March 18, 2025 • 46 mins
Saundra Dalton-Smith is a Board-Certified internal medicine physician and work-life integration researcher. She founded Restorasis, which promotes workplace wellbeing through the 7 Types of Rest Framework™ aimed at burnout prevention and work-life balance. As a busy physician, author, and mother, she helps high-achievers address work-rest imbalances and achieve a thriving lifestyle.
An international wellness expert, she has been featured in various media outlets Prevention, MSNBC, Women's Day, FOX, Fast Company, Psychology Today, INC, and TED.com. and authored the bestseller "Sacred Rest," which discusses the seven types of rest necessary for productivity and happiness. And today we will be diving into her latest book called Being Fully known which she Challenges Readers to Discover the Freedom of Authentic Emotional Rest, Being Fully Known invites readers on a transformative journey to silence self-doubt and the limiting beliefs that keep us stuck to embrace the fullness of our God-given identity.
If you consider yourself a high-achiever or a go-getter, this episode is for you.
Links to Dr.Saundra Dalton-Smith:
Restquiz.com
https://www.drdaltonsmith.com/
-Links-
https://www.svetkapopov.com/
https://www.instagram.com/svetka_popov/
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hey friends, welcome to the Ones who Dared podcast,
where stories of courage areelevated.
I'm your host, vekka, and everyother week you'll hear
interviews from inspiring people.
My hope is that you will leaveencouraged.
I'm so glad you're here.
Welcome to the On a Day Podcast.
(00:28):
This episode features Dr SondraDalton-Smith, who's a
board-certified internalmedicine physician and a
work-life integration researcher.
She founded Restorasis, whichpromotes workplace well-being
through the seven types of restframework aimed at burnout
prevention and work-life balance.
As a busy physician, author anda mother, she helps high
achievers address work, rest andbalances and achieve a thriving
(00:51):
lifestyle.
She's also an internationalwellness expert featured in
various media outlets, includingWoman's Day Prevention, fast
Company, psychology Today, inc.
And TEDcom.
Today we are going to be divinginto her latest book called
being Fully Known, whichchallenges the reader to
discover the freedom ofauthentic emotional rest.
(01:11):
You guys are going to love thisepisode, especially if you're
someone on the high achievingside and someone who identifies
as a doer.
Enjoy, dr Sandra Dalton-Smith.
Welcome to the One Third Airpodcast.
It's so great to have you back.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
It's great to be here with you.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
So the first time we had you on, we talked about
seven different types of restand you wrote a book on sacred
rest.
And so today we are going to betalking about your newest book,
called being Fully Known, and Iwould love to know about what
inspired you to write this bookand how does this book build on
your previous one.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Yeah, so in Sacred Rest I talk about seven
different types of rest physical, mental, spiritual, emotional,
social, sensory and creative.
Well, we have a quiz atrestquizcom and we have a whole
lot of research that showedquite a few people were
struggling with three of thosemore than the others, and those
three included spiritual,emotional and social.
(02:13):
And so I started really seeingthat in my own life as well,
that those were three areas thatkind of continuously kept
popping up in multiple differentways, kind of continuously kept
popping up in multipledifferent ways, and then, after
kind of seeing that researchcoincide with that, it just
opened me up to looking at whyis that?
You know, what's driving someof those continued issues that
(02:35):
we're having with emotional andsocial and spiritual rest, and
so that's what I wrote about inthis new book, being Fully Known
.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
And you're a perfect example of someone who has been
on the path of a physician.
So that's what you've beendoing your whole life and you
model your message really wellIn this book.
You show us about becoming, butalso that transition portion
which can be pretty painful, andso I'm curious to know on what
made you transition from being aphysician, being really
(03:03):
comfortable in your field, beingan expert in your field, to
taking that leap into theunknown and being a speaker and
author and doing all thewonderful things that you're
doing currently At the Once aYear podcast.
Giving back is part of ourmission, which is why we proudly
sponsor Midwest Food Bank.
Here's why Midwest Food BankPennsylvania distributes over
(03:23):
$25 million worth of food.
Now, that's amazing.
(03:47):
Join us in supporting thiscause To learn more or to give
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Speaker 2 (03:54):
Yeah, I can't say it was one of an easy choice, or
even one that I came alongsideGod with, you know, is one of
those situations where I reallyjust felt like I was being
prompted over and over and overagain that there's something
outside of what I've been doing.
(04:15):
However, it didn't seem logical.
I couldn't.
I couldn't put all the pieceslogically together in such a way
that I, that the plan, feltlike it was safe enough for me
to step out and do and I thinkthat's the hardest part of that.
I think, whenever you feel likeyou're being called or pulled to
something else that iscompletely different than what
(04:38):
you've always done, you don'thave a pattern or a framework
for it.
There doesn't appear to be amap.
Have a pattern or a frameworkfor it.
If there doesn't appear to be amap, you just feel like I know
I'm supposed to be doingsomething else.
It's you're out on the deep endand I feel like that's that's
the hardest part of it isgetting over this, this need to
feel like overly secure andstable and have all the answers
(05:01):
to a place of just surrenderingto the process, doing it messy,
getting outside of your logicand reasoning and just going
with the flow, for how your lifeis kind of taking you along,
and it's been.
It's been an amazing, justbeautiful journey with lots of
ups and downs, lots ofchallenges, you know, lots of
(05:25):
different learning lessons alongthe way, but it has been fun
and I and I think that's thepart that most of us are needing
in our life.
We're needing the joyfulsatisfaction of living.
We're playing too safe and thenwe're wondering why we're not
satisfied.
We're like why am I notenjoying my life?
You know, some of the funnestrides are the ones that give you
(05:47):
a little bit of a surprise inbetween.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
We have to be willing to let ourselves get to that
place.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
Yeah, I mean, we're always evolving, right.
As humans, we're multifaceted,multi-talented, which you also
touched in this book, andsometimes, though, the people
around us are so used to and socomfortable with us being the
way that they've always known usto be, and when we evolve and
become different from whatthey're used to seeing us, we
are faced with certainresistance, and you talk about
the different attacks that weface.
Can you go into some of theattacks and some of the
resistance that we face when wemay choose to take on a
(06:29):
different career path or maybeevolve into something different?
Speaker 2 (06:34):
Yeah, I call it friendly fire because usually
the people you love, the peopleyou think are going to support
you, and then they start sayingthis stuff and you're like you
start questioning.
You start questioning whetheror not you should do things.
You know, one of them is theloss attack and oftentimes this
attack tends to come as you knowit comes.
(06:55):
It comes out sometimes a littlebit harsher than they think it
is.
I did this with my friend iswhat I share about in the book.
She, she felt like she wassupposed to go across the world
to do something and I'm likethat's a horrible idea.
You know who told you youshould do that?
That's crazy and you know itwasn't that it was a horrible
(07:15):
idea.
It's just I didn't want to losemy friend.
We had lunch every week.
You know I was going to losesomething with her move.
And I think a lot of us have totake a real hard look at when
someone comes out againstsomething that we so desire to
do.
What?
What could be an ulteriormotive?
Not that they're trying to bemalicious or mean, but what
(07:35):
could be at the heart behind whythey don't want this to happen?
Another can be a safety attack.
Maybe they are so safe and soafraid of risk, but you're not.
You have a level of boldnessthey haven't developed yet, and
so it's their lack of risktaking that they're kind of
putting on you and they'remaking it sound like this is so
(07:56):
risky and this is something youshould be scared of because of
your safety.
But it's really a fear.
Is what they're having?
A fear rather than a truesafety issue?
Sometimes it's a control.
You know, sometimes people wantto be able to hold on to things
and control the circumstances,even if that means controlling
(08:18):
you, because you are a part oftheir circumstances, and so it
just requires us to not getangry and offended right off
hand, because that's usuallywhat happens.
Relationships get divided,people get mad at each other you
didn't support me when I triedall the stuff and we just have
to realize that there'ssomething at the heart of that
(08:39):
that's really driving thosedecisions.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
Yeah, I've heard it said before too that they're
almost agreed.
They are in that season oftransition, grieving the person
that you once were, and so howdo we respond to that?
Or what is a healthy way toprocess that with the loved one
who say you know you are,they're seeing you grow in ways
they haven't seen you growbefore, they're seeing you jump
(09:03):
into new ventures and take risksand they're just not really
comfortable and there's thatfear that comes up.
What is a healthy way to handlethat?
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Yeah, I think you have to shine light on it.
I think we have to not tiptoearound it and call a thing a
thing, just kind of go directlyin and discuss it.
So if I'm chatting with, thatis kind of like.
My friend in the book shared anexample of that she just kind
of like came right in and waslike hey, you know, I know this
(09:33):
is going to change everythingand I think sometimes we have to
be able to and willing to saythat and give what reassurances
we can.
So, for like in that situation,I know this is going to change
things.
We're not going to be able tohave dinner, you know, together
and, you know, laugh till we cryon each other's clothes, that
kind of thing anymore, becauseI'm not going to be here and
(09:54):
you're going to be there and allof that.
But hey, we can still gettogether on zoom and have a meal
together and you know you stillcan WhatsApp me whenever you
want.
You know what I mean.
Just reaffirm that you're notlosing me.
Things are changing but I'mstill here.
It's still me underneath.
(10:15):
Whatever changes are happening,it's still me and I'm still for
you.
I'm still here with you.
I still love you, care for you,whatever the dynamics of the
relationship may happen to be,because that's what we need.
That's really what the person'strying to get at.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Yeah, and I think it's really interesting because,
like you said, it's the peoplethat are the closest to us, the
ones that you think have thebest interest in mind for you,
right, and when they start tofeel those things, it it almost
has us losing confidence in me.
Are we taking the right path?
Am I crazy?
Or is this the right way to goabout it?
(10:52):
And so it's just.
It's an interesting transitionof pivot, and I'm curious too
how was that for you?
Did you experience some of thatwith your friends and loved
ones when you were transitioningfrom being a physician and just
being an expert at what you doto going into something
completely different?
Speaker 2 (11:09):
Yeah, I absolutely did.
I had a family member, I'll putit that way.
I had a family member who who,when I shared really what I felt
like was on my heart and what Ienvisioned that at that time
just really, really kind ofbluntly, was like oh, I don't
(11:31):
think that's what you heard.
I think you heard this becausethat, no, that that's you know,
that's kind of pie in the sky,that's too much to dream about,
that's kind of mindset and andit hurt because this is someone
who I'd watched do some amazingthings and it was as if to me I
perceived it as, oh, they don'tthink I'm good enough, they
(11:53):
don't think I'm able to do it,they don't think I have what it
takes.
I initially started kind oftaking it in all wrong and it
was years of kind of processing,which is how I can recognize
some of the friendly fire now.
Years of kind of processing toget to the point with that, they
didn't want me to get hurt,they feared that I would be
(12:14):
disappointed if I didn't getthere and I've lived through so
much disappointment in my lifeand when I was able to kind of
get to a level of conversationwith this person to see that was
at the root of it.
It's like you've lived throughso much trauma and drama.
I didn't want your hopes to gettoo high and get crashed,
crushed again.
There's a whole day.
(12:35):
I went from being mad, angryand hurt by this person to
seeing that they were trying tolove me the best way they knew
how that they were trying tolove me the best way they knew
how.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Yeah, yeah, and sometimes we may take that the
wrong way, like our perceptionof what we think they're saying
and also what they're saying,what they actually mean in what
they're saying, which also leadsme to the spin cycle, because
in that you mentioned how youhad this belief that when
something good happens to me,something negative follows, and
I think that's a belief that alot of us carry to some degree,
(13:09):
right when we have thatthrilling experience or when
we're hit, that peak ofsomething that we're trying to
work towards or achieve, andthen, right after that, there's,
you know, you get sick, orsomething happens to your kid or
whatever, whatever.
And so can you speak into.
How do we dismantle some ofthose toxic subconscious beliefs
(13:33):
that we carry?
Because this is what stops usfrom fully being known and fully
becoming of who we're made tobe.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Yeah, we start self-sabotaging ourselves.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
Yes, and we all do it Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
And you know how do we get past that.
It really is kind ofconfronting it and confronting
it head on.
You have to recognize it first,because it's hard to break a
cycle you don't even know you'rein People just keep going
around that mountain and youdon't even know you're going
around the same mountain.
But when you recognize it, youhave to then confront it.
(14:09):
And where did the root of itcome from?
Because it had to startsomewhere.
You don't just end up in acycle.
Something starts the cycle, andso I had to go all the way back
to when did I start believingthis?
What pattern or what was theinitial thing where I thought
this is the truth?
And then, what is the?
(14:30):
What is the real truth?
You know, what is what is thetruth that I can either frame
through God's word or framethrough through looking at it
outside of my life, looking atsomeone else's life, not just
taking my own personalexperience, but looking at it in
(14:53):
other ways, to be able to cometo a determination of okay, this
is just a mindset that I'vewrapped myself up in, what's a
different way of thinking?
And then start living out ofthat different way of thinking.
Because, for myself, I, as longas I can remember.
Because, for myself, I, as longas I can remember, every time
something good happened to me, Iwas just waiting.
I was waiting for the othershoe to drop, and it's like I
was.
It was like negativeanticipation and expectation,
(15:18):
and so I was not satisfiedalmost until I saw it, because
then I thought, now it's over, Ican move on to the next thing.
And if you think about howwarped that is, you will almost
get into a situation where youmake the negative happen just
because you're like, well, it'sgot to happen, yeah, it's got to
happen.
For me to be able to go to that, whatever the next thing is,
(15:42):
rather than being able to seethat things are individualized,
they don't have to be in a cycle, they can actually be linear
and can go along a path, and orthey can accelerate and actually
get better and better.
You don't have to, you don'thave to always be spiraling.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, and what are some tips that you have for
someone who maybe feel stuck andthey are in that spiral cycle?
Speaker 2 (16:05):
For myself.
It's the reason why eachchapter we use, we put like some
specific scriptures for eachchapter.
You know, I really believe whatit says, that the word of God
is a two edged sword and it cutsbetween spirit and soul.
And I feel like sometimes thatwas what is what has to happen.
We have to have a completereframing of our thinking
(16:26):
process so that we are thinkingfrom an elevated place, we are
thinking with the mind of Christ, we are able to be to kind of
view it in a completelydifferent way.
So I love if there's a cyclethat I'm spinning around in
having something very specificthat I am saying.
That is the opposite of that.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Yeah, and some of us too.
We have a lot of trauma that wehave brought from our childhood
which that's something, too,you address in the book that
there's certain frameworks thatwe bring to the table that
aren't sabotaging to our usbeing able to be fully known,
fully seen and just becoming ofwho we are meant to be.
And if we don't deal with someof those traumas, then we can't
(17:12):
get to the place of being thepeople that we're created to be.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Yeah, and I think too for myself too.
I've often thought that I hadto get to the place where it's
like I people say things likeI'm beyond my trauma, I've
gotten beyond my trauma, mytrauma is a part of me.
I don't get like it doesn't gofive feet behind me or five
(17:36):
steps in front of me.
It is like a part of me.
I lived it.
It is a part of me, but it doesnot have to dominate me.
And so I think we have to getto a place where we understand
the trauma does have some levelsof shaping of us.
It becomes a part of us, andit's the reason why on the cover
of the book we actually put theolives because, I share about
(18:02):
how, when we are, when olive oilis made, if you take the pit
out, the part that's hardened inthe middle out, and you crush
it, you get an oil that is justnot as flavorful.
It's not as it's not ascolorful, it doesn't have the
fullness of what we expect witholive oil.
And our lives are no differentwith olive oil.
(18:24):
And our lives are no differentIf we take the traumas
completely out, the traumas, thedramas, all the stuff we live
throughout, we get an expressionthat is not as flavorful and
colorful and full as it could be.
So, rather than trying to get toa, to try to get to an
unrealistic place where the trynever think about the trauma it
doesn't, you know, it's as if itnever happened where I never
think about the trauma, itdoesn't you know, it's as if it
(18:44):
never happened.
It doesn't really exist.
It happened, it changed thingsin me, it shaped part of who I
am, and now let it all getcrushed and release something
beautiful that somebody else canbenefit from.
Let it all get crushed andrelease something flavorful that
doesn't fit in but belongs inthe spaces where it's at,
(19:04):
because it brings a uniqueexpression of God's heart, of
his nature, of his healing, ofhis presence, all of those
things that we get to carry withus.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
That's so beautiful.
Yeah, and healing is about alsoreframing.
Right, we reframe theexperiences that happen to us,
that take us from perhaps beinga victim of how we once saw the
situation to seeing itdifferently, and yet the memory
is not erased.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Yes, yes, because I don't care who you are or how
healed you've been.
There are moments when you willfeel something.
You will have some type oftrigger.
I've seen it so many timespeople who are like, oh, I don't
, I don't think about thatanymore, and sometimes something
(19:48):
will hit your heart and triggerthe emotion that was related to
that If you've really beenthrough any type of trauma and
will trigger that and you startfeeling I'm not healed.
You are healed, but it's stillin you and sometimes something
like lights, a fire to it andyou have to put the fire back
out again.
Doesn't mean you started backat ground zero, but it.
(20:11):
It's in you, and so we have tobe able to allow ourselves to be
in process all the time, notfeeling like, oh, I arrived and
now, if anything happens, I didnarrive.
It's, you're in process.
Work, all the work in process.
It all has levels of healing,levels of levels of release,
(20:32):
levels of exploration with God,and we got to be okay with that.
That we don't.
We can't just check the boxtrauma checked and move on that.
There is an ongoing process.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Yeah, I mean, one of the things that I love about
your work is you studied humanbehavior, you studied so many
different patterns and you'veworked in corporate and ministry
and you're not really someonewho's boxed into anything and I
think you also address thatsomewhere in my research.
And I'm the same way where it'slike you know, don't box me in,
I don't belong here or there.
(21:06):
We are such multifaceted,multi-talented human beings that
we're not intended to be injust one specific area and I
think sometimes when we aregrowing or on our journey, we
feel like this is it, or otherpeople put us in these boxes and
to evolve out of that is hardwork.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Yeah, those boxes, I tell you, that's, that's the
issue.
That's the issue.
We like our boxes.
That's the problem.
You know, I liked my box ofbeing a physician because I knew
what I was doing there.
It was highly predictable, itwas extremely safe, it felt
comfortable to me, it felt known.
(21:52):
I felt known, I felt seen inthat role, I felt appreciated in
that role.
So it had all the fixings of atrap, is what it was.
It had all the fixings of atrap and I feel like that's what
happens to a lot of us.
We have certain roles that whenwe get into them they started
(22:12):
off as a blessing but then weallowed them to become a trap
where we stayed there because itjust feels so right and we stop
looking, we stop exploring withGod, we stop asking questions
of his spirit, we stop eventrying to see is there anything
else?
You know, do I like doinganything else?
Are there other parts of methat I want to explore?
(22:34):
Are there other things I'd liketo learn?
We stop even asking thosequestions of ourselves and
unfortunately, a lot of us don'tstart asking those questions
again until we're like in our50s and 60s, you know, when you
get to the place where all thekids are gone and you're home
alone and you you got a lot oftime on your hand, or you're
retired and you're like now what?
(22:55):
And it's a shame because wecould have been asking those
very same questions when we were20 and 30 and 40, and exploring
all along so so that we get toreally be the fullest version of
ourselves and enjoy all thedifferent facets of the way God
put us together.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Yeah, and it's also, in a sense, we get to a point
that we're so good at somethingand so comfortable that we're no
longer growing, and that's whenwe become stagnant.
In some ways, we becomedissatisfied, but it's also the
comfort zone, so it's like tomove from there to there is
really stretching.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
It is that the whole process of becoming has tension
to it.
It's an uncomfortable tension,uncertainty, and I feel like
that's why a lot of us resist it.
We don't like uncertainty.
It's a level of continuousstress and we hear the word
(23:52):
stress and we think stress bad.
Stress actually is good incertain situations.
Growth only comes throughstress.
Stress simply means change, andso we have to kind of almost
like change our mindset aroundthe unknown and uncertainty.
(24:14):
The unknown and uncertaintyBecause I mean, if you look at
the Bible and scripture, everyperson that we celebrate in the
Bible had to go through a greatunknown.
Every one of them had to gothrough a great unknown, and so
they had to deal with thistension of becoming.
So it's kind of strange that weseem to think we don't have to
(24:43):
because it's a part of thegrowth process with God.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Yeah, absolutely, I love that so much.
And when we are in the processof growth, a lot of times we
will have negative self-talk.
And so what are some advice youcan give us to overcome some of
that negative self-talk andjust some of the thoughts that
we all battle with from time totime?
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Yeah, the negative self-talk.
There's a lot of reframing thathas to do as far as what we say
to ourselves.
I sometimes will think tomyself when I say this to
anybody else, like anybody not afriend, a foe, anybody Some of
the things we say to ourselveswe literally would not say to
(25:26):
anybody, not even someone wedon't like, because it's so rude
.
Yeah, but we would say it toourselves.
And so when I say something tomyself that I then check myself
and like I wouldn't say this tomy worst enemy, why am I saying
it to myself?
And then I often then have toeven take a step back further.
What, what makes me think Ideserve to hear that?
(25:48):
Wow, because sometimes that'sthe issue.
It's like I'm not, I'm not evenhonoring some part of myself,
that I feel like I deserve to bebelittled or I deserve to be
put down or I deserve to bewhatever.
You know, whatever it is thatyou're saying to yourself.
And so I think we have toconstantly stay in in
(26:11):
conversation and processing isthat's the emotional rest part
of the book.
Conversation and processing isthe that's the emotional rest
part of the book.
That's why every chapter endswith these like daily unveiling
questions, because we have to.
We have to start askingourselves why we're doing stuff.
What's behind this?
What am I really saying tomyself when I do this or I say
(26:32):
this, or I think that?
Speaker 1 (26:35):
I love that.
Do I deserve to be told this?
And that's such an interestingway to reframe that.
The other thing that I lovethat you touched on this book
and I think we all struggle withthis as well is the difference
between being and doing.
I know that you're an achiever,you know and you love to do
things, and I fall in the sameboat where if I'm not
(26:57):
accomplishing things, if I'm notdoing stuff, I just feel less
than to some degree Right, andit's almost like I don't feel
productive, I don't feel likeI'm contributing and all of that
.
But you really touch on thedifference, too, between doing
and being, and so, yeah, tell usmore about that.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Yeah, I'm a Martha.
All day, every day, that is mylet's get it done.
So, yes, that that is my mindsetas well.
So the thing with doing andbeing is that doing keeps your
identity wrapped up in theperformance being what your
identity, your identity just is,being what your identity, your
(27:40):
identity just is.
It doesn't matter anything else.
No, no productivity attached toit, no outcomes attached to it.
And in a society and a culturefor outcomes and productivity
and metrics are like how wejudge everything, to say I, I am
going to change to kind of takemyself out of that way of
thinking to the point where myidentity does not require
metrics, outcomes or performance.
(28:01):
It just simply is, iscompletely countercultural and
completely freeing, and it givesyou the ability to then take
some courageous steps and docertain things that you, that
doers, may not do because theyare, they are wrapping the doing
and even if they begin in themindset of what is the outcome,
(28:23):
the productivity, the end resultgoing to be where someone who
is being would just step into itbecause that, because they're
not attached to that.
I'll give an example I do awhole lot of work with writers
and speakers.
That's where I do mentoring andcoaching, and so I'll have
someone say I feel like, I feellike I'm supposed to write a
(28:44):
book or start a ministry or dowhatever it is that they're that
they feel led to.
A doer would then rationalizehow many copies are going to get
sold?
How many speaking engagementsam I going to get?
They're going straight to themetrics.
How many followers do I have onsocial media?
Is my platform big enough?
All the stuff Someone who'sbeing that identity, being what
(29:08):
they feel like they've beenspoken into says.
You know what the success is?
Just that I'm being who I feellike I'm called to be.
I'm supposed to be someonewho's writing and communicating
and sharing truth.
So whether one person or ahundred people read it or buy it
or engage with it doesn't makea difference, because I'm going
(29:30):
to just be who I am.
And who I am is a writer.
Who I am is a speaker.
Who I am is someone who is freeto share truth with other
people.
Who I am is someone who enjoyslaughter.
So I'm going to share laughterand they're just being who they
are and letting the expressionof that have its joy without
worrying about what metricsfollow or come with it.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Yeah, that's so good, but the pressures are real in
our culture, right?
I mean we're all right.
I mean we're all pressured to.
I mean I'm working on a bookright now and it's like the
platform the platform, theplatform, and that is very
opposite of being right, becausebeing is resting in your
message.
It's, it's doing the deep workversus to.
I have to build this because X,y and Z and if I don't build
(30:15):
this, then this is going to lookdifferent and all this stuff.
So and that's just one exampleright Of an author, just with
the platform thing but we allhave different pressures and so
our culture is so focused aboutresults and the hustle culture
where it's like get things doneand I love being productive.
I'm not saying that just sitthere and do nothing.
(30:36):
But how do we learn in ourculture to be more than produce
and, you know, essentially bejust producers?
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Yeah, it's a continuous act of surrender is
what I'm finding, because, youknow, if you sit down with I've
now had the opportunity to sitwith so many different people,
with so many from so manydifferent levels within their,
their ministry or their work, asfar as success, so to speak, as
the world calls it.
(31:07):
And when you sit down withpeople, one of the things that I
find consistently with peoplewho had had something happen and
it's like, wow, how did thishappen?
How did all of a sudden,everybody wanted to purchase
your book or your album orwhatever it is that they had
Most of those people will tellyou I don't know, it's like all
(31:31):
of a sudden, bam, it's like outof nowhere, this thing just
happened.
And I'm just here on the rideand I'm just trying to keep up
with the ride.
They may have had some, someplans and specifics, but they
didn't necessarily, theycouldn't orchestrate it exactly.
The way it all came together andI think the beauty of that
process is is that our culturetries to control the process to
(31:55):
get certain outcomes and it canproduce certain outcomes, but
when it produces it, then it hasto maintain it and a lot of
work and energy and stress andnegative stress and pressure
that goes into the maintainingof it, because all of it came
from human effort and humanstrength, whereas when we see
(32:16):
someone who kind of went alongwith how you know, you thought
this was going to be it, but itwas actually.
This is the thing God raised upand decided to use more than the
other thing.
They don't have to uphold it.
God himself upholds it and it'sand there's a and, even though
there's a pressure could attachto the success, it's not the
(32:38):
same pressure.
It's a pressure to stay yieldedto his process and to not put
their hands on it and try tograb control back.
And so I think we we have tokind of choose.
Do we want to have to upholdall of it ourselves in the
productivity, or do we want tolet grace uphold it and our, our
work be the work of surrender?
Speaker 1 (33:01):
That's good, yeah, I mean.
And then you get emotionalburnout right from trying to
uphold the standards that youcreated, that weren't authentic
to yourself to begin with.
You were just going along withwhat was required or expected,
so to speak.
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Yeah, especially.
You know you mentioned likewith platform.
I can't tell you how manyauthors I've spoken to who are
like well, they tell me I haveto post on social media 10 times
a day, or whatever it is.
The new statistic is, and I gotto do so many reels and so many
this and I hate it.
And it's like then why are youdoing it?
Like, what kind of life is that?
Who signs up for that life?
(33:38):
Is that success worth it?
Because it's the selling of thesoul, so to speak.
Everything in you is tellingyou you don't want to do that,
which means you're shutting downwhat you really want to do, and
so you have to make a choice inwhat is actually of value most
to me, and then be willing torelease what needs to be
(34:01):
released and grab hold of whatneeds to be grabbed hold to.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Yeah, that's beautiful.
What is the connection betweenrest and being able to live
authentically?
When we are in the state ofrest that sometimes the most
creative and incredible ideascome to life right when we're on
vacation or when we are in aplace that allows for us to just
(34:25):
get rid of all the noise, allthe distractions, and we come
into that state of rest that nowthere's something that's coming
out that we wouldn't have hadhad we tried to be so productive
in the process.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
Yeah, I think rest definitely opens us up to
creativity, and I feel like abig part of that is because most
of the types of rest that thatI call creative rest, the types
of rest that that inspire us ormotivate us to and bring forth
innovation and creativity A lotof those have to do with nature
(35:01):
and things that have to do withstuff that's already been
created.
So when we're looking at thosethings, when we're experiencing
creative rest, we're beholdingGod in many ways.
We're seeing aspects of hischaracter, aspect of his
greatness, of his goodness, andanytime you are beholding him,
it is going to unlock somethinginside of you because beholding
(35:23):
him acts like a mirror.
It reflects back to us thingsthat we then can see of
ourselves, which then calls usout into the becoming, not to
become more of something, butwe're becoming more aware of
what's inside of us becausewe're beholding who we're made
in the image of, and so it'skind of this reciprocal process
(35:45):
you behold, you become, youbehold, you become, and then,
wherever you happen to be, youcan step into those spaces,
recognizing you are bringingsomething into that situation
that belongs there.
It may not fit in, becausefitting in is its own level of
stress, but it has a place ofbelonging there.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
It is bringing some element of what you beheld into
that space, because that'sneeded in the place where you
happen to be, and so we kind ofthis, this ongoing process,
(36:32):
where you see the flow of thesethree working together and you
can see how resting particularlyrest as it relates to
creativity, your work and youcontinue to show us what it's
really like to walk the walkinto.
Essentially, you're doing whatyou preach right, and so that's
so beautiful, and what are somethings that is currently
lighting your fire?
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Yeah, what's currently lighting my fire.
The number one thing right nowthat's lighting my fire is just
seeing people take steps of boldsteps of courage into the
unknown, with God just steppingout, trying it.
I say risking, risking whateveris required to risk and
(37:11):
oftentimes the risk is the riskof failure, as we put it but
allowing themselves to just findjoy in the doing and in this.
Taking the action step I shouldsay the doing of whatever he
told you and I think that rightnow is giving me the most joy is
just seeing people kind of becourageous and be who God says
(37:32):
they are.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
Yeah, it's so beautiful to be who you're meant
to be, essentially not thepressures of the world, because
there's so much.
There's so much pressure in ourculture to hold a certain
standard or be a certain way.
And you know, when you look atall the different artists and
people who have created some ofthe most pioneering things or
(37:55):
pivoting work, it was them beingfully authentic to who they are
.
It wasn't them trying to, youknow, create something based on
other people's expectations.
I mean even the book the Shack,which you've probably heard of,
right.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
That story is incredible.
I mean, the guy just wrote aletter to his family, you know,
and that was the work he did andhe completed in six months.
He never had any intentions ofselling it.
It became, and it was rejectedto by publishers, and then it
became a bestseller just throughword of mouth and became a
movie, and many lives have beenchanged because of it.
(38:32):
But the author never intendedit to be this productive thing
that sells X, y amount of copiesor whatever, and so I think
that's something that we canlearn too, from just being fully
in tune with our creator and intune with who we're supposed to
be, and I love that your bookreally sheds light to that.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Well, I appreciate that.
Yeah, it's fun.
I always say I am a bit of areluctant writer because I
prefer to speak overwrite,because English is not my thing.
I'm more of a sciencebackground text with God,
(39:15):
because in the writing of it youlearn so much about him and you
and just his word and how heput things together and how, how
putting words together work,words that can be very common,
that you hear every day.
Putting them together in a veryspecific way can have a
completely different effect, andto me that it's.
(39:37):
It's just.
It just shows kind of just whatour lives look like.
You know, there's all theselives, there's all these people,
there's all these words, butGod brings.
There's all these experiences,but God brings them all together
into these unique sentences.
And when I look at someone Ioftentimes think God, what is?
That person is a uniquesentence in your story.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
Yeah it's so beautiful.
What do that person is a uniquesentence in your story.
Yeah, it's so beautiful.
What do you hope that peoplewill get?
Speaker 2 (40:04):
out of your book being fully known.
What will they get out of it?
Jesus.
That's what I hope they get outof it.
If I simplified it, I hope theyget Jesus out of it.
I hope they read.
I hope they read through thetext, the stories, they read
through the scriptures and theygo through the questions and, on
(40:25):
the other side of it, that theystart seeing, they start
beholding Jesus in everythingthey see and from there they
start becoming more like him.
Speaker 1 (40:35):
And as a writer, as you were taking time to write
this book, how would you saythat this book has shaped you
from some of the other work thatyou've done?
Speaker 2 (40:45):
I would say this, this I've never thought of
writing a memoir, necessarily,or a book.
That's kind of a retelling ofmy own story.
I would probably say this bookis the closest thing to that of
me telling my own story andjourney.
So, and it's a journey inprocess, don't get me wrong, I
(41:06):
have not arrived at any of theword, but but it's a journey I'm
in process with God, with, andso I would say that's probably
how it's shaped me.
It's helped me to sit down withthe process, celebrate things I
didn't celebrate when I shouldhave.
Now that I look back on it, I'mlike you know what I should
have celebrated, that I calledit a failure but it actually was
(41:30):
a success.
Or I beat myself up over thatwhen I actually should have gave
myself grace, and so I thinkthat's what I've been
experiencing as I wrote thisparticular book.
Speaker 1 (41:42):
What are some books that you're excited about
currently or in your readingstack?
Speaker 2 (41:48):
You know what?
I've been so busy?
I don't have a reading stackright now other than the Bible.
My reading stack is very slim.
Right this very moment there'sa couple of books that I have
been talking with my husbandabout because he right now is
the avid reader in our familyand he has a to be read list the
(42:09):
size of Texas, but I could nottell you what's on it.
I told him to give me untilApril and we will take a look at
it and we will take a look atit.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Such is life, right I mean.
Sometimes it's just you have todo what you can in your
capacity and, as you know,someone who studied rest and you
tend to operate in what youpreach about right and so yeah,
I took them all off my tube.
Speaker 2 (42:32):
I was like I need I.
Right now I have to keep onesingle focus.
Speaker 1 (42:36):
Yeah, Well, is there, Dr Sondra?
Is there anything that Ihaven't asked you or anything
else you'd love to share withthe listener?
Speaker 2 (42:46):
You know.
Nothing specifically comes tomind.
I just, would you know,encourage people.
If the book is set up in such away that if you're someone who
enjoys doing I shouldn't sayenjoy, but who does fasting it's
set up in a way to be able touse it as a 21 day fast it has
21 chapters to be able to walkthrough it at a pace.
However, some people like to doit with it within groups and so
(43:09):
we actually do have some videosthat go with the book, that go
five videos that go over some ofthe key chapters and key parts
and sections of the book, sothat you can work through it as
a group and do it for six weeksor seven weeks or however many
weeks you decide, so that youcan actually have others to
converse with it.
Because I think it's helpfulsometimes to be able to discuss
(43:31):
some of these life experiences,because they are so common
between so many of us and havingopportunities to be able to
share with a small group or witha friend and be able to talk
about some of those unveilingquestions as you process through
them.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
Yeah, I do love how you included that at the end of
each chapter you have a guide,you have some scripture, you
also have questions, so it'sreally allowing you to work
through each chapter.
And having a book club that'show you grow, especially with a
book like this.
That really has you reflectdeeper upon who you are and who
you're becoming and things thatyou could be working on.
(44:06):
And if you're in a book club ona book like this, it's like a
mastermind guide.
So I highly encourage you toget Dr Sandra's book called
being fully known and it's a gem.
There's so much in there thatwill benefit you as you grow and
evolve.
And, yeah, I just really havebeen enjoying reading through
your manuscript.
(44:26):
Oh thank you so much, and also Ilove to end the podcast with
asking what is an advice thatyou'd love to pass on to the
listener.
It could be anything.
It could be related orunrelated to the book.
Speaker 2 (44:41):
The thing that initially came to mind I had
experienced this weekend.
We had a women's event and itwas an unusual women's event.
The theme was joy and we werehaving dancing and praise and
all the things.
And I saw a young woman wholooked literally like I did when
I was her age and she was soafraid and she would not come
forward like everybody else islike praising and dancing and
(45:04):
doing all of the things, havingfun, doing all the games and she
was just kind of in the cornerjust looking and smiling and I
and I that I would leave youwith this thought, this thought
when is it?
When are you going to comeoutside of the box?
(45:25):
What has to happen for you toget to the place where your joy
is more important than theirwords?
Because that's what I wishsomeone had told me many years
ago.
Speaker 1 (45:34):
Wow, that's deep, yeah, I mean, for some of us
that takes like a midlife crisis, right, Something to happen
like a heart attack, just thingsthat really are really, really
difficult for us to really say.
Hey, you know what I'm going tostart becoming who I'm made to
be and you start to find thediscontentment within yourself
where before it's just the.
(45:55):
You're on this wheel and you'rejust going with emotions and
it's like you're living butyou're not.
You're half dead.
In a sense, your body's alivebut your mind is not.
Well, thank you so much, DrSandra, for coming on the
podcast.
It's been an honor talking toyou and I'm sure that the
listener is going to be reallyinspired by our conversation and
(46:17):
all the gems and tips that youhave to offer.
And again, go get this bookwhere books are sold, called
being Fully Known by Dr SandraDalton-Smith.
Thank you for listening to theOnce we Dare podcast.
It is an honor to share theseencouraging stories with you.
If you enjoy the show, I wouldlove for you to tell your
friends, leave us a reviewerrating and subscribe to wherever
you listen to podcasts, becausethis helps others discover the
(46:40):
show.
You can find me on my website,speckhopawcom.
Hey friends, welcome to the Ones who Dared podcast,
where stories of courage areelevated.
I'm your host, vekka, and everyother week you'll hear
interviews from inspiring people.
My hope is that you will leaveencouraged.
I'm so glad you're here.
Welcome to the On a Day Podcast.
(00:28):
This episode features Dr SondraDalton-Smith, who's a
board-certified internalmedicine physician and a
work-life integration researcher.
She founded Restorasis, whichpromotes workplace well-being
through the seven types of restframework aimed at burnout
prevention and work-life balance.
As a busy physician, author anda mother, she helps high
achievers address work, rest andbalances and achieve a thriving
(00:51):
lifestyle.
She's also an internationalwellness expert featured in
various media outlets, includingWoman's Day Prevention, fast
Company, psychology Today, inc.
And TEDcom.
Today we are going to be divinginto her latest book called
being Fully Known, whichchallenges the reader to
discover the freedom ofauthentic emotional rest.
(01:11):
You guys are going to love thisepisode, especially if you're
someone on the high achievingside and someone who identifies
as a doer.
Enjoy, dr Sandra Dalton-Smith.
Welcome to the One Third Airpodcast.
It's so great to have you back.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
It's great to be here with you.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
So the first time we had you on, we talked about
seven different types of restand you wrote a book on sacred
rest.
And so today we are going to betalking about your newest book,
called being Fully Known, and Iwould love to know about what
inspired you to write this bookand how does this book build on
your previous one.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Yeah, so in Sacred Rest I talk about seven
different types of rest physical, mental, spiritual, emotional,
social, sensory and creative.
Well, we have a quiz atrestquizcom and we have a whole
lot of research that showedquite a few people were
struggling with three of thosemore than the others, and those
three included spiritual,emotional and social.
(02:13):
And so I started really seeingthat in my own life as well,
that those were three areas thatkind of continuously kept
popping up in multiple differentways, kind of continuously kept
popping up in multipledifferent ways, and then, after
kind of seeing that researchcoincide with that, it just
opened me up to looking at whyis that?
You know, what's driving someof those continued issues that
(02:35):
we're having with emotional andsocial and spiritual rest, and
so that's what I wrote about inthis new book, being Fully Known
.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
And you're a perfect example of someone who has been
on the path of a physician.
So that's what you've beendoing your whole life and you
model your message really wellIn this book.
You show us about becoming, butalso that transition portion
which can be pretty painful, andso I'm curious to know on what
made you transition from being aphysician, being really
(03:03):
comfortable in your field, beingan expert in your field, to
taking that leap into theunknown and being a speaker and
author and doing all thewonderful things that you're
doing currently At the Once aYear podcast.
Giving back is part of ourmission, which is why we proudly
sponsor Midwest Food Bank.
Here's why Midwest Food BankPennsylvania distributes over
(03:23):
$25 million worth of food.
Now, that's amazing.
(03:47):
Join us in supporting thiscause To learn more or to give
go to MidwestFoodBankorg slashPennsylvania.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Yeah, I can't say it was one of an easy choice, or
even one that I came alongsideGod with, you know, is one of
those situations where I reallyjust felt like I was being
prompted over and over and overagain that there's something
outside of what I've been doing.
(04:15):
However, it didn't seem logical.
I couldn't.
I couldn't put all the pieceslogically together in such a way
that I, that the plan, feltlike it was safe enough for me
to step out and do and I thinkthat's the hardest part of that.
I think, whenever you feel likeyou're being called or pulled to
something else that iscompletely different than what
(04:38):
you've always done, you don'thave a pattern or a framework
for it.
There doesn't appear to be amap.
Have a pattern or a frameworkfor it.
If there doesn't appear to be amap, you just feel like I know
I'm supposed to be doingsomething else.
It's you're out on the deep endand I feel like that's that's
the hardest part of it isgetting over this, this need to
feel like overly secure andstable and have all the answers
(05:01):
to a place of just surrenderingto the process, doing it messy,
getting outside of your logicand reasoning and just going
with the flow, for how your lifeis kind of taking you along,
and it's been.
It's been an amazing, justbeautiful journey with lots of
ups and downs, lots ofchallenges, you know, lots of
(05:25):
different learning lessons alongthe way, but it has been fun
and I and I think that's thepart that most of us are needing
in our life.
We're needing the joyfulsatisfaction of living.
We're playing too safe and thenwe're wondering why we're not
satisfied.
We're like why am I notenjoying my life?
You know, some of the funnestrides are the ones that give you
(05:47):
a little bit of a surprise inbetween.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
We have to be willing to let ourselves get to that
place.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
Yeah, I mean, we're always evolving, right.
As humans, we're multifaceted,multi-talented, which you also
touched in this book, andsometimes, though, the people
around us are so used to and socomfortable with us being the
way that they've always known usto be, and when we evolve and
become different from whatthey're used to seeing us, we
are faced with certainresistance, and you talk about
the different attacks that weface.
Can you go into some of theattacks and some of the
resistance that we face when wemay choose to take on a
(06:29):
different career path or maybeevolve into something different?
Speaker 2 (06:34):
Yeah, I call it friendly fire because usually
the people you love, the peopleyou think are going to support
you, and then they start sayingthis stuff and you're like you
start questioning.
You start questioning whetheror not you should do things.
You know, one of them is theloss attack and oftentimes this
attack tends to come as you knowit comes.
(06:55):
It comes out sometimes a littlebit harsher than they think it
is.
I did this with my friend iswhat I share about in the book.
She, she felt like she wassupposed to go across the world
to do something and I'm likethat's a horrible idea.
You know who told you youshould do that?
That's crazy and you know itwasn't that it was a horrible
(07:15):
idea.
It's just I didn't want to losemy friend.
We had lunch every week.
You know I was going to losesomething with her move.
And I think a lot of us have totake a real hard look at when
someone comes out againstsomething that we so desire to
do.
What?
What could be an ulteriormotive?
Not that they're trying to bemalicious or mean, but what
(07:35):
could be at the heart behind whythey don't want this to happen?
Another can be a safety attack.
Maybe they are so safe and soafraid of risk, but you're not.
You have a level of boldnessthey haven't developed yet, and
so it's their lack of risktaking that they're kind of
putting on you and they'remaking it sound like this is so
(07:56):
risky and this is something youshould be scared of because of
your safety.
But it's really a fear.
Is what they're having?
A fear rather than a truesafety issue?
Sometimes it's a control.
You know, sometimes people wantto be able to hold on to things
and control the circumstances,even if that means controlling
(08:18):
you, because you are a part oftheir circumstances, and so it
just requires us to not getangry and offended right off
hand, because that's usuallywhat happens.
Relationships get divided,people get mad at each other you
didn't support me when I triedall the stuff and we just have
to realize that there'ssomething at the heart of that
(08:39):
that's really driving thosedecisions.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
Yeah, I've heard it said before too that they're
almost agreed.
They are in that season oftransition, grieving the person
that you once were, and so howdo we respond to that?
Or what is a healthy way toprocess that with the loved one
who say you know you are,they're seeing you grow in ways
they haven't seen you growbefore, they're seeing you jump
(09:03):
into new ventures and take risksand they're just not really
comfortable and there's thatfear that comes up.
What is a healthy way to handlethat?
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Yeah, I think you have to shine light on it.
I think we have to not tiptoearound it and call a thing a
thing, just kind of go directlyin and discuss it.
So if I'm chatting with, thatis kind of like.
My friend in the book shared anexample of that she just kind
of like came right in and waslike hey, you know, I know this
(09:33):
is going to change everythingand I think sometimes we have to
be able to and willing to saythat and give what reassurances
we can.
So, for like in that situation,I know this is going to change
things.
We're not going to be able tohave dinner, you know, together
and, you know, laugh till we cryon each other's clothes, that
kind of thing anymore, becauseI'm not going to be here and
(09:54):
you're going to be there and allof that.
But hey, we can still gettogether on zoom and have a meal
together and you know you stillcan WhatsApp me whenever you
want.
You know what I mean.
Just reaffirm that you're notlosing me.
Things are changing but I'mstill here.
It's still me underneath.
(10:15):
Whatever changes are happening,it's still me and I'm still for
you.
I'm still here with you.
I still love you, care for you,whatever the dynamics of the
relationship may happen to be,because that's what we need.
That's really what the person'strying to get at.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Yeah, and I think it's really interesting because,
like you said, it's the peoplethat are the closest to us, the
ones that you think have thebest interest in mind for you,
right, and when they start tofeel those things, it it almost
has us losing confidence in me.
Are we taking the right path?
Am I crazy?
Or is this the right way to goabout it?
(10:52):
And so it's just.
It's an interesting transitionof pivot, and I'm curious too
how was that for you?
Did you experience some of thatwith your friends and loved
ones when you were transitioningfrom being a physician and just
being an expert at what you doto going into something
completely different?
Speaker 2 (11:09):
Yeah, I absolutely did.
I had a family member, I'll putit that way.
I had a family member who who,when I shared really what I felt
like was on my heart and what Ienvisioned that at that time
just really, really kind ofbluntly, was like oh, I don't
(11:31):
think that's what you heard.
I think you heard this becausethat, no, that that's you know,
that's kind of pie in the sky,that's too much to dream about,
that's kind of mindset and andit hurt because this is someone
who I'd watched do some amazingthings and it was as if to me I
perceived it as, oh, they don'tthink I'm good enough, they
(11:53):
don't think I'm able to do it,they don't think I have what it
takes.
I initially started kind oftaking it in all wrong and it
was years of kind of processing,which is how I can recognize
some of the friendly fire now.
Years of kind of processing toget to the point with that, they
didn't want me to get hurt,they feared that I would be
(12:14):
disappointed if I didn't getthere and I've lived through so
much disappointment in my lifeand when I was able to kind of
get to a level of conversationwith this person to see that was
at the root of it.
It's like you've lived throughso much trauma and drama.
I didn't want your hopes to gettoo high and get crashed,
crushed again.
There's a whole day.
(12:35):
I went from being mad, angryand hurt by this person to
seeing that they were trying tolove me the best way they knew
how that they were trying tolove me the best way they knew
how.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
Yeah, yeah, and sometimes we may take that the
wrong way, like our perceptionof what we think they're saying
and also what they're saying,what they actually mean in what
they're saying, which also leadsme to the spin cycle, because
in that you mentioned how youhad this belief that when
something good happens to me,something negative follows, and
I think that's a belief that alot of us carry to some degree,
(13:09):
right when we have thatthrilling experience or when
we're hit, that peak ofsomething that we're trying to
work towards or achieve, andthen, right after that, there's,
you know, you get sick, orsomething happens to your kid or
whatever, whatever.
And so can you speak into.
How do we dismantle some ofthose toxic subconscious beliefs
(13:33):
that we carry?
Because this is what stops usfrom fully being known and fully
becoming of who we're made tobe.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Yeah, we start self-sabotaging ourselves.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
Yes, and we all do it Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
And you know how do we get past that.
It really is kind ofconfronting it and confronting
it head on.
You have to recognize it first,because it's hard to break a
cycle you don't even know you'rein People just keep going
around that mountain and youdon't even know you're going
around the same mountain.
But when you recognize it, youhave to then confront it.
(14:09):
And where did the root of itcome from?
Because it had to startsomewhere.
You don't just end up in acycle.
Something starts the cycle, andso I had to go all the way back
to when did I start believingthis?
What pattern or what was theinitial thing where I thought
this is the truth?
And then, what is the?
(14:30):
What is the real truth?
You know, what is what is thetruth that I can either frame
through God's word or framethrough through looking at it
outside of my life, looking atsomeone else's life, not just
taking my own personalexperience, but looking at it in
(14:53):
other ways, to be able to cometo a determination of okay, this
is just a mindset that I'vewrapped myself up in, what's a
different way of thinking?
And then start living out ofthat different way of thinking.
Because, for myself, I, as longas I can remember.
Because, for myself, I, as longas I can remember, every time
something good happened to me, Iwas just waiting.
I was waiting for the othershoe to drop, and it's like I
was.
It was like negativeanticipation and expectation,
(15:18):
and so I was not satisfiedalmost until I saw it, because
then I thought, now it's over, Ican move on to the next thing.
And if you think about howwarped that is, you will almost
get into a situation where youmake the negative happen just
because you're like, well, it'sgot to happen, yeah, it's got to
happen.
For me to be able to go to that, whatever the next thing is,
(15:42):
rather than being able to seethat things are individualized,
they don't have to be in a cycle, they can actually be linear
and can go along a path, and orthey can accelerate and actually
get better and better.
You don't have to, you don'thave to always be spiraling.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, and what are some tips that you have for
someone who maybe feel stuck andthey are in that spiral cycle?
Speaker 2 (16:05):
For myself.
It's the reason why eachchapter we use, we put like some
specific scriptures for eachchapter.
You know, I really believe whatit says, that the word of God
is a two edged sword and it cutsbetween spirit and soul.
And I feel like sometimes thatwas what is what has to happen.
We have to have a completereframing of our thinking
(16:26):
process so that we are thinkingfrom an elevated place, we are
thinking with the mind of Christ, we are able to be to kind of
view it in a completelydifferent way.
So I love if there's a cyclethat I'm spinning around in
having something very specificthat I am saying.
That is the opposite of that.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Yeah, and some of us too.
We have a lot of trauma that wehave brought from our childhood
which that's something, too,you address in the book that
there's certain frameworks thatwe bring to the table that
aren't sabotaging to our usbeing able to be fully known,
fully seen and just becoming ofwho we are meant to be.
And if we don't deal with someof those traumas, then we can't
(17:12):
get to the place of being thepeople that we're created to be.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Yeah, and I think too for myself too.
I've often thought that I hadto get to the place where it's
like I people say things likeI'm beyond my trauma, I've
gotten beyond my trauma, mytrauma is a part of me.
I don't get like it doesn't gofive feet behind me or five
(17:36):
steps in front of me.
It is like a part of me.
I lived it.
It is a part of me, but it doesnot have to dominate me.
And so I think we have to getto a place where we understand
the trauma does have some levelsof shaping of us.
It becomes a part of us, andit's the reason why on the cover
of the book we actually put theolives because, I share about
(18:02):
how, when we are, when olive oilis made, if you take the pit
out, the part that's hardened inthe middle out, and you crush
it, you get an oil that is justnot as flavorful.
It's not as it's not ascolorful, it doesn't have the
fullness of what we expect witholive oil.
And our lives are no differentwith olive oil.
(18:24):
And our lives are no differentIf we take the traumas
completely out, the traumas, thedramas, all the stuff we live
throughout, we get an expressionthat is not as flavorful and
colorful and full as it could be.
So, rather than trying to get toa, to try to get to an
unrealistic place where the trynever think about the trauma it
doesn't, you know, it's as if itnever happened where I never
think about the trauma, itdoesn't you know, it's as if it
(18:44):
never happened.
It doesn't really exist.
It happened, it changed thingsin me, it shaped part of who I
am, and now let it all getcrushed and release something
beautiful that somebody else canbenefit from.
Let it all get crushed andrelease something flavorful that
doesn't fit in but belongs inthe spaces where it's at,
(19:04):
because it brings a uniqueexpression of God's heart, of
his nature, of his healing, ofhis presence, all of those
things that we get to carry withus.
Speaker 1 (19:13):
That's so beautiful.
Yeah, and healing is about alsoreframing.
Right, we reframe theexperiences that happen to us,
that take us from perhaps beinga victim of how we once saw the
situation to seeing itdifferently, and yet the memory
is not erased.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Yes, yes, because I don't care who you are or how
healed you've been.
There are moments when you willfeel something.
You will have some type oftrigger.
I've seen it so many timespeople who are like, oh, I don't
, I don't think about thatanymore, and sometimes something
(19:48):
will hit your heart and triggerthe emotion that was related to
that If you've really beenthrough any type of trauma and
will trigger that and you startfeeling I'm not healed.
You are healed, but it's stillin you and sometimes something
like lights, a fire to it andyou have to put the fire back
out again.
Doesn't mean you started backat ground zero, but it.
(20:11):
It's in you, and so we have tobe able to allow ourselves to be
in process all the time, notfeeling like, oh, I arrived and
now, if anything happens, I didnarrive.
It's, you're in process.
Work, all the work in process.
It all has levels of healing,levels of levels of release,
(20:32):
levels of exploration with God,and we got to be okay with that.
That we don't.
We can't just check the boxtrauma checked and move on that.
There is an ongoing process.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Yeah, I mean, one of the things that I love about
your work is you studied humanbehavior, you studied so many
different patterns and you'veworked in corporate and ministry
and you're not really someonewho's boxed into anything and I
think you also address thatsomewhere in my research.
And I'm the same way where it'slike you know, don't box me in,
I don't belong here or there.
(21:06):
We are such multifaceted,multi-talented human beings that
we're not intended to be injust one specific area and I
think sometimes when we aregrowing or on our journey, we
feel like this is it, or otherpeople put us in these boxes and
to evolve out of that is hardwork.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Yeah, those boxes, I tell you, that's, that's the
issue.
That's the issue.
We like our boxes.
That's the problem.
You know, I liked my box ofbeing a physician because I knew
what I was doing there.
It was highly predictable, itwas extremely safe, it felt
comfortable to me, it felt known.
(21:52):
I felt known, I felt seen inthat role, I felt appreciated in
that role.
So it had all the fixings of atrap, is what it was.
It had all the fixings of atrap and I feel like that's what
happens to a lot of us.
We have certain roles that whenwe get into them they started
(22:12):
off as a blessing but then weallowed them to become a trap
where we stayed there because itjust feels so right and we stop
looking, we stop exploring withGod, we stop asking questions
of his spirit, we stop eventrying to see is there anything
else?
You know, do I like doinganything else?
Are there other parts of methat I want to explore?
(22:34):
Are there other things I'd liketo learn?
We stop even asking thosequestions of ourselves and
unfortunately, a lot of us don'tstart asking those questions
again until we're like in our50s and 60s, you know, when you
get to the place where all thekids are gone and you're home
alone and you you got a lot oftime on your hand, or you're
retired and you're like now what?
(22:55):
And it's a shame because wecould have been asking those
very same questions when we were20 and 30 and 40, and exploring
all along so so that we get toreally be the fullest version of
ourselves and enjoy all thedifferent facets of the way God
put us together.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Yeah, and it's also, in a sense, we get to a point
that we're so good at somethingand so comfortable that we're no
longer growing, and that's whenwe become stagnant.
In some ways, we becomedissatisfied, but it's also the
comfort zone, so it's like tomove from there to there is
really stretching.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
It is that the whole process of becoming has tension
to it.
It's an uncomfortable tension,uncertainty, and I feel like
that's why a lot of us resist it.
We don't like uncertainty.
It's a level of continuousstress and we hear the word
(23:52):
stress and we think stress bad.
Stress actually is good incertain situations.
Growth only comes throughstress.
Stress simply means change, andso we have to kind of almost
like change our mindset aroundthe unknown and uncertainty.
(24:14):
The unknown and uncertaintyBecause I mean, if you look at
the Bible and scripture, everyperson that we celebrate in the
Bible had to go through a greatunknown.
Every one of them had to gothrough a great unknown, and so
they had to deal with thistension of becoming.
So it's kind of strange that weseem to think we don't have to
(24:43):
because it's a part of thegrowth process with God.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Yeah, absolutely, I love that so much.
And when we are in the processof growth, a lot of times we
will have negative self-talk.
And so what are some advice youcan give us to overcome some of
that negative self-talk andjust some of the thoughts that
we all battle with from time totime?
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Yeah, the negative self-talk.
There's a lot of reframing thathas to do as far as what we say
to ourselves.
I sometimes will think tomyself when I say this to
anybody else, like anybody not afriend, a foe, anybody Some of
the things we say to ourselveswe literally would not say to
(25:26):
anybody, not even someone wedon't like, because it's so rude
.
Yeah, but we would say it toourselves.
And so when I say something tomyself that I then check myself
and like I wouldn't say this tomy worst enemy, why am I saying
it to myself?
And then I often then have toeven take a step back further.
What, what makes me think Ideserve to hear that?
(25:48):
Wow, because sometimes that'sthe issue.
It's like I'm not, I'm not evenhonoring some part of myself,
that I feel like I deserve to bebelittled or I deserve to be
put down or I deserve to bewhatever.
You know, whatever it is thatyou're saying to yourself.
And so I think we have toconstantly stay in in
(26:11):
conversation and processing isthat's the emotional rest part
of the book.
Conversation and processing isthe that's the emotional rest
part of the book.
That's why every chapter endswith these like daily unveiling
questions, because we have to.
We have to start askingourselves why we're doing stuff.
What's behind this?
What am I really saying tomyself when I do this or I say
(26:32):
this, or I think that?
Speaker 1 (26:35):
I love that.
Do I deserve to be told this?
And that's such an interestingway to reframe that.
The other thing that I lovethat you touched on this book
and I think we all struggle withthis as well is the difference
between being and doing.
I know that you're an achiever,you know and you love to do
things, and I fall in the sameboat where if I'm not
(26:57):
accomplishing things, if I'm notdoing stuff, I just feel less
than to some degree Right, andit's almost like I don't feel
productive, I don't feel likeI'm contributing and all of that
.
But you really touch on thedifference, too, between doing
and being, and so, yeah, tell usmore about that.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Yeah, I'm a Martha.
All day, every day, that is mylet's get it done.
So, yes, that that is my mindsetas well.
So the thing with doing andbeing is that doing keeps your
identity wrapped up in theperformance being what your
identity, your identity just is,being what your identity, your
(27:40):
identity just is.
It doesn't matter anything else.
No, no productivity attached toit, no outcomes attached to it.
And in a society and a culturefor outcomes and productivity
and metrics are like how wejudge everything, to say I, I am
going to change to kind of takemyself out of that way of
thinking to the point where myidentity does not require
metrics, outcomes or performance.
(28:01):
It just simply is, iscompletely countercultural and
completely freeing, and it givesyou the ability to then take
some courageous steps and docertain things that you, that
doers, may not do because theyare, they are wrapping the doing
and even if they begin in themindset of what is the outcome,
(28:23):
the productivity, the end resultgoing to be where someone who
is being would just step into itbecause that, because they're
not attached to that.
I'll give an example I do awhole lot of work with writers
and speakers.
That's where I do mentoring andcoaching, and so I'll have
someone say I feel like, I feellike I'm supposed to write a
(28:44):
book or start a ministry or dowhatever it is that they're that
they feel led to.
A doer would then rationalizehow many copies are going to get
sold?
How many speaking engagementsam I going to get?
They're going straight to themetrics.
How many followers do I have onsocial media?
Is my platform big enough?
All the stuff Someone who'sbeing that identity, being what
(29:08):
they feel like they've beenspoken into says.
You know what the success is?
Just that I'm being who I feellike I'm called to be.
I'm supposed to be someonewho's writing and communicating
and sharing truth.
So whether one person or ahundred people read it or buy it
or engage with it doesn't makea difference, because I'm going
(29:30):
to just be who I am.
And who I am is a writer.
Who I am is a speaker.
Who I am is someone who is freeto share truth with other
people.
Who I am is someone who enjoyslaughter.
So I'm going to share laughterand they're just being who they
are and letting the expressionof that have its joy without
worrying about what metricsfollow or come with it.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Yeah, that's so good, but the pressures are real in
our culture, right?
I mean we're all right.
I mean we're all pressured to.
I mean I'm working on a bookright now and it's like the
platform the platform, theplatform, and that is very
opposite of being right, becausebeing is resting in your
message.
It's, it's doing the deep workversus to.
I have to build this because X,y and Z and if I don't build
(30:15):
this, then this is going to lookdifferent and all this stuff.
So and that's just one exampleright Of an author, just with
the platform thing but we allhave different pressures and so
our culture is so focused aboutresults and the hustle culture
where it's like get things doneand I love being productive.
I'm not saying that just sitthere and do nothing.
(30:36):
But how do we learn in ourculture to be more than produce
and, you know, essentially bejust producers?
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Yeah, it's a continuous act of surrender is
what I'm finding, because, youknow, if you sit down with I've
now had the opportunity to sitwith so many different people,
with so many from so manydifferent levels within their,
their ministry or their work, asfar as success, so to speak, as
the world calls it.
(31:07):
And when you sit down withpeople, one of the things that I
find consistently with peoplewho had had something happen and
it's like, wow, how did thishappen?
How did all of a sudden,everybody wanted to purchase
your book or your album orwhatever it is that they had
Most of those people will tellyou I don't know, it's like all
(31:31):
of a sudden, bam, it's like outof nowhere, this thing just
happened.
And I'm just here on the rideand I'm just trying to keep up
with the ride.
They may have had some, someplans and specifics, but they
didn't necessarily, theycouldn't orchestrate it exactly.
The way it all came together andI think the beauty of that
process is is that our culturetries to control the process to
(31:55):
get certain outcomes and it canproduce certain outcomes, but
when it produces it, then it hasto maintain it and a lot of
work and energy and stress andnegative stress and pressure
that goes into the maintainingof it, because all of it came
from human effort and humanstrength, whereas when we see
(32:16):
someone who kind of went alongwith how you know, you thought
this was going to be it, but itwas actually.
This is the thing God raised upand decided to use more than the
other thing.
They don't have to uphold it.
God himself upholds it and it'sand there's a and, even though
there's a pressure could attachto the success, it's not the
(32:38):
same pressure.
It's a pressure to stay yieldedto his process and to not put
their hands on it and try tograb control back.
And so I think we we have tokind of choose.
Do we want to have to upholdall of it ourselves in the
productivity, or do we want tolet grace uphold it and our, our
work be the work of surrender?
Speaker 1 (33:01):
That's good, yeah, I mean.
And then you get emotionalburnout right from trying to
uphold the standards that youcreated, that weren't authentic
to yourself to begin with.
You were just going along withwhat was required or expected,
so to speak.
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Yeah, especially.
You know you mentioned likewith platform.
I can't tell you how manyauthors I've spoken to who are
like well, they tell me I haveto post on social media 10 times
a day, or whatever it is.
The new statistic is, and I gotto do so many reels and so many
this and I hate it.
And it's like then why are youdoing it?
Like, what kind of life is that?
Who signs up for that life?
(33:38):
Is that success worth it?
Because it's the selling of thesoul, so to speak.
Everything in you is tellingyou you don't want to do that,
which means you're shutting downwhat you really want to do, and
so you have to make a choice inwhat is actually of value most
to me, and then be willing torelease what needs to be
(34:01):
released and grab hold of whatneeds to be grabbed hold to.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Yeah, that's beautiful.
What is the connection betweenrest and being able to live
authentically?
When we are in the state ofrest that sometimes the most
creative and incredible ideascome to life right when we're on
vacation or when we are in aplace that allows for us to just
(34:25):
get rid of all the noise, allthe distractions, and we come
into that state of rest that nowthere's something that's coming
out that we wouldn't have hadhad we tried to be so productive
in the process.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
Yeah, I think rest definitely opens us up to
creativity, and I feel like abig part of that is because most
of the types of rest that thatI call creative rest, the types
of rest that that inspire us ormotivate us to and bring forth
innovation and creativity A lotof those have to do with nature
(35:01):
and things that have to do withstuff that's already been
created.
So when we're looking at thosethings, when we're experiencing
creative rest, we're beholdingGod in many ways.
We're seeing aspects of hischaracter, aspect of his
greatness, of his goodness, andanytime you are beholding him,
it is going to unlock somethinginside of you because beholding
(35:23):
him acts like a mirror.
It reflects back to us thingsthat we then can see of
ourselves, which then calls usout into the becoming, not to
become more of something, butwe're becoming more aware of
what's inside of us becausewe're beholding who we're made
in the image of, and so it'skind of this reciprocal process
(35:45):
you behold, you become, youbehold, you become, and then,
wherever you happen to be, youcan step into those spaces,
recognizing you are bringingsomething into that situation
that belongs there.
It may not fit in, becausefitting in is its own level of
stress, but it has a place ofbelonging there.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
It is bringing some element of what you beheld into
that space, because that'sneeded in the place where you
happen to be, and so we kind ofthis, this ongoing process,
(36:32):
where you see the flow of thesethree working together and you
can see how resting particularlyrest as it relates to
creativity, your work and youcontinue to show us what it's
really like to walk the walkinto.
Essentially, you're doing whatyou preach right, and so that's
so beautiful, and what are somethings that is currently
lighting your fire?
Speaker 2 (36:50):
Yeah, what's currently lighting my fire.
The number one thing right nowthat's lighting my fire is just
seeing people take steps of boldsteps of courage into the
unknown, with God just steppingout, trying it.
I say risking, risking whateveris required to risk and
(37:11):
oftentimes the risk is the riskof failure, as we put it but
allowing themselves to just findjoy in the doing and in this.
Taking the action step I shouldsay the doing of whatever he
told you and I think that rightnow is giving me the most joy is
just seeing people kind of becourageous and be who God says
(37:32):
they are.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
Yeah, it's so beautiful to be who you're meant
to be, essentially not thepressures of the world, because
there's so much.
There's so much pressure in ourculture to hold a certain
standard or be a certain way.
And you know, when you look atall the different artists and
people who have created some ofthe most pioneering things or
(37:55):
pivoting work, it was them beingfully authentic to who they are
.
It wasn't them trying to, youknow, create something based on
other people's expectations.
I mean even the book the Shack,which you've probably heard of,
right.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
That story is incredible.
I mean, the guy just wrote aletter to his family, you know,
and that was the work he did andhe completed in six months.
He never had any intentions ofselling it.
It became, and it was rejectedto by publishers, and then it
became a bestseller just throughword of mouth and became a
movie, and many lives have beenchanged because of it.
(38:32):
But the author never intendedit to be this productive thing
that sells X, y amount of copiesor whatever, and so I think
that's something that we canlearn too, from just being fully
in tune with our creator and intune with who we're supposed to
be, and I love that your bookreally sheds light to that.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Well, I appreciate that.
Yeah, it's fun.
I always say I am a bit of areluctant writer because I
prefer to speak overwrite,because English is not my thing.
I'm more of a sciencebackground text with God,
(39:15):
because in the writing of it youlearn so much about him and you
and just his word and how heput things together and how, how
putting words together work,words that can be very common,
that you hear every day.
Putting them together in a veryspecific way can have a
completely different effect, andto me that it's.
(39:37):
It's just.
It just shows kind of just whatour lives look like.
You know, there's all theselives, there's all these people,
there's all these words, butGod brings.
There's all these experiences,but God brings them all together
into these unique sentences.
And when I look at someone Ioftentimes think God, what is?
That person is a uniquesentence in your story.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
Yeah it's so beautiful.
What do that person is a uniquesentence in your story.
Yeah, it's so beautiful.
What do you hope that peoplewill get?
Speaker 2 (40:04):
out of your book being fully known.
What will they get out of it?
Jesus.
That's what I hope they get outof it.
If I simplified it, I hope theyget Jesus out of it.
I hope they read.
I hope they read through thetext, the stories, they read
through the scriptures and theygo through the questions and, on
(40:25):
the other side of it, that theystart seeing, they start
beholding Jesus in everythingthey see and from there they
start becoming more like him.
Speaker 1 (40:35):
And as a writer, as you were taking time to write
this book, how would you saythat this book has shaped you
from some of the other work thatyou've done?
Speaker 2 (40:45):
I would say this, this I've never thought of
writing a memoir, necessarily,or a book.
That's kind of a retelling ofmy own story.
I would probably say this bookis the closest thing to that of
me telling my own story andjourney.
So, and it's a journey inprocess, don't get me wrong, I
(41:06):
have not arrived at any of theword, but but it's a journey I'm
in process with God, with, andso I would say that's probably
how it's shaped me.
It's helped me to sit down withthe process, celebrate things I
didn't celebrate when I shouldhave.
Now that I look back on it, I'mlike you know what I should
have celebrated, that I calledit a failure but it actually was
(41:30):
a success.
Or I beat myself up over thatwhen I actually should have gave
myself grace, and so I thinkthat's what I've been
experiencing as I wrote thisparticular book.
Speaker 1 (41:42):
What are some books that you're excited about
currently or in your readingstack?
Speaker 2 (41:48):
You know what?
I've been so busy?
I don't have a reading stackright now other than the Bible.
My reading stack is very slim.
Right this very moment there'sa couple of books that I have
been talking with my husbandabout because he right now is
the avid reader in our familyand he has a to be read list the
(42:09):
size of Texas, but I could nottell you what's on it.
I told him to give me untilApril and we will take a look at
it and we will take a look atit.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
Such is life, right I mean.
Sometimes it's just you have todo what you can in your
capacity and, as you know,someone who studied rest and you
tend to operate in what youpreach about right and so yeah,
I took them all off my tube.
Speaker 2 (42:32):
I was like I need I.
Right now I have to keep onesingle focus.
Speaker 1 (42:36):
Yeah, Well, is there, Dr Sondra?
Is there anything that Ihaven't asked you or anything
else you'd love to share withthe listener?
Speaker 2 (42:46):
You know.
Nothing specifically comes tomind.
I just, would you know,encourage people.
If the book is set up in such away that if you're someone who
enjoys doing I shouldn't sayenjoy, but who does fasting it's
set up in a way to be able touse it as a 21 day fast it has
21 chapters to be able to walkthrough it at a pace.
However, some people like to doit with it within groups and so
(43:09):
we actually do have some videosthat go with the book, that go
five videos that go over some ofthe key chapters and key parts
and sections of the book, sothat you can work through it as
a group and do it for six weeksor seven weeks or however many
weeks you decide, so that youcan actually have others to
converse with it.
Because I think it's helpfulsometimes to be able to discuss
(43:31):
some of these life experiences,because they are so common
between so many of us and havingopportunities to be able to
share with a small group or witha friend and be able to talk
about some of those unveilingquestions as you process through
them.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
Yeah, I do love how you included that at the end of
each chapter you have a guide,you have some scripture, you
also have questions, so it'sreally allowing you to work
through each chapter.
And having a book club that'show you grow, especially with a
book like this.
That really has you reflectdeeper upon who you are and who
you're becoming and things thatyou could be working on.
(44:06):
And if you're in a book club ona book like this, it's like a
mastermind guide.
So I highly encourage you toget Dr Sandra's book called
being fully known and it's a gem.
There's so much in there thatwill benefit you as you grow and
evolve.
And, yeah, I just really havebeen enjoying reading through
your manuscript.
(44:26):
Oh thank you so much, and also Ilove to end the podcast with
asking what is an advice thatyou'd love to pass on to the
listener.
It could be anything.
It could be related orunrelated to the book.
Speaker 2 (44:41):
The thing that initially came to mind I had
experienced this weekend.
We had a women's event and itwas an unusual women's event.
The theme was joy and we werehaving dancing and praise and
all the things.
And I saw a young woman wholooked literally like I did when
I was her age and she was soafraid and she would not come
forward like everybody else islike praising and dancing and
(45:04):
doing all of the things, havingfun, doing all the games and she
was just kind of in the cornerjust looking and smiling and I
and I that I would leave youwith this thought, this thought
when is it?
When are you going to comeoutside of the box?
(45:25):
What has to happen for you toget to the place where your joy
is more important than theirwords?
Because that's what I wishsomeone had told me many years
ago.
Speaker 1 (45:34):
Wow, that's deep, yeah, I mean, for some of us
that takes like a midlife crisis, right, Something to happen
like a heart attack, just thingsthat really are really, really
difficult for us to really say.
Hey, you know what I'm going tostart becoming who I'm made to
be and you start to find thediscontentment within yourself
where before it's just the.
(45:55):
You're on this wheel and you'rejust going with emotions and
it's like you're living butyou're not.
You're half dead.
In a sense, your body's alivebut your mind is not.
Well, thank you so much, DrSandra, for coming on the
podcast.
It's been an honor talking toyou and I'm sure that the
listener is going to be reallyinspired by our conversation and
(46:17):
all the gems and tips that youhave to offer.
And again, go get this bookwhere books are sold, called
being Fully Known by Dr SandraDalton-Smith.
Thank you for listening to theOnce we Dare podcast.
It is an honor to share theseencouraging stories with you.
If you enjoy the show, I wouldlove for you to tell your
friends, leave us a reviewerrating and subscribe to wherever
you listen to podcasts, becausethis helps others discover the
(46:40):
show.
You can find me on my website,speckhopawcom.
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