146 - Exploring Nostalgia and New Beginnings: Fantastic Four, Jurassic World Rebirth, and Captain America's Next Chapter - The Project Infinite Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's the Infinite.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
Podcast.
Go tell your friends, it's theInfinite Podcast.
My journey never ends.
It's the Infinite Podcast withRob and Kork the Cube.
Hello everybody and welcome toanother episode of the Project
Infinite Podcast, the podcastcovering the infinite and

(00:23):
ever-expanding multiverse offandom, from movies, comics, tv
shows, video games.
We've got you covered.
I'm Rob.
I'm here, as always with Court,and Court thought we were going
to be talking about theFantastic Four next week because
we thought we were getting itduring the Super Bowl and we
probably still will yeah, we'llget something.

Speaker 1 (00:42):
We'll get a little something.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
But we got the fantastic four trailer this week
right um, with a big, um, bigthing, where they were just like
hey, I see what you did therethey're like watch out, the
trailer's coming tomorrow at 7am.
There's gonna be a big thing andeveryone's gonna be there and
they're gonna do a big, bigbutton push and then they're
gonna show the trailer and it'sit feels like a big deal and it,
and it is a big deal there, andthey're going to do a big
button push and then they'regoing to show the trailer and it

(01:06):
feels like a big deal.
And it is a big deal because,as we're going to talk about in
a little bit, the trailer wasreally, really impressive.
It was incredible.

Speaker 1 (01:16):
It was outstanding, not only the sell of this
trailer but the sell of thesecharacters, and it doesn't even
feel like it's a sell.
It feels like they are family.
It feels like you know the cellof these characters and it
doesn't even feel like it's acell.
It feels like they are family,it feels like you know them.
There's somebody made a goodpoint If there's there's this
nostalgic overlay over this, oflike this feels correct and
familiar.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
It's everything that that has been kind of rumored
and has been, you know not,maybe not promised, maybe, maybe
maybe someone promised itsomewhere that I that I can't
recall.
But, um, this idea that thismovie was going to be truly
different from from any otheroffering in the mcu, um, to this
point, um, and I think thetrailer has delivered on that
promise, um, and we also got ajurassic rebirth, uh, rebirth

(01:57):
that was called yes yeah, I gota final fantasy on the brain.
Um, yeah, jurassic world rebirthtrailer that we also thought we
were going to get during theSuper Bowl, but these, you know,
just getting ahead of it andour main topic of discussion
this week, obviously CaptainAmerica Brave New World is
coming out next week.
So we're going to take a strolland just kind of talk about Sam

(02:20):
Wilson and the MCU and whatkind of I don't want to say
justifies this movie, becausethat sounds demeaning, but just
kind of like you know, maybepeople just don't realize kind
of the arc that Sam has gone onand really how important he is
to the greater kind of MCU andreally what a great character he

(02:41):
is, from his inception inCaptain America, the Winter
Soldier to now where he'sstarring in his own Captain
America movie, which I think iskind of a unique arc for any of
these MCU characters.
We haven't really seen thatShuri comes to mind, but also
Shuri was only in two moviesbefore Black Panther 2.

(03:04):
Sherb is only in two moviesbefore Black Panther 2.
So Sam has really, you know, asfar as like a mantle passing
type of deal, um, which we'vedone an episode on mantle
passing before, but Sam isreally the only one so far.
That's kind of.
We've seen him from Inceptionto where he was just a guy in
the military, to being Falcon,to being Captain America, which
I think is a really, really coolarc for him.

(03:24):
So, um, we'll talk about samand as we bleed into a new world
, but first we do have some news, starting, of course, with
odyssey casting.
Um, I didn't.
I was, I was skeptical thatthis was going to become like
another bit, like anotheroppenheimer thing.
Sure, um, and I guess it justis that every week we're gonna
get, we're gonna get castinguntil this movie is made.

(03:45):
Um, so we got a, a, a, aPentagon of of castings over the
last week.
So we're, we're filling inthose.
You know, these are going to beobviously the, the actors you
know big name, decent, namedactors, um, that will probably
be filling.
You know, kind of like the theJack Quaid role in Oppenheimer,
where they're.
You know, kind of like the thejack quaid role in oppenheimer,
where they're you know, they'regood names, that like you're

(04:06):
like, oh, hey, that person, andthen they'll be in the movie for
maybe like a minute or two, um,and then keep it moving, um so
what are the directors doing?
it like that I know it's, it's,it's.
I told you, when you know wetalked about burn ball last week
, like it just feels likenolan's gravitas, where, like
you you know, elliot Page, forexample, who got cast in this
can can star in his own thingand but Nolan calls and you're

(04:31):
like sure, I'll do two minutes.

Speaker 1 (04:34):
Of course.
Of course, there's there'shistory there.
Yeah, there's history, which isamazing.

Speaker 2 (04:38):
But yeah, so Elliot Page is, the is the first one.
Hamish Patel.

Speaker 1 (04:43):
Yep as well, my favorite character from Tenet.
He's not going to drive a 747into a building, right?
Why not Question mark?
He does the same thing in thismovie.
The same exact thing.

Speaker 2 (04:57):
With a horse cart or a boat.

Speaker 1 (04:59):
A horse cart would be .
No, the boat would be thefunniest thing.
That would be incredible.
You're not going to.
He said Odysseus says you'renot going to.

Speaker 2 (05:09):
Why not John Leguizamo?
Famed character actor JohnLeguizamo has been cast in this
movie.

Speaker 1 (05:15):
That's my second favorite casting so far, because
I just believe they just raninto each other on the street in
LA and they're just like youwouldn't want to be in my movie,
right.

Speaker 2 (05:22):
Yeah, it's like you wouldn't want to be in my movie,
right?
Yeah, it's like sure.

Speaker 1 (05:27):
Benny Safdie obviously is coming back.
He's starting to really rack upregulars.

Speaker 2 (05:31):
Yeah, yeah, which is cool.

Speaker 1 (05:34):
When James Gunn does it, people have a problem and
then the crocodile hunter, SteveIrwin.
No no.

Speaker 2 (05:40):
Has been resurrected.
He's back.
He's going to wrangle theSphinx.
Oh boy, Look at this beautyhere.

Speaker 1 (05:47):
She's going to be real gentle-like here.

Speaker 2 (05:50):
You think the Sphinx is vicious, but you just got to
answer a riddle, odysseus, I'mkidding, it's not Steve Irwin,
it's Bill Irwin who is the.

Speaker 1 (05:58):
Long-lost cousin of Steve Irwin no no, just kidding.

Speaker 2 (06:01):
no, no, just kidding um voiced um.
What's the character ininterstellar?
uh tars, yes yes, so the voiceof tars he should still play
tars in this movie um, joiningthe long, long, long list of
casting for the odyssey,obviously starring tom holland

(06:21):
and many, many others.
Um, so again, yeah, like I said, we're we're running this movie
.
I feel I I do enjoy this bitthat we're doing.
We did it with abenheimer.
We're doing this because italso makes like before you know
what the movie will be out.
We're like remember when we didthat bit with all the casting,
and now the movie's here, um, soI think that's great.
Um, and, as always, we're gonnafind fewer and fewer things to

(06:45):
say about this movie until weactually see some things from it
other than just keeping thisbit going as long as people keep
getting cast.
So, and then more news todaythat came out there is a live
action Gundam movie happening.

Speaker 1 (07:02):
I don't even know how to even begin to think about
this.
You know what's insane?
I watched Pacific Rim two daysago.

Speaker 2 (07:08):
Yeah, so this is Obviously this can work.
It is being co-produced betweenBandai, namco and Legendary, so
that's pretty great, and thedirector is Jim Mickle who wrote
and directed Sweet Tooth.
Hmm, I mean, as Pacific Rimshows, I think this can work.

(07:28):
Just big giant robots fightingeach other, I think people are
in.
I think, having theco-production of Legendary, who
obviously have experience inthis realm with Godzilla vs Kong
, of just big romps with giantcreatures, um, I think it can be

(07:48):
cool.
Obviously, anime adaptationsare hit or miss, um, but gundam
is uniquely suited for a liveaction adaptation.
Yeah, as opposed to, like youknow, like a dragon ball, or I
mean one piece pulled it off.
One piece is on netflix is verypopular, um, as a live action
adaptation.
So, um, just giving big giantrobots fighting each other, and

(08:09):
I think we'll have a fun timeput ben mendelsohn in this for
some reason, sure, yeah?
I'd be in on that.
Put a I don't know.
I was gonna say, just put thepeople that are in pacific
remember movie.
Today we are canceling thechocolate.
Idris Elba, what's his name inthose?
Stacker Pentecost yeah, stackerPentecost, that's an all-timer.

(08:29):
It's up there.
One of these days we'll do anepisode on just like all-time,
just fictional character namesin movies.

Speaker 1 (08:35):
General Quaritch is up there.

Speaker 2 (08:37):
Quaritch is up there, but man Stacker, Pentecost is
just Apollo Creed's up there.
Apollo Creed is definitely upthere.
That's iconic BlackAgar-Boltagon.

Speaker 1 (08:48):
That's not a yeah, it's not a movie character.
But yeah, what do you mean?
He was in my favorite, theMultiverse of the Madnesses.
Wanda, look over there.
I wouldn't do that if I were.
You Don't be rash, yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:05):
So I think a Gundam live action movie can absolutely
work, but it can alsocompletely bomb.
That's the fun thing aboutthese anime adaptations it feels
like you can't have a decentanime adaptation.
You know what I mean.
It's either great to good, likeOne Piece, or it's Dragon.

Speaker 1 (09:22):
Ball Evolution.
Well, if I really want to makesome points about no, I'm
kidding.

Speaker 2 (09:28):
Or it's the Last Airbender that one hurt me
personally.
Yeah, yeah, speaking of thingsthat are hurting us.
Personally, the Sandman, yeah,man, I don't want to touch too
much on the Neo game and stuff.
It's horrifying.
It is horrifying.
You know someone, you know, I,I openly admit, on this podcast

(09:51):
I admitted, you know I lovedGaiman's work.
Um, the Sandman is one of myfavorite stories of all time and
the things that you know, it'sbeen documented that he and his
wife, most horrifyingly enough,have been, have been accused of,
and a lot of this stuff hasbeen confirmed as just
horrifying and it completelycheckers my view on a writer and

(10:12):
an artist that I have had greatrespect and admiration for, and
I just don't have that respectand admiration for him anymore.
I just don't.
So, coming off the back of that, and then I mean I think there
is some legitimacy to the ideathat they were just going to end
this after two seasons anyway.
Um, so the same man will beending after two seasons.

(10:32):
Um, basically, netflixbasically said, like this show
was always conceptualized, youknow, around dream story and
dream story will conclude inseason two, and that's it.
Um, you and Dream Story willconclude in season two and
that's it.
You know, it sucks because thatfirst season of Sandman is so
incredible and we, you know,unfortunately, we lauded the

(10:57):
inclusion of Neil Gaiman in thatprocess of putting together
that first season and, like Isaid, just everything that has
come out about him and his wifeand the things that he's been
involved in when it comes to,you know, the sex abuse and
everything, just again, it justit, really, you know, not just
stings on that kind of level butalso just like as a person,

(11:17):
just the victims of everythingthat that he's been accused of,
is just it's, it's heartbreakingand and not heartbreaking for
me, it's heartbreaking for thevictims, you know, like you know
, it's not one of those thingswhere, like I was hurt by this,
no, like it sucks for sure, butlike I'm not hurt by this, Like
I'm not physically oremotionally affected by this.
You know, obviously the victimsare who, you know, we need to

(11:44):
rally around and defend and bethere for and it just sucks that
you know, unfortunately, thisreally, really brilliant piece
of work that you know, thehorrifying thing about it and
everything that's happened withNeil Gaiman is he wrote to a lot
of these things, you know, andwas an outspoken kind of

(12:04):
defender of the feministmovement and all that stuff and
for him to turn around in hispersonal life and be nothing
short of the monster that he's,the monsters that he's depicted
in his works, is just really,really awful.
I mean, I don't really I don'tknow what else to say.
Um, I didn't really want to getinto, like, the neil gaiman

(12:27):
side of it.
I just kind of wanted to talkabout sandman ending, but just,
it's impossible to ignore, it'simpossible to not talk about um.
So, yeah, I mean, you know, I,I, I hope that I can still watch
this show without feeling anytype of just ickiness about it.
Um, cause I do, I did so enjoythat show and it's still one of

(12:49):
my favorite stories, you know,irregardless of all the
horrifying stuff.
You know, I had no way, shape orform, wanted to make it seem
like I'm endorsing Neil Gaimanby watching this.
It's just, it's unfortunate,it's just really really
unfortunate.
Um, so watching this, it's justit's unfortunate, it's just

(13:09):
really really unfortunate.
Um, so that's that on sandmanand all that stuff.
Um, so try to, we show wesoldier on um to jurassic world
rebirth.
So we got a trailer for thejurassic world continuation
directed by gareth edwards.
Um channel channel favoritegareth edwards, and I will say
this trailer has the GarethEdwards sauce to it.

Speaker 1 (13:26):
Yeah it's got the finish.
I mean now you're playing inthe realm where, like, because
Gareth Edwards, obviously he'shad some incredible actors under
his belt, but I mean now you'renow he's got Mahershala Ali,
now he's got Scarlett Johansson.
So I love the enhancement kindof his.
His repertoire with all thesegreat actors are really starting
to come, come to fruition.
Not that he hasn't worked withincredible actors yet, but I'm

(13:48):
talking more like mainstreamblockbuster as well too.
So that that makes me happy aswell.
And I mean there's a finish tothis movie that feels very
Gareth Edwards, that's very true.
So how do we feel about thisplot?
How do we feel?
Um?

Speaker 2 (14:02):
I mean, how do we feel um?
I mean it feels very jurassicworldy, like I don't really.

Speaker 1 (14:06):
It feels very by the numbers and I think that was by
design to like in a weird way, Ifeel like the idea is like let
gareth cook for himself, let thecast be the cast, like.
The movie's positioning is alsointeresting because you're two
weeks before superman, so likeyou only have this tight window
to really get everything rampedup and going.
So I think the simplicity is agood thing, like don't overtly

(14:30):
make anything too, you know,controversial or too like
nothing too insane.
Just not necessarily by thebooks, because I wouldn't ever
call gareth edwards by, or Iwould never call him by the
books, I mean from godzilla, andhe's already taken these
franchises.
Like I think about this all thetime.
I rewatched all the monstermovies.
So, starting with 2014,godzilla.
If you look at the newestGodzilla Kong movie and you look

(14:53):
at that Godzilla movie, you'relike what happened?
Like what happened to the art.
So that, for Gareth Edwards,makes me very happy and very
optimistic.
That doesn't matter what hedoes.
The creator obviously was ahuge hit for the fact of the way
that he shot that movie and forthe source material as well too
, and it got even more, you know, prominent as the last months
came on too.
But I just it's for me it's ingareth edwards.

Speaker 2 (15:16):
We trust, and I think the studios also know that too
yep, and I think he can, becausehe did this with godzilla in
2014.

Speaker 1 (15:23):
He can restore the horror element, not only the
horror element, but he canrestore, like the there's a
realism overlay that he has.
He added on rogue one, heobviously added on the creator,
but like he just has this likereal world feel to the way that
he makes movies, and I mean toyour point, godzilla is the one

(15:44):
where you're like, wow, thisfeels like an actual film, this
doesn't feel like a Godzillamovie, this feels like a horror
movie, this feels like thehorror of nature type of movie.

Speaker 2 (15:55):
And he has a great feel for scale.
Obviously it's one of hisbiggest strengths and he has a
great feel for the looming youalways talk about.
It's not the bang, it's theanticipation of the bang, and
he's mastered that, whether it'sGodzilla Just look at these
films that he's directed right.
Godzilla 2014, obviously it'sGodzilla Rogue One, it's the

(16:18):
Death Star, it's the impending.

Speaker 1 (16:21):
It's the weight, it's the size of the Death Star.

Speaker 2 (16:23):
Yeah, and the creator ?
It's Nomad.
Yeah, we were just talkingabout that earlier, like it's
one of the most it does.
It doesn't speak, it's not amonster, it's just this looming
thing in the sky that, when yousee it, it done.

Speaker 1 (16:36):
I really love gareth edwards sound design too the way
that he uses sound to hisadvantage, like you're talking
about an advanced levelfilmmaker that has a lot of
respect from a lot of people inhollywood as well too.
So I'm glad to see maher shahlee back as well too.
Yep, um, I think scarlettjohansson is a very good choice,
just to lead the movie as welltoo.
Like I said, the point of whereyou're positioning this movie,
like you're, once july 11th hitslike it's, it's gonna be kind

(17:00):
of over for the rest of themovie landscape until, like, the
oscar season's roll around inoctober, like that's gonna be
the true penance of this year.
So to get your and I'm talkingabout this like, if this isn't
jurassic world, you know what Imean like the jurassic franchise
.
So to sneak this movie not tosneak it, but to sneak this
movie in july 2nd genius.
Like, get this right beforeit's too late, but it's still

(17:21):
fresh in the minds and peopleare like or you might get the
people that are like I hatesuperhero movies, let's go see
Jurassic, you know what I mean.
Like you might still get somepeople in there.

Speaker 2 (17:28):
And Gareth Edwards has this ability.
You know, and it feels like itfelt like for a little bit,
especially with the last one,that these Jurassic movies were
veering into, that Kong vsGodzilla, fast and Furious,
furious, like kind of romp typemovies.
And what makes the originaljurassic park movie so
successful is that thrillerhorror, you know thing, where,

(17:53):
like, the dinosaurs aren't toooverexposed and then suddenly
the freaking velociraptor comesout of the shadows and that's
what I feel like gareth ed isgoing to bring that Gareth
Edwards sauce.
You can feel it?
Yeah, 100%.
The latest Jurassic ones, likethe Chris Pratt-led ones, were
very action-heavy.

(18:13):
Yep, dinosaurs fightingdinosaurs.

Speaker 1 (18:16):
It was a product of its time.
Yeah, and guess what movie theywere trying to chase a lot in
there.
Gareth Edwards' Godzilla had alot of implications for a lot of
things in Hollywood after that,whether people want to admit
that or not.

Speaker 2 (18:27):
Yeah, you think he looks at Godzilla now and he's
like what have I done?

Speaker 1 (18:30):
What happens to the game I love?
He's allegorical Oppenheimer.
Like what have I done Becausein that 2014, Godzilla was in it
for?
Like what's the screen timefive, four or five minutes.
Yeah, total in like a two, two,ten, two, fifteen.
And it's great, oh that I, I.
One day we're gonna have toreview that movie specifically,
because that movie is anabsolute gem.

(18:52):
Yeah, it's a perfect example oflike how to make me care about
human characters that Ishouldn't, because you made
godzilla a force of nature yep,yep 100.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
So, yeah, I mean, I'm really.
We talked for a while as soonas, as soon as as soon as it got
announced that he was attachedto this jurassic project.
Um, we were both really, reallyexcited because I, I guess I
just I just didn't think, Idon't know, I guess I didn't
think he was gonna do like a bigbudget, like franchise movie
again.
Yeah, I just thought he wasjust kind of like gonna be doing

(19:23):
off, doing his own stuff, or doyou think?

Speaker 1 (19:25):
the studio went to him and well, yeah, I think so
like hey, like we've seen whatyou've done with rogue one, like
I think hollywood's clear likethe people are clamoring for
like more quote-unquote cinemaand blockbusters and we're gonna
talk about that in a little bitwe want to return jurassic park
to proper scary jurassic parkum and scale and what's better

(19:46):
at scale and and spectacle thanyou know, than the lord and
savior himself, steven spielberg.

Speaker 2 (19:52):
So yes, I'm really, I'm really looking forward to it
, um, so that's fun.
It's a fun cute little jurassicjurassic world movie.
But the cute little um, we, aswe said up top, got a trailer
for fantastic four first steps.
Um, and wow, um, I just I thismovie.

(20:13):
This movie has the thing right,the thing that, like you watch,
you know you watch, I'm fromthis is that movie.
You know, kind of likeOppenheimer I'm not comparing
the two, but from Inception tocasting, it's checking all the
boxes of something that's trulyspecial.

(20:34):
Is it going to win an Oscar?
No, but is it something thatcan be special within the
confines of the superhero genre?
Yes, I think so.
And, like I said, it's checkingall the boxes from Inception,
when were like we're marvel'sthe mcu, we're doing the
fantastic four, we're setting itin the 60s, it's gonna be, I
don't think.
I don't think at the time weeven knew it was going to be
like a retrofuturism no not yet.

(20:55):
I think.
We just knew it was going to bein the 60s.
We thought it might have takenplace in the past.
Um and john watts wasassociated with it.

Speaker 1 (21:03):
John Watts was going to direct it.
They had the whole Marvel panelat the D 23.
Like he was going to directthis movie and people thought
first like okay, good, includingmyself.

Speaker 2 (21:12):
Like good, like he's got a good.
You know, he's got a goodhandle on classic Spider-Man.

Speaker 1 (21:18):
He's got a good hand, he's got a good handle.

Speaker 2 (21:19):
He's already directed a trilogy with a legacy
character Um, you know the mcu,they're gonna do the fantastic
four justification, like they'regonna do it right.
Um, and then, like it kind ofwent dark for a while and we
were like what's going on withthis fans?
We didn't have a cast for thelongest time um to the point.

Speaker 1 (21:39):
It had been like weeks of like every reporting
outlets, like we have to cast,and we were like no, you don't.
No, you don't just kidding?

Speaker 2 (21:45):
no, you don't.
And then this is the pointwhere Matt Shackman steps in.
And then we find out it'staking place in the 60s, but
it's going to be a retrofuturism60s.

Speaker 1 (21:56):
And that's where you, that's where my wheels started
turning and I'm like, oh, thiscould be really cool so at first
I was like, okay, shackman'shere, and then you start to
think about what Shackman's done, right, yeah, game of Thrones.

Speaker 2 (22:09):
Which I just found this out Yep Succession.
He directed one of my favoriteepisodes of Game of Thrones ever
Succession.

Speaker 1 (22:16):
Game of Thrones, mad Men, mad Men Like Mad Men might
be the most like.
This might be a mixture, not amixture of Mad Men and
WandaVision, but you know he'sgot a handle.
The best thing about sayingthis, that's a versatile
filmmaker.
If you look at the landscape, acouple of those things are not
alike each other at all,absolutely at all.

Speaker 2 (22:36):
Yeah, and then obviously he was the writer and
director of WandaVision, whichis, to this day, probably the
most unique thing that Marvel'sdone, oh, 100%.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
Until probably this movie that's coming out and I
don't even want to label it asunique.
I want to label it as almostlike this I love the take.
The take is super specialbecause it's the take.
But what does Court always say?
Court talks behind the scenes.
It's the fact that they were.
They tested the Panavisioncameras, like they were.

(23:07):
They.
They said like, and then youget the thing at the bottom,
like, presented by fantasticvision.
I loved it.
They.
They did a whole launch as ifthey were doing a sixties.
Like what Marvel movie is doingthis?
Like I've never seen a Marvelmovie.
This not only does it feel soseparate, like you said it
before, we had like.
This feels like an actual filmyeah, so he's attached to it.

Speaker 2 (23:28):
And then again to your point, like the casting
thing, forever it was.
We didn't know who the cast was.
Then it was confirmed, likethis was locked in.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
Well, we had the cinema cast, because there was a
time where it was like, well,it's locked in.
They got marta, robbie and adamdriver and we were like, okay,
that's good.
Okay, I was, I was happy withthat, I was very happy.

Speaker 2 (23:51):
I was like I, I you know it was getting reported by
like reputable sources, and I itfelt so crazy that, like I kind
of didn't believe it though,but I was like, all right, I
gotta I gotta see this whichbugged you more?

Speaker 1 (24:04):
I have one that bugged me more about the two of
them.
It was adam driver that buggedme more.
That I couldn't yeah, because Ido think margot robbie would
have done this yeah, I think sheI think she probably would have
she did the suicide squad well,the suicide squad was
incredible.

Speaker 2 (24:20):
It was but she also did the first one, oh, shoot
anywho.
And then we got basically whatturned out to be this cast with
one adjustment.
Yes, so it was Matt Smith,vanessa Kirby, eben Moss,
bacharach and Joseph Quinn andeveryone was like okay, I think
the Joseph Quinn one was the onethat people were like.

Speaker 1 (24:41):
Including myself.
I take ownership and blame,including myself.
I said it, I take ownership andblame including myself.

Speaker 2 (24:46):
I said it, I wasn't a fan, to your credit.
Also, the one that you weremost excited for was the Evan
Moss back rock casting.
Yes, um, and I think going intothis, and then, and then, and
then, and then.
I remember specifically wherewe were.
Yes, we were both at work.
I think I came to you first andI said did you see the
Fantastic Four thing?
And you said no, and I saidPedro Pascal is Reed Richards.

Speaker 1 (25:09):
And I was behooved.

Speaker 2 (25:12):
I'm learning this and then that got the internet in a
frenzy.
He's too overexposed.
He's too this.
He's too that you know whatelse.
He is A really good actor.
I think that gets lost in allthe stuff that he does.
Let's rip too overexposed.
He's too this.
He's too that you know whatelse.
He is a really good actor.
I think that gets lost in allthe stuff that he does let's rip
into this then.

Speaker 1 (25:28):
Yes, just let's rip into this.
I mean, I, I and too and I alsosaid I wasn't I never not been
sold on pedro pascal.
It was him as reed richardsthat I questioned a bit.
As soon as he opened his mouthin this trailer, I said, oh yeah
, that's actually Reed Richards,but it's Reed Richards, as if

(25:49):
he wasn't 19.
Like, that's him, and you madean incredible point.
He's hiding himself.
That's not Reed, right there.

Speaker 2 (25:56):
Yeah, we segue.
So we segue from all thisbackstory into the trailer
itself.
And it just opens with thisJetsons-type retro-futuristic
60s.
The score.

Speaker 1 (26:10):
The score Michael Cicchino's score.
The score is just, he's done itagain?

Speaker 2 (26:14):
Do they just do the thing if?

Speaker 1 (26:15):
they do a spinoff from this.
If they do a Johnny spinoffwith Spider-Man, they have to
let his son do the score.
Is that how that works?
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (26:22):
So we open up.
We.
Is that how that works?
Yeah, um.
So we open up, we get vanessakirby a sue storm bringing
people into the baxter buildingum, and then you get to your
point and to my point, the pedropascal reed richards of of.
He's very george jetson, he'svery william shatner from star
trek, he's very proper and he'slike we have dinner at seven
every every sunday.

Speaker 1 (26:42):
He has the he.
He's the only one that has thebit of the 60s.
Yeah, dash to it.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
But to my point, every time you hear him speak in
this trailer besides when he'stalking to sue and you know in
the in the middle of the trailerhe's doing pr, essentially for
the fantastic four, becauseagain, another bit of brilliant
writing in this story.

Speaker 1 (27:03):
They are already the fantastic four not only are they
the fantastic, they are famous,they're famous.
What really sells me on this,it's the coupling of that with
like having this backdrop oflike what happened on the I know
what happened on the mission,but I'm sitting here like what
happened on this mission.
But it's insane that I'mtethered to this thing, like

(27:23):
them up.
I mean, when they talked aboutthis movie, like the preliminary
at Comic-Con, they talked aboutlike hey, like we watched
Apollo.
Like the first thing we did waswe all watched Apollo 13
together, we all watched ittogether.
Like that was one of the biginspirations from this.
You see it in the trailer.
Like the found not the foundfootage, but like like the
archival 1960s documentariantype of.

(27:44):
You know, I have a theory as towhy it looks like that and what
they're trying to do, and Ithink it's your kids, marty,
it's your kids.
Um, I think matt shackmanwatched after sun and he took
the whole inspiration to do itlike this.

Speaker 2 (27:57):
But this is special and then, yeah, so we get, we
get redoing the whole.
We have dinner at 7 everySunday, no matter what Yep, and
then we get the introduction ofBen Grimm.

Speaker 1 (28:11):
We see him, they did not hide it, and that's when I
knew they weren't playing gameswhen they immediately showed him
.

Speaker 2 (28:17):
They immediately showed him.
Evan Boss Macarack already Ifeel is going to be the heart of
this movie.
I think he's going to be themuch you know.
You can ha-ha it all you want.
The emotional core of thatoriginal Fantastic Four movie is
Ben Grimm.
Michael Chiklis is Ben Grimm.
He has the most quote-unquotetragedy associated with him and

(28:38):
it feels like they're going tolean into that.
But we get just this incrediblycharming scene with him cooking
dinner with herbie and it'sjust ebon boss back rack at his
best.
Um, added a clove of garlic.
That because it wasn't good,just because I wanted to add a
little more zip, and I'm like,all right, um the ben the ben.
Grim design, so phenomenal.

(28:59):
I don't understand how peopleare unhappy with this design and
I think I have a theory on whypeople are unhappy with it and I
think it's because it looks toocomic book accurate and it
makes people unsettled.
I think this thing design isuncanny, valley of levels of
accurate and it makes peopleuneasy.
He looks just like the thing,like he was ripped out of a

(29:24):
comic book page Literally.
Kirby's the thing.
It's crazy Like that characterin that movie does not look like
he should be moving or doingthings with real people.
It's that good, and I thinkthat just makes people very
unsettled.
Because it took me a second tosettle into it.

Speaker 1 (29:44):
I think also I was surprised because I didn't know
what to think.
Going into this trailer, likewhat they were going to show,
and that was this was one of thepoints that I told you before
we hopped on that I reallyappreciated.
I said, hey, they're going forit like this is the fantastic
four.
Like they're not, like they'renot josh tranking it and be like
we've got to hide things.
No, no, no.
Like even if it was an originstory and they had to.

(30:04):
Like give me everything.
Give me the robot.
Give me the robot.
Give me Ben Grimm in a bigFantastic Four sweater.
Give me Johnny jumping off theledge.
Flame on immediately.

Speaker 2 (30:14):
Also, can we talk about that spot for a second Dog
, the dust kicking up onto thecamera?

Speaker 1 (30:20):
The lens flares Because they shot this with
anamorphic lenses.
They're making a movie.
Yeah, that scene where Ben'swalking in his comic-accurate
trench coat.

Speaker 2 (30:31):
Yeah, we get sad, bad Grim and the Ten.

Speaker 1 (30:33):
He looks like Bear Bryant.

Speaker 2 (30:35):
Except Raphael from the Ninja Turtles movie.
Come on man, yeah, we got sadbad Grim and the Ten trench coat
, which is another great shot ofagain public relations.

Speaker 1 (30:45):
Reeded richards, talking, you know, talking about
this is the best pilot I knowthat's looking you and like I
love how unapologetic like it isevan moss bachrock, like it's
just him, it's just him beinghim, yeah, and then they cut.

Speaker 2 (30:58):
That's such an incredible casting, oh my god
then they cut to sad Ben Grimmbeing like I'm ugly, I'm a rock,
I'm a big ugly rock man.
And then we just get variousshots of things while Sue's
doing a big voiceover.
Invisible Woman looks great.
They're doing, they're goingthe light reflecting route with

(31:21):
her powers.
It's the light that basicallycauses her invisibility.
She doesn't just flame on, thatbasically causes her
invisibility.
She doesn't just flame on,flame off with the invisibility.
Um, they actually have like ascience to it which I think is
going to be an important part ofthis movie.
Like, I think the science bitis going to be important.
You know we see reed doing abig drawing on a chalkboard.
Yep, um, and I, I like I toldyou that's.

(31:41):
That's the only shot in thistrailer where you see the real
Reed Richards and it's,coincidentally enough, where you
don't see him speak.

Speaker 1 (31:47):
You see him twice, in my opinion.
You see him there and you seehim when he's holding Sue.
That's the two times you seehim when he's holding, like
because he truthfully does lovehim.
He just thinks he can outsmartthe love and he's cold, and that
was the thing thing.
I hope they don't shy away fromthat and I think I don't think
they're going to be.
Neither I think they're gonnalet them be like hey, I have to

(32:07):
be this way and then, once theyget there, like she's gonna be
like I love you, but you're ajerk, like you are, you're cold
and like yep, and that's why Ithink the vanessa kirby thing,
like she's the tether, she's thelike she, she's gonna be the
tether.
Yep, because he's reads thebrains like Johnny's really the
soul of this thing.

Speaker 2 (32:25):
Yeah, we don't see a ton of Joseph Quinn in this, but
this is how I know we have themakings of a potentially special
movie.
The careful selection of whenyou see Johnny and what he's
doing and the line he gives,just the high.
But you get it.
You get the character just inthat moment.

(32:46):
He's lounging, he's got theastronaut helmet on, sue walks
in on him and he's like hi, andI'm like, and that immediately,
like it shot me back to StrangerThings, like with Eddie.

Speaker 1 (32:56):
What made him so lovable is that affableness,
that kind of just charmingcharisma, that kind recklessness
that eddie had in strangerthings like I just know that
they saw him in that and werelike we're just gonna do that,
but you're johnny storm well, Ihave an insane theory as to how

(33:17):
you can structure these, becausethe second fantastic four movie
won't come out until aftersecret wars, and rightfully so
right, and then they'll be inthe 616 by that time and they'll
be in the future by that time.
You can plausibly spin this todo this movie as the first one
and it's like you get to coverall the best bases of the
Fantastic Four comics.
What you do is you do thismovie, you set it in the 60s,

(33:37):
like it's Jack Kirby and StanLee doing this, and then you
shoot post Secret Wars to the616 and you have you do you do a
nihilist?
Like you build up to like forjoseph quinn specifically, he
has just like stranger things.
I think he's gonna do theheroic sacrifice.
It won't, we're not gonna seethis for years, but that's what

(33:58):
you need to build to like he'sthat dumb kid, but like that's
his heart.
Like his heart is like I.
I know I'm, I'm rash and I'mlike dumb, but like I still love
you guys and like I loveFranklin and I love that I, I
love this earth.
Yep, like I will stillsacrifice you.
Like you.
It's again like it's a.
It's funny enough, like they inthe Tim Story ones.

(34:22):
He's like I'm not just thisdumb, I have something, I have a
little something special, andunfortunately he had to
sacrifice himself to show it.
So I hope they get there.
I hope they get there, but youset the next two in the future
and you just do Hickman's run.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
And that's the thing that we also didn't see in this
trailer is, we do know that thekids are in this movie.

Speaker 1 (34:41):
We don't not know, because they've been very coy
about it, especially to thepoint where they were talking in
the interviews and VanessaKirby's like I guess you're just
going to have to watch them eattheir parents.
By this time they're parents.

Speaker 2 (34:54):
Yeah, and then we get some, like I said, we get some
great action shots ofConspicuous by its absence.
Are the powers of Mr Fantastic?
Um, theories as to why?
No, I think they might just besaving it.
I think they're saving it, yeah, because it's the hardest.
It's the hardest one to pulloff.

Speaker 1 (35:15):
Um it's so hard to go and Griffin you own Griffin can
actually just do that.

Speaker 2 (35:19):
It's it's the hardest one to make look good and pull
off, and I think they're just.
Maybe they're still working onit, maybe they're just hiding it
, um, but I think it's it's thehardest effect to pull off out
of all of them.
So I think they're just, Ithink they're just hiding it, um
, and letting it, letting itcook a little bit before it's
ready to, to uncork itself andlike I said the I've said this

(35:40):
before talking about reedrichards.

Speaker 1 (35:41):
Reed richards, true power isn't the stretch.
No, his power is his mind.
Like that's the true yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
And I think they funny enough, like maybe like to
your point, like about a theoryabout why we didn't see his
powers.
Maybe he doesn't use them a tonin the movie.

Speaker 1 (35:55):
Yeah, and you know what that also accentuates too
the fact of the guilt, the, thathe feels that and he talks
about it in the trailer, whicheven goes further to that point.
He said the last time, like,because what I'm thinking is
whenever they're there, that youknow what they're, probably
before the big third act, like,like, because, again, a theory
that I also have is thatgalactus isn't coming to devour
the planet, he's coming forsomething and if they don't do

(36:17):
it, then he'll devour the planetto kind of get the ball rolling
, like I hey, sorry, but I needyou guys, but I think what he's
saying basically, like the lasttime because he says it the last
time we went up there you knowBen wasn't a rock and like
that's comic, notorious Like hefeels ultimate guilt for turning
his best friend into that.

Speaker 2 (36:34):
And you see it too in the trailer with Sue, and you
see them well.
You see her getting her powersand you see just this brief
moment of him thinking thatshe's dying and you see just
this brief moment of himthinking that she's dying.

Speaker 1 (36:48):
You never get that in the other movies either.
You know, funny enough.
You get that from Miles Tellerbetter than you do from Yohan
Griffin.
Not the actors, but thecharacters.
You get that a little better inFantastic Four.
Funny enough of the guilt thathe feels, to the point where he
exiles himself, essentially.
But man, absolute nail.
I mean.
Uh, we could just go down thelist real quick.
John malkovich is probablyplaying red ghost.

(37:09):
Yep, makes a lot of sense,which is cool.
Um, galactus galactus.

Speaker 2 (37:15):
He's got the big head .
There's no more space clouds tobe had.
He's got the big head.
He's just galactus.
He's just galactus.
Like.
What else are you gonna say?
Like, if I think the thingreveal in the trailer is the
promise of the eventual Galactusreveal, they're like look at
what we did here with the thing,and now here's Galactus.

(37:38):
What do you think we're gonnado with Galactus?
And I think he's gonna lookgreat, Incredible.

Speaker 1 (37:43):
He can shift his mass too, right, galactus?
Yeah, because once heinevitably fights Erisham, he's
going to need to be a lot bigger.

Speaker 2 (37:51):
I just can't wait for the voice oh.

Speaker 1 (37:53):
Inosin's voice.
I can't wait.
That's going to be the truebang of this is Inosin's voice.

Speaker 2 (37:58):
I can't wait.
I can't wait for that, I can'twait.

Speaker 1 (38:09):
We didn can't wait for that.
I can't wait.
We didn't see anything of thesilver surfer in this trailer.
Maybe, maybe they and this islike conspiracy theory I think
they did it on purpose for, likethe nerds, to be like a woman
can't be silver surfer, eventhough in the comics there's a
woman.
That's the silver surfer.
I think maybe they did that onwhich sucks that's.
But, like again, this traileris to focus on the four.
That's what this trailer's todo.

Speaker 2 (38:22):
Yeah, this trailer.

Speaker 1 (38:23):
We always say this all the time about trailers Like
, the trailer needs to tell mewhat the vibe is A teaser
trailer, should be vibe and feel, and this trailer, official
trailer one, should start togive me some story beats, some
plot yep, and this trailer didvibe and feel off the charts.

Speaker 2 (38:40):
I don't know anything about that.
I have my theories.

Speaker 1 (38:41):
I don't know a gosh darn thing about this movie,
truthfully.
I just know that they'reprobably telling this non-linear
.
It's like a recollection, it'sa video recollection of the
events of the first flight.
For a reason, somethingprobably happened.

Speaker 2 (38:54):
You think Galactus destroys the Earth at the end of
this?

Speaker 1 (38:57):
It's either he destroys the Earth or he takes
Franklin with him.

Speaker 2 (39:05):
Because the theory that people have been isolating,
especially in the reed richardsstuff, is that he's working on
the multiversal bridge and thatcould be the conduit of like
reed.

Speaker 1 (39:11):
Richards was able to build this in 1963 with a box of
scrap with a chalkboard with abox of retro futuristic scraps.

Speaker 2 (39:19):
Um.
So the theory is that galactuswill inevitably destroy this
Earth and the Fantastic Fourwill use the multiversal bridge
to escape, which is a prettysound, solid theory.

Speaker 1 (39:31):
I think they get into the main 616.
Obviously, I don't knowanything about the events of.
Well, they're probably going todo the Oatu thing where they're
like hey, the multiverse iscollapsing.

Speaker 2 (39:41):
Men out of time, family out of time.

Speaker 1 (39:44):
Well, it could be like galactus is.
It could truthfully be galactusis trying to like, spare them
like galactus is trying to sparethem the fate of like the
universe.
Galactus is running.
They're trying to spare themthe fate of like the universe
because he knows what'shappening.
He knows what's gonna happenlike what they can play it as is
like galactus already survivedthe multiverse collapse before,
in the previous universe.

Speaker 2 (40:04):
He got out of there.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
I'm trying to save you guys from the horror that is
to come Diltzman NullifierUnless Tiamat's also in that
Earth too.

Speaker 2 (40:16):
Get rekt Galactus.

Speaker 1 (40:17):
That's a comics thing .
He didn't want the celestialexpanse, so he started to eat
the planets and Reed saved himto do that.

Speaker 2 (40:25):
just because, like reed's, like I understand the
bigger picture and everybody'slike that's still murder, friend
um, but yeah, and then we getthe, the big, the big, the suit
reveal, the big suit reveal,fantastic for incredible it,
it's fantastic.
Say it again what are we?

(40:50):
Some type of Fantastic Four?

Speaker 1 (40:52):
What are we?
Some type of Fantastic Foursquad?

Speaker 2 (40:54):
A lesser movie would have said that yeah, no a better
movie.

Speaker 1 (40:57):
Actually would have said that.

Speaker 2 (40:59):
We're the Fantastic Four and these are our first
steps.
He didn't say that, but yeah, Imean, I don't know what else.
What else can we say?

Speaker 1 (41:08):
I, I mean this.
This was just.
It's one of the best trailersI've ever seen.
Big swing, big swing, bigtheory, time, big, all right.
So I need one big theory and Iwould need one massive
overreaction overreaction.

Speaker 2 (41:24):
In the sense of what?

Speaker 1 (41:25):
like it could be anything.
It could be good, bad, ugly,okay, decent, like, just like.
This is my overreaction toanything that's associated with
this movie could be.
The box office could be likethis movie's gonna make three
billion dollars no, no, no, no.

Speaker 2 (41:38):
Um.
Big theory, big theory time.
Um, I don't know if it's somuch of a theory, but I think
we're going to get a Doctor Doomsomething absolutely.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
What better way if this movie truthfully is good,
it'll quiet the people that arelike, well, you just threw that
in the multiverse of madnessdeniers of the Illuminati to be
like.
You can't just throw this inthe throat if they execute it
the way and still keep theintegrity of this film.
Robert Downey Jr showing up andPedro and him and like, if they
execute it the way and stillkeep the integrity of this film,
robert downey jr showing up atthis is like and pedro and him
like immediately already knoweach other, immediate buttheads.

(42:10):
Like and have him be victor atthe point, don't I mean
obviously it'll be dr doom, butlike approach him as victor
first of like.
Like reed, you idiot, you thinkyou're so smart with your
baxter building.
I have a country's dummy.

Speaker 2 (42:23):
Yeah, they need to with Downey, I think is make him
.
They need to immediately drawthe contrast between him and
Tony Stark.
He has to be like properly cold, menacing, villainous jokes no
like yeah, you need to, doesn'tquip.
Yeah, you got to separate doom.

(42:44):
Separate Doom from Stark.
That's gotta be mission A withthis whole Robert Downey Jr
thing.

Speaker 1 (42:50):
I do think he's in this movie and again I'm gonna
bold state claim same thing he'sthe Doctor Doom from that
universe.
Mm-hmm, yep.
And then your big overreaction,my big overreaction.
You can be like.
This is going to be thegreatest comic book movie of all
time.

Speaker 2 (43:09):
I don't know if it's a big overreaction, I think I
don't want to be careful how Iword this.
I think Vanessa Kirby couldpotentially be the face of
Marvel going forward.
Wow, that's incredible.
If this movie works, because Ithink she's going to be that
integral to the plot and peopleare going to leave that movie

(43:30):
going, she's.
She's the one that needs tolike kind of build around for
lack of a like we've we've hadthe marvel problem, right, we've
talked about this for months atthis point, like who are we
building around?
It's gonna be them.
I think it's gonna be them andI think it's gonna be her.

Speaker 1 (43:43):
Your immediate answer is Pedro, but I feel like it's
going to.
It's like the four of them arejust so special in all of their
own right.
But I could see what you'resaying about Vanessa Kirby, my
conspiracy theory.
Um, they're going to do thecouncil of reads and that's how
read is going to know what'sgoing to happen, like what's
going on, because the Iguarantee you, the other ones of
them are going to be likeGalactus, isn't it?

(44:03):
Is it going to be?
You think it's going to be allof them?
I hope so and I hope it doesn'tbetray the again.
That's the thing I'm afraid ofis that, like Shackman is very
adamant, like we can't do whatthey did in Multiverse of
Madness.
At the same time, if the filmitself is still good enough, it
wouldn't take away.
It could really.
Potentially, it could add,because it's something that's so

(44:25):
notorious, like the Illuminaticharacters that we got the only
one, that was actually the onlytwo that were actually members
of the Illuminati, or threeprofessor X, uh, read in in
black bowl, Like it felt so toyour point, like that's not what
that movie was like, that wasin the cell of that movie.

Speaker 2 (44:41):
Right.

Speaker 1 (44:42):
That was five.
You like that was in the cellof that movie, right, that was
five.
You walked in and said, heyguys, make sure you get this
right, but the illuminati.
You can't make sure you get theilluminati right, but like, how
I want it to go is like reed ismessing around with the
multiverse, even if it's atransmission any sort of type
he's like messing around withthe multiverse and he's being a
bad dad.
Um, it's as simple as, like yoand and Griffin, I genuinely

(45:04):
think is in this movie.
I do think there's another ReedRichards in this movie.
I don't know if it's apost-credits scene, I don't know
if it's the middle of the movie.
Um, yo and Griffin.
I just think John Krasinski isone call away.
Well, like, why not?
Like, just why not?
The one that I truthfully wouldbe overjoyed to see, and I
think would be insane, would beMiles Teller.

(45:26):
But you spin it and you makehim the maker.
So it's like he's still Reed,but he's gone.
He's truthfully gone, and maybethe maker's the one that gives
him the idea for, hey, youshould make the ultimate
nullifier and just murder himwhen he comes.

Speaker 2 (45:40):
Destroy Galactus.
I think that's a good call.
I think, yeah, I think they doget Yohan Griffin in this movie.
If for nothing else, likeMarvel's usually been pretty
good with that type of stuff,especially with the old hat Fox
group, yeah Of kind of givingthem a little something.
A little something If they wantit, yeah, Obviously, like Ben

(46:01):
Affleck probably doesn't want it, sure, but like stewart's done
a couple things now.
Obviously hugh jackman cameback um.
Jennifer garner came back umblee or wesley snipes obviously
came back.
So like it does feel like if,if the one c, grammar, kelsey
grammar's back, he wants to playbeast and more things.
Kelsey Grammer loves playingBeast.

(46:23):
Did I read that he wants to bein one of these Avengers movies?

Speaker 1 (46:31):
as Beast.
It's going to happen Because wesaid, because our theory was
like Put him in a Sentinel.
You cowards Beast loves drivingSentinels, oh dear.
I genuinely think they're goingto get the X-Men lineup from
the Bryan Singer movies just tobe.
They still could spin it as the.
To get the X-Men lineup fromthe Bryan Singer movies just to
be.
They still could spin it as theAvengers versus the X-Men, it's
that universe versus the main616 on Battleworld.

(46:54):
They could still do it.

Speaker 2 (46:55):
I'm thinking Chris Evans came back as Johnny Storm
for a little bit, so I think ifYohan Griffin wants to do it, I
wouldn't be totally shocked.
Right, I'd be like my degreesof, I guess.
If we're going to rank thedegrees, of surprise for the
Reed Richards actors showing up.
I think Ewan Griffin is mostlikely to appear, I think

(47:15):
Krasinski's in the middle secondplace and Miles Teller is far
and away the least likely toshow up.

Speaker 1 (47:21):
Just call Miles Teller and say you can be a bad
guy.
He hates that movie.
Yeah, he does, but like, if youspin it and you're like dude,
you get to be cool.

Speaker 2 (47:30):
This time he's like hmm, I do want to be cool.

Speaker 1 (47:33):
And he's looking over his shoulder making sure glenn
powell isn't behind yeah keepthat guy away from me my
overreaction is that shackman'sgonna turn into the golden boy
of marvel you talked, talked,you, talked, you told me about
this.

Speaker 2 (47:45):
He's going to be like I love this idea.

Speaker 1 (47:47):
By the end of this movie, not only will he be the
golden boy of Marvel, theRusso's if this rumor is true,
they're going to get the fit theX-Men.

Speaker 2 (48:05):
He's going to hand the first X-Men Simple.
I think that can absolutelyhappen because I think this
movie's going to do really well.

Speaker 1 (48:08):
Give Shackman a younger cast for the X-Men.
Give him like.
I saw this Sadie Sink thing.
I saw the.
I forget the one guy's name.
Oh, the Cyclops thing.
Yeah, oh, harrison Dickinson.

Speaker 2 (48:19):
Harrison Ford.
Nope ford, nope um maybe onceupon a time harrison ford is
cyclops.
They did that movie in the 60s.
No current harrison ford.
No to me, my x-men.
God he's cool.
Is he cool?
Hell yeah, he's cool I'mharrison ford, y'all that's the

(48:40):
alternate universe guardians ofthe galaxy.
Um, no, I think you'recompletely right.
I think I think this couldabsolutely happen, for that's
the alternate universe Guardiansof the Galaxy.
No, I think you're completelyright.
I think this could absolutelyhappen for Matt Shackman, and I
think it would be great.

Speaker 1 (48:53):
He could potentially turn into what James Gunn was
for them at some point.

Speaker 2 (48:56):
This is his second movie ever.

Speaker 1 (48:59):
I think it's his first.

Speaker 2 (49:02):
No, it's his second, but the first one was a nothing
burger.
Don't say nothing.
Cut Bank was the name of it,liam hemsworth was in it.

Speaker 1 (49:12):
Oh shoot, bob billy.
Bob thornton was in it.
John malkovich was also in it.

Speaker 2 (49:15):
Now it makes sense.
The film follows a witness to amurder who wants to get rich
off of what he saw.
It released in the unitedstates apr 3rd 2015.
A limited release and video bydemand by A24.
All right, 92 minutes, cool.
No, I think that's accurate.
I think, man, if you could get,if this movie's as good as it

(49:35):
looks, and you could get adirectorial stable of Matt
Shackman, ryan Coogler what'shis name?

Speaker 1 (49:44):
from Deadpool and Wolverine, Sean Levyine, sean
Levy, sean Levy.
I think he's gonna commit toStar Wars though I think he's
gonna commit, he shouldn't, heshouldn't.
Maybe he'll do the next,because that movie made a.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
They're gonna do another one and I think, to add
an overreaction to youroverreaction on top of like,
because of the news about theRussussos.
Yep, I think kevin feige isgetting ready to hand the
baseball cap over to the russosget to a two, a two-headed
monster.

Speaker 1 (50:10):
Instead of just himself he steps into like a
more ceo role.
I can see a possible future way, way down the line where kevin
feige turns into the ceo ofdisney.
Like I can see a future wherethat happens.

Speaker 2 (50:21):
This is, this is the type of thing that we're.
This is what we wanted he'srunning disney now.

Speaker 1 (50:30):
Um, I'm not even joking like I genuinely think at
some point in his lifetime he'sthe one making them all the
money.
That's what I'm saying.
He's the one that's literallylike he.
He coerced and and plotted andschemed to make them the single,
most plotted and schemed,single, most successful movie
franchise of all time and it'sgonna, it's gonna swing back up.

Speaker 2 (50:49):
Man, it really is once fantastic.

Speaker 1 (50:52):
Four happens once let me tell you something.
Once the first trailer fordoomsday comes out and like you
get one cameo from one person,you're everybody's gonna be oh,
we're back, we're so back Ithink.

Speaker 2 (51:03):
I think we're having that reaction now.
Yeah we're so back With thisFantastic Four thing.
Man, I really do.

Speaker 1 (51:09):
Yeah, I have one fear , because I'm thinking about
2022, when Ant-Man and the Waspcame out, or Quantumania came
out, and I was like, okay, or2023.
And I was like, all right, I'mfeeling like you remember.
I was like, all right, I'mfeeling like you remember.
Like I was like we're going tobounce back, Like no, no, we
were came off of Wakanda forever.
I was like we're going to getback into the multiversal saga.

Speaker 2 (51:31):
We're really going to start to ramp up.
Yeah, but Quantum Minion neveranswered.
It.
Never answered the question.
The biggest question that I hadfor it was was how is this
Ant-Man Kang thing going to work?
And it didn't.
No, it turns out it was withthe answer.
Like this I don't necessarilyhave a question about Right,
like that trailer didn't give meanything where I'm like
skeptical or nervous about theplot.

(51:52):
Sure.
Where I'm like well, how's thisgoing to work?
How's that Like they said it inthe retro, like any, all bets
are off.
All bets are off.
I think that's with Ant-Man.
That's the thing that bugged methe most about it.

Speaker 1 (52:03):
I see what you did there.

Speaker 2 (52:11):
Was you have to find a way?

Speaker 1 (52:11):
to resolve the movie and still keep Kang going.
Not only keep Kang going, butkeep him as the top absolute dog
to go against everybody.
And then they just said thismovie doesn't matter to anything
.
What?

Speaker 2 (52:21):
if he lost though, To Ant-Man.
Whereas this it's set in analternate timeline or alternate
Earth, whatever you want toanything.
What if he lost, though, toAnt-Man?
Whereas this it's set in analternate timeline or alternate
Earth, whatever you want to say,all bets are off.
They could lose, they probablywill lose, whereas, like
Quantumania, you're like, howcan he?
Ant-man can't lose.

Speaker 1 (52:38):
But Kang also can't lose.
Like you're, ant's the man youcan't lose.

Speaker 2 (52:41):
He can't lose because if he loses, he's done, he's
kang will kill him and he heshould have.
But then we found out thatant-man was him.

Speaker 1 (52:50):
No ant-man has hands.
His hands are in an e foreveryone.
He beat up captain america.
He did beat up captain america.
Did he get some cheap shots in?
Yeah, um, here's what I'msaying, though.
Who's kang, who's ant-Manfought?
He fought the Falcon.
He fought the one guy in jail.
He fought Kang.
He fought War Machine.

(53:10):
Do you have any correlationbetween these two?
He fought Black Panther.
He fought Black Panther For abit.
There's a lot of correlationbetween who he's fought.
I'm not making any accusationsor saying anything.
I'm just saying he's friendswith TI.
Say it.
I'm just saying he's friendswith ti.
Say it.
I'm just saying, say it what?
I have a black friend.

(53:31):
You didn't think we were comingwith the.
It could possibly be some sortof a racist bit, but it's here.
Um, not paul rudd, he's adelightful human being, but
scott lang, we have questions.
This was about the fantasticforce.
It was, um, you know what?
The number one thing I thinkabout there are my final remarks
on this trailer.
What if the rest of the mcu wasset in the 60s like you dropped

(53:54):
it, I?
You drop ant-man.
He's probably hank him.
You drop him in the 60s, youdrop spot.
The big one is, you dropspider-man in the 60s.
What does it look like?
Um drop spider-man in the 60s,you drop who else?
I got Iron man.
You drop Iron man in the 60s.
You know, one of the big ones Iwant to see is the Fantastic
Four, the X-Men in the 60s.
I would really like to see thatone.

Speaker 2 (54:15):
Did you see people saying that they should bring
Dominic Cooper back to be TonyStark of that Fantastic Four
universe?

Speaker 1 (54:23):
That would be insane.
I think that would be cool,that would be wild, as like 60s
Iron man.

Speaker 2 (54:28):
I think that would be cool, as like 60s Iron man.

Speaker 1 (54:30):
I think that'd be cool.
They could yeah, they couldplausibly like, have a, have a
Tony Stark in that universe.
They could have a, they couldhave a Steve Rogers in that
universe.
I think personally, you couldprobably get away with it and go
further with it.
You don't you can have a BlackPanther in that universe that's
running around Wakanda, likethis is where the comic started,
like it started in the 60s,like you can have all these

(54:50):
things plausibly.
Yeah, you can have a whole.
You can have a bruce brannerrunning around.

Speaker 2 (54:54):
I do think this, this earth, is destined to be
destroyed, though I think that'sultimately where this is going,
um, and that's how you get themover, and then you like there's
a whole compelling situationthat emerges from that.
Like they were heroes on theirearth, like famous heroes are
the real mysterios.
Like they were famous heroes ontheir earth and they got, they

(55:16):
lost and the earth was destroyed.
How do they, how do theyrecover, recover from that?
Yep, I think that's really thatcould be a really interesting I
.
How does reed richards recover?

Speaker 1 (55:26):
from that, because he thinks he can outsmart, he's
the smartest man alive and hestill couldn't figure it out.

Speaker 2 (55:31):
He couldn't figure it out, and then dr doom shows up
on top of that yeah, he's likemy old wait victor.

Speaker 1 (55:37):
Are you here to help?
No, I'm here to murder you,reed.

Speaker 2 (55:39):
I hate you no, don't play the, so I don't know.
I think a lot of cool stuff cancome out of this um and also
just make a simple great film.

Speaker 1 (55:51):
Yeah, and I think they might have done it yeah, I
think they might have done ittoo.

Speaker 2 (55:54):
And, in the spirit of great, great teaser trailers, I
want to see more.
I'm I need another trailer likeI just need one now.
Like, like, show me, show memore from this movie, like I,
I'm, I'm ready, I'm ready for it.
The suits look great.
Suits look so good, so good.

(56:14):
I just they.
They went to I think they'vegone to a special, special place
.

Speaker 1 (56:19):
You could really like you, could you?
You essentially, what they canpop, they can do, is like, if
they want to keep making theseand I think if this movie finds
a way to sneak into the 800 tobillion range, like you're, oh,
I think it's going to these likethe second one and especially
post and this is the thing thatthe mcu didn't have post end
game, that they're gonna havegoing into post secret wars, is

(56:40):
like a definitive team of a-listactors ready to rock right
after.
Like that's something theyweren't banking on.
And you have the potential inthe, in the, not the probability
like they're probably going tocall the next one the mutant
saga.
Like you have the X-Men readyto go.

Speaker 2 (56:54):
And seeing this trailer alongside the Superman
trailer and they're releasingsuch proximity to each other.
I don't.
I don't think we have arivaling faction situation.
I think we have a potentialsuperhero Barbenheimer Sitch.

Speaker 1 (57:13):
And I didn't believe you until yesterday, when this
trailer came out Because we'vekind of been going back and
forth about this I genuinelythought it was going to be an
absolute battleground.
Superman was either going to beSuperman comes, gets the Top
Gun run, and then Fantastic Fourhas to be detached to the
Marvel name.

Speaker 2 (57:25):
I think they're going to feed off each other, because
I think they're both going tobe really good and I think
they're both going to be reallygood and I think they're both
going to be like actual moviesand I think people are going to
gravitate to that and I thinkboth these movies are going to
do really well.

Speaker 1 (57:38):
I can, I'm going to, I mean, we're probably we're
going to see both in the sameday, like once fantastic four
comes out, like I'm, I'm itchingto see both and like I might
catch the early Supermanscreener before I go to see
Fantastic Four.
I really want to see both ofthese movies and at the end of

(57:58):
the day and I'll leave it withthis is this not the coolest
dang thing in the world thatwe're getting a prime Superman
and a prime Fantastic Four moviein two weeks of each other.
Is that not the coolest thing?
It's really good man Made bypeople that look like they care
about these characters.

Speaker 2 (58:13):
This I mean, for lack of a better word this fantastic
four thing felt so it's noteven.
It's not early mcu, it'santithetical to anything that
they've done.
Yeah, besides, maybewandavision funny enough.

Speaker 1 (58:27):
You know how many people that didn't realize that,
like I was watching a wholebunch of trailer reactions.
I saw so many people thatdidn't realize that I was
watching a whole bunch oftrailer reactions.
I saw so many people thatdidn't know that Shackman did
this.
They were like kind of feelslike WandaVision.
I'm like, yeah, it does kind offeel like WandaVision.
It feels so much likeWandaVision, wandavision's such
a gem yeah, it really is, butnow he's like filmmaking.

Speaker 2 (58:45):
Yeah, I can't wait, man.
I really can't wait and it'sgoing to hit.

Speaker 1 (58:51):
They're going to show it during the Super Bowl and
I'm going to be like, yep, Ineed to see it right now.
Man, that really took away allthe massive trailers that can
come out for the Super Bowl.

Speaker 2 (59:01):
I know I don't know what we're going to do next week
for the Super Bowl, and I don'tknow what we're going to do.

Speaker 1 (59:13):
I don't know.
We'll figure it out.
We'll recap the Superbowl.
Yeah, we're going to do a sport.
No, we're going to do remember,the Titans next week.
Um, how fun.
How fun is this?

Speaker 2 (59:17):
How fun is football Zero fun, sir.
I love that movie so much.
Um, captain America so uh.
Captain America, brave newworld is out next week.
Um came, came, crept right upon us.
Um, it is kicking off the.
I guess agatha kind of did this, but this is kicking off the.
The cinema year for 2025, formarvel.

(59:37):
Um, coming off the back ofdeadpool and wolverine, marvel
is so back.
Marvel's been never been moreback.
Um.
Deadpool and wolverine came outin.
Wow came out almost a year ago.
Yep, that's crazy.
When did it come out?
July, july 26th, I think it'sbecause that movie stayed in
theater so long that I'm like itfeels like it just came out.
But no that movie's been outsince July, wow.
So first movie since Deadpooland Wolverine starring Sam

(01:00:00):
Wilson, and that's what we wantto talk about.

Speaker 1 (01:00:04):
Yeah, we want to talk about Anthony Mackie's journey
throughout the MCU up until thispoint.

Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
Yes, starting throughout the MCU up until this
point.
Yes, starting with CaptainAmerica Winter Soldier, my
favorite Marvel film ever, andhe is a great grounding
point-of-view character inWinter Soldier and he's the.

Speaker 1 (01:00:25):
What I love about it is not only does it ground Steve
, it grounds us in a way too,because he truthfully is the
audience surrogate in there.
He's this guy that has thisfigure that had been talked
about throughout history for solong that comes back that he has
to kind of help along the way.
That is a good surrogatecharacter to have along with
this plot.
I don't think, and we won't doit until God, hoping years and

(01:00:50):
years and years and years andyears and years and years and
years in the future, like whenanthony mackie, unfortunately,
as all human beings do pass awaylike jesus, no, like.
My point is like I don't thinkwe appreciate anthony mackie the
way that we should.
I don't think we ever have andunfortunately, like, like I said
, when he's the oldest of allmen, like I, like I hope that,

(01:01:13):
like I hope it doesn't take tothat.
Like I love listening to him ininterviews.
He just seems fun, like heseems like a fun guy, but he
also seems like he cares, likehe also genuinely seems like he
cares about these characters,like he's very like active and
vocal about the actor experiencetoo, which I really appreciate
and you can see it.
You can see all those like youknow you can see all these
little bits and pieces andreally appreciate, and you can

(01:01:34):
see it.
You can see all those like youknow, you can see all these
little bits and pieces andespecially in Winter Soldier,
you can see it Like he has atenderness to him which I really
appreciate.

Speaker 2 (01:01:39):
I love his backstory of being, you know, a veteran
that helps veterans, yes.
And what a perfect and that'swhat makes is so important to
the character of captain americathat that almost becomes like

(01:02:01):
his defining quality as captainamerica, but it's the quality
that's always been there.
Um, like I said, he's just atremendous audience and I just
love how down he is.
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:02:11):
You know.
It's like again to your point,like he's you know, ex-military
guy right and like themilitary's guy is at his front
step.
That's like, if you're like abasketball player, like that's
like at a park playing andLeBron pulls up, you're like,
yeah, you want to be on my teamto show up at rucker park?
Yeah, I want to be on your team.
Your, your basketball, is thelebron james.

(01:02:32):
Why would I not want to?

Speaker 2 (01:02:33):
be on.
Yeah, captain america's like,hey, man, we're gonna, we're
doing this, this is gonna suck.
And he's like you, sure youwant to do this.
He's like what does he say?
What's the line where he's likefight, you know, doing a
mission with captain america.
Like sign me up, man, like I'mready to roll.
He, he gives steve.
Uh, introduction to the culture.

Speaker 1 (01:02:49):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:02:50):
Which I really like.

Speaker 1 (01:02:51):
I love that first interaction with the two of them
.
Decent 1978 Trouble mansoundtrack.
He's like.
I'll add it to the list.
They're such a great pairingthat you don't think about.

Speaker 2 (01:03:03):
And there was never once the idea that he was
Captain America's sidekick,which could have easily happened
.
He could have easily just beenpassed off as Captain America's
sidekick, which could haveeasily happened.
He could have easily just beenpassed off as Captain America's
sidekick, and I think the Russos, and before them in First
Avenger, did a really nice jobwith Bucky and Sam, not making

(01:03:24):
them Steve's sidekicks.

Speaker 1 (01:03:26):
They're making them Steve's friends.
So that way the emotional gutpunch is like I think we've
grown a bit numb to the sidekickdying trope.
Thanks, robin, you murderedthat four Bucky too.
Bucky too, but they do a goodjob with Sam about making him a
human being, and a human beingthat we care about too.
I'm worried about him thiswhole fight, but he's also cool

(01:03:48):
as heck.

Speaker 2 (01:03:48):
Yes, I mean, yeah he's.
I mean just the Falcon, theredesign to the modern MCU of
not making him like a birdperson and making him like a
tech guy, like big he's, a techexpert he is.

Speaker 1 (01:04:03):
he can pilot those wings in a way that nobody else
can.

Speaker 2 (01:04:08):
And that's why he keeps them when he becomes
captain America, cause he that,yep, and that's why he keeps
them when he becomes captainamerica, because he, that's.
That's that's the thing is like.
That's what I love about.
It's one of my favorite things.
Talking about jumping toguardians of the galaxy 3.
It's one of my favorite thingsthat they do with peter quill in
guardians of galaxy 3, like heyes, he is a goof, he is jokey,
jokey, jokey guy.

(01:04:28):
But the one scene that sticksout to me in guardians 3 is when
he's venting about gamora whileat the same time like
effortlessly taking down, likean advanced defense system, and
I'm like that's why you're asuperhero, that's why you are,
that's why you're the leader ofthe guardians of the galaxy,
because you have this expertisethat no one else has, and sam
has that also with the wings andwith his combat prowess.

(01:04:50):
No one else can do with thosewings what Sam can do.
That's the most important thingin a hero.
Why are you the way you are?
Why are you a hero?
Because you can do things thatnobody else can.
Why is Tony Stark Iron man?
Because he can do things thatnobody else can.
Same thing, right down the listPeter Parker, steve Rogers.
They are in those positionsbecause they can do things that

(01:05:12):
no one else can, and Sam fitsthat exact thing.

Speaker 1 (01:05:19):
And I'll cap off your point by this he's a hero
because he can do the thingsthat other people can't.
He's Captain America becausehe's not a better.
He's the best person that hecan be For other people.
That's why he's.

Speaker 2 (01:05:32):
Captain America, that's can be for other people.

Speaker 1 (01:05:33):
That's why he's captain.

Speaker 2 (01:05:34):
That's why it's yours .
That's why it's yours, we'llget to infinity war in a second
um civil.
Uh ant-man, he shows up, itgets his ass kicked I'm just
saying man, I'm just saying allthose things, all those things
that I just said about him,about being the best at what he
does, completely undone byAnt-Man.

Speaker 1 (01:05:52):
I don't understand it , man, it's funny.

Speaker 2 (01:05:55):
It makes sense in the sense that he, sam, at the end
of the day, still has humanity,he still is susceptible to
overlooking somebody.
He's an Avenger now, right?
Well, I guess Age of ultronbefore, avengers, right?
He I mean, he doesn't do muchin avengers in in age of ultron

(01:06:15):
he lands he shows up at the end,he's the deus ex falcon.
At the end he shows up with nickfury and all this stuff and, to
be fair, you know, I guess thebiggest thing that happens to
him in age of ultron is he's anavenger.
Now he shows up with vision andwanda and War Machine and
they're the Avengers.
Nothing really comes of that.

Speaker 1 (01:06:36):
Yeah, it does, they are the Avengers, sort of.
Yeah, they're the Avengers inCivil War.

Speaker 2 (01:06:42):
Yeah, they start as the they do an Avenger.

Speaker 1 (01:06:44):
Yeah, they do an Avengering together.
And then Wanda ruined it.

Speaker 2 (01:06:47):
Yeah, so before he does Avengering in Civil War, he
does get his ass kicked byAnt-Man, but to my point, he is
susceptible to hubris, like anyof us.
He's an Avenger, he's feelinghimself, he's like get lost,
little man, little person.
And Scott, again to my pointabout what makes these heroes

(01:07:11):
heroes.
Scott is the best at what hedoes.
He is the best thief, he is thebest at subterfuge, he is the
best and he's the best.
He's also a good tech guy.
He can get, and he can get in afalcon's suit and disable him.
You know, credit, credit toant-man, um, but they strike up
a nice little, a nice littlefriendship on the back end of
that which I really wish we sawa little bit more of.

Speaker 1 (01:07:32):
To be perfectly honest, If Scott was in Infinity
War, that's probably whereyou'd do it.

Speaker 2 (01:07:38):
You know what I want more than anything in the world,
and I don't know if it's evergoing to happen Scott's affinity
for the mantle and the personof Captain America.
I want that to play out withSam.

Speaker 1 (01:07:49):
That would be so funny.
He's just like well, he trustedyou, so now you're my captain.
Yeah, I think that would befreaking awesome.

Speaker 2 (01:07:55):
Like whatever you yes , cats, whatever you say,
captain America and Sam's likeknock it off.

Speaker 1 (01:07:58):

Speaker 2 (01:07:59):
Like I'm not Steve, knock it off, tic-tac, have this
shit.
What do you mean by you?
I want to see, I want to seescott and and sam reunite, now
that sam's captain america.
I don't know if we'll ever seeit, but I I want to see it.
I think that would be really,really cool.

(01:08:19):
Um, civil war.
Um, sam is a very importantvocal part of civil war.

Speaker 1 (01:08:27):
Yeah, he is he's, he's and it's not.
I don't even think it's becauseof I think a part of it is it
played off of his relationshipwith cap and how much they'd
been through, but also I thinkit was it's sam being sam.
It's what sam had been throughtoo.
Like freedom, like nolegislation on superheroes.
Like why would I ever want to?
Like I saw what hydra just didto everybody with some

(01:08:49):
legislation.
Like why would I ever want thatever again?
I saved, I saved you, I savedyou.
And you want to talk to meabout superhero registrar Like
you, you must be crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:08:58):
Cause that's the thing that everyone forgets
about the Hydra thing in WinterSoldier, they were going to wipe
all the superheroes off the map.
Yes, that was the plan, likeSam, you know, to Sam and
Steve's credit, they were neverlike, hey, we saved you guys
from Hydra.
They never said that becausewhy would they?
And that's why both of themwere Captain America, and I love
the framing that everyone's out, even Cap's allies, are

(01:09:20):
skeptical of Bucky, but not Sam,because Sam went through the
events of Winter Soldier withSteve.
He knows what happened to Bucky, so he's like I'm, I'm with you
to, you know, to quote bucky,like I'm with you to the end of
the line, pal, um, him andt'challa have have some nice

(01:09:41):
back and forth, which I reallyappreciate.
Um, he's, yeah, I really loveyou know, sam's.
He's the one that suggests tocap that like, hey, like there
might be no going back from this.
Yeah, like we might have tofight iron man like this and his
crew like this might be coming.
You know, he's the one whosuggests getting clint out of

(01:10:01):
retirement.
He's the one who suggestsrecruiting wanda, like those
were all sam's ideas.
You know what I mean, which Ithink I think again is is.
We're just, we're justsprinkling.
You know, we're sprinkled,sprinkling stuff in there.
Like I think everyone was sodead set on bucky taking the
shield once chris evans was done, um, I don't think, you know,

(01:10:23):
to be honest, like I don't thinkanyone ever considered that sam
was gonna get the shield.
I don't think everyone, anyoneever considered that, um, man I
love, and then it's sam.
That's the one that breaksthrough to tony.
Yep, in civil war, you knowwhere.
Sam's like why would I tell youanything?
And then tony's like look, Idisabled the communication.

(01:10:45):
Like can you level with me?
Like is, is this legit?
Like what cap's doing?
And sam's's like when had likeyeah, yeah, basically like when
has he ever led you wrong?
Yeah, like, like, what are wetalking about here?
Like, like, what are we doing?
Um, turns out Steve did leadhim wrong for for many, many,
many.
And then we go.

(01:11:07):
You know, steve breaks them allout of prison at the end and
then we get his return.
We get Sam's return in InfinityWar with Black Widow and
Captain America that I wish wehad gotten more of the three of
them doing stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:11:23):
Dude Together.
What I love about it, too, isit bolsters Falcon's credibility
, even though you shouldn'treally need to do that,
especially civil war.
But it keeps getting him higherand higher and higher on that
list and on that like, yeah,yeah, talk about not the most
powerful avengers, but like themost important avengers like sam
is high on that list of likecrucial to this avengers team he
was avengering in the shadowsfor with with captain america

(01:11:48):
and black widow for presumablyyears.

Speaker 2 (01:11:51):
I wish I.
It's another thing I wish wejust got more of.
I don't know, I don't thinkthere was ever a place for it If
Disney Plus existed, maybe,maybe they would have done it.
And I think that would have beensuper, super cool.
Just cause, like they're kindof like the mean Avengers, like
they were going to kill ProximaMidnight, like like Black, like
they were going to kill ProximaMidnight, Like Black Widow
straight up tells her like wedon't want to kill you but we

(01:12:12):
will if we have to, and I'm like, yeah, yeah, like there's a
chippiness and a darkness tothat trio that like I kind of
like, like Sam's never hesitantto pull the straps out.
And again, like he knocksProxima Midnight on her ass A

(01:12:33):
few times, a few times.
Like he's squirrely, that guy,when he gets in the air, then
he's kind of relegated to justair support in the Infinity War
battle, him and War Machine,which is kind of cool.
And then Sam gets snapped outof existence.
Mr Crafted America, I don'tfeel so good, sucks, man Dang,

(01:13:01):
that scene sucks.
Oh, all the Disney Pluscharacters got snapped out of
existence, that's true.
And then, endgame, he has theline, the line, the line On your
left, cabot Sam, do you read me?
And then, endgame, he has theline, the line, the line on your
left, cabot Sam, do you read me?
On your left, he flies through.
It's awesome.
There's really.

(01:13:21):
I mean, what else do you say?
And then, obviously, the momentat the end of, at the end of
endgame, the official mantlepass.
You don't got the shield inthat little thing, do you?
And that shield's shaped bagged.
Maybe that shield's shapedbagged.

Speaker 1 (01:13:37):
You wouldn't have to have the shield in there, would
you?
You want me to pass that toBucky, right?

Speaker 2 (01:13:42):
But I love that scene where him and Bucky see Steve
and Bucky initiates Bucky knows,he knows, he knows.
And Bucky initiates Bucky knows, he knows, he knows, yep.
And Bucky goes, he says to Samhe goes, go ahead.
Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1 (01:13:55):
Sam goes up and I love that point you made because
it's going to, it helps so muchin Falcon and the Winter
Soldier, like they do have aspecial relationship, the two of
them as well too.
We didn't even really talkabout that as well too.
Yeah, well, because, um, well,because we don't really see it

(01:14:16):
develop in the movies.
To be you know, they don'tspend a whole ton of time
together, but the time they dospend, together like I love,
like the fight for steve's bestfriendedness that they have.

Speaker 2 (01:14:20):
But it's also it's not even a fight so much as it's
like you're his best friend, no, you're his best friend like
they're like too modest and to.
And then the modesty comes to aculmination when steve's
sitting and Bucky tells Sam likehe's here for you, he's here to
give you that, like he's nothere to give me that he's here
for you, go get it.
And then obviously Sam andSteve share just a wonderful,

(01:14:42):
wonderful moment that's almostundercut by the distracting
Chris Evans aging up.
Yeah, cgi, the Joe BidenChristopher, the Joe
Bidenification of Chris Evansaging up.
Yeah, cgi, the Joe BidenChristopher, the Joe
Bidenification of Chris Evans.
And he officially gives theshield over.
You know, he's like I had to goback and get something, had to

(01:15:03):
bring it here, and Sam's likecool shield man and Steve's like
why don't you try it on?

Speaker 1 (01:15:12):
And Sam's like he does the meme.

Speaker 2 (01:15:14):
You don't mean me, do you?
And Sam grabs the shield and hedoes a pose, big, pose, Big
Captain America pose.
The Captain America music playsbehind him and he says how does
it feel Like it's someoneelse's?
It isn't.

Speaker 1 (01:15:31):
And I'm like, yeah, that's enough to make a grown
man go Heck yeah.
Um and then basically he justgives the shield right back to
the American.

Speaker 2 (01:15:43):
They still have a nice moment where he's like I'm
just sad I have to live in aworld without captain America.
And Steve's like what if youwere captain America, you know?
And he's like what if you werecaptain america, you know?
And he's like I don't, you knowhow does it feel like it's
someone else's?
He's like you know, I'll do mybest is what he says to steve
and c goes, and that's why it'syours and that's why it is his,
because that's all at the end ofthe day.

Speaker 1 (01:16:05):
super serum aside, steve rogers was just a guy
doing his best guy doing hisbest and a guy trying to do the
right thing, yep, and then toyour point he just gives the
shield right, but that's not theright that we were talking
about, sam Demi.

Speaker 2 (01:16:20):
Steve went no, and that's a big sticking point in
Falcon and the Winter Soldier,where Bucky's like what why?

Speaker 1 (01:16:29):
What?
He time-traveled all the wayacross the multiverse to get
that thing back here and youjust said I'm going to give it
to the American government.

Speaker 2 (01:16:36):
So that they could give it to John Walker.

Speaker 1 (01:16:38):
Let's talk about John Walker for a little bit.
Yeah, I think one of the mostcompelling characters in the
entire MCU.
Can't wait to see more of him.
Can't wait, he's so interesting, he's so interesting, he's so
interesting, so again.
So let's remix the point.
Like john walker in anotheruniverse would have been sam,
like another military guy that,when steve came back to the

(01:16:59):
modern age, like, hey, I canhelp you just by myself being me
like, and then just give me themantle of captain america.
However, john is lacking onething that sam does not lack.

Speaker 2 (01:17:09):
John lacks a bit of humanity, which which sam makes
up for in droves, which, to befair, john does reconcile with
quite a bit.
Yeah, he does.
When, like he's he's talkingabout like getting his medal of
honors and he's like I got thesemedals like by killing people,
and his you know, his bestfriend lamar, is like nah, man,
you're fucking rad yeah, are younot the coolest guy ever, dude?

Speaker 1 (01:17:31):
You were the high school quarterback and you dated
the most popular girl.
Now you're Captain America.
That's not cool bro.

Speaker 2 (01:17:37):
And John's like yeah, it is kind of cool.

Speaker 1 (01:17:38):
Now give me that super soldier zero.

Speaker 2 (01:17:41):
And now I'm crazy.
Now I'm crazy.
All the meanwhile, though, samand Bucky are just back and
bickering.
Essentially Because Sam andBucky are just back and
bickering?
Essentially Because Bucky justhe can't get it.
He doesn't get it.
And why doesn't he get it?
Court Because racism?
Huh, well, because Sambasically says like this was

(01:18:01):
never going to happen, like theywere never going to let this
happen anyway.

Speaker 1 (01:18:06):
So let me just I mean , we can talk about the bigger
fish, yeah, about you know, Ithink we should what this show
tackled, he's tackled, he'stackled.
Not the robot, the creator fromthe robot, from the creator,
john Walker is tackled, he'stackled.
No, that's what John Walkersaid to Sam.
He's tackled.
No, that's what he tried to sayto the Dora Milaje he's tackled

(01:18:26):
.
Let's talk about it, man.
So I always will respect thisshow.
So so much for what they did.
I mean to take an approach likethis, and here's the thing that
I always say with this becausethis, this was like the first
exit.
It was obviously, it was thescene in endgame, uh, the a4
scene.
But this was the true likenarrative plot piece show to be

(01:18:47):
like they're gonna get woke.
That doesn't exist.
That's not a thing thatactually exists, just so
everybody knows.
But what I think was specialabout it was Anthony Mackie's
commitment to it and everybody'scommitment to it, and it's, I'm
sorry, like to offend anybody,like that's a real anxiety.
That's an actual, real-lifeanxiety that he had.
And look what the governmentimmediately did they immediately

(01:19:09):
just turned it over to somebodyelse that looked just like
Steve, just turned it right backover to him, because that's the
thing that they thought thateverybody needed.

Speaker 2 (01:19:16):
And Bucky couldn't wrap his head around it.
Because he comes from a placeof privilege.

Speaker 1 (01:19:21):
Yep, he's like why would you ever give this away?
You know how difficult this is.
And Sam, and again, this iswhat I'll give Sam and his arc
in that show.
Sam immediately said to yourpoint they're not going to
accept me as Captain America,they want the blonde-haired,
blue-eyed guy to be Captain.

Speaker 2 (01:19:37):
America.
It's not.
Yeah and he doesn't.
I don't believe it's been awhile since I watched Falcon and
the Little Children, but Idon't think he outright says
like I gave the shield upbecause they were just going to
take it from me anyway.
But that's the implication.

Speaker 1 (01:19:49):
And you know what they might cover, Because one of
the things I was very concernedabout Brave New World they were
going to retract the same thingthat a six-episode show already
did.
What they might remix it as islike, hey, it's not that they're
going to take the shield awayfrom me, it's that once I become
the government's CaptainAmerica, I'm going to have an
immediate like I'm going to havea target that Steve never had

(01:20:10):
on my back, Because some peoplewill just want me dead because
of the way I look.
They wanted Steve dead becauseof the symbol that he was.

Speaker 2 (01:20:16):
And they're not going to trust me to make the
decisions that he made.

Speaker 1 (01:20:19):
Yep.
At the end of the day, he wasone of the main heroes of the
second battle of New York, likethe battle that saved the entire
human race, like he was themain guy and I think the public
knows that he was the main hewas captain America.

Speaker 2 (01:20:32):
Yeah, yep, and, and I mean just the obviously the
line that sticks out is theIsaiah Bradley line.

Speaker 1 (01:20:38):
They'll never let a black man be captain America.

Speaker 2 (01:20:41):
Yeah, and like for the complaint about the show
being woke, especially like Idon't know.
A lot of people talk about thebank scene.
Yeah, it just happened to RyanCoogler.
Oh yeah, like a month ago, likethe same exact thing.
Not the same exact thing.
He wasn't taking out a loan,but he was trying to withdraw
money from his bank account.

Speaker 1 (01:20:57):
Yeah, you're talking Right.
You're talking about the scenewhere him and Bucky are just
walking down the street and thecops are like oh, he's.

Speaker 2 (01:21:09):
And the guy's like oh my God, wait.

Speaker 1 (01:21:10):
He said you played for?
Did you play for LSU orsomething?
He's like no, you're the Falcon.
Yeah, you saved the wholeuniverse.

Speaker 2 (01:21:16):
Yeah, of course I'll help you with a you know
whatever.
But before then he got deniedthe loan for no reason.
Well, month ago, like he gotprofiled at a bank trying to get
money out of his account and hegot profiled like they did they
thought he was like robbing themoney, and then, once they
figured out what it's, just like, oh I'm so.

(01:21:37):
No, no, no, keep that sameenergy up, yeah, so it's not too
woke, like this stuff happensto people all the time like it's
, it's and you think like, oh,that could possibly happen to
someone that famous, and then itliterally happened to someone
that famous.

Speaker 1 (01:21:52):
So yeah, and lebron gets the n-word spray painted on
his garage door for existing.
So yes, I think isaiah bradleywas right in that line and sam.

Speaker 2 (01:22:07):
I mean look how many hoops sam had to jump through to
prove that he could be CaptainAmerica.
Like, even though in the end,like Isaiah, was wrong.
Quote unquote Like look whatSam had to do to get the
recognition and to be CaptainAmerica, you know what I mean.
Like first of all, john Walkerhad to kill somebody in broad

(01:22:27):
daylight.

Speaker 1 (01:22:27):
You know how I think about it and I think real world
implication for that.
I guarantee you, and I kind ofhope, that obviously, if John
Walker was in Cap 4, which Ioriginally thought was going to
happen I think they would havecovered this.
John Walker probably would havehad a support like a group of
people that were like you know,it would have been a Homelander
thing.
No, like John, this is theCaptain America that we need now

(01:22:48):
, versus Sam is the actualCaptain America that the world
needs.

Speaker 2 (01:22:52):
Yeah, that's a great point.
It's a great point.
They never really touch on that.
They did such a.
It was kind of like ahand-washy job of like alright,
he crossed the line.

Speaker 1 (01:23:02):
Excel plot hand-washy .
Obviously, and I'll neverforget, because this was 2021,
the show came out.
I'll never forget when he was,episode four ends and he's
holding the shield.
It was plastered all oversocial media.
He's holding the shield withthe blood on and I was just like
this is something like the end.

Speaker 2 (01:23:16):
They kind of like you said, they kind of well,
because they had to it's the sixepisode, structure six episode
structure and they had to makejohn walker sympathetic but
again, the six episode structuremakes that very too quick.

Speaker 1 (01:23:31):
Yeah, like the and the, and then you get to episode
five.
Like I understand your mandates, like I've only ever done what
you'd like.
Imagine that played out alittle bit more.

Speaker 2 (01:23:38):
Yeah, like they had to, they had to, yeah, they had
to.
They had to wash John Walker upa little bit to make him a
little more sympathetic.
So they basically made it solike the serum made him crazy,
by your eyes bulging out of yourhead what just happened oh,
basketball stuff, only jimmybutler being on the warriors now
whoa wow, that is big news.
Breaking news jimmy butler gottraded.

Speaker 1 (01:24:00):
Breaking news breaking news jimmy butler is
one of the warriors.
That's how reed richards wouldhave said it um, wow, cool.

Speaker 2 (01:24:10):
Um, but yeah, john walker, so yeah, they do.
They had to make himsympathetic because they had to
make him a main character ofsomething else, um, so I don't
think there was really room todo like the homeland
verification of like this sectof people actually kind of liked
what john walker did, like itwas kind of rad.

Speaker 1 (01:24:26):
Um, but I think I still john, john Walker's not a
bad person.
No, no, he's not, and that'ssomething that they you know
episode two does that so well.
I really liked that episode ofthe beginning of episode two
because again in a longer formatshow that whole idea keeps
running that like John Walker isthis American war hero.
He just doesn't have and hestill has integrity.

(01:24:49):
Like John Walker has a lot andI think the Thunderbolts is
going to do the heavy liftingfor that.
Like John Walker has like a lotof good qualities to him.

Speaker 2 (01:24:57):
He just he's a product of what he was built to
be and he's trying to find theline between you know, being
this executioner level, likeword of law, captain American,
like the integrity of just beinga good man yep, that's a great
point.
And and to like the like thejohn walker thing like he, he

(01:25:18):
embodied the idea of captainamerica the way he thinks of
captain america whereas sam,having actually known captain
america and fought alongside him, actually knows the qualities
of what makes Captain AmericaCaptain America, whereas John
Walker just saw Captain Americaas a cop Rogue calls him an

(01:25:39):
X-Men 97, America's top cop.

Speaker 1 (01:25:40):
I'll even go further he sees himself as a George
Washington.
I'm going to go across theriver with you guys.
That's not who Captain Americais.

Speaker 2 (01:25:54):
Obviously, we get that great fight scene, which
obviously doesn't have anythingto do with with, like the
character, but it does?

Speaker 1 (01:25:59):
I think it does it.
You know what it does.
It shows that even though thatthere's super soldiers around,
like sam can still hold his ownlike.
Obviously, the narrativeimplications of this fight are
heavy and that's what and wetalked about this before it's
one of my single favorite fightsin a comic book thing Is the
John Walker-Bucky-Sam fight.
I love, love, love.
It's brutal.
This fight is brutal.

(01:26:20):
He literally uses thepropulsion from the jets to
break John's hand.
It is gruesome.
I love this fight.
But episode 5 kind of halts.
You get back to this wholepoint like he goes to see isaiah
one more time and that's whereisaiah gives him like they will
net, like they're like you'restill, you're still trying, like
you're still trying to do it.
You don't understand.

Speaker 2 (01:26:39):
He's like no, I'm trying to be better, like I'm
trying something different yeah,we can't keep getting in this
cycle of you know, we can't keepputting you know a glass
ceiling over ourselves.

Speaker 1 (01:26:53):
Like maybe Other people are already trying to do
it.
Why can we?
Why do we have to do it toourselves?

Speaker 2 (01:26:57):
And you know what Sam is reticent Like maybe, maybe
you're right, but I have to try.
Yep, you know what I mean.
And then eventually theWakandans you know the you know
that great Wakandan subplot withBucky you know moves his way
over to Sam and he gets the newsuit.

Speaker 1 (01:27:17):
There's something poetic about it.
I just wanted to touch on that.
There's something poetic abouthim getting a suit from an
African country.
That's so advanced.
There's something poetic aboutthat as well, too.

Speaker 2 (01:27:28):
That's a great point yeah, that's a great point where
Steve's original suit was madeby the government.
The US government, yep, thegovernment.

Speaker 1 (01:27:37):
You're talking to the president of the government.
That's how people think JohnWalker is Captain America, like
his supporters.
Do Talk to the president of thegovernment.

Speaker 2 (01:27:44):
But no, that's a great point.
Steve's suit was made by the USgovernment and Sam suit was
made by Wakanda, which I thinkis really, really cool.
Um, we get a great Sam Wilsontraining montage with the shield
and him like training to becomecaptain America, like training
him, like pushing himself as faras he can possibly go as a

(01:28:04):
human man.

Speaker 1 (01:28:05):
He's proving to himself that he has the, that
one's like the physical, likeI'm proving that I'm the
physical person I can do.
I can do this all day, likehe's he's developing that
intrinsic thing that made crogers, c rogers I love and then
like, and then just jump intoepisode six.
I love love and I've alwaysliked that captain america

(01:28:25):
falcon design when it came out,I think it's a really cool
design and it played so well andI was so scared.
I was so scared when I knew thatthis is the direction they were
going to go.
They were going to give themthe white suit.
I was so scared and it looks sogood.
It looks so good in action,great and that episode six, and
I was just I'm thinking aboutthis because I have the episode
five fight scene on right nowI'll probably kick on the

(01:28:46):
episode six scenes in a second.
If this show didn't have somuch of a villain problem, this
would have been far and away thebest show that they had done up
until this point, because ifyou want to use the, the theory,
like the logic, like your show,your thing's only as good as
your villain, like.
If this show had a true greatvillain to go against him, woof.
This would have been this showI still think, is it's.

(01:29:08):
It is, I think, loki myfavorite.
This is my second favorite show, man.
Imagine if they would have hadGiancarlo Esposito as Sidewinder
for this.

Speaker 2 (01:29:17):
Ooh yeah.
Unfortunately, Carly Morgenthauand the Flag Smashers are just.
They don't justify the weightof those final moments where Sam
is trying to reason with her.

Speaker 1 (01:29:29):
There's such a half measure, because that's not the
point of this thing.
By that time You're over it.

Speaker 2 (01:29:33):
By that time, yeah and also it's like time and
place, Sam, that's kind of howthe audience feels.
The Flag Smashers don't needredemption Right, Like you know,
and then I mean Sharon Carterjust kills her.

Speaker 1 (01:29:53):
And she kills Bartok, and Bartok's time is over.

Speaker 2 (01:29:54):
Yeah, yeah, man, there really is an alternate
future where john carlos bozzitoplays sidewinder against him,
in this show specifically, andwell, I mean at the time of this
show, and then subsequently,like the cat 4, news broke
immediately after falcon thewinter soldier.
That was the plan.

Speaker 1 (01:30:07):
The plan was for cat 4 to be the serpent society why
can't the serpent society justbe the only villains of their
movie?
Why do they keep gettingbrushed aside?
Because Harrison Ford can playRed Hulk.
So they get pushed aside Everytime.
If I had a dime for every time,this would happen.
I'd have 20 cents.
But why do I have 20 cents?
Why do the Serpent SocietyJustice for the Serpent Society?

Speaker 2 (01:30:27):
I was just going to say you're a steadfast Serpent
Society supporter, is what I'mhearing, mm-hmm.
World-renowned terrorists, theSerpent Society Listen.

Speaker 1 (01:30:37):
I think personally that the Serpent Society has
misunderstood a bit the SerpentSociety no, don't do it.

Speaker 2 (01:30:47):
And then he's Captain America.
Yeah, he gives a big speech.
You got to do better, senator.
Look as far that what?
No, it's just more of the trade.
Oh, okay, sorry, you gotta dobetter, senator.
Look, he's not Steve Rogers yet.

Speaker 1 (01:31:02):
Yeah that it's rough, and I will say it that's rough
man.

Speaker 2 (01:31:07):
He didn't get the speech thing down yet.
He he didn't get the speechthing down yet.
He might get there.
Yeah, we'll see what this moviebrings.
Maybe he'll do a speech, butmaybe he's not meant to do a
speech.

Speaker 1 (01:31:16):
You know?
No, I think he's meant to do aspeech.

Speaker 2 (01:31:18):
You think?

Speaker 1 (01:31:19):
He can do a good speech, can he?
I think he's got it.
You want me, come and get me,and he's going to say that to
Ereshim's yeah, um, but then.

Speaker 2 (01:31:29):
But then you know, obviously at the end he takes
isaiah back to the exhibit andisaiah got his own room.

Speaker 1 (01:31:38):
Yeah, I love it I love it so special and we will
see isaiah bradley will returnin captain maker 4 and hopefully
elijah bradley will also return, because I still have that
theory that the serum passedthrough down to him so he still
is a bit enhanced himself andthen he'll get rid.
And then they might recognizethat and through the shield
files they might recognize thatand be like, hey, do you have

(01:31:58):
any of this super soldier serum?

Speaker 2 (01:31:59):
he's like maybe a little bit, and he's like maybe
a lot of bit, and then speakingof out out there theories, I'm
still holding on to my theorythat the isaiah bradley thing is
a false flag from Ross.

Speaker 1 (01:32:11):
From Ross.

Speaker 2 (01:32:12):
Yeah, not from the leader, potentially Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:32:17):
No, I don't think Ross is that evil.
I don't think he's that evil.
He's one of the Red Hulks, butI don't think he's that evil.
Just storing it out there, justkeeping that out there.
I don't think Ross.
I think Ross is beingmanipulated by the
intelligentsia, by Throughwhat's his name.

Speaker 2 (01:32:35):
The leader, the leader.

Speaker 1 (01:32:37):
Okay, let's talk Cap 4 for a second.
So that's him.

Speaker 2 (01:32:40):
He's Captain America now.

Speaker 1 (01:32:42):
And can the Marvel?
He's done it.
Can the MCU not forget that,please, in this film?
Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (01:32:51):
That's that, please, in this film.
Oh my god, that's my biggestfear.
I know it's, it's.
I don't think it's a fearthat'll be alleviated until I've
literally sat down and the filmis over and I don't see.
This is the problem.

Speaker 1 (01:32:58):
See, I'm having, I'm having quantum mania level
questions and I wouldn't havehad these, not the mcu run from
the past few years, I wouldn'thave had these I'm having
quantum mania level questionsabout this captain america movie
and it's making me very nervous.

Speaker 2 (01:33:11):
As we've just chronicled, this character is
great.
I love this character.
I love Anthony Mackie'sportrayal.
I just hope that this.
I hope they put as much love,care, attention, talent, writing
into this movie that they havefor the three previous Captain
America movies.
That's what I'm hoping.
I just don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:33:33):
The Fandango interview made me a little bit
feel a little bit better,because it seemed like they were
having fun, like that's thebiggest change, I think, is like
they're having a little bitmore fun.
Sure, but they, I think theyunderstand the weight, I do
think the backlog, heavy lifting, lifting.
I don't know if they becausethey did listen to this podcast
I think that I think thatgenuinely they were listening
and they said, like the avengersthing guess what one of the

(01:33:54):
promos just happened theavengers.
Like sam, I want you to rebuildthe avengers and he basically
asked like what happened?
weren't you the guy that was allanti-avengers the last time he
said you guys saved the universe.

Speaker 2 (01:34:06):
I love that they confronted that, because that
could have easily been like aplot hole, a massive plot hole
and this is obviously.

Speaker 1 (01:34:12):
Rest in peace to william.
Hurt like you still would havecrushed this the same way, but
there's something about harrisonford delivering these lines.
That's, it's just it's I agreemistakeable I agree he has it
like he's got the thing say thatagain.

Speaker 2 (01:34:26):
Come on, man.
Um no, I totally agree.
I totally agree and that you'reright.
That was.
They released that scene and itmade me raise my eyebrows a
little bit, like maybe, maybethis movie won't be as hulk
centric as we might think or itstill will be and she hulk.
Just well, they could remix theage of ultron end scene and

(01:34:49):
just get, get the new avengersthere man, but I wouldn't give
for a post-credit scene where hesays avengers assemble and it's
like a new crew of avengers.

Speaker 1 (01:34:58):
I think that would be really cool um, I need
something you want out of thismovie, something you don't want
out of this movie, and andsomething that is going to
propel this movie into thefuture of the mcu um, something
I want from this movie I, I, Iwant I think I kind of just
stepped on it a little bit, likeI want this movie to be on par

(01:35:19):
with those other Captain Americamovies.

Speaker 2 (01:35:22):
Um, I know, the first Avenger kind of gets lost a
little bit.
That movie's pretty good, thatmovie's really really good.
Um, so I just hope that prettygood, that movie's really really
good.
Um, so I just hope that I hopethey didn't just take their foot
off the gas because chris evansisn't in this one.
Like I hope I hope they made,like I hope they, I hope someone
somewhere sat down and watchedthose other three captain

(01:35:42):
america movies and we're likenow we gotta, we have a legacy.
You know, kind of in the sensethat, like sam is upholding the
legacy of actual Steve Rogers'Captain America, julius Ohna is
kind of carrying the legacy ofCaptain America the film
franchise, and I hope I mean Idon't wish this weight upon him,

(01:36:03):
but I hope he, I think heunderstands that.
I hope Marvel gave him theresources and the freedom to
live up to that.

Speaker 1 (01:36:15):
You know what I mean I think harrison ford might help
with that a little bit, becauseharrison ford seems like he's
for the creator versus he's forthe studio.

Speaker 2 (01:36:22):
He's also very protective of anthony mackie,
yeah, yeah, well, did you seethat that little clip when she
the interviewer and you know shedidn't mean anything by it, but
she was like how does it feellike being in a movie, like with
the black Captain America?
And he was like he's justCaptain America and he's like
better than that.

Speaker 1 (01:36:39):
He's Anthony Mackie and I'm like Harrison Ford's
awesome dude, they said it inall the stuff that they tell and
I love how like uncoy thatAnthony Mackie is too.
Like Anthony Mackie just kindof speaks his mind.
He still has like his PRtraining that like Evan Evan
just can't get and I love it.
It makes him so much more purebut like he still is just him,

(01:36:59):
that's just still Anthony Mackie.
And all the interviews too, andbut like you see, they're like
telling stories like Harrison's.
Like I just invited everybodyout for a drink after the set.
I told out for a drink afterthe set.
I told I it's, I'm on the setwith them and you're talking
about one of the single mostfamous as mo capping.
I can't, I couldn't believe ithe's mo capping the red hole.

Speaker 2 (01:37:17):
He's over 80 years old.
It's awesome, dude.
It's amazing.
I love how into that I didn'twhen this happened.
When this happened, I just Ijust did not think I thought he
was and he's admitted as suchthat like the check is nice.
But like I literally thought hewas and he's admitted as such,
so like the check is nice, butlike I literally thought he was,
I thought we were going to get.
I thought he was going to mailit in Mm-hmm.
Be perfectly honest with you,it does not seem that way.

(01:37:39):
No, he seems like he's.
He's really.
What turned me around was theComic-Con thing.
Yeah, when he showed up likethe red Hulk and he like yelled
and I'm like what is happening?
He's, he's really trying.
Yeah, he is.
I love it, and I think amotivated Harrison Ford injected
into this movie could elevateit to something really really

(01:38:01):
cool.

Speaker 1 (01:38:02):
Okay, so Harrison Ford is the thing that you're
excited about, or that you youreally want them to really get
after.
What's one thing that you'relike?
No, we got gotta make sure thisdoesn't happen.

Speaker 2 (01:38:12):
I think we've talked about this point for months and
it's don't lose Captain Americain the Captain America movie.
Don't turn this into Hulk.
Where's?

Speaker 1 (01:38:22):
the Hulk.
Even in Avengers 2.5 Civil War.
That was Captain America'sCivil War.

Speaker 2 (01:38:26):
That was still a Captain America story To the
point where we've talked aboutit before where Captain America
says Iron man is the antagonist.
Yes, he is.
They made Iron man theantagonist.
Iron man is not a hero orprotagonist of that movie, he's
the antagonist.
To the point where the finalfight is not Captain America vs
Zemo, it's Captain America andBucky vs Iron man.
So I hope Sam does not get lostin this movie.

(01:38:51):
I really need that to nothappen.
Then what was your third thing?

Speaker 1 (01:38:57):
The future of Marvel.
What's your big theory comingout of this movie?

Speaker 2 (01:39:02):
I mean the Avengers have to be formed, I think, or
at least concepted Team.
Maybe he throws papers down ona desk in a post-credit scene,
just like avengers.

Speaker 1 (01:39:13):
One of like this is this this is who we're thinking
for this team.
Who's your team?

Speaker 2 (01:39:19):
uh, I think thor has to be a perma avenger.
Um, I think captain marvel hasto be involved in some capacity.
I think sh Shang-Chi has to bethere for sure.
He was too important in thescope of whatever that was at
the end of Shang-Chi that I feellike he has to be there.

(01:39:41):
I do think She-Hulk will bethere in place of Banner.
I think Banner will be like.

Speaker 1 (01:39:50):
I'm out of the game man, but I have somebody that
can do exactly what I can, andshe's better at it than I am.

Speaker 2 (01:39:57):
Sorry nerds, yeah, she-hulk.
Oh no, it's the Woke Hulk again.

Speaker 1 (01:40:04):
The Woke Avengers.
My Woke incel bit is back.
She-hulk Black Captain America.

Speaker 2 (01:40:19):
Wasp.
I can't do this.
Um funny enough, like I don'tthink dr strange is there?
No, I don't think.
I don't even think spider-manis there?

Speaker 1 (01:40:24):
no not because they're all gonna be avengers by
the secret wars.

Speaker 2 (01:40:29):
Yeah, yeah, I mean like a team.
Yeah, like I'm talking like Ageof Ultron, like post-credits
scene, like yeah, I'm trying tobecause I'm I think I don't want
to step on yours because Ithink yours is going to involve
the Thunderbolts, like pittingthose two units against each
other.
So I'm trying to think likewho's facing who?
Like obviously Thor is notfacing the Thunderbolts, he'll

(01:40:52):
pace them all, but like he'sgonna be there, like when
they're like Shit, the universeis ending.
Thor's gonna be like I'mtagging in, like you don't tag
Thor in until, like the world isending, you don't tag Thor in
to fight the Thunderbolts.
Who do I got?
That might be it.
Little, small, little team.
Captain America, she-hulk,shang-chi, um, captain Marvel,

(01:41:18):
and that that might be.
That might be it.

Speaker 1 (01:41:20):
Little team, little team, little team to carry on
into whatever happens next um,my thing I need, I need, need,
need, need, need to happen inthis movie is them to.
What I was really thinkingabout, too, is I need this to.
I just it's the same thing.
I keep saying I need it tostill be in a semblance of a

(01:41:42):
film, like I don't, I don't needlike any crazy amount of Easter
eggs, I don't like I need liketight action, like action, tight
action, good narrative it'snarratively, I think that's my
biggest thing.
I need just good narrative fromthis movie.
I need a compelling narrativethat's not absurd and not insane
.
I need somethingcharacter-driven narrative that

(01:42:04):
I care about and that I'm goingto care about for time to come.

Speaker 2 (01:42:07):
Remember why Falcon and the Winter Soldier was so
good.
Don't lose that sauce in theRed Hulk of it all.

Speaker 1 (01:42:15):
Because I texted you and I said this movie has to
deal with this.
You have to deal with, you know, because they won't run away
from it.
You're going to have to dealwith the Captain America.
You're going to have to dealwith the Red Hulk.
You're going to have to dealwith the intelligentsia by the
leader.
You're going to have to dealwith Sabra.
You're going to have to dealwith him training his own
running mate.
Now You're going to have todeal with Tiamat.

(01:42:36):
We didn't even talk about that.
You're going to have to dealwith the adamantium in the room.
You're going to have to dealwith the serpent society in this
movie, In a two-hour movie.

Speaker 2 (01:42:45):
Yeah, Notoriously this is a pretty short movie.

Speaker 1 (01:42:49):
Yes For what they're trying to get after.
I'll just jump into the thingthat I really, really do not
want to happen.
It's the, it's the serpentsociety thing.
They can't just throw them inand throw them out.
You're wasting, john carloesposito if you do that.
That's an absolute, monumentalwaste.
If you do it, because I'mtrying to think of the structure

(01:43:10):
of everything, like what Ithink is like the serpent
society is like a contractkilling team, and like I think
that the leader is going to makesure, like let me take Captain
America off the board while Ican, and he's going to use the
Because I think the first team'sgoing to happen, and then in
the middle of the movie he'sgoing to be like all right, can
you go murder Captain America?
For me, that'd be nice to takehim out of here.
So it's just, the mishandlingof Giancarlo Esposito is a thing

(01:43:33):
that absolutely cannot happenin this movie.

Speaker 2 (01:43:35):
I agree.
Yeah, it's one of the thingsthat we're like.
When he got cast, I was likewhoa, who's he playing?

Speaker 1 (01:43:41):
Who's he playing?
They said it at that point.
This is before the Harrisonforecasting.
He's got to be somebody huge inthis movie, right, he's got to
be like.
Which villain could he beplaying?
And then they turn it intoSidewinder.

Speaker 2 (01:43:54):
Who's due to be in more stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:43:57):
Well, I know they got the rumors of Moon Knight
something Moon Knight relatedlike they were going to let
Sidewinder.

Speaker 2 (01:44:02):
The moon is watching.
The moon is watching.
Post-credits scene is justSidewinder and then the moon
hovering over him.

Speaker 1 (01:44:12):
The country rubbing his hands.
You know who he would be a goodvillain for.

Speaker 2 (01:44:20):
He would be a good villain, for he would be a fun
villain for the young avengersto fight like as a team, like
whatever john carlo espositoloves beating up kids.

Speaker 1 (01:44:23):
That's what I'm saying.
Like I'd be like him againstlike some he's already got beef
with baby yoda, he would be thebest like scooby-doo-esque
villain to fight like the youngavengers he's already got beef
with baby yoda.

Speaker 2 (01:44:33):
He can.
He can also beef with someyoung Avengers.
I would love for him and KateBishop to just argue for like
five minutes.
Why are you so mean?

Speaker 1 (01:44:47):
You are not Hawkeye.
You think some kids can comearound and usurp my name aside,
the Winders, I am.

Speaker 2 (01:44:56):
Sidewinder.
Why does he do that?
Because I fight for the SerpentSociety.

Speaker 1 (01:45:04):
Alright, my theory, some absolute Possibilities of
the Weapon X Program by the endof this movie Makes a lot of
sense.

Speaker 2 (01:45:16):
Makes a lot of sense Makes a lot of sense.
Yeah, I mean we haven't reallytalked about the adamantium
thing.

Speaker 1 (01:45:22):
That goes to my point of like they are putting a lot
of different stuff into thismovie.

Speaker 2 (01:45:26):
Yeah, I think people, like people, were psyched about
that idea and then I feel likepeople just completely forgot
about it Because the Red Hulk'sin this movie now Like Adam
Antium being introduced in theMCU and it's like kind of
getting like okay.
I think you know what else Ithink also kind of did.
That Is the fact that we havenow already seen Wolverine in
the MCU.
So I kind of like took the windout of the sails, because I

(01:45:49):
just feel like people are likeyeah okay, Wolverine's coming,
we know.
okay, Wolverine's coming, weknow, you know.
So I feel like there is anelement of that where they kind
of put a hat on a hat a littlebit by being like ooh, Adam
Antium in the MCU, but then wejust already got Wolverine.

Speaker 1 (01:46:03):
Unless you do an absolute mic drop of Mr
Sinister's around pulling somesort of strings, mr Sinister.

Speaker 2 (01:46:12):
Maybe John Collins' Esposito turns into Mr Sinister
at the end.

Speaker 1 (01:46:17):
No, I know a lot of people wanted him to play
something X-Men related andthat's why I was so surprised.
You know what I think?
I think they had a bigger rolefor him intended, but then they
got Harrison Ford.
So they were like Harrison Ford, giancarlo Esposito like an
ultimate bad win-lose.
It's like the worst becauseit's the biggest win but also

(01:46:37):
the biggest loss, and like Ijust can't justify a world where
, like you get GiancarloEsposito and he's Sidewinder,
that's I can't, no man it'sSidewinder.

Speaker 2 (01:46:50):
I can't.
I can't do this anymore.
Diamondback's also in thismovie, correct?

Speaker 1 (01:46:57):
I need it to be the Diamondback from Luke Cage.

Speaker 2 (01:47:00):
With the weird Helmet , helmet.

Speaker 1 (01:47:03):
I don't know what happened in Luke Cage man.
That first half of the firstseason was so money.

Speaker 2 (01:47:07):
Diamondback.
What the hell, what the hell.

Speaker 1 (01:47:11):
What's his name?
Seth Rollins got cut from thismovie, yeah, and he talked about
it.

Speaker 2 (01:47:15):
He did, yeah, which makes sense.
I mean, this movie underwentpretty substantial reshoots, so
I guess that does make a lot ofsense.
But yeah, they had to make moreroom for the Hulk stuff.
Yeah, this movie is all overthe map.

Speaker 1 (01:47:32):
Can we agree on a big thing that's probably going to
happen, mark Ruffalo being inthis movie?
You have all the wholecharacters in this movie.
You're telling me that markruffalo is not in this movie?

Speaker 2 (01:47:42):
it would be really weird if he wasn't in it, which
I don't know if that's adamnation of me or a damnation
of how this movie was built.
But like you have ross, youhave the leader.
You bet he's in this movie, bethe's in this movie, bet he is
in this movie.
Nope and nobody.
I feel like.
I feel like the alien from themoon meme and nobody's talking
about this Liv Tyler in thismovie and nobody is talking

(01:48:05):
about this.
Um, yeah, she is in this.
That's weird.
Why would they do?

Speaker 1 (01:48:13):
that?
Why would they do that?
Just put him in the movie andhave him fight with Sam.
Have him fight Sam, sam gonnafight, wait Sam with Sam.
He's gonna fight two hulks.
He's gonna fight Erish and thejudge.

Speaker 2 (01:48:26):
He has to get some practice in he's gonna fight two
hulks in this movie what's Hulkworse than him fighting two
hulks, them fighting three Hulks.

Speaker 1 (01:48:35):
Fighting the woke Hulk, no fighting she Hulk.

Speaker 2 (01:48:39):
What's next?
They Hulk.
Alright, maybe I crossed theline there it's fine.

Speaker 1 (01:48:49):
No, you have to do the across the spot.
I made a mistake.

Speaker 2 (01:48:52):
I made a mistake.
I made a mistake, man.
If they're hiding Ruffalo,they've been hiding Ruffalo this
whole time and he's going to bein this that'd be a pretty good
reveal.
Yeah, Because there's noindication or inclination that
he's anywhere near this movie.
So if they were able to hidethat, that's pretty impressive.
The leader, Betty.

(01:49:13):
They brought all the IncredibleHulk characters back, except
the Hulk.

Speaker 1 (01:49:18):
Yeah, he's gotta be in this movie.
How's Sam beating him?
Well, and also, which Conk himin the head with the shield,
which because I've been tryingto piece together all the clips
they've been releasing and allthe trailers they've been
releasing, because they've beenreleasing a lot Like this one's
had a lot, a lot, a lot ahead ofthe days and I think purposely

(01:49:39):
because you know, this moviejust not gonna have the same
reverence as fantastic four does, or bolts, I think.

Speaker 2 (01:49:43):
But I think the cherry blossom fight is like
earlier in the movie how earlythough well, because I think
they said like like I don'tthink he can go from just
chatting with ross to himturning into a red hulk to him
just chatting with ross againthe runtime really bugs me about
this movie.
Hey man, I know we just hadthat role outside, but we got to
reform the avengers.

Speaker 1 (01:50:04):
Well, I think the end end scene is the team and stuff
, the adamantium.
But why?
But who's he fighting there?
Well, unless the leader is like, well, he's fighting the other
countries because the leadermanipulates fighting the other
countries, he's fighting all theother countries, like, well,
he's fighting the othercountries because the leader
manipulates, he's fighting theother countries, he's fighting
all the other countries Becausehe's the only one that's like,
no, they can't get their handson me.
But who is he fighting?
It's the Top Gun Maverick thing.

(01:50:25):
They're fighting the, the Rush.

Speaker 2 (01:50:29):
Like if he spent the first half of the movie fighting
our Red Hulk he's gotta be, notin the first half, not in the
first half.

Speaker 1 (01:50:44):
It's like this.
The fourth act.
Who's he fighting on teamisland?
He can't fight the leader.
No, paste him the governments.
He's fighting what?
Unless sidewinder comes back?
No, no, there gets gonna belike sidewinder, because I think
one of the clips says like,like, what happened in
washington was like a tragedyand they're, they're on the
submarine or they're on the boat.
So the team and stuff has to bethe post like that, not that
has to be that.

Speaker 2 (01:51:03):
So he's just gonna fight a bunch of guys.
Yes, it's gonna be like.
No, he can't just fight a bunchof guys at the end of the movie
.
I don't know like because hefought the red hulk in the in
the beginning of the movie.
Yeah, I don't understand how anyof this works.
That's a weird placement.
You've got to fight the randomguys first and then you fight
the Red Hulk, not the other wayaround.

(01:51:24):
Because I'll tell you what, ifI was one of those random guys
and Captain America, who justfought the Red Hulk, showed up,
I'm leaving.
I'm not fighting that guy, I'mnot going anywhere near that guy
, unless he's going to fightIsaiah Bradley at the end.

Speaker 1 (01:51:38):
No, absolutely not, Absolutely not.
I don't think so.

Speaker 2 (01:51:41):
The leader's like look at this, the brainwashed
Captain America.
No, he's too old.
Are you ageist right now?

Speaker 1 (01:51:48):
No, no, he can fight for an old guy?
Sure, sure, I want to see himfight.
Steve old steve, yes.
Joe biden, yes this guy.
This guy loves watching theelderly fight that wouldn't be a
funny fight it would be theystill got a bit of the serum
left in them, but they're stillold, so it like cancels out that

(01:52:11):
would be pretty good.

Speaker 2 (01:52:12):
I don't know, man, I don't know what's gonna happen.

Speaker 1 (01:52:13):
I don't know what's gonna happen that's the one
thing about this movie is, likeusually in a movie, that should
be a good thing.
I don't know what's gonnahappen.
But now I'm like I don't knowwhat's gonna happen I think it
has something to do with spiderno cut it out.

Speaker 2 (01:52:25):
Get another old, another guy with a wingsuit.
The vulture shows up.
Him and captain america arehaving like a dog fight in the
air.
We didn't even talk aboutJoaquin this whole time.
He's got some work to do.
I need to see a little more outof him.

Speaker 1 (01:52:40):
I like him, I like Danny Ramirez.
I think Danny Ramirez is greathow do you differentiate him
from Sam where at that point inthe MCU, though, like what makes
?
What makes Joaquin Joaquin?
That's the thing that you gottaask in this movie.
That's a good point.
He can't just be a sub-variantconduit.
They're both flying guys andthey both have similar.

(01:53:00):
They're ex-military guys thatgo to the symbol of Captain
America to help propel them.

Speaker 2 (01:53:06):
He feels very sidekick-y in the way that Sam
didn't.
Sam wasn't.

Speaker 1 (01:53:09):
Yep, that's a good point.
I'm gonna watch Winter Soldiertonight.

Speaker 2 (01:53:13):
That is a good point.
How do they differentiate them?
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:53:16):
You make them a human being?
You gave them, but again, thisis a two-hour movie.
You're already asking a lot outof a lot of people?

Speaker 2 (01:53:23):
Yeah, I have.
There's a lot of characters inthis movie.
I have a weird.
I think he gets.

Speaker 1 (01:53:30):
He's going to get sidelined.
I think quite a bit sequences,but like what makes him
different?

Speaker 2 (01:53:34):
otherwise he's gonna be like yeah man, go, sam, go.
Like that I think I don't knowwhere else he fits, to be
perfectly honest, into this inthis movie besides sidekick and
like it's unfortunate, likewhat's your thing?

Speaker 1 (01:53:49):
like who are you?
What's your thing?
What do you do?
I want to know who you are.
That's captain america's thefourth yeah, I'm like I said.

Speaker 2 (01:53:58):
I think the last couple weeks have massaged my,
my tensions a little bit also.

Speaker 1 (01:54:03):
Everybody relax about the anthony anthony mackie
quote-unquote controversy.
What an absurd thing to eventhink about being upset about.

Speaker 2 (01:54:14):
Yeah, insane, that's wild.
Yeah, I think what's come outin the last few weeks has
massaged some of my concerns,but I'm still.
This movie, I don't know.
This movie makes me nervous.
I just I don't know.
I truly don't know what toexpect.
And normally that's a goodthing, but it's like I don't
know what to expect in the senseof trepidation I'm like I have

(01:54:38):
there.
It's because it's Marvel,because if this were any other
movie, there are so many redflags about this movie that,
like in any other circumstance,I'd be like, oh no, this could
be like a disaster.
But because it's Marvel andbecause I trust Marvel and it's

(01:54:58):
a character I really like andHarrison Ford's in it, part of
me is like I think this moviemight be really good.

Speaker 1 (01:55:07):
I'm going to stick bold, stake claim on like this
movie can be solid.
Nice it could be.
This movie might be okay, Likeyou got to kind of get, kind of
get into the realm of how youthink about so let me pull this
up quick.

Speaker 2 (01:55:20):
I have my Marvel MCU rankings.

Speaker 1 (01:55:23):
And I think ours are very, very similar.
There's differences, Like Ihave Eternals at 1.

Speaker 2 (01:55:27):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's differences, but like so
when you say this movie mightbe solid.

Speaker 1 (01:55:31):
Okay, so let me get my ranking out too.

Speaker 2 (01:55:34):
So when you say this movie might be solid, right, are
we talking?
Because, like in the middle ofmy pack, here I have the two
Doctor Strange movies, captainAmerica 1, spider-man, far From
Home, eternals Like that.
Is that what we're talkingabout?

Speaker 1 (01:55:51):
Like that kind of range.
Okay, so I might have to alsore-rank these movies, because
times change your mind, but myfear is that this movie is going
to ride along the lines of,like Thor one, Ant-Man and the
Wasp Hulk the worst.

Speaker 2 (01:56:07):
So it's like at the like, not the bottom, but like
the like approaching the bottomRight, cause I have like, in
that kind of rain, have, likethe marvels, ant-man, one thor,
love and thunder, incrediblehulk ant-man and the wasp, like
that yeah, my true fear is thatthis movie is going to get down
to the ant-man quantumania loveand thunders like thor the dark

(01:56:30):
worlds, like that's my true fear.

Speaker 1 (01:56:31):
I'm gonna have to really re-rank this because I
personally think I have captainmarvel a little too low I think
I also have a little too lowlooking at it.
Yeah, a little too low.
I think this is gonna soundinsane.
I have iron man 2 and 3 alittle too low I have iron man.

Speaker 2 (01:56:46):
No, I think I have iron man 2 in an appropriate
place I have the marvels alittle too high after
re-watching that movie.
I think I have that movie,probably properly placed.

Speaker 1 (01:56:56):
I have it a little too high.

Speaker 2 (01:56:57):
I have Thor 11 Thunder way too high.

Speaker 1 (01:56:59):
I have it.
I think it's the second worstMarvel movie that there's ever
been.

Speaker 2 (01:57:03):
I have it way higher than that.

Speaker 1 (01:57:06):
I think it's funny because I was so excited for
both of those, but I hadQuantumania and Thor 11 Thunder
in my bottom three.
I think that's some of theworst that you can get out of
this.

Speaker 2 (01:57:18):
Yeah, yeah, I have to re-rank these two, I think.

Speaker 1 (01:57:21):
Black Widow, I might have a little too low to.

Speaker 2 (01:57:23):
I have Black Widow as the second worst.

Speaker 1 (01:57:27):
Maybe it needs to belong there, because I have to
think about the other movies,Like I think I might have
Guardians 2 a little too low.

Speaker 2 (01:57:35):
Where do you have guardians to 14?
I have an 11.

Speaker 1 (01:57:39):
I think I have a little too low.
I see, here's my nuclear take.
As much as that movie is fun towatch the second half I have no
way home.
Way too high.

Speaker 2 (01:57:48):
Where do you have that?

Speaker 1 (01:57:48):
I have an 11.
I have a 13.
That's like one of my nuclearhot takes of the mc but I
wouldn't put it much lower than13, no no, because that the
second half of that movie, evencameo fest aside I have like a
fun.

Speaker 2 (01:58:00):
So for perspective, I have no way home above avengers
one.

Speaker 1 (01:58:04):
I do too deadpool and wolverine I oh, that's the
movie I didn't have, becausethere's 34 movies.
Yes, I have 30, yeah, 34 I haveto add, okay, so let me put
deadpool wolverine 15th and thatwas me just kind of spitballing
.
But 15 is good.
Let me add Deadpool andWolverine in here, and then
we'll talk a little bit.
I'm going to just put it 12,and then I'm going to just move

(01:58:25):
stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:58:25):
I'm not moving anything else right now.

Speaker 1 (01:58:27):
Let me put it 12, and then I'll move.

Speaker 2 (01:58:29):
I have it 15.
It's better than no Way Home.
I have them close, but I haveno Way Home.
Better I have.

Speaker 1 (01:58:37):
Shang-Chi 12th.
I have Shang-Chi 13th because Ijust accidentally put Deadpool
and Wolverine there.
I'm putting Deadpool andWolverine above Thor Ragnarok.

Speaker 2 (01:58:49):
I have Thor Ragnarok 10th.
My top 10 is prettyunassailable.

Speaker 1 (01:58:53):
I'm putting Shang-Chi above Spider-Man.
No Way Home I have.

Speaker 2 (01:58:55):
Shang-Chi also above Spider-Man no Way Home.
My top 10 is prettyunassailable.
I'm putting Shang-Chi aboveSpider-Man no Way Home.
I have Shang-Chi also aboveSpider-Man no Way Home.
My top 10, I think I've saidthis before when we did this
last time are prettyunassailable and it's going to
take a special movie to be abovethem.
Winter Soldier Winter Soldier 1, guardians 1, avengers Infinity
War Guardians 3, civil War 5,black Panther 2, 6, avengers
Endgame 7, iron man 1, 8.
Black Panther 9, thor Ragnarok10.

(01:59:17):
I think I've said it, it'sgoing to take a pretty special
movie to crack that top 10.

Speaker 1 (01:59:23):
Fantastic Four will probably get there.
I have this otherworldlyfeeling that Fantastic Four is
going to get into this top 3.
It might take Guardians 3 outof the top three.

Speaker 2 (01:59:38):
Oh, you have Guardians 3 in the top three.

Speaker 1 (01:59:39):
Mine is, guardians 1 is 1, winter Soldier is 2,
guardians 3 is 3.
And you can toss up some days.
For me, there's some days whereI think Guardians of the Galaxy
, volume 3, is the best MCUmovie that's ever been released.
That is an absolutely specialfilm.

Speaker 2 (01:59:53):
I think that sometimes too, and then I'm just
looking at Avengers, InfinityWar, and I'm like what's better
than that movie?

Speaker 1 (02:00:00):
I have Infinity War 4 , I have Civil War 5.

Speaker 2 (02:00:03):
So we have the same top five, just in a different
order.

Speaker 1 (02:00:05):
Endgame.
I have sixth, Black Panther.
I have seventh, Wakanda Forever, I have eighth.
I'm going to swap that.
Actually I'm going to put Ironman in eighth, Wakanda Forever
in ninth and I'm going to haveThor Ragnarok in.

Speaker 2 (02:00:15):
We have the exact same top ten, just in a
different order.
So, like I'm saying, captainAmerica, I think, falls.

Speaker 1 (02:00:25):
Which, to be fair, far From Home, needs to go down
this list.

Speaker 2 (02:00:28):
I have in the middle of the pack, quote-unquote, I
have Avengers 1, deadpool andWolverine, spider-man,
homecoming, age of Ultron,eternals those are all good
movies.
So if Captain America ends upthere, great.
It would be the third rankedCaptain America movie for me if
it ends up in that spot, becauseI have Captain America 1 below
that mark.

(02:00:48):
So if Captain America 4 isbetter than that, I feel like
that's a pretty good success.
We'll revisit this rankingafter next week.
We'll place Captain America 4Brave New World amongst the
pantheon of Marvel movies.

Speaker 1 (02:01:06):
I am just praying to God it doesn't get in that last
five range.
Oh Lord, I'm hoping and hoping.
I'm very scared.

Speaker 2 (02:01:14):
But we'll see.
We shall see that's going to doit for us this week while we
mull over our MCU rankings.
You can follow us on Twitter atProjectIneve underscore pod.
You can follow us on Instagram.

Speaker 1 (02:01:26):
That's the Project Infinite pod.

Speaker 2 (02:01:27):
It's never usually that early.
I know I forgot the other twothings TikTok and YouTube at the
Project Infinite podcast.
Going to get more active onTikTok now that it's not banned.
I stayed away from the TikTokposting for a while because I
didn't know if it was going tobe a thing anymore, but it's
probably still a thing.
So I'm hoping to get more clipsup there because the Joker clip
did pretty well on TikTok.

(02:01:48):
Then why'd you make the movie?
Why'd you make the movie ToddPhillips?

Speaker 1 (02:01:52):
He's never, the Joker .

Speaker 2 (02:01:54):
Yeah, next week we're gonna talk.
I mean, we don't crazy enoughlike we don't have a whole lot
of stuff to talk about the SuperBowl, because all the trailers
we thought we were gonna get wegot.
So I don't know maybe we justtalk about our favorite sports
movies we could do that, or wecould just hold off on doing an
episode until after we seeCaptain America and just do an

(02:02:15):
episode either that Thursday orFriday, and maybe just do
Captain America next week.

Speaker 1 (02:02:21):
You guys aren't going to be ready for the straight
out of theater reactions.
Those are the ones that we'regoing to start doing, those the
straight out of theaters.
We're going to just interviewpeople outside of the theater.

Speaker 2 (02:02:29):
Yeah, what did you think of the black Captain
America?

Speaker 1 (02:02:32):
They made him he's what so?

Speaker 2 (02:02:36):
yeah, maybe that's just what we do, unless
something happens during theSuper Bowl that just no Banes
here.

Speaker 1 (02:02:43):
Oh no.

Speaker 2 (02:02:43):
Yeah, let's review the Dark Knight Rises.
Next week We'll do aretrospective on the.
Actually, we'll just do aretrospective on the football
field scene from the Dark KnightRises.

Speaker 1 (02:02:55):
It'll be the longest episode we've ever done.

Speaker 2 (02:02:57):
It's going to be pretty tough to top that Shogun
episode.
That Shogun episode was prettylong.
So yeah, maybe that's what wedo.
Maybe we just hold off and do alate release next week and just
do Captain America review,because we're going to do one
anyway.
We'll see.

(02:03:18):
We'll see what happens.
Maybe we'll come up withsomething to do early next week
before Captain America.
Until then, from me, from theCareful man.
You know what, go ahead.
I wasn't going to do that.
I was going to do a FantasticFour related one.

Speaker 1 (02:03:33):
No, you can do it, go ahead.
No, no, no.

Speaker 2 (02:03:38):
I'm not doing it.

Speaker 1 (02:03:38):
I'm giving you permission this week.

Speaker 2 (02:03:39):
No, that's a trap.
No, go ahead.
Nope, nope, nope.
From the Reed Richards of thepodcast no, that's not a good
thing, yeah, it is.
No, it's not.
It's a fine thing.
He's a piece of crap.
No, no, no, no, no, you don'thave kids yet.

Speaker 1 (02:03:55):
It's fine, reed Richards canonically is a bad
person.
He's a bad dad.
He's a decent to bad person.
I love this being.
The hot take is that ReedRichards is just no good.

Speaker 2 (02:04:07):
He's a bad dad, but he might be okay as a person.

Speaker 1 (02:04:19):
He's the Captain America.
Brave New World of Persons inamerica.
Brave new world of persons hemight be okay.

Speaker 2 (02:04:22):
He's a middle of the road person, he's a genius, he's
a phenomenal hero.
You are the reed richards prversion reed richards of the
podcast, who is a great person.
He has dinner at seven everysunday.
You think the john walker likeno matter what.

Speaker 1 (02:04:41):
You think that John Walker cultists would like to
read Richard's Lovers?
Do you think those peopleinteract on the internet and
they're just like See, this islike where?
I no, because they're all fromthe 60s.
This is where, oh no, this isall.
They basically should be fromthe 60s for the John Walker ones
too.
But this is why I like the idea.
This is why I like the idea oflike the oh man, what if they
did set that in the 60s and JohnWalker takes the shield a few

(02:05:02):
years later in the 60s?

Speaker 2 (02:05:11):
We gotta go, man, we gotta get out of here.

Speaker 1 (02:05:14):
We didn't even talk about Jeffrey Wright's the
Watcher.
That's gonna be in theFantastic four probably that'd
be pretty cool.

Speaker 2 (02:05:21):
What the hell is this ?

Speaker 1 (02:05:22):
airshams.
The judge is gonna be in thismovie stop stealing my bit.

Speaker 2 (02:05:27):
Airships I can't wait for airship to show up in the
thunder.
He's not gonna wait.
No, you switched movies.
No, he's gonna be in all ofthem.
Oh yeah, he's going to be inevery single Marvel movie, just
like this.

Speaker 1 (02:05:35):
What did you guys do to my son?
You killed Tiamat.
I killed my son.

Speaker 2 (02:05:41):
You killed my son.
He brings freaking CaptainAmerica up there, like he did
with the other Eternals.

Speaker 1 (02:05:47):
Captain America's.
Just like you want me, you wantme.

Speaker 2 (02:05:51):
Come and get me Hulk.
Who have the thunderbolts.
Is he taking up there?

Speaker 1 (02:05:55):
ghost, ghost, yeah ghost is gonna be like what,
what's going on?

Speaker 2 (02:06:01):
she vanishes and Erisham's like what?
What Erisham, erisham literallycreates the Eternals is
bamboozled by, by invisibility.
How did you?
What did you?

Speaker 1 (02:06:15):
no way, how did you learn what did you no way?
How did you learn this power?

Speaker 2 (02:06:20):
I must know this power.
He didn't To be fair, he didn'tmake an eternal luck advantage.

Speaker 1 (02:06:26):
He said, dude, what?
No, he's literally like whydidn't I think of that man Dang
it.

Speaker 2 (02:06:30):
I'm Aresham the Judge .

Speaker 1 (02:06:31):
I'm not Aresham the Smart One.
I didn't think of that, damn.

Speaker 2 (02:06:35):
Are we ever going to see those characters again?
No, no, we're not.

Speaker 1 (02:06:39):
There was a time where we would have.

Speaker 2 (02:06:44):
Yeah, but it's not this day.
All right, guys, we'll see younext week for some random thing,
or we're going to reviewCaptain America when it comes
out.
Until then, goodbye Peace.

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146 - Exploring Nostalgia and New Beginnings: Fantastic Four, Jurassic World Rebirth, and Captain America's Next Chapter

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}146 - Exploring Nostalgia and New Beginnings: Fantastic Four, Jurassic World Rebirth, and Captain America's Next Chapter