Retiring Superwoman: Breaking the Chains of Perfectionism ft. Aseanté Renee [REPLAY]

Episode Transcript
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Aliya Cheyanne (00:00):
Welcome back to the Prolific Hub podcast.
I'm so excited today to bejoined by my dear friend,
ashante Rene.
If you've been listening for awhile, you know I have mentioned
her a few times on this show,that I've been wanting to get
her on, and I'm so honored thatI'm able to have this
conversation with her and shareit on the podcast, and I hope

(00:23):
that you will find it asvaluable and as beautiful as I
do.
Ashante is a dear friend, she'sa mentor and she's actually a
former boss at an organizationthat we used to work at, and I'm
just so grateful to have her inmy life.
So, without further ado, let'sjump into the episode.

(00:43):
Hi everyone, welcome back to theProlific Hub podcast.
I'm your host, aaliyah Cheyenne, and I'm so excited today to be
joined by Ashante Rene.
Hi Ashante, hi Aaliyah.
Oh my gosh, you should Wow.
Okay.
So for anyone who's beenlistening to the show for a
while, you know I keep talkingabout this woman who is a former

(01:06):
boss of mine, a mentor and afriend who I have wanted on the
show for a long time, and she'sfinally here.
I'm so excited.
Yes, so Ashante, as I mentioned, is a former boss of mine.
We worked at an organizationthat will not be named, but she

(01:28):
brought me on board there and itwas just such an honor to work
under her leadership and be apart of her team.
She has remained an incrediblementor to me.
She's the one who made me feellike I could even do the
consulting thing a couple ofyears ago and help me with one

(01:50):
of my first clients ever, and Ihave the honor of like
supporting her with launchingsome of her work and doing some
comms to support her and socialmedia, and I'm just so honored
to have you here today.
Yeah, I'm going to pass.
Thank you, no, thank you.

(02:11):
Okay, before I get too mushy,ashante, I would love for you to
introduce yourself.
I always ask guests tointroduce themselves how they
would love to be seen and knownin the world today, so I would
love for you to share that.

Aseanté Renee (02:29):
That's such a good question.
I was like, how would I love tobe seen today.
I would love to be seen todayas Do Not Disturb.

I mean, that's me kind of every day Wow.

So yeah, I'm Ashante Rene.
I am the founder and chiefwellness officer of the axon
group.
I'm also the founder and ed ofthe susu house and I've started
the retiring superwoman campaign, and, and, and, and, and I
think I want to be I don't eventhink I want to be known as a
protector of Black women, as ahealer, as a supporter, as an

(03:10):
advocate, as a cheerleader, asthe whole girl, girlfriend
support.
I just really love us.
I really love us, really loveus.
And I want to be known assomeone who helps us heal, helps
us elevate, helps us check out,helps us be soft, helps us be

(03:34):
powerful, helps us be mediocreif we choose to like, helps us
have agency and determine ourown path and our own journey.
So, yeah, that's what I want tobe known for.

Yes, and that you are, because so many of
those things you've done for me,so I you know we're doing our
podcast, but it's also friend tofriend.
I treasure you a lot, so thankyou, it's going to be the same
whole podcast.

I know, right, I have an issue with Black women
loving each other, then youshouldn't be on the spot.
You shouldn't be listening tothis podcast.

Listen, that part, that part, okay, so let's
get into all the good stuff.
So you mentioned multiplethings the Axon Group, the Susu
House, retiring superwomancampaign so we're going to talk
about all of those as their ownthings.
But first can you tell us alittle bit more about the Axon

(04:29):
group Like, what is the Axongroup?
Folks who may not be aware ofit, and then we'll talk a little
bit more about Suzu House.

Yeah, so I am a licensed therapist and I pivoted
into doing executive coachingand performance coaching,
specifically with melanatedwomen and, even more specific,
with Black women executives,because we are often the ones
that are called in to fix issuesthat we didn't create, to stand

(04:59):
at the edge of the glass cliffwhich creates burnout, which
creates exhaustion, and we arecalled in to change the world
with the resources of the magicschool bus knapsack Like you get
a pencil and eraser and apeanut butter sandwich.
Go fix my organization.
You need more resources.
Here's some duct tape.

(05:20):
Why couldn't you make it work?
And so I really just wanted tostart working consistently with
us around that, and the the Axongroup is a consulting,
performance coaching firm thatreally focuses on us, with an
element that's woven through,that's just connected to our
healing, because I think that'sthe heart of everything that we

(05:43):
do, and so I really do helppeople create lives.
They don't have to escape that,they don't have to take two to
four weeks off to go recoverfrom, and they don't have to
figure out a strategy becausethey're already burned out.
It's not so much about a dreamcareer or a dream relationship.
It's about having a dream lifethat you actually deserve.
So create lives where you don'thave to escape them.

(06:06):
You actually enjoy them.
The balance looks like ebbs andflows and, most importantly, I
create spaces where you get tobe comfortable to be whatever
version of yourself shows upthat day.

Yeah, I love that, but the thing that's
coming up for me and you sayingall of that is like man, how are
you doing that for yourself?

Writers make the worst patients and therapists
make the worst clients.
Actually, all of the stuff thatI have created, all the
different platforms, come from aplace of I wasn't doing this
for myself, or I was burned outmyself, or I am my own
recovering perfectionist, and sowhat I often tell people is I

(06:49):
don't come at this work as anexpert.
I come at this work as someonewho's living it with you, and so
I'm walking alongside you inyour journey, and some areas I
have already experienced, so Ihave knowledge, and some areas I
believe you came to me for usto learn from each other.
I don't think anything I've beenthrough has been wasted,
because it all gets to be anopportunity to be in service of
someone else at some point, andso I am helping myself as I'm

(07:14):
you know, both have my ownresources to pour into me and as
I'm helping other women,because you get to see yourself
in other people and you know,there's moments where you're
giving advice or sharing stuffYou're like, ooh, that that one
was for me too.
Hold on, I'm going to go rightback when going.
So it is a and it is a form ofaccountability for me, like part
of having these platforms andhaving these companies and

(07:36):
having these nonprofits are alsoaccountability points for me.
I'm like how can I talk aboutthis?
You know and and want this andneed this for other women and
I'm not doing it for myself.
And in what areas am I notdoing it for myself?
A great example is an event wehosted for, I think the launch
event we did for Susu House, andit was about women resting and

(07:58):
our healing.
We brought in Octavia Rahim atone point and I'm like how can I
be talking to people about howthey should heal and how they
should rest and how they get topause, and I'm stressing out
about putting the event on, orI'm stressing my team on putting
the event on.
That's counterproductive.
We're not going to.
Oftentimes, with a lot ofnonprofits and just a lot of
spaces, period, we dismantle thething outside of our office

(08:21):
that we're ultimately recreatinginside of our office, and I
never, yeah.
And so these, these platformsare those checks and balances
for me where it's like, okay,you offer this to other people,
where are you doing it for you?
And so it forces it to staypresent for me, because you know
, you know, I got the memory ofdory.
If something's not in front ofme, I'd be like, oh, that's
what's right.
Right, I was supposed to bebreathing.

My bad, my bad my goodness, that is how I I I
do it for myself.

It's often um, it's often the accountability
that I'm working in or thepeople that I get to work with
yeah, I think that's such abeautiful answer.

So on a previous episode we had a friend of
yours on the show, jen Roberts.
I love Jen, yes, hi, jen.
The founder of Color GirlsLiberation Lab.
She said a quote on thatepisode where you actually
reminded her like hey, this workthat you're doing is also for

(09:23):
you.
Like, hey, this work thatyou're doing is also for you.
So I think it's very fullcircle that you're saying like
you know, the work that you'redoing with Axon Group, with
Sousou House, with RetiringSuperwoman, is also for you.
It's an accountability practice, it's a way for you to see
yourselves in the women thatyou're supporting and it's a way
for you to remind yourself likehey, like I need to be living

(09:44):
these principles too.
So I think that's beautiful.
Thank you, yeah, on that note,you brought up Sisu House in
that answer.
So can you tell all the peopleswhat is a Sisu House?

Sisu House.
So Sisu House was also birthedout of.
Most of these things getbirthed out of a frustration.
It's like why don't we havethis thing?
Okay, well, fine, I'm going tojust create something so I don't
have to keep asking people andgetting told no.
So Susu House is a nonprofitthat's focused on healing equity

(10:21):
, specifically as it relates topractitioners and those in the
community who may not have thefinancial means to access
different healing modalities.
We often talk about equity asit relates to criminal justice
reform, social justice reform,education, reproductive rights,
and I think all of those thingsare important.

(10:42):
And you know cause I don't liketo say but, and if we get all
these things that we're saying,that we want and we are in a
more healed space and we aremore healed versions of
ourselves, we're just going tocontinue to recreate bad
patterns that we have learned.
You know, it's going to put newwine and old wineskin type of
thing.
So Susu House was created toreally just work on healing

(11:03):
equity because I think that is acornerstone of what actual
change is going to look like inour society.

Yeah.

And part of it was for people who may not have
the financial means, because,unfortunately, healing equity is
a bit of a privilege.
It's a privilege to be able totake a break or take time off if
you're burned out, or to eventhink about the existential
things around.
What do I actually need?
Who am I?
Or to even think about theexistential things around.
What do I actually need?
Who am I Like if I'm justtrying to pay bills?
I'm trying to keep the lightson, I'm trying to keep a roof
over my head.
You know what I don't have timefor To go see how a sound bath

(11:30):
makes me feel.

Yeah.

Because I also believe you know, therapy is not
the only like talk, therapy isnot the only form or the only
healing modality that resonateswith people.
But if you're trying to justlive day to day, you don't have
time or access or the privilegeto pause and even think through
those things.
And I wanted to make thataccessible to us, especially
from an indigenous perspective,because most of these healing
modalities come from us anywayand they were taken from us and

(11:57):
now sold back to us, and so Ijust wanted to bring what's
already innate in us in somekind of way, and so I wanted to
offer healing events for freefor people to try out what may
work for them or what you knowfor them, to get curious about
different ways that they canaccess resources that will just
help them in whatever traumathey're working through, be it

(12:18):
talk therapy, human design,astrology, sound bath work,
reiki work, energy work, chakrawork, herbal work, whatever that
means for you and connected towhatever that means for you and
your religious beliefs.
I didn't want there to be afinancial barrier to that.
Finances shouldn't stop someonefrom being able to heal through
trauma.
Secondly, I wanted to make itequitable for practitioners,

(12:41):
because a lot of practitionersthat look like me go into this
work to work with people thatlook like us, and we also have
to be able to pay our bills.
And so there's a it's afrustration around.
I want to help my people, butmy people can't afford my rates.
So how do I, you know, have asustainable life for myself and
help my folks?
And so, coming in and makingsure with the SUSO House, when

(13:02):
we do events, we paypractitioners their full rate.
Sometimes you pay them morethan the rate that they're
offering You'd be like.
No, actually, you know, from anequitable perspective, we never
pay a practitioner less than aparticular amount, and so it
always is that or above, and sogiving them a chance to actually
get introduced to more people,aid their full rate for what
they're doing, do the thing thatthey're gifted and call to do

(13:25):
and love to do, and it invitespeople in to try something new.
Without money being a factor,we just basically raise a lot of
money and then put it back intothe community to do healing
events for folks, to buildcommunity and take what they
need from that.

I love that.
I feel like for any, for anyCaribbean people that are
listening.
They're like Susu pasa pasa.
Yes, partner, yes, the partner.

Is our time right .
Our currency is our time in thisparticular way.
And so you know thepractitioners are, you know,
trading their time for me, andthen the community is trading
their time, and then I'm kind ofthe middleman, or Susu is the
person in the middle or theentity in the middle, just kind
of creating.

(14:14):
It's the house, like everybodygets to come into the house.
So like you come into the houseyou go eat, good, You're going
to have community, you're goingto laugh, you're going to enjoy
each other, and so Susu, 2soo isthat entity, it's that house
that folks get to come into tofigure out what works best for
them.

Yeah, and I think what you're doing is so
important creating moreaccessibility, really, for
people who either don't haveaccess or who want to provide
the service, but they also needto survive this capitalistic
hellscape.
You know, we all have toparticipate to the degree that
we need to to survive untilsomething better comes.

(14:52):
So I love this just kind ofmerging of providing more
support in that space, wherepeople who need it, who might
not be able to afford it, cancome to the house and get what
they need and the peopleproviding the service can also
be supported in the work thatthey're called to do.
So I think that's reallyspecial.
Okay, so we're going to talkabout more of this stuff.

(15:14):
There's so many things aroundthis.
So you already spoke about whatled you to creating these
things, because you recognized alack or you felt like you
needed it as well.
So that launched you intowanting to provide the support
through the Susu House and theAxon Group, and I think that's
wonderful.
But I often ask people aboutpurpose.

(15:35):
So I feel like identifying aneed and identifying and
creating this entity to servethis gap is one thing, but I'm
often really curious about whatcalls people to their purpose.
How do you know what is thething in your body, what is the

(15:56):
thing in your spirit and yourmind that affirms you that this
is your purpose?
Your purpose, so, in what waydoes the Axon group.

does Sisu House fuel your purpose as a person in
this world?
I've read a quote recently andI'm going to kind of butcher it,
but the essence of it is yourpurpose is the thing that you do
that lights you up, that alsoserves, that helps people right,
that serves the world.
And these things don't feellike work to me.
They don't feel like the oldadage you know, do what you love

(16:37):
and then like, if you get paidfor it, like that's bonus or
that's extra, like in anon-capitalist way.
But these things don't feellike work.
They feel like a culmination ofthe experiences that I've had
throughout my life, the wisdomthat I have gained, the mistakes
that I have made, the traumathat I have been through.
These things feel like that wasthe training ground.

(17:00):
That was the training groundfor this.
This is why I went through that.
This is why I went through that, this is why I experienced that
situation.
This is why I made thathorrible mistake to learn, so I
could be here, so it wouldn't bewasted.
And so it doesn't feel likework.
It feels like confirmation ofthe life that I have lived so

(17:23):
far.
And that's how I know it's apart of my purpose.
It feels exciting At the heartof it.
It feels effortless.
The execution and those piecestake energy and take work and
can be stressful.
But at the heart of the idea,the purity of the idea, the

(17:44):
motivation behind the idea ofthese things feel effortless and
they actually give me life,Like when I see a Black woman
have like an aha moment in asession, or I see you know
someone sitting like at a soundbath, because I've never done
something like that before andthey're like I just see tears
coming down their face andthey're like I don't even know

(18:06):
what this is, but I needed that.
They may not ever go do thatagain, but in that moment they
got to feel loved on, they gotto feel seen, they got to feel
cared for and I'm like that's it.
That's it.
And every single time,something like that happens and
it's like, yep, that's the,that's the work.
Yeah, Like for a lot of us,it's like I am a healer, at the

(18:28):
heart of all of what I do, andI've had a lot of roles in a lot
of industries and I've gottento a point where the I realized
the through line of all of thatwas helping people and helping
people heal, and because inhelping other people heal, it's
helping me heal my own stuff aswell.
And so it it's helping me healmy own stuff as well.
Yeah, and so it doesn't feellike work to me?
Yeah, it really doesn't.

(18:49):
It feels like second nature.

Yeah, I think that's a beautiful answer.
For so many people who feellike just unsure about what to
do.
I often lean on something likethat quote that you shared at
the beginning that, like youknow, think about what you would
do for free, just because itbrings you joy and it makes you

(19:13):
feel good and you're helpingothers and it lights you up,
like that is likely the thingthat will help to align you with
your purpose.

Like if you're feeling lost or unsure, and I
think your answer is just abeautiful thing that just
supports that idea Like this issecond nature for you, it feels
good and I love that answer andyou don't always get paid for
your purpose, and so also forsome people it's like I don't
want to get paid for it, becausethe moment money comes into it
then it feels like a burden andit it taints a little bit.

(19:45):
And so for some folks purposemay not be something that pays
you, For others it is.
But either way, knowing whatthat thing is, that like lights
you up and fills you up, kind offeels like your North Star, is
good to learn, and it took me avery long time to get there.
A lot of I learned it bylearning all the things I do not
enjoy yeah it wasn't like ohyeah, fine.

(20:08):
It was like I want to be ahealer.
I'm like, no, I want to be awhen I was five, yeah, and so
I've gone through like so manyiterations of roles and
responsibilities and thingswhere I it was right for me in
that season but it was not, ohyeah, all I was supposed to
experience in that season.
But it was not my purpose.

(20:29):
But it was getting me closerand closer to my purpose.

Yes.

Yeah, exactly, I'm like the alchemist.

Yes, which I'm currently rereading because I
read it many years ago.
I'm someone, when I read, Ihighlight things that stand out
to me.
So it's very interesting to menow to be rereading it and like
looking at my old highlights,like does this still resonate?
Am I highlighting new things?
Because I'm in a differentseason and the messages are
landing differently for me.
I love that.

(20:55):
And just leaning into, like yousaid, like sometimes your
purpose ain't always going topay you.
Like there's this culture nowabout monetizing every single
thing, even things that are likeyou know what you feel
passionate about and for somepeople it does work out to do
both and for some folks itdoesn't.
But really leaning into thatthing that lights you up and
brings you joy, like that willhelp to bring you to that

(21:18):
purpose.
And going through phases andseasons and stages that also
help to bring you closer too,because somebody rolls.
They may be tough, but theyhelp us to weed out what we do
and what we don't want, what wedo and what we don't need.

If you are in a job where you're like this is
not my purpose, but it paysbills in a way that allows me to
lean into my purpose.

So I think, also expanding this very
prescriptive idea of like whatit looks like to be happy or
live a particular type of lifeyeah, yeah, I feel like you've
touched on this in many ways,like just identifying what you
wanted to create in the world,leaning into what feels good to
you.
But I feel like there's always.

(22:04):
There are always these momentsand instances and events that
kind of like catapult us intocharting our own paths and
becoming entrepreneurs andsolopreneurs.
What was that moment or thatfeeling for you where you just
kind of knew like I need to, Ineed to do this thing, like I

(22:25):
need to take it seriously, Ineed to pursue this.
What was that moment for you?

I'm laughing because I don't think it was one
moment.
Okay, I'm saying some of thecities of events where it's like
, if you're one more time, likeI've been, I wasn't catching it.
I wasn't catching it.
I wasn't catching it.
I think it was after, likepeople say, death by a thousand
cuts.
It was kind of likerealizations by a thousand WTFs.

(22:53):
I was like what in the.
I was like okay, what are allthese different things telling
me?
Even then, it wasn't somethingI was sure of.
There wasn't an aha sure ofthat there was.
There was a aha oh my gosh, Ineed to be an entrepreneur and
do this on my own.
That was, that was not it.
Like I was not a I'm about tobe an entrepreneur.

(23:15):
But no, it was none of that.
It was I can't do these thingsanymore like this.
Don't, I'm going to start doingthis instead.
So I went out of options,playing the game the way that I
was told to play it, and Ididn't know what else to do.
So I just started doing thisother thing and then realized,
oh, that's what it's called.
Okay, cool, great, that's whatwe'll do.
But it wasn't that I stumbledinto it.

(23:35):
It wasn't some amazing epiphanydeclaration, it was just like
that has to be something else.
I can't work in this space thisway.
I can't work with theseparticular constraints.
I can't work with thesephilosophies being the thing

(23:55):
that people often work and liveby, and I'm going to be honest
with my former employers I'mpretty sure that didn't make me
a great employee, because I wasconstantly like wait, what?
No, I don't like that.
Wait what you want that?
So if any of y'all are watchingand someone has passed it to
you, I I am aware now in my 2020hindsight wisdom, it probably

(24:16):
didn't make me that great of anemployee, because there was
constant like why are we doingthis, like this, like, why does?
it make sense.
It it's like, well, so much ofthat didn't make sense, then you
go do it.
I guess I'll go do it.
Yeah, and so there really wasn'ta a like now it was.

(24:36):
It was a series of continuous Iknow what I don't want, I know
what I don't like, I know what'snot working.
And if I'm going to stay inthese very specific restrictive
spaces, I have to play by thoserules.
Like you can't get mad at rulesand then stay in the space
that's perpetuating the rules,Like if you don't either conform
to it or do something else,because at that point you're

(24:59):
like now you're just beingdisruptive for no reason and so
I'm like all right, well, let mejust leave and go do something
else then.
And that's kind of how thathappened.
And it was a slow roll, Like Islowly like rolled into doing my
own thing and then picked it upand you know what I started,
what Axon started out as it nolonger looks like that, and then
being okay with the evolutionof what my company looks like,

(25:21):
being okay with the evolution ofwhat Susu looks like and what
it offers, and not having tohave it all figured out.
And the recoveringperfectionist in me does not
like that at all.
No part of me enjoys that.
Yeah, Piece of the journey,it's part of the journey.
So, yeah, there wasn't one thing.

Yeah, I love that.
The analogies you shared,shared, but also the language of
stumbling into it, becausesometimes they're like you said,
there isn't an epiphany, likesometimes you just learn along
the way and sometimes you'retripping and stumbling and
falling into it, but eventuallyyou figure it out and you or you
just learn or you learn how tofall better.

I'm still tripping, but I'm like I know
I'm a fault.
It's like I know I can't wearthese heels and you or you learn
how to fall better.
I'm still tripping, but I'mlike I know I'm a fall.
It's like I know I can't wearthese heels, but I know I got
eight steps before I fall again.
Before I didn't know I hadeight good steps.
Now I know I got eight goodsteps before I fall again and I
know how to fall.
Now I'm not going to fall forit, I'm going to fall to the
side.
So I just mess up and it's it's.

(26:29):
That's all I got.
I'm just all better at thispoint.

I know I like I literally just had an image in
my head of when I was younger,trying to wear heels I had no
business wearing it like Ireally could work walking them
every step.
I was like every step I wasstumbling and my ankle was just
kind of like like going likethis, but but I held my head
high, made it to my destination,I took the joints off.

(26:57):
Look, look.

No, and I know there's supposed to be this.
I think oftentimes we look tohave people be experts so then
they can tell us what to do andtell us how to respond to a
thing, and I'm like I'm sorry,most of us don't know what we're
doing either.
I'm much more honest andnormalizing the like y'all.
I'm still falling, like I feel.
Two days ago I was like, ooh,that was a bad idea.
Okay, noted.

(27:20):
Yeah, it's a series of justlearning how to fall.

Yeah, and navigating hardships, because
this no path is easy, but thisone, especially when you're
trying to figure stuff out, itcan be really tough, so thank
you for that.
I would like to talk a littlebit more about the recovering
perfectionists, because you'vementioned it a few times and I
know that is an aspect of yourwork as well.
So it sounds superself-explanatory but folks who

(27:57):
might not understand, can youbreak it down?
What and who is the recoveringperfectionist?

I I am she, she is I, we are her.
Yeah, I realized a few yearsago, after you know most major
transitions in your life, youkind of start to do an
evaluation of everything in yourlife and one of the things that
came up was how much of aperfectionist I really was Girl

(28:27):
I have had.
I realize I am a perfectionistand I silence on the phone and
I'm like she's taking it in too,cause I was, yeah, that was
good.
And then she's still silent onthe phone.
I'm like hello, yeah.
I'm like, oh, she must reallybe feeling this, like she's
processing it, like I processedit.
And I'm like, girl, you heardme.

(28:49):
She's like, yeah, true, wait.

I'm like girl, you heard me.
She's like, yeah, Wait what?
That was all the response.
It was that kind of silence.
Okay, Hold on.

Read that wrong.
What Girl I thought you knew.
I said what do you mean?
This is new.
She said it's new to you.
I really thought you knew youwere a perfectionist.
I did not.
I thought I was coming to youfor new information.
Come to find out, did not?
what I thought I was coming toyou new information, come to
find out, I'm the last to know.
So then I started calling moreand more friends and they're all
like girl, yeah, are you beinglike, is this a?
Are we playing a game?
Like what's that?
How do you not know?

(29:21):
I thought.
And so one my epiphany andrevelation was not that deep
because everybody else knew butme.
So that hurt a little, but, youknow, really started this
process of really leaning into.
Well, how did I get here, like,and what does this mean?
I know what you know.
Sometimes people use perfection.

(29:41):
It's like oh well, what's your,what's your biggest weakness?
I'm a perfectionist.
I was like actually, yeah,actually, that's a thing yeah
and I really started to leaninto what that meant for me and
I came to the realizationspecifically with melanated
people that perfectionism is acoping mechanism.
It is a trauma response becauseof all the generational trauma

(30:03):
we have experiences.
It's not just like I just wantto be the best because I'm type
A and I have to.
No, this is actually aboutsafety and us being
perfectionists and us usingperfectionism as a coping
mechanism is actually about oursafety.
If I can anticipate everything,if I can cross every T, if I
can dot every I and if I canknow everything that's happening
before it happens, I won't beblindsided, I won't be caught

(30:24):
off guard, I won't be harmed.

Yeah.

And so I really started to unpack what that
actually meant, which is why Istarted calling myself a
recovering perfectionist,because I think it is something
that is going to take a lifetimeto unpack and undo for myself,
and it also, as a recoveringperfectionist, gives me grace,
like if I'm in recovery, thereare going to be days where I'm
like oh, I was not.

(30:47):
I was a little more perfection,little less recovery today, and
so I started doing work aroundthat.
It started when I would talk toa lot of my clients and just
talk to other Black women.
It's like, oh yeah, I'm aperfectionist, oh, I'm
recovering from that, and itjust became such a real.
It just really started tohighlight how, oh, this isn't

(31:08):
just my issue, this is somethingout in the world and we just
don't have words for it yet andpeople really hadn't connected
trauma to perfection, like beingperfectionist because of our
trauma, and so I just reallystarted to lean into that and
started teaching workshopsaround it.
I'm currently working on a booktalking about it and talking

(31:29):
about it through the lens wherewe center melanated women,
specifically Black women,oftentimes self-help books,
center whiteness, and we have tocontort ourselves into ways to
make the language make sense tous, and so I want to start with
us as the center, and so thisbook coming out hopefully in
2025, around that particularthing and how to care for

(31:51):
ourselves and how to do that.
So right now there's workshopsand, just you know, talks and
conversations and yeah thingsand stuff like that, just to
really unpack why we, why we usethis as a coping mechanism, the
different types ofperfectionists that people may

(32:11):
show up as because it's not allpersonalities, right, like
people who don't have typepersonalities still engage in
perfectionism, people who areprocrastinators that is a
science on perfectionism, right,you're like, well, if it's not
perfect and I can't get it, justright, I'm just I'm just gonna,
yeah, right.
So yeah, um, kind of live inthe realm of perfectionism that

(32:32):
we don't realize are actually,you know, a part of that coping
style.
And so, just bringing that tolight and, with most things,
normalizing it in a way wherepeople just don't feel like
there's something wrong withthem, like there's nothing wrong
, right, like a lot of times,clients come to me and I'm like,
let's start with you're notbroken, you are not broken and

(32:54):
so you do not need to be fixed.

We do.

Let's start there , like and you already have
everything you need in you toheal and now you bring in all
these resources to help supportthat.
But please know, the work thatwe are doing is not because you
were broken and you need to befixed and you need to be fixed.
It is because you have survivedcertain traumas and now those
survival tactics may not beneeded anymore and we need to
figure out what to replace itwith.
Fracture hasn't just served usand because it creates positive

(33:22):
results, we think it's a cheatcode.
In actuality, it is somethingthat's eroding the most
authentic version of ourselves.

Yeah, I love that and that's just such a
beautiful explanation and itgives people an opportunity to
really if they feel like theyidentify with that term and that
title to really think about howperfectionism has showed up and
served them, whether that'sbecause of trauma or certain
environments or disadvantages ordifferent things they've had to

(33:54):
navigate in life thatformulated their personality
that way, and how to kind ofstep out of that and step into
your body and inner knowingabout how to like navigate it.
Once where they were trying tomake the case for leaning away

(34:15):
from that term, but when youactually read the article,
they're talking about a lot ofthe same things.
It's about how we've come toidentify this way because of
certain disadvantages in life orcertain environments, certain
things that have made us hardand become like this, and,
instead of leaning intohopelessness and trying to
become this flawless person,like embrace this aspect of

(34:35):
yourself and like learn how towork around it.
And I'm just kind of like well,I understand what you're saying
but at the same time, part ofbreaking away and doing better
is, you know, some aspect ofhealing, some aspect of recovery
, some aspect of looking atthings differently.
So I think you know yourexplanation is beautiful and I

(34:58):
cannot wait for the book to comeout.
I will be reading it.
I'll be adding it to my libraryMe either.

You know what a recovering perfectionist can
want to do Write a book aboutall the ways they've been a
perfectionist and then share itwith the world the world they
messed up yeah but the more Iwrite, the more I'm like, oh,
this was not a good idea.
This feels so sad andchallenging.
Oh, but yeah, so that articleyou're speaking about it's the.
I also think people withdifferent experiences get to use

(35:26):
words differently yeah yep, yep.
I think it's easy to say like,oh, it makes you feel hopeless.
If you're a recoveringperfectionist, I'm like, yeah,
if you've always operated fromthe space of hope and
opportunity and access andprivilege, if you've never
operated from those spaces, it'sthe saying you're a recovering
perfectionist gives youpermission to be human, yeah,

(35:47):
and gives you permission to taketime to figure it out.
It gives you permission to getover a breakup and then, three
years later, hear a song by youknow, or hear a song by, I would
say, brian McKnight.
bless his heart he can't get, hecan't get like hear a love song
from the 90s, I'll just saythat and all of a sudden you're

(36:09):
crying, right.
Yep, I thought I was done withthis.
I thought calling yourself arecovering perfectionist gives
you permission to be like, yeah,that particular season of that
thing I did heal.
And this new emotion I'mfeeling is triggering something
on a new level, right, Shout outto all my elderly millennials
Super Mario Brothers, like, yeah, you healed level three, but

(36:31):
now you're on level eight andlevel eight.
These same things are coming upand that's okay.
And so I think, saying youcan't, you also just saying you
shouldn't use a word anymore.
It's like who are you?
How dare you?
Because you don't know who thatword or what that phrase, how
that resonates with people.
And so just the privilege ofsaying we have to throw this

(36:51):
away, we can't use this anymore,Already speaks to your
privilege around the thing.
When I say it, when I sayrecovering perfectionists, I am
inviting people to givethemselves the permission to be
human messy.

And that's so important.
That's so important, especiallybeing in a world that tells you
you have to act a certain wayand be a certain way.
Like I'm in an era of justshowing up as myself, like my
authentic self, my, like, mymessy self, my sometimes wrong
self, like, listen, I'm a personI keep seeing this language

(37:29):
around and it's certain pagesthat I follow that really
explore just beef and thingslike that.
But just giving yourself gracebecause, depending on what you
believe in, we're all just doinglife for the first time.
Like it doesn't matter how oldwe get.
In the grand scheme of theuniverse, we're all babies.
We're just babies and we'rehere for the first time

(37:52):
experiencing life.
So it's I think about that alot when I'm trying to give
myself grace, when I makemistakes, or when I'm trying to
give other people in my lifegrace or maybe something
affecting me in a way thatwasn't intended that we're all
just doing life for the firsttime.
We're all figuring it outtogether.
So I love the idea of justembracing your fullness, flaws,

(38:16):
mistakes and all, and just beingmore human, because that's what
we are at the end of the day.

Like I why didn't I know how to do that?
Because you didn't yeah, justbe yeah, and that's hard, and I
say that with the.
I have to tell myself thatquite often.
So sit with whatever you needto sit with around that, ashanti
, and now figure out how you'regoing to manage, because so many

(38:40):
of us are human most of thetime.
People aren't doing somethingagainst you.
They're doing it for themselves, like people are for themselves
.
They're not against you, yep,yep, and that's a really hard
thing to sit with, right.
They're not trying to comeagainst you, yep, yep, and
that's a really hard thing tosit with, right.
They're not trying to come foryou, they're just trying to help
themselves and in helpingthemselves, a ripple effect may

(39:00):
harm you and the consequences ofit and the impact of it not
minimize it, but it's not alwayssomeone's out to get you.
Sometimes they are, but it isnot always that, especially when
it's people that you care about.

Most of the time , when it's them, it's not.

Yeah, right, but like, let me put that caveat out
there the people that love andactually care for you.
When they do something that'shurtful or harming or disturbing
or frustrating or deeplydisappointing, they're not doing
it to harm you.
They are doing something insupport of themselves and the
ripple effect of that is harmingyou.
The impact still gets to be theimpact and it's not necessarily

(39:40):
intentional.

Yeah, yeah, thank you for that.
I think that's excellent.
Nothing to add there, yeah,just sitting with that for a
moment.
Okay, so we've mentioned theRetiring Superwoman series.
Like, we've mentioned it, wehaven't gone in depth about it,

(40:02):
so please can you talk to us andtell the audience more about
what is the Retiring SuperwomanLike?
What is the series that you'velaunched?
Can you talk to us a little bitmore about it?
Retiring?

superwoman came up because I'm tired, because I
was trying to do all thesethings in 2023 and 2023 kicked
my butt like it was really rude,like it was really.
2023 was rude.
I'm like you didn't want to behere.
Why did you show up, like youcould have just quietly quit and
not brought me your drama, 2023.
Yeah, why are you coming for me?

(40:37):
And I just ended up notpracticing any of the things I
preached to my clients, whichwas accountability piece, and I
realized just how tired I wasand how over it I was, and this
was a new level of like.
So what does your authenticself look like?
And so retiring superwoman cameto be because I was in a

(41:01):
session with somebody or aworkshop or a panel or something
, and we were talking maybe itwas the glass cliff, I think it
may have been something with thefemale quotient, I'm not sure,
but we were talking about, like,our labor and what that means,
and specifically for black andbrown women, and it was just our
, our value.
Because of slavery, our valuewas literally connected to our

(41:26):
labor and our activity, likethat's the only reason we were
valuable in society's eyes is iswhat we put out, what we were
able to do, what we were able toaccomplish and I know things
have shifted over- time, buthave they there's have.

Well, we like slavery.
Has it ended?

no, podcast, part two, we will be getting racial
analysis of the new Jim Crow,the new corporate community.
We'll get into those?
Yes, but it hadn't, becausethen we'd internalized it right.
Yeah, so it was the I'm thestrong friend, I got to handle
it, I got to take care of it,I'm the one that people call on,

(42:10):
I'm the one that blah, blah,blah and on some level it turned
us into a martyr and I canspeak for myself.
I realized it had turned meinto an interesting martyr
victim and I started playing inthat cycle and that dynamic and
then I realized I enjoyed it,like I liked being the martyr,
because then I could feel like,oh, look at what's happening to

(42:30):
me, look at how people are.
I'm like, well, but you agreedto do some of these things that
you're not being sad about.
You agreed to participate in X.
You didn't set a betterboundary here, and sometimes you
don't know the boundary youshould set until you have to set
it.
Yes, and sometimes theseboundaries are much harder,
especially in the families ohyeah, 100% of the family

(42:51):
dynamics and so it reallystarted to get me.
It allowed me to start reallyunpacking.
Wait, my value really is in mylabor and that, in conjunction
with the recoveringperfectionist piece Like if I
put stuff out, then I was enough, like it all became.
It was very external and itwasn't about the fact that I
could just do this.
The fact that I am present, thefact that I am here, the fact I

(43:11):
am here, the fact that I canbreathe, that may be valuable,
but that also isn't somethingthat messaging isn't expressed
or acknowledged in society.
Right, it's about what you cando, what you can bring to the
table, and so well you can.
And so retiring superwomanreally became like a cultural
movement where we prioritize thewell-being of others.
Like we explore how weprioritize the well-being of
others, like we explore how weprioritize the well-being of

(43:35):
others and how we can set betterboundaries for ourselves, our
value could no longer come fromour labor or our sacrifice or
our resilience or our exhaustion, and I really kind of like
declared war against the wordresilience, like I actually
despise that word because it isused as a badge of honor.

(43:55):
Like, oh, you're so resilient,how about we get to a point
where I actually don't have toget knocked down and get back up
, and then that be celebrated?
How about you just don't knockme down?

How about?

we don't even bring resilience into the
conversation, because resiliencemeans I am able to withstand a
hardship.
How about we take out thehardship?
I'm sorry the fact that I cantake a punch.

Because you're so strong and you're so
resilient.
I mean, how about no?

So retiring is a campaign similar and it's under
the Susu House where we'reexploring like one where we have
started to internalize, whereour value is all about our
production and external things,where we're also playing into
that role, where we're refusingto take the cape off ourselves,
like where we're adding.
You know, we're perpetuatingthis thing that we say we want

(44:43):
to be differently or we want tobe different, and then what we
can start doing to change thatand it's not major life
overhauls, cause I hate whenpeople are like all you have to
do is just start loving onyourself more.
It's just more self-love anddeep breathing.
Ma'am, if I knew how to dothese things consistently, I
wouldn't be in the position thatI'm in right now.
Facts Don't just say all youhave to.

(45:04):
Anytime someone says all youhave to do is nope, shut up, I'm
not talking to you.
I'm not talking to you.
That's all I had to do.
And so retiring superwoman isbeing very honest around.
You may be in a meshed familydynamic where you can't just
start saying no to everythingbecause something may not get
done, someone may not get thecare that they need, and so you
can't just be like I quit, I'mdone with it.
Or you may have a family andchildren where you still have to

(45:26):
care for them.
Or you may be in a certaindynamic or situation,
professionally or in friendships, where I can't just be like new
boundaries for me, new boundaryalert.
I'm not doing this like that.
That may not be what actuallyworks for you in this particular
season, but you can build up tothat.
You can actually start askingquestions now and getting
curious about how showing up inthese roles is still serving you

(45:48):
, because we don't do anythingthat doesn't serve us, be it
healthy or unhealthy.
So let's just start becomingaware around, like why does this
identity mean so much to you?
Why are you holding onto it?
Let's start unpacking that.
And then let's start figuringout how you can start seeing the
value in just you being in thisworld, and then let's start
doing some activities aroundthat so that muscle can get

(46:09):
built up.
And then maybe let's startidentifying just one area, not a
whole life overhaul, but onearea where you start practicing
a better boundary for yourself.

Yeah.

Hold that muscle up and then it builds, and it
builds and it builds.
But understanding that this hasbeen ingrained in us for
centuries, we're not going to,in one workshop, in one training
, in one retreat, in one book,change this superwoman mentality
.
And so again, it's the retiring, it's the recovering, it's the
ING of it.
I'm intentionally using this.

(46:39):
Words matter to me.
I'm intentionally using the INGin these words to understand
that it is a process to help toget people permission to take
their time through this.
And in some cases they'd belike I don't want to work on
being a retiring superwoman, Idon't have the capacity for it.
But the campaign a little bitback to the campaign.

(46:59):
We partner with localBlack-owned businesses and give
melanated women an opportunityto come in and receive something
or a discount on something atno cost to them, to remind them
like you don't have to doanything to receive something or
a discount on something at nocost to them, to remind them
like you don't have to doanything to receive something
kind.
You don't have to do anythingto receive a gift, you don't
have to do anything to be lovedon.

(47:21):
And so one of the places thatwe went was Brooklyn Tea in New
York.
Shout out to University.
Shout out to Ali Wright, one ofmy hands and alum.
You know, brothers in the world, he's a co-founder of Brooklyn
Tea, and so we had one eveningfrom five to seven.

(47:41):
If you came in, you got $10 offwhatever thing you purchased,
no questions asked If you were amelanated woman, you $10 off,
no matter what it is.
If you want to know more aboutretiring superwoman grade, if
you just want it to get the freething and be out, you get to do
that as well.
But it's a space for people tojust be poured into with no

(48:02):
strings attached, and so we didthis with a few different
businesses in the area and arelooking to expand that to other
cities where we can just come inand do you know retiring
superwoman events where youliterally just get to come and
get loved on and get somethingfree that helps to calm your
nervous system.
So, at the end of the day, it'sa very big piece of it, right,

(48:24):
like figuring out how, asretiring superwoman, superwomen,
how do we start calming ournervous system?
How do we start engaging ourdifferent senses in a way where
we're not always upregulated,we're not always on alert, we're
not always on the ready, we'renot always staying ready, so we
don't have to get ready becauseI'm like, basically, we just

(48:45):
saying we always activated andyou should, yeah, right, and so
we pick organizations and wepick businesses that can tap
into one of your five senses andso offering a gift to you to
tap into one of your five senses, and again at no cost to you,
because you should not have topay.
Yeah, we explore some of thesethings.

Yeah, so, yeah, I love that.
And a couple of things.
I love how that's one feedinginto this larger conversation
around the fact that so many ofour third spaces are
disappearing.
So many people are staying homeor they're going to work, but
the third space where theyconnect with people, where they
practice community care orself-care, is just like

(49:29):
disappearing.
So even in doing this work,you're recreating those spaces.
But I also firmly believe that,as much as trauma can be
generation generation, so canhealing and so can joy, and I
love the tools that so many ofus are employing now to

(49:49):
experience, now to live in ourbodies, now to pass on to nieces
and nephews and children, andit just makes me hopeful,
especially during a time where Idon't have a lot of hope,
because the world is crazy aboutwhat the future might hold like
, what a new generation orgenerations of healing will look
like down the line.
So I love this idea of givingus permission to set aside or

(50:18):
acknowledge, but also giveourselves a break from the
things that we've carried eitherin our own lives or that are
passed down to us, that wedidn't ask for, and charting a
new course.
So I love that.

I got goosebumps when you said healing is
generational, joy isgenerational.
Like when we finish this I'mgoing to probably go write
something about that, I willabsolutely credit you with it.
But that just gave me so muchjoy because we always talk about
, like you know, the comms inboth of us, like the
communication.
Both of us talk about theproblem, talk about the solution

(50:52):
.
It was about trauma'sgeneration.
It's our generational trauma.
We're breaking generationalcurses.
Yeah, yeah, I was like what ifwe just talk about building
generational healing, that?
Just thank you for that, yeah.
Yeah, and not to countgenerational curses, but to be
like, let's talk aboutgenerational gifts.
Yeah, yep, let's talk aboutgenerational gifts.

(51:14):
Yeah, yep, let's talk aboutgenerational legacies, and so
that, yeah, healing isgenerational, joy is
generational.
You'll see that again.
Yeah, you'll see that again,aaliyah.

Okay, Gosh Ashante, this has been so good.
I know we're almost at time, soI just want to wrap up with
some last questions.
And then you know, have youshare where the Axon Group
launching Susu House, doing theRetiring Superwoman campaign,
working on the recoveringperfectionist work and writing a
book?

What is something that kind of comes to you right
now in terms of a lesson you'velearned or advice you'd love to
share to someone who wants tochart their own path as well?
Release knowing how it's goingto work out.
Release knowing how it's goingto play out.
I'm literally telling myself,like that's not advice I'm
giving to other people.
It's all like this for me.
Yes, especially in the lastcouple of months, I released the

(52:38):
expectation of it looking acertain way, and just because it
may not look the way you wantedor anticipated or planned for
or desired one does it mean itwasn't successful?
Yes, and two, does it mean thatyou're not doing exactly what

(52:59):
you're supposed to be doing?

Yes.

Yeah, because the things that are put in us, that
are entrusted to us to bebirthed into the world like.
Not everyone gets the sameideas, not everyone gets the
same epiphanies, and if you'vebeen blessed to have one in any
capacity, that means you'reentrusted with it.

Yeah.

And so that also means you're entrusted with it,
because it's there to teach yousomething as well, and so I'm
doing all of these things andalso understanding, because at
one point, I was like I'm doingall of these things and also
understanding, because at onepoint, I was like I'm doing all
these different things and howscattered do I look?
I'm like actually, no, there'sa through line in all of these.
Oh, absolutely yeah, givingmyself permission to pause,

(53:50):
giving myself permission to makemistakes, giving myself
permission to fail, givingmyself permission to not know
how it's going to play out,giving myself permission to
pivot yes, this route isn'tgoing the way I thought it would
.
I can pivot, and that's still.
All of these entities andplatforms are a constant teacher
and reminder of that for me,and so I would want to offer

(54:14):
that to other folks as well.

Yeah, I really do hope that you're listening to
your own advice in this moment.

So anyone listening, if you ever see this,
I give you permission now toyou know, hold me accountable.
You're like maybe that's it Onthe podcast.
You're not doing it.
I'm like you're right, I don'tknow you, but thank you for
sharing.

You're right, yeah, yeah, I think.
I think what you spoke to justalso speaks to giving ourselves
grace and allowing change tohappen.
Yeah, what is it Parable of theSower Mm-hmm, when Octavia
Butler, the main character, istalking about just reevaluating

(54:57):
the relationship with God andrecognizing that God has changed
?
That stays with me all the time, because if one thing, if
there's one thing that's goingto happen in life, it's going to
change If perfectionists don'tlike change.

Yeah, you know what healing requires.

Change and being able to evolve and grow with
that, despite the discomfort.
In spite of the discomfort.
Okay, lord, okay yeah.

It happens to me, enjoy it.

Yeah, it's hard.
It's hard, but it's necessary.

Some days it's a rage room.
It's a but it's necessary wedon't like it either.

Some days it's a rage room.
It's a rage room.

Sometimes it's Annie up, sometimes it's not.
But yeah, I'm there.
Let me stop there.

Yeah, All right, Ashante.
So let me just ask you what isbringing you joy in this season,
right now?
I know a lot of things aregoing on, but what is one thing
that's giving you just joy rightnow?
Comfort.

In this exact moment, it's my dog.
He keeps trying to joke aboutme.
He keeps trying to make anappearance.
Oh, he's done.

He's not grew.
He literally keeps like, ohokay, it's up to make an
appearance.

Oh, podcast, he's done.

He's not grew.
He literally keeps like oh,okay, it's up to you.
Okay, if you're watching onvideo, you get to see little
Bishop.
My God, he's the cutest.
Aw, you see, just wanted togive his mommy some kisses, yeah
.

He is bringing a lot of joy to me right now.
The other thing the.
A lot of joy to me right now.
The other thing the sun yeah,like I find myself going outside
and just standing in the sun.
Yes, and just just standing inthe sun and, and yeah, having
those moments of really deepgratitude, like again, like I

(56:56):
said, know, I'm from the South,I'm very, very, uh, prayers that
my grandma and great grandmasand like the, the the aunties
and deaconess would pray thatI'm just grateful that I woke up
in my right mind, I'm gratefulthat my lips, I'm grateful that
I was like why would you pray,why would you be thankful for
that?
Like that's a given?
No, it's not.

(57:17):
No, it's not, yeah, yeah.
So what's bringing me joy isremembering those very basic
privileges that I have theability to breathe air without
fear, ability to eat withoutconcern or worry, the ability to
actually be in my right mind,to be able to walk outside and

(57:38):
stand in the sun and not worryabout my safety.
That does bring me joy, deepgratitude and deep joy.

Yeah, I love that.
I spoke on a recent episodeabout just doing some grounding
work, like going in the grassbarefoot, just releasing
whatever I was feeling to theearth and just letting the sun
hit me and taking it in slowlywherever I felt the warmth and
being very overly present withmy body, and so I love that.

(58:08):
Shante, thank you so much.
This has been such a beautifulconversation.
I appreciate you so much.
Can you let the folks knowwhere to find you, where to
support your work?

Gosh, of the three websites, of the three
organizations.
List them all.
List them all, baby.
Yes, yeah, so you have the Axon.
I know this will go in yourlink in position.
So, axon group, if you want todo some coaching work, honestly,
you know what?
How people can support me,because I'm just a name of a
thing.

(58:41):
Yeah, also, I used to be messyin the ask.
See, I'm practicing what Ipreach right now.
I had no official pitch.
Do it, Do it.
The way I would love for peopleto support is to donate to the
Susu House.
Yes, and you can actually go tosusuhouseorg and donate, because
all of the money that peopledonate literally goes right back
out into the community to dohealing events, to do healing

(59:05):
retreats, to do healingworkshops.
To give scholarships to peopleif they want to go to other
practitioner healing retreatsand workshops and they can't
afford it Scholarships for folksto be able to go.
Do those types of things, likeif you've ever had a woman, if
you've ever had a super woman inyour life that loved on you,
nurtured, you, cared for, you,got you through, go donate.

(59:26):
Go donate as a way of first, gotell them Thank you.
First and foremost, go tellthat person Thank you, like as
soon as this podcast ends, gotell them thank you.
And then, secondly, go donateto the Susu House and that will
allow us to do more healingevents.
It'll allow me to do morethings in the community.
It allows us to support morepractitioners.
It'll allow us to support moremelanated women.

(59:47):
It allows us to do moreretiring superwoman events.
Go donate $2,000, $2 million.
I will take $2 million and ifyou know somebody, a corporation
, organization, y'all trying todo some healing equity work.
You work at a company that'strying to do some healing equity
work, that wants to do asponsorship donation.
Send us the money, send it tous, yes, yes, I'll ask for all

(01:00:12):
the things now.
I love that.
Yeah, anyone who's on a newstalk show y'all know Tamron,
y'all know Sherry, y'all knowanybody who want to pick this up
so we can make this nationaland help more people.
Hit them up, yep, send it tothem, get them involved, help me
, help me, help me.

(01:00:32):
That's my ask yeah.
Please use your network to helpme heal melanated women.

Aliya Cheyanne (01:00:40):
Yes, I love that and I will make sure I link to
Sisu House in the show notes andask folks to support your work
and to make a donation, and Ispeak on the show all the time
about fostering community andhow we can show up for each
other.
So if you're listening and youfeel called to support in this

(01:01:01):
way, please do.
That's the end of our episode.
Thank you, ashante.

Aseanté Renee (01:01:08):
Feels like we just had lunch, like these are
what our lunches sound like.

A working lunch or working in quotes.

A working lunch.

This is beautiful.
You're just a breath of freshair and so wise and even with
all the things that you carry,the fact that you can inspire
others is just a testament tothe woman you are.
So I appreciate you.
I appreciate this time with youand, yeah, this has been great.
I hope that anyone listeningthat you also feel inspired and,

(01:01:38):
yeah, thank you.
Anyone listening that you alsofeel inspired and, yeah, thank
you.

Can I just say, like Leah, you're absolutely
amazing.
You know I'm big on givingpeople their flowers in real
time.
I know you are.
You are one of the smartestpeople that I know.
You are so creative and socaring and so courageous.
You are truly charting your ownpath and from the woman that I

(01:02:02):
met to the woman that I'm seeingnow, that courage and that
power is palpable.
And you are doing this podcastand it is a healing modality.
It is a healing platform forboth yourself and other people
and just, I don't think peoplegive enough credit to someone
having an idea and then bring itto fruition Like that takes so

(01:02:25):
much work and so much audacityand so much tenacity and so much
courage.
And you have that in spades andI am so thankful for you and I
am so grateful for you and I amso blessed to consider you a
friend and to be able to witnessyou on this journey and I think
people listening to yourpodcast would feel the same way,
like you are a trailblazer,change making, powerhouse, dope

(01:02:51):
ass woman and thank you forallowing us to experience your
brilliance.

Thank you, I wasn't expecting to cry.
I'm going to stop the recording, okay, now that I've composed
myself.
Shanti, I just want to saythank you for coming on the show
.
I loved having you on as aguest.

(01:03:22):
Thank you for being anincredible friend, an incredible
mentor and leader and such aspecial person in my life.
To everyone listening, I hopethat you enjoyed this episode.
If it spoke to you, if itresonated with you, please share
it with someone in your network.
Please consider Ashanti's callto action.

(01:03:43):
The Susu House is doing suchincredible work in the community
and it's such an importantresource and important tool and
in many cases, a lot of thefunding, a lot of the grants and
all kinds of things are sogatekept and hard for
women-owned businesses to accessBlack women-owned businesses to

(01:04:06):
access marginalized communitiesperiod, and it would be
world-changing to really get toSue House the funding that it
deserves.
If you feel inspired, if youhave it within your resources to
do so, please consider adonation.
If that's not in yourwheelhouse, but maybe you know
six degrees of separation, youhave someone in your network who

(01:04:28):
knows someone who knows someoneelse.
Let's get Sisu House therecognition it deserves in today
.
If you enjoyed this episode.
You can send us a text messageusing the link in the show notes
.
You can send in a voice notewith your thoughts.
Have an opportunity to haveyour voice heard on the podcast.

(01:04:49):
I would love that you can emailthe show.
Email me at podcast at theprolifichubcom to share any
thoughts or feedback you haveand let's keep the conversation
going.
I will catch you all back herenext week.

Thanks, so much for tuning in.

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