We live in the most medicated generation in history — and yet chronic illness, burnout, and hopelessness are still skyrocketing. So what gives?
In this powerful episode of the Rev Rx Podcast, Chad Potts sits down with fellow pharmacist Cory Jenks — a lifestyle medicine coach and improv comedian — to unpack what’s really broken in our healthcare system… and what you can actually do to reclaim your health.
Together, they expose how our system is built to manage symptoms, not heal people, and why true wellness often starts after the prescription pad is put down.
This is a no-fluff, no-shame conversation for anyone tired of the sick-care cycle — and ready for lasting change.
Why shame and blame don’t help chronic illness
The difference between managing vs. reversing disease
How lifestyle changes create real, lasting freedom
Why medication is overused — and what works better
The power of community and accountability in healing
Check out the following links to learn more!
Learn more about Rev Rx Coaching: www.manalivecoaching.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:11):
Hello and welcome back to another episode of the Rev RX
Podcast where we show you how tothrive in faith, family, and
health. My name is Chad Potts, and I'm
your host. Today's episode is a
conversation between two pharmacists, but probably not
the kind that you're used to. We're going to be talking today
about hope beyond the prescription pad.
My guest, Corey Jinx, is a fellow pharmacist.
(00:34):
He's also an improv comedian anda lifestyle coach.
And he's helping people reverse chronic illness not just with
medication, but with mindset, movement, meaning, and, yes,
laughter. Today, we're going to explore
together why the healthcare system in America is great at
managing disease, but not so great at restoring health and
(00:58):
vitality, and what you can do starting today to take ownership
of your body, your habits, and your future.
This isn't about guilt or shame.It's about freedom.
You're going to love what Corey has to say, so let's dive in.
I introduced to you my friend Corey Jinx.
(01:19):
Corey, brother, thank you so much for joining us today on the
Rev RX Podcast. Man, what a privilege it is to
have you here on the show. I followed you for a while and I
couldn't wait for this interview.
I know and it almost like it's taken like 3 times to happen.
So this is this is you know the best things are never easy.
That's right. We thought it would be easy,
everyone would do it, so here weare.
That means it's going to be extra epic, so yes.
(01:40):
Indeed. Well, man, you're a, you're a
baseball fan. You're a fellow pharmacist, your
comedian, which is which is awesome.
I love that. And really you're just an all
around great guy that you you'verealized that you need to carve
your own path sometimes in life.And I resonate 1000% with that.
So welcome to the show, Man up. Before we get into a lot of what
(02:03):
you're into, can you tell us a little bit about you, kind of
where you come from, a little bit about how you landed where
you are today? Yeah, well, it's a, it's AI did
a complete 360. So I grew up in Tucson, AZ.
I might, yeah. Baseball fan.
I played baseball in high school, not well enough to where
my chemistry teacher was like, what do you want to do with your
life? I said, I want to pitch for the
Cubs. And she said, no, you're not.
How about pharmacy? You're you like chemistry.
(02:24):
So I at 17 made the fateful choice to go to pharmacy to do
pharmacy. I, I went across the country,
the University of South Carolina, just for a little
adventure. And I love out of state tuition
and student loans. So no, it was a great choice.
Awesome. Six years, came back home to
Tucson, did a residency at the VA for a year and that was a
graduate, 11, finished residency12.
(02:45):
And then I have practiced as a pharmacist since.
I've done inpatient, outpatient,retail.
Right now I practice as an ambulatory care pharmacist.
So I do, for those who are not pharmacists listening to this,
we can function. Think of it like a physician's
assistant. So I have agreements with
doctors, I can write prescriptions and I basically
hone in on diabetes and obesity or my specialties.
(03:06):
That's really where my passion lies.
My wife's a nurse practitioner. She works for a company that
does diabetes and obesity management through lifestyle.
That's really my my biggest pushwith patients that that's the
professional side. So as you can see, 360 across
the country and back. Personally, I've done yeah, you
mentioned comedian. I feel like that is a subjective
description. Some may find me funny, some may
not. Depends on who you ask, right?
(03:27):
Yeah, exactly. It depends on what the audience
says, but I've done improv comedy since 2013, and I kind of
integrated that into my pharmacypractice in life.
And I think that's, you know, improv comedy are life skills.
We could all use listening, communication, teamwork,
empathy, all the stuff that healthcare does poorly that
angers us. So I try to implement that.
And then I'm a dad of three, basically, by the time you hear
(03:50):
this, I'll have a 7 year old, almost 5 year old and a almost 2
year old. So man, lots of fun.
And I think that probably gets, gets my description out in a
nutshell. And if I missed anything that
you've, you've done your homework on me.
If I miss something I can I can focus on it.
So well, and, and you know, there's a lot of commonalities
between us. Same thing here.
(04:11):
I played baseball in high schooland wanted to play in college
and and had a couple walk on opportunities.
But when I started in college, my my advisor basically told me,
OK, you can, I was pre Med at the time.
You can go pre Med or you can play baseball.
Which one you want to do? Like you missed the too many
labs and different things with baseball.
(04:31):
And yeah, I said, well, let's let's pursue pre Med.
And then I realized I don't liketouching people.
Oh my gosh, yeah. Same journey, yeah.
And I'm like, all right, pharmacy's cool.
And the rest is history. And, and yeah, you know, I, I
really love the whole lifestyle management and you and I've kind
of both talked about it. I tell people, you know, if I
could work myself out of a job as a pharmacist, man, I would be
(04:53):
thrilled because that means thatwe're getting healthy and that
means we don't need all of thesemedications.
Well, well, medications always have some role, probably, but
largely it becomes a crutch to us a lot of times, right?
I agree. I think that the I kind of
parallel this to like acute versus chronic issues.
Acutely, our healthcare system is really good.
(05:13):
If you get hit by a car, if you have some trauma, if you have an
infection, we're pretty darn good at fixing you up, keeping
you alive and and then getting you back to life.
But we do an awful job of chronically managing people.
And I feel like we chronically manage, we call it management.
I, I would like to reverse it. And I mean, I think the root of
a lot of this is metabolic syndrome, metabolic disease,
(05:35):
type 2 diabetes, insulin resistance, that really is the
root of many of our chronic ills.
And we do an awful job of, of helping people really gain their
life back. And for me, the the chronic
suffering that people have wheretheir lives revolve around being
overweight, being sick, low energy, low enjoyment of life
because your lives are revolvingaround pharmacy trips, checking
(05:57):
blood sugars, warning about blood sugars, blood pressures,
etc. We're awful at that.
And so I think that you and I are on the same page of the day
that I could leave work. And they say, Corey, there's no
more sick, chronically sick people.
I would say great. But also if my kid has a severe
infection, we're going to use anantibiotic.
So I think there's you can swingtoo far one way or another.
That's right. Of trying to be like super
(06:18):
holistic, like there's, there's times where a medicine's OK.
It's just that when the first thing we do when someone has a
little high blood sugar is reached for a prescription pad,
we're setting up them up for years of dependence on on a
system that's going to only kindof really more sick.
Exactly, Yeah. And I love the way you
differentiated that. The acute system is fantastic,
you know, and, and we all have experienced that I think to some
(06:41):
degree or another, some acute exacerbation and injury.
You know, something happens and,and you know, you go to the ER,
they fix you up, they get you back, you know, and, and you
know, even the surgical system and the way things operate that
way. I've been very pleased with the
American healthcare system from an acute standpoint.
I think where we have room to grow and maybe even reverse our
(07:02):
thinking is in that chronic management.
And so, you know, it's kind of that it's kind of the thought of
instead of prescribing a drug, prescribing lifestyle changes.
So a lot of the chronic disease states that we see and a lot of
what you focus on are similar things to what I focus on to
y'all work in a very similar, I guess program.
(07:24):
Yeah. And you know, it's one of those
situations where most of the risk factors and most of the
causes of those are lifestyle related.
And so it only makes sense that the cure the the healing would
take place from a lifestyle perspective too.
Can you can you elaborate a little bit on that and what your
general approach is as you see patients with diabetes and
(07:44):
obesity and kind of what the first step might look like?
I think the first step is to tell them to forgive themselves
because when we talk about a healthcare system that's that
does a poor job of making them managing their chronic illness,
they're not reversing it. I think we got to step back and
realize we live in a society andan environment that's designed
to make us sick. Now, I don't know about you, but
(08:04):
I like central air, I like pickup trucks and I like being
able to hit a button on my phoneand have food delivered to my
house in 30 minutes. These are things that people 152
hundred years ago would have like lump, like the richest
triple kings couldn't live like we do, right?
Unfortunately, the richest people, like the poorest people
could live like the richest people years ago and you can
have these delicious unhealthy things delivered to you.
(08:26):
You don't have to get out of your chair.
Like you drive down the road andthere's 17 fast food
restaurants, there's billboards,there's there's scientists
making food addicting. So I tell patients to really
beat themselves up. And I think one step thing I'll
say too is I think our healthcare system blames, does a
lot of patient blame. And the reality is like, it's
imagine someone who's stressed, working 2 jobs, terrible family
(08:47):
life, no relationships, no family support, and you ask them
to eat whole healthy organic foods.
It's like, that's crazy, right? Yeah.
So they're reaching for these comforts, whether it's their
phone, their Netflix, their, their, their fast food.
So the first thing I say is forgive yourself because there
are really smart people who usedto sell cigarettes, they're now
selling this. That being said, it's now your
(09:08):
responsibility with this knowledge to help come up with a
system and I'll help you build this environment to get
healthier. So I think the first thing I I
address is like the self hatred that people will have and have
some compassion and empathy for the situations that people are
in. And then it's what do you want
life to look like? Because some people will say, I
will never touch a weight, I will never go to the gym, I will
(09:29):
not move. I will take insulin and eat
cookies. And I say, all right, I can do
that. I can make your numbers look OK.
You will get sicker, you will get fatter.
And that is your choice. I cannot make you do anything.
It's really about figuring out their why and what they want
like to look like. And then from there, it's OK.
What are you willing to change? What would a different lifestyle
look like? What would that, you know, get
(09:50):
get you? So it's it's not the
paternalistic like you must do this.
It's the, well, what do you wantto do?
And then we'll help you get there.
And that's a, that's a paradigm shift a little bit from what we
traditionally think of as, you know, as, as the medical system
because it, there's a couple things that impact there.
I'd love to talk about #1 is that there is a lot of judgment
(10:12):
and shame when it comes to, OK, I have this chronic disease.
And, and I think number one, I love that you address that
first, because that needs to, you know, if, if they're in this
cycle of this perpetual judgmentand shame, self judgement, you
know, self hatred, whatever you want to call it, you know, I
can't believe I let myself get into this situation.
(10:34):
This is all my fault. You know, they're, they're never
going to have that breakthrough in my opinion.
And from what I've seen, becausethat cycle is just going to
continue. And, you know, they may show
some improvement, but the minutethat they go back, oh, look,
there's me again. I failed.
And so it's not that you failed.You're you're in a system that
doesn't support health. You know, when people when
(10:56):
people go on a diet, we feel like that's extreme.
When reality that's just eating normally.
Yeah, you know, we our. Our idea of normal eating has
been so hijacked and and messed up that like I, I healthy is
relative. Like you, there are people who
are healthy from the spectrum ofvegan, the carnivore.
So I'm not going to get into thediet.
(11:17):
I'm not going to get into the diet worse here, right?
There's a way of eating that many of us can follow and be
healthy. And I've seen all all ends of
the perspective. Sure, but when my wife and I
show up to, you know, walk around with kids, food for our
kids. And even when our our daughter
was a almost 8 year old and she started eating, we would just
give her small versions of real food and people were just like,
you're not giving her rice puffs.
(11:37):
I'm like, no, she can eat real food.
Like, and I'm not shaming peoplewho give rice puffs.
This is again not, but it's we're so conditioned to be like,
well, we obviously need to have a meal every two hours and we
obviously have to snack and we obviously have to have these
processed bags of stuff with us all the time.
And unfortunately, my wife and Iand A lot of our friends are in
(11:58):
a similar way where we'll make prepare most of our own food,
eating out some rare thing, but the norm is not that.
And so when you try to get away from that, people are just like,
how can you take away my fast food because it's not supposed
to have it? Like Taco Bells, I'm sorry if
they sponsor you, but like, you literally come up with a fourth
meal. They're like, we haven't made
people fat enough yet. We need to give them. 1/4 meal
(12:19):
like no. You don't, you don't even eat
burritos at 11:00 PM. So right.
It's it's, it's re shifting likewhat we consider normal.
And that's it's hard if all, andI'm 38 as we record this in
2025. So I grew up with fruit by the
foot and Gushers and Dunkaroos and all of the like yummy snack
foods, Saturday morning cartoonsand cereals.
(12:41):
And we just thought that was normal.
But then like our grandparents were like, what the heck are you
eating? Like.
Quiet old man, you don't know what you're talking about and
like. It's a new day.
They kind of they kind of did. So to buckle to buck the trend
of what is market to marketed tous as normal is hard.
Yeah, it is. And realizing that, realizing
(13:02):
that world that we that we are spending every day in and that
we're inundated, you know, with with the marketing and and we're
up against the best minds in theworld, you know, all of these
food companies. And this isn't a yeah, I'm not
my Taco Bell endorsement is pending currently.
So we're OK talking about that. All right.
Yeah. But but you know, like you were
inundated with commercials and marketing and the best minds in
(13:24):
the world that are creating these, you know, these slogans
in these campaigns. And sometimes it feels food.
Food products as I do air quotesfor those Yeah a.
Lot of what we eat isn't that's good.
A lot of what we eat isn't really food.
You know, it's edible. Sure.
Is it food? Probably not.
(13:45):
But you know, it's one of those things where the shame or
judgment really doesn't help, you know, So realizing where you
are and then realizing where youcan be.
Because I think there's also a misconception too about, OK,
once somebody has a diagnosis ofpre diabetes or type 2 diabetes,
well, I'm a quote diabetic and there's nothing I can do about
(14:10):
that. And here's the path that's going
to be laid out for me. And so being able to help
someone see the hope of, you know what?
You can control this. You don't have to just, you
know, and for some people it maylook different.
Every person has a different path.
But realizing that there is hopeof controlling that without the
insulin, without some of the other things that we have, Not
(14:30):
saying those things aren't greattools, but largely it can be.
I've seen it reversed and I knowyou have two with lifestyle
modifications. Yeah.
And I think that the big thing as you said is to give them the
option. I think many patients when they
get it, like I had a patient theother day who took his A1C from
14 to 5.9. Yeah, off of insulin now still
(14:53):
on a couple other medicines, butand he's like the doctor said,
most diabetics never get their sugar that low.
I'm like, well, why would you even say that?
Like you're, you're, you're, you're.
Setting them up to fail. Right.
You're giving them learned helplessness.
You're basically saying you don't have a chance of of fixing
this, so the best you can do is to just try to not be too sick.
And the guy is 39 years old too.Like he's got hopefully 40 more
years plus a life to live. And you're giving him this
(15:16):
decades long diagnosis and lack of hope.
And the number of times people have come into my office like
the doctor was mad at me, this I'm like, I get it because
doctors are burned out. They're angry, they're
frustrated. They're like you're, you're
basically tying people's hands behind their back with, with,
with giving, removing the optionof, of earning their, their,
(15:36):
their vibrancy back. And that, that to me, aside from
any medication, it's just one ofthe most egregious things that
I, that I come across and try to, as you say, give them the
path, give the whole give, just give them the option.
Yeah, give them the option. I love that.
And option is key because if we don't take the individual person
into consideration, and that's kind of always been the case
(15:56):
with medicine, we're seeing, I mentioned the paradigm shift a
little bit. We're seeing this become more
individualized because used to you go to the doctor and they
say you have this, here's your treatment, see you later, see
you in a month or whatever, you know, now, now we're kind of
more so taught to ask some of those questions.
So, you know, motivational interviewing or you know,
whatever you want to call it. But you know what, what are you?
(16:20):
What are you willing to do? Right?
You know, what can what can you do and not here's what you
should do because I think shouldas a shame based word.
Yeah. But what, what would that look
like for you? What are you willing to change?
What could change in your life? And what would that look like?
Because there is no one-size-fits-all option either.
You know, we're not going to getevery single person doing, you
(16:43):
know, four days a week, an hour in the gym, running two or three
miles a few times a week. Yeah, that's not doable for
everybody and so. Finding I don't have time to do
that. I don't either.
So I'm a dad of three, two and we're about the same age as
yours. So yeah, yeah, it's it's tough,
but realizing where they are giving them the option for where
(17:04):
they could be and saying what can you do to get there is is
powerful giving them that choice.
Yeah, to me, it's not about perfect health.
It's can we just stop making US sick?
Like here are the here are the three levers of poison you're
putting into your body. Can we stop one of the levers?
Can we stop two of the levers? Can can you not do the levers on
two of the days of the week? And and then from there, it's
(17:24):
just a matter of if they feel better doing that, they're like,
oh, I want to keep doing this. And one thing that I'll say, I
was just kind of noodling on this the other day.
I haven't trademarked this yet, but the idea of like the missing
macronutrient of the community and support and the number of
patients I come that come to me that are doing well until their
spouse, their families, like I make cookies and it's gonna hurt
my feelings if you don't eat these cookies or something to
(17:45):
something like that or you're getting too skinny.
And this person's still £250. They have another £100 to lose.
So I think that understanding the, the challenges they face
from not only like the, the world that we live in, but also
just think of their interpersonal relationships that
are sabotaging it too. It's there's a lot of forces
working against folks. And so if you can give them the
easiest, smallest steps to take.And Amy, in my mind, if everyone
(18:08):
that is taking insulin in this country, if we could get them to
take 10% less, how much better would they feel?
How much weight would lose? How much money would we save?
If we could get 10% less medication, just 10% like right,
that would be huge. It would be a big chunk of our,
of our giant healthcare budget. So yeah, versus this all our
nothing thinking like, well, if you can't totally reverse
diabetes with lifestyle, what's the point?
Like there's a lot of points. Yeah, it's not about perfection.
(18:32):
Yeah, it's about better. Yep.
It's about progress. And you know, a lot of that is,
you know, it's like if you're trying to lose weight, if you've
got £50 to lose, you're not going to lose 50 lbs all at one
time. You're going to lose it a pound
at a time. And realizing that that can take
time. And it's the same way with some
of this lifestyle, you know, lifestyle prescriptions, as I
(18:52):
call it. You know you're not going to
reverse it overnight, but can you be a little better tomorrow
than you were today? Yeah, and I think this is where
I kind of integrate some of the comedy that I've learned, like
one of the big lessons. That we next question.
Yeah, one, one of the lessons from, from improv comedy, like
like 2 words, yes. And is the main basis of improv
if you, you're nothing about it from this conversation.
(19:14):
So we agree and we built together essentially just means
we're listening. But one of the things that you
want to do on stage if you're doing a scene is to figure out
the person's why or the characters why.
Like what do they want? What do they want?
And if you can figure out what that person in front of you
wants, it's a much easier path because if you figure out that
they want nothing to do with lifestyle, I'm going to save my
breath. I'm going to be like here.
Listen, if you ever want to talkabout diet and exercise, I got
(19:35):
all kinds of and it sounds like you had nothing to do with that.
So here's, here's our options right now.
And it saves a lot of heartache too, because they feel hurt.
Like it's like that's the biggest thing is if you can make
that person, that patient, the client, whoever is in front of
you feel seen, heard and understood, they're going to be
more apt to trust you and listento you.
And that's, I think that was oneof the biggest things that I was
able to learn doing comedy is let and pharmacists are very
(19:58):
part of the pun here, prescriptive or very left
brained. We like things to be a certain
way. And I and letting go of that and
turning every interaction into sort of AI won't call it a game,
but it's kind of a fun scene. Every, every patient doesn't
realize they're in an improv scene with me and I'm just
listening and responding to themas best I can.
So yeah. And that's really that that goes
(20:19):
a long ways too, I think with patients because it it's not a
great experience. Let me just say this, It's not a
great experience going to the doctor, I mean.
It's not fun. You know, I've, I've never been
like, man, I can't wait to go to, you know, you might be
really sick and know that's going to make you feel better
because they're going to prescribe, you know, antibiotic
or whatever. That's a little different.
But you know, there's it's neverlike, man, I can't wait to go.
(20:42):
It's just such a fun journey. You know it There's again,
there's usually a lot of shame and judgment.
I'm not where I should be. I know that my doctor got mad at
me, whatever the case is. But you know what?
Making it a little more fun withcomedy, with making it about
that patient and their why. That goes a long ways towards
(21:03):
helping them reach their goals. Because now it's not something
they're doing out of shame and judgment, but it's something
that they're doing because hey, they've given me hope.
They understand me as a person and they've asked me what I
thought, which is sometimes unheard of in the medical field.
Oh, yeah, like the, the, the blank stares I get.
And I'm like, So what would you like to do?
And they're like, wait, what? I get to choose.
I'm like, Oh yeah. This is I came to you.
(21:24):
Don't you tell me I'm lazy. You you pick, you pick the
roads. I'll give you 3 roads.
You pick the one, I'll help you,I'll help you take it.
But I think it makes it more funto practice too.
I mean, this is more pharmacist,but this could be any profession
is if you are I I tell students that that are with me, that I'm
precept, I'm going in there and having a conversation and in the
course of this conversation, we're talking about their
grandkids, the sports opening day and the ones that want to
(21:47):
talk about politics. I'm like, all right, whatever,
but in the course of these conversations, I'm doing
pharmacy. I just don't make it the main
like the job gets done, but in not in a very like check boxy
way, because it's just I think they're going to be more apt to
share, listen and trust you if you're just going to talk to
them as a human. Yeah, conversations go a long
ways. Yeah, people like to be talked
(22:09):
with, not talked to exactly. So I appreciate you taking that
standpoint. I want to back up a little bit
because part of your story is very similar to mine in that you
went through pharmacy school, got your Pharm D.
Sure did. You had all the Student Loans,
(22:29):
so I went in state but at private school.
So OK, I'm with you. Yeah.
And now, you know, you graduated.
I realized the point where I'm like, all right, I graduated
$150,000 in student loan debt. I've started a job.
I started a job that, you know, I've kind of always, I couldn't
wait to get out of school to start a job, start making real
money. Oh, yeah.
And you know, I, I went to work every day and I didn't like it.
(22:54):
Yeah, to be honest. You know, I'm like, man, this is
this is what everyone told me would make me happy.
And I went to work every day andit was so stressful.
And it was, it was just not thatfulfilled feeling that I thought
I would. Have You had a similar moment
right? Yeah, I I would say that there's
(23:15):
a lot of promises made to pharmacy students, mostly
related to your income. Yeah.
But yeah, for me, it was a slow build to to realizing that I'm
going to work every day and I'm not really, you know, for you,
your environment working retail pharmacy was super stressful.
Yeah, stressful and probably notfeeling like you're making a
huge difference. For me, it is it has morphed
(23:37):
into, and I wouldn't say there was a Seminole moment, but it
has become a slow build of I went to school for all this
time. I'm spending all these hours at
this place. I'm doing all of these things
and when my patients are able todo lifestyle, they do, they do
better. But I'm doing all this work and
it feels like it's almost for nothing.
Like I tell my wife, it's like the metaphor metaphorically.
(23:59):
Like if you worked at a tire shop in a town called Nailville,
everyone's coming in and there'sjust, we're patching holes.
They're going out. And this just seems like, what
am I doing here? And maybe part of it's getting
older and realizing your time isfinite.
But I was just like, yeah, this is not.
I picked this thing at 17 because I couldn't play baseball
and I was good at science. And.
(24:19):
Right. Like I mean, I joke, I mean at
17 we can all there's so many bad paths people can take.
And my joke is like I took the darkest one.
See, it's like my friends. At least they were drinking and
having fun. Right.
Yeah, I should not have gotten. I'm glad it's not going down
those paths. That was a joke.
Remember, I'm a comedian. But it's, it's been sort of like
(24:39):
I, I don't feel like all of thiswork has made a huge dent in
other people's lives. And so that's where integrating
comedy into what I'm doing, writing a couple books and now
the building a diabetes coachingprogram with another pharmacist
who feels the same way is, is the path that I'm taking.
And I, I applaud because there'smany pharmacists and many people
(25:00):
in different jobs that or just like, I don't like this.
I really hate it. Paycheck's good.
So I'm just going to stuff it down, stuff those feelings down,
let it eat me from the inside, right?
But I mean, my biggest thing I, I, I guess not a silly reason,
but a deeper reason is we have kids.
You have kids, three kids, all right, team outnumbered team's
own defense right on. That's right, you tell them grow
(25:23):
up and work hard and you can do it.
Do what it be whatever you want to be.
And if they see me going to workand hating my life, they're
going to say, dad, why don't youdo what you want to do?
You want a hypocrite and I will just have to eat it versus, you
know, like a few years ago, I quit my full time government job
and went and worked, started working part time doing the same
sort of work, having more time with my kids, having more time
(25:44):
to record podcasts without some hosts like you write books and
and pursue these things that aremore meaningful.
And it is a very unconventional thing to do.
But I will say that every older person I talked to was like, oh,
you'll never regret having that time with your kids.
And yeah, my wife, my wife said you're you're happier, which is
great. It means that I'm happy around
my family, my kids, which I've really diverged off the initial
(26:05):
kind of question there, but. No, that's.
It the deeper reasons as to why you would walk away from
something that is, relative to the average American income,
very lucrative. But if you hate it, what's the
point? You don't get a reward on your
deathbed for like making a lot of money and hating it.
Right. And that's the thing too is I
(26:26):
think there's a lot of listenersthat are that are hearing this
today and they're nodding their heads when you're talking about,
I go to work every day and I hate it.
I think there's a, there's a, there's just a resonance with
that. There's so many people that
aren't living their dream life and you've, you've kind of
(26:47):
turned it around and you've carved out, you know, that a
life for yourself that you enjoy.
And you know, I've, I've done something similar in it and it
looks a little different, but I,I've made several career moves
and every career move I've made has been a significant, a
significant hit to my income. I feel, yeah.
(27:08):
Every single move, but every single move has been an
improvement to my quality of life and the time I have with my
kids and the time I have with myfamily.
And you know, that's really what's been so meaningful to me
is finding that, you know, finding that thing that makes
you happy and pushing through. Yeah.
One of the ways that you describe that that that you're
(27:32):
well adept to, to kind of go through these 4 stages of
contentment. I really find those to be
ingenious to be honest with you because you put in the words
some things with it. We oftentimes think and maybe
not be able to verbalize. Can you walk through that a
little bit and talk about how tobreakthrough those stages?
(27:53):
Yeah, those like 4 walls of convention you were.
Yeah. So we have our expectations,
norms, habits and limits. So like the expectations are
basically what society expects of us.
Maybe what your parents did, maybe what your peers.
And so like, oh, man, I, I'm supposed to go to college, get
this job, make this money. And my parents were teachers.
So when I, yeah, you know, told them I have a pharmacy job and
(28:15):
this is what I make, they were like, oh, well, it must be nice.
It is. But you also had summers off.
So yeah, let's not forget, forget about that.
So it's really hard to overcome those expectations, but it
becomes more about do you care what others think or expect?
Or do you care what you expect? And then the norms like blindly
following the rules, who, who, who made those rules, right?
Who made that 4th meal? Who said we have to snack all
(28:35):
day? You know, taking it back to the,
to the lifestyle approach. And then habits.
I, I think we get stuck in these, these patterns over and
over and over again. And then we're like, why am I
unhappy? I'm doing the same thing over
and over again. I'm still unhappy.
So that that definition of insanity is doing the same
thing, expecting something different.
And then the limits. And then these limits can come
from sort of those outside expectations, but we can also
(28:58):
put those on ourselves and Oh, I'm not good enough.
I can't do this. And I Kali, it's just like every
every Disney movie, every hero'sjourney is the protagonist
doesn't believe they can do it. They find a guide or they find
it within themselves that they can do it.
And they're like, Oh my gosh, I was able to do it.
And so that is that is that sortof missing macro of community or
(29:21):
support of like imagine that youwanted to make a career move,
but your wife said, oh, Chad, you can't do that.
There's no we need that money. You got to suck it up.
Or you know, if your family members are like, you're crazy.
And I know that when I left my stable full time government job
to work part time for a private company like but your pension,
but your health, I'm like, I know, I know, I know, I know,
(29:44):
stop, stop reminding me of the of the dollar signs that I'm
leaving behind. But right, right.
The but the limits of you can't,can't reverse diabetes.
You can't do this. Well, who says?
And I don't want to listen to those limits.
So and it's, I mean they're ingrated us from a from a young
age and as parents, I'm very careful.
My wife and I are very careful about what we say to our kids
(30:05):
around our kids, what you can do, what you can't do.
And realizing that man, like there's life is competition.
You played sports, there's the other team, but man, every,
every competition is really within your own brain.
Like you're, if you can overcomeyourself, there really isn't
anything that you can't accomplish on on sort of an
outside level. And it, it seems so simple.
(30:26):
It seems so simple, but then youyou get into it and you're like,
oh wow, I really am sabotaging myself with how I'm thinking and
then acting. Yeah, mindset is key.
And in the older I get, I'm a little older than you, Corey.
I'm 41, OK. And you know, the older I get, I
like to think I'm wiser. I'm not sure about that, but.
(30:48):
I I'll I'll vouch you, you definitely have that air of
wisdom, that many you're 41 there's.
It's the Gray hairs, isn't? It listen, I'm gonna call out my
parents generation of the boomers like I feel like you can
be old and not wise and you can be younger and wise and I
there's a lot of older people who aren't wise anymore.
But anyway, the older you get. I, I I interrupted my.
So yeah, no, I appreciate it. The older I get, the more that I
(31:11):
realize the truth in what you just said, that there are these
expectations that are put on us sometimes by ourselves.
But you know, it, it's like, allright, I'm doing the thing.
Going back to when I realized, OK, I, I can't do retail
pharmacy forever to become a jaded, angry old man like every
(31:33):
other person I worked with. You know, when I realized that
I'm like, I, I've done the very thing that the world, whoever
the world is, the world told me that I needed to do to be happy.
And I realized the emptiness in that.
And you know what, I think a lotof people get stuck in that we
(31:55):
do the things that are expected of us.
We, we have these conventional thoughts, conventional habits,
conventional ideas that we try to, you know, nobody wants to be
radical. We're going to walk the path and
we've got to do the things and yeah, but but then realizing
that, you know what, that may not be your path.
That may not be the path that's going to lead you to life of, of
(32:19):
joy, right? That may not be what's going to
fulfill you and leave you satisfied at the end of the day.
And realizing we only get one ofthese.
We get, we get, we get one trip,you know the end.
I want to make that count and I only don't want to make that
count, but I want to make sure that like I'm doing what brings
me fulfillment and satisfaction.Otherwise, what's the point,
(32:42):
right? And so I love that that you have
had the and honestly, like in today's world with all of these
conventional thoughts and ideas and expectations, it takes guts,
you know, call it what you want to, but we'll just call it for
this purpose. It takes guts to to step outside
of those conventions and carve your own path.
(33:04):
Yeah. It takes guts to, you know, to
say, you know what? I'm going to give up that
pension. I'm going to give up whatever it
is. Yeah, you're reminding me.
What about this? What about this?
I haven't forgotten about it. Didn't make this decision
because I wasn't aware of that. Right.
But what I'm saying is that there are things that are more
important to me than that. So really when it comes down to
it, Corey, it seems to be about priorities.
(33:25):
Is that an accurate statement for what you've been through?
I would say so. And I think there there's a
couple thoughts that come to mind.
I think it's priorities. It's understanding the season of
life that I'm in. So you know, with young kids,
they will get older and become angry teenagers that want
nothing to do with me. And if I want to go make more
money while they're off with their friends, then there's a
chance to I can do go do that Right now.
(33:46):
They seem to really like me. So I'm going to lean into that
and as a parent, having more time to be with them and
selfishly sort of influence themand guide them when they're
still more apt listening. And another that comes to mind
like walking away from a air quote.
Sure thing. I think I'm going to, I'll bring
a lesson of comedy back into this.
(34:06):
And I think the best comedies are ones that have a strong, we
call it base reality. So think of Seinfeld.
It's the show where there's simple relationships or, or the
office. It's set in an office, but
within it there's a lot of like variety and difference and
things that can really pop. So for us, like we work jobs,
like I still have AW two job. We have to pay bills.
(34:26):
We can't ignore that. We, you know, the dream life.
I'm just going to move on an island and.
Right. No, they're they're.
We're still logically going through life and doing the
things we have to do, paying bills, taking care of our
health, taking care of ourselves.
But within that there is room now to maneuver and build
something on our own that will help support our reality and
also bring that deeper meaning. And as you say, the priority of,
(34:49):
of making an impact like climbing up I, I'm fortunate
enough to have been able to climb up Maslow's hierarchy to
get to that point where I want to fulfill something more
fulfilling. Personally, if something were to
happen in life and I had to go back to full time pharmacy and
do something I didn't really love, but it meant that we had
shelter and food, then I do thatand I've acknowledged that like
(35:09):
that. And I, that's a possibility.
Like I maybe when I'm 65, I'll have regretted this choice at
38. But for now, this is, this is
the season we're in. This is the priority and this is
the the way we're choosing to live life.
Yeah, yeah. I love that.
And that's really encouraging for those people out there.
And it's not saying that we're not telling everybody go quit
your job. Oh, no, go part time, you know?
(35:30):
Yeah. But what we're saying is is
this, you know, what brings you satisfaction and fulfillment, It
might just be worth it to pursuethat.
And in your life's an illustration of that as well.
Thank you. Yeah, yeah.
It's cool to talk to other folkswith the, with the, with the
who've had the similar like, Oh my gosh, do something different.
It's scary, but. We'll be it is it can be scary
(35:53):
and you know, each each step of my journey has been scary and
here I am, you know, podcasting,you know, never thought I'd be
doing that and starting a men's coaching business.
Never thought. I mean, I just need one more
thing to do right? And, you know, but it there,
there's something about steppinginto your purpose and you can
(36:14):
you can fulfill that in a lot ofdifferent ways.
But but that's what I'm after. That's what you're after.
And man, this has been fun. Yeah, we talked about a lot of
different things that way. A.
Lot of ground, yeah, there's, there's a lot, there's a lot.
There's a lot of depth and variety to life.
And you've in 30 to 35 minutes, we've gone through a bunch.
I I appreciate you shepherding me through so much valuable
(36:36):
information and valuable approaches and mindset to life.
Yeah, we'll have to do around 2 sometime.
Man, this has been fun. I want to kind of.
So we talked about lifestyle management of chronic disease.
We talked about, you know, food,exercise, those sort of things.
We talked about life. We talked about fulfilling your,
your, you know, your passion, your purpose.
(36:59):
What would be something you wantto leave my audience with,
Corey? It can be something related to
those things. It could be something funny.
I just, and I don't usually do this, but I just feel LED, you
know, you're you're such an interesting guy.
I feel like that you have so many strengths.
But what would be your closing remarks to our audience today?
I think you got to figure out what's important and don't be
(37:20):
afraid to, to, to do what's important to you.
And that to me, for me, it's like #1 family slash health and
getting, you know, getting into sort of some of the nitty gritty
of like, you know, societal expectations.
We don't drive nice cars. We have a modest house, but it's
allowed us to have more time. And this is train of thought
(37:41):
going here, but, you know, figuring out what's important to
you. And then to me, it's owning your
time, owning your time as much as you can.
And that's been the blessing that we've found ourselves with
life. I, I, you mentioned like
building a dream life. I literally told my wife last
week, Oh my gosh, we're living our dream life like it was a
Thursday like this. We went to the library, we went
(38:03):
to the bank with our kids. We ran some errands at Home
Depot, but we had the freedom todo it at the end of the day.
Like we played indoor, like indoor kickball because we let
our kids play ball in the house because that's that's a priority
for me is letting them be active.
And I was laying down at 9:00. I was like, Oh my gosh, it's
Thursday. We hung out all day.
We didn't have stress. Like it was a day she was off
from work. I don't work Thursdays usually.
(38:23):
It's like this is a dream life. So your dream life is closer
than you think. Go get it.
I love it. And that reminds me that, you
know, sometimes trade-offs, there's trade-offs with
everything. So make sure you're looking at
what you're trading, yes, for the life that you're living.
So Corey, man, this has been awesome.
Can you tell our listeners whereto find out more about you and
(38:43):
how to enter into your world? Yeah, go to Corey Jenks calm and
it's my parents were cheap so noIan Corey CORYJENKS calm so.
He sold separately. They didn't buy the vial there,
but if you go there, you can youcan sign up for my newsletter
get get to me on the various social medias that I admittedly
don't post a lot on. But if you find me there, send
(39:03):
me a message. And if something resonated with
you great, positive or negative,I don't care.
I'm always looking to hear what people are are thinking of of my
approach to life. But I appreciate your giving
sharing your platform with me. If you go to my website, I have
written a couple books. I have a healthcare book and a
dad book so you can find it all from the website there too.
Yeah, I love it. And and I'm all about both of
(39:24):
those things. So yeah, I can attest.
Corey's a a man just full of knowledge about all kinds of
different things. And you're, you're doing
important work, my friend. So keep it up.
And I hope you have a blessed one, man.
Likewise. Thank you for listening to the
Rev RX Podcast. We hope you enjoyed what you
heard today and if so, we'd loveit if you would hit that
subscribe button so that you'll never miss a new episode from
(39:45):
us. Also, feel free to leave us
reviews and comments as we'd love to hear from you.
Be blessed and be the very best you.
Hello and welcome back to another episode of the Rev RX
Podcast where we show you how tothrive in faith, family, and
health. My name is Chad Potts, and I'm
your host. Today's episode is a
conversation between two pharmacists, but probably not
the kind that you're used to. We're going to be talking today
about hope beyond the prescription pad.
My guest, Corey Jinx, is a fellow pharmacist.
(00:34):
He's also an improv comedian anda lifestyle coach.
And he's helping people reverse chronic illness not just with
medication, but with mindset, movement, meaning, and, yes,
laughter. Today, we're going to explore
together why the healthcare system in America is great at
managing disease, but not so great at restoring health and
(00:58):
vitality, and what you can do starting today to take ownership
of your body, your habits, and your future.
This isn't about guilt or shame.It's about freedom.
You're going to love what Corey has to say, so let's dive in.
I introduced to you my friend Corey Jinx.
(01:19):
Corey, brother, thank you so much for joining us today on the
Rev RX Podcast. Man, what a privilege it is to
have you here on the show. I followed you for a while and I
couldn't wait for this interview.
I know and it almost like it's taken like 3 times to happen.
So this is this is you know the best things are never easy.
That's right. We thought it would be easy,
everyone would do it, so here weare.
That means it's going to be extra epic, so yes.
(01:40):
Indeed. Well, man, you're a, you're a
baseball fan. You're a fellow pharmacist, your
comedian, which is which is awesome.
I love that. And really you're just an all
around great guy that you you'verealized that you need to carve
your own path sometimes in life.And I resonate 1000% with that.
So welcome to the show, Man up. Before we get into a lot of what
(02:03):
you're into, can you tell us a little bit about you, kind of
where you come from, a little bit about how you landed where
you are today? Yeah, well, it's a, it's AI did
a complete 360. So I grew up in Tucson, AZ.
I might, yeah. Baseball fan.
I played baseball in high school, not well enough to where
my chemistry teacher was like, what do you want to do with your
life? I said, I want to pitch for the
Cubs. And she said, no, you're not.
How about pharmacy? You're you like chemistry.
(02:24):
So I at 17 made the fateful choice to go to pharmacy to do
pharmacy. I, I went across the country,
the University of South Carolina, just for a little
adventure. And I love out of state tuition
and student loans. So no, it was a great choice.
Awesome. Six years, came back home to
Tucson, did a residency at the VA for a year and that was a
graduate, 11, finished residency12.
(02:45):
And then I have practiced as a pharmacist since.
I've done inpatient, outpatient,retail.
Right now I practice as an ambulatory care pharmacist.
So I do, for those who are not pharmacists listening to this,
we can function. Think of it like a physician's
assistant. So I have agreements with
doctors, I can write prescriptions and I basically
hone in on diabetes and obesity or my specialties.
(03:06):
That's really where my passion lies.
My wife's a nurse practitioner. She works for a company that
does diabetes and obesity management through lifestyle.
That's really my my biggest pushwith patients that that's the
professional side. So as you can see, 360 across
the country and back. Personally, I've done yeah, you
mentioned comedian. I feel like that is a subjective
description. Some may find me funny, some may
not. Depends on who you ask, right?
(03:27):
Yeah, exactly. It depends on what the audience
says, but I've done improv comedy since 2013, and I kind of
integrated that into my pharmacypractice in life.
And I think that's, you know, improv comedy are life skills.
We could all use listening, communication, teamwork,
empathy, all the stuff that healthcare does poorly that
angers us. So I try to implement that.
And then I'm a dad of three, basically, by the time you hear
(03:50):
this, I'll have a 7 year old, almost 5 year old and a almost 2
year old. So man, lots of fun.
And I think that probably gets, gets my description out in a
nutshell. And if I missed anything that
you've, you've done your homework on me.
If I miss something I can I can focus on it.
So well, and, and you know, there's a lot of commonalities
between us. Same thing here.
(04:11):
I played baseball in high schooland wanted to play in college
and and had a couple walk on opportunities.
But when I started in college, my my advisor basically told me,
OK, you can, I was pre Med at the time.
You can go pre Med or you can play baseball.
Which one you want to do? Like you missed the too many
labs and different things with baseball.
(04:31):
And yeah, I said, well, let's let's pursue pre Med.
And then I realized I don't liketouching people.
Oh my gosh, yeah. Same journey, yeah.
And I'm like, all right, pharmacy's cool.
And the rest is history. And, and yeah, you know, I, I
really love the whole lifestyle management and you and I've kind
of both talked about it. I tell people, you know, if I
could work myself out of a job as a pharmacist, man, I would be
(04:53):
thrilled because that means thatwe're getting healthy and that
means we don't need all of thesemedications.
Well, well, medications always have some role, probably, but
largely it becomes a crutch to us a lot of times, right?
I agree. I think that the I kind of
parallel this to like acute versus chronic issues.
Acutely, our healthcare system is really good.
(05:13):
If you get hit by a car, if you have some trauma, if you have an
infection, we're pretty darn good at fixing you up, keeping
you alive and and then getting you back to life.
But we do an awful job of chronically managing people.
And I feel like we chronically manage, we call it management.
I, I would like to reverse it. And I mean, I think the root of
a lot of this is metabolic syndrome, metabolic disease,
(05:35):
type 2 diabetes, insulin resistance, that really is the
root of many of our chronic ills.
And we do an awful job of, of helping people really gain their
life back. And for me, the the chronic
suffering that people have wheretheir lives revolve around being
overweight, being sick, low energy, low enjoyment of life
because your lives are revolvingaround pharmacy trips, checking
(05:57):
blood sugars, warning about blood sugars, blood pressures,
etc. We're awful at that.
And so I think that you and I are on the same page of the day
that I could leave work. And they say, Corey, there's no
more sick, chronically sick people.
I would say great. But also if my kid has a severe
infection, we're going to use anantibiotic.
So I think there's you can swingtoo far one way or another.
That's right. Of trying to be like super
(06:18):
holistic, like there's, there's times where a medicine's OK.
It's just that when the first thing we do when someone has a
little high blood sugar is reached for a prescription pad,
we're setting up them up for years of dependence on on a
system that's going to only kindof really more sick.
Exactly, Yeah. And I love the way you
differentiated that. The acute system is fantastic,
you know, and, and we all have experienced that I think to some
(06:41):
degree or another, some acute exacerbation and injury.
You know, something happens and,and you know, you go to the ER,
they fix you up, they get you back, you know, and, and you
know, even the surgical system and the way things operate that
way. I've been very pleased with the
American healthcare system from an acute standpoint.
I think where we have room to grow and maybe even reverse our
(07:02):
thinking is in that chronic management.
And so, you know, it's kind of that it's kind of the thought of
instead of prescribing a drug, prescribing lifestyle changes.
So a lot of the chronic disease states that we see and a lot of
what you focus on are similar things to what I focus on to
y'all work in a very similar, I guess program.
(07:24):
Yeah. And you know, it's one of those
situations where most of the risk factors and most of the
causes of those are lifestyle related.
And so it only makes sense that the cure the the healing would
take place from a lifestyle perspective too.
Can you can you elaborate a little bit on that and what your
general approach is as you see patients with diabetes and
(07:44):
obesity and kind of what the first step might look like?
I think the first step is to tell them to forgive themselves
because when we talk about a healthcare system that's that
does a poor job of making them managing their chronic illness,
they're not reversing it. I think we got to step back and
realize we live in a society andan environment that's designed
to make us sick. Now, I don't know about you, but
(08:04):
I like central air, I like pickup trucks and I like being
able to hit a button on my phoneand have food delivered to my
house in 30 minutes. These are things that people 152
hundred years ago would have like lump, like the richest
triple kings couldn't live like we do, right?
Unfortunately, the richest people, like the poorest people
could live like the richest people years ago and you can
have these delicious unhealthy things delivered to you.
(08:26):
You don't have to get out of your chair.
Like you drive down the road andthere's 17 fast food
restaurants, there's billboards,there's there's scientists
making food addicting. So I tell patients to really
beat themselves up. And I think one step thing I'll
say too is I think our healthcare system blames, does a
lot of patient blame. And the reality is like, it's
imagine someone who's stressed, working 2 jobs, terrible family
(08:47):
life, no relationships, no family support, and you ask them
to eat whole healthy organic foods.
It's like, that's crazy, right? Yeah.
So they're reaching for these comforts, whether it's their
phone, their Netflix, their, their, their fast food.
So the first thing I say is forgive yourself because there
are really smart people who usedto sell cigarettes, they're now
selling this. That being said, it's now your
(09:08):
responsibility with this knowledge to help come up with a
system and I'll help you build this environment to get
healthier. So I think the first thing I I
address is like the self hatred that people will have and have
some compassion and empathy for the situations that people are
in. And then it's what do you want
life to look like? Because some people will say, I
will never touch a weight, I will never go to the gym, I will
(09:29):
not move. I will take insulin and eat
cookies. And I say, all right, I can do
that. I can make your numbers look OK.
You will get sicker, you will get fatter.
And that is your choice. I cannot make you do anything.
It's really about figuring out their why and what they want
like to look like. And then from there, it's OK.
What are you willing to change? What would a different lifestyle
look like? What would that, you know, get
(09:50):
get you? So it's it's not the
paternalistic like you must do this.
It's the, well, what do you wantto do?
And then we'll help you get there.
And that's a, that's a paradigm shift a little bit from what we
traditionally think of as, you know, as, as the medical system
because it, there's a couple things that impact there.
I'd love to talk about #1 is that there is a lot of judgment
(10:12):
and shame when it comes to, OK, I have this chronic disease.
And, and I think number one, I love that you address that
first, because that needs to, you know, if, if they're in this
cycle of this perpetual judgmentand shame, self judgement, you
know, self hatred, whatever you want to call it, you know, I
can't believe I let myself get into this situation.
(10:34):
This is all my fault. You know, they're, they're never
going to have that breakthrough in my opinion.
And from what I've seen, becausethat cycle is just going to
continue. And, you know, they may show
some improvement, but the minutethat they go back, oh, look,
there's me again. I failed.
And so it's not that you failed.You're you're in a system that
doesn't support health. You know, when people when
(10:56):
people go on a diet, we feel like that's extreme.
When reality that's just eating normally.
Yeah, you know, we our. Our idea of normal eating has
been so hijacked and and messed up that like I, I healthy is
relative. Like you, there are people who
are healthy from the spectrum ofvegan, the carnivore.
So I'm not going to get into thediet.
(11:17):
I'm not going to get into the diet worse here, right?
There's a way of eating that many of us can follow and be
healthy. And I've seen all all ends of
the perspective. Sure, but when my wife and I
show up to, you know, walk around with kids, food for our
kids. And even when our our daughter
was a almost 8 year old and she started eating, we would just
give her small versions of real food and people were just like,
you're not giving her rice puffs.
(11:37):
I'm like, no, she can eat real food.
Like, and I'm not shaming peoplewho give rice puffs.
This is again not, but it's we're so conditioned to be like,
well, we obviously need to have a meal every two hours and we
obviously have to snack and we obviously have to have these
processed bags of stuff with us all the time.
And unfortunately, my wife and Iand A lot of our friends are in
(11:58):
a similar way where we'll make prepare most of our own food,
eating out some rare thing, but the norm is not that.
And so when you try to get away from that, people are just like,
how can you take away my fast food because it's not supposed
to have it? Like Taco Bells, I'm sorry if
they sponsor you, but like, you literally come up with a fourth
meal. They're like, we haven't made
people fat enough yet. We need to give them. 1/4 meal
(12:19):
like no. You don't, you don't even eat
burritos at 11:00 PM. So right.
It's it's, it's re shifting likewhat we consider normal.
And that's it's hard if all, andI'm 38 as we record this in
2025. So I grew up with fruit by the
foot and Gushers and Dunkaroos and all of the like yummy snack
foods, Saturday morning cartoonsand cereals.
(12:41):
And we just thought that was normal.
But then like our grandparents were like, what the heck are you
eating? Like.
Quiet old man, you don't know what you're talking about and
like. It's a new day.
They kind of they kind of did. So to buckle to buck the trend
of what is market to marketed tous as normal is hard.
Yeah, it is. And realizing that, realizing
(13:02):
that world that we that we are spending every day in and that
we're inundated, you know, with with the marketing and and we're
up against the best minds in theworld, you know, all of these
food companies. And this isn't a yeah, I'm not
my Taco Bell endorsement is pending currently.
So we're OK talking about that. All right.
Yeah. But but you know, like you were
inundated with commercials and marketing and the best minds in
(13:24):
the world that are creating these, you know, these slogans
in these campaigns. And sometimes it feels food.
Food products as I do air quotesfor those Yeah a.
Lot of what we eat isn't that's good.
A lot of what we eat isn't really food.
You know, it's edible. Sure.
Is it food? Probably not.
(13:45):
But you know, it's one of those things where the shame or
judgment really doesn't help, you know, So realizing where you
are and then realizing where youcan be.
Because I think there's also a misconception too about, OK,
once somebody has a diagnosis ofpre diabetes or type 2 diabetes,
well, I'm a quote diabetic and there's nothing I can do about
(14:10):
that. And here's the path that's going
to be laid out for me. And so being able to help
someone see the hope of, you know what?
You can control this. You don't have to just, you
know, and for some people it maylook different.
Every person has a different path.
But realizing that there is hopeof controlling that without the
insulin, without some of the other things that we have, Not
(14:30):
saying those things aren't greattools, but largely it can be.
I've seen it reversed and I knowyou have two with lifestyle
modifications. Yeah.
And I think that the big thing as you said is to give them the
option. I think many patients when they
get it, like I had a patient theother day who took his A1C from
14 to 5.9. Yeah, off of insulin now still
(14:53):
on a couple other medicines, butand he's like the doctor said,
most diabetics never get their sugar that low.
I'm like, well, why would you even say that?
Like you're, you're, you're, you're.
Setting them up to fail. Right.
You're giving them learned helplessness.
You're basically saying you don't have a chance of of fixing
this, so the best you can do is to just try to not be too sick.
And the guy is 39 years old too.Like he's got hopefully 40 more
years plus a life to live. And you're giving him this
(15:16):
decades long diagnosis and lack of hope.
And the number of times people have come into my office like
the doctor was mad at me, this I'm like, I get it because
doctors are burned out. They're angry, they're
frustrated. They're like you're, you're
basically tying people's hands behind their back with, with,
with giving, removing the optionof, of earning their, their,
(15:36):
their vibrancy back. And that, that to me, aside from
any medication, it's just one ofthe most egregious things that
I, that I come across and try to, as you say, give them the
path, give the whole give, just give them the option.
Yeah, give them the option. I love that.
And option is key because if we don't take the individual person
into consideration, and that's kind of always been the case
(15:56):
with medicine, we're seeing, I mentioned the paradigm shift a
little bit. We're seeing this become more
individualized because used to you go to the doctor and they
say you have this, here's your treatment, see you later, see
you in a month or whatever, you know, now, now we're kind of
more so taught to ask some of those questions.
So, you know, motivational interviewing or you know,
whatever you want to call it. But you know what, what are you?
(16:20):
What are you willing to do? Right?
You know, what can what can you do and not here's what you
should do because I think shouldas a shame based word.
Yeah. But what, what would that look
like for you? What are you willing to change?
What could change in your life? And what would that look like?
Because there is no one-size-fits-all option either.
You know, we're not going to getevery single person doing, you
(16:43):
know, four days a week, an hour in the gym, running two or three
miles a few times a week. Yeah, that's not doable for
everybody and so. Finding I don't have time to do
that. I don't either.
So I'm a dad of three, two and we're about the same age as
yours. So yeah, yeah, it's it's tough,
but realizing where they are giving them the option for where
(17:04):
they could be and saying what can you do to get there is is
powerful giving them that choice.
Yeah, to me, it's not about perfect health.
It's can we just stop making US sick?
Like here are the here are the three levers of poison you're
putting into your body. Can we stop one of the levers?
Can we stop two of the levers? Can can you not do the levers on
two of the days of the week? And and then from there, it's
(17:24):
just a matter of if they feel better doing that, they're like,
oh, I want to keep doing this. And one thing that I'll say, I
was just kind of noodling on this the other day.
I haven't trademarked this yet, but the idea of like the missing
macronutrient of the community and support and the number of
patients I come that come to me that are doing well until their
spouse, their families, like I make cookies and it's gonna hurt
my feelings if you don't eat these cookies or something to
(17:45):
something like that or you're getting too skinny.
And this person's still £250. They have another £100 to lose.
So I think that understanding the, the challenges they face
from not only like the, the world that we live in, but also
just think of their interpersonal relationships that
are sabotaging it too. It's there's a lot of forces
working against folks. And so if you can give them the
easiest, smallest steps to take.And Amy, in my mind, if everyone
(18:08):
that is taking insulin in this country, if we could get them to
take 10% less, how much better would they feel?
How much weight would lose? How much money would we save?
If we could get 10% less medication, just 10% like right,
that would be huge. It would be a big chunk of our,
of our giant healthcare budget. So yeah, versus this all our
nothing thinking like, well, if you can't totally reverse
diabetes with lifestyle, what's the point?
Like there's a lot of points. Yeah, it's not about perfection.
(18:32):
Yeah, it's about better. Yep.
It's about progress. And you know, a lot of that is,
you know, it's like if you're trying to lose weight, if you've
got £50 to lose, you're not going to lose 50 lbs all at one
time. You're going to lose it a pound
at a time. And realizing that that can take
time. And it's the same way with some
of this lifestyle, you know, lifestyle prescriptions, as I
(18:52):
call it. You know you're not going to
reverse it overnight, but can you be a little better tomorrow
than you were today? Yeah, and I think this is where
I kind of integrate some of the comedy that I've learned, like
one of the big lessons. That we next question.
Yeah, one, one of the lessons from, from improv comedy, like
like 2 words, yes. And is the main basis of improv
if you, you're nothing about it from this conversation.
(19:14):
So we agree and we built together essentially just means
we're listening. But one of the things that you
want to do on stage if you're doing a scene is to figure out
the person's why or the characters why.
Like what do they want? What do they want?
And if you can figure out what that person in front of you
wants, it's a much easier path because if you figure out that
they want nothing to do with lifestyle, I'm going to save my
breath. I'm going to be like here.
Listen, if you ever want to talkabout diet and exercise, I got
(19:35):
all kinds of and it sounds like you had nothing to do with that.
So here's, here's our options right now.
And it saves a lot of heartache too, because they feel hurt.
Like it's like that's the biggest thing is if you can make
that person, that patient, the client, whoever is in front of
you feel seen, heard and understood, they're going to be
more apt to trust you and listento you.
And that's, I think that was oneof the biggest things that I was
able to learn doing comedy is let and pharmacists are very
(19:58):
part of the pun here, prescriptive or very left
brained. We like things to be a certain
way. And I and letting go of that and
turning every interaction into sort of AI won't call it a game,
but it's kind of a fun scene. Every, every patient doesn't
realize they're in an improv scene with me and I'm just
listening and responding to themas best I can.
So yeah. And that's really that that goes
(20:19):
a long ways too, I think with patients because it it's not a
great experience. Let me just say this, It's not a
great experience going to the doctor, I mean.
It's not fun. You know, I've, I've never been
like, man, I can't wait to go to, you know, you might be
really sick and know that's going to make you feel better
because they're going to prescribe, you know, antibiotic
or whatever. That's a little different.
But you know, there's it's neverlike, man, I can't wait to go.
(20:42):
It's just such a fun journey. You know it There's again,
there's usually a lot of shame and judgment.
I'm not where I should be. I know that my doctor got mad at
me, whatever the case is. But you know what?
Making it a little more fun withcomedy, with making it about
that patient and their why. That goes a long ways towards
(21:03):
helping them reach their goals. Because now it's not something
they're doing out of shame and judgment, but it's something
that they're doing because hey, they've given me hope.
They understand me as a person and they've asked me what I
thought, which is sometimes unheard of in the medical field.
Oh, yeah, like the, the, the blank stares I get.
And I'm like, So what would you like to do?
And they're like, wait, what? I get to choose.
I'm like, Oh yeah. This is I came to you.
(21:24):
Don't you tell me I'm lazy. You you pick, you pick the
roads. I'll give you 3 roads.
You pick the one, I'll help you,I'll help you take it.
But I think it makes it more funto practice too.
I mean, this is more pharmacist,but this could be any profession
is if you are I I tell students that that are with me, that I'm
precept, I'm going in there and having a conversation and in the
course of this conversation, we're talking about their
grandkids, the sports opening day and the ones that want to
(21:47):
talk about politics. I'm like, all right, whatever,
but in the course of these conversations, I'm doing
pharmacy. I just don't make it the main
like the job gets done, but in not in a very like check boxy
way, because it's just I think they're going to be more apt to
share, listen and trust you if you're just going to talk to
them as a human. Yeah, conversations go a long
ways. Yeah, people like to be talked
(22:09):
with, not talked to exactly. So I appreciate you taking that
standpoint. I want to back up a little bit
because part of your story is very similar to mine in that you
went through pharmacy school, got your Pharm D.
Sure did. You had all the Student Loans,
(22:29):
so I went in state but at private school.
So OK, I'm with you. Yeah.
And now, you know, you graduated.
I realized the point where I'm like, all right, I graduated
$150,000 in student loan debt. I've started a job.
I started a job that, you know, I've kind of always, I couldn't
wait to get out of school to start a job, start making real
money. Oh, yeah.
And you know, I, I went to work every day and I didn't like it.
(22:54):
Yeah, to be honest. You know, I'm like, man, this is
this is what everyone told me would make me happy.
And I went to work every day andit was so stressful.
And it was, it was just not thatfulfilled feeling that I thought
I would. Have You had a similar moment
right? Yeah, I I would say that there's
(23:15):
a lot of promises made to pharmacy students, mostly
related to your income. Yeah.
But yeah, for me, it was a slow build to to realizing that I'm
going to work every day and I'm not really, you know, for you,
your environment working retail pharmacy was super stressful.
Yeah, stressful and probably notfeeling like you're making a
huge difference. For me, it is it has morphed
(23:37):
into, and I wouldn't say there was a Seminole moment, but it
has become a slow build of I went to school for all this
time. I'm spending all these hours at
this place. I'm doing all of these things
and when my patients are able todo lifestyle, they do, they do
better. But I'm doing all this work and
it feels like it's almost for nothing.
Like I tell my wife, it's like the metaphor metaphorically.
(23:59):
Like if you worked at a tire shop in a town called Nailville,
everyone's coming in and there'sjust, we're patching holes.
They're going out. And this just seems like, what
am I doing here? And maybe part of it's getting
older and realizing your time isfinite.
But I was just like, yeah, this is not.
I picked this thing at 17 because I couldn't play baseball
and I was good at science. And.
(24:19):
Right. Like I mean, I joke, I mean at
17 we can all there's so many bad paths people can take.
And my joke is like I took the darkest one.
See, it's like my friends. At least they were drinking and
having fun. Right.
Yeah, I should not have gotten. I'm glad it's not going down
those paths. That was a joke.
Remember, I'm a comedian. But it's, it's been sort of like
(24:39):
I, I don't feel like all of thiswork has made a huge dent in
other people's lives. And so that's where integrating
comedy into what I'm doing, writing a couple books and now
the building a diabetes coachingprogram with another pharmacist
who feels the same way is, is the path that I'm taking.
And I, I applaud because there'smany pharmacists and many people
(25:00):
in different jobs that or just like, I don't like this.
I really hate it. Paycheck's good.
So I'm just going to stuff it down, stuff those feelings down,
let it eat me from the inside, right?
But I mean, my biggest thing I, I, I guess not a silly reason,
but a deeper reason is we have kids.
You have kids, three kids, all right, team outnumbered team's
own defense right on. That's right, you tell them grow
(25:23):
up and work hard and you can do it.
Do what it be whatever you want to be.
And if they see me going to workand hating my life, they're
going to say, dad, why don't youdo what you want to do?
You want a hypocrite and I will just have to eat it versus, you
know, like a few years ago, I quit my full time government job
and went and worked, started working part time doing the same
sort of work, having more time with my kids, having more time
(25:44):
to record podcasts without some hosts like you write books and
and pursue these things that aremore meaningful.
And it is a very unconventional thing to do.
But I will say that every older person I talked to was like, oh,
you'll never regret having that time with your kids.
And yeah, my wife, my wife said you're you're happier, which is
great. It means that I'm happy around
my family, my kids, which I've really diverged off the initial
(26:05):
kind of question there, but. No, that's.
It the deeper reasons as to why you would walk away from
something that is, relative to the average American income,
very lucrative. But if you hate it, what's the
point? You don't get a reward on your
deathbed for like making a lot of money and hating it.
Right. And that's the thing too is I
(26:26):
think there's a lot of listenersthat are that are hearing this
today and they're nodding their heads when you're talking about,
I go to work every day and I hate it.
I think there's a, there's a, there's just a resonance with
that. There's so many people that
aren't living their dream life and you've, you've kind of
(26:47):
turned it around and you've carved out, you know, that a
life for yourself that you enjoy.
And you know, I've, I've done something similar in it and it
looks a little different, but I,I've made several career moves
and every career move I've made has been a significant, a
significant hit to my income. I feel, yeah.
(27:08):
Every single move, but every single move has been an
improvement to my quality of life and the time I have with my
kids and the time I have with myfamily.
And you know, that's really what's been so meaningful to me
is finding that, you know, finding that thing that makes
you happy and pushing through. Yeah.
One of the ways that you describe that that that you're
(27:32):
well adept to, to kind of go through these 4 stages of
contentment. I really find those to be
ingenious to be honest with you because you put in the words
some things with it. We oftentimes think and maybe
not be able to verbalize. Can you walk through that a
little bit and talk about how tobreakthrough those stages?
(27:53):
Yeah, those like 4 walls of convention you were.
Yeah. So we have our expectations,
norms, habits and limits. So like the expectations are
basically what society expects of us.
Maybe what your parents did, maybe what your peers.
And so like, oh, man, I, I'm supposed to go to college, get
this job, make this money. And my parents were teachers.
So when I, yeah, you know, told them I have a pharmacy job and
(28:15):
this is what I make, they were like, oh, well, it must be nice.
It is. But you also had summers off.
So yeah, let's not forget, forget about that.
So it's really hard to overcome those expectations, but it
becomes more about do you care what others think or expect?
Or do you care what you expect? And then the norms like blindly
following the rules, who, who, who made those rules, right?
Who made that 4th meal? Who said we have to snack all
(28:35):
day? You know, taking it back to the,
to the lifestyle approach. And then habits.
I, I think we get stuck in these, these patterns over and
over and over again. And then we're like, why am I
unhappy? I'm doing the same thing over
and over again. I'm still unhappy.
So that that definition of insanity is doing the same
thing, expecting something different.
And then the limits. And then these limits can come
from sort of those outside expectations, but we can also
(28:58):
put those on ourselves and Oh, I'm not good enough.
I can't do this. And I Kali, it's just like every
every Disney movie, every hero'sjourney is the protagonist
doesn't believe they can do it. They find a guide or they find
it within themselves that they can do it.
And they're like, Oh my gosh, I was able to do it.
And so that is that is that sortof missing macro of community or
(29:21):
support of like imagine that youwanted to make a career move,
but your wife said, oh, Chad, you can't do that.
There's no we need that money. You got to suck it up.
Or you know, if your family members are like, you're crazy.
And I know that when I left my stable full time government job
to work part time for a private company like but your pension,
but your health, I'm like, I know, I know, I know, I know,
(29:44):
stop, stop reminding me of the of the dollar signs that I'm
leaving behind. But right, right.
The but the limits of you can't,can't reverse diabetes.
You can't do this. Well, who says?
And I don't want to listen to those limits.
So and it's, I mean they're ingrated us from a from a young
age and as parents, I'm very careful.
My wife and I are very careful about what we say to our kids
(30:05):
around our kids, what you can do, what you can't do.
And realizing that man, like there's life is competition.
You played sports, there's the other team, but man, every,
every competition is really within your own brain.
Like you're, if you can overcomeyourself, there really isn't
anything that you can't accomplish on on sort of an
outside level. And it, it seems so simple.
(30:26):
It seems so simple, but then youyou get into it and you're like,
oh wow, I really am sabotaging myself with how I'm thinking and
then acting. Yeah, mindset is key.
And in the older I get, I'm a little older than you, Corey.
I'm 41, OK. And you know, the older I get, I
like to think I'm wiser. I'm not sure about that, but.
(30:48):
I I'll I'll vouch you, you definitely have that air of
wisdom, that many you're 41 there's.
It's the Gray hairs, isn't? It listen, I'm gonna call out my
parents generation of the boomers like I feel like you can
be old and not wise and you can be younger and wise and I
there's a lot of older people who aren't wise anymore.
But anyway, the older you get. I, I I interrupted my.
So yeah, no, I appreciate it. The older I get, the more that I
(31:11):
realize the truth in what you just said, that there are these
expectations that are put on us sometimes by ourselves.
But you know, it, it's like, allright, I'm doing the thing.
Going back to when I realized, OK, I, I can't do retail
pharmacy forever to become a jaded, angry old man like every
(31:33):
other person I worked with. You know, when I realized that
I'm like, I, I've done the very thing that the world, whoever
the world is, the world told me that I needed to do to be happy.
And I realized the emptiness in that.
And you know what, I think a lotof people get stuck in that we
(31:55):
do the things that are expected of us.
We, we have these conventional thoughts, conventional habits,
conventional ideas that we try to, you know, nobody wants to be
radical. We're going to walk the path and
we've got to do the things and yeah, but but then realizing
that, you know what, that may not be your path.
That may not be the path that's going to lead you to life of, of
(32:19):
joy, right? That may not be what's going to
fulfill you and leave you satisfied at the end of the day.
And realizing we only get one ofthese.
We get, we get, we get one trip,you know the end.
I want to make that count and I only don't want to make that
count, but I want to make sure that like I'm doing what brings
me fulfillment and satisfaction.Otherwise, what's the point,
(32:42):
right? And so I love that that you have
had the and honestly, like in today's world with all of these
conventional thoughts and ideas and expectations, it takes guts,
you know, call it what you want to, but we'll just call it for
this purpose. It takes guts to to step outside
of those conventions and carve your own path.
(33:04):
Yeah. It takes guts to, you know, to
say, you know what? I'm going to give up that
pension. I'm going to give up whatever it
is. Yeah, you're reminding me.
What about this? What about this?
I haven't forgotten about it. Didn't make this decision
because I wasn't aware of that. Right.
But what I'm saying is that there are things that are more
important to me than that. So really when it comes down to
it, Corey, it seems to be about priorities.
(33:25):
Is that an accurate statement for what you've been through?
I would say so. And I think there there's a
couple thoughts that come to mind.
I think it's priorities. It's understanding the season of
life that I'm in. So you know, with young kids,
they will get older and become angry teenagers that want
nothing to do with me. And if I want to go make more
money while they're off with their friends, then there's a
chance to I can do go do that Right now.
(33:46):
They seem to really like me. So I'm going to lean into that
and as a parent, having more time to be with them and
selfishly sort of influence themand guide them when they're
still more apt listening. And another that comes to mind
like walking away from a air quote.
Sure thing. I think I'm going to, I'll bring
a lesson of comedy back into this.
(34:06):
And I think the best comedies are ones that have a strong, we
call it base reality. So think of Seinfeld.
It's the show where there's simple relationships or, or the
office. It's set in an office, but
within it there's a lot of like variety and difference and
things that can really pop. So for us, like we work jobs,
like I still have AW two job. We have to pay bills.
(34:26):
We can't ignore that. We, you know, the dream life.
I'm just going to move on an island and.
Right. No, they're they're.
We're still logically going through life and doing the
things we have to do, paying bills, taking care of our
health, taking care of ourselves.
But within that there is room now to maneuver and build
something on our own that will help support our reality and
also bring that deeper meaning. And as you say, the priority of,
(34:49):
of making an impact like climbing up I, I'm fortunate
enough to have been able to climb up Maslow's hierarchy to
get to that point where I want to fulfill something more
fulfilling. Personally, if something were to
happen in life and I had to go back to full time pharmacy and
do something I didn't really love, but it meant that we had
shelter and food, then I do thatand I've acknowledged that like
(35:09):
that. And I, that's a possibility.
Like I maybe when I'm 65, I'll have regretted this choice at
38. But for now, this is, this is
the season we're in. This is the priority and this is
the the way we're choosing to live life.
Yeah, yeah. I love that.
And that's really encouraging for those people out there.
And it's not saying that we're not telling everybody go quit
your job. Oh, no, go part time, you know?
(35:30):
Yeah. But what we're saying is is
this, you know, what brings you satisfaction and fulfillment, It
might just be worth it to pursuethat.
And in your life's an illustration of that as well.
Thank you. Yeah, yeah.
It's cool to talk to other folkswith the, with the, with the
who've had the similar like, Oh my gosh, do something different.
It's scary, but. We'll be it is it can be scary
(35:53):
and you know, each each step of my journey has been scary and
here I am, you know, podcasting,you know, never thought I'd be
doing that and starting a men's coaching business.
Never thought. I mean, I just need one more
thing to do right? And, you know, but it there,
there's something about steppinginto your purpose and you can
(36:14):
you can fulfill that in a lot ofdifferent ways.
But but that's what I'm after. That's what you're after.
And man, this has been fun. Yeah, we talked about a lot of
different things that way. A.
Lot of ground, yeah, there's, there's a lot, there's a lot.
There's a lot of depth and variety to life.
And you've in 30 to 35 minutes, we've gone through a bunch.
I I appreciate you shepherding me through so much valuable
(36:36):
information and valuable approaches and mindset to life.
Yeah, we'll have to do around 2 sometime.
Man, this has been fun. I want to kind of.
So we talked about lifestyle management of chronic disease.
We talked about, you know, food,exercise, those sort of things.
We talked about life. We talked about fulfilling your,
your, you know, your passion, your purpose.
(36:59):
What would be something you wantto leave my audience with,
Corey? It can be something related to
those things. It could be something funny.
I just, and I don't usually do this, but I just feel LED, you
know, you're you're such an interesting guy.
I feel like that you have so many strengths.
But what would be your closing remarks to our audience today?
I think you got to figure out what's important and don't be
(37:20):
afraid to, to, to do what's important to you.
And that to me, for me, it's like #1 family slash health and
getting, you know, getting into sort of some of the nitty gritty
of like, you know, societal expectations.
We don't drive nice cars. We have a modest house, but it's
allowed us to have more time. And this is train of thought
(37:41):
going here, but, you know, figuring out what's important to
you. And then to me, it's owning your
time, owning your time as much as you can.
And that's been the blessing that we've found ourselves with
life. I, I, you mentioned like
building a dream life. I literally told my wife last
week, Oh my gosh, we're living our dream life like it was a
Thursday like this. We went to the library, we went
(38:03):
to the bank with our kids. We ran some errands at Home
Depot, but we had the freedom todo it at the end of the day.
Like we played indoor, like indoor kickball because we let
our kids play ball in the house because that's that's a priority
for me is letting them be active.
And I was laying down at 9:00. I was like, Oh my gosh, it's
Thursday. We hung out all day.
We didn't have stress. Like it was a day she was off
from work. I don't work Thursdays usually.
(38:23):
It's like this is a dream life. So your dream life is closer
than you think. Go get it.
I love it. And that reminds me that, you
know, sometimes trade-offs, there's trade-offs with
everything. So make sure you're looking at
what you're trading, yes, for the life that you're living.
So Corey, man, this has been awesome.
Can you tell our listeners whereto find out more about you and
(38:43):
how to enter into your world? Yeah, go to Corey Jenks calm and
it's my parents were cheap so noIan Corey CORYJENKS calm so.
He sold separately. They didn't buy the vial there,
but if you go there, you can youcan sign up for my newsletter
get get to me on the various social medias that I admittedly
don't post a lot on. But if you find me there, send
(39:03):
me a message. And if something resonated with
you great, positive or negative,I don't care.
I'm always looking to hear what people are are thinking of of my
approach to life. But I appreciate your giving
sharing your platform with me. If you go to my website, I have
written a couple books. I have a healthcare book and a
dad book so you can find it all from the website there too.
Yeah, I love it. And and I'm all about both of
(39:24):
those things. So yeah, I can attest.
Corey's a a man just full of knowledge about all kinds of
different things. And you're, you're doing
important work, my friend. So keep it up.
And I hope you have a blessed one, man.
Likewise. Thank you for listening to the
Rev RX Podcast. We hope you enjoyed what you
heard today and if so, we'd loveit if you would hit that
subscribe button so that you'll never miss a new episode from
(39:45):
us. Also, feel free to leave us
reviews and comments as we'd love to hear from you.
Be blessed and be the very best you.
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