March 3, 2025 • 12 mins
Hosts Meghan (Smallwood) and Patrick (Cadigan) have a short discussion on the importance of financial literacy for students with disabilities, noting a common stigma that they cannot manage their own money. They emphasize the shift from handling cash to using debit cards and the need for basic financial education. Practical strategies include community-based instruction, involving students in household financial decisions, and using chores and allowances to teach budgeting. They highlight the significance of understanding banking, the difference between necessities and luxuries, and the impact of taxes on paychecks. Join the conversation!
Episode Keywords:
Financial literacy, students with disabilities, money management, debit cards, community-based instruction, independent living skills, budgeting, vocational skills, banking, necessities vs luxuries, SSI, paycheck, credit card, financial independence, transition process.
Links:
SSI (page)
SSI Discussion- Ep. 21 (link)
ABLE National Resource Center (site)
Maryland (specific) Links/Supports:
Centers for Independent Living (site)
To download a copy of a transcript for this episode or any of our previous conversations, click here.
Also visit our Podcast webpage to find links to all of our other discussions; go to www.p2transition.com.
Additional information about post-secondary transition can be found at our website.
The Post-Secondary Transition Podcast Facebook page.
Visit our YouTube Channel to find additional video resources.
Intro/Outro music by AudioCoffee from Pixabay.
Transition music by Joseph McDade from Transistor.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Patrick Cadigan (00:00):
Patrick, welcome. This is the Post
Secondary Transition podcastwhere we cover the ins and outs
and everything in between of thetransition process for families
of students with disabilities. Iam one of the hosts. My name is
Patrick Cadigan, and as always,I have a co host. And who would
that be?
Meghan Smallwood (00:16):
Yep, I am Meghan Smallwood, and I am, oh,
my God, my brain just...what wasI saying?
Patrick Cadigan (00:25):
I think you were talking about the fact that
you're a host.
Meghan Smallwood (00:28):
Yeah, and I am Meghan Smallwood, and I am the
other host.
Patrick Cadigan (00:34):
So this week, both Meghan and I are a little
bit under the weather, if youcan't already tell from our
voices, but something that hadcome up last week that we
thought we would touch upontoday in our discussion is that
of financial literacy. SoMeghan, what were you thinking
that we should be talking about?
Meghan Smallwood (00:55):
Yeah, it's a topic that I know we focused a
lot on over the last few years,with our students in the
classroom, but I feel likethere's such a stigma about
students or individuals withdisabilities and managing their
own money. I know, growing up,you know, back in the 90s, I
don't the topic wasn't covered alot. For my sister to this day,
(01:19):
I know she receives a paycheckfrom her job, and she doesn't
need a choice in it. She doesn'tcare how much money it is. It
means nothing to her. And it'sa, it's something that I wish
she had a little more investmentin and knowledge about. So it's,
it's a topic dear to my heart,and I recognize, and I think,
you know, a lot of our educatorsand families recognize that some
(01:41):
of these concepts can be reallyhard to understand, but just
that exposure and giving thatbasic idea about money and being
safe with it, and some of thatbasic ideas that we all should
know is important.
Patrick Cadigan (01:57):
That was actually something that had come
up just last week in discussionwith some teacher friends of
mine, where they were expoundingon the virtues of understanding
money, but then also recognizingthe changes that have happened,
where now there's actually verylittle paper money that's
actually being exchanged rightlike it's now gone to a more
(02:21):
credit based system, or at leastusing a debit card. So, and
that's a different, you know?
That's a different function, soto speak.
Meghan Smallwood (02:29):
Yeah, and I feel like for so many years,
when I was in the classroom, wedid focus on counting change and
counting bills and next dollarup, which are all great ideas
and strategies. But you'reright, like a lot of people are
using debit cards now and prefilling the card with a certain
amount of money. I mean, look atlike the even the ABLE account
has debit card to use, so it'simportant just to have that
(02:53):
basic knowledge of what itmeans. I mean, I think of gift
cards. Even my sister gets agift card for Christmas, and she
puts it right in her drawer andnever looks at it again. So
understanding what it means isis very important, and it's
things that you know, teacherscan teach, but also families can
implement at home. So I thinkwith financial literacy, it's
(03:14):
just important that theindividuals with disabilities
learn just how to manage andmake good decisions about their
money, and it's also animportant key to giving them
some more independence.
Patrick Cadigan (03:26):
Well, and I think that one of the things
that doesn't come up in theconversation, and you've said it
before, is that people withdisabilities can manage their
own money.
Meghan Smallwood (03:36):
Absolutely.
And I know as teachers, youknow, we really try to hone in
on these concepts, especiallyduring those transition years. I
know, just in the classroom,from what I've witnessed and
what I've done, we practice alot of real life examples with,
you know, structured learningexperiences. But also when we go
out in the community, we do alot of community based
instruction, where maybe we'llgo out to lunch and they have to
(03:58):
bring money or bring their debitcard, and we help them determine
if they have enough or if theirmeal they'll get change back for
their meal. That's somethingthat's also very important that
they learn not to walk away ifthey're due money back. There's
also resources out in thecommunity that families can
access, such as a center forindependent living, and they
(04:19):
really will help students toowith independent living skills
like that, money management, Imean, something as simple as
making change for the bus fare.
You know, those are littlethings I think many people take
for granted, but it is somethingthat we can teach and reinforce
for our individuals withdisabilities.
Patrick Cadigan (04:38):
So when we talk about, when you say
reinforcement, how can familiesreinforce these concepts? Like,
what are some of the things thatthey can do to kind of jump in?
Meghan Smallwood (04:48):
I think that's, you know, it's a scary
idea, like, oh my gosh, how am Igoing to do this for them? But
really, it's just including themin their everyday conversations
at home. I mean, it's somethingas simple as showing them. The
grocery list. You know, I justmade my grocery list and went
shopping this weekend with mykids, explaining to them that we
have a budget for the food, sowe have to compare prices when
(05:09):
we shop. We don't want to buythe more expensive item we would
like to save money if there'scoupons or if there's sales
going on, let's pay attention tothat, and even having them add
up the different items on acalculator as they go, just to
practice that budgeting, thoselittle things can, over time,
really start to sink in and getthem to practice these skills
(05:34):
more and more. I think about,you know, we always talk about
vocational skills, right? Andhaving them do more chores at
home to help, you know,reinforce what they're doing at
work or at school, implementingan allowance for them for every
chore they do, you know, even ifit's a couple dollars, that will
help practice with budgeting. Ithink just, you know, I've done
(05:57):
that with my kids too, justteaching them that also, when
you do work, you earn apaycheck. I mean, that's
something, like I said, mysister still doesn't have, so I
think that's something that wecan start, even at a young age.
Patrick Cadigan (06:13):
Kids doing stuff around the house for
money. Some people call thatbribery.
Meghan Smallwood (06:17):
What a concept, Yeah, amazing, though
it works.
Patrick Cadigan (06:22):
All right. And then along the lines, again, of
concepts that might be hard tounderstand, you have brought up
before about banking and howthey need to be aware of that.
So do you...
Meghan Smallwood (06:36):
Right.
Patrick Cadigan (06:36):
...want to touch on that?
Meghan Smallwood (06:38):
Yeah, I think banking is also a very scary
thing, because, you know, whenyou when the students turn 18,
that's really when I think thatcomes to fruition. Because if
they're receiving SSI, where isthis money going to go? Some of
them have never had a cat anaccount to themselves. You know,
I think sometimes parents are alittle nervous about them having
an account in their name, but Ithink having them involved in
(07:01):
that process and aware of thismoney coming in for them is so
important, especially if youknow, when we've talked about
SSI before and how to increasethe amount you get, you
technically pay rent, they'reaware of that they're paying
their portion to live in ahouse, Just like any other
individual over 18 without adisability may be doing if they
(07:24):
move back home, or they're goingout and living in an apartment.
So I think the little thingsthat we just take for granted
and just write off, I mean justincluding them in the
conversation, so they know wherethe money is going, although
they have money coming in, andwhere the money is going, and
what form that everything doescost money. Like I mentioned to
(07:44):
my sister, having a job andgetting a paycheck, I think just
going over what that means whenthey get it. Some of our
students, I know that would geta paycheck, and they'd get all
excited, and then they'd see,well, why didn't I get all my
money? You know, explaining tothem that they're paying taxes
and there's money being takenout. So you may think you're
going to get X amount, but whenyou actually get your paycheck,
(08:05):
it's not so that helps with thebudgeting aspect as well. I
think that having a bank accountthat they could access, like we
talked about using a debit card,making them aware of not
overspending, being sure thatthey know how much they have to
spend, and staying within thatrange. And also the differences
(08:27):
between that and a credit card.
You know, I know, when I wasyoung and first had a credit
card, I was like, Oh, great,free money. You know, I don't
have to pay this right now. Soagain, just being sure, as basic
as it can be, you know that theymight need to know you still
have to pay for this, you stillhave to budget, and that's still
(08:48):
going to be your money.
Patrick Cadigan (08:52):
Again, kind of knowing those little
differences.
Meghan Smallwood (08:54):
Yeah, and you know something, I remember going
over a lot with students, it wasjust the difference between
necessities and luxuries, thatcan be a hard concept, too,
because, you know, we seesomething that we really want
and we're fixated on it, justexplaining to them, okay, that's
nice, but it's not somethingthat we need. However, we can
(09:15):
practice saving up for an item,and that's something the parents
can also do at home. You know,if the the house needs to buy a
new TV, they can be involved inthe process of, okay, we're
going to save the money up.
Let's look and compare prices.
Let's see what the better dealis. And just, you know, making
them involved so that theyunderstand a little better.
Patrick Cadigan (09:36):
Yeah, that sounds really good. And with
that, this has been a relativelyshort conversation, even though
we try to keep our discussionsshort, but these are really
designed and intended to start aconversation within families and
and we hope that that this ishelping just a little bit. I
(09:59):
think I can speak for Meghan,when we say that we're really
looking forward to getting backto kind of like a more regular
schedule and health. And umm...
Meghan Smallwood (10:08):
Yeah.
Patrick Cadigan (10:09):
But boy, oh boy.
Meghan Smallwood (10:11):
I do like these topics, though, and I
think it is great for familiesto think about these things, and
even if it just, you know,plants the seed, talk to other
people, find out what they mightbe doing for their child or, you
know, young adult with adisability. It just helps to get
you thinking
Patrick Cadigan (10:26):
Yeah, and always keep in mind that there
are links in the show notes tothe things that we discuss and
some resources that we think wecould that can be helpful. So
yeah, just because theconversation is short doesn't
mean that there's not more todive into and look into.
Meghan Smallwood (10:41):
Right. And we're always happy to continue
the conversation about thesetopics in later times too.
Patrick Cadigan (10:46):
Sounds good.
All right. Well, thankseverybody, and we will catch up
with you soon.
Meghan Smallwood (10:51):
All right, thank you.
As always, you'll find links tothe information from our
conversations in our show notes.
We would love for theinformation from this and all
our other discussions to reachas many families as possible,
(11:11):
and we need your help to dothat. You can find our
conversations atwww.p2transition.com, like,
follow, share out the podcast.
Our conversations are posted toall the major platforms,
including Apple podcasts,Spotify, YouTube music, and
that's just naming a few. Soplease share and share often.
Patrick Cadigan (11:32):
Please check out our YouTube channel. We've
done some of the legwork for youby curating videos of topics
that revolve around transition.
We have playlists forguardianship, alternatives to
guardianship ABLE accounts, andthere's more to come, so please
be sure to subscribe there aswell. And finally, check out our
website, which is full ofinformation and links to
resources around the transitionprocess. Open your web browser
(11:53):
of choice and surf towww.postsecondarytransition.com
we thank you so much for thetime that you've spent with us,
and look forward to talkingagain soon.
Patrick, welcome. This is the Post
Secondary Transition podcastwhere we cover the ins and outs
and everything in between of thetransition process for families
of students with disabilities. Iam one of the hosts. My name is
Patrick Cadigan, and as always,I have a co host. And who would
that be?
Meghan Smallwood (00:16):
Yep, I am Meghan Smallwood, and I am, oh,
my God, my brain just...what wasI saying?
Patrick Cadigan (00:25):
I think you were talking about the fact that
you're a host.
Meghan Smallwood (00:28):
Yeah, and I am Meghan Smallwood, and I am the
other host.
Patrick Cadigan (00:34):
So this week, both Meghan and I are a little
bit under the weather, if youcan't already tell from our
voices, but something that hadcome up last week that we
thought we would touch upontoday in our discussion is that
of financial literacy. SoMeghan, what were you thinking
that we should be talking about?
Meghan Smallwood (00:55):
Yeah, it's a topic that I know we focused a
lot on over the last few years,with our students in the
classroom, but I feel likethere's such a stigma about
students or individuals withdisabilities and managing their
own money. I know, growing up,you know, back in the 90s, I
don't the topic wasn't covered alot. For my sister to this day,
(01:19):
I know she receives a paycheckfrom her job, and she doesn't
need a choice in it. She doesn'tcare how much money it is. It
means nothing to her. And it'sa, it's something that I wish
she had a little more investmentin and knowledge about. So it's,
it's a topic dear to my heart,and I recognize, and I think,
you know, a lot of our educatorsand families recognize that some
(01:41):
of these concepts can be reallyhard to understand, but just
that exposure and giving thatbasic idea about money and being
safe with it, and some of thatbasic ideas that we all should
know is important.
Patrick Cadigan (01:57):
That was actually something that had come
up just last week in discussionwith some teacher friends of
mine, where they were expoundingon the virtues of understanding
money, but then also recognizingthe changes that have happened,
where now there's actually verylittle paper money that's
actually being exchanged rightlike it's now gone to a more
(02:21):
credit based system, or at leastusing a debit card. So, and
that's a different, you know?
That's a different function, soto speak.
Meghan Smallwood (02:29):
Yeah, and I feel like for so many years,
when I was in the classroom, wedid focus on counting change and
counting bills and next dollarup, which are all great ideas
and strategies. But you'reright, like a lot of people are
using debit cards now and prefilling the card with a certain
amount of money. I mean, look atlike the even the ABLE account
has debit card to use, so it'simportant just to have that
(02:53):
basic knowledge of what itmeans. I mean, I think of gift
cards. Even my sister gets agift card for Christmas, and she
puts it right in her drawer andnever looks at it again. So
understanding what it means isis very important, and it's
things that you know, teacherscan teach, but also families can
implement at home. So I thinkwith financial literacy, it's
(03:14):
just important that theindividuals with disabilities
learn just how to manage andmake good decisions about their
money, and it's also animportant key to giving them
some more independence.
Patrick Cadigan (03:26):
Well, and I think that one of the things
that doesn't come up in theconversation, and you've said it
before, is that people withdisabilities can manage their
own money.
Meghan Smallwood (03:36):
Absolutely.
And I know as teachers, youknow, we really try to hone in
on these concepts, especiallyduring those transition years. I
know, just in the classroom,from what I've witnessed and
what I've done, we practice alot of real life examples with,
you know, structured learningexperiences. But also when we go
out in the community, we do alot of community based
instruction, where maybe we'llgo out to lunch and they have to
(03:58):
bring money or bring their debitcard, and we help them determine
if they have enough or if theirmeal they'll get change back for
their meal. That's somethingthat's also very important that
they learn not to walk away ifthey're due money back. There's
also resources out in thecommunity that families can
access, such as a center forindependent living, and they
(04:19):
really will help students toowith independent living skills
like that, money management, Imean, something as simple as
making change for the bus fare.
You know, those are littlethings I think many people take
for granted, but it is somethingthat we can teach and reinforce
for our individuals withdisabilities.
Patrick Cadigan (04:38):
So when we talk about, when you say
reinforcement, how can familiesreinforce these concepts? Like,
what are some of the things thatthey can do to kind of jump in?
Meghan Smallwood (04:48):
I think that's, you know, it's a scary
idea, like, oh my gosh, how am Igoing to do this for them? But
really, it's just including themin their everyday conversations
at home. I mean, it's somethingas simple as showing them. The
grocery list. You know, I justmade my grocery list and went
shopping this weekend with mykids, explaining to them that we
have a budget for the food, sowe have to compare prices when
(05:09):
we shop. We don't want to buythe more expensive item we would
like to save money if there'scoupons or if there's sales
going on, let's pay attention tothat, and even having them add
up the different items on acalculator as they go, just to
practice that budgeting, thoselittle things can, over time,
really start to sink in and getthem to practice these skills
(05:34):
more and more. I think about,you know, we always talk about
vocational skills, right? Andhaving them do more chores at
home to help, you know,reinforce what they're doing at
work or at school, implementingan allowance for them for every
chore they do, you know, even ifit's a couple dollars, that will
help practice with budgeting. Ithink just, you know, I've done
(05:57):
that with my kids too, justteaching them that also, when
you do work, you earn apaycheck. I mean, that's
something, like I said, mysister still doesn't have, so I
think that's something that wecan start, even at a young age.
Patrick Cadigan (06:13):
Kids doing stuff around the house for
money. Some people call thatbribery.
Meghan Smallwood (06:17):
What a concept, Yeah, amazing, though
it works.
Patrick Cadigan (06:22):
All right. And then along the lines, again, of
concepts that might be hard tounderstand, you have brought up
before about banking and howthey need to be aware of that.
So do you...
Meghan Smallwood (06:36):
Right.
Patrick Cadigan (06:36):
...want to touch on that?
Meghan Smallwood (06:38):
Yeah, I think banking is also a very scary
thing, because, you know, whenyou when the students turn 18,
that's really when I think thatcomes to fruition. Because if
they're receiving SSI, where isthis money going to go? Some of
them have never had a cat anaccount to themselves. You know,
I think sometimes parents are alittle nervous about them having
an account in their name, but Ithink having them involved in
(07:01):
that process and aware of thismoney coming in for them is so
important, especially if youknow, when we've talked about
SSI before and how to increasethe amount you get, you
technically pay rent, they'reaware of that they're paying
their portion to live in ahouse, Just like any other
individual over 18 without adisability may be doing if they
(07:24):
move back home, or they're goingout and living in an apartment.
So I think the little thingsthat we just take for granted
and just write off, I mean justincluding them in the
conversation, so they know wherethe money is going, although
they have money coming in, andwhere the money is going, and
what form that everything doescost money. Like I mentioned to
(07:44):
my sister, having a job andgetting a paycheck, I think just
going over what that means whenthey get it. Some of our
students, I know that would geta paycheck, and they'd get all
excited, and then they'd see,well, why didn't I get all my
money? You know, explaining tothem that they're paying taxes
and there's money being takenout. So you may think you're
going to get X amount, but whenyou actually get your paycheck,
(08:05):
it's not so that helps with thebudgeting aspect as well. I
think that having a bank accountthat they could access, like we
talked about using a debit card,making them aware of not
overspending, being sure thatthey know how much they have to
spend, and staying within thatrange. And also the differences
(08:27):
between that and a credit card.
You know, I know, when I wasyoung and first had a credit
card, I was like, Oh, great,free money. You know, I don't
have to pay this right now. Soagain, just being sure, as basic
as it can be, you know that theymight need to know you still
have to pay for this, you stillhave to budget, and that's still
(08:48):
going to be your money.
Patrick Cadigan (08:52):
Again, kind of knowing those little
differences.
Meghan Smallwood (08:54):
Yeah, and you know something, I remember going
over a lot with students, it wasjust the difference between
necessities and luxuries, thatcan be a hard concept, too,
because, you know, we seesomething that we really want
and we're fixated on it, justexplaining to them, okay, that's
nice, but it's not somethingthat we need. However, we can
(09:15):
practice saving up for an item,and that's something the parents
can also do at home. You know,if the the house needs to buy a
new TV, they can be involved inthe process of, okay, we're
going to save the money up.
Let's look and compare prices.
Let's see what the better dealis. And just, you know, making
them involved so that theyunderstand a little better.
Patrick Cadigan (09:36):
Yeah, that sounds really good. And with
that, this has been a relativelyshort conversation, even though
we try to keep our discussionsshort, but these are really
designed and intended to start aconversation within families and
and we hope that that this ishelping just a little bit. I
(09:59):
think I can speak for Meghan,when we say that we're really
looking forward to getting backto kind of like a more regular
schedule and health. And umm...
Meghan Smallwood (10:08):
Yeah.
Patrick Cadigan (10:09):
But boy, oh boy.
Meghan Smallwood (10:11):
I do like these topics, though, and I
think it is great for familiesto think about these things, and
even if it just, you know,plants the seed, talk to other
people, find out what they mightbe doing for their child or, you
know, young adult with adisability. It just helps to get
you thinking
Patrick Cadigan (10:26):
Yeah, and always keep in mind that there
are links in the show notes tothe things that we discuss and
some resources that we think wecould that can be helpful. So
yeah, just because theconversation is short doesn't
mean that there's not more todive into and look into.
Meghan Smallwood (10:41):
Right. And we're always happy to continue
the conversation about thesetopics in later times too.
Patrick Cadigan (10:46):
Sounds good.
All right. Well, thankseverybody, and we will catch up
with you soon.
Meghan Smallwood (10:51):
All right, thank you.
As always, you'll find links tothe information from our
conversations in our show notes.
We would love for theinformation from this and all
our other discussions to reachas many families as possible,
(11:11):
and we need your help to dothat. You can find our
conversations atwww.p2transition.com, like,
follow, share out the podcast.
Our conversations are posted toall the major platforms,
including Apple podcasts,Spotify, YouTube music, and
that's just naming a few. Soplease share and share often.
Patrick Cadigan (11:32):
Please check out our YouTube channel. We've
done some of the legwork for youby curating videos of topics
that revolve around transition.
We have playlists forguardianship, alternatives to
guardianship ABLE accounts, andthere's more to come, so please
be sure to subscribe there aswell. And finally, check out our
website, which is full ofinformation and links to
resources around the transitionprocess. Open your web browser
(11:53):
of choice and surf towww.postsecondarytransition.com
we thank you so much for thetime that you've spent with us,
and look forward to talkingagain soon.
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com