When New Mexico Dust Falls on Ohio Cars, We Have Questions

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When dust from New Mexico creates mud rain in Ohio, the Outer Belt crew finds themselves discussing one of nature's strangest phenomena. The hosts share their experiences with mud-coated vehicles and the resulting car wash chaos across the region, providing a fascinating look at how weather patterns thousands of miles away can impact daily life.

The conversation takes a serious turn as they examine a controversial new Arkansas bill that would drastically change requirements for non-US commercial drivers. This proposed legislation would require US-issued CDLs, ban certain visa holders from operating commercial vehicles in Arkansas, and mandate English language proficiency tests during traffic stops. The hosts question the bill's legality, potential conflicts with interstate commerce regulations, and concerns about implementation fairness.

Drawing from their extensive industry experience, the crew delves into the effectiveness of current drug testing protocols after discussing a tragic case in Oregon where a truck driver under the influence killed seven farm workers. They thoughtfully examine whether the current 50% random testing requirement for carriers is sufficient, the challenges of catching impaired drivers, and how the Drug and Alcohol Clearinghouse has improved safety measures.

Throughout the episode, the hosts balance technical industry knowledge with accessible explanations, making complex regulations and safety concerns understandable for listeners from all backgrounds. Whether you're a trucking professional or simply curious about the forces shaping interstate commerce and highway safety, this episode offers valuable insights into the changing landscape of American transportation.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 2 (00:09):
Hey everybody, welcome to the Outer Belt.
I'm Patrick, and you all knowmy friends Billy Buttermilk,
eric and Jerry.
Oh man, and we are here from abeautiful Ohio.
It's a wonderful faux springday, or is it real spring day?
No, it's not real spring, it'snot real.

Speaker 3 (00:24):
spring it's not real spring.

Speaker 1 (00:26):
It's the faux spring.
It's teasing us.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
But it's doing a great job of teasing us.
It said when I woke up thismorning high of 68.
And it got up to what?
74?
Something like that todaySomething.
It was crazy warm and beautiful, just not a cloud in the sky.
I'm excited about Friday.
I am too 77.

Speaker 4 (00:45):
That's too hot.
I say we hit 80.
I bet you we will.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
But you know, what's going to happen is we have
storms rolling in, oh yeah.
Big, huge.
I've already seen severeweather.
They've got their differentcolors coming up from the south,
whatever's going to be, andwe're kind of in this one color
all the way to Cleveland,because it dips to 57 the
following day.
So that's lots of thunderstorms, possible tornado warnings.

(01:11):
Your eyes and your ears, yourphone, on all that good stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:15):
We're going to have another tornado session, a
tornado therapy session like wedid last year.
Remember that we're all down inour basements texting back and
forth.
What?

Speaker 3 (01:26):
are you doing Sirens going off from three different
cities?

Speaker 1 (01:29):
It does warm up to the 60s and then it dips right
back to the 40s.
So, like I agree with Vince,maybe not quite done with winter
, but because that Thursday, the20th, a low of 28.
To me that's winter.

Speaker 2 (01:43):
Yeah, it's very winter.
I was going to say so,certainly no snow, but now that
you said 28, that might be apossibility.
Oof, we could see anotherdusting.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
We're in Mother Nature's needs-to-take-her-meds
kind of moments, these nextcouple of weeks.

Speaker 5 (01:55):
We really are it rained, she hasn't taken her
meds all stinking and it rainedmud.

Speaker 1 (02:02):
And it rained mud.
I mean, like You're stillpretty amazed by that it rained
mud From New Mexico.

Speaker 2 (02:09):
Isn't that a song?
It's raining mud.

Speaker 1 (02:14):
New Mexico mud.

Speaker 2 (02:16):
I've seen some crazy stuff in my life, but I've never
seen it rain, mud, and I'm fromSouth Louisiana.
One thing we know about is rain.
It's never mud.
Nope, I mean that just blew meaway and then the whole city
just looks so dusty.
It was weird driving on theroads and seeing like the clear
tire tracks on the roads, likeif, as if it was snow Right, but

(02:38):
it was actually just the dustthat was left over and it was.
It was crazy, absolutely crazy.

Speaker 3 (02:45):
We haven't had a regular rain since then.
We haven't, we need one, sothere's nothing to wash it away
with no, it's oh the lines atthe.

Speaker 1 (02:52):
What day were we out and about Saturday.

Speaker 4 (02:54):
Saturday, yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:55):
Oof the lines at the, Because this happened Friday
night.

Speaker 3 (02:58):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (02:59):
And the lines at the Car wash.
Car, the car washes were people.
Well, that one over by.
Joanne's was just honking,honking at each other.
People were not being patientand polite.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
No, the lines are still terrible.
I went to the one over onSawmill today and I was like
nope and kept on going.

Speaker 5 (03:17):
There was nowhere in line this morning at 730.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
Well, people have jobs.

Speaker 4 (03:23):
Yeah, at my house they were backed out into the
road, down the street to thenext stoplight, blocking the
traffic.
At the stoplight they were alllined up so I was like, okay,
I'm going to go to another one.
So I drove out going towards Idon't know where the hell I'm at
.
Pickerington.
So I went out to another oneand they actually cut the

(03:46):
entrance off from the road andhad everybody lined up down this
like the sidewalk and itstretches into a mall parking
lot and it was down the mallparking lot like over half the
mall people just sitting andwaiting.
I was like yeah, forget thatCar wash, ain't that serious.

Speaker 1 (03:58):
No, it ain't.
I'll go home and get the bucketand the sponge and give it a
what for.

Speaker 2 (04:03):
And it is dust, to be clear, it's not salt.

Speaker 1 (04:05):
It's not corroding your paint.

Speaker 2 (04:07):
It's just dust, so I'll be happy to get it off my
vehicle.
I'm hoping the next couple daysthat line will go down enough
that I can swing it and grab it.
But I do check pretty muchevery day now.

Speaker 3 (04:19):
I went this past weekend Monday maybe and I did
the one on sawmill and I wasable to get in and out in less
than half an hour.

Speaker 2 (04:29):
Oh, I have not been able to.
I haven't seen it like that yet.

Speaker 3 (04:30):
I must have caught it .

Speaker 2 (04:32):
You must have had the opportune time.

Speaker 3 (04:33):
Special time.

Speaker 4 (04:34):
I got lucky.
My car was in the garage and Ididn't get anything.

Speaker 1 (04:38):
Mine normally is in the garage.

Speaker 4 (04:39):
I got lucky.

Speaker 1 (04:40):
Ours was in the garage and it still had debris
on it Like a dusting.

Speaker 5 (04:44):
It was weird.
Maybe our garage isn't assealed as Jerry's Apparently not
.

Speaker 4 (04:47):
Well, they just put a new roof on ours too.
Maybe that helped.

Speaker 2 (04:51):
Yes, maybe your roof is leaking dust.
Could be that's what it was.
I'm not a carpenter, it wasn'tthe dust from the rain that got
into your car or to your car inthe garage.
It just shook the buildingenough the dust fell off the
ceiling fan.

Speaker 3 (05:04):
That's directly above your garage, so that's aged
dust.

Speaker 2 (05:07):
Yes, I always thought it was weird.
They put a ceiling fan rightover your car.
I thought that was weird too,but maybe In an unfinished
basement, in an unfinishedbasement where you keep your car
.

Speaker 5 (05:18):
Yes, we keep our car in the basement.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
They've got yeah car in the basement.
I have noticed.

Speaker 5 (05:23):
Just drive it down.

Speaker 2 (05:24):
But it's such a narrow ramp.
It is and it only fits your carLike I can't fit my.

Speaker 1 (05:30):
Jeep in there.
It's too tall.
It really is so for the viewers, because I did see some what
about the listeners?

Speaker 2 (05:38):
No, not them, just the viewers.

Speaker 1 (05:39):
The viewers, the listeners.

Speaker 2 (05:41):
You can see this picture here.
No, the listeners the viewers,the viewers, the listeners, the
viewers.

Speaker 1 (05:44):
You can see this picture here.
No, the listeners, the viewers,um I in fact, I did see some uh
drivers out there makingcomments on some social media
platforms, including high fields, uh, that that they had got
stuck in a severe sandstorm downin in like arizona or new
mexico, that area like reallybad.
I did see that area like reallybad.

Speaker 2 (06:05):
I did see that.

Speaker 1 (06:05):
Filled their truck with the dust, just you know,
really atrocious.
So that's kind of what happenedand it's.
I guess we all woke up up herein this area, ohio, or along the
path of the rain that day, tothis weird substance on all of
our cars or this glow outside.

Speaker 2 (06:25):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (06:26):
And I know that I follow Ohio News and Weather and
they had posted that there wasan atmospheric pressure or an
inversion or something andbasically the clouds sucked up
the dust out of that storm.
The wind just sucked it all upand then it was in the clouds.

(06:47):
And so, as the clouds aretraveling from New Mexico all
the way you know along theirline Kentucky, so on and so
forth, all the way through Ohio,as they're dispensing moisture,
it was also dispensing thatdust which then created mud rain
.
As Patrick said, I thought itwas a pretty cool phenomenon.

(07:07):
I've never heard of reallyanything.
The meteorologists, they wereall kind of in awe of it, as if
maybe they've never seen itbefore or maybe it's been 100
plus years since something likethis has happened.
I thought it was a very coolphenomenon that we had New
Mexico dust on our cars.

Speaker 5 (07:25):
I don't know if you guys heard or not, but Jim
Cantore is thinking aboutretiring from the Weather
Channel, really.
Yeah, melissa's been gettingphone calls all week to be his
replacement Because she's on topof the weather like that.

Speaker 1 (07:38):
I love weather, though you know that.

Speaker 2 (07:43):
You're talking about the dust storms out in
California and Arizona and NewMexico, wherever it was out
there.

Speaker 1 (07:48):
West, out west, out west.

Speaker 2 (07:49):
I remember seeing a lot of that on my news feed.
I didn't put it together thatthat is what fed this storm
until you just said that.

Speaker 1 (07:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:57):
I completely didn't put two and two together, but
yeah, that was wild.

Speaker 1 (08:02):
I kind of picture it maybe almost being like an
inverted tornado, but don't, Imean not quite maybe, but you
know, like as a section whereit's going up and then those
clouds held.

Speaker 2 (08:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (08:14):
They were so dense that they held the dust in them.
I mean, just as a scienceperspective, I think that's just
a pretty cool thing.

Speaker 2 (08:22):
I do too.
I think that's just a prettycool thing.
I do too.
But it also kind of tears allthose holes in a smart water
theory where they're talkingabout how it's distilled by the
clouds.
Because I wouldn't want todrink that water.
No, you don't know.
Smart water claims to bedistilled by the clouds.

Speaker 1 (08:36):
No, have you ever melted snow?
It's not as pretty as you thinkit is.

Speaker 2 (08:41):
It's all the salt.

Speaker 1 (08:42):
Ew.

Speaker 2 (08:46):
And the yellow color.
Anyway, it was glorious today.

Speaker 1 (08:48):
Doors were open in the house.
Took Annie for a little walk.

Speaker 2 (08:52):
I took a scenic drive .

Speaker 1 (08:53):
Was it nice.

Speaker 2 (08:54):
It was very lovely.
I took the 270 scenic bypassroute All the way around, all
the way around, and I got in thetruck around 345.
Or left the yard about 345.

Speaker 1 (09:08):
And I'm like, well, this is perfect and I had to go
get Right at rest shower yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:12):
And I had to go get some air in a tire that was a
little low, and so I'm likethat's really going to set me in
the perfect spot and I mean Idid great.
I headed south and I went down,had no issue on 270.
Started coming up north, goingaround the airport, everything's
fine, 70 was.
I saw 70 as I went over and I'mglad I went on 70, but I wasn't

(09:33):
on 70, so who cares?
So I just kept on going rightand I get up around just north
of.

Speaker 1 (09:40):
Easton Polaris, I believe it's, westerville, it is
yeah, and Albany.

Speaker 2 (09:42):
Polaris?
I believe that's Westerville.

Speaker 1 (09:44):
It is, yeah, and Albany, that area, oh, it's
always congested up north,though.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
It really is.
It really is, I don't know.
Well, I guess what I saw wasmostly people going north, so
like going from the 71.

Speaker 5 (10:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (10:01):
So that was a lot of traffic.

Speaker 5 (10:02):
It was right there, yeah they're coming out of the
part of the city going north,going home.

Speaker 2 (10:06):
Yeah, I thought it was cool, though I did see, when
I was on 270, headed towards 71on the south side, I saw a
truck going the oppositedirection as me and it was a
very unique truck.
It was a much, much, much olderExpediter.
So it was kind of cool to seelike, oh wow, that thing's still

(10:28):
running, like it's got to havea million miles plus two million
miles.
It's old.
And then when I got to North270, I passed it again.

Speaker 1 (10:36):
Oh, they're doing a loop too.

Speaker 2 (10:38):
Well, I think they were doing the bypass from
downtown, but they went left andI was going right or they went,
they went west, I was goingeast, and so once I got up north
, they obviously hit trafficsomewhere and I had caught back
up with them again that's funny,so it was kind of cool to see
that.

Speaker 1 (10:54):
Why were you doing the?

Speaker 2 (10:55):
loop.
Uh, we have a truck that was ina very bad wreck, uh, several
months ago and, uh, it was notenough damage to total the truck
out, but it was a substantialamount of damage, and so it's
been in the process of gettingrebuilt for quite some time.
It's all new.
And when I say it's all new,it's all new.

(11:17):
The cab and the sleeper and theengine are original.
The drive axles are new.
The box is brand new.
The toolboxes are new.
The box is brand new.
The toolboxes are new.
We have a couple new framerails on it.
They were going to straightenthem, but they actually replaced
them, which is funny, because Ihave a buddy of mine.
Back in the day we used to talkabout how older trucks like,

(11:39):
yeah, just rebuild everything,replace everything, and the
thing we'd always joke about isnew frame rails or whatever.
And Rebuild everything replaceeverything, and the thing we'd
always joke about is new framerails or whatever, and it was
like because that's usually themark of a total vehicle is
replacing a bit frame rail.
But on, these trucks are soexpensive that didn't deter it.
And so it's a brand new truckand I want to go take it for a

(12:02):
drive, just because it's aboutto go on the road and I wanted
to make sure everything feltright before we got on the road
and it drove like a dream.
It drives like a brand-newtruck.
I mean mostly because it's abrand-new truck yeah over half.
It's a brand-new truck yeah overhalf of it's brand-new, yeah,
so it really drove great.
It really was a nice ride.
So, that's why I made that bigloop.

(12:30):
So the loop you made were youon the outer belt.
Some refer to it as the outerbelt.
Okay, I was just curious.
Yes, you're right, especiallyif you look at the map.
Well, that's a weirdcoincidence.
That is a weird coincidence.

Speaker 1 (12:38):
The outer belt on the outer belt.

Speaker 2 (12:39):
It's almost like we named it after that.
Yeah, maybe they named thehighway after us.
I could see that, jerry, canyou research that for us, sure
will.

Speaker 1 (12:50):
Quick fact check and the answer is they named it
after us.

Speaker 2 (12:54):
Excellent, there it is, there it is.
Put that in Guinness.

Speaker 1 (13:00):
And it spits out the answer.

Speaker 5 (13:03):
Or better, yet you can do the triple P.

Speaker 1 (13:04):
Oh, the triple you can do the triple P.
Oh, the triple P I love thetriple P.

Speaker 5 (13:07):
What is that?
He was a character on, let'ssay, new Orleans.
Okay, he was their tech guy,and whenever he went to do
something on his computer, hebasically just did like this and
it was just a clacky, clacky,clack, clack, as quick as it
could be.

Speaker 2 (13:21):
Yeah, if you're listening, it's just like Just
slapping the keyboard.
Slapping the keyboard like it'sa bomb.
He was doing 100 characters aminute, gotcha.

Speaker 1 (13:28):
I don't know anybody really that could do.
I mean, if you could do 100characters, kudos to you.
I'm at 60.

Speaker 2 (13:32):
Like a courtroom stenographer is basically what
he's doing Basically, if it wasan old school type, I'd be like
he.

Speaker 1 (13:40):
He'd just be talking and just doing a lot of.

Speaker 5 (13:42):
Just slapping.

Speaker 1 (13:42):
And so we call it the Triple P because that was his
nickname on the show.
But anyways, you've seen thosepeople.

Speaker 2 (13:50):
I have.
Have you ever called a Kelly?
Does she do the Triple P?

Speaker 1 (13:55):
The whole time Just to make it sound like she's
doing work On the phone.

Speaker 4 (13:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (13:58):
She's got the loudest keyboard known to man and it is
just the whole time it'skeyboard known to man and it is
just the whole time.

Speaker 1 (14:12):
It's.
Vince has a loud keyboard.
I used it for a hot moment hererecently and I was like, wow,
this thing sounds like Triple P.

Speaker 4 (14:18):
For some reason Don's wanting to get a mechanical
keyboard.
I'm like no.

Speaker 5 (14:23):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 4 (14:23):
They're loud.
Is that what you have?

Speaker 2 (14:25):
It depends on the keys you get.
It's the tall ones, right that?

Speaker 5 (14:28):
have, the more they have more tactile feel, but
depending on which keys you get,there are quieter ones than
some of the louder ones.

Speaker 2 (14:38):
So do you get a USB-C to serial port or parallel port
?

Speaker 5 (14:43):
If it's a Mac, it's an ADB port.

Speaker 2 (14:44):
I just to a serial port or a parallel port If it's
a.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
Mac.
It's an ADB port, ADB yeah.

Speaker 2 (14:48):
I just need like little half-inch keys.

Speaker 1 (14:49):
But if they're using the IBM, not like two-inch keys
that take forever to strike,which I think that's where
you're getting your sound from,but I just need a little.

Speaker 5 (14:56):
Well, some people like the tactile feel of the
response they get from the keyNever thought about that yeah,
they get from the key Neverthought about that yeah.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
Yeah, interesting, I think last didn't.

Speaker 2 (15:06):
Last episode we talked about the plastic of the
VHSs and how like unique thatwas.
I think about the plastic ofthat keyboard, of the 1984 IBM
keyboard that had that slightlittle like little groove to it,
little dip.
Little sway, little dip to itand then just the functioning
and then the number button andit's just yeah.

(15:28):
And then were you a fan of theenter.
That was like a weird up squarelarge thing, or did you like
the slender?
One.

Speaker 1 (15:36):
No, I like the bigger one, but I also like the enter
next to the numbers pad.
Because I can do numbers pad bytouch.

Speaker 2 (15:45):
So you could do the triple P on the number pad,
because I can do numbers pad bytouch.
So you could do the triple P onthe number pad.

Speaker 1 (15:47):
I can do triple P on the number pad, but yes, I'm
sure our listeners and viewers,our audience, will like it.
I don't do as much data entry,so data entry.
So I did have a job, though,where they pulled me out of
sales and moved me into dataentry Because I could do so many
words per minute.
Which meant you flipped a lot oftheir.

(16:09):
It was a mail order kind ofthing and I could do I don't
know like 500 mail orderpostcards in a day because I
could type so fast.
Coffee or sunglasses theyadvertised in magazines.

Speaker 2 (16:22):
It sounds to me like the old school fundraisers we
used to do in elementary school,middle school.
It was like popcorn, wrappingpaper, fudge and greeting cards
and mascara, and it was likethese don't.

Speaker 1 (16:35):
No, these were actual postcards, like in your GQ,
your Vogue, your whatever.
And it was for Veritas Coffeeand I can't think of the other
name of the sunglasses.
But the sunglasses were verymuch the buy 15 for one penny
and you get 15 CDs or cassettes,jerry.
So the sunglasses were not ofquality, the coffee was of

(16:57):
quality.

Speaker 3 (16:58):
Can you imagine ladies with the inch and a half
nails?
Oh, yes, I remember those.
I remember that I've seen it,I've seen it, I'm from South
Louisiana, I've seen it.
I wasn't going to go there, butyeah.

Speaker 1 (17:11):
They really sound flickety-flackety.

Speaker 2 (17:13):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (17:15):
There's no backspacing either.

Speaker 2 (17:17):
You have to type with your first knuckle, because if
you type with the point of yourfinger, it's two keys at once.
That's funny.
Do they teach typing anymore?
Oh, I don't know.
I grew up where you didn't havea computer in every room or
whatever I was typing, notcomputers.
You could do typing.
So my school I am young enoughthat when they taught typing it

(17:41):
was on a computer.
But not every room at theschool had a computer in it and
certainly there were no laptopsfor kids or iPads, iphones,
anything like that was crazy.

Speaker 1 (17:52):
I don't think they're teaching typing they're
teaching typing of some sort.

Speaker 5 (17:56):
They have to.

Speaker 2 (17:57):
I don't think they are.

Speaker 5 (17:58):
I think it's like keyboarding now or something.

Speaker 2 (18:00):
Yeah, but I am a pretty proficient typer and I
was not at high school.
It's just become so much a partof what we do that I've just
learned it and I'm reasonablyfast at it.

Speaker 1 (18:15):
Do you keep your fingers on the little nubbies or
do you know where the keys are?

Speaker 2 (18:20):
I don't know.
I wonder now if kids are justlearning how to type, because it
is just a part of what you do,but I guess as a kid you're not
really typing a lot, right?

Speaker 3 (18:28):
Definitely not texting, maybe that's it, or at
least sending emails.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
That could be.
The other thing, too, is ifthey're always on a device and
they don't have a real keyboard.

Speaker 1 (18:36):
Boy, I don't know.
Good question If you have ayoungin' out there, what are
they learning?

Speaker 2 (18:40):
I'll tell you one thing that's really messing with
me right now.
So, as many of you all know,I'm taking pilot's license
lessons learning how to fly aplane Been doing it for a long
time now Hope to be done soonand the airplane I was in flying
at the school.
They sold it and bought the newmodel and I'm now on the new
model and part of what we do onthe airplane.

(19:06):
Because it's a newer airplane,more advanced.
It has a keyboard.
The old plane had theQ-W-E-R-T-Y QWERTY keyboard.
The new one does not.
And I'm telling you I feel likeI'm 117 years old every time I
have to type something and it'salways just four letters, but
it's always like why does thislook?
Like I'm reading the Matrix,like every time Is it just

(19:27):
alphabetical?

Speaker 5 (19:28):
It's alphabetical.
Oh, it's Nightmare.

Speaker 2 (19:31):
Wow, it's like why would you do this?
Why would you change to thisnew keyboard?
And it's been a struggle a realstruggle to learn it.
I am so used to that, courtney.

Speaker 1 (19:44):
Give it two weeks, I bet you'll be proficient.

Speaker 2 (19:48):
I'm getting better at it, but it's still like there
are times where I do want twothings I'm like where, there you
are Interesting.
It's just funny how your brainlearns that muscle memory or
whatever.
So, melissa, yes, you weresharing with the group earlier,
yeah, and I thought what youwere sharing with us was very

(20:13):
interesting and I asked you totalk about it.

Speaker 1 (20:17):
So I originally saw it off, you know, my morning
deep dive into social media,kind of drink coffee kind of
thing.
A reel came past and this guywas mentioning this new arkansas
bill and that dot officers arepulling people over for
something.
And I'm like, well gee, Iwonder if he's just, you know,
blowing smoke.

(20:37):
It's a real come on.
Not everything on social mediais at face value, so I dig a
little deeper, I know right, Idug a little deeper and cdl life
has an article on it and itsays arkansas bill bans
non-citizens from operating acommercial vehicle without a us

(20:58):
issued cdl and english languageproficiency.
So it says a bill recentlyintroduced in Arkansas would
crack down on non-citizensworking as commercial truck
drivers as well as the carriersthat employ them, so not just
the drivers.
And it happened on February25th.

(21:18):
The Secure Roads and SafeTrucking Act of 2025, or HB 1569
, was introduced in the Arkansasstate legislator.
So they did have fiveprovisions.
The first one says it requires adomestic issue by the US

(21:40):
District of Columbia or PuertoRico CDL in order to operate a
commercial vehicle in Arkansas.
Truck drivers with a B-1, b-2,or B-1, b-2 combination visa
would be banned from operating acommercial vehicle in Arkansas.
I'd just say penalties forviolation include impoundment of

(22:03):
the commercial vehicle and afine of $5,000 for the
commercial vehicle operator.
A Canadian commercial driver'slicense reciprocity would no
longer be recognized under theprovisions of the bill.
Any comments on that one beforeI move on to two?

Speaker 2 (22:22):
Yeah, so the B-1, B-2 are the combination.
Those are work visas for peoplecoming into the country.
If you are driving a truck fromMexico into America to make a
pickup or delivery, you operateyour Mexican CDL under that visa
and that allows you to comeinto the states.

(22:43):
So what they're saying is, eventhough you can come in that way
legally throughout the country,you cannot drive in Arkansas.

Speaker 1 (22:53):
Oh, that's interesting.

Speaker 2 (22:54):
So they are saying we don't want those drivers here,
you have to have a US CDL, aUS-issued CDL.
And then they say Canadians'driver's license won't work, and
the reason they say that isbecause Canadians and Americans,
we don't have to have visas togo to each other's countries.
So, like we do a lot of time,highfield always has teams going

(23:17):
in and out of Canada, no visasrequired.
You just go to it.
It's just part of our freetrade agreement.

Speaker 3 (23:22):
I'm surprised Quebec's not included in that,
because they're strictly French.

Speaker 2 (23:26):
They're so French People in Arkansas probably
aren't thinking about that.
I think Mexico's probably moreof who they're really targeting.

Speaker 1 (23:34):
So number two requires commercial vehicle
operators to demonstrate Englishlanguage proficiency sufficient
to read road signs and warningsigns, understand traffic
control devices and communicateeffectively in an emergency with
emergency services, lawenforcement and other.
Drivers Operating a CMV withoutproficiency in the English

(23:58):
language could result in a fineof $5,000.

Speaker 2 (24:02):
Now this is already required, correct?
Yes?

Speaker 5 (24:04):
To get a CDL, it is required federally.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
Yes, To get a CDL in America?
Yes, Is it required?
If you have a B1-2 orcombination visa?
I wonder if it's required forthose drivers.
I would imagine it is and youprobably have to prove you can
speak English to get that visa.
I wonder if it's required forthose drivers.
I would imagine it is, and youprobably have to prove you can
speak English to get that visa.
But what is prove you can speakEnglish?

Speaker 3 (24:26):
But do they have commercial visas, Like under
your visa?
Is there something else listedon the?

Speaker 2 (24:34):
paperwork.

Speaker 5 (24:35):
I think in order to get that visa you have to be
sponsored, and this isspeculation on the paperwork.
I think in order to get thatvisa, you have to be sponsored,
and this is speculation on mypart.
If you're driving for a Mexicancarrier, then there wouldn't be
a sponsorship.
To enter the United States,you'd probably have to apply for
a visa still to use thatlicense right Well, to get a
work visa period Of any type.

(24:56):
You have to be sponsored by acompany in the United States.
Yes, so like the.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
Mexican trekking companies are all partnered with
an American trekking company.
I do know that much.
I remember when it firststarted happening, because
there's only a handful that cando it, it's not widespread.

Speaker 5 (25:11):
Everybody can do it, everybody can go on in.

Speaker 2 (25:13):
It's just a few and and a lot like most are just
limited to right at the border,but then there are a few that
are experimenting with goingfurther.
Yeah, there's only a few thatcan like.
If you had freight in Mexicothat you had to deliver in
Canada, there's only a couple ofcompanies that have abilities
to do that and it's still apilot program, and even those

(25:33):
companies can't deliver andcan't pick up and deliver within
the United States.
Correct.

Speaker 5 (25:39):
You can pick up in Mexico and deliver into the
United States, pick up in theUnited States and deliver in
Mexico, but you can't make anintermediate trip to deliver
freight.
So if you pick up in the UnitedStates, deliver into Laredo,
you can't then pick up in Laredoand go to.
Detroit Correct, you have topick up in Laredo and deliver
back in Mexico.
Same thing with Canada, yeah.

Speaker 1 (25:59):
Oh, that's interesting, so it's directional
.

Speaker 2 (26:02):
Correct and you can't like.
If you were a Mexican operatorand you had freight in your
truck, you couldn't swing.
You know, I'm taking this loadto Toronto from Nuevo Laredo,
which is the Mexico side, and enroute there I'm going through
Kansas City and Kansas City hasa load that I can pick up and

(26:23):
then take that into Canada.
You can't do that either.

Speaker 1 (26:26):
So no double booking on your truck.

Speaker 2 (26:28):
Correct.

Speaker 1 (26:28):
Whatever you get in Mexico goes all the way to the
destination.
Now it can be delivered.

Speaker 2 (26:33):
So if you had, like, a truckload of stuff picked up
in Canada I'm sorry in Mexico,and so if you had a truckload of
stuff picked up in Mexico andyou delivered, half that
truckload in the US and thenhalf that load in Canada that's
allowed.
You just can't then pick up anddeliver again.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
So not multiple trips , correct and a lot of that
trade is universal.

Speaker 2 (26:53):
It works the same for airplanes, works the same for
trains, works the same for ships.
If you ever wondered why on acruise, if, like the cruises
that go from Los Angeles or evenSan Francisco to Hawaii, they
always go to either Victoria,british Columbia, which is in
Canada or they go down toEnsenada in Mexico.
It's because you have to toucha foreign port because of the

(27:16):
way they do.
Those ships are registered notin America, and you go from a
one port in America to anotherport in America without touching
, without touching somebody else.

Speaker 3 (27:27):
That's very sense.
That's very common in Alaskancruises, victoria oh yeah, just
Columbia is yep.

Speaker 5 (27:33):
I think there's only one ship in the United States
that doesn't.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
That's in Hawaii correct, that's because they
circle.

Speaker 5 (27:38):
Right and there have to be so much percentage of
American crews.
It's extremely expensive.
The ship was made in America.

Speaker 2 (27:46):
It's one of the oldest ships, the oldest cruise
ships out there, because it hadto be made in America and we
ain't made an American cruiseship in a long time, a long time
.
Wow, all right.

Speaker 1 (27:53):
All right.
So number three saysestablishes the offense of and
this is in quotes criminal useof a commercial vehicle in
quotes.
If a non-citizen without aUS-issued CDL quote causes the
bodily harm of another personwhile operating a commercial

(28:15):
motor vehicle in quotes, theoffense is a Class D felony that
comes with a minimum six-monthprison term.

Speaker 2 (28:24):
So they're basically kind of like the last one with
the English language wherethere's now a fine.
They're basically saying, youknow, we have these laws and now
we're going to put a penalty togo with it, whereas, like FMCSA
says, well, you can't have aCDL.
They're saying, yeah, but ifyou're caught here driving it
and you don't have a CDL, here'sthe law that's going to— and in

(28:44):
this case you cause harm tosomeone.
Here's this extra offense.

Speaker 1 (28:47):
We're just going to automatically give you a Class D
felony with a minimum penalty.

Speaker 5 (28:52):
But I'm curious about the minimum six-month prison
term, if they would really dothat or if they would deport the
person you would be subject todeportation if you are not a US
citizen and you get yourself afelony, certainly, and it could
also be that you do your sixmonths and get deported.
We've seen it happen for yearswhere someone commits a felony,

(29:18):
they do their time here in theUnited States and then
immediately are deported afterthat.

Speaker 1 (29:24):
If a non-US citizen without a US-issued CDL this is
number four is operating a CMVand causes a fatal crash, they
can be convicted of a Class Bfelony with a minimum of 10
years prison sentence.
So number three is if you dobodial harm.

Speaker 2 (29:44):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (29:45):
Number four is if you cause a fatal crash.

Speaker 2 (29:47):
You know what, now that I think about it, with the
minimum sentence thing, theseare already illegal in the
United States.
I think they're adding theminimum sentence thing so they
can imprison these people Right,so they don't just
automatically have to deport you.

Speaker 5 (30:00):
I'm not following.
What you're saying is illegalin the United States.

Speaker 2 (30:03):
If you get in a wreck or you cause a wreck that
causes bodily harm or thatcauses a fatal crash and you're
convicted of manslaughter, wellthen you already go to jail, but
if you're a non-citizen, theywould just automatically deport
you.
I think this is establishing abase saying we don't
automatically deport you.

Speaker 5 (30:23):
But I think there's a difference between this is
appears from what is written bya CDL life to be cut and dry in
a commercial vehicle that causesand you cause a fatal crash.
Plain and simple class B felony.
You're on your way to jail.

(30:44):
Minimum 10 years Now.
There are times when you canhave a fatal crash that is your
fault and not be charged withmanslaughter.

Speaker 2 (30:52):
Okay, so they're just filling in these minimums.

Speaker 5 (30:55):
That's what it appears to me just reading what
we're reading.
They're filling in.
Look, if you were in acommercial vehicle and you did
not have a US driver's licensecommercial driver's license and
you were a non-citizen, thenit's an automatic Class B felony
as opposed to.
Let's look at the causation.

Speaker 1 (31:12):
Let's take it to trial.
Let's do whatever You're goingto get a minimum of 10 years.

Speaker 3 (31:16):
Yeah, no questions, you're going to get a minimum of
10 years no questions Right offthe top.

Speaker 1 (31:19):
We're still going to take it to trial, but your
minimum sentence is going to be10 years.

Speaker 2 (31:24):
The trial is going to dictate whether or not you are
guilty of causing the issue.
Sure, I don't think, because apolice officer says you're at
fault, they're going to sayautomatic 10 years.
They're going to verify that.

Speaker 5 (31:37):
I think that's where a trial comes in.
If I'm driving down the road inmy car and I make a lane change
and I didn't see the car comingnext to me and I make a lane
change into them and it causes,unfortunately, that person to
die, I don't know that I'm goingto be charged with involuntary
manslaughter or vehicularmanslaughter because of what

(31:58):
happened there, if I were underthe influence, if I were
distracted it changes thingsright.
Yes, so I think what they'resaying here is that little
swerve you did on purpose, byaccident.
You didn't see the car there.
You did a little swerve.
Well, if they find that youcause an accident, this is the
minute you start off at 10 yearsor six months for the.

(32:20):
And I may be being too granularthere.

Speaker 2 (32:22):
No, I think you're being great, I think you're
right, and when I say it makessense, I'm understanding what
you're saying.
I'm not necessarily saying Iagree or disagree.

Speaker 1 (32:27):
I'm just saying I follow what you're saying.
Okay, so number five itpenalizes trucking companies
that provide commercial vehiclesto ineligible operators with a
fine of $10,000.

Speaker 3 (32:43):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (32:46):
So the reel I saw that led me down this rabbit
hole of educating myself was theman was saying that DOT
officers were pulling peopleover to do English proficiency
testing.
Now I thought that was kind ofodd, because don't you need

(33:10):
cause to pull a CMV over?

Speaker 2 (33:14):
No.

Speaker 1 (33:14):
But maybe not.
I've always thought, maybeyou're just— Random roadsides.

Speaker 3 (33:18):
Random roadsides, random roadsides.
Sure, I just think of a waystation too.

Speaker 1 (33:22):
No, we've had our fair share of random roadsides.
One of my very first ones was arandom and I'm like 2 in the
morning, what am I doing?
I was in the right lanetraveling speed limit.
My lights are not on bright,like what are we doing here, but
he was just checking his quotafor the night or doing a random.

Speaker 2 (33:44):
I bought a brand-new truck, or we bought a brand-new
truck.
I drove it down to Texas andpulled through a not even a
weigh station, a toll plaza, andthere was a cop who had just
gotten done.
He pulled one truck over, he'djust gotten done with that.
Guy Walked over to the tollplaza as I was paying my toll,
pointed at me and pointed overto the side and I was like, okay

(34:04):
, all he saw was the front of mytruck.
He had no clue if I was astraight truck tractor.
Nothing, it was just your turnit was just my turn.
I pulled over and we did aroadside inspection on a brand
new truck.

Speaker 5 (34:16):
It was a day old, wow , and he puts you out of service
.
For what issue?
No, he couldn't find anythingwrong.

Speaker 2 (34:20):
He actually loved the truck and gave me a lot of
praise about it.

Speaker 1 (34:22):
They usually do, don't they they?

Speaker 2 (34:24):
do A lot of times.
When they see it, it's a nicetruck to do.

Speaker 3 (34:27):
On the flip side, we'd have a team disqualified
for falsifying logs and that'show they were found out.
That's how they were found out,found out.
Random inspections.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
Random inspections, we'll catch that kind of stuff.

Speaker 1 (34:40):
That's an interesting thing, because Is that the only
way you're going to catch them,unless they cause an accident?

Speaker 5 (34:46):
We just read one through five, your trucks out of
Mexico are going to have on thefront of the tractor and also
on the back of the trailer aUnited States license plate,
from whatever state they're thetrailer a United States license
plate from whatever statethey're registered in in the
United States and a Mexicandriver's license.

Speaker 1 (35:04):
Are they really driving up to Arkansas?
Oh sure.

Speaker 5 (35:06):
And I only ask this because we drove from here.
We see them here in Ohiosometimes.

Speaker 1 (35:10):
And I'm only familiar with the Laredo Sure, yep,
what's the other one, del Rio?

Speaker 5 (35:15):
We see them here in Ohio all the time.
Del Rio, we see them here inOhio all the time.

Speaker 1 (35:17):
Really, oh yeah, oh yeah.
Thank you for educating me.

Speaker 2 (35:22):
There's a lot of, especially with the car freight,
especially with car freight andI don't mean hauling cars, I
mean hauling parts and pieces Alot of that stuff is they make
the parts in Mexico and theydrive them up to Canada and a
lot of times they cross, dockand put them on the trucks and
send them up here.
That's why the pilot programseven exist to try to make that
easier so Mexican truckingcompanies can get freight up

(35:44):
here or up to Canada.
But yeah, absolutely, it'ssuper, super common.

Speaker 1 (35:49):
Jerry, you have any input on all of this?
One through five Arkansas.
I heard a little ditty thatWyoming was already doing it.
Now, I did not dig deeper.
I do not know if Wyoming'sdoing it.
I'm telling you, I'mfact-checking myself right now,
but I did see something thatWyoming was already doing this,
so I'm not sure.

Speaker 4 (36:09):
It makes me wonder like we already have the FMCSA
rule that says you have to beEnglish-speaking and so forth to
hold a CDL, how many accidents,how many rules have been broken
have they actually caught?
That's on the books to makethis law seem worth it?

(36:32):
In my eyes, I think it's just awaste of taxpayers' money.

Speaker 5 (36:35):
I think what I've experienced myself is I know
that I've experienced myselfdrivers that do not speak
English in a truck that has gota US DOT number on the side,
doesn't have a Mexican licenseplate, so it's a United States
carrier, and they don't speakEnglish.
I was trying to help a ladyback into a spot one time that

(36:58):
did not speak a lick of Englishand since I hadn't driven a
Class A truck in quite some time, there was another driver
walking by and I asked him if hespoke Spanish.
And he did.
I said can you please help her?
Because I don't speak Spanishand I haven't backed a Class A
truck in so long, I can't helpher.
And she did not speak a lick ofEnglish.

(37:21):
We have the example of thedriver in Colorado coming down
into Denver on the hill thatlost his brakes and couldn't
read the signs.
A lot of that was lack oftraining, because they did say
he didn't have the propertraining and he didn't know what
that runaway truck ramp wasbecause he didn't read English
Spoke and he didn't know whatthat runaway truck ramp was
because he didn't read English,spoke it but couldn't read it.
So we have there are tons ofexamples out there, I think of

(37:47):
people who are getting CDLs anddon't speak English and can't
read the signs, because I thinkthere are certain states that
aren't testing for that thing,because I think there are
certain states that aren'ttesting for that thing.

Speaker 1 (37:59):
That was going to be my question.
And are they this $10,000 fineto the carrier that Arkansas is
doing?
Who is liable for that in theend?
Because people, somebody ispassing them, whether that be
the school, the trainers.
How about the DMV?
The DMV had to let them get aCDL somehow.

(38:20):
I did not mean to cut you off,but who's?
Because I'd like to hear youropinion on that who's passing
them.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
But I do think if you are at a DMV in Florida or New
Mexico, arizona, texas, southernCalifornia, if you speak
Spanish and you have someonethere that's coming to test for
their CDL right, like they wentthrough schooling, and now
they're here to test for itright and get their license, if

(38:50):
you already speak Spanish andthey speak Spanish and it's
easier to communicate in thatvernacular, then you're probably
doing that, not thinking aboutthe fact that this person has to
know how to speak English.

Speaker 4 (39:02):
Why?

Speaker 1 (39:02):
isn't the government violating?
The FMCSA rule so why isn't thegovernment though, at some
level, the FMCSA?
Federal holding your stateagencies, your local agencies,
all the way down accountable.
Can they read 12 signs inEnglish Hold on.

Speaker 2 (39:20):
This is for non-US holders.
Yes, yes so if you're in mexico, you're probably not getting a
person who can say you can speakenglish at your dmv right
correct.
So this is definitely not notthat, but but we see it
ourselves like I've hadconversations with our
recruiters.

(39:41):
Hey, you know, these two peopleare wanting to come drive with
us.
Husband speaks English, wifedoesn't.
Wife speaks English, husbanddoesn't.
I got their sister on the phonebecause they don't speak
English and they wanted to workwith us, or whatever Like.
There are ways of corruption,corruption of falsifying records
, all around to make it happen.

(40:02):
We see it within ourselves.
Now we tell people no, neitherone of our carriers will allow
it, fmc.
So whether or not you have alicense or not, neither carrier
will allow it.
So we don't, can't, can't doanything about it, but um it it.
They're obviously, it'sobviously happening and I I
think that the seats are goinglike well, arkansas is going all
right.
If this person has authority todrive here through Texas, is

(40:27):
Arkansas going to sue Texas overthat?

Speaker 1 (40:30):
Ooh.
Probably not right, Probablynot no, no, but you know who we
can.

Speaker 2 (40:35):
I can sue Warner, sure Not saying that they're the
ones.
I'm not trying to put themunder the bus.

Speaker 1 (40:41):
But the $10,000 fine.

Speaker 2 (40:43):
Absolutely.
Once that happens, then you canactually do things like that.
I think that's where it comesfrom.

Speaker 5 (40:50):
So I was just looking on California's DMV website.
The First Motor VehicleHandbook which you would use to
study for the test is availablein two languages Spanish and
English.

Speaker 2 (41:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (41:03):
And that's a state that is following FMCSA rules.
So maybe you understand Englishenough to have a conversation,
but not quite read it wellenough, or you comprehend it
better in Spanish versus English, I don't know where that line
is.

Speaker 2 (41:16):
apprehend it better in Spanish versus English?
I don't know where that line is.
If I go into Ontario, where I'mrequired to know French enough
to drive, I know enough Frenchthat I can actually read their
signs and I can get through theprovince fine.
But if I get an officer thatwants to sit there and have a
conversation with me in French,I'm screwed, I can't do it so

(41:37):
there is that point of do youknow enough to legally be able
to operate Versus proficientlyoperate?

Speaker 5 (41:42):
Texas offers the same option for Spanish or English.

Speaker 1 (41:44):
Oh, I bet.

Speaker 5 (41:45):
Ohio might even.

Speaker 2 (41:48):
What a great conversation.
Here's my issue.
Do you think?

Speaker 1 (41:51):
other states are going to follow this.

Speaker 2 (41:53):
I don't know, but here's my issue Of Checking for
Spanish, checking for Englishproficiency and pulling people
over and randomly checking that.
Now it's up to the discretionof the officer to determine
whether or not you're proficientor not, which means if you get

(42:15):
a racist cop who doesn't likeMexicans, driving to their state
you're screwed.
You get a cop with a thickaccent you can't understand to
begin with, absolutely, even ifyou are English and that's
happened to me in SouthLouisiana with people I would
consider my own Like I justcan't understand what you're
saying.

Speaker 1 (42:30):
Right.

Speaker 2 (42:30):
Like speak slower.
Think about Ed Origen Edgeron,edgeron, coach.

Speaker 3 (42:35):
O, how many times did we watch him on the news going
like what did you say?
Now, like, imagine him being apatrol officer pulling somebody
over while you're have aconversation while you're
already nervous.

Speaker 1 (42:48):
So if, if a dot officer is pulling someone over
hypothetically for this new lawand they're giving, let's say,
english proficiency test of somesort that they've now got, do
you still have to meet the othercriteria to be put out of
service and fined?
Or are they just putting youout of service because you don't

(43:10):
have English as a proficiency?

Speaker 2 (43:12):
Do you see where I'm going?
Yeah, it sounds like if youdon't have English as a
proficiency, that's it, you'restopped.

Speaker 1 (43:18):
So it doesn't matter about visas or anything else,
it's just English proficiency,because that's included in their
loan.

Speaker 2 (43:25):
Yeah, and in this situation if you don't have a US
.
So the English proficiency Ihave an issue with.
The second thing I have anissue with is your visa from
Mexico no longer being valid.
Your visa from Mexico no longerbeing valid Because if the
federal government, the federalFNCSA, has said, as a country,
we are going to allow thisprogram to happen, you can come

(43:45):
here with your Mexican CDL,under this visa, do everything
right and you can run the UnitedStates Interstate Highway
System.
Then one particular statesaying you can't do it while
still collecting federal moneyto maintain their interstates
and highways, that's a problem.

Speaker 1 (44:07):
I see.

Speaker 2 (44:08):
Yeah, now you are screwing with interstate
commerce, which is something youcannot do.
Now they give California a lotof leeway.
They give California a lot ofleeway with that.
Give California a lot of leewaywith that, but they do stop a
lot of that stuff based oninterstate commerce.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
That's interesting.
Jerry, you've got thoughts Isee them.

Speaker 4 (44:27):
I was just thinking I don't want to get political.
It's kind of along that line.
It's hard not to in this wholerealm because this whole realm
because but I was just curiousif this has recently came out
because of the recent actionsthat trump just did place in
english as the official language.

Speaker 2 (44:45):
Well, this came out in february, so I don't think
that that had happened yet.
I'd have to go double check mytime frame, but I don't think so
I'm on a website called billchart bill track.

Speaker 5 (44:56):
Uh, that is actually talking about this bill
specifically.
The draft was released onFebruary 24th 2025.
The last action on this wasFebruary 25th 2025, and it's in
committee still, so it hasn't.
There's been no update.
But if you go toBillTracker50.com look up AR-50.

(45:18):
Hb 1569, you can read theentire text of the bill there to
get a little bit of anexplanation of what's going on,
and some of the things that wetalked about that we're
speculating on could certainlybe in that full text of what
they have to do.
If they have certain criteria,are they asking certain

(45:40):
questions, looking forparticular answers?
As opposed to just, um, notrandomly, but okay, we'll go
with randomly can't think of theword randomly having trying to
have a conversation withsomebody and they can't
understand that conversation.
It's kind of like a, a fieldsobriety test, right where you
have to.
You have to be trained to do itfirst of all, and then you are
looking for certain responses toyour your test and that type of

(46:02):
thing versus just oh, this guycan't speak English because I
asked him who's the bestfootball team in the land and he
answered Alabama and not theRazorbacks.
Well, he doesn't understandwhat I'm asking him.
You know that kind of thing.

Speaker 1 (46:17):
Makes sense.
I'm excited to kind of notexcited.
I'm interested to see where itgoes, how it dials in, if it
helps anything.

Speaker 2 (46:29):
If it goes.
I mean, like you said, it's incommittee.
A lot of bills die in committee.
A lot of bills never make itout of committee, you know.

Speaker 1 (46:36):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:37):
So it's possible.
A lot of times when I seethings like this, I can't help
but wonder what happened.
I think you were mentioning,like how much of a hassle is
this?
Did someone from acongressman's territory our
district rather get killed orhurt by someone working under?

Speaker 4 (47:03):
a visa and that's why this got done I, I don't, I
don't know I think it also stemsoff of something you touched on
a minute ago.
Is, I don't know, just in myopinion, racism sure there's.
There's arkansas is the raciststate there is.
It's a fact.
You can look it up.
They have the racist, mostracist county in all of the

(47:25):
entire US.
Me and Don drove through thereonce and I swear to God there
was a billboard sign that saidwhere white families thrive.

Speaker 2 (47:33):
I have seen that.
Actually, I didn't know whatyou were talking about it's
coming from a state.

Speaker 4 (47:39):
That's the reason why that's in my head.
It's coming from a state thatalready has these pretenses and
it's just like they're taking itfurther.

Speaker 3 (47:50):
In cases like that, I don't think it should be a
trooper or the person who pullsthem over at their discretion,
whether they're guilty or notyeah there needs to be some.
There needs to be someframework.
Did you do this?
Yes, no.
Can you do this?
Yes, no.
Can you do this?
Yes, no.
There's going to be an Englishtest.
Can you answer these questions?
Do you understand what thesesigns?

Speaker 1 (48:12):
mean Very black and white, not based on somebody's
opinion or feeling.
Yeah, I like that Well again,it interested me.
Actually, I saw more than onereel.
There's a YouTube channel outthere or a handle or whatever.
He's pretty big in the truckingcommunity and has a podcast and

(48:34):
he talked about it today.

Speaker 5 (48:36):
Oh, I hate that guy.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
But again.

Speaker 5 (48:41):
I know who you're talking about.

Speaker 1 (48:41):
Yes, again I just was trying to educate myself.
So can we switch gears just fora second, because I have
another question.
Sure, so I'm from Oregon, aseveryone knows, and in a year

(49:02):
last year, I believe it was.
It might have been a yearbefore, and I'm going to preface
this with.
I know that the Outer Beltdoesn't like to talk about death
, but we're going to talk aboutit because I do have a question.
There was a truck driver thatunfortunately killed seven farm
workers in Oregon.
On the side of the road theywere kind of at a rest area and
this truck driver just blewthrough and unfortunately killed

(49:26):
seven of them.
He was recently sentenced thisweek to 48 years, and that's not
my question.
He admitted to being—here.
This is what I want to know.
He testified at his trial thathe had the effects of drugs he
took the night before the crashhad worn off and he had knotted

(49:47):
off at the wheel.
Traces of methamphetamines,fentanyl and morphine were found
in his blood after the crash.
My question is how often arecompanies doing randoms and how
are these types of drugs?
Because, from what I understand, these may be lasting your
blood system a little longerthan normal.
How are these slipping throughthe cracks.

(50:12):
My other question would be isif they are getting reporting to
the clearinghouse, are therestill companies that hire people
who have been negativelytargeted on the clearinghouse?

Speaker 5 (50:28):
Maybe I didn't say that I can't answer your second
question of how long thesethings stay in your system.
I don't know.
We talked a few months backabout the requirements of motor
carriers to test their fleet,and a motor carrier is required
to test 50% of their fleet everyyear.
Now it doesn't mean if I have100 drivers, I have to test 50
of them every year.
It means that I have to do 50random tests every year and

(50:51):
there could be drivers that aregetting two and three tests in
that course of a year that makeup that 50 because it truly is
random, right?
Does that make sense?
Sure, so they're required totest at least 50 percent of
their drivers every year.
So that's how 50 percent don'tget tested and slip through, and
it could be 55 percent becauseof those people.

(51:14):
They got tested, testedmultiple times because they came
up randomly.
Um, as far as the, the, theclearinghouse, is concerned,
when you have a failed test, afail to test or a failure to
test, or a.
DUI.
Then your name goes in theclearinghouse and a company, a
carrier, is not permitted tohire you unless you've gone

(51:38):
through a SAP program through aSAP program.
So they have to.
The carrier is required toquery the clearinghouse during a
pre-employment screen, sothey're querying the
clearinghouse.
They're pulling your drivingrecord and the other things that
they're doing your criminalbackground if they do that.

(51:59):
So, all those things are beingdone and if you come up negative
or not eligible on theclearinghouse, they cannot hire
you until you go through thosesteps.

Speaker 1 (52:09):
So I have a couple questions.
Do any of you, just looking forfeedback, feel that the random
should be randomly across yourfleet as opposed to multiple
people?
And I realize that's not sorandom if it's random?

Speaker 5 (52:24):
no, because it makes it easier for someone for them
to target someone because theydon't like particular person and
say, oh, this is a random,we're going to take you again it
also makes it easier to protectpeople so exactly you know.

Speaker 2 (52:39):
I know that eric takes uh drugs that he won't
pass.

Speaker 1 (52:43):
So I just make sure that he's not part of it For his
health.

Speaker 5 (52:49):
No, he's just talking in general.

Speaker 3 (52:51):
I was talking in general, he's not being specific
.

Speaker 2 (52:54):
Yeah, correct.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
But what if you just did a drug test last week and
now it's this week's random andyou come up again?
Shouldn't there be some kind ofa something in place that says
they've had one in the last 60days?

Speaker 5 (53:06):
Because they may have , so you can maybe test those
other people who could be using.
That person may have passedthat drug screen yesterday Sure
and gone out today and got highas a kite.

Speaker 1 (53:16):
Which is fine.

Speaker 5 (53:17):
No, it's not fine, that's bad.
I mean not fine, that's notwhat I meant.

Speaker 1 (53:21):
What if the random your guy that's using
methamphetamines on all the timebut he's never got a random and
he's worked for your companyfor years.

Speaker 2 (53:27):
So everybody gets a pre-employment drug screen too.
So you got to remember thatEverybody has to have a drug
screen to come in.

Speaker 1 (53:37):
I just thought it was and this is I'm not trying to
be controversial I just thoughtit was odd that he admitted to
being under these and I'm likethere are so many checks and
balances out there that I knowI'm aware of.
How did one slip through?
And we're not just talking likehad some beers the night before
at the truck stop or you knowwhatever.
But I mean this guy was underquite a bit and I'm like how do

(54:01):
we in the trucking industry, howdo you not have that?

Speaker 2 (54:06):
Well, I think if you've ever spent time around
people who use and abuse drugs,you know they're very, very good
at hiding it.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
Sure.

Speaker 2 (54:14):
So if they're very, very good at hiding it, how do
we know he wasn't randomly drugtested just a month ago and had
a fake sample?

Speaker 4 (54:24):
That's true, just a month ago and had a fake sample,
or you know.

Speaker 2 (54:25):
I mean, there's so many things that people do to
hide their tracks and there's somany ways they get around.
My thing is if he killed sevenpeople with all that in his
system, why do you only get 48years?

Speaker 5 (54:39):
That's the real injustice.

Speaker 2 (54:43):
That's the real injustice.
I mean if a driver is working asnormal and something
catastrophic happened and theylost control of the vehicle but
it was completely out of theirhands Blown tire, tire, a blown
tire or something like that ThenI see either no sentence or, if

(55:05):
it's something that's like hewas talking about you just
merged or something and barelydid something that caused an
accident like that Then that'swhere those smaller offenses
come in.
If you're under the influenceof drugs and you kill those
people, I get that.
It's not murder, right, becausemurder is intentional, but it

(55:27):
is manslaughter, and sevenpeople's manslaughter.
That's funny, that should be, Imean.
Yeah, I just thought it wasQuite a bit higher.

Speaker 1 (55:37):
My takeaway because again I've been following it was
how he admitted to so much andI'm like but there is, there
seems to be.

Speaker 2 (55:46):
Well, him admitting it makes sense, because he's
already busted right.

Speaker 1 (55:48):
So many checks and balances, but yet we're missing
some Is there.

Speaker 5 (55:54):
But we're always going to miss some in a system
where we're only testing 50% ofthe carrier's fleet In a random,
but they are being tested aheadof time.

Speaker 2 (56:02):
And we used to be only 25%.
Yeah, I mean they doubled it.

Speaker 5 (56:05):
Do you think it should be?

Speaker 2 (56:05):
more.

Speaker 5 (56:06):
Well, it gets to be a cost-benefit calculation, right
when what's it cost to test100% of your fleet and how often
do you test them?

Speaker 1 (56:17):
Once a year Deceased people Twice a year.

Speaker 2 (56:19):
Well, not only that, but you've got well.

Speaker 5 (56:22):
we can't Do you test everyone before they get in
their truck.
They pee in a cup and you testit before they can go on the
road.
I mean, that's really the onlyway you're going to stop it.
But then once they stop an hourdown the road and shoot up or
you know whatever, yeah, youknow.
So what's that program?
Look like that you use to stopthem.

Speaker 2 (56:44):
Yeah, and there is risk, I think, analysis that we
all do on a daily basis.
Sure and we decide we're goingto jump in our car and go to
Kroger, or we're going to take along road trip or whatever.
Like we all accept a certainlevel of risk because we have to
work.
We have to make money, we haveto get groceries, we have to do
those things right and chancesare we're going to be fine.

(57:06):
But there's still some riskassociated with that.
I'm not saying it's okay thatthis happened.
It's not.
And again, I don't think thepunishment necessarily makes
sense for the crime.
That happened happened, um, butat what point?

(57:27):
How you know, how do youcontrol, how do you handle?
all that kind of stuff so I meanyou've got two, two big
implements and you've seen,every year we've seen drug
related offenses come down toget lower and lower.
So it is working.
But you do have the, thedoubling of the drug and alcohol
testing, and you do have ourdrug testing, rather not alcohol

(57:47):
drug testing, and you do havethe um, the clearinghouse sure
so now, repeat offenders can'trepeat offend yeah we can't slip
through yeah, which Iappreciate that there are huge,
huge improvements, but I meanyou still, there is always going
to be someone that's going toslip through the folds.

Speaker 1 (58:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (58:06):
There's no way to wrap everything we do in bubble
wrap and say it'll always beprotected.
You know we do what we can.
But just like you remember themovie Worth, I know you and I
talked about it.
If you haven't seen it, it's agreat movie.
We have talked about it, yes,they talk about how they value
the insurance companies valuethe life of an individual and it

(58:27):
was based around 9-11.
That same calculation ishappening on everything we do.
Sure Got something like this.
Like Vince said, there is acertain point where, if we make
things so expensive, no one canafford them, but we're
guaranteeing that no truckdriver ever is going to have
drugs in their system.
What's the point?
Because now all of a sudden wecan't buy things because you

(58:49):
can't get milk, because milk isa hundred dollars a gallon.

Speaker 5 (58:51):
Well, think about this too.
We don't drug and alcohol testpeople when they get their
driver's license to drive a caroh so we're talking about
testing CDL holders, which Irecognize that as a CDL holder,
I'm responsible for a really big, heavy piece of equipment that
can do a lot of damage.
As a car driver, I'mresponsible for a lot smaller

(59:13):
piece of equipment that can't doas much damage.
But how many people that areout there driving cars every day
are subject to random drugscreens?
Yeah, probably not a lot Notvery many.

Speaker 2 (59:26):
No, but how many?

Speaker 5 (59:27):
people are out there driving cars every day are
killing people because they'reout under the influence of
whatever it might be that'scausing them to be altered.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:38):
When it first happened I was really hoping.
You know like there's all thisspeculation of course that's
what people do but I was reallyhoping it was.
I reached for something.
I nodded off.

Speaker 5 (59:51):
Well, he did nod off.

Speaker 1 (59:52):
he said More, though, from lack of sleep.
My foot slipped off the brakeas I was trying to come into the
rest area.
I just thought it would be.
Sun was in my eyes, there was aglare, just something different
, but sadly it wasn't the case.

Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
I feel it's our nature as humans is to try to
make sense of a terriblesituation.
The airplane in Toronto thatflew from Minneapolis that
rolled over, I mean, for a week.
It was just tons of speculationfrom all the pilots and the
poor training and all this stuffall the way to the other side,

(01:00:29):
which is, oh, it's perfectlysafe.
And that almost almost to thepoint where they're like, well,
that really didn't happen.
You know what I mean?
Like it's really to the pointof like everything was perfect.
This is a fluke, freak accident.
It's like, well, planes don'tbreak their wings off and roll
over, based on everything wasperfect.
This was a fluke, freakaccident.
It's like, well, planes don'tbreak their wings off and roll
over.
Based on everything beingperfect Something happened.

(01:00:51):
So we try to rationalize andmake things better.
Unfortunately, in this case,sometimes evil prevails.
It's unfortunate, but it doeshappen.

Speaker 1 (01:01:03):
So drug screenings and clearinghouse are a good
thing in the current CDL world.
Yes, ma'am Good.

Speaker 3 (01:01:13):
Well, thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:01:13):
I appreciate you.
I know that wasn't on theagenda, but it piqued my
interest this week because I sawthe follow-through and just
didn't know if there could havebeen a way to catch that.

Speaker 2 (01:01:26):
You know, I saw the follow up with that too, but I
didn't take the time to read it.
So I saw he got sentenced, butI didn't know what, for I
thought it was a simplevehicular manslaughter.
I didn't realize.

Speaker 1 (01:01:34):
Which is what it was yeah Times 48 or times seven
people, which ended up being 48years.
But he did admit to.
Is that a 48-year minimum.
Wow, now that you mention that,I still have the article open
here.

Speaker 2 (01:01:51):
So I had a family member.
I won't say who it was, but Ihad a family member who did have
48 years and three months.
Okay, can you share thatarticle?
So, I had a family member thatwas found guilty of vehicular
manslaughter and it was asimilar case, with drugs in
their system and they were in acar, not a commercial vehicle,

(01:02:17):
and they were convicted of like20 years but like a minimum of
four or five.

Speaker 1 (01:02:25):
Right.

Speaker 2 (01:02:26):
And so that's why I was wondering is this a minimum
of four or five per person, andthen?

Speaker 1 (01:02:30):
but the maximum could be 110 years or what, but it
sounds like if you're sayingit's that exact number, it was
seven counts of second degreemanslaughter and three counts of
assault, as well as recklessdriving manslaughter and three
counts of assault, as well asreckless driving.

Speaker 5 (01:02:47):
The jurors acquitted him of driving under the
influence of intoxicants.

Speaker 2 (01:02:50):
So they thought it was low enough dosage out of his
system it says they foundtraces of meth, fentanyl and
morphine.

Speaker 5 (01:02:57):
But they say traces, they don't say how much.
Obviously, yeah, Gotcha.

Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
They say the crash was one of the state's deadliest
, which happened in May of 2023,when he ran into the van
carrying the 11 farm workersthat was parked on the I-5, on
the side of I-5, in anagriculture area of the
Willamette Valley.
So they must not have been.
I thought for some reason theywere in a rest area hysteria.

Speaker 2 (01:03:26):
Well, that does you know that, especially being
traced, as it does raise thequestion of if you're a drug
user and you cause an accident,but you are not under the
influence at that time.
Where does that play in?

Speaker 1 (01:03:36):
Oh, I think it definitely plays in.
How about?
All the well, this is myopinion.
Uh, we're Boy, we're being veryopinionated tonight, but what
about all the people maybe youdidn't kill on your way up there
that you could have potentiallykilled?
I don't think.

Speaker 2 (01:03:53):
But I'm saying, if you're not under the influence,
not under the influence, oh notunder the influence.

Speaker 1 (01:03:57):
Well, like Vince said , he was acquitted on that, so
it didn't play a factor into it.

Speaker 5 (01:04:02):
So digging a little deeper into the original story
from the Oregon PublicBroadcasting.
The article you sent me wasfrom the AP so it was summarized
a little bit.
The jury unanimously found thedriver guilty on seven counts of
second-degree manslaughter.
Each count carries a mandatorysentence of six years and three

(01:04:24):
months in prison.
He's also found guilty of threecounts of third-degree assault
and one count of recklessdriving.
They don't say what sentencethose requires.
So if we do six times seven is42.

Speaker 1 (01:04:35):
They're not doing them concurrently, they're doing
them consecutively, I wouldassume, since the reason you get
48 years, so 42.

Speaker 5 (01:04:43):
three months times seven is 21.
Two more years so yeah, justtwo more years, plus whatever he
got for the other two charges.

Speaker 2 (01:04:55):
So that is, it does sound like it's a minimum, it
does.
And you know what?
Has he been sentenced or has hejust been found guilty?
No, he's been sentenced.

Speaker 5 (01:05:02):
Okay, I swear they didn't say it, okay, so there
were a total of 11 people, 11farm workers, in the truck or in
the van that he hit.
So the seven are the firecharges.
The other three are the thirddegree assault.

Speaker 2 (01:05:19):
Oof, what a mess yeah .
What a mess yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:05:22):
Oof.

Speaker 1 (01:05:23):
This doesn't pay.

Speaker 2 (01:05:25):
It really doesn't To do drugs or alcohol.
Or sleep.
Go out of service or sleep.

Speaker 1 (01:05:29):
Or sleep deprived.

Speaker 2 (01:05:31):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:05:32):
Any of that.

Speaker 2 (01:05:32):
Sleepy.

Speaker 1 (01:05:33):
It's not worth the freight delivery.

Speaker 2 (01:05:35):
Tired and sleepy at the steering wheel is just as
dangerous as being intoxicatedSure.

Speaker 3 (01:05:40):
Yep, Yep.
Even our carriers that we workwith.
They make exceptions for peoplewho call in exhausted.

Speaker 1 (01:05:53):
When Vince and I were out there, that was definitely
our number one motto was safety,and the number one safety was
being asleep or rested.
You know, next would be likeweather if you're not feeling
safe, Because if you're notfeeling safe you're going to
have all that anxiousness.
That's weather typically, butthose were our number ones.
Definitely sleep.
Sleep was if you're not rested,it's just like being drunk or

(01:06:16):
intoxicated.

Speaker 2 (01:06:17):
Yeah, sleep's a big one.
I mean, it just takes onelittle doze off, and you're done
, you're done, that's it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:26):
Seven people on the side of the road.

Speaker 3 (01:06:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:06:28):
Well, I appreciate that.
Again, I know we don't like totalk about morbid things.
But it also involves theclearinghouse and random drug
screenings and all that.

Speaker 2 (01:06:39):
It's a reminder of what could happen right Again.
Everything is a risk analysisthat goes along with it.
As truck drivers, we'veaccepted a certain amount.

Speaker 1 (01:06:47):
But even as four-wheelers we do Agreed Well,
great conversation, you guys,tonight.

Speaker 2 (01:06:53):
I agree I enjoyed it.
It's been a lot of fun.

Speaker 1 (01:06:56):
I can't wait to watch how Arkansas plays out.

Speaker 2 (01:07:00):
Oh, I was thinking to myself like are they going to?
Beat the Razorbacks.

Speaker 1 (01:07:05):
What are you talking about?
We're not quite there yet.

Speaker 2 (01:07:09):
No, not quite there.
It's way too soon.
Well, it has been a lot of fun.
I appreciate our time, ourgroup therapy session, together.
I hope we were entertaining foryou all out there on the road.
Thank you for listening andwatching.
If you like us, hit thatsubscribe button.
Give us a thumb up.
Y'all out there on the road.
Thank you for listening andwatching.
If you like us, hit thatsubscribe button.
Give us a thumb up.
Share us on your social media.

(01:07:29):
If you don't like us, hit thatthumbs down sign twice.
Leave us a comment in ourreview and if there's anything
you want us to talk about,please let us know.
We said we were going to betalking more about Highfield
Last episode.

Speaker 1 (01:07:44):
Yeah, how's that research coming?

Speaker 2 (01:07:45):
It's good, but this episode's already gone pretty
long, so we'll save it for nextweek.
Got it, but we thank all ofy'all for being out there and
supporting us.
Jerry, what about forgetting?

Speaker 4 (01:07:59):
If you would like to send us an email, you can do
that at theouterbeltpodcast atgmailcom.
If you're interested inlearning more about high field
or joining high field, you cango to high field truckingcom.
You can also reach out to us onthere through our chat function
, monday through Friday from 8am to 6 pm Eastern Standard Time
.
You can also give us a call at833-493-4353, option one 1, or

(01:08:23):
833-HIGHFIELD.

Speaker 1 (01:08:26):
I'm ready to take your call.

Speaker 2 (01:08:29):
And if it's not, you.

Speaker 1 (01:08:30):
It'll be Delina.

Speaker 2 (01:08:31):
And if it's not, her.

Speaker 1 (01:08:32):
It'll be one of us to call you back.

Speaker 2 (01:08:35):
I'll answer no, you won't.
I won't, you're right.

Speaker 1 (01:08:37):
Actually it's going to be Delina, then me, and then,
if neither one of us answer,one of us will call you back.
That's the order.

Speaker 2 (01:08:45):
Love automation.
It's a beautiful thing, isn'tit?
Can't wait until we can replacethat with bots.
Anyways, ai, they don't callbots anymore, do they?
It's AI now.
Ai.
Anyways, alright, in themeantime, stay safe, make good
decisions.
Oh, I should have hit therecord button.

Speaker 5 (01:09:04):
Yeah you, good decisions.
Oh, I should have hit therecord button.
Yeah, you should have.
Don't leave money on the table.

Speaker 4 (01:09:10):
And keep those wheels of Tarnum.
Thank you.