Podcast Hits and NFTs

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:07):
Oh, hi, welcome. Youmean don't you here? The podcast Club
dot TV Cocktail Hour, at leastwhen we record it is I don't know
what it is. When people arelistening, it's dry January. You probably

(00:30):
need a couple of cocktails. Listento this. Yeah, amen to that,
unless you're doing dry January like Mollyis respect I mean not really,
I like was wasted the first half. I'm just trying to recover. You
know what I'm saying, Like,it's a balance. It's a balance.
You know, you can't win themall. Yeah, you know what I'm

(00:51):
saying. You gotta leave some forother people. Average averages out to being
somewhat dry or dry or January.Yeah, well I guess compared to December,
right, it's just dryer, dry, ish y January. I was
gonna do like dry January for real. And then I remember to my best

(01:11):
friend who was coming for a visit, and so like a week before he
showed up, I started preemptively drinkingto prepare myself for his visit. I
was like, dry January is over. I have Yeah, I'm gonna get
ugly if you don't. I can'ttell if I gained weight for my livers
swollen. You know what I mean. It's a combination in the two good

(01:34):
times. Yeah, that's what's up. Well, yeah, What's Happened in
the World podcast? All kinds ofcrazy stuff in the news, Joe Rogan's
losses. Goddamn mind, what elseis new? Everyone is trying to tell
him that at least he wasn't aprick about it before, although that's kind
of his whole stick. But ohmy gosh. I follow him on Facebook
and he posts me me like seventimes a year. He's posting like seven

(01:57):
times an hour right now. It'stotally gone to his head. He's like
posting all like you know, I'mlike, all right, Joe, or
like, so you're on a firstname basis with them of course, Many
and Joy go away back, youknow what I'm saying, Me and Joey.
Actually it's what you prefer him.Yeah, whoa back in the day,
Julie Joey ledge Foot. That's hisunofficial nickname. Most people don't know

(02:23):
that about her. Most people don'tyou heard it here first people. I
don't even know if he does.He knows that it doesn't matter. So
we're gonna do a three hour podcast, like he does. I hope not.
On our way to it. Ithink I'm gonna eat some mushrooms.
I'll be right back and then I'llbe here and we're back strong. We're

(02:44):
back in the in the room,Paul Stammts would be proud. Yeah,
there's a lot going on in thenews right now. Um well, Marcus
brought this article to our attention.The bloom or an article. Lots of
podcasts people talking about it this week. I was in a Twitter space about

(03:05):
it. What is it? Gome in? I'm not in tune with
the news. Basically, Bloomberg islike, oh, podcasting hasn't produced a
hit in years whatever, So like, what does it hit mean? Yeah?
And does that matter? Well,some of the data is interesting that
they provide, but it is totalclickbait, like Bloomberg typically does. They

(03:29):
go with the incendiary title get everybodyall handwavy about stuff, and so they
can sell ads, you know.That's that's what the article basically is about.
But some of the points they makeare valid, which are are interesting
anyway. Now, I don't knowhow valid they are that the top ten
podcasts none of them were released inthe last year, and on average,

(03:51):
what makes the top ten most downloadson like Apple Music, Like, is
that the gauge? Right? That'sanother thing they don't specify. Yeah,
so what the top ten podcasts?Right? Is it streams? Is it
downloads? Is it exacts across exactly? That That is the biggest thing with
determining what it is. But they'reall like, they're they're like, they're

(04:13):
they're in the top ten because ofreruns, because people are like because I
mean, like, uh, Iwas the one Cereal. I don't.
I don't think that because that wassuper old. I mean I guess so,
I well, no, Cereal isstill active. They're still putting out
episode they have it in a while, but that first season if people are
listening to it now, which theystill are, I'm sure. But that's

(04:34):
their point, is that to getto become a hit in the podcast world,
it is a lot harder now,mostly because the space is a lot
more active. There's a lot morepodcasts, like millions of millions of millions
of more podcasts since when Cereal firststarted, you know. Um. But

(04:55):
there's also something that's implied but Idon't think it's explicitly stated, is that
there is staying power with these peoplethat started early on, you know,
yeah, and it makes sense likethat the podcast even if it's the biggest
celebrity on the planet. You know, if Trump started a podcast or something,
God forbid, Um, it wouldprobably be super popular, but it

(05:17):
would it wouldn't. I don't knowthat it would stay. It would compete
with those other ones as far asyeah, yeah, why hasn't Trump started
the podcast? Because after that phasewas about, I was like, what
is he doing? Actually, heshould totally start a podcast. Have you
heard him talk? People love tohear him talking, like to hear him

(05:40):
talk. That's another topic because peopleprobably won't let him Yeah, that's probably
or he doesn't have anyone thinking aboutit all right, way, they're all
wrong. Um, he's starting asocial media platform instead. Right, And
that's an interesting interesting because there's somegreat shit out there in podcast world.

(06:00):
And it goes back to we talkedabout, you know, how to cut
through and how to like how doeshow does something get popular? Right?
Like every like and what is popularI guess is like the other thing like
that. We've talked about that too, like what's the what's the benchmark?
How do you aggregate all the dataacross like all the all the different ways,
including watching on your insight or anywhereelse. Like there's a lot of

(06:25):
ways to consume this content. Yeah, because it's different than some other things.
If you want, if you payattention to iHeartRadio, all of their
podcasts are in the top best,like out of the top ten, six
of them or I heartpot you know, right, So yeah, it's like
whoever's participating in the tracking and likewhat makes it the best? Like what
if there's a podcast that has lesslisteners than how we built this, but

(06:47):
has you know, one hundred thousandpaid subscribers, ye, Like does that
make it better? Or is itonly based on downloads? And then are
we accounting for like the bogus downloadsand the double downloads and the Facebook downloads
and all this? Like how manytimes in the last year I have companies
come out right across two platforms.You do it on Spotify and you're on

(07:09):
an Apple podcast, Like, what'swhat? That's a great point, Molly
about the ad stuff. I don'tthink I heard anybody mentioned that in the
ad writer space. Yeah, right, because that, to me, the
monetary influx from it would would bea huge indicator of success, you know,
on the flip. It's like,not every podcast monetizes it that way,

(07:30):
right, facts, and so itcomes a lot of different ways.
Well right, so it like brandpodcast, right, it's not about plays.
And you could get a ten milliondollars geospatial little satellite mapping contract,
you know what I mean because ofthat podcast and maybe it got fifty downloads.
So how does that get you know, how does that get thrown in

(07:50):
the hat? You know what Imean? It's a good podcast, yeah,
Like or what makes a top atop ten? Top ten podcast?
Yeah? Top ten? And thesegoons are just talking about the publicly available
lists, you know, the toptop lists or whatever, and the charts
and the charts don't matter. It'slike measuring just downloads. And it's like

(08:11):
it's the chart, you're right,what's the charts out? There's Google,
there's Spotify, they're all separate.Yeah right right. So in the other
news part of my UM twenty twentytwo prediction has already started to come true.
So there's that what the crazy one? What crazy one? What was
a crazy one? That Spotify isgoing to go out of business and tank

(08:33):
the podcast? It starts happening?What happened? Podcasts closed? Their only
original content podcast studio and fired twelvepeople last week. Yes, so they
spent like, I don't know,a good trillion dollars, I just made
that number up. It's good trillionand because you want to spell that ga
t R I ll iowan a goodtrillion dollars buying other podcast companies. But

(08:58):
they have a twelve in actual physicalpodcast studio that wasn't able to crank out
anything relevant enough or revenue generating enoughto sustain the salary of twelve people.
So I would say that I mightbe on track to being correct with my
crazy prediction. I wonder why,though, I wonder I want that.

(09:20):
Does that have to do with haveto do with Spotify or does it have
to do with just the studio,Like did Spotify squander the studios capabilities because
they wanted certain things or did thiswas a studio just not as capable as
they made themselves out to me whenpurchased. Well, there's a tell all
waiting to happen. Yeah, bookis coming and was it? Ashley at

(09:45):
hot Pod report on that. Ican't remember who wrote about it, but
I don't even know. Yeah,but yeah, I'd forgot about that.
The what I read whoever wrote aboutit, which we'll put try to final
link put in the show notes.They did have good shows. None of
them were hits, but you know, they were well regarded shows that are

(10:07):
now being produced by some of theother teams that they purchased. They just
kind of got shuffled off. ButI remember some insiders that got let go
saying that they were kind of likethe bastard step child that didn't ever get
any attention or props or funding oranything like that. So they were making
good content, but they Spotify wasn'tgiving them the time a day because they

(10:28):
cared more about Gimlet, about Wonderie, about all these other places that they
bought, which is just I thinkthat's a good indication, you know what
I mean. You can't either,you can't even employ twelve people. I
mean, yeah, it's it's nota good look no matter how you slice
it. Unless you made a crazyprediction for twenty twenty two and it's coming

(10:50):
true three weeks in ben year.Pretty and I should go gamble. That's
what I'm here. That's right.They have casinos down there coast Rica.
I don't know. Probably Molly willfind one. If not there start one
on the st off the topic,did you guys get hit with any tsunamis

(11:11):
from the big volcano? No,but the waves were a little bit weird.
Okay. I went out there andI looked straight into the ocean,
and I said, take me first, and just didn't work out. So
I'm glad it didn't work out,Molly know, it picked me, pick
me no. And then of courseNetflix, like the algorithm like suggested that

(11:35):
I watched the movie The Impossible aboutthe two thousand and four tsunami in Thailand.
I was like, okay, okay, Netflix, thanks for stoking my
fears accurately, like Jesus Christ,kind of crazy. They listen in on
your devices. It's not just Suckerbergpeople. Yeah, everybody going back,
going back to the first the firsttopic about like the top ten cutting through

(11:58):
and all that sort of stuff.It goes back to what we were going
to talk about last time at theend before going down the rabbit hole.
I'm just gonna go right down.Let's do it. Do it. Let
if you have a decentralized yeah,right right, wait, wait before we
go, I gotta get prepared,water hydrated. All right, all right,
So podcasting and Molly like, you'relike huge about this. Like podcasting

(12:24):
has been very much about there notbeing a gate keeper, and it can
you can do it on your own. It can do your own thing,
and that's and you totally still can. But they're all often these different how
do you find it? Like it'sall it's it's not it's decentralized in a
way because anyone can do their ownthing, but it's not really decentralized because
there's still nothing like unifying all ofthem except the fact that they're a podcast.

(12:48):
So what if there was a wayto do a decentralized podcast platform where
I know because I was I waswatching it about it descendalize like music licensing
platform and every all these users canAnd it's interesting because in the end,

(13:09):
I think there's still an element oflike gatekeeping because like someone's got to curate
or determine what's garbage from quality,and I guess like it's like who determines
garbage versus quality? But like ifyou're flooded with a ton of things that
are like don't even pat Okay,I'm getting ahead of myself, everybody could
submit their own content. Users andlike right now you pay Spotify to be

(13:33):
used for data farming. Basically,like I listen to these sort of things,
and then Marcus is also interested inthings that are similar. So they're
going to take my information that Ilisten to these things and give it to
Marcus, and Marcus is going tobe like, oh shit, I like
this because it's similar to what Ilisten to. I pay Spotify to enable
them to use my information to dothat. Right, I benefit because I

(13:54):
get like to listen to cool music, But like I'm paying them. What
if the ecosystem will warded me forcurating a list that Marcus likes to listen
to. And so there's kind oflike this like tokenization and this kind of
decentralized nature that like there's no onecentral entity that is hosting and harvesting this
data, but the data exists amongstthe many, and the many determine what's

(14:18):
popular. And it's always like voting, and if you are a part of
the community, you're you're contributing tothe community, you are curating lists,
you're uploading podcasts, you're doing thesethings. Then you get more voting rights,
you get more say in what happenswithin the ecosystem. So that everybody

(14:39):
that's contributing to it is a partof it, instead of it being like,
hey, Spotify, here's my thing, Like can you make my podcasts
like on the top list of likewhatever, Like there's still a grind to
be played with spot with Spotify,right like you it's like it's like it's
like record labels before, right,Like how do you get your thing to
be like in the top list?Like there's definitely a game to be played

(15:00):
in the way that it exists rightnow. What if there wasn't a Spotify
to go preach to, but thecommunity that exists within that supports the endeavor
ultimately votes on what rises to thetop. And there's elements to that like
don't that like fall through the cracks. But that's one way of kind of
doing like decentralized community based podcasting discussand so that that's the interesting part of

(15:26):
NFTs, not just using them tocollect digital assets, but it's that decentralization
and the monetization aspect and the utilityof it. Right Like it earns you
vote of a vote at the table, like it's it's you have this piece,
this this this virtual document that saysthat you are part of you know,

(15:50):
you're one vote in this growing communityand you can cast your chips in
to say this happens or whatever thatthat may be. How do you see
NFTs, Molly, I don't.This ship confuses the hell out of me.
Yeah, same here, Adam isthe expert. I go deeper and
deeper down the rabbit hole every day. But and I don't know, I

(16:12):
don't know all of it, butI know that like that idea of it
being kind of community, Like thecommunity is very essential to a lot of
this stuff that it has to dowith the community that is building any one
of these NFTs, tokens, coins, whatever whatever it is, it has

(16:33):
to be and a lot of themlike going like discord or whatever. But
the community's got to be solid andthe community's got to be invested in what
it's trying to do. And it'sabout the community. And so by contributing
to any one of these, whetherwhether it's like theoreum or pod coin or

(16:56):
whatever the hell you want to whateverit is, there's a point. I'm
just making that up right now.But we just started writing a podcin podcorin.
You heard it here first people podcoin January eighteen, twenty two seven,
twenty six Eastern Time. Pod coin, we called trademarks. That's how
that works, right, So that'show it works. It's recorded into the
ledger of pod coin. That's thefirst podcoin transaction, podcorn. You know,

(17:22):
there's the community's got to be strongto make any one of these things
like relevant. Like that's kind ofhow a lot of it happens. That's
why these things blow up, notbecause they're just not just not just because,
but because there's a momentum behind it, and it takes many people to
make their be momentum. It's kindof like taking Spotify and flipping it the
other way that all the users benefitand have a say in what becomes popular

(17:48):
on Spotify, not because Spotify saidso and jams it down your throat,
but it's the reverse. It's thatthe US it's totally user generated and user
curated, and so it's a lotcredits up vote stuff in a way,
but a lot more complicated. Itcould it could be like that, I
bet there's still and like look there'sstill has this is where like I don't

(18:10):
know that there's fully uh an answersolution yet because there's still got to be
a level of moderation. You stillwant someone that's that's still kind of maintaining
it so that like a bunch ofbots don't just come in and say,
oh, this really racist, terriblepodcast is going to end up being number
one because all these other bots startedcontributing and earning these tokens that earn them

(18:34):
votes that then say that one's thebest. So like, there's there's definitely
holes in the implementation, but Ithink, at least right now with my
limited knowledge of like what that couldlook like, that's one way. That's
one way, but I think itcould end up being kind of like what

(18:56):
what I know Molly's in archive conversations, like that's always what like what fired
me about? What's what you firedup about? Was like you can just
make a podcast and put it outthere into the ether and do something really
cool with it, agnostic of anyof these other platforms, Like you can
just do a cool thing, youknow, and there's no you're you're the
master of your own domain. Youcan do gatekeepers, right, you can

(19:18):
do you can do what you wantto do with it. But you know,
then it comes back to like topten and like what's the best and
how do you gauge this and likewhat that mean the discoverability aspect, there's
still an element of you wanting tokind of be a part of something,
and those some things that exist rightnow aren't quite um, they're not quite

(19:42):
solving the problem just yet. There'sstill gatekeepers in a way. And that
that's where I see people calling bullshit, is that there is no truly decentralized
platform because you all got to gosomewhere to vote on stuff or to you
know, cash in your money orwhatever, you know, sign up for
the thing or whatever. You haveto use a website, you have to

(20:03):
use some kind of platform. Soit's it can never be truly decentralized,
right, Well, it's decentralized inthat it's not Spotify, and we keep
saying Spotify, But it's not companyX that is coasting, right, it's
not. It's not company X thatis hosting the ledger and determining what is

(20:25):
a valid contribution. Right. It'snot the staff, it's the commending,
it's all. It's all the peoplethat support the ecosystem. Because the ecosystem
exists not in one server bank inmy bedroom, but in a thousand server
banks across different places. And we'reall sharing the ledger that dictates that this

(20:48):
thing happens. So it's like ahuman algorithm. So that's kind of where
a lot of it goes. Andthis is kind of getting really far away
from podcasting. But like the buzzwordnow is is dow DAO centralized autonomous.
Another word is gonna hate You gotthe doo, you got you got the
dow, now you got doos.So DOO is like it's like basically a

(21:12):
coding in what like an like organizationalrules that dictate how something's going to happen.
Smart contract, same kind of thing. I'm not as familiar. That's
like the new thing that a lotof things are happening with. But it's
like everybody throws money into like athing and then it buys it it.

(21:33):
Okay, I'm just brainstorming. NowI'm just talking. This might need to
be deleted from the whole podcast.Um. But like the everybody contributing to
this could become a potential owner rightthere. They're an owner of the ecosystem.
They are contributing to it, andany ad spend, any ad revenue

(21:56):
that gets generated by any podcast inthe system is paid back to the owners
which is everyone and so in thatand that's where like a dow comes in,
where like there's a maybe the wholeplatform collects AD revenue and distributed its

(22:18):
amongst its top best. That soundslike communism, dude, but no,
but like but like we contributed toit, like we I mean, you
know, you're not kind of wrong, um, but like that because capitalism
is working so well for us rightnow. But that's you know, a
bucket of a bucket of AD revenuecomes in and the dow the smart contract

(22:41):
says, Okay, once we've hitthis capacity of like some of the money
has to be used to to paythe people that support the system that they
are using their computers to support thesystem because it still requires computing power.
But any any balance left over atthe end of every month gets distributed out
to each individual person that's owns atoken, and it's tributed to the ecosystem
because we curated, or we voted, or we did anything else that enhanced

(23:04):
that potential for this system to improve. Molly, you had some some more
faces going on there. It remindsme of this show I was watching on
Netflix, I think, where theywere living in the future and it was
all like a simulation and they hadlike skins and they got like a new

(23:26):
skin. Altered carbon, altered carbon. Yes, that's a great show.
I heard that's a good show.I feel like the metaversus altered carbon,
except altered carbon was like really violentand really crazy. Yeah, but it
is. It feels exactly the sameto me. It is. Yeah,
it's like a like a not evenutopian because it becomes dystopian because these people

(23:51):
take advantage, just like with capitalism, just sort of communism all of us
sounds good on paper, but assoon as somebody figures out how to gain
the system, we'll lose again.I like that you just said communism sounds
good on paper, but I'm justsaying as you were. But yeah,
I mean I don't know. Ithink you know, at the core,

(24:14):
right, like part of me islike, okay, I feel like an
old person is I'm like, Idon't know what that shit is. I'll
be in the jungle if you needme, right, I'm like, I'm
just gonna stay in Costa Rica andmy guy can do whatever you're gonna do,
and then I'll just die. Everythingwill be fine. But part of
this just feels like escapism, youknow, or like it's like Basis going
to the moon. It's like,are we just creating another digital planet for

(24:37):
us to fuck up eventually? Idon't know. It all feels very weird.
And I'm not like anti tech oranti like future first by any means.
I just your skeptical. I justdon't. I just don't understand.
You know when I saw some articlethe other day about somebody was like selling
knockoffs of NFTs and the artist waslike, please, this is work.

(25:02):
I just offer staling people's work,yeah, which is like, well,
dude, it's kind of easy.All you gotta do is right click on
that Mickey flicky and it's yours.So I mean, I'm just saying,
oh, we don't need to godown that rabbit hole. The rabbit hole.
I mean, it's all very interesting. I mean, isn't you know
ed it's core. Isn't the communityjudging what's good and what's bad and moving

(25:23):
it to the top as it's essentiallywhat's supposed to be happening, But it's
not. The gay keepers are Spotifyand iHeart Radio and they're all getting paid
by the record labels to play thatmusic. So yeah, we're all being
force fed like the was it,like the Island Boy and on that right,
like it's not real, right,it's and and podcasting is not at

(25:44):
the level that music industry is wherethe corporations are completely manipulating all the lists
everywhere. But it's getting more andmore like that every day because Spotify is
buying up everybody. You know,you have all these big studios, all
this money is invested, so ofcourse they're going to push hard for their
own content over the indie creators andyou know, so, yeah, Molly,

(26:10):
You're totally right. It's it's it. I don't see, like,
I see some interesting things developing,but I don't know how it's going to
pan out in the long term,you know. I Mean, what would
be cool is if you could gointo the metaverse and be like, I'm
gonna go to Joe Rogan studio todayand you're like Mark Brown and your little
cartoon down and you walk over andyou're like, Joe, suck it,
what's that buckfucker? And you sitdown and you talk to heckle him in

(26:32):
his own podcast. Now, ifI could do that in the metaverse,
you'd be there all day, allday I'll be throwing fake your new job.
I would just visit various people's metaversesand heckle them. It could be
amazing, but I don't know.We were kind of talking a little bit
something about this too, Like,um, so I was working with this

(26:55):
guy Ben and I can't remember thename of his company right now, which
is terrible, but he has likewe're one of those Oculus riff things and
his you know, and and hedoes, oh, his company's called metas
something, which is crazy too.He was like, hey, what's up.
But they have these like crazy likethree sixty cameras. I think we

(27:15):
talked about this before with sound andeverything. So I was like, man,
how crazy would it be if youcould like go in with this headset
and like enter a space and youcould be in like, you know,
rare essence, you know, concerton the stage and the drums are louder
over here and the vocals are alot of right and like so like when
I think about the metaverse and likethe application like that, I'm like,

(27:37):
oh, that could be a coolway of interacting and all that. But
this the rest of it, Idon't know. It just feels like escapism
and it's not necessarily a bad thing. I mean, we're killing you know,
we're killing the air we breathe,We're killing the planet. It's like
essentially not safe to leave your house. Between like mass shootings and COVID,
you might as well just keep yourass at home. We'll move to Costa

(27:59):
Rica. Not that we don't haveCOVID, we can't put any of that
going around, but at some pointis everybody's going to be in their living
room, like on their like yeah, that's just like Wally, like you,
it's like Wally and Idiocracy. Rememberhe's like sitting on a pliner and
it's a toilet than any you know, Like the only thing missing is the
goggles. I just like, howfar you know are we from that?

(28:26):
Yep, that's taken like a that'sthat's way deeper down the rabbit hole.
Then I can go and still stayrelevant to podcasts. Yeah, well,
so how do we put a bowon the NFT discussion? Because to me,
it is like the one last thingI'd like to say about it,
And I think Molly you hinted atthis that it does sound way too complicated

(28:51):
for regular people, Like if Ieven the value for value stuff that's going
on right now where you can buyus techi and give it to somebody for
listening to their pot casts and likeJames Cridland and Ebo Tier and those guys
are doing it. But um,it's too complicated for me to set up
like I want to. I alreadyhave a Venmo, already have Like were

(29:12):
these credit cards thousand dollars to liveequipment behind him? You're saying like it's
too much, but it is,it is, it totally is super complicated.
It took me, and I feelsuper old. I tried. I
bought an NFT and it took mean exhorbitant amount of time and I did

(29:36):
it all wrong. Um, andI learned a lot from doing that.
And the answer is one hundred percent. It's way too early. This is
like coding your This is like preMySpace, like coding your first website and
HTML and putting a pretty cat ona website calling and with music playing in
the background, and you thought youwere a coder, Like look where we
are now, you know what Imean? Like that didn't exist twenty years

(29:57):
ago or whatever whatever the hell thirtyyears ago whatever that was, so like
it's we're in gen one of thisthing happening, and half this ship is
going to go completely zero nowhere,and half the ship might exist for a
little bit longer, but like,you don't code an HTML anymore, dude,

(30:18):
And that was like the jam,you know what I mean. So
like even what we think of asbeing like pretty prolific and stuff right now
may not exist anymore. I thinkit's interesting the idea, and it still
has I'm not saying that anything thatI've said in the last fifteen minutes or
whatever makes any sense at all.I think there's still limitations to like the
whole idea that you can be trulydecentralized, right, that you can be

(30:42):
truly agnostic of any singular entity orgroup of people being moderators or curators or
anything that puts someone to the tothe cool kid List, to the top
ten, right, But it isit's a different way of spinning the organization

(31:07):
of it up, and there couldbe a cool way to deliver that sort
of experience and ultimately, go oly, go okay, do it? Okay?
What if what if the podcast NFTwas like I'm thinking about like that
Martin Screlli guy who bought like theonly Woo Tang album, then the government

(31:29):
took it and then farmer bro It'samazing, right, So but what if
what if podcasts NFTs were like that? Like what if Redman, Method Man
and Rick Ross at a podcast butlike it wasn't available anywhere and you could
buy the NFT of that podcast andthen you're the only person I could hear
those things. But in that scenario, only super famous rich people would be

(31:53):
able to make anybody doing that,because, like you know, as we'd
proven weekend and week out, youcan't just get people to listen to your
ship. Yep, okay, flipit, you're not you're right, and
you're you're right, you're very right, right something like that, where it's
like woutang and it's like limited likeonly the most it's still a money game,

(32:17):
right at that point it probably is. You're doing it for the money
only. However, however, there'sa lot of ways to do that.
So like what you can do,you're very right about that way as an
artist, as a musical artist,as an audio artist, it's the same.
It's a little bit different than thegraphical artist, because the musical artist

(32:37):
you can say you're all all thosepeople that buy this NFT that is this
audio recording. You're the only peoplethat you all own this and any revenue
that comes from the streams of thisand that that's existing like current framework framework

(32:58):
of like how those people get paid. You can now benefit from owning this
piece of this content. Or you'rethe exclusive listener and you can decide,
and the ecosystem, the ten ofyou or the twenty of you or the
hundred of you that own one ofthese can decide. We're gonna all vote
and we're gonna say we're gonna placethis year, or we're going to keep

(33:19):
it to ourselves and we're going tokeep it really cool for forever. So
like, there's totally ways to dothat in a way that could be very
I'm not an artist, nor amI creative enough to think of a way
that makes that really fucking rad.But the potential exists that you could totally
control that release and that you hadan interview with like the sickest someone that

(33:40):
never does anything ever, and youhave the moment captured. I don't know,
but see you know, Molly,I don't know. I'm so twisted
around right now, Molly, Ican't even I can't even I can't even
handle it. But as a creator, to me, I create things as
a way to connect with other humanbeings. And if I'm creating something purely

(34:00):
out of and there's nothing wrong withcreating something purely out of the desire to
profit from it. But if I'mgoing to create this exclusive thing that only
a small group of people get tohear just for the sake of making money,
like it goes against to me whatpodcasting is all about. It's like

(34:21):
broadcasting so more people can hear it, you know. That's that's why podcast
was created the first place. Andthat was just one way of spinning it.
That was just one implementation, right, Like it could be a bunch
of different things, and it doesn'tneed to be that. It could be
that everybody, like the originator.Like the thing about the NFC is like
you've created a digital product, whichI think is important to like the NFC

(34:43):
working to get a digital product.Yeah, that the exchange of the digital
product or the activities of the digitalproduct are trackable and the there is verifiable
because it's a community of people thatverify that this exists, this relationship exists,
that you own this thing that thatequates to that can ultimately end up

(35:07):
in delivering value to the holders andthe original content creator. So this sounds
like music licensing essentially, but itis. It is. If it totally
there's just no BMI or ASCAP orwhatever, it totally is exactly. That's
exactly it. There's you're one hundredpercent right that you markus if you make

(35:30):
If you created a podcast you couldwrite and you wanted to release it as
an NFT or whatever, you couldwrite that the monetary exchanges of that,
after the initial minting of it,the initial like creation of it, you
get a cut of every single transactionthat happens as a result of it.
Forever and always. You always getten percent, no matter what you get.
Someone sells in for thousandsayste a hundredbucks. Someone sells for two thousand,

(35:52):
two hundred bucks. So someone sellsfifty bucks, you get five bucks.
Doesn't matter if it goes up ordown. You're always getting a cut
of it. Gotcha. And youcan build that in and the ecosystem delivers
that um and nobody can change itbecause it's built into the ecosystem, because
it's built into the token. It'sbuilt and that's the power goes out the

(36:13):
world, but the world to gethit hit by an asteroid on all kinds,
right, or a tsunami or samior a volcano or anything else or
aliens. Yeah. Well, ifI had a podcast of me and Tupac
talking about Jack and NFT the shipout of it, the shit out of

(36:36):
it, I have to think I'dhave to figure out a way to get
some techias or what only. Ifyou couldnt your experience with Mike Tyson that
time when you were like rolling aroundDC, I don't I don't remember all
the details. I just remember thatMike Tyson and shrooms were apart. If
you c nft that experience for classicClassic life, you could nft that rolling

(36:58):
in it. Yeah, everyone toride and sidebar total sidebar. But related
to the two things that I justmentioned, Mike Tyson was recently on podcast
and I think it's like, I'mnot saying that he's the greatest person in
the world, but Logan Paul makesthe Impulsive podcast, which is like number

(37:22):
one rated by I don't know um, but he had Mike Tyson on there.
He had Mike Tyson on this podcast, and Mike Tyson is a shroomhound
Oh yeah, Mike, Mike Tysontook a fistful shrooms like this on the
show, and whoa wait, doyou guys see what happens next week?

(37:44):
Just hate him and just starts chewinghim. I guess his job into the
Mike. Oh no, just stopsshroomtound and it's wild. I am going
to watch that I meet you needto watch. And it's all a podcast,

(38:05):
so it's reliant, it's it relatesto our discussion. It's research,
it's research, it's market research.Man. I have a pretty good George
Clinton mushroom story too, but saveit. Save it for the next because
we got to talk about Yeah.So let's let's bring it back to the
world. Marcus. We've we've gone, We've gone around the horn here,

(38:25):
Marcus, what's up? Backwards?Control your backwards today? I my my
wife has moved out of our office. Not the second. I always got
really grim for a second. We'relike, what, I don't know how
respect for a spot? That wasawesome. She moved out of the office.

(38:49):
So now I have a dedicated podcaststudio space that's twenty foot by twenty
foot above my garage. Jen hastaken over our dining room, which is
going complete, coletely unused. I'mbuilding her tomorrow some barn doors that are
sound panels on the backside. Brilliant, yes, and I'm going to document.

(39:10):
I'll do video about the whole process. I already recorded what it sounds
like with nothing in the room.I recorded what it sounds like with only
the rugdown, and I still needto record what it sounds like just with
the furniture, and then I'm gonnado it with the bookshelves and the acoustic
treatment stuff. So that's going tobe a whole thing. But I pivoted.
I used to be facing that wayover by that window, so now

(39:32):
I'm in the middle of the roomlike a proper studio. I'm three feet
off the wall, and I've stillgot my cool bookshelf over there with all
my microphones. I had to shufflesome things around because more of it's visible
now. So you moved. Iwas wondering you didn't move the camera to
the other side of the desk.I did move the camera to the other
side of the desk, and youmove the desk and I move the desk.

(39:54):
So I'm having to get used tofacing my left instead of my right
and it's this is the first endeavorI like today. I spent way too
long getting everything dialed in, butI'm loving the new lighting. I'm loving
how far back the wall away itlooks like a cooler backdrop. I got
an accent light lighting up the wallback there, which is just kind of

(40:14):
adding texture, which I know youguys can't see because the riverside is chopping
me off. But um yeah,any more cool lights in there, and
then I'll also got every time itnever it never sees it too amazing time.
I've got this set up over here. If you make me full screen,

(40:35):
Adam, you'll be able to see. But this is a gear tree
for a client that that I hadthem send it to me. It's by
Ulanzi. It was like eight hundredbucks for this mounting system. But it
has the camera and the light.It's like this really nice metal um thing.
But I've got her camera, whichis the Sony zv eton, which

(40:55):
we talked about last week, Molly. I don't know if it's on the
show or not, but um withthe Sigma lens, and it looks awesome,
looks really really good. And I'meven backlit. I mean, I'm
not facing my microphone. But areyou doing all this video stuff in the
atam Yes, the switching, yes, with the picture and picture with the
little circle and all that. Ohso yeah I didn't. I didn't mean

(41:20):
to do that, but yeah it'sawesome. So yeah, um shit,
we all need to do better.But yeah, this arm yourself. Man,
I got a brand new light.I'm killing it over. Molly's light
is awesome, doing shit. Iwas gonna get that light that Molly Molly
has, the new Loom Cube iskey light? Is that what it's No,

(41:42):
the key light is the Elgatta one, which is pretty much the same.
Yeah, a nice little light.It's got different settings and it has
a really cool built in arm.It's got a cool built in arm,
so you can oh shit, ohcan't take me anywhere. Well, now
you see what it's like without thelight. Yeah, without the light,
but it looks great now. Ifeel like I should be telling my my

(42:07):
sad story. Hey, Siri,turn off my video light. Oh Jesus
Christ, hold on, she's takingthem. She didn't do it. Yeah,
well I have I have scene sets, so when I can't say it

(42:28):
because it'll shut everything down on mycamera. Turn off. But I say
no, what could it be.It's a great end of the podcast.
And do it? Do it?Are you ready? Yeah? Yes,
three, two one, do it. This is hey everyone, it's been
a pleasure the podcast up. Thanksa lot, Lesten to subscribe, great
Marcus, do it? Hold on, Hey, Siri, I'm done broadcasting,

(42:52):
done broadcasting old my god in everything, and just like that, shut
my camera off, but the audiois still there. House awesome. This

(43:17):
podcast was produced by Heartcast Media.

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