Classic Episode: August 16, 2009 — Modern Mystic Walter Starcke - The Paracast — The Gold Standard of Paranormal Radio

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:12):
You've dared about the Powercast with your host is Jane
Steinbergha David Nay.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
Mister Beetney, you have discovered a fascinating guest for this
week's episode. Okay, can you tell us how this came
to be? Well, hopefully everybody else will.

Speaker 1 (00:32):
Think he's fascinating too, not just me, but yeah, serendipity
is how I found this guy. I often go through
YouTube looking for weird videos, partially for our Paracast TV
thread on the Paracast forums, and also partially because I
don't really watch much TV gene and instead I watch

(00:54):
videos on YouTube because there's a lot more esoteric, bizarre
things make a long story short, and looking through some
very specific topics that let's just say it might surprise
some of our listeners that I would potentially even be
interested in these topics. I happened to ponn a video
of a little bit of a talk by this guy,

(01:15):
Walter Starkey, and I'm listening to him, and I thought,
you know, this guy sounds incredibly intelligent. Now he really
comes from the more religious side of the world, or
at least that's what I thought until I started researching him,
and in doing that, Gene. It turns out that this

(01:35):
guy is one fascinating cat. Heal the people he's known,
the places he's been, and I have to tell you,
I read that he is like in his late eighties.
Now I'm looking at these videos of him, supposedly recorded
within the last few years, and the guy supposed to
be in his late eighties, and I'm looking at him, going,

(01:56):
there's just no way that this guy could be in
his late eighties. Looks like he's in his like mid
sixties or something. It just like blew my mind. And
so the more I read about him more I was
fascinated by him. And, like I said, Jean, some of
the stuff that he talks about, well, you know who
we reminded me of. He reminded me of Bernard Haitsch,
doctor Bernard hayschho we had on the show, who a

(02:18):
lot of our listeners really enjoyed, right astrophysicists, who has
this book to God theory and is looking for sort
of a synthesis of religion and science. At least that's
how I understood it when I read his book, and
it seemed to me that Walter is coming at it
from a slightly different angle it's more like he's looking

(02:40):
for the synthesis of religion and then science. But it's
not quite that straightforward. And in listening to this a
little bit of video on him, in doing some research
on him, some reading about him on the web, and
his life story, I thought, now, this guy you want
to talk about great stories. So in the same vein
as we had our UFO luminaries telling fascinating stories about

(03:03):
John Keel, let's have Walter come on and tell us
not only fascinating stories about his life. And this guy, man,
what a life he's had. I mean, really really amazing,
unique stuff. But in reading some of his work, I mean,
this is a guy who talks about religion and then
brings up metaphysics, and then brings up quantum mechanics, and

(03:25):
then Marlon Brando. You know, like, what Marlon Branda does
he have to do with any of this. Well, Walter,
in his life knew all of these really interesting people.
This guy has lived more than a few lives in
his lifetime. And I thought, this is a guy who
never shows up on shows like ours. Never. I mean,
I don't think the guy's ever I don't think he's
ever been on coast to Coast. I could be wrong

(03:47):
about that, but he certainly doesn't show up on any
of the paranormal shows Radars, and I thought, you know,
watching this is the kind of guy who we need
to have on the parent cast.

Speaker 2 (03:58):
Well, it's unfortunate that actually some of the people that
we talked to in our special John Keel memorial episode,
they don't show up on paranormal shows generally either. That's right,
And I can tell you that, you know Jerry Clark,
how often does he come on the shows we know?
Brad Steiger does, Jim Moseley seldom goes on those shows.
Lauren Coleman not so much. Kurt Southerly, who was an

(04:21):
old and dear friend, never does those shows.

Speaker 1 (04:24):
Yeah. No, we're you know, we have a unique little
place here. So let's get right to it. Let's go
talk to Walter absolutely coming up next on the Paracast.
I'm repeating, we're not in Kansas anymore.

Speaker 3 (04:43):
You've entered another dimension.

Speaker 1 (04:46):
You've entered para cast, Walter Starkey, like I was talking

(05:15):
about in a little preamble, I happen to find you
quite by accident. One of the very first words I
read associated with your name was metaphysics. So for people
who are perhaps not familiar with that term, could you
give us a working definition of metaphysics.

Speaker 3 (05:31):
Well, actually, the word really came into being one hundred
years ago, and it really meant at that time mind
over matter, you know, in other words, the power and thought.
And it's such a wide feel because some people make
a religion out of it, some look at it purely
some mental exercise. So meta mind physics, it's mind over

(05:54):
matter is what it really started out. And I think simultaneously,
scientists way back to Max Plank in nineteen fifteen said
that everything was consciousness manifesting in form. If you want
to change the farm, change the consciousness. Well, consciousness and
thought comes out of your consciousness. It's an expression of
your consciousness. So it's all sort of tied together. The

(06:17):
whole positive thinking thing.

Speaker 1 (06:20):
Came out of the same advent, So we're talking about
a synergistic way of looking at the universe. And you know,
in researching you, Walter, I was fascinated to find that
you were someone who was very deeply interested in the
writings of Pierre the Tailhart di Shardine. And I always
screw up the pronunciation of that name so you'll correct

(06:41):
me if I'm wrong, and I suspect I am.

Speaker 3 (06:43):
They used todaya or chardan to chardan, Okay, all right,
but I know that the des Shardan is almost was
almost sort of added on tailheart is really sort of
that that's his real last name.

Speaker 1 (06:55):
I in college had read a found in the library
college a book of his that had never been signed out,
and I ended up signing out this book. And it
really was the title. They say, don't judge a book
by its cover, but I judged a book by its title.
It was a book called Building the Earth. And I
saw that and I thought, you know, I need to

(07:15):
grab this and I need to read it. And even
though it came from a primarily religious point of view,
being someone who really at the time and to some
extent now still sort of self identifies as somewhat agnostic
with spiritual tendencies, but it's more complicated than that, I
started to learn that this man was a palaeontologist and

(07:36):
really was involved in some groundbreaking scientific work, but yet
was able to broach the world of religious thought. And
it seems to me, Walter, like you're someone who really
closely mirrors that in that you come from a bigger
world and were sort of led down a certain path.
And I'm wondering if you tell us a little bit
about where Walter Starkey comes from.

Speaker 3 (07:56):
You know, I was another sit in the Navy in
the Second World War, and then I went to New
York because I didn't want to come back to Texas
and conform. And the only thing I could fake my
way into women Before this happened, and I was taking
pills to cob pick me up and things to calm
me down. I was in terrible shape. And one night
I was down in the village. I was on my

(08:19):
way home, looking going to the subway, and I'd had
too much to know. I was drunk, and I got mugged.
I took my coat with the little money I had
in it, and I had enough change in my pocket
to get home, and woke up the next morning with
a black eye and a bruised face. So I couldn't
even go out and look for work. And it was
the strangest thing. It was like, I guess you'd call

(08:41):
it an epiphany, a damn opening up and all the
muddy water going out. And then it said to me,
and now study all the world's religions, and if you
can find truths to appear in all of them, then
you might might agree with those truths. But it really
went on as I came to discovery that I've not
been a religious person because I think most religions, in fact,

(09:05):
all I know of, have a pitfall. But I started
my search and to see central truths in life, and
that led me into most remarkable ways. And then after
that epiphany, success just came flowing in. I started out
as an actor in New York and played three Children
of Leagues on Broadway my first year, and then became

(09:26):
a producer, and I was the youngest producer ever to
win the Drama Critic Circle at that time by producing
I Am a Camera, which was made into the musical Cabaret.
I still get royalty some cabaret coming. Wow.

Speaker 1 (09:38):
Wow. And so it's just been a search for meaning,
you know, as we all seem to have. But now
you came to your path in sort of a unique way.
For example, one of your books is called It's All God. Obviously, Walter,
I don't need to tell you that when people hear
the word God, there are certain connotations that in people

(10:00):
sort of a very base response you know, some people
immediately project onto that word certain meaning. Other people project
onto that word certain certain nastiness. So what's your happening.

Speaker 3 (10:14):
I wouldn't have called it it's all God without the subtitle,
which is it's all God, the flowers and the fertilizer.

Speaker 1 (10:21):
You're right, you're right, Okay, Because I.

Speaker 3 (10:24):
Don't believe in God as something out there sitting on
a cloud, I go for it. I do feel there
is an ultimate truth. I do feel there is a
higher consciousness that's in all of us. And if for
shorthand you want to call it God, okay, But you know,
I'll tell you something. I have a club, well not really,
but it's called the TTP Club, and I think this

(10:47):
is all you need. You can throw away all the
religious stuff and all of that if you're just TTP
trust the process. I mean, life is a process, and
it's a fantastic thing. And either we trust this trust life,
oh we don't. And so when difficulties come up, we
just have to ask ourselves, do our trust the process?

(11:07):
Because if we do, we're really having faith in anything
that one might call God.

Speaker 1 (11:11):
When we talk about the process, we're talking about our lives.

Speaker 3 (11:14):
Right. Look, first of all, I'm a great believer in evolution,
not just the evolution from the one cellar meble that
ended up with this complicated human body. But we've had
the evolution of thought, We've had the evolution of spirit.
It's constantly growing, we're constantly advancing, and I have a
great trust in that. Now I'm going to get on

(11:36):
another subject. I'm particularly alive with it right now because
of a shift in two things. There's a shift in
consciousness which I think I never thought I would see happen.
When I had my epiphany and I saw the future,
I thought, oh, this is not going to happen, But
by golly, it's happening now. I'll talk about that shift

(11:56):
in a minute. And the other was a globalization. These
two things, well, now the shift is this. Always results
have been more important than how to get them. Getting
them is more important than how you did it. In
other words, the objective was more important than the subjective content.

(12:17):
In other words, people thought, well I want peace. Well,
if they're thinking objectively, then let's just kill everybody else
and now I'll be at peace. Well that doesn't make sense.
And now we have a shift, And to me, I
think that's the reason people are attracted to Obama because
first of all, he tries to look at the quality

(12:38):
of the decisions of the things that he wanted to say.
And then you may or may not agree with how
he goes about objectifying them, but subjectively you agree with
him because he's on the right side of good things.
And so I think that's the shift that's taking place now,
where the priority is changed, instead of the objective being

(13:01):
primary and the subject to being secondary, that we're shifting
to where this subjective is primary and the objective necessary. Now,
that is an absolute necessary thing if we're going to
have globalization. In September a year ago, when all of
the financial institutions of the world, all of them in

(13:21):
every country, unrelated to each other, all took a dump
on the same day, in the same way, that showed
us something. We're now living in a global society, a
global consciousness. No longer can we say well, we have
our own nation and we don't need anybody else. We're
all interlocked. Now. People don't even begin to realize yet

(13:46):
how this is affecting them individually. You know, in the past,
if my little toe was infected, I'd say, well, it's
way down there, so I don't care about it outside
out of mind. Well, now our little toe may be
people starving in Bosnia, and if we don't do something
about it, it could affect our whole leg and our
whole body of mankind. So this is I think this

(14:07):
is the most exciting, the most wonderful, most privileged time
to be alive that we've ever had.

Speaker 1 (14:14):
There are people, you know, it's interesting when you bring
up the concept of globalization. I remember being a young
child when Apollo leven landed on the Moon. There was
that moment, I mean, everybody was watching on television, and
there was that moment when it really felt like the
national boundaries that divide us most of the time, that

(14:35):
they really seemed to fall away. There was that moment
where it wasn't just an American stepping on for the
first time to the surface of another celestial body, but
it was it was humanity doing that. And I've always
contended that the most important single image of the twentieth
century was that infamous shot of the planet Earth and

(14:55):
space hanging there. You know, we had never had a
chance to look back in on ourselves like that realize, hey,
this is a very finite place and it's the only
place we have. There is no other room. There is
no place we can get in a car and drive to. Well,
if you know, if we screw this pool up, we'll
just go to the pool down the street. Now, when

(15:16):
we talk about a sense of a global consciousness, there
are some people who would say, well, you know, that's
now you're talking about one world order and there's kind
of a there's a negative connotation to that. Do you
know what I mean?

Speaker 3 (15:31):
Oh, sure, I know what you mean. To them, it
is because they look into self protectiveness, you know, and
self you know, fear. I don't care what kind of
fear it is, whether it's fear of change or whatever
it is. Fear is a lack of self love. Fear
says I don't have that within me that can take

(15:53):
care of this, no matter what it is. See, that's
why I say we've got to trust the process, because
it's out of our hands individually now and out of
our nation's hands individually. As a nation. We're all inunder locked,
our economies are, and the whole world is. And so
that's why a different ballgame. It's not accidental because with

(16:18):
the advent of the cell phone, the CNN and so forth.
So when everybody communicates, everybody in the world knows everything
is going on all over the world. My mother was
a little girl, her knowledge was as far as the
horse could go in a day, and now we can
circle earth a few times in a day, I mean,

(16:39):
and the impact on the natural psyche. But you talked
about yourself and the things that you saw on the
landing when you were a kid, Well, you were sensitive.
There are a lot of kids that weren't sensitive. They
didn't look at it that way. They just looked at
it as there's something that they saw on the news,
and they didn't look at the implication.

Speaker 1 (17:00):
See. I remember all my friends, we were talking about
it endlessly for days. I mean, it seemed to capture
all of our attention. And my parents, I mean, they
were the ones that really, you know, they made sure
that we knew all about it because it was a
once in a lifetime kind of thing. I mean, really,
were there people that didn't care.

Speaker 3 (17:21):
I don't want to believe that they cared. But when
you talked about it, you mentioned the subjective nature of it,
that you saw it as humanity doing it they had
as a person doing it, you know, they didn't see
it how it really related to them. They didn't see
the subjective nature of it. They just saw the objective occurrence.

Speaker 1 (17:42):
Now, that's interesting because you're almost putting those two words
on opposite ends of where we would normally think about them.
But I also noticed in your book that you do
that a lot, you know, when you talk about and
I want to you know, well, we brought you on
without giving you a tremendous amount of context for what

(18:04):
we do on this show and the things that we
talk about. And I thought that would be an interesting
sort of an exercise, because in the realm of paranormal research,
we become known as being very objective thinkers and really
trying to look at things from a scientific point of view.
I don't want to say we're taking a detour, but

(18:27):
we're going off in a bit of a tangent here
that we normally normally don't go off on. But one
of the reasons that we're doing it is because of
the things that I've heard you say. You know, you're
talking about religion being something that has held us back
from being one with the universe. I think that's really interesting,
and quite frankly, I think you're really onto something there.

Speaker 3 (18:47):
Well, it has from one thing. I mean, I've been
around the world five times. I've lived in zoom monasteries
into monasteries. I've seen it all and all, I mean,
all of the Rose religions the same. But I think
it was a flaw. They all admitted that there was
some sort of supreme being a la Brahm collective conscious

(19:09):
of whatever you wanted to call it. But they all
said that to get it, you had to get rid
of your humanity. And that's because that laid a guilt
trip on us. All religions lay guilt trip on because
they talked in terms of absolutes, and at this level,
that's why there is no such things as a paranormal.
It is our trying to understand things that we didn't

(19:34):
think were normal and discover that they really are normal.
It's just that they weren't normal because we didn't understand them.

Speaker 1 (19:42):
So give them the word paranormal.

Speaker 4 (19:52):
Hi, this is Don Ecker and you are tuned into
the Para Cast with Jen Steinberg and David Biedney. Hey,
let me tell you what you're going to hear Steph
here that you probably won't hear anywhere else. Hear that,
George Snory.

Speaker 2 (20:09):
We're talking with a very I don't know, unusual guest
for us, but certainly someone who has an interesting life story,
interesting experience.

Speaker 1 (20:18):
Walter's starting, and I want to thank you, Walter for
saying what you just said, because when I've always heard
the term supernatural and paranormal, to me, it's just an
emphasis about what we don't know about this universe. And
it really it's more of our problem with the fact
that we're human beings and we have to categorize everything.

(20:40):
So we put things that we know about in a
box and everything else is outside of us. And that's
sort of the same way you look at spiritual life, right,
I mean, what's your personal philosophy.

Speaker 3 (20:52):
Let's get right to Everything we've been talking about is
a lie. And I'll tell you what I mean by that.
It's word. It's about the truth. The truth can't be voiced.
It can only be experienced. See, it's like programming computer.
We can think about it, talk about it, put it
on paper, whatnot. But actually, if you don't experience it,

(21:15):
it's nothing. And that's where it's at. So that's why
I use the phrase third dimension and fourth dimension. Third
dimension is this level of time and space here now,
and it's limited. Fourth dimension is beyond personal sense, it's
the unlimited, infinite, and we only have moments of experiencing that.

(21:37):
But even the slightest moment sheds the lot of light
at this third dimensional level where we think, and somebody
might saying those experiences where you break through into the
fourth dimension are paranormal, Well, they're available, but many people
never experience it.

Speaker 1 (21:57):
How do you feel about the youth of chemistry to
enhance the quote unquote normal human experience. One thing that
keeps coming up when people talk about these topics is
that there are certain compounds that break down one's perceptive limitations.
Let's call them, and let's them see what some people

(22:19):
feel is an objective alternate reality. Now, I'm going to
imagine Walter, based on the little I've read about your
personal story, you've probably touched the face of the fire
of some of that stuff. And I'm wondering because, again,
given the kinds of interactions personal interactions you had with
some fairly well known people in the world of entertainment,

(22:41):
what's your thought about, for example, the use of hallucinogenic compounds.

Speaker 3 (22:46):
You know, I wrote a book called The Eulseeland Revolution,
and it was about a lot of it in the
hippie period and whatnot. And I had a chapter in
there on drugs and lucigemics and so forth. And all
of my friends I was living in Key West at
the time, who were into all of that, they all
read the chapter and said right on it was okay.

(23:07):
And I was on the art link letter probill I
won't go into that, and he asked me about it,
and his interviewers had interviewed me. Now he hadn't, but
his interviewers had, and on the air he said suddenly
he said, I understand you smoke marijuana. And he said, no,
I don't answer that. And he turned to the audience
and he said, tune in tomorrow and hear what he

(23:29):
has to say about it. Well, they'd asked me if
I'd ever smoked marijuana. I said, of course I have.
And I cried everything because when I wrote The Ultimate
Revolution and I had not done it, people said, well,
you've never done it. So when I got back home
to Key Wes, I decided to take a trip, and

(23:49):
so I did. I took some acid and it really
was a revealed something to me. That was in me
standing there watching the whole experience, because it was like
going to the top of the mountain where you saw
a supernaturalness and everything, you saw these other dimensions. So
it was okay with me. But for kids who have

(24:11):
not had a lot of experience, and they have this
mountaintop experience and then when they come down from it,
they haven't earned it. Because in life we usually say, well,
I can get to the top of that mountain. We
get there and we say, oh, my goodness, say the
valley in a higher mountain, Well, okay, I can get there.
And we get there and say, oh, there's a valley
in a high mountain, and we earn our development. And

(24:32):
sometimes when they're too young and they do it, they
see things that are too far from their reach and
so then their lives at this level become a mess.
So it's a tricky area. I knew Oldest Huxley quite well,
and he's sort of the Hindo the Vedanta monastery at
a time when I would visit there, and he was
a wonderful, wonderful man, and he opened the door for

(24:56):
the use of drugs in psychotherapy, not because when he
took mesculine. I admired the man, but even when I
was young and knew him, when I was in my
late twenties, I didn't want to train places with him
because his mind was so strong that he thought he
could understand everything. And when he took masculine for the

(25:19):
first time, something stronger than his mind took over. So
he was a really eye opener to him. As a
matter of fact, he died on acid. I mean not
that he took it a lot or anything, but on
his last wishes to help get out, he did. And
so that opened the door for all the psychologists if
the great Huxley would do it, you know, and it's

(25:43):
an experienced little field, and so it can possibly do
good and it can possibly do a lot of harm.

Speaker 2 (25:50):
Well, taking these substances, Welker, well do you think is
actually happening? Are you being exposed to something that's really
genuine place at genuine presence or is it all just
something in your head?

Speaker 1 (26:04):
Or is there a difference?

Speaker 3 (26:05):
Listen, the Hindus say that this life is an illusion,
Well it's not an illusion. Our interpretation of it is
an illusion, so we all your interpretation of it is
a difference than mine. Which is the truth. None of them,
probably as far as we humanly can understand. I think
some of those could open people up so that they

(26:29):
would them on their own search further, But ask to me,
is this when the scriptures say at the beginning in
Genesis that man and woman was created given dominion over
the world of effect, what does dominion mean? Dominion means

(26:51):
use everything, but don't be used by anything. So I
can go and have myself a couple of martinis, and
I'm not being used by the martinez. I'm using them.
But if I have to have that martini, I'm being
used by the martinis. And so it's the same with
chemicals and with lucinogenics or anything. I think anything can

(27:15):
be done if it's done in the right way, and
if you're in control. The toughest thing that people don't
want to hear because they want to blame a god
or government, or a husband or a wife or something,
is you create all the laws that operate your own life.
There's no outside influence laying a trip on you, if

(27:39):
any kind, you do it to yourself. If you could say, well,
my government, you empower the government to do that by
your belief and so this is a it's a terrifying
thing to take responsibility for your own life. But if
you don't like something in your life, you have set
it up. And so you've got to figure about how

(28:00):
to change your consciousness if you want to change the form.
And it's goodly scientific now manifest and.

Speaker 1 (28:09):
That's something that right, and I think it was on
the first chapter of It's All God, you bring up
quantum mechanics, which I think a lot of people who
might read your books might look at that and go,
what's this. I mean here, you're bringing up a branch
of physics in a book about spirituality, which, by the way,
is something that I think that we want to explore more.

(28:29):
I had just recently read The Conscious Universe by Dean Raydon.
I don't know if you're familiar with him, Dean Raydon.
It's a book called The Conscious Universe. I think you
would quite like it.

Speaker 3 (28:39):
Walter.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
Title is yeah, and there is a book you can
definitely judge by its title. It's actually it's quite excellent,
and it talks about the extension of what we know
to be science into realms that most people don't think
are scientific, but where he basically presents real hard evidence
to describe things like precognitive ability, psychic ability, things like telekinesis.

(29:08):
I mean things that we would normally think are or
not that we our audience would think is normal, would
normally think is nonsense because our audience is definitely thinking
outside of the box, as it were. But where most
people would look at that and say, well, that's just nonsense,
you can't prove that scientifically, And Raydon actually backs up

(29:28):
his statements with numbers, with experimental evidence that indicates that, indeed,
there is an interaction going on, sort of what I
like to think of as a dialogue going on between
us and the universe. But something you said before, Walter,
that is something that I've always had some issues with.
I'm going to throw it right out to you and
see how you respond. The idea that you control your life,

(29:53):
that you define the laws. And a friend of mine
my first year of college, my old dear friend, David Grooms.
I haven't spoke to you. It's going to in years.
The first hour we were talking to each other, he
said to me, I'll never forget this. He said, you
create your own reality.

Speaker 3 (30:07):
That's just what I said.

Speaker 1 (30:08):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely absolutely.

Speaker 3 (30:10):
Said you create your own law, your own nows, no no,
no other laws to work on you.

Speaker 1 (30:15):
That's right. But you know what I said to him, Walter,
and I'll say it to you now. I'm curiously how
you respond. I said to him, you know what, Dave,
that's all good and fine, But when your local star
goes nova or super nova, I contend that at that time,
at that point, you no longer create your own reality.
Your star decides your fate. What do you say to that.

(30:35):
I don't know what you mean by that star explodes.
Our star at a certain point gets to an age where.

Speaker 3 (30:41):
Yeah, but you know you have to finding whether you
are a body, personality, a temporary thing, or life eternal.
You know, we can never have or I ask you this,
can we have infinity minus anything?

Speaker 1 (30:57):
Mathematically we're not supposed to be able to know.

Speaker 3 (31:00):
All right, So there will always be a David. Your
body may leave, but the consciousness we call this individual
unique consciousness called David, will always exist because we can't
have infinity minus anything. So you know, I was thinking
this morning a statement that my saintly grandfather made an

(31:21):
a letter you sent me, and he said, life is real.
Life is I understand the grave is not the go
dust to the dust. The Returnist was not written of
the soul because I happen to believe. And it's again,
I can't think fourth dimensional things beyond me, but I
sent them. And I don't feel like I just came
along eighty nine years ago, and I just don't feel

(31:42):
like I'm going to leave in a couple of more
years from now. There's some continuity and I don't know
what it is, but that's what I believe now. If
that's my nova that shoots off into space.

Speaker 2 (31:53):
Okay, So what would be the theory of say, when
you die in this reality, you're in another reality and
people can call it heaven, but maybe it's just Walter Starkey,
David Biedni and Geen Steinberg continuing on, and maybe we
died in twenty seven different realities and now we're on
reality number twenty eight.

Speaker 3 (32:13):
Well, you know, I don't believe, as some of the
Oriental religions that you sort of go back into just
a big pool where you lose your identity. You're just
part of this mass. That's the reason why I'm afraid
of a suicide, because I'm afraid that I may be
worse off if I do it and don't learn the

(32:36):
lessons that I'm here to learn now, and I put
them off and I escape. I'm not committing suicide, even
though my desire for suicide is the desire to live
not die. I feel like I'm living dead now and
I want to get out of here. And so we
just have to kind of sense these things now, you.

Speaker 1 (32:56):
Know, Walter, people who have listened to this show regularly
know about one of my experiences, one of my anomalous
experiences that involved my mother's passing, and she and I
had had an agreement that if she could somehow give
me some sort of sign of continuance, that she would.
And I've told this story on the show before. I

(33:17):
won't retell it now. At some point you and I
will talk and I'll tell you about this. But actually,
my mother did exactly that. She actually was able to
give me not just some sort of secondary evidence, but
she gave me direct physical evidence of continuance beyond this
corporal existence, and also mixed it in with the idea

(33:40):
that she retained her identity. So what you said before that,
David as me. You know that I don't somehow cease
to exist after this body goes. There are a lot
of people who consider themselves skeptical thinkers who would say, well,
that's just whoey. I'm not one of them. I actually,
and I've come out about this on this show. I've

(34:02):
said that my mother was able to provide to me
physical evidence of a continuance where she actually retained her
sense of identity, and I've actually found great comfort in that.

Speaker 3 (34:14):
I'm going to tell you my mother's story. I was
very close to my mother, and when she died, I
felt a loss. And for months I felt a heaviness
because I was very close to her, and all of
a sudden that heaviness lifted, and I thought, well, that's strange.
And two days later I got a letter from a

(34:38):
woman on the East coast that I know very well
and a woman on the West coast that I know
very well, and they don't know each other at all,
and both of them said, your mother has been hanging
around because she's been worried about you, but she knows
you're going to be all right now, so she's gone
on that it lifted, and so I had I had

(35:01):
to believe that there was something to it. I mean,
I don't understand it. But must be there. Now.

Speaker 1 (35:07):
You've had, as we've intimated before, and Walter, you've had
a really interesting life. Now one of the things that
you've written a book about, and I started your people
sent me three of your books, and I started reading
all three, actually simultaneously. Apparently I started with the one
I should have ended with first, and I'm sort of
like that. But one of the books they sent me

(35:28):
was about your experiences, your many years working very closely
booked with someone by the name of Joel Goldsmith. And
I'm hoping that you can you can fill in our
because I don't know that any of our listeners have
ever heard of this man. You're in the paracast with

(35:58):
Gene Steinberg and David Ban You never know what's going
to happen.

Speaker 2 (36:02):
Next, we're talking to Walter Starkey, a modern mystic. And
now let's have the answer to the question.

Speaker 3 (36:13):
Joel who has He wrote thirty five books that are
still in print. He died though a long time ago.
I can have eight years right now, and I studied
with him, and then finally I had a difficulty because
he was very absolutist, absoluteist. Lay a guilt trip on
you because I think absolutes are good to aim at

(36:36):
because we get further than we would if we didn't
dam at them. But if we believe we can achieve
them at this less than absolute level, we lay a
guilt trip on ourselves. So I'm against that. And the
one thing that's most important to have said earlier is
self love. And as long as your guilt is the enemy,

(36:57):
and it is the one thing that I'm you know,
rapidly against. But I am indebted to this man, Joel Thosmith,
because he was what you would call a mystic, and
mysticism simply means, you look it up in the dictionary,
the ability to contact the divine center within yourself, nothing

(37:18):
to do with some god out there. It's what we
call mystics anybody who's religious, But that's not what a
mystic is. A mystic believes that he can experience his
own godliness, not something out there. And so he projected
into me that not only that possibility, but that reality.

(37:38):
And now I'm a great advocate, not for any religious
reason at all, for meditation. At ninety eight, everybody's always
not believing my age. Well, Deepak Choker says that meditation
is the best anti aging thing possible. Well, I've been
meditating since I was in my twenties every morning, not

(38:01):
for some superstitious thing to appeal to some god out there,
but gimply to drop the finite sense of self, to
drop personal sense. It's like taking a psychic bath every
morning to get rid of the things that I've taken
on during the last twenty four hours, and then going
within and listening. You know. One of the greatest bad

(38:24):
things we have is that little children are intuitive. Then
we send them to school and the first thing they
try to do is kill their intuition, and they don't conform,
you know. And when religious people talk about this still
small voice, that's all they're talking about. And we all
should listen to our own intuition and trust it because

(38:44):
it knows what we need. So every morning I get
quiet and turn it in and listen, you know. And
we should also, I believe we should dialogue with ourselves.
I'll ask my higher self, well, what do you think
about this? And then I said, listen to hear what
my higher self will tell to me my lower self.

Speaker 1 (39:06):
We live in such a media saturated culture Walter, where
you know, the notion of quiet time is something that
people don't take time for. So how did you get
into the habit of doing this daily meditation? Before you
answer that, I just want to tell people that, Well,
I saw these videos of you on YouTube and you
stated I think these videos are a couple of years old.

(39:28):
So at the time you were eighty seven years old,
and I'm looking at you talking, I'm thinking, there's just
no way this guy is eighty seven years old. It's impossible.
I've never seen an eighty seven year old with that
kind of energy who looks so relatively youthful, and Walter,
I still don't believe it. Are you really like eighty
nine years old? I mean, that's amazing. Really truly, my whole.

Speaker 3 (39:49):
Life really is. In my title of my first book,
The Doubles read, I don't think anything out here is
either or I'm not a man a man of God.
I'm both, so forth and so on. So we always
have two things. For instance, if I have a candle
flame which is my spirit, and I take it outdoors,
it'll blow out unless it has a shield. If it

(40:11):
can't exist without the shield, well, then the shield is
every bit, every bit is important as a flame. Well,
my body is the shield and I've always taken care
of it. Right now. I have a trainer I go
to once a week. I go to the gym at
least two times a week, you know. I work at
it and eat fairly healthy, drink a little too much wine,

(40:33):
but otherwise, And so we've got to live holistically. And
when I talk about globalization, that applies to our own
body too, because we have so many different conventions the
mental possession. And when I say spirit, I'm not talking
about anything religious. There is a spirit in every word

(40:53):
you say. Somebody else can say the same sentence you
say and there say it with poisonous spirit, or you
can say it with a loving spirit.

Speaker 1 (41:02):
You know.

Speaker 3 (41:03):
And so the spirit is simply the spirit in which
you face life. And I've always faced life with a
very positive spirit, you know. I just refuse so that
stress have its way. And those things all add up. Well.

Speaker 1 (41:16):
I know that some of our listeners are probably thinking, boy,
if only David would listen to this guy, and Gene
is probably Gene probably has some of the same issues
I do. I mean, we, you know, Walter on the show.
One of the things that we're known for. We sometimes
have people on who make what we consider to be
outrageous claims about certain things, and we take them to task.

(41:38):
And I know that I specifically, you know, Gene is
kind of like the good cop and I'm the bad cop,
and people will take me to task. Why don't you
have to be so mean with that person? And you know,
usually what I say to people is that, look, I
take these topics seriously. When there are people who make
a mockery of them, it bothers me on a personal level.

(42:00):
Am I taking stuff too? Am I taking stuff too? Personally? Walter?
How do I sort of disconnect or maybe tone down
that part of me to be more accepting, Because I'll
tell you, like Gene, I'm a native of New Yorker.
We're both native Brooklynites. And there's a thing, it's like,
it's a genetic thing that when faced with BS stuff

(42:22):
that's like really obviously just nonsense, we get emotional. I
certainly get very emotional about it, Gene to a lesser degree,
but Jane does as well. Are we doing something wrong?

Speaker 3 (42:31):
Well? You know, I take the words of the world's
most famous rabbi as a philosophy that's very sound Jesus,
because he was a rabbi and in Luke. He says,
forgive seventy siven to seven if they repent on that
makes it. I have a lot of difference than these
Christians who think, well, Jesus should put our arms around

(42:54):
the son of a b and forgive him. That's bad
because then you become an enabler. Getting back to what
you said, when I see someone violating the principles of love,
I'll come testimon it. I mean, I won't just forget
it and be an enabler and say, bump against it
and change. Fine. If they don't, I'll shake the dust

(43:15):
from my feet. But I believe we all to stand
up for the things we believe in, whether they're right
or wrong or else. We're woolding ourselves and we stand
up eaten for the wrong things. That's why I say
everybody's religion I honor because it is their highest sense
of truth. And that's what I honor, everybody reaching out

(43:35):
to the highest sense that they can, even if it's
the wrong one.

Speaker 1 (43:38):
As far as concern, So, the intent is what you're
looking at. Really, Yes, you.

Speaker 3 (43:44):
Hit the word. That's the word intent.

Speaker 1 (43:47):
That's the important word, okay, because you know when you
look at intent, I mean there are some people. I
guess it's all about point of view. And this actually
brings me to something else about the writing of yours
that I've read Walter and the throw kind of it's
not kind of a left field question. But there's a
cult movie that a lot of younger people tend to like.

(44:08):
It's called Donnie Darko. I bring it up because in
the movie there's a scene where there is this sort
of a motivational speaker. Actually it's played by Patrick Swayzey,
who I understand is very sick right now, and he's
talking to a classroom and he's basically saying to them, Okay,
here's how everything works. You've got He's got a scale.

(44:30):
He says, on this end, you have fear, and on
this end you have love. And you're either in one
place or the other. And the main character of the
movie basically says, hey, you know, things aren't that straightforward.
It's not a binary world. There's lots of shades of
gray in between. What's your how do you feel about that?

Speaker 3 (44:49):
You know, we have to look at it in terms
of energy. The thing that people don't understand thinking love
isn't it feeling love? Sends out an energy, and there's
low voted enterity. There's different degrees higher energy, lower energy.
It's not just an energy period. And so I do

(45:09):
believe that at this level nothing is complete by itself.
We have to look at everything in terms of the
what and the how, or the here and the there
in order to get a holistic picture. And if there's
anything you wish to achieve, you say, well, now, what

(45:29):
do I need to add to this in order to
achieve it. So there are a lot of things that
you know, I don't believe in law. I believe in grace.
In other words, I believe everything's constantly moving and law.
People created their Old Testament with all of its laws
because they didn't trust themselves. They needed guidelines to depend

(45:55):
on rather than their own sense of self. And I
think that's also symbolic what the New Testament stood for,
because he said, you know, take the first commandment and
throw the other nine paranoid doll shalt not commandments away,
and add until the first or second love your neighbor,
love cause, and love effect. And if you can love
both of them, And so that means look right out

(46:17):
here at the world of effect and don't see it materially.
This again is why I'm really all for Obama, because
he really incorporates both. He's very practical, he's got a
brilliant mind, but he looks at seek you first, the
kingdom of God, seek you first, the subjective nature, and

(46:37):
that's what he does, and I think we should in
our own lives. There again is why meditation is to
me important because I programmed my day. You know, it's
like this. I meditate to get the music going. If
you've ever worked in any place that has musaic, you
forget that the music's playing until it stops, and then

(46:58):
you say, well, what's up all the music? So I
get the music going in the morning and then I
don't think about it, you know. But when I began
to feel poisonous, I said, oh the music stopped, which
brings me up another subjects. I'm gonna stick it in
real quickly. That is, we've got to be aware of pollution.

(47:18):
We pollute ourselves innocently. Now. I've just recently realized this
in this respect because I went to that movie The
Wrestler because the guy was up for Academy Award. Yeah, yes, yes,
And when I left the picture, I was in terrible shake.
I was feeling awful and angry, and I snapped at
my friend about something and so forth. But the thing

(47:41):
was because I had taken on into my consciousness this
poisonous anger, this physical torture, and so for for two hours,
and I was polluting my spirit.

Speaker 2 (47:55):
It's a movie about somebody who undergo an incredible amount
of torture.

Speaker 3 (48:00):
Yeah. Yeah, And so I think it's the same way
about people. Is there people around you is to poisonous
that you don't like? Walk away? Be polite, but walk away,
and that includes members of your own family. If they're that.

Speaker 2 (48:16):
Way, isn't there no way to convert them to something
a little less unpleasant?

Speaker 3 (48:22):
I think we can voice something, but we're not our
brother's keeper. We're not responsible for making someone change it.
They've got to go through their own evolution. But we
can hold out. We can point out the truth to them,
and if they accept them, fine, they say, don't fine,
It's not just to be hitlers and decide that we

(48:44):
want to make the whole world serve us or what
we think is right.

Speaker 1 (48:49):
Yeah, I'm going to offer you as an antidote to
the wrestler. Walter, the director who did that is one
of my personal favorites. His name is Darren Aronofsky. He's
truly brilliant and the fact that that movie disturbed you
so to me, indicates that Aaronovsky achieved sort of what
he wanted to a couple of things. Never see his
second movie called Requiem for a Dream, because it will

(49:11):
screw you up for months, So don't ever watch that.
But I would strongly recommend that you consider watching his
third movie called The Fountain, which is almost the spiritual
antithesis to The Wrestler and will leave you. And you
might not think of think that about ten minutes into

(49:32):
the movie, but trust me on this, by the end
of it it will you will have a different appreciation
for Aronofsky's work. He's very intense about what he does.

Speaker 3 (49:43):
And the rest name of that last movie, The Fountain,
the Fountains at least it had been out a while.

Speaker 1 (49:52):
It came out a couple of years ago, and it
was one of those very polarizing movies that a lot
of people felt was almost too metaphysical in nature, but
that some of us just worship. It's beautiful, un beautiful
and really what it is in Aronofsky's films, have all

(50:12):
been what I would categorize as ruminations. His first film,
which is called Pies, is a rumination on the nature
of you know, I was describing this to someone yesterday.
I forgot exactly how I described it. Requiem for Dream
a rumination on the nature of addiction, The Fountain of
rumination on the nature of death and love. And The

(50:38):
Wrestler is a rumination on the nature of celebrity. Yeah,
they each have and they're all very deep in how
they approach their topics. Oh, I know what. The Pie
is a rumination on the nature of curiosity. Yes, but
it is also a very difficult picture, and the ending

(51:03):
left a lot of people very confused, though I've never
thought his work was confusing at all. He's just a
very It's one of those directors that he's all about intensity.
So I'm not surprised you walked out of The Wrestler
feeling very upset and angry. I think that's exactly what
he tried to achieve. But that leads me to another question. Movies.

(51:24):
What's one of the most uplifting movies you've ever seen?

Speaker 3 (51:28):
Oh? Goodness, I don't know. Out of Africa, I don't
know that I know particular actors better than the movies.
I go see anything Meryl Streets, and I think she's
such an incredible actress. I just offhand, I can't exactly remember.

Speaker 1 (51:45):
What did you think about Doubt? Did you see Doubt?

Speaker 3 (51:47):
Oh? Yes, I thought it was excellent there again Street.
You know, because she can put so much into the thing.
I mean, even the evil of that woman, she had
a sense of despite all her evilness.

Speaker 1 (52:03):
You know, the movie had a lot of evil in
it actually, but you see the thing is I like.

Speaker 3 (52:10):
That movie because I thought it was exposing the evil
and making people really value what was right and good
and noble. And the actor, whatever his name is, he's
so tremendous.

Speaker 1 (52:24):
Philip Seymour Hoffmann, Yeah he is. Yeah, Oh yeah.

Speaker 3 (52:30):
I think I was attracted to the theater to begin
with for spiritual reasons. If you can create a drama
on the film or on the stage that is so
real that for two hours, laugh and cry and take
it as reality, that means that you can break this
twenty four hour reality just as well that this is

(52:51):
continuous soap opera. I really think life is a soap opera.
I mean, I don't understand it I'm playing in it.
And what's more, I talked to New York. I usually
speak in New York about once a year, and I
was up at Symphony Space a year or so ago,
and the title of my talk was the Gospel according

(53:11):
to Tallulah, because the last play I produced start at
the Bankhead and the main thrust of it was for
us to realize that we write the script, and we
direct the performance, and we star in it. So if
we don't like some of the dialogue or some of
the action of the script, change it. You're the author

(53:32):
of it. Change it.

Speaker 2 (53:33):
I'll tell you what before we change any more scripts,
here's this one before we break for our hourly interval.
As they say, Walter, where can our listeners learn more
about the things you do?

Speaker 3 (53:45):
My name is spelled. That's the key thing. It's the
German name s t A r c k E dot com.
If they go on Walter Starke s t A r
c k e dot com, everything comes up on and.

Speaker 1 (54:00):
More will come up on the other side of the
para cast. Hi, this is Bryce Label.

Speaker 4 (54:17):
I'm the producer of Dark Skies, the co author of
ad After Disclosure, And you are listening to the Paracast,
the gold standard of paranormal radio.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
Walter Starkey is a writer, a producer, and a modern mystic. Walter,
what do you mean by modern mystic as opposed to
mystic or ancient mystic?

Speaker 3 (54:41):
Perhaps, well, the ancient mystics are mystics in the past.
Most people think they're religious people who belong to some
organizations or churches or some particular philosophy. Where is as
I said the first part, that mysticism is only the
belief that you can tune within to receive by your

(55:05):
intuition all knowledge or whatever there is. But there's something
in the break that came into my mind that I
want to talk about, and that is I think the
saint of the twentieth century was Albert Einstein. People don't
really realize how much he has contributed because in nineteen

(55:26):
twenty four, he and the man came Bos came up
with the Bose Einstein condensate, and at the time everybody
thought they were crazy, and the other scientists said, oh,
it can't be proved, this is ridiculous. It's because they
were saying that though a wave is made up of
the particles, a particle and a wave were different, and

(55:50):
bose in Einstein said that at one point they were
the same, and they said, this is illogical, it doesn't
make any sense. Well, in the the nineteen nineties, some
young scientists proved it, and I mean materially scientifically proved it.
They took some super cold atoms and some high powered

(56:11):
cameras and produced a little shadow. And then where they
say that when this is completely explored, we're going to
be able to create things atom by adam. Now what
the Bose Einstein constant says. You know that at one
point they are the same. Now that is the motive
behind the power of the Jesus Christ election, because in

(56:36):
him God and man at one point became the same.
But that's the truth about you and me and all
what we do. We either accept limitations of our finite
self or we accepted yes, I'm finite, but I'm also infinite,
and there are ways that I can go and tune

(56:58):
in at times and have access to this infinite knowledge.
So like, for instance, this winter, I'm going to give
a seminar at my ranch in Texas on practical mysticism
because this is very practical. It's not religious, it's practical
because if you can learn how to get out of

(57:21):
your limited sense and activate your intuition. You can just
do fantastic things and they're very practical in your lives,
in both your health and you. But here's the difference too.
You remember last year there was the big business about the.

Speaker 1 (57:42):
Secret Oh yes, oh yes.

Speaker 3 (57:45):
Two of the people were on it were motivational people,
and two of the people on it Michael, my old friend,
Michael beckw with and so we're coming from the spiritual
cent Now, there was a difference. The motivational people said,
if you want a pink pat black, you just picture
that catalect and you put a picture on the wall,

(58:05):
and you can will that into being.

Speaker 1 (58:08):
And you know that's true.

Speaker 3 (58:09):
You can, and then you may very easily get in
it and go to the corner and get them wreck
and kill your blood yourself. On the other side said, no,
don't do it objectively. Do it subjectively. No, and put
the energy into it. I'm saying, you don't just think it.
You have to put the energy into it. It is
my right to have the perfect transportation for me. It

(58:30):
is my right to have the perfect transportation. Now, I
don't analyze whether that's the Mercedes Benz or afford, but
it will be the perfect transportation for me, and you
can manifest it and you want it, and you won't
go down and get the wreck because it's the right thing.
So one is approaching it subjectively and one is BROLLI objectivity.

(58:51):
And that's what my life is. I don't ever so
called pray for anything. I just know that it's my
right to have the health abundant and those things.

Speaker 1 (59:01):
And they come, let me now play. I've got to
put on my regular hat then, because well, you know,
I've had some good friends of mine who you know,
said to me, do you know about the secret? And
I would look at them and I would say, you know,
it's interesting to me how really so much of the audience,

(59:22):
the constituency of that book ends up being in the
modern western world. I said, I challenge you to take
that book to the poorest parts of Africa, take it
to most of South America, and convince people who are
living on a couple of bucks a day that if
they want to they want to do something, that all

(59:43):
they have to do is really put it out there
and it will it will come forward. And I know
that I'm sort of oversimplifying this, but it just seems
to me, like, you know, you look at the history
of mankind. And one of the things I've really been
fascinated by your your writings, Walter, is that you definitely
have a very good grasp on history. I mean, look
at the history of the species and how often has

(01:00:06):
that really been true? Or is it that everybody's missing
the boat or missing the picture? I mean, what what
do you mean?

Speaker 2 (01:00:12):
You know?

Speaker 1 (01:00:12):
How relevant is the secret for people in Rwander Somalia.

Speaker 3 (01:00:17):
Well, listen, here's the thing. When I had to play
I on a camera in New York. Julie Harris played
the lead in it, and she in rehearsals, she went
through the whole process of developing the part, and then
she turned it over to the technique and so she
was good every night. And she went out to make

(01:00:39):
a movie a member of the wedding, and we put
another girl in who had to see it, and so
she was good one day and the next. So it's
not just a matter of learning the intellectually learning the lessons.
It's a matter to turning it over to the subconscious.

(01:01:00):
The I don't know how to put it, but you
have to be aware of what you're doing. I'm off
the track now this well yourself, well.

Speaker 1 (01:01:15):
It just it seems to me like there's a certain
amount where you can manifest that this is you know,
you sort of you go into yourself and you just
even I kind of wanted to get back to this
actually leads us back to something I want to ask
you about before, because this idea of just even being
able to meditate every morning, I mean, how do you

(01:01:35):
approach that process? This is something I'd actually like to learn.
So how do I how do I approach the process
of being able to in the madness that goes on
in our lives? Walter, how do you turn everything off?

Speaker 3 (01:01:48):
While you said earlier about it, we're all so busy,
and so one has to want to enough to give
up a half hour earlier in the morning or whatever
it is, to go and shut the door and open
themselves and attempt to do it. And it's maybe like

(01:02:11):
water breaking through a stone. It may have to have
drop after drop. You may have to try it daily
and daily with that word you said, your intent, and
then it begins. Suddenly it breaks through. It doesn't just
happen out of the blue, like turning a switch off
and on. It's something that you grow into or you

(01:02:33):
grow as part of yourself. In other words, you've got
to take time to open yourself. And I say, well, look,
I just can't do this and keep trying.

Speaker 1 (01:02:46):
So how do you then contrast that with epiphanies.

Speaker 3 (01:02:48):
Well, that can happen too, because as I've said, I've
had a couple of them in my life that have
been really something. But I think that everything had lit up.
That epiphany didn't happen by accident either.

Speaker 1 (01:03:03):
It's kind of like the overnight success actor actress that
was actually working at it for ten years and finally
got a break.

Speaker 3 (01:03:09):
You know, we are like an iceberg floating in an ocean.
Only a tiny bit of us appears above the surface.
That's our conscious mind. We live mainly by the bigger mass,
which is our unconscious mind, our conscious mind. But the

(01:03:29):
conscious mind is important because it's how we program the unconscious.
If you do something over and over and over and
up again, it programs the unconscious. But I'm floating in
the sea of the super conscious, and so are you.
So we both have access to that same sea, that
same ocean of all consciousness, and we have to recognize

(01:03:52):
that in each other and recognize it in ourselves, that
we're going from our conscious mind, which is above the surface,
into our unconscious mind, and through that to our super
conscious mind.

Speaker 1 (01:04:04):
In your book, it's all God you talk about in
reading it. It's interesting I came upon your discussion about
agnostics and how that came to be because it really
it sort of ties very interestingly to the tagline that
I've had here on the shelf since we began the show,
which is that I don't want to believe, I want

(01:04:26):
to know. I don't want to believe in certain anomalous phenomena,
I want to understand them. So could you talk to
us a little bit about how this separation in the
technology I got.

Speaker 3 (01:04:41):
Point out that Constancy, the Emperor of Rome in three
hundred and twenty five eighty at the Council of Nicia time,
God had to get rid of the Gnostics because he
had to rule a couple of million people, and how
can you rule, let me if they don't believe that
a government is veiledimate authority, because the Gnostics believe that

(01:05:02):
the ultimate authority is within yourself, and so the government
would have to be secondary. So he had to get
rid of the Gnostics and I feel that with the
metaphysical movement, Christian science and all of that was a
rebirth in our society of the gnostics who are saying
it's within yourself that you see. I shock people a

(01:05:25):
lot because I don't believe in God. I just don't
believe in God as anything other than apart from myself.
And you know, it's very good to get to the
point to believe that God is with me, that God
is in me. That's fine. We've got to get there
before we can go that's high school, before we can

(01:05:45):
go to college. But college is no, that's still too God.
And God is as me, not in me, not with me,
but as me, appearing as me. And then that's sense
because your consciousness. And that's why I love the word consciousness,
and I love that everything is consciousness manifesting in form,

(01:06:08):
because consciousness creates whatever is. The creator is God and
that's your own consciousness. So you can create whatever life
you want for yourself. And as you said, and I said,
but we set those laws for ourselves and then they
work and we were unscreaming. And so the thing is,
we have to know we can change those laws. Ah.

(01:06:31):
And one of the main ones we change. Is this
get rid of the future. If you think I will
have money, I will have abundance. That's in the future.
You have to say I have even though you overdrew
at the bank. You've got to say I have it.
And if you believe I have, you will have.

Speaker 1 (01:06:52):
Well. Is that something like the power of positive thinking?

Speaker 3 (01:06:55):
I think it all ties together. I think positive thinking
was the beginning one hundred years ago with Norman Dixon,
Peel and those others that brought in that subject.

Speaker 1 (01:07:09):
Is it that simple, though, Walter See, this is where
the skeptic in need comes up and says, wait a minute.
It's almost like that's oversimplification, isn't it?

Speaker 3 (01:07:19):
Or is it? Well, I'll tell you if I can
programming the computer, but if you don't turn it on,
it doesn't do any good. And the thing about it is,
if you don't program the computer and you turn it on,
you don't get anything anyway. So we might as well
program the computer. Don't believe that the programming does it

(01:07:40):
because they didn't do anything. It's all mental, but the
experiential I stood up at an annual conference for religious
science out there's a silomar year or so ago and
I told him the metaphysical field is over. It's done.
It's finished. It's done what it had to do. It
had to introduce these ideas and now if it doesn't

(01:08:01):
move into the experience, it's finished. And that's true. Everything
is experiential. You might say I love someone, Well do
you feel it? Do you experience it? Or you're just
saying it.

Speaker 1 (01:08:13):
The question is do you show it?

Speaker 3 (01:08:15):
Right? Yeah, do you show it? Do you live it?
Is it real? And you know scientists have wondered what
is this power and they're trying to find it in
the laboratory. Well, consciousness is an energy. Love is an energy,
and if love is there, that energy is there because,

(01:08:36):
like pr Deschardana said, love is the only energy capable
of totalizing the world, making us all realize our oneness.
And I'm such a positivist because I see it happening.
I see this globalization as a move forward where we're
really interlocking. And I see again I'm going on about

(01:09:00):
Obama because there's a spirit that a lot of He's
almost becoming a worldwide president. He's honored in so many countries,
and what are they honoring? Not a man? Not a man,
an idea? You know, and that's why it's good that
he's black, because that's saying that those things don't make
any difference, that we're all won. Oh. I think this

(01:09:23):
is a great time to be a life. Hi, this
is Nick Pope.

Speaker 1 (01:09:38):
You're listening to the Paracost with Jeen Steinberg and David.

Speaker 2 (01:09:42):
Bietne, Walter Starkey joining us this week on the Power Cast,
and we're talking about right now, just mentioning the influence
of President Obama. Now, some people were saying, well, he
also wants to look for a single world government and
we can't have that. We've got to have the separate countries,

(01:10:03):
the separate tribes, whatever. That's not a good thing to
have one world.

Speaker 3 (01:10:08):
Well, we wouldn't have a thing called the United States
if we felt that way, because we'd say, oh, well,
we can't do that. Texas would no longer be Texas
in California would no longer be California. I think we
can be united countries, united nations as there was that title.

(01:10:28):
And it doesn't mean that they lose their identity or
anything else. It's just that they recognized the family of
all mankind, and so we can all work together and
our experiment here you know, the United States was a
tremendous experiment when it came into being, and look how
it has changed the whole world and become the most

(01:10:49):
successful nation in the world because those principles.

Speaker 1 (01:10:53):
You know, I'll add to that later, because when the euro,
the idea of the euro first came around, there were
a lot of people that felt that that could never
was never feasible. In fact that I remember at the
time the discussion being, well, look at Greece with Drachma.
You know, here they've had a currency for like two
thousand years. There's no way that a new currency is
going to take hold. And not only did it take hold,

(01:11:15):
but it really started to provide a real alternative and
competitor to the dollar, one that I think a lot
of people never saw it coming. So I think at
that level I would agree with you, But I would
add though, And it's interesting because while well, the whole
Obama thing, I mean, I hope that your positive attitude

(01:11:38):
about this is rewarded, and I have a concern And
I'm not someone who's known to be a conservative thinker.
I'm a bit of a I don't know, I'm to
the left of liberal quite frankly, but I'm concerned that
a lot of the you know, the reality of what
has come out of the Obama administration has perhaps not

(01:12:00):
matched the image that's projected. And I wonder what your
feelings are about image versus reality, because this is like
so much. I mean, you talk about religion, for example,
where you have Catholicism Christianity portray a certain image, but
then there's a reality to it that really seems to
be a product of the foibles of human character. What

(01:12:22):
are your thoughts about that?

Speaker 3 (01:12:23):
There is always this gap. I don't know, but like
I'm with you and I'm left off in this word
socialism socially, I mean society, but a lot of that
was done in the name of social Absolute power corrupts absolutely,

(01:12:46):
and the guys that got in control of it became dictators.
But the thing is that if we truly had democratic socialism,
I would be a happy boy, because there is no
reason I should be a millionaire and there are people
starving in Somalia with in a world that has the

(01:13:07):
technology that can make this place happen. If we didn't
put it into guns and bombs and spend it building
homes and feeding the poor. And so forth, And you
know that really gets the concerned.

Speaker 1 (01:13:21):
I have to tell you, I'm so on the same
page with you about that, Walter. You know, I look
at the money that's been spent on the quote unquote
Iraq war On.

Speaker 3 (01:13:30):
Oh, it's just I think it's second Darving right here
in our country.

Speaker 1 (01:13:35):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, you know, so, I'm so there
with you. But if we took that money and we
put it towards trying to make the world a better place,
how much further would we have gotten?

Speaker 3 (01:13:46):
So is that?

Speaker 1 (01:13:48):
It is that the fall from grace though, Walter, I mean,
go back to the Bible where Adam and Eve eat
of the fruit of the tree of knowledge. Is that
knowledge the double edged sword that will do us in potentially?

Speaker 3 (01:13:58):
No, that and the knowledge of good and evil? It's
the and it's the problem. Gre evil is two sides
of one coin, and what looks like good and evil
it's the end by separating those two and realizing, see,
I believe that there's one process at work, one power
if you have called one god, if you want to

(01:14:19):
call it that, and so forth. But all you have
to do is look back to England, to London in
Dickens' time, where you couldn't got in the street at night,
where they had children that never saw the light of day,
working in slave companies or what do you call it,
where they put retarded people in dungeons and so forth.

(01:14:44):
We have come a long way, don't lose sight of that.
That's the double thread. We've come a long way and
we've still got further to go, but it's going in
the right direction. And now we're breaking into this sense
of globalization, which is a big step of realizing no
nation is completely autonomous any longer. We as the United

(01:15:07):
States can't exist just in our borders. We are too
dependent on exports, imports, things like this. It's all working together,
and so I'm a double threat. I'm quite aware of
the inequities and I want to do something about it.
On the other hand, I believe in trust the process.

Speaker 1 (01:15:25):
So it's going to be fits and starts, but eventually
we get there.

Speaker 3 (01:15:29):
Yeah. Yeah, And I'm not saying Pollyanna, it's all heaven
by any means, but I'm saying that's why at this level,
there's always two. There are no absolutes. And I think
that the people didn't understand the Christian message because they
looked at it objectively in terms of healings and resurrections

(01:15:50):
and things that happened physically. They didn't listen to the
priority of SEEKI first the spiritual, the subjective nature of things,
which was in his message. He had both love God
and love neighbor, but love cause and love effects. But
first look at cause. And I think that the reason

(01:16:12):
I go on about Obama not because of him as
an individual, because there are a lot of others that
are doing it too, but he symbolizes it right now
of starting from a subjective of saying as his goal
is to have national health and national things, you know,
to augment the rights that we all have to share

(01:16:36):
in this wonderful world.

Speaker 1 (01:16:37):
So Walter, let me ask you a question then, because
I'm going to imagine that and correct me if I'm wrong.
But I would imagine that the majority of the people
that you speak to an audience come to see you,
perhaps not because of a New Age background, but a
Christian or Catholic background. With that, am I misstating that?

Speaker 3 (01:16:59):
Is that most of the people that come now have
come up through the metaphysical approach, not the traditional religions.
At all. And the thing that I'm really impressed with
are the younger people, because this younger generation were not
like when I was a teenager, it saani was gay

(01:17:20):
or straight, or black or white and all it made
a difference. They don't give a damn. And they said, well,
so what you know? And that's encouraging to me. I
think we've got some really advance. But then there's also this.
There are some children coming along now, which some people
call the Indigo children, who are just incredible. And I

(01:17:45):
had an experience they really taught me. A less than
a year or so ago. I was speaking of the
big church in Houston, and after I was signing books
out in the lobby and a little boy couldn't have
been more than five five verse six. He came up
with his father and his father said he is, I'm
going to tell you, and the boy said, I don't

(01:18:06):
remember the words, but he said equivalent. I really liked
what you had to say. Well, how could he have
understood my metaphysics? But anyway, I thanked him. I said
thank you very much and went on signing books. And
then my partner puncted me and said, look he was
outside crying. I hadn't recognized who he was. So after that,

(01:18:26):
now something like that happens. I'm around that table on
a huggle and say thank you. Let him know I
know who you are too, you know, and seeing through appearances.
And so we've got some tremendous young people coming along.

Speaker 1 (01:18:40):
Walter. Do you think that perhaps those intelligent kids, those aware,
sensitive kids were there before, but the culture wasn't quite
as accepting of these ideas, and therefore perhaps we didn't
know about them as much as we do now. I've
wondered about that. What do you think about that idea?

Speaker 3 (01:18:59):
Well, like I said earlier, I believe in evolution, and
I think consciousness is evolving just as much as the
body has evolved and changed. And so I really think
they are more of them now than there were. I
don't think it was just unrecognized. I just think that

(01:19:21):
they're really the higher levels of consciousness coming in the form.

Speaker 1 (01:19:28):
So then, if we look at the things that go
on around this world that seem to be very negative
and destructive, is this the Ying Yang balance of reality?
Is there? Can we ever perceive of a time, for example,
when the world will not be at war with itself?

Speaker 3 (01:19:48):
Yes? Look right, now, the age of nations going to
war with other nations is over. Just a few years
ago Germany was fighting France, so to speak. That kind
of war's over. We still have terrorists and gang type things,
but we don't have nations fighting nations anymore. Right now,

(01:20:11):
and just in the last few years, really there's nobody
building up great national armies to go and squash another nation.
There's force of being to try to stop you know,
like I said, terrorists like some of them Latin or
whoever it is we see.

Speaker 1 (01:20:31):
Do you really think that's true? The Walter, I mean,
look at the incredible amount of tension between for example,
India and Pakistan. I mean, they've been sort of on
the brink of a nuclear war for a number of years.

Speaker 3 (01:20:43):
Now.

Speaker 1 (01:20:44):
Look at North Korea with all of its neighbors.

Speaker 3 (01:20:49):
I mean, none of those are about to go to war.
And everybody pretty well recognizes that. Now Pakistan and the
end they both have atomic warfare equipment and whatnot. It's
not going to happen. Nations are not. They they may
go on and you know, there's another thing about life.

(01:21:10):
We have to realize. If there wasn't the negative, we
would never create. We're constantly in and out of balance.
Otherwise we couldn't walk, and our job is to be
like typerope walkers. We lean over to this side and
something says, no, wait a minute, there's a real world

(01:21:31):
out there. Get practical. And then we lean over this
side and he says, now, look, you're getting too practical
the spiritual as you need some more of that to
get balanced, and then we can walk the type rope.

Speaker 1 (01:21:43):
Now, I wanted to ask you something about the balance
and the mechanism another dimension you've entered, the paracast.

Speaker 2 (01:22:22):
We're talking to Walter Starky, mystic author, producer. Okay, the
balance mechanism in our crazy little world that we deal
with power and normal events. Some suggest that certain things
that happened to people, it could be UFOs or encounters
with other entities, whatever they might be, the messages they

(01:22:42):
give to us are designed strictly to restore the balance.

Speaker 3 (01:22:47):
What do you think, Well, I think that's I mean,
I would like to think that I really do. For instance,
right now, it looks like the world is going to
have a recession. That's good because we've gotten so fat
and so consumer crazy, and sometimes we need to go

(01:23:07):
through I can remember the nineteen thirties, I was, you know, ten, eleven,
twelve up years old. It's the beginning of it, of
the depression recession, and then people cared. They cared about
the quality of their work, and they cared about each other,

(01:23:27):
and it was a different society we had. And then
the Second World War came and after that we got
rich and we lost all of that, and we got
greedy and so forth. So sometimes we need to get spanked.
You know. Sometimes I do this partly because it gets
to laugh. But I'll say to people that they say,

(01:23:48):
I'm an eighty nine year old bachelor with no children.
That's not true. I've got an eighty nine year old
child named Walter. That's and sometimes I've got to spank him.
Sometimes i have to nurture him. But I'm constantly aware
of me and my higher self. And then for instance,

(01:24:08):
when I'm out speaking, whether I'm speaking to you right
now or not, if I'm not hearing it, I got
a problem. So Walter, the human being, Walter is always
aware of that other need too, and I know we've
got to be on the same page, and we're all
that way. When we get angry, that's the moment when

(01:24:29):
we've lost the two selves, we might be annoyed and
so forth, and there's still the two. I'm annoyed by him,
But when we get angry, we lose all that. So
they're always tooless and going through life and the need
to be in balance. But that takes not just one thing.

(01:24:52):
It's not an absolute. You swing over here, you swing
over there too much for this, work a little too hard,
So play a little more. Play too much, you get
back to work, back and forth.

Speaker 2 (01:25:03):
So if we are encouraged by what appears to be
an outside force to bring ourselves back into balance, is
that an outside force or is that our subconscious saying
get it together?

Speaker 3 (01:25:15):
Man? There isn't any outside force other than our own
higher consciousness, which is outside of us because we put
it out there, it's really in us. There is no
God acting on our lives other than that that we are.
There's no government, there's no thing making rules and regulations.

(01:25:39):
We create our whole lives. But we are a higher consciousness,
we're a lower consciousness. We're in a middle consciousness. We
have a whole range of infinite natures wrapped up in one.

Speaker 1 (01:25:52):
I think what gene is sort of referring to Walter,
You look at we'll get specific here. You look at
claimed UFO encounters, where people say that they've interacted with
beings coming from who claim to come potentially from other planets,
who have messages that they sometimes in part and we're

(01:26:14):
not saying that, and this is we're not talking about
the veracity of these claims, but just the idea that
there would be beings some other planets that come to Earth,
that seem to come to Earth and say things to
us about how we should care for our planet or
about our planet. And there are some people that look
at that and say, all right, what we're dealing with
here are not solid creatures some other planet who have

(01:26:38):
come here out of altruistic intentions, but are indeed some
sort of manifestation. There are some there're some the thinkers
along these lines that say, these are potentially unknown mechanisms
of our planet that are tapping into our subconscious being
and using that to evoke for our conscious minds. This

(01:27:04):
physical manifestation is visual manifestation, that is a message that
the planet is attempting to give us through our subconscious
and conscious minds. I think that's what Gene is implying, right, Gene,
I think you summarized it very well. That's a great
reader's digest version.

Speaker 3 (01:27:21):
Yeah, that's excellent. That is one explanation, that's I think
right on. I think there are a number of different explanations,
and that would be serving to be one that would
be at the top of my list. You know, at
night we look out there and we see those billions
intrusions of stars, and what makes us think that we're
more advanced are different than every single one of them

(01:27:44):
out there. And we know that Einstein also proved that
time curves mean it's time is not a reality. So
if time is not a reality, space is not a reality.
And some of those consciousnesses from planets that are technically
millions of years away could appear here too. I mean,

(01:28:06):
you know, it's all possible, but it's all taking place
in consciousness. We are not physical, We are consciousness. We
are invisible, and I'm not what I see in the mirror.
And look at the pictures of me when I was
a foot hide, two feet high, three feet high. All
those bodies are gone. I have always been here because

(01:28:26):
I am this consciousness that's manifesting the life I live.

Speaker 2 (01:28:30):
Well, I kind of think here that I don't want
to necessarily be the person that I see in the window.

Speaker 3 (01:28:35):
Oh well, well if you don't want to, then change it.

Speaker 2 (01:28:38):
Okay, Well I think that's an important thing here.

Speaker 1 (01:28:41):
How do we change it?

Speaker 3 (01:28:42):
You know?

Speaker 2 (01:28:42):
Do we have to get together with other people or
what we imagine to be other people to start the
change of the change is not just what we're doing,
but what we're doing in this country, in this city,
in this neighborhood.

Speaker 3 (01:28:54):
Well, there's not one law I do believe where two
or more gathered together. You see. Now I give seminars
at times at my ranch, and we're going to be
doing some miss Winter called practical mysticism, because all of
this is very practical. And I tried when I can

(01:29:14):
to limit them. I used to have maybe a couple
hundred people, but now I try to limit them to
no more than like twenty five or so people, because
if you get more than that, it becomes a glob
twenty five people. It can be a group dynamic, and
it isn't one person some leader to laying the message

(01:29:36):
down and affecting everybody. They create an energy out of
the group dynamic, and that's where we're going in the
world today, ultimately the whole world.

Speaker 1 (01:29:46):
Well, I think Jane was getting at the idea of
whether or not this is something that you can accomplish alone,
so changing yourself, whether it is a collective effort, Well both,
you know.

Speaker 3 (01:30:00):
We do it alone, but I do think that collectively
there are times when it's a real boost for us,
a real help. Otherwise I wouldn't have any seminars at all,
because I just as I said that group dynamic is
a force of power and energy. One person can carry

(01:30:22):
a hundred pounds, but two people can carry three hundred pounds,
so there.

Speaker 1 (01:30:27):
Is strength and numbers.

Speaker 3 (01:30:31):
Yeah, and then some Yeah, you know, it's difficult because
you two, I never know who's speaking.

Speaker 2 (01:30:38):
We don't either, by the way, we always no idea
who's speaking. I mean, sometimes a voice appears on the
radio show and I think, you know, I must be
David because I mix his voice a certain way, and
then no, that's me.

Speaker 1 (01:30:54):
But that can't be me. I never said that. That's
the way I explain to people is I'm the sexy
voice and the other one yeah, yeah, yeah, no, and
he has no where ego either, poor a sense of reality.
But well no, but let's talk about ego for a
minute here, because Walter, it's almost like I wanted to

(01:31:15):
have a book about your time in New York on Broadway.
So you interact with a lot of very well known
people in your time. Did you find that how did
you find these people to be on a spiritual level?
I think there's this perception that people who are hungry
to be in the limelight, like a lot of the
kind of actors and actresses you might have interacted with,

(01:31:38):
are perhaps lacking a certain spiritual component, or that if
they get that spiritual component, then they tend to sort
of move away from that limelight. What did you find
in that world?

Speaker 3 (01:31:48):
Well, there again, they're all kinds, and unfortunately, I have
found that unless people have some sense of needing to
fulfill a spiritual side in their life, there's the ones
that get out of balance and turn into alcoholics or

(01:32:08):
other things. For instance, I remember I was going to
vacation in Haiti and a friend of mine, who was
the literary editor for the New York Herow Tribune Sunday edition, said,
here is an advance of a first novel that's coming
out that I'm going to give a good notice to
so I went down and I read it when I
got back, and I was impressed by the book. I

(01:32:31):
thought it was a little self conscious where he talked
about the minners, stitch the water and so forth, but nonetheless,
and he said, well, I'm giving a costail party to
introduce this young writer to some of the literary people
and invited me and I went, well, John van Bruten
was there and who wrote I remember Mama Voice of

(01:32:53):
the Turtle in all those plays. And John was a
six foot one reserved Englishman and he was sitting in
an a postered arm backed chair and right up in
his face the book was Other Voices of the Rooms
by Truman Capoti. And Truman was right up in John's face,
Oh mister, And John was looking like, what is this mosquito?

Speaker 1 (01:33:17):
He terrified.

Speaker 3 (01:33:18):
So to get him off of John's back, I said, hey, Truman,
come here commitment. And I said, you know, I just
got back from Haiti, and I told him all about Haiti.
And he got on the plane the next day and
went to Haiti and out of that came the House
of Flowers and the Haitian stories. Well, so I knew
Truman through his career, and he didn't have that spiritual thing,

(01:33:40):
and he ended up a miserable drunk getting beat up
on the street in his latter lives in Key West,
you know, because if you don't have that sense to
balance the other, it's bad business. This is Leslie Kane

(01:34:05):
and I'm with the Coalition for Freedom of Information and
you are listening to the Paracast with Gene Steinberg and
David B. Edney.

Speaker 1 (01:34:14):
Before we get into any other business, we're talking to
Walker Starkey.

Speaker 3 (01:34:18):
And that's spelled s T A r c K dot com.

Speaker 1 (01:34:24):
And by the way, we also have a link to
his website, so you don't have to remember that. Oh really,
that's right. We charge extra for that, except for you
because you're a nice guy.

Speaker 3 (01:34:35):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:34:38):
Well, now on the other side, so that actually that
was really kind of a that was cool about putting
now on the other side of that. Who might you
have encountered in your time in that world that we
wouldn't necessarily think of as a spiritually evolved person who
you found to be extremely spiritually evolved. If there is
such an example.

Speaker 3 (01:34:57):
Well, I don't necessarily, but I'll tell you this. Necessarily
think she was this quote unquote spiritual person But when
Telula Bankhead was a little girl, I don't know, I
five or six years old or something, she had a
real spiritual experience where she saw the infinite potential within

(01:35:17):
herself and never had it again, nor did she have
anyone who could run into anyone who could explain it
to her or teach her how to develop it or
understand it. And so she pushed herself to try to
express this infinity that she had, you know, and so

(01:35:39):
that had come from a spiritual basis. Then, on the
other hand, Julie Harris, the year after she was in
my playe on my camera, she was in a play
where she played San Joan and one night she stumbled
on the stage cut her lip and they had to
bring the curtain down until they patched her lip up
and so forth. It was in all the paper. So

(01:36:00):
I called it up and I said, Julie, what's this
about you cutting your lip on the stage? And she said,
I forgot I was acting, which is the story. You know,
we have to always be a spiritual self observing our
material self, another partner in this life. It's when the

(01:36:22):
two come together and we think, well, I'm just awful
or I'm just this or that, and that's when we're
asking for trouble.

Speaker 1 (01:36:31):
Is there any way to walk in multiple worlds? And
the reason I was asking before Walter about you know,
what's your typical audience, because I have to imagine that
if you're standing in front of a room full of
and not that you'd even be in the situation, but
just to play this what if game for a moment,
if you were standing in front of a in front

(01:36:51):
of a room of primarily fundamentalist thinkers, right, you know,
there are certain statements in your books that I guessing
would infuriate.

Speaker 3 (01:37:01):
Them, but I don't stand any those groups fortunately. But
you mentioned about the YouTube before. It was really interesting
because some people in Germany saw that and asked me
to come over. I've just been back a couple of weeks,
and they said they'd pay my transportation to give me

(01:37:23):
a fee, and I said, well, I don't go by
myself anymore, Aaron, I think you ought to talk to
She went with me, and so they gave me two
tickets and they asked what my fee was and I said, well,
three thousand euro and to do this speech. And they said,
well that's a little heavy. How about two thousand, I said, fine,

(01:37:46):
and so off we went. Oh because of this new
day of YouTube.

Speaker 1 (01:37:51):
It's an amazing thing you do. Yeah, it's a new day.

Speaker 3 (01:37:54):
And so I'm getting on things like that more younger people.
But in the past it has been people in the
surgeries up.

Speaker 1 (01:38:04):
Okay, Yeah, Without YouTube, I would have never found your words.
It wouldn't have happened. So we definitely have YouTube to
thank for you being on the Paracast. Besides yourself. You know,
YouTube was an amazing thing. Now while you might not
find yourself in front of that kind of audience, I
have to believe that. And I haven't read the comments

(01:38:26):
on your YouTube posted videos, but I have to think
that there are some people who would say to you, well,
wait a minute. You know you're you're making certain statements
like you know on the Paracast. There are people have
accused us, Jana and myself of being very hard on
religion because of the dogmatic approach of most organized religion.
But it sounds like Walter, you're sort of in the

(01:38:49):
same camp as we are.

Speaker 4 (01:38:50):
I mean, what.

Speaker 1 (01:38:52):
You're sort of saying is that you feel that religion
gets in between a person and there God. Essentially, is
that right.

Speaker 3 (01:39:00):
Oh, absolutely, And it lays a guilt trip on people.
And the number one thing is self love. I don't
care what. You must love yourself because if you don't
love yourself, you don't have any love to give anybody.
And religion does more to kill self love. Organize religions

(01:39:20):
because in the minutes you have an organization. You've got
those on the right and those on the left, and
you've got rules and regulations, and this is what we believe.
And we may patronize the other religions, but we have
the truth and all that is for the birds.

Speaker 1 (01:39:38):
So give us a working differentiation between self love and narcissism.
And what narcissism, Well, a narcisists.

Speaker 3 (01:39:49):
Believes he's what he sees in the pond. He's believing
that he is he doesn't know who he is. Oh,
you mentioned ego. In egotism, ego simply means I it's
the sense of self. I hope we've got egos. Oh
my goodness. If we didn't have egos, we'd never do anything.

(01:40:10):
But egotism is a misuse of a misunderstanding of the ego.
It's seeing, it's believing that one is something they're not
that's egotism. Ego is a recognition of I am that
I am. And then that's one of the things in
the course in Miracles that I didn't like was it
is kept putting the ego down, the egosis and the

(01:40:31):
egos that ego is not egotism is that's the misuse
of the ego. God created everything, and everything is good,
and everything can be misused, whether it's religion, beliefs, no
matter what are something material. I mean, God created my
glass of wine, but if i have to have ten

(01:40:54):
glasses of wine, I'm misusing the gift.

Speaker 1 (01:40:57):
In your journeys around the world, you took a close
look at the Eastern religions and you compared them with
the Judeo Christian sort of a foundation that the Western
world has. What did you find to be the useful similarities?
What did you find to be the sort of common

(01:41:21):
truth between those worlds? And if you're looking at things
like Buddhism and.

Speaker 3 (01:41:26):
You look at you, I mean not talking about individuals,
but talking about the whole collective thing. We in the
Western world were more objective. We wanted results. Therefore, we
built a scientific society that was way in advance of
until now the Orientals. The Orientals were more subjective. They

(01:41:49):
were looking more for the spirit of things, and they
ignored the material aspect. So they had the worst filth
and the worst poverty and so forth. So now is
the day when no longer is east and west and
west is west, and never the twains shall meet. Now

(01:42:10):
they're coming together. So we have the subjective to set
the tone for the objective. And in Wilhelm is each
Ching the introduction is written by Carl Jung, and Jung
it's a wonderful essay, and he says that the time

(01:42:32):
was that they had the we had the material and
they had the ritualistic and now it is time that
the two came together, explaining that though throwing the ea
ching was an action, but nevertheless it carried a subjective
meaning could be used valuably if it was used not superstitiously.

Speaker 1 (01:42:56):
In our show, in past episodes we touched upon a
really interesting historical character, Nikola Tesla, and his many contributions
to our technological reality today. Well, a lot of people
don't realize, and it's something that you mentioned early on
in the episode. Walter Tesla was a very a certain

(01:43:20):
part of his life, probably when he was sort of
in his his middle age, he was a very interested
student of the Vedic philosophy and and and Vedanta. Now,
I think you actually brought that up earlier on in
the show because it sort of ties right in with

(01:43:41):
what you've been saying all along that you know, basically,
the human nature is essentially divine in nature, and that
is sort of the goal of us being alive, is
to realize that we're a divine entity. And it's interesting
because Tesla was somebody who, you know, sort of the
pre eminent scientists of his age, and yet there was

(01:44:05):
a side of him that I don't know that many
people knew about or even aware of. So do you see, then, Walter,
that ultimately in our world, in order for us to
essentially evolve, do you see that the realms of what
we would normally call religious thought and science are going
to have to start to move back together. Do you

(01:44:27):
think that maybe at some point they got separated and
now they're going to have to come back together at
a certain point.

Speaker 3 (01:44:33):
Well, I think they were separated, and I think they've
come back together because you know, Einstein and so many
of them, for instance, who was it that invented the
radio that was well.

Speaker 1 (01:44:50):
See, interestingly enough, it was Tesla that actually really invented radio.
Marconi built on his work but then right, but it
was really as funny.

Speaker 3 (01:45:00):
Marconi has said that he had spent his time trying
to overcome the resistance of the ether, and then he
found don't overcome it, use it to carry the message,
you know. And before he thought that he had to
overcome obstruction and then realized, no, who use it? And

(01:45:23):
so that was like a spiritual understanding. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:45:28):
No, there are some people who would say, well, he
was actually copying on Tesla's riff even in that regard,
but he might have been.

Speaker 3 (01:45:35):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:45:36):
That was interesting because actually Tesla was awarded, was posthumously
awarded the patent for the basic pattern for radio, many
years after it been granted to Marconi. Because I mean,
and history bears us out, Tesla was something someone who
not only felt that way about communication but also about energy.
He worked he had impass in the early early parts

(01:45:58):
of the twentieth century wireless transmission of electricity happening in
a way that to my knowledge has not still not
been replicated to this day. So you feel though that
as we move forward into the future world or that essentially,
you know, because science really is in many ways has

(01:46:18):
become and I know I'll get in trouble for saying this,
but it's sort of become its own little fundamentalist religious movement. Yeah,
and it kind of completely wants to exclude sort of
the spiritual aspect or component at the same time. You know,
you brought Christian science before. And I worry about that

(01:46:41):
a little bit because I know, just spending some time
with some family of mine hearing about a very distant
family member who is a believer in Christian science broke
her risk and never had its set. I mean, so
obviously right that there are extremes of all of this
that are counterwell.

Speaker 3 (01:46:58):
With uscally, was it nut? I mean she her husband
had a swinger in a swing because she had these
migraine headaches, and even after she had established Christian science,
she would take codeine or something and she would say, well,
if my head hurts, how can I do a treatment?
I hope It's all crazy. It's all transitional, and when

(01:47:19):
somebody brings it in to begin with, they're usually it
comes through a faulty instrument to begin with. But the
answer really is you have dominion when you can use
everything and not be used by anything, use every experience
in your life. What is this telling me? You know,

(01:47:40):
it's perfectly all right to have difficult times, it's not
all right to waste them, and we waste them if
we don't say, well, now, what am I learning from this?
Because our purpose is to expand consciousness constantly?

Speaker 1 (01:47:55):
You know on that point, Walter, I would you know
I have to say, and this might again might be
a surprise for some of our audience, but I know
personally my personal philosophy about life is that we are
here to learn and to collect stories. And I've always
lived my life by those two guiding principles that everything

(01:48:15):
that's material, oh it stays here. This is all on loan.
But I think what you do take are the lessons
that you've learned and the stories of how you've learned
those lessons. And I have to say, for the past
couple of hours, I am going to very much enjoy
this memory of having spoken with you, because I think
you have a lot to offer.

Speaker 3 (01:48:36):
Let me just say one more thing that's so important, please,
it is your whole life is what you give because
all of your getting company you're giving. So the especial
thing you've got to think of all the time is
what can I give? Give? Give, give.

Speaker 2 (01:48:52):
I'll tell you what you can give right now, which
is kind of a bad pun. Tell everybody your web
address again they can get in touch with you and
learn more about the things that you're doing.

Speaker 3 (01:49:03):
Well. It's the website is Walter sta rcak dot com
and it has all my books and a little history,
and I put articles in that at some time to time.

Speaker 1 (01:49:14):
Okay, so you keep it up.

Speaker 2 (01:49:16):
So even though you are at the bright young age
of eighty nine years, and we hope you'll be around
for another eighty nine years. And I wish that when
I am eighty nine, I will be half as intelligent,
half as bright, half as smart as you are.

Speaker 1 (01:49:33):
For your achievement.

Speaker 3 (01:49:34):
Here you dear well, we all love each other.

Speaker 2 (01:49:37):
Okay, Walter Starkey, thank you so much for joining us
this week. I'm the Power Cast.

Speaker 3 (01:49:42):
Thank you, thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:49:44):
Walter. The Power Cast with Gene Steinberg and David Pietney
is a production of Making the Impossible Incorporated. Join us
next week for a new adventure in the Power Casts.

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Classic Episode: August 16, 2009 — Modern Mystic Walter Starcke

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Classic Episode: August 16, 2009 — Modern Mystic Walter Starcke