December 31, 2024 • 59 mins
Teliee Popov shares his remarkable journey from a struggling musician to a thriving entrepreneur, highlighting the resilience, creativity, and determination that have driven his success. Through failures, setbacks, negotiations, and opportunities, Teliee encourages listeners to embrace their entrepreneurial spirit and persist in the face of obstacles.
• Teliee's early experiences ignited his entrepreneurial aspirations
• The shift from music to the business world
• Drawing lessons from challenges to pave the way for future achievements
• The significance of negotiation in business
• Tales of conquering fear and demonstrating perseverance in entrepreneurship
• Valuable insights on launching new ventures and adapting to difficulties
• Words of encouragement for those navigating their own entrepreneurial hurdle
-Links-
https://www.svetkapopov.com/
https://www.instagram.com/svetka_popov/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I think about it and I'm like you know what?
I'm going to risk it all.
I'm going to rent this space.
I rent it, but while renting it, I immediately start shifting
the companies I'm working withand all of a sudden I'm going
much higher end and I'm grabbinga few Italian companies and a
Canadian, and even the Chinesecompanies.
(00:23):
There are a few very few,actually two that I know of that
are pretty decent Grab both ofthem.
Open up the showroom.
That actually is spectacular.
It's a beautiful showroom.
I'm in the art district.
I mean, this is quite differentfrom where I started.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Hey friends, welcome to the Ones who Dared podcast,
where stories of courage areelevated.
I'm your host, vekka, and everyother week you'll hear
interviews from inspiring people.
My hope is that you will leaveencouraged.
I'm so glad you're here, talitPapa.
(01:04):
Welcome to the Wants to Darepodcast.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Well, thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
I am so genuinely excited to have you on here.
There has been so many peoplethat asked me to bring him on,
you on, and we've been trying toget you on and finally we're
getting it done, so I'm thrilled, Okay.
Okay we're getting it done, soI'm thrilled.
(01:31):
Okay, so you are a reallyinteresting guest because I know
you more intimately than I haveor know any other guests or any
other person really and youinspire me so much and there's
days where I'm like, wow, how doyou do the things that you do?
And I just feel like you trulyare an inspiration.
I don't know if you know thator not, but you really do
inspire me in so many ways.
(01:52):
And we have grown together.
Obviously we've been married forover 20 some years, so we have
kind of molded and shaped eachother.
You help me to be more of arisk taker.
You help me to care a lot lesswhat people think, because you
just kind of do what you do andyou roll with it and, versus to,
I'm a little more risk averseand also I cared a lot more
(02:16):
about what people thought than Ido now.
And you're just such aninspiring person and you're so
blunt, so straight to the point,and people really want to hear
from you.
So I'm so excited for you toshare your story.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
That's awesome.
Let's go.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Okay, well, also, you have an entrepreneur story
that's a little bit differentfrom other people.
You went from being a musicianto someone who performed on
stages, like in Nashville atDove Awards.
You're a music producer.
You're also an audio engineer.
You went from building abusiness to losing everything,
(02:53):
to rebuilding a successfulbusiness once again and reach
your incredible goals.
So I'd love to kind of get somebackstory on your entrepreneur
journey before we get started on.
At what point in your life didyou feel like you knew you were
going to be an entrepreneur?
Speaker 1 (03:13):
well, I guess, when I realized I don't really like
working for other people, Idropped out of high school I
went working for this factorypacking t-shirts and I I was
like, wow, this really sucks.
Probably the first week and I'mthinking, wow, my parents were
working like this.
I didn't think about thatbefore and I was thinking, well,
(03:34):
I bought a car at an auctionand this car is worth probably
double what I paid for it.
What if I sell it?
What?
What happens?
So kind of started selling carsand making money and I realized
, well, why in the world dopeople even have jobs where you
can?
Just, it's not about, it's notabout working for your money,
(03:57):
it's about just making moneydifferent ways yeah, and how old
were you when you sold thatfirst car?
uh 16 okay.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
So you were already at that point thinking like, wow
, this is not something I wantto do with my life, like I don't
want to take the traditionalroute of nine to five exactly,
even though I did have to getall the jobs.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
After that I went working for a couple of
factories we were buildingcabinetry and um and that's and
I was still.
I would work night shift.
I would still go to theauctions to copart, get beat up
cars, fix them, sell them.
I actually had my own littleshop like a body shop and then
(04:43):
and that's before I moved toFlorida I still had another job.
So I worked for about a yearand a half of my life for other
people do you feel like youlearned anything there, working
for other people?
I mean looking back, I'mthinking because there were huge
cabinetry shops and just theinventory and the management, or
(05:07):
more like mismanagement, whatI've seen, just bad managers
screaming at people.
I'm thinking, wow, I wouldnever do that, and you know me,
I never do that.
It's crazy.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
You mean learning what not to do like in your
company as a boss and stuffCorrect, yeah.
So, and then you also had amusical background, which is
very interesting because you hadthis side to you that's
artistic with music and I viewyou as an artist before a
business person.
I mean you're a combination ofboth, but you definitely are an
(05:43):
artist.
I mean you're a combination ofboth but you definitely are an
artist.
And how have you managed tokind of balance the creative
aspect of who you are with thebusiness aspect?
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Well, the way I look at it, if you're an artist,
everything's an art form.
If I'm writing music, I have tobe creative, I have to find the
sounds.
I have to pretty much see thewhole entire song as this sphere
that I'm working in.
And business is the same thing.
It's art, it's creatingsomething out of nothing and
(06:15):
like.
If you look at Elon Musk, Idon't view him as somebody who's
you know, owns a factory.
I view him as somebody whocreates things that other people
just unable to create.
He thinks the way that otherpeople cannot think, and that's
what a true entrepreneur is.
It's not necessarily somebodywho just copies somebody else.
(06:37):
Oh, they're buying a car at theauction.
I'm going to go do the samething.
Maybe that's where you start.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
And for a long period in your life you were pursuing
music.
You thought that was initiallythe path that you wanted to take
right.
At what point did you figureout that you don't want that to
be your number one focus?
Speaker 1 (06:56):
oh, it's pretty simple.
As soon as I figured out that Icannot make any money doing it.
I mean, if I could make moneydoing it, I'd probably still be
doing it.
But you know, moving to Atlanta, fighting through it for two
years, failing completely, nevermaking more than a couple
(07:19):
hundred bucks a show, it's just,it's devastating box a show.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
It's just, it's devastating.
Yeah, but would you say what it?
When you say failing, you meannot achieving the goals that you
had, because in some ways yousome people would view that as a
success if you were able toperform with other bands, which
you did, you were able to go todouble award shows in
nashville's, you performed onseveral stages and different
events, and things like that.
So how do you define failure?
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Well, if your success is being a struggling musician
and because you're still outthere and people are listening
to your music and that's success, then yeah, that's successful
for you.
But to me success was well.
First of all, I always wantedto be an actual artist, not some
traveling guy or know.
Hey, we hit the radio once inatlanta, once in baltimore and
(08:10):
yay, I mean it just felt likewe're just always falling short.
And even with the artists thatI've worked with, I just feel
like most of them never reallytruly made it, even though, yeah
, they were signed artists, butthey were.
They were not where I wanted,where I wanted myself to be.
(08:30):
So to me that's not reallysuccess.
It's either you succeed or youdon't.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
I don't think there's something in between yeah, and
also I think you're a prettyunconventional person in general
.
I feel like you're one of themore unique people that I know,
or one of the most unique peoplethat I know, because I think
just the way you think is reallydifferent.
It's very unorthodox.
You kind of do your own thing,you go against the grain, you
(08:58):
don't really care if it's youknow, something that's been done
before, if it's somethingthat's expected to be done, you
just do your own thing.
And I just recall, you know,just knowing you, you sharing
how school was a very difficultexperience for you.
And you know, just like RichardBranson, you think that you
(09:20):
have dyslexic or you're dyslexicto some degree.
You have dyslexic or you'redyslexic to some degree.
How would you attribute thedifficulty in school, in your
childhood, to building thatresilience for entrepreneurship?
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Yes, I'm definitely.
If it comes to school, I cannotlearn well at all.
If somebody's teaching me onpaper and showing me on the
board, I feel like I'm dumb.
That's just not the way I learn.
I learn from experiences likeyou.
See somebody do something like,wow, that's cool, I can do that
(09:55):
, you add your own, you recreate.
But if somebody just sits thereand tries to get all this
information pounding into yourhead, it's just I don't know.
It's not going to work for me.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Yeah, so do you feel like that school model is not
for everybody?
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Absolutely not.
I mean, it doesn't work for meat all.
I don't think it works for myboys either.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
Yeah, well, it's just really, in general, the school
system has been very much toproduce workers, right, and
that's not the way that youthink.
There's something interestingthat I find that you told your
dad when you were young.
I'm curious if you're willingto share it on the podcast.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
If you're talking about that.
I told my dad that I'm going tobe a millionaire at 13 years
old.
That I did, and he was.
You know.
At first he was like, oh that'sreally cool, huh, just laughing
.
And then I really startedbelieving what I was saying and
(11:03):
he eventually got really mad atme.
He's like you're not going tobe a millionaire, okay, if you
want to work you know what workis you take a shovel, you dig a
hole.
That's working, working withyour hands.
I'm like that's crazy.
And I told him no, you're wrong, I'm going to be a millionaire.
And but that, I think, maybesolidified the fact.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
I'm like no, I'm going to prove you wrong.
And what do you think made youbelieve that when you were 13?
Like, where in the world didyou get that concept?
Speaker 1 (11:32):
I just thought there's millionaires out there,
and if they can do it, why can'tI do it?
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Yeah, but you know, you lived when you were 13,.
We didn't have the internet,wasn't really a thing.
There wasn't podcasts likethere is now that young kids can
listen to podcasts about othermillionaires.
They're influencers, as theycall them, on social media and
all of that.
So for you to get that conceptwould have been so differently
delivered.
(11:57):
Did you come acrossmillionaires like?
How did you even come to thatidea?
Speaker 1 (12:02):
no, not really.
I mean, we lived in lancastercounty, which doesn't have.
Well, I guess they havemillionaires.
We didn't know any.
I don't know, I really don't, Idon't remember.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
So you just kind of had this your own thought like
this is what I want to do.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Yeah, and I kind of knew it was going to happen,
like I literally knew that.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
That's interesting.
And then, how many years did ittake you?
Speaker 1 (12:29):
to or about what age were you able to actualize that?
I think I was 32.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Okay, yeah, so let's go into your entrepreneur story.
So you, you shared earlier thatyou didn't um, you realized
like I do not want to do thisnine to five thing.
I hate working at the factory,I don't want to do this, but I
got to figure out a way to makemoney.
You tried the music route.
(12:53):
The music route didn't reallypan out in the way that you
expected it to, and you wantedto figure out how to make money.
So can you take us on thatentrepreneur journey of where
were you at and how did you getto where you are today?
Speaker 1 (13:10):
When we moved to America from Russia, my dad well
, he always had bees in Russiatoo and he kind of was working
with different entrepreneursthere.
This one guy he bought my dadout completely and then my dad
was working for him.
I don't know, not the best deal.
We moved to america.
He gets bees.
Uh, he finds out aboutpollination.
(13:33):
So he's like, okay, we're gonnaput, put out on some orchards
and, for example, I wouldobviously help him load, unload.
We get to an orchard and I'mjust a kid, I'm like 12 years
old.
He's like, hey, go, go talk tohim, tell him how much money we
want to get orchard.
And I'm just a kid, I'm like 12years old.
He's like, hey, go go talk tohim, tell him how much money we
want to get for each hive.
I'm like, what the?
I'm 12 and I'm like, okay, sowe go there, I'm negotiating
(13:57):
with the farmers, because my daddoes not speak one word of
english at this point.
And then, after you donegotiate that, and you're
walking back to tell your dad,you're like, oh my gosh, that
was awesome.
I can't believe it, I did that.
So that would be how I started,I think, kind of like where it
(14:18):
was born, where I can negotiatea deal, where I started being a
salesperson and then when I wasbuying, selling cars, every car,
every client is different.
It's not even like selling thesame item or same piece of
furniture.
You know how to talk about thatpiece of furniture.
A car is always different,especially when it's not from a
(14:38):
BMW dealership.
It's kind of constantly moldingand bending you and making you
shift and think differently thenext time.
What did I do wrong or what didI do good?
And then you know, when wemoved to Florida I started
construction business.
Well, I started a flooringbusiness.
I was a subcontractor fordifferent stores, I was laying
(15:04):
carpet, I was laying woodenfloors.
And again, you have to beconstantly going selling your
ability to do the job.
So you have to let people knowyes, I am good, yes, here's my
job, this is what I've done.
And then, eventually, when I hadthe other construction
companies, such as FinnishCarpentry, that I was working
(15:27):
directly with builders likePulte Homes, I had contracts
with American Homes, leeWeatherington, which is a big
(15:47):
builder of custom floors fromsecondary companies that were
buying it from Shaw, from Mohawkin Dalton Georgia, and it was
cheap, because Dalton Georgia ischeap, but Atlanta was
expensive.
Let's say Buckhead or Midtown,but Atlanta was expensive.
(16:08):
Let's say Buckhead or Midtown.
So I figured, wow, in Midtownthey're selling this for $7.99 a
square foot, but I can get itfor $120.
Is this even real?
I couldn't believe it.
This was probably my first truesales, like getting it from not
necessarily from a factory, butgetting it from whatever
distributor.
Let's say yeah, and then I puton craigslist it sells an exam
(16:31):
like that's crazy, what the heck, because it's cheap and all I
have to do is transport it.
If you take all these yearswe're talking about two decades
and then you actually mold themall together and you get a much
clearer picture of business.
You will understand business insuch a broader spectrum than
(16:54):
somebody can sit there and teachyou on a board writing hey,
this is what you do, this iswhat you do in business.
Really, how am I supposed tolearn?
That's crazy.
I don't think anybody can learnthat's crazy.
I don't think anybody can learnthat.
If you don't actually gothrough it yourself and get the
beat down of your life, I Idon't know how you're going to
be an entrepreneur yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
So all those things, the experiences that you had,
they molded you into essentiallythe next phase and um, you
tried other things too.
You tried selling online.
You tried buying products on.
You tried selling online, youtried buying products on eBay
and all the different things,and I think you've said before
that you have how many failedbusinesses.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
Eight that were registered.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
That were registered.
Yeah Right, and so that's trulya lot of entrepreneurs story
where they have failed multipletimes over and over again before
they hit that success mark.
And even when they hit thatsuccess mark, they generally hit
a point where they take risksand they lose it all, and then,
(18:02):
when they built back up, theyreally built a solid business.
So is that, does that soundfamiliar?
Is that part of your story aswell?
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Yeah, absolutely Before we moved to Atlanta from
Sarasota, that was myconstruction business, that in
business.
But that just happened tohappen right at that 2007
recession when everybody justwas losing everything.
(18:32):
So it's not like because wewere doing pretty well with that
business and what could havegrown that business probably to
something massive in Cirrus Autoright now but we didn't have
the chance and the whole thingfell apart.
And then to restart that, eventhough in Atlanta I was doing
all these things, I was notsuccessful.
(18:53):
I couldn't really understandhow to market properly.
I couldn't find the clients Ididn't necessarily have.
I mean, I had a van.
It's like selling stuff out ofa van.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Yeah, and it was a pretty rusty van, if I may add.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
It was definitely rusty and it was a maroon color.
Speaker 2 (19:10):
And it was like rust falling out of the bottom.
So I don't think people reallywould probably take that too
seriously.
But essentially that was thepoint before moving to Atlanta,
where we lost everything and westarted back from ground zero.
Before moving to Atlanta, welost everything and we started
back from ground zero.
And on top of that, I thinkit's a lot harder to build a
(19:31):
business or be successful whenyou don't have the financial
income to leverage off of.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Yeah, no, of course, when we moved back from Atlanta
to Florida, we stayed with myparents.
It was rough.
We didn't have any money at all.
And the reason we moved backactually I should add this my
dad.
Again, he's a beekeeper.
(19:58):
He calls me.
He's like hey, we should dosomething with these bees, we
should really build a newbusiness.
I'm thinking, well, that'sgreat, so we move back, we're
staying with my parents, we geta loan for my dad it's an
agricultural loan with the stateof Florida and we we buy a
(20:22):
truck, we buy a forklift.
I built out this huge trailerit's a honey house with the
whole conveyor system.
But the loan was contingentthat we secure some kind of
pollinating contracts, at leasttwo.
(20:45):
We were supposed to secure onein California for almonds and
one in Maine for blueberries.
So California was kind of easy.
I secured that one real quick.
In Maine I'm struggling.
Then we get this full truck ofhoney because we're already
collecting honey in Florida,because we already have like a
(21:05):
thousand hives.
I'm driving the truck up toGolden something it's like a
honey receiving facility inLancaster.
I drove it up there.
I get out of the truck, a truckpulls up behind me and it's
this famous beekeeper, davidRosenberg, and he was on 60
(21:30):
Minute.
That's actually where I seenhim and that's where I
recognized his face.
I couldn't believe it like that.
That can't be him.
So I pull, I come up to him,I'm like are you David Rosenberg
?
He's like yes, I am.
So we we were just talking andhe was actually pulling a load
up from Florida, from David MMendes, which is probably the
(21:53):
third largest as far as how manybees he has goes in America.
And I asked him so I cannotsecure a contract for
blueberries?
And he's like well, let me seewhat I can do for you.
He calls me back in about aweek.
He's like I'm going to connectyou with the blueberry freezer.
So I get two contracts, whichare pretty much all I really
(22:16):
have to do, but I'm fighting fora third one for cranberries in
Massachusetts.
But that's really difficultbecause it's very limited.
So I did not get that one.
And then we have to actuallysend the bees out and collect
money from these contracts,because if we don't, we default
on the loan.
And my dad is telling me no,we're not going to do that.
(22:40):
People are stealing bees inCalifornia.
We don't have the money to goto the blueberry freezer.
I'm like, wait, hold on asecond.
Why don't we negotiate a dealwith a trucking company and pay
them only after we get the money?
Oh, they're not gonna do that.
I'm like no, they're probablygonna do that and he's the boss.
So he's like no.
(23:00):
So I'm like, all right, well,this is not working out, so I
leave that company and thenstart again buying cars on cheap
cars, very cheap cars that haveblown gaskets on Craigslist
fixing them.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Yeah, that was a pretty humbling time in our
lives, was it not?
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Yeah, kind of felt like back in Atlanta.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
All right where it was.
Well, Winston Churchill hasthis quote that I love.
It says success is stumblingfrom failure to failure without
no loss of enthusiasm.
And how would you say that youcontinue to trying again, having
the resilience, having the gritto give it another go, even
(23:49):
when we're basically at rockbottom as far as finances go, as
far as our sense of pride?
And having been successful,having had all our needs met
financially and doing fairlydecently, to essentially having
nothing and having to rebuildall over again, how do you keep
(24:12):
going when the going gets tough?
Speaker 1 (24:15):
I think that's the whole point is that you don't
have a choice.
I mean, what are you going todo?
Lay down and die you just thatis your drive, is your failure?
Uh, if you're living as somekid in some fancy house with
your parents supplying you foreverything, are you even going
(24:35):
to be an entrepreneur?
And why would you be anentrepreneur?
Why would you do anything?
Just take it easy.
Everything's good when you'reliving.
When you have nothing, youfight.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Yeah, and so how did your story transition from again
having nothing to building asuccessful furniture business?
Speaker 1 (24:59):
Well, at one point I found a couch on Craigslist and
I bought it in Tampa, brought itback, also brought back a
catalog that just happened tohave a number on it.
I called the number to see ifthey would sell me that couch,
because at this point, of course, I'm at the point in my life
(25:22):
where I'm searching everywherefor absolutely anything, just
throwing and see what sticks,and I call them.
They're like yeah, we can sellyou one couch, and I bought it
for like $750.
And they're like yeah, it's 300bucks.
I'm like what?
That's crazy.
That's actually a legit margin.
(25:43):
So I'm like well, can I buy one?
They're like, yeah, but youdon't want to because you know
it's going to cost like $300 tobring it to you from.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Orlando.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
And I'm like, okay, but I'll pay that $300 because
that's all I have.
So I do sell it probably withina couple hours back on
Craigslist for $750.
I'm like, well, that's prettycrazy.
So in a week I sold.
In a week I'm getting a fulltruckload now and in a month we
(26:16):
have I literally remembercounting the cash in my closet
and it's eighteen thousanddollars.
Going from zero to eighteenthousand was pretty incredible.
Um, I probably never actuallyseen eighteen thousand dollars
before that.
And then we had to move a fewplaces, graduating the garage,
(26:39):
other garages, that's next to it.
I booked probably 25% of thisfacility and I'm thinking I need
a store.
I don't want to sell out ofgarages and people are actually
coming there.
And I remember this one lady.
She's like well, I guess that'sone way you can do it.
I'm like that sucks, that'swhat she thinks of me one way
that one way you can do it.
(27:02):
You know, like that, that's notwhat I want to do.
And then we find other linesthat are, you know, obviously a
little better lines.
There's still Chinese lines andI opened up one store.
So now you have like a showroom, but again I have to be closing
it the whole time because I'mdoing all the deliveries.
(27:24):
And my neighbor was arestaurant supplier.
He's like look, you havecustomers coming here, but
you're never there, so it's yourfault.
I'm like, yeah, well, I alsohave to deliver, or I'm just me
with my little pickup truck.
And eventually I'm driving homeand I see this art gallery on
(27:53):
this street in Sarasota, butit's so off-grid.
It's just like what is the artgallery doing there?
I'm shocked and there's a signright next to it for lease.
I'm like whoa, that's weird.
And so I turn around, I comeback in, I come in there and
(28:15):
this lady from Iceland and I askher.
I'm like what are you doinghere?
it's such a nice art galleryright, it was a pretty
industrial area, yeah and she'slike, well, I used to be
actually on main street and Ihad 10 000 square feet art
(28:38):
gallery, and that's again before2007.
Um, then she was on st armin's,which is pretty expensive rent
there, and she's like I had 5000 square feet there.
And this is just simply wherelife took me.
Like this is downgrading,downgrading.
And here I am now.
I'm like, wow, well, I like thespace next to you, I'm going to
(29:00):
rent it.
So I opened up a store there andshe's every day she's bored
because there's and she has onlylike, designers coming there
that worked with her forprobably 20 years, and every day
she's just mentoring me,constantly talking to me about
what I should be doing, whatdesigners want, and I'm already,
(29:21):
at that point, buying someknockoffs of classics like
Herman Miller, noel classics,probably Artifort, but of course
, all knockoffs still from china.
And she started telling me youknow what?
You need to go to downtown, youshouldn't be here.
I'm thinking, well, you camefrom downtown.
(29:42):
I can't even think that way,I'm just me.
And I realized one of myfriends two of them just opened
up an Italian kitchen showroomScavolini, which is a huge brand
in Italy on Main Street.
So I'm like I'm going to gotalk to them.
I drive up there and I'm likeI'd love to open up a showroom
(30:04):
somewhere around here too.
They're like, well, why don'tyou just work with us?
I'm like really.
They're like yeah, we havespace here.
It's just kitchens, and thenthere's space in the middle and
then we realized that space ispretty small.
Then there's another space onpalm avenue, which is the the
art district, and I'm like, hey,why don't we rent this out?
(30:24):
This is way bigger and we canbe here together.
We go there, we make anappointment.
The owner shows up in themorning and they don't show up.
They call me and oh yeah, wechanged their mind.
We put $50,000 into thislocation.
We shouldn't be moving, andthat makes sense, that's fair.
(30:46):
And so I have a conversationwith her and I think about it.
I'm like you know what?
I'm going to risk it all.
I'm going to rent this space.
I rent it, but while renting it, I immediately start shifting
the companies I'm working withand all of a sudden I'm going
(31:13):
much higher end and I'm grabbinga few Italian companies and a
Canadian and even the Chinesecompanies.
There are a few, very few,actually two that I know of that
are pretty decent.
Grab both of them.
Open up the showroom.
That actually is spectacular.
It's a beautiful showroom.
I'm in an art district I meanthis is quite different from
where I started.
And then, you know, nobodycomes in at all.
(31:37):
It's horrible.
I'm thinking this is a bad move.
But the art district has theseart walks last Friday of every
month and all of a sudden thefirst art walk happens.
One client comes in fromToronto and buys $25 25 000
worth of furniture and I waslike that's one client that's in
(31:58):
and I don't even have todeliver it.
I just I actually shipped it tohis house from different
warehouses and wherever I wasgrabbing them some in New Jersey
, high Point, thomasville and Iwas pretty surprised that I
could pull off.
This was probably one of thefirst times I pulled something
(32:21):
off like that, so that gives meanother boost of courage.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
Right and, like they say, peak to peak when you reach
one peak it gives youconfidence to go towards the
next peak.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
Yep, but eventually I'm thinking, well, I need some
really big line.
So I'm talking to this otherline called Caligaris.
They have stores all over Italy.
They're actually very famousfor their dinette sets.
And they show up and they'relike well, they convinced me,
you should do a Caligari store.
I'm like, okay, but you guysdon't have seating.
And I'm like thinking, okay,well, I can negotiate a deal
(33:04):
with them for seating withanother Italian line and do an
Italian store.
They agreed to that, exceptthis store is now too small for
what we're doing.
I see this other location wherewe are right now for lease,
lease to own, and that's on onour light, on a corner
(33:25):
fruitville and lemon cattycorner from whole foods I it's
like location, location.
And somehow they agreed tolease to me, even though the
owner did not want to, because Iwasn't.
He claimed that I had nocredibility.
I'm just a small timebusinessman and a lot of times
(33:46):
that's literally what it is.
That's what I've been told.
The whole time.
It's like you're nobody, evenwhen you're doing business, like
, oh, you're too small.
Oh yeah, no, we want to dosomething with a big company.
It's constantly like that andsomehow the realtor helped me
negotiate the lease.
(34:07):
So I leased this place.
We open up Caligari's store andwe bring in this leather line,
gamma, which we still sell both.
But Gamma is a pretty goodleather line from Italy and I
sign up and it says Caligari's,and I see Caligari's is trying
to put up Caligari's stores allover the US.
(34:28):
I'm thinking, wait, I'mactually not promoting myself,
I'm promoting them, I'm buildingtheir.
Wait, I'm actually notpromoting myself, I'm promoting
them, I'm building their brand,I'm not building our brand.
So I'm thinking that's not good.
So we decided to cut that andbuild our own brand, and that's
when we branded ourselves asSoftSquare.
And immediately all the otherlines that were already had
(34:53):
offices in the US all want towork with us.
Not to mention, there was acouple of big stores that closed
during the recession andthey're scrambling trying to
find anybody who's at that pointat least on our level, to sell
to.
Of course they're not going tosell to me prior me, but this is
different.
(35:14):
So we go to the Milan show andthere are just unbelievable
amount of options.
So many Italian, german, swisscompanies except you can't just
buy from them, because a lot ofthem are already working with
your competitors and at thispoint.
(35:36):
There are obviously good storesin Sarasota.
It's kind of always a closedmarket, and what started
happening was I identified thecompanies that I want to have on
the floor and you startnegotiating deals.
And the way you do that is well, hey, this competitor right
(35:57):
here claims they have your brand, but do they have it on the
floor?
No, or maybe, hey, they justhave one setting.
Well, I'm going to give youthree settings.
How about that?
Well, that's a deal for them.
And hey, my location is alwaysbetter than theirs because we
are on the light, on fruitville.
And eventually we got probably25 brands that way that are top.
(36:24):
And then I realized, hey, hownice that would be to go after
the biggest brands.
There are, the ones that areonly in design districts, in,
you know, on Madison, or youknow, the Miami Design District
and Brera in Paris.
And so we started negotiating.
Well, it took me about sevenand a half years to negotiate a
(36:46):
deal with B&B Italia, while theywere telling me no, of course
not, we would never work withyou.
And then somehow they changedtheir mind and as soon as we
picked up B&B other companieslike Casino they never even want
to talk to us.
All of a sudden they're callingus and begging us to get into
(37:08):
the store.
I'm like what in the world isgoing on to get into?
Speaker 2 (37:11):
the store and look what in the world is going on.
Yes, essentially, softsquarewent from being the underdog of
like who are you?
We're not going to sell to youbecause you don't have
comparable brands and you're notreputable enough we don't know
who you are to people and brandsthat are well-known throughout
the world now want to work inthe showroom now are asking to
(37:32):
be in the showroom and berepresented by the company.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Yeah, I mean, that's, I guess, the way it works.
You just keep working, workingto the top, and sometimes going
that high is also a bad thing,because now you're too high-end
and now you're too expensive.
A market is like a pyramid andthe higher you go, the smaller
it gets a pyramid, and thehigher you go, the smaller it
(37:58):
gets.
And you want to be somewheremiddle, high, but not high, high
, and that's essentially kind ofwhere we ended up with half of
our store and I've been tryingto walk it back, but that that
is a hard thing, because oncepeople think you're very
expensive, let's not go there.
How are you going to bring themback?
Speaker 2 (38:14):
Yeah, and so, with building up the company, what
were some of the biggest or whatwere some of the hardest parts
about being able to build?
Because you just mentioned thatit took seven years to get this
(38:34):
one brand that you had your eyeon for a long time, and so it
took a lot of grit and a lot ofpersistence and perseverance and
what would you say is thehardest part of walking through
that journey.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Honestly, it's all hard, but I enjoy that challenge
.
It is also fun.
And if you don't enjoy being anentrepreneur, if you don't
enjoy an everyday fight, aneveryday I don't want to say
(39:11):
struggle, but it is a struggle,but it's also.
It's like wrestling.
You don't have to go out thereand wrestle, but why do you
choose to?
Because you enjoy it right.
Same thing here.
It is all hard, it's very hardto negotiate deals, but I love
negotiating those.
(39:32):
It's.
It's hard to constantly be toldno, but then that one, yes,
gives you this courage.
You're like, oh whoa, that wasso worth it, the fight was worth
it.
And then you get emboldened andit it really is.
To me, the fight is fun.
(39:53):
If I did not like it, I don'tthink I could do it.
Speaker 2 (39:56):
What would you say is the greatest reward of being an
entrepreneur?
Speaker 1 (40:03):
I guess you can say a reward would be finances living
in a nicer house, driving anicer car Is that the greatest
reward?
Nicer house, driving a nicercar is that the greatest reward?
Um, to me, honestly, just justthe fact to have something
that's nobody else in the wholecity of sarasota has achieved, a
(40:27):
store like that to me that's,that's huge, because I can just
think back and think that'sawesome.
I literally beat out so manypeople.
The fight was incredible,getting punched in the face like
nobody else, but I feel like Iwon and I feel so great.
That actually feels amazing.
Just winning feels good.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
You like to win?
Yes.
Speaker 1 (40:49):
I do.
Speaker 2 (40:49):
If I know anything about you, it's that you love to
win and you don't like to win.
Speaker 1 (40:54):
Yes, I do If I know anything?
Speaker 2 (40:55):
about you?
It's that you love to win andyou don't like to lose.
Speaker 1 (40:59):
Correct, but you're not afraid to get into a fight
that, even if you risk losing,you still are willing to fight
it out.
Well, I mean, you have to fight.
If you don't fight, you'realready lost.
If you don't start something,you're already lost.
We all start at zero.
So what, hey, let's be afraidof doing something so we might
eventually go back to zero.
I don't get it.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
What would you say is the biggest risk that you took
as an entrepreneur?
Speaker 1 (41:23):
Yeah, that's a good one.
We opened up a showroom inNaples and this showroom is
twice the size of Sarasotashowroom.
Put in close to a milliondollars.
We struggled for three and ahalf years.
It was the most beautifulshowroom, probably second most
beautiful in all of Florida,next to a showroom in Miami that
(41:46):
I like very much.
And then clients were just notcoming.
We couldn't hire anybodybecause people in Naples don't
necessarily work, they're allretirees.
Our employees were driving fromFort Myers, which is an hour
away.
It was hard and then, afterstruggling for three and a half
(42:09):
years, I had to close it.
Except I couldn't close itbecause I have a seven-year
contract yeah, so that one wasduring COVID and they want
$183,000 or $87,000 for me tobreak the contract.
Well, that's actually later on.
(42:31):
First they said absolutely notnot happening, but I'm already
thinking well, we don't have achoice.
I started selling the furnitureoff without having an ability
to break the contract.
I'm selling the furniture offalready probably sold 20% of it
to the point of no return.
I know there's no returnbecause I don't have the money
to buy new furniture to refillthe store, and I know there's no
(42:52):
return because I don't have themoney to buy new furniture to
refill the store, and I'm thereby myself at this point.
I'm pretty much living at thisstore.
Speaker 2 (42:59):
Right, because we already the employees are no
longer there.
Essentially we there areemployees that were there.
We had to let go some peopleand we knew that we were closing
the store, so that it was overfor as far as the team goes.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
Correct.
And then I'm working with alandlord who is in Boston it's a
huge company and they don'treally care about people like
small guys because it's a bigcompany and eventually they
agreed okay, give us $100,000and we'll terminate the contract
.
That was literally Christmasfor me, that was.
(43:38):
I couldn't even believe it.
I know it sounds crazy.
Hey, just give us a hundredgrand and you can walk away.
I was like, are you serious?
I wired them the money thatprobably like in 10 minutes, you
know, because I was selling offa lot of furniture.
So we started getting the moneythat probably like in 10
minutes, you know, because I wasselling off a lot of furniture.
So we started getting the moneyback.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
And then we were able to be month to month, liquidate
everything, got all our moneyback that we put into it and
more.
And it was actually incredible.
We walked out of that situationwinners but not really losing
anything.
It was great.
It's how we were able to moveback to Pennsylvania.
(44:18):
Well, at the same time, thewhole time I'm running Naples,
our manager in Sarasota isrunning Sarasota for three and a
half years and I realized wait,I did not run the store in
Sarasota for so long Do I reallyhave to live in Sarasota?
And I realized no, we don'thave to live in Sarasota because
(44:38):
it runs on its own and we wereable to move.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
Yeah, so would you say that in retrospect that
seemed like a failure, but youstated that it felt like a win,
that we won at the end.
Speaker 1 (44:54):
Yeah, a lot of things feel like a failure, but just
don't think about it as afailure.
It's just another step.
I mean, even if you fail, ohwell.
Speaker 2 (45:04):
Yeah, I find that it's interesting in life that
there's things in the momentthat feel like the world is
going to end because thiscurrent hope you had, this
current dream, you had this plan, this business plan that you
have is not panning out the waythat you initially thought it
would, and in that moment itfeels like it's the end of the
(45:25):
world.
But then later you look back onit and it's like, wow, this is
actually worked out to be such ablessing.
Yeah, it ended up being so muchgreater of a blessing than you
(45:46):
anticipated it to be.
Can you speak into that?
Speaker 1 (45:51):
Yeah, I mean, it is very hard when it's happening
and you do feel like you're sucha failure.
I remember thinking ourcompetitors in Sir Soda are
probably laughing at me.
Oh, look at this guy.
He went there.
He thought he can do it.
So pathetic.
I'm thinking like that aboutmyself, thinking this sucks, but
(46:17):
you know who cares that's whatit teaches you.
Who cares like, who cares whatthey're thinking?
Who are these people?
Do we even know them?
Speaker 2 (46:22):
right.
Yeah, I mean and you're the onethat taught me to really um,
not, not, not, it's not notcaring about people, but um, not
allowing the opinions of otherpeople to impact your choices,
because, at the end of the day,the truth is is that people
think a lot less of you than youthink, and people care about
(46:43):
you a lot less than you think,care about you a lot less than
you think.
So if we're going to allow theopinions of others to dictate
the choices that we make, therisks that we take, we're kind
of cheating ourselves out ofliving our lives to the fullest,
versus just doing the thingthat you want to do or allowing
a narrative of someone else'spossible thoughts that you're
(47:05):
assuming impact that decisionyeah, I mean that's correct okay
, I think what's reallyinteresting about you is that
you continue to persevere, evenwhen things are hard, but you
also have the capacity to do somuch more than just what you're
doing.
And even though, with thefurniture business, we've been
in it for over a decade and it'sstill growing, it's, you know,
(47:30):
we're pivoting in different wayswith the marketplace and so
forth, and yet there's otherthings that you're working on
and dreaming about beyond that,so would you like to speak on to
that?
Speaker 1 (47:42):
then this is just for fun, but I am going to be
releasing an album.
It's just Chill Beats album,maybe January February.
Speaker 2 (47:51):
And what's the name of the album or the name of the?
Speaker 1 (47:56):
I don't really know yet, maybe Radio City.
Speaker 2 (47:59):
Right, but what's your name on Spotify?
Speaker 1 (48:03):
Oh, I'm Gravity Pool.
Speaker 2 (48:05):
Gravity Pool.
So that's it, guys.
Go look up Gravity Pool onSpotify or wherever you listen
to music.
Speaker 1 (48:10):
So I'm also working on building a new company right
now.
It's called Zero Trim and whatit is?
It's an architectural productfor an interior of a house.
It lets you build an interiorwith no trim, no casings around
the door, no baseboard, allframeless doors.
We integrate LED lighting.
(48:31):
I'm trying to make this wholething as a smart home, but with
our own hardware, and we've doneall the designs in France.
The website is up.
I pretty much got all thecontracts I need for hinges and
locks.
Unfortunately, they're going tocome from Italy.
I got everything, except it'skind of hard to raise money for
(48:55):
a new company, especially whenyou have no revenue.
So that's what I'm working on,and I'm working with the state
of Pennsylvania right now,because what they want to do is
bring manufacturing, bring jobsand bring tech to pennsylvania,
and that's pretty much whatwe're bringing, and so they're.
Speaker 2 (49:14):
They want to work with us, which is great and you
have a patent pending for thistechnology as well, correct?
Yes, some of it for the doorand so, essentially, you're
going to be manufacturing andthe design and the current
website.
What's the name of the website?
Speaker 1 (49:31):
It's zerotrimcom.
Speaker 2 (49:33):
What would you say to someone who is struggling right
now so someone who's maybe intheir entrepreneur journey that
they just feel like they are inthe worst season of their life,
kind of like you were and wewere at one point.
What would you tell them?
Speaker 1 (49:53):
I guess it really depends what we're talking about
.
Are they in a business and thebusiness is just terrible, or
are they trying to open up abusiness they don't know how?
I would need a A little bit ofbackstory, yes, yeah.
Speaker 2 (50:09):
Well, essentially it's like what would you say to
someone who's trying to dosomething, who's trying to make
something successful and theyjust they're feeling discouraged
?
Maybe what I'm asking is moreof like how would you encourage
someone who's really strugglingand they feel like they're just
(50:30):
at the bottom and they don'tknow how to get back up?
What encouragement would youhave for them?
Speaker 1 (50:36):
I guess sometimes when you're in business and
you're so stuck or just sobackwards and you know there is
no revenue, sometimes it is justthe end of it and perhaps you
have to start something else.
I mean, like I said, I failedeight times and that's
registered.
My failings are registered.
(50:57):
But if you're struggling withstarting a business and you just
want to give up, I mean I wouldencourage anybody and everybody
don't give up.
I mean, giving up is just going, it's just being exactly where
you are.
For example, if when I was azero and I would never start
(51:21):
nothing, then I would be alwaysa zero.
And if you don't keep fightingor you're afraid to do something
, because what if you're goingto fail?
But you already failed, you'rea zero.
So how much lower can you go?
If you try, you should go backto where you are, so you should
try again until you get somekind of success.
Speaker 2 (51:42):
There you go.
That's good advice.
What is the best advice thatsomeone else gave you?
Speaker 1 (51:51):
go.
That's good advice.
What is the best advice thatsomeone else gave you?
That's probably when I was inconstruction business and I
thought I was doing good.
And this guy, eric uh, we werein his house and he was very
successful he.
He had he sold two of his paintbusinesses in brooklyn but he
leased back the building.
So I mean that's a good deal.
(52:12):
You're just always collectingmoney.
And you got money up front andhe was telling me you need to
start selling.
I'm like, no, eric, I'm doinggood, it's all good.
He's like, no, no, you're notlistening to me, you need to
sell.
You want to make money, yousell.
And then eventually I was like,oh my gosh, eric is so right,
(52:35):
you sell.
You always sell, even if you'rein finances.
What are you doing?
You're selling, you're sellingservices.
What are you doing in this kindof industry?
You're selling a product.
It's always selling.
And once you're good at selling, if you can master selling, you
officially have been born againas a salesman, and that is
(52:56):
irreversible yeah, that's goodadvice.
Speaker 2 (53:00):
Um, what do you think is the bravest thing that you
have ever done?
Speaker 1 (53:05):
Bravest, I don't know .
Skydiving, I don't know.
Honestly, again, that store inNaples that took a lot of guts,
that was hard, that was.
I don't want to say I wish Inever did it, but I wish I never
did it.
Speaker 2 (53:24):
But we just talked about how you learned from it,
so Sure.
Speaker 1 (53:27):
Sure, you learn from it, so sure, sure you learn from
it.
But you don't want to, youdon't want to do that again.
Speaker 2 (53:32):
No, I don't want to do that again either.
Absolutely not.
Um, what would you say arethree books that were the most
transformational for you?
Speaker 1 (53:43):
I mean, I like a few books that I read by Richard
Branson, and one of them iscalled Screw it, let's Do it.
And what I like about RichardBranson especially for who I am,
is he kind of is the similar,he's the same person.
He just constantly tries thingsand fails and says screw it,
let's do it this way, or let'sjust get rid of this airline
(54:07):
that sucked.
Speaker 2 (54:08):
That's the way he thinks and he's pretty
unconventional too, like youwould say that, um, he doesn't
try to fit into a certain mold,he just does his own thing and
creates his own path yeah, he's,I mean he's definitely out
there.
Speaker 1 (54:24):
Some of the other books that I listened to was the
Algebra of Wealth, think andGrow Rich.
Both of them are similar.
You know there's a lot of booksSnowball by Warren Buffett but
that's about the markets.
If you're into that the BurrMethod, if you're into real
estate, if you are in realestate and you don't know that
(54:47):
book, you need to know that bookyeah, and what did you like
about how to um think and growrich?
maybe it was by napoleon hill Imean, it gives you a lot of
examples about life and kind oflike it's not all necessarily
business, but it's just the waypsychology of your brain works
(55:08):
and why you think certain waysor how you can transform your
thought patterns.
Um, it goes very deep.
So you might have to read orlisten to that book many times
until you're like oh okay, I getit.
I get it.
Speaker 2 (55:24):
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 (55:26):
Yeah, that's good what is it like to have your
wife as a business partner.
I mean, it's good and bad, andthe good is that you know you
can constantly kind of pullideas from each other and you're
always in the proximity of eachother.
(55:47):
So you know if you have athought at night or before you
go to bed you can talk about it.
You don't have to be like, oh,I have to call this guy but I
can't, he's sleeping.
So the accessibility Right, butat the same time I mean, we had
(56:07):
rough times, especially that-we're both extremely
strong-willed.
Speaker 2 (56:10):
You'd say yes.
Speaker 1 (56:11):
And then we'll fight for ideas, or I think this is
the way this works.
No, I think this is the way itworks, and it's like wait, but
we're like equal partners, sowho decides?
It's kind of difficult.
Speaker 2 (56:26):
Yeah, who decides?
It's kind of difficult, yeah.
But at the same time, though,we leverage each other's
strengths and weaknesses,because by this point in our
business partnership, we'veidentified where you are strong
at and where your role is, orwhere you fit, versus to where
my strengths are, where I fit,and so I think we've managed to
(56:48):
mature into giving each otherthe space and the freedom to be
more in charge in those areasversus in the beginning.
I think it was pretty rough ofmolding into from a marriage
partnership into a businesspartnership, where it was like,
initially, it's like I builtthis baby as a business, so I,
(57:10):
you know, this is the way thatI've been doing things.
And then I came in and you werelike but, but I did it this way
, and it's like well, here's anew way of thinking about this
idea, you know yeah, I mean, youpick your fights and you know
you work better with with theemployees, with people, so I
don't even want to do that,that's great.
Speaker 1 (57:27):
You want to with employees, with people, so I
don't even want to do that,that's great.
You want to have your meetingswith them?
Good, I don't have to do it,it's awesome.
But then, when it comes todesigning, I don't necessarily
want to give that away, becauseI love designing and I'm great
at it and you give me thatleeway of doing it.
Speaker 2 (57:49):
Right, but it also will definitely give you my
strong input.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
Yes, of course, but there's also other things you
don't have to deal with thewarehousing and shipping and
containers.
Speaker 2 (58:02):
Right.
Would you recommend peopleworking with their spouse?
Speaker 1 (58:08):
I mean that really depends.
Depends what kind of a businessit is.
I can see that either beingextremely successful or
destroying their relationshipcompletely.
I mean it really depends on thepeople and the business is
there anything else you'd loveto add to this conversation?
Speaker 2 (58:27):
no, I mean, it was fun.
Depends on the people and thebusiness.
Is there anything else you'dlove to add to this conversation
?
Speaker 1 (58:31):
No, I mean, it was fun, let's do it again.
Speaker 2 (58:34):
Yeah, let's do it again.
Well, thank you for being onthis podcast.
I am really excited to see whatfeedback we get and how it
encourages people who are maybein the middle of their
entrepreneur journey or just foryou know people, to get
inspired by your walk, yourprocess, thank you.
(58:55):
Thank you for listening to theones who dare podcast.
It is an honor to share theseencouraging stories with you.
If you enjoy the show, I wouldlove for you to tell your
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You can find me on my website,speckhopoffcom.
I think about it and I'm like you know what?
I'm going to risk it all.
I'm going to rent this space.
I rent it, but while renting it, I immediately start shifting
the companies I'm working withand all of a sudden I'm going
much higher end and I'm grabbinga few Italian companies and a
Canadian, and even the Chinesecompanies.
(00:23):
There are a few very few,actually two that I know of that
are pretty decent Grab both ofthem.
Open up the showroom.
That actually is spectacular.
It's a beautiful showroom.
I'm in the art district.
I mean, this is quite differentfrom where I started.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Hey friends, welcome to the Ones who Dared podcast,
where stories of courage areelevated.
I'm your host, vekka, and everyother week you'll hear
interviews from inspiring people.
My hope is that you will leaveencouraged.
I'm so glad you're here, talitPapa.
(01:04):
Welcome to the Wants to Darepodcast.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Well, thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
I am so genuinely excited to have you on here.
There has been so many peoplethat asked me to bring him on,
you on, and we've been trying toget you on and finally we're
getting it done, so I'm thrilled, Okay.
Okay we're getting it done, soI'm thrilled.
(01:31):
Okay, so you are a reallyinteresting guest because I know
you more intimately than I haveor know any other guests or any
other person really and youinspire me so much and there's
days where I'm like, wow, how doyou do the things that you do?
And I just feel like you trulyare an inspiration.
I don't know if you know thator not, but you really do
inspire me in so many ways.
(01:52):
And we have grown together.
Obviously we've been married forover 20 some years, so we have
kind of molded and shaped eachother.
You help me to be more of arisk taker.
You help me to care a lot lesswhat people think, because you
just kind of do what you do andyou roll with it and, versus to,
I'm a little more risk averseand also I cared a lot more
(02:16):
about what people thought than Ido now.
And you're just such aninspiring person and you're so
blunt, so straight to the point,and people really want to hear
from you.
So I'm so excited for you toshare your story.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
That's awesome.
Let's go.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Okay, well, also, you have an entrepreneur story
that's a little bit differentfrom other people.
You went from being a musicianto someone who performed on
stages, like in Nashville atDove Awards.
You're a music producer.
You're also an audio engineer.
You went from building abusiness to losing everything,
(02:53):
to rebuilding a successfulbusiness once again and reach
your incredible goals.
So I'd love to kind of get somebackstory on your entrepreneur
journey before we get started on.
At what point in your life didyou feel like you knew you were
going to be an entrepreneur?
Speaker 1 (03:13):
well, I guess, when I realized I don't really like
working for other people, Idropped out of high school I
went working for this factorypacking t-shirts and I I was
like, wow, this really sucks.
Probably the first week and I'mthinking, wow, my parents were
working like this.
I didn't think about thatbefore and I was thinking, well,
(03:34):
I bought a car at an auctionand this car is worth probably
double what I paid for it.
What if I sell it?
What?
What happens?
So kind of started selling carsand making money and I realized
, well, why in the world dopeople even have jobs where you
can?
Just, it's not about, it's notabout working for your money,
(03:57):
it's about just making moneydifferent ways yeah, and how old
were you when you sold thatfirst car?
uh 16 okay.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
So you were already at that point thinking like, wow
, this is not something I wantto do with my life, like I don't
want to take the traditionalroute of nine to five exactly,
even though I did have to getall the jobs.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
After that I went working for a couple of
factories we were buildingcabinetry and um and that's and
I was still.
I would work night shift.
I would still go to theauctions to copart, get beat up
cars, fix them, sell them.
I actually had my own littleshop like a body shop and then
(04:43):
and that's before I moved toFlorida I still had another job.
So I worked for about a yearand a half of my life for other
people do you feel like youlearned anything there, working
for other people?
I mean looking back, I'mthinking because there were huge
cabinetry shops and just theinventory and the management, or
(05:07):
more like mismanagement, whatI've seen, just bad managers
screaming at people.
I'm thinking, wow, I wouldnever do that, and you know me,
I never do that.
It's crazy.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
You mean learning what not to do like in your
company as a boss and stuffCorrect, yeah.
So, and then you also had amusical background, which is
very interesting because you hadthis side to you that's
artistic with music and I viewyou as an artist before a
business person.
I mean you're a combination ofboth, but you definitely are an
(05:43):
artist.
I mean you're a combination ofboth but you definitely are an
artist.
And how have you managed tokind of balance the creative
aspect of who you are with thebusiness aspect?
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Well, the way I look at it, if you're an artist,
everything's an art form.
If I'm writing music, I have tobe creative, I have to find the
sounds.
I have to pretty much see thewhole entire song as this sphere
that I'm working in.
And business is the same thing.
It's art, it's creatingsomething out of nothing and
(06:15):
like.
If you look at Elon Musk, Idon't view him as somebody who's
you know, owns a factory.
I view him as somebody whocreates things that other people
just unable to create.
He thinks the way that otherpeople cannot think, and that's
what a true entrepreneur is.
It's not necessarily somebodywho just copies somebody else.
(06:37):
Oh, they're buying a car at theauction.
I'm going to go do the samething.
Maybe that's where you start.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
And for a long period in your life you were pursuing
music.
You thought that was initiallythe path that you wanted to take
right.
At what point did you figureout that you don't want that to
be your number one focus?
Speaker 1 (06:56):
oh, it's pretty simple.
As soon as I figured out that Icannot make any money doing it.
I mean, if I could make moneydoing it, I'd probably still be
doing it.
But you know, moving to Atlanta, fighting through it for two
years, failing completely, nevermaking more than a couple
(07:19):
hundred bucks a show, it's just,it's devastating box a show.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
It's just, it's devastating.
Yeah, but would you say what it?
When you say failing, you meannot achieving the goals that you
had, because in some ways yousome people would view that as a
success if you were able toperform with other bands, which
you did, you were able to go todouble award shows in
nashville's, you performed onseveral stages and different
events, and things like that.
So how do you define failure?
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Well, if your success is being a struggling musician
and because you're still outthere and people are listening
to your music and that's success, then yeah, that's successful
for you.
But to me success was well.
First of all, I always wantedto be an actual artist, not some
traveling guy or know.
Hey, we hit the radio once inatlanta, once in baltimore and
(08:10):
yay, I mean it just felt likewe're just always falling short.
And even with the artists thatI've worked with, I just feel
like most of them never reallytruly made it, even though, yeah
, they were signed artists, butthey were.
They were not where I wanted,where I wanted myself to be.
(08:30):
So to me that's not reallysuccess.
It's either you succeed or youdon't.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
I don't think there's something in between yeah, and
also I think you're a prettyunconventional person in general
.
I feel like you're one of themore unique people that I know,
or one of the most unique peoplethat I know, because I think
just the way you think is reallydifferent.
It's very unorthodox.
You kind of do your own thing,you go against the grain, you
(08:58):
don't really care if it's youknow, something that's been done
before, if it's somethingthat's expected to be done, you
just do your own thing.
And I just recall, you know,just knowing you, you sharing
how school was a very difficultexperience for you.
And you know, just like RichardBranson, you think that you
(09:20):
have dyslexic or you're dyslexicto some degree.
You have dyslexic or you'redyslexic to some degree.
How would you attribute thedifficulty in school, in your
childhood, to building thatresilience for entrepreneurship?
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Yes, I'm definitely.
If it comes to school, I cannotlearn well at all.
If somebody's teaching me onpaper and showing me on the
board, I feel like I'm dumb.
That's just not the way I learn.
I learn from experiences likeyou.
See somebody do something like,wow, that's cool, I can do that
(09:55):
, you add your own, you recreate.
But if somebody just sits thereand tries to get all this
information pounding into yourhead, it's just I don't know.
It's not going to work for me.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Yeah, so do you feel like that school model is not
for everybody?
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Absolutely not.
I mean, it doesn't work for meat all.
I don't think it works for myboys either.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
Yeah, well, it's just really, in general, the school
system has been very much toproduce workers, right, and
that's not the way that youthink.
There's something interestingthat I find that you told your
dad when you were young.
I'm curious if you're willingto share it on the podcast.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
If you're talking about that.
I told my dad that I'm going tobe a millionaire at 13 years
old.
That I did, and he was.
You know.
At first he was like, oh that'sreally cool, huh, just laughing
.
And then I really startedbelieving what I was saying and
(11:03):
he eventually got really mad atme.
He's like you're not going tobe a millionaire, okay, if you
want to work you know what workis you take a shovel, you dig a
hole.
That's working, working withyour hands.
I'm like that's crazy.
And I told him no, you're wrong, I'm going to be a millionaire.
And but that, I think, maybesolidified the fact.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
I'm like no, I'm going to prove you wrong.
And what do you think made youbelieve that when you were 13?
Like, where in the world didyou get that concept?
Speaker 1 (11:32):
I just thought there's millionaires out there,
and if they can do it, why can'tI do it?
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Yeah, but you know, you lived when you were 13,.
We didn't have the internet,wasn't really a thing.
There wasn't podcasts likethere is now that young kids can
listen to podcasts about othermillionaires.
They're influencers, as theycall them, on social media and
all of that.
So for you to get that conceptwould have been so differently
delivered.
(11:57):
Did you come acrossmillionaires like?
How did you even come to thatidea?
Speaker 1 (12:02):
no, not really.
I mean, we lived in lancastercounty, which doesn't have.
Well, I guess they havemillionaires.
We didn't know any.
I don't know, I really don't, Idon't remember.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
So you just kind of had this your own thought like
this is what I want to do.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Yeah, and I kind of knew it was going to happen,
like I literally knew that.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
That's interesting.
And then, how many years did ittake you?
Speaker 1 (12:29):
to or about what age were you able to actualize that?
I think I was 32.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Okay, yeah, so let's go into your entrepreneur story.
So you, you shared earlier thatyou didn't um, you realized
like I do not want to do thisnine to five thing.
I hate working at the factory,I don't want to do this, but I
got to figure out a way to makemoney.
You tried the music route.
(12:53):
The music route didn't reallypan out in the way that you
expected it to, and you wantedto figure out how to make money.
So can you take us on thatentrepreneur journey of where
were you at and how did you getto where you are today?
Speaker 1 (13:10):
When we moved to America from Russia, my dad well
, he always had bees in Russiatoo and he kind of was working
with different entrepreneursthere.
This one guy he bought my dadout completely and then my dad
was working for him.
I don't know, not the best deal.
We moved to america.
He gets bees.
Uh, he finds out aboutpollination.
(13:33):
So he's like, okay, we're gonnaput, put out on some orchards
and, for example, I wouldobviously help him load, unload.
We get to an orchard and I'mjust a kid, I'm like 12 years
old.
He's like, hey, go, go talk tohim, tell him how much money we
want to get orchard.
And I'm just a kid, I'm like 12years old.
He's like, hey, go go talk tohim, tell him how much money we
want to get for each hive.
I'm like, what the?
I'm 12 and I'm like, okay, sowe go there, I'm negotiating
(13:57):
with the farmers, because my daddoes not speak one word of
english at this point.
And then, after you donegotiate that, and you're
walking back to tell your dad,you're like, oh my gosh, that
was awesome.
I can't believe it, I did that.
So that would be how I started,I think, kind of like where it
(14:18):
was born, where I can negotiatea deal, where I started being a
salesperson and then when I wasbuying, selling cars, every car,
every client is different.
It's not even like selling thesame item or same piece of
furniture.
You know how to talk about thatpiece of furniture.
A car is always different,especially when it's not from a
(14:38):
BMW dealership.
It's kind of constantly moldingand bending you and making you
shift and think differently thenext time.
What did I do wrong or what didI do good?
And then you know, when wemoved to Florida I started
construction business.
Well, I started a flooringbusiness.
I was a subcontractor fordifferent stores, I was laying
(15:04):
carpet, I was laying woodenfloors.
And again, you have to beconstantly going selling your
ability to do the job.
So you have to let people knowyes, I am good, yes, here's my
job, this is what I've done.
And then, eventually, when I hadthe other construction
companies, such as FinnishCarpentry, that I was working
(15:27):
directly with builders likePulte Homes, I had contracts
with American Homes, leeWeatherington, which is a big
(15:47):
builder of custom floors fromsecondary companies that were
buying it from Shaw, from Mohawkin Dalton Georgia, and it was
cheap, because Dalton Georgia ischeap, but Atlanta was
expensive.
Let's say Buckhead or Midtown,but Atlanta was expensive.
(16:08):
Let's say Buckhead or Midtown.
So I figured, wow, in Midtownthey're selling this for $7.99 a
square foot, but I can get itfor $120.
Is this even real?
I couldn't believe it.
This was probably my first truesales, like getting it from not
necessarily from a factory, butgetting it from whatever
distributor.
Let's say yeah, and then I puton craigslist it sells an exam
(16:31):
like that's crazy, what the heck, because it's cheap and all I
have to do is transport it.
If you take all these yearswe're talking about two decades
and then you actually mold themall together and you get a much
clearer picture of business.
You will understand business insuch a broader spectrum than
(16:54):
somebody can sit there and teachyou on a board writing hey,
this is what you do, this iswhat you do in business.
Really, how am I supposed tolearn?
That's crazy.
I don't think anybody can learnthat's crazy.
I don't think anybody can learnthat.
If you don't actually gothrough it yourself and get the
beat down of your life, I Idon't know how you're going to
be an entrepreneur yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
So all those things, the experiences that you had,
they molded you into essentiallythe next phase and um, you
tried other things too.
You tried selling online.
You tried buying products on.
You tried selling online, youtried buying products on eBay
and all the different things,and I think you've said before
that you have how many failedbusinesses.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
Eight that were registered.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
That were registered.
Yeah Right, and so that's trulya lot of entrepreneurs story
where they have failed multipletimes over and over again before
they hit that success mark.
And even when they hit thatsuccess mark, they generally hit
a point where they take risksand they lose it all, and then,
(18:02):
when they built back up, theyreally built a solid business.
So is that, does that soundfamiliar?
Is that part of your story aswell?
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Yeah, absolutely Before we moved to Atlanta from
Sarasota, that was myconstruction business, that in
business.
But that just happened tohappen right at that 2007
recession when everybody justwas losing everything.
(18:32):
So it's not like because wewere doing pretty well with that
business and what could havegrown that business probably to
something massive in Cirrus Autoright now but we didn't have
the chance and the whole thingfell apart.
And then to restart that, eventhough in Atlanta I was doing
all these things, I was notsuccessful.
(18:53):
I couldn't really understandhow to market properly.
I couldn't find the clients Ididn't necessarily have.
I mean, I had a van.
It's like selling stuff out ofa van.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Yeah, and it was a pretty rusty van, if I may add.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
It was definitely rusty and it was a maroon color.
Speaker 2 (19:10):
And it was like rust falling out of the bottom.
So I don't think people reallywould probably take that too
seriously.
But essentially that was thepoint before moving to Atlanta,
where we lost everything and westarted back from ground zero.
Before moving to Atlanta, welost everything and we started
back from ground zero.
And on top of that, I thinkit's a lot harder to build a
(19:31):
business or be successful whenyou don't have the financial
income to leverage off of.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Yeah, no, of course, when we moved back from Atlanta
to Florida, we stayed with myparents.
It was rough.
We didn't have any money at all.
And the reason we moved backactually I should add this my
dad.
Again, he's a beekeeper.
(19:58):
He calls me.
He's like hey, we should dosomething with these bees, we
should really build a newbusiness.
I'm thinking, well, that'sgreat, so we move back, we're
staying with my parents, we geta loan for my dad it's an
agricultural loan with the stateof Florida and we we buy a
(20:22):
truck, we buy a forklift.
I built out this huge trailerit's a honey house with the
whole conveyor system.
But the loan was contingentthat we secure some kind of
pollinating contracts, at leasttwo.
(20:45):
We were supposed to secure onein California for almonds and
one in Maine for blueberries.
So California was kind of easy.
I secured that one real quick.
In Maine I'm struggling.
Then we get this full truck ofhoney because we're already
collecting honey in Florida,because we already have like a
(21:05):
thousand hives.
I'm driving the truck up toGolden something it's like a
honey receiving facility inLancaster.
I drove it up there.
I get out of the truck, a truckpulls up behind me and it's
this famous beekeeper, davidRosenberg, and he was on 60
(21:30):
Minute.
That's actually where I seenhim and that's where I
recognized his face.
I couldn't believe it like that.
That can't be him.
So I pull, I come up to him,I'm like are you David Rosenberg
?
He's like yes, I am.
So we we were just talking andhe was actually pulling a load
up from Florida, from David MMendes, which is probably the
(21:53):
third largest as far as how manybees he has goes in America.
And I asked him so I cannotsecure a contract for
blueberries?
And he's like well, let me seewhat I can do for you.
He calls me back in about aweek.
He's like I'm going to connectyou with the blueberry freezer.
So I get two contracts, whichare pretty much all I really
(22:16):
have to do, but I'm fighting fora third one for cranberries in
Massachusetts.
But that's really difficultbecause it's very limited.
So I did not get that one.
And then we have to actuallysend the bees out and collect
money from these contracts,because if we don't, we default
on the loan.
And my dad is telling me no,we're not going to do that.
(22:40):
People are stealing bees inCalifornia.
We don't have the money to goto the blueberry freezer.
I'm like, wait, hold on asecond.
Why don't we negotiate a dealwith a trucking company and pay
them only after we get the money?
Oh, they're not gonna do that.
I'm like no, they're probablygonna do that and he's the boss.
So he's like no.
(23:00):
So I'm like, all right, well,this is not working out, so I
leave that company and thenstart again buying cars on cheap
cars, very cheap cars that haveblown gaskets on Craigslist
fixing them.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Yeah, that was a pretty humbling time in our
lives, was it not?
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Yeah, kind of felt like back in Atlanta.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
All right where it was.
Well, Winston Churchill hasthis quote that I love.
It says success is stumblingfrom failure to failure without
no loss of enthusiasm.
And how would you say that youcontinue to trying again, having
the resilience, having the gritto give it another go, even
(23:49):
when we're basically at rockbottom as far as finances go, as
far as our sense of pride?
And having been successful,having had all our needs met
financially and doing fairlydecently, to essentially having
nothing and having to rebuildall over again, how do you keep
(24:12):
going when the going gets tough?
Speaker 1 (24:15):
I think that's the whole point is that you don't
have a choice.
I mean, what are you going todo?
Lay down and die you just thatis your drive, is your failure?
Uh, if you're living as somekid in some fancy house with
your parents supplying you foreverything, are you even going
(24:35):
to be an entrepreneur?
And why would you be anentrepreneur?
Why would you do anything?
Just take it easy.
Everything's good when you'reliving.
When you have nothing, youfight.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Yeah, and so how did your story transition from again
having nothing to building asuccessful furniture business?
Speaker 1 (24:59):
Well, at one point I found a couch on Craigslist and
I bought it in Tampa, brought itback, also brought back a
catalog that just happened tohave a number on it.
I called the number to see ifthey would sell me that couch,
because at this point, of course, I'm at the point in my life
(25:22):
where I'm searching everywherefor absolutely anything, just
throwing and see what sticks,and I call them.
They're like yeah, we can sellyou one couch, and I bought it
for like $750.
And they're like yeah, it's 300bucks.
I'm like what?
That's crazy.
That's actually a legit margin.
(25:43):
So I'm like well, can I buy one?
They're like, yeah, but youdon't want to because you know
it's going to cost like $300 tobring it to you from.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Orlando.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
And I'm like, okay, but I'll pay that $300 because
that's all I have.
So I do sell it probably withina couple hours back on
Craigslist for $750.
I'm like, well, that's prettycrazy.
So in a week I sold.
In a week I'm getting a fulltruckload now and in a month we
(26:16):
have I literally remembercounting the cash in my closet
and it's eighteen thousanddollars.
Going from zero to eighteenthousand was pretty incredible.
Um, I probably never actuallyseen eighteen thousand dollars
before that.
And then we had to move a fewplaces, graduating the garage,
(26:39):
other garages, that's next to it.
I booked probably 25% of thisfacility and I'm thinking I need
a store.
I don't want to sell out ofgarages and people are actually
coming there.
And I remember this one lady.
She's like well, I guess that'sone way you can do it.
I'm like that sucks, that'swhat she thinks of me one way
that one way you can do it.
(27:02):
You know, like that, that's notwhat I want to do.
And then we find other linesthat are, you know, obviously a
little better lines.
There's still Chinese lines andI opened up one store.
So now you have like a showroom, but again I have to be closing
it the whole time because I'mdoing all the deliveries.
(27:24):
And my neighbor was arestaurant supplier.
He's like look, you havecustomers coming here, but
you're never there, so it's yourfault.
I'm like, yeah, well, I alsohave to deliver, or I'm just me
with my little pickup truck.
And eventually I'm driving homeand I see this art gallery on
(27:53):
this street in Sarasota, butit's so off-grid.
It's just like what is the artgallery doing there?
I'm shocked and there's a signright next to it for lease.
I'm like whoa, that's weird.
And so I turn around, I comeback in, I come in there and
(28:15):
this lady from Iceland and I askher.
I'm like what are you doinghere?
it's such a nice art galleryright, it was a pretty
industrial area, yeah and she'slike, well, I used to be
actually on main street and Ihad 10 000 square feet art
(28:38):
gallery, and that's again before2007.
Um, then she was on st armin's,which is pretty expensive rent
there, and she's like I had 5000 square feet there.
And this is just simply wherelife took me.
Like this is downgrading,downgrading.
And here I am now.
I'm like, wow, well, I like thespace next to you, I'm going to
(29:00):
rent it.
So I opened up a store there andshe's every day she's bored
because there's and she has onlylike, designers coming there
that worked with her forprobably 20 years, and every day
she's just mentoring me,constantly talking to me about
what I should be doing, whatdesigners want, and I'm already,
(29:21):
at that point, buying someknockoffs of classics like
Herman Miller, noel classics,probably Artifort, but of course
, all knockoffs still from china.
And she started telling me youknow what?
You need to go to downtown, youshouldn't be here.
I'm thinking, well, you camefrom downtown.
(29:42):
I can't even think that way,I'm just me.
And I realized one of myfriends two of them just opened
up an Italian kitchen showroomScavolini, which is a huge brand
in Italy on Main Street.
So I'm like I'm going to gotalk to them.
I drive up there and I'm likeI'd love to open up a showroom
(30:04):
somewhere around here too.
They're like, well, why don'tyou just work with us?
I'm like really.
They're like yeah, we havespace here.
It's just kitchens, and thenthere's space in the middle and
then we realized that space ispretty small.
Then there's another space onpalm avenue, which is the the
art district, and I'm like, hey,why don't we rent this out?
(30:24):
This is way bigger and we canbe here together.
We go there, we make anappointment.
The owner shows up in themorning and they don't show up.
They call me and oh yeah, wechanged their mind.
We put $50,000 into thislocation.
We shouldn't be moving, andthat makes sense, that's fair.
(30:46):
And so I have a conversationwith her and I think about it.
I'm like you know what?
I'm going to risk it all.
I'm going to rent this space.
I rent it, but while renting it, I immediately start shifting
the companies I'm working withand all of a sudden I'm going
(31:13):
much higher end and I'm grabbinga few Italian companies and a
Canadian and even the Chinesecompanies.
There are a few, very few,actually two that I know of that
are pretty decent.
Grab both of them.
Open up the showroom.
That actually is spectacular.
It's a beautiful showroom.
I'm in an art district I meanthis is quite different from
where I started.
And then, you know, nobodycomes in at all.
(31:37):
It's horrible.
I'm thinking this is a bad move.
But the art district has theseart walks last Friday of every
month and all of a sudden thefirst art walk happens.
One client comes in fromToronto and buys $25 25 000
worth of furniture and I waslike that's one client that's in
(31:58):
and I don't even have todeliver it.
I just I actually shipped it tohis house from different
warehouses and wherever I wasgrabbing them some in New Jersey
, high Point, thomasville and Iwas pretty surprised that I
could pull off.
This was probably one of thefirst times I pulled something
(32:21):
off like that, so that gives meanother boost of courage.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
Right and, like they say, peak to peak when you reach
one peak it gives youconfidence to go towards the
next peak.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
Yep, but eventually I'm thinking, well, I need some
really big line.
So I'm talking to this otherline called Caligaris.
They have stores all over Italy.
They're actually very famousfor their dinette sets.
And they show up and they'relike well, they convinced me,
you should do a Caligari store.
I'm like, okay, but you guysdon't have seating.
And I'm like thinking, okay,well, I can negotiate a deal
(33:04):
with them for seating withanother Italian line and do an
Italian store.
They agreed to that, exceptthis store is now too small for
what we're doing.
I see this other location wherewe are right now for lease,
lease to own, and that's on onour light, on a corner
(33:25):
fruitville and lemon cattycorner from whole foods I it's
like location, location.
And somehow they agreed tolease to me, even though the
owner did not want to, because Iwasn't.
He claimed that I had nocredibility.
I'm just a small timebusinessman and a lot of times
(33:46):
that's literally what it is.
That's what I've been told.
The whole time.
It's like you're nobody, evenwhen you're doing business, like
, oh, you're too small.
Oh yeah, no, we want to dosomething with a big company.
It's constantly like that andsomehow the realtor helped me
negotiate the lease.
(34:07):
So I leased this place.
We open up Caligari's store andwe bring in this leather line,
gamma, which we still sell both.
But Gamma is a pretty goodleather line from Italy and I
sign up and it says Caligari's,and I see Caligari's is trying
to put up Caligari's stores allover the US.
(34:28):
I'm thinking, wait, I'mactually not promoting myself,
I'm promoting them, I'm buildingtheir.
Wait, I'm actually notpromoting myself, I'm promoting
them, I'm building their brand,I'm not building our brand.
So I'm thinking that's not good.
So we decided to cut that andbuild our own brand, and that's
when we branded ourselves asSoftSquare.
And immediately all the otherlines that were already had
(34:53):
offices in the US all want towork with us.
Not to mention, there was acouple of big stores that closed
during the recession andthey're scrambling trying to
find anybody who's at that pointat least on our level, to sell
to.
Of course they're not going tosell to me prior me, but this is
different.
(35:14):
So we go to the Milan show andthere are just unbelievable
amount of options.
So many Italian, german, swisscompanies except you can't just
buy from them, because a lot ofthem are already working with
your competitors and at thispoint.
(35:36):
There are obviously good storesin Sarasota.
It's kind of always a closedmarket, and what started
happening was I identified thecompanies that I want to have on
the floor and you startnegotiating deals.
And the way you do that is well, hey, this competitor right
(35:57):
here claims they have your brand, but do they have it on the
floor?
No, or maybe, hey, they justhave one setting.
Well, I'm going to give youthree settings.
How about that?
Well, that's a deal for them.
And hey, my location is alwaysbetter than theirs because we
are on the light, on fruitville.
And eventually we got probably25 brands that way that are top.
(36:24):
And then I realized, hey, hownice that would be to go after
the biggest brands.
There are, the ones that areonly in design districts, in,
you know, on Madison, or youknow, the Miami Design District
and Brera in Paris.
And so we started negotiating.
Well, it took me about sevenand a half years to negotiate a
(36:46):
deal with B&B Italia, while theywere telling me no, of course
not, we would never work withyou.
And then somehow they changedtheir mind and as soon as we
picked up B&B other companieslike Casino they never even want
to talk to us.
All of a sudden they're callingus and begging us to get into
(37:08):
the store.
I'm like what in the world isgoing on to get into?
Speaker 2 (37:11):
the store and look what in the world is going on.
Yes, essentially, softsquarewent from being the underdog of
like who are you?
We're not going to sell to youbecause you don't have
comparable brands and you're notreputable enough we don't know
who you are to people and brandsthat are well-known throughout
the world now want to work inthe showroom now are asking to
(37:32):
be in the showroom and berepresented by the company.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Yeah, I mean, that's, I guess, the way it works.
You just keep working, workingto the top, and sometimes going
that high is also a bad thing,because now you're too high-end
and now you're too expensive.
A market is like a pyramid andthe higher you go, the smaller
it gets a pyramid, and thehigher you go, the smaller it
(37:58):
gets.
And you want to be somewheremiddle, high, but not high, high
, and that's essentially kind ofwhere we ended up with half of
our store and I've been tryingto walk it back, but that that
is a hard thing, because oncepeople think you're very
expensive, let's not go there.
How are you going to bring themback?
Speaker 2 (38:14):
Yeah, and so, with building up the company, what
were some of the biggest or whatwere some of the hardest parts
about being able to build?
Because you just mentioned thatit took seven years to get this
(38:34):
one brand that you had your eyeon for a long time, and so it
took a lot of grit and a lot ofpersistence and perseverance and
what would you say is thehardest part of walking through
that journey.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Honestly, it's all hard, but I enjoy that challenge
.
It is also fun.
And if you don't enjoy being anentrepreneur, if you don't
enjoy an everyday fight, aneveryday I don't want to say
(39:11):
struggle, but it is a struggle,but it's also.
It's like wrestling.
You don't have to go out thereand wrestle, but why do you
choose to?
Because you enjoy it right.
Same thing here.
It is all hard, it's very hardto negotiate deals, but I love
negotiating those.
(39:32):
It's.
It's hard to constantly be toldno, but then that one, yes,
gives you this courage.
You're like, oh whoa, that wasso worth it, the fight was worth
it.
And then you get emboldened andit it really is.
To me, the fight is fun.
(39:53):
If I did not like it, I don'tthink I could do it.
Speaker 2 (39:56):
What would you say is the greatest reward of being an
entrepreneur?
Speaker 1 (40:03):
I guess you can say a reward would be finances living
in a nicer house, driving anicer car Is that the greatest
reward?
Nicer house, driving a nicercar is that the greatest reward?
Um, to me, honestly, just justthe fact to have something
that's nobody else in the wholecity of sarasota has achieved, a
(40:27):
store like that to me that's,that's huge, because I can just
think back and think that'sawesome.
I literally beat out so manypeople.
The fight was incredible,getting punched in the face like
nobody else, but I feel like Iwon and I feel so great.
That actually feels amazing.
Just winning feels good.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
You like to win?
Yes.
Speaker 1 (40:49):
I do.
Speaker 2 (40:49):
If I know anything about you, it's that you love to
win and you don't like to win.
Speaker 1 (40:54):
Yes, I do If I know anything?
Speaker 2 (40:55):
about you?
It's that you love to win andyou don't like to lose.
Speaker 1 (40:59):
Correct, but you're not afraid to get into a fight
that, even if you risk losing,you still are willing to fight
it out.
Well, I mean, you have to fight.
If you don't fight, you'realready lost.
If you don't start something,you're already lost.
We all start at zero.
So what, hey, let's be afraidof doing something so we might
eventually go back to zero.
I don't get it.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
What would you say is the biggest risk that you took
as an entrepreneur?
Speaker 1 (41:23):
Yeah, that's a good one.
We opened up a showroom inNaples and this showroom is
twice the size of Sarasotashowroom.
Put in close to a milliondollars.
We struggled for three and ahalf years.
It was the most beautifulshowroom, probably second most
beautiful in all of Florida,next to a showroom in Miami that
(41:46):
I like very much.
And then clients were just notcoming.
We couldn't hire anybodybecause people in Naples don't
necessarily work, they're allretirees.
Our employees were driving fromFort Myers, which is an hour
away.
It was hard and then, afterstruggling for three and a half
(42:09):
years, I had to close it.
Except I couldn't close itbecause I have a seven-year
contract yeah, so that one wasduring COVID and they want
$183,000 or $87,000 for me tobreak the contract.
Well, that's actually later on.
(42:31):
First they said absolutely notnot happening, but I'm already
thinking well, we don't have achoice.
I started selling the furnitureoff without having an ability
to break the contract.
I'm selling the furniture offalready probably sold 20% of it
to the point of no return.
I know there's no returnbecause I don't have the money
to buy new furniture to refillthe store, and I know there's no
(42:52):
return because I don't have themoney to buy new furniture to
refill the store, and I'm thereby myself at this point.
I'm pretty much living at thisstore.
Speaker 2 (42:59):
Right, because we already the employees are no
longer there.
Essentially we there areemployees that were there.
We had to let go some peopleand we knew that we were closing
the store, so that it was overfor as far as the team goes.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
Correct.
And then I'm working with alandlord who is in Boston it's a
huge company and they don'treally care about people like
small guys because it's a bigcompany and eventually they
agreed okay, give us $100,000and we'll terminate the contract
.
That was literally Christmasfor me, that was.
(43:38):
I couldn't even believe it.
I know it sounds crazy.
Hey, just give us a hundredgrand and you can walk away.
I was like, are you serious?
I wired them the money thatprobably like in 10 minutes, you
know, because I was selling offa lot of furniture.
So we started getting the moneythat probably like in 10
minutes, you know, because I wasselling off a lot of furniture.
So we started getting the moneyback.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:56):
And then we were able to be month to month, liquidate
everything, got all our moneyback that we put into it and
more.
And it was actually incredible.
We walked out of that situationwinners but not really losing
anything.
It was great.
It's how we were able to moveback to Pennsylvania.
(44:18):
Well, at the same time, thewhole time I'm running Naples,
our manager in Sarasota isrunning Sarasota for three and a
half years and I realized wait,I did not run the store in
Sarasota for so long Do I reallyhave to live in Sarasota?
And I realized no, we don'thave to live in Sarasota because
(44:38):
it runs on its own and we wereable to move.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
Yeah, so would you say that in retrospect that
seemed like a failure, but youstated that it felt like a win,
that we won at the end.
Speaker 1 (44:54):
Yeah, a lot of things feel like a failure, but just
don't think about it as afailure.
It's just another step.
I mean, even if you fail, ohwell.
Speaker 2 (45:04):
Yeah, I find that it's interesting in life that
there's things in the momentthat feel like the world is
going to end because thiscurrent hope you had, this
current dream, you had this plan, this business plan that you
have is not panning out the waythat you initially thought it
would, and in that moment itfeels like it's the end of the
(45:25):
world.
But then later you look back onit and it's like, wow, this is
actually worked out to be such ablessing.
Yeah, it ended up being so muchgreater of a blessing than you
(45:46):
anticipated it to be.
Can you speak into that?
Speaker 1 (45:51):
Yeah, I mean, it is very hard when it's happening
and you do feel like you're sucha failure.
I remember thinking ourcompetitors in Sir Soda are
probably laughing at me.
Oh, look at this guy.
He went there.
He thought he can do it.
So pathetic.
I'm thinking like that aboutmyself, thinking this sucks, but
(46:17):
you know who cares that's whatit teaches you.
Who cares like, who cares whatthey're thinking?
Who are these people?
Do we even know them?
Speaker 2 (46:22):
right.
Yeah, I mean and you're the onethat taught me to really um,
not, not, not, it's not notcaring about people, but um, not
allowing the opinions of otherpeople to impact your choices,
because, at the end of the day,the truth is is that people
think a lot less of you than youthink, and people care about
(46:43):
you a lot less than you think,care about you a lot less than
you think.
So if we're going to allow theopinions of others to dictate
the choices that we make, therisks that we take, we're kind
of cheating ourselves out ofliving our lives to the fullest,
versus just doing the thingthat you want to do or allowing
a narrative of someone else'spossible thoughts that you're
(47:05):
assuming impact that decisionyeah, I mean that's correct okay
, I think what's reallyinteresting about you is that
you continue to persevere, evenwhen things are hard, but you
also have the capacity to do somuch more than just what you're
doing.
And even though, with thefurniture business, we've been
in it for over a decade and it'sstill growing, it's, you know,
(47:30):
we're pivoting in different wayswith the marketplace and so
forth, and yet there's otherthings that you're working on
and dreaming about beyond that,so would you like to speak on to
that?
Speaker 1 (47:42):
then this is just for fun, but I am going to be
releasing an album.
It's just Chill Beats album,maybe January February.
Speaker 2 (47:51):
And what's the name of the album or the name of the?
Speaker 1 (47:56):
I don't really know yet, maybe Radio City.
Speaker 2 (47:59):
Right, but what's your name on Spotify?
Speaker 1 (48:03):
Oh, I'm Gravity Pool.
Speaker 2 (48:05):
Gravity Pool.
So that's it, guys.
Go look up Gravity Pool onSpotify or wherever you listen
to music.
Speaker 1 (48:10):
So I'm also working on building a new company right
now.
It's called Zero Trim and whatit is?
It's an architectural productfor an interior of a house.
It lets you build an interiorwith no trim, no casings around
the door, no baseboard, allframeless doors.
We integrate LED lighting.
(48:31):
I'm trying to make this wholething as a smart home, but with
our own hardware, and we've doneall the designs in France.
The website is up.
I pretty much got all thecontracts I need for hinges and
locks.
Unfortunately, they're going tocome from Italy.
I got everything, except it'skind of hard to raise money for
(48:55):
a new company, especially whenyou have no revenue.
So that's what I'm working on,and I'm working with the state
of Pennsylvania right now,because what they want to do is
bring manufacturing, bring jobsand bring tech to pennsylvania,
and that's pretty much whatwe're bringing, and so they're.
Speaker 2 (49:14):
They want to work with us, which is great and you
have a patent pending for thistechnology as well, correct?
Yes, some of it for the doorand so, essentially, you're
going to be manufacturing andthe design and the current
website.
What's the name of the website?
Speaker 1 (49:31):
It's zerotrimcom.
Speaker 2 (49:33):
What would you say to someone who is struggling right
now so someone who's maybe intheir entrepreneur journey that
they just feel like they are inthe worst season of their life,
kind of like you were and wewere at one point.
What would you tell them?
Speaker 1 (49:53):
I guess it really depends what we're talking about
.
Are they in a business and thebusiness is just terrible, or
are they trying to open up abusiness they don't know how?
I would need a A little bit ofbackstory, yes, yeah.
Speaker 2 (50:09):
Well, essentially it's like what would you say to
someone who's trying to dosomething, who's trying to make
something successful and theyjust they're feeling discouraged
?
Maybe what I'm asking is moreof like how would you encourage
someone who's really strugglingand they feel like they're just
(50:30):
at the bottom and they don'tknow how to get back up?
What encouragement would youhave for them?
Speaker 1 (50:36):
I guess sometimes when you're in business and
you're so stuck or just sobackwards and you know there is
no revenue, sometimes it is justthe end of it and perhaps you
have to start something else.
I mean, like I said, I failedeight times and that's
registered.
My failings are registered.
(50:57):
But if you're struggling withstarting a business and you just
want to give up, I mean I wouldencourage anybody and everybody
don't give up.
I mean, giving up is just going, it's just being exactly where
you are.
For example, if when I was azero and I would never start
(51:21):
nothing, then I would be alwaysa zero.
And if you don't keep fightingor you're afraid to do something
, because what if you're goingto fail?
But you already failed, you'rea zero.
So how much lower can you go?
If you try, you should go backto where you are, so you should
try again until you get somekind of success.
Speaker 2 (51:42):
There you go.
That's good advice.
What is the best advice thatsomeone else gave you?
Speaker 1 (51:51):
go.
That's good advice.
What is the best advice thatsomeone else gave you?
That's probably when I was inconstruction business and I
thought I was doing good.
And this guy, eric uh, we werein his house and he was very
successful he.
He had he sold two of his paintbusinesses in brooklyn but he
leased back the building.
So I mean that's a good deal.
(52:12):
You're just always collectingmoney.
And you got money up front andhe was telling me you need to
start selling.
I'm like, no, eric, I'm doinggood, it's all good.
He's like, no, no, you're notlistening to me, you need to
sell.
You want to make money, yousell.
And then eventually I was like,oh my gosh, eric is so right,
(52:35):
you sell.
You always sell, even if you'rein finances.
What are you doing?
You're selling, you're sellingservices.
What are you doing in this kindof industry?
You're selling a product.
It's always selling.
And once you're good at selling, if you can master selling, you
officially have been born againas a salesman, and that is
(52:56):
irreversible yeah, that's goodadvice.
Speaker 2 (53:00):
Um, what do you think is the bravest thing that you
have ever done?
Speaker 1 (53:05):
Bravest, I don't know .
Skydiving, I don't know.
Honestly, again, that store inNaples that took a lot of guts,
that was hard, that was.
I don't want to say I wish Inever did it, but I wish I never
did it.
Speaker 2 (53:24):
But we just talked about how you learned from it,
so Sure.
Speaker 1 (53:27):
Sure, you learn from it, so sure, sure you learn from
it.
But you don't want to, youdon't want to do that again.
Speaker 2 (53:32):
No, I don't want to do that again either.
Absolutely not.
Um, what would you say arethree books that were the most
transformational for you?
Speaker 1 (53:43):
I mean, I like a few books that I read by Richard
Branson, and one of them iscalled Screw it, let's Do it.
And what I like about RichardBranson especially for who I am,
is he kind of is the similar,he's the same person.
He just constantly tries thingsand fails and says screw it,
let's do it this way, or let'sjust get rid of this airline
(54:07):
that sucked.
Speaker 2 (54:08):
That's the way he thinks and he's pretty
unconventional too, like youwould say that, um, he doesn't
try to fit into a certain mold,he just does his own thing and
creates his own path yeah, he's,I mean he's definitely out
there.
Speaker 1 (54:24):
Some of the other books that I listened to was the
Algebra of Wealth, think andGrow Rich.
Both of them are similar.
You know there's a lot of booksSnowball by Warren Buffett but
that's about the markets.
If you're into that the BurrMethod, if you're into real
estate, if you are in realestate and you don't know that
(54:47):
book, you need to know that bookyeah, and what did you like
about how to um think and growrich?
maybe it was by napoleon hill Imean, it gives you a lot of
examples about life and kind oflike it's not all necessarily
business, but it's just the waypsychology of your brain works
(55:08):
and why you think certain waysor how you can transform your
thought patterns.
Um, it goes very deep.
So you might have to read orlisten to that book many times
until you're like oh okay, I getit.
I get it.
Speaker 2 (55:24):
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 (55:26):
Yeah, that's good what is it like to have your
wife as a business partner.
I mean, it's good and bad, andthe good is that you know you
can constantly kind of pullideas from each other and you're
always in the proximity of eachother.
(55:47):
So you know if you have athought at night or before you
go to bed you can talk about it.
You don't have to be like, oh,I have to call this guy but I
can't, he's sleeping.
So the accessibility Right, butat the same time I mean, we had
(56:07):
rough times, especially that-we're both extremely
strong-willed.
Speaker 2 (56:10):
You'd say yes.
Speaker 1 (56:11):
And then we'll fight for ideas, or I think this is
the way this works.
No, I think this is the way itworks, and it's like wait, but
we're like equal partners, sowho decides?
It's kind of difficult.
Speaker 2 (56:26):
Yeah, who decides?
It's kind of difficult, yeah.
But at the same time, though,we leverage each other's
strengths and weaknesses,because by this point in our
business partnership, we'veidentified where you are strong
at and where your role is, orwhere you fit, versus to where
my strengths are, where I fit,and so I think we've managed to
(56:48):
mature into giving each otherthe space and the freedom to be
more in charge in those areasversus in the beginning.
I think it was pretty rough ofmolding into from a marriage
partnership into a businesspartnership, where it was like,
initially, it's like I builtthis baby as a business, so I,
(57:10):
you know, this is the way thatI've been doing things.
And then I came in and you werelike but, but I did it this way
, and it's like well, here's anew way of thinking about this
idea, you know yeah, I mean, youpick your fights and you know
you work better with with theemployees, with people, so I
don't even want to do that,that's great.
Speaker 1 (57:27):
You want to with employees, with people, so I
don't even want to do that,that's great.
You want to have your meetingswith them?
Good, I don't have to do it,it's awesome.
But then, when it comes todesigning, I don't necessarily
want to give that away, becauseI love designing and I'm great
at it and you give me thatleeway of doing it.
Speaker 2 (57:49):
Right, but it also will definitely give you my
strong input.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
Yes, of course, but there's also other things you
don't have to deal with thewarehousing and shipping and
containers.
Speaker 2 (58:02):
Right.
Would you recommend peopleworking with their spouse?
Speaker 1 (58:08):
I mean that really depends.
Depends what kind of a businessit is.
I can see that either beingextremely successful or
destroying their relationshipcompletely.
I mean it really depends on thepeople and the business is
there anything else you'd loveto add to this conversation?
Speaker 2 (58:27):
no, I mean, it was fun.
Depends on the people and thebusiness.
Is there anything else you'dlove to add to this conversation
?
Speaker 1 (58:31):
No, I mean, it was fun, let's do it again.
Speaker 2 (58:34):
Yeah, let's do it again.
Well, thank you for being onthis podcast.
I am really excited to see whatfeedback we get and how it
encourages people who are maybein the middle of their
entrepreneur journey or just foryou know people, to get
inspired by your walk, yourprocess, thank you.
(58:55):
Thank you for listening to theones who dare podcast.
It is an honor to share theseencouraging stories with you.
If you enjoy the show, I wouldlove for you to tell your
friends.
Leave us a reviewer rating andsubscribe to wherever you listen
to podcasts, because this helpsothers discover the show.
You can find me on my website,speckhopoffcom.
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Intentionally Disturbing
Join me on this podcast as I navigate the murky waters of human behavior, current events, and personal anecdotes through in-depth interviews with incredible people—all served with a generous helping of sarcasm and satire. After years as a forensic and clinical psychologist, I offer a unique interview style and a low tolerance for bullshit, quickly steering conversations toward depth and darkness. I honor the seriousness while also appreciating wit. I’m your guide through the twisted labyrinth of the human psyche, armed with dark humor and biting wit.