February 22, 2025 • 38 mins
(00:53) Chef Jonathan Homer, the executive chef at Pizzaiolo Primo in Market Square, takes us on an exhilarating journey through his career and aspirations. Transitioning from a successful stint at Blue Sky, Chef Homer immerses himself in Primo's world of Neapolitan-style cuisine, celebrated for its made-to-order pastas and irresistible wood-fired pizzas. We rave about the iconic crab limon and ragu bolognese with tagliatelle, and the art behind crafting a perfect margherita pizza that has sold thousands.
Jonathan's story is one of resilience and passion, tracing back to family roots in Uniontown and Cleveland, where Polish and Italian community traditions first sparked his culinary dreams. Jonathan's journey is filled with personal challenges, including his father's illness and recovery, which propelled him toward his dreams in St. Louis. His time at Favazza's Italian restaurant taught him the finer points of fresh pasta making, cementing his dedication to the craft.
(19:48) This chapter of his life paints a vivid picture of a chef who constantly evolves, learning from each experience and mentor he encounters, which continues with his return to Pittsburgh.
(26:37) Later in the show, we explore the warmth and wings of Bigham Tavern in Mount Washington with Autumn Pawelec, and get a cherished family tradition of making homemade gnocchi from the Costanzo family. Join us for an episode filled with passion, perseverance, and flavor.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Doug (00:01):
Welcome to The Pittsburgh Dish.
I'm your host, Doug Heilman.
What's the secret to culinarysuccess for this week's guest,
constant learning.
We talk with executive chefJonathan Homer Love to know that
favorite neighborhood bar spotfor good food and drinks.
Autumn Pawelec has her pick inMount Washington and Want the
(00:28):
backstory on Italian gnocchi.
We have that, along with arecipe.
All that ahead, stay tuned.
The Pittsburgh Dish issupported by Chip and Kale
plant-based meals.
Select from dishes like crispyKorean barbecue, tofu bowls or
Chesapeake Bay chowder.
Visit their website atchipandkale.
com to learn more.
(00:50):
Now on to the show.
Well, thank you so much forcoming over and for being on the
show.
Would you introduce yourself toour listeners and what you have
going on right now in the worldof food?
Jon (01:04):
Yeah, so I'm Chef Jonathan Homer.
I am the chef at Pizziolo Primoin Market Square.
Doug (01:10):
And, Jon, this is a new move for you, right?
Because I've actually talked toyou once before with your
lovely wife-to-be, your fiancée.
Jon (01:19):
Selina Progar.
That's right, she's the pastrychef at Eleven.
She came on back in December.
Yes, we were discussing this.
Off air is what they say,that's right.
Yeah, she came on.
I was the chef at Blue Sky thenand I've moved on since and
down at Market Square now.
It's been a good month and acouple days.
Doug (01:38):
Just since January or so, since we're recording, oh my
goodness.
Well, I have to say, you know,Blue Sky had a great run.
I guess, unfortunately, likewe're moving on, yeah, and that
concept is no longer.
But I'll tell you, PizzioloPrimo has always been such a
consistently good spot.
Jon (01:55):
Yeah, it's a great location .
The team that's already therewas great, so I'm excited to
move in there and kind of fillthat role that they were looking
for with a chef to, you know,kind of take on a lot of
responsibilities that they werelooking for.
Doug (02:09):
Yeah, do you have any idea how long they have been open in
that spot?
Jon (02:13):
I think it was like 15 years.
Oh my gosh, that's right.
Yeah, something like that.
Doug (02:25):
And we should remind our listeners this location, Pizzolo
Primo, in Market Square.
It's right in like sort of thenice corner by Starbucks.
It's Neapolitan style.
They've got the wood fired ovenright.
Yes, Pizzas built the wallaround it.
And all of the pastas I meaneverything that I've had has
always been amazing.
Jon (02:35):
Yeah, so a lot of our pastas are made fresh in house.
We've, like I said, we have agreat prep team, we have a great
.
I have a great team around me.
They just plugged and played me, so that's great for me.
Is there another location?
Yes, there's a location over inSouth Fayette, over in
Bridgeville.
It's been open about a year anda half now.
Doug (02:53):
So, as you join this new team, is there anything right
out of the gate that you'reexcited for or that you're
bringing to the table there?
Jon (03:01):
Well, so I worked for a couple of Italian chefs in my
life.
I'm more excited to see whatthey have to offer and what I
can learn.
You know, 32, 33 in October andI, for me, I just I love
learning.
I love showing people what Ihave, but I also like learning
from other people too.
So it's, you know, it's, it's agood balance and the more that
(03:24):
you put into something, the morethat you know you can get out
of it.
Doug (03:28):
That's right Before you joined this team, were you a
patron of the restaurant?
Did you guys go?
Jon (03:35):
Yeah, so actually, uh, I have a couple of friends that
worked down there.
Um and uh, we went down.
We went down last summersometime.
Uh, selena and I did, and thepasta was great, the food's
great, the atmosphere was alwaysgreat, so it was easy to pick
that place as my next landingspot.
Yeah, yeah.
Doug (03:54):
I have to say I have a couple favorite dishes.
I really love the ragubolognese with the tagliatelle,
I think.
Yep, Do you guys have?
Jon (04:03):
a favorite.
I guess mine right now would bethe crab limon.
Oh yeah, it's a really goodsauce.
All the sauces there are freshmade as we're doing.
Nothing's made ahead of time.
You're making it on the line togo.
That's another aspect that Ilove is everything is made right
in the pan, fresh, for eachdish.
Doug (04:24):
Wow yeah, there's none of this like pre-batch stuff.
Jon (04:27):
No, it's not scoop and pour you know nothing like that, so
it's cool.
Doug (04:31):
And the pizzas are amazing too.
I mean, I think, do they cookin like under two minutes or
something?
Is that like that, the pizzas?
Jon (04:37):
there are really fast.
We have a really good pizzateam too.
You know there's like two orthree guys there.
One guy's been there for 10years.
He started as a busboy andmoved all the way up to the
pizza guy.
He's got his pizzas down.
I'm sure he can make it fasterthan that.
I just brought back an oldemployee too.
He was telling me about allthese competitions they used to
(04:59):
go to and stuff like that.
I think we have a good stylethat has been in place.
If it's not broke, don't fix it.
I agree.
Doug (05:06):
I am wondering, Jon, like at the restaurant, is there
another dish or pizza that'slike the top seller or something
that everybody goes for?
Jon (05:14):
So last summer, whenever Selina and I were there, our
friend Michelle told us our ourmargarita pizza is our top
seller.
She was like, got to get one ofthose.
So we sat down at the bar,grabbed a drink their glass of
wine and we had that.
Margarita pizza is our topseller.
She was like, got to get one ofthose.
So we sat down at the bar,grabbed a drink there, a glass
of wine and we had thatmargarita pizza and just fell in
love with it.
It's just, the tomato sauce isfresh made, the mozzarella is
(05:35):
fresh made in house, the doughobviously everything's fresh
made.
And then, topping that with afresh basil, it's just, it's
melts in your mouth as you'retalking.
Doug (05:43):
I'm shaking my head because I've actually had this
pizza many times myself.
It's probably my favorite.
Jon (05:47):
We were talking about it recently, actually to the media
team that is around me right nowand I think last year they sold
over 6,000 of them, so that's agood seller for us.
Doug (05:59):
That's amazing.
You've had sort of a great,pretty storied career in
culinary so far.
But I do want to take a stepback and just ask you where did
this passion for cooking andfood start?
Did you cook a lot in yourfamily?
Did folks cook?
Jon (06:15):
for you.
So as a kid, I had a veryItalian grandmother and a very
Polish grandmother.
So, I learned to make raviolisand pierogies with my two little
baby fists, you know they hadme in the kitchen.
My mom's mom, you know she madeeverything Italian.
You know seven fishes.
I learned about that before Iwas even born.
(06:36):
Oh, you know she did not speakEnglish very well, it was very
broken, wow, you know.
So that was that was fun tolearn from her.
And then you know my dad's mommaking pierogies.
You know chicken and dumplings,things like that.
Talking about the freshness,that's where I it all goes back
to.
For me it was six, seven yearsold in their kitchens.
You know I want all of thisright now.
(06:58):
Yeah, right, so is your familyfrom Pittsburgh.
So I grew, um, I grew up inunion town, okay, um, my dad was
born and raised there.
My mom was, uh, born in toronto,oh, and she grew up in
cleveland oh yeah, so they, theymet in cleveland, got married
in cleveland, but we would, sowe would go up there for
christmas and things like that.
And that's why I mentioned theseven fishes, because that was a
(07:20):
big part of, yeah, going up tocleveland, big ital, italian
community up there, exactly,exactly.
So they got married at a churchcalled St Rocco's.
The festival up there wasenormous, you know, people
flocked from other cities tocome to that St Rocco's festival
and get the Italian sausage wasthe dish that my dad and I
always went down there for.
Doug (07:40):
So, oh, that's great memories.
Now what about your own cooking?
Like when do you rememberstarting to cook for yourself or
for other folks?
Jon (08:05):
no-transcript actually cooking for other people
obviously my brothers andsisters but it felt like I was
actually doing something.
And then, you know, as I gotolder, I worked at a couple of
different places, and I workedat this place called a duck
hollow, and one Valentine's Day,whenever I was 15 years old,
(08:25):
the chef comes down.
He's like which one of you guysdoesn't have a date tonight?
And I was just like that's me.
He's like you're working fryers?
Oh, my goodness.
And that's the storied careerof how that started.
Doug (08:36):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, remind me Duck Hollow.
Was this like a restaurant?
Jon (08:40):
So Duck Hollow is a golf course in Uniontown but they had
like banquet area and stufflike that.
So on Valentine's Day theywould have a big dinner or, you
know, it'd be a place for peoplein Uniontown to go.
Sure and so you started on thefryer, started on fryers.
I asked the chef.
I said when do I pull this foodup?
He's like whenever it's done.
I was like, okay, I'm 15.
Doug (09:02):
I don't know what you're saying.
Truly, training by fire.
We did not have deep fires inmy home growing up.
Jon (09:06):
No, exactly exactly.
Doug (09:08):
Okay, so let's just kind of take your journey along from
the golf course.
Where did you go next?
Jon (09:14):
I was there for quite a while and then there was a
restaurant in Morgantown calledT-Bones and part of the
ownership group of Duck Hollowhad gone down to T-Bones and
they asked me to come along andthat's where I became the first
time I got a sous chef position.
Joe (09:30):
I followed.
Jon (09:31):
The chef, chef Mike, took me down there and it was that
one was another experience,cause you were, you were doing
things like inventory andscheduling and things like that,
and I was, like you know, justamazed by it's not just cooking
in kitchens, right?
(09:51):
So, yeah, so from there, um, Ieventually made my way out to St
Louis and, yeah, that was, thatwas a journey in itself.
In my early twenties, my dad,um, got sick and uh, I stuck
back to in Pittsburgh, in theunion town, I should say.
Um, I stuck back in that areato um to help him.
And uh, one day he went to rehaband told his um, his physical
therapist.
He was like my son really wantsto go follow this culinary
(10:14):
career.
It's like I need to be able toget myself off the floor before
he'll leave us.
And uh, one day I came downfrom the room that I was staying
in at their house and he's likestay right there.
And he gets down on the floorand gets himself back up.
And whenever he gets back up,he's like go, go, do what you
want to do, oh my goodness.
So I went out to St Louis and itwas very, you know, bittersweet
(10:37):
because I was like, thankgoodness, he can take care of
himself, but also, you know, Iwas going to miss them and you
know that time that we had builttogether there.
but yeah, I started at a placecalled Favazas which was an
Italian restaurant out there inthe Hill and the restaurants
older than my dad, you know the,the owner, Tony Favazza, great
guy, His, his son, is like a bigmanager there.
(10:58):
They, they welcomed me in likefamily, except for whenever the
cardinals played the pirates,because the cardinals out there
are like the stealers of courseyeah, it's a religion
for them but um, yeah, that's,that's a lot of.
Uh, the first italian umrestaurant that like I really
saw you know fresh things beingmade, you know fresh pastas and
things like that, like in arestaurant environment, not just
(11:21):
in grandma's kitchen in ohio.
Doug (11:23):
So just to kind of take a step back.
All of your education ishappening on the job.
You're at the T-Bonesrestaurant at 19 years old.
Joe (11:32):
Yeah, oh my gosh.
Doug (11:33):
Learning the inventory, learning all the real sort of
the back of the house businessstuff.
Jon (11:37):
I was young and dumb and thought I knew everything.
You know, and I can say thatmultiple times in my career and
I'll probably say that again.
You know, at some point.
You know, but not even 22 yearsold, I'm moving to a brand new
city, 600 miles away, differenttime zone, you know, finding
this cool opportunity.
I, honestly, whenever I movedout there, I just Googled, you
(11:59):
know, restaurants in St Louisand started finding different
ones that I thought I would fitin at.
You know, and I did interviews.
I went out there a couple oftimes and talked to some of the
people and you know, I talked toTony Favazza and Mark Favazza
and they were just, they werejust so welcoming they were.
It was like my, my grandfatherand my older brother were like
(12:19):
all right, come on in.
You know, we're going to showyou how to make this stuff.
You know, they showed me theropes.
You know, at Favazas I startedas a line cook or prep cook,
moved up to a line cook and youknow, by the time I was leaving,
I was making gelato for him.
You know, I left to go to FourSeasons in St Louis and I still
would go back and help Tony makegelato every summer.
(12:40):
You know things like that.
I mean to this day, if Tonycalled me and was like hey, come
on out here.
I would still probably want todo it.
Doug (12:47):
Yeah, oh, what a great bond and what a great sort of
formative years story.
So you have this time at theItalian restaurant and then
you're saying, like you moved togo to the four seasons in St
Louis at 21, 22, 23,.
Jon (13:02):
You're working two, three jobs.
You know everybody does it.
But another chef friend of minehelped me from a bar that I was
working at move into a spotwhere I could go to Four Seasons
.
I went up there and Iinterviewed and that's the first
time I met Gianni Colucci, whois a world-renowned Michelin
star Italian chef, my biggestinspiration in my life.
(13:25):
Um, he, as far as cooking goes,um he just, he taught me so
much and took me under his wingand it was, it was a great
experience.
But I just remember theinterview and one of the things
he said to me.
There was another gentlemansitting there.
He had a shirt on that, youknow, wasn't buttoned up, he was
kind of slouched over and I'msitting straight up and I got a
tie on.
He said why should I hire youover him?
(13:46):
And I'm like, well,presentation's key in our
industry.
And so he hires me.
And then a couple months laterhe actually hired the other
gentleman too.
So it was pretty cool momentfor me.
And I asked him, you know why?
Why he had chosen me and thatwas why that cause the answer
presentation's key, you know,and me, and that was why?
Doug (14:05):
because the answer presentation's key.
You know well, you're right.
I mean, all the details countin the restaurant business, in
the dish that you serve, whatthe plate looks like.
So even you dressing up alittle bit more than the next
person absolutely gives you thatlittle bit of an edge.
Jon (14:16):
Absolutely I love that every time, every time I go to
an interview, I dress up,doesn't doesn't matter what it's
for you.
Actually, whenever I got hiredat Blue Sky, eventually,
whenever I come back toPittsburgh, the owner there
after he hired me, he's like Isaw you were dressed to the T,
but then I saw you weren'twearing any dress socks and I
knew you were more on my level.
(14:37):
And I laugh because now, everysingle time I go to an interview
I wear dress socks.
So it's just take those littlethings from each interview and
carry them on to each one.
So it's a builder, yeah, sure,yeah.
But Four Seasons in St Louisstarted as a pizza guy there and
that was an experience in itsown.
Going back to the things of mesaying I thought I knew
(14:58):
everything, you know.
I walked in there and I waslike I'm better than a pizza guy
.
And I got back there and Irealized how quickly, like, how
much better those chefs werethan me, and it just built.
It just built a fire in me.
I was like man, I just want tomake myself so much better I
still do, but like that fire,whenever I saw how great those
chefs were, I mean I can, I canjust remember seeing guys like
(15:20):
Austin Beckett and Joe Simanekand they were my age you know
they're no older than me, and Iwas just like God, these guys
are so good, you know, I waslike that, how do they knew all
this stuff?
And I'm just watching them andeach one of them just took the
time to sit there with you andactually like talk to you about
like what, what we're trying todo here, you know and that that
was something that I aspired tobe too, you know so.
Doug (15:46):
I mean sometimes, when we surround ourselves with the
right people, you just take thatlittle bit of something from
all of them and it alsoenergizes you to be at or better
than that level Absolutely yeah, yeah.
Jon (15:52):
This is Chef Homer and you're listening to The
Pittsburgh Dish.
Doug (15:57):
So what else happens Like how long do you stay at the Four
Seasons?
When do you graduate from PizzaGuy?
Jon (16:02):
Yeah, so I moved around a little bit there.
I stayed on pizzas for a couplemonths and then they eventually
started making some changes.
Some people move in otherplaces, some people are getting
promoted, so I did pastas theregarbage and then eventually I
was a grill guy because they hadthis thing called task force
and all these guys went out todifferent places and they needed
(16:24):
a grill guy.
I jumped in you know I'd beenwatching Joe and Austin really,
really actually do that grillposition, became friends with
those guys and just took advicefrom watching what they did, you
know.
So give me the opportunity toput me in that position.
After I became the grill guy,you know that was those guys all
started coming back and it wasan opportunity for me to move
(16:46):
around the kitchen.
And then we had a huge banquetkitchen as well that seated up
to 500 people.
So I got the opportunity to godown there and learn that.
You know, and I learned fromguys like Roy Mosley, david
Ballard these guys, these chefs,are big chefs in St.
Louis, and you know they, theytook the moments to actually
teach me and that was.
That was something where youknow again, I, as I was learning
(17:06):
, I would sit there and think I,I want to be that kind of chef
whenever I, you know, finallyget my own spots.
I want to be able to teachpeople what I've been taught.
Doug (17:16):
You just have me thinking that part of the reason they
were really good chefs and arereally good chefs is because
they do take the time to teachother aspiring folks around them
, exactly.
Jon (17:26):
So I just wanted to also say for our listeners, if
they're not familiar with theFour Seasons, this is a high end
, high volume place right beyondthe banquets, so it's a five
star hotel at least the timethat I was there, and in
Missouri I think it was justthem and the Ritz yeah, four
Seasons is a high-end place andCello was there before I got
(17:48):
there and Gianni he turned itinto what it was.
The previous chef was anamazing chef as well.
I didn't work for him.
He left right before I gotthere and he went down to Four
Seasons Orlando and turned thatinto an amazing restaurant and
Gianni kind of created thatfamily-like environment in the
kitchen.
You know learning from eachother.
You know not just the olderguys teaching the new guys, but
(18:10):
vice versa too.
Doug (18:12):
I love so much about this story because the path to what
you're doing is not always aboutgoing to a culinary school
program.
You can really learn and absorbso much from your on-the-job
experience and just steppinginto the fire, so to speak.
Were there any other pivotalmoments or mentors from the four
seasons that you reallyappreciated before you decided
(18:34):
to move back to Pittsburgh?
Jon (18:35):
Yeah, chef Frank Woods, he's a friend of mine.
He was the first person from StLouis to come out and visit me
in Pittsburgh after I moved back.
A lot of people are verysupportive of me coming back
here because it was for my dadto be with, to be around family,
and you know it was my sisterjust had a baby and it was like
I didn't want to miss out onnieces and nephews and you know,
(18:58):
seeing my dad, you know bebetter and walking down the, you
know his daughter's down theaisle and things like that, yeah
, but yeah, Chef Frank Woods,man, he took me under his wing
so many times and he, you knowhe was hard on me but he was
like a big brother to me.
You know it was like no, you'redoing that wrong and this is
(19:19):
why you're doing it wrong.
You know he, I remember I movedto mornings and he, he had been
on mornings for like two orthree years.
You know I was making an omeletat one point and he just looked
at me and he's like no you know,he pushed me aside and he was
like this is how you do it andthis is why you do it this way,
you know, and 5 billion omeletslater, you know, every time I
(19:40):
flip an omelet I think of FrankWoods.
Doug (19:40):
You think of that moment.
Right, I love that.
So I'm going to like pop backin, because when we interviewed
your fiance Selina, I sort ofremember part of this.
There's a moment in your timein St Louis that you decide I'm
coming back to Pittsburgh.
And was it your mom or your dadthat said why don't you look at
the best restaurants here andapply?
Is that right?
Jon (19:59):
Yeah, so my dad flies out to St Louis and I'm packing up
my house and we're talking andwe actually end up going up to
Chicago and we go to GibsonSteakhouse Amazing, amazing food
city in itself and he and Idrive back from Chicago, just
father-son moments, just talkingsports, talking whatever.
(20:19):
And we're getting on our wayback and he's like what do you
want to do when you get backthere?
You know he's like you don'thave a job lined up, you don't
have anything lined up.
What do you want to do?
I was like I want to cooksomewhere.
Obviously he's like where youknow, he goes on his phone, he
Googles best restaurants inPittsburgh and you know the
(20:40):
usuals come up and Altius comesup.
I kind of told this story on uhlast time I was on, but just to
refresh your memory, um, I, he,he calls the phone number to
Altius and he's like hey, can Italk to the chef or the manager
or whatever?
And then he hands me the phone.
Doug (20:57):
I was like thanks, man, this is your dad setting you up?
Joe (20:59):
Yeah, exactly.
Jon (21:00):
So Chef Jess comes on and I was like, hey, I'm moving back
from St Louis, this is myexperience.
I can send you a resume, whichyou know.
She gives me her email and weset up an interview and the
first person I see is Selina.
Whenever I walk into Altius,first night shift there, you
know, I worked with her atstashed, a couple other places,
and I was choosing between thisplace and that place and I chose
(21:22):
Altius because I saw Selina,you know.
But it was a great moment forme too, because it was one of
the best restaurants in the city.
Doug (21:30):
I think it still is Right.
Yeah, yeah, it definitely is.
You're just not there anymorebecause you guys started to date
Exactly, exactly.
Jon (21:37):
So so I left there and I went to Stonehouse, which is
closer to Uniontown, and I wastraveling back and forth and
then eventually COVID hit andall the restaurants shut down,
and that's whenever her and Ikind of moved in together.
And I moved back down toPittsburgh and waited for COVID
(21:58):
to to end and I eventuallystarted working for Richard
Deschantz.
Coop De Ville is where Istarted there, ok, and then I
moved on to Tako Torta.
Oh, yeah, yeah.
Joe (22:09):
Over in East.
Doug (22:09):
Liberty.
Jon (22:11):
Yeah, Bakery Square.
Bakery Square, that's right.
And then from there is wherethe Blue Sky opportunity
eventually happened.
A friend of a friend told methat there was a restaurant open
in East Liberty.
They thought that I'd fit therole and that's where I met Matt
and Matt, he and I interviewedand that was in April.
(22:31):
He hires me and then we didn'topen until July.
Oh wow, that was a learningexperience in itself.
Was a restaurant.
What year was this?
God?
That had to be 21, 21 to 22,probably.
Yeah so whatever would it be in20?
Doug (22:45):
we are in 25 right now.
Jon (22:47):
Yeah, gosh yeah, so it'd be 20, 22, I think it was yeah and
now you've moved on and you'reat Pizziolo Primo in Market
Square.
Doug (22:57):
Yes, for this last, as we're recording, about a month,
month and a half.
Jon (23:00):
Yeah.
Doug (23:01):
All right, Still learning right.
Jon (23:03):
Yeah, oh, I mean, and again , I'll learn.
I'll learn every day.
I don't ever want to put downthe notebook to sit there and
I'm taking notes everywhere.
But I was the chef at Blue Skyand I was taking notes
everywhere.
But I was the chef at Blue Skyand I was taking notes from
other people.
Matt really showed me how torun a business and things like
(23:23):
that, those things that I hadn'tlearned before in the past.
And take little things that yousaid from every opportunity.
Doug (23:30):
Well, I love your success and just the story of your whole
culinary journey.
I'd love to know, beyond thewedding which I know is coming
up later this year, right, yes,september 20th, your soon-to-be
wife said she's gonna make allthe desserts herself.
She is, yeah.
Well, beyond the wedding, whatother goals or events or
(23:52):
anything else you have coming upthis year?
What's?
Jon (23:54):
ahead.
For you, I would just say, forme, it's just trying to build
from the strong foundation thatwe have at primo.
I was really happy whenever thesocial media team that's here
today, they they came to us andthey were like, hey, we want to,
we want to push this.
And I was happy about thatbecause I at blue sky, that I
(24:14):
felt like that was a big part ofus was.
You know, that's how we got alot of our business was pushing
out this kind of stuff.
Doug (24:21):
The right kind of marketing is what you're saying,
yeah.
Jon (24:23):
And for me, like just building that foundation that is
already at Primo is really justmy biggest goal right now.
I love it.
Doug (24:31):
Well, I need to go and visit there.
Now that we talked about thepizza and that tagliatelle,
those are my favorite things,absolutely All right, john,
let's go ahead and plug yoursocial handles.
Where can people find andfollow you if they want to
follow your journey?
Jon (24:46):
So, Chef_ Homer1 for me, and is that on Instagram?
Yeah that's Instagram.
I think that's pretty much theonly social media that you post.
Yeah, okay.
Doug (24:55):
And we can remind folks about the restaurant.
It's pizzioloprimo.
com and the handle on Instagramis pizzioloprimo_ms for the
market square location.
Yep, all right, john, I thinkyou know this last question
because you've been around thisshow before.
Yes, the name of the show isthe Pittsburgh dish.
What's the best dish you've hadto eat this past week?
Jon (25:19):
Uh.
So I kind of cheated here causeI knew this question was coming
.
So I went to go visit chefChris at high hold.
Oh yeah yeah, and uh, I had hislamb.
Um, I, I knew this question wascoming.
Chef Chris had me um betweenBlue Sky and Primo.
He had me come up and come upand help him out a little bit
with.
Actually it was New Year's Eve,so I think we helped each other
(25:40):
that night, yeah.
Doug (25:42):
This is Chef Chris O'Brien out at the Hyeh olde in Moon,
and if someone hasn't been there, it's a spectacular looking
place.
Jon (25:50):
Absolutely, it's gorgeous.
It's been there forever.
Chef Chris was the chef there awhile back and he recently came
back in 2021, if I'm notmistaken and this became one of
my friends.
Chef Chris was the chef there awhile back and he recently came
back in 2021, if I'm notmistaken and just became one of
my friends and his food isphenomenal.
And again, I just love learningfrom smart people and I
consider him one of the best inthe city.
Doug (26:09):
So, just to recap, you had this lamb this past week.
Yes, and tell us a little bitmore.
What's the preparation on it?
Jon (26:15):
Oh my gosh.
I mean it's a local farm andeverything about the dish is
just.
You know the flavors that heputs into it.
Everything the grilled it'sjust, it's just melts in your
mouth, you know falls off theboat.
It's delicious.
Doug (26:29):
Sounds so good.
Chef Jonathan Homer, thank youso much for being on The
Pittsburgh Dish.
Thank you, Doug.
Anytime.
Up next want the inside scoopon a great bar spot for food and
drinks.
Our friend, autumn Pavelic,shares her pick.
We're joined by Autumn Pavelic,model and lifestyle creator, on
(26:49):
Instagram.
Autumn, you've been doing a lotmore with food in your
Instagram feed.
Yeah more with food in yourInstagram feed.
Yeah, I was wondering when youand your fiance, kevin go out,
maybe to watch one of the gamesat your favorite bar and have
some bar snacks or food.
Do you have a spot that kind ofalways draws you in?
Autumn (27:06):
Yes, absolutely, Bigham Tavern up in Mount Washington.
They're actually located onBigham Street Right.
We've been going there since westarted dating, like seven
years ago.
And it's just it's our likeversion of Cheers, if you know
what I mean their bar food is mepersonally, I think their bar
food is some of the best barfood in Pittsburgh.
(27:27):
And that's something it'sawesome Like.
It's such, it's such a coolenvironment, the food's good,
the drinks are always cold.
I mean it's just, and thebartenders there we love to.
It does feel like a littlecheers, like a little family.
Whenever you know you become aregular there.
Maria (27:42):
Yeah.
Autumn (27:42):
But whenever we go like, let's say, we're going to go
watch like a Steeler game theirwings again, I'm telling you I
think they are some of the bestin the city.
Doug (27:51):
This is an extensive menu too, if someone takes a look,
there's like a huge section justfor mild and then they get a
little more intense.
What do you like?
Autumn (27:59):
I love the BT original.
I love it so much.
They sell some of their saucesand I actually buy the bottle to
keep it home because, like,let's say, I'm cooking wings at
home and that's the sauce I want.
It's just, it's such a good OGBuffalo sauce, but with their
own little twist on it, it's so,so good.
Doug (28:17):
Oh, I love that.
Yeah, does Kevin have afavorite?
Autumn (28:20):
He does he.
I forget the name of cause the.
The list of sauces is so long,but I want to say it's like a
little bit more of a kick to it.
It's definitely not a dry rub,it's a sauce.
I forget the name of it, butit's just he loves it, he of it,
but it's just he loves it.
He loves a little bit more of akick to his wings, like he'll
actually like sweat a little bitwhen he eats it.
Doug (28:40):
Yeah, I get it, though it's kind of an obsession.
I'm obsessed with watching hotones nowadays.
Yes, okay, outside of the wings.
Is there anything else on themenu?
That's always sort of a go-tofor the two of you.
Autumn (28:50):
Yeah, so they have.
They have some really good likemunchy appetizers, like, let's
say, if you want to go and graba couple beers and you just want
a couple little like snackyfoods.
Their pierogies are reallyreally good.
Their fried pickles they callthem tickled pickles are also
extremely good, okay, wait, wait, tickled pickles.
Tickled pickles.
Yes, okay, this is a friedpickle.
Yes.
Doug (29:11):
Is there anything extra special going on?
Or just like, straight up good,it's just good.
Autumn (29:14):
The breading's really good, and then they have
homemade ranch that you can dipit into and it's so yum.
Doug (29:19):
Yeah, here's a critical question.
I want to know Are they chipsor spears?
They're spears, yeah, yeah,they're spears.
Autumn (29:25):
They're really really good.
So those are like our go-to,like munchy snacks.
And then, oddly enough, theyhave a really good French onion
soup.
Yes, have, I mean they have awhole menu.
Um, their grilled chickensalads are really good.
Um, they have really decentsmash burgers there too, but
their french onion soup I don'tknow what it is, but like it's
(29:45):
just good.
Like I will get the frenchonion soup every time.
Wings and french onionsinteresting combo.
Doug (29:52):
I love that combo yeah, it's so good, perfect for a game
day.
Yes, so we're talking aboutBigham Tavern, right on Bigham
Street.
Autumn (29:58):
Bigham Street.
Right next to Armful of FlowersRight on Bigham Street.
Doug (30:02):
Autumn.
Thanks so much.
Autumn (30:03):
Yeah, thank you.
Doug (30:06):
You can follow Autumn Pawelec on Instagram at Autumn
Pawelec.
You may remember, a few weeksback we talked with Joseph
Costanzo Jr and his daughter,Maria C Palmer.
Maria co-authored the book Onthe Rocks, all about her dad's
journey, and while we weretogether that day, they shared a
(30:26):
bit more about another favoritefamily dish.
Guys, you stopped by the studioto kind of tell the bigger
story, but we got to talkinggnocchi.
Do I understand?
You have a recipe or a coupleof things to share with our
listeners?
Maria (30:38):
Yeah.
So, dad, why don't you sharesort of the facts about it, and
then I will share the recipe?
Joe (30:44):
Sure, At the Prima Donna we did homemade gnocchi, made it
right in-house, we used a potatobase and most southern Italian
dishes that are gnocchi are madewith potato.
Now the northern Italiansusually use ricotta cheese
(31:09):
instead of the potato.
It's based on the region,because Southern Italians were a
lot more poor than NorthernItalians.
So, Maria, a lot of hergnocchis that she makes in her
cooking classes, she makes itwith ricotta, which it makes the
gnocchi a lot lighter.
Where at the Prima Donna wemade traditional peasant.
(31:34):
Italian food which I coined thatphrase peasant Italian food,
and the gnocchi were made withpotato-based, of course.
So that's the difference.
There's two types of gnocchi.
The actual gnocchi itself isusually made with potato, but
(31:54):
the Northern Italians usually doit with ricotta cheese.
So, maria, you can talk alittle about your recipe, which
you make with ricotta.
Maria (32:05):
Yeah, so, and actually my recipe is not really my recipe,
it's my dad's aunt.
Autumn (32:12):
Josephine.
Maria (32:13):
She is very innovative cook and she taught me how to
make this years ago and reallyyou can substitute.
If you want to try the potatobase, you can substitute the
same amount of ricotta for thesame amount of the potato, and
that's how you do it.
But it's very simple.
It just is a few ingredients.
(32:34):
So you have ricotta cheese andI'll just give this little tip
Make sure you dry out yourricotta as much as possible.
Doug (32:43):
Like do you put it over a strainer with, like paper towels
, or how do you do it?
Maria (32:47):
Well, a lot of times I will take it out of the
packaging and.
I'll wrap it up in paper towels, kind of like a pillow.
Yes, and then I'll just throwit in the refrigerator and it's
probably not the best for theenvironment and a bowl and it
just kind of yeah but I'llswitch out the paper towels a
couple of times just to soak upall of that moisture.
Doug (33:05):
Gotcha.
Maria (33:06):
You want to get the moisture out because if not,
you're going to going to add inyour flour until it's really the
consistency of a light doughwhere you can work it but it's
(33:38):
not sticking to you.
Doug (33:39):
Gotcha.
Maria (33:41):
And then you know, you cut off maybe like a three
eighths of an inch piece, youroll it like a snake, you cut it
on a bias and then you sort ofroll it either with your thumb
and kind of make an imprintwhich is the very traditional
way, or you could do the fancyway which I like to do, either
with a grid or with a fork withthe back.
Doug (33:59):
Is that with the gnocchi board that I see?
Maria (34:01):
Yeah, you can use the board.
Doug (34:03):
That's the fancy way.
Maria (34:04):
Yeah, or you could just use a fork.
The fork does the same thingand provides those grooves that
really hold the sauce in verywell.
It's not hard to do, but it'ssomething that will wow your
guest.
I teach this class quite a lotand people come back and say,
hey, I've made this now part ofmy holiday tradition, or
whenever I'm going to a potluckI make this and you know people
(34:28):
go crazy over it because there'snot a lot of people that are
actually homemaking pastanowadays.
Joe (34:34):
Right.
No, I want to say also becauseof the peasant Italian cuisine.
We didn't use a fork, we usedour thumbs.
Doug (34:46):
Now, Maria, does this fit the same when you boil the
gnocchi, whether it's thericotta or the potato?
We're waiting until they floatfor a minute or two, yeah.
Maria (34:55):
Yeah, you can definitely wait till they float till for a
minute or two until they're done, and the other thing that I
like to do too, because they'refragile- yes.
So I never just take it out ofthe colander and just dump it.
I fish them out.
So if you have one of thosewire baskets, yes, like I call
it a spider.
Doug (35:14):
Yes, yeah.
Maria (35:15):
You can, you know, fish them out on the top and then you
put your gnocchi a layer ofsauce, little cheese, and then
repeat, kind of a layeringeffect, just like lasagna and
you know can garnish on the topwith a little basil if you'd
like, or some hot pepper flakes,if that's what you're into.
Fresh mozzarella, or, you know,a little bit of ricotta too, it
(35:37):
doesn't matter.
Doug (35:38):
Is it a red sauce that you like with your gnocchi?
Maria (35:40):
I do yeah.
Doug (35:41):
Yeah, I do.
Joe (35:42):
You could use an Alfredo sauce if you want.
You could use an olive oil andgarlic you know with anchovies,
but I mean, the red sauce is thetraditional way and it was such
an inexpensive pasta to make,especially people who were poor,
and your children could getfilled up with this pasta and
(36:09):
they don't have to eat a lot Ifyou didn't have the food, that's
where it was.
So this became a luxury dish,even though it was really a poor
person's dish.
Yes, and I said to my dad wouldyou believe when you were
coming over on this boat, onthis ship, that people would
(36:32):
stand in line for two hours toeat gnocchi?
And he said I never would havebelieved it.
When I was growing up he saidpeople laughed that we were
eating this dough or this pasta,and now people are begging for
it.
Doug (36:52):
Goes to show when food is simple ingredients, done well
and made with love, it's goingto always win out Exactly.
Thank you both so much forsharing a lesson on Yaki, a
recipe, and thank you both againfor being on the Pittsburgh
Dish.
Maria (37:07):
Thank you.
Thank you, Doug.
Doug (37:10):
Maria has several live events coming up in the
Pittsburgh area.
You can find more informationon her website, mariacpalmer.
com.
Maybe you'll catch her makingthat gnocchi.
Do you have a recipe?
Share it with us.
Just go to our website at www.
pittsburghdish.
com and look for our share arecipe form.
(37:31):
If you enjoyed the show,consider buying us a coffee for
this episode or supporting theshow monthly.
You can find links to thoseoptions at the bottom of our
show description.
And if you want to follow myown food adventures, you can
find me on social media at DougCooking.
That's our show for this week.
Thanks again to all of ourguests and contributors and to
(37:52):
Kevin Solecki of Carnegieaccordion company for providing
the music to our show.
We'll be back again next weekwith another fresh episode.
Stay tuned.
Welcome to The Pittsburgh Dish.
I'm your host, Doug Heilman.
What's the secret to culinarysuccess for this week's guest,
constant learning.
We talk with executive chefJonathan Homer Love to know that
favorite neighborhood bar spotfor good food and drinks.
Autumn Pawelec has her pick inMount Washington and Want the
(00:28):
backstory on Italian gnocchi.
We have that, along with arecipe.
All that ahead, stay tuned.
The Pittsburgh Dish issupported by Chip and Kale
plant-based meals.
Select from dishes like crispyKorean barbecue, tofu bowls or
Chesapeake Bay chowder.
Visit their website atchipandkale.
com to learn more.
(00:50):
Now on to the show.
Well, thank you so much forcoming over and for being on the
show.
Would you introduce yourself toour listeners and what you have
going on right now in the worldof food?
Jon (01:04):
Yeah, so I'm Chef Jonathan Homer.
I am the chef at Pizziolo Primoin Market Square.
Doug (01:10):
And, Jon, this is a new move for you, right?
Because I've actually talked toyou once before with your
lovely wife-to-be, your fiancée.
Jon (01:19):
Selina Progar.
That's right, she's the pastrychef at Eleven.
She came on back in December.
Yes, we were discussing this.
Off air is what they say,that's right.
Yeah, she came on.
I was the chef at Blue Sky thenand I've moved on since and
down at Market Square now.
It's been a good month and acouple days.
Doug (01:38):
Just since January or so, since we're recording, oh my
goodness.
Well, I have to say, you know,Blue Sky had a great run.
I guess, unfortunately, likewe're moving on, yeah, and that
concept is no longer.
But I'll tell you, PizzioloPrimo has always been such a
consistently good spot.
Jon (01:55):
Yeah, it's a great location .
The team that's already therewas great, so I'm excited to
move in there and kind of fillthat role that they were looking
for with a chef to, you know,kind of take on a lot of
responsibilities that they werelooking for.
Doug (02:09):
Yeah, do you have any idea how long they have been open in
that spot?
Jon (02:13):
I think it was like 15 years.
Oh my gosh, that's right.
Yeah, something like that.
Doug (02:25):
And we should remind our listeners this location, Pizzolo
Primo, in Market Square.
It's right in like sort of thenice corner by Starbucks.
It's Neapolitan style.
They've got the wood fired ovenright.
Yes, Pizzas built the wallaround it.
And all of the pastas I meaneverything that I've had has
always been amazing.
Jon (02:35):
Yeah, so a lot of our pastas are made fresh in house.
We've, like I said, we have agreat prep team, we have a great
.
I have a great team around me.
They just plugged and played me, so that's great for me.
Is there another location?
Yes, there's a location over inSouth Fayette, over in
Bridgeville.
It's been open about a year anda half now.
Doug (02:53):
So, as you join this new team, is there anything right
out of the gate that you'reexcited for or that you're
bringing to the table there?
Jon (03:01):
Well, so I worked for a couple of Italian chefs in my
life.
I'm more excited to see whatthey have to offer and what I
can learn.
You know, 32, 33 in October andI, for me, I just I love
learning.
I love showing people what Ihave, but I also like learning
from other people too.
So it's, you know, it's, it's agood balance and the more that
(03:24):
you put into something, the morethat you know you can get out
of it.
Doug (03:28):
That's right Before you joined this team, were you a
patron of the restaurant?
Did you guys go?
Jon (03:35):
Yeah, so actually, uh, I have a couple of friends that
worked down there.
Um and uh, we went down.
We went down last summersometime.
Uh, selena and I did, and thepasta was great, the food's
great, the atmosphere was alwaysgreat, so it was easy to pick
that place as my next landingspot.
Yeah, yeah.
Doug (03:54):
I have to say I have a couple favorite dishes.
I really love the ragubolognese with the tagliatelle,
I think.
Yep, Do you guys have?
Jon (04:03):
a favorite.
I guess mine right now would bethe crab limon.
Oh yeah, it's a really goodsauce.
All the sauces there are freshmade as we're doing.
Nothing's made ahead of time.
You're making it on the line togo.
That's another aspect that Ilove is everything is made right
in the pan, fresh, for eachdish.
Doug (04:24):
Wow yeah, there's none of this like pre-batch stuff.
Jon (04:27):
No, it's not scoop and pour you know nothing like that, so
it's cool.
Doug (04:31):
And the pizzas are amazing too.
I mean, I think, do they cookin like under two minutes or
something?
Is that like that, the pizzas?
Jon (04:37):
there are really fast.
We have a really good pizzateam too.
You know there's like two orthree guys there.
One guy's been there for 10years.
He started as a busboy andmoved all the way up to the
pizza guy.
He's got his pizzas down.
I'm sure he can make it fasterthan that.
I just brought back an oldemployee too.
He was telling me about allthese competitions they used to
(04:59):
go to and stuff like that.
I think we have a good stylethat has been in place.
If it's not broke, don't fix it.
I agree.
Doug (05:06):
I am wondering, Jon, like at the restaurant, is there
another dish or pizza that'slike the top seller or something
that everybody goes for?
Jon (05:14):
So last summer, whenever Selina and I were there, our
friend Michelle told us our ourmargarita pizza is our top
seller.
She was like, got to get one ofthose.
So we sat down at the bar,grabbed a drink their glass of
wine and we had that.
Margarita pizza is our topseller.
She was like, got to get one ofthose.
So we sat down at the bar,grabbed a drink there, a glass
of wine and we had thatmargarita pizza and just fell in
love with it.
It's just, the tomato sauce isfresh made, the mozzarella is
(05:35):
fresh made in house, the doughobviously everything's fresh
made.
And then, topping that with afresh basil, it's just, it's
melts in your mouth as you'retalking.
Doug (05:43):
I'm shaking my head because I've actually had this
pizza many times myself.
It's probably my favorite.
Jon (05:47):
We were talking about it recently, actually to the media
team that is around me right nowand I think last year they sold
over 6,000 of them, so that's agood seller for us.
Doug (05:59):
That's amazing.
You've had sort of a great,pretty storied career in
culinary so far.
But I do want to take a stepback and just ask you where did
this passion for cooking andfood start?
Did you cook a lot in yourfamily?
Did folks cook?
Jon (06:15):
for you.
So as a kid, I had a veryItalian grandmother and a very
Polish grandmother.
So, I learned to make raviolisand pierogies with my two little
baby fists, you know they hadme in the kitchen.
My mom's mom, you know she madeeverything Italian.
You know seven fishes.
I learned about that before Iwas even born.
(06:36):
Oh, you know she did not speakEnglish very well, it was very
broken, wow, you know.
So that was that was fun tolearn from her.
And then you know my dad's mommaking pierogies.
You know chicken and dumplings,things like that.
Talking about the freshness,that's where I it all goes back
to.
For me it was six, seven yearsold in their kitchens.
You know I want all of thisright now.
(06:58):
Yeah, right, so is your familyfrom Pittsburgh.
So I grew, um, I grew up inunion town, okay, um, my dad was
born and raised there.
My mom was, uh, born in toronto,oh, and she grew up in
cleveland oh yeah, so they, theymet in cleveland, got married
in cleveland, but we would, sowe would go up there for
christmas and things like that.
And that's why I mentioned theseven fishes, because that was a
(07:20):
big part of, yeah, going up tocleveland, big ital, italian
community up there, exactly,exactly.
So they got married at a churchcalled St Rocco's.
The festival up there wasenormous, you know, people
flocked from other cities tocome to that St Rocco's festival
and get the Italian sausage wasthe dish that my dad and I
always went down there for.
Doug (07:40):
So, oh, that's great memories.
Now what about your own cooking?
Like when do you rememberstarting to cook for yourself or
for other folks?
Jon (08:05):
no-transcript actually cooking for other people
obviously my brothers andsisters but it felt like I was
actually doing something.
And then, you know, as I gotolder, I worked at a couple of
different places, and I workedat this place called a duck
hollow, and one Valentine's Day,whenever I was 15 years old,
(08:25):
the chef comes down.
He's like which one of you guysdoesn't have a date tonight?
And I was just like that's me.
He's like you're working fryers?
Oh, my goodness.
And that's the storied careerof how that started.
Doug (08:36):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, remind me Duck Hollow.
Was this like a restaurant?
Jon (08:40):
So Duck Hollow is a golf course in Uniontown but they had
like banquet area and stufflike that.
So on Valentine's Day theywould have a big dinner or, you
know, it'd be a place for peoplein Uniontown to go.
Sure and so you started on thefryer, started on fryers.
I asked the chef.
I said when do I pull this foodup?
He's like whenever it's done.
I was like, okay, I'm 15.
Doug (09:02):
I don't know what you're saying.
Truly, training by fire.
We did not have deep fires inmy home growing up.
Jon (09:06):
No, exactly exactly.
Doug (09:08):
Okay, so let's just kind of take your journey along from
the golf course.
Where did you go next?
Jon (09:14):
I was there for quite a while and then there was a
restaurant in Morgantown calledT-Bones and part of the
ownership group of Duck Hollowhad gone down to T-Bones and
they asked me to come along andthat's where I became the first
time I got a sous chef position.
Joe (09:30):
I followed.
Jon (09:31):
The chef, chef Mike, took me down there and it was that
one was another experience,cause you were, you were doing
things like inventory andscheduling and things like that,
and I was, like you know, justamazed by it's not just cooking
in kitchens, right?
(09:51):
So, yeah, so from there, um, Ieventually made my way out to St
Louis and, yeah, that was, thatwas a journey in itself.
In my early twenties, my dad,um, got sick and uh, I stuck
back to in Pittsburgh, in theunion town, I should say.
Um, I stuck back in that areato um to help him.
And uh, one day he went to rehaband told his um, his physical
therapist.
He was like my son really wantsto go follow this culinary
(10:14):
career.
It's like I need to be able toget myself off the floor before
he'll leave us.
And uh, one day I came downfrom the room that I was staying
in at their house and he's likestay right there.
And he gets down on the floorand gets himself back up.
And whenever he gets back up,he's like go, go, do what you
want to do, oh my goodness.
So I went out to St Louis and itwas very, you know, bittersweet
(10:37):
because I was like, thankgoodness, he can take care of
himself, but also, you know, Iwas going to miss them and you
know that time that we had builttogether there.
but yeah, I started at a placecalled Favazas which was an
Italian restaurant out there inthe Hill and the restaurants
older than my dad, you know the,the owner, Tony Favazza, great
guy, His, his son, is like a bigmanager there.
(10:58):
They, they welcomed me in likefamily, except for whenever the
cardinals played the pirates,because the cardinals out there
are like the stealers of courseyeah, it's a religion
for them but um, yeah, that's,that's a lot of.
Uh, the first italian umrestaurant that like I really
saw you know fresh things beingmade, you know fresh pastas and
things like that, like in arestaurant environment, not just
(11:21):
in grandma's kitchen in ohio.
Doug (11:23):
So just to kind of take a step back.
All of your education ishappening on the job.
You're at the T-Bonesrestaurant at 19 years old.
Joe (11:32):
Yeah, oh my gosh.
Doug (11:33):
Learning the inventory, learning all the real sort of
the back of the house businessstuff.
Jon (11:37):
I was young and dumb and thought I knew everything.
You know, and I can say thatmultiple times in my career and
I'll probably say that again.
You know, at some point.
You know, but not even 22 yearsold, I'm moving to a brand new
city, 600 miles away, differenttime zone, you know, finding
this cool opportunity.
I, honestly, whenever I movedout there, I just Googled, you
(11:59):
know, restaurants in St Louisand started finding different
ones that I thought I would fitin at.
You know, and I did interviews.
I went out there a couple oftimes and talked to some of the
people and you know, I talked toTony Favazza and Mark Favazza
and they were just, they werejust so welcoming they were.
It was like my, my grandfatherand my older brother were like
(12:19):
all right, come on in.
You know, we're going to showyou how to make this stuff.
You know, they showed me theropes.
You know, at Favazas I startedas a line cook or prep cook,
moved up to a line cook and youknow, by the time I was leaving,
I was making gelato for him.
You know, I left to go to FourSeasons in St Louis and I still
would go back and help Tony makegelato every summer.
(12:40):
You know things like that.
I mean to this day, if Tonycalled me and was like hey, come
on out here.
I would still probably want todo it.
Doug (12:47):
Yeah, oh, what a great bond and what a great sort of
formative years story.
So you have this time at theItalian restaurant and then
you're saying, like you moved togo to the four seasons in St
Louis at 21, 22, 23,.
Jon (13:02):
You're working two, three jobs.
You know everybody does it.
But another chef friend of minehelped me from a bar that I was
working at move into a spotwhere I could go to Four Seasons
.
I went up there and Iinterviewed and that's the first
time I met Gianni Colucci, whois a world-renowned Michelin
star Italian chef, my biggestinspiration in my life.
(13:25):
Um, he, as far as cooking goes,um he just, he taught me so
much and took me under his wingand it was, it was a great
experience.
But I just remember theinterview and one of the things
he said to me.
There was another gentlemansitting there.
He had a shirt on that, youknow, wasn't buttoned up, he was
kind of slouched over and I'msitting straight up and I got a
tie on.
He said why should I hire youover him?
(13:46):
And I'm like, well,presentation's key in our
industry.
And so he hires me.
And then a couple months laterhe actually hired the other
gentleman too.
So it was pretty cool momentfor me.
And I asked him, you know why?
Why he had chosen me and thatwas why that cause the answer
presentation's key, you know,and me, and that was why?
Doug (14:05):
because the answer presentation's key.
You know well, you're right.
I mean, all the details countin the restaurant business, in
the dish that you serve, whatthe plate looks like.
So even you dressing up alittle bit more than the next
person absolutely gives you thatlittle bit of an edge.
Jon (14:16):
Absolutely I love that every time, every time I go to
an interview, I dress up,doesn't doesn't matter what it's
for you.
Actually, whenever I got hiredat Blue Sky, eventually,
whenever I come back toPittsburgh, the owner there
after he hired me, he's like Isaw you were dressed to the T,
but then I saw you weren'twearing any dress socks and I
knew you were more on my level.
(14:37):
And I laugh because now, everysingle time I go to an interview
I wear dress socks.
So it's just take those littlethings from each interview and
carry them on to each one.
So it's a builder, yeah, sure,yeah.
But Four Seasons in St Louisstarted as a pizza guy there and
that was an experience in itsown.
Going back to the things of mesaying I thought I knew
(14:58):
everything, you know.
I walked in there and I waslike I'm better than a pizza guy
.
And I got back there and Irealized how quickly, like, how
much better those chefs werethan me, and it just built.
It just built a fire in me.
I was like man, I just want tomake myself so much better I
still do, but like that fire,whenever I saw how great those
chefs were, I mean I can, I canjust remember seeing guys like
(15:20):
Austin Beckett and Joe Simanekand they were my age you know
they're no older than me, and Iwas just like God, these guys
are so good, you know, I waslike that, how do they knew all
this stuff?
And I'm just watching them andeach one of them just took the
time to sit there with you andactually like talk to you about
like what, what we're trying todo here, you know and that that
was something that I aspired tobe too, you know so.
Doug (15:46):
I mean sometimes, when we surround ourselves with the
right people, you just take thatlittle bit of something from
all of them and it alsoenergizes you to be at or better
than that level Absolutely yeah, yeah.
Jon (15:52):
This is Chef Homer and you're listening to The
Pittsburgh Dish.
Doug (15:57):
So what else happens Like how long do you stay at the Four
Seasons?
When do you graduate from PizzaGuy?
Jon (16:02):
Yeah, so I moved around a little bit there.
I stayed on pizzas for a couplemonths and then they eventually
started making some changes.
Some people move in otherplaces, some people are getting
promoted, so I did pastas theregarbage and then eventually I
was a grill guy because they hadthis thing called task force
and all these guys went out todifferent places and they needed
(16:24):
a grill guy.
I jumped in you know I'd beenwatching Joe and Austin really,
really actually do that grillposition, became friends with
those guys and just took advicefrom watching what they did, you
know.
So give me the opportunity toput me in that position.
After I became the grill guy,you know that was those guys all
started coming back and it wasan opportunity for me to move
(16:46):
around the kitchen.
And then we had a huge banquetkitchen as well that seated up
to 500 people.
So I got the opportunity to godown there and learn that.
You know, and I learned fromguys like Roy Mosley, david
Ballard these guys, these chefs,are big chefs in St.
Louis, and you know they, theytook the moments to actually
teach me and that was.
That was something where youknow again, I, as I was learning
(17:06):
, I would sit there and think I,I want to be that kind of chef
whenever I, you know, finallyget my own spots.
I want to be able to teachpeople what I've been taught.
Doug (17:16):
You just have me thinking that part of the reason they
were really good chefs and arereally good chefs is because
they do take the time to teachother aspiring folks around them
, exactly.
Jon (17:26):
So I just wanted to also say for our listeners, if
they're not familiar with theFour Seasons, this is a high end
, high volume place right beyondthe banquets, so it's a five
star hotel at least the timethat I was there, and in
Missouri I think it was justthem and the Ritz yeah, four
Seasons is a high-end place andCello was there before I got
(17:48):
there and Gianni he turned itinto what it was.
The previous chef was anamazing chef as well.
I didn't work for him.
He left right before I gotthere and he went down to Four
Seasons Orlando and turned thatinto an amazing restaurant and
Gianni kind of created thatfamily-like environment in the
kitchen.
You know learning from eachother.
You know not just the olderguys teaching the new guys, but
(18:10):
vice versa too.
Doug (18:12):
I love so much about this story because the path to what
you're doing is not always aboutgoing to a culinary school
program.
You can really learn and absorbso much from your on-the-job
experience and just steppinginto the fire, so to speak.
Were there any other pivotalmoments or mentors from the four
seasons that you reallyappreciated before you decided
(18:34):
to move back to Pittsburgh?
Jon (18:35):
Yeah, chef Frank Woods, he's a friend of mine.
He was the first person from StLouis to come out and visit me
in Pittsburgh after I moved back.
A lot of people are verysupportive of me coming back
here because it was for my dadto be with, to be around family,
and you know it was my sisterjust had a baby and it was like
I didn't want to miss out onnieces and nephews and you know,
(18:58):
seeing my dad, you know bebetter and walking down the, you
know his daughter's down theaisle and things like that, yeah
, but yeah, Chef Frank Woods,man, he took me under his wing
so many times and he, you knowhe was hard on me but he was
like a big brother to me.
You know it was like no, you'redoing that wrong and this is
(19:19):
why you're doing it wrong.
You know he, I remember I movedto mornings and he, he had been
on mornings for like two orthree years.
You know I was making an omeletat one point and he just looked
at me and he's like no you know,he pushed me aside and he was
like this is how you do it andthis is why you do it this way,
you know, and 5 billion omeletslater, you know, every time I
(19:40):
flip an omelet I think of FrankWoods.
Doug (19:40):
You think of that moment.
Right, I love that.
So I'm going to like pop backin, because when we interviewed
your fiance Selina, I sort ofremember part of this.
There's a moment in your timein St Louis that you decide I'm
coming back to Pittsburgh.
And was it your mom or your dadthat said why don't you look at
the best restaurants here andapply?
Is that right?
Jon (19:59):
Yeah, so my dad flies out to St Louis and I'm packing up
my house and we're talking andwe actually end up going up to
Chicago and we go to GibsonSteakhouse Amazing, amazing food
city in itself and he and Idrive back from Chicago, just
father-son moments, just talkingsports, talking whatever.
(20:19):
And we're getting on our wayback and he's like what do you
want to do when you get backthere?
You know he's like you don'thave a job lined up, you don't
have anything lined up.
What do you want to do?
I was like I want to cooksomewhere.
Obviously he's like where youknow, he goes on his phone, he
Googles best restaurants inPittsburgh and you know the
(20:40):
usuals come up and Altius comesup.
I kind of told this story on uhlast time I was on, but just to
refresh your memory, um, I, he,he calls the phone number to
Altius and he's like hey, can Italk to the chef or the manager
or whatever?
And then he hands me the phone.
Doug (20:57):
I was like thanks, man, this is your dad setting you up?
Joe (20:59):
Yeah, exactly.
Jon (21:00):
So Chef Jess comes on and I was like, hey, I'm moving back
from St Louis, this is myexperience.
I can send you a resume, whichyou know.
She gives me her email and weset up an interview and the
first person I see is Selina.
Whenever I walk into Altius,first night shift there, you
know, I worked with her atstashed, a couple other places,
and I was choosing between thisplace and that place and I chose
(21:22):
Altius because I saw Selina,you know.
But it was a great moment forme too, because it was one of
the best restaurants in the city.
Doug (21:30):
I think it still is Right.
Yeah, yeah, it definitely is.
You're just not there anymorebecause you guys started to date
Exactly, exactly.
Jon (21:37):
So so I left there and I went to Stonehouse, which is
closer to Uniontown, and I wastraveling back and forth and
then eventually COVID hit andall the restaurants shut down,
and that's whenever her and Ikind of moved in together.
And I moved back down toPittsburgh and waited for COVID
(21:58):
to to end and I eventuallystarted working for Richard
Deschantz.
Coop De Ville is where Istarted there, ok, and then I
moved on to Tako Torta.
Oh, yeah, yeah.
Joe (22:09):
Over in East.
Doug (22:09):
Liberty.
Jon (22:11):
Yeah, Bakery Square.
Bakery Square, that's right.
And then from there is wherethe Blue Sky opportunity
eventually happened.
A friend of a friend told methat there was a restaurant open
in East Liberty.
They thought that I'd fit therole and that's where I met Matt
and Matt, he and I interviewedand that was in April.
(22:31):
He hires me and then we didn'topen until July.
Oh wow, that was a learningexperience in itself.
Was a restaurant.
What year was this?
God?
That had to be 21, 21 to 22,probably.
Yeah so whatever would it be in20?
Doug (22:45):
we are in 25 right now.
Jon (22:47):
Yeah, gosh yeah, so it'd be 20, 22, I think it was yeah and
now you've moved on and you'reat Pizziolo Primo in Market
Square.
Doug (22:57):
Yes, for this last, as we're recording, about a month,
month and a half.
Jon (23:00):
Yeah.
Doug (23:01):
All right, Still learning right.
Jon (23:03):
Yeah, oh, I mean, and again , I'll learn.
I'll learn every day.
I don't ever want to put downthe notebook to sit there and
I'm taking notes everywhere.
But I was the chef at Blue Skyand I was taking notes
everywhere.
But I was the chef at Blue Skyand I was taking notes from
other people.
Matt really showed me how torun a business and things like
(23:23):
that, those things that I hadn'tlearned before in the past.
And take little things that yousaid from every opportunity.
Doug (23:30):
Well, I love your success and just the story of your whole
culinary journey.
I'd love to know, beyond thewedding which I know is coming
up later this year, right, yes,september 20th, your soon-to-be
wife said she's gonna make allthe desserts herself.
She is, yeah.
Well, beyond the wedding, whatother goals or events or
(23:52):
anything else you have coming upthis year?
What's?
Jon (23:54):
ahead.
For you, I would just say, forme, it's just trying to build
from the strong foundation thatwe have at primo.
I was really happy whenever thesocial media team that's here
today, they they came to us andthey were like, hey, we want to,
we want to push this.
And I was happy about thatbecause I at blue sky, that I
(24:14):
felt like that was a big part ofus was.
You know, that's how we got alot of our business was pushing
out this kind of stuff.
Doug (24:21):
The right kind of marketing is what you're saying,
yeah.
Jon (24:23):
And for me, like just building that foundation that is
already at Primo is really justmy biggest goal right now.
I love it.
Doug (24:31):
Well, I need to go and visit there.
Now that we talked about thepizza and that tagliatelle,
those are my favorite things,absolutely All right, john,
let's go ahead and plug yoursocial handles.
Where can people find andfollow you if they want to
follow your journey?
Jon (24:46):
So, Chef_ Homer1 for me, and is that on Instagram?
Yeah that's Instagram.
I think that's pretty much theonly social media that you post.
Yeah, okay.
Doug (24:55):
And we can remind folks about the restaurant.
It's pizzioloprimo.
com and the handle on Instagramis pizzioloprimo_ms for the
market square location.
Yep, all right, john, I thinkyou know this last question
because you've been around thisshow before.
Yes, the name of the show isthe Pittsburgh dish.
What's the best dish you've hadto eat this past week?
Jon (25:19):
Uh.
So I kind of cheated here causeI knew this question was coming
.
So I went to go visit chefChris at high hold.
Oh yeah yeah, and uh, I had hislamb.
Um, I, I knew this question wascoming.
Chef Chris had me um betweenBlue Sky and Primo.
He had me come up and come upand help him out a little bit
with.
Actually it was New Year's Eve,so I think we helped each other
(25:40):
that night, yeah.
Doug (25:42):
This is Chef Chris O'Brien out at the Hyeh olde in Moon,
and if someone hasn't been there, it's a spectacular looking
place.
Jon (25:50):
Absolutely, it's gorgeous.
It's been there forever.
Chef Chris was the chef there awhile back and he recently came
back in 2021, if I'm notmistaken and this became one of
my friends.
Chef Chris was the chef there awhile back and he recently came
back in 2021, if I'm notmistaken and just became one of
my friends and his food isphenomenal.
And again, I just love learningfrom smart people and I
consider him one of the best inthe city.
Doug (26:09):
So, just to recap, you had this lamb this past week.
Yes, and tell us a little bitmore.
What's the preparation on it?
Jon (26:15):
Oh my gosh.
I mean it's a local farm andeverything about the dish is
just.
You know the flavors that heputs into it.
Everything the grilled it'sjust, it's just melts in your
mouth, you know falls off theboat.
It's delicious.
Doug (26:29):
Sounds so good.
Chef Jonathan Homer, thank youso much for being on The
Pittsburgh Dish.
Thank you, Doug.
Anytime.
Up next want the inside scoopon a great bar spot for food and
drinks.
Our friend, autumn Pavelic,shares her pick.
We're joined by Autumn Pavelic,model and lifestyle creator, on
(26:49):
Instagram.
Autumn, you've been doing a lotmore with food in your
Instagram feed.
Yeah more with food in yourInstagram feed.
Yeah, I was wondering when youand your fiance, kevin go out,
maybe to watch one of the gamesat your favorite bar and have
some bar snacks or food.
Do you have a spot that kind ofalways draws you in?
Autumn (27:06):
Yes, absolutely, Bigham Tavern up in Mount Washington.
They're actually located onBigham Street Right.
We've been going there since westarted dating, like seven
years ago.
And it's just it's our likeversion of Cheers, if you know
what I mean their bar food is mepersonally, I think their bar
food is some of the best barfood in Pittsburgh.
(27:27):
And that's something it'sawesome Like.
It's such, it's such a coolenvironment, the food's good,
the drinks are always cold.
I mean it's just, and thebartenders there we love to.
It does feel like a littlecheers, like a little family.
Whenever you know you become aregular there.
Maria (27:42):
Yeah.
Autumn (27:42):
But whenever we go like, let's say, we're going to go
watch like a Steeler game theirwings again, I'm telling you I
think they are some of the bestin the city.
Doug (27:51):
This is an extensive menu too, if someone takes a look,
there's like a huge section justfor mild and then they get a
little more intense.
What do you like?
Autumn (27:59):
I love the BT original.
I love it so much.
They sell some of their saucesand I actually buy the bottle to
keep it home because, like,let's say, I'm cooking wings at
home and that's the sauce I want.
It's just, it's such a good OGBuffalo sauce, but with their
own little twist on it, it's so,so good.
Doug (28:17):
Oh, I love that.
Yeah, does Kevin have afavorite?
Autumn (28:20):
He does he.
I forget the name of cause the.
The list of sauces is so long,but I want to say it's like a
little bit more of a kick to it.
It's definitely not a dry rub,it's a sauce.
I forget the name of it, butit's just he loves it, he of it,
but it's just he loves it.
He loves a little bit more of akick to his wings, like he'll
actually like sweat a little bitwhen he eats it.
Doug (28:40):
Yeah, I get it, though it's kind of an obsession.
I'm obsessed with watching hotones nowadays.
Yes, okay, outside of the wings.
Is there anything else on themenu?
That's always sort of a go-tofor the two of you.
Autumn (28:50):
Yeah, so they have.
They have some really good likemunchy appetizers, like, let's
say, if you want to go and graba couple beers and you just want
a couple little like snackyfoods.
Their pierogies are reallyreally good.
Their fried pickles they callthem tickled pickles are also
extremely good, okay, wait, wait, tickled pickles.
Tickled pickles.
Yes, okay, this is a friedpickle.
Yes.
Doug (29:11):
Is there anything extra special going on?
Or just like, straight up good,it's just good.
Autumn (29:14):
The breading's really good, and then they have
homemade ranch that you can dipit into and it's so yum.
Doug (29:19):
Yeah, here's a critical question.
I want to know Are they chipsor spears?
They're spears, yeah, yeah,they're spears.
Autumn (29:25):
They're really really good.
So those are like our go-to,like munchy snacks.
And then, oddly enough, theyhave a really good French onion
soup.
Yes, have, I mean they have awhole menu.
Um, their grilled chickensalads are really good.
Um, they have really decentsmash burgers there too, but
their french onion soup I don'tknow what it is, but like it's
(29:45):
just good.
Like I will get the frenchonion soup every time.
Wings and french onionsinteresting combo.
Doug (29:52):
I love that combo yeah, it's so good, perfect for a game
day.
Yes, so we're talking aboutBigham Tavern, right on Bigham
Street.
Autumn (29:58):
Bigham Street.
Right next to Armful of FlowersRight on Bigham Street.
Doug (30:02):
Autumn.
Thanks so much.
Autumn (30:03):
Yeah, thank you.
Doug (30:06):
You can follow Autumn Pawelec on Instagram at Autumn
Pawelec.
You may remember, a few weeksback we talked with Joseph
Costanzo Jr and his daughter,Maria C Palmer.
Maria co-authored the book Onthe Rocks, all about her dad's
journey, and while we weretogether that day, they shared a
(30:26):
bit more about another favoritefamily dish.
Guys, you stopped by the studioto kind of tell the bigger
story, but we got to talkinggnocchi.
Do I understand?
You have a recipe or a coupleof things to share with our
listeners?
Maria (30:38):
Yeah.
So, dad, why don't you sharesort of the facts about it, and
then I will share the recipe?
Joe (30:44):
Sure, At the Prima Donna we did homemade gnocchi, made it
right in-house, we used a potatobase and most southern Italian
dishes that are gnocchi are madewith potato.
Now the northern Italiansusually use ricotta cheese
(31:09):
instead of the potato.
It's based on the region,because Southern Italians were a
lot more poor than NorthernItalians.
So, Maria, a lot of hergnocchis that she makes in her
cooking classes, she makes itwith ricotta, which it makes the
gnocchi a lot lighter.
Where at the Prima Donna wemade traditional peasant.
(31:34):
Italian food which I coined thatphrase peasant Italian food,
and the gnocchi were made withpotato-based, of course.
So that's the difference.
There's two types of gnocchi.
The actual gnocchi itself isusually made with potato, but
(31:54):
the Northern Italians usually doit with ricotta cheese.
So, maria, you can talk alittle about your recipe, which
you make with ricotta.
Maria (32:05):
Yeah, so, and actually my recipe is not really my recipe,
it's my dad's aunt.
Autumn (32:12):
Josephine.
Maria (32:13):
She is very innovative cook and she taught me how to
make this years ago and reallyyou can substitute.
If you want to try the potatobase, you can substitute the
same amount of ricotta for thesame amount of the potato, and
that's how you do it.
But it's very simple.
It just is a few ingredients.
(32:34):
So you have ricotta cheese andI'll just give this little tip
Make sure you dry out yourricotta as much as possible.
Doug (32:43):
Like do you put it over a strainer with, like paper towels
, or how do you do it?
Maria (32:47):
Well, a lot of times I will take it out of the
packaging and.
I'll wrap it up in paper towels, kind of like a pillow.
Yes, and then I'll just throwit in the refrigerator and it's
probably not the best for theenvironment and a bowl and it
just kind of yeah but I'llswitch out the paper towels a
couple of times just to soak upall of that moisture.
Doug (33:05):
Gotcha.
Maria (33:06):
You want to get the moisture out because if not,
you're going to going to add inyour flour until it's really the
consistency of a light doughwhere you can work it but it's
(33:38):
not sticking to you.
Doug (33:39):
Gotcha.
Maria (33:41):
And then you know, you cut off maybe like a three
eighths of an inch piece, youroll it like a snake, you cut it
on a bias and then you sort ofroll it either with your thumb
and kind of make an imprintwhich is the very traditional
way, or you could do the fancyway which I like to do, either
with a grid or with a fork withthe back.
Doug (33:59):
Is that with the gnocchi board that I see?
Maria (34:01):
Yeah, you can use the board.
Doug (34:03):
That's the fancy way.
Maria (34:04):
Yeah, or you could just use a fork.
The fork does the same thingand provides those grooves that
really hold the sauce in verywell.
It's not hard to do, but it'ssomething that will wow your
guest.
I teach this class quite a lotand people come back and say,
hey, I've made this now part ofmy holiday tradition, or
whenever I'm going to a potluckI make this and you know people
(34:28):
go crazy over it because there'snot a lot of people that are
actually homemaking pastanowadays.
Joe (34:34):
Right.
No, I want to say also becauseof the peasant Italian cuisine.
We didn't use a fork, we usedour thumbs.
Doug (34:46):
Now, Maria, does this fit the same when you boil the
gnocchi, whether it's thericotta or the potato?
We're waiting until they floatfor a minute or two, yeah.
Maria (34:55):
Yeah, you can definitely wait till they float till for a
minute or two until they're done, and the other thing that I
like to do too, because they'refragile- yes.
So I never just take it out ofthe colander and just dump it.
I fish them out.
So if you have one of thosewire baskets, yes, like I call
it a spider.
Doug (35:14):
Yes, yeah.
Maria (35:15):
You can, you know, fish them out on the top and then you
put your gnocchi a layer ofsauce, little cheese, and then
repeat, kind of a layeringeffect, just like lasagna and
you know can garnish on the topwith a little basil if you'd
like, or some hot pepper flakes,if that's what you're into.
Fresh mozzarella, or, you know,a little bit of ricotta too, it
(35:37):
doesn't matter.
Doug (35:38):
Is it a red sauce that you like with your gnocchi?
Maria (35:40):
I do yeah.
Doug (35:41):
Yeah, I do.
Joe (35:42):
You could use an Alfredo sauce if you want.
You could use an olive oil andgarlic you know with anchovies,
but I mean, the red sauce is thetraditional way and it was such
an inexpensive pasta to make,especially people who were poor,
and your children could getfilled up with this pasta and
(36:09):
they don't have to eat a lot Ifyou didn't have the food, that's
where it was.
So this became a luxury dish,even though it was really a poor
person's dish.
Yes, and I said to my dad wouldyou believe when you were
coming over on this boat, onthis ship, that people would
(36:32):
stand in line for two hours toeat gnocchi?
And he said I never would havebelieved it.
When I was growing up he saidpeople laughed that we were
eating this dough or this pasta,and now people are begging for
it.
Doug (36:52):
Goes to show when food is simple ingredients, done well
and made with love, it's goingto always win out Exactly.
Thank you both so much forsharing a lesson on Yaki, a
recipe, and thank you both againfor being on the Pittsburgh
Dish.
Maria (37:07):
Thank you.
Thank you, Doug.
Doug (37:10):
Maria has several live events coming up in the
Pittsburgh area.
You can find more informationon her website, mariacpalmer.
com.
Maybe you'll catch her makingthat gnocchi.
Do you have a recipe?
Share it with us.
Just go to our website at www.
pittsburghdish.
com and look for our share arecipe form.
(37:31):
If you enjoyed the show,consider buying us a coffee for
this episode or supporting theshow monthly.
You can find links to thoseoptions at the bottom of our
show description.
And if you want to follow myown food adventures, you can
find me on social media at DougCooking.
That's our show for this week.
Thanks again to all of ourguests and contributors and to
(37:52):
Kevin Solecki of Carnegieaccordion company for providing
the music to our show.
We'll be back again next weekwith another fresh episode.
Stay tuned.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, And Charlamagne Tha God!