Thinking Outside the Box

What did you think? Text us by clicking here! We are unable to reply on this app, so include phone # or email address.

In this episode, host David Nakhla talks with two deacons, David Pendergrass,  Covenant Reformed OPC in West Plains, MO, and Greg Harrison, Second Parish OPC, Scarborough, ME, who have, through the Lord's leading, found their professional calling largely based in the ministry of mercy. These two unique examples of thinking outside the box may not represent the Lord's calling for everyone, but David and Greg encourage deacons to look for ways in their lives to follow where the Lord is leading as they think outside the box.

Referenced in this episode:
Hearts of Hope
Sweetwater Research
James 1:27
John 14:18
Practicing the King's Economy by Michael J. Rhodes, Robby Holt, Brian Fikkert
David Pendergrass' church: Covenant Reformed OPC, West Plains, MO
Greg Harrison's Church: Second Parish OPC, Scarborough, ME
The Life of Lilian Trasher: Nile Mother by Beth Prim Howell
Mark and Debbie MacLachlan
"To the Least of These" David Nakhla’s trip to Romania to visit Greg Harrison
Jeremiah 29:7
Contact David Pendergrass ([e-mail])
Contact Greg Harrison ([e-mail])

Prayer requests:

David: 

• An increase in needed donations for Sweetwater Research
• Full-time remote work for David
• Add to Sweetwater board members

Greg:

• Praying that people gifted in teaching would come alongside to help teach their kids
• Looking for a place to purchase
• A body of Christ to be raised up nearby for the family to be fed spiritually
• Younger people to help serve with Hearts of Hope
• Funding to aid additional orphans

You can find all of our episodes at thereformeddeacon.org. Make sure to follow us on your favorite podcast player, so you don't miss an episode. Follow us on Facebook and Instagram for giveaways and more information. Find other resources on OPCCDM.org. Make sure to send us some feedback on your podcast player or ask a diaconal question by going to OPCCDM.org.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Our mandate is perfect religion and undefiled
before God, is to visit theorphan and the widow in their
affliction and to remainunspotted from the philosophy of
this world, and that is everyChristian's work.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
Welcome to the Reformed Deacon a casual
conversation with topicsspecifically designed to help
local Reformed Deacons topicsspecifically designed to help
local Reformed Deacons.
There are nearly a thousandDeacons in the OPC alone, so
let's take this opportunity tolearn from and encourage one
another.
We're so glad you could join us.
Let's jump into our nextepisode.
Hi, my name is David Nochlin.

(00:37):
Today, on the Reformed Deacon,we'll be talking with two OPC
Deacons whose day jobs comprisework that is actually very
diagonal in nature.
David Pendergrass is theexecutive director of Sweetwater
Research.
Sweetwater Research is anon-profit that designs and
supports holistic waterstrategies and education to

(01:00):
improve the effectiveness ofwater projects around the world
in a gospel-centered manner.
David serves as a deacon atCovenant Reformed OPC in West
Plains, missouri.
So welcome to the podcast,david, thank you.
And then we, secondly, areblessed to have Greg Harrison
patching in from Romania.
He's a deacon at Second ParishOPC in Scarborough, maine,

(01:25):
serving there for almost 20years before moving to Ukraine
in 2018.
And now, because of the war,they live in Romania.
Greg, along with his wifeBonnie, have opened their home
to Ukrainian orphans orphanswith special needs special needs

(01:48):
, those orphans who are nowrefugees, and they now run this
nonprofit organization calledHearts of Hope Ukraine.
Greg, thank you for joining us.

Speaker 1 (01:53):
Thank you, david, good to be here.

Speaker 2 (01:55):
Welcome, david and Greg.
I'm excited to have both of youhere to talk about your
respective work or maybe moreaccurately, your callings, as
they are very much works ofmercies.
I've interacted with both ofyou over a number of years and,
david, this is the first timewe've had the opportunity to,
besides being on a conversation,kind of be a little bit

(02:15):
face-to-face.
And then, of course, greg, I'vehad the privilege of visiting
you in Romania and seeing thework firsthand of Hearts of Hope
.
So maybe for about five minutesor something like this,
introduce yourself and the workthat you're doing and kind of
how the Lord even led you intothat work, and we can start with
you, david.

Speaker 3 (02:36):
Yeah, I think the best way to begin is to say that
I'm a water scientist who lovesJesus, and what Sweetwater does
is water for the body and waterfor the soul, and we do that
through science, education andresearch.
I got started on this pathbecause way back in high school
up in St Louis I did a waterecology class with the Missouri

(02:57):
Botanical Gardens and we wentaround for a year to various
streams in Missouri finding outhow to look at water quality
based on what lived in the water.
That fascinated me.
Here.
God gave us so much, so manyresources that we can use to
take care of the world that hemade.
I've always been a bit of anature boy.

(03:19):
You know, loved to be out inthe woods and trying to name the
trees I saw, or turn over rocksand see what lived under them.
In 1998, I was at CovenantCollege and it was a Sunday
afternoon.
I was journaling after churchout in front of Davis Hall and I
said, lord, I've got to pick amajor.
I could do English, I could domusic, I could do biology.

(03:43):
What should I do?
Please guide me.
Holy Spirit, you're the one whomade me, and I was meditating
on Ephesians 2.10, that the Lordhas saved us unto good works
that he prepared in advance thatwe should walk in them.
Well, if God prepared me inadvance for some work, that
means there's some skill in me,some natural disposition that I

(04:05):
can lean into and invest in andtrust that, when the time comes
for me to apply that for thespread of the gospel, for the
speaking of God's glory withinmy field of expertise, that he
would open that door.
So I committed myself tobiology because I said you know
what?
I've always been a curiousGeorge.
I love water.

(04:25):
I want to become a waterscientist.
Just a couple of months later, Imet Mark McLaughlin with SIM in
Ethiopia.
He was an agroforester workingthere and he invited me to come
over for a few months.
So we did some ethnobotanicalresearch and interviewing local
farmers out in the ruralvillages of the highlands of
Ethiopia, and that opened doorsfor the gospel with these men.

(04:51):
I thought, oh, this is great.
I am loving this.
Here's a platform for me as ascientist to share the love of
Christ.
I decided to invest in mymaster's in aquatic biology.
I graduated in 2006 from TexasState University and from there
took a job as a water scientistin Texas for 10 years with the
Texas Institute for AppliedEnvironmental Research, because
I knew that if I was going to goover as a scientist to some

(05:13):
place in some far-flung part ofthe world, I had to give real
information.
That was truly helpful.
Why would people listen toanything I have to say about
spiritual water if the physicalwater I have to say about
spiritual water, if the physicalwater I'm telling them about is
all broken and I'm not offeringany real solutions?
That was a great trainingground for me.

(05:33):
2017, I decided to launchSweetwater Research as kind of
the full fruiting of all of that.
Training and investment of time,money, just leaning into the
wisdom of mercy ministry,speaking with elders, deacons,
pastors, reading books whenhelping hurts was a huge
influence.

(05:53):
What Sweetwater is is theformation of 30 years of
gathered wisdom and educationand investment.
To draw from the parable of thetalents, I'm not the guy with
the 10 talents, I'm the guy withthe two talents.
There's not much I'm good at,but I can do water science and I
love Jesus and I'm going toinvest there.

(06:15):
Over the last eight years, then,the Lord has been blessing us
little by little with growth.
We've grown so much more thanwhere we started with growth.
We've grown so much more thanwhere we started, but we're
still a small nonprofit 501c3.

(06:35):
But whether I was a scientistin academia, bringing the gospel
to the atheistic materialistsin the dark world of scientific
academia, or whether I wasministering to the wit of the
orphan and the poor in Ethiopia,I knew that I could always use
water and my understanding ofthe natural world as a platform
for the gospel.
Everybody speaks the languageof nature.
That book is open to everyone,so I see my role as a translator

(06:55):
to translate that language ofcreation into the language of
special revelation in thescriptures.
I can use that as a bridge andso I want to bring them into
that language that God speaks tothe Holy Spirit in his word.

Speaker 2 (07:10):
Kind of like Jesus with the woman at the well.

Speaker 3 (07:13):
Yeah Well, and with so many agricultural parables,
yeah, yeah, absolutely so.

Speaker 2 (07:18):
David, can you explain a little bit more about
how Sweetwater Research worksand your interaction with
Ethiopia?

Speaker 3 (07:28):
Yeah, we work with a process called CARE Communicate,
ascertain, research and Educate.
We start with communication.
We don't invite ourselves intoanywhere.
People invite us in.
We're a service for hire, aChristian service for hire, and
so people communicate with usthat they have an interest in

(07:51):
bringing a water scientist intotheir situation because they
recognize that water is at theroot of so many of their
diaconal needs.
Where they're at.
After we spend some timeunderstanding what their felt
needs are, I'll probe a littledeeper to find out perhaps what
some of the real needs arebehind the scenes.
I'll ask questions that promptthem to think about where their
water comes from, what they'redoing with it while they have it

(08:13):
and where it goes when they'redone with it, and how that
impacts their local community.
What are the interactions theyhave with their local church and
what is the community's view ofthe local church?
All of these go into kind of ahopper that I distill down into
some kind of plan for how we'regoing to continue to interact in
a project.
Then we move from communicateto ascertain where we will

(08:37):
actually go overseas to thelocation where we've been
invited, maybe through a localleader, maybe through a church
member, a parachurch ministryand we will ascertain what has
God given them.
We don't begin with the questionwhat do you lack.
We begin with the question whatdo you have?

(08:57):
That's what Jesus asked hisdisciples when he was feeding
the crowds.
He said what do you have?
They brought the fish and thebread.
He said that's enough, becauseyou have me and I'm enough.
We entrust to the Lord, inprayer, everything that he's
given the people, whether it'sthe sweat of their brow, the
trees that they've planted, theclouds in the sky, the sun in

(09:20):
the sky to disinfect water.
You can set out water in aclear bottle and the sun can,
through its UV rays, disinfectthe water very effectively
really, and moringa is awonderful water clarifier if you
have turbid water.
So we bring all this to theLord and we say, lord, we offer
this to you.
Please work through us asscientists, as community members

(09:43):
, to use what you've given forgood purpose in bringing clean
water to this community and,through that effort, open doors
for the gospel.
So then we go from ascertain toresearch, where, if questions
arise that need some scientificresearch to be done, or if we
need to do some maybesociological background

(10:04):
information to understand whatproject would actually be
sustained here?
What are the local mores orgovernment norms that we need to
be aware of as we're developingthe project?
We do that research and we workup a work plan.
We bring that to the people andwe say here's the work plan,

(10:25):
let's develop a memorandum ofunderstanding with you.
Whoever the point man will be,the person of peace, the local
leader, the church elder perhaps?
And then we move to educatewhere, after we've done our
research and we're presentinggood information that's been
vetted because, again, we don'twant to give people trash.
If we give them trash, they'renot going to listen to what we

(10:46):
have to say about Christ and wewant real solutions to their
water.
Besides, we put into theirhands what they need to be able
to carry on the work.
We don't give a man a fish.
We teach him to fish and weapply that to the water sector.

Speaker 2 (11:03):
Wow, that's really great, Well thought through, and
my mind just is going withseeing how that can be very
effective in lots of places.
That's really, really great,thank you, david.
So, greg, introduce yourself alittle bit Arts of Hope, very

(11:24):
different ministry and yet verydiagonal and very meaningful in
many ways.
So maybe introduce yourself.

Speaker 1 (11:26):
Sure, I've been a builder for a long time, mostly
wooden buildings, but open toother materials and such, and
that's kind of like my skill setthat I bring to my ministry.
But my wife and I, 10 years,almost 11 years ago now, adopted
four kids from Ukraine.

(11:47):
Before that, we were childlessfor 21 years as I was serving as
a deacon, also experiencing thepain of childlessness, and so
at age 47, my wife and I werelike we got to stop talking
about when we have our children,because that age has passed.

(12:10):
You know, what are we going todo?
All right, so well, most peopleadopt kids when they want kids.
So we proceeded, we movedforward with that, we hosted our
kids.
We decided to go with Ukrainefor many reasons because Russia
shut down their adoption programthe year before.
We decided to adopt.

(12:30):
So, long story short, weadopted four kids from Ukraine,
from this little village inUkraine, and five years later
the Lord started putting on mein a real heavy way that there
were some kids out there a wholebunch of them, actually that I
met that over the process ofadopting the four that I have, I

(12:55):
met and I began to love thesekids and I knew that they
weren't going to make it becausethey're all kind of on the edge
of functionality.
Most of them were pretty wellchallenged with what they could
do and I just I knew that thesekids weren't going to make it.
I started looking into whattheir lives were going to be

(13:19):
like after they age out and it'sa grim reality for these kids,
like really extremely grim.
And so I became like, the moreI looked into it, the more I
felt that we had to do somethingabout it personally and we
started hosting them.

(13:40):
Once in a while there's ahosting program.
You can host an orphan fromUkraine and different parts of
Eastern Europe, so we would hostthem and they would become my
children.
They're not adopted, butthey're hosted.
That broke my heart, to knowthat they weren't going to have
a family.
So my wife and I startedpraying about what to do, what

(14:03):
to do, what to do, and we justtalked and talked and what to do
, and so finally a longtimefriend of ours said well, you
know, I think we can help youwith that.
We just came into a fairlysizable estate.
We'll give you $100,000.
You can start doing what youneed to do.
$100,000, you can start doingwhat you need to do so.

(14:25):
In 2018, we established anindependent, like a
not-for-profit entity and wenamed it Hearts of Hope Ukraine.
Our pastor's on the board, wehave people from our

(14:49):
congregation that help us run it, and so we moved to Ukraine in
2018, bought a house, bought avan and immediately started
taking in some of the kids wehad hosted before that knew us
and trusted us and they reallywanted to live with us.
So it wasn't long before we hadfour kids living with us
full-time as young adults.
But I'll tell you, nothing muchin my life has ever prepared me
for this work, and when Godsays I will not leave you as

(15:15):
orphans, it wasn't a complimentLike, all right, so he calls us
sheep, okay, which is anotherput down, because sheep are just
crazy, smart and self-centeredand clever.
Sheep are not good animals andorphans are, I would say, the

(15:39):
most dangerous people that youcan get to know in many cases,
especially the ones that grow upin Eastern European orphanages,
because they learn from anearly age how to be criminals,
basically, and so you know, thefour that we took in were the

(16:01):
four that the traffickers didn'twant.
That we took in were the fourthat the traffickers didn't want
, basically, and because one wasan epileptic, you know she was
going to die pretty soon anyways, they all have like really
fairly profound disabilities.
They were given to us and westarted to learn to live
together and you know it wasreally rough at first.

(16:23):
The first three years in anorphan's life in a family is
like everything human depravity.
And when Christ begins a workin you, he gradually brings you

(16:54):
out of that depravity and intohis kingdom by covering you with
his blood, anyway.
So in short, my work isdiscipleship of orphans.
That's what I do is my wife andI work with specifically
orphans and you know, not all ofthem are missing mother and
father.
So I say the poorest amongst us, because they are living in a

(17:18):
wretched situation when they'rein that orphanage or the group
home where they're at.
When they're in that orphanageor the group home where they're
at, and it really takes threeyears for them to decompress,
settle down and begin to processthe gospel, begin to process
information period.
And so it's a commitment thatmy wife and I have made, a

(17:41):
lifetime commitment.
We're getting older I'm 58.
My wife and I have made alifetime commitment.
We're getting older, I'm 58.
My wife's 59.
Yeah, so our prayer, our aim isto not just provide a family for
them, which they desperatelyneed to do, but to bring them to
Christ, to bring them into arelationship with the living God

(18:03):
through Jesus Christ, to arelationship with the living God
through Jesus Christ.
And doing so brings a lot ofglory to God because you know,
people hear what we do and youknow it's like just a natural
open to the gospel.
So in fact I've kind of come tothe realization maybe Jesus
says the poor you'll always havewith you that he kind of

(18:25):
maintains their lot.
Some people don't want a lot ofmoney, you know, and they don't
go after it and sometimes theymake sort of bad decisions.
So they need a little bit ofhelp.
Or they have trauma and theycan't make money.
Or they have a littledisability and they'll never
make any money and they'llalways need help.
Disability, and they'll nevermake any money and they'll

(18:49):
always need help.
And I think that our mandate isperfect religion and undefiled
before God is to visit theorphan and the widow in their
affliction and to remainunspotted from the philosophy of
this world.
And that is every Christian'swork, one way or the other, with
whatever gift they have,whether it be teaching,
supporting, going, encouraging,visiting, whatever well for

(19:13):
those are specially gifted to dothe orphan?
No, it's everybody.
Perfect religion is practicedby all Christians.

Speaker 2 (19:32):
You're challenging us to respond to what we're called
to do.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
Yeah, look who's the audience In James 1.27,.
Who is the audience?
It doesn't say who it is, it'sobviously everybody audience.
It doesn't say who it is, it'sobviously all everybody.
You know, every christianperson out there, everybody that
christ shed his blood for greg.

Speaker 3 (19:50):
I think something that you're getting at is that
the scriptures haven't saiddavid pendergrass, I declare,
will lead sweetwater research orgreg will lead hearts of hope.
What he has declared is thatthis is true religion will lead
hearts of hope.
What he has declared is thatthis is true religion I take
care of the widow, the orphan,in their distress, and he's
given us basic wisdom how todiscern what are the gifts and

(20:12):
talents that he's given us, andthen we use them.
It's easy to over complicatethe matter, and others listening
to us should not be intimidatedby he's amazing giants of the
faith.
They're, they're doing waterscience and they're over helping
the widows and the orphans inRomania and Ukraine and praise
God for how he's manifested hiswill through us in ministry.

(20:32):
But this is for everyone toconsider, isn't it?

Speaker 1 (20:36):
Yeah, in some way or another, like later in James it
says you know I've given yougifts, now don't go spending it
on yourself and your own lust.
Build my kingdom.
Do what it takes to get thisthing James 127, done.
Some people are great atserving a glass of water like

(20:58):
one little glass of water, andthat one glass can change a
person's life forever.
The Spirit can do all kinds ofwonderful and weird things, and
that one glass can change aperson's life forever.

Speaker 2 (21:08):
Spirit can do all kinds of wonderful and weird
things.
It's a part of it seeing theopportunities that the Lord
places before us.
Yeah, which is your story, greg, and your story, david.
I mean, the Lord led you to thework that you're in.
You know, in a sense you didn'tgo looking for that specific

(21:30):
thing, but you did look to theLord for how he would lead you
in the area of service thatyou're in now.
Greg, if I could just add alittle bit to your story, as I
had the opportunity to visit you, what I learned is that your
ministry is not just to orphansand orphans.
The plight of the orphans inUkraine is pretty, as you said,
pretty bleak.
I mean, these predominantlywill turn into street children.

(21:54):
They're in the orphanage for aperiod of time.
Many of them will be traffickedand then many of them end up on
the streets.
And the ones you have actuallytaken particular interest in is
actually many of them specialneeds orphans.
So you say the plight gets evendeeper when it's a special
needs orphan.
And now these special needsorphans are actually refugees

(22:16):
since the war, are now refugeesin Romania.
They're Ukraine special needsorphans, ukrainian, who are now
refugees in Romania.

Speaker 1 (22:26):
Three of our girls were displaced twice.
First time in 2014,.
Dasha came to our town toanother orphanage.
They moved the orphanage overto Gilead, and Anastasia and
Nastia.
Both were moved from the warzone in 2014.

Speaker 2 (22:47):
Yeah, eastern Ukraine just internally displaced from
eastern Ukraine more to the west.

Speaker 1 (22:53):
Yeah, you know this is the second time they've been
displaced.
And you know Dasha, who is nowmy son's wife, said to me that
to be an orphan in your hometownis fairly difficult.
It's a difficult life, but tobe an orphan in a town where

(23:14):
nobody knows you, nobody caresabout you, nobody knows your
family, nobody knows anythingabout you, is the most lonely
thing.

Speaker 2 (23:23):
Lonely and incredibly vulnerable, vulnerable to be
taken advantage of becausethere's no protection measure.

Speaker 1 (23:29):
Yeah, Nobody's looking after you.

Speaker 2 (23:32):
And then if the other thing I was thinking I could
just clarify a little bit moreyou visiting, but my sense is
teachers to control the youngerones.

Speaker 1 (24:07):
So they have free reign to do whatever they want
to the youngers.
So it's kind of like auniversity for criminals there,
because they teach everything,all the tricks, all the lies.
Yeah, they learn to be fairlydangerous, tricky people.
They're treacherous anddepraved and you know like at

(24:31):
first, when you meet them,they're charming and they're
cute and they are like littlescammers.
But that's all of us, that'severybody.
God says I will not leave youas orphans.
Okay, I'm not going to leaveyou in your depravity.

Speaker 2 (24:48):
So, guys, people will hear these stories and be
amazed.
But it'd be easy to feel likeyou are the super deacons and
the listeners will pray for you,but 99% will feel out of their
league and not see any directconnection of this material to
their lives.
Possibly we want people to seethat this is your calling, but

(25:11):
everyone can think a bit outsidethe box.
That's what we're calling thisepisode thinking outside the box
about how to serve with adeacon's heart.
So maybe you guys could talk alittle bit about how your
diaconal calling in the heart,or the hurting and needy that
God has worked in you, that ledto these opportunities.

Speaker 3 (25:34):
I might address the word amazed in your question.
I understand the human instinctto be amazed at somebody going
overseas and being a waterscientist.
That sounds only for theimportant, intelligent people
out there.
I can tell you that that is notme.
I'm not an amazing person, I'mjust a dude.

(25:55):
I'm just a guy who happens tolike water and is analytical,
and I love Jesus and I liketalking about him.
How often did God speak to theprophets?
Was it daily, or was it every40 years or something?
I mean, there was so muchmundanity.
There was so much day-to-daytask work that was dull, boring.

(26:17):
Everyone needs to remember that.
Our Father knows what we do insecret and what we pray in
secret and when we in secretgive money to someone in need,
when in secret, quietly, we'rediscipling our children at home
or the orphan on the street or ayoung man who's hooked on drugs
in our neighborhood and hewants to do a bit of Bible study

(26:40):
in our office.
Maybe the world isn't seeingthat, but our Heavenly father is
seeing it and he loves it.
Take joy in God, taking joy inyou doing what he's called you
to do and built you for, andgiving you the time and the
opportunity to do.
If you're a teacher in aclassroom and you're speaking of

(27:03):
Christ and his glory withinyour discipline that you're
teaching.
If you're a mother at homenursing a baby, singing hymns
for that child to hear sothey'll be able to sing them
back to you in your old age,whether you're carrying trash
for the local city and speakingof Christ to your co coworkers,

(27:27):
whatever you're doing, take joyin the Lord, giving glory to him
in that work.
You don't have to be somethingyou're not.
If everybody was a hand, wherewould the foot be?

Speaker 1 (27:37):
I'd say, you know, try to figure out what your
gifts are and see how it fits inwith loving people.
Like, say, if you meet ahomeless dude on the street,
there's like 10,000 reasons whyhe's there, but just like, stop.
I like to look them in the eyes, I like to ask them how they're

(28:00):
doing, I like to touch theirhand, you know, and if they ask
for something, I always try togive it.
You know, it's between him andgod what he does with it.
But I want to be that bridgethat I'm asked to be for christ,
like christ works through me,and to make connections with,

(28:20):
with people.
So it doesn't have to be likethis huge life commitment, you
know, and it can be as simple asgiving somebody a glass of
water, like I said before.
And Jesus said to be faithfulin the small things and I'll
give you bigger and betterthings to do.

(28:41):
So I would say, focus in onthose really small things that
we're asked to do and that Jesusdid daily in his ministry, like
you know.
Think of the Lord of theuniverse coming and washing a
guy's feet.
How many of us would do that?

Speaker 3 (29:01):
Our local elders and deacons are also there.
Lord has provided those for us.
We can lean into them tounderstand us well.
God has specially gifted thesemen for those tasks the elders
as rulers and deacons as peoplewith some insight into mercy
ministry and how it can best beconducted, and possibly some

(29:24):
wisdom into how God has in factgifted you.
Maybe just have theconversation with your elders
and deacons, and your fellowlaity for that matter.
You know me well.
Can you please talk throughwith me where you think my
strengths lie, where myweaknesses lie as well, because
that might also help form avision for where you should be
applying your gifts and skillsin some practical outworking in

(29:47):
mercy ministry.

Speaker 1 (29:48):
Yeah, like most of us have a passion, like something
that we were almost idolatrousabout.
Like we think about it, oh,wouldn't it be fun to do this.
Well, that can be for thekingdom.
It's usually an indicator ofwhere your gifts lie, is what
you think about doing all thetime.
And you know, like for me itwas building and designing and

(30:09):
for many years I didn'tunderstand that I could use
building and designing God'skingdom together in my mind that
, yeah, I should be using thisas in the work for the Lord.
It was kind of like for manyyears it was my business and I
was trying to build my businessand then I would devote a little

(30:33):
bit of time on the side for theLord and my diaconal work and
such like that.
But for me the focus wasmisplaced.
My business was I thought of itas my business, not the Lord's
business.
And if we can like switch itaround, there's actually a
really nice book calledPracticing the King's Economy.

(30:55):
It's by a couple of Covenantgrads how businesses can do
their business with a focus onbuilding the kingdom, and they
used Letourneau as an example.
He was pretty successful and hedevoted 90% of his income to

(31:18):
building things for the Lord,and he used 10% on his own.

Speaker 2 (31:24):
He flipped the tithe on his head.

Speaker 1 (31:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (31:27):
He lived he lived on 10% and gave away 90%.

Speaker 1 (31:29):
Yeah, yeah, yep, and I, I think you know in America
we we kind of really are focusedin on, we think that our
business is our own business,and then we a little bit of
what's left over to the work ofthe church and the work of
mercies.

Speaker 2 (31:47):
But I do think that we could really prioritize in a
more biblical way as businessowners that even with ministries
, which you're both in, theministries and you as ministry
workers, are able to do thatthrough the sacrificial giving
of others.

(32:09):
And so, whoever it was, greg,who gave that initial $100,000
gift, you know, sometimes thatis the hand and foot, you know,
one enabling the other, andthat's, I think, that's, the
beauty of the church, is thatit's not this isn't my own
personal ministry, but we workas a body.
And yet, at the same time, Ithink we all should be attuned

(32:30):
to the opportunities that theLord brings us day in and day
out Gospel opportunities, mercy,opportunities in our
interactions, even if it'ssomebody sitting in front of a
grocery store asking for ahandout, interactions, even if
it's somebody sitting in frontof a grocery store asking for a
handout, taking that opportunityto speak the love of Christ to
them and show that in a tangibleway.
David, can you give a storyfrom your work that, in a sense,

(32:58):
would be a confirmation of thecalling that the Lord has called
you to at this time?

Speaker 3 (33:02):
David, yes, if I'm doing my work right, people will
be drinking cleaner physicalwater and will be hearing of the
living water that Jesus Christbrings, the gospel.
I was invited to Cambodia by aministry that was working in the
Siem Reap area in 2018.
And we took a trip over therein 2019.

(33:24):
They this ministry wasdelivering water filters ceramic
water filters to villages, andthese were supposed to take care
of a family's water needs forseveral years, but they were
only lasting several monthsbecause there was so much fine
clay floating in the water thatthey were drawing from from

(33:45):
these old pits that it wasclogging up the little
micropores in these ceramicfilters, and I was tasked with
finding some natural solution,working with what people had
locally to bring about somesolution there.
So we prayed.
The Lord said what do they have?

(34:05):
We did a bit of researchstateside while we could, and
then we were brought over toCambodia with this organization
to see if it would work, and wequickly found out that it
wouldn't.
I also quickly found out that,although we were going to be in
country for about a week, Ireally only had about three full
afternoons at the location toin fact execute any of this

(34:28):
research, so I was scrambling.
First day was when wediscovered that our original
filtration idea was not going towork.
It had to do with using somerice holes and some sand and
things to kind of physicallyfilter some of these clay
particles out.
Second day was going back to thedrawing board and saying, okay,
lord, what do they have?
And so we walked around thearea and just observing what has

(34:51):
God made in terms of trees,grass, dirt, sun, the people,
what kind of strengths do theyhave?
And we said, lord, open oureyes, what do they have?
And I realized they havemoringa.
Moringa is a tree that growslike a weed in the tropics.

(35:17):
It's very nutritious.
It's also kind of a fatty foodF-A-D-D-Y here in the United
States, often as a nutritionalsupplementulant and flocculant,
which means that it'll takesmall particles in the water,
kind of bring them togetheralmost like a snowball or little
magnet shards to a piece ofenergized metal and it'll make
that ball of clay reach sort ofa critical mass to where it
weighs enough that it will nowsink more rapidly through the

(35:39):
water and settle out at thebottom.
I knew this and this is part ofthe street water story because I
had gone to the EducationalConcerns for Hunger organization
in Fort Myers, florida, tolearn about tropical
agricultural emissions, and Iremember that there was some
research there on moringa thatit could do this kind of trick
with the water.
So I got online, I looked up abunch of scientific papers and

(36:02):
saw how they did theirexperiments, and then we created
a sort of experiment justworking with what we had, with a
bit of Moringa seed that wecrushed up, and we needed some
water, some clean water, inorder to test how making a
Moringa solution would work onthe dirty water.
There was one particular kindof person I wanted to meet in
this village that we were at.

(36:22):
I said I want to meet a widow,because sweet water we minister
to the widow, the orphan and thepoor.
Specifically, we aim at that.
So does anybody here know awidow I could speak with who
happens to have some water?
We could bring her into thework.
And they said, yeah, there'sthis woman named One W-U-N who
lives down the road about 100yards.

(36:42):
Let's go see if we can use her.
Well, she's happy to oblige,letting us take a bit of water
from her.
Well, that we could use in ourexperiments.
And then we noticed that therewas a termite mound under her
house and that that could causesome problems for her home.
And so we asked her why are youleaving this termite mound up?

(37:03):
It was about three feet highand very conspicuous.
And she said well, the demonsthat killed my husband live in
that termite mound and if I takeout their home, they're going
to kill me, and then my orphanedgrandson, who I'm taking care
of, will not have anybody tocare for him.
Through the interpreter, wesaid well, you know, you can be

(37:26):
set free from the tyranny of thedevil.
Do you want to hear about JesusChrist?
Her voice shifted and she beganto channel the demon and speak
in a different language that shedidn't know, and she began to
tell us about how I'm thegeneral of this and that
dominion.
And you have no authority here.
You need to leave.
Rather than simply talking tothe demon or trying to challenge

(37:47):
the demon or do an exorcism, Isaid, through the interpreter,
I'm going to tell you aboutJesus Christ.
And so we gave her the gospelGenesis through Revelation,
focusing specifically on thepower he has as king of kings to
take out any enemy.
She calmed down.
She did not believe in Christin that moment, but she did come

(38:07):
back the next day in her rightmind and she said I want to be a
part of this project.
How can I help?
I found out after we came backfrom Cambodia that a few months
later an evangelist a Cambodianevangelist went to that town
again, gave her the gospel andshe did believe.
This is a town where there werealmost no believers to begin.
Now, the crazy cat lady youknow the local demoniac is now

(38:32):
one of the first believers inher village and is being
discipled by that ministry thatwe came to help.
Moreover, we finally did get oursolution when we, even though
our first method didn't work itwas trial and error.
That's science.
Something doesn't work.
You go back to the drawingboard, you try a new thing, you
keep your notes.
Through the scientific method,we were able to come up with a

(38:53):
way to sort of maximize howMoringa was used to flocculate
the nasty water, so that youcould drink the water off the
top of the bottle and let thesludge at the bottom be
discarded.
We then came back with thatinformation to the United States
and I got an intern namedKaylee Holmark from Covenant

(39:16):
College, who had just graduatedin environmental science, and
her project for a year with uswas to maximize the Moringa
method.
How do we use as little Moringaseed as possible with as little
labor as possible to create themost clean water as possible in
the shortest amount of timepossible?
That's now been developed intoa manuscript that we'll be

(39:39):
publishing Lord willing soon, ina scientific publication that
will go out to the world.
Now we have a light, not onlyin Cambodia but also to
scientific academia and to thelarger philanthropic world, so
that more and more people cantake what we've learned and
apply it for the benefit of thewidow, the orphan and the poor.
Now we're bringing clean waterphysically and we're bringing
the spiritual water of Christ,and when we go speak at

(40:01):
scientific conventions about theresearch that we did, we always
speak of Christ to all of thesepeople who are in that room.
So the Lord is opening doorsfor the gospel through the
platform of water science.

Speaker 2 (40:12):
Nice, nice, very good , greg, can you share a specific
story through which we couldsee that your confirmation is
where the Lord would have you be?

Speaker 1 (40:24):
Yeah, I think I mentioned kind of how
treacherous and beat up our kidsare when they first come to us.
I won't go on about that.
And over a six-year period wecould see that there was some
fruit being born.
There was some fruit being bornthat these seeds that God has
worked in us to plant arestarting to like soften the soil

(40:47):
of their hearts, change theirrocky hearts to real hearts, you
know, functioning hearts.
And so now they all professChrist and they're just
different people today.
They have a relationship withChrist.
They're calm, kind to eachother, they do their daily work

(41:07):
faithfully.
They begin their day in theirown private devotions and then
they gather corporately beforebreakfast and they pray together
for each other.
And that's just to me more thanI can really talk about.

Speaker 2 (41:26):
Wonderful testimony.

Speaker 1 (41:27):
And then the other sort of aspect is you know, we
meet people and we do a lot oftraveling because our church is
an hour and a half, almost twohours away, so we take the train
there when the traffic on theroad is bad.
So we meet people on the trainand one night on the way back
there were these Russian womenon the train.

(41:50):
These are people from Russiawho are there at war with our
country, and they heard our kidsspeaking Russian and so they
kind of asked us where we'refrom and who we were and such.
But when they found out aboutwhat we do for these kids, these
orphan kids because people inEastern Europe run from orphans

(42:10):
because they have such a badreputation they run from them
and they say to each other whywould you ever spend any time
with this garbage?
And they've said that to me,not these ladies.
I'm with this garbage, andthey've said that to me, not
these ladies.
So when they found out what wedid and why we do it because
we're grateful to Christ forwhat he did for us and that

(42:31):
we're pure garbage ourselves andChrist gave his life for us
while we were yet his enemies,these ladies they're orthodox,
and when they think they've meta saint.
They want to touch you and theywant to bow down before you,
and I kind of felt like Paul inthat moment, when he was

(42:52):
basically worshipped and I, ofcourse, I said no, no, we're not
saints.
We're no different than anybody, other than the fact that
Christ died for our sins andwe're grateful.
That's it.
It's simple as that, and wehave the Spirit of the living
God working in us to do thiswork.
So, no, we're not anybody thatyou should bow down to or touch

(43:18):
or anything, and it's availableto you too.
They were just like crying, andit was a to you too.
They were just like crying andit was a very sweet moment, so
that's kind of like encouragingfor us when that happens.

Speaker 2 (43:31):
Yeah, Brothers, as you think about deacons who are
listening to this and others, doyou have practical ways that
deacons can become aware orprepared and open to these kinds
of ideas that fill our heartswith the deep sense of the
gospel and God's work?

Speaker 3 (43:52):
This may sound just a little too 30,000-foot view,
but don't neglect your morningdevotions.
But don't neglect your morningdevotions, don't neglect prayer.
It's as we're looking intoChrist's face that we become
more like him.
We become what we gaze into.
Christ is so full of love andcompassion and as we gaze into

(44:18):
his holiness as well, werecognize our own depravity, our
own sinfulness, and that wewere the orphans that he came to
.
Greg is giving such a beautifultestimony of how we, as deacons
, need to recognize humbly thestate we were in when Christ
saved us and that we are calledas fellow sinners to those who

(44:40):
are downtrodden under thetyranny of the devil, suffering
under the weight of the pains ofthis life.
Gaze into Christ and also.
He's given us his word for areason.
Use it for practical things.
If he told us to care for thewidow and the orphan, he's not
going to simply give us thatcommand and give us no other

(45:01):
instruction.
Psalm 119,.
Open my eyes that I may seewonderful things in your word.
Pray specifically, lord.
What are my particular giftsand how can I use them to care
for the widow, the orphan andthe poor effectively, fruitfully
, with perception of how you,holy Spirit, are working in my

(45:23):
local community in the contextof this little ministry moment.
Why wouldn't he answer thatprayer?
Why wouldn't he give you thewisdom and the insight
understand the providentialcircumstances that are going on?

Speaker 1 (45:35):
I couldn't have said it better myself.
That's exactly the answer thatI had.
So that's exactly the answerthat I had.
So you know, like I was goingto say, zoom in on James 127,
because it really is written toall of us.
Zoom in on that and ask God toarrange a circumstance to obey

(45:57):
that.
That is how he's glorified whenpeople you know, like in Isaiah
I think it's 58, what's theacceptable fast?
You know what is the acceptablefast that we're called to do?
It's to care for the widow andthe poor and the orphan.

(46:19):
And when you do that, then yourrighteousness will shine like
the noonday sun and others willsee that and glorify God and
turn to him.
That's his calling card when hesees people putting their skin
in it and really devoting theirlife to it, it just blows them

(46:41):
away, some of them, and it'slike living proof that there is
a God, because there's no humanway to live with an orphan.
There's no way to do it otherthan through the power of the
living spirit, the living God,working in you and giving you

(47:02):
wisdom and strength to go ondoing that day after day.
And to me, I think for somepeople it's like yeah, yeah, I
see it now.
See, there's a God as a saviorand it just grabs their
attention and that's kind of hismechanism, god's mechanism.

Speaker 3 (47:24):
Greg and I both have had to do our homework at times
in order to be more effective atequipping others to glorify God
and enjoy him forever, byunburdening them of the sort of
material needs, thecircumstances that are weighing
them down, that are depressingtheir full expression of the
fruitfulness that they wouldhave otherwise in Christ.

(47:45):
For me, I had to go get mymaster's degree, at minimum,
because I just simply couldn'toperate in the world I wanted to
operate.
That piece of paper that says Iwent through the gauntlet of
academia is my passport intoother places where I can carry
the gospel.
Is my passport into otherplaces where I can carry the
gospel.
I'm sure Greg has had to gothrough the ringer with local

(48:06):
governments and understand thebureaucratic aspects of running
an orphanage.
There's a lot of paperworkthat's associated with being a
501c3 or whatever the nonprofitequivalent is in his country.
So if you are a deacon lookingfor some practical thing here,
as you're pressing into whatyou're good at, also ask the

(48:26):
Lord is there some way I canimprove on this gift?
How do I invest in that talent?
Going back to the parable ofthe talents, do I need to go get
a degree to be able to pressdeeper into this field.
Do I need to become moreeducated in some local
bureaucratic paperwork so that Ican kind of learn how to work
the system to greater advantageon behalf of the people that I'm

(48:48):
serving and then take action onit?
Don't procrastinate.
Why wait If the Lord has saidlove, mercy, do justice, walk
humbly with your God.
Don't overcomplicate it, juststart doing it.
Look for little openings theLord has given you in the
resources that he's put in frontof you.
You don't have to work withwhat you don't have.
Work with what you do have.

Speaker 1 (49:06):
God has not put us in charge of getting results from
people in their lives.
Getting the result is God'swork, and so don't get
discouraged if people don'tcooperate with you.
Just keep doing the work andGod will take care of glorifying
himself through youFaithfulness.

Speaker 3 (49:27):
Are you guys familiar with Lillian Trasher?

Speaker 2 (49:29):
I don't think so.

Speaker 3 (49:31):
She had the nickname Mother of the Nile and in the
early 1900s she opened anorphanage in Egypt.
At the end of her life, havinghelped many, many thousands of
orphans, an interviewer askedher what's the secret behind
your success?
I think it was even Timemagazine, in fact, who was
interviewing her, and she saidsecret to my success.

(49:54):
There's no secret.
The Lord told me to dosomething and I just didn't stop
doing it.
I love that emphasis, greg, onthe tenacity of it.
Yeah, if all the circumstancesthat the Lord's presented to you
are to keep on in this thing,then keep doing it.
It can be very hard.
I'm not saying it's easy.
It certainly isn't.

(50:15):
There are certainly days I'vewanted to quit.
But miracle, you know theordinary means of grace, one of
which is the fellowship of thesaints.
Right that other believers arecoming around.
Whether it's financial help,whether it's prayer, whether

(50:37):
it's a word of encouragement, agood sermon.
It comes in many forms, but theLord takes care of his own and
when he provides thatencouragement, take it up.
Don't push it away and say well, I'm just, I'm too depressed,
too sad, I'm just, I can't evenabsorb it right now.
No, drink up that water fromheaven, put your roots deep into
that stream.
It makes glad the people of thecity of God.

Speaker 1 (50:59):
I'd say visit.
You know, come and see thepeople in the field.
Come and see us, because youcan listen to a podcast and then
forget about it 15 minuteslater.
Come and see what we do, meetour kids, see where we live,
talk to us.
If you can't come, then youtalk to us on the phone.
We're a little isolatedSometimes we feel like we could

(51:22):
use a good conversation becausewe don't speak Romanian very
much.
It's nice to also be encouragedby people.
They come and they pray for us.
We've had some visitors thisyear and we've been really
blessed, including you, david.
We're very encouraged by yourvisit and if there's anybody out

(51:43):
there that's interested in mywork, in our work in God's work,
come and experience it foryourself.
Just visit, be the tourist.
I'd love to show you around,introduce you to my family, and
you never know what sort oflittle thing might come of that.

Speaker 2 (52:01):
Greg, that's a great segue because one of my hats is
short-term missions coordinator,as you know, and I know, david,
that you took some trips thatwere.
If I remember reading yourhistory, there were some early
on trips that were meaningful toyou and I guess that's where
Greg has certainly plugged it.
Do you have anything to add tothat with regards to just the
impact of a missions trip typeof opportunity to explore and

(52:25):
how the Lord maybe even usedthat in your life to cement what
he was doing?

Speaker 3 (52:30):
I would give a very hearty amen to that.
I'm still in communication withMark McLaughlin.
He's been a mentor for me these25 years, since we were working
together in Ethiopia in 99.
Through conversations with himand doing some work between then
and now in Ethiopia and doingsome work between then and now
in Ethiopia, he's been acritical factor in the
development of Sweetwater and inmy own missiology.

(52:53):
And he and his wife are kind oflifers in the foreign mission
field.
You know they spent manydecades in Ethiopia and are
still involved there.
Yes, and I can tell you and Ithink I'm speaking for Greg too,
just based on the little I'vegotten to know him in this
discussion that it really is ajoy and a privilege to mentor

(53:13):
and to pass on what we havelearned in our experience, not
because we're the greatestexperts in the world in what we
do, but praise God that in ourposition, we have something to
offer and we'd love to pour thatinto the next generation.
As a water scientist workingthrough sweet water, one of our
goals is to raise up that nextgeneration of water scientists

(53:34):
who love christ, and so there'sa young lady named keba bush
mulat in ethiopia right now,who's from the highlands, the
very area where I work, and, uh,she recently received her
master's in aquatic biology andshe loves christ, and so we are
working with her, mentoring herin her continuing progression as
a professional to become awatered leader in her own

(53:55):
hometown.
I mentioned the Cambodia projectwhere we brought research back
with us on Moringa, and therewas an intern named Kaylee
Hallmark.
Well, she now has received hermaster's in environmental
science from Penn State and isgoing into mission work as a
scientist overseas, and she is anow board member with
Sweetwater.
She's completing a two-yearterm with us as a board member,

(54:16):
and so we've been pouring intothese people who have been
working with us hands-on,actually doing the work with us
in the countries where we'reworking.
It brings great encouragement.
Honestly, it keeps us motivatedfor the work when people want
to get their hands dirty or, inmy case, wet with the work.

Speaker 2 (54:34):
David, do you ever have people travel with you when
you do these site visits andinvestigations, or is that?

Speaker 3 (54:42):
complicated, depends on where I'm going, but yes, in
2019, when I went to Cambodia, Itook my then 11-year-old son
with me and that was veryimpactful for him, really
developed his sense of mercy,ministry, of the Lord's
compassion for others who arenot like him.
This summer, in July, I went tonorthern Uganda with a man

(55:03):
named Rob Dandridge, who's beenjust a terrific volunteer for
Sweetwater, a very dear brotherin Christ, and it really, I
think, solidified his commitmentto Sweetwater and gives him a
stronger voice on behalf of ourwork.
He's able to speak moreconfidently about what we're
doing with others and help togrow the ministry and expand our

(55:28):
ability to help others, Becausethe larger we get, the more
influence we can have.

Speaker 2 (55:34):
Do either of you think that being a deacon in a
connected church very much?
We talk about the network ofdeacons and connecting deacons
local, regional, national, kindof in our Presbyterian form of
government.

Speaker 1 (55:52):
Has that helped in your work at all?
Yeah, before we left, a coupleyears before we left, after we
had adopted our kids, I saw acouple people in my church sort
of take notice and start to beinterested in fostering, and so
we set up a fund for adoptionand anybody that wanted to give
to that line item in our budgetcould do that.

(56:14):
And I just think that if we cansort of raise awareness of you
know, we can really comealongside people.
That I mean adoption each oneof our kids cost us $40,000 and
we didn't have any of it.
It all got fundraised and soour church helped us.

(56:35):
Lots of different people chippedin, and so adoption is very
expensive.
So if a church has an adoptionfund already set up, accessible
to people that are interested inadopting, and then the other
thing you can do is people thathave adopted and that are
fostering are going throughthings that nobody will ever

(56:56):
understand unless you've done it, and so if you can just lend an
ear to them, pray for them,don't judge them, don't judge
their kids, and just really tryto be there for them and love on
them and support them, don'tjudge them, don't judge their
kids, and just really try to bethere for them and love on them
and support them in whatever wayyou can.
That'll maybe start the ballrolling and the James 127 thing.

Speaker 2 (57:23):
That's good, and Greg also.
It's my understanding that alot of churches in the
Presbyterian New York andEngland actually have come along
as supporters of Arts of Hope,right?
Yes?

Speaker 1 (57:34):
Yes, indeed, I don't know if I can mention.
I mean, you've given us, over atwo-year period, $30,000 over
one year and $30,000 justrecently.

Speaker 2 (57:45):
Yeah, our involvement has been mainly because of the
refugee situation, and so thathas enabled us to come alongside
what you guys are doing,insofar as it's a ministry to
Ukrainian refugees.
I mean, that's been the contextof it.

Speaker 1 (58:04):
And our local church, Second Parish.
We're on their budget.
We're on the budgets of two orthree other Presbyterian LPC
churches in Maine andindividuals also give to us.
But, yeah, the church has beenvery supportive increasingly, so
that's good, yeah.
So we're very thankful for thatand praise God for the work

(58:28):
that he's done in the hearts ofpeople that are making those
decisions.

Speaker 3 (58:33):
I think for me the connection to the OPC in the
last four years has beentransformative for me,
understanding both my rolepersonally as a deacon, what
that means to be an officer,what it means to be specifically
a deacon in the church of God.
It's also been transformativefor me to understand the best

(58:55):
way to express that ministryprofessionally, in the form of
Sweetwater.
What is our goal?
Is it simply to operate all thetime as a parachurch ministry,
just kind of casually workingwith Christians regardless of
what church they're in?
Or is it to solidify, toundergird, the relationship that
a local church has with itscommunity?

(59:15):
For example, in Jeremiah 29, 7,as the exiles are about to go
into Babylon, god says when youget to this place, work for
their good, for in their welfarewill be your welfare.
Place, work for their good forin their welfare will be your
welfare.
We're all in this nest together.
Everybody drinks water.
Some of those who drink waterare going to heaven, some who
drink water are going to hell,but we all drink water, as

(59:39):
Christians and non-Christiansare in that same ditch together,
digging for that well water.
Conversations about Christ willnaturally occur If we can work
through the local body of Christ, wherever that's at to be, the
place where people go to findout something about clean water.
Then also there's opportunityto become connected to the body

(01:00:02):
of Christ, because it is throughthe church that salvation is
normally accomplished by Christ.
It's through that preaching ofthe word, it's through that
shepherding from the elders,through the service of the
deacons, through the fellowshipwith the laity, through the
sacraments, through prayer.
This is all provided throughthe church principally.

(01:00:23):
So Sweetwater, though aparachurch ministry that is not
connected to a particulardenomination, does have a
statement of faith and those ofthe Reformed faith will pick up
on the Reformed cues, you mightsay in the statement of faith
that I've presented on ourwebsite.

(01:00:50):
We intend to be a broader rangeof mercy challenges, because in
some places where cholera,dysentery, typhoid are a major
problem, that's a suffocatingburden.
It covers everything, itovershadows so many things.
We send medical missionariesoverseas all the time, but
they're mostly treating at thesymptom side.

(01:01:10):
Sweetwater's able to deal withthe cause side.
We want to deal with the causesof the water pollution that are
leading to all of these healthdifficulties where so much of
our money and time is beinggiven.
Imagine how much time if you'rea deacon in a church that's
burdened by water stress.
How much time would you havefor ministering in other

(01:01:32):
capacities if you didn't have tominister to 50% of your
congregation that was at homesick with dysentery?
Parched throats don't praiseGod, nor do parched souls, and
hungry stomachs have no ears.
We've got to free people up tobe able to attend the Lord's Day
worship.
We've got to free people upfrom be able to attend the
Lord's Day worship.
We've got to free people upfrom all these medical problems

(01:01:57):
where so much of our time andresources as the body of Christ
are being put.
So there's definitely anecclesiastical focus,
ecclesiastical effort.
Let's say.
Even though Sweetwater is not achurch, nor is it affiliated
with a particular denomination,I, as a deacon, certainly have
my ecclesiastical motives.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
Let's say that's good , thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:02:17):
One thing that my local church did for me was to
preach a good, solid theology tome for 21 years.
A good, solid theology to mefor 21 years, and that gave me
the foundation to go out and dowhatever it was I needed to do
and the motivation to do it.

(01:02:37):
Amen, amen and amen.
And I would say, you know, tothe churches keep preaching the
full word of God and don't skimpon the sovereignty of God in
all things, because he can doamazing things through worms
like me and things like that,and he equips his saints with

(01:03:00):
the word to go out and do thework he needs to have done or he
chooses to have done through us.
So keep preaching the word, youpastors of you churches.

Speaker 3 (01:03:11):
Something I want to tap back into.
Greg, you were talking abouthow long it takes to work with
these orphans.
This is not a one-touch thing.
You don't just interact onetime with orphans, you're
interacting over a lifetime withthe orphans.
We have to remember as deaconsthat our purpose is to bring
people into that fullness andfruitfulness of their

(01:03:33):
relationship with Christ.
It is not simply to fix someimmediate need.
Yeah, it's holistic.
It's holistic Just going backto sort of the founding of the
diaconate in Acts 6, in itsprototype form there that one of
the purposes, in addition totaking care of the physical

(01:03:53):
needs of the widows, was to freeup the spiritual work of the
apostles.
It is definitely a holisticeffort.
And so, as deacons are workingthrough their particular skill
set, wherever they're at theirunique calling and gifting, ask
that question how can I applythis for connecting the people

(01:04:15):
I'm working with into a localbody, preferably their own,
preferably a solid, reformedchurch, but regardless that
they're in some kind of care ofa local shepherd, because that
under shepherd is there to bringfood and water for the people,
to give that word of God, andwe're trying to not be the one
in charge of that person'sspiritual growth.

Speaker 2 (01:04:39):
We're trying to connect them up to Christ, who
is Exactly, yes, yeah, that'sthe importance of the local
church, and really pluggingpeople ultimately into the local
churches has got to be at thebasis of what we're doing.

Speaker 1 (01:04:48):
Yep, you know this kind of leads into.
Your next question is what oursituation is.
The churches are all based inurban areas.
We're not an urban ministry,you know.
We want to be where the poorpeople are, and that's in the
mountains.
It's in kind of fairlyinaccessible places, and so part

(01:05:10):
of what we envision and hopeand pray that God will do is
that we'll also become churchplanners, because we need people
that are apt to teach, to comealongside us to help us teach
our kids.
I'm not a very good teacher andso I do my best, but I know
that there are people gifted inthat we're praying that there

(01:05:31):
will be people that comealongside us and teach our kids,
help teach our kids and, at thesame time, plant a church in
the woods somewhere, and part ofit is.
We're here in Romania.
We're looking for a place tobuy, and there's no place that's
affordable to us other thansomething that's an hour away

(01:05:52):
from the city, and that's achallenge that I know God is
quite well aware of, and we'repraying that he'll provide a
place for us in a place wherepeople need us.
But we also need to besustained spiritually, we need
to be fed, and we can't just belike an entity unto ourselves

(01:06:15):
out in the woods with kids.
We just can't do that.
We need to be a part of thebody of Christ, and so that's
one thing that we're looking fora solution to.
We're praying about where tosettle in Romania, if we're to
settle anywhere, but right nowwe are commuting to church two
hours one way, two hours back,and it's difficult.

(01:06:36):
It's not sustainable really.

Speaker 3 (01:06:39):
Do you hear that church?
Do you hear that young man?
Listen to what Greg is sayingand step up.

Speaker 1 (01:06:43):
Thank you.
Yeah, we're praying, you know.
Ask the Lord.
We need younger people too,because we're getting up there
in age and we would like thenext generation to kind of come
and come alongside us and get toknow what we do and let's grow
this.
You know, there's 30 kids thatcall us mama and papa.
I'm not under any illusion thatI'm going to be able to help

(01:07:06):
them all, but I'd like to helpthe ones that want to be helped,
and there are a few therealready, but we don't have a
place for them yet.
You know, we're hoping tosettle somewhere and to start
building our program anddeveloping it, and there has
been a bit of a two-year delaybecause of this war.

Speaker 2 (01:07:27):
Thank, you, David?
What are some ways that we canbe praying for you and your
labors?

Speaker 3 (01:07:33):
There are two primary areas where Sweetwater needs
help.
We recently entered a phase ofcapacity development.
We need $12,000 in recurringmonthly donations.
We're currently at four inrecurring monthly donations.
We're currently at four.
Because there's been a lag indonations recently, I've had to

(01:07:53):
pull back on my hours.
I simply can't give toSweetwater what I used to and
still provide for my family.
So right now I'm seekingfull-time work.
If anybody out there has aministry position that I can
work remotely, I would love todo it.
I'm good at water science andgood at teaching.
I love talking about the gospel, so if anybody out there knows
anything that could be a workfor me in that world, I'd love

(01:08:15):
it.
The other thing Sweetwater needsis to develop our board.
We recently added another boardmember, but we're looking for
three more at least three more.
These are people who loveministry to the widowed, the
orphaned and the poor.
They have a resume of workingat the executive level and have
gifts and talents that I don'thave and that can compliment the

(01:08:38):
gifts and talents of ourexisting board.
So if you're interested inspeaking with me about that, you
can contact me by phone oremail, which I think will be in
the show notes, perhaps Shownotes, yep, and you can also
check out our websitesweetwaterresearchorg.
We're also on Facebook andInstagram.

Speaker 1 (01:08:56):
Great.
So we're funded, we pay ourrent, you know, faithfully, and
we're able to pay our rent inour own salaries.
But we're not able to go beyondthat right now.
We actually don't have anymoney to buy a place and, no, we
just don't period.
So I want to do the GeorgeMueller thing, where he prayed

(01:09:18):
and the money came and I amzealous for the glory of God in
the way he provides and Irecognize that.
You know if, say, if I do askfor money and somebody answers
that it is God 100% working inhim to do that.
Yes, but yeah, we could reallyuse some capital to buy a place

(01:09:43):
so that we can move on andaccept the next crop of kids
that are aging out, like rightnow.
This year there's like five ofthem and they all want to be
with us.
We can build little houses forthem.
We have people lined up thatwant to be a part of our program
, like, say, on a two to threemonth level, a time commitment,

(01:10:07):
that have like skills that theywant to pass on to our kids, but
we we don't have a place to dothat in yet.
So the the program is a littlebit on hold right now.

Speaker 3 (01:10:18):
So when the church takes care of her own, it
results in many thanksgivings togod.
Yes, from second corinthiansnine, and praise the lord for
that.
So whether you're the onegiving the money, whether you're
the one receiving the money,it's the Lord's and he's getting
glory and praise him for it.

Speaker 1 (01:10:33):
Yes, amen.

Speaker 2 (01:10:35):
Brothers, I'm so thankful to hear your stories.
Get a window into your heartsand what motivates you to do
what you do, and we'll see howthe Lord even uses this, not
only in the hearts of deaconswho hear and grow through the
challenges and encouragementsthat you've given.

(01:10:56):
But I'd say to the deacons outthere, these are two deacons who
are faithfully serving.
These are essentially bothparachurch ministries.
They're not necessarilydirectly under the OPC, but
these are faithful brothers andthose who'd like to contribute
towards their ministry,responding to the needs that
they have to come alongside them.
Information will be in the shownotes for that.

(01:11:17):
David, thank you very much forjoining us on the podcast.

Speaker 3 (01:11:21):
Thank you.
The Reformed Deacon has been agreat blessing to me in my young
years.
As a deacon only having servedtwo so far I have much to learn,
and the Reformed Deacon's beena big part of that.

Speaker 2 (01:11:31):
Wonderful and, greg, thank you for joining us.
Our listeners will not be soaware of the in and out that
we've suffered by our Wi-Fibecause our producer, trish,
will do such a fantastic job incleaning all this up.
Thanks to Trish.
But thank you, greg, for takingthe time to join us as well.
Sharing from your heart, yeahthanks very much.

Speaker 1 (01:11:52):
We're very grateful, thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:11:54):
And deacons, we hope that this episode will encourage
you in your service to yourcongregation and possibly start
thinking outside the boxregarding the ministry of mercy
in our parts of the world, inour corner of the vineyard.
Through Christ Jesus, thanksfor joining us.
Go to our website,thereformedeaconorg.
There you will find all ourepisodes, program notes and

(01:12:15):
other helpful resources, andplease make plans to join us
again next month for anotherepisode of the Reformed Deacon
Podcast.
¶¶.