Prepare to be taken on a whirlwind journey with Tarry Summers, the real estate maestro, as he lays bare the blueprint of his single-family property empire. We're not just talking about buying and selling; we're getting into the lifeblood of the trade – managing numerous properties, deciphering market swings, and the smart play of 1031 exchanges. Tarry doesn't shy away from the hard-hitting realities of land scarcity and homeownership dreams, painting a vivid picture of why single-family homes remain a golden ticket in the investment carnival.
Shifting gears, we crack the code on staying afloat in the turbulent tides of the roofing and insurance sectors. It's a tale of transformation, from insurance reliance to retail resilience, and the allure of private equity's eagle eye for robust retail components. Personal anecdotes aren't spared either – I'll recount my foray into the fitness industry as he is the owner of the Arnold Classic's official gym and the surprising doors it flung open. It's an episode brimming with strategies, market insights, and the occasional chuckle, reminding you that business is as much about the unexpected as it is about the bottom line.
But at the heart of it all, we circle back to the core – the relationships that forge our paths to success. Whether it's rubbing elbows with elites at the Arnold Classic or nurturing my real estate brainchild, it's clear that genuine connections pave the way to authentic wealth. The episode winds down with tender reflections on family, work-life harmony, and my personal strides toward sobriety, proving that the quest for success is also a journey of self-discovery. So, strap in for an episode that promises as much wisdom as it does warmth, and perhaps, just perhaps, you'll walk away with more than you came for.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Right.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
You're like that buzzard ain't rang.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
That game ain't over with, so keep going.
I have thrived in that chaos.
How could this be happening toany of you guys?
Pay attention to anything Isaid Like.
Welcome back to the RecklessCEO Podcast, where we keep it
real, raw and real.
I'm going to be talking likeit's just you.
(00:34):
So welcome back to the RecklessCEO Podcast.
I got an old time friend, dudeit's been Old time friend.
But it's been a long time, man.
Yeah, I'm actually excited tohave you in, brother, I had a.
Bobby was like dude, you guysgot to get on a podcast together
.
He was all about it, so I waslike man, let's make it happen,
(00:56):
dude.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
And I'm like where's Bobby?
Or he's like where's Bob, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
I thought he was going to come in and hang out
and be a part of our chat.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
I got him working today, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Usually it's the opposite.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Usually I'm the one working.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Well, you know how, like, everyone has their role.
Yeah, yeah, that means.
But, hey, terry Summers, Iappreciate you coming in.
Man, I'm excited to have you on, bro I you know what, what you
have done in real estate, and Imean, bro, it's incredible, it's
.
I mean, you've got to have oneof the biggest portfolios in
Columbus.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
It's not, you know, private equity or syndication
stuff right, probably on thesingle family side for sure.
But it's, it's gritty, man.
You know it's one house at atime.
All these apartment gurus it'strue what they say Like can't
just buy a whole apartment fullof single family houses, yeah,
so you have to onesie, twosieyour way and be super organized.
(01:43):
You know you got to getinsurance on every property,
utilities on every property, allthese different roofs, all
these different sewer lines.
So I mean you have all theseproblems amplified and
multiplied.
But I'm a big believer in thesingle family house.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
You've always been the single family guy you know I
don't discriminate on assetclasses.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
If it makes money I'm in.
Man I'm in.
But you know I always try to.
I mean, you're never going tobe able to predict the future,
but I try to look at trends andwhat people want and buy what
they buy what they want, I guess.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Oh, and I mean you look at a, I mean a city like
Columbus.
At the end of the day,everything's still going to run
off of.
You know your the, theavailability, you know and I
mean everything's ran by.
You know people moving here,the scarcity of more properties,
less properties.
They can't build more landthere ain't really many places
to put much more houses.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Right and if you want to be close right.
And I know that people want tolive in a home versus an
apartment Right, I mean you canactually own a home, can't own
it.
You can't own your apartmentunit, yeah, you know.
And so I mean you're having alot of people that you know, you
know, you know, have rented fora long time and they want to
buy a house right, and they wantto be able to create that
equity and some generationalwealth, right.
(02:54):
Yeah, grant Cardone says it's abad deal, but I think all of
America would disagree.
Yeah, so I mean it gives youthe ability to you know you can
rent it, you can sell it, youcan.
I mean it's where's anapartment unit?
If I want to sell the apartmentcomplex, I guess I'll sell the
whole damn thing.
Yeah, whereas like a house, Ican be like, hey, if I've got a
20-year apartment building or a20-you know 20 unit or 20 houses
(03:17):
, I can just sell one if I wantto.
So it gives you options, right.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
And a little yeah, like you said, it gives you a
little flexibility right versusjust the apartment side.
And I mean dude to be for aportfolio that size.
I mean, how many houses for oursingle families are you
operating?
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Right now 257.
Sure, we are buying two today.
So we because you know how itworks we close all of our deals
on Fridays from two to four.
But you know, I look at myselfas not like a hoarder of houses.
It's like you know, I'm a realestate dealer, I'm a trader, so
I'm always buying, I'm alwaysrenting, I'm always in the
market to sell.
(03:55):
So I'm looking at everyopportunity, as you know, not
what's the return on investment,but what's the return on equity
.
You know can is what's thecompound interest effect if I
sell this property and then 1031exchange and buy six more, or
if I refinance this property,maybe hold on to it, knowing
that there's going to be amassive appreciation run up,
(04:15):
maybe in three years I sell it,and so I'm just playing that
compound interest game at alltimes and just constantly
looking at it and that's that'sreal estate one-on-one and
compound interest.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
It is man, it is man, it is man, it is man, it is man
, it is man, it is man, it isman, it is man, it is man, it is
man, it is man, it is man it isman, it is man, and so that's
man, it is man, it is man.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Yeah, the here is my final comment on the
multi-billion-dollarchte man.
It's all hands off, that's it.
Money, that's it, it is man Ina man that loves another man too
much to handle the feeling ofincome from investing.
It's got to do with winning aCash and Money.
It is a long-term thing.
(05:06):
You know, if you think you'regonna own the world in real
estate like go into a differentbusiness where you can clip
contracts and something that'sway more scalable, like this is
probably if you wanna scale realestate and make construction,
like dude, they suck, they suckat scaling.
There's so many differentpeople in between the profit and
(05:26):
it just there's just it sucksand it costs a lot of money to
do it.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
You know what I mean.
I mean I would say for me, likethat was, that was the biggest
swing for me to get into.
I mean the roofing side.
Like I'm not a roofer, I didn'tknow roofing, I didn't have no
experience with it.
You know what I mean.
But starting to you know,having mentors that are helping
me understand business and thesethings.
It was like roofing to me madesense because it's the
acceleration right.
(05:51):
It's like for me.
I thought that I gotta findsomething that creates the money
to be able to then put it backinto a long-term play, but where
I wanna get to in the timeframethat I would like to get there
to real estate.
That was gonna.
I feel like that was gonna takea long time.
It does take a long time man Imean you've been doing it for
what?
20 years no.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Ain't that old man?
Speaker 1 (06:10):
How old are you Come on, bro.
I think you started at like 25when you started.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
I bought my first house.
Actually, I was telling youbefore we got on, I actually
bought my first five houses inthis building.
Have not been back to thisbuilding since.
That's crazy, and I'm pullingup and I'm like I'm getting
flooded with all these differentfeelings.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
I'm like man just kinda remember like what it took
to be able to save up enoughmoney to get that first one and
then I mean the second one.
I drove back from Pittsburgh,pennsylvania, literally had to
get a direct deposit in my bankaccount, grabbed the check, hope
that it deposited enough to beable to show a six-month reserve
, which I made it by like 40bucks.
(06:49):
So I remember driving backbecause I knew I was gonna need
money and I didn't have anycredit cards or anything at the
time and I rode up to theclosing on empty in my car
because needed that money in mybank account and do a screenshot
to then send it.
So it just.
But if you can do it once, youcan do it again, and if you can
do it again, do it again, do itagain.
Then you got something.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Yeah, and then it's getting the people around you to
build it.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Yeah, and I mean that's the.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
I think that's the next hardest thing and it's
being able to.
I mean, you get it as theleader, the owner man, like you
always gotta be on 10.
You always gotta be motivatedand spot like I can't have a
down day and walk into theoffice full of people that are
relying on the energy that Ibring to the table.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
For sure, see.
But I disagree somewhat, though.
Like I tend to be an emotionalleader, so if I'm having a bad
day, like sometimes, people aregonna know about it.
Yeah, but I also I'm very I tryto be as transparent as
possible.
It's like look, guys, you know,like right now we're dealing
with draw issues on a commercialbuilding.
We've got three differentcredit unions that have to agree
(07:54):
for this draw to be released.
We've been four and a halfweeks and they told us we get
five draws.
Well, five draws on a millionbucks, and it just, you know,
stuff starts to add up and thenwe're outpacing these draws,
like so, yeah, man, sometimesyou have some bad days, and when
you have some bad days, I wantmy team to know about it and
(08:14):
just say, hey, man, I just needto know, I need to know from you
.
Guys, you got my back the sameway I got yours, you know.
And if they're having a bad day, cool man, you know.
I want them to be open andhonest about it too.
Like, okay, hey, this sucks inyour life, cool, let's go out to
lunch.
Or hey, let's sit and talkabout it for a second, let's
take 20 minutes and, you know,just get your head right, slow
down yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, and I mean, and people need that man.
I mean I agree, yeah, you'vegot to be, definitely be
transparent, but it still can beexhausting when you're the guy
that's got to be the guy.
You know what I mean and a lotof it, like I would say, for you
know where we're at.
One of the biggest struggles, Iwould say, or constraints, in
our business now is the, youknow, trying to get other people
(08:53):
to bring ideas Right, cause alot of times if you're the guy
that's kind of built it you'reyou know everyone's looking at
you for majority of theinformation or the next steps or
where does it come in?
You know, and for me now I'mlike trying to help, be like
listen, I don't know, I knowabout to where we're at.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Cause that's all I've been.
I've never been farther thanthis.
You know what I mean and so youknow, really trying to help to,
you know, give other people,empower them enough to like want
to start stepping up and makingdecisions and making calls and
understanding that, dude, evenif you do it wrong, it's an
opportunity to learn.
Yeah Right, I'd rather youattempt it and fail and we can
have a conversation on it and Ican help you learn from that
(09:31):
conversation.
Then you know, not making adecision in reliant on my
affirmation to make one everytime you know what idea I hate
from the team?
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Lowering prices, yeah .
It seems like that's like theall, that's the I'm like.
Besides lowering price, theprice was the solution.
Let's come up with some ideas.
Well, we could lower the note,besides lowering the price Right
.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
That's like that's.
That's the one option thatdoesn't happen.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
That option is not on the table.
Yeah, no, I feel that.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
That's, that's the.
That's where you got to bringvalue right.
Like I tell our guys all thetime like insurance roofing
isn't sales, Like it's insuranceroofing Right, it's not a value
game, it's.
It's literally like come in,there's a panel deductible and
that's it.
And so now we're transitioninginto trying to push more retail,
trying to push windows siding.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Are you?
Are you starting to see becauseinch, I mean my insurance is,
tighten it up every single realestate person?
I mean, if you're in Floridaright now and you have
multifamily, there's twocompanies, yep.
So if you have a claim with one, you're screwed.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Done.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
But even so, like you know, ours have, you know, even
doubled in some cases.
Yeah, you know, for the mostpart, I mean we're talking 50 to
60% increases and in mybusiness model, it adds up right
, it's a chunk of change.
Anytime that I've got 5% of mytotal gross number being eight
up by inch or more than 5% beingeight up by insurance.
Yeah, that's a slippery slope,yeah, and you know these things
(10:49):
are going through the roof.
But I guess my question is islike you know, I know that you
know, in the roofing insurancebusiness, you know that's a big
business and in every insurancecompany, foremost American,
modern, all these guys are likeman, we just keep getting killed
on these roofs, blah, blah,blah, yeah, like well, yeah, I
mean, that's their businessright, that's their business,
but do you see that drying up?
(11:10):
Or do you see like, hey, likethey're starting to not pay out?
Or is there like 100% yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
And that's why I've had conversations with some.
You know private equity buyersthat are looking to.
You know invest into roofingcompanies and you know their
biggest thing is like you needto be at a minimum 30 plus
percent retail.
Like 30% of your business needsto be coming from customer pay,
financing cash, like whateverit is, if it's.
(11:37):
You know, 80, 90% of yourbusiness is insurance.
Like they're devaluing you bymultipliers because of that.
Because it's not a predictablegame.
Right, it's like we can.
We can chase storms and do allthose things here, but it's like
is that really a scalable model?
It is, in a sense, becauseevery year you get something,
but as far as projections ofreoccurring revenue and
(11:59):
potential, you can't, thenyou're trying to predict storms,
yes, you're trying to predictstorms, yeah.
And so we see it all the timeand you know our big push to
most of our clients that I tellthe guys is like go out there,
you know, start with insurance,but then try to lead them into
going retail, because what we'lltell them is like hey, listen,
we got a bunch of differentfinancing options right, and
what we can help you do is let'sfinance it today.
(12:20):
Let's get your roof done.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
The great thing about this is we have financing for
you today.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Payment options.
You know what I mean.
You got these payment optionsright and so about what we can
do is you know we'll finance youget your roof built.
We can still file the claim, wecan still liaise on that
process, but now, when you getthat $20,000 check that you
would have been putting towardsthe roof, you put that in your
pocket and you just, you knowmay pay it for the next 12 years
.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
man, you ever just ask somebody hey, how you
financing this You're like oh,I'm paying cash.
I'm not financing, I'm payingcash.
They're crazy, bro, you knowwhat I mean.
And so I like to take awayclothes.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
We're we're.
But you're seeing, I'm seeing alot of that and you know, I
think that it's only going tocontinue to tighten up, like
that's.
One thing I love about theMidwest is like it's kind of a
it's, it's kind of like a hiddengem.
It really is like the you knowthe Ohio area, the you know
Pennsylvania, kentucky, like youknow these spots are.
They're not sexy, they're not.
(13:10):
You know, a ton of hail damageand Florida and Texas and all of
that, but there's, it's, goodmargins, it's, you know, it's
inconsistent with the weather,but it's like I don't know.
Man, I love the market up herefor sure.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
And you're definitely seeing it Because it's all you
know, or that's probably truetoo.
I mean.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
I've seen, I mean I know, I know guys that are.
I'd say it's the only thingI've operated in Right.
I've got friends that havecompanies in Texas and Florida
and I'll tell you how great itis.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Yeah, 100%.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
And you think, the grass is greener.
But they knew all the nuancesand I mean the grass is a little
bit greener.
Sometimes it can be greener,yeah, I mean, but it's not
always as green.
Yeah, so you got the Arnoldcoming up.
Yeah, man, talk a little bitabout pro's gym.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Oh man, so my original I call it my original
mentor, really guy pulled me outof a party, gave me a job when
I was 22.
He had the opportunity to buywhich was the official gym of
the Arnold Classic.
I had like 48 grand of my bankaccount at the time.
He needed 30.
That got me like 7% of the gym,yeah.
(14:10):
And then there was like allthese different partners and so
he was just kind of scrappingtogether to make it happen, so
you know I'm basically emptyingout like 60% of my bank account
on a whim.
Probably a bad move at the time,but now I'm grateful.
It's like yeah eight years ago.
But you know, you saw thepotential.
You know middle downtown bankbuilding, one of the four
(14:33):
original buildings built alongwith the state house in the
middle of downtown Columbusofficial gym, the Arnold Classic
, yeah, so there was a lot ofopportunity there, but the gym
was losing like 30 grand a month.
You had 400 members all paying$10 a month.
Rents, 13 Gs Do the math.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Yeah, that ain't making sense.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
No so.
But you know, I saw the longterm vision of it and I recently
just bought the building,finally from landlord two years
ago.
That's freaking awesome.
So bought the building andthat's a cool ass building.
It is a cool building.
Yeah, it's so cool.
The 70th phone call ever madein human history was made from
(15:12):
the executive office of thisbuilding.
Because it was the telephone,it was like the telephone
central operating office wherethey plugged in the cord.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
Yeah, and I thought well, there's wires to Lord in
this building and none of themare electrical.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
They're all phone wires.
But but yeah, you know it's alot of cool history with it and
so I bought it.
The bank that had the no, nobig secret, you know, commercial
real estate's in big, bigtrouble right now.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
Small local community banks are in big, big trouble
and I saw that firsthand.
You know the bank that did theloan.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
Did an interest only 24 month loan like they were
doing at the end of the raterate cycle.
Yeah, I was on one of those.
And then the three creditunions are paired together to
redo this loan and do therenovation loan Bent me over
backwards to be able to get that, to be able to get this
renovation yeah, dealing withthe ramifications of it now,
yeah, but, yeah.
But this is like the firstArnold classic where I can be
(16:07):
proud of our product and it'snot anywhere close to being
there yet.
Yeah, not even close.
But but, uh, I never wanted tomarket the gym or really put my
face behind it.
And Matt, he's a 50-50 partnerin the gym, 100% of the building
.
So you worked your way up from7%.
Speaker 1 (16:25):
Yeah, yeah, just buying in, man, buying in,
staying consistent, yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
One day I'm gonna make some money out of it.
But yeah, man, I never reallywanted to market the gym or
myself with it, because it wasalways less than a subpar
product.
Place needed renovated, thebathrooms were disgusting, the
place needed painted, I mean,you know everything.
Yeah, I mean we spent 150 grandon AC unit because we were
without heat and air for twoyears.
(16:51):
Yeah, that's why we you know,kind of our hand was forced to
buy this building.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
But yeah, man, I'm rambling at this point.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
But I can't tell.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
I'm super excited about it because it's like you
know, I got in the fitnessindustry.
It was what my passion wasoriginally, and now it's kind of
coming full circle.
15 years down the line I'mright back in fitness where I
started, but only I've got thereal estate play with it too,
and so I'm excited to see wherethe brand goes, where you know
the real estate play with thisgoes our licensing model, the
(17:20):
online model with this brand.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
So I'm excited and I think too, it's like where it's
at now is to the point where youcan actually add your value to
it.
Yeah, I mean it's kind of thebuild up phase, like it wasn't
necessarily like your wheelhouse, essentially where you know.
Now I think it's from whatyou're telling me right it's
like now it's becoming kind ofthe product that you're making
it into as well.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
For sure you know when you have something that
your name's behind and you knowthat it sucks you just kind of
just want to put your freakinghead down, yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
But you know it's just a process, man, it's a
process, but the problem is isyou know your customer doesn't
give a shit about your processor their time, nope.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
No, it's zero, it's about them, yep.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
And then, when they you get your five seconds of hey
guys, I've worked really,really hard at this.
I'm glad to share it with theworld.
Blah, blah, blah.
You get your applause for aboutfive seconds and then they
don't care anymore.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
Yeah, it's what you do for me.
Yeah.
Yeah, man Dude, I mean I needto actually come down.
It's been a long time sinceI've been down there.
I mean probably three yearssince I was down at that gym.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
Yeah, yeah, it's coming along.
So I mean, you know we've gotthe Arnold next week.
That's a huge day.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
I mean huge, huge man .
Speaker 2 (18:27):
I mean we'll do.
We'll do three months for thisyear, We'll probably do six
months worth of revenue in aweek, so huge.
I mean we've got Jay Cutler,Roddy Coleman, Michael Hearn is
doing our VIP party, Dio Champyeah, he's doing a party there.
Midwest Kong, who's our firstsponsored athlete, he's got his
bench party.
(18:48):
So like we've got all of thesegreat athletes that are so
successful in their arena andthey all kind of just come
together.
They come together at pros andit becomes this whole like side
event of the Arnold class.
It really does, yeah, I mean,it's an event center for a whole
week and it's like if you wantto go, you know, like we had
Arnold, for instance, actuallyin the gym was that two weeks
(19:10):
ago, I think?
And we've got this picture toArnold where he does this, yeah.
And then he posted on hisInstagram that same photo in
front of his photo doing this atour gym.
Yeah, that's fucking cool.
And like when he was in there,he's like tapping on this kid's
shoulder.
He's like, hey, I want to workout together, yeah.
And the kid just doesn't evenknow what to say because he just
looked up and saw Arnold andhe's like, no, you can have it,
(19:31):
and Arnold doesn't want to takehis piece of equipment.
Arnold wants to work out andfeel normal and just work out
with this kid and workingtogether and share that
camaraderie.
Speaker 1 (19:40):
Yeah Well, dude, and that's cool for you too.
Like you said, I mean for it, Imean myself as well.
Right, it's like Arnold's, likethe pinnacle of bodybuilding,
or fitness in any way right.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
So for you in general , I mean governor movie star,
everything man real estate mogulyou know yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
And that's cool, man, and I mean that's the powerful
thing about that.
You know, having a buildinglike that or a place like that
is like dude, that you'recreating that opportunity for a
kid that literally would havenever had that chance to meet.
And Arnold, like when I wasbodybuilding that shit without a
shit, my pants are fucking on.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
I'd have been like oh my God, this is crazy.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
Yeah, and then you know.
So while you're there, you knowpeople can train, you know,
basically with their favoritepro.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
And those guys are super cool, Like it's.
So what's wild to me is thepeople that are least
egotistical, generally speaking,are the people that have
reached such a high level ofsuccess that they realize that
they've already been past thatego stage and they're just like
they just want to be normal.
Yeah, they just want to feellike they fit in and not be
bothered with pictures and allthat stuff.
(20:41):
It's going to be a part of it.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
It's going to be a part of it, yeah, and I think
that's I mean, that's the youknow natural trajectory or
spiral dynamics or whatever youwant to call it right.
It's like we all kind of gothrough.
We go through that phase, right.
I'm like you want to be popularor you want to be, even if it's
for a stint.
We all kind of like level up inour own way and it's at some
point it's like I kind of feellike I might deserve this or
(21:02):
this is you know.
And then you get past that partand you realize it's more about
wanting to help people and growpeople and you don't need to be
, you don't need to be attentionanymore.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Yeah, you know, yeah, some people thrive on it though
.
Influencers, that's true, dudeInfluencers.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
Yeah, what are you?
Are you still I mean, you'restill running doing coaching
masterminds.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
So, yeah, I've got a very, very small community
called scalers.
Only it's about scaling realestate.
My whole MO for building it waslong-term relationship capital.
You know, eventually in the Icall it the pyramid of real
estate, you know, you start offwholesaling and you flip, then
you rent and then eventuallybecome the bank.
(21:40):
Well, we all need each other inthis ecosystem, right, and so
you can never become too big.
I mean, I was talking to one ofmy lenders earlier today and
he's like man, can you introduceme to some wholesalers?
And then you would think that,like wholesalings, like bottom
of the barrel, but not, we allneed each other in this
ecosystem, yeah, so for me it'sabout creating people you know,
I know like and trust we can dodeals together, long, long-term
(22:04):
relationships, and you know itjust whatever's going to pivot
more money inside their ownbusiness and inside my own
business and do what people thatyou like doing it with.
Quite, quite frankly, yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
It's like long-term games with long-term people.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
You know.
So that that's kind of the MO.
But you know the tagline isgetting you to, or taking you to
, a hundred units and beyond.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
So for I like that.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Yeah, I came up with that one.
I was like, yeah, that's kindof cool.
Because I was trying to figureout, like what this was right.
You know you have a ton ofpeople teaching people how to
wholesale flipping houses.
Renting houses is the mostunsexiest thing ever.
You know the $300 a month cashflow.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
It's like storage units.
They're both kind of yeah Likeit's.
It's like who's getting excitedabout $300 a month?
Nobody.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
Unless you're looking at equity.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
Unless you're looking at equity.
It's a long-term game, right,yeah.
And if I could get enough $400a month cash flows in my mind,
even if those stayed the same, Icould get like my 10 grand a
month number, yeah, and that waslike the original thing and
that was kind of indestructibleif you will, yeah, but it's.
It's not very sexy, but youknow, for a lot of people it's
(23:11):
like hey, I want to generatereal wealth and not just
wholesale, not just being a ratrace of flipping houses Because
it is man, I mean it's afull-time job and more.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
Yeah, Well, and it's made out with social media and
everything else and it's likeyou know, that's like the sexy
thing is to teach wholesaling.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Yeah, I mean you know , and it's like, and that's
going bye-bye.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Yeah, you know Well the what's I mean title.
I mean explain a little bit ofthat because probably people out
there kind of listen to it.
Yeah, spin that mic towards youhere.
There we go this way, there wego, yeah.
So, yeah, talk a little bit.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Yeah, man, yeah, we care People that will teach
wholesale.
And now there's like this therewas this lawsuit just happen,
like two, three weeks ago Maybewhere someone got sued for a ten
million bucks for cold callingand texting wasn't even their
company and I think they gotbanged for about a million a
half when it was all said anddone.
So this is gonna be the firstcase on.
(23:59):
You know.
So, all those annoying spamcalls you get spam texts and all
yeah and None of us have doneit right.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Optin.
They've all opted.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
Yeah, of course so it's gonna be interesting to see
where this goes, yeah, but youknow, laws change, regulations
change and you just try tooperate in the boundaries that
you can for the time being.
But you got a, you got to atleast pay attention of what's
happening in the future.
Or else, if you get like wewere talking about insurance,
right, like dude, if all you'redoing is relying on that one,
(24:32):
you're not.
Exit strategy, right, and thatone, you're done.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
You're done.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
So you have to be a little bit forward thinking and
forward-looking yeah if you'renot then you're gonna get
crushed.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
I mean I talk, I like you continues to scale and grow
as you've got a pivot.
You've seen season.
I mean you see the real estateso cyclical you know, yeah,
Neighborhoods change.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Yeah, you know where people want to want to live,
where people want to work andplay.
Yeah, it's change.
So you know you can't do thisall the time, but at the same
time you just have to have likea Just a decent head on your
shoulders to say this is okayand be honest with yourself,
like even though my business isset up this way, yeah.
This is gonna go like this, andI need to.
I need to make some appropriatechanges now, so that way I'm
(25:09):
ahead of the curve.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
How would I mean for you with the way your business
is set up?
Is it coming because you I meanyou don't necessarily, you're
not as heavy as the wholesaling,as much as you're trying to
acquire yourself right?
So it's like is you know, it iswhat, even with cold calling
and outbound SMS and stuff likethat is, is that something for
you that you're starting tochange, whether it's like agent
relationships and things likethat, or for sure.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
Yeah, if you think about it, the best deals we've
ever made in our lives have beenthrough relationships.
Yeah, yeah.
And we're good, like we'retrying to automate relationships
, and it's like, dude, it's,it's, it's the hard work, yeah,
and it's not even hard, it's fun.
Like, yeah, why in the hellwould you not want to develop a
relationship with somebody, makea lot of money with them, go
out and celebrate your winstogether?
(25:53):
Yeah, you know like, that'skind of the old-school way of
doing business, but guess what?
It's coming back.
It is coming back.
Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
I thought our guys all time like the best thing
about the roofing industry isit's low barrier to entry.
The worst thing about theroofing industry is it's low
barrier to entry.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
I'm saying wholesaling right so you get,
you know You've get the peoplethat are Transactional.
But then you start to findyourself kind of competing with
the market and what they'redoing right, like I'll catch us
Doing that all the time.
I'm like wait, wait, wait, likehold up, like that's how
everybody else is doing it, likelet's slow down, like really
focus on the consultation, let'sfocus on getting to the table
with people.
Let's like that's actuallybuild relationships, let's
(26:28):
actually sell, because that'swhat no one else wants to do.
They don't.
They don't.
They want to take the quick, doa photo, you know, inspect the
house, send them a photo report,tell them to file a claim over
the phone roll.
You know what I mean it's like.
But how much are you leavingthe table when you sit down and
talk to them about siding andgutters and windows and like
actually connect with the personbecause even if they have
somebody else that give them abetter bid.
Speaker 2 (26:48):
Yeah if you build that relationship and especially
like if you got four peoplechasing your, chasing your house
in a storm, right, what's gonnaseparate you?
Right, a connection you know, Imean insurance.
Same way.
Going back to insurance, youknow I'm I got an insurance
agent right now I've been loyalto for ten years.
He's not the cheapest, he's notthe most.
Actually he sucks at beingefficient.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
I'll tell him that to his face.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
I'm like dude, you got to get the system.
Speaker 1 (27:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
But I love him to death, yeah, loving the death,
yeah, and very good friend, andyou know it goes a long way.
So it's coming back around, butyou know.
You asked about deal flow.
Yeah, I have relationships, ifyou again, everything cyclical.
But like when I first gotstarted in real estate, there
was zero money to be found, butthere was all these deals, yeah,
(27:35):
and everyone's like, oh, yougot started in 2012, 2013, back
in a hay.
Yeah, we had it easy right dude,where were you gonna find money
?
Yeah, because money did notexist.
Hard money was not a thing.
Yeah, you know, if you did findhard money, they were gonna do
one or two loans for you.
It was gonna be four points 14%if you were gonna get it.
Yeah, there was no scaling thisstuff, right, so it was it.
(28:00):
Now the pendulum has shifted towhere there's no deals and
there's all this money.
Yeah, right, so finding moneyis so easy.
Now it's where are you gonnafind the deal?
Yeah, and so you know you haveto put yourself out there.
You got to be on social media.
You have to be the first personpeople think about whenever
they come across something.
You know, look, share sales aregonna be a thing again.
(28:22):
People are struggling to paytheir bills.
I mean, I don't know how badthe world's gonna get, but yeah,
this soft landing scenario, I'mnot buying it.
Yeah, and, and nobody that's in.
I mean, I graduated college in08 and I'm not saying we're
gonna get back there, but youcan't pretend that you're too
smart for the market either.
Yeah, you're never gonna fightand beat the Fed.
You're never gonna fight andbeat the market.
(28:43):
So at least, like, have sometype of margin of safety when
you're investing and say, hey,this could be this, something
that happens, yeah, and if itdoes happen, how much can I
withstand Before I go belly up?
Yeah, right, and for a lot ofpeople I would say that that
margin of safety is like hereyeah.
Until you've been through it,and then, once you've been
(29:04):
burned by it.
Now your margin of safety ishere, which you're never gonna
make any money or take any riskeither.
So it's about striking abalance with being able to put
your your head on the pillow atnight yeah, feeling good about
what you, what you're doing,you're not over leveraged, but
same time, taking enough risk tobe able to grow too.
It's a.
That's a balance.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
It's balance you done , and you've done it.
Well, you know what I mean.
It's like it's it's.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
You know I wouldn't say well, Learned from it.
Yeah, well, I mean I would youknow.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Yeah, even even talking about that, right, it's
like you know I look at you,know when you and I work
together right.
I'm like Now where I'm at, Iunderstand business more right,
like I feel like when you knowyou and I work together, you
know I I would just learn inentrepreneurship and getting
into all that, and I was leaninginto the sexy side of it.
(29:50):
I wanted to be cool, I wantedto be doing those things, you
know what I mean and and evenlike power, god, level, right,
like that's.
I wanted to be the man right andyou know, thinking that you
know more than you know.
And I look at myself, where I'mat now, and I'm like dude,
you're a good dude, bro.
Yeah, you've done an awesomejob, man.
I look at the scalability ofyour business and you know, or
(30:11):
what you scaled it to is likeman, that's.
It's an impressive thing, bro.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
So I appreciate that and that's out of it, man.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
I you know I want us to be cool again.
You know what I mean.
We're good man.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
I told you off air.
You know part of you know.
I got the Arnold next week.
I have literally eight breatheand slept at gym.
I should be there right now,but I said that there's
absolutely no way in the worldthat I was gonna miss this.
Yeah, dude, I.
I ran up to you at that eventand I'm like it's time and I
gotta reach out to this dude.
And you know.
(30:41):
One of the things that you knowand this is partially Something
I had to learn in this businesstoo Is that you know, because
of the low barrier to entryright, and because of what
people see on social media andthey see the big checks you know
and you're transparent.
Everyone else sees it too andEventually these people are
going to leave and they want todo their own thing and you have
(31:03):
to be okay with it.
You know At that time, you know, and it's just, it's part of
the business, it's part of thegame, right, and that's
something I've had to, like,come to grips with and learn, I
mean from.
I Mean shoot right after youleft.
I mean we had, we ramp back up.
You know had a bunch ofacquisition guys run around the
office.
You know High-five, each otherplan, grab ass all day.
(31:26):
You know having fun and youknow, slowly, as the market
began to turn, more people wentout on their own.
It's like it was like a wholenew cycle again.
Yeah, you know, I look at that.
The amount of people We've hadinside our real estate business,
like, as you know, w2s ormovies or whatever.
It's like, wow, it has justbeen a ton, yeah, yeah.
But you know, it's part of thebit, it's the natural
(31:49):
progression of this business,man.
It's just.
It is what it is.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Well, I think that you know, you know, I mean, I
look at even where you knowwe're at now, compared to where
I was, you know, three or fouryears ago, and you know I had, I
had probably, not probably I'vehad great people that came
through that if they were tocome into my business now They'd
have much more success.
They'd they'd fit better I'vegiven them a better success plan
.
Like right, like I look at that,all Time that's part of the
hardest part is like as thebusiness is growing, you're it's
(32:16):
always constantly changing.
People are changing, themarkets are changing and and so
you know as a business, owner,you're changing we're trained,
we're changing.
You know, and I look at that now, I'm like man, like the amount
of people that I had comethrough that worked or didn't
work out, and it's like man.
They'd be great now yeah, youknow what I mean if they could
come in and I could act, becauseI didn't have the systems and
the things to be able To getthem to where they needed to be
(32:37):
and and I actually probablyfailed most of them because I
didn't have that but I didn't, Iwasn't able to create it until
I failed people to figure outwhere to do it right the next
way, you know.
So I mean, I think that's a bigpart of it.
It's just, you know, you'vekind of got to take those hard
L's but eventually you get a Wout of it.
You know what I mean man.
Yeah, it's, it's, it's a.
Yeah, business is a fucking,it's fun.
(32:57):
You know, every day I'm likeman.
It's a good-ass time.
I love being able to do whatyou do.
But you know, into the day too,it's also you.
You don't get to walk away froma job at the end of the night
and get asleep.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
You still got a business and people to take care
of that's something that I havedone a much better job of
recently is sleep, and I've wetalked about blood tests before,
before this, and you know,getting older, 37 years old now
I need my sleep.
Yeah, terry needs some sleep.
Yeah, and you know, I want tohave some peace when I sleep,
(33:29):
yeah, so I guess, with, withthat being said, you, you know,
I just I want to go to work, Idon't want to be so risky and so
, you know, such a rodeo kinganymore, you know it's like dude
, I just I want to go home, bewith my kid.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
And spent because he's only gonna be a little once
.
How old is he now?
He's almost two, almost two.
What's his name?
Titan.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
Titan, that's an awesome name.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
Yeah, terry, the third, but we called it.
We called him Titan.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
But he's learning his numbers and like he's smart,
he'd like I turn on the stockchannel and like I'll pay
attention to my portfolio yeah,you know our trades and all that
stuff and he just startsrallying off all the numbers.
But like it's a little stufflike that, like I don't want to
miss any of those moments.
Yeah, and you know, I'm not thefirst person in the office
anymore.
Yeah, thursdays I don't even goin, I'm just hanging out with
(34:19):
him.
So like I've gotten back tothis point, to where I remember
why I got invested in realestate in the first place, and
it wasn't to be a business owner, it wasn't to to show off or
have the.
You know, I mean, dude, look atthese, look at these bobo's you
know, like it wasn't about thestuff.
Man Right, you know I meanthere's no watch, yeah, none of
(34:41):
that stuff.
You know it's about the time,freedom.
And then you know, if I want togo fly somewhere, you know, for
an event or whatever, it's noteven a quit, I'm just going to
go do it, but I'm going to beright back on the first flight.
Home, yeah, hang out with myfamily, yeah.
So I don't know.
Speaker 1 (34:57):
It's long, long winded, but it's lifestyle right
and it's all what you want outof your life, and I mean, I
think that dude, that and that'sa great thing too, and I think
that's one of the you know,that's one of the hardest things
when you know you're gettinginto business is that what do
you?
What's the end goal?
You know what I mean.
Like, and we don't really thinkabout that.
Like for me, I look at whereI'm at now and what are what my
(35:20):
goals are, and things like that,and I have conversations with
people and they don't evenreally know what they want out
of life, right?
Speaker 2 (35:25):
So you just kind of, and if you don't know it as the
owner.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Then like what do you ?
Your people are going to comeand go because they need
something when are you takingthem to?
Speaker 2 (35:32):
And then wherever you want to live your life based
around your business.
Yeah, I mean, your people arepaying attention.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Right, don't set the standard a certain way too Right
.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
Because then you're being a phony and then you're
being fake and the next thingyou know, if you want to be the
guy that's you know at theoffice all the time, then you
want to go through this phase towhere you're not, they're like
where in hell is this guy?
Yeah, he's falling off Right.
So I think, you know, I justhave open conversations where
I'm at that may change.
You know there's times where,hey, we go gangbusters and I
like that, like I love thebusiness as a sport thing.
(36:00):
I don't like it to consume 12months, 365 days a year.
You know, I want to go onvacation with my family or do
XYZ, but it's nice to be able todo that but then also be able
to experience home.
Yeah, 100% as well.
Yeah, you know, just startedplaying in a band again.
Speaker 1 (36:16):
It's nice to be able to experience that 100% and just
be there.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
Yeah, Dude, man, drumming has always been like my
passion.
Yeah, they call it.
I think they call it flow state.
I think I might have heard thatfrom Greg Ford one time, but I
heard that word flow state andI'm like dude, when am I in my
flow state?
Yeah, Like dude, I'm playingdrums man.
I'm not, I'm not the greatestdrummer, but you know, enjoy it,
I enjoy it.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
You had long hair back in the day too, Didn't you?
I had hair back today.
Yeah, I had hair Gone now.
That's why.
That's why I'm all had it upall the time I haven't been.
Speaker 2 (36:49):
I haven't been to Turkey yet, but but yeah, I
played up until I was like 25and had I bought my very first
house in this building.
Speaker 1 (37:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
And I remember that I , the same day I bought that
house, I got a promotion to goto Pittsburgh, pennsylvania,
which was it was going to belike on the sales side.
I knew I probably would havehad a potential to make, we'll
say, 40 to $60,000 more a year.
Go into Pittsburgh, Go intoPittsburgh, yeah.
And the gym that I was at I hadalready Maxed, maxed it out,
(37:22):
like I had already sold everysingle person personal training
in this gym.
Yeah, I mean, you're a fuckingsavage bro you know what I mean
You're gonna hunt them down, Ijust but, like there's all, you
know, if I've pulled, if there's, you know, 2000 members of this
gym and I've talked to 2000,.
You know, I and that gym took adeep dive.
So I knew that if I didn'tleave, like, yeah, I was going
to be stuck and I was going todie in this gym in Gross City.
(37:43):
So, anyway, same exact day, Itook this promotion to
Pittsburgh, which also meant Iwould have to leave my band as
well.
Yeah, which sucked, and thatwas a tough conversation.
That was always a thing that,like aided me.
I chose money over my passion,yeah.
And now here we are, you know,12, 13 years later, and I'm
trying to get my passions back.
(38:04):
Yeah, you know, there's like anold, what is it?
I think it's something not inHindu, but like Buddhist culture
where they say, you know, manis like the only person that
tries to create so much money,only to try to use it to then
regain what's purposeful in lifeand then regain their health.
(38:24):
I forget the phrase that theysay but like it's kind of funny
how we do that.
And I don't want to be 45 yearsold, you know, no offense if
you're 45, but, like you know,the older we get, the more you
realize like, hey, this iswhat's important to me, this is
my passion, this is my hobby,like these entrepreneurs that
say they don't have hobbiesbullshit, right, you know, I'm
just.
I'm not on that ice bath fourtimes before 4am, like no one
(38:46):
does that shit.
You know these people are liars, Right.
So, like you know, do thethings that make you happy and
own it.
But anyways.
Speaker 1 (38:53):
No, I love that.
I mean.
I mean, you know, you know Ihadn't got to connect in a while
, man, and you know it's cool to.
It's cool to hear all thethings that you're doing.
It would have been a differentconversation, you know, five
years ago, of what the focus wasand where the goal was and what
was happening.
You know what I mean and youknow it's cool to see the things
that bring you enjoyment andfulfillment now and, like you
(39:14):
can see, you're like lit uptalking about the kids, lit up
talking about the band and like,dude, that's a, that's an
awesome thing, bro, yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
And you know, I mean, I mean business, same way, you
know, and it's just, it's allwhat you want, right?
I mean, do you want to?
I mean there's people that wantto have the biggest, baddest
media company, for instance.
Awesome, dude.
If that's what brings youhappiness and joy, dude, I'm
going to be your number onesupporter on that.
There's no right, wrong orindifferent in the sport.
(39:40):
Right, it's all what you want,because, like, there's always
going to be someone with abetter house, you know, it's
always going to be a little bittaller, a little bit more hair
on their head, a little bit morefit, a little bit more in shape
, more money, but it's like youknow what's the best version of
your own life and it's aconstant and it sounds cliche as
shit, but I don't know.
It's just kind of where I'm at,like dude, I got two phones now
(40:03):
, one for social media, one formy real phone, just so that you
know you don't get caught in.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
that I like that.
That's actually a good idea.
Well, dude, it sucks the endman.
You know what I mean Becauseyou're always it's always a dick
measuring contest nowadays.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
I hate it.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
You know what I mean?
Everything's what they're doing,why they're doing it, how
they're doing it and there's somuch gossip and it's just like
you know that's what I love witheven what we've got here.
It's like, dude, I just builtmy own table.
You know what I mean.
I'm like I don't, I just keepit to the confines of what we've
got here.
Everything that I have in myit's in my family, you know what
I mean.
And I'm like I don't needanything else other than this as
(40:37):
long as I like taking care ofmy people, I like coaching my
people, like roofing to me isthe vehicle that allows me to
mentor and grow young men andwomen.
Like that's what I love to domore than anything.
And you know that's like I tryto just stay hyper-focused on
that and not let the outsidestuff, you know, get in your
head, because it will.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
Yeah, you know it does and you feel like you're
doing when.
You feel like you're doingsomething wrong because you got
on social media and sawsomething and it's just, it's so
quick, dude, it's so quick andyou know it's our job to put out
good content, but it's notgoing to be for everybody.
I'm not going to be foreverybody.
You're not going to be foreverybody.
(41:15):
You're not going to be foreverybody.
You know You're not going to befor everybody and that's okay.
There's nothing wrong with that.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
And I think it's understanding too from the side
of, like you know, you've got tobe a creator for it, not a
consumer right, because theconsumption is what really it's
where it gets you right, likethe negative consumption.
Yes, yes, yes, you've got to beable to.
You know, because I don'tnecessarily really even like
social media, we got the mediateam.
Now they do all the postinglike, they take care of all
(41:41):
those things, but at the end ofthe day, you know, it's still a
a necessary evil.
You've got to have it to beable to build in today's day and
age.
Speaker 2 (41:52):
You have to you have to, man, but yeah, for me too.
Like someone said this a whileago, they're like you know, when
you don't hear from anymore andI just disappear, like that's
when I made it.
Speaker 1 (42:03):
Yeah, and I was like that's good yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:06):
That's good, yeah, dude, but you know for people
that you know when they achievea certain level to them with a
success and all those things,and you don't feel the need that
you have to.
You know.
You know what, man, it'sTuesday.
I just don't.
I don't want to be on socialtoday and you don't have to.
It's freedom, Right, but whenyou have to do all the same and
(42:28):
there's a lot of people that arelocked in that prison too, yeah
, and I'm calling it a prisonbecause that's what, from my, my
viewpoint, what it is.
But you know even some of themost famous people in the world,
or what we consider the mostsuccessful people your
Kardashians, your Kevin Hartyour rocks.
You can never not do it.
So you know, what did youcreate for yourself?
Is it?
If it's what you want, Awesome,yeah, Love it, yeah.
(42:50):
But if it's not, then what didyou really create?
And so those are things I thinkwe we don't think about enough
when we get into business andlife.
And again, it's just whateverthe end result is or an end
result can change too, butwhatever that end result is cool
.
Try to, you know, frame yourand you got to work to that
right.
You're not just going to startyour business on day one and
then be there and be there.
(43:10):
But, like you know, have anactive journey towards it.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
Yeah, but just don't forget it, yeah, and enjoy the
progress, enjoy the process ofit, right Cause if you're always
, you know, measuring it off thegap in the game of where you're
not yet, you know that thatthat'll where you out to Like.
You've got to find the smallwins along the way.
This is definitely a gain righthere.
Speaker 2 (43:30):
You like that?
That's pretty good man, I'veactually never had it.
Um, we had these in the gym and, uh, I had like the uh iced one
, but that was the only one Ihad.
This, that's pretty solid yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:41):
Good Like 3D man, it's good stuff.
Speaker 2 (43:42):
Yeah, I need to get off of those things at some
point in my life.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
I think you.
I actually never drank energydrinks until I worked with you.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Really yeah.
Well, you always just make themonster runs down there, bro,
and I never had a.
Speaker 1 (43:55):
I'd never had an energy drink.
Now I'm like six a day, youknow.
I mean it's caffeine.
I feel like I just I create badhabits for people.
Speaker 2 (44:02):
Man Like man, I show up for a.
I show up around Christmas inthe office and I'm just getting
a bottle of bourbon.
Someone sent me Jack Daniels.
I'm like dude, I can't tell you.
Last time I drank Jack Danielsyeah, uh, you know.
Bottle of rum.
Like dude, I don't even drinkrum.
Like they're just like, they'reassuming it Bottle of Blanton's
and like damn that Like, andit's all like Whole shelf.
Yeah, Whole shelf.
Speaker 1 (44:22):
I haven't even touched it.
Yeah Well, brother, dude, Iwant to.
I want to get you back to youruh, back to the Arnold stuff you
got going on.
Man, I don't want to keep youtoo much longer.
You're good, let me ask you this, brother you got you know guys,
obviously in the in the realestate space, people getting in
man, I'm a little, give themsome wisdom, man, or how can
they find you, how can they workwith you?
I mean how you know you?
(44:42):
There's a lot of people thatlisten to you know this, that
are getting into real estate orwanting to man and you're like a
fucking you're a stud at,you're the celebrity.
You're a celebrity in theColumbus market right when it
comes to real estate, I would.
Speaker 2 (44:53):
I would just say it's whatever you want, right, like,
if you want to, if you want tomake 10 grand a month, dude, go
wholesale, and then you'll do itwith minimal work.
Um, or you know, buy 20properties, pay them off.
Yeah, that's cool.
Yeah, I mean I want to sell mybusiness for an extreme multiple
at some point.
(45:13):
Um, you know, uh, my, myoriginal goal was a hundred
million before I'm 40.
Um, I don't know if I'm goingto make it, but we're, we're
going to try.
Speaker 1 (45:21):
I mean, I feel like momentum and time is on your
side.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
Momentum and time and compound interest, man and um.
But I, uh, I would just saywhatever it is that you want and
then just figure out.
You know how do I reverseengineer this stuff.
You know, um, you know rentalsaren't sexy.
But you know, I just had a tax,I had a tax meeting earlier
today.
I can tell you, man, we just weredid the way that we were
running would set a run ofstraight line depreciation.
(45:44):
We ran makers depreciation on acouple of things and then
amended a tax return to to makeit work and like tax bill,
literally hundreds of thousandsof dollars just by redoing some
properties, some biggerproperties and portfolio Like.
It is amazing what you can doand the way that you I don't use
word manipulate, but the waythat you can re classify numbers
(46:07):
to work in your favor withrental properties.
You can't do that with withhardly anything else.
You can't, um, but uh, but yeah,um, I would just say, man, like
, get a mentor to mentors, help.
You don't have to pay an armand a leg to find a mentor.
Uh, you know, go work forsomebody for free, you know.
Uh, go intern.
You know, spend two hours withsomebody to say, hey, I just
(46:29):
want to be a fly on the wall.
Speaker 1 (46:30):
Bring value.
Speaker 2 (46:30):
Yeah, and then the last thing.
The last thing I want to do isjust be in your presence and I
will go.
I'll go do two hours worth ofwork for you, but I would at
least want to just sit in theroom and see what you do for 20
minutes out of those two hours.
Yeah, great, I would.
I mean, if you were going tobring me that much, you know
cool.
Speaker 1 (46:46):
You have to man it's.
It's osmosis learning.
Get good at all Osmosislearning yeah.
Speaker 2 (46:51):
But you don't have to spend you know 15 grand on your
coaching, you know course orwhatever, um, you know, if you
want to.
I think people that do pay payattention.
That's true.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
You know like kind of tithing to the church.
You know what I mean.
You give your money to thechurch.
You listen to them.
Yeah, I need.
Speaker 2 (47:05):
I need to.
I started so I'd never titheuntil two years ago and I set it
up for what I thought was anappropriate amount.
Speaker 1 (47:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (47:15):
And I haven't changed it yet.
Yeah, and I need to change that.
That's your reminder to changeit.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (47:21):
And I'm like, because it just comes out automatically
, right, and it's so much easier.
Speaker 2 (47:24):
But then, once you see it, the email hit your
you're like and then they takeout the 25 cents or whatever for
the transaction fee.
I'm like they're trying to getone over on that and that's it.
Speaker 1 (47:35):
That's over my 10%.
Speaker 2 (47:36):
Yeah, uh, but yeah, I mean dude, just uh, and
sticking it for the long haul.
Um, the the number one thing Icould say is compound interest
at all times.
Uh, make sure every dollar,every piece of equity, every
person, everything that you haveat your disposal, is earning
compound interest for you.
That's the name of the game.
Um, don't be afraid to buyrentals.
The $300 a month isn't sexy,but eventually it compounds into
(48:01):
hundreds of thousands ofdollars and a good market too,
you know yeah.
And, um, yeah, just reach out tomentors.
I mean, dude, it's not.
The reason I love this businessis cause you don't have to
reinvent the wheel, you don'thave to recreate anything.
Hell, you don't even have tocreate anything.
You just do what other peoplehave been doing over recorded
history and just be in the game,be as best as you can at it and
(48:22):
just be in it for a long time,and you'll be successful.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
Take the licks.
Yeah, I mean, you gotta stickthrough it.
What's the, what's the best wayfor them to find you?
Terry, how, how do I get?
Speaker 2 (48:31):
it Uh, ta or RY.
That's TA or RY.
Say it again Uh, terry sums atInstagram, cause some girl named
Terrin Summerton took TerrySummers.
Speaker 1 (48:41):
Dang, I feel like you've been trying to get that
for a long time.
Speaker 2 (48:43):
I have I offered like 15 Gs for it.
Speaker 1 (48:45):
The other day.
Speaker 2 (48:45):
She's like if you drive 15 grand cash down here,
then maybe I'll consider it.
Yeah, I get any worth it.
Speaker 1 (48:49):
She's just a mad Karen, like she really is Her
name should not be Terrin.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
It's to be Karen, right?
Um, but yeah, some check out ofTexas took that.
But it's Terry sums onInstagram.
Uh, you can hit me up onFacebook as well.
Um, terry Summers, or?
Uh, we have our scalars.
Only, mastermind, um, if youare scaling your real estate
portfolio and you think thatyou're going to be an asset to
the community, great, we'd loveto have a conversation with you.
Um, and then that's it.
(49:15):
Man, I'm just, I'm here to hereto be as valuable as I can, and
, um, I love it.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
I forgot real quick before we wrap up.
Speaker 2 (49:23):
How's your dad, man?
How's your father?
Speaker 1 (49:26):
I mean, your dad was like, I mean, your dad's such a
nice fucking dude.
Like I even passed him a fewtimes and he always would stop
and you know bullshit for aminute, so I don't want to make
sure.
I asked how he was.
Speaker 2 (49:35):
He's, uh, he's awesome man.
Um, you know the the.
His stress levels aretremendously lower.
Um and uh, yeah, he's just,he's happy man.
He gets to do it now because wehave that construction company
together.
You know he's, he's a majorityon the minority, um, and I try
(49:56):
to get him to like get with thetimes.
Speaker 1 (49:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:58):
Not happening.
But you know, for me he's happy, I get to spend time with him.
Um, do I know that we could domore and more often and be a lot
bigger and all this stuff?
And it's like, yeah, but atwhat cost?
Right?
Yeah, it's like, dude, ifyou're happy and you want to go
run the Lowe's and pick up thismaterial, for no damn reason.
All right, cool man you youwant to go do that, who am I to
(50:19):
tell?
you, you know they're all littlethings, you know.
Oh, but you had it.
He's having fun.
Yeah, that's awesome bro.
Speaker 1 (50:25):
Well, dude, terry, I appreciate you coming on man and
we got to.
We got to make sure we thisthing can't be the only time we
can.
Speaker 2 (50:29):
yeah, man, I appreciate you having me on.
Yeah, oh man.
I haven't drank in a couple ofmonths, oh man.
Speaker 1 (50:36):
After you celebrate the Arnold wins you know what I
mean.
Speaker 2 (50:38):
Yeah, yeah, maybe after Saturday.
Speaker 1 (50:40):
All right, reckless CEO, we're out.
Right.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
You're like that buzzard ain't rang.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
That game ain't over with, so keep going.
I have thrived in that chaos.
How could this be happening toany of you guys?
Pay attention to anything Isaid Like.
Welcome back to the RecklessCEO Podcast, where we keep it
real, raw and real.
I'm going to be talking likeit's just you.
(00:34):
So welcome back to the RecklessCEO Podcast.
I got an old time friend, dudeit's been Old time friend.
But it's been a long time, man.
Yeah, I'm actually excited tohave you in, brother, I had a.
Bobby was like dude, you guysgot to get on a podcast together
.
He was all about it, so I waslike man, let's make it happen,
(00:56):
dude.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
And I'm like where's Bobby?
Or he's like where's Bob, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
I thought he was going to come in and hang out
and be a part of our chat.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
I got him working today, yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
Usually it's the opposite.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Usually I'm the one working.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Well, you know how, like, everyone has their role.
Yeah, yeah, that means.
But, hey, terry Summers, Iappreciate you coming in.
Man, I'm excited to have you on, bro I you know what, what you
have done in real estate, and Imean, bro, it's incredible, it's
.
I mean, you've got to have oneof the biggest portfolios in
Columbus.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
It's not, you know, private equity or syndication
stuff right, probably on thesingle family side for sure.
But it's, it's gritty, man.
You know it's one house at atime.
All these apartment gurus it'strue what they say Like can't
just buy a whole apartment fullof single family houses, yeah,
so you have to onesie, twosieyour way and be super organized.
(01:43):
You know you got to getinsurance on every property,
utilities on every property, allthese different roofs, all
these different sewer lines.
So I mean you have all theseproblems amplified and
multiplied.
But I'm a big believer in thesingle family house.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
You've always been the single family guy you know I
don't discriminate on assetclasses.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
If it makes money I'm in.
Man I'm in.
But you know I always try to.
I mean, you're never going tobe able to predict the future,
but I try to look at trends andwhat people want and buy what
they buy what they want, I guess.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Oh, and I mean you look at a, I mean a city like
Columbus.
At the end of the day,everything's still going to run
off of.
You know your the, theavailability, you know and I
mean everything's ran by.
You know people moving here,the scarcity of more properties,
less properties.
They can't build more landthere ain't really many places
to put much more houses.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Right and if you want to be close right.
And I know that people want tolive in a home versus an
apartment Right, I mean you canactually own a home, can't own
it.
You can't own your apartmentunit, yeah, you know.
And so I mean you're having alot of people that you know, you
know, you know, have rented fora long time and they want to
buy a house right, and they wantto be able to create that
equity and some generationalwealth, right.
(02:54):
Yeah, grant Cardone says it's abad deal, but I think all of
America would disagree.
Yeah, so I mean it gives youthe ability to you know you can
rent it, you can sell it, youcan.
I mean it's where's anapartment unit?
If I want to sell the apartmentcomplex, I guess I'll sell the
whole damn thing.
Yeah, whereas like a house, Ican be like, hey, if I've got a
20-year apartment building or a20-you know 20 unit or 20 houses
(03:17):
, I can just sell one if I wantto.
So it gives you options, right.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
And a little yeah, like you said, it gives you a
little flexibility right versusjust the apartment side.
And I mean dude to be for aportfolio that size.
I mean, how many houses for oursingle families are you
operating?
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Right now 257.
Sure, we are buying two today.
So we because you know how itworks we close all of our deals
on Fridays from two to four.
But you know, I look at myselfas not like a hoarder of houses.
It's like you know, I'm a realestate dealer, I'm a trader, so
I'm always buying, I'm alwaysrenting, I'm always in the
market to sell.
(03:55):
So I'm looking at everyopportunity, as you know, not
what's the return on investment,but what's the return on equity
.
You know can is what's thecompound interest effect if I
sell this property and then 1031exchange and buy six more, or
if I refinance this property,maybe hold on to it, knowing
that there's going to be amassive appreciation run up,
(04:15):
maybe in three years I sell it,and so I'm just playing that
compound interest game at alltimes and just constantly
looking at it and that's that'sreal estate one-on-one and
compound interest.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
It is man, it is man, it is man, it is man, it is man
, it is man, it is man, it isman, it is man, it is man, it is
man, it is man, it is man it isman, it is man, and so that's
man, it is man, it is man.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Yeah, the here is my final comment on the
multi-billion-dollarchte man.
It's all hands off, that's it.
Money, that's it, it is man Ina man that loves another man too
much to handle the feeling ofincome from investing.
It's got to do with winning aCash and Money.
It is a long-term thing.
(05:06):
You know, if you think you'regonna own the world in real
estate like go into a differentbusiness where you can clip
contracts and something that'sway more scalable, like this is
probably if you wanna scale realestate and make construction,
like dude, they suck, they suckat scaling.
There's so many differentpeople in between the profit and
(05:26):
it just there's just it sucksand it costs a lot of money to
do it.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
You know what I mean.
I mean I would say for me, likethat was, that was the biggest
swing for me to get into.
I mean the roofing side.
Like I'm not a roofer, I didn'tknow roofing, I didn't have no
experience with it.
You know what I mean.
But starting to you know,having mentors that are helping
me understand business and thesethings.
It was like roofing to me madesense because it's the
acceleration right.
(05:51):
It's like for me.
I thought that I gotta findsomething that creates the money
to be able to then put it backinto a long-term play, but where
I wanna get to in the timeframethat I would like to get there
to real estate.
That was gonna.
I feel like that was gonna takea long time.
It does take a long time man Imean you've been doing it for
what?
20 years no.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Ain't that old man?
Speaker 1 (06:10):
How old are you Come on, bro.
I think you started at like 25when you started.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
I bought my first house.
Actually, I was telling youbefore we got on, I actually
bought my first five houses inthis building.
Have not been back to thisbuilding since.
That's crazy, and I'm pullingup and I'm like I'm getting
flooded with all these differentfeelings.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
I'm like man just kinda remember like what it took
to be able to save up enoughmoney to get that first one and
then I mean the second one.
I drove back from Pittsburgh,pennsylvania, literally had to
get a direct deposit in my bankaccount, grabbed the check, hope
that it deposited enough to beable to show a six-month reserve
, which I made it by like 40bucks.
(06:49):
So I remember driving backbecause I knew I was gonna need
money and I didn't have anycredit cards or anything at the
time and I rode up to theclosing on empty in my car
because needed that money in mybank account and do a screenshot
to then send it.
So it just.
But if you can do it once, youcan do it again, and if you can
do it again, do it again, do itagain.
Then you got something.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Yeah, and then it's getting the people around you to
build it.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Yeah, and I mean that's the.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
I think that's the next hardest thing and it's
being able to.
I mean, you get it as theleader, the owner man, like you
always gotta be on 10.
You always gotta be motivatedand spot like I can't have a
down day and walk into theoffice full of people that are
relying on the energy that Ibring to the table.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
For sure, see.
But I disagree somewhat, though.
Like I tend to be an emotionalleader, so if I'm having a bad
day, like sometimes, people aregonna know about it.
Yeah, but I also I'm very I tryto be as transparent as
possible.
It's like look, guys, you know,like right now we're dealing
with draw issues on a commercialbuilding.
We've got three differentcredit unions that have to agree
(07:54):
for this draw to be released.
We've been four and a halfweeks and they told us we get
five draws.
Well, five draws on a millionbucks, and it just, you know,
stuff starts to add up and thenwe're outpacing these draws,
like so, yeah, man, sometimesyou have some bad days, and when
you have some bad days, I wantmy team to know about it and
(08:14):
just say, hey, man, I just needto know, I need to know from you
.
Guys, you got my back the sameway I got yours, you know.
And if they're having a bad day, cool man, you know.
I want them to be open andhonest about it too.
Like, okay, hey, this sucks inyour life, cool, let's go out to
lunch.
Or hey, let's sit and talkabout it for a second, let's
take 20 minutes and, you know,just get your head right, slow
down yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, and I mean, and people need that man.
I mean I agree, yeah, you'vegot to be, definitely be
transparent, but it still can beexhausting when you're the guy
that's got to be the guy.
You know what I mean and a lotof it, like I would say, for you
know where we're at.
One of the biggest struggles, Iwould say, or constraints, in
our business now is the, youknow, trying to get other people
(08:53):
to bring ideas Right, cause alot of times if you're the guy
that's kind of built it you'reyou know everyone's looking at
you for majority of theinformation or the next steps or
where does it come in?
You know, and for me now I'mlike trying to help, be like
listen, I don't know, I knowabout to where we're at.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Cause that's all I've been.
I've never been farther thanthis.
You know what I mean and so youknow, really trying to help to,
you know, give other people,empower them enough to like want
to start stepping up and makingdecisions and making calls and
understanding that, dude, evenif you do it wrong, it's an
opportunity to learn.
Yeah Right, I'd rather youattempt it and fail and we can
have a conversation on it and Ican help you learn from that
(09:31):
conversation.
Then you know, not making adecision in reliant on my
affirmation to make one everytime you know what idea I hate
from the team?
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Lowering prices, yeah .
It seems like that's like theall, that's the I'm like.
Besides lowering price, theprice was the solution.
Let's come up with some ideas.
Well, we could lower the note,besides lowering the price Right
.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
That's like that's.
That's the one option thatdoesn't happen.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
That option is not on the table.
Yeah, no, I feel that.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
That's, that's the.
That's where you got to bringvalue right.
Like I tell our guys all thetime like insurance roofing
isn't sales, Like it's insuranceroofing Right, it's not a value
game, it's.
It's literally like come in,there's a panel deductible and
that's it.
And so now we're transitioninginto trying to push more retail,
trying to push windows siding.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Are you?
Are you starting to see becauseinch, I mean my insurance is,
tighten it up every single realestate person?
I mean, if you're in Floridaright now and you have
multifamily, there's twocompanies, yep.
So if you have a claim with one, you're screwed.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
Done.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
But even so, like you know, ours have, you know, even
doubled in some cases.
Yeah, you know, for the mostpart, I mean we're talking 50 to
60% increases and in mybusiness model, it adds up right
, it's a chunk of change.
Anytime that I've got 5% of mytotal gross number being eight
up by inch or more than 5% beingeight up by insurance.
Yeah, that's a slippery slope,yeah, and you know these things
(10:49):
are going through the roof.
But I guess my question is islike you know, I know that you
know, in the roofing insurancebusiness, you know that's a big
business and in every insurancecompany, foremost American,
modern, all these guys are likeman, we just keep getting killed
on these roofs, blah, blah,blah, yeah, like well, yeah, I
mean, that's their businessright, that's their business,
but do you see that drying up?
(11:10):
Or do you see like, hey, likethey're starting to not pay out?
Or is there like 100% yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
And that's why I've had conversations with some.
You know private equity buyersthat are looking to.
You know invest into roofingcompanies and you know their
biggest thing is like you needto be at a minimum 30 plus
percent retail.
Like 30% of your business needsto be coming from customer pay,
financing cash, like whateverit is, if it's.
(11:37):
You know, 80, 90% of yourbusiness is insurance.
Like they're devaluing you bymultipliers because of that.
Because it's not a predictablegame.
Right, it's like we can.
We can chase storms and do allthose things here, but it's like
is that really a scalable model?
It is, in a sense, becauseevery year you get something,
but as far as projections ofreoccurring revenue and
(11:59):
potential, you can't, thenyou're trying to predict storms,
yes, you're trying to predictstorms, yeah.
And so we see it all the timeand you know our big push to
most of our clients that I tellthe guys is like go out there,
you know, start with insurance,but then try to lead them into
going retail, because what we'lltell them is like hey, listen,
we got a bunch of differentfinancing options right, and
what we can help you do is let'sfinance it today.
(12:20):
Let's get your roof done.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
The great thing about this is we have financing for
you today.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Payment options.
You know what I mean.
You got these payment optionsright and so about what we can
do is you know we'll finance youget your roof built.
We can still file the claim, wecan still liaise on that
process, but now, when you getthat $20,000 check that you
would have been putting towardsthe roof, you put that in your
pocket and you just, you knowmay pay it for the next 12 years
.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
man, you ever just ask somebody hey, how you
financing this You're like oh,I'm paying cash.
I'm not financing, I'm payingcash.
They're crazy, bro, you knowwhat I mean.
And so I like to take awayclothes.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
We're we're.
But you're seeing, I'm seeing alot of that and you know, I
think that it's only going tocontinue to tighten up, like
that's.
One thing I love about theMidwest is like it's kind of a
it's, it's kind of like a hiddengem.
It really is like the you knowthe Ohio area, the you know
Pennsylvania, kentucky, like youknow these spots are.
They're not sexy, they're not.
(13:10):
You know, a ton of hail damageand Florida and Texas and all of
that, but there's, it's, goodmargins, it's, you know, it's
inconsistent with the weather,but it's like I don't know.
Man, I love the market up herefor sure.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
And you're definitely seeing it Because it's all you
know, or that's probably truetoo.
I mean.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
I've seen, I mean I know, I know guys that are.
I'd say it's the only thingI've operated in Right.
I've got friends that havecompanies in Texas and Florida
and I'll tell you how great itis.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Yeah, 100%.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
And you think, the grass is greener.
But they knew all the nuancesand I mean the grass is a little
bit greener.
Sometimes it can be greener,yeah, I mean, but it's not
always as green.
Yeah, so you got the Arnoldcoming up.
Yeah, man, talk a little bitabout pro's gym.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
Oh man, so my original I call it my original
mentor, really guy pulled me outof a party, gave me a job when
I was 22.
He had the opportunity to buywhich was the official gym of
the Arnold Classic.
I had like 48 grand of my bankaccount at the time.
He needed 30.
That got me like 7% of the gym,yeah.
(14:10):
And then there was like allthese different partners and so
he was just kind of scrappingtogether to make it happen, so
you know I'm basically emptyingout like 60% of my bank account
on a whim.
Probably a bad move at the time,but now I'm grateful.
It's like yeah eight years ago.
But you know, you saw thepotential.
You know middle downtown bankbuilding, one of the four
(14:33):
original buildings built alongwith the state house in the
middle of downtown Columbusofficial gym, the Arnold Classic
, yeah, so there was a lot ofopportunity there, but the gym
was losing like 30 grand a month.
You had 400 members all paying$10 a month.
Rents, 13 Gs Do the math.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Yeah, that ain't making sense.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
No so.
But you know, I saw the longterm vision of it and I recently
just bought the building,finally from landlord two years
ago.
That's freaking awesome.
So bought the building andthat's a cool ass building.
It is a cool building.
Yeah, it's so cool.
The 70th phone call ever madein human history was made from
(15:12):
the executive office of thisbuilding.
Because it was the telephone,it was like the telephone
central operating office wherethey plugged in the cord.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
Yeah, and I thought well, there's wires to Lord in
this building and none of themare electrical.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
They're all phone wires.
But but yeah, you know it's alot of cool history with it and
so I bought it.
The bank that had the no, nobig secret, you know, commercial
real estate's in big, bigtrouble right now.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:37):
Small local community banks are in big, big trouble
and I saw that firsthand.
You know the bank that did theloan.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
Did an interest only 24 month loan like they were
doing at the end of the raterate cycle.
Yeah, I was on one of those.
And then the three creditunions are paired together to
redo this loan and do therenovation loan Bent me over
backwards to be able to get that, to be able to get this
renovation yeah, dealing withthe ramifications of it now,
yeah, but, yeah.
But this is like the firstArnold classic where I can be
(16:07):
proud of our product and it'snot anywhere close to being
there yet.
Yeah, not even close.
But but, uh, I never wanted tomarket the gym or really put my
face behind it.
And Matt, he's a 50-50 partnerin the gym, 100% of the building
.
So you worked your way up from7%.
Speaker 1 (16:25):
Yeah, yeah, just buying in, man, buying in,
staying consistent, yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
One day I'm gonna make some money out of it.
But yeah, man, I never reallywanted to market the gym or
myself with it, because it wasalways less than a subpar
product.
Place needed renovated, thebathrooms were disgusting, the
place needed painted, I mean,you know everything.
Yeah, I mean we spent 150 grandon AC unit because we were
without heat and air for twoyears.
(16:51):
Yeah, that's why we you know,kind of our hand was forced to
buy this building.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
But yeah, man, I'm rambling at this point.
Speaker 1 (16:58):
But I can't tell.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
I'm super excited about it because it's like you
know, I got in the fitnessindustry.
It was what my passion wasoriginally, and now it's kind of
coming full circle.
15 years down the line I'mright back in fitness where I
started, but only I've got thereal estate play with it too,
and so I'm excited to see wherethe brand goes, where you know
the real estate play with thisgoes our licensing model, the
(17:20):
online model with this brand.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
So I'm excited and I think too, it's like where it's
at now is to the point where youcan actually add your value to
it.
Yeah, I mean it's kind of thebuild up phase, like it wasn't
necessarily like your wheelhouse, essentially where you know.
Now I think it's from whatyou're telling me right it's
like now it's becoming kind ofthe product that you're making
it into as well.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
For sure you know when you have something that
your name's behind and you knowthat it sucks you just kind of
just want to put your freakinghead down, yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
But you know it's just a process, man, it's a
process, but the problem is isyou know your customer doesn't
give a shit about your processor their time, nope.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
No, it's zero, it's about them, yep.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
And then, when they you get your five seconds of hey
guys, I've worked really,really hard at this.
I'm glad to share it with theworld.
Blah, blah, blah.
You get your applause for aboutfive seconds and then they
don't care anymore.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
Yeah, it's what you do for me.
Yeah.
Yeah, man Dude, I mean I needto actually come down.
It's been a long time sinceI've been down there.
I mean probably three yearssince I was down at that gym.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
Yeah, yeah, it's coming along.
So I mean, you know we've gotthe Arnold next week.
That's a huge day.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
I mean huge, huge man .
Speaker 2 (18:27):
I mean we'll do.
We'll do three months for thisyear, We'll probably do six
months worth of revenue in aweek, so huge.
I mean we've got Jay Cutler,Roddy Coleman, Michael Hearn is
doing our VIP party, Dio Champyeah, he's doing a party there.
Midwest Kong, who's our firstsponsored athlete, he's got his
bench party.
(18:48):
So like we've got all of thesegreat athletes that are so
successful in their arena andthey all kind of just come
together.
They come together at pros andit becomes this whole like side
event of the Arnold class.
It really does, yeah, I mean,it's an event center for a whole
week and it's like if you wantto go, you know, like we had
Arnold, for instance, actuallyin the gym was that two weeks
(19:10):
ago, I think?
And we've got this picture toArnold where he does this, yeah.
And then he posted on hisInstagram that same photo in
front of his photo doing this atour gym.
Yeah, that's fucking cool.
And like when he was in there,he's like tapping on this kid's
shoulder.
He's like, hey, I want to workout together, yeah.
And the kid just doesn't evenknow what to say because he just
looked up and saw Arnold andhe's like, no, you can have it,
(19:31):
and Arnold doesn't want to takehis piece of equipment.
Arnold wants to work out andfeel normal and just work out
with this kid and workingtogether and share that
camaraderie.
Speaker 1 (19:40):
Yeah Well, dude, and that's cool for you too.
Like you said, I mean for it, Imean myself as well.
Right, it's like Arnold's, likethe pinnacle of bodybuilding,
or fitness in any way right.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
So for you in general , I mean governor movie star,
everything man real estate mogulyou know yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
And that's cool, man, and I mean that's the powerful
thing about that.
You know, having a buildinglike that or a place like that
is like dude, that you'recreating that opportunity for a
kid that literally would havenever had that chance to meet.
And Arnold, like when I wasbodybuilding that shit without a
shit, my pants are fucking on.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
I'd have been like oh my God, this is crazy.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
Yeah, and then you know.
So while you're there, you knowpeople can train, you know,
basically with their favoritepro.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
And those guys are super cool, Like it's.
So what's wild to me is thepeople that are least
egotistical, generally speaking,are the people that have
reached such a high level ofsuccess that they realize that
they've already been past thatego stage and they're just like
they just want to be normal.
Yeah, they just want to feellike they fit in and not be
bothered with pictures and allthat stuff.
(20:41):
It's going to be a part of it.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
It's going to be a part of it, yeah, and I think
that's I mean, that's the youknow natural trajectory or
spiral dynamics or whatever youwant to call it right.
It's like we all kind of gothrough.
We go through that phase, right.
I'm like you want to be popularor you want to be, even if it's
for a stint.
We all kind of like level up inour own way and it's at some
point it's like I kind of feellike I might deserve this or
(21:02):
this is you know.
And then you get past that partand you realize it's more about
wanting to help people and growpeople and you don't need to be
, you don't need to be attentionanymore.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
Yeah, you know, yeah, some people thrive on it though
.
Influencers, that's true, dudeInfluencers.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
Yeah, what are you?
Are you still I mean, you'restill running doing coaching
masterminds.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
So, yeah, I've got a very, very small community
called scalers.
Only it's about scaling realestate.
My whole MO for building it waslong-term relationship capital.
You know, eventually in the Icall it the pyramid of real
estate, you know, you start offwholesaling and you flip, then
you rent and then eventuallybecome the bank.
(21:40):
Well, we all need each other inthis ecosystem, right, and so
you can never become too big.
I mean, I was talking to one ofmy lenders earlier today and
he's like man, can you introduceme to some wholesalers?
And then you would think that,like wholesalings, like bottom
of the barrel, but not, we allneed each other in this
ecosystem, yeah, so for me it'sabout creating people you know,
I know like and trust we can dodeals together, long, long-term
(22:04):
relationships, and you know itjust whatever's going to pivot
more money inside their ownbusiness and inside my own
business and do what people thatyou like doing it with.
Quite, quite frankly, yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
It's like long-term games with long-term people.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
You know.
So that that's kind of the MO.
But you know the tagline isgetting you to, or taking you to
, a hundred units and beyond.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
So for I like that.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Yeah, I came up with that one.
I was like, yeah, that's kindof cool.
Because I was trying to figureout, like what this was right.
You know you have a ton ofpeople teaching people how to
wholesale flipping houses.
Renting houses is the mostunsexiest thing ever.
You know the $300 a month cashflow.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
It's like storage units.
They're both kind of yeah Likeit's.
It's like who's getting excitedabout $300 a month?
Nobody.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
Unless you're looking at equity.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
Unless you're looking at equity.
It's a long-term game, right,yeah.
And if I could get enough $400a month cash flows in my mind,
even if those stayed the same, Icould get like my 10 grand a
month number, yeah, and that waslike the original thing and
that was kind of indestructibleif you will, yeah, but it's.
It's not very sexy, but youknow, for a lot of people it's
(23:11):
like hey, I want to generatereal wealth and not just
wholesale, not just being a ratrace of flipping houses Because
it is man, I mean it's afull-time job and more.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
Yeah, Well, and it's made out with social media and
everything else and it's likeyou know, that's like the sexy
thing is to teach wholesaling.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Yeah, I mean you know , and it's like, and that's
going bye-bye.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Yeah, you know Well the what's I mean title.
I mean explain a little bit ofthat because probably people out
there kind of listen to it.
Yeah, spin that mic towards youhere.
There we go this way, there wego, yeah.
So, yeah, talk a little bit.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Yeah, man, yeah, we care People that will teach
wholesale.
And now there's like this therewas this lawsuit just happen,
like two, three weeks ago Maybewhere someone got sued for a ten
million bucks for cold callingand texting wasn't even their
company and I think they gotbanged for about a million a
half when it was all said anddone.
So this is gonna be the firstcase on.
(23:59):
You know.
So, all those annoying spamcalls you get spam texts and all
yeah and None of us have doneit right.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Optin.
They've all opted.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
Yeah, of course so it's gonna be interesting to see
where this goes, yeah, but youknow, laws change, regulations
change and you just try tooperate in the boundaries that
you can for the time being.
But you got a, you got to atleast pay attention of what's
happening in the future.
Or else, if you get like wewere talking about insurance,
right, like dude, if all you'redoing is relying on that one,
(24:32):
you're not.
Exit strategy, right, and thatone, you're done.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
You're done.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
So you have to be a little bit forward thinking and
forward-looking yeah if you'renot then you're gonna get
crushed.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
I mean I talk, I like you continues to scale and grow
as you've got a pivot.
You've seen season.
I mean you see the real estateso cyclical you know, yeah,
Neighborhoods change.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Yeah, you know where people want to want to live,
where people want to work andplay.
Yeah, it's change.
So you know you can't do thisall the time, but at the same
time you just have to have likea Just a decent head on your
shoulders to say this is okayand be honest with yourself,
like even though my business isset up this way, yeah.
This is gonna go like this, andI need to.
I need to make some appropriatechanges now, so that way I'm
(25:09):
ahead of the curve.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
How would I mean for you with the way your business
is set up?
Is it coming because you I meanyou don't necessarily, you're
not as heavy as the wholesaling,as much as you're trying to
acquire yourself right?
So it's like is you know, it iswhat, even with cold calling
and outbound SMS and stuff likethat is, is that something for
you that you're starting tochange, whether it's like agent
relationships and things likethat, or for sure.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
Yeah, if you think about it, the best deals we've
ever made in our lives have beenthrough relationships.
Yeah, yeah.
And we're good, like we'retrying to automate relationships
, and it's like, dude, it's,it's, it's the hard work, yeah,
and it's not even hard, it's fun.
Like, yeah, why in the hellwould you not want to develop a
relationship with somebody, makea lot of money with them, go
out and celebrate your winstogether?
(25:53):
Yeah, you know like, that'skind of the old-school way of
doing business, but guess what?
It's coming back.
It is coming back.
Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
I thought our guys all time like the best thing
about the roofing industry isit's low barrier to entry.
The worst thing about theroofing industry is it's low
barrier to entry.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
I'm saying wholesaling right so you get,
you know You've get the peoplethat are Transactional.
But then you start to findyourself kind of competing with
the market and what they'redoing right, like I'll catch us
Doing that all the time.
I'm like wait, wait, wait, likehold up, like that's how
everybody else is doing it, likelet's slow down, like really
focus on the consultation, let'sfocus on getting to the table
with people.
Let's like that's actuallybuild relationships, let's
(26:28):
actually sell, because that'swhat no one else wants to do.
They don't.
They don't.
They want to take the quick, doa photo, you know, inspect the
house, send them a photo report,tell them to file a claim over
the phone roll.
You know what I mean it's like.
But how much are you leavingthe table when you sit down and
talk to them about siding andgutters and windows and like
actually connect with the personbecause even if they have
somebody else that give them abetter bid.
Speaker 2 (26:48):
Yeah if you build that relationship and especially
like if you got four peoplechasing your, chasing your house
in a storm, right, what's gonnaseparate you?
Right, a connection you know, Imean insurance.
Same way.
Going back to insurance, youknow I'm I got an insurance
agent right now I've been loyalto for ten years.
He's not the cheapest, he's notthe most.
Actually he sucks at beingefficient.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
I'll tell him that to his face.
Speaker 2 (27:11):
I'm like dude, you got to get the system.
Speaker 1 (27:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
But I love him to death, yeah, loving the death,
yeah, and very good friend, andyou know it goes a long way.
So it's coming back around, butyou know.
You asked about deal flow.
Yeah, I have relationships, ifyou again, everything cyclical.
But like when I first gotstarted in real estate, there
was zero money to be found, butthere was all these deals, yeah,
(27:35):
and everyone's like, oh, yougot started in 2012, 2013, back
in a hay.
Yeah, we had it easy right dude,where were you gonna find money
?
Yeah, because money did notexist.
Hard money was not a thing.
Yeah, you know, if you did findhard money, they were gonna do
one or two loans for you.
It was gonna be four points 14%if you were gonna get it.
Yeah, there was no scaling thisstuff, right, so it was it.
(28:00):
Now the pendulum has shifted towhere there's no deals and
there's all this money.
Yeah, right, so finding moneyis so easy.
Now it's where are you gonnafind the deal?
Yeah, and so you know you haveto put yourself out there.
You got to be on social media.
You have to be the first personpeople think about whenever
they come across something.
You know, look, share sales aregonna be a thing again.
(28:22):
People are struggling to paytheir bills.
I mean, I don't know how badthe world's gonna get, but yeah,
this soft landing scenario, I'mnot buying it.
Yeah, and, and nobody that's in.
I mean, I graduated college in08 and I'm not saying we're
gonna get back there, but youcan't pretend that you're too
smart for the market either.
Yeah, you're never gonna fightand beat the Fed.
You're never gonna fight andbeat the market.
(28:43):
So at least, like, have sometype of margin of safety when
you're investing and say, hey,this could be this, something
that happens, yeah, and if itdoes happen, how much can I
withstand Before I go belly up?
Yeah, right, and for a lot ofpeople I would say that that
margin of safety is like hereyeah.
Until you've been through it,and then, once you've been
(29:04):
burned by it.
Now your margin of safety ishere, which you're never gonna
make any money or take any riskeither.
So it's about striking abalance with being able to put
your your head on the pillow atnight yeah, feeling good about
what you, what you're doing,you're not over leveraged, but
same time, taking enough risk tobe able to grow too.
It's a.
That's a balance.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
It's balance you done , and you've done it.
Well, you know what I mean.
It's like it's it's.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
You know I wouldn't say well, Learned from it.
Yeah, well, I mean I would youknow.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Yeah, even even talking about that, right, it's
like you know I look at you,know when you and I work
together right.
I'm like Now where I'm at, Iunderstand business more right,
like I feel like when you knowyou and I work together, you
know I I would just learn inentrepreneurship and getting
into all that, and I was leaninginto the sexy side of it.
(29:50):
I wanted to be cool, I wantedto be doing those things, you
know what I mean and and evenlike power, god, level, right,
like that's.
I wanted to be the man right andyou know, thinking that you
know more than you know.
And I look at myself, where I'mat now, and I'm like dude,
you're a good dude, bro.
Yeah, you've done an awesomejob, man.
I look at the scalability ofyour business and you know, or
(30:11):
what you scaled it to is likeman, that's.
It's an impressive thing, bro.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
So I appreciate that and that's out of it, man.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
I you know I want us to be cool again.
You know what I mean.
We're good man.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
I told you off air.
You know part of you know.
I got the Arnold next week.
I have literally eight breatheand slept at gym.
I should be there right now,but I said that there's
absolutely no way in the worldthat I was gonna miss this.
Yeah, dude, I.
I ran up to you at that eventand I'm like it's time and I
gotta reach out to this dude.
And you know.
(30:41):
One of the things that you knowand this is partially Something
I had to learn in this businesstoo Is that you know, because
of the low barrier to entryright, and because of what
people see on social media andthey see the big checks you know
and you're transparent.
Everyone else sees it too andEventually these people are
going to leave and they want todo their own thing and you have
(31:03):
to be okay with it.
You know At that time, you know, and it's just, it's part of
the business, it's part of thegame, right, and that's
something I've had to, like,come to grips with and learn, I
mean from.
I Mean shoot right after youleft.
I mean we had, we ramp back up.
You know had a bunch ofacquisition guys run around the
office.
You know High-five, each otherplan, grab ass all day.
(31:26):
You know having fun and youknow, slowly, as the market
began to turn, more people wentout on their own.
It's like it was like a wholenew cycle again.
Yeah, you know, I look at that.
The amount of people We've hadinside our real estate business,
like, as you know, w2s ormovies or whatever.
It's like, wow, it has justbeen a ton, yeah, yeah.
But you know, it's part of thebit, it's the natural
(31:49):
progression of this business,man.
It's just.
It is what it is.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Well, I think that you know, you know, I mean, I
look at even where you knowwe're at now, compared to where
I was, you know, three or fouryears ago, and you know I had, I
had probably, not probably I'vehad great people that came
through that if they were tocome into my business now They'd
have much more success.
They'd they'd fit better I'vegiven them a better success plan
.
Like right, like I look at that,all Time that's part of the
hardest part is like as thebusiness is growing, you're it's
(32:16):
always constantly changing.
People are changing, themarkets are changing and and so
you know as a business, owner,you're changing we're trained,
we're changing.
You know, and I look at that now, I'm like man, like the amount
of people that I had comethrough that worked or didn't
work out, and it's like man.
They'd be great now yeah, youknow what I mean if they could
come in and I could act, becauseI didn't have the systems and
the things to be able To getthem to where they needed to be
(32:37):
and and I actually probablyfailed most of them because I
didn't have that but I didn't, Iwasn't able to create it until
I failed people to figure outwhere to do it right the next
way, you know.
So I mean, I think that's a bigpart of it.
It's just, you know, you'vekind of got to take those hard
L's but eventually you get a Wout of it.
You know what I mean man.
Yeah, it's, it's, it's a.
Yeah, business is a fucking,it's fun.
(32:57):
You know, every day I'm likeman.
It's a good-ass time.
I love being able to do whatyou do.
But you know, into the day too,it's also you.
You don't get to walk away froma job at the end of the night
and get asleep.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
You still got a business and people to take care
of that's something that I havedone a much better job of
recently is sleep, and I've wetalked about blood tests before,
before this, and you know,getting older, 37 years old now
I need my sleep.
Yeah, terry needs some sleep.
Yeah, and you know, I want tohave some peace when I sleep,
(33:29):
yeah, so I guess, with, withthat being said, you, you know,
I just I want to go to work, Idon't want to be so risky and so
, you know, such a rodeo kinganymore, you know it's like dude
, I just I want to go home, bewith my kid.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
And spent because he's only gonna be a little once
.
How old is he now?
He's almost two, almost two.
What's his name?
Titan.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
Titan, that's an awesome name.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
Yeah, terry, the third, but we called it.
We called him Titan.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
But he's learning his numbers and like he's smart,
he'd like I turn on the stockchannel and like I'll pay
attention to my portfolio yeah,you know our trades and all that
stuff and he just startsrallying off all the numbers.
But like it's a little stufflike that, like I don't want to
miss any of those moments.
Yeah, and you know, I'm not thefirst person in the office
anymore.
Yeah, thursdays I don't even goin, I'm just hanging out with
(34:19):
him.
So like I've gotten back tothis point, to where I remember
why I got invested in realestate in the first place, and
it wasn't to be a business owner, it wasn't to to show off or
have the.
You know, I mean, dude, look atthese, look at these bobo's you
know, like it wasn't about thestuff.
Man Right, you know I meanthere's no watch, yeah, none of
(34:41):
that stuff.
You know it's about the time,freedom.
And then you know, if I want togo fly somewhere, you know, for
an event or whatever, it's noteven a quit, I'm just going to
go do it, but I'm going to beright back on the first flight.
Home, yeah, hang out with myfamily, yeah.
So I don't know.
Speaker 1 (34:57):
It's long, long winded, but it's lifestyle right
and it's all what you want outof your life, and I mean, I
think that dude, that and that'sa great thing too, and I think
that's one of the you know,that's one of the hardest things
when you know you're gettinginto business is that what do
you?
What's the end goal?
You know what I mean.
Like, and we don't really thinkabout that.
Like for me, I look at whereI'm at now and what are what my
(35:20):
goals are, and things like that,and I have conversations with
people and they don't evenreally know what they want out
of life, right?
Speaker 2 (35:25):
So you just kind of, and if you don't know it as the
owner.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Then like what do you ?
Your people are going to comeand go because they need
something when are you takingthem to?
Speaker 2 (35:32):
And then wherever you want to live your life based
around your business.
Yeah, I mean, your people arepaying attention.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Right, don't set the standard a certain way too Right
.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
Because then you're being a phony and then you're
being fake and the next thingyou know, if you want to be the
guy that's you know at theoffice all the time, then you
want to go through this phase towhere you're not, they're like
where in hell is this guy?
Yeah, he's falling off Right.
So I think, you know, I justhave open conversations where
I'm at that may change.
You know there's times where,hey, we go gangbusters and I
like that, like I love thebusiness as a sport thing.
(36:00):
I don't like it to consume 12months, 365 days a year.
You know, I want to go onvacation with my family or do
XYZ, but it's nice to be able todo that but then also be able
to experience home.
Yeah, 100% as well.
Yeah, you know, just startedplaying in a band again.
Speaker 1 (36:16):
It's nice to be able to experience that 100% and just
be there.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
Yeah, Dude, man, drumming has always been like my
passion.
Yeah, they call it.
I think they call it flow state.
I think I might have heard thatfrom Greg Ford one time, but I
heard that word flow state andI'm like dude, when am I in my
flow state?
Yeah, Like dude, I'm playingdrums man.
I'm not, I'm not the greatestdrummer, but you know, enjoy it,
I enjoy it.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
You had long hair back in the day too, Didn't you?
I had hair back today.
Yeah, I had hair Gone now.
That's why.
That's why I'm all had it upall the time I haven't been.
Speaker 2 (36:49):
I haven't been to Turkey yet, but but yeah, I
played up until I was like 25and had I bought my very first
house in this building.
Speaker 1 (37:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
And I remember that I , the same day I bought that
house, I got a promotion to goto Pittsburgh, pennsylvania,
which was it was going to belike on the sales side.
I knew I probably would havehad a potential to make, we'll
say, 40 to $60,000 more a year.
Go into Pittsburgh, Go intoPittsburgh, yeah.
And the gym that I was at I hadalready Maxed, maxed it out,
(37:22):
like I had already sold everysingle person personal training
in this gym.
Yeah, I mean, you're a fuckingsavage bro you know what I mean
You're gonna hunt them down, Ijust but, like there's all, you
know, if I've pulled, if there's, you know, 2000 members of this
gym and I've talked to 2000,.
You know, I and that gym took adeep dive.
So I knew that if I didn'tleave, like, yeah, I was going
to be stuck and I was going todie in this gym in Gross City.
(37:43):
So, anyway, same exact day, Itook this promotion to
Pittsburgh, which also meant Iwould have to leave my band as
well.
Yeah, which sucked, and thatwas a tough conversation.
That was always a thing that,like aided me.
I chose money over my passion,yeah.
And now here we are, you know,12, 13 years later, and I'm
trying to get my passions back.
(38:04):
Yeah, you know, there's like anold, what is it?
I think it's something not inHindu, but like Buddhist culture
where they say, you know, manis like the only person that
tries to create so much money,only to try to use it to then
regain what's purposeful in lifeand then regain their health.
(38:24):
I forget the phrase that theysay but like it's kind of funny
how we do that.
And I don't want to be 45 yearsold, you know, no offense if
you're 45, but, like you know,the older we get, the more you
realize like, hey, this iswhat's important to me, this is
my passion, this is my hobby,like these entrepreneurs that
say they don't have hobbiesbullshit, right, you know, I'm
just.
I'm not on that ice bath fourtimes before 4am, like no one
(38:46):
does that shit.
You know these people are liars, Right.
So, like you know, do thethings that make you happy and
own it.
But anyways.
Speaker 1 (38:53):
No, I love that.
I mean.
I mean, you know, you know Ihadn't got to connect in a while
, man, and you know it's cool to.
It's cool to hear all thethings that you're doing.
It would have been a differentconversation, you know, five
years ago, of what the focus wasand where the goal was and what
was happening.
You know what I mean and youknow it's cool to see the things
that bring you enjoyment andfulfillment now and, like you
(39:14):
can see, you're like lit uptalking about the kids, lit up
talking about the band and like,dude, that's a, that's an
awesome thing, bro, yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
And you know, I mean, I mean business, same way, you
know, and it's just, it's allwhat you want, right?
I mean, do you want to?
I mean there's people that wantto have the biggest, baddest
media company, for instance.
Awesome, dude.
If that's what brings youhappiness and joy, dude, I'm
going to be your number onesupporter on that.
There's no right, wrong orindifferent in the sport.
(39:40):
Right, it's all what you want,because, like, there's always
going to be someone with abetter house, you know, it's
always going to be a little bittaller, a little bit more hair
on their head, a little bit morefit, a little bit more in shape
, more money, but it's like youknow what's the best version of
your own life and it's aconstant and it sounds cliche as
shit, but I don't know.
It's just kind of where I'm at,like dude, I got two phones now
(40:03):
, one for social media, one formy real phone, just so that you
know you don't get caught in.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
that I like that.
That's actually a good idea.
Well, dude, it sucks the endman.
You know what I mean Becauseyou're always it's always a dick
measuring contest nowadays.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
I hate it.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
You know what I mean?
Everything's what they're doing,why they're doing it, how
they're doing it and there's somuch gossip and it's just like
you know that's what I love witheven what we've got here.
It's like, dude, I just builtmy own table.
You know what I mean.
I'm like I don't, I just keepit to the confines of what we've
got here.
Everything that I have in myit's in my family, you know what
I mean.
And I'm like I don't needanything else other than this as
(40:37):
long as I like taking care ofmy people, I like coaching my
people, like roofing to me isthe vehicle that allows me to
mentor and grow young men andwomen.
Like that's what I love to domore than anything.
And you know that's like I tryto just stay hyper-focused on
that and not let the outsidestuff, you know, get in your
head, because it will.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
Yeah, you know it does and you feel like you're
doing when.
You feel like you're doingsomething wrong because you got
on social media and sawsomething and it's just, it's so
quick, dude, it's so quick andyou know it's our job to put out
good content, but it's notgoing to be for everybody.
I'm not going to be foreverybody.
You're not going to be foreverybody.
(41:15):
You're not going to be foreverybody.
You know You're not going to befor everybody and that's okay.
There's nothing wrong with that.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
And I think it's understanding too from the side
of, like you know, you've got tobe a creator for it, not a
consumer right, because theconsumption is what really it's
where it gets you right, likethe negative consumption.
Yes, yes, yes, you've got to beable to.
You know, because I don'tnecessarily really even like
social media, we got the mediateam.
Now they do all the postinglike, they take care of all
(41:41):
those things, but at the end ofthe day, you know, it's still a
a necessary evil.
You've got to have it to beable to build in today's day and
age.
Speaker 2 (41:52):
You have to you have to, man, but yeah, for me too.
Like someone said this a whileago, they're like you know, when
you don't hear from anymore andI just disappear, like that's
when I made it.
Speaker 1 (42:03):
Yeah, and I was like that's good yeah.
Speaker 2 (42:06):
That's good, yeah, dude, but you know for people
that you know when they achievea certain level to them with a
success and all those things,and you don't feel the need that
you have to.
You know.
You know what, man, it'sTuesday.
I just don't.
I don't want to be on socialtoday and you don't have to.
It's freedom, Right, but whenyou have to do all the same and
(42:28):
there's a lot of people that arelocked in that prison too, yeah
, and I'm calling it a prisonbecause that's what, from my, my
viewpoint, what it is.
But you know even some of themost famous people in the world,
or what we consider the mostsuccessful people your
Kardashians, your Kevin Hartyour rocks.
You can never not do it.
So you know, what did youcreate for yourself?
Is it?
If it's what you want, Awesome,yeah, Love it, yeah.
(42:50):
But if it's not, then what didyou really create?
And so those are things I thinkwe we don't think about enough
when we get into business andlife.
And again, it's just whateverthe end result is or an end
result can change too, butwhatever that end result is cool
.
Try to, you know, frame yourand you got to work to that
right.
You're not just going to startyour business on day one and
then be there and be there.
(43:10):
But, like you know, have anactive journey towards it.
Speaker 1 (43:12):
Yeah, but just don't forget it, yeah, and enjoy the
progress, enjoy the process ofit, right Cause if you're always
, you know, measuring it off thegap in the game of where you're
not yet, you know that thatthat'll where you out to Like.
You've got to find the smallwins along the way.
This is definitely a gain righthere.
Speaker 2 (43:30):
You like that?
That's pretty good man, I'veactually never had it.
Um, we had these in the gym and, uh, I had like the uh iced one
, but that was the only one Ihad.
This, that's pretty solid yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:41):
Good Like 3D man, it's good stuff.
Speaker 2 (43:42):
Yeah, I need to get off of those things at some
point in my life.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
I think you.
I actually never drank energydrinks until I worked with you.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Really yeah.
Well, you always just make themonster runs down there, bro,
and I never had a.
Speaker 1 (43:55):
I'd never had an energy drink.
Now I'm like six a day, youknow.
I mean it's caffeine.
I feel like I just I create badhabits for people.
Speaker 2 (44:02):
Man Like man, I show up for a.
I show up around Christmas inthe office and I'm just getting
a bottle of bourbon.
Someone sent me Jack Daniels.
I'm like dude, I can't tell you.
Last time I drank Jack Danielsyeah, uh, you know.
Bottle of rum.
Like dude, I don't even drinkrum.
Like they're just like, they'reassuming it Bottle of Blanton's
and like damn that Like, andit's all like Whole shelf.
Yeah, Whole shelf.
Speaker 1 (44:22):
I haven't even touched it.
Yeah Well, brother, dude, Iwant to.
I want to get you back to youruh, back to the Arnold stuff you
got going on.
Man, I don't want to keep youtoo much longer.
You're good, let me ask you this, brother you got you know guys,
obviously in the in the realestate space, people getting in
man, I'm a little, give themsome wisdom, man, or how can
they find you, how can they workwith you?
I mean how you know you?
(44:42):
There's a lot of people thatlisten to you know this, that
are getting into real estate orwanting to man and you're like a
fucking you're a stud at,you're the celebrity.
You're a celebrity in theColumbus market right when it
comes to real estate, I would.
Speaker 2 (44:53):
I would just say it's whatever you want, right, like,
if you want to, if you want tomake 10 grand a month, dude, go
wholesale, and then you'll do itwith minimal work.
Um, or you know, buy 20properties, pay them off.
Yeah, that's cool.
Yeah, I mean I want to sell mybusiness for an extreme multiple
at some point.
(45:13):
Um, you know, uh, my, myoriginal goal was a hundred
million before I'm 40.
Um, I don't know if I'm goingto make it, but we're, we're
going to try.
Speaker 1 (45:21):
I mean, I feel like momentum and time is on your
side.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
Momentum and time and compound interest, man and um.
But I, uh, I would just saywhatever it is that you want and
then just figure out.
You know how do I reverseengineer this stuff.
You know, um, you know rentalsaren't sexy.
But you know, I just had a tax,I had a tax meeting earlier
today.
I can tell you, man, we just weredid the way that we were
running would set a run ofstraight line depreciation.
(45:44):
We ran makers depreciation on acouple of things and then
amended a tax return to to makeit work and like tax bill,
literally hundreds of thousandsof dollars just by redoing some
properties, some biggerproperties and portfolio Like.
It is amazing what you can doand the way that you I don't use
word manipulate, but the waythat you can re classify numbers
(46:07):
to work in your favor withrental properties.
You can't do that with withhardly anything else.
You can't, um, but uh, but yeah,um, I would just say, man, like
, get a mentor to mentors, help.
You don't have to pay an armand a leg to find a mentor.
Uh, you know, go work forsomebody for free, you know.
Uh, go intern.
You know, spend two hours withsomebody to say, hey, I just
(46:29):
want to be a fly on the wall.
Speaker 1 (46:30):
Bring value.
Speaker 2 (46:30):
Yeah, and then the last thing.
The last thing I want to do isjust be in your presence and I
will go.
I'll go do two hours worth ofwork for you, but I would at
least want to just sit in theroom and see what you do for 20
minutes out of those two hours.
Yeah, great, I would.
I mean, if you were going tobring me that much, you know
cool.
Speaker 1 (46:46):
You have to man it's.
It's osmosis learning.
Get good at all Osmosislearning yeah.
Speaker 2 (46:51):
But you don't have to spend you know 15 grand on your
coaching, you know course orwhatever, um, you know, if you
want to.
I think people that do pay payattention.
That's true.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
You know like kind of tithing to the church.
You know what I mean.
You give your money to thechurch.
You listen to them.
Yeah, I need.
Speaker 2 (47:05):
I need to.
I started so I'd never titheuntil two years ago and I set it
up for what I thought was anappropriate amount.
Speaker 1 (47:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (47:15):
And I haven't changed it yet.
Yeah, and I need to change that.
That's your reminder to changeit.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (47:21):
And I'm like, because it just comes out automatically
, right, and it's so much easier.
Speaker 2 (47:24):
But then, once you see it, the email hit your
you're like and then they takeout the 25 cents or whatever for
the transaction fee.
I'm like they're trying to getone over on that and that's it.
Speaker 1 (47:35):
That's over my 10%.
Speaker 2 (47:36):
Yeah, uh, but yeah, I mean dude, just uh, and
sticking it for the long haul.
Um, the the number one thing Icould say is compound interest
at all times.
Uh, make sure every dollar,every piece of equity, every
person, everything that you haveat your disposal, is earning
compound interest for you.
That's the name of the game.
Um, don't be afraid to buyrentals.
The $300 a month isn't sexy,but eventually it compounds into
(48:01):
hundreds of thousands ofdollars and a good market too,
you know yeah.
And, um, yeah, just reach out tomentors.
I mean, dude, it's not.
The reason I love this businessis cause you don't have to
reinvent the wheel, you don'thave to recreate anything.
Hell, you don't even have tocreate anything.
You just do what other peoplehave been doing over recorded
history and just be in the game,be as best as you can at it and
(48:22):
just be in it for a long time,and you'll be successful.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
Take the licks.
Yeah, I mean, you gotta stickthrough it.
What's the, what's the best wayfor them to find you?
Terry, how, how do I get?
Speaker 2 (48:31):
it Uh, ta or RY.
That's TA or RY.
Say it again Uh, terry sums atInstagram, cause some girl named
Terrin Summerton took TerrySummers.
Speaker 1 (48:41):
Dang, I feel like you've been trying to get that
for a long time.
Speaker 2 (48:43):
I have I offered like 15 Gs for it.
Speaker 1 (48:45):
The other day.
Speaker 2 (48:45):
She's like if you drive 15 grand cash down here,
then maybe I'll consider it.
Yeah, I get any worth it.
Speaker 1 (48:49):
She's just a mad Karen, like she really is Her
name should not be Terrin.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
It's to be Karen, right?
Um, but yeah, some check out ofTexas took that.
But it's Terry sums onInstagram.
Uh, you can hit me up onFacebook as well.
Um, terry Summers, or?
Uh, we have our scalars.
Only, mastermind, um, if youare scaling your real estate
portfolio and you think thatyou're going to be an asset to
the community, great, we'd loveto have a conversation with you.
Um, and then that's it.
(49:15):
Man, I'm just, I'm here to hereto be as valuable as I can, and
, um, I love it.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
I forgot real quick before we wrap up.
Speaker 2 (49:23):
How's your dad, man?
How's your father?
Speaker 1 (49:26):
I mean, your dad was like, I mean, your dad's such a
nice fucking dude.
Like I even passed him a fewtimes and he always would stop
and you know bullshit for aminute, so I don't want to make
sure.
I asked how he was.
Speaker 2 (49:35):
He's, uh, he's awesome man.
Um, you know the the.
His stress levels aretremendously lower.
Um and uh, yeah, he's just,he's happy man.
He gets to do it now because wehave that construction company
together.
You know he's, he's a majorityon the minority, um, and I try
(49:56):
to get him to like get with thetimes.
Speaker 1 (49:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:58):
Not happening.
But you know, for me he's happy, I get to spend time with him.
Um, do I know that we could domore and more often and be a lot
bigger and all this stuff?
And it's like, yeah, but atwhat cost?
Right?
Yeah, it's like, dude, ifyou're happy and you want to go
run the Lowe's and pick up thismaterial, for no damn reason.
All right, cool man you youwant to go do that, who am I to
(50:19):
tell?
you, you know they're all littlethings, you know.
Oh, but you had it.
He's having fun.
Yeah, that's awesome bro.
Speaker 1 (50:25):
Well, dude, terry, I appreciate you coming on man and
we got to.
We got to make sure we thisthing can't be the only time we
can.
Speaker 2 (50:29):
yeah, man, I appreciate you having me on.
Yeah, oh man.
I haven't drank in a couple ofmonths, oh man.
Speaker 1 (50:36):
After you celebrate the Arnold wins you know what I
mean.
Speaker 2 (50:38):
Yeah, yeah, maybe after Saturday.
Speaker 1 (50:40):
All right, reckless CEO, we're out.
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