June 15, 2025 • 39 mins
Serena speaks with Vimala Thangaveloo, a former Fortune 500 attorney turned executive coach. Vimala’s journey from the courtroom to coaching is a story of embracing transitions and using personal differences as superpowers. She shares her transformative GPS framework, which helps professionals — especially those who feel like outsiders — step into their career genius zones and increase their income while remaining true to themselves.
Vimala talks about how to navigate the corporate world as an outsider, particularly when your personality or background doesn’t fit the typical mold. She explains the importance of building authority and how visibility plays a key role in advancing your career. Whether you identify as an introvert or simply feel out of place in a loud, extroverted environment, Vimala’s insights will inspire you to take ownership of your career path with clarity and confidence.
Key Highlights:
- The Outsider’s Journey: Vimala reflects on her career transition from a litigator to an executive coach, helping outsiders leverage their unique perspectives as strengths.
- Building Career Authority: Learn why building authority early in your career is essential, even if you believe you’re in a “recession-proof” industry.
- The Power of Knowing Yourself: How self-awareness, understanding your value, and aligning your messaging with your strengths are key to creating a powerful personal brand.
3 Key Takeaways:
- Know Yourself: Start by identifying what makes you unique and what energizes you. Self-awareness is the foundation of career success and helps you align your skills and passions with your professional goals.
- Build Authority: Don’t wait for the “perfect” moment—build your authority consistently, whether through your LinkedIn profile, internal resume, or public visibility. Position yourself as a go-to person for solving specific problems.
- Embrace What Makes You Different: Instead of trying to fit into traditional molds, embrace your outsider perspective and turn it into a superpower. Leadership today requires authenticity, and the world needs your unique contributions.
Resources:
- Follow Vimala Thangaveloo on LinkedIn.
- Sign up for Vimala’s Outsiders Edge newsletter for practical, actionable steps to elevate your career.
Call to Action:
- If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to The Quiet Warrior Podcast for more inspiring insights and leave us a 5-star rating on your podcast app to help introverts and quiet achievers worldwide find their voice.
- Sign up for The Visible Introvert newsletter for a real, tell-it-like-it-is look at life and work through the eyes of introverts and quiet achievers and those who work with them.
- Join The Visible Introvert Academy if you’re ready to elevate from quiet achiever into a Quiet Warrior in your life and work.
This episode was edited by Aura House Productions
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, I'm Serena Loh.
If you're used to hearing thatintroverts are shy, anxious,
antisocial and lack goodcommunication and leadership
skills, then this podcast is foryou.
You're about to fall in lovewith the calm, introspective and
profound person that you are.
Discover what's fun, unique andpowerful about being an
(00:21):
introvert, and how to make theelegant transition from quiet
achiever to quiet warrior inyour life and work anytime you
want, in more ways than youimagined possible Welcome.
Welcome to another episode ofthe Quiet Warrior podcast.
Today we're talking with VimalaThangavelu, who went from
(00:44):
Fortune 500 attorney to anexecutive coach specializing in
helping outsiders increase theirincome.
Growing up, she did everythingright, got the degrees, climbed
the corporate ladder, but aftera back injury that her doctor
ranked second only to childbirth, she started counting the real
cost of her success.
(01:05):
Now, through her signature GPSframework, she helps ambitious
professionals who don't fit thetraditional mold transform their
differences into theirsuperpower.
Welcome, vimala, to the QuietWarrior podcast.
I'm so glad to have you here.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Hi Serena, it's so good to be here.
I've been a fan of the podcastsince I can't remember when, so
this is an honor.
Thank you for inviting me, ohbeautiful.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Thank you so much.
Tell us more about your careerstory, because we all want to
know what made you decide toswitch away from law.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Talk about pivots, serena, I know you've pivoted as
well and I characterize mypivots from the rooms that I've
been in, so from a courtroom toboardrooms to now the coaching
room.
So I started as a litigator whenI was a baby lawyer and then I
joined Shell, had an amazingcareer, it was an incredible
(02:07):
workspace and I got to work andlive in Europe, asia and
Australia and life was gooduntil, if you remember, 2022,
the pandemic happened and I wasin a foreign country country,
living alone in my apartment,and this is a great privilege.
(02:31):
I understand that being in aforeign country when you had a
potentially a life-threateningpandemic swirling around you
really isolated me in myapartment and I had time for the
, I think, first time in a longtime to think and as I reflected
, I reflected how I had mentoredlawyers in my career, but I was
(02:57):
really bottom line orientated.
So as I sat down and you knowagain time for reflection I
started calling up my fellowcolleagues who looked like me,
because I realized that I carrythis shadow around me and the
shadow was really being anoutsider in the spaces that I've
(03:20):
been in, whether it's becauseof my voice, my accent, the way
I thought and when I startedreaching out to other women and
men who are like me, I realizeda very similar story.
So that got me thinking andwhen I came back to Australia
about a year later, I certifiedas a coach because those
(03:47):
conversations sparked somethingin me and I really wanted to see
outsiders succeed in their ownterms, not to have to twist
themselves up into a pretzel.
So a year ago I startedfull-time coaching outsiders to
(04:08):
really be the best versions ofthemselves and living in their
career genius zone and knockingtheir career out of the park.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
I love that identified that some of us feel
like outsiders, even when wehave the same qualifications.
We have the same experiences,the same abilities, but
something about the culturemakes it hard for us to fit in.
What do you think that is?
Speaker 2 (04:38):
That's such an important question and before
going into that specifically,may I say that I actually am an
ambivert, so not an extrovert,not an introvert, but somewhere
in between.
But I've always loved yourpodcast.
I love the term the quietwarrior because to me it was
(04:59):
part of being an outsider aswell.
I knew a lot of introvertswhere, in the places that I
worked, that felt that theydidn't fit in, because the
corporate world generally,generally, is rewards more
extroverted, bigger, dare I say,louder voices.
So whenever you have the powerstructure not looking, sounding
(05:24):
or thinking like you, unlessleadership and the people around
you make a real concertedeffort to include you in and
appreciate your differences,you're going to feel like an
outsider I imagine, especiallyin the early years, it would be
(05:45):
even more so because not onlyare you a newbie, but you're a
newbie plus an outsider and youdon't have the power to
influence decisions, isn't it?
(06:07):
As you're talking.
It just got me back to when Iwas a new litigator and I was in
a courthouse that was not myhome courthouse.
I was in a different state andI had this opponent who was an
(06:32):
older gentleman, seeminglysmiley but of course you know
he's a litigator and he wantedto win the case for his client
and I was I would have been ayear, not even qualified and he
came up to me and he said so,I'm, my mother tongue is Tamil,
and he knew that.
And he said he referred to meas a small girl.
Papa, how are you doing, smallgirl?
(06:52):
This is the first time I hadever spoken to him and it was,
of course, intended to put me inmy place.
Know that he's the man and hewas the one in charge.
He had authority and I didn't,and at that time I didn't have
the vocabulary or the insight orthe wisdom to know what he was
(07:15):
doing.
So I felt very intimidated.
So 100% correct that you don't.
The more lower you are in thehierarchy or the authority
ladder, the more disempoweredyou're going to feel.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
So what does one do in a situation like that, aside
from biding your time until youhave gained more authority?
Speaker 2 (07:44):
What I think social media has done really well is
brought awareness.
So there's a lot morediscussions around how you
respond to people who areabrasive, rude or put you down,
rude or put you down.
I feel that today's lawyers whocome out are far more aware,
(08:11):
emotionally aware, and are farmore educated to be able to fend
off those kind of attacks.
And I'm putting the bunny earshere.
They're attacks, invertedcommas, because it's not a
physical attack, but it'scertainly an attack that's
attacking your authority beforeyou get into the room and say
(08:33):
that I have qualified, I deserveto be here, and if anyone is
going to put me down, I'm goingto stand my ground.
(08:54):
So in that situation I wouldhave been.
If that happened again, I wouldhave been a bit cheeky and said
well, hello, tata, and Tata inmy language means grandfather.
So to be able to just bring itback and not being so
shell-shocked, to be a bitplayful about it, humor is a
great authority and thatsometimes doesn't come,
(09:17):
especially for outsiders,doesn't come automatically,
especially when it comes to ifthere's an age difference as
well.
So it takes a bit of practice.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
I love that you said that, because I can think of all
the situations when I was anewbie lawyer as well, in open
court, in chambers, and thatfeeling of ooh, I am so small,
I'm so new, I'm just a small fry.
And then, on top of that,there's also our cultural
(09:51):
conditioning we are trained togive respect to older adults
right, it's the hierarchy of thefamily and then the hierarchy
of society.
There is a pecking order andit's almost like we need to know
where our place is, and Isuppose that that was what your
senior opponent was trying toremind you.
(10:12):
And so for newer lawyers cominginto this new space and with
the aid of social media, greaterawareness, being more mindful,
more grounded, having all thesetools and resources, I think
(10:34):
it's perhaps, in a sense, it'smuch more, should we say it's a
bit easier to be a quiet warriorthese days easier to be a quiet
warrior?
Speaker 2 (10:48):
I think so, and I don't say this lightly.
I think it is easier being aquiet warrior because there are
voices for quiet warriors.
Take yourself, serena, whatyou're doing with your podcast
(11:08):
and how you show up on LinkedIn.
You are a self-proclaimed quietwarrior and by your actions you
show that.
Hey, you can show up in a waythat is very aligned to the
personality that I am, and I seemany other examples of that on
(11:37):
Instagram, on LinkedIn, and thatis the good part of social
media.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Yes, I think it's that visibility that gives
others permission to speak up,to feel that my voice is valid
and I do have a place in thisconversation.
I think it gives courage toother people who are still
contemplating and still worryingthat speaking up is somehow
going to disrupt the status quo,going to take away that feeling
(12:01):
of safety.
So I think that's the good partabout social media.
So that's one way the jobmarket has changed since you
were a lawyer.
Are there other ways the jobmarket has changed?
Speaker 2 (12:13):
Absolutely so when I let me just share this by
telling a story.
Many years ago I got a role asa lawyer because I ticked many
boxes.
I was a litigator, so Iunderstood how the courts worked
(12:33):
.
I was a company secretary.
I trained as a commerciallawyer, so they hired me because
of the range and I had greatrange and they knew that with
all that I had I could get inmore fast and get the job done.
That range was seen as an asset.
(12:54):
Today that range could get youoverlooked because you don't
come up really neatly packagedso people can't pinpoint what it
is that you do, especially forthe more senior roles.
And I think visibility isreally important now compared to
(13:19):
even five years ago.
And I think what's even moreimportant is authority.
Are you speaking in a way thatmakes people take notice, makes
(13:40):
people understand that yourvalue translates to solving
their pain point?
And for outsiders this isdifficult for two reasons.
First reason is because you arein a room that doesn't
appreciate what you are puttingdown, as the kids say nowadays.
(14:00):
So, for instance, if you're anintrovert and you know you're in
a room where loud voices, Iwanted to say charisma, but
charisma is often wronglytranslated to being louder and
more forceful, a certain type ofleader.
So if you are in that room,then no matter what you do, it's
(14:22):
going to be very difficult tobreak through that.
What you do, it's going to bevery difficult to break through
that.
The second reason is becausethe translation could be better.
You could be using your voiceand speaking words that the
other person understands in amore effective way.
So in my coaching room we doboth work.
(14:43):
We do both work identifying therooms that you feel really
comfortable in and also beingable to translate your value in
a way that really resonates withthe market.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
I think a lot of listeners will be very curious
and want to know more about thistranslation process.
How does one take years ofexperience and specific examples
of working with different kindsof clients, different settings,
a different range of skills, adifferent range of skills, and
(15:30):
then translate that intosomething that not only is
understood by the other partybut also appreciated by the
other party, in that they cansee straight away that you bring
a certain kind of value thatwould be an asset to their
organization?
Speaker 2 (15:43):
Really important question.
So I use a bit of a frameworkto do that.
This is years after workingwith engineers.
They have a.
I have a framework for for mostof the things I teach, and this
is the framework that I'mtalking about.
Is the three no framework?
Three no?
(16:04):
So you know yourself, you knowwho you're speaking to and you
know the landscape.
So, firstly, knowing yourself.
This is why I often talk aboutthe career genius zone.
You've got to really understandwhat lights you up.
I don't believe in doing workwhere we encourage people,
(16:28):
especially women, to get yetanother certification.
I was speaking to an artistrecently and I commented that
she had everything labeled andwas so organized and she said
she used to be a scientist andshe wasn't a very good one, but
(16:50):
because of expectations, shewent on gathering certification
until one day she realized inher 40s that she loved art.
So knowing yourself is reallyimportant.
It's going to be a lot ofenergy to translate something
when you really couldn't be.
Your heart is not in it.
(17:11):
So that's one knowing yourself,knowing them.
And when I say knowing them, solet's say I'm talking to Serena.
Serena is hiring me to work inher organization.
So what is Serena really afterwhat is serena's pain points?
In fact, one of the exactquestions I ask my clients in
(17:34):
the questionnaire that they theydo and I work together is what
would your future client strokeemployer be so worried about
that they'll be up at 3amthinking about it.
So if serena is going to beconcerned about how the energy
(17:58):
transition is going to play upin western australia, then I'd
advise my clients to to reallydig deep on that topic and then
knowing the landscape.
So again, first know yourself,know them, which is your client
and knowing the landscape.
(18:19):
So what's coming up that canthreaten not only Serena's
business but you as well, andone very I mean.
We are having this conversationin May of 2025, and, of course,
the discussions on AI is manyand prolific now, so that is
(18:39):
something that we've got toconsider when we are talking to
Serena.
In summary, it's not abouttelling you whatever I want,
telling Serena whatever I wantto tell, but picking and
choosing the things that accordwith the tree norm.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
Got it.
So your framework sounds like away to zoom out, starting from
within, meaning that first Ineed to know myself very well,
because that gives me clarity,but it also tells me what the
boundaries may be.
And then I need to zoom out toyou, because you are the focus
(19:21):
of my efforts at presenting, atcommunicating, at persuading you
that I'm the right fit for whatyou're looking for.
And then I've got to take aneven larger view, zooming out
even more to take into accountwhat the threats may be, where
the opportunities may be, maybethe strengths, the weaknesses of
the organization or theindustry.
(19:43):
So I get that bit, or theindustry, so I get that bit.
But starting from ourselves, Ithink that actually is the
greatest challenge, because alot of clients tell me they
haven't got clarity.
They're still waiting forclarity, especially people in a
mid-career, mid-life transition,considering their next steps.
They've been putting in acouple of decades doing the work
(20:07):
and they've become highlycompetent in what they do.
Now they're considering whatshould I do with the rest of my
life?
And when we talk about knowingourselves, actually I know very
few people who spend timegetting to know themselves,
because everyone is just so busy, so overwhelmed, juggling so
many things.
It feels like taking time outto know yourself and ask
(20:30):
yourself those questions.
It's like a luxury, like anoptional extra.
So how do you make the case forpeople to take this time and
make the effort to knowthemselves?
How do they even start theeffort to know themselves.
Speaker 2 (20:48):
How do they even start?
So there's a lot out thereabout knowing your purpose.
Start with your purpose.
People say Now that was one ofthe more unhelpful advice that I
got when I was in corporate.
Not because it's bad advice,but because it was so big and it
(21:13):
wasn't something that I couldlatch onto.
My brain just didn't work thatway.
I'm sure it would for a lot ofpeople.
That wasn't me.
So what I do with my clients isjust get very practical and we
talk about what gets them inflow.
We have a series of questions.
For instance, what is it thatyou speak about a lot?
(21:37):
And there's a series of sixquestions which we do in 10
minutes, which we really getinto, which gives us a lot of
data.
So we start with the data andit doesn't really take a lot of
time.
So within, if you're asking theright questions, let's say it's
(22:00):
yeah, what do you speak about?
What do you think about?
Look within to come out withthe things that interest you and
what you know a lot about.
So when I've done this with myclients, there are typically two
ways that they go.
The first is they aren't reallyinterested in what they do, and
(22:27):
then what we do is we do a bitof benchmarking to see how they
are placed in the market.
So these are the clients who Iconsider are swimming in a
stream that is clear andwonderful, and we've just got to
help them swim in in um moreshallow water so it's easier for
(22:51):
them.
The other type of clients arethose who are not swimming in
the stream that they that theylove.
In fact, when I was growing upum in kuala lumpur, there was
this river called the klangriver, and if there are any
malaysians hearing uh this, youwould know that the clay who
(23:14):
used to live in kl have seen theklang river.
It's the, unfortunately, themost brown river that you could
ever see in your life.
And this is what swimming likea clang in the clang river feels
like that you are not in flow,that you're not doing the thing
that lights you up.
For instance, I had a clientwho was, who is, an accountant,
(23:42):
and this person was highlyvalued for doing the detailed
work because they are smart, buttheir stream, their clean
stream, is where they actuallyget to see the big picture and
help organizations with businesstransformation, not to do more
(24:04):
of the finer details, but tomake sure that they are showing
up with the big picture,painting the actual business
transformation story adequately.
I know we've moved a littlefrom your question.
I was trying to show by exampleof what that means.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
Okay.
So in the case of someone whois swimming in the wrong stream
or maybe is swimming upstreamwhen they could be swimming
downstream and having an easiertime, how do you help them find
their genius zone?
So you ask them these sixquestions to bring some clarity
to their thought processes.
But how does someone know whenthey have actually identified
(24:49):
their genius zone?
Speaker 2 (24:52):
So they will be looking at what they are
speaking about, what they thinkabout, what do they love to
research, what gives them energy, what do they really love to
action?
And when you answer thesequestions, you get a story.
(25:15):
You get a story that tells youa little more about you.
And then we get some more data.
And then we get some more data.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
We test this and see whether or not it makes sense so
it sounds to me like a verydata-driven approach, because a
lot of us, you know, when we arefirst embarking on something
like, let me find my purpose orlet me figure out what to do in
(25:50):
this next season of life, youare right, it is very amorphous,
very vague.
We are used to, step-by-step,something concrete frameworks,
something to latch on to.
We need some kind of linear,you know, some kind of structure
that makes us feel safe thatthis is achievable.
(26:12):
I can do this, I can take onestep at a time, but when we make
a big leap into what is my lifepurpose, that just feels really
out of reach.
And so what you're doing isyou're you're putting supports
in place so that they can gofrom one place and then jump to
another and another and it feelssafe.
They're not going to fall inbetween the cracks.
(26:33):
They're not going to, you know,jump off the abyss.
You're not asking them to makeany massive commitments to
something that they can't seeyet.
It sounds to me that you'reproviding a safe, supported
process and you're walking themthrough I think you've
summarized it really well.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
The picture that comes in my mind is, instead of
really jumping off the bridgeand swimming in this deep ocean,
you have stones in place thatyou you're walking on.
Now you might not haveguardrails, but they are.
The stones are broad enoughthat you can walk on slowly and
(27:14):
as you go through this discovery, you can see yourself with a
360 view in.
In fact, one of my clients,after finishing the process, she
said well, you know, I actuallyfeel seen holistically, even if
it's in my career.
And just to be clear, I don'tthink that the advice and just
(27:35):
follow your passion and themoney would come.
I don't subscribe to that.
I don't think it's, especially,you know, if you've got kids
and you've got a mortgage andyou've got to make it work with
many people don't have thatluxury.
Someone came to me and spoke tome the other day and said well,
I have the golden handcuffs on,I can't just leap off
(28:00):
everything and do what I like.
My response was well, you'renot going to.
However, if you don't, ifyou're still stuck and you don't
do anything new, as Mr Einsteinsaid, doing the same thing and
expecting different resultsthat's the definition of
insanity.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Yes.
So this is about also takingself-responsibility for the way
our career is progressing.
So if you're swimming in abrown river, if you're swimming
in the wrong river, do somethingabout it, but don't make any
sudden moves without actuallyweighing through the
consequences.
I understand that, but whatabout people who say oh, you
(28:40):
know, I don't think anything isgoing to happen to my industry?
It's really resilient.
Maybe it's AI proof, it'sredundancy proof.
What do you say to people likethat?
Speaker 2 (28:52):
I hope there are.
I don't think that even safeindustries are safe.
So five years ago I would havethought that teaching and
teachers are in the safestindustry and jobs that one could
(29:17):
ever imagine, until I heardthat the place where I'm in,
which is Western Australia, werelaying off teachers.
So it just shows that we are intimes that are very different
than the 1990s.
So in the 1990s, for instance,there was this concept of career
(29:39):
.
Resiliency was born Before that.
If you imagine yourself on atrain.
You got on this career train.
You joined a company,especially if it was a stable
company, the company.
You went along with thatcompany and that company took
you to retirement.
In the 1990s, we started havingrecessions, job and
(30:02):
restructuring, so people bootedyou off the train and you were
expected to then have your owncareer parachute.
Now, of course, with AI andenergy transition and all the
weird and wonderful things thatare going on, you're not having
a parachute.
I think it's not enough.
(30:22):
You've got to learn to pilotyour own career plane.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
So we need a pilot's license as well, on top of
everything else that we need tolearn.
What is the biggest takeaway,you would say, for professionals
who are navigating thesecomplex times?
What is the one thing theyshould pay attention to?
(30:50):
They should really look into.
They should start doing now,not wait till next year or
further down the line, furtherdown the line.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
If there's anything that anyone takes away from this
conversation, I'd say thisBuild your authority and build
it early.
Build it even though you thinkthat you are recession-proof.
(31:22):
This is how it was different.
When I was trying to get intothe job market in Perth because
my family was here I was toldthat well, as long as I worked
in X industry, I was in theenergy industry and in Perth
(31:42):
there was a resource boom at thetime.
So as long as I worked inhelping people in an industry
that helped people take mineralsor resources out of the ground,
I'll be fine.
It's moved very differently, ofcourse.
The economy is different andyour results are no longer your,
no longer safeguard that it'sgoing to get you anywhere,
(32:08):
especially if you don't have theconnections in a new country.
Actually safeguard that isbuilding your authority, really
getting, for instance,practically what that might look
(32:29):
like is if you work in a bigcompany, making sure that your
internal resume is sharp, youknow your pain points of the
clients that you're going tohelp In an external world.
It can look like a LinkedInprofile that has more than your
job title.
Speaker 1 (32:50):
When you say building your authority, how is that
different from building yourpersonal brand, which is what a
lot of experts and marketers aretelling people to do?
Is that the same thing?
Speaker 2 (33:03):
You are building your personal brand, but in a way
that's very targeted.
It's not just about having aLinkedIn profile, but it's about
having a LinkedIn profile,firstly, that's aligned to you
and you are looking to solve theproblems of the industry and
the employers that are going toserve you.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
So you almost have to be very exclusive, in a sense
that you are targeting a certainset of problems or a certain
problem and you're not reallytalking about the other things.
You want people to remember youfor being the problem solver in
this particular area.
Is that what you're sayingExactly?
Speaker 2 (33:49):
And that's why it's not only about building your
brand, but it's about buildingyourself as the go-to person for
the problems that your futureemployers are going to be
looking for.
Speaker 1 (34:02):
So a specialist approach, not a generalist
approach, because other peoplemay say you know, oh, I can do
everything.
I've got a wide range of skills, I can solve all kinds of
problems.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Yeah, I think, going back to the example that I gave,
that when I pitched myself as awearer of many hats, especially
if you're going into moresenior roles, I don't think that
approach is what employers arelooking for.
In fact, that approach canactually really be an impediment
(34:42):
to your authority building.
And in your authority, if youthink about it, you're known for
one thing Like Serena, you'reknown for being a coach and a
spokesperson for introverts.
Would that be right?
Would that be the right way tosay it?
That would be right.
So, in that sense, you're seenas the authority for that.
(35:05):
So extroverts, people who wantto, for instance, be louder,
would not go to you.
But that's okay.
You're an authority in a placethat you're comfortable with.
That's what you want to beknown for, that's what you're
passionate about about, and thatis also your genius zone.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
Is that right?
That's right, that's right.
So that's a that's anintersection between that area
that you choose to specialize inwith where you think your
talents and your genius lie, andto do it in a way that is very
specific, very targeted, veryhelpful.
So you almost make it easy,you've almost done the work for
(35:46):
the person that is consideringyou and making it easy for them
to say yes, this is the person,this is the authority, this is
the one I want on my team to besolving problems because of the
way they've positionedthemselves.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
That's exactly right, I think.
In today's market, it's nolonger about getting people to
translate your expertise for you.
It is a very fast-moving marketgenerally a very fast-moving
market generally and people'sattention spans are getting
shorter.
(36:23):
In fact, there's been countlesstests to show this.
So what happens then is thatthere's no patience and a
proliferation of people in themarket who are really good at
what they do.
So you need to be or rather, weneed to be really sharp with
(36:43):
our messaging.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
And that applies whether you're in corporate,
whether you are starting out anew venture.
It is still about the messaging, it is still about the
impression we are making, it isstill about the presence and
what do people take away fromthat first contact with us and
what do they see us as theauthority in.
So I think you've explainedthat really well, vimala, and I
(37:09):
really appreciate that.
You know this reminder thatthere is no industry now, in
this current situation, with theway the economy and the world
work.
That is AI-proof, that isrecession-proof.
That is recession-proof that isforever stable.
Things that were once stableare now being shaken at the
roots, and so it is incumbent, Ithink, on all of us, as the
(37:30):
managers and the CEOs of our owncareer, to take charge and take
responsibility for that.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
We need to get that pilot license for our own
careers, Serena.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Absolutely so.
Where would people go to findout more about what you do, and
is there something you'reworking on at the moment that
you would like to spotlight?
Speaker 2 (37:55):
Thank you for asking me.
My LinkedIn profile is the bestform of contact and I have a
free newsletter that's calledthe Outsider's Edge.
Now I'm really practical in myapproach and what you talked
about, and taking small steps,but practical steps to help us
(38:18):
get that pilot license.
That's what I showcase in mynewsletter, so I'd love it if
you come join me on the otherside of the.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Outsider's Edge Fabulous.
Thank you so much for givingall our listeners the Outsider's
Edge in a time when everythingis complex and volatile and
ambiguous and just reallyshaking under our feet.
But you've given us somethingto hold on to and you've given
us some thoughts and a way toget started on taking charge of
our own careers.
(38:49):
So thank you so much, Vimala,for coming on.
The Quiet Warrior podcast.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
It's been such a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (38:55):
Thank you for having me here, and that was another
episode of the Quiet Warriorpodcast.
If you've enjoyed listening tothis episode and hearing
Vimala's insights, do give alike and subscribe, and write a
review as well, so that theQuiet Warrior podcast can get in
front of more introverts aroundthe world.
See you on the next episode.
(39:17):
I'm so grateful that you'rehere today.
If you found this contentvaluable, please share it on
your social media channels andsubscribe to the show on your
favorite listening platform.
Together, we can help moreintroverts thrive To receive
more uplifting content like this.
Connect with me on Instagram atSerena Lo Quiet Warrior Coach.
(39:39):
Thank you for sharing your timeand your energy with me.
See you on the next episode.
Hi, I'm Serena Loh.
If you're used to hearing thatintroverts are shy, anxious,
antisocial and lack goodcommunication and leadership
skills, then this podcast is foryou.
You're about to fall in lovewith the calm, introspective and
profound person that you are.
Discover what's fun, unique andpowerful about being an
(00:21):
introvert, and how to make theelegant transition from quiet
achiever to quiet warrior inyour life and work anytime you
want, in more ways than youimagined possible Welcome.
Welcome to another episode ofthe Quiet Warrior podcast.
Today we're talking with VimalaThangavelu, who went from
(00:44):
Fortune 500 attorney to anexecutive coach specializing in
helping outsiders increase theirincome.
Growing up, she did everythingright, got the degrees, climbed
the corporate ladder, but aftera back injury that her doctor
ranked second only to childbirth, she started counting the real
cost of her success.
(01:05):
Now, through her signature GPSframework, she helps ambitious
professionals who don't fit thetraditional mold transform their
differences into theirsuperpower.
Welcome, vimala, to the QuietWarrior podcast.
I'm so glad to have you here.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Hi Serena, it's so good to be here.
I've been a fan of the podcastsince I can't remember when, so
this is an honor.
Thank you for inviting me, ohbeautiful.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Thank you so much.
Tell us more about your careerstory, because we all want to
know what made you decide toswitch away from law.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Talk about pivots, serena, I know you've pivoted as
well and I characterize mypivots from the rooms that I've
been in, so from a courtroom toboardrooms to now the coaching
room.
So I started as a litigator whenI was a baby lawyer and then I
joined Shell, had an amazingcareer, it was an incredible
(02:07):
workspace and I got to work andlive in Europe, asia and
Australia and life was gooduntil, if you remember, 2022,
the pandemic happened and I wasin a foreign country country,
living alone in my apartment,and this is a great privilege.
(02:31):
I understand that being in aforeign country when you had a
potentially a life-threateningpandemic swirling around you
really isolated me in myapartment and I had time for the
, I think, first time in a longtime to think and as I reflected
, I reflected how I had mentoredlawyers in my career, but I was
(02:57):
really bottom line orientated.
So as I sat down and you knowagain time for reflection I
started calling up my fellowcolleagues who looked like me,
because I realized that I carrythis shadow around me and the
shadow was really being anoutsider in the spaces that I've
(03:20):
been in, whether it's becauseof my voice, my accent, the way
I thought and when I startedreaching out to other women and
men who are like me, I realizeda very similar story.
So that got me thinking andwhen I came back to Australia
about a year later, I certifiedas a coach because those
(03:47):
conversations sparked somethingin me and I really wanted to see
outsiders succeed in their ownterms, not to have to twist
themselves up into a pretzel.
So a year ago I startedfull-time coaching outsiders to
(04:08):
really be the best versions ofthemselves and living in their
career genius zone and knockingtheir career out of the park.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
I love that identified that some of us feel
like outsiders, even when wehave the same qualifications.
We have the same experiences,the same abilities, but
something about the culturemakes it hard for us to fit in.
What do you think that is?
Speaker 2 (04:38):
That's such an important question and before
going into that specifically,may I say that I actually am an
ambivert, so not an extrovert,not an introvert, but somewhere
in between.
But I've always loved yourpodcast.
I love the term the quietwarrior because to me it was
(04:59):
part of being an outsider aswell.
I knew a lot of introvertswhere, in the places that I
worked, that felt that theydidn't fit in, because the
corporate world generally,generally, is rewards more
extroverted, bigger, dare I say,louder voices.
So whenever you have the powerstructure not looking, sounding
(05:24):
or thinking like you, unlessleadership and the people around
you make a real concertedeffort to include you in and
appreciate your differences,you're going to feel like an
outsider I imagine, especiallyin the early years, it would be
(05:45):
even more so because not onlyare you a newbie, but you're a
newbie plus an outsider and youdon't have the power to
influence decisions, isn't it?
(06:07):
As you're talking.
It just got me back to when Iwas a new litigator and I was in
a courthouse that was not myhome courthouse.
I was in a different state andI had this opponent who was an
(06:32):
older gentleman, seeminglysmiley but of course you know
he's a litigator and he wantedto win the case for his client
and I was I would have been ayear, not even qualified and he
came up to me and he said so,I'm, my mother tongue is Tamil,
and he knew that.
And he said he referred to meas a small girl.
Papa, how are you doing, smallgirl?
(06:52):
This is the first time I hadever spoken to him and it was,
of course, intended to put me inmy place.
Know that he's the man and hewas the one in charge.
He had authority and I didn't,and at that time I didn't have
the vocabulary or the insight orthe wisdom to know what he was
(07:15):
doing.
So I felt very intimidated.
So 100% correct that you don't.
The more lower you are in thehierarchy or the authority
ladder, the more disempoweredyou're going to feel.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
So what does one do in a situation like that, aside
from biding your time until youhave gained more authority?
Speaker 2 (07:44):
What I think social media has done really well is
brought awareness.
So there's a lot morediscussions around how you
respond to people who areabrasive, rude or put you down,
rude or put you down.
I feel that today's lawyers whocome out are far more aware,
(08:11):
emotionally aware, and are farmore educated to be able to fend
off those kind of attacks.
And I'm putting the bunny earshere.
They're attacks, invertedcommas, because it's not a
physical attack, but it'scertainly an attack that's
attacking your authority beforeyou get into the room and say
(08:33):
that I have qualified, I deserveto be here, and if anyone is
going to put me down, I'm goingto stand my ground.
(08:54):
So in that situation I wouldhave been.
If that happened again, I wouldhave been a bit cheeky and said
well, hello, tata, and Tata inmy language means grandfather.
So to be able to just bring itback and not being so
shell-shocked, to be a bitplayful about it, humor is a
great authority and thatsometimes doesn't come,
(09:17):
especially for outsiders,doesn't come automatically,
especially when it comes to ifthere's an age difference as
well.
So it takes a bit of practice.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
I love that you said that, because I can think of all
the situations when I was anewbie lawyer as well, in open
court, in chambers, and thatfeeling of ooh, I am so small,
I'm so new, I'm just a small fry.
And then, on top of that,there's also our cultural
(09:51):
conditioning we are trained togive respect to older adults
right, it's the hierarchy of thefamily and then the hierarchy
of society.
There is a pecking order andit's almost like we need to know
where our place is, and Isuppose that that was what your
senior opponent was trying toremind you.
(10:12):
And so for newer lawyers cominginto this new space and with
the aid of social media, greaterawareness, being more mindful,
more grounded, having all thesetools and resources, I think
(10:34):
it's perhaps, in a sense, it'smuch more, should we say it's a
bit easier to be a quiet warriorthese days easier to be a quiet
warrior?
Speaker 2 (10:48):
I think so, and I don't say this lightly.
I think it is easier being aquiet warrior because there are
voices for quiet warriors.
Take yourself, serena, whatyou're doing with your podcast
(11:08):
and how you show up on LinkedIn.
You are a self-proclaimed quietwarrior and by your actions you
show that.
Hey, you can show up in a waythat is very aligned to the
personality that I am, and I seemany other examples of that on
(11:37):
Instagram, on LinkedIn, and thatis the good part of social
media.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Yes, I think it's that visibility that gives
others permission to speak up,to feel that my voice is valid
and I do have a place in thisconversation.
I think it gives courage toother people who are still
contemplating and still worryingthat speaking up is somehow
going to disrupt the status quo,going to take away that feeling
(12:01):
of safety.
So I think that's the good partabout social media.
So that's one way the jobmarket has changed since you
were a lawyer.
Are there other ways the jobmarket has changed?
Speaker 2 (12:13):
Absolutely so when I let me just share this by
telling a story.
Many years ago I got a role asa lawyer because I ticked many
boxes.
I was a litigator, so Iunderstood how the courts worked
(12:33):
.
I was a company secretary.
I trained as a commerciallawyer, so they hired me because
of the range and I had greatrange and they knew that with
all that I had I could get inmore fast and get the job done.
That range was seen as an asset.
(12:54):
Today that range could get youoverlooked because you don't
come up really neatly packagedso people can't pinpoint what it
is that you do, especially forthe more senior roles.
And I think visibility isreally important now compared to
(13:19):
even five years ago.
And I think what's even moreimportant is authority.
Are you speaking in a way thatmakes people take notice, makes
(13:40):
people understand that yourvalue translates to solving
their pain point?
And for outsiders this isdifficult for two reasons.
First reason is because you arein a room that doesn't
appreciate what you are puttingdown, as the kids say nowadays.
(14:00):
So, for instance, if you're anintrovert and you know you're in
a room where loud voices, Iwanted to say charisma, but
charisma is often wronglytranslated to being louder and
more forceful, a certain type ofleader.
So if you are in that room,then no matter what you do, it's
(14:22):
going to be very difficult tobreak through that.
What you do, it's going to bevery difficult to break through
that.
The second reason is becausethe translation could be better.
You could be using your voiceand speaking words that the
other person understands in amore effective way.
So in my coaching room we doboth work.
(14:43):
We do both work identifying therooms that you feel really
comfortable in and also beingable to translate your value in
a way that really resonates withthe market.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
I think a lot of listeners will be very curious
and want to know more about thistranslation process.
How does one take years ofexperience and specific examples
of working with different kindsof clients, different settings,
a different range of skills, adifferent range of skills, and
(15:30):
then translate that intosomething that not only is
understood by the other partybut also appreciated by the
other party, in that they cansee straight away that you bring
a certain kind of value thatwould be an asset to their
organization?
Speaker 2 (15:43):
Really important question.
So I use a bit of a frameworkto do that.
This is years after workingwith engineers.
They have a.
I have a framework for for mostof the things I teach, and this
is the framework that I'mtalking about.
Is the three no framework?
Three no?
(16:04):
So you know yourself, you knowwho you're speaking to and you
know the landscape.
So, firstly, knowing yourself.
This is why I often talk aboutthe career genius zone.
You've got to really understandwhat lights you up.
I don't believe in doing workwhere we encourage people,
(16:28):
especially women, to get yetanother certification.
I was speaking to an artistrecently and I commented that
she had everything labeled andwas so organized and she said
she used to be a scientist andshe wasn't a very good one, but
(16:50):
because of expectations, shewent on gathering certification
until one day she realized inher 40s that she loved art.
So knowing yourself is reallyimportant.
It's going to be a lot ofenergy to translate something
when you really couldn't be.
Your heart is not in it.
(17:11):
So that's one knowing yourself,knowing them.
And when I say knowing them, solet's say I'm talking to Serena.
Serena is hiring me to work inher organization.
So what is Serena really afterwhat is serena's pain points?
In fact, one of the exactquestions I ask my clients in
(17:34):
the questionnaire that they theydo and I work together is what
would your future client strokeemployer be so worried about
that they'll be up at 3amthinking about it.
So if serena is going to beconcerned about how the energy
(17:58):
transition is going to play upin western australia, then I'd
advise my clients to to reallydig deep on that topic and then
knowing the landscape.
So again, first know yourself,know them, which is your client
and knowing the landscape.
(18:19):
So what's coming up that canthreaten not only Serena's
business but you as well, andone very I mean.
We are having this conversationin May of 2025, and, of course,
the discussions on AI is manyand prolific now, so that is
(18:39):
something that we've got toconsider when we are talking to
Serena.
In summary, it's not abouttelling you whatever I want,
telling Serena whatever I wantto tell, but picking and
choosing the things that accordwith the tree norm.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
Got it.
So your framework sounds like away to zoom out, starting from
within, meaning that first Ineed to know myself very well,
because that gives me clarity,but it also tells me what the
boundaries may be.
And then I need to zoom out toyou, because you are the focus
(19:21):
of my efforts at presenting, atcommunicating, at persuading you
that I'm the right fit for whatyou're looking for.
And then I've got to take aneven larger view, zooming out
even more to take into accountwhat the threats may be, where
the opportunities may be, maybethe strengths, the weaknesses of
the organization or theindustry.
(19:43):
So I get that bit, or theindustry, so I get that bit.
But starting from ourselves, Ithink that actually is the
greatest challenge, because alot of clients tell me they
haven't got clarity.
They're still waiting forclarity, especially people in a
mid-career, mid-life transition,considering their next steps.
They've been putting in acouple of decades doing the work
(20:07):
and they've become highlycompetent in what they do.
Now they're considering whatshould I do with the rest of my
life?
And when we talk about knowingourselves, actually I know very
few people who spend timegetting to know themselves,
because everyone is just so busy, so overwhelmed, juggling so
many things.
It feels like taking time outto know yourself and ask
(20:30):
yourself those questions.
It's like a luxury, like anoptional extra.
So how do you make the case forpeople to take this time and
make the effort to knowthemselves?
How do they even start theeffort to know themselves.
Speaker 2 (20:48):
How do they even start?
So there's a lot out thereabout knowing your purpose.
Start with your purpose.
People say Now that was one ofthe more unhelpful advice that I
got when I was in corporate.
Not because it's bad advice,but because it was so big and it
(21:13):
wasn't something that I couldlatch onto.
My brain just didn't work thatway.
I'm sure it would for a lot ofpeople.
That wasn't me.
So what I do with my clients isjust get very practical and we
talk about what gets them inflow.
We have a series of questions.
For instance, what is it thatyou speak about a lot?
(21:37):
And there's a series of sixquestions which we do in 10
minutes, which we really getinto, which gives us a lot of
data.
So we start with the data andit doesn't really take a lot of
time.
So within, if you're asking theright questions, let's say it's
(22:00):
yeah, what do you speak about?
What do you think about?
Look within to come out withthe things that interest you and
what you know a lot about.
So when I've done this with myclients, there are typically two
ways that they go.
The first is they aren't reallyinterested in what they do, and
(22:27):
then what we do is we do a bitof benchmarking to see how they
are placed in the market.
So these are the clients who Iconsider are swimming in a
stream that is clear andwonderful, and we've just got to
help them swim in in um moreshallow water so it's easier for
(22:51):
them.
The other type of clients arethose who are not swimming in
the stream that they that theylove.
In fact, when I was growing upum in kuala lumpur, there was
this river called the klangriver, and if there are any
malaysians hearing uh this, youwould know that the clay who
(23:14):
used to live in kl have seen theklang river.
It's the, unfortunately, themost brown river that you could
ever see in your life.
And this is what swimming likea clang in the clang river feels
like that you are not in flow,that you're not doing the thing
that lights you up.
For instance, I had a clientwho was, who is, an accountant,
(23:42):
and this person was highlyvalued for doing the detailed
work because they are smart, buttheir stream, their clean
stream, is where they actuallyget to see the big picture and
help organizations with businesstransformation, not to do more
(24:04):
of the finer details, but tomake sure that they are showing
up with the big picture,painting the actual business
transformation story adequately.
I know we've moved a littlefrom your question.
I was trying to show by exampleof what that means.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
Okay.
So in the case of someone whois swimming in the wrong stream
or maybe is swimming upstreamwhen they could be swimming
downstream and having an easiertime, how do you help them find
their genius zone?
So you ask them these sixquestions to bring some clarity
to their thought processes.
But how does someone know whenthey have actually identified
(24:49):
their genius zone?
Speaker 2 (24:52):
So they will be looking at what they are
speaking about, what they thinkabout, what do they love to
research, what gives them energy, what do they really love to
action?
And when you answer thesequestions, you get a story.
(25:15):
You get a story that tells youa little more about you.
And then we get some more data.
And then we get some more data.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
We test this and see whether or not it makes sense so
it sounds to me like a verydata-driven approach, because a
lot of us, you know, when we arefirst embarking on something
like, let me find my purpose orlet me figure out what to do in
(25:50):
this next season of life, youare right, it is very amorphous,
very vague.
We are used to, step-by-step,something concrete frameworks,
something to latch on to.
We need some kind of linear,you know, some kind of structure
that makes us feel safe thatthis is achievable.
(26:12):
I can do this, I can take onestep at a time, but when we make
a big leap into what is my lifepurpose, that just feels really
out of reach.
And so what you're doing isyou're you're putting supports
in place so that they can gofrom one place and then jump to
another and another and it feelssafe.
They're not going to fall inbetween the cracks.
(26:33):
They're not going to, you know,jump off the abyss.
You're not asking them to makeany massive commitments to
something that they can't seeyet.
It sounds to me that you'reproviding a safe, supported
process and you're walking themthrough I think you've
summarized it really well.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
The picture that comes in my mind is, instead of
really jumping off the bridgeand swimming in this deep ocean,
you have stones in place thatyou you're walking on.
Now you might not haveguardrails, but they are.
The stones are broad enoughthat you can walk on slowly and
(27:14):
as you go through this discovery, you can see yourself with a
360 view in.
In fact, one of my clients,after finishing the process, she
said well, you know, I actuallyfeel seen holistically, even if
it's in my career.
And just to be clear, I don'tthink that the advice and just
(27:35):
follow your passion and themoney would come.
I don't subscribe to that.
I don't think it's, especially,you know, if you've got kids
and you've got a mortgage andyou've got to make it work with
many people don't have thatluxury.
Someone came to me and spoke tome the other day and said well,
I have the golden handcuffs on,I can't just leap off
(28:00):
everything and do what I like.
My response was well, you'renot going to.
However, if you don't, ifyou're still stuck and you don't
do anything new, as Mr Einsteinsaid, doing the same thing and
expecting different resultsthat's the definition of
insanity.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Yes.
So this is about also takingself-responsibility for the way
our career is progressing.
So if you're swimming in abrown river, if you're swimming
in the wrong river, do somethingabout it, but don't make any
sudden moves without actuallyweighing through the
consequences.
I understand that, but whatabout people who say oh, you
(28:40):
know, I don't think anything isgoing to happen to my industry?
It's really resilient.
Maybe it's AI proof, it'sredundancy proof.
What do you say to people likethat?
Speaker 2 (28:52):
I hope there are.
I don't think that even safeindustries are safe.
So five years ago I would havethought that teaching and
teachers are in the safestindustry and jobs that one could
(29:17):
ever imagine, until I heardthat the place where I'm in,
which is Western Australia, werelaying off teachers.
So it just shows that we are intimes that are very different
than the 1990s.
So in the 1990s, for instance,there was this concept of career
(29:39):
.
Resiliency was born Before that.
If you imagine yourself on atrain.
You got on this career train.
You joined a company,especially if it was a stable
company, the company.
You went along with thatcompany and that company took
you to retirement.
In the 1990s, we started havingrecessions, job and
(30:02):
restructuring, so people bootedyou off the train and you were
expected to then have your owncareer parachute.
Now, of course, with AI andenergy transition and all the
weird and wonderful things thatare going on, you're not having
a parachute.
I think it's not enough.
(30:22):
You've got to learn to pilotyour own career plane.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
So we need a pilot's license as well, on top of
everything else that we need tolearn.
What is the biggest takeaway,you would say, for professionals
who are navigating thesecomplex times?
What is the one thing theyshould pay attention to?
(30:50):
They should really look into.
They should start doing now,not wait till next year or
further down the line, furtherdown the line.
Speaker 2 (30:59):
If there's anything that anyone takes away from this
conversation, I'd say thisBuild your authority and build
it early.
Build it even though you thinkthat you are recession-proof.
(31:22):
This is how it was different.
When I was trying to get intothe job market in Perth because
my family was here I was toldthat well, as long as I worked
in X industry, I was in theenergy industry and in Perth
(31:42):
there was a resource boom at thetime.
So as long as I worked inhelping people in an industry
that helped people take mineralsor resources out of the ground,
I'll be fine.
It's moved very differently, ofcourse.
The economy is different andyour results are no longer your,
no longer safeguard that it'sgoing to get you anywhere,
(32:08):
especially if you don't have theconnections in a new country.
Actually safeguard that isbuilding your authority, really
getting, for instance,practically what that might look
(32:29):
like is if you work in a bigcompany, making sure that your
internal resume is sharp, youknow your pain points of the
clients that you're going tohelp In an external world.
It can look like a LinkedInprofile that has more than your
job title.
Speaker 1 (32:50):
When you say building your authority, how is that
different from building yourpersonal brand, which is what a
lot of experts and marketers aretelling people to do?
Is that the same thing?
Speaker 2 (33:03):
You are building your personal brand, but in a way
that's very targeted.
It's not just about having aLinkedIn profile, but it's about
having a LinkedIn profile,firstly, that's aligned to you
and you are looking to solve theproblems of the industry and
the employers that are going toserve you.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
So you almost have to be very exclusive, in a sense
that you are targeting a certainset of problems or a certain
problem and you're not reallytalking about the other things.
You want people to remember youfor being the problem solver in
this particular area.
Is that what you're sayingExactly?
Speaker 2 (33:49):
And that's why it's not only about building your
brand, but it's about buildingyourself as the go-to person for
the problems that your futureemployers are going to be
looking for.
Speaker 1 (34:02):
So a specialist approach, not a generalist
approach, because other peoplemay say you know, oh, I can do
everything.
I've got a wide range of skills, I can solve all kinds of
problems.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Yeah, I think, going back to the example that I gave,
that when I pitched myself as awearer of many hats, especially
if you're going into moresenior roles, I don't think that
approach is what employers arelooking for.
In fact, that approach canactually really be an impediment
(34:42):
to your authority building.
And in your authority, if youthink about it, you're known for
one thing Like Serena, you'reknown for being a coach and a
spokesperson for introverts.
Would that be right?
Would that be the right way tosay it?
That would be right.
So, in that sense, you're seenas the authority for that.
(35:05):
So extroverts, people who wantto, for instance, be louder,
would not go to you.
But that's okay.
You're an authority in a placethat you're comfortable with.
That's what you want to beknown for, that's what you're
passionate about about, and thatis also your genius zone.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
Is that right?
That's right, that's right.
So that's a that's anintersection between that area
that you choose to specialize inwith where you think your
talents and your genius lie, andto do it in a way that is very
specific, very targeted, veryhelpful.
So you almost make it easy,you've almost done the work for
(35:46):
the person that is consideringyou and making it easy for them
to say yes, this is the person,this is the authority, this is
the one I want on my team to besolving problems because of the
way they've positionedthemselves.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
That's exactly right, I think.
In today's market, it's nolonger about getting people to
translate your expertise for you.
It is a very fast-moving marketgenerally a very fast-moving
market generally and people'sattention spans are getting
shorter.
(36:23):
In fact, there's been countlesstests to show this.
So what happens then is thatthere's no patience and a
proliferation of people in themarket who are really good at
what they do.
So you need to be or rather, weneed to be really sharp with
(36:43):
our messaging.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
And that applies whether you're in corporate,
whether you are starting out anew venture.
It is still about the messaging, it is still about the
impression we are making, it isstill about the presence and
what do people take away fromthat first contact with us and
what do they see us as theauthority in.
So I think you've explainedthat really well, vimala, and I
(37:09):
really appreciate that.
You know this reminder thatthere is no industry now, in
this current situation, with theway the economy and the world
work.
That is AI-proof, that isrecession-proof.
That is recession-proof that isforever stable.
Things that were once stableare now being shaken at the
roots, and so it is incumbent, Ithink, on all of us, as the
(37:30):
managers and the CEOs of our owncareer, to take charge and take
responsibility for that.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
We need to get that pilot license for our own
careers, Serena.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Absolutely so.
Where would people go to findout more about what you do, and
is there something you'reworking on at the moment that
you would like to spotlight?
Speaker 2 (37:55):
Thank you for asking me.
My LinkedIn profile is the bestform of contact and I have a
free newsletter that's calledthe Outsider's Edge.
Now I'm really practical in myapproach and what you talked
about, and taking small steps,but practical steps to help us
(38:18):
get that pilot license.
That's what I showcase in mynewsletter, so I'd love it if
you come join me on the otherside of the.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
Outsider's Edge Fabulous.
Thank you so much for givingall our listeners the Outsider's
Edge in a time when everythingis complex and volatile and
ambiguous and just reallyshaking under our feet.
But you've given us somethingto hold on to and you've given
us some thoughts and a way toget started on taking charge of
our own careers.
(38:49):
So thank you so much, Vimala,for coming on.
The Quiet Warrior podcast.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
It's been such a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (38:55):
Thank you for having me here, and that was another
episode of the Quiet Warriorpodcast.
If you've enjoyed listening tothis episode and hearing
Vimala's insights, do give alike and subscribe, and write a
review as well, so that theQuiet Warrior podcast can get in
front of more introverts aroundthe world.
See you on the next episode.
(39:17):
I'm so grateful that you'rehere today.
If you found this contentvaluable, please share it on
your social media channels andsubscribe to the show on your
favorite listening platform.
Together, we can help moreintroverts thrive To receive
more uplifting content like this.
Connect with me on Instagram atSerena Lo Quiet Warrior Coach.
(39:39):
Thank you for sharing your timeand your energy with me.
See you on the next episode.
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