65: Hockey Dreams and Coaching Realities with NHL Alumni Boo Nieves

Send us a text

Former NHL player and coach Boo Nieves joins us to share his transformative journey from a multi-sport upbringing in Syracuse, New York, to finding his true calling on the ice. Through humorous tales, like rollerblading around his house to impress his parents, Boo reveals the unique challenges and rewards of both roller and ice hockey, especially during the COVID-19 pandemic in Florida. Listeners will gain insight into how hockey skills have evolved over the years and the cultural contrasts in coaching styles across the globe.

Boo and I also explore the nuances of youth hockey development, recounting experiences from prestigious tournaments such as the Quebec Pee-Wee Tournament. We shed light on the pressures young athletes face and emphasize the significance of resilience and work ethic. From being scouted to facing setbacks, Boo's candid reflections on his personal journey underscore the importance of education alongside athletics, offering inspiration to aspiring players and their families.

Our conversation delves into the exciting transition from college to the professional leagues, with Boo Nieves sharing his exhilarating signing experience with the New York Rangers. We also discuss the physical demands of the AHL and the setbacks of injuries, which led Boo to pivot from playing to coaching. This episode serves as a testament to the resilience required to navigate a sports career, encapsulating the rewarding cycle of teaching and learning, and offering valuable lessons for athletes at every stage of their journey.

ThePodolskiyMethod.com
Facebook, Instagram, YouTube:
@SharpSkateNY
@IlyaPodolskiy
@thepodolskiymethod

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:43):
Good morning everybody and welcome back to
the Podolsky Method podcast.
Before we start, I'd like toremind you of our sponsors.
Print Only With Us, a fullprinting shop here in Brooklyn,
New York, If anybody's lookingfor some shirts or some cool
swag.
They do pretty much everything,including printing on metal, so
it's a lot of fun.
Swag they do pretty mucheverything, including printing
on metal.

(01:03):
It's a lot of fun.
Make sure you check out WorkGateHockey, WorkGateHockeycom for
10% off.
You can use the code10PODOLSKIY that's 10 Podolski.
Workgate creates a face maskthat goes underneath your visor
so you can protect those teethwhen you play hockey.

(01:25):
Check out our friends at HowieHockey for 10% off.
With them, Use the codeP-O-D-O-L-S-K-I-Y 1-0.
That's Podolsky 10.
And you can get your tape andwhatever hockey needs you have.
Of course, check out the JuniorRangers programming.
As you guys remember, we servethe community by having 10

(01:50):
sessions and full gear includedin this learn-to-play programs
to introduce kids to hockey andget them to love the game.
We're in, I believe, 60 ringsor so around the Tri-State area,
so definitely give them a lookat nhlcom slash rangers, slash
community, slash youth dashhockey, and check out my website

(02:11):
, thebodalskymethodcom.
I'm your creator and host CoachOya Bodalsky, Level 5 USA
Hockey Master Coach.
Creator and host of theBodalsky Method.
Owner and operator of SkateSharp Big Shop, called Sharp
Skate New York, here in New York, and a USA Hockey coach
developer and a CPA by trade.
And today I have a wonderfulguest with me, Christopher

(02:34):
Buyeves.
Did I say that right?

Speaker 2 (02:37):
Yes, yes, you did Well done, thank you.

Speaker 1 (02:40):
Awesome.
Just to give you a little bitof background.
He plays for the NHL, he's acoach and he established the top
line elite hockey.
Would you want to tell folks alittle bit about yourself?

Speaker 2 (02:56):
Yeah, no, I am now, wow, currently 30 years old, and
I remember some of the firsttimes I took a step on the ice.
I think I was, I want to say,four or five years old and all
of the kind of similar to whatthe Rangers do now like kind of
learn to play.
I grew up in Syracuse, new York, so not much going on up there

(03:17):
other than hockey in the winter,lacrosse in the summer, made my
way to prep school, college,and then eventually found myself
fortunate enough to play at MSG.
So, yeah, we can dive more intothat later on, but yeah, just a
little bit about me.

Speaker 1 (03:29):
Awesome.
So, boog, what was it likegrowing up?
Were your parents supportingyour hockey ambition, your
sports?
Did you play a lot of differentsports or just hockey?

Speaker 2 (03:42):
So actually I played every single sport except hockey
, and hockey was the last one,um, so I was, um, I'm one of
four siblings, um, I have anolder sister and older brother
and a younger sister, um, and mydad had actually played, uh,
division two basketball at lemoyne, which is a small, small
school in um, in syracuse.
So he, he loved basketball, heloved football, so those were

(04:07):
his two kind of primary sportsand obviously he pushed us in
those directions.
And you go to the YMCA orwhatever recreation centers near
your house and you playfootball, you play soccer, you
play basketball, baseball,whatever it may be, and I was
good, I just I just didn't lovethem.
You know, it felt like I waslike, oh, it's like the thing I

(04:27):
do, right, and I think I pickedup hockey because I was
rollerblading around and we hadwe had wooden floors in our
kitchen and it would drive myparents absolutely nuts because
I was scuffing up the floors andeverything and they're like
just go outside, justrollerblade outside.
So I would roll a bit outsideand I got pretty good at it and
I think eventually their parentswere just like, I don't know,

(04:49):
maybe we should let them tryhockey and um, I remember the
first time I skated I don't knowwhy, I remember this I was such
a good skater.
I was helping the coach give,you know, like the little
support beams, like the littlelike sometimes they're like sea
otters or whatever, like youknow, and I was helping the
coaches bring them to the otherkids, and my parents were like,
all right, I think we found asport.

(05:10):
Um, so yeah, that's, that waskind of my little entry level to
, uh, to hockey that's awesome,and so um you play roller hockey
as well, or just throw with itum, not too much roller hockey.
Yeah, I know people ask that.
Honestly, no, I I just got intoit by rollerblading.
Um, I I played, but not like ina serious league or anything

(05:32):
like that, like maybe in thestreet here and there, but
mostly like street hockey when Iwas home.
That was just kind of like myentry level to it.
But I did try it actually whenI was um over covid.
Um, my family lives in floridanow and I moved down there over
COVID and I tried to play rollerhockey with some guys and I was
actually getting like made funof because I kept falling and
like it's a totally differentdynamic, like it's a totally

(05:53):
different game and I didn'tunderstand it.
I couldn't really cross over, Icouldn't really stop and these
guys are like this guy plays inthe NHL and I was like I got to
figure this out.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
Yeah, I had a similar experience, but reversed,
because I started playing rolehockey.
Because in Brooklyn we didn'thave a lot of rinks so we would
play role hockey like six, sevenhours a day every day.
Yeah, we got really good at itand then at some point we
decided to switch to ice and ourwhole team went.
You know, we all converted andI remember everybody's like

(06:24):
stumbling around and then wetried to do both you like have a
game of roller and then twohours away, there you're on the
ice and you can't transitionbecause it's completely
different type of like movementskating it is no, you're right.

Speaker 2 (06:36):
Like people don't understand that.
Like it's like the stopping istotally different and the way,
the way, like the movements ofroller hockey is like you get
speed and you can kind of likeglide, like you can use your
speed right and, and it's moreof like three on three style,
right, it's like possession,where it's like if you don't
like it, you kind of turn away.
If you don't like it, you turnaway and you wait till something

(06:58):
opens up, whereas, like icehockey, like coach is screaming
on the bench like get the puck,go to him, pressure him, him,
pressure him, go to him.
Like you want someone to attackyou, you know, head on with
their shoulders squared to aroller hockey, that's easy.
Like in hockey it's like, okay,I'm about to get crushed.
Right now I got to be able tomake a play with the puck.
So, you're right, it's twototally different games and it
is cool to be able to switchback.

(07:18):
Hockey gives you, like the kidswho play roller hockey growing
up have really good hands, liketheir hands are unbelievable.
But then I feel like when theyget to ice, they struggle with
the moving their feet with theirhands simultaneously, and then
vice versa with.
You know ice hockey players whotry to play roller like like
it's too slow, like I'm gettingfrustrated, and then they end up

(07:39):
getting beat because they don'thave the patience.
So it's.
It is cool to learn thosedifferent dynamics yeah, the
coordination thing goes out thewindow.
Oh my God, it's gone.

Speaker 1 (07:48):
Yeah, no, this is great.
So once you took to hockey, howmany days a week would you get
on the ice?

Speaker 2 (07:57):
I want to say, when I first was doing learn-to-play,
it was like one practice a weekand then whatever games on the
weekend, maybe one Saturday, oneSunday morning kind of thing,
um, and then I started playing,um, double a.
I actually never, I didn't playtriple a right away, um,
because my parents, we weren't ahockey family and I mean,

(08:18):
obviously, as you know, a lot ofpeople I'm sure listening to
this, understand that like it's,it's still a very unique sport.
It's it's an ever-changinglandscape and unless you come
from a hockey family, like you,don't know where to go, who to
play, what travel like, whattravel teams, what tournaments,
single a, double a, whatever.
So we just we ended up indouble a.
It was just a local rink and itwas easy, it was convenient and

(08:40):
, um, I think from the age ofwhatever it it's like seven or
eight, I think, when I startedplaying squirts, I was double A
and I was probably practicing, Iwant to say, once or twice a
week and then same thing, gameson the weekend.

Speaker 1 (08:54):
Nice.
Yeah, I think it's similar nowbut, like for our squirts and up
, even my team now have likethree practices during the week.
One is like a skills practice,then you have two team practices
and then the games on theweekend.
So I think there's a lot moredemand and that's happening at
the levels from development allthe way up through AA, and I'm

(09:18):
sure AAA has even morecommitment than those AA and A
programs.

Speaker 2 (09:28):
Yeah, yeah, commitment than than those
double a and a programs.
Yeah, yeah, I, I.
I think I think what happenedhonestly is you're right like
the demand for ice obviouslywent up, so then parents and
kids wanted to get on the icemore, but I think that there was
definitely, um, you know, alack of, like you just said,
like development, of like skilldevelopment and team development
, of like learning playdevelopment, learning hockey, iq
, learning how to play withoutthe puck, and I think that I

(09:49):
think my generation kind ofmissed that.
I feel like we started gettingon the ice more than other kids,
but we weren't really usingthat time efficiently, like we
weren't learning things thatthese kids you know, who are
entering NHL now know, right.
So I think that we're now juststarting to catch up and we're
understanding, like you said,like that's a great schedule One
skill session, two teampractices Like that's awesome.

(10:10):
Because I feel like when I wasgrowing up, it was just like
whatever the coach wanted to dothat day, or there wasn't really
much of a model and it was justlike let's get on the ice more

(10:37):
no-transcript.

Speaker 1 (10:46):
They're just phenomenal skaters, like skill
wise.
It's just so much different, Doyou?

Speaker 2 (10:49):
think that's the result of that transition that
you just mentioned.
Yeah, absolutely I.
I think that I think that therewas a point where skills was
seen as like oh, can you flip apuck over your stick and toe
drag?
And now skills are can youskate full speed up the ice and
catch a backhand pass?
That's cross ice.
Like that's an elite skill, likeI think that when you go and
you kind of boil down whatskills are, you can ask you know

(11:10):
a hundred different people, andI'm sure you know a thousand
people too, and it's the same.
You'll get a different answerfrom everybody.
But I think, collectively, whenyou do get to those levels, the
skill level is through the roof.
Like I wasn't learning thatstuff and the kids who even are
a couple years younger than me,the stuff that they're learning
and the stuff that they're ableto do.
It's incredible but it'sefficient and it's useful,

(11:31):
though Some of the skill stuffwe would have wasn't very useful
.
I'm never going to really flip apuck over a stick in the middle
of a game as a coach on the ice.
That would drive me nuts andI'm sure it would drive you nuts
too, right, so I want to seethe kid who can get the puck
across his body and weighttransfer and drop his shoulder
and drive to the net.
That's an elite skill.
So, yeah, no, the skill levelis through the roof and it's

(11:54):
clearly only getting better.

Speaker 1 (11:56):
Yeah, I feel like you made a great point just now
because you see that all thetime there's always that kid
trying to do the michigan.
You know, by the wall behindthat right?
Yeah, it's fun in school, likeI'm all for it, but you, you
know chances are you never gonnause in the game and you know if
you try to, you know, at theolder levels you get rocked.

(12:19):
At the younger levels, you know, everybody gets managed no,
you're right.

Speaker 2 (12:25):
It's crazy like you'll be standing there like
running a skill session and youknow the first three kids are
paying attention, and there'sthe one kid who's got his back
turned to you and he's liketrying to get the puck off the
wall.
I'm like can you please likelisten?
If you can pull it off in thedrill, great, but just pay
attention so we can get throughthe drill, and that's an added
bonus that I'm happy to let youdo.

Speaker 1 (12:43):
But we got to get through this first right, I
always try to put the kid in thefront of the line.
So you, you know, you call themin and you see who's the
straggler, who's like justplayed with the puck.

Speaker 2 (12:52):
I was like you, you're going first yep, yep, hey
, if you've got hands, you wantto show it, go ahead, prove it
yeah, you're the first one.

Speaker 1 (12:58):
The drill yeah, I remember uh, you know I coach
with uh a couple of Europeancoaches and they're amazing
coaches and they always tell mestories.
He's like when we were kidsgrowing up, you know, like
Russia and training.
He's like you never wanted togo first because if you messed
up a drill, your coach wouldkick you in the behind and like

(13:19):
whack you with a stick and belike what are you doing?
He's like now you're like whowants to go?

Speaker 2 (13:23):
Every single kid's like me and nobody understood
what you like the drill is yeah,because like there's no
consequences here, right, andthat's such a funny point
because we were actually justone of my colleagues at Topline,
justin Selman.
We went to China in August andsome of the kids were like not

(13:45):
paying attention and this wasthe craziest thing.
The coach would come over andlike kind of whack them with the
stick and like the first timeit happened, like me and Justin
looked at each other like oh myGod, like oh my God, there's
like live bar here, like thisperson's going to get in so much
trouble, and then like anotherkid messed up and like whack and
I'm like, okay, this is likenormal here, so whack.
And I'm like, okay, this islike normal here.
So, um, no, it's funny youbrought that up because I feel

(14:05):
like when, when we were kids,like yeah, you could get away
with it, like a coach kind oflike give you a little whack and
you're like okay, okay, okay,like I'll do it, I'll do it
right now, like that's.

Speaker 1 (14:13):
That doesn't apply no , no, yeah, different culture.
So talk to me a little bitabout, you know, your transition
from youth hockey and I knowyou.
You know I listened to you talka little bit about the PV
tournament because I was at yourtryout for the Quebec PV team.
For those listening, I was oneof the head coaches for the

(14:37):
Quebec PV team for the New YorkRangers.
Quebec has one of the biggesttournaments for PV level hockey.
It's pretty cool.
So maybe you could talk alittle bit about your experience
at that tournament and yourtransition from youth into your
professional career yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (14:55):
So I, I think I I stepped into triple a hockey.
I want to say I was, I think,my second year squirts or first
year of peewee.
I want to say so.
I got a couple of years of AAbefore I made the transition and
then I went to AAA and, as yousaid, I grew up in Syracuse.

(15:15):
I was playing for the SyracuseStars and my coach at the time
was Steve Sibeli, who now workswith NYSHA, helps with the
festival tournaments.
I'm sure a lot of people haveseen him and talked to him and I
talk to him a lot.
He's honestly one of arguablythe best things that's ever
happened to me in ice hockey andwe still have a really good
relationship.
So, yeah, I made the jump and Iwent to that tournament.

(15:41):
I think you're 12.
Yeah, it's 12 of you, I want tosay.
And we went there.
For us it was a little bitdifferent because I don't think
the charters were as I don'tknow if they were existed or as
serious I guess you would say,because we went with our
Syracuse team.
We had a bid and at the time,jacob Chuba, who's in New York

(16:04):
now, we grew up playing againsteach other.
He was in CompuWare Andrew Koppwas on that team and then
Little Caesars went as their ownteam, honey Bake went as their
own team, the Colonials went Allof these teams that we would
normally play they went as theirown team, whereas, as we know,
now you need the charter andthere's, like, the Rangers have

(16:25):
a team, who you know I coachedwith Brian Mullen and Steve
Arulo, and you know, the Devilshave their team and the
Islanders have their team.
So it's definitely different,definitely different landscape
now, but my experience there was.
It was awesome.
I, I, I just remember likehanging out in the hotel like
for like it just felt like itwent on forever, right, and it's
cool because you, when you stay, you lose, you go home, so it

(16:48):
was kind of like a do or dieattitude and you're just with
all your best friends, 12 yearsold, just living out of a hotel
for like it's like a what a weekand a half, two weeks almost.
And um, you go to the snow parkand you do the toboggan and I
think one of the coolest partsabout it is like in New York
city, if you took every, youknow, basketball court or tennis
court or any of thoseeverywhere in Quebec, those are

(17:11):
all rinks, like you could walk,you know, half a mile in any
direction you'll find a rink andit's cool because there's
locals out there in jeans andmittens, and then there's
there's kids out there who are12 years old playing in the
Quebec tournament, and we wouldjust play with locals and you
would get the they call themlike the beaver tails, which is
like the fried dough, like thecinnamon sugar, and we would

(17:32):
just sit there and eat those anddrink hot chocolate until
literally our parents dragged usoff the ice.
And no, I mean, it's such anincredible tournament and we
were fortunate we made it to thesemifinals, but it was kind of
silly for us because we ended upplaying the same four teams.
I think it was us.
We lost to CompuWare in thesemifinals.
It was us, compuware, littleCaesars and the Marlins Sorry,

(17:53):
not the Marlins, because theToronto team don't go.
I don't know some other Canadianteam, no-transcript, don't make

(18:14):
.
One of these teams like youdon't get to go and I don't know
.
I think for a lot of parentslistening, though at the same
times, it's like it isn't theend of the world.
You know, I think that a lot ofpeople put pressure on the kids
to make this tournament.
And there's plenty of kids whodon't play in this tournament,
who still play in the NHL andplay college Like the Toronto
teams, like we said, don't evengo Right.
So you know, think aboutToronto as a whole.

(18:34):
Like you can name a thousandNHLers who have played over a
thousand games and nonedefinitely not make or break for
the kids.

Speaker 1 (18:45):
Yeah, yeah, no, and my older one ended up not making
the team and he's playingdouble-A hockey.
He's loving it.
You know, the best part wasthat he wasn't upset about it.
I got some feedback about whathe needs to work on things like
that, which was great, so I wasat that.

(19:08):
I think it was the first tryoutthat you guys had in Palisades
a couple of years ago.

Speaker 2 (19:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:14):
And it was wonderful.
One is that I know all the guysworking with the Junior Rangers
, so it was great to seeeverybody.
But two, I got, you know,different perspectives from you
guys as coaches and stuff likethat.
It was just really coolexperience.
The panel that mike benelli ranwas was wonderful.
You know, I just thought it wasreally really cool for the two
days, uh, that we were there.

(19:35):
Um, you know, hit him on theice playing against you know,
some of the best kids at thatage group in the area.
It was really really cool.
So even the tryout itself waslike phenomenal yeah, no, yeah,
no.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
I I think the rangers they do a really good job
honestly, like you said, likemike benelli does such a good
job with the panel, and you knowit is one of the first times
where a lot of parents get tosit there and say like hey, like
what did you do growing up?
Like what teams did you playfor?
Were you a triple, a player youknow out of?
And you know a lot of peopleare surprised to hear that.
You know most of us aren't likeeverybody's got a little bit of
a different path and I thinkthat there's, like we said,

(20:12):
there's so much pressure to puton these kids at such a young
age to make these teams and youknow I mean as we'll talk about,
you know, kind of fuels thefire and I think that it's it's
helpful that they do give thefeedback they do right and, like
you said, it's one of the firsttimes where most of these kids
find out kind of, where theystack up against some of the
better players in the area andit's eye-opening for some kids

(20:36):
and it's, at the end of the day,like that's all you can ask for
is a good experience for thekids yeah, and you know I had a
situation now where you know Ihave my middle kid was
phenomenal and one of the topkids last year in squirts.

Speaker 1 (20:49):
And then you move up to peewee and it's a completely
different story.
He's struggling a little bit inthe beginning of the season and
then, you know right, all of asudden there's a lot of emotion
and a lot of like.
You know, I was one of the bestlast year.
Then you know, now I'm my thirdwine guy.
And then you know we had aconversation about hey, you know
, like the only way I know howto get better is to go to work,

(21:11):
go to practice, show up everyday, put in the work.
That's going to build yourconfidence because you're doing
a little bit more than maybe thenext guy.
You know, do some off ice athome when nobody's looking, and
then eventually you're going toget to to be one of the top guys
again.
I was like, but you're now ayear younger than everybody else
, cause the next age group is.
You know you're progressing andso so just, it's a good

(21:35):
opportunity, like a goodteaching moment to work through
that adversity.

Speaker 2 (21:40):
You know what I mean, like when things are just kind
of not going your way and you'relike, oh, adversity, you know
like when things are just kindof not going your way and you're
like, oh, all of a sudden, I'mnot the best, and you're like,
okay, well, just go back to work, it's okay, yeah, no, it is.
And I think that it's almostbetter for these kids to
experience this at a younger age, because I think, for me
personally, one of my biggestflaws in my development was I
never really experienced thisuntil I got to, you know, like

(22:03):
like college and pro, and a lotof these kids, I think, who
experienced this now as they getolder, like it doesn't phase
them, like it's just anotherchallenge, it's another day,
whereas someone like me, Ididn't understand that until I
got to you know, the pro level,and I think that it definitely
was detrimental to mydevelopment, for sure.
And and then I think, on theother side of it, as you know,

(22:24):
like there's also.
I think part of the problem,though, is like I think the way
you just handled your situationwas great.
Like you tell your kid you getto work, like it is what it is,
like it's a very humbling sportand you'll get there, but I
think that that's one of theworst things you can do with
these kids, cause you see, youknow he played for the avalanche

(22:47):
this year and then he went toWoodbridge and now he's over at
the Colonials and it's just likeyou know what's the common
denominator here?
It's always the coach's fault,or it's always the other kids on
the other team, and it's neveryou know what.
Maybe we just need to go backto the grindstone and get back
to.
You know the basics.

Speaker 1 (23:05):
Yeah, and you know, I'm glad you said that, because
I talk a lot on the show aboutkitchen talk, or what I call
kitchen talk is when parentsstanding, you know, visually I
imagine parents standing in thekitchen, the kid being around
the wall, and they start to gooh, the coach just doesn't like
our kid, that's why he's playingon the slide, that's why he
doesn't play power, playwhatever, whatever, whatever and

(23:26):
it's all.
Coach, bad, organization is bad, this is bad, that's bad.
And then the kid shows up andloses interest in what the coach
has to say.
And so you know, have you seenthat happening with kids that
you're coaching now?
Or the kids as you were growingup, like your teammates, where
that really impacted theirpsyche and the way they perform?

Speaker 2 (23:48):
yeah, no, a hundred percent.
Um, kids I grew up with, yeah,absolutely like.
There were kids who you knowwere absolutely studs at, you
know, 13, 14 years old.
And you know my coach, stevesabelli, growing up was he's
really hard to play for, like I.
I was probably our best playerbut he was the hardest on me,
like if I wasn't back checking,if I wasn't sending a good

(24:09):
example like I.
He never made hockey easy forme, which was probably why he
was the best thing that everhappened to me right in the game
of in the sport.
But there was kids who werestuds and they didn't understand
that, you know.
You know sometimes he wouldhave me penalty kill and not
have me on the power play, youknow, at 13 years old, like, and
that's fine, because that'swhat he needed me to do.

(24:29):
Or sometimes he would justrandomly throw me in front of
the net or take a face off andjust get off the ice.
Like that that's just your role.
And some kids don't understandthat.
And I think the other side ofthat too is a lot of people
parents start freaking outbecause if their kid's on the
third line on, you know,whatever x organization doesn't
mean they can't be a first linerat y organization the next year

(24:50):
.
Like they think that their kidis now being labeled and, you
know, molded into the specificplayer and like, no, it's
actually up to you and yourchild to figure out.
Okay, this is our role thisyear and next year we're going
to have a different role.
How are we going to adapt?
It's not.
My kid had 45 goals last yearand he only has 12.
And we're at Christmas, like.
I can promise you, thesecolleges aren't going to call

(25:12):
you and ask you or look up eliteprospects and see how many
goals your kid had when theywere 10 years old.
It's irrelevant.
Okay, it's if your kid can playthe game at a high level and
think the game at a high leveland adapt at a high level.

Speaker 1 (25:26):
Right, that's such a great point because, you know, I
was at a training that JuniorRangers organized and we had
somebody from USA Hockey show upand I remember the gentleman's
name.
I'm actually, you know, nowthat I joined the coach
developer program for USA Hockeyand I get to teach.
I always think back to the waythis guy delivered his message

(25:48):
and he um had this video onscreen.
He pulled up cindy crosby.
He's like cindy crosby was afirst round pick and his
partners when he won the stanleycup, one was a seventh round
pick and one was an eighth roundpick and they were all the same
line and he's like do you thinkhis mom called the coach and
was like, hey, why the hell ismy first round pick playing with

(26:09):
the seventh and eighth rounders?
He's like, and it was just sucha cool, like respect.
I was like this, I'm gonnasteal that.

Speaker 2 (26:17):
I was like this is so good no, that is like, that's
awesome, like that, that that'sit to its heat, like it's, it's,
it's insane.
There's just this like if you,if you gave these parents what
they wanted, right, I would havea 2010 skating with the college
guys who skate with me and Iwould have the college guys
skating with the NHL guys whoskate with us.

(26:37):
Like it, it doesn't work likethat.
Like I think that there's thisnever ending level of you know,
they just want, they just wantthe next level, they want what's
what's next, they want what'sright above them.
And listen, I understand itfrom hey, I want my kid to be
pushed.
That's great, I understand thatand I appreciate that.
But hockey is an intrinsicallymotivating sport.

(26:59):
There's I didn't play up at all.
Growing up, for example, Iplayed.
I'm a 94.
I played with 94s my wholeentire life until you get to
whatever you 16.
And then it's two birth years,right, my, my whole life I grew
up playing with 94s because myparents felt like, yeah, he
could have played up with the93s, but if him playing up is
the only way he's going to bemotivated, then how is he going

(27:20):
to manage when he's 20 years old, sitting in a college locker
room and his, his line mates 25and his other line mates 18.
Like how are you going tohandle that?
And especially, you know, ifyou get to pro?
Like my first time I stepped inthe locker room I think I was
like 23, 24 years old, you knowthere were guys who were pushing
40 with two kids and there wereliteral kids, 18 years old, who

(27:42):
had made the team, likeFilipino out of camp.
Like you have to be able tounderstand those dynamics that
these ages, they genuinely don'tmatter where these kids come
from, don't matter.
It's you're playing for yournext shift and it's hard to
explain to the kids and I knowyou feel the same way.
It's hard to explain it to themuntil there's money being put
into your bank account becauseof your performance and that's

(28:03):
what pays for your life.
Right, it's hard becausethey're going to go home,
they're going to have their meal, they're going to have a
comfortable bed, no matter what.
But when you're playing for youknow your life, it a lot of
things change right.

Speaker 1 (28:15):
So I know earlier you mentioned a little bit about
your uh against disappointmentsas you were growing, going into,
you know, college and into procareer.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat and how that kind of
fueled you to get to the nextlevel?

Speaker 2 (28:28):
yeah, absolutely so.
I, um, I stayed in Syracuseuntil I played U16.
Um, and that was my last year.
And then my parents were like,okay, you know, it's time for us
to make a decision.
Um, and I was probably one ofthe better 94s in the country.
Um and NTDP had been watching mefor years.

(28:50):
Um, that was always on theirradar.
Always, speaking to those guys,they actually flew me out and
had me visit, like, thefacilities, the school.
They had me meet the counselorsand like everything.
They're like these are thepeople you're going to send your
, you know, like from yourpublic school.
Like, when you come here, theseare the people you need to be
in contact with.
Blah blah, blah.
This is where you're going toeat lunch.
This with blah blah blah.

(29:13):
This is where you're gonna eatlunch.
This is where you're gonna goschool.
When you get out of the rink,this is your billet.
Feel like this, all of thisstuff.
And I'm just like, wow, cool,this is amazing.
And actually on the same tripwas jacob shruva and seth jones
and I was like, wow, this is socool, like we're gonna do this
together.
And then the 40 man camp camearound.
I had a good tryout not great,not bad.
Um, and like at that point, youknow everybody at the tryout,
um, so there's like no,everyone's a familiar face.
And they released the team andI got cut and I I just remember

(29:40):
like sitting in the car with mydad and like my heart just sank
and I was like what do you meanI got?
I've never been cut.
Like that's, this is a mistake.
Like I, I'm me, I shouldn'thave been, because this is, this
is impossible.
And my dad's like yeah, theydidn't, they didn't pick you.
And I was just like I just likelost it.
I was just like why?
Like what do you mean?
Like what's wrong with me?
And he was just like you know,they had a phone call and I

(30:02):
didn't advise her at the timeand I was committed to Michigan
at the time, I committed a veryyoung age.
And they were just like, yeah,you, you just, we didn't feel
like you know your style of playfits, you know who we have.
We feel like we have guys thatcan do your strengths better
than you and your weaknesses.
We have guys that are fillingthose spots.
And I was just like wow.
I honestly considered like Idon't even know if I want to do

(30:23):
this anymore, blah, blah, blah,blah, blah.
And my parents were like, okay,relax, we're going to take some
time.
I took a couple weeks off thiswas in the spring, I think.
So I had nowhere to play in thefall and it's crazy because I'm
this 15-year-old kid who'scommitted to Michigan and I
don't even have a place to playin the fall.
So I was like you know what?
Screw this?
I want to go to the USHL and Iwant to play the 17s for those

(30:47):
people aren't familiar the under17, under 18 national program
play in the ushl.
So I wanted to go to the ushlto prove them wrong, play them.
My parents were like, absolutelynot, you're going to boarding
school.
And I was like boarding school,like I don't want to go to
boarding school.
Why would I go to boardingschool?
And they're like because youalready have a commitment to a
very good school.
Um, the coach at the time, matther, who now works with the nhl,

(31:08):
played in the NHL, was thecoach there and he was a
Michigan alumni and Michigancalled me and they were like hey
, like go play for this man,matt Herr, he's awesome, he's
built a really good program atKent.
You're going to get a reallygood education.
You're going to have plenty oftime to lift, become a man, get
stronger and come to us at 18,you know, ready to go and I like
fine.

(31:28):
And I'll tell you what.
It was probably the bestdecision you know I ever made in
my whole entire life.
Um, you know, here I'm here inla visiting, you know, my friend
who had a baby, and she was,you know, at boarding school
with me.
That's where I met her and hermom ended up being my financial
advisor for the years I wasplaying.
Um, so much networking and somany good things came out of it.
So, but no, that was my firstexperience of really getting cut

(31:51):
from a team.

Speaker 1 (31:53):
That's amazing.
I love that story and how thatdeveloped into this whole life
for you right, and you know, Iknow one of the kids he was
actually on the show as wellDaniel Dijanjev.
He plays Penn State Division Inow.
He played for the national teamfor a couple of years and
people were saying, you know hissize was an issue, but he's you

(32:16):
know he's now playing DivisionI and you know I think that's a
pretty phenomenal feat for anyhockey player, even if you don't
go anywhere after that.
You know, if you don't want toplay pro or you know there's a
lot of options now to play proin europe and everything else,
but uh, even if you didn't wantto, I feel like if my kid make
it to d3 or do d1 college levels, you know it's phenomenal no,

(32:42):
it is, it's, it's.

Speaker 2 (32:43):
It opens up so many avenues and and I mean I, I
think, as we can talk about alittle later but but I think
that you know a lot of theseplayers who are going to college
are starting to develop at alater rate, which means you know
they're stepping into the NHL,but they're ready to play in the
NHL at 25, 26.
Whereas, yes, you know, you'regoing to have your unicorns that

(33:05):
are 18, 19 years old.
They're going to make the team,but there's two of them here.
What about you know the to makethe team?
But there's, there's two ofthem here.
What about you know themajority of the team?
And there's 23 man rosters inthe nhl.
So you do the math if one ofthem's top five pick, that's
five kids, okay, there's what?
33 teams in the nhl, 34 teamsthe nhl.
Like, I think you start to boilit down and I think that you

(33:25):
want to be one of those guysthat's ready to go at 25, who's
got the longevity?
Who's ready to play?
Who's who's got the longevity?
Who's ready to play?
Who's a man?
Not, you know, the kid whomakes the team at 18, that is,
in the AHL at 19, then up anddown at 20, and then finally
sticks at 21.
Listen, nothing wrong with that, but you want to go in, you
want to be ready, you want toget there and you want to stay
there.

Speaker 1 (33:43):
So playing?
I wanted to ask you a littlebit about your college playing
career, because you're coming inright, you're a freshman and
you basically playing guys whoare like four years older, who
are shaving and the whole nineyear old.
They got full beards.
You're like the young kid.
Uh, what that?
What's that like?
Like, did you?
Did you get intimidated or isit like comfortable?

Speaker 2 (34:04):
um, yeah, honestly, thinking back, I don't know what
was wrong with me, but I wasjust fearless, like I wasn't
like a confrontational person,but I just didn't think much of
it.
And no, I mean we at Michigan,most of the freshman classes
will be true freshmen, or youknow one year of juniors, um,
because a lot of us, you know, Ithink it was like three two

(34:25):
years ago there was like thefirst overall pick, second
overall pick, fourth, fifth,like listen, I mean that was an
absurd year.
But like every year you'regetting a top 10 pick, like my
year it was Truba had gone, Ithink whatever he top 15 and
then I was a second rounder, copwas like a fourth rounder, um,

(34:45):
and then I think the year thatyear to DGSEP, you went early in
the in the second round too,like I mean you've got a first
round or two second rounders ina fourth rounder, like that's
like pretty crazy, right.
And but for us, I think goingto a place like michigan is such
an advantage because it'sgeared towards a pro style game.
We are treated like pros, weare expected to perform like

(35:06):
pros, like when you go into.
You know, my first year we werein the ccha, so we were playing
miami of ohio, northern michiganlake, superior michigan state.
Um, I'm missing a coupleschools, century or sorry,
western michigan um, a lot ofschools that a lot of people
probably haven't heard of.
But the best part about thoseschools is we would go up to,

(35:27):
say, northern michigan to plan afriday and saturday night and
the place is sold out.
Yes, yes, it only holds, saywhatever, 4,000 people compared
to these massive North Dakotastadiums.
But these guys are 21, 22 yearold freshmen.
So when they're seniors, theyare 24, 25, some of them are 26
years old.
We're 18, 19, 20 year oldlittle kids, highly touted, and

(35:49):
it's the best thing for us tolearn how to play against these
men, like that was our Achillesheels playing against those
bigger, older, faster, strongerteams.
They would dump the puck andthey would run you through the
boards.
The crowd would go wild and wewere not used to that.
We were used to catching a pass, circling back with our head up
, making whatever playscomfortable for us.
But you learn to play highlevel hockey and you learn to

(36:13):
adapt.
So I think, yeah, I mean, thefirst year was awesome.
We had a really good team.
Um, unfortunately, my sophomoreyear had a bit of a sophomore
slump.
I struggled because that wasalso another learning year for
me.
Um, because jt comfort came in.
He was like a late firstrounder or early second rounder.
Tyler mod had come in and thoseguys like that just bumped us

(36:34):
all down right and that in ourfreshman year Kopp had an
unbelievable year.
So sophomore year Kopp wasactually made an assistant
captain, so he was first line,he was running it, and then JT
Comfort came in, highly touted,he was made second line and my
sophomore year I found myself onthe third line.
And then JT Comfort came in,highly touted, he was made

(36:54):
second line and myself I foundmyself on the third line and I'm
just like how is this possible?
I'm a second round pick, likewhat is going on?
And it was a bit of a learningcurve.
You know, I played with a lot ofdifferent guys, I learned to
play a little bit of a differentrole, um, and then junior year
made a bounce back, um, butagain it was definitely a
struggle because then junioryear came and I think it was uh

(37:14):
who came in that year I want tosay it was Dylan.
Yeah, I think that was Larkin.
Yeah, I think that was Larkincame in my life.
That was my senior year.
This was like Cooper, marodiand all these guys, um.
And then senior year was also astruggle because I found myself
kind of teeter-tottering betweensecond and third line again

(37:36):
because Dylan Larkin had come inand I mean, like what do you?
You're not going to put himbehind any of us.
So like that kind of bumped usdown again and but no, I mean it
was good because that's a prostyle game, right.
Like you're in a locker roomwith guys who are coming in
signing big deals and yeah, likeif you guys sign a big deal,
he's going to come in and seeyou on the first line and you're
going to get bumped on thesecond.
And then if another guy comesin, you're going to get bumped

(37:57):
on the third.
And, like you said, like yourparents don't call a college
coach and say, hey, you know,little Johnny's upset had 30
goals.
You know, in youth hockey likethat doesn't happen.
Like you said, you show up, yougrind, you work, you figure it
out.
And I think one of my favoritestories from my college
experience is Zach Hyman.

(38:17):
And what a lot of people don'tknow about Zach Hyman is this
kid was the hardest workingperson I've ever met in my
entire life.

Speaker 1 (38:24):
I've never met anybody like him.

Speaker 2 (38:27):
He was there a year before me.
He barely played his freshmanyear.
Um his sophomore year hestarted to get in pretty
regularly but like bottom six,fourth line grinder.
His junior year he was on myline and I don't know what
happened, but he just I mean, heworked every, every, every year
he worked.
He was always number one infitness testing and we did a lot

(38:50):
of off-ice admission Like wewere packed and he was always
finishing first Every time wehad a back skate, always
finished first, always worked onhis skills, like and I know
people hear these stories andthey're thinking yeah, blah,
blah, blah.
I'm sure he did Like no, youdon't understand, this guy had
to be dragged off the ice,dragged off the turf.
So junior year he startsplaying pretty well and I don't

(39:16):
know what happened.
But at Christmas I just feellike everything just clicked for
this kid.
He was coming in, he was like apoint per game from Christmas
on the way out.
And I just remember thisspecific play against Minnesota.
We were, we were out there andit was like late in the game.
I think we were down by acouple goals and he just made
the strongest power move.
He just caught across the ice,took like three guys with him,
tucked it behind the goalie andand I was like Holy smokes, like
Hyman, like what is going on?
His senior year?
Dylan Larkin comes in, theyplay together, they mesh.

(39:37):
Hyman almost wins the HobieBaker award, goes and plays a
little in the AHL.
Next thing you know he'splaying in Toronto and he just
was in the Stanley cup finalslast year playing on Connor
McDavid's line.
So like that's one of myfavorite stories to tell people,
because people don't understandthat kid's path.
People don't understand, likeyou were saying before, the
grind and thesticking-to-it-ness and the

(39:58):
discipline and the resiliencethat a lot of these kids show,
which eventually land them aspot in, you know, the greatest
league in the world.

Speaker 1 (40:04):
Yeah, I love.
Thank you so much for sharingthat story because you know
you're absolutely right.
I think people don't.
Really.
They lose perspective veryquickly.
They tend to just kind offorget that.
You know it's not an overnightsuccess, nobody's just born.
And then the next day they'relike oh, now I'm in the nhl,
look at me, like the work thatgoes into it behind the scenes

(40:26):
there's, there's this uh, reallycool, um, I guess meme that was
going around that says theyonly show you the one moment it
was successful, but the 356before that where he missed the
shot, missed the net or lost thepuck every time he tried to do
that drill.
Nobody actually puts it up ontheir social media so folks can

(40:48):
see the failures is what getsyou to that success, and you
know you got to try it 300 timesuntil you get it right once oh
my god, yeah, no, it's, it's sotrue and and and it's it's.

Speaker 2 (41:00):
He's such a cool story and and you know it was
it's still so cool to see him,you know, playing it at such a
high level and um, and he stilldoes so much charity work off
the ice like he's.
He's a true role model and youknow, I'm so fortunate to have
played with him at uh, it's sucha prestigious school awesome,
so talk to me a little bit aboutgetting into that pro career

(41:20):
mode.

Speaker 1 (41:20):
So now you're out of college, you get to the nhl.
What was that like when you hadto like sign your first deal
with the rangers?

Speaker 2 (41:28):
um, yeah, that was so .
That was that was exciting.
Um I um.
So after my junior year, I hada pretty good year and I
actually remember being pulledinto red berenson's office and
he was just like there's a lotof speculation.
A lot of us were leavingbecause zach wierenski was was
going to leave after one yearand d giuseppe had left and you
know we had a little bit of aturnover and and I remember red

(41:49):
kind of sat me down.
For those people who don't knowRed Berenson, this is one of the
most intimidating men.
He does not smirk, he does notsmile.
He was one of the first collegeplayers to ever play in the NHL
.
One of the first players toever wear a helmet in the NHL.
He used to do taxes for theMontreal Canadiens because none
of the guys had a collegeeducation.
This guy is the world's mostinteresting man.

(42:09):
I, because none of the guys hada college education.
Like this guy is like world'smost interesting man.
And I remember sitting in hisoffice and he was just like we
just sat there, like he sat down, I sat down and he just like
looked at me for like a good two, three minutes and I'm just
like what's going on Red, andhe's just like how are you?
And I'm like I'm good.
And he no-transcript called andhe was like hey, we got the

(43:10):
deal done.
Blah, blah, blah.
So he's like tomorrow they'regoing to send the paperwork over
, we'll find a place you can sit, sign it, whatever.
I'm like okay, great.
And I was waiting to figure outwhere I was going to go,
because I didn't really plan togo straight to new york.
But I didn't really knowbecause they were kind of going
into playoffs I don't know ifthey want to carry an extra body
just to get me on the ice alittle bit.
I didn't expect to play withnew york, but, like you know.

(43:31):
So I go to spanish class thenext day and I'm like glued to
my phone because I'm waiting forjefforton, who was the GM at
the time, to call me.
You know to say like hey, likewell, congratulations, it's that
this is what we're doing.
And I was in Spanish class andmy Spanish teacher was just like
you need to put your phone away.
And I'm just like okay, likelisten, it's just really
important.
And they're like I'm sure it'simportant, everyone's important,

(43:54):
like put your phone away.
And I'm like okay.
So I'm like kind of sittingthere, like looking at it, and
finally my teacher snaps andshe's like give me your phone.
And I'm like no, no, no, no, no, like I cannot give you my
phone, like this is.
And she just like took it andthere's nothing on her desk
except for my phone and it'sfacing up and I'm just sitting
there like I'm looking at mywatch and like there's 30

(44:23):
minutes left in class and I'mjust like please, can I see my
phone?
She's like nope.
She's like I don't care if thisis the most important phone
call.
You're like I'm like it is likeI need to pick up this phone
call.
She's like nope, she's likeyou're not.
And I just sat there and hecalled like two more times and
I'm just like the GM of the NewYork Rangers thinks I'm ignoring
him.
Right now.
This guy's giving me alife-changing event and I can't
even you know, I can't even pickup my phone.

(44:45):
So finally I get to talk to himafter and I'm like I'm so sorry
.
Like I was in class.
He's like it's all good.
He's like I'd rather you be inclass than you know chatting
with me and um, but no, it wasexciting.
I ended up going to Hartfordright after I went to the AHL,
and which was great I think weplayed.
We finished up the season,which I think there was like 15
games left, and I did reallywell, actually, I think I I

(45:07):
think I had like 14 points inlike 15 games or something.
It was awesome.
They slotted me right in.
But one thing I did learn,though, is it's easy to go from
college to like the AHL because,like you're fresh, no one knows
who you are.
Like, you can kind of flyaround, get away with things you
wouldn't normally get away with.
And also, too, what peopledon't understand about the pro

(45:29):
league is like it's a grind likethe end of the year, like, if
you're not making playoffs, likeyeah, you're still playing for
another contract, but like guysare tired, guys are grinding
down.
I'm fresh out of college.
I just played 40 games.
These guys are on game whateveryou know 62.
And, as you know, the pro stylegame it's heavier, it's harder,
it's longer.
So, but no, that was my firstexperience of pro hockey, and it

(45:54):
was incredible.
And then that summer, I workedout in Connecticut with Ben
Prentice.
A lot of people are familiarwith him.
You know a lot of pro guys workout there.
It was like Cam Atkinson,petretti, kreider, pesci, hayden
, james, neal, like a lot ofthose guys at the time were
working out there.
So I got that under my belt.
It was cool.

(46:14):
That was like the first time Iskated with pros, worked out
with pros kind of thing.
Skated with pros worked outwith pros kind of thing.
And then there's rookietournaments.
So going before training campit's actually kind of like a
really big advantage for rookiesbecause you get to play in
these rookie tournaments wherethey bring you in about a month
earlier.
You get on the ice with thecoaches and it's all guys who
have signed or guys who play inthe CHL, because they're allowed

(46:38):
to go to play in thesetournaments and then without any
commitment and then go back totheir teams as free agents.
But in college you lose youramateurism when you sign that
contract.
So it's only guys who havesigned from college and
potential guys that they'relooking to pick from the OHL,
chl, whatever.
And so ours was Traverse City.
So we go and we skate forwhatever week.

(46:59):
We go to Traverse City up innorthern Michigan, like the UP,
and it's like us I want to sayit's Columbus, I don't even know
, like Detroit and like a coupleother teams, and I think what
was cool for me that year was wehad, I think, five guys from
Michigan who had signed thatyear all playing in that

(47:19):
specific tournament and everysingle guy wore a letter for
their team, because it was likeZach Ranske for Columbus, jt
Comfer what team was JT drafted?
Buffalo, Tyler Mott was with Iwant to say, columbus or Chicago
, and Justin Selma was with theSt Louis Blues and then I was
with New York and we all therewith CRNA, which was pretty cool

(47:41):
for us, and I played reallywell in that, actually really
really well, and I was comingout of there with a boatload of
confidence and the advantage tothat is you get out of that
tournament and you go straightto training camp, which is kind
of a grind but you're also ingreat shape.
You, you've been skating,you've been playing games,
whereas a lot of these pro guyshave just been working on it's

(48:02):
getting.
For the other two weeks that youwere up there, um, but
unfortunately my last game ofTraverse City I had a concussion
, um, which is a lot of peopleknow is kind of like the story
of the rest of my career,unfortunately, but um, so that
kind of set me back.
Didn't do training camp, thatwhole entire first year, which
was frustrating because I feellike I had a pretty good chance
to make the team.
But ended up in Hartford thefirst year, played really well,

(48:27):
got called up super early on toplay a game, did well, told me,
hey, you know, come Christmaswe're going to look to get you
back up here, you know, forsomething more permanent.
And I was like this is great.
Unfortunately, anotherconcussion around christmas and
then, you know, from then on Iwas kind of like up and down,
always battling injury, um, butthe entry to professional hockey

(48:49):
was, you know, great.

Speaker 1 (48:49):
Everything after that it's a bit of a struggle yeah,
folks, you know and I'm glad youmentioned the, the injuries and
the concussions, because forfor athletes go and thinking
about going pro and you know youcould be extremely good, but
you know you get plagued alittle bit with things like that
, uh, you know, and that couldthrow your whole career out the
window.
I know, I wrestled in college,I wrestled d3, and we had this

(49:13):
um phenomenal coach from iraq,uh, and he was a Olympic
contender and blew out his kneesand that was it his wrestling
career.
He was phenomenal, he was justjacked like unbelievable
wrestler, but you know that wasit, you know.
So it's really tough when youhave to deal with those, but you

(49:39):
know you still got to havequite a bit of a professional
career, which was awesome.
And then tell me a little bitabout your transition to
coaching.
How did that happen?

Speaker 2 (49:50):
Yeah, yeah.
So I, officially, I think, Idid my last year with New York
and Hartford.
Covid hit, and then I signed aone-year deal with Tampa and
then got hurt again and I wasjust like all right, like I
can't, I can't keep doing these.
So I actually took a long time.
It took about a year and a halfoff from hockey.
I kind of traveled and justkind of, you know, figured out

(50:11):
what else I wanted to do.
And you know, top line wassomething that we had done when
we were all playing in the minorleagues.
You know, our first coupleyears of pro.
It was just kind of a fun thingwe did in New Jersey.
Like we saw people putting oncamps and stuff and we were like
, you know, we've been to a lotof camps, we know what we like,
we know what we don't like, sowe put one on for fun and you
know, the parents loved it, thekids loved it.
So we did another one the nextyear and another one the next

(50:33):
year and then COVID hit and andobviously, as people know, a lot
of things kind of slowed down.
So I was still playing or kindof finishing up.
Justin Connor and RJ, who alsorun Topline with me.
They all had started runningsessions out of this place
called the Anvil in Fairlawn,new Jersey, and it was the Gleis

(50:53):
, the synthetic ice, because youcouldn't get on real ice over
COVID.
So they started running that,which was awesome, and I
finished up.
And they started running that,which was awesome, and I
finished up, and they weregrowing.
You know they were doing areally good job.
You know it went from, you know, one kid one hour to two kids
in an hour to four hours andfour kids, and you know, just
kept going and going and goingand you know, went from going to
the kids houses to them, comingto them, and you know they

(51:15):
really did the foundationalgroundwork which you know, which
has set up, set up top linetoday.
And you know, as that grew, andthen I, I ended up coming back
to New York, um, and it was kindof serendipitous the timing,
cause they had just beenestablished in Newburgh, um, so
for people that don't know,that's where the Mid-Hudson
Steel play up at ice time.
Um, mike Leahy runs that rink,who's awesome, um, him and his

(51:37):
wife, jackie, and they weregreat to us.
We ended up building a gymthere the summer I came back,
which was our first gym that webuilt for Topline and we ran a
lot of our online sessions attheir rink.
And then, you know, as westarted growing, you know more
and more people.
I live in Manhattan, I live inthe city, so I was going up
there every day and, you know,some kids were starting to come

(51:58):
up there from the city and theywere like, hey, did you want to
do some stuff in the city?
And I was like, yeah, sure.
And then next thing, you know,I mean everyone, every skills
coach knows how this goes.
You know.
Next thing, you know you'redoing six AMs with one kid and
then another kid strolls by, andnow you're doing five days a
week and now you're getting nicelater.
Now you're going back, know,six, seven hours of sessions a

(52:18):
day and um, but no, I mean, itgrew pretty quickly.
You know, we we got in um tocity ice, I want to say about
two years ago now, where webuilt that gym, um, and now we
run all the on and off bysessions for the tier one team
that runs out of there, thenychc um.
And we just finished buildingour third facility in wyckoff,
new jersey, um.
We opened that in march of thisyear and, yeah, we've kind of

(52:41):
grown as a staff, we've hired acouple more people and I think,
yeah, no, it's been interesting.
It's one of those things whereyou feel like you could write a
book about every single day justbecause of the most ridiculous
stuff that happens.
It's just when you think thingsare going smooth, a kid forgets
his skate, or a kid forgets hisglove, and you know, you, you
have one left glove on causehe's wearing your left glove and

(53:03):
it's way too big for him.
And the other kid, you know,was 15 minutes late Once the
stand, 15 minutes late, like youknow how it goes.
There's just always somethingand but no, I mean it's, it's
been incredible, honestly, theamount of people you meet and
the connections that you makeand the people that coached you
when you were younger.
You can now kind of give backand it's it's.
It's kind of come full circleright, because my, my coach at

(53:25):
boarding school met her.
You know I used to babysit hiskids when I was playing for him
there and now his, his older sonnow is playing in Rochester in
the NOL and I was.
I was skating and working himout in the in the summer and
then his daughter, jillian.
She's, I think, a junior now atDeerfield, um, we skate and
worked her out in the summer.
So it's been cool to see thatstuff come full circle, um, and

(53:48):
to kind of be able to kind ofgive back to the people who
helped me in my career and andhelp them, you know, um, develop
their kids Um, because, youknow, I think an advantage we
have is we're not too farremoved from the game, right,
but we are far enough removedwhere we can, you know, talk to
the parents and they canunderstand our perspective, but
yet we can still relate to thekids and see it from their

(54:08):
perspective.
So, no, it's been incredibleand we've had a lot of support
from from other skills coachesaround.
We do a lot of collaborativework with, with everybody and
all of these different rings.
So so, yeah, it's it's, it'sbeen a fun ride so far and I
think we still have a prettylong ways to go that's awesome.

Speaker 1 (54:24):
No, I love, I love all the work that you guys are
doing now and the training thatyou guys are putting in,
especially.
You know, I feel like offseason everybody's always
looking for opportunities tojump into another clinic or
another training session and seesomething new, and you know we
always talk about um.
It's.

(54:44):
It's good for kids to be ableto kind of see and diversify.
But, as you mentioned earlier,I think you're being a part of a
certain club and being andleaving for reasons like, hey,
you know, parallel a to a, butjust leaving to a different club
because your kid's notperforming hard enough, as
opposed to going in and takingsome extra lessons.

(55:06):
Uh, you know, sometimes that'skind of like a detriment in our
sport, right?

Speaker 2 (55:12):
yeah, no, it is, yeah , it's, it's just part of the
extra work you you mentioned awhile ago and and you know
there's I won't name his name,but there's, you know a kid who
was skating with us three yearsago and and even four years ago
actually, and, and you know, allthe other parents didn't want
him on the ice.
You know he's slowing down thedrills, he's this, he's that.
Well, you know what that kidended up committing to michigan.
You know a couple, you know, Ithink it was last summer, um, so

(55:35):
it, and now all of those sameparents, same kids, hey, hey,
when's, when's when someone's soskating, hey, let us know when
someone's so it's going to be inthe gym.
Like you work so hard, likeit's so good for my kid and I'm
just, obviously, you know we letthem know.
You know we want everyone towork together, but the back of
our minds were like, you know,you didn't even want this kid on
the ice with your son threeyears ago, but and now everybody

(55:56):
wants to follow in his path.
So it's interesting Like thatstuff happens and that stuff is
real.

Speaker 1 (56:02):
Yeah, and it happens more often than not, right?
I love to use.
Scott Pippen is a great story,right, because he was a tall boy
with his basketball team incollege because he was too short
and then he grew like 17 inchesover summer and became the
all-favorite point guard.
So we see that all the time,right?
We see those kids that arestruggling and then you try to

(56:25):
explain to parents that thereare, you know, certain games
tight games, maybe you're goingto play your top players, but
then there's other games whereit's just a little lopsided or
you're up by three or down bythree or whatever, and you're
giving opportunities to the kidswho don't really get
opportunities normally, right.
So you kind of trying tobalance the whole spectrum and
giving everybody opportunitiesto play those power plays,

(56:47):
penalty kills and experiences.
But if you want to play at ahigher level and you're playing
on the third or fourth line,that's not the worst thing in
the world.
You know you can use that, asyou've been saying so many times
now.
You know how you can use thatto motivate you to get to that
next level and to get to thosetop two lines.

Speaker 2 (57:15):
Absolutely the guy in boarding school to being top
six my freshman year to bottomsix for two years, then top six
again my senior year to a bottomsix guy in the NHL.
I've seen it all, I've played itall.
I've been on the penalty kill,I've been on the power play,
I've sat on the bench the last10 minutes of the game.
I get it.
So it's good.

(57:37):
It's good to be able to see allof the different sides of it
and to understand them and kindof soak it in and understand why
you're feeling the way you'refeeling and not just point
fingers.
Because you know, as as I'msure you tell your kids, like as
you get to the higher levels,there's no, you know, calling
the coach and complaining it'sit's up to you like you need to

(57:58):
make a change, you need to makea decision, and you know I
calling the coach andcomplaining it's it's up to you
Like you need to make a change,you need to make a decision, and
you know, I think that that'sprobably the most important part
about hockey.
It's just the lessons you learnand to learn to not only work
with people from a fundamentalstandpoint but to understand how
to adapt to the situationsaround you.

Speaker 1 (58:16):
And I know earlier you mentioned something that
really extorted out to me.
You said you accepted your rolewith different teams, right,
and I had Theo Fleury on theshow earlier.
I'm going to just you know 14thor 15th episode and that's one
of the things he said.
Because he was, you know, smalland he came into Calgary and

(58:37):
you know he's like in an Olympicteam with Gretzky and Lemieux
and all those guys.
He's like I was like what wasthat like?
Because he was a, they put himon a fourth line because all
these guys we know are legends.
He was like, well, he's like Iaccepted my role.
He's like I had a role to play.
He's like I realized that youknow, when I skated I was
willing to die for that puck and90% of the other people weren't

(58:58):
.
And he's like, and that was my,my purpose, he's gonna end up
with a gold medal because Iexactly took up my role.
So, yeah, maybe you could talka little bit about that concept.
And you know how do you helpkids to understand like they
come to you for skill training,but I'm sure they they kind of
inquire with you and look foradvice from you in terms of how

(59:21):
do they accept their positionnow and as they're working
towards something bigger, yeah,no, that's a really good
question.

Speaker 2 (59:29):
And and and I think the number one thing I say
actually I had a kid the otherday come and the mom was.
The mom was just like yeah, youknow it's been frustrating she,
she was good about it, she waslike it's been.
You know, he was playing centerlast year and he was kind of
like the go-to guy and now he'splaying right winger, you know,
as a lefty, and I'm like, well,okay, well, that means that he's

(59:49):
going to be making a lot ofplays on his backhand.
Has he been working on hisbackhand?
And she was like not really.
Like, I'm playing right wing asa lefty.
That means I'm going to becatching passes on my backhand.
I'm going to have to make a lotof plays to the middle of my
backhand.
Yes, if I can cut across, I'min an advantage.
But to get there I got to getstronger on my backhand.
So, like that whole session, Iwas like listen, backhand

(01:00:13):
everything.
We're going to catch passesskating full speed.
We're going to catch passesskating backwards.
You're going to catch rims.
You're going to learn how toget this puck from your backhand
to your forehand the mostefficient, the most quickly.
And I'm going to talk to youabout different areas of the ice
where you should understandwhen to use your backhand, when
not to use your backhand, whereyou're vulnerable, where you're
not vulnerable and, honestly,it's.
It was such a good session forhim because I think that not

(01:00:35):
only he left there moreconfident, but just with a
better understanding of what aright winger does in the game of
hockey, because I think, likeyou said, these kids they only
see highlights, they only seePanarin skating from the blue
line in cutting across scoringthe Rangers win three to two.
Everybody's happy, but theydon't see him at the training
facility picking up 50 rims in arow, messing up 30 of them,

(01:00:59):
figuring out when to cut to theice, when to stay tight to the
boards, and I think thataccepting a role isn't.
Oh, I had a good shift and Iblocked a shot as a bottom six
guy.
Okay, put me back up at the topsix, it's okay.
What did you do before youblocked that shot?
Were you even in the rightposition?
Was you blocking that shot,making up for you being out of
position?
What did you do after the blockshot?

(01:01:24):
Did you chase it down?
Did you get it deep?
Did you have a turnover at theblue line.
Did you try to make a play, youwould have made playing as a
top six guy.
Because all of these things,when you really just boil them
down, is when you look at aStanley cup team, like you know
the, the Florida Panthers, likethe guys who are helping them,
truly, when these games aren'tthe guys scoring the goals, it's
, it's the guys who are causingthose turnovers at the blue line
, like everybody you know wantsto talk about that play.

(01:01:45):
You know that that happenedwith truba.
Um, they're like, why did hestep there at the blue line?
Well, because he's trying tomake a play to help his team win
, and at the highest levels inthe world someone has to win and
someone has to lose.
Like he took a rest risk, thepuck went by, they went on an
on-man rush.
But you know what, you knowwhat nobody talks about.
Where was the third guy?
That was the third guy, high,that was supposed to be back

(01:02:06):
checking right.
Like that guy didn't accept hisrole.
That guy assumed Trouba wasgoing to be able to take out two
guys and get him the puck.
So I think there's so manyexamples over the game of hockey
that people can kind of pulland grab at.
But hockey that people can kindof pull and grab at.
But I think accepting your roleis just more of what your
parents are seeing and what thecoach is happy with.
When you are truly on the iceit's.
Did you watch?
You know a player who plays onhis off wing?

(01:02:28):
You know.
Learn how to pick up rims.
Learn, you know how to cut tothe middle.
Learn how to communicate withhis center, his center low and
slow, or his center breakingthree.
Like does he need to get it offthe glass?
Like there's so many littlethings these kids can do and at
the end of the day, it's nottheir fault.
They don't know, they're kids.
Like it's up to people like meand you, you know, to teach them
, to help them understand it.
But like, going back, I thinkthat kid left that session, you

(01:02:51):
know not, like I said, moreconfident, but he understood his
role as a right winger now.
So now when he gets to the nextlevel and his coach says, hey,
you're playing center again.
Boom, that's easy, I know howto play center or the next level
, you know.
He goes to college.
Boom, you're a winger.
Yeah, I know how to do.
I don't want to play as a rightwinger, that's great, so so I I
think it's truly fununderstanding and and and

(01:03:11):
learning everything around thatposition, not just what you guys
see, you know, in the highlightreels yeah, I love that.

Speaker 1 (01:03:18):
Thank you, that.
That was incredible.
That's actually something thatmike is is struggling with now.
My middle one that wasmentioning earlier is is exactly
that situation.
He was the center.
Now, yes, he's kind ofinterchangeably, mostly playing
right wing and and the samething, so he's it's hard for him
to to get those pucks,especially on the walls.
When he picks it up and one ofthem he's trying to just quickly

(01:03:40):
chip it up the wall and it goesright to the other defenseman.
We talk a lot about beingpatient with the puck, making
conscious plays and everythingwe do with purpose.
You can justify why did youmake that play?
Why did you move the puck thatway or this way instead of
holding on to it and making aplay?

(01:04:01):
So you're not.

Speaker 2 (01:04:01):
You know you get the nerves out of it exactly and and
for that, like we, we, we tellkids like video, video, video,
video, video, watch yourself,watch yourself, watch yourself.
Because the best advice I evergot as a kid was you never
played as well as you think youdid and you never played as bad
as you think you did, until youwatch video.
And there's a lot of like oh,does that happen when you sit

(01:04:23):
there and watch video with kids?

Speaker 1 (01:04:24):
so, yeah, I would harp on video a lot then awesome
and I, you know, I had a reallyfunny story with my older one.
He, um, he was at a game andyou know I couldn't be there, I
was coaching my other kid.
And so he comes home and youknow he had a penalty late in
the game and he's like, you know, they gave me a penalty, but I
was nowhere near the guy, it wasthe other kid that did it.

(01:04:46):
And then you know, we go onlive bar and I pull up the video
and literally slow-mo, he comesin two-handed right against the
other guy.
The guy goes flying.
I was like, wait a second, thatwasn't you right?
Let's rewind, let's see whothat really was.
And he's like okay, I got it.
I was like, but he was soconvinced yeah, it wasn't for

(01:05:09):
the video, there's just noargument.

Speaker 2 (01:05:11):
He was like you might have believed him too.

Speaker 1 (01:05:13):
Yeah, but he was convinced himself.
He was shocked.
He was shocked, he was himself.
He was yeah, you were shy.
He was like yeah, how did thathappen?
I was like no, that that's you,buddy, that was you I know,
it's so, I know it's, it's sofunny, like it's.

Speaker 2 (01:05:30):
The kids are just they, you're right.
Like they convince themselvesso much that they almost
convince me too, right like thatwasn't me that shot that puck.
I'm like actually was it.
And then you look back.
I'm like it was you that shotright because you start doubting
.

Speaker 1 (01:05:42):
You say like, maybe I got it wrong, maybe I was
looking, so I don't know no,it's true, it is now.
They're hilarious well, that'sthe well.
I know we're coming up on thehour, but I always like to close
out the show with a few rapidfire questions, so I'm gonna put
them up on screen.
Uh, first one is what do youthink motivates athletes?

Speaker 2 (01:06:04):
um, I think what motivates athletes is you know
what got them into, you knowtheir sport in the first place.
I think that it's easy to kindof get blinded by okay, you know
, I want to go to the nhl, Iwant to make millions of dollars
.
Okay, that's great, everybodywants to do that.
But how badly do you want to dothat when it's pouring outside
and you're at the track?
Do you still want to do that?

(01:06:25):
And you know when the ice ismelted and you have to stay for
an extra hour, and it's 11o'clock and now you're going to
go on the ice at 12 o'clock, doyou still want to stay and do
that?
So I think I think you learn alot about yourself as an athlete
when things are going poorly,kind of like what we were
talking about.
When you're put in a positionyou're not normally used to
playing and you go home thatnight and say I don't want to

(01:06:46):
play hockey anymore.
Do you go home that night andsay, okay, I'm gonna adapt and
I'm gonna learn and I'm gonnafigure out how to get better at
this specific part of my game inorder to become a more
well-rounded hockey player?

Speaker 1 (01:06:57):
awesome.
Uh, next player, awesome.
Next question Name threecharacter traits you notice in
successful athletes.

Speaker 2 (01:07:05):
I think, right off the bat, number one is
consistency.
I think some of the bestathletes you see in the world
just to have their whatever it's, their routine or their warm up
.
I think consistency isabsolutely number one.
I think another one would bediscipline.
Obviously, you know that comesup a lot, obviously, but I think
that you know being able to,you know, block out noise and

(01:07:29):
being able to truly focus.
And I think one thing I like tosay a lot with the kids is just
be present, right, like, don'tworry about the team you're
playing this weekend, don'tworry about, you know, the team
you played last weekend, like,be present.
And if you're able to bepresent and you know, with
consistent on top of that, Ithink that you know, I think
that that's just, that'sunbeatable.
Um, a third trait I think iswould be, you know, passion for,

(01:07:54):
for the sport.
I think people who, people who,who make it to the highest
levels, like they truly it.
It's not a oh, I'm doing thisto make money or I'm doing this
because it's something that I'mgood at.
You don't play in the NHLbecause you're good at hockey.
You play in the NHL because youlove hockey so much that you've
spent the last whatever 20something years of your life

(01:08:16):
dedicating yourself to shooting,passing, skating, weight you've
you've sacrificed a lot.
Your parents have sacrificed alot.

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
So I think those three I think consistency,
discipline and passion kind ofcomplete a well-rounded athlete
I love it and you know it mademe think of yarmir yager, who's
still playing in the pro leagueshe's player.

Speaker 2 (01:08:38):
Owner left winger.

Speaker 1 (01:08:40):
Like it's crazy, it's nuts, just like the guys you
know, gonna be 78 years old,playing professional cocky like
sweden he's a terminator.
It's crazy so cool, uh.
One more question here is ifyou can name three things that
hold athletes back.

Speaker 2 (01:08:59):
I think first thing that comes up for me would be
fear.
I think and I think that'ssomething I kind of struggle
with I think fear is somethingthat holds a lot of athletes
back.
It's the fear of losing, it'sthe fear of getting caught, it's
the fear of putting yourself ina situation where you may not
be successful.
And I, you know, I wish I didthat more.
I wish I skated with guys thatwere better than me a lot more.

(01:09:21):
Instead, I, you know, I wish Idid that more.
I wish I skated with guys thatwere better than me a lot more,
instead of, you know, skatingwith guys I knew I was better
than or as good as right.
And I think this one kind ofpiggybacks off of it, I think
doubt, because I think, kind ofcoming off of fear, then kids
start to doubt themselves andlike, do I belong in this league
, do I belong in this team?
Do I belong here in general?
Like, is this, you know,something that I can, you know I

(01:09:44):
can find success in?
And I think the third thing, Idon't know, a couple different
things come up.
I would say one thing I think,for a lot of kids I see now is
kind of being inquisitive,asking questions and

(01:10:05):
understanding, right, becauseit's one thing to have a coach
show you a cool drill and you'llbe able to do it, but why are
you doing it and when in a gameshould you be doing this?
And I think one thing that'scool about a lot of kids that we
have now is and kids in generalis they're so inquisitive now
and they because I'm an adultand because I said so, it

(01:10:27):
doesn't really work anymore,right, like sometimes kids will
be like why are we doing thisexercise?
Or like, what is this showgoing to help us with in a game?
And it forces coaches tohonestly learn themselves to, to
, to figure out why they areteaching these kids these things
and when it is going to beuseful, and I feel like it makes
the sessions more efficient andmore productive and just better

(01:10:49):
well-rounded as a whole.
So I think that those threedefinitely are things that I
honestly felt like held me backa little bit and I would like to
see a little bit less of thesekids if they're able to control
that.

Speaker 1 (01:10:59):
Awesome.
I mean that's pretty much themain reason I teach Michigan for
at least 30 minutes of everypractice.
Just to make sure you know,because that's going to happen,
Cut that part out.

Speaker 2 (01:11:14):
Okay, what?

Speaker 1 (01:11:14):
about some dive guys.
Let's go.
It's funny because if you do saythat there are like two kids
who will start to do it, you'relike, okay, we're not actually
going to do that right, no, Iusually play around with the uh,
with the junior rangers kids,I'll be doing learn to play and
I'll pick up the puck on mystick and I'll be like okay, now
, everybody else, they all lookat me as I'm kidding me.

(01:11:34):
So it's a lot of fun.
Uh, boo.
Thank you so much.
I know we went a little bitlonger than than anticipated,
but I really appreciate yourtime.
This was so informative andhelpful.
Um, if people want to find atop line hockey, where do they
go?

Speaker 2 (01:11:53):
um.
So you can find us attoplinehockeycom um on instagram
, at topline hockey um TikTok,all that good stuff.
We're everywhere.
And then we're located at CityIce Pavilion and the Graveyard,
both in Long Island City.
We run sessions out ofSportarama American Dream.
We're up in Newburgh at icetime, we're out in Wyckoff,

(01:12:15):
Hawthorne area, so, yeah, wekind of cover most of the
tri-state area.
So yeah, just give us a shout,send us a message on the app, on
the website, on Instagram.
We'll get right back to you andwe'll find some sessions for
you.

Speaker 1 (01:12:28):
Wonderful.
Thank you so much again.
Thank you everybody who joinedin and listened.
If you do have questions forBoo and you'd like to ask them,
you can send them to me at thePodolsky method on Instagram or
Facebook or, you know, reach outto booze through social media
through his top line page.
Thanks again, we appreciateyour time.

Speaker 2 (01:12:51):
Awesome.
Thank you so much for having me.

Speaker 1 (01:12:53):
All right, Well with that, everybody.
Have a wonderful rest of yourday.