AI Is Rewiring the Human Brain

Neuroscientist and author Dr. Richard Restak warns that the 21st century’s fusion of AI, surveillance, and psychological manipulation is literally reshaping the human brain. Dissecting how governments and tech giants are weaponizing anxiety, rewriting history, and even experimenting with memory editing and mind-computer interfaces—all under the guise of progress.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:07):
All right, And joining us now is doctor Richard Restak, MD,
and he is a neuroscientist as well, and he has
written a lot of books on the brain, and now
this is one kind of the nexus of our brain
and artificial intelligence. So I wanted to get him on
because we, as you know, we talk about AI and

(00:27):
its impact on society quite a bit. Thank you for
joining us, doctor Rustick.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
Well, I'm happy to be here.

Speaker 3 (00:34):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (00:34):
David.

Speaker 1 (00:35):
You've written so many books and best selling author and
of course people can bind this on Amazon. You've written
so many books. What is different about the brain? What
is different about this one? And why did you write
this book?

Speaker 2 (00:47):
I wrote this book to announce and to discuss the
dangers that are lurking and so to speak, in the
twenty first century and are unique to the going first,
that are having an effect on the brain and a
negative one, so that we really are imperiled by eight
different factors, one of which is the global warming. We

(01:11):
have new diseases that are present in the twenty first
century that are increasing, starting with COVID and moving forward.
We have problems of course with the global warming, which
we'll talk about more detail. And then the internet the
effect of the Internet, the effect of AI memory, the alteration,

(01:34):
the attempt to alter memory, almost to alter our memories
of what the past is like. This is an ongoing
enterprise by various governments of the world, including our own.
We also have surveillance. The seventh a surveillance becoming increasingly
a surveillance society. It's almost impossible to not be revealing

(01:58):
things about yourself because there's surveillance cameras everywhere. I can
give you several examples, not just in my own personal life.
And then finally, the eighth one is anxiety. All of
these things are creating what I call existential anxiety. People
are being given information, but it's being molded according to

(02:20):
the thoughts and the inclinations of people in power. For instance,
let's take today's right out of New York Times. On
page A seven, there's an article called the air in
New Delhi is life threatening, and it tells the tale
of the New York Times reporters who have spread themselves

(02:42):
throughout New Delhi from six a m. Until late in
the evening of a certain day recently, and they measured
the particulate matter in the air, and it was anywhere
from ten times to thirty times as great as would
be concerned minimally normal. Now on top of that you

(03:04):
have the statement that they state that the government is
actually trying to hide this kind of insight to the
populace by spraying water and other things like that. It
says that they're doing this around the measuring stations. They're
also losing data from measuring stations during the worst outs pollution.

(03:29):
So there you have the molding of the facts, either
denying them all together or trying to improve them so
that people say, oh, well, they measured it down. It's
such and such a measuring state, and it was really
not a lot of high. Of course, they were spreading
water and other things to try to reduce this. So
we've got a capitalist society here in the United States

(03:52):
which has invested interest in pushing forward certain scientific points
of view. So science is being put sort of in
the back seat. And as politicians and other people, all
of whom share one thing capitalistic enterprises in which they're
part of, for which they are advancing.

Speaker 1 (04:15):
And a kind of crony capitalism where they can get
protection and subsidies as well, and the control is being
taken away from us because as I was just reporting
earlier today they're working very hard to make sure that
state and local governments can't enact any control on artificial intelligence.
And they came up in the context of talking about

(04:37):
how the manufacturers of tasers also big manufacturers of police
body camps, how they want to wed that to artificial intelligence.
And the question is, you know what could possibly go
wrong with that? If they identify you, they misidentify you
as a dangerous criminal, and warn the police about how
dangerous you are, they could get people killed.

Speaker 2 (04:59):
Well, not only that, but all these efforts set up
a sense of anxiety and fear. Let me tell you
what happened to me one morning, called a cab to
go to medical appointment, and we've started going down the road.
I said to the driver, you know you're not going
the most efficient or the quickest way. He said, I

(05:20):
know that, he said, but I don't want to go
that way because they're speed cameras. I said, well, you
know you're driving very sensibly and you're not speedy, and
I'm in no hurry. So what's the problem. He said, Well,
they take pictures of everybody that goes by those cameras
because they want to see who's in those photos in
those cars. So I asked them to give me a

(05:41):
reference for that, and he got set of didn't say
anything else for the rest of the trip. So when
I got down to the medical building, I got in
the elevator and said, in this facility there is surveillance,
both obvious and hidden, and the.

Speaker 3 (05:58):
Third clause watch and you know this is one morning.

Speaker 2 (06:03):
And then when I got up to sign in, I
signed the board with an electronic ben and I didn't
see you go, no signature I saw. I said, well
it didn't take. You know it took, but we don't
know it to go on the screen so it could
be seen. I said, why is that? Said, well, somebody
who haunts you might see the thing and then remember
it and use your for your signature to forward something somewhere. Well,

(06:28):
first of all, there was a sign that said stand
ten feet back, and secondly, there's nobody else behind me.
So there's three examples, just drawing it random that were
becoming an increasingly surveilled society, which is creating a sense
of paranoia and a sense of fear. So the brain
has to adjust to these type of things, David, and

(06:48):
it's very hard to do.

Speaker 1 (06:50):
And I think that is calculated. You know they've been
they wanted to do this even to the extent and
when you talk about these cameras taking everybody's picture, the
flock network that is out there, this corporation that is saying, well,
we can do whatever we want because it's in public
space and you know we're we're not government, so we
can collect this information. And yet they collect it in

(07:12):
order to sell it to the government.

Speaker 3 (07:13):
So it's just.

Speaker 1 (07:14):
One level in direct but they not only grab your
license plate, but they also do a complete profile of
your car and all of its idiosyncrasies. Is have a
dent here, does have a scrape there? What about a
bumper sticker? So it creates a model of your car.
And so they almost have like, you know, biometric identification
of your cars as well as of you. And this

(07:36):
is now made possible because of the advances of AI.
But this has been something that has been concerning me.
I look at things kind of from a libertarian perspective,
and this has been concerning me for a long time.
The idea that government is using technology, many different ways
of Internet, social media, things like that, to monitor and

(07:58):
to manipulate us all the time, and to me, artificial
intelligence just puts this on steroids. And so I think
there's something to be anxious about. If we're going to
look at this, we should be concerned about it. Maybe
not anxious, but we should be concerned about the goals
of people who are putting this kind of stuff together.

Speaker 2 (08:19):
So yeah, well there's that, and then there's if you
can manage to change the present, you can manipulate the future.
Of course. Is the real way to get it is
to get control of the past. Is warwell pointed out? Yes,
you control the past, you know, you can control the
present and by the implication, control of the future. And

(08:39):
we're seeing alterations of materials, even government documents, government films, documentaries,
things like that are being altered in ways that are
not visible I should say detectable, not detectable to the
ordinary person. So they get ideas about what the past

(08:59):
was like which are wrong and don't show you. As
I mentioned in the book, if you were at a
dance in eighteen fifty before the Civil War and it's
a film or watch Let's say we're watching a film
about eighteen fifty and we're seeing people ballroom dancing all that,

(09:20):
and then one of them pulls the side and pulls
out a cell phone, and you say, wait a minute,
we didn't have cell phones. Then, well, you know, there
were a lot of things that were going on now
that we're not going on in the past, and it's
not too our advantage to try to pretend that they were.
They weren't. We have to understand the past, understand the future,

(09:43):
and we're not only creating situations that are false, but
we're also like in nineteen eighty four, or Well created
a character called Commander Olov. He was a war hero.
He got all sorts of metals, and it was all
the products that were all told to honor him and

(10:05):
so forth. Well, he never existed. He actually was made
up entirely. And that's one of the things that the
narrator is doing in the job of work is filling
in photographs see concerting O WIV into historical events that happened,
wartime scenarios, etc. Anyone reading it will say, wow, this

(10:27):
is this is some man. Well, he was a complete fabrication.
We're just about at that point with Sora out, the
the AI out. Well, it could take you and had you,
you know, to say, let's get to David Knight and
have him leading some sort of a parade or whatever,
and you know, suddenly people say, well, gosh, I saw

(10:48):
him with my own eyes. So what's happening is that
the actually seeing is believing is being turned on its head.
So that's no longer true.

Speaker 1 (10:57):
You're talking about a completely fabricated character out of Orwell
it's just recently they had Tilly Norwood, who has a
completely fabricated AI personality, and the person who came up
with it got agents representing her, They got her out
there as an actress. I mean it was like, so,
I've created an AI actress which will do a lot
of different roles for you.

Speaker 3 (11:19):
She probably does her own stunts as well.

Speaker 1 (11:20):
I'm actually people in SAG, the screen actors Gil and
they're furious about this.

Speaker 3 (11:26):
And I said, any.

Speaker 1 (11:27):
Agent that presents this AI character is not going to
do any business with us. But we're already at that point.
It truly is interesting, Yeah, And one of.

Speaker 2 (11:37):
The ways of neutralizing it is to create the situation
that exists right now between you and me. You're laughing,
and I'm laughing because it seems funny, and it is funny,
but it's a very serious purpose behind all of this. Yes,
it's all hatter to try to alter people's perceptions so
that they begin to doubt the varietity of what they're seeing.

Speaker 3 (11:58):
That's right.

Speaker 1 (11:59):
Yes, I've talked for the longest time about how the
whole idea for the Internet was created by DARPA psychologists,
and I've been concerned that it was all about the
psychological manipulation from.

Speaker 3 (12:09):
The get go with all of this.

Speaker 1 (12:10):
But as a physician and as a neuroscientist, I'd be
interested in your take on, you know, what is currently
going on, because besides manipulating the past by changing information
about the past or you know, memory holding it or
writing a new alternative history of it, they are also concerned.
And there's been projects that have been put out by DARPA,

(12:33):
and I don't know if they've been successful or not,
but they you know, they're putting out requests for people
to come up with things to manipulate people's memories. So
you've got a soldier, they say it, who's got bad PTSD.
Let's get rid of that memory. Let's give them different memories.
What do you see in terms of someone who studies
the brain and neuroscience, what do you see about that,

(12:54):
what do you take, as I think is the state
of the art with that.

Speaker 2 (12:59):
Last book was called the Complete Book of Memory. It
had to do with memory and studying memory in great detail.
And of course you have to do away with the
concept that memory is like a videotape or something that
you just store in your brain and when you get
and want to get it, you just bring it out
like you bring out a videotape. It's not like that.

(13:19):
It's a reconstruction. Each time you think back to a
certain event, you alter that memory so that you have
memory one, memory two, memory three, on and on and all.
That's the nature of memory. And memory can be manipulated.
It's always, you know, in the courtroom they're always trying

(13:40):
to avoid the contamination of the witness. An example that
would be, well, which car went through the red light?
And to ask a witness and he said, oh, it
was it was a red car went through the red light. Well,
would it surprise you to know that it wasn't a
red light but it was a stop sign? Misterial witness.

(14:00):
Of course, his credibility is gone because he took the
suggestion that it was a red light. Instead, it'll be
very easy to do because you don't necessarily have that
image of that intersection in your mind. So that's why
there's protections even in the courtroom against leading the witness.
They caught, in other words, providing information that's either not

(14:24):
through at all or half true. So we've got that call.
This is not this didn't start in the twenty first century.
That that started, you know, as long as we've had courtrooms.
This is a more emphasis now on altering memory. So
the people will not will get up there and undercross
examination they'll do pretty well because their whole memory has

(14:44):
been altered. They've changed by various mechanisms, suggestion, repeating information
which is false, of course, which is the misinformation. There's
a cartoon about a week ago by Ramirez in which
he's Fulter Prize winner. He has three doctors in an

(15:04):
operating room in a laboratory. So one of them is
looking into a microscope and he looks up and he says,
this is the most dangerous pathogen we have ever encountered.
And the second doctor says, well, is it bubonic plague?
Is it smallpox? And then the one that he says, no,
it's misinformation, disinformation.

Speaker 1 (15:28):
That's right, And we've got to be very careful because
many times the people who will tell us about that
are the people who want to be the ones who
define what the information is for us, and they will
ask those leading questions, you know, when we're talking about
leading questions and manipulating people. There's been a lot of
reports about artificial intelligence kind of people who have a

(15:53):
particular psychosis or something and they get involved with the
AI and it starts to confirm the thing that they want,
because that's what it is set up to do in
terms of bias that want to you know, be empathetic
and sympathetic to people, and so it starts doing that
and leading them further and further down a particular rabbit hole.
There's been situations of you know, people who got into

(16:15):
severe mental distress, some suicides of some young children and
other things like that speak to that aspect of it
and the real danger of that. That is really kind
of I think speaks to the psychological aspect and potential
of artificial intelligence, and that could be weaponized. Right now,
it's just kind of happening out of their business model, right,

(16:36):
but that could definitely be weaponized against people.

Speaker 2 (16:39):
Well, I talk about that. In my book, in the
chapter on the Internet, there are famous examples of people
who have suicided right on the internet law feed, and
they've been manipulated to doing that by other people who
have encourage them, said this would be a sign of strength,

(17:00):
this would be a sign of that you're not afraid
to die if necessary. And there's cases of it that
actually led to the suicide. One of them is most grizzly.
I have in my book about a person who has
talked into pouring gasoline over themselves and setting a match,
all on open feed Internet. And while this fire is burning,

(17:24):
you can hear everybody in the backgrounds cheering, we did it,
We did it. We got him to do it.

Speaker 3 (17:30):
Wow, that's amazing.

Speaker 2 (17:34):
So there's something about the internet and about that actually
brings out statistic criminal, psychopathic trends, and we don't know why.
Is it. The fact that you don't necessarily can't be identified.
It's something that is going to be influencing and has
influenced the Internet greatly, and it will continue to do

(17:56):
so until we understand it.

Speaker 1 (17:59):
I think that's one things that's so dangerous about the
things that we saw with lockdown. Other aspects of it.
There's an adimization here in so many different ways. The government,
tech and tech companies are trying to make sure that
we don't we're not in person with each other. You know,
many cases like, for example, in this interview, we couldn't

(18:19):
do this interview if we both had if one of
both of us had to travel. We're able to do
this because we can do it over zoom or whatever.
But just taking ordinary things that you would normally do
in terms of interacting with people in school or in
church or in your community or whatever, taking that away
and putting a screen between the two of you, it

(18:41):
really does change the way people interact with each other.
I remember Errol Morris, the film director, was able to
get people to say all kinds of things.

Speaker 3 (18:49):
He got a.

Speaker 1 (18:49):
Murderer to confess, he got he got Robert McNamara to
confess about the false Flago, the Vietnam War. He got
people say all kinds of stuff because there was that
distance between him and them. He could have interviewed them
in person. But what he did was he put an enterotron,
which he is what he called it. It was basically
a teleprompter that he had set up so he could

(19:11):
do two way communication at the time, and once he
had that distance there, then it completely changed the dynamics
that he would have versus with somebody person to person.
And that's what we're talking about here, isn't it.

Speaker 2 (19:24):
Yeah, we're talking about that, And of course there's the
inegradations of this, and it continues like we're you're interviewing me,
we're discussing. I feel like it's a discussion. If I
were to say something that later I regretted, I could
probably say, oh, well, that wasn't me, that was my avatar.

Speaker 3 (19:42):
Or my agent.

Speaker 1 (19:43):
Right, I got an AI agent that's out there doing that, right,
that's crazy. We also see though, as a doctor, you're
seeing people have noticed actual physical changes that can be
observed in people's brains from I'm thinking the story about
the London taxi drivers who would do the knowledge and

(20:04):
they would find that as they memorized all these factual
details and drew on that all the time in order
to take people to you know, this very complicated city
with its complicated streets, that they had a particular part
of their brain that was larger than the typical person.
And then they found that once they stopped doing that,

(20:24):
it started to shrink again, and we're starting to see
that happening with people in a lot of different areas
of their life, that kind of atrophy, and it's physically observable,
isn't it.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
Well, it is.

Speaker 3 (20:35):
You have to learn.

Speaker 2 (20:36):
You have to use the things that you have learned
to do. Like I mentioned in my memory book, there's
all kinds of memory exercises that you could do. I
do them every day and they're very easy and they
can help you to continue with your with your memory
to keep it sharp.

Speaker 1 (20:53):
Give us some examples. I'm sure everybody would love to
know that. I would all like to have a better memory.
What kind of things do we can we do to
exercise Well.

Speaker 2 (21:00):
Think about the fact that you never had to learn
pictures when you were an infant and a young child.
A picture was something that you could you may not
know what you're looking at, but you could see it
without an intermediary whrest. Language is something that you have
to hear from other people. It's something that's sort of
added on to the brain. Okay, So as a result,

(21:24):
the most the best way of remembering something is to
make a image for it.

Speaker 3 (21:33):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (21:34):
For instance, I have a little dog called a skipper Key.
Skipper Key is a Belgian dog. He's a nice little fellow.
But it was embarrassing to me when walking the street,
people say what kind of a dog is that? And
it couldn't come up with a name because it was
such complicated. And I thought that skipper Key, I didn't
speak any doubt you or anything. So then I got

(21:56):
this image of a small boat with a large captain
with a beard holding a big key. So it was
skipper Key, and I remember forever, so I was I
had the picture. Once I have the picture, it's easy
to do another way, easy way to do it, and
you can do that with all kinds of times. All
the time, I was going upstairs before I came down

(22:19):
to the office, and I wanted to get my wallet
and I wanted to get my cell phone. So I
just had an image of a wallet in the form
of a cell phone, and I was walking up the
stairs talking into the wallet cell phone. So I got
up and I knew I had these two elements to get.
Be very easy to get one and forget the other,

(22:39):
so that you have these images all the time, and
the quickest you know. This is sort of off the
topic of the book, but if you want to have
a firepower memory for a load of things, it's up
to ten things and get ten areas that you are
familiar with that every day, and then you could put

(23:03):
on those images the thing you're trying to remember. So
if I'm trying to remember a loaf of bread, milk,
maybe a batteries, I have a regular way of doing that.
I have like I remember the library that's near my home,

(23:24):
the coffee shop, liquor store, Georgetown University, Medical School where
I went, Georgetown University, Cafe Milano, which is a place
in Washington everybody gathers, and then Keybridge, Ewa, Jeema Memorial,
and Regan Airport. So that bread would be, for instance,

(23:47):
the loaf of bread. I was looking in the window
of the library. Instead of seeing books, I see bread,
loaves of bread. And when I get down to the
liquor store, instead of being filled with liquor, that'll be
milk bottles. So that's how I love to get to it.
So I have those ten so I can get ten
items together not any problems at all.

Speaker 3 (24:07):
That's great.

Speaker 1 (24:08):
Yeah, you know, it's interesting you talk about the importance
of a visualization. It's one of the things that I
do in terms of preparing for the show. I have
a lot of articles that I go through and it's
really when I highlight things or when I write them down,
that's when I can remember them. If I don't do that,
if I were just to read these things, I wouldn't
remember them. But if I interact with it and write

(24:29):
it down, that helps me to remember it. So that
is a kind of visualization there, I guess as well.

Speaker 3 (24:35):
It is.

Speaker 1 (24:36):
It truly is interesting what you said earlier about memory
not being something that is stored in a place. As
somebody coming from a computer science background, that was a
very different thing. When you construct your your memory, you know,
how do you reconstruct that? I mean that that as
opens up a whole new area of questions as well.
In other words, if every time somebody brings up a subject,

(24:58):
I mean, there is isn't something that's stored initially to
reference that and then rebuild from that.

Speaker 2 (25:05):
There's that because there's the inner there's the interconnections. Like
you know, somebody listening to us might say, well, gee,
this is called the twenty first century brain, but I
haven't heard that much about the brain. Well let me
just link that up so that these things make sense.
We have a new version, or I should say, a
new understanding of the brain called the connectomic brain, in
which there's all kinds of interactions in the brain of

(25:30):
parts of the brain. But you don't we're just learning
about I have the I use the metaphor of a
bull of spaghetti. You pull out one of the strains
of spaghetti, and you're never have any idea what it's
connected to. How many other strains is spaghetti this is
connected to? So that if you think of the brain
as being kind of set to make connections, that's its

(25:55):
natural process. So it gets back to these things that
we were talking about earlier, you know, global warming and
memory and surveillance and all that. How are we going
to solve all those Well, somehow or other those things
are connected with each other. That's the take home message
of this book. And the basic goal is to try

(26:19):
to figure out what it is that connects these things,
what it is that would allow us to buy solving
one of them solve the other. And I mentioned at
the end of the book, experts so far haven't done it.
So it's useful, as Hiak said, to get ordinary people

(26:42):
to give When I say ordinary, I mean, non specialized
people to give their ideas. Do you I wonder what
such and such would happen, what would happen about global
warming for a while those In fact, there's still experiments
going on on the effect of sulfur that would help
the the CO two problem and you know, shooting sulfur

(27:04):
up into the into the atmosphere. Of course, the reason
for that was the volcano in nineteen eighty something in
which after that volcano in Hawaii it was noted that
the air was clearer and there was less pollution. So
that's something to think about, is there's some way of
using that particular sulfur experiment to decrease global warming. War,

(27:32):
for instance, we don't think of war as a cause
of global warming, but it is.

Speaker 3 (27:36):
Or CO two warning.

Speaker 2 (27:40):
Yeah, but what up since the Ukraine War and the
gauze of war. Then you know, a tremendous amount that's
going to overcome and exceed the benefit of any of
these things, like you know, non gasoline engines, but using
things like that.

Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah, it's kind of like you know, shooting up rockets
in order to put satellites up. You know, how many,
how many cars and lifetime use of cars from people
would that be equivalent to and you start talking about
all the missiles that are being shot and then you
get to the explosives as well. Uh, it is really
interesting how they focus us on their objectives for their

(28:22):
ways to control the manipulation has been going on for
quite some time. And so yeah, that is it is
pretty amazing. And I guess that's my you know, my my.
When we look at this stuff, it really does look
like science fiction. And I'm almost inclined to write it
off on our first see it when DARPA is saying, well,
we need to find some way that we can, uh,

(28:43):
you know, erase memories and people and insert new memories
into them. And we were going back to total recall, right,
so it sounds like something from Philip K. Dick novel,
but they're really working on that. And I guess one
of the most striking things that we saw we reported
on a couple of weeks ago, and it was a
company that was bragging about how they could read your

(29:05):
mind more accurately and quickly than their competitors. Because there's
a lot of different companies that are doing this and
how they could it's called brain. It was the name
of the company, and so they had a way that
they would do MRI and they could essentially train it

(29:25):
on your brain in a much shorter period of time
to the other people, and they could get much better results.
And our producers just pull this up. So what they
do is they show you an image and you're looking
at that image, and then it's reading your mind and
reconstructing what you're looking at, which I thought was absolutely
amazing and terrifying at the same time. How is this
going to be used? I guess that's the real issue

(29:46):
when we start talking about all these different things. I
think that is the real case that it's difficult for
people to understand just how far and how quickly the
technology has progressed, and then to say, and how do
we control this from being used for bad purposes?

Speaker 2 (30:04):
Well, that's a specifically twenty first century problem, because all
of these things have either originated in the twenty first
century or they have in fact further developed and become
increasingly threatening. And bear in mind, we have to have
to solve these problems because they're not something that's going
to go away. And then the most important thing to remember, David,

(30:27):
is that all of these things harm the brain, and
the brain is the thinking processor. It's going to save us.
It's going to figure out what the problems, what the
solutions to the problems are. So we know now that
wildfire smoke, for instance, it creates dementia, It enhances the

(30:48):
likelihood of something that's coming to menash So as the
brain is affected negatively increasingly over longer and longer periods
of time, our ability to solve these problems and to decrease.
So we've got to do it now. We've got to
get serious about it. And this business of people getting
up saying the global warming is fiction and all that

(31:10):
is really very very disturbing.

Speaker 3 (31:14):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:15):
Well, you know the example that you gave earlier of
the fact that the Indian government was manipulating the temperature
at some of the stations there.

Speaker 3 (31:23):
That kind of works both ways.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
They have put some of these temperature stations on the
airport tarmacs, and in the UK they have a lot
of the temperature stations that they've got there. They're just
extrapolating the data. They don't have real temperature measurement stations there.
So it all really gets back, I think, to the
scientific method, and that's really where we have to hold
people's feet to the fire. We're talking about something like that.

(31:46):
We can have an absolute standard of what truth is,
and that truth is going to be being able to
measure something accurately and being able to reproduce that. And
then I think a good yardstick for that is when
somebody is trying to high their data. That's that's the
clue right there that they're not doing science. Because if
they're doing science and they've come to the right conclusion,

(32:09):
they don't have a problem with somebody looking at their data.
And so I've got a question here for you from
a person in the audience asking you know about doctors
James Giordano and Charles Morgan and their work with military.
I'm not familiar with those names. I don't know if
you know anything about that or not.

Speaker 2 (32:26):
To your Donna says familiar. What particular thing are they
asking about them?

Speaker 3 (32:31):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (32:32):
It just says their work with military. I guess i'd
have to do with something, but you haven't heard of it.

Speaker 2 (32:36):
I'm not sure I could say to your dollar, did
this or did that? Not sure?

Speaker 3 (32:41):
I understand.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
Yeah, let's talk a little bit about the things that
we have been anxious about and of course, as Christians,
we have one answer to it. But you talk about
how this is something that has been around pretty much
all of our life. I mean there was I grew
up with anxiety about nuclear warfare. Example, that was on
everybody's television, and that was a fourth front front of

(33:05):
our mind, especially growing up in Florida when the Cuban
missile crisis was happening. They got us really afraid of that.
When I was in elementary school, you know, it's like
there's not gonna be enough time for you to get home,
you know, a nuclear bomb started falling in So I
mean there's all these different ways that you can panic people.
I guess part of it is how do we identify
the real problems and how do we deal with those

(33:28):
problems because there's always things that are competing for our
attention and our anxiety, many of which are not real,
you know, And usually the things that you're really the
most concerned about won't happen. And it may be sometimes
because you have taken a precaution about it. What would
you say about that about anxiety?

Speaker 2 (33:52):
It started to break up a little bit. Can you
hear me? Clearly?

Speaker 3 (33:55):
I hear you yes, yes, sorry about that. You talked about.

Speaker 2 (33:58):
Breaking up a little bit, talking.

Speaker 1 (34:00):
About traumatizing a population. You know, what do you do
to guard against that type of thing? And of course
that's going to really escalate with the ability of AI
to create a narrative.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
Yeah, well, let's talk about it. There's an avenue to
get into that. Let's go back to what you've brought
about the atomic weapons and the atomic war, the fears
of the people that there's going to be another atomic war.
I mean, you know, this is not unrealistic. There's even
been a movie that's just come out that's getting all
kinds of attention, as you know, and it has to

(34:37):
do with the threat of a nuclear war things in
the If you look at what's happening in the Europe
right now, there's all kinds of suggestions that could lead
to a nuclear war. I mean, Ukraine now has announced
that they're under no conditions willing to give up any
land and Stalin is i mean Putin is thinking what

(34:59):
he can do to change that, but maybe he'll attack
another country. I mean, this is scary stuff. So what's
happening in response to the government is to try to
show that, oh we shouldn't worry about it. We have
things under control. But I don't think things are under control.

Speaker 1 (35:18):
And we've talked about the problems, and we talked about
problems you have. Your final chapter is New Ways of Thinking,
and i'd like to talk about that. One of the
things that you say is Occam was wrong. Occam's razor
that you know people are familiar with. Tell us a
little bit about that. Why is I come wrong?

Speaker 2 (35:38):
Well, because he says that, you know, the entities are
not to be multiplied, meaning that we can always explain
things best by limiting ourselves to the minimum amount of factors.
Ideally want one cause of every effect. That's not true.
It's certainly not true in the twenty first century. There's
all kinds of interactions between factors and cause, so that

(36:02):
Alkham was wrong in that basis. We have to think
of an interconnecting pool, just as in the brain, of
interconnections of neurons, interconnections of these problems. And they're all related.
They're all really, all eight of them I talk about
in my book. They're all related. And if you can
figure a way of influencing one, you influence all the others.

(36:23):
I mean, who would think there'd be a connection between
global warming and the amount of artisan and cheese for
INSS high end cheese, well there is because they don't
chicken stole lay many eggs, and it would be all
the various other things to come on in terms of
making cheese. I've earned that. Learned that the other day.

(36:43):
That was something that was a surprise to me.

Speaker 1 (36:46):
You know, it's kind of interesting. We talked about Connections
so much. There was a series that was I think
it was on PBS. I think the guy's name was Burke.
I can't remember his first name. I'm not sure about
the last name.

Speaker 3 (36:56):
But we had a.

Speaker 1 (36:57):
Series called Connections, and I thought was fascinating because what
he would do is he would take a whole series
of connections to show how a particular technology had evolved,
you know, so he might go from you know, the
quill to the to the jet engine.

Speaker 3 (37:13):
Or something like that.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
And it was a fascinating, fascinating thread of things, very
much like what you're talking about.

Speaker 2 (37:24):
It really is. And I did I did consult his work,
Actually did you. I was writing this book because he
did that Connections. He did a book called The Day
of the World Changed and all this he also did
a book called Circles, in which he would start with
one particular event that he cared in history, and if
you go around the circle, you come back to the

(37:44):
beginning where it started, where this particular inventor invented something
would led up to it. What was the circle leading
to that? So, yes, we're talking about connections, and we're
talking about the inability to understand things without reference to
awarding and accessory factors. We have that going all the time,

(38:04):
denying things that are going to be happy. Of course,
I think the fearful thing is that the government is
aiding in this denial, because if you deny that there's
a problem, then there's very little impetus to try to
solve it, you know, Yeah, and there no problem, don't
try to solve it.

Speaker 1 (38:25):
They're throwing out their own chaos and uncertainty and anxiety
that's out there all the time always.

Speaker 3 (38:33):
I guess.

Speaker 1 (38:33):
So the question is you're talking about volatility, uncertainty, complexity,
and ambiguity. I mean it sounds like a government policy.
I think they've got bureaucracies that specialized on that.

Speaker 2 (38:46):
Yeah, yeah, well actually that's true.

Speaker 1 (38:48):
Yeah, that's in your section there about new ways of thinking,
and so how do we incorporate that in the new
ways of thinking that help us to solve this riddle.

Speaker 2 (38:58):
Well, each of those factors is a factor that helps
you to understand things and to have more control. It
doesn't necessarily mean it helps you to link them together.
That has to be done by original thinking. You have
to be under those things. Things are evolvable. You don't
have a basic situation that doesn't change. It changes all

(39:21):
the time. So that the other thing that I want
to emphasize the most is that is the role of
capitalism in all of this. I mean, there's all this
like the private equity, the business of people having a
point of view that is going to advance them financially,

(39:42):
and that blinding them to the problems that are here. Like,
for instance, we talked about global warming. Well, the rich
people of very rich people are buying multi million dollar
departments and condominiums which have special air filters which will
keep wildfire smoke out and we'll try to keep the

(40:03):
global warming effect at bay by superpower air conditioners.

Speaker 1 (40:11):
So the building they're building their own bunkers to buildings
that are creating all kinds of chaos and and uh,
you know, weapons of war, mass destruction, they're out. They're
building super bunkers in various places as well, So I
think they're somewhat pessimistic about what they're doing.

Speaker 2 (40:30):
Well, it's basically the idea is that, you know, we
don't care about the ordinary person. We're going to survive.
We're going to see to our own survival, and if
we in order to do that we have to deny
certain things that are that are going on, will do so. Now, incidentally,
all of this is not conscious thinking. They don't necessarily say, well,
I'm going to deny global warming because it will be

(40:52):
to my advantage financially because all my investment is in
the globe the all gas industry. They don't. They don't
do it that way. They come up with pseudo logic
things that seem to make sense to them, but if
they didn't have a financial thrust in the matter, they
would look out upon it quite differently.

Speaker 3 (41:12):
That's right.

Speaker 1 (41:12):
We can always find a justification for what it was,
what it is that we really want. Everybody should understand
that if your parents this time of year, at Christmas time,
you can always understand that people will come up with
a justification for what they.

Speaker 3 (41:24):
Want, and that's as.

Speaker 1 (41:26):
True of government as it is of corporations out there,
and it's really dangerous one of the two of them
connect with each other. I think that's one of the things.
You know, you talk about connections and the importance of
it and how we can try to connect these different factors,
each of us individually, But I think it's the human
connection that is out there that is going to be
essential for all of this. It's going to be our

(41:46):
collective work on all this. What do you think about that?
Would you agree with that?

Speaker 2 (41:53):
Well, I'd agree with it, But there's so many things
that are taking place now that are causing the schisms
and yes, splitting people into factors and belief systems and
political points of view, and that's very dangerous because then
you can't get together any kind of unity, even in
the face of an emergency.

Speaker 1 (42:13):
Well, I think we've always had I think we've always
had these factor you know, factions and things like that.
You know, the founders of the country warned about factions
and political parties. But I think what makes it unique
is that when you're interacting with people on a personal basis,
you interact with them a little bit differently than if
you've got that separation between you that technology is giving

(42:34):
us now because now you're interacting with something that's abstracted,
is not with another person. And there's also the body
language that you're not picking up on. But it makes
it easier for you to be harder on people when
there's that distance there. I think that's why I think,
you know, the personal connection I think is really vital
to making these connections and coming up with an understanding

(42:55):
of what's going on. We talked about the hidden factors
that are out there, hidden unrelated to topics other people,
as you pointed out earlier, just talking to ordinary people
about what is that you see with different things. I
think that is the genius of the collective free market
out there, that there's so many observers who are looking
at things and thinking about them, and it's kind of

(43:18):
their collective decision that is kind of guiding things along,
as opposed to having a central planner who's doing that.
What do you think about that You've got to in
your final chapter a new way of thinking. You have
what you call it sensible solution. What does that really involve?

Speaker 2 (43:37):
I'm sorry, I hear what you said.

Speaker 1 (43:40):
You have a sensible solution. What do you think a
sensible solution to the kind of stress and chaos and
anxiety that we have, manipulation that we have. What is
a solution to that?

Speaker 2 (43:51):
Well? I think the Wikipedia is a good example of that.
They have people from all walks of life, all levels
of education, free to contribute to whatever topic they may
want to do that it may be helpful. I mentioned
earlier about the effect of global warming on the making
of cheese. It might be somebody who makes cheese that's

(44:14):
going to come up with some idea. You know, we
don't know that. We don't know that. That may not
be where it comes some original idea of want to
do about global warming? And you put it on what
I'd like to think, And I hope it will be
developed a kind of Wikipedia where the ordinary person can
feel free to put forth their ideas about it. Now

(44:35):
you say, well, we already have that, we have the Internet. No,
we don't. The Internet is a commercial situation. It's all
done for making money and grab attention and all that,
and there's no criticism of it. There's no pure review,
if you will, rights in the Wikipedia. I mean, you know,
people get write in and say, well, that particular contribution

(44:55):
as bonkers and then give an example why it is
that was a very good idea. And after that you
begin to get things coming together in unpredictable ways that
they help us solve these eight problems.

Speaker 1 (45:10):
Yeah, the problem is it seems like whenever you wind
up having a form or place where things can be,
and that's true of the Internet, it's also true of Wikipedia,
then it becomes you have gatekeepers who are there and
we saw this in spades throughout the COVID stuff that
if somebody's got a different idea, rather than debate them,
the impetus is to silence them by the people who

(45:33):
are an authority. And so that really, I think is
the key thing, and I think as part of that
we see a continuing rise in disgust and deprivation of
free speech. People are not interested in the principle of
free speech. They don't want to have open debate. And

(45:55):
I see this regardless of where people coming from on
the political spectrum. There is a declining interest and debate
and thinking. You know, the debate is critical to critical thinking,
and so the people who are in charge, the gatekeepers,
whether it's Wikipedia or the Internet or any other form

(46:15):
of information. They are weighing in on that, and they
don't want things that they disagree with. And it might
be because they've got an agenda, or it might be
because they've just got a particular prejudice about something. They
want to make sure that the contrary views don't get
out there. That I think is the real keys that's there.

(46:35):
And again, this is part of this atomization that we
have of people feeding that tribalism in the way that
we've never seen it before using technology.

Speaker 2 (46:45):
I would agree with everything you've just said exactly, and
I think we have to try to get beyond that.
But we get back again to this business of people
having their own personal financial point of view and position
and pushing that basically on the fact that they look
upon it as so maybe we're talking about a capitalism problem.

(47:09):
We've got capitalism. It's what this country's all about. But
I mean it's certain parts of it. Now we've gone
to the point where people are unable to take another
point of view if it's going to be financially harmful
and hurtful to them.

Speaker 1 (47:22):
Yeah, I think that, you know, we start looking at
the tech companies.

Speaker 3 (47:27):
I don't think that their capitalism would exist.

Speaker 1 (47:29):
I don't think they have billions of dollars if they
weren't unified with the government. So there's a there's a
symbiosis there that the two of these entities feed off.

Speaker 3 (47:39):
Of each other.

Speaker 1 (47:40):
And I think that's that in exus, right there is
the is the difficult thing. And and so I think,
you know, when I think of capitalism, I don't like
to refer to capitalism anymore because I think of it
as a partnership, a public private partnership, some kind of
an economic fascism where they are working together. But I
like to think of a free, competitive market where the

(48:02):
government doesn't have any role except as some kind of
a referee between two parties that have a conflict or something.
But yeah, that's the thing that's really driving this. You know,
many people when they talk about AI, they said, well,
you know, here's a couple of different outcomes. Maybe this
stuff really works the way it's supposed to work, it
takes everybody's jobs and we wind up with a depression,
or maybe it doesn't work at all, in which case

(48:24):
the big AI stock bubble that we've got bursts and
everybody loses their job because of that. Well, there's a
third alternative, and that is that the government keeps propping
it up with public funds because it feeds their surveillance
and manipulation needs their ability to surveil and to control us.

(48:45):
And I really think that that's where this is all
going to head. I don't really you know, those other
two things may happen, and they may be true, but
I think there is a customer out there for the
AI stuff that is driving all this stuff that has
been putting out these proposals for the longest time. That's governments,
governments around the world. I mean, we look at the
Brain project that we had a few years ago, that

(49:06):
was during the Boma administration. But things like the Brain
Computer Interface that Elon Musk and many other tech companies
are doing out there. There's neuralink and there's a lot
of them that are doing that. That's being driven by
the government wanting to connect into our minds, hack into
our minds really, and they've been funding that kind of thing.

(49:26):
So how do we break that.

Speaker 2 (49:28):
Yeah, on the Musk side, it sees doing it for money,
I mean obviously to make money, that's right, So that
there's unholy alliance, if you will, between someone who can't
see anything on the dollar, and in the other side
of the government can't see anything other than increasing power
and surveillance over the population.

Speaker 1 (49:47):
Yeah, that's right, absolutely true. Well, it's a fascinating book.
It's fascinating take on this and and of course you've
written many books on the brain, the memory one very interesting,
and you do have sections about memory in this book
as well. And people be able to find this on Amazon,
I guess is the best place that they can find

(50:07):
it looking for the title of this and it is.
You know, it is something that I think we all
need to think about how we're going to operate the
effects that this technology is having on our brains in
the twenty first century. And that is the title of
the book, The twenty first Century Brain by Richard Restak.

(50:28):
Thank you very much, doctor Restak. Thank you, appreciate you
coming on.

Speaker 2 (50:32):
And Georgia, thank you.

Speaker 3 (50:34):
A very interesting conversation. Thank you. Have a good day.
Folks are gonna take a quick break and we will
be right back.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
The common man, they created common Core, dumbed down our children.
They created common past track and control us. They're Commons
project to make sure the commoners own nothing.

Speaker 3 (51:05):
And the Communist future.

Speaker 1 (51:08):
They see the common man as simple, unsophisticated ordinary.

Speaker 3 (51:13):
But each of us has.

Speaker 1 (51:14):
Worth and dignity created in the image of God. That
is what we have in common. That is what they
want to take away. Their most powerful weapons are isolation, deception, intimidation.
They desire to know everything about us, while they hide
everything from us. It's time to turn that around and

(51:37):
expose what they want to hide. Please share the information
and links you'll find at the davidknightshow dot com. Thank
you for listening, Thank you for sharing. If you can't
support us financially, please keep us in your prayers. D
davidknightshow dot

Speaker 2 (51:57):
Com and Stasist