October 9, 2023 • 46 mins
Ready to unearth the divine mysteries buried in the biblical landscape of John Chapter 6? Buckle up, because in this episode, we - your hosts Ken and Steve - embark on an enlightening exploration of the miraculous provisions of Jesus, the faith of a young boy, and the crowd's awe-struck reactions. We'll investigate Jesus' claim of being the bread of life and its profound significance in the Jewish sacrificial system.
This episode takes a deep dive into the struggles faced by Jesus' disciples - particularly their struggle with the concept of consuming his flesh and blood. We'll even analyze why Jesus chose the 12 disciples and why Judas continued to follow him, despite his lack of faith.
In the concluding part of our discussion, we'll shift focus onto Jesus as the bread of Heaven, his references to manna, and the Pharisees' disbelief. As we revisit the faith of the young boy who selflessly offers his food to Jesus, we strive to inspire you to delve into your own understanding of the Bible. So, join us on this journey of discovery - after all, if we, just regular guys, can study the Bible, you can too!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ken (00:08):
Hi, you are listening to the Regular Guys Bible Study
Podcast.
We are your host, Ken and Steve, and we are just Regular Guys
studying the Bible.
Steve (00:21):
Not theologians, that's right.
Ken (00:33):
I thought about re-recording that, because I
sound like such an idiot in that, and then I realized would it
be any different?
I'm going to say no.
I have noticed, though, thatmany times when you listen to a
podcast, it's not the hosts thatare doing that first part, it's
(00:56):
the producer.
So why don't we have ourproducer do the intro for us?
That's a great idea, aren't youthe?
Steve (01:05):
producer.
Ken (01:07):
Well, okay, that's a problem.
We don't have a producer,really.
I don't know.
I can't do anything with that.
Are you having a good day,Steve?
That's been a weird weekend.
Has it?
Yes, I know what you're saying.
Steve (01:30):
I've had a very tiring week Me too, but it's partly
because I'm not sleeping.
Ken (01:35):
Because you're not sleeping .
I'm having a tiring weekbecause I'm having to go into
the office.
I can't believe I used to dothis.
How did?
Steve (01:43):
I manage.
Ken (01:47):
I'm having to talk with people and, honestly, after
talking with people all day inperson and not being able to
roll my eyes because I don'thave my camera on, I hope I
remembered that I'm justexhausted.
I don't really want to talkright now.
Steve (02:10):
I hear you.
I had meetings all day onTuesday and I was just like it
hasn't even been eight hours yet, but I had nine hours of
meetings.
How is that possible?
Ken (02:20):
Yeah Well, I'm sure people are not here hoping to hear
about our day and our week.
It doesn't sound like it's veryuplifting.
No, it's not very uplifting.
Hold on, let's start over.
You know what?
I'm really having a good day,steve, how about you.
Steve (02:37):
It's been a weird week.
Ken (02:43):
All righty, okay.
Well, we are studying Johnchapter six today.
It is really long, but thething is, it really is necessary
One big piece.
It's necessary, especially thebiggest piece of it really needs
to stick together.
So we're going to try to getthrough it today.
I hope you'll stay with us.
(03:04):
It's really kind of cool andit's one of those things that,
to me, the fact that this,especially the end of this
chapter, the fact that it's inthe Bible, adds legitimacy to
the scripture, because it's notgood, right, it's not all good
(03:26):
stuff that's in here.
You know what I'm saying.
Steve (03:32):
I'm sure by the time we finish I will All right,
Whatever.
Ken (03:36):
All right.
Oh man, I forgot to pray aboutthis before we start.
You know what we're going topray on the thing, god.
I just pray for this podcasttoday, father, that your Holy
Spirit would fill us and that wewould say words that are from
(03:57):
you and not from us.
I pray for the people listening.
I pray for these guys that areafraid to study the Bible.
They don't understand that theycan study the Bible themselves,
that they will realize that ifthese idiots, steve and Ken, can
read the Bible, they can do ittoo.
They don't have to havesomebody read it to them.
(04:20):
They can read it and understandit, and when they don't
understand it, there's lots ofplaces to find understanding.
We just thank you, father, forgiving us this privilege.
In Jesus' name, we pray.
Amen.
Steve (04:32):
Amen, maybe we don't have to read it now.
Ken (04:35):
Why.
Steve (04:36):
Well, you just told them they could read it.
Well, they can, and I want themto.
Ken (04:43):
But nothing's wrong with listening to other people and
what they have to say also, aslong as they are theologically
sound and you should be able totell the thing is if you don't
read the Bible yourself youdon't know you don't know if
somebody's phenyl eyes.
Steve (04:58):
I have a friend whose son is struggling with that right
now with his church, that he'srealizing that what he was
reading in the Bible isn'tdriving with what they're saying
.
Ken (05:07):
Yeah, and that's a big fear I have for the next generation
that there's a lot of churchesout there changing their message
and the message is not biblicaland you've got to read the
Bible to know what it says.
Don't rely on a pastor to tellyou what the Bible says.
(05:32):
Once you understand what theBible says, find a pastor who
preaches that.
All right, I'm going to jumpoff my soapbox.
And, steve, do you want to readthis first section?
Sure?
After this, hold it.
After what?
What just happened?
Steve (05:54):
This is the.
You know, it hasn't been thatlong since we went over this and
I'm having trouble remembering.
And Jesus just gave this bigspeech about who he is and what
his witnesses are, and theydon't believe the prophets.
Why would they believe him?
Ken (06:14):
Yeah, basically saying he's equal to God.
Steve (06:17):
Yep.
Ken (06:18):
Yep OK.
Steve (06:20):
After this, Jesus went away to the other side of the
Sea of Galilee, which is the Seaof Tiberius, and a large crowd
was following him because theysaw the signs that he was doing
on the sick.
Jesus went up on the mountainand there he sat down with his
disciples.
Now the Passover, the feast ofthe Jews, was at hand.
Lifting up his eyes then, andseeing that a large crowd was
(06:42):
coming toward him, Jesus said toPhilip where are we to buy
bread so these people may eat?
He said this to test him, forhe himself knew what he would do
.
Philip answered him 200 denariiworth of bread would not be
enough for each of them to get alittle.
One of his disciples, Andrew,Simon Peter's brother, said to
(07:03):
him there is a boy here who hasfive barley loaves and two fish,
but what are they for so many?
Jesus said have the people sitdown Now?
There was much grass in theplace, so the men sat down,
about 5,000 in number.
Jesus took the loaves and whenhe had given thanks, he
distributed to them, to thosewho were seated, so also the
(07:26):
fish, as much as they wanted.
Ken's giving me a look.
I'm not giving you a look.
Ken (07:34):
And when they had eaten their fill, he told the
disciples gather up the leftoverfragments that nothing may be
lost.
Steve (07:41):
So they gathered them up and filled 12 baskets with
fragments from the five barleyloaves left by those who had
eaten.
When the people saw the signthat he had done, they said this
is indeed the prophet who is tocome into the world.
Perceiving then that they wereabout to come and take him by
force to make him king, jesuswithdrew again to the mountain
by himself.
(08:01):
All right.
Ken (08:04):
There's a couple of things I notice about this.
Steve, I don't read very well.
No, I'm giving you grace, I wasnot looking at you funny, it's
just how I look.
He is pretty funny looking OK,ok, ok, ok.
I noticed a couple of things,though.
First of all, there's a lot ofpeople there, and when it says
(08:29):
5,000 men, I've heard peoplespeculating that there might
have been 10,000 or more peopletotal, because there were
probably some women and childreninvolved in this as well.
The second thing I notice isthat, even though there's no way
(08:54):
that five loaves of bread andtwo fish would feed that many
people, for some reason who saidit?
Andrew brought it up to Jesus.
Yep, like, maybe he thoughtwell, this is Jesus.
(09:14):
He turned water into wine.
Maybe he can turn these thingsinto a lot of food.
So there's a small amount offaith just to say, well, we got
these, but I don't know, I don'tknow how far that's going to go
(09:34):
.
Steve (09:36):
But isn't it also interesting that there's this
boy whose mom packed him a lunchand he was like here you can
use my stuff, I'll share.
Ken (09:48):
I mean, it doesn't say he said that.
Steve (09:51):
Well, no, Maybe Andrew just said oh look, there's some
food I'll get that for my kid,oh, my boy Let me have your food
.
No but.
Ken (10:01):
I agree.
I think he was probably willingto share, but it does not
necessarily say that.
Another thing I noticed is youcould say he distributed to
those who were seated.
You could say, oh well, I beteverybody just stood up because
(10:21):
they knew they weren't going toeat.
You could say you might hearpeople say that.
But I think that's interestingbecause even if you had those
loaves of bread and fish andjust broke them into 12 baskets,
they wouldn't fill thosebaskets.
Steve (10:44):
No.
Ken (10:44):
That's.
Steve (10:46):
And I've also heard and I hate to say it, but this was
that immense breakfast thing andthe guy that was speaking was
like, well, maybe all theseother people also had food.
And when they saw the boy wasgoing to share, they pulled out
their stuff and shared too.
And I'm like are you trying totake away the miracles of the
(11:10):
Bible?
I mean, it doesn't even sayanything like that here.
No, I was actually pretty upsetafter that man's breakfast.
That was said from the front.
Yeah, yeah, that's not ourcurrent church, not even my
church it was.
I went with a friend.
Ken (11:28):
OK, your friend is stupid.
No, I didn't.
I take that back.
No, no, but that is points to areason why you need to make
sure your church is preachingwhat the Bible preaches, because
the Bible is clear here thatthis is a miracle.
Yeah, and I'll say to anyonewho wants to see that video'm
(11:51):
traveling by all means.
The people were so excited byit, in fact, that they were
going to take Jesus by force.
Steve (12:00):
It's like him king and make him king.
And that doesn't happen becausepeople brought up my own food
Right.
Ken (12:07):
And it just doesn't fit.
Yeah, I agree.
Ok, is there anything elseyou'd like to say about that
story?
Steve (12:18):
Well, going back to the boy, yeah.
I have a note that I had leftin my Bible from some previous
either sermon or reading.
I said I don't have much, butwhat I have to give, I give to
Jesus.
That's what this boy did.
Ken (12:36):
Wow.
Steve (12:38):
That's what this podcast is, that really hit me hard.
Right there, steve, that istrue, I've got a hammer, I could
hit you harder.
Ken (12:48):
I don't, that's OK.
No, don't, but yeah, that issuch man.
That attitude is what we shouldhave, because the first one,
not the hammer one, no, no.
But do you ever feel inadequateAt what you can do for God?
Steve (13:14):
Yes.
Ken (13:16):
Because I mean, if I have any feelings at all about what I
can do for God, it is ofinadequacy, and I wish I was
many times.
I wish I was more confident inwhat I can do for God and and
(13:36):
all of that.
But, man, that is a reallystrong statement.
I don't have much, but what Ihave I give to God or give to
Jesus.
And he can multiply it andJesus can do incredible things
with that.
Steve (13:56):
So maybe we should stop there.
No.
Ken (14:02):
Man then actually put a little bit of moisture in my
eyes, steve, thinking about thatand I appreciate you sharing.
All right, you know what I'mgoing to read this next long
section.
Steve (14:20):
You sure you can make it through all five verses?
Well, we'll see.
Ken (14:25):
But, you know, if you are familiar with the story of Jesus
walking on the water, this,this is that story, but it's in
the book of John, which is not avery widely shared story,
because it doesn't really talkabout it.
Steve (14:42):
No, it's very quick, all right.
Ken (14:44):
So when evening came, so Jesus withdrew so that people
couldn't find him.
When evening came, hisdisciples went down to the sea,
got into a boat and startedacross the sea to Capernaum.
It was now dark and Jesus hadnot yet come to them.
The sea became rough because astrong wind was blowing.
When they had rode about threeor four miles they saw Jesus
(15:09):
Walking on the sea and comingnear the boat and they were
frightened.
But he said to them it is, I donot be afraid.
Then they were glad to take himinto the boat and immediately
the boat was at the land towhich they were going.
I have that part highlighted.
Why do you have thathighlighted, steve?
Steve (15:28):
How were they?
Immediately where they weregoing to go.
Is this another miracle?
Yeah, it's a miracle.
Ken (15:35):
So he like teleported the boat to the shore.
Steve (15:37):
I don't know about teleported.
Ken (15:41):
Teleported is a certain type of magical travel.
This is miracle travel.
It's not magical travel or StarTrek travel yeah, I don't know.
But so when I first read this,I thought, well, hold on.
They were going against astrong wind, so maybe they were
being blown back and they didn'trealize it.
(16:05):
And then they were just at theshore and there was Jesus.
Now you sound like that.
Well, that's true, that's true.
But we all, I think, have atendency especially try to make
it logical Engineering logicbrain wants to find logic and
everything.
But you know what?
They were going against thewind and when he got into the
(16:29):
boat they were immediately onthe other side where they were
going, and Jesus didn't take aboat.
So there, somewhere, there's amiracle in there.
So it might as well be all themiracle that stated, other than
(16:52):
just the walking on the water.
Steve (16:53):
Yeah, I think that's true , Other than just the walking on
the water.
Yeah, yeah.
Ken (17:04):
So anyway, I think I would be afraid if I saw someone
walking on the water.
Steve (17:10):
Yeah, me too.
I'd be afraid if I turn aroundand realize, oh look, we're
there.
Ken (17:18):
Yeah, that would be startling, what just happened.
Did you think they might havelike passed out for a second and
then awoke and they were there.
So, or do you think timehappened?
I don't think no time happenedfor them to travel, or they just
blanked out and all of a suddenthey're there.
Steve (17:42):
I'll have to save that one for when we get there.
I don't know.
Ken (17:47):
It doesn't really matter, but it says immediately the boat
was at the land.
So if you take that literally,then no, then no time passed.
All right, I don't know whatelse to say about that one.
Jesus walked on the water.
It's a very short version ofthat story here, but it is
(18:14):
mentioned here.
All right, let's.
Why don't we go into the nextsection?
Excellent idea.
All right, this is where thereally long stuff starts.
Would you like to read thisfirst section, or do you want me
to read the first section?
It's really long.
Steve (18:36):
I'll start and then tag team you.
Ken (18:38):
Okay.
Steve (18:39):
On the next day, the crowd that remained on the other
side of the seesaw that therewere had been only one boat
there and that Jesus had notentered the boat with his
disciples, but that hisdisciples had gone away alone.
Other boats from Tiberius camenear the place where they had
eaten the bread after the Lordhad given thanks.
So when the crowd saw thatJesus was not there, nor as
(19:02):
disciples, they themselves gotinto the boats and went to
Capernaum seeking Jesus.
When they found him on theother side of the sea, they said
to him Rabbi, when did you comehere?
Jesus answered them truly.
Truly, I say to you you wereseeking me not because you saw
signs, but because you ate yourfill of the loaves.
(19:25):
Do not work for the food thatparishes, but for the food that
endures to eternal life, whichthe Son of man will give to you.
For on him, god the Father,they have been given thanks for
their sacrifice.
God the Father has set his seal.
Then they said to him what mustwe do to be doing the works of
God?
Jesus answered them this is thework of God that you may
(19:48):
believe in him, whom he has sent.
So they said to him.
Then, what sign do you do thatwe may see and believe you?
What work do you perform?
Our fathers ate the manna in thewilderness, as it is written.
He gave them bread from heavento eat.
Jesus then said to them, truly,truly, I say to you it was not
(20:08):
Moses who gave you the breadfrom heaven, but my father gives
you the bread, the true breadfrom heaven, for the bread of
God is he who comes down fromheaven and gives life to the
world.
They said to him, sir, give usthis bread always.
Tag.
Ken (20:25):
Okay, before I start reading, that would make me so
mad If you were Jesus.
If I was Jesus.
It's like what sign do you doyou?
Steve (20:35):
saw a miracle and you want more.
Ken (20:40):
Okay, we give us the bread always.
Then we always want the freebread and fishes.
Steve (20:47):
Even though you said don't seek after the food that
fills your belly.
Ken (20:53):
Yeah, all right, okay.
So Jesus said to them afterthey said, sir, give us the
bread always.
So Jesus said to them I am thebread of life.
Whoever comes to me shall nothunger and whoever believes in
me shall never thirst.
But I said to you that you haveseen me and yet do not believe.
All that the Father gives mewill come to me, and whoever
(21:17):
comes to me I will never castout.
I have come down from heavennot to do my own will, but the
will of him who sent me.
And this is the will of him whosent me that I should lose
nothing of all that he has givenme, but raise it up on the last
day.
For this is the will of myFather that everyone who looks
(21:40):
on the Son and believes in himshall have eternal life.
And I will raise him up on thelast day.
So the Jews grumbled about himbecause he said I am the bread
that came down from heaven.
They said it's not this Jesus,the Son of Joseph, whose father
and mother we know.
How does he say I have comedown from heaven?
(22:02):
Jesus answered them do notgrumble among yourselves.
No one can come to me unlessthe Father who sent me draws him
and I will raise him up on thelast day.
It is written in the prophetsand they will all be taught by
God.
(22:22):
Everyone who has heard andlearned from the Father comes to
me.
Not that anyone has seen theFather, except he who is from
God.
He has seen the Father Truly.
Truly, I say to you whoeverbelieves has eternal life.
I am the bread of life.
Your fathers ate the manna inthe wilderness and they died.
(22:44):
This is the bread that comesdown from heaven so that one may
eat of it and not die.
I am the living bread that camedown from heaven.
If anyone eats of this bread,he will live forever.
And the bread that I give forthe life of the world is my
flesh.
The Jews then disputed amongthemselves, saying how can this
(23:08):
man give us his flesh to eat?
So Jesus said to them truly,truly, I say to you unless you
eat the flesh of the Son of manand drink his blood, you have no
life in you.
Whoever feeds on my flesh anddrinks my blood has eternal life
, and I will raise him up on thelast day, for my flesh is true
(23:32):
food and my blood is true drink.
Whoever feeds on my flesh anddrinks.
My blood abides in me and I inhim, as the living Father sent
me and I live because of theFather.
So whoever feeds on me, he alsowill live because of me.
(23:54):
This is the bread that camedown from heaven, not like the
bread the fathers ate and died.
Whoever feeds on this breadwill live forever.
Jesus said these things in thesynagogue as he taught at
Capernaum.
Steve (24:11):
Yeah.
Ken (24:15):
All right.
So Jesus is making some bigtime claims.
Steve (24:22):
Well, it's some sane stuff that is hard to swallow.
Ken (24:30):
Yep.
Steve (24:36):
I mean, I've heard people say before that they can't
believe in the Bible because ittalks about eating Jesus, and
I'm sure they're referring tothis passage.
Ken (24:48):
Okay, and so what does it mean?
Steve (24:54):
Well, we now take it to mean communion, but I think it's
more about how he had to diefor our sins.
Ken (25:04):
Yeah, that's how I take it.
We, you know he is that perfectlamb that was sacrificed, and
and you know, we don't sometimesit's hard, for people in the
West at least, to comprehendthis sacrificial system that the
(25:27):
Jews had.
I know that there's places allover the world, though, that
still do some of these things,and I was in a place last summer
where they were preparing forthe sacrifices, and they have
(25:48):
these huge drainage systems forthe blood, for the blood Yep,
and they drain it.
It made it drains into thecreek.
It's got to be nasty, but therewere everywhere.
You looked, as we're about toleave, because this is about to
(26:10):
happen right before we left,just more and more goats, and
it's not a cows aren't popularin the area, but goats and sheep
and pigs I think pigs, not pigs, not if it's Jewish.
It was not Jewish.
(26:31):
Oh, okay, I don't want to talkabout where I was, though.
Steve (26:41):
Oh, so there was another thing in here.
Let me see if I can find theverse oh, verse 40, that
everyone who looks on the sun,you know what?
(27:03):
Next week we're going to belooking at the sun because
there's going to be an eclipse.
Ken (27:11):
Doesn't that mean the sun will be hidden?
Steve (27:17):
Let's just move on, Ken.
Ken (27:21):
Okay, but you're right, we will look at it when we normally
just.
That's a different sun, though,steve.
Steve (27:29):
Yeah, I know Okay.
Ken (27:31):
But I think it's interesting.
I think you know language isnot a coincidence.
I think it's interesting thatsun, the son of God, who is the
light of the world, it is thesame word Spelled differently.
(27:53):
Spelled differently.
It's an interesting word thatwe use for the light of the
world, the sun.
You think that's coincidental?
It might be humanlycoincidental.
I don't think it's acoincidence from the father.
Steve (28:12):
We're only talking about English.
Ken (28:15):
Yes, but that's our language.
Steve (28:20):
It's not the only language.
Ken (28:21):
Just like Peter sounds like the word for rock Petra.
Steve (28:29):
Rock doesn't sound anything like I know, but that's
not our language.
Ken (28:34):
I'm just okay.
Um what?
What else would you like to sayabout this?
There's so much we could talkabout that.
There's a lot of things that Icould try to talk about.
Steve (28:54):
Well, and I think the last part of chapter six is the
disciples basically saying whatare you talking about, jesus?
This is some hard stuff.
Ken (29:06):
Well, we're not there yet Just a minute.
I want to talk about what wehave read.
All right it is hard stuffBecause he's saying another
thing.
He says which is really goingto be difficult for some people
to take.
Let's see 40.
Steve (29:28):
Where was?
Ken (29:28):
that when he says that he has seen God.
Okay, 46.
Not that anyone has seen thefather, except he who is from
God.
He has seen the father and who,is he saying, is sent from God
(29:49):
himself himself.
Has anyone seen God?
What?
What do the Jews believe?
Do you know what the Jewsbelieve?
Can you see God?
Steve (30:01):
I don't think so.
There was the time that, uh,was it Moses that hid in the
cleft of the rock and Jesus puthis hand over him as he walked
past, or uh, that's what causedhim to glow?
Ken (30:14):
I think you're getting two stories mixed up.
But in the cleft of the rock,when, uh, he hears the whisper
or something of the wind, andthat was God's voice, anyway but
you were going somewhere butman cannot see God, see God's
(30:39):
face, that is, see God's face Um.
But he's claiming that he hasseen the father because he is
from the father Um, which Ithink that's a big deal here.
Steve (30:55):
If the Pharisees are listening, that's a really big
deal.
Ken (31:00):
Yeah, I think they are listening.
Um all right.
Um now you know he goes here.
Here he goes a little furtherthan I understand.
Um so he keeps talking abouteating my flesh and drinking my
(31:21):
blood, um which we're saying.
We're saying that is prettymuch accepting his sacrifice.
Um right, is that what?
Steve (31:32):
we're saying.
That means that's what we'resaying, and we're talking about
communion.
Ken (31:36):
is that reminder?
Um, he says, do this inremembrance of me later on,
right For the, that's thecommunion, taking the bread
which is the last body anddrinking the wine which is his
blood.
Um, but then he says this um,for my flesh is true food and my
(32:01):
blood is true drink.
What does that mean?
True, it's like it's, he's likesaying that.
That to me, that sort of soundslike you saying I'm not using a
metaphor here, I'm saying thatit really is food and drink.
Steve (32:21):
So I'm gonna take a stab here.
We haven't really talked aboutthe third member of the Trinity
here, which is the Holy Spirit,and and we want to abide in the
Holy Spirit For Basically allthat we do and all that we Think
(32:44):
or live, whatever.
So maybe he's referring to, youknow, having the Holy Spirit
live in us as as Food and light.
Ken (32:59):
You're saying, you think that the true I saying true food
and true drink that's the HolySpirit.
Steve (33:09):
Maybe I.
Ken (33:13):
Don't know that's.
Steve (33:15):
That seems a stretch to me, Steve but in order to abide
in him, we have to abide in theHoly Spirit.
Ken (33:32):
Her feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood, abides in me
and in him as living father sentme and I live because of the
father.
So whoever feeds on me, he willhave, he will live because of
me.
Now I I don't.
(33:52):
I don't see.
I think the Holy Spirit is justnot in this Conversation.
That's what I think.
Steve (33:59):
All right, it was just a thought I know I could be wrong
too.
Ken (34:02):
Steve, you know what I think we've established.
I'm not the smartest person inthe world.
Steve (34:07):
I Don't think there's any question about that.
Ken (34:12):
Do we need to establish it again?
No, I think we're good.
Okay, at any rate, this Was alot that he was laying down on
the people and he said this.
And it said he said this in thesynagogue as he taught, so this
wasn't just on a hill.
Yeah, this is.
(34:33):
This is inside the synagogue,no longer a crowd trying to make
him king.
But yeah, so I guarantee youthere were Pharisees all around
listening to this.
All right, so now why don't weread this last section and see
what happened?
Steve (34:52):
When many of his disciples heard it, they said
this is a hard saying.
Who can listen to it?
But Jesus, knowing in himselfthat his disciples were
grumbling about this, said tothem Do you take a fence at this
?
Then what if you were to seethe Son of man ascending to
where he was before?
It is the Spirit who gives life.
The flesh is no help at all.
(35:14):
The words that I have spoken toyou are spirit and life, but
there are some of you who do notbelieve.
For Jesus knew from thebeginning who those were who did
not believe and who it was whowould betray him.
And he said this is why I toldyou that no one can come to me
unless it is granted by grantedhim by the Father.
After this, many of hisdisciples turned back and no
(35:37):
longer walked with him.
So Jesus said to the 12 Do youwant to go away as well?
Simon Peter answered him Lord,to whom shall we go?
You have the words of eternallife, and we have believed and
we have come to know that youare the Holy One of God.
Jesus answered them did I notchoose you, the 12?
(35:57):
And yet one of you is a devil.
He spoke of Judas, the son ofSimon, a scurriot, for he, one
of the 12 was going to betrayhim.
Ken (36:09):
Okay.
So the disciples say, wow, thisis really hard to take.
You're saying I'm supposed toeat your flesh and drink your
blood.
Steve (36:24):
Hmm, what's for dessert?
Ken (36:29):
Yeah, so, and this is what I was saying I I think it really
gives legitimacy to thescriptures when a lot of people
who were following him and theycall them disciples it's not to
be confused with the 12disciples Possils Well, these
(36:49):
were apostles too, right.
I thought only the 12 got thatI don't know what that word
means.
Yeah, at any rate.
Steve (36:58):
The 12 established.
Ken (37:02):
Anyway, there were lots of people following Jesus that were
considered he can.
They considered themselves hisdisciple, but a lot of these
people just turned away Becausethey couldn't take this teaching
.
So why didn't the 12 turn away?
Steve (37:35):
I think the 12 have seen a whole lot more than these
others have seen, like the wholewalking on water thing.
Was it just the 12 in the boator was it some of these people
that walked away?
Ken (37:50):
And I assume it's just the 12.
Steve (37:54):
Basically what I assume as well.
Every you know Children's storythat shows it, shows it as the
12.
Ken (38:02):
I don't agree with you, though, that it's the miracles
that they've seen more.
Steve (38:07):
I hadn't finished.
Okay, I was gonna say and weknow that God has put into
Peter's heart that he's the sonof God, he being Jesus here, not
yes.
So I think God has alreadyplaced it into their hearts to
believe.
Ken (38:26):
Okay, um, I agree with that .
And If we look above, back whenJesus was talking up his, his
speech there, that Was hard forpeople.
Let's see.
He says but I said to you thatyou will, that you have seen me,
(38:53):
and yet do not believe.
All that the Father gives mewill come to me and whoever
comes to me I will never castout, for I have come down from
heaven not to do my will, butthe will of him who sent me Hold
on.
This is not where I thought Iwas at in this, and this is the
(39:16):
will of him who sent me that Ishould lose nothing of all that
he has given me, but raise it upon the last day, for this is
the will of my father, thateveryone who looks on the son
and believes in him Should haveeternal life.
And I will raise him up on thatlast day that there is one
(39:38):
other section I thought I was at, but that's a different spot.
Let me see there is.
There is one spot if you canhelp me find it, steve where he
says Is it where he's talkingabout the manna?
No, he says no one can come tome unless the father draws him.
Everyone who has heard andlearned from the father comes to
(40:01):
me.
Let's see.
Steve (40:05):
No, no, no no, I think that verse 44 is a key point
though.
Ken (40:10):
It is, but that's not the verse I was looking for.
Ah, verse 44.
No one can come to me unlessthe father who sent me draws him
isn't that what I just?
Said verse 44.
Oh, but that's not where I wasreading before, was it?
(40:30):
No, but you did touch it again,and that's what?
Okay?
Steve (40:33):
okay, we know we're not that smart and apparently I
can't listen, but so who did?
Ken (40:46):
did Jesus call the other disciples or did he call the 12?
Steve (40:53):
oh, good question.
I think he called the 12 andthe others just kind of started
following the others followed.
Ken (41:01):
Yes, he even says let's see where's it say oh man, I wish I
was better at like skimming.
God make me better at skimming.
So it says here that.
Oh.
(41:24):
He says in verse 70 Jesusanswered them.
Did I not choose you, the 12?
And yet one of you is a devil.
So Jesus chose these 12.
So that means God called themto follow him because Jesus is
(41:45):
the Christ.
So God called them.
Jesus called them to follow him.
That's why they are stillfollowing him, because they've
been called by God to do that.
It's a good point.
Steve (42:00):
So why do you suppose Judas continued to follow?
I mean, I realize he's beencalled, but he didn't truly
believe, or else he just chosenot to believe at some point um,
hmm, did he not believe?
(42:24):
I've always had questions abouthim because I think in his heart
he may have thought he wasdoing the right thing to like oh
, if I do this, then Jesus willshow everybody that he's the,
the son of God, and become kingof the world.
And yet he betrayed him.
(42:50):
He did betray Jesus, but it waspart of the plan and I've
always struggled with that hewas called by God to betray
Jesus.
Ken (43:00):
Right?
Steve (43:01):
that's an interesting struggle, and the part I
struggle with is whether or nothe has punished eternally in
hell for that you know what?
Ken (43:18):
I think we'll find out.
We will not in our podcast.
Oh, we will find out in heaven.
Okay, I will find out in heaven.
I'll find out if you reallyaccepted Christ when I get there
assuming I get there, assumingyou get there first then when I
get there, I'll find out ifyou're there oh, is it a race
(43:40):
now race to the finish line,which isn't a bad race, not not
that we should seek death, I'mnot saying that but it's not a
bad thing when we end up goingto the father amen alright,
(44:02):
anything else Steve no, I thinkwe covered a lot of it.
I'm sure we could have gonedeeper on some things yeah, we
definitely could have gonedeeper in that huge section
where Jesus is talking about whohe is and we could have talked
about you know how manna.
(44:23):
You know he refers to manna alot and how that refers to him.
But because earlier, actuallyjust real quick, earlier, do you
remember that he's he's talkingto the Pharisees and said Moses
talked about me and you, youdon't even realize, you don't,
(44:45):
you don't recognize me.
And here is it.
Just realized this right now.
By the way, I didn't thinkabout this until this very
moment.
He is, he is telling them rightnow.
Here is one of those placeswhen Moses talks about the manna
.
The manna from heaven is me.
Steve (45:08):
I am the food from heaven so you think that bread that
they were collecting every day,and only enough, that was
symbolic of Jesus coming.
Ken (45:19):
Oh, you don't think it was actually.
I don't think that was Jesusthe manna.
I think this, what that was aforetelling of Jesus coming to
feed the people with his bodyand with his blood.
Yeah, so I don't know, I justthought of that.
(45:44):
I haven't really fleshed it outso funny.
All right, I think that's it.
Guys, please leave commentswherever you listen to this and
leave us notes of encouragement.
(46:06):
And you know the bad thingsjust forget bits and leave the
trolls.
Yeah, please, trolls.
All right, see you guys.
Hi, you are listening to the Regular Guys Bible Study
Podcast.
We are your host, Ken and Steve, and we are just Regular Guys
studying the Bible.
Steve (00:21):
Not theologians, that's right.
Ken (00:33):
I thought about re-recording that, because I
sound like such an idiot in that, and then I realized would it
be any different?
I'm going to say no.
I have noticed, though, thatmany times when you listen to a
podcast, it's not the hosts thatare doing that first part, it's
(00:56):
the producer.
So why don't we have ourproducer do the intro for us?
That's a great idea, aren't youthe?
Steve (01:05):
producer.
Ken (01:07):
Well, okay, that's a problem.
We don't have a producer,really.
I don't know.
I can't do anything with that.
Are you having a good day,Steve?
That's been a weird weekend.
Has it?
Yes, I know what you're saying.
Steve (01:30):
I've had a very tiring week Me too, but it's partly
because I'm not sleeping.
Ken (01:35):
Because you're not sleeping .
I'm having a tiring weekbecause I'm having to go into
the office.
I can't believe I used to dothis.
How did?
Steve (01:43):
I manage.
Ken (01:47):
I'm having to talk with people and, honestly, after
talking with people all day inperson and not being able to
roll my eyes because I don'thave my camera on, I hope I
remembered that I'm justexhausted.
I don't really want to talkright now.
Steve (02:10):
I hear you.
I had meetings all day onTuesday and I was just like it
hasn't even been eight hours yet, but I had nine hours of
meetings.
How is that possible?
Ken (02:20):
Yeah Well, I'm sure people are not here hoping to hear
about our day and our week.
It doesn't sound like it's veryuplifting.
No, it's not very uplifting.
Hold on, let's start over.
You know what?
I'm really having a good day,steve, how about you.
Steve (02:37):
It's been a weird week.
Ken (02:43):
All righty, okay.
Well, we are studying Johnchapter six today.
It is really long, but thething is, it really is necessary
One big piece.
It's necessary, especially thebiggest piece of it really needs
to stick together.
So we're going to try to getthrough it today.
I hope you'll stay with us.
(03:04):
It's really kind of cool andit's one of those things that,
to me, the fact that this,especially the end of this
chapter, the fact that it's inthe Bible, adds legitimacy to
the scripture, because it's notgood, right, it's not all good
(03:26):
stuff that's in here.
You know what I'm saying.
Steve (03:32):
I'm sure by the time we finish I will All right,
Whatever.
Ken (03:36):
All right.
Oh man, I forgot to pray aboutthis before we start.
You know what we're going topray on the thing, god.
I just pray for this podcasttoday, father, that your Holy
Spirit would fill us and that wewould say words that are from
(03:57):
you and not from us.
I pray for the people listening.
I pray for these guys that areafraid to study the Bible.
They don't understand that theycan study the Bible themselves,
that they will realize that ifthese idiots, steve and Ken, can
read the Bible, they can do ittoo.
They don't have to havesomebody read it to them.
(04:20):
They can read it and understandit, and when they don't
understand it, there's lots ofplaces to find understanding.
We just thank you, father, forgiving us this privilege.
In Jesus' name, we pray.
Amen.
Steve (04:32):
Amen, maybe we don't have to read it now.
Ken (04:35):
Why.
Steve (04:36):
Well, you just told them they could read it.
Well, they can, and I want themto.
Ken (04:43):
But nothing's wrong with listening to other people and
what they have to say also, aslong as they are theologically
sound and you should be able totell the thing is if you don't
read the Bible yourself youdon't know you don't know if
somebody's phenyl eyes.
Steve (04:58):
I have a friend whose son is struggling with that right
now with his church, that he'srealizing that what he was
reading in the Bible isn'tdriving with what they're saying
.
Ken (05:07):
Yeah, and that's a big fear I have for the next generation
that there's a lot of churchesout there changing their message
and the message is not biblicaland you've got to read the
Bible to know what it says.
Don't rely on a pastor to tellyou what the Bible says.
(05:32):
Once you understand what theBible says, find a pastor who
preaches that.
All right, I'm going to jumpoff my soapbox.
And, steve, do you want to readthis first section?
Sure?
After this, hold it.
After what?
What just happened?
Steve (05:54):
This is the.
You know, it hasn't been thatlong since we went over this and
I'm having trouble remembering.
And Jesus just gave this bigspeech about who he is and what
his witnesses are, and theydon't believe the prophets.
Why would they believe him?
Ken (06:14):
Yeah, basically saying he's equal to God.
Steve (06:17):
Yep.
Ken (06:18):
Yep OK.
Steve (06:20):
After this, Jesus went away to the other side of the
Sea of Galilee, which is the Seaof Tiberius, and a large crowd
was following him because theysaw the signs that he was doing
on the sick.
Jesus went up on the mountainand there he sat down with his
disciples.
Now the Passover, the feast ofthe Jews, was at hand.
Lifting up his eyes then, andseeing that a large crowd was
(06:42):
coming toward him, Jesus said toPhilip where are we to buy
bread so these people may eat?
He said this to test him, forhe himself knew what he would do
.
Philip answered him 200 denariiworth of bread would not be
enough for each of them to get alittle.
One of his disciples, Andrew,Simon Peter's brother, said to
(07:03):
him there is a boy here who hasfive barley loaves and two fish,
but what are they for so many?
Jesus said have the people sitdown Now?
There was much grass in theplace, so the men sat down,
about 5,000 in number.
Jesus took the loaves and whenhe had given thanks, he
distributed to them, to thosewho were seated, so also the
(07:26):
fish, as much as they wanted.
Ken's giving me a look.
I'm not giving you a look.
Ken (07:34):
And when they had eaten their fill, he told the
disciples gather up the leftoverfragments that nothing may be
lost.
Steve (07:41):
So they gathered them up and filled 12 baskets with
fragments from the five barleyloaves left by those who had
eaten.
When the people saw the signthat he had done, they said this
is indeed the prophet who is tocome into the world.
Perceiving then that they wereabout to come and take him by
force to make him king, jesuswithdrew again to the mountain
by himself.
(08:01):
All right.
Ken (08:04):
There's a couple of things I notice about this.
Steve, I don't read very well.
No, I'm giving you grace, I wasnot looking at you funny, it's
just how I look.
He is pretty funny looking OK,ok, ok, ok.
I noticed a couple of things,though.
First of all, there's a lot ofpeople there, and when it says
(08:29):
5,000 men, I've heard peoplespeculating that there might
have been 10,000 or more peopletotal, because there were
probably some women and childreninvolved in this as well.
The second thing I notice isthat, even though there's no way
(08:54):
that five loaves of bread andtwo fish would feed that many
people, for some reason who saidit?
Andrew brought it up to Jesus.
Yep, like, maybe he thoughtwell, this is Jesus.
(09:14):
He turned water into wine.
Maybe he can turn these thingsinto a lot of food.
So there's a small amount offaith just to say, well, we got
these, but I don't know, I don'tknow how far that's going to go
(09:34):
.
Steve (09:36):
But isn't it also interesting that there's this
boy whose mom packed him a lunchand he was like here you can
use my stuff, I'll share.
Ken (09:48):
I mean, it doesn't say he said that.
Steve (09:51):
Well, no, Maybe Andrew just said oh look, there's some
food I'll get that for my kid,oh, my boy Let me have your food
.
No but.
Ken (10:01):
I agree.
I think he was probably willingto share, but it does not
necessarily say that.
Another thing I noticed is youcould say he distributed to
those who were seated.
You could say, oh well, I beteverybody just stood up because
(10:21):
they knew they weren't going toeat.
You could say you might hearpeople say that.
But I think that's interestingbecause even if you had those
loaves of bread and fish andjust broke them into 12 baskets,
they wouldn't fill thosebaskets.
Steve (10:44):
No.
Ken (10:44):
That's.
Steve (10:46):
And I've also heard and I hate to say it, but this was
that immense breakfast thing andthe guy that was speaking was
like, well, maybe all theseother people also had food.
And when they saw the boy wasgoing to share, they pulled out
their stuff and shared too.
And I'm like are you trying totake away the miracles of the
(11:10):
Bible?
I mean, it doesn't even sayanything like that here.
No, I was actually pretty upsetafter that man's breakfast.
That was said from the front.
Yeah, yeah, that's not ourcurrent church, not even my
church it was.
I went with a friend.
Ken (11:28):
OK, your friend is stupid.
No, I didn't.
I take that back.
No, no, but that is points to areason why you need to make
sure your church is preachingwhat the Bible preaches, because
the Bible is clear here thatthis is a miracle.
Yeah, and I'll say to anyonewho wants to see that video'm
(11:51):
traveling by all means.
The people were so excited byit, in fact, that they were
going to take Jesus by force.
Steve (12:00):
It's like him king and make him king.
And that doesn't happen becausepeople brought up my own food
Right.
Ken (12:07):
And it just doesn't fit.
Yeah, I agree.
Ok, is there anything elseyou'd like to say about that
story?
Steve (12:18):
Well, going back to the boy, yeah.
I have a note that I had leftin my Bible from some previous
either sermon or reading.
I said I don't have much, butwhat I have to give, I give to
Jesus.
That's what this boy did.
Ken (12:36):
Wow.
Steve (12:38):
That's what this podcast is, that really hit me hard.
Right there, steve, that istrue, I've got a hammer, I could
hit you harder.
Ken (12:48):
I don't, that's OK.
No, don't, but yeah, that issuch man.
That attitude is what we shouldhave, because the first one,
not the hammer one, no, no.
But do you ever feel inadequateAt what you can do for God?
Steve (13:14):
Yes.
Ken (13:16):
Because I mean, if I have any feelings at all about what I
can do for God, it is ofinadequacy, and I wish I was
many times.
I wish I was more confident inwhat I can do for God and and
(13:36):
all of that.
But, man, that is a reallystrong statement.
I don't have much, but what Ihave I give to God or give to
Jesus.
And he can multiply it andJesus can do incredible things
with that.
Steve (13:56):
So maybe we should stop there.
No.
Ken (14:02):
Man then actually put a little bit of moisture in my
eyes, steve, thinking about thatand I appreciate you sharing.
All right, you know what I'mgoing to read this next long
section.
Steve (14:20):
You sure you can make it through all five verses?
Well, we'll see.
Ken (14:25):
But, you know, if you are familiar with the story of Jesus
walking on the water, this,this is that story, but it's in
the book of John, which is not avery widely shared story,
because it doesn't really talkabout it.
Steve (14:42):
No, it's very quick, all right.
Ken (14:44):
So when evening came, so Jesus withdrew so that people
couldn't find him.
When evening came, hisdisciples went down to the sea,
got into a boat and startedacross the sea to Capernaum.
It was now dark and Jesus hadnot yet come to them.
The sea became rough because astrong wind was blowing.
When they had rode about threeor four miles they saw Jesus
(15:09):
Walking on the sea and comingnear the boat and they were
frightened.
But he said to them it is, I donot be afraid.
Then they were glad to take himinto the boat and immediately
the boat was at the land towhich they were going.
I have that part highlighted.
Why do you have thathighlighted, steve?
Steve (15:28):
How were they?
Immediately where they weregoing to go.
Is this another miracle?
Yeah, it's a miracle.
Ken (15:35):
So he like teleported the boat to the shore.
Steve (15:37):
I don't know about teleported.
Ken (15:41):
Teleported is a certain type of magical travel.
This is miracle travel.
It's not magical travel or StarTrek travel yeah, I don't know.
But so when I first read this,I thought, well, hold on.
They were going against astrong wind, so maybe they were
being blown back and they didn'trealize it.
(16:05):
And then they were just at theshore and there was Jesus.
Now you sound like that.
Well, that's true, that's true.
But we all, I think, have atendency especially try to make
it logical Engineering logicbrain wants to find logic and
everything.
But you know what?
They were going against thewind and when he got into the
(16:29):
boat they were immediately onthe other side where they were
going, and Jesus didn't take aboat.
So there, somewhere, there's amiracle in there.
So it might as well be all themiracle that stated, other than
(16:52):
just the walking on the water.
Steve (16:53):
Yeah, I think that's true , Other than just the walking on
the water.
Yeah, yeah.
Ken (17:04):
So anyway, I think I would be afraid if I saw someone
walking on the water.
Steve (17:10):
Yeah, me too.
I'd be afraid if I turn aroundand realize, oh look, we're
there.
Ken (17:18):
Yeah, that would be startling, what just happened.
Did you think they might havelike passed out for a second and
then awoke and they were there.
So, or do you think timehappened?
I don't think no time happenedfor them to travel, or they just
blanked out and all of a suddenthey're there.
Steve (17:42):
I'll have to save that one for when we get there.
I don't know.
Ken (17:47):
It doesn't really matter, but it says immediately the boat
was at the land.
So if you take that literally,then no, then no time passed.
All right, I don't know whatelse to say about that one.
Jesus walked on the water.
It's a very short version ofthat story here, but it is
(18:14):
mentioned here.
All right, let's.
Why don't we go into the nextsection?
Excellent idea.
All right, this is where thereally long stuff starts.
Would you like to read thisfirst section, or do you want me
to read the first section?
It's really long.
Steve (18:36):
I'll start and then tag team you.
Ken (18:38):
Okay.
Steve (18:39):
On the next day, the crowd that remained on the other
side of the seesaw that therewere had been only one boat
there and that Jesus had notentered the boat with his
disciples, but that hisdisciples had gone away alone.
Other boats from Tiberius camenear the place where they had
eaten the bread after the Lordhad given thanks.
So when the crowd saw thatJesus was not there, nor as
(19:02):
disciples, they themselves gotinto the boats and went to
Capernaum seeking Jesus.
When they found him on theother side of the sea, they said
to him Rabbi, when did you comehere?
Jesus answered them truly.
Truly, I say to you you wereseeking me not because you saw
signs, but because you ate yourfill of the loaves.
(19:25):
Do not work for the food thatparishes, but for the food that
endures to eternal life, whichthe Son of man will give to you.
For on him, god the Father,they have been given thanks for
their sacrifice.
God the Father has set his seal.
Then they said to him what mustwe do to be doing the works of
God?
Jesus answered them this is thework of God that you may
(19:48):
believe in him, whom he has sent.
So they said to him.
Then, what sign do you do thatwe may see and believe you?
What work do you perform?
Our fathers ate the manna in thewilderness, as it is written.
He gave them bread from heavento eat.
Jesus then said to them, truly,truly, I say to you it was not
(20:08):
Moses who gave you the breadfrom heaven, but my father gives
you the bread, the true breadfrom heaven, for the bread of
God is he who comes down fromheaven and gives life to the
world.
They said to him, sir, give usthis bread always.
Tag.
Ken (20:25):
Okay, before I start reading, that would make me so
mad If you were Jesus.
If I was Jesus.
It's like what sign do you doyou?
Steve (20:35):
saw a miracle and you want more.
Ken (20:40):
Okay, we give us the bread always.
Then we always want the freebread and fishes.
Steve (20:47):
Even though you said don't seek after the food that
fills your belly.
Ken (20:53):
Yeah, all right, okay.
So Jesus said to them afterthey said, sir, give us the
bread always.
So Jesus said to them I am thebread of life.
Whoever comes to me shall nothunger and whoever believes in
me shall never thirst.
But I said to you that you haveseen me and yet do not believe.
All that the Father gives mewill come to me, and whoever
(21:17):
comes to me I will never castout.
I have come down from heavennot to do my own will, but the
will of him who sent me.
And this is the will of him whosent me that I should lose
nothing of all that he has givenme, but raise it up on the last
day.
For this is the will of myFather that everyone who looks
(21:40):
on the Son and believes in himshall have eternal life.
And I will raise him up on thelast day.
So the Jews grumbled about himbecause he said I am the bread
that came down from heaven.
They said it's not this Jesus,the Son of Joseph, whose father
and mother we know.
How does he say I have comedown from heaven?
(22:02):
Jesus answered them do notgrumble among yourselves.
No one can come to me unlessthe Father who sent me draws him
and I will raise him up on thelast day.
It is written in the prophetsand they will all be taught by
God.
(22:22):
Everyone who has heard andlearned from the Father comes to
me.
Not that anyone has seen theFather, except he who is from
God.
He has seen the Father Truly.
Truly, I say to you whoeverbelieves has eternal life.
I am the bread of life.
Your fathers ate the manna inthe wilderness and they died.
(22:44):
This is the bread that comesdown from heaven so that one may
eat of it and not die.
I am the living bread that camedown from heaven.
If anyone eats of this bread,he will live forever.
And the bread that I give forthe life of the world is my
flesh.
The Jews then disputed amongthemselves, saying how can this
(23:08):
man give us his flesh to eat?
So Jesus said to them truly,truly, I say to you unless you
eat the flesh of the Son of manand drink his blood, you have no
life in you.
Whoever feeds on my flesh anddrinks my blood has eternal life
, and I will raise him up on thelast day, for my flesh is true
(23:32):
food and my blood is true drink.
Whoever feeds on my flesh anddrinks.
My blood abides in me and I inhim, as the living Father sent
me and I live because of theFather.
So whoever feeds on me, he alsowill live because of me.
(23:54):
This is the bread that camedown from heaven, not like the
bread the fathers ate and died.
Whoever feeds on this breadwill live forever.
Jesus said these things in thesynagogue as he taught at
Capernaum.
Steve (24:11):
Yeah.
Ken (24:15):
All right.
So Jesus is making some bigtime claims.
Steve (24:22):
Well, it's some sane stuff that is hard to swallow.
Ken (24:30):
Yep.
Steve (24:36):
I mean, I've heard people say before that they can't
believe in the Bible because ittalks about eating Jesus, and
I'm sure they're referring tothis passage.
Ken (24:48):
Okay, and so what does it mean?
Steve (24:54):
Well, we now take it to mean communion, but I think it's
more about how he had to diefor our sins.
Ken (25:04):
Yeah, that's how I take it.
We, you know he is that perfectlamb that was sacrificed, and
and you know, we don't sometimesit's hard, for people in the
West at least, to comprehendthis sacrificial system that the
(25:27):
Jews had.
I know that there's places allover the world, though, that
still do some of these things,and I was in a place last summer
where they were preparing forthe sacrifices, and they have
(25:48):
these huge drainage systems forthe blood, for the blood Yep,
and they drain it.
It made it drains into thecreek.
It's got to be nasty, but therewere everywhere.
You looked, as we're about toleave, because this is about to
(26:10):
happen right before we left,just more and more goats, and
it's not a cows aren't popularin the area, but goats and sheep
and pigs I think pigs, not pigs, not if it's Jewish.
It was not Jewish.
(26:31):
Oh, okay, I don't want to talkabout where I was, though.
Steve (26:41):
Oh, so there was another thing in here.
Let me see if I can find theverse oh, verse 40, that
everyone who looks on the sun,you know what?
(27:03):
Next week we're going to belooking at the sun because
there's going to be an eclipse.
Ken (27:11):
Doesn't that mean the sun will be hidden?
Steve (27:17):
Let's just move on, Ken.
Ken (27:21):
Okay, but you're right, we will look at it when we normally
just.
That's a different sun, though,steve.
Steve (27:29):
Yeah, I know Okay.
Ken (27:31):
But I think it's interesting.
I think you know language isnot a coincidence.
I think it's interesting thatsun, the son of God, who is the
light of the world, it is thesame word Spelled differently.
(27:53):
Spelled differently.
It's an interesting word thatwe use for the light of the
world, the sun.
You think that's coincidental?
It might be humanlycoincidental.
I don't think it's acoincidence from the father.
Steve (28:12):
We're only talking about English.
Ken (28:15):
Yes, but that's our language.
Steve (28:20):
It's not the only language.
Ken (28:21):
Just like Peter sounds like the word for rock Petra.
Steve (28:29):
Rock doesn't sound anything like I know, but that's
not our language.
Ken (28:34):
I'm just okay.
Um what?
What else would you like to sayabout this?
There's so much we could talkabout that.
There's a lot of things that Icould try to talk about.
Steve (28:54):
Well, and I think the last part of chapter six is the
disciples basically saying whatare you talking about, jesus?
This is some hard stuff.
Ken (29:06):
Well, we're not there yet Just a minute.
I want to talk about what wehave read.
All right it is hard stuffBecause he's saying another
thing.
He says which is really goingto be difficult for some people
to take.
Let's see 40.
Steve (29:28):
Where was?
Ken (29:28):
that when he says that he has seen God.
Okay, 46.
Not that anyone has seen thefather, except he who is from
God.
He has seen the father and who,is he saying, is sent from God
(29:49):
himself himself.
Has anyone seen God?
What?
What do the Jews believe?
Do you know what the Jewsbelieve?
Can you see God?
Steve (30:01):
I don't think so.
There was the time that, uh,was it Moses that hid in the
cleft of the rock and Jesus puthis hand over him as he walked
past, or uh, that's what causedhim to glow?
Ken (30:14):
I think you're getting two stories mixed up.
But in the cleft of the rock,when, uh, he hears the whisper
or something of the wind, andthat was God's voice, anyway but
you were going somewhere butman cannot see God, see God's
(30:39):
face, that is, see God's face Um.
But he's claiming that he hasseen the father because he is
from the father Um, which Ithink that's a big deal here.
Steve (30:55):
If the Pharisees are listening, that's a really big
deal.
Ken (31:00):
Yeah, I think they are listening.
Um all right.
Um now you know he goes here.
Here he goes a little furtherthan I understand.
Um so he keeps talking abouteating my flesh and drinking my
(31:21):
blood, um which we're saying.
We're saying that is prettymuch accepting his sacrifice.
Um right, is that what?
Steve (31:32):
we're saying.
That means that's what we'resaying, and we're talking about
communion.
Ken (31:36):
is that reminder?
Um, he says, do this inremembrance of me later on,
right For the, that's thecommunion, taking the bread
which is the last body anddrinking the wine which is his
blood.
Um, but then he says this um,for my flesh is true food and my
(32:01):
blood is true drink.
What does that mean?
True, it's like it's, he's likesaying that.
That to me, that sort of soundslike you saying I'm not using a
metaphor here, I'm saying thatit really is food and drink.
Steve (32:21):
So I'm gonna take a stab here.
We haven't really talked aboutthe third member of the Trinity
here, which is the Holy Spirit,and and we want to abide in the
Holy Spirit For Basically allthat we do and all that we Think
(32:44):
or live, whatever.
So maybe he's referring to, youknow, having the Holy Spirit
live in us as as Food and light.
Ken (32:59):
You're saying, you think that the true I saying true food
and true drink that's the HolySpirit.
Steve (33:09):
Maybe I.
Ken (33:13):
Don't know that's.
Steve (33:15):
That seems a stretch to me, Steve but in order to abide
in him, we have to abide in theHoly Spirit.
Ken (33:32):
Her feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood, abides in me
and in him as living father sentme and I live because of the
father.
So whoever feeds on me, he willhave, he will live because of
me.
Now I I don't.
(33:52):
I don't see.
I think the Holy Spirit is justnot in this Conversation.
That's what I think.
Steve (33:59):
All right, it was just a thought I know I could be wrong
too.
Ken (34:02):
Steve, you know what I think we've established.
I'm not the smartest person inthe world.
Steve (34:07):
I Don't think there's any question about that.
Ken (34:12):
Do we need to establish it again?
No, I think we're good.
Okay, at any rate, this Was alot that he was laying down on
the people and he said this.
And it said he said this in thesynagogue as he taught, so this
wasn't just on a hill.
Yeah, this is.
(34:33):
This is inside the synagogue,no longer a crowd trying to make
him king.
But yeah, so I guarantee youthere were Pharisees all around
listening to this.
All right, so now why don't weread this last section and see
what happened?
Steve (34:52):
When many of his disciples heard it, they said
this is a hard saying.
Who can listen to it?
But Jesus, knowing in himselfthat his disciples were
grumbling about this, said tothem Do you take a fence at this
?
Then what if you were to seethe Son of man ascending to
where he was before?
It is the Spirit who gives life.
The flesh is no help at all.
(35:14):
The words that I have spoken toyou are spirit and life, but
there are some of you who do notbelieve.
For Jesus knew from thebeginning who those were who did
not believe and who it was whowould betray him.
And he said this is why I toldyou that no one can come to me
unless it is granted by grantedhim by the Father.
After this, many of hisdisciples turned back and no
(35:37):
longer walked with him.
So Jesus said to the 12 Do youwant to go away as well?
Simon Peter answered him Lord,to whom shall we go?
You have the words of eternallife, and we have believed and
we have come to know that youare the Holy One of God.
Jesus answered them did I notchoose you, the 12?
(35:57):
And yet one of you is a devil.
He spoke of Judas, the son ofSimon, a scurriot, for he, one
of the 12 was going to betrayhim.
Ken (36:09):
Okay.
So the disciples say, wow, thisis really hard to take.
You're saying I'm supposed toeat your flesh and drink your
blood.
Steve (36:24):
Hmm, what's for dessert?
Ken (36:29):
Yeah, so, and this is what I was saying I I think it really
gives legitimacy to thescriptures when a lot of people
who were following him and theycall them disciples it's not to
be confused with the 12disciples Possils Well, these
(36:49):
were apostles too, right.
I thought only the 12 got thatI don't know what that word
means.
Yeah, at any rate.
Steve (36:58):
The 12 established.
Ken (37:02):
Anyway, there were lots of people following Jesus that were
considered he can.
They considered themselves hisdisciple, but a lot of these
people just turned away Becausethey couldn't take this teaching
.
So why didn't the 12 turn away?
Steve (37:35):
I think the 12 have seen a whole lot more than these
others have seen, like the wholewalking on water thing.
Was it just the 12 in the boator was it some of these people
that walked away?
Ken (37:50):
And I assume it's just the 12.
Steve (37:54):
Basically what I assume as well.
Every you know Children's storythat shows it, shows it as the
12.
Ken (38:02):
I don't agree with you, though, that it's the miracles
that they've seen more.
Steve (38:07):
I hadn't finished.
Okay, I was gonna say and weknow that God has put into
Peter's heart that he's the sonof God, he being Jesus here, not
yes.
So I think God has alreadyplaced it into their hearts to
believe.
Ken (38:26):
Okay, um, I agree with that .
And If we look above, back whenJesus was talking up his, his
speech there, that Was hard forpeople.
Let's see.
He says but I said to you thatyou will, that you have seen me,
(38:53):
and yet do not believe.
All that the Father gives mewill come to me and whoever
comes to me I will never castout, for I have come down from
heaven not to do my will, butthe will of him who sent me Hold
on.
This is not where I thought Iwas at in this, and this is the
(39:16):
will of him who sent me that Ishould lose nothing of all that
he has given me, but raise it upon the last day, for this is
the will of my father, thateveryone who looks on the son
and believes in him Should haveeternal life.
And I will raise him up on thatlast day that there is one
(39:38):
other section I thought I was at, but that's a different spot.
Let me see there is.
There is one spot if you canhelp me find it, steve where he
says Is it where he's talkingabout the manna?
No, he says no one can come tome unless the father draws him.
Everyone who has heard andlearned from the father comes to
(40:01):
me.
Let's see.
Steve (40:05):
No, no, no no, I think that verse 44 is a key point
though.
Ken (40:10):
It is, but that's not the verse I was looking for.
Ah, verse 44.
No one can come to me unlessthe father who sent me draws him
isn't that what I just?
Said verse 44.
Oh, but that's not where I wasreading before, was it?
(40:30):
No, but you did touch it again,and that's what?
Okay?
Steve (40:33):
okay, we know we're not that smart and apparently I
can't listen, but so who did?
Ken (40:46):
did Jesus call the other disciples or did he call the 12?
Steve (40:53):
oh, good question.
I think he called the 12 andthe others just kind of started
following the others followed.
Ken (41:01):
Yes, he even says let's see where's it say oh man, I wish I
was better at like skimming.
God make me better at skimming.
So it says here that.
Oh.
(41:24):
He says in verse 70 Jesusanswered them.
Did I not choose you, the 12?
And yet one of you is a devil.
So Jesus chose these 12.
So that means God called themto follow him because Jesus is
(41:45):
the Christ.
So God called them.
Jesus called them to follow him.
That's why they are stillfollowing him, because they've
been called by God to do that.
It's a good point.
Steve (42:00):
So why do you suppose Judas continued to follow?
I mean, I realize he's beencalled, but he didn't truly
believe, or else he just chosenot to believe at some point um,
hmm, did he not believe?
(42:24):
I've always had questions abouthim because I think in his heart
he may have thought he wasdoing the right thing to like oh
, if I do this, then Jesus willshow everybody that he's the,
the son of God, and become kingof the world.
And yet he betrayed him.
(42:50):
He did betray Jesus, but it waspart of the plan and I've
always struggled with that hewas called by God to betray
Jesus.
Ken (43:00):
Right?
Steve (43:01):
that's an interesting struggle, and the part I
struggle with is whether or nothe has punished eternally in
hell for that you know what?
Ken (43:18):
I think we'll find out.
We will not in our podcast.
Oh, we will find out in heaven.
Okay, I will find out in heaven.
I'll find out if you reallyaccepted Christ when I get there
assuming I get there, assumingyou get there first then when I
get there, I'll find out ifyou're there oh, is it a race
(43:40):
now race to the finish line,which isn't a bad race, not not
that we should seek death, I'mnot saying that but it's not a
bad thing when we end up goingto the father amen alright,
(44:02):
anything else Steve no, I thinkwe covered a lot of it.
I'm sure we could have gonedeeper on some things yeah, we
definitely could have gonedeeper in that huge section
where Jesus is talking about whohe is and we could have talked
about you know how manna.
(44:23):
You know he refers to manna alot and how that refers to him.
But because earlier, actuallyjust real quick, earlier, do you
remember that he's he's talkingto the Pharisees and said Moses
talked about me and you, youdon't even realize, you don't,
(44:45):
you don't recognize me.
And here is it.
Just realized this right now.
By the way, I didn't thinkabout this until this very
moment.
He is, he is telling them rightnow.
Here is one of those placeswhen Moses talks about the manna
.
The manna from heaven is me.
Steve (45:08):
I am the food from heaven so you think that bread that
they were collecting every day,and only enough, that was
symbolic of Jesus coming.
Ken (45:19):
Oh, you don't think it was actually.
I don't think that was Jesusthe manna.
I think this, what that was aforetelling of Jesus coming to
feed the people with his bodyand with his blood.
Yeah, so I don't know, I justthought of that.
(45:44):
I haven't really fleshed it outso funny.
All right, I think that's it.
Guys, please leave commentswherever you listen to this and
leave us notes of encouragement.
(46:06):
And you know the bad thingsjust forget bits and leave the
trolls.
Yeah, please, trolls.
All right, see you guys.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy And Charlamagne Tha God!
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.