity bettercoffee trees will present to
them.
And that was the foreign conceptto them.
Opportunity.
I say it this way, ifopportunity hit them on the
head, they wouldn't know it.
And you know, you the saying isyou know, teach a man to fish
(31:22):
and you feed him for a lifetime,but they they wouldn't have
known what a fish was, theywouldn't have known what to do
with the fishing, but youcouldn't have teach them taught
them how to fish because thatjust was not in the context of
their culture.
SPEAKER_01 (31:34):
Yeah, it's kind of like you don't know what you
don't know, right?
And right.
SPEAKER_00 (31:38):
So we can make all of these platitudes and and
sayings, and they all sound gooduntil you get on the field and
you get in front of somebodylike that, or you get in front
of a community of people likethat, and it's like you know,
the the the answers are not whatwe think they are, they're not
the easy answers.
But what we saw was you canteach them, you can train them,
but you've got to show them howto what an opportunity is and
(31:59):
how to exploit an opportunity.
And so that we shifted all ofour programming starting there
into moving into that direction.
And it took us a couple years todo it, but now we've created
four or five hundred jobs inthat country.
Uh at times from some of ourprograms, we may have as many as
(32:19):
five to seven hundred people,local people working for us on a
part-time basis to help us withour agriculture or what other
things.
So we brought that thinking,what it did is it helped us to
learn how to design our programsthat teaches them to what to do
with an opportunity and thenhelp provide the opportunity for
(32:40):
them because there's nothingthere for them.
There is nothing.
It had to be created, but youhave to create it in a way that
you understand that it fitstheir culture because you're not
changing the culture, you'renever going to change the
culture.
So it has to fit their cultureand then done in a way that they
feel like they are accomplishingit themselves, not that we're
(33:01):
doing it for you and to you.
And so that's what's how we canchange.
SPEAKER_01 (33:08):
Oh, that's incredible.
What would you say to someone,maybe a person listening right
now, that just feels sounqualified to make a
difference?
And you often said aboutyourself that you're just an
ordinary guy who answered acall.
SPEAKER_00 (33:23):
Yeah.
I uh I am.
I've got no honest, I have nospecial skills or talents.
SPEAKER_01 (33:30):
That is like, look, I'm not special, okay?
I am not.
SPEAKER_00 (33:34):
I'm just an ordinary person.
I truly am.
I'm no different than anybodyelse.
The only thing I will say I didthat most people haven't done is
um I just said yes to God and Igot out of the pew.
You know, Svetka, when I talk atchurches, people come up to me
frequently, and um, and I don'tspeak very often, but people
(33:56):
always come to me, you know, I'mjust waiting to hear God's will.
I'm waiting for God to turnlight green.
I'm like, you know what?
God's waiting for you.
You don't, you Jesus said,whatever you do in Matthew, he
said, whatever you do for theleast of these, you do it for
me.
Now, to me, the key word in allof that is whatever, whatever
(34:18):
you do, whatever you do, you'redoing it for me.
Because you're doing it to theleast of these.
So the freedom we have in Christis so unimaginable to most
Christians because we think wegot to fit in God's perfect
will.
Well, God's like, you know, yourperfect will is like my perfect
will is to get you out of the Pand get you moving so I can
(34:39):
guide you.
And God will guide you.
But you know, all it takes is awilling heart.
But the one thing I want other,you know, like Christians and
non-Christians to understand isthat being a Christian is is
probably the greatest adventureon the planet.
There's I don't think there's, Idon't believe there's anything
they can even compare to being aChristian lived the way God
(35:02):
wants us to live it, not the waywe choose to live it, sitting in
church waiting to hear as well.
No, that's not an adventure,that's boredom.
You're bored as a Christian,which is terrible.
We shouldn't be bored asChristians.
We should be living a lifethat's ad a life of adventure.
So, what's an adventure to me isgoing to be different than maybe
the guy sitting next to me orsomeone else.
(35:22):
They define their own life onwhat adventure looks like to
them, and then just let God takeit and just start moving.
But the thing is, like what I'mI love what I do.
I mean, this life, I dream thislife of, I remember sitting in a
church service back in the 80s,it shows you my age, um, about
this guy who owned a businessand he used his business to fund
(35:45):
his missions.
And I remember sitting in thatchurch, I remember just like it
was last night, sitting in thereand thinking, okay, that's what
I want to do with my life, andthis is what I think I want it
to look like.
As he's talking, I'm buildingthis dream.
And as I sit here in front ofyou today, I'm living that dream
today.
And I'm not saying that God gaveme that dream.
I'm just saying that was a dreamI came up with.
(36:06):
Now I do I believe God gave thatto me?
Yes, I do.
But it wasn't one of these, youknow, oh, God told me this.
No, it was like, this is what Ithis, I think I want to do this.
And God, I'm I'm literally doingit today.
But honestly, I don't have anymore talents than anyone else.
The only thing I did was sayyes, Lord, and got out of the
church pew and said, now what?
(36:28):
So then people go, Well, what doyou do then?
What's that what's the nextstep?
What's the logical next step?
Well, I don't know what's onyour heart.
Well, I you know what I see,these homeless people.
Oh, great, well, go do somethingfor a homeless person.
Just see one, go do somethingnice for them, see what happens.
You know, just to get peoplemoving out of their church Ps.
SPEAKER_01 (36:47):
Yeah, I think that is such a huge point because
there's a lot of people that Iknow, like you said, that are
waiting to get this hugerevelation of that one big thing
they're supposed to do withtheir life, right?
And they call it a calling.
Okay.
Um one of my favorite quotes,and I say this in the podcast
(37:08):
quite often, is um by MayaAngela, who said, Your legacy is
every life you touch.
unknown (37:13):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (37:14):
I love that.
So it's it's not about doingthis one ginormous big event
that is gonna be the pinnacle ofyour life, that is your legacy,
that is this is what you're bornfor.
Yes, sure, we have differenttalents and abilities, and
everyone's wired a little bitdifferently from each other.
We're, you know, thinkdifferently.
At the end of the day, what Ibelieve is that we can impact
(37:37):
the people around us, you know.
Just this morning I got news ofmy friend who lost her husband.
And it's like, how can you bethere for her in this moment,
right?
So that is that is oneopportunity that says, hey, the
here's an opportunity to impacta life today, right?
Exactly.
Um and so I'd love for you tospeak to that person who's just
(37:58):
feels stuck because they'rereally complicating it.
SPEAKER_00 (38:06):
Um okay.
So um I'm thinking that so somany times, so much of the time
we spend, like we just talkedabout, like trying to discern
God's will from my life.
(38:26):
Oh, what's my calling?
Do I have a calling?
Yes, everybody who's a Christianhas got a calling on their life
because that's why we'reChristians.
We became Christians because Godwas calling us to Him, He was
the one drawing us to Him.
And so, you know what I wouldsay again is going back to you
(38:46):
have no idea how much freedomthere is in serving God.
God is such a, He, oh gosh,that's a hard question that you
asked me.
Um I would just say it likethis.
You know, get your butt out ofthe church pew and just see what
God has for you.
(39:07):
Just take the next step, takethe next step.
Don't quit trying to figurethings out.
You will never figure this out.
All you will do is end upfrustrating yourself.
And you know what?
You have been given one life.
Don't waste it, don't waste halfof it, don't waste 10% of it.
Trying to figure out the callingof God on my life.
(39:27):
When the Bible makes it veryclear, there's 2,700 or so
verses that deal with povertyand injustice.
Pick one of those verses, buildyour life around it, and you'll
be in the center of God's will.
That's all it takes.
The Bible has everything we needto know.
But going back to what Jesussaid, whatever you do for the
least of these, you're doing itfor me.
(39:49):
That's all we need to know.
Now go figure out what you wantto do for the least of these.
What does that mean to you?
You, like you mentioned, you hada friend that just lost a
husband.
Go be with that person.
Go sit and don't say a word.
Just sit with them, be presentwith them.
Um, you know, I have a neighborthat's got cancer and he can't
do his yard work, so I go do hisyard work for him.
(40:09):
You know, there's alwayssomething we can do to start.
And but but you know, at the endof the day, God's for the most
part waiting for us to take thesteps.
And he's not gonna push us outof a church pew.
He's gonna make, he wants us totake the initiative to trust him
enough to get up and go stand ina pew and go, okay.
(40:30):
Um I'm presenting myself to you,God, use me however you want.
It's think of it like this (40:35):
you you sign, okay, God, I'm gonna
sign this contract with you.
I sign my name on it, and I handit back to him, but the page is
blank.
God, you fill in the rest.
That's another way to look atit, maybe.
SPEAKER_01 (40:52):
Yeah, that's beautiful.
Um, looking back to you startedoff with just, you know, in
alcoholism, being despaired,down and out, not really having
a lot of hope for your future.
And having that encounter withGod has changed so much, and you
(41:13):
just stepped out and did whatyou felt prompted to do at the
time.
Do you think God wastes any partof our story?
unknown (41:24):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (41:25):
Not at all.
I mean, at my lowest, like if Ididn't have my parents' basement
to go to, I would be, I wouldhave been living under a bridge
and I wouldn't be sitting heretoday.
That's where I came from.
And God has used that to, yeah,no, I mean it's it's our whole
life.
God, nothing surprises God.
(41:47):
And you know, I don't understandsome things, it's like, why did
I have to go through that, Lord?
You before I would, the Biblesays before He formed us and
knew us before we were everborn.
You knew I was gonna go throughall this.
You knew I was gonna put my wifethrough hell.
Why would you allow this?
Those things I don't understand,but what I do know is God does
use that, and that's what helpsbuild us and and and makes us
(42:12):
who we are today.
It's like, so some of thosethings that I, you know, as I
look back, you know, 2020,hindsight's 2020, I look back on
that, and it's like, those werehorrible times, but you know
what?
It also gave me the stick toit-ness of not quitting, not
giving up, you know, and andthat has served me, served me
well over my entire life.
(42:34):
Had I not been through that, Idon't know if I would have had
that attitude.
And if I didn't have thatattitude, it wouldn't have
served me well in what I dotoday because everything we've
ever started, we've never hadthe money, and we look at it and
go, my God, this is impossible.
We can't do this.
But then we're like, no, wait aminute.
Let's pull back and go, okay, wecan't do it, but let's figure
out how we're gonna do itanyway.
And so all of that, that youknow, how I am today, that all
(42:57):
came from back in in my brokendays of God taking that, using
it, and repurposing some ofthose experiences.
Um and it's also helped me tohave a heart for people that
were just beyond help becauseI've always thought I was beyond
help.
Even in my drinking days, I justthought, you know, my in my
(43:18):
sober times, I would think mylife is you know ruined, I'm on
nothing, and you know, didn'thave good thoughts about myself
whatsoever.
But God takes all of that, Hedoesn't waste any of it.
And what do you think?
SPEAKER_01 (43:31):
Go ahead.
SPEAKER_00 (43:32):
I was gonna say people think they have to get
over all of that.
And it's like, you know, if youjust ask God to forgive you your
sins, he forgives and heforgets.
And it's the hardest thing forus is to forget our past or what
we've done.
But God will use those things.
SPEAKER_01 (43:50):
And and what do you think about yourself now?
SPEAKER_00 (43:56):
Um I think I'm just getting started in life
sometimes in some respects.
Um I think that you know, Istill struggle sometimes.
It's like, why would God I'm alittle, I mean, I just can be
transparent.
There are days where I think,why would God ever use me?
You know, and I pull back andlook at everything that's going
(44:17):
on in all of our programs.
And I mean, we got almost 300people that work full-time for
us now, and it started with atwo-pound bag of rice, and it's
like, but I still at times havethose thoughts.
They're nowhere near like itused to be.
But um I just try to um I don'tthink look at myself, honestly.
I just see the needs and whatneeds to be done and um and just
(44:41):
do it.
And just do it.
Yeah, I don't want to waste timetrying to figure myself out
because I'll never get anywhere.
SPEAKER_01 (44:50):
Yeah, and as a founder of Crisis Aid
International, you are helpingthe helpless.
You also have entered some ofthe most extreme high-risk no-go
zones around the world.
You've seen things that probablymost of our I haven't seen and
most of the listeners mostlikely haven't seen.
My question to you is how do younot get frustrated at God?
(45:17):
How do you not get disappointedor quit seeing so much injustice
in the world?
SPEAKER_00 (45:25):
How do you deal with that, I guess, is what I'm
trying to Well, the way I see itactually is that um when I see
these things, I see it like Godhas given me an opportunity to
do something in the midst ofthis horrible situation.
So I thank God for letting me bepart of a solution that he has
(45:49):
for these people.
Um so I've I learned early on,like like my very first trip to
Sudan, it when I came back, Icould not talk for two weeks
because of the things that weheard and the experiences and
things I saw, and never seenanything compared.
And I'd been some bad places inthe world up to that point, but
(46:11):
that was a turning point.
I mean, I could not, I camehome, I didn't talk to my wife,
my children, my staff, myemployees at the agency.
People thought I lost my mind,but looking back on it, was I
was just processing everythingI'd learned and saw and
experienced, and used that toum, you know, to not allow it to
(46:31):
overwhelm me, but to charge meand to energize me to start to
do something and and you know,to start to believe God.
It's like, God, you sent mesomewhere.
It's like, you know, I heard Godspeak to me the last day in
South Sudan, and um as we wereleaving this group of people,
and they were going to they werein a horrible situation, and
(46:53):
they were the survivors of thevillage, got attacked the night
before.
These were about 70 men, women,and children.
And they they were like we wereright on the edge of the Sahara
Desert, it was like 120, 125degrees, super hot.
We were hundreds of miles fromfood, water, shelter, and then
we we literally just came uponthese people.
(47:16):
And um, it was the end of ourtrip, and it was our last day,
and we had to go back thatafternoon.
And I remember, you know, we hadnothing.
If we had water cans, there wasno water.
If we had food, there was no wayfor no way for the cook them,
they cooked them.
They literally had the clotheson their back, and some of them
didn't even have the clothes ontheir back anymore because of
the when they were escaping thethe bush, the the African bush,
(47:40):
you know, ripped a lot of theclothes off.
And it was just a horriblesituation, and and uh they were
going to die.
And you know, I sit here andgoes with that goes all the way
back to the year 2000.
There was no way that they couldsurvive.
There was on, there's justnothing, we had nothing, they
were they were too far fromanything.
And so, but I remember lookingback over my shoulder as we were
(48:01):
pulling away, and I heard thevoice of God say to me, doing
nothing is no longer an option.
And I just thought, okay, and upto that point that um I had been
spending my vacation timesmuggling Bibles and into
restricted countries and stuff,but I knew instantly what God
was saying.
He's like gonna change the focusof what I was doing with my
(48:24):
quote vacation time, which wasuh to provide food, water, and
shelter that people didn't haveany.
And so that was the beginning ofit, and so we just went wherever
God we felt like God led us.
So worked in Sudan for 10 years,Afghanistan for 12 years, um, we
did work in North Korea and manyother countries.
But our focus now is in EastAfrican America.
SPEAKER_01 (48:47):
And so when you were there when you were in some of
these dangerous situations, didyou just felt or just trusted
that God was gonna protect youor you were doing and what you
were doing?
I mean, there must have beenmoments where you felt like, oh
crap, like this is this is bad.
unknown (49:04):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (49:07):
There are quite a few of those moments, frankly.
SPEAKER_01 (49:10):
Like, what did I just get myself into, right?
Like, uh Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_00 (49:14):
Can I tell you a quick story?
SPEAKER_01 (49:16):
Yes, go for it.
SPEAKER_00 (49:17):
We were standing and this was our first time into
Afghanistan, it was eight weeksafter 9-11.
Oh no, it was 10 weeks after9-11.
And uh long story short, it'sthis the this the full story is
in the box is in the book, butuh so we went there to do a
distribution, food distribution,and and um wherever God showed
(49:38):
us.
So, long story short, we are inthe city, my friend and I, he's
from South Africa, and we'restanding in this alleyway.
We were there three days tryingto find food and trucks and
stuff.
We couldn't, nobody would talkto us or anything.
And it was a bizarre scene.
Every male, no matter how oldthey were, little kids to old
men, everybody had guns.
(49:59):
It was so bizarre.
But we um we had a translator,so we met a guy who told us
about this spot, and so, or thisperson, so we're standing in
this alley, we're meeting withthe commander of the Afghan army
who controls the entire borderwith Pakistan, and so like our
planes are still bombing them,you know, in the mountains, and
(50:22):
I'm an American and my friend'sfrom South Africa, and we're
standing in this alley waitingto go meet this guy to see if he
could help us.
And it was one of those momentslike where God took the grace
off of us, and instantaneously Ilooked around and I see these
guys standing.
I mean, these are like theTaliban guys that we were seeing
(50:44):
on TV, and they had their gunsand and everything, and it's the
two of us, and and it's like Ifreaked out, and my friend
freaked out, and we got in thisbig argument in front of these
guys, and they're looking at uslike we're insane.
And it was like the grace cameoff of us, and then I realized
the danger that we really werein.
It's like we probably aren'tcoming home from this.
(51:07):
What was wrong with us?
Why were we so stupid?
Who do we think we are?
And then the gate opens and theguy comes out and said, The
commander will see you now.
And then we both looked at eachother and we're like, Let's go.
So we went in there and we satdown, and he was sitting in a
chair, and there were three ofus, my friend, myself, and the
translator.
And we were circled around hishis butt with his bodyguards,
(51:28):
and then one thing I noticed wasthat the fingers were on the
trigger, and it was like, Thisis not good, this is very bad.
And I said to my friend, I'mlike, What are we gonna say?
You go, Well, you do the talk.
I'm like, I don't know, you dothe talk.
We're arguing back and forth infront of this man, trying to
keep you know, very soft spot.
I'm like, You jerk, why the helldid you put me in here?
Um you're gonna get killed,you're an American.
I'm like, we're saying, and theguy just stops, he goes, Okay.
(51:50):
And to our translator, he goes,Well, he wants to know what you
want.
And I was like, Okay, if I'mgonna die, I'm gonna die far for
God.
And so I said, God put it onheart to come here, God put it
on heart of people in America togive us money to come here
because he sees your suffering,he sees your widows dying, he
(52:10):
sees your children starving.
God loves you so much, he sentus here to help you.
And I remember thinking, if Idie, I die.
Nobody's ever gonna know it,I'll never find our body.
So what's the big deal?
And so um, he looks at us, and Imean it was very tense.
You could read body language,very tense.
And he sits back in his chairand he relaxes like this and
(52:33):
crosses his hand, and he lookedat us and he said, I honor you
for the reason you're here.
I know that your God sent us,sent you to help us.
Wow, when he said I honor you, Iknew exactly what that meant.
When an Afghan puts you in theirhonor or honors you, if anything
would happen to us, he was dutybound to revenge us.
(52:56):
So if somebody would kill us, hewas duty bound to kill whoever
killed us.
And so, long story short, thattwo days later we ended up
delivering food to a villagevery far away, way up in the
mountains, to people that werestarving.
He had no food for severalweeks.
Uh, but this guy said, I'm gonnahelp you.
(53:18):
He goes, What do you want?
I said, We need to buy food.
And and he said, Okay, I canhelp you with this.
Do you have money to pay for it?
We said, sure.
I said, but we're not giving itto you.
We'll pay them, we'll pay themerchants.
He goes, that's fine, I don'twant your money.
He goes, I'm not here to robyou.
You're here to help.
We're going to help you help ourpeople.
He goes, I'm going to give youmy personal bodyguard, the
(53:38):
leader who is my father-in-law.
His team is going to be yourbodyguard until you leave to go
back home.
And then whenever you come back,they can be your bodyguards.
And so God just opened a doorup, just a miraculous door, and
gave us incredible favor.
And we fed those people, and for12 years we were feeding people
(53:59):
in Afghanistan.
SPEAKER_01 (54:01):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (54:02):
But that was one time, honestly, that I think I
would that I didn't think wewould come back home from that
trip.
And nobody knew where we were.
SPEAKER_01 (54:10):
So wow.
That's incredible.
And your wife didn't know whereyou are, your kids don't know
where you are.
SPEAKER_00 (54:15):
You're just like they knew we were going to
Afghanistan and they were nothappy.
I mean, uh, they were not happyat all with me.
SPEAKER_01 (54:23):
Um, because they're aware of the risks, right?
SPEAKER_00 (54:27):
Yeah, yeah, they did.
unknown (54:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (54:29):
Um, that's incredible.
I mean, I I Pat, I could sithere and talk to you all day,
but I just want to also honoryour time.
Um, is there anything else you'dlike to add uh prior to us
wrapping up the podcast?
SPEAKER_00 (54:41):
Yeah, I would like to say this.
Um, as passionate as I am aboutcrisis aid, I don't know if I
said this earlier or not, butI'm equally as passionate.
Sometimes I think I'm even morepassionate to see Christians
live the full life that Godwants them to live.
It's not, it's it's not likeit's his, God desires us to live
(55:04):
a full life.
And he's made plans for us to dothat before we were ever born.
But it takes our cooperation.
We have to cooperate with God.
And the way we cooperate withGod is say, yes, Lord, whatever.
Now, many of us have things inour heart, you know, like I
mentioned earlier, some peoplehomeless, some child, you know,
with orphans or water orevangelism or whatever, we have
(55:26):
things in our heart.
But we put things on top of thatthat we put there, and then we
blame God for not talking to us.
When God just saying, All youhave to do is say yes.
And I have the best life thatyou could ever.
The life I have planned for youis so much better than you can
comprehend right now.
But if you don't come out ofthat church pew and say yes, you
(55:48):
won't experience this life.
And the world needs us rightnow.
The world needs Christians tobecome Christians and do what
God called us to do, which iswhatever you do for the least of
these, you do for me.
It's that simple.
SPEAKER_01 (56:06):
That's beautiful.
Thank you so much for sharingthat.
Well, I usually ask um threequestions at the end of the
podcast.
One is, what's the bravest thingyou've ever done?
Which I think you just coveredwith the Gan story.
Um and then what are threepivotal books that you read?
It could have been any time, itdoesn't have to be a recent read
(56:27):
that were just transformativefor your life.
SPEAKER_00 (56:30):
Without a doubt, the first book was God Smuggler by
brother Andrew.
Um had I not read that book, Ididn't even have a Bible that
night.
Um I read that book before Iever bought a Bible.
Had I not read that book, Ipromise you, I would not be
doing what I do today because Iwould have never thought about
it.
I would have, I was marketing,advertising, successful, and it
(56:51):
was getting even more so, and Icould have gone down that road
and been a real happy Christian.
But that book literally changedmy life, the direction of my
life.
Um and then the Bible is one,um, naturally.
Um, and then there was a book Iread, and this goes back to the
year 2000.
I know we're about we're out oftime.
(57:13):
Um, it's called Seizing YourDivine Moments by Erwin McManus.
And I think it's published nowunder a different title.
But I was at a point in my lifewhere I was trying to determine
do I want to do this or do I notwant to do this?
I felt like God was leading mein this direction and um this to
do something, but I wasn't sure.
And uh pastor friend gave methat book, and after I read that
(57:35):
book, I'm like, okay, this is Iknow that I know that I know God
said go do what you want to do,and I'll be with you.
And so that book really, reallyimpacted my life.
SPEAKER_01 (57:44):
And my next question is what's the best advice that
someone gave you?
SPEAKER_00 (57:47):
You can love your wife, but make sure she's your
best friend also.
I didn't do that on my firstmarriage, and today I today my
wife is my best friend.
And we are truly partners inevery aspect of our life,
including our our work withCrisis Aid, our ministry work.
SPEAKER_01 (58:04):
That's beautiful.
Well, um, for those who arelistening, Pat Bradley has a
book out called Born for Rescue.
Um, also, he leads Crisis AidInternational.
Uh, Pat, where is the best placewhere people can find you?
Crisisaid.org.
That's it.
Well, Pat, thank you so much foryour time.
Thank you for your story, foryour courage, and for inspiring
(58:26):
all of us today.
SPEAKER_00 (58:27):
It was a true privilege.
Thank you for giving it to me.
SPEAKER_01 (58:30):
Thank you for listening to the Ones Who Here
podcasts.
It is an honor to share theseencouraging stories with you.
If you enjoy the show, I wouldlove for you to tell your
friends, leave us a reviewerrating, and subscribe to
wherever you listen to podcastsbecause this helps others
discover the show.
You can find me on my website,specopop.com.
What if one single moment could change everything
in your life?
In today's episode, we sit downPat Bradley, a man who went from
being a broken alcoholic whosemarriage fell apart to founding
Crisis Aid International, anonprofit that's brought hope to
millions around the world.
You see, Pat's story isn't justabout recovery from alcoholism.
(00:22):
It's about how faith, courage,and one life-changing decision
can rewrite your story to.
In this episode, you're gonnalearn how to find purpose even
in your greatest pain, how tostep boldly into your calling,
even when you can't see the pathahead.
Pat also shares some of thewildest stories you'll ever
hear.
From standing in war zones totrusting God in the most
(00:45):
dangerous places on earth.
If you have ever felt likeyou've gone too far to turn back
or too broken to be used, pleaseallow this episode to be your
reminder that redemption is realand your breakthrough might just
be one moment away.
Pat Bradley, welcome to the OnceAre Dare podcast.
(01:06):
I'm so honored to have you onhere.
SPEAKER_00 (01:08):
It's an honor to be on here.
SPEAKER_01 (01:10):
You have such an incredible story.
I've from my perspective andreading your book, reading your
work, it just shows of how muchof a difference one life can
make.
But you weren't always involvedin what you're doing, you
weren't always saving lives.
And what was your pivotal pointor what happened prior to you
(01:31):
getting involved in helping somany people?
SPEAKER_00 (01:34):
Well, um, the story begins with um our marriage.
Let's start with that, my firstmarriage.
And uh I was an alcoholic.
I would just get to the point.
I was an alcoholic, afunctioning alcoholic.
Uh I held down my job, and uh,but I drank too much.
And so my wife, after six years,six and a half years of being
(01:56):
married, we had two youngchildren, three and five years
old.
Um, she decided to divorce me.
And that literally made my worldcrash.
So up until that point, youknow, I was all about partying
and having a good time and anduh just enjoying life as the way
I saw fit, but not the way shesaw fit.
(02:17):
And uh so my world came crashingdown.
And so the uh she actually shecalled me at work and and she
said, You need to come home now.
And I said, I don't want to comehome now, I'm going out with my
friends.
And she said, No, you need tocome home right now.
And I just something in methought, hmm, I better go home.
And so I went home and I walk inthe front door, and there she's
(02:38):
standing here with two blackplastic trash bags and a piece
of paper in her hand, and uh allmy worldly possessions were in
those trash bags, and the paperwas a uh court order telling me
I had to vacate in 30 minutes orI'd be thrown in jail.
So I pleaded and tried.
She wouldn't, you know, shewouldn't change her mind.
So um that night is the lastnight I drank.
(03:01):
And the next morning I woke upin my mom and dad's bed
basement.
I can't tell you today how I gotthere.
I have virtually no recomm youknow recollection.
And so um that led me to um seekhelp.
Like, what do what can I do?
And I tried to call her and begher and plead with her, and she
wouldn't even talk to me.
(03:21):
Um and so somewhere I rememberhearing that you know Alcoholics
Anonymous is a program, and shetold she told me you need to go
into a treatment center.
I said, Well, I can't go into atreatment center.
I got a job, and I can't be gonefor 30 days.
And uh anyway, long story short,she um hung up on me again, and
so I decided to seek outAlcoholics Anonymous, and I went
(03:43):
to my first meeting the nextnight, and I had learned from
that first meeting that shesaid, if you come 90, 90
meetings in 90 days, it's equalto the kind of uh therapy or
whatever you get from uh beingin a treatment center.
So I thought, okay, I can dothis, and I did it.
And on day 91, I called her upand then I said, Hey, guess
what?
(04:03):
I completed 90 days and she hungup on me again.
So the divorce went through, andshortly after the divorce, um, I
took a new job.
And so back then, when I wasduring my drinking days, I got
am I saying your name right?
It's bad guy.
SPEAKER_01 (04:19):
Yeah, yeah, you got it.
SPEAKER_00 (04:21):
Um, like we had to borrow money to feed my kids
every week.
Like I wasn't making much money.
Um, and so um we were poor.
We just were poor.
I don't know what else to say.
So anyway, I took this new job,and I it was a new company, a
startup, and I mean, I Godblessed me, but I didn't know it
was God at the time.
I thought it was me, and um Istarted making, you know, within
(04:45):
six months more money than I hadever dreamed possible.
And, you know, I thought I washappy, I bought a new car, I
bought a condominium, everythingwas going great.
But, you know, late at nightthere was that ache in my heart
knowing my wife and my kids.
And uh in my mind, I said Ihated my wife for divorcing me
and how she ruined my life.
But in all sincerity, in myheart, I still loved her with
(05:10):
everything in me.
And um, and so my children,after about a year and a half,
they start talking about thisTuesday school.
And I'm thinking, this soundsreally weird.
What is Tuesday school?
What's Tuesday school?
Yeah, and so um I was born andgrew up in a Catholic church
until I was old enough to um notgo on my own.
(05:32):
And so that was my background.
No, um, so I decided I'm gonnago check on what Tuesday school
is, and so I couldn't make it ona Tuesday, but I thought, okay,
I'm gonna go on a Sunday.
So I had the kids, I called myex-wife and I said, Hey, I'm
gonna bring the kids to thechurch, and then you can take
them from there, but I want tocome and sit in the service and
see what's going on.
(05:53):
And she said, Well, okay.
I said, but I'd like to sit withyou.
And so what I was planning ondoing was um I was convinced
this was a cult.
And um so I met my wife on thechurch steps, uh, and that that
was that was an experience.
It was hot, I was covered insweat.
(06:13):
It was we pulled into thisparking lot, and it was like a
mile-long back like traffic jamto get into the parking lot to
go into the church.
I had never seen anything likethis.
And I'm going, this is a cult.
This is a cult.
Look at all these people.
And so we walked in and walkedinto the church, and there were
thousand thousands of people,but there were TV cameras, and
(06:35):
but and I'm as soon as I saw thecameras, this is a cult, this is
a cult, I'm gonna get my kidsback.
I can so I'm making mental notesof what I'm seeing.
Um, but that day something crazyhappened, and um I heard the
voice of God speak to me duringthat service, and he said, How
many times must I call you?
And I heard that three times.
(06:57):
And when I heard that, I waslike in this, like this fog, and
it was right after the worshipservice, and so it was and I'm
not describing it very clearly,but it was just so bizarre.
And when I think back on it, itstill is bizarre.
But um, so I'll just tell youhow it went.
(07:18):
This guy gets up at the end ofworship, starts speaking real
loud, whatever's what how I howI knew this, I don't know.
I knew it was a message intongues, and so that you know
that was weird, and I thought,oh, confirmation, more more
ammunition for getting the kids.
But when he got done, and thepastor got up and explained what
happened, and he gave thisinterpretation, and that's when
(07:42):
I heard God speak to me.
How many times must I call you?
And he said it three times.
And then after the third time,like this fog went away, and I
literally found myself sobbinguncontrollably.
I could not stop.
And then my brain started, I'mgoing, You have lost your mind.
What is wrong with you?
(08:02):
And people like looking at me,and my ex-wife is who's sitting
next to me, is like trying toscoot away and look at me like
I'm insane.
I'm thinking I'm insane.
I didn't know what happened.
Um, and I didn't uh and so theygave an altar call.
You know, I'm like, Do you wantto give your life to Christ, to
Jesus?
And I wanted to, but I didn't gobecause I was too embarrassed,
because I was crying so hardthat I couldn't stop.
(08:25):
But I was also afraid I mightsee somebody that knows me, and
I don't want them to see mereacting this way.
So um Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (08:32):
So you came there to investigate.
unknown (08:34):
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (08:35):
I came there to say, Oh, this is a cult.
I'm gonna prove that my wife isinvolved in some weird stuff so
that I can have you know custodyof the kids or whatnot.
And then you come there and youhave this encounter.
SPEAKER_00 (08:46):
Uh yes.
Wow.
I had this encounter.
So we left, and uh and so umtrying to think, so it was a
friendly party.
Parking lot said goodbye tokids, said goodbye to my
ex-wife, and so uh later thatday I started feeling like very
bad about not going forward.
That like now they we call itthe conviction of the Holy
(09:08):
Spirit.
I mean, I know exactly what thatwas, and it that was Sunday, and
then Monday it continued and andit got stronger and stronger,
and then Tuesday even gotstronger.
They had a service on Tuesdaynights, like I mentioned
earlier, Tuesday, Tuesdayschool.
And so I told my for somereason, I don't know why, I
called my wife and I said, Areyou taking the kids to the
church tonight?
She said, Yeah, I go, Well, I'mgonna come too.
(09:29):
I go, can we sit together?
And she said, Well, I guess shestill was keeping me at 100
yards away.
And uh, so I went and they gavean altar call, and I mean I ran
down to that altar, and uh andI, you know, I just I knelt down
and I gave my life to Jesus.
And that night got everythingchanged for me for the best, but
(09:54):
I had no idea what was coming.
Um after the service was over, Iwent, there was a bookstore, and
so I went in the bookstore andthere was this book called God
Smuggler.
It was on like an end aisle, andit did um title kind of caught
my attention.
So I bought it, and I didn'thave a Bible, and I went home
and I started reading it.
I mean, I couldn't put that bookdown, and I quit like three or
(10:15):
four in the morning, and thenthe next went to work, and then
the next day, uh the next nightI finished it, and I just prayed
a simple prayer.
I said, God, if you can ever useme to help people that are being
persecuted like this, I'm justmaking myself available.
And uh that's how it allstarted.
And then um, so my wife and Iwere having starting to talk a
(10:36):
little bit more and a little bitmore, and then I in my business
I went to the company she workedfor.
I was in marketing advertising,and uh her boss wanted to have a
meeting with me about acampaign, and so I'm standing in
a lobby, and uh receptionistsaid, Oh, her assistant will
come get you.
And so I'm standing looking outthe windows, and I heard this
door open.
I turned around.
There's my ex-wife standingthere.
Now I'm I'm at that point, I'mnot hating her, but I wasn't
(11:00):
liking her a lot.
Right.
I took a look at her and she hasthis auburn hair.
I'm like, oh my god, she'sgorgeous.
You know, I'm seeing her, I'mlike, wow, she's beautiful.
And so we walked to her boss'soffice, had a little chat, and
then she walked me out, and uhwe had even a nicer
conversation, and then we agreedto meet for a coffee, and we met
for coffee and um started seeingeach other very carefully.
(11:24):
I mean, I'm kind of kind oflike, if we're gonna do it,
let's do it, let's jump in andfigure it out as we're going.
And she's a little bit morecautious.
And uh, but six months later wegot remarried for the second
time.
SPEAKER_01 (11:35):
Wow, that's so beautiful.
Yeah, yeah.
In your book, um, Born toRescue, you write about a
life-changing moment in EastAfrica.
I'm curious to how you got thereand what that moment was.
SPEAKER_00 (11:49):
So, how we got to East Africa was um, again, this
is gonna sound crazy, but I'msitting in my office in the ad
agency at lunch, and I'm comeacross the internet headline
that said 14 million Ethiopiansat risk of death by starvation.
And this no sooner than I readit, I knew that God just said
go.
(12:10):
And I didn't know anybody, um, Ididn't know anybody that knew
anybody in in Ethiopia.
I contacted a friend who'd madesome connections and uh he ended
up getting back to me with aphone number, which I put it on
a yellow post-it note, and 30days later I go to Ethiopia with
the yellow post-it note and aphone number, not knowing what
(12:31):
was going to come out of this.
I just knew God said go, andbased on what had happened in uh
Sudan and Afghanistan, um, Ijust knew God would show us.
And so we spent the next sixdays driving around the
countryside and uh looking attherapeutic feeding centers and
seeing firsthand visually thestarvation, literally people
(12:55):
literally dying of starvation,men, women, children.
And it was horrible.
Um but it was one of thosemoments to where we pulled up
after six days, pulled in thisvillage that they knew we were
coming, and there was 250mothers sitting on the side of
this hill, and they um theelders came out and talked to
us, and they said, you know, yousee all those children up there,
(13:17):
and each mother had at least onechild, and they were obviously
they were severely malnourished.
I had never really experiencedany of this until this trip
about severe malnutrition andyou know, like kids that look
like skeletons or people, iswhen I say that term, that's
what I'm referring to.
Um but I knew we needed to buildwhat was called a therapeutic
feeding center in order to treatthem properly, and so and I also
(13:41):
knew it would cost$100,000 to dothat, plus you have to staff
one.
And we didn't, you know, I justthey asked me, they begged me,
would you please do something?
And I said, Okay, I'm comingback.
We'll we're gonna build atherapeutic feeding center and
do what we can to help thesechildren.
And so they were thankful.
And um the next day I left andflew home.
(14:02):
And as I'm flying home, I'mthinking to myself, what is
wrong with me?
We had our mailing list, it waslike 40 people, and it was
mainly friends and relatives whowere you know tired of getting
my mail and giving me money.
SPEAKER_01 (14:15):
Right, same people, right?
That you're kind of like, hey,here I am.
SPEAKER_00 (14:19):
Yeah, I'm like, how can I ask them again?
And then I knew we had$350 inour bank account.
And I came back and I told mywife who wasn't thrilled.
She's like, What did you tellthem?
What is wrong with you?
Don't you know we only got thismuch and we can't?
And I called my board togetherand I said, Okay, guys, this is
you know, this is what I'mthinking, this is what I think
God told us.
(14:39):
And uh, four of my board memberswere on, two of them weren't.
Um, they said, You know, you'regonna kill these kids, you don't
know what you're doing, andwe've never done this before,
and where's the money gonna comefrom?
And where are you gonna findpeople?
And I'm like, I don't know.
God said, Do it.
He showed me them.
How could I not do something?
I said, We're doing this, and soum, over the next six weeks, a
(15:02):
hundred thousand dollars camein.
Wow, I to this day my wife and Istill can't tell you how that
happened.
But people start hearing andmoney started coming in from
people we never even knewexisted, and so we went over
there, uh, got got everythingset up and built, but we needed
help, we needed workers, and umagain, we were ready to go, but
(15:25):
no one to work.
And so that afternoon, this wasin a very remote part of the
country, and there was no cellservice, there never was cell
service, but my guide, mytranslator, friend, the East
African guy, um, has a cellphone to start ringing.
And I looked at him and helooked at me and I go, Well,
answer it.
And he answered it, and he'slike, he's I mean, he's African,
(15:49):
and I teased with him, I said,You turned white on that phone
call.
What happened?
And and he said, he puts a handover me, he goes, This is my
office.
He said, There's two a doctorand two nurses, two pediatric
nurses, a pediatrician.
They just showed up, they weresupposed to go spend three
months working with anotherorganization that just were told
they were not needed and they'regetting ready to go home unless
(16:11):
we can we use them.
I go, Yeah, we can use them.
And so the next day we had ourmedical staff free of charge.
And what the beauty of it waswas that this doctor and these
nurses have spent over 20 yearsworking at therapeutic feeding
centers in third worldcountries.
So they have all the experiencewe ever could possibly dream and
(16:32):
hope for just landed right in mylap.
And all I did was show up with alittle yellow post-it.
SPEAKER_01 (16:38):
Wow, that I'm just thinking over what you just
said.
That is so incredible.
I mean, going there to beginwith without having no plan.
And you, you know, coming from aplace of marketing and business,
you know that's not really theway that things should be done,
right?
And and then making thiselaborate promise to these
(17:02):
people that are desperate forhelp.
And you're like, I'll figure outa way.
Like, what was going throughyour mind at that time?
Like, how do you just jump withthe leap of faith and then just
like, okay, we'll just do it?
SPEAKER_00 (17:14):
Um, I don't know.
I just it's kind of I guess I'mwired that way.
God has wired me to be that way.
Um you know, it's just like ifwe're trying to figure out what
God wants us to do and we haveto have everything planned out
and we make all of our plans andstuff, what I've learned is that
you kind of remove God from theequation because you just put
(17:36):
what you think in there.
And so, yeah, you we can makeplans, but I when I do it even
to this day, they're very loose.
They're very loose.
It's like, okay, we're here, weknow we want to get here in the
next year.
I think these are the steps.
Let's begin walking to see whereit ends up.
And God always, a hundredpercent of the time, comes
(17:57):
through so much more than I hadever dreamed possible.
It's like one example we werewent into the can I tell you
this story?
Yeah.
Okay, we went into, I wasstanding in this same country,
and it was a Saturday afternoon,and we're standing in a corner.
I was talking to a guy that hada ministry work to street kids,
homeless kids living on thestreet.
(18:18):
And I'm standing there and we'retalking, and then I hear this
voice say to me, Ask him aboutprostitution.
And I thought, this is strange.
I'm not asking him aboutprostitution.
He's like he's like a pastor,and he's helped.
I just ignored it, and then likeit happened again a couple
minutes later.
And so again, the experience Ihad in Sudan and Afghanistan,
(18:39):
and then this country, I knewthat I knew that God was saying
something.
So I stopped him.
I go, Can you tell me aboutprostitution?
And uh excuse me?
I'm telling you about myministry.
I know I love your ministry, butI gotta ask you this.
And so he tells me about thisred light district.
And uh I said, Okay, I said, Canyou take us down or I'd like to
(19:00):
see this?
And he um gave me another weirdlook, but he said, sure, we can
go down.
He goes, When do you want to go?
I go, I want to go at night.
I'm gonna see it at night whenit's really, you know, doing its
thing.
And um he said, Okay, so wentback to my hotel and called my
wife and she said, Well, whatare you doing tonight?
And I said, Well, we're gonna gohang out with the prostitutes.
SPEAKER_01 (19:20):
And she goes, She's like, Yeah, that sounds like a
plan.
SPEAKER_00 (19:24):
Exactly.
She's like, that's a reallyinteresting thing to tell me
when you're on the other side ofthe world.
But she knew at that point thatthe last few years of of some of
the crazy stories and stuff, shewas like, Okay.
And so we went there and um andI just walked through there.
I just didn't expect anything, Ihad no plans.
And so we start this startedthis conversation um with these
(19:48):
with these girls.
There's five of them, and theytold us, like, and I don't mean
this to be racist in any way,shape, or form, but they said,
you know, you're the first whitepeople that ever come down here.
I mean, there are thousands ofgirls.
They live in these little tinsheds that are like six feet by
eight feet, enough room for abed and a table, no running
water, no s no open sew, it'sstunk.
(20:08):
It was uh it was it was hell onearth.
It was like you can't imagineanything so bad.
I've seen horrible things inmany countries, but this topped
it all.
SPEAKER_02 (20:18):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (20:19):
And so we were getting a big crowd around um
because you know, who are thestrangers?
What do they want?
And they're talking to thesegirls, and and and I said, Hey,
can we go in and talk in one ofyour rooms so we can kind of get
out of here and they go, sure,we can go in this room.
And so as we were walking in, Ilooked over my shoulder and I
saw this one young girl walkingdown, and she just had this
white outfit on, which was kindof strange.
(20:40):
Um, but she was walking down,and I just told asked our
translator, I said, Ask her ifshe wants to come in with us.
And she she went back and askedher, and and um she said, sure.
So she came in.
I assumed she knew the otherfive, but she did not, they
didn't know each other.
And so we're sitting in there,we're talking, we're gonna
listen to their stories, and um,you know, then he asked, Why are
(21:02):
you here?
And I'm like, Um, I'm not surewhy I'm here, but I know this
much.
God has a much better plan foryour life than what you're
living through.
Are you interested in hear aboutthis?
They go, sure, what do you tellus about it?
And I'm like, Well, you know, Italked about how much God loved
them, and it breaks his heart tosee what they're living through,
and we understand, but we didn'tunderstand, I didn't mean to say
it that way, that we can'tunderstand what you're going
(21:24):
through, but we think we may beable to do something to help.
And then in my mind, I'm going,What are you doing?
What are you doing?
You're walking into it again.
SPEAKER_01 (21:32):
Yeah, making promises again.
SPEAKER_00 (21:34):
Yeah, making promises.
And so um we we uh and but allthe while this one young girl
was sitting on the edge, kind ofa little away from them.
And uh so, you know, I said, Doyou want, you know, give your
life to Christ?
Because, you know, somethingcould happen to you night.
So we talked about salvation andwhat it meant and stuff.
And so they all agreed and theyall prayed and gave their life
(21:56):
to Jesus.
But when we were done, thesecond we were done, I felt so
laser focused on the one girl,just the one girl.
And so I was talking to her, andit was so long ago now, it was
in 2006.
It was in 2006 of December.
I didn't know what it was abouther, but I just felt like God
(22:17):
has a special plan for yourlife, and I don't know what it
is, but you need to, you know,seek God for what's what He has
for you.
And we just talk, then I heardthis crazy thing say, baptize
her.
I'm like, there's no water.
I've never baptized a soul, Idon't even know what you say to
baptize somebody, and so I justkind of got quiet, and um, then
(22:39):
I heard it again, like baptizeher now.
So I had a friend with me, and Ilooked at him like this is what
I feel like God said.
And he goes, Okay, let's do it.
So I told the girls, I said,Somebody get a pot of water, we
need to baptize her.
They all kind of looked at mekind of weird, and they were
like, who is this guy?
We are weird, we get it.
But so we got the water and wewent out in the alley, and uh
(23:00):
again it got crowded.
Um, and I had her bend over atthe waist, and I'm like, okay,
let's start pouring water on.
I don't remember what I saidother than that.
I said something, I guess Iprayed something appropriate.
I hope I did.
But I said, and I baptize you inthe name of the Father, Son, and
the Holy Spirit.
And then I like you can standup, and then water is dripping
(23:21):
down her hair onto her face,onto her clothes, and everything
got quiet.
And I looked at her and she hada smile that like lit up this
whole alleyway.
There was such a physicaltransformation in this young
girl, and everybody there sawit, and nobody said a word.
It was one of those God moments,like I'm getting goosebumps
(23:44):
right now, thinking about thatmoment and what what happened to
her and what everyone saw.
And so after about a couple ofseconds, I looked at her and I
go, Would you like to leave heretonight?
And she looked at me, she said,Yes.
And I said, Is it safe?
Is it can you leave with ustonight?
(24:05):
She said, My owner is not heretonight, so yes, I can come
tonight.
SPEAKER_02 (24:10):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (24:11):
Okay, run back, get all your stuff, and come get
get, you know, come back, we'llwait for you.
And now I'm starting to think,like, what are we gonna do with
her?
Like, okay, here we go again.
I don't open my mouth.
But it's like, you know, and myfriend, like, what are you doing
with her?
And then the guy at the head ofthe street man came up to me,
like, what are you gonna do withher?
What's your plan?
(24:32):
I go, I don't have a plan, but Iknow this much.
We can't leave her here.
God, God brought us here.
This was a divine.
We can't leave her here.
And so she came back about 10minutes later, and she had like
this Walmart-sized shopping bagwith all her worldly
possessions.
That's all she owned.
And as we're walking out, I'mtrying to think, what are we
gonna do?
(24:52):
I have no plans, no ideas.
Um, so I so I start asking her,I was like, Oh, tell me, how old
are you?
She was 16, she had no livingfamily that she knew of, and
she'd been there five years.
But the thing that really brokemy heart is she said, the
thought of ever leaving therehad never occurred to me.
And I thought, you're 16 yearsold, you have no family, and in
(25:13):
your mind, this is where youwill spend the rest of your life
in this horrific red lightdistrict being raped multiple
times every night, seven days aweek.
Wow.
And I was like, we can't wewe'll figure this out.
And so we put her in an office,let her sleep on the floor for a
night or two, and then we foundan apartment.
But what that began unplanned,that began our work in what we
(25:36):
you know in sex traffickingwork.
And back then the word sextrafficking did not exist.
No one ever heard that term.
I had never heard this term, andso that girl, her her agreeing
to come out has led us into thisum uh work in rescuing victims
of sex trafficking, and nowwe've moved into the prevention
(25:59):
side.
We've got 23, 22 full-time staffin America that work on nothing
but sex trafficking and sextrafficking um prevention.
Uh we have a lot of work in thatcountry.
So, to date, since then, we'vehelped over 9,700 girls get out
and be rescued from beingvictims of trafficking.
(26:21):
And then when we do that, wedon't just like dump them
somewhere.
It's like they come into ourprogram and we train them, we
educate them so that they can goout and live and be a success.
SPEAKER_01 (26:31):
Yeah, and you have homes in the states as well, is
that correct?
SPEAKER_00 (26:34):
Yes, we do.
We have one in Grand Rapids andit'll house 20 girls.
Uh, we just opened it a yearago, and I mean, this is a
beautiful, beautiful home.
The pastor of the church thatwe're partnering with, um, and
when we were done, he looked atme and the price tag was like
8.5 million.
And he looked at me and goes,This is what I get for letting
(26:55):
my rich congregation membersdesign this home.
But it is a it is a premierhome.
It was it's been so well thoughtout, you know, triggered.
Like you got two wings, and thewings are staggered, so there's
not one long hallway, so they'restaggered.
Because a lot of times the girlsworking in a in a hotel, they s
(27:17):
see this long hallway and itjust triggers things in them.
And so there's like there's nodark corners in any anywhere.
There's not a dark corner.
When you go down a stairwell,automatic lights kick on, so
there's not even a second ofdarkness.
So just you know, all theseyears we've learned a lot of
things of how to employ it toget the best success.
SPEAKER_01 (27:34):
And wow, so everything was intentionally
designed in the place.
SPEAKER_00 (27:39):
Yes, very much so.
Yeah, for the girls and youknow, for the victims.
SPEAKER_01 (27:44):
Wow, that is so incredible.
I mean, there's so manydifferent pillars that you do
besides you're feeding thehungry, you're rescuing uh, you
know, people that are involvedin sex trafficking, having homes
for them.
Do you also do some preventativecare as well?
SPEAKER_00 (28:02):
Um yes, we do.
In fact, we um so we kind ofshifted our model back in 2017,
I think.
Um there was uh we were at oneof our food distribution sites,
and I'm turning around, I meanthere's hundreds of people
there.
And so up until that time, ourour struggle was keeping keeping
(28:24):
children alive, and there wereso many, we didn't we didn't
have enough, so we did the bestwe could with what we had for as
many as we could.
But I turned around and thisfather hands me this not like
shoves this child into my arms.
And I mean I had never seen achild this bad.
She was four years old, weighedless than I think weighed less
(28:45):
than it's in a book how much sheweighed, like six pounds.
Um and you took one look at herand it's like she's hours from
dying.
She's not, you know, there's umyeah, so anyway, just trying to
think about how that felt.
She uh we got her to a hospitaland she died the next day.
(29:08):
And it just like it was one ofthose things where we've seen
that happen before, but this onewas special because A, she was
the worst we ever seen.
But B, when the father put herin my arms, felt good, the
desperation in his eyes waspalatable.
So it just so palatable, and andit it we couldn't speak, but you
(29:29):
could understand his heart.
And what I learned was he hadlost his wife a year before to
something, uh, some kind ofinfection that was easily
treatable with uh an antibiotic.
And he had lost two otherchildren to starvation uh
several months about threemonths before this day that he
handed this daughter to me.
And this was his last child, andthere she was ready to die.
(29:52):
And the desperation waspalatable, and I'll never forget
what that what that looked like.
And so the next day, when weFound out she passed away, I
turned around to my countrydirector and I said, you know
what?
I said, we have to learn to askbetter questions.
I heard Tony Robbins say thatone time.
I thought it was such abrilliant statement.
And so it was like, what are wegonna?
(30:15):
We've been struggling to keepchildren alive.
But what can we do different tostart to prevent them from
getting into this?
And it all went back to thatfather.
And what God showed us was thisman was a hard worker.
He tried to hire himself out forday labor.
His clothes literally were soold and dirty, they were
literally falling apart on him,but that's all he had.
(30:37):
And he did his darn but he didhis best.
He didn't, he didn't have thething is that there's no
opportunities for people.
So it's like we don't want to,we can't go over, you know,
teach them how to do thingsbecause you gotta be culturally
sensitive and just a lot ofreasons.
There's there's a good way to doit and there's a wrong way to do
it.
And so what God showed us wasthat it's not just demonstrating
(31:02):
to them how to grow bettercoffee trees, but it's to show
them the opportunity bettercoffee trees will present to
them.
And that was the foreign conceptto them.
Opportunity.
I say it this way, ifopportunity hit them on the
head, they wouldn't know it.
And you know, you the saying isyou know, teach a man to fish
(31:22):
and you feed him for a lifetime,but they they wouldn't have
known what a fish was, theywouldn't have known what to do
with the fishing, but youcouldn't have teach them taught
them how to fish because thatjust was not in the context of
their culture.
SPEAKER_01 (31:34):
Yeah, it's kind of like you don't know what you
don't know, right?
And right.
SPEAKER_00 (31:38):
So we can make all of these platitudes and and
sayings, and they all sound gooduntil you get on the field and
you get in front of somebodylike that, or you get in front
of a community of people likethat, and it's like you know,
the the the answers are not whatwe think they are, they're not
the easy answers.
But what we saw was you canteach them, you can train them,
but you've got to show them howto what an opportunity is and
(31:59):
how to exploit an opportunity.
And so that we shifted all ofour programming starting there
into moving into that direction.
And it took us a couple years todo it, but now we've created
four or five hundred jobs inthat country.
Uh at times from some of ourprograms, we may have as many as
(32:19):
five to seven hundred people,local people working for us on a
part-time basis to help us withour agriculture or what other
things.
So we brought that thinking,what it did is it helped us to
learn how to design our programsthat teaches them to what to do
with an opportunity and thenhelp provide the opportunity for
(32:40):
them because there's nothingthere for them.
There is nothing.
It had to be created, but youhave to create it in a way that
you understand that it fitstheir culture because you're not
changing the culture, you'renever going to change the
culture.
So it has to fit their cultureand then done in a way that they
feel like they are accomplishingit themselves, not that we're
(33:01):
doing it for you and to you.
And so that's what's how we canchange.
SPEAKER_01 (33:08):
Oh, that's incredible.
What would you say to someone,maybe a person listening right
now, that just feels sounqualified to make a
difference?
And you often said aboutyourself that you're just an
ordinary guy who answered acall.
SPEAKER_00 (33:23):
Yeah.
I uh I am.
I've got no honest, I have nospecial skills or talents.
SPEAKER_01 (33:30):
That is like, look, I'm not special, okay?
I am not.
SPEAKER_00 (33:34):
I'm just an ordinary person.
I truly am.
I'm no different than anybodyelse.
The only thing I will say I didthat most people haven't done is
um I just said yes to God and Igot out of the pew.
You know, Svetka, when I talk atchurches, people come up to me
frequently, and um, and I don'tspeak very often, but people
(33:56):
always come to me, you know, I'mjust waiting to hear God's will.
I'm waiting for God to turnlight green.
I'm like, you know what?
God's waiting for you.
You don't, you Jesus said,whatever you do in Matthew, he
said, whatever you do for theleast of these, you do it for
me.
Now, to me, the key word in allof that is whatever, whatever
(34:18):
you do, whatever you do, you'redoing it for me.
Because you're doing it to theleast of these.
So the freedom we have in Christis so unimaginable to most
Christians because we think wegot to fit in God's perfect
will.
Well, God's like, you know, yourperfect will is like my perfect
will is to get you out of the Pand get you moving so I can
(34:39):
guide you.
And God will guide you.
But you know, all it takes is awilling heart.
But the one thing I want other,you know, like Christians and
non-Christians to understand isthat being a Christian is is
probably the greatest adventureon the planet.
There's I don't think there's, Idon't believe there's anything
they can even compare to being aChristian lived the way God
(35:02):
wants us to live it, not the waywe choose to live it, sitting in
church waiting to hear as well.
No, that's not an adventure,that's boredom.
You're bored as a Christian,which is terrible.
We shouldn't be bored asChristians.
We should be living a lifethat's ad a life of adventure.
So, what's an adventure to me isgoing to be different than maybe
the guy sitting next to me orsomeone else.
(35:22):
They define their own life onwhat adventure looks like to
them, and then just let God takeit and just start moving.
But the thing is, like what I'mI love what I do.
I mean, this life, I dream thislife of, I remember sitting in a
church service back in the 80s,it shows you my age, um, about
this guy who owned a businessand he used his business to fund
(35:45):
his missions.
And I remember sitting in thatchurch, I remember just like it
was last night, sitting in thereand thinking, okay, that's what
I want to do with my life, andthis is what I think I want it
to look like.
As he's talking, I'm buildingthis dream.
And as I sit here in front ofyou today, I'm living that dream
today.
And I'm not saying that God gaveme that dream.
I'm just saying that was a dreamI came up with.
(36:06):
Now I do I believe God gave thatto me?
Yes, I do.
But it wasn't one of these, youknow, oh, God told me this.
No, it was like, this is what Ithis, I think I want to do this.
And God, I'm I'm literally doingit today.
But honestly, I don't have anymore talents than anyone else.
The only thing I did was sayyes, Lord, and got out of the
church pew and said, now what?
(36:28):
So then people go, Well, what doyou do then?
What's that what's the nextstep?
What's the logical next step?
Well, I don't know what's onyour heart.
Well, I you know what I see,these homeless people.
Oh, great, well, go do somethingfor a homeless person.
Just see one, go do somethingnice for them, see what happens.
You know, just to get peoplemoving out of their church Ps.
SPEAKER_01 (36:47):
Yeah, I think that is such a huge point because
there's a lot of people that Iknow, like you said, that are
waiting to get this hugerevelation of that one big thing
they're supposed to do withtheir life, right?
And they call it a calling.
Okay.
Um one of my favorite quotes,and I say this in the podcast
(37:08):
quite often, is um by MayaAngela, who said, Your legacy is
every life you touch.
unknown (37:13):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (37:14):
I love that.
So it's it's not about doingthis one ginormous big event
that is gonna be the pinnacle ofyour life, that is your legacy,
that is this is what you're bornfor.
Yes, sure, we have differenttalents and abilities, and
everyone's wired a little bitdifferently from each other.
We're, you know, thinkdifferently.
At the end of the day, what Ibelieve is that we can impact
(37:37):
the people around us, you know.
Just this morning I got news ofmy friend who lost her husband.
And it's like, how can you bethere for her in this moment,
right?
So that is that is oneopportunity that says, hey, the
here's an opportunity to impacta life today, right?
Exactly.
Um and so I'd love for you tospeak to that person who's just
(37:58):
feels stuck because they'rereally complicating it.
SPEAKER_00 (38:06):
Um okay.
So um I'm thinking that so somany times, so much of the time
we spend, like we just talkedabout, like trying to discern
God's will from my life.
(38:26):
Oh, what's my calling?
Do I have a calling?
Yes, everybody who's a Christianhas got a calling on their life
because that's why we'reChristians.
We became Christians because Godwas calling us to Him, He was
the one drawing us to Him.
And so, you know what I wouldsay again is going back to you
(38:46):
have no idea how much freedomthere is in serving God.
God is such a, He, oh gosh,that's a hard question that you
asked me.
Um I would just say it likethis.
You know, get your butt out ofthe church pew and just see what
God has for you.
(39:07):
Just take the next step, takethe next step.
Don't quit trying to figurethings out.
You will never figure this out.
All you will do is end upfrustrating yourself.
And you know what?
You have been given one life.
Don't waste it, don't waste halfof it, don't waste 10% of it.
Trying to figure out the callingof God on my life.
(39:27):
When the Bible makes it veryclear, there's 2,700 or so
verses that deal with povertyand injustice.
Pick one of those verses, buildyour life around it, and you'll
be in the center of God's will.
That's all it takes.
The Bible has everything we needto know.
But going back to what Jesussaid, whatever you do for the
least of these, you're doing itfor me.
(39:49):
That's all we need to know.
Now go figure out what you wantto do for the least of these.
What does that mean to you?
You, like you mentioned, you hada friend that just lost a
husband.
Go be with that person.
Go sit and don't say a word.
Just sit with them, be presentwith them.
Um, you know, I have a neighborthat's got cancer and he can't
do his yard work, so I go do hisyard work for him.
(40:09):
You know, there's alwayssomething we can do to start.
And but but you know, at the endof the day, God's for the most
part waiting for us to take thesteps.
And he's not gonna push us outof a church pew.
He's gonna make, he wants us totake the initiative to trust him
enough to get up and go stand ina pew and go, okay.
(40:30):
Um I'm presenting myself to you,God, use me however you want.
It's think of it like this (40:35):
you you sign, okay, God, I'm gonna
sign this contract with you.
I sign my name on it, and I handit back to him, but the page is
blank.
God, you fill in the rest.
That's another way to look atit, maybe.
SPEAKER_01 (40:52):
Yeah, that's beautiful.
Um, looking back to you startedoff with just, you know, in
alcoholism, being despaired,down and out, not really having
a lot of hope for your future.
And having that encounter withGod has changed so much, and you
(41:13):
just stepped out and did whatyou felt prompted to do at the
time.
Do you think God wastes any partof our story?
unknown (41:24):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (41:25):
Not at all.
I mean, at my lowest, like if Ididn't have my parents' basement
to go to, I would be, I wouldhave been living under a bridge
and I wouldn't be sitting heretoday.
That's where I came from.
And God has used that to, yeah,no, I mean it's it's our whole
life.
God, nothing surprises God.
(41:47):
And you know, I don't understandsome things, it's like, why did
I have to go through that, Lord?
You before I would, the Biblesays before He formed us and
knew us before we were everborn.
You knew I was gonna go throughall this.
You knew I was gonna put my wifethrough hell.
Why would you allow this?
Those things I don't understand,but what I do know is God does
use that, and that's what helpsbuild us and and and makes us
(42:12):
who we are today.
It's like, so some of thosethings that I, you know, as I
look back, you know, 2020,hindsight's 2020, I look back on
that, and it's like, those werehorrible times, but you know
what?
It also gave me the stick toit-ness of not quitting, not
giving up, you know, and andthat has served me, served me
well over my entire life.
(42:34):
Had I not been through that, Idon't know if I would have had
that attitude.
And if I didn't have thatattitude, it wouldn't have
served me well in what I dotoday because everything we've
ever started, we've never hadthe money, and we look at it and
go, my God, this is impossible.
We can't do this.
But then we're like, no, wait aminute.
Let's pull back and go, okay, wecan't do it, but let's figure
out how we're gonna do itanyway.
And so all of that, that youknow, how I am today, that all
(42:57):
came from back in in my brokendays of God taking that, using
it, and repurposing some ofthose experiences.
Um and it's also helped me tohave a heart for people that
were just beyond help becauseI've always thought I was beyond
help.
Even in my drinking days, I justthought, you know, my in my
(43:18):
sober times, I would think mylife is you know ruined, I'm on
nothing, and you know, didn'thave good thoughts about myself
whatsoever.
But God takes all of that, Hedoesn't waste any of it.
And what do you think?
SPEAKER_01 (43:31):
Go ahead.
SPEAKER_00 (43:32):
I was gonna say people think they have to get
over all of that.
And it's like, you know, if youjust ask God to forgive you your
sins, he forgives and heforgets.
And it's the hardest thing forus is to forget our past or what
we've done.
But God will use those things.
SPEAKER_01 (43:50):
And and what do you think about yourself now?
SPEAKER_00 (43:56):
Um I think I'm just getting started in life
sometimes in some respects.
Um I think that you know, Istill struggle sometimes.
It's like, why would God I'm alittle, I mean, I just can be
transparent.
There are days where I think,why would God ever use me?
You know, and I pull back andlook at everything that's going
(44:17):
on in all of our programs.
And I mean, we got almost 300people that work full-time for
us now, and it started with atwo-pound bag of rice, and it's
like, but I still at times havethose thoughts.
They're nowhere near like itused to be.
But um I just try to um I don'tthink look at myself, honestly.
I just see the needs and whatneeds to be done and um and just
(44:41):
do it.
And just do it.
Yeah, I don't want to waste timetrying to figure myself out
because I'll never get anywhere.
SPEAKER_01 (44:50):
Yeah, and as a founder of Crisis Aid
International, you are helpingthe helpless.
You also have entered some ofthe most extreme high-risk no-go
zones around the world.
You've seen things that probablymost of our I haven't seen and
most of the listeners mostlikely haven't seen.
My question to you is how do younot get frustrated at God?
(45:17):
How do you not get disappointedor quit seeing so much injustice
in the world?
SPEAKER_00 (45:25):
How do you deal with that, I guess, is what I'm
trying to Well, the way I see itactually is that um when I see
these things, I see it like Godhas given me an opportunity to
do something in the midst ofthis horrible situation.
So I thank God for letting me bepart of a solution that he has
(45:49):
for these people.
Um so I've I learned early on,like like my very first trip to
Sudan, it when I came back, Icould not talk for two weeks
because of the things that weheard and the experiences and
things I saw, and never seenanything compared.
And I'd been some bad places inthe world up to that point, but
(46:11):
that was a turning point.
I mean, I could not, I camehome, I didn't talk to my wife,
my children, my staff, myemployees at the agency.
People thought I lost my mind,but looking back on it, was I
was just processing everythingI'd learned and saw and
experienced, and used that toum, you know, to not allow it to
(46:31):
overwhelm me, but to charge meand to energize me to start to
do something and and you know,to start to believe God.
It's like, God, you sent mesomewhere.
It's like, you know, I heard Godspeak to me the last day in
South Sudan, and um as we wereleaving this group of people,
and they were going to they werein a horrible situation, and
(46:53):
they were the survivors of thevillage, got attacked the night
before.
These were about 70 men, women,and children.
And they they were like we wereright on the edge of the Sahara
Desert, it was like 120, 125degrees, super hot.
We were hundreds of miles fromfood, water, shelter, and then
we we literally just came uponthese people.
(47:16):
And um, it was the end of ourtrip, and it was our last day,
and we had to go back thatafternoon.
And I remember, you know, we hadnothing.
If we had water cans, there wasno water.
If we had food, there was no wayfor no way for the cook them,
they cooked them.
They literally had the clotheson their back, and some of them
didn't even have the clothes ontheir back anymore because of
the when they were escaping thethe bush, the the African bush,
(47:40):
you know, ripped a lot of theclothes off.
And it was just a horriblesituation, and and uh they were
going to die.
And you know, I sit here andgoes with that goes all the way
back to the year 2000.
There was no way that they couldsurvive.
There was on, there's justnothing, we had nothing, they
were they were too far fromanything.
And so, but I remember lookingback over my shoulder as we were
(48:01):
pulling away, and I heard thevoice of God say to me, doing
nothing is no longer an option.
And I just thought, okay, and upto that point that um I had been
spending my vacation timesmuggling Bibles and into
restricted countries and stuff,but I knew instantly what God
was saying.
He's like gonna change the focusof what I was doing with my
(48:24):
quote vacation time, which wasuh to provide food, water, and
shelter that people didn't haveany.
And so that was the beginning ofit, and so we just went wherever
God we felt like God led us.
So worked in Sudan for 10 years,Afghanistan for 12 years, um, we
did work in North Korea and manyother countries.
But our focus now is in EastAfrican America.
SPEAKER_01 (48:47):
And so when you were there when you were in some of
these dangerous situations, didyou just felt or just trusted
that God was gonna protect youor you were doing and what you
were doing?
I mean, there must have beenmoments where you felt like, oh
crap, like this is this is bad.
unknown (49:04):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (49:07):
There are quite a few of those moments, frankly.
SPEAKER_01 (49:10):
Like, what did I just get myself into, right?
Like, uh Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_00 (49:14):
Can I tell you a quick story?
SPEAKER_01 (49:16):
Yes, go for it.
SPEAKER_00 (49:17):
We were standing and this was our first time into
Afghanistan, it was eight weeksafter 9-11.
Oh no, it was 10 weeks after9-11.
And uh long story short, it'sthis the this the full story is
in the box is in the book, butuh so we went there to do a
distribution, food distribution,and and um wherever God showed
(49:38):
us.
So, long story short, we are inthe city, my friend and I, he's
from South Africa, and we'restanding in this alleyway.
We were there three days tryingto find food and trucks and
stuff.
We couldn't, nobody would talkto us or anything.
And it was a bizarre scene.
Every male, no matter how oldthey were, little kids to old
men, everybody had guns.
(49:59):
It was so bizarre.
But we um we had a translator,so we met a guy who told us
about this spot, and so, or thisperson, so we're standing in
this alley, we're meeting withthe commander of the Afghan army
who controls the entire borderwith Pakistan, and so like our
planes are still bombing them,you know, in the mountains, and
(50:22):
I'm an American and my friend'sfrom South Africa, and we're
standing in this alley waitingto go meet this guy to see if he
could help us.
And it was one of those momentslike where God took the grace
off of us, and instantaneously Ilooked around and I see these
guys standing.
I mean, these are like theTaliban guys that we were seeing
(50:44):
on TV, and they had their gunsand and everything, and it's the
two of us, and and it's like Ifreaked out, and my friend
freaked out, and we got in thisbig argument in front of these
guys, and they're looking at uslike we're insane.
And it was like the grace cameoff of us, and then I realized
the danger that we really werein.
It's like we probably aren'tcoming home from this.
(51:07):
What was wrong with us?
Why were we so stupid?
Who do we think we are?
And then the gate opens and theguy comes out and said, The
commander will see you now.
And then we both looked at eachother and we're like, Let's go.
So we went in there and we satdown, and he was sitting in a
chair, and there were three ofus, my friend, myself, and the
translator.
And we were circled around hishis butt with his bodyguards,
(51:28):
and then one thing I noticed wasthat the fingers were on the
trigger, and it was like, Thisis not good, this is very bad.
And I said to my friend, I'mlike, What are we gonna say?
You go, Well, you do the talk.
I'm like, I don't know, you dothe talk.
We're arguing back and forth infront of this man, trying to
keep you know, very soft spot.
I'm like, You jerk, why the helldid you put me in here?
Um you're gonna get killed,you're an American.
I'm like, we're saying, and theguy just stops, he goes, Okay.
(51:50):
And to our translator, he goes,Well, he wants to know what you
want.
And I was like, Okay, if I'mgonna die, I'm gonna die far for
God.
And so I said, God put it onheart to come here, God put it
on heart of people in America togive us money to come here
because he sees your suffering,he sees your widows dying, he
(52:10):
sees your children starving.
God loves you so much, he sentus here to help you.
And I remember thinking, if Idie, I die.
Nobody's ever gonna know it,I'll never find our body.
So what's the big deal?
And so um, he looks at us, and Imean it was very tense.
You could read body language,very tense.
And he sits back in his chairand he relaxes like this and
(52:33):
crosses his hand, and he lookedat us and he said, I honor you
for the reason you're here.
I know that your God sent us,sent you to help us.
Wow, when he said I honor you, Iknew exactly what that meant.
When an Afghan puts you in theirhonor or honors you, if anything
would happen to us, he was dutybound to revenge us.
(52:56):
So if somebody would kill us, hewas duty bound to kill whoever
killed us.
And so, long story short, thattwo days later we ended up
delivering food to a villagevery far away, way up in the
mountains, to people that werestarving.
He had no food for severalweeks.
Uh, but this guy said, I'm gonnahelp you.
(53:18):
He goes, What do you want?
I said, We need to buy food.
And and he said, Okay, I canhelp you with this.
Do you have money to pay for it?
We said, sure.
I said, but we're not giving itto you.
We'll pay them, we'll pay themerchants.
He goes, that's fine, I don'twant your money.
He goes, I'm not here to robyou.
You're here to help.
We're going to help you help ourpeople.
He goes, I'm going to give youmy personal bodyguard, the
(53:38):
leader who is my father-in-law.
His team is going to be yourbodyguard until you leave to go
back home.
And then whenever you come back,they can be your bodyguards.
And so God just opened a doorup, just a miraculous door, and
gave us incredible favor.
And we fed those people, and for12 years we were feeding people
(53:59):
in Afghanistan.
SPEAKER_01 (54:01):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (54:02):
But that was one time, honestly, that I think I
would that I didn't think wewould come back home from that
trip.
And nobody knew where we were.
SPEAKER_01 (54:10):
So wow.
That's incredible.
And your wife didn't know whereyou are, your kids don't know
where you are.
SPEAKER_00 (54:15):
You're just like they knew we were going to
Afghanistan and they were nothappy.
I mean, uh, they were not happyat all with me.
SPEAKER_01 (54:23):
Um, because they're aware of the risks, right?
SPEAKER_00 (54:27):
Yeah, yeah, they did.
unknown (54:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (54:29):
Um, that's incredible.
I mean, I I Pat, I could sithere and talk to you all day,
but I just want to also honoryour time.
Um, is there anything else you'dlike to add uh prior to us
wrapping up the podcast?
SPEAKER_00 (54:41):
Yeah, I would like to say this.
Um, as passionate as I am aboutcrisis aid, I don't know if I
said this earlier or not, butI'm equally as passionate.
Sometimes I think I'm even morepassionate to see Christians
live the full life that Godwants them to live.
It's not, it's it's not likeit's his, God desires us to live
(55:04):
a full life.
And he's made plans for us to dothat before we were ever born.
But it takes our cooperation.
We have to cooperate with God.
And the way we cooperate withGod is say, yes, Lord, whatever.
Now, many of us have things inour heart, you know, like I
mentioned earlier, some peoplehomeless, some child, you know,
with orphans or water orevangelism or whatever, we have
(55:26):
things in our heart.
But we put things on top of thatthat we put there, and then we
blame God for not talking to us.
When God just saying, All youhave to do is say yes.
And I have the best life thatyou could ever.
The life I have planned for youis so much better than you can
comprehend right now.
But if you don't come out ofthat church pew and say yes, you
(55:48):
won't experience this life.
And the world needs us rightnow.
The world needs Christians tobecome Christians and do what
God called us to do, which iswhatever you do for the least of
these, you do for me.
It's that simple.
SPEAKER_01 (56:06):
That's beautiful.
Thank you so much for sharingthat.
Well, I usually ask um threequestions at the end of the
podcast.
One is, what's the bravest thingyou've ever done?
Which I think you just coveredwith the Gan story.
Um and then what are threepivotal books that you read?
It could have been any time, itdoesn't have to be a recent read
(56:27):
that were just transformativefor your life.
SPEAKER_00 (56:30):
Without a doubt, the first book was God Smuggler by
brother Andrew.
Um had I not read that book, Ididn't even have a Bible that
night.
Um I read that book before Iever bought a Bible.
Had I not read that book, Ipromise you, I would not be
doing what I do today because Iwould have never thought about
it.
I would have, I was marketing,advertising, successful, and it
(56:51):
was getting even more so, and Icould have gone down that road
and been a real happy Christian.
But that book literally changedmy life, the direction of my
life.
Um and then the Bible is one,um, naturally.
Um, and then there was a book Iread, and this goes back to the
year 2000.
I know we're about we're out oftime.
(57:13):
Um, it's called Seizing YourDivine Moments by Erwin McManus.
And I think it's published nowunder a different title.
But I was at a point in my lifewhere I was trying to determine
do I want to do this or do I notwant to do this?
I felt like God was leading mein this direction and um this to
do something, but I wasn't sure.
And uh pastor friend gave methat book, and after I read that
(57:35):
book, I'm like, okay, this is Iknow that I know that I know God
said go do what you want to do,and I'll be with you.
And so that book really, reallyimpacted my life.
SPEAKER_01 (57:44):
And my next question is what's the best advice that
someone gave you?
SPEAKER_00 (57:47):
You can love your wife, but make sure she's your
best friend also.
I didn't do that on my firstmarriage, and today I today my
wife is my best friend.
And we are truly partners inevery aspect of our life,
including our our work withCrisis Aid, our ministry work.
SPEAKER_01 (58:04):
That's beautiful.
Well, um, for those who arelistening, Pat Bradley has a
book out called Born for Rescue.
Um, also, he leads Crisis AidInternational.
Uh, Pat, where is the best placewhere people can find you?
Crisisaid.org.
That's it.
Well, Pat, thank you so much foryour time.
Thank you for your story, foryour courage, and for inspiring
(58:26):
all of us today.
SPEAKER_00 (58:27):
It was a true privilege.
Thank you for giving it to me.
SPEAKER_01 (58:30):
Thank you for listening to the Ones Who Here
podcasts.
It is an honor to share theseencouraging stories with you.
If you enjoy the show, I wouldlove for you to tell your
friends, leave us a reviewerrating, and subscribe to
wherever you listen to podcastsbecause this helps others
discover the show.
You can find me on my website,specopop.com.
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