September 10, 2025 • 32 mins
Most of us fear failure. But the truth? Perfectionism kills more dreams than failure ever will.
Pastor and author Justin Grifford joins the Rev Rx Podcast to talk about why waiting for perfect conditions is a death sentence for your calling—and why starting poorly is actually the way God grows us.
We dig into:
The 5 phases of growth: Dream → Plan → Start → Grind → Finish
Why “perfect plans” end in dead dreams
How perfectionism is really fear in disguise
Why progress matters more than polish
Practical ways to sidestep perfection and finally start
How grace covers imperfect beginnings
📚 Check out Justin’s book Start Poorly and resources at JustinGrifford.com
Connect with RevRx!
chad@manalivecoaching.com
www.manalivecoaching.com
IG: @chadpottspharmd or @revrxwellnessconsulting
FB: Chad Potts or RevRx
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:11):
Hello and welcome back to another episode of the Rev RX
Podcast where we show you how tothrive in fate, family, and
help. My name is Chad Potts and I'm
your host today. I'm really excited for you to
meet my friend Justin Grifford. Justin is a pastor, He's an
author and he's kind of an expert and one of the things
that I really have first hand experience with and that is
(00:32):
perfectionism. You see, I'm the type of person
maybe you're like this too, to where things need to be just
right, Things need to be perfector else it kind of hinders me
from moving forward. I can get so lost in those
details that oftentimes I procrastinate because of my
perfectionism. Well, if you ever find yourself
realizing that your perfectionist tendencies are
(00:53):
holding you back in life, then you're in good company.
Justin has been there, done that, got the T-shirt, and wrote
the book on it. Literally.
He's written a book called StartPoorly, and he shows us how to
sidestep perfectionism in order to reach our goals.
You're going to love this conversation.
Very relatable, very practical, and one that I think will help
you move forward as you try to turn your potential into
(01:16):
reality. So without further ado, I
introduce to you my new friend Justin Grifford.
Justin Grifford, man, thanks so much for joining us today on the
Rev RX podcast. Man, what a privilege it is to
have you here in the show. I've had this earmarked for
quite a while and I'm so excitedto jump in with you today.
(01:36):
Thank you, Chad. I'm just thrilled to be here.
And let's get to it. Yeah.
I'd love for you to just let ourlisteners know a little bit more
about you so they can get to know you.
How did you get to be who you are today?
I'd love to unpack your book a little bit later, but before
that, who's Justin Grifford? So I am a I'm a husband, I'm a
father and I'm a pastor. I've been married for about 16
(01:58):
years, almost 16 years. I've got 3 kids.
They are 1410 and four and I've been a pastor, been in ministry
for about as long as I've been married, about 16 years.
I've served as an associate pastor.
I've served as a youth pastor for about 10 of those years.
I've been a senior pastor for about two years now and have
(02:18):
lived kind of originally from Arkansas, lived in Missouri for
a little while, actually lived in South Korea for about a year,
but then been doing ministry in Alabama and now in Mississippi.
Awesome. And you know you've you've got
away with words. That's one of the things I've
noticed about you. I think pastors need to, you
know, you have to be able to take ancient literature and be
(02:39):
able to explain it in ways people can understand, but some
are more gifted than others and you're very gifted at that.
So I just want to give you that compliment right off the bat.
I appreciate that. And and So what drew me to you
was your book that's called Starting Poorly.
First of all, the title's catchy.
I like that, but I, I resonated with it because, man, this
journey that I've been on and for all of my listeners here,
(03:03):
I've been doing this a little over a year now.
This podcasting journey for me was about starting poorly.
I'm a perfectionist at heart. And if I'm going to release
something, especially if I'm going to put my, my name and my
face on things like to podcast and I'm going to put it out
there for the world to see, man,it needs to be perfect before I
(03:23):
do it. And that's my nature.
That's how I want to be. But, you know, I got a nudge
from God to start this podcast and it had to just start poorly,
you know, and, and I, that was the first time in my life I'd
really taken that leap of faith and said, you know what, It's OK
if it doesn't have to be perfect, because if I wait for
(03:43):
it to be perfect, I'll be waiting for years and I may not
ever do it. And so I was drawn to that.
And and then working my way through it, you know, you work
through the different stages of,of all of this.
But, but what was really your intent when you, when you came
out this book? You know, what was it that that
led you to that? What, what, what made you want
(04:04):
to write this book about starting poorly?
Was it personal experience or you know, I've, I've read the,
I've read the book so I know, but can you tell our listeners a
little bit about so? The the build up to all of this
is whenever I became a father, realized how much free time I
used to have and I was serving as an assistant pastor at the
time. I was husband and new, a new
father and I found that the growth within me just wasn't
(04:27):
happening like it wasn't happening by accident.
I was not being the father I wasmade to be, the husband I was
made to be, the pastor was made to be.
And so I realized that my time is no longer my own.
And so if I'm going to be the man that God's called me to be,
the husband, the father, I need to steward my time better.
And so that led me to this journey, on this journey of
(04:49):
developing habits and goals and attainable things that I can do
along the way. And so that being part of my
life the last 12 years or so, itled me to the end of 2023, the
beginning of 2024. And if you're really into goals,
you, you like the end of one year and the beginning of the
next because you can evaluate, OK, how well did I do?
How many books did I read? How many miles did I run?
(05:11):
And what can I launch into goinginto the new year?
And so that was me at the transition to 2024.
There were books I want them to read, Miles I want them to read,
I wanted to do, I wanted to practice writing more, all of
these different things. And so as as January 1st hits
hit the calendar, I get COVID, Iget the flu, I pull my
(05:34):
hamstring, I have an infection that kind of lingers on
throughout the rest of the year.And so any workout that I'm
doing is a walk to the bathroom and back.
But once you do that with the flu, you're exhausted.
And I remember watching my kids play outside, sitting on the
edge of my bed thinking, man, I am starting the year very
poorly. And it taught me thinking.
(05:55):
It just took me down this this rate of thoughts of man,
everything in life that we do, we start poorly, whether it's
it's it's tying our shoes, it's potty training, it's swinging a
Golf Club for the first time, it's algebra starting a job on
the first day. We all start poorly.
And overtime we we get better. But when it comes to the things
(06:15):
that we've always wanted to do, the dreams, the goals, the
habits that we want to develop, like you said, we feel like it
has to be perfect. We feel like we have to have the
perfect plan. Everything needs to be in place.
And if one thing goes wrong, if we miss one day of the diet, one
meal on the diet, let's throw itall away.
If we miss one workout, let's throw it all away.
(06:36):
It's not worth doing. And that sounds crazy because if
we if we treated our kids that way, we make one mistake with
our kids. Well, we got to you got to give
them up for adoption, you know, like that's so the, the start
poorly theme became sort of a soundtrack for me.
And honestly, it's, it's a version of God's grace.
It's a version of grace to us todo and to pursue the things that
(06:59):
we've always wanted to do. That's so good.
And there's a lot to unpack there.
Let me start off by saying, yeah, marriage and parenting are
two of the most sanctifying institutions there are.
Amen. You know, you think you're
selfish. Get married.
I'm sorry you think yourself less, right?
Get married. You know, you think that you've
got things together. Have kids, man.
(07:19):
They show you, you know, they show you just how imperfect you
are. And I'm convinced that's just
part of God's, again, part of God's grace for us.
And you know, when we get into those moments and we think about
like our kids learning to tie our shoes, to tie their shoes or
think about you, any task that they learn, Yeah, they start
poorly. I've got two kids.
(07:39):
I've got 3 kids too. Mine are a little younger than
yours. They're 35 and eight and my
older two were just starting in ball.
So we're getting involved with baseball.
We've tried soccer, but you know, they they don't like to
run. So that wasn't for them and or
they didn't when they were that age, but they're now they're
into baseball. And you know, if I I thought
(08:00):
about the same thing and going through your book, you know, if,
if we use the same logic with them as we do with ourselves,
like, you know, hey, buddy, you can't hit the baseball first
time. You just need to hang it up.
You need to quit. You know, you're just not good
at this and you need to wait until you're perfect to start
playing. That makes no sense, right?
Right. And I think it's because we we
live in such an instant culture.And I'm sure as a pharmacist you
(08:21):
get it too, that people rather than, rather than changing their
diet or changing their lifestyle, just give me a pill
and make all this go away. And even for kids video games,
you can, you can put Madden or college football in in the game
and you can be the best quarterback in the nation.
It just doesn't happen like thatin real life.
(08:42):
And so I try to tell my kids, I've tried to teach them.
I took them to the tennis courtsfor the first time just a couple
weeks ago. And on the way there, I told
them the words, OK, guys, we're going to start poorly.
You're not going to be able to hit the ball soundly every time.
Just this is a learning experience.
And it's so important to come alongside them and really help
(09:02):
them set realistic expectations,isn't it?
I think that's part of our our job as parents is that, yeah, in
an instant culture that we live in, being able to show them
that, you know, not everything'sthis way.
A matter of fact, the things that really matter aren't that
way. The things that are worthwhile
take time and. Hard things in life are worth
doing. Yeah, yeah.
And so, yeah, I've been thinkingabout that lately with the ball
(09:25):
illustration and I'm like, man, but we're we're so hard on
ourselves. And and there is this
expectation that things need to be, like you said, perfect, but
starting poorly. There's a lot of reward in that.
What have you found that really limits us from this expectation
of, OK, if I'm going to start, it's got to go great because you
(09:46):
mentioned everybody around January 1st, they said all these
resolutions that me included, there's nothing wrong with that.
Sure, yeah. But we know we want to be our
best self. We're trying to set ourselves
up. This is going to be my year.
And so I'm, I'm 41 when I turn 40, I said, you know what?
I'm, I'm going to be the healthiest I've ever been when I
turned 40. Well, you know, that whole like,
(10:07):
if you want to hear God laugh, tell him your plans.
It wasn't what God had in mind for me when I turned 40.
Oh, when I turned 40, I had some, some issues pop up and
Long story short, ended up having to have like it was 4
surgeries over 18 months and wow, kept me out of like, you
know, I had the same goals as what you were mentioning.
Wanted to run all the miles, wanted to do all the workouts,
(10:29):
wanted to be healthy, wanted, you know, And I found myself in
this, in this condition to whereI couldn't do anything that I
wanted to do. All those, all those things I'd
set up for myself, it seemed like they were impossible now.
And so the temptation there is to say, forget it all.
Is that what you found in your studies?
(10:49):
In your experience is that thereis this tendency if it can't be
perfect, which is not worth doing?
I think so, yeah. I think that there's there's
different types of fear. Like when we think of fear, we
think of, oh, we're just afraid.And, and in the book, I I kind
of paint the picture of do you remember the old indoor malls?
I don't think we see them as much anymore, but they had the
(11:09):
food courts and you've had the Sabaro's pizza next to the five
Chinese restaurants where you can get samples.
And I love, you know, I would gothere now.
Miss those days? Yeah, miss those days.
And so I think that fear is almost like that food court that
there's different fear vendors that there's there's a fear of
perfectionism. There's a fear you can go over
here, there's a fear of not being good enough.
(11:30):
Go over here, there's a fear of,oh, you're just a copycat of
somebody else. You're, you're an imposter.
There's so fear kind of manifests itself in all these
different places. And even as you're making
progress on your goal, on your dream, fear will tell you a
different story along the way. Yeah.
And you know, that it comes downto, you know, is is it good
(11:52):
enough? How, how much is good enough?
Or at least it has for me in thein the podcasting journey when I
first started this. You know, you, you see Joe
Rogan, you see all these people and man, everything's so
polished. Everything's so great.
And you know, there's, there's alot of limiting beliefs, I think
that pop up whenever we're starting something new, which
also holds us back, you know, part of that whole process of
(12:13):
starting poorly. But, you know, along the lines,
you just have to be able to accept that, you know, there are
limitations in everything that you do, but starting is the most
important step. Can you talk about that?
Just actually starting as being the biggest thing there may be.
The biggest mistake we make is not in the mistakes we make, but
it's not starting anything because we're scared we're going
(12:34):
to make mistakes. I think whenever we start, we
actually, we actually get a taste because, you know, we're
talking about potential. There's some studies done on
potential. I think the numbers are like 50%
of all people feel like actuallyit's larger than.
I think it's like 70% of all people feel like they aren't
living up to their potential, that there's just a bunch of
(12:55):
people walking around just with this gap inside of them, right.
And yeah, imagine, imagine the toll that that takes on them, on
their bodies, on their thoughts,how much healthier they would be
if they were living, living intothat.
And so I think whenever you start, you actually begin to to
taste that dream. You actually begin to taste what
(13:16):
it would be like to do that thing to play the guitar, to
write a book, to train for a marathon.
And, and when you start, you actually begin to, to put into
motion that thing that you've always wanted to do and think, I
think a little bit of planning is necessary.
A lot of planning isn't vital because as soon as you start,
you realize that you, that your plans change, that you needed to
(13:40):
make that plan and, and pencil rather than in pen.
And then you got to be able to pivot.
But when you do start, because I'm sure that you had some
preconceived notions about podcasting, what what changed
for you, what mindset changed for you once you chose to start?
Well, it was just realizing that, you know, something's
better than nothing because if Ijust sit around waiting until
(14:02):
I'm ready, I'll never be ready. Yeah, but you know what?
Something's better than nothing.And everyone has to start
somewhere. Is kind of was kind of by
mantra. Joe Rogan didn't start as Joe
Rogan, you know, He started. He didn't start as what he is
now. He started, you know, like the
rest of us start. And Can you imagine hosting for
three hours a day? Can you like?
(14:24):
I can't imagine doing that. But how much better you'd be?
Sure, that's true. That's true.
And I think back, you know, I think back to my first few
episodes and I apologize to my listeners for for some of those
because, yeah, the audio wasn't great.
The video wasn't great. The conversations may not have
even been all that good. Right.
Yeah. But I think the the grace of God
(14:45):
shined through it because I was faithful and I was obedient in
what He knows me to do. And that's the thing too, you
know, from a faith standpoint, when we're at our weakest,
that's when he's the strongest. And so if I'm always leaning
into I've got to be perfect, I've got to be perfect.
Well, where do we need God? Where does he need to come into
our life? You know, at some point we need
to be able to say, all right, ifhe's calling me to this, he's
going to equip me for it. That doesn't mean immediately,
(15:06):
but it means I'm going to grow into it.
And so at what point do I trust him to be able to make up for
that gap, if that makes sense? Yeah, that's a good question.
I I think I don't wonder sometimes if we would probably
never admit to this, but we think, OK, this is something
that I want to do. This is a dream that I have.
And so it's kind of personal andmaybe it's a little selfish and
God doesn't really have anythingto do with it because it's not
(15:29):
anything super spiritual or it'snot any pursuit of him.
But in reality, I believe that if it's, if it as his children,
if it's something that we're interested in doing and, and
it's not opposed to him, then I think if we care, he cares.
And so if, if we, if this is something that we want to do,
it's most certainly something that we need to allow him into.
(15:50):
Because if you, if you look at the Christian life, if you look
at what Jesus has called us to be like him.
And so you want to talk about starting poorly and and never
reaching perfection in this life.
I mean, the, the Christian life is a is a lifetime of starting
poorly and struggling and striving to become more and more
(16:11):
like Jesus. DA Carson has a great quote.
He says that no one stumbles into holiness and it's it's
about grace driven effort that that we are sanctified, that we
become holy. And so it's just all about that
effort and trying. And so if that's the case with
the Christian life, it's most certainly the case with learning
how to play the guitar, with writing a book, with taking
(16:32):
singing lessons, or whatever thecase may be.
Starting A blog. Starting a podcast.
Yeah. And you know, in your book you
describe these phases that we gothrough and I believe there's is
there 5 or 5 or 6? 5 phases.
Yeah. Can you kind of give us an
elevator pitch version of those and just kind of maybe we can
walk through those and have conversation about it?
(16:53):
Yes. So I think that every phase
exists or every, every dream, every goal, ever habit exists in
these five phases. There's and each one in the book
I highlight there's pros to thatphase, There's cons and there's
box jumps. Whenever I was in high school,
we had to do these box jump exercises and feeded them.
But you couldn't move on. Until you cleared the box jumps.
And so I identify some box jumpsand ways to get over those in
(17:15):
each phase. And so the first phase is the
dream phase and man the dream phase, it's like we're kids
again. It's like we were in in
elementary school. I want to be an astronaut.
I want to be a baseball player. And it's, it's amazing the dream
phase because you can do anything You can be anything and
you can live in this Wonderland as long as you want to.
But if that's also the con is that you some people stay in the
(17:36):
dream phase their entire in our life and they never do anything
about it. And so the the hurdle there in
trying to figure out how do we move on to the actual planning
phase is, is feel like people are busy.
Everybody's busy. The single, the single man's
busy, the married mom is busy, everybody's busy.
But if you can just designate about 15 minutes to just begin
(17:59):
writing down that thing, what itis you want to do, what it is
you want to accomplish, you can start taking a step to the plan
phase. And the plan phase is just that.
It is creating a simple plan. OK, when, when am I going to do
this? How much time am I going to
dedicate to it a day? When am I going to start just
creating just a couple simple little steps will will make a
(18:21):
huge difference. And the box jump there and
you've already spoken to it is perfection getting the perfect
plan. People will get stuck in the
plan phase for a long time if they're waiting for the perfect
plan. And so the the box jump the way
to clear that basically is just to clear that simple plan.
Answer 3 questions. When will I start?
What do I need to start and how long do I work on it per day or
(18:43):
what's the frequency of it? And so those are the first two
phases. The third phase is the start
phase. And we've already talked about
that. The pro there is that you, you
finally are putting, you know, it's where the rubber meets the
road. You're finally putting that into
practice. The con there is that you're
about to find out if you really have what it takes.
And from there you move on to the grind phase and there is no
(19:06):
box jump from start to grind. The grind phase will find you.
You will discover how hard this is.
This is you know, to put a biblical illustration to it,
This is the people wandering through the wilderness.
This is God's people being sanctified.
This is this is the long journeyand and knowing that that this
is developing you, this is that developed their character.
(19:27):
It's developing your perseverance and you're finding
out what you're made of. And then the final phase, if you
continue through that, if you just keep working because the
temptation in the grind phase isdoubt that can I do this?
Can I finish this? The final phase is the finish
phase. And in the finish phase, it's
just that you finally, you finally finished the book.
You finally are a consistent podcast host.
(19:48):
You finally get to run the marathon.
And so the that's obviously its own pro, but but the con and the
fear with the finish phase is OKnow that I've accomplished this.
What's next? People often find so much of
their identity and a certain goal and a certain dream.
What if, what if I paint the paintings?
(20:08):
What if I sell my book? But what if no one likes it?
What if no one likes the work that I do?
What if I'm just a laughing stock?
Because of this, I'm the butt ofevery joke.
There's even a fear when we finish the goal.
So those are the five phases that that every that all of
these find themselves in at one point and and at different times
we can get hung up on in different phases.
(20:29):
Yeah, and that's a really good overview of the, of just really
the whole process of, you know, setting a goal, going after your
goal and finishing your goal. And I love how you address the,
the finishing aspect. If I want to.
Can we talk about that just a minute?
Yeah, sure. Because, you know, it's it's, we
think, all right, I'm done. And when I finish, everything's
(20:49):
going to be fantastic. And, and, you know, there is
that sense of accomplishment at the end, but you're right,
there's so many doubts there. There's so many limiting beliefs
there. And, and I just love to dig
deeper there a little bit too, because we can start and we can
finish something, but it doesn'tend that the finish doesn't.
And so, you know, going on past the finishing and, and you know,
(21:10):
we're never really done with this race.
If we want to use the Christian illustration too, you know, the,
the whole idea of we, we start poorly every day.
You know, we're never going to achieve flawlessness and
perfection on this side of heaven.
You know, there, that's, that's glorification waiting to happen
on the other side. But you know that it's, it's
that, it's the grind that we seem to be stuck in, but yet
(21:33):
there are little finishes along the way.
And those are times where we cancelebrate.
You finished your book. You know, there's, there's a
celebration there. You know, I've, I've, I've had
milestones along my journey. You know, I had the DTH episode
come out just recently, you know, and so I'm like, all
right, yay, But then doubt creeps in, doesn't it?
And I'm, I'm a convinced a lot of times that's just it is
(21:56):
either things in our past that kind of pop up, you know, I'm
not good enough. No one wants to hear my voice,
that kind of thing. Sometimes it's a a trick of the
enemy who who's the author of discouragement a lot of times.
But what have you found is that biggest challenge?
Once we do, all right, we set out, we grind, you know, we, we
end up going through the finishing process, but sometimes
(22:18):
it's not what we think it's going to be.
Yeah, you touch. On it a little bit there's
there's 2 tips that I I recommend.
I have tips recommended throughout each phase, but those
two tips are are sell your work,ship your work.
Seth Godin talks about whatever it is that you finish, share it
with the world. He has this great quote.
(22:38):
Your work will never be good enough for everyone, but it's
already good enough for someone.And well, that, that told me
that again, that's a that's a perfectionistic mindset that we
bring in is that everyone has tolike it.
No, no, they don't and they won't.
But what you have already done is, is good enough for someone
and finding your audience is, iswhat's so important.
(22:58):
But but you, you talking about your 50th episode.
That's that's one of the tips isthat make a memory, post it,
post a picture of it, celebrate it.
My my wife was was really sweet and doing this in in the middle
of my my book launch. There's been so much time and
energy and and sure, a little bit of neglect of my own family
(23:18):
and working in this just becauseit's demanded so much of me.
But but my wife created my own little launch party and launch
backdrop. I didn't have an official launch
party anywhere, but she created one for me in our kitchen.
Her doing that we have we have pictures of it and she helped me
celebrate that. She helped me celebrate in
almost memorial. And so I think whenever we can,
(23:41):
we have these wins along the way.
It it is important to to celebrate.
It is important to communicate that this is my 50th podcast
that this is the launch of this thing.
This is a win that we have because you're right in in the
long marathon that is the Christian life.
We we have to be able to define what what's a win and how we can
(24:01):
celebrate. Those are are really important.
Along the way, they kind of become our.
Ebenezer moments, don't they? Yes.
Yes, our moments of. Remembrance where we, we realize
God's faithfulness to us. And you know, and that's kind of
what that reminds me of is in this Christian journey that we
have, you're just this journey called life.
You know that it's not separate.If you're a believer, you know,
(24:22):
it's not a separate thing. It's just part of you.
But in this journey called life,there, there are seasons and,
and God's faithfulness proves true in every season, but in so
many different ways. And so, you know, you go through
those seasons of all right, well, here's what I'm facing
now. And I'm going to, you know, I'm
going to, I'm going to push through and I'm going to become
(24:44):
whoever it is God tells me I need to become and I'm going to
finish it. And God was faithful to me.
And then now I've got a pivot. You mentioned the art, kind of
the heart of the pivot. That's been the name of the game
for me. I feel like the last two years.
Write everything in pencil and learn to pivot.
But you know, then we. Pivot and, you know, rarely is
life ever just a steady climb. It's it's hills and it's valleys
(25:09):
and it's mountains and it's low moments.
You know, we, we, we go through those and we grind some more.
We dream, we grind, we finish and and then we pivot again.
And so creating those little moments of celebration is, to
me, remembrance of how far we'vecome, how far we've come with
God's help. You know, at 25 episodes, I had
(25:29):
a little mini, yeah, mini celebration.
At 50, I had one. You know, I don't plan on
quitting this anytime soon. Maybe I'll have 100.
Keep on going. Thousand, who knows?
But yeah, yeah. You know it.
And each step of the way, hopefully, we get better.
But each step of the way, we were better than we were before.
And you know, that's a lot of how I see the Christian life in
(25:50):
walking with God because there there is not flawlessness or
perfection on this side, but it's can I be more Christ like
today than I was yesterday? Can I be more Christ like
tomorrow than I was today? And I think that kind of helps
us think through that and have those little moments.
But man, that's so good. You just you nailed like the
(26:12):
human experience in like 10 minutes.
So well, and and. You touched on something too,
like a you can measure how many books you sell, you can measure
how many podcasts you have. Like those are measurables.
It's really hard to measure sanctification.
It's I've long dreamed and, and,and you as a pastor understand
this. I've long dreamed of there being
like this virtual meter over everyone's head to let me know
(26:34):
if they're getting it or not. If it's red, if it's green, and
I would love it if that exists, that'd be awesome.
Yeah, that'd be awesome. But see that meter?
Move just a little bit as we're teaching.
That'd be great. That's right.
Yes, that would do my heart. Such good, right?
Right. You know, but even even beyond
that, it's things like, you know, there is sanctification,
but then just like maturity in general, you know that it's hard
(26:58):
to measure that. It's hard to measure how much
more mature I am as a fill in the blank.
You know how much better I am asa dad for example, then I.
Was when I first. Started this game, yeah.
Yeah, you know that's. Something that I have zero way
of knowing from an objective point of view how much better I
am. But you know what?
(27:18):
That's where we have to say, allright, let's, let's celebrate
those milestones. You know what my kids said this
last week and that really let meknow they've been listening,
they've been paying attention. It may not look like it, right?
It may not seem like it, but youknow what they did?
And that shows me they get it. Or you know what?
They learned how to do this and you know, one of the things I've
learned about being a dad and I,you know, I had no stretch
(27:41):
perfect, any consideration but you there.
Yep, I'm here. He gave me the warning that my
battery's getting low, but we got we got.
OK, cool. Anyway, one of the things I've
learned learned about from beinga dad is that you know, you
don't, you don't really know where you are in the in the
grand scheme of things until afterwards.
It's in looking back a lot of times that we realize that
(28:02):
growth. And so kind of my last question
for you is what's your view on kind of reflection?
Because I think all along the way we need to see the progress
we've we've gone through. And so there's a lot of value in
retro retrospection, a lot of value in reflecting on where did
I start and then where am I now?Yeah, that.
That's good. I've always been, I had this
(28:23):
conversation a few years ago with somebody.
They they are very good at reflection.
I have always been. What's the next thing?
Yeah. And so I've been awful at what
you're talking about. But, but I think I think
whenever I allow myself to do that, and you, you touched on
this a little bit at the beginning of the podcast, is
that having, having a wife and having children pulls a lot of
(28:44):
selfishness out of you. And, and over time, when you're
drained of that, you're actuallya pretty a lot more selfless
person than you were at the beginning.
And so, yeah, I, I think that I think it's really helpful,
especially with any goal or any journey that you're on, if you
can document in some way. I found this really cool way of
doing it for me. I've never used this before.
(29:08):
And and so this is a plug to these people, but there's
something called the hero's journal, OK.
And, and it's a really, it's kind of they these, these people
kind of did their own research with goal setting and they
basically told almost like a, almost like a role-playing game
story. And every, every page has a
(29:29):
little caricature and picture and you see this little
character go on this journey. And as you, as you work towards
your goal, as you document what your goal is for, for that day
or for that, that 90 day period,you can talk about how you're
feeling. You can journal how you're
feeling. And you see this character on
each page go from place to placeand overcome certain obstacles.
(29:52):
And so revisiting that, something I'd never used before,
was kind of a companion that I took on this little trip.
And so I think that if you can do something like that, whether
that's on a specific goal, whether that's on your faith
journey, that's just one of, again, one of the spiritual
disciplines that we're better for if we can make ourselves do
it. Yeah, 100%.
(30:13):
I've never been a believer in journaling until recent years.
I'm like, oh, that's something, you know, Dear Diary, that's
that's something all the teenagegirls do.
But yeah, yeah, maybe they do that.
Right. Yeah, there's.
A lot of value in that, you know, just in in documenting,
you know, some of those high moments, some of those low
moments. And again, it's just those ways
of looking back and saying, huh,things have changed a lot over
(30:34):
time. Yeah.
Yeah. And I know, I think I know what
you're talking about too. I'll put a link to that in the
show notes as well. Yeah.
It's really cool. Hero Journal you're.
Right. I mean I.
I've gone back and looked at a journal entry that I made a few
years ago and something really major and, and frustrating was
going on. And looking back, I thought, you
know, that that really wasn't asbig of a deal as I thought it
(30:55):
was like God has a way of, of pulling you out of that and
making you forget it and. That's a, you know, that's,
that's a large part of life, isn't it?
And in the moment, things seem like a much bigger deal than if
we just get through it, look back and we're like, not that
big a deal. Yeah.
Yep. Just a man this has been.
Awesome. I could, I could talk to you a
(31:15):
while about this, but man, you have you've really had a lot of
value to my life and in the in your writing and excited to
bring that value to my listenersas well.
Can you tell us how they can connect with you and enter into
your world? Absolutely.
You could go to justingrifford.com GRIF
authority com and there you can subscribe to my newsletter that
(31:36):
you can purchase my book. There's an Amazon link there,
but you can also find it at bookBarnes and Noble
books-a-million. It's available in the Audible as
well if you want me to read it to you, but it's pretty much
available everywhere. Awesome.
Thank you so much, brother. Keep doing the awesome work for
the Kingdom and we'll be in touch for sure.
But you guys check them out. Justin Grifford, I'll put the
(31:57):
links in the show notes and you guys check them out.
Doing great work and and man, just keep being a blessing.
All right. Thanks, Chad.
Thank you for listening. To the Rev RX Podcast, we hope
you enjoyed what you heard today, and if so, we'd love it
if you would hit that subscribe button so that you'll never miss
a new episode from us. Also, feel free to leave us
reviews and comments as we'd love to hear from you.
(32:17):
Be blessed and be the very best you.
Hello and welcome back to another episode of the Rev RX
Podcast where we show you how tothrive in fate, family, and
help. My name is Chad Potts and I'm
your host today. I'm really excited for you to
meet my friend Justin Grifford. Justin is a pastor, He's an
author and he's kind of an expert and one of the things
that I really have first hand experience with and that is
(00:32):
perfectionism. You see, I'm the type of person
maybe you're like this too, to where things need to be just
right, Things need to be perfector else it kind of hinders me
from moving forward. I can get so lost in those
details that oftentimes I procrastinate because of my
perfectionism. Well, if you ever find yourself
realizing that your perfectionist tendencies are
(00:53):
holding you back in life, then you're in good company.
Justin has been there, done that, got the T-shirt, and wrote
the book on it. Literally.
He's written a book called StartPoorly, and he shows us how to
sidestep perfectionism in order to reach our goals.
You're going to love this conversation.
Very relatable, very practical, and one that I think will help
you move forward as you try to turn your potential into
(01:16):
reality. So without further ado, I
introduce to you my new friend Justin Grifford.
Justin Grifford, man, thanks so much for joining us today on the
Rev RX podcast. Man, what a privilege it is to
have you here in the show. I've had this earmarked for
quite a while and I'm so excitedto jump in with you today.
(01:36):
Thank you, Chad. I'm just thrilled to be here.
And let's get to it. Yeah.
I'd love for you to just let ourlisteners know a little bit more
about you so they can get to know you.
How did you get to be who you are today?
I'd love to unpack your book a little bit later, but before
that, who's Justin Grifford? So I am a I'm a husband, I'm a
father and I'm a pastor. I've been married for about 16
(01:58):
years, almost 16 years. I've got 3 kids.
They are 1410 and four and I've been a pastor, been in ministry
for about as long as I've been married, about 16 years.
I've served as an associate pastor.
I've served as a youth pastor for about 10 of those years.
I've been a senior pastor for about two years now and have
(02:18):
lived kind of originally from Arkansas, lived in Missouri for
a little while, actually lived in South Korea for about a year,
but then been doing ministry in Alabama and now in Mississippi.
Awesome. And you know you've you've got
away with words. That's one of the things I've
noticed about you. I think pastors need to, you
know, you have to be able to take ancient literature and be
(02:39):
able to explain it in ways people can understand, but some
are more gifted than others and you're very gifted at that.
So I just want to give you that compliment right off the bat.
I appreciate that. And and So what drew me to you
was your book that's called Starting Poorly.
First of all, the title's catchy.
I like that, but I, I resonated with it because, man, this
journey that I've been on and for all of my listeners here,
(03:03):
I've been doing this a little over a year now.
This podcasting journey for me was about starting poorly.
I'm a perfectionist at heart. And if I'm going to release
something, especially if I'm going to put my, my name and my
face on things like to podcast and I'm going to put it out
there for the world to see, man,it needs to be perfect before I
(03:23):
do it. And that's my nature.
That's how I want to be. But, you know, I got a nudge
from God to start this podcast and it had to just start poorly,
you know, and, and I, that was the first time in my life I'd
really taken that leap of faith and said, you know what, It's OK
if it doesn't have to be perfect, because if I wait for
(03:43):
it to be perfect, I'll be waiting for years and I may not
ever do it. And so I was drawn to that.
And and then working my way through it, you know, you work
through the different stages of,of all of this.
But, but what was really your intent when you, when you came
out this book? You know, what was it that that
led you to that? What, what, what made you want
(04:04):
to write this book about starting poorly?
Was it personal experience or you know, I've, I've read the,
I've read the book so I know, but can you tell our listeners a
little bit about so? The the build up to all of this
is whenever I became a father, realized how much free time I
used to have and I was serving as an assistant pastor at the
time. I was husband and new, a new
father and I found that the growth within me just wasn't
(04:27):
happening like it wasn't happening by accident.
I was not being the father I wasmade to be, the husband I was
made to be, the pastor was made to be.
And so I realized that my time is no longer my own.
And so if I'm going to be the man that God's called me to be,
the husband, the father, I need to steward my time better.
And so that led me to this journey, on this journey of
(04:49):
developing habits and goals and attainable things that I can do
along the way. And so that being part of my
life the last 12 years or so, itled me to the end of 2023, the
beginning of 2024. And if you're really into goals,
you, you like the end of one year and the beginning of the
next because you can evaluate, OK, how well did I do?
How many books did I read? How many miles did I run?
(05:11):
And what can I launch into goinginto the new year?
And so that was me at the transition to 2024.
There were books I want them to read, Miles I want them to read,
I wanted to do, I wanted to practice writing more, all of
these different things. And so as as January 1st hits
hit the calendar, I get COVID, Iget the flu, I pull my
(05:34):
hamstring, I have an infection that kind of lingers on
throughout the rest of the year.And so any workout that I'm
doing is a walk to the bathroom and back.
But once you do that with the flu, you're exhausted.
And I remember watching my kids play outside, sitting on the
edge of my bed thinking, man, I am starting the year very
poorly. And it taught me thinking.
(05:55):
It just took me down this this rate of thoughts of man,
everything in life that we do, we start poorly, whether it's
it's it's tying our shoes, it's potty training, it's swinging a
Golf Club for the first time, it's algebra starting a job on
the first day. We all start poorly.
And overtime we we get better. But when it comes to the things
(06:15):
that we've always wanted to do, the dreams, the goals, the
habits that we want to develop, like you said, we feel like it
has to be perfect. We feel like we have to have the
perfect plan. Everything needs to be in place.
And if one thing goes wrong, if we miss one day of the diet, one
meal on the diet, let's throw itall away.
If we miss one workout, let's throw it all away.
(06:36):
It's not worth doing. And that sounds crazy because if
we if we treated our kids that way, we make one mistake with
our kids. Well, we got to you got to give
them up for adoption, you know, like that's so the, the start
poorly theme became sort of a soundtrack for me.
And honestly, it's, it's a version of God's grace.
It's a version of grace to us todo and to pursue the things that
(06:59):
we've always wanted to do. That's so good.
And there's a lot to unpack there.
Let me start off by saying, yeah, marriage and parenting are
two of the most sanctifying institutions there are.
Amen. You know, you think you're
selfish. Get married.
I'm sorry you think yourself less, right?
Get married. You know, you think that you've
got things together. Have kids, man.
(07:19):
They show you, you know, they show you just how imperfect you
are. And I'm convinced that's just
part of God's, again, part of God's grace for us.
And you know, when we get into those moments and we think about
like our kids learning to tie our shoes, to tie their shoes or
think about you, any task that they learn, Yeah, they start
poorly. I've got two kids.
(07:39):
I've got 3 kids too. Mine are a little younger than
yours. They're 35 and eight and my
older two were just starting in ball.
So we're getting involved with baseball.
We've tried soccer, but you know, they they don't like to
run. So that wasn't for them and or
they didn't when they were that age, but they're now they're
into baseball. And you know, if I I thought
(08:00):
about the same thing and going through your book, you know, if,
if we use the same logic with them as we do with ourselves,
like, you know, hey, buddy, you can't hit the baseball first
time. You just need to hang it up.
You need to quit. You know, you're just not good
at this and you need to wait until you're perfect to start
playing. That makes no sense, right?
Right. And I think it's because we we
live in such an instant culture.And I'm sure as a pharmacist you
(08:21):
get it too, that people rather than, rather than changing their
diet or changing their lifestyle, just give me a pill
and make all this go away. And even for kids video games,
you can, you can put Madden or college football in in the game
and you can be the best quarterback in the nation.
It just doesn't happen like thatin real life.
(08:42):
And so I try to tell my kids, I've tried to teach them.
I took them to the tennis courtsfor the first time just a couple
weeks ago. And on the way there, I told
them the words, OK, guys, we're going to start poorly.
You're not going to be able to hit the ball soundly every time.
Just this is a learning experience.
And it's so important to come alongside them and really help
(09:02):
them set realistic expectations,isn't it?
I think that's part of our our job as parents is that, yeah, in
an instant culture that we live in, being able to show them
that, you know, not everything'sthis way.
A matter of fact, the things that really matter aren't that
way. The things that are worthwhile
take time and. Hard things in life are worth
doing. Yeah, yeah.
And so, yeah, I've been thinkingabout that lately with the ball
(09:25):
illustration and I'm like, man, but we're we're so hard on
ourselves. And and there is this
expectation that things need to be, like you said, perfect, but
starting poorly. There's a lot of reward in that.
What have you found that really limits us from this expectation
of, OK, if I'm going to start, it's got to go great because you
(09:46):
mentioned everybody around January 1st, they said all these
resolutions that me included, there's nothing wrong with that.
Sure, yeah. But we know we want to be our
best self. We're trying to set ourselves
up. This is going to be my year.
And so I'm, I'm 41 when I turn 40, I said, you know what?
I'm, I'm going to be the healthiest I've ever been when I
turned 40. Well, you know, that whole like,
(10:07):
if you want to hear God laugh, tell him your plans.
It wasn't what God had in mind for me when I turned 40.
Oh, when I turned 40, I had some, some issues pop up and
Long story short, ended up having to have like it was 4
surgeries over 18 months and wow, kept me out of like, you
know, I had the same goals as what you were mentioning.
Wanted to run all the miles, wanted to do all the workouts,
(10:29):
wanted to be healthy, wanted, you know, And I found myself in
this, in this condition to whereI couldn't do anything that I
wanted to do. All those, all those things I'd
set up for myself, it seemed like they were impossible now.
And so the temptation there is to say, forget it all.
Is that what you found in your studies?
(10:49):
In your experience is that thereis this tendency if it can't be
perfect, which is not worth doing?
I think so, yeah. I think that there's there's
different types of fear. Like when we think of fear, we
think of, oh, we're just afraid.And, and in the book, I I kind
of paint the picture of do you remember the old indoor malls?
I don't think we see them as much anymore, but they had the
(11:09):
food courts and you've had the Sabaro's pizza next to the five
Chinese restaurants where you can get samples.
And I love, you know, I would gothere now.
Miss those days? Yeah, miss those days.
And so I think that fear is almost like that food court that
there's different fear vendors that there's there's a fear of
perfectionism. There's a fear you can go over
here, there's a fear of not being good enough.
(11:30):
Go over here, there's a fear of,oh, you're just a copycat of
somebody else. You're, you're an imposter.
There's so fear kind of manifests itself in all these
different places. And even as you're making
progress on your goal, on your dream, fear will tell you a
different story along the way. Yeah.
And you know, that it comes downto, you know, is is it good
(11:52):
enough? How, how much is good enough?
Or at least it has for me in thein the podcasting journey when I
first started this. You know, you, you see Joe
Rogan, you see all these people and man, everything's so
polished. Everything's so great.
And you know, there's, there's alot of limiting beliefs, I think
that pop up whenever we're starting something new, which
also holds us back, you know, part of that whole process of
(12:13):
starting poorly. But, you know, along the lines,
you just have to be able to accept that, you know, there are
limitations in everything that you do, but starting is the most
important step. Can you talk about that?
Just actually starting as being the biggest thing there may be.
The biggest mistake we make is not in the mistakes we make, but
it's not starting anything because we're scared we're going
(12:34):
to make mistakes. I think whenever we start, we
actually, we actually get a taste because, you know, we're
talking about potential. There's some studies done on
potential. I think the numbers are like 50%
of all people feel like actuallyit's larger than.
I think it's like 70% of all people feel like they aren't
living up to their potential, that there's just a bunch of
(12:55):
people walking around just with this gap inside of them, right.
And yeah, imagine, imagine the toll that that takes on them, on
their bodies, on their thoughts,how much healthier they would be
if they were living, living intothat.
And so I think whenever you start, you actually begin to to
taste that dream. You actually begin to taste what
(13:16):
it would be like to do that thing to play the guitar, to
write a book, to train for a marathon.
And, and when you start, you actually begin to, to put into
motion that thing that you've always wanted to do and think, I
think a little bit of planning is necessary.
A lot of planning isn't vital because as soon as you start,
you realize that you, that your plans change, that you needed to
(13:40):
make that plan and, and pencil rather than in pen.
And then you got to be able to pivot.
But when you do start, because I'm sure that you had some
preconceived notions about podcasting, what what changed
for you, what mindset changed for you once you chose to start?
Well, it was just realizing that, you know, something's
better than nothing because if Ijust sit around waiting until
(14:02):
I'm ready, I'll never be ready. Yeah, but you know what?
Something's better than nothing.And everyone has to start
somewhere. Is kind of was kind of by
mantra. Joe Rogan didn't start as Joe
Rogan, you know, He started. He didn't start as what he is
now. He started, you know, like the
rest of us start. And Can you imagine hosting for
three hours a day? Can you like?
(14:24):
I can't imagine doing that. But how much better you'd be?
Sure, that's true. That's true.
And I think back, you know, I think back to my first few
episodes and I apologize to my listeners for for some of those
because, yeah, the audio wasn't great.
The video wasn't great. The conversations may not have
even been all that good. Right.
Yeah. But I think the the grace of God
(14:45):
shined through it because I was faithful and I was obedient in
what He knows me to do. And that's the thing too, you
know, from a faith standpoint, when we're at our weakest,
that's when he's the strongest. And so if I'm always leaning
into I've got to be perfect, I've got to be perfect.
Well, where do we need God? Where does he need to come into
our life? You know, at some point we need
to be able to say, all right, ifhe's calling me to this, he's
going to equip me for it. That doesn't mean immediately,
(15:06):
but it means I'm going to grow into it.
And so at what point do I trust him to be able to make up for
that gap, if that makes sense? Yeah, that's a good question.
I I think I don't wonder sometimes if we would probably
never admit to this, but we think, OK, this is something
that I want to do. This is a dream that I have.
And so it's kind of personal andmaybe it's a little selfish and
God doesn't really have anythingto do with it because it's not
(15:29):
anything super spiritual or it'snot any pursuit of him.
But in reality, I believe that if it's, if it as his children,
if it's something that we're interested in doing and, and
it's not opposed to him, then I think if we care, he cares.
And so if, if we, if this is something that we want to do,
it's most certainly something that we need to allow him into.
(15:50):
Because if you, if you look at the Christian life, if you look
at what Jesus has called us to be like him.
And so you want to talk about starting poorly and and never
reaching perfection in this life.
I mean, the, the Christian life is a is a lifetime of starting
poorly and struggling and striving to become more and more
(16:11):
like Jesus. DA Carson has a great quote.
He says that no one stumbles into holiness and it's it's
about grace driven effort that that we are sanctified, that we
become holy. And so it's just all about that
effort and trying. And so if that's the case with
the Christian life, it's most certainly the case with learning
how to play the guitar, with writing a book, with taking
(16:32):
singing lessons, or whatever thecase may be.
Starting A blog. Starting a podcast.
Yeah. And you know, in your book you
describe these phases that we gothrough and I believe there's is
there 5 or 5 or 6? 5 phases.
Yeah. Can you kind of give us an
elevator pitch version of those and just kind of maybe we can
walk through those and have conversation about it?
(16:53):
Yes. So I think that every phase
exists or every, every dream, every goal, ever habit exists in
these five phases. There's and each one in the book
I highlight there's pros to thatphase, There's cons and there's
box jumps. Whenever I was in high school,
we had to do these box jump exercises and feeded them.
But you couldn't move on. Until you cleared the box jumps.
And so I identify some box jumpsand ways to get over those in
(17:15):
each phase. And so the first phase is the
dream phase and man the dream phase, it's like we're kids
again. It's like we were in in
elementary school. I want to be an astronaut.
I want to be a baseball player. And it's, it's amazing the dream
phase because you can do anything You can be anything and
you can live in this Wonderland as long as you want to.
But if that's also the con is that you some people stay in the
(17:36):
dream phase their entire in our life and they never do anything
about it. And so the the hurdle there in
trying to figure out how do we move on to the actual planning
phase is, is feel like people are busy.
Everybody's busy. The single, the single man's
busy, the married mom is busy, everybody's busy.
But if you can just designate about 15 minutes to just begin
(17:59):
writing down that thing, what itis you want to do, what it is
you want to accomplish, you can start taking a step to the plan
phase. And the plan phase is just that.
It is creating a simple plan. OK, when, when am I going to do
this? How much time am I going to
dedicate to it a day? When am I going to start just
creating just a couple simple little steps will will make a
(18:21):
huge difference. And the box jump there and
you've already spoken to it is perfection getting the perfect
plan. People will get stuck in the
plan phase for a long time if they're waiting for the perfect
plan. And so the the box jump the way
to clear that basically is just to clear that simple plan.
Answer 3 questions. When will I start?
What do I need to start and how long do I work on it per day or
(18:43):
what's the frequency of it? And so those are the first two
phases. The third phase is the start
phase. And we've already talked about
that. The pro there is that you, you
finally are putting, you know, it's where the rubber meets the
road. You're finally putting that into
practice. The con there is that you're
about to find out if you really have what it takes.
And from there you move on to the grind phase and there is no
(19:06):
box jump from start to grind. The grind phase will find you.
You will discover how hard this is.
This is you know, to put a biblical illustration to it,
This is the people wandering through the wilderness.
This is God's people being sanctified.
This is this is the long journeyand and knowing that that this
is developing you, this is that developed their character.
(19:27):
It's developing your perseverance and you're finding
out what you're made of. And then the final phase, if you
continue through that, if you just keep working because the
temptation in the grind phase isdoubt that can I do this?
Can I finish this? The final phase is the finish
phase. And in the finish phase, it's
just that you finally, you finally finished the book.
You finally are a consistent podcast host.
(19:48):
You finally get to run the marathon.
And so the that's obviously its own pro, but but the con and the
fear with the finish phase is OKnow that I've accomplished this.
What's next? People often find so much of
their identity and a certain goal and a certain dream.
What if, what if I paint the paintings?
(20:08):
What if I sell my book? But what if no one likes it?
What if no one likes the work that I do?
What if I'm just a laughing stock?
Because of this, I'm the butt ofevery joke.
There's even a fear when we finish the goal.
So those are the five phases that that every that all of
these find themselves in at one point and and at different times
we can get hung up on in different phases.
(20:29):
Yeah, and that's a really good overview of the, of just really
the whole process of, you know, setting a goal, going after your
goal and finishing your goal. And I love how you address the,
the finishing aspect. If I want to.
Can we talk about that just a minute?
Yeah, sure. Because, you know, it's it's, we
think, all right, I'm done. And when I finish, everything's
(20:49):
going to be fantastic. And, and, you know, there is
that sense of accomplishment at the end, but you're right,
there's so many doubts there. There's so many limiting beliefs
there. And, and I just love to dig
deeper there a little bit too, because we can start and we can
finish something, but it doesn'tend that the finish doesn't.
And so, you know, going on past the finishing and, and you know,
(21:10):
we're never really done with this race.
If we want to use the Christian illustration too, you know, the,
the whole idea of we, we start poorly every day.
You know, we're never going to achieve flawlessness and
perfection on this side of heaven.
You know, there, that's, that's glorification waiting to happen
on the other side. But you know that it's, it's
that, it's the grind that we seem to be stuck in, but yet
(21:33):
there are little finishes along the way.
And those are times where we cancelebrate.
You finished your book. You know, there's, there's a
celebration there. You know, I've, I've, I've had
milestones along my journey. You know, I had the DTH episode
come out just recently, you know, and so I'm like, all
right, yay, But then doubt creeps in, doesn't it?
And I'm, I'm a convinced a lot of times that's just it is
(21:56):
either things in our past that kind of pop up, you know, I'm
not good enough. No one wants to hear my voice,
that kind of thing. Sometimes it's a a trick of the
enemy who who's the author of discouragement a lot of times.
But what have you found is that biggest challenge?
Once we do, all right, we set out, we grind, you know, we, we
end up going through the finishing process, but sometimes
(22:18):
it's not what we think it's going to be.
Yeah, you touch. On it a little bit there's
there's 2 tips that I I recommend.
I have tips recommended throughout each phase, but those
two tips are are sell your work,ship your work.
Seth Godin talks about whatever it is that you finish, share it
with the world. He has this great quote.
(22:38):
Your work will never be good enough for everyone, but it's
already good enough for someone.And well, that, that told me
that again, that's a that's a perfectionistic mindset that we
bring in is that everyone has tolike it.
No, no, they don't and they won't.
But what you have already done is, is good enough for someone
and finding your audience is, iswhat's so important.
(22:58):
But but you, you talking about your 50th episode.
That's that's one of the tips isthat make a memory, post it,
post a picture of it, celebrate it.
My my wife was was really sweet and doing this in in the middle
of my my book launch. There's been so much time and
energy and and sure, a little bit of neglect of my own family
(23:18):
and working in this just becauseit's demanded so much of me.
But but my wife created my own little launch party and launch
backdrop. I didn't have an official launch
party anywhere, but she created one for me in our kitchen.
Her doing that we have we have pictures of it and she helped me
celebrate that. She helped me celebrate in
almost memorial. And so I think whenever we can,
(23:41):
we have these wins along the way.
It it is important to to celebrate.
It is important to communicate that this is my 50th podcast
that this is the launch of this thing.
This is a win that we have because you're right in in the
long marathon that is the Christian life.
We we have to be able to define what what's a win and how we can
(24:01):
celebrate. Those are are really important.
Along the way, they kind of become our.
Ebenezer moments, don't they? Yes.
Yes, our moments of. Remembrance where we, we realize
God's faithfulness to us. And you know, and that's kind of
what that reminds me of is in this Christian journey that we
have, you're just this journey called life.
You know that it's not separate.If you're a believer, you know,
(24:22):
it's not a separate thing. It's just part of you.
But in this journey called life,there, there are seasons and,
and God's faithfulness proves true in every season, but in so
many different ways. And so, you know, you go through
those seasons of all right, well, here's what I'm facing
now. And I'm going to, you know, I'm
going to, I'm going to push through and I'm going to become
(24:44):
whoever it is God tells me I need to become and I'm going to
finish it. And God was faithful to me.
And then now I've got a pivot. You mentioned the art, kind of
the heart of the pivot. That's been the name of the game
for me. I feel like the last two years.
Write everything in pencil and learn to pivot.
But you know, then we. Pivot and, you know, rarely is
life ever just a steady climb. It's it's hills and it's valleys
(25:09):
and it's mountains and it's low moments.
You know, we, we, we go through those and we grind some more.
We dream, we grind, we finish and and then we pivot again.
And so creating those little moments of celebration is, to
me, remembrance of how far we'vecome, how far we've come with
God's help. You know, at 25 episodes, I had
(25:29):
a little mini, yeah, mini celebration.
At 50, I had one. You know, I don't plan on
quitting this anytime soon. Maybe I'll have 100.
Keep on going. Thousand, who knows?
But yeah, yeah. You know it.
And each step of the way, hopefully, we get better.
But each step of the way, we were better than we were before.
And you know, that's a lot of how I see the Christian life in
(25:50):
walking with God because there there is not flawlessness or
perfection on this side, but it's can I be more Christ like
today than I was yesterday? Can I be more Christ like
tomorrow than I was today? And I think that kind of helps
us think through that and have those little moments.
But man, that's so good. You just you nailed like the
(26:12):
human experience in like 10 minutes.
So well, and and. You touched on something too,
like a you can measure how many books you sell, you can measure
how many podcasts you have. Like those are measurables.
It's really hard to measure sanctification.
It's I've long dreamed and, and,and you as a pastor understand
this. I've long dreamed of there being
like this virtual meter over everyone's head to let me know
(26:34):
if they're getting it or not. If it's red, if it's green, and
I would love it if that exists, that'd be awesome.
Yeah, that'd be awesome. But see that meter?
Move just a little bit as we're teaching.
That'd be great. That's right.
Yes, that would do my heart. Such good, right?
Right. You know, but even even beyond
that, it's things like, you know, there is sanctification,
but then just like maturity in general, you know that it's hard
(26:58):
to measure that. It's hard to measure how much
more mature I am as a fill in the blank.
You know how much better I am asa dad for example, then I.
Was when I first. Started this game, yeah.
Yeah, you know that's. Something that I have zero way
of knowing from an objective point of view how much better I
am. But you know what?
(27:18):
That's where we have to say, allright, let's, let's celebrate
those milestones. You know what my kids said this
last week and that really let meknow they've been listening,
they've been paying attention. It may not look like it, right?
It may not seem like it, but youknow what they did?
And that shows me they get it. Or you know what?
They learned how to do this and you know, one of the things I've
learned about being a dad and I,you know, I had no stretch
(27:41):
perfect, any consideration but you there.
Yep, I'm here. He gave me the warning that my
battery's getting low, but we got we got.
OK, cool. Anyway, one of the things I've
learned learned about from beinga dad is that you know, you
don't, you don't really know where you are in the in the
grand scheme of things until afterwards.
It's in looking back a lot of times that we realize that
(28:02):
growth. And so kind of my last question
for you is what's your view on kind of reflection?
Because I think all along the way we need to see the progress
we've we've gone through. And so there's a lot of value in
retro retrospection, a lot of value in reflecting on where did
I start and then where am I now?Yeah, that.
That's good. I've always been, I had this
(28:23):
conversation a few years ago with somebody.
They they are very good at reflection.
I have always been. What's the next thing?
Yeah. And so I've been awful at what
you're talking about. But, but I think I think
whenever I allow myself to do that, and you, you touched on
this a little bit at the beginning of the podcast, is
that having, having a wife and having children pulls a lot of
(28:44):
selfishness out of you. And, and over time, when you're
drained of that, you're actuallya pretty a lot more selfless
person than you were at the beginning.
And so, yeah, I, I think that I think it's really helpful,
especially with any goal or any journey that you're on, if you
can document in some way. I found this really cool way of
doing it for me. I've never used this before.
(29:08):
And and so this is a plug to these people, but there's
something called the hero's journal, OK.
And, and it's a really, it's kind of they these, these people
kind of did their own research with goal setting and they
basically told almost like a, almost like a role-playing game
story. And every, every page has a
(29:29):
little caricature and picture and you see this little
character go on this journey. And as you, as you work towards
your goal, as you document what your goal is for, for that day
or for that, that 90 day period,you can talk about how you're
feeling. You can journal how you're
feeling. And you see this character on
each page go from place to placeand overcome certain obstacles.
(29:52):
And so revisiting that, something I'd never used before,
was kind of a companion that I took on this little trip.
And so I think that if you can do something like that, whether
that's on a specific goal, whether that's on your faith
journey, that's just one of, again, one of the spiritual
disciplines that we're better for if we can make ourselves do
it. Yeah, 100%.
(30:13):
I've never been a believer in journaling until recent years.
I'm like, oh, that's something, you know, Dear Diary, that's
that's something all the teenagegirls do.
But yeah, yeah, maybe they do that.
Right. Yeah, there's.
A lot of value in that, you know, just in in documenting,
you know, some of those high moments, some of those low
moments. And again, it's just those ways
of looking back and saying, huh,things have changed a lot over
(30:34):
time. Yeah.
Yeah. And I know, I think I know what
you're talking about too. I'll put a link to that in the
show notes as well. Yeah.
It's really cool. Hero Journal you're.
Right. I mean I.
I've gone back and looked at a journal entry that I made a few
years ago and something really major and, and frustrating was
going on. And looking back, I thought, you
know, that that really wasn't asbig of a deal as I thought it
(30:55):
was like God has a way of, of pulling you out of that and
making you forget it and. That's a, you know, that's,
that's a large part of life, isn't it?
And in the moment, things seem like a much bigger deal than if
we just get through it, look back and we're like, not that
big a deal. Yeah.
Yep. Just a man this has been.
Awesome. I could, I could talk to you a
(31:15):
while about this, but man, you have you've really had a lot of
value to my life and in the in your writing and excited to
bring that value to my listenersas well.
Can you tell us how they can connect with you and enter into
your world? Absolutely.
You could go to justingrifford.com GRIF
authority com and there you can subscribe to my newsletter that
(31:36):
you can purchase my book. There's an Amazon link there,
but you can also find it at bookBarnes and Noble
books-a-million. It's available in the Audible as
well if you want me to read it to you, but it's pretty much
available everywhere. Awesome.
Thank you so much, brother. Keep doing the awesome work for
the Kingdom and we'll be in touch for sure.
But you guys check them out. Justin Grifford, I'll put the
(31:57):
links in the show notes and you guys check them out.
Doing great work and and man, just keep being a blessing.
All right. Thanks, Chad.
Thank you for listening. To the Rev RX Podcast, we hope
you enjoyed what you heard today, and if so, we'd love it
if you would hit that subscribe button so that you'll never miss
a new episode from us. Also, feel free to leave us
reviews and comments as we'd love to hear from you.
(32:17):
Be blessed and be the very best you.
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