October 8, 2025 • 50 mins
Brian Smith grew up in the Bible Belt but far from God—afraid of death, angry at Christians, and proud of being the class clown. Then real friends loved him without an agenda… and a year after graduation he discovered they’d secretly advocated so he could walk.
On a Georgia roadside he prayed, “Jesus, if you’re real, save me,” and everything changed. We cover fear, pride, authentic Christianity, Romans Road, and how to be the kind of friend who tears off roofs.
For more information about Rev Rx, Man Alive Coaching, or how you can receive Jesus as your Lord and Savior, you can email chad@manalivecoaching or visit www.manalivecoaching.com
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Episode Transcript
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(00:11):
Hello and welcome back to another episode of the Rev RX
Podcast. My name is Chad Potts and I'm
your host today. I'm so excited to bring you a
gospel shaped conversation with my new friend Brian.
You see, Brian Smith is a student pastor just up the road
from me in Georgia in a town called Dunwoody.
But what you're going to love about him is his testimony
(00:33):
that's going to just shake you to your core because he grew up
in the Bible Belt, but he was the self-proclaimed atheist.
Yet God never gave up on him. He pursued him and threw some
friends who loved him without anagenda.
He came to know the Lord, proceed to call to ministry and
now is serving in that role. You're going to love to hear the
(00:56):
difference that God made in his life.
I think you're going to relate to every part of his testimony.
And I can't wait for you to watch this all the way to the
end so you can see how this story ends.
Without further ado, I introduced to you my new friend,
Brian Smith. Brian Smith, Brother, what a
privilege it is to have you hereon the show from just up the
road in Dunwoody, GA Thank you for being here.
(01:20):
I'm excited about it. Well, I heard your story and it
was on a different podcast and I'm like, what is up with this
guy from Dunwoody? You have an you have just a
powerful story of God changing your life and using you in a
mighty way. And man, I want to get into that
story because that's what I wantto talk about today.
But before then, hey, tell us who you are, but where you're at
(01:40):
and the good things that the Lord's using you to do there in
Dunwoody. Yeah, so I'm originally from
South Georgia, a little town called Brunswick.
It smells awful, but it's on thecoast, so it's beautiful.
It does. Yeah.
I, I, I came with the faith whenI was 20 years old, like I'd say
when I was, I was 20. I turned it was in that summer
of that, that year. But I'm a, I'm a student pastor
(02:04):
at a church called Dunwoody Baptist in Dunwoody, GA.
We're in the interim season. So I'm, I'm currently the
primary communicator. So I'm trying to juggle students
and called big church, which is probably not the right word, but
students say in big church. At the same time, my wife and I
have been married, I think for, oh, I should know this by now.
(02:25):
16 years, 16 or 17 years. And then we got 4 kids.
I got a 10 year old, twin 10 year olds, an almost 13 year old
and then an almost 3 year old. So we got a gaffe.
You do All over the place. Well, yeah.
Bless you brother, man you. You got your hands full and you
(02:45):
know God's using you and he's using your story because one of
the things that I want to go into is about your upbringing
and smelly old Brunswick. You know, I, I've, I'm a couple
hours from the coast here in middle Georgia and love the
coast, but you're right, man, itstinks down there.
Yes, thanks dude. But you grew up in Brunswick and
you know, you didn't grow up, you're in a Bible Belt, right?
(03:06):
But you didn't grow up as faith with faith to part of your
story. Can you tell us a little bit
about that? It's.
One of those things that like I,I don't really know why it
wasn't part of our, our family. Because you've been in the in
the South in like in the the Bible belt, Bible Belt, it's
always around, right? There's churches are everywhere.
Churches always around. But it just wasn't important to
(03:27):
my parents. Like they taught me I when I was
a little kid. They taught me that.
Now I lay me down to sleep prayer.
Sometimes we pray that prayer, and they taught me the scary
version of it. Like, I know there's a new nice
version, but the one they taughtme was that, you know, I pray
the Lord, if I should die beforeI awake, I pray the Lord my soul
to take. And I remember as even as a
little elementary school kid hearing those words and be like,
(03:50):
God, please don't take my soul. Please don't take my soul.
Like, why is that on the table? Yeah.
Like, I don't want that. So it's not like my parents were
like, against faith. It just didn't matter.
My mom is like going to make this.
It's it's true, but a joke. But I, I don't know if I knew
that Easter was like a religiousthing until I was, you know,
(04:14):
middle school. It was, it wasn't, it was like,
man, we hate the church and we hate God and we hate Christians.
It was more like they we treatedthem like almost like this is a
matter. It's just a dumb thing.
We did have the the churches andtown used to do like hell houses
or judgment house, just not so like, you know, like as a kid
(04:35):
you would go to like the Jay CS haunted house and then you would
go to the church to go to their judgement house because it was
just as scary as the IT was likea it felt like a scary haunted
house because you get to walk through hell at the end, But
that's kind of it was very shallow.
Any parts of the faith? Yeah, yeah, you know, and I and
I love that you defined that because it's not like you were
(04:56):
anti faith. It just, you know, you do your
thing, I do mine and that's not my thing, you know, and I'm
around that a lot too. And you know, I kind of joke
you're in the Bible Belt, you know, but yeah, I mean it, it's
this is spiritual apathy. You know, it is kind of a the
word that comes to mind or the phrase that comes to mind.
And you know, there, there's a lot of people out there that are
maybe in that same boat. You know, you're just, you're
(05:18):
not anti Christian. You're just that's that's not
your thing. And so that's how you grew up.
And, you know, as, as you Share your story, and I've been
fortunate to hear it now, you know, as you Share your story,
you talk about as you went through school, you kind of had
these thoughts about Christians,right?
Like kind of some, you know, some ideas about who they were
(05:39):
and kind of why they believe what they believed.
Can you take us into that a little bit?
Because I find that very interesting and very relatable.
Yeah, I, like I said, I I have abizarre, I hold on to memories.
I'm sure everyone does anyway. But I, my dad, I remember one
time we are, we, we're driving somewhere.
And then like one of those little moments of like
(06:00):
contemplation, I think it was quoting A Steely Dan song.
I don't know where this came from, but he said to me, I
thought he was out of the blue. He was like, son, I'm not sure
if there's a heaven, but I know that there's a hill and it like,
was it? That was a terrifying thing to
hear as a little kid because I, I especially as a young person,
I, I hated the idea of death. I'm so scared of that idea.
(06:22):
I have an uncle who is a, a grave digger.
It always sounds funny when I say that he's awesome.
Uncle Terry TNT vault Monument, like buried people for a living.
He would talk about funerals allthe time and we were really
close. His son, my cousin, we're super
tight. We're we're like best friends.
And so it wasn't like totally uncommon to go to the graveyard
and sit in the car by Terry, youknow, put out chairs or dug a
(06:44):
grave. And so I don't know if I was
around death more or maybe everyone has those those fears.
But like, I hate it. I hate I would wake up at night
with like cold sweats, even as alittle kid.
And I had those moments where it's like, it almost feels
better to not be born because once you're born, you have to
die. And like, why?
And I would go to my mom and my dad and say, like, I, I'm that
(07:07):
fear was like real in me. And they would say like doing
the best they can to like comfort a little kid who's like
having like an existential fear moment, right?
My mom is a that's going to, it's a long time.
Like you're so young. That's a long way away.
And it didn't help because that's the problem, right?
Like it is a long way away, but it's inevitable and it's right
(07:28):
there and, and, and I hate it. I'm so scared of it.
And as I got older, fear in me like became more like anger,
like I anger like I was, I was mad about it.
I don't like that. I didn't like the idea of of
like people on as if any faith acting like they weren't afraid
of death. In my mind.
(07:48):
I just assumed that all, all of faith, all of especially
Christians were people doing everything they could to ignore
just the reality of death. Like all of it is fear.
You're scared, all of you were scared and you refuse to make
you're scared. And I'm tired of feeling scared
so I'm going to be mad instead of scared.
Yeah, yeah. And that's that's how I kind of
felt about all of it. Yeah, and you know, there's
(08:10):
that's a real that's a common conception really of the
Christian faith or of faith in general, is that it's just the
answer to the existential crisisthat we have to come come to at
some point to realize, you know,hey, we're all going to die.
And, and I'm man, I understand that waking up in the cold
sweats because there's been times childhood and then even
like young adult years where, you know, before Jesus really
(08:31):
got a hold of my life where I would wake, I would let my mind
go there. And I'm like, you know, what if,
what if this is it? And then like, you know, you
live and like you go through theday-to-day and you stress and
you go to work and you pay your bills and you know, like then
someday you're going to die. And then that's, that's it.
And you're no more. It's all pointless.
(08:52):
Yeah, you're it's all pointless and and you're just lying to
yourself. And I didn't like it.
Yeah, yeah. So you know, yeah, it's that
concept of his fate just being used to to make us feel better
about the and you know, it's that's a common thing.
And and and I think that's very relatable too, because that's
one of the one of the skeptics that that I kind of follow are
(09:12):
ex skeptics. You could say, you know, that
that's one of the big things. And so you had this fear and you
you kind of thought of Christianity, I guess, maybe as
a fear based type thing. Yeah, but it and it, you know,
you, you fear. And then, hey, here in the Bible
belt too. Another thought that takes me to
is a lot of times we accept Christ because we don't want to
go to hell. It's not that we, you know, I'm
(09:36):
not, I'm not saying people, I'm not saying that's not real, but
I'm saying, you know, that's, that's, that's the way a lot of
times we get people is, you know, those judgement houses and
that makes you just scared to death.
If you're walking through hell, then literally and you know, I
don't want to, I don't want to go there.
I better do whatever it takes tonot go there.
You. Know and if that becomes the
reality of what our Christian walks about, we're missing so
(09:57):
much. Not that that can't be a
starting place, but from someoneon the outside looking in, that
makes total sense. It, it also made me feel like I
couldn't because later on I got invited to church and my dad
even talked to me about this, about being cautious around
Christians. But it also kind of made me feel
like I couldn't trust them because I didn't believe they
were being honest. It's like you believe in God or
whatever you don't really. Like, if I, if I could get
(10:19):
inside your brain, I would find out that you really didn't.
And I didn't. So made me feel like they were
like slimy in a way. Like I can't trust.
Yeah. Phony.
That's right. Yeah.
Yeah, you know, and and they want you to come along and you
know, they they wanted you to bea part of them, but it was just
more so about, you know, they wanted something from you almost
(10:44):
Yeah, yeah. And I get that.
Yeah. So you talk about too how you
were a little bit of a I'm not putting words in your mouth, a
little bit of a bully towards kind of a class clown, but with
a mean spirit. Tell us about that with towards,
towards some of the, some of thefaith-based guys, because I
mean, let's face it, if you wantto get into somebody's kitchen
these days, you know, you bring up faith and that really does
(11:05):
it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You know, I'm not a great. I was never a good student, but
I was always a fast talker. I felt like as a kid sometimes
being like quick to speak, like it gets you in trouble, but also
it opens up a whole lot of doorsfor you.
And I found out, I can't tell you like a specific time or
whatever, but like, I mean, every young person goes to this,
(11:25):
right? You want to fit in.
And I, I found out the easiest way to make friends was to try
to be funny. And the easiest way to make
people laugh is to be mean to someone else sometimes.
Yeah. And also there's a whole lot
more to it. And then I'm going to over
analyze myself. I have a learning disability.
It's called dysgraphia, which islike, it's kind of like inverse
(11:46):
dyslexia. So like when I write things, it
looks crazy. Like sometimes I can't remember
like what direction the letters to, like the word was is
supposed to be. And I'll write like, numbers for
letters, like FS for fives and fives, refs and sevens and s s.
So I like, I also struggle with feeling like I was dumb.
Like I didn't want to feel dumb.Like something was wrong with
(12:07):
me. And I had to take all these
tests and it was, you know, thisthing.
So I wanted to fit in and I didn't want to feel dumb.
And the best way I figured out to, like, kind of deal with that
was pick whoever the people I thought were the the people I
wanted to be around and then tryto make them laugh.
Right. Like, I wanted to make myself
feel smarter than other people. Yeah.
(12:28):
And I hope that this group of people will be like, hey, you
should come and hang it. Like we'll protect you.
Like, come and be part of our proud.
So I just, yeah, I don't know, man.
I still have that. Some people will run from
confrontation. And sometimes I look forward.
And especially if it's going to be like a verbal thing, I was
confident. I'm going to make you look dumb
and I'm going to feel so good about it.
And I would argue with people about things that, like, I
(12:51):
didn't believe in. I just wanted them to feel
wrong. Yeah, I don't think it sounds
crazy to me, man, but if you make them.
Feel wrong, then that makes you feel better.
It makes you feel right. Yeah.
Yeah. And I like the idea of being
smarter than them. We've all been there.
But we want to be, we want to besmart ones in the room.
We want to be the liked ones in the room.
And a lot of times we have to belittle others to make that
(13:12):
happen. And.
What we like about the right people too, right Like you want
the right people to like you. Exactly.
So you know, you went through this and then at some point you
kind of you use that word atheist, right?
You know, it kind of started as a little bit of a, you know,
maybe an agnostic or just a apathy towards fate.
But at some point you grasped a hold of that phrase atheist.
(13:33):
Tell us about that and and kind of why you chose that and what
that meant to you. But what was that like to go,
you know, from apathy to atheismand then how you describe
yourself? Yeah, I, you know, I'm trying
to. I don't, I don't know when I
first heard that word or, or learn the word, but like I said,
I like, I like sports, but I wasn't, I wasn't great at them,
you know, but I like that This Is Us versus them kind of
(13:54):
mentality, you know, competition.
Yeah. It felt like to me it was like
if you're going to have to pick a team that was a team that was
easier to to pick and it was a little like a like stand like
standoff fishing and unique yournovel almost.
So I know like in 8th grade, it probably wouldn't be this.
In 8th grade, I got invited to athing at a church.
It was called Power team. I don't know if you guys ever
(14:15):
had power team in Dublin. Yes.
Well, in, in Rome, where I grew up, we had the power team come
to our church and man, I, I was,I was enthralled.
I loved it. So I went, I went.
They I got invited. You know, it's just, it's like
WWE guys, maybe I don't know who, they're big, huge muscle
dudes who. Break.
Just break stuff. They break boards.
(14:35):
And that's what I remember, yeah.
Giant blocks of ice on. Fire and they think they came to
our school even. Yeah.
That would be cool. So people were like, you gotta
come to see these guys break things.
And it's like, well, of course we're gonna come and see guys
break things. And I remember him.
It was 7th grade actually. And I remember them doing the
whole thing. And at the end they were like
giving them their, their, I knowthe words testimony now, right,
(14:57):
But I know what they were just talking right.
And they're like, I was, I had these drug issues and I had
these all these problems in my life.
Now I met Jesus and then they did a, a, a old school close
your head, bow your eyes and I like it.
It did mess me up like I had I had it was emotional and then I
was in the same way I was just Ifelt like I was being
manipulated, like I hate. I didn't like that.
(15:18):
And how do you think that was a catalyst to be like, like,
don't, like, do that again, you know, like don't.
Not go in there, yeah. Don't dip your toe back in that
pool. So I was kind of trying to build
a wall because I didn't like theway I felt after that.
And so like there were, there were a lot of times, 9th, 10th
and 11th grade where like, you know, I liked saying like, Hey,
(15:39):
I'm an atheist because it felt like it wasn't something you
should say. Do what?
I mean, just for the fun of being like, I'm not scared of
this thing. And you guys, you can say
whatever you want to say but I'mwilling to be like death sucks
and y'all are scared and I, I won't I, I put in words.
It just made me feel better about all that.
(16:01):
Well, and, you know, you kind ofgave yourself a title and it was
one that stood out. Yeah, I put a jersey on, right?
I kind of put a jersey on and I was like, this is the team now.
Yeah, and, and bless those guys,Power team.
Yeah, I'm sure God used them in some cool ways.
Yeah, yeah. I remember thinking how cheesy
it was if I'm honest. But I love seeing them, like,
bash the things and smash the boards and, you know, do all
(16:23):
that stuff. I love that part.
But yeah, like that, you know, it seemed a little forced.
You know, they're telling their testimony and, you know, there's
big guys and they're crying. And it's like, I can relate to
that. And, you know, not to the point
where it just, like, pushed me away.
But I can see how that would have because you don't.
People don't like the feeling ofbeing manipulated.
Yeah, and I'll tell you what it like I've never seen anything
like it. Like I never heard people talk
(16:44):
about the past and what the bad,you know, I hadn't seen that
before. So it wasn't like I was like,
Oh, this is cheesy. It was like almost too real.
You know what I mean? It's like when you have that
that like tank like that, that we call them tanker swords,
right? Those things in your mouth and
you keep pushing on it and you're like don't want to
because it hurts, but you kind of it's like one of those things
I was. Like I can't not.
Yeah, I don't like that you're pushing here.
(17:05):
And then and that's a that was apivotal moment, you know, it
sounds like and you know, kind of in your walk and, and kind of
helped you choose that jersey. Yeah, pushed me like I don't
want that again. Yeah, yeah.
Then as you got into high school, you befriended some some
guys, right? I want to talk about the
importance of who you surround yourself with.
(17:25):
Yeah, man. Because here you are.
Brian the Atheist. Yeah, I'm not sure that's what
you. That's probably not what they
called you, but that's what I'm calling you, Brian the atheist.
Brian, a smart mouth jerk. But but you were friends with
some guys that were pretty good guys, right?
Can you tell us about that? Yeah, man, like I and it was, it
was summer after 7th grade and 8th grade, they redistricted our
(17:48):
schools and got sent to a new middle school for 8th grade.
And like that whole like I want to fit in thing was so strong.
And now I'm at a new school withnew people and there are people
from the island that go to the school.
So they're like, you know, way richer and different and like to
fit into that school seems so much different to me than it did
at the first middle school was at it was it was even called
Jane Macon, which sounds like a just a real fancy Jane Macon
(18:11):
middle school. Gentleman and a scholar.
Yeah, it just sounds nice. Yeah.
And it was real easy to see who the, the like the guys were that
like everyone liked. It was super obvious who they
were. I just try to force my way in,
like every way. I feel like I just made myself
sit at the table. I did everything I could to be
(18:32):
around him. I changed like the way I
dressed, the way everything I did.
I was trying to fit in with these guys and not all of them,
like a lot of them made mistakes.
They got older. Like the core dudes that were
part of that group and from my perspective just happened to be
Christians. I almost had the reverse
situation a lot of parents have where it's like my kids hanging
with the wrong crowd. The cool kids happened to be the
(18:54):
good crowd at my school and their middle schoolers.
We did all sorts of dumb stuff as we got older, but even in 8th
grade, especially my, my friend Alex and Marcus, my cousin TJ
was, we went to a different school, but he ended up hanging
out with those guys as well. But like they were like goofy
and authentic in a way that I, Iwasn't.
And it was my first time hangingout with Christians that I was
like, like these dudes don't seem scared.
(19:16):
I don't know, like they didn't seem, they seem different than
when I thought they were going to be like and I had to hang out
with them because I didn't I wanted to fit in and they with
people that you needed to fit inwith.
They were, they were the ones you needed to that you needed to
open that door. So, yeah.
And yeah. So that was kind of it that I
want to sit there a minute because that's interesting.
(19:38):
You found these guys and and they were they, they were, they
were maybe not what you thought that Christians were about on
this side of things. All right, so I'm skipping a
little bit, you know, on this side of things.
Now you're a pastor. What's your, how do you, how do
you look back at that and make sense of that?
You know that I think there are probably a lot of people,
(19:59):
they're skeptical about Christians, but then there were
some you were drawn to. And how do you, how do you make
sense of that? I think one of those guys who
ended up being like one of my best friends, like his parents,
his his parents have been divorced.
His dad had had a couple of relationships.
They lived with a step dad and his mom.
My parents didn't get along. They lived in separate rooms.
(20:22):
They fall all the time. And there's probably a whole lot
of anger and stuff in me becauseof that jazz too.
But all the all like the anger and the fear and the like I want
to fit in that I had like built up.
I know, man, for an eighth grader because I'm talking so
deep, but didn't I didn't have the words for it.
I just this is all the things I felt right.
He didn't have like he was a cool skin school and he didn't
care. He wasn't trying to be cool.
(20:43):
He wasn't like trying to fit in.He wasn't trying to impress
anybody. He wasn't trying to act like
things are good at home. He wasn't he was just him.
He just being there and and being a dude it, it was like,
it's like I met a new type of person is what it felt like in
some ways, because some of the other friends in the group were
(21:03):
probably more similar to me thannot.
But there's a few of them that were like they didn't care
because they didn't care. They were kinder because they
didn't care. They were like cooler.
They like they had a piece like I would say now looking back,
right, they have that piece thatI was like desperately longing
for and even they was a great piece, you know what I mean?
It was like. A lot.
(21:25):
Well, I think we're all after that.
Yeah. And I talk to men every day that
are after that. We didn't, we never grow out of
it until we find that the sourceof true peace.
I love that because, yeah, there's these caricatures of
Christians. Yeah.
And some, let's face it, some people live that out, you know,
some people are living out that caricature because that's what
they know. But then when you when you meet
(21:45):
the real deal, like when you when you meet the one that's you
know, and I don't a lot of different words for it.
When you meet the one that's sold out and when you meet the
one that has that piece that's found, you know, that
relationship with Christ and it comes out of them.
It oozes out of them. It's contagious and and there's
something attractive about that,isn't there?
(22:06):
Yeah, yeah. I mean, I knew something was
like, as I got older, I, I kept a like a journal.
I'd write stuff in it. And there's a whole lot of like,
I know something's missing, right?
And it was I felt like hollow and I felt like I had met a real
people didn't mean like I feel like a hollow person who like
encountered a solid person sometimes.
(22:27):
And I was like, whoa, what it What is this?
Yeah, give me some of that, right.
Yeah, yeah, because even though I didn't want to be, I didn't
read all the time, you know? And and then, you know, you
these were friends that you carried, carried with you.
And they're, they're reached a point in time where you were you
were getting ready for graduation.
Can you talk to us about that? I love.
(22:48):
Yeah, I love some of this. Didn't think you were going to
graduate but. No, yeah, bye.
So I was, I started hanging out with those guys in 8th grade, In
9th grade, you know that our friends group was pretty
solidified and the whole time wewere in high school, they are
super involved in church. And they weren't perfect, man.
I've talked to some of the guys now and they were like, we
(23:10):
didn't even try. And I'm like, that's kind of the
point. They weren't, they weren't over.
They they, they can invite me tocamp sometimes and they invite
me to come to the church group stuff.
And I think I went once and samething.
People were crying. I didn't like it.
So I didn't go anymore. So they weren't like, they
weren't like, hey, Brian, here'sa Bible verse or hey, Brian,
let's pray together. None of that.
They were just kind of being friends.
And they also had there's a whole part of their life I never
(23:32):
really was evolved in back then.I never saw what they did at
church for what it was like for them or not.
But we were just real close. The more I hung out with them,
the more they they shaped me. But I was still dull, broken
center me. So yeah, Senior High School.
I was in a sociology college class that I I needed to
graduate my teacher, poor Miss McNair.
(23:56):
I mean, I'm also from a small town and had this big ego and
this big pride thing. I felt like I was too smart for
my school and my town. And so like, I just didn't do
anything like I, But sometimes Itold my teachers that begin
like, I'm too smart for this. I'll pass whatever test you want
to give me, but I'm not doing like word searches, like I'm a
grown up. I don't need this junk in my
life. And Miss McNair, like, I guess
(24:17):
an adult now, I'm like, man, you're the perfect kind of
teacher that you're kind of a teacher we need.
But she did not care. She was not moved by my pride or
charisma or small town. This kid thinks he knows
everything. And so at the end of the class,
I think I, it was either 40 or 30 was by like total grade.
I needed 70 to graduate. And in my high school, the last
week of school, seniors didn't come to school.
(24:38):
And it was like all graduation practices.
And then for some reason that the families let seniors rent
houses on the island. They'd all live over there for a
week. So before that final week of
school, you would get your, yourgrades.
So now your official grades, like here's your grade from each
class. You shouldn't even be in that
situation where you don't know if you're going to graduate or
not. But I got my, my thing from Miss
(25:00):
McNair and it said like, Hey, itsaid my score, what grade was,
you know, whatever. And I was so mad at like I
blamed her. I was like, why would, why would
she do this to me? And then I knew that the school
would send something to my parents until like, I've raced
home as fast as I could and was like waiting in the mailbox and
trying to take this letter out because I don't want my parents
(25:22):
find out that I failed. And then that whole week, like
it's senior week that's supposedto be like, it's your last week
of high school and everyone's, you know, making memories and
this is the teen ROM com movie week of life, right?
I was like, and everyone's goingto find out that I'm like, I'm a
shame, like I am phony. I acted like I was smarter than
everybody. I was better than everybody.
And I did all this stuff and I'mwhatever.
(25:43):
And I'm not going to graduate high school.
I didn't want anyone to know about it.
And we want to find out about it.
We, we would go in the mornings to school for graduation
practice. And I remember there's a couple
times administrators would walk in and tap someone on the
shoulder and take him out. And I was just waiting, man.
Like, like, I was going to throwup every second we were in that
room. Like, they're going to come and
(26:04):
tap my shoulder. And then in front of all these
people, I'm going to be finally embarrassed.
And like, you know, that was awful.
And they never came and got me. And I was like, even on
graduation night, I was convinced, dude, that they
didn't. Like, embarrassing me in front
of the school wasn't enough. Like it had to be the whole
town. And like, Doctor Turner's going
to Call My Name and I get up there.
He was going to stay in front ofeverybody, but not Brian.
(26:25):
He didn't like passed this, thislike easy class because he
thought he was better than everybody.
And like, we got to teach him a lesson.
And then graduation night happens and I, they gave me a
diploma and I like, I like, I cannot tell you how like I was.
I was just convinced it all was going to fall apart.
I was terrified of everybody finding out.
(26:48):
Waiting on the other shoe to drop.
Well, yeah. And then I thought like, right
after graduation for a while, like I did it like I fooled all
these people, like I am better than this dumb small town and
these dumb small town teachers. And like she talked a big game.
But in the end, I won. Like I beat.
I felt like I won. And they just, you know, either
they gave me a diploma because they didn't want to deal with me
or they gave me a diploma because they knew I was right.
(27:09):
Like just all sorts of weird ego, you know, stuff mixed into.
And mashed them like the power team.
So the the the sometime that that summer after we graduated
high school, that my friend group, my cousin Alex, Marcus
and Jordan, these guys like theystarted going to a church in
town that started like a contemporary service And they
(27:30):
were playing like, you know, regular church songs now, like a
modern worship music at the time, Chris Thomas songs.
I don't know what they were. They were singing those songs
and they only had an orchestra up to that point.
And the church really needed someone to like come help run
sound for that new modern worship service.
And I don't, you know what they did, but they convinced the
church to, to hire me to come and run sound for services.
(27:54):
And there's a whole lot into that story.
But there was a one of the Sundays about a year after I
graduated, maybe like almost a year that I've been running
sound up in the balcony at FirstBaptist Brunswick.
And I saw one of my teachers. It's like she went to church
there. And I eventually was like, I got
(28:14):
to find like, what happened? How did I, how did I graduate?
And so I, I went and found her. She was my economics teacher
whose class sitting at class I ignore.
I slept through it all the time.Like my little sister still
tells a story about like she wasin 9th grade when I was a senior
and she would come into the sameteacher's classroom and I would
(28:35):
just be sleeping on the back desk.
And the teacher was like, nobody, wake him up.
Let's just see how long he'll sleep, you know, and, and I was
really disrespectful and unkind to this poor lady.
It was, you know, anyway, because I went and found her and
I was like, hey, what happened? Do you know about this?
Do you know how I wasn't supposed to graduate?
Like, what did the teachers talk?
You know, does anyone know what happened?
(28:55):
And she was like, yeah, of course we everyone talks like,
yeah, everyone knew that you weren't supposed to graduate.
Like the teachers knew. I knew.
And she didn't say it, but she should have been like, yeah,
Miss McNair is doing the right thing too.
So I was like, well, so how did I graduate?
And she was like, you, you don'tknow.
And I don't know why what happened.
(29:18):
And, and those that friend groupwho I kind of like brought me in
and, and that group of Christiandudes, like I said, you weren't
really trying to do. I mean, they were trying.
They weren't over the top. I think.
I guess she had told them, hey, your friend Brian's not going to
graduate. I didn't, I didn't tell anybody.
I didn't go to anything there and ask her to give me chances
(29:40):
or extra credit. I just was going to sit in my
failure on my own. And she told some of these
friends, which, you know, it wasa kind of bold thing to do
anyway, and they prayed togetherand they decided they were going
to go talk to Miss McNair for me.
So like my friends, without telling me, went and asked like
her. Like they went on on my bath.
(30:01):
That teacher who I was so rude to went on my behalf and said,
like, hey, we really believe that there there's more to
Bryant than all this stuff that he's kind of built up.
And I don't know, they convincedher when no one ever told me.
Like they for, you know, a year or so, like they didn't like
hold it over my head that I didn't know any of it, you know,
and. Then it's amazing.
(30:21):
Yeah, dude, suddenly, like all the stuff that that preacher was
talking about, about like, you know, Jesus loving you before
you could love him, helping you before you could help anyone,
like standing in, you know, the gap for you.
Like all of it felt like it hit me in that moment, like, oh,
like, that's what these people did for me.
And that like, I mean, that was kind of the first step to like,
(30:44):
I don't know, making my heart like beat a little bit, you
know, like be real, like it was.And Mary, like I said, I like to
think I'm smart, but I know I'm not.
But it really was God being like, here's look, this is how
it works. You couldn't do it on your own.
So someone else did it for she feel like and it it opened it up
to me a whole bunch man. Isn't that the gospel story?
(31:06):
Yeah, right. Yeah, we can't do it on our own.
We need others. We need someone to advocate for
us. Yeah.
Yeah. That's what.
Yeah. Jesus is our advocate, man.
Man, that's powerful. The power of friends, too.
I'm reminded. And and sometimes you use this
parallel of the man who was brought to Jesus and lowered
through the roof. And of course, we've seen, you
know, social media memes, you know this.
(31:27):
It matters who you surround yourself with, you know, find
you some friends that will that will lower you through the roof.
Yeah. And you know, like you, you've
experienced that in a lot of ways, you experienced that with
your graduation like that shouldn't have happened, but but
and they, and then you experienced it too with, you
know, they, they did lead you tothe Lord.
Yeah. You know, and, and not in a way
(31:49):
that was just bashing you over the head.
Like, dude, wake up. You know, wasn't preaching to
you What? They were just your friend and
they cared for you and they loved you and they didn't have
an agenda. Like that's the thing that comes
to mind for me. They're we're not going to be
front, we're not going to be friends with Brian so that he
can be a Christian and so he canbe a check mark and a notch in
(32:11):
our belt and all these things. Just going to love them.
And you know, we're going to, we're going to live the life in
front of them and we're going todo what's best for Brian.
And it's not reminded. Go ahead.
I would say, I, I talked to, I said my cousin, we're supposed
to probably Alex. We're super close.
I did a, we did a series at church a couple months ago about
(32:31):
like people sharing their testimonies.
And I was, I was sharing that story and my wife called Alex up
and had him come for one of the services.
It was cool. So Trigger was like, Hey, here's
here's one of the guys I was talking about.
He's right here. Sure.
He shot my cousin to get him to say stuff too.
And he's like, only God could change Brian's mind because he
was too hard headed. Like in some ways it was like,
you know, we tried, but it wasn't going to work.
Only God had to get to him. But I talked to those guys and
(32:53):
like, if they were here, they were like, we didn't really do
anything. And I'm like, dude, you don't
even know who like how much you like, I wouldn't have come to
Jesus. And if I hadn't come to Jesus,
then I, I wouldn't be on the like the, the path that he's got
me on. I wouldn't have met my wife.
I wouldn't have like none of what I have none of like the
blessings I've got to experienceand like the strength and the
hardships I've got to experience.
Like it wouldn't have happened if I didn't have these friends
who were like, just like living out middle school faith and high
(33:17):
school faith in best that a middle school high schooler
could. You know, I don't think they
even understand how big of a deal it is to me.
Yeah, Yeah. Well, super powerful and, and,
and I want to revisit that in a minute, but one will give you an
opportunity to, you know, where did it go from there?
Because that was kind of the first point where, you know, God
began softening your heart And, and I love that, you know,
(33:37):
there's sometimes things happen like this, right?
And sometimes things happen gradually with God.
And so I'd love for you to kind of talk about that.
So your heart was softened in that moment.
But then there was more to the story.
Yeah, I would say that that because it's it's different
looking back now, right. But that first power team, I
know me a power team, but it wasthe first time I'd like seen
there something more than what Ithought there was, right.
(34:00):
And then just hang out with dudes.
And then that I mean, that moment hit me hard because even
if you like don't go to church, I didn't go to church at all,
right. I still like I heard about
David. You hear stuff.
Right as part of our culture. And, and so there's a couple
things that caught me real off guard when I came to church.
The Bible wasn't what I thought it was.
(34:23):
And I heard, you know, these people like just do a good job
of, of preaching it and reading it and like, there are real
people in it who have real struggles.
And I was like, all right, that's different.
And yeah, there were, there weresome people at the church who
weren't like super cool or superkind.
Like I, I wore a hat one time. I didn't know you weren't
supposed to when a lady got mad at me and I didn't, I didn't
(34:44):
even know, right? Like what if?
You weren't being disrespectful,you just didn't know.
And I think I said this earlier,like my dad was like, be
careful. Like they always want something
from you. I'm assuming they're just going
to try to take money from you. Like I kind of thought church
people were all like the worst type of car salesman man.
I know people have bad church experiences, but do that little
church love lost little punk kidright from the start.
(35:06):
Like enough that like I wanted to be just to even though I was
still like, this is dumb. I just like life better around
the church people. Like even though the oldest
church lady was kind and I was it, it just that shook me,
right. So I was shook by the kindness
and by the like authenticity of the the stuff that was happening
(35:26):
in the Bible. And then that moment with Miss
Greiner and then all of it like just kind of stacked right.
And then one day that the the past was he was walking through.
I know like I know now it's called like the Romans Rd. but
he's walking through you know you know Romans 623 we've all
sinned falls towards the glory of God wages of sin is death.
That's 323 sorry whatever the but to get to God's eternal
(35:48):
life, Christ Jesus at the right moment.
Jesus died for the sinners and professor mouth.
He believed in heart. He was doing the gospel like
here's this is how it works. You're a Sinner.
You got to confess you could be saved and it it rocked me same
thing. Like I was I was crying.
It's not coming on my nose kind of thing.
I was up in the balcony, you know, at the church and work in
(36:11):
the sound booth and just overwhelmed by all of it.
And he did the like, if you wantto pray to see Jesus, I want you
to stand up right now. Walk down the aisles.
I stood up and I was hit man with that same pride piece.
That's like, this is the heat. Like, dude, this is what he
does. He puts on a suit and he
manipulates people. Like that's what that's what
they're doing. Like you, they're playing songs
(36:32):
that make you feel this way and the lights look this way.
So you feel like it's all fake and you are too.
You should know better. Like you should know better.
This is not how it is. I sat down and I was frustrated
with myself again for like giving in, man.
I got my car and I was driving home on this road called 341 and
(36:53):
I don't like, I don't, I'm a bigtalker band, but I don't got
good words. I don't got.
I do not have good words for this part.
I I'm a fellow Georgian, I understand.
This part I, I just got overwhelmed, man.
I, I had like a I'm trying to try to put in the words for what
it was then, but I, I just, I had an encounter with this the
living God, like the holy. I don't know, like it wasn't
(37:14):
like lights. It wasn't anything.
I just could not go any further.Like I had pulled my car on the
side of the road. I couldn't go back home.
I couldn't go back to the church.
I was, I just was stuck at all in some ways.
I couldn't move. I couldn't go anywhere.
I didn't know what I I don't know.
And I had to pray. That's what I feel like I had to
do. And I didn't know what to pray.
And when I prayed was Jesus, if you're real, save me and man,
(37:35):
like I know, I know, like my past was still with me.
My struggle, all the stuff was still there.
But like for me, at least in that moment, something changed.
Like I, I left church, one person I stopped on the side of
the road and I was a different person when I came home.
And I made a whole bunch of awful mistakes as a young
(37:55):
believer too. But like, like the like that
hollowness, that emptiness that I was feeling was like starting
to get full. Did you do what I mean?
Like I don't know how to put in words like, but yeah, it was, it
was like it was an instant moment for me, but it was a
(38:17):
whole lot of build up and then obviously a whole lot of process
afterwards, right. But that was like the moment
everything changed for. Me and we all, you know, if
we're believers, we all have that moment where we can point
to we should, where everything changed.
Yours was a long time coming, you know, with all the ways that
(38:38):
God was, you know, call it what you will.
It was the grace of God in your life through all of those things
kind of leading you to Him untilthe time was right.
And man, what a powerful. I've got tears in my eyes right
now. Like just what a powerful story,
what God can do. And it's hard to put in the
words, isn't it? Because my my 8 year old little
girl, she just asked Jesus into her heart and I get to baptize
(39:01):
her this weekend which is cool. That's awesome.
We were doing a video like tell us about, you know what, what
that meant to you. Bless her heart.
She just had a hard time puttingin the words.
She's like, I just, I don't knowhow to say it.
I just don't know how to say it.I'm like, I hear you, girl.
Like I, you know, on this side of things, looking back, it's
easier to describe, but in the moment, you just know things are
(39:21):
different. You know that what you were
looking for has been found. And man, that's a that's a
powerful testimony of what God can do in the hearts of someone,
in the heart of someone who wasn't interested in him but yet
kept pursuing him. And I see that pursuit alter
your story. I see a God pursuing you.
(39:44):
And I'm reminded that God died for us while we were still
sinners. Yeah.
God loved. Us first that that you know, God
proves his own love or God demonstrates his own like he
didn't have to the King of Kingsdoesn't need to prove anything
to anybody, but he chose to prove his love to you.
That why you were still a Sinner.
Like what kind of God proves hislove to people who can't love
(40:07):
him back? Like, you know, I mean like,
that's, yeah. What's wild?
And and and knowing, like givingyour life for people who you
know will never come to you. Yeah, yeah.
That's that's an amazing kind oflove.
And I'm reminded of the love that your friends showed you.
You know, they weren't trying tohold that over your head.
They weren't doing it for a pat on the back.
(40:28):
They weren't doing it to show you how good of a friend they
were. They were doing it because it
was best for you, knowing that you may never know about it and
you may never appreciate what they did for you.
And that was OK because that's not why they did it.
It was love that led them. And so.
Yeah. And what, what didn't, what it,
what a God we serve. Yeah.
Right. You were atheist,
(40:50):
self-proclaimed atheist and cameto know the Lord and now here
you are serving as pastor. When did that call come?
I'm just curious. Man, it, it's, there's a whole
lot of stuff to that too, right I.
Have loaded question right. I know, right?
I, I went, I have two undergrads, 1 is an outdoor
(41:10):
education and 1 is in psychology.
And I had this goal like right after I got saved, I started
working in summer camps. I loved, I loved that that
world. I had this goal of like doing
like adventure based counseling.I wanted to kind of pursue, but
all throughout college I worked at churches.
I worked at church in Millsville.
I got a pretty young Christian. The other thing guy did, man is
(41:31):
he put real clear, like the samething.
I'm going to talk backwards, back headed, but he put real
clear, like disciplers in my life, you know, So I had a guy
named Curtis Wright when I got saved, who like instantly
invited me in to to like opportunities to like
participate in like playing in the band.
And he had me the first chance to ever lead a Bible study when
I didn't know nothing. I remember talking about the
Narnia books and how much I loved him at like a college
(41:54):
Bible study thing. And he was like, well, Brian,
you know, that's like supposed to help people understand Jesus.
And I was like, it is, you know,but like, he, he.
Was a good story. Yeah, when I went to college,
there's another guy named Jeff Simmons who was a pastor of
church there who let me be a worship leader of this little
small church. And man, he had, he still does,
dude. He'd like, you know, people
(42:14):
might look at his church and sayit's not influential.
But I can tell you, man, in the Kingdom, like he's doing, he's
faithful and he serves and he loves these people in in in this
town that are often overlooked. I had these great disciplers in
my life who kept giving me opportunities in school, spoke
at us as a youth group at another church in town.
(42:36):
At the end of the night, anothercollege student came up to me
and he was like, Brian, this is super weird, dude.
I don't think you should be a pastor.
Like it was one of those things and just kind of rode well off.
Graduate high school, got married at high school, graduate
college and was married. Went to work at a place called
Project Adventure, visit adventure based counseling and
about a year into it, the state of Georgia pulled funding for
(42:57):
adjudicated youth. That's what we served kids that
were in prison. And so the company which it's
it's up in Connecticut. We're like a Georgia branch of
it was going to close that branch down and we're trying to
decide what we're going to do next.
And my wife was like, I think this is what you should do.
I think this like God has you remember Micah told you you
should be a pastor. I think you should.
It was just one of those kind ofconversations confirmations.
(43:21):
Yeah, there's a there's a big old church in town called 12
Stone. And I sent a Facebook message to
one of the pastors and said something like, I don't have any
experience. I just kind of feel like this is
what God wants me to do. And they were like, all right,
come on. It's like that's kind of how it
worked for me. Yeah.
Well, and and you know, that's The thing is it that happened
with me too, when I when I was feeling called into ministry,
(43:43):
all of a sudden God put the exact people I needed in my life
at the exact period I needed. Them you.
Know and you look back and like that's no that's no coincidence
like there's no way that that that was not by God's design and
hey you never know the power of a Facebook message that's how I
asked out my wife for the first time so.
Hey I I asked my wife out on AOLand said no MSN instant
(44:04):
messenger. So yeah, there you go.
Love technology, right? Well, thank you for sharing your
raw, your real, your authentic. Thanks man.
You know, there's people out there with, with, with stories
to tell and they Polish them up.Dude, this is the real deal.
This is the work of God in a young man who had no interest in
(44:26):
being worked on. My God, but yet God pursued him,
chased him until his heart was ready.
And what I want to encourage ourlisteners with is you know, you
may find yourself on one end of this journey or somewhere in the
middle, you may find yourself a skeptic.
You're not real sure about this whole faith thing.
You're not sure about the Christianity thing.
(44:47):
You got the caricature of Christians that you've been
looking at and and and y'all want to encourage you with
Brian's words that hey, he thought that too.
But then when he realized and got to know some people and
stepped foot in that church, that things became real to him
and he began to see that authentic Christian life lived
out. So don't let a bad experience
(45:08):
keep you from pursuing God further.
Or maybe you find yourself as you're kind of just fickle about
faith. You know, you're not anti faith.
You're not really even skeptical.
It's just something other peopledo and you're just not
interested in that. To each his own, right?
I want to encourage you that you're never going to, you're
never going to be fulfilled by the things of this world.
(45:30):
Stop chasing the things of this world because they'll never fill
you up. They may make you feel good for
a minute, but you're going to beempty again.
And Brian said it so clearly. Well, I was empty.
And then all the sudden when I had that experience with the
living God, when the Holy Spiritwas there meeting with me,
speaking with me, I was full. I love that.
(45:54):
I love that because that it showthat shows us, you know, and and
it's not about what God can do for us, but that just shows you
right there that hey, that's what we're all looking for.
That's what we're all chasing. And you know, your circumstances
may not be what you want them tobe.
You may be living a life you notyou would have never chosen.
But regardless, you can have peace and joy and you can
(46:16):
experience the love of Christ. And that's the game changer.
And if you're a Christian, I only encourage you by the
friends that Brian had because, hey, how you live your life
matters. There's people watching.
There's people that you know that that are in need of a touch
from God and God uses you. There is no Plan B and you were
(46:39):
it. And so, hey, be on the lookout
for opportunities not to bash people over the head with the
gospel, not to judge them and talk about how ungodly they are
with the love on them and to do what's best for them.
And Brian, your story brings allthat together.
And I just want to thank you forsharing it with us today.
Thanks, man. Hey, I wanted, I don't, I don't
(47:04):
do this often, but I wondered, can you pray for us?
Can you pray us out as we'd say in student ministry?
Yeah. Can you pray us out?
Because man, I just want to hearyou talking to God on behalf of
the listeners that are listeningto this today.
Yeah, man, let's pray. I want to be a good Christian
and take my hat off. I don't want to get in trouble.
(47:24):
You good, you good. I, I want to take a moment right
now and I just want to say how grateful we are, I am to have
these kind of conversations for a chat with podcast for all the
listeners who are paying attention and, and hearing what
you are all about God. But I can't say thank you enough
(47:45):
for the way that you you pursuedme that you, you proved your
love to me before I ever even got it.
I, I hope God, I never grow likehard hearted to how good you
are. Thank you for the the friends
that you put in my life. Thank you for using them to to
chase after me and God thank youfor for their faith, for the the
the cross where you died for their sins as well can just.
(48:09):
But God, I pray would be that all of us listeners who are
followers of Jesus, God, I pray that all of us hear the gospel
like it was the very, very firsttime we've ever heard it before.
Don't let our hearts grow like hard at all to how different and
how radical and how unique you truly are.
And then, Father, I want to prayfor anyone who's listening, who
knows what, what, what it feels like to be hollow and and
(48:30):
hopeless and alone. And I want to pray for the
people who don't have great church stories, who gave it a
try and just felt like it didn't, you know, work.
They just felt more judgement and more hate and more
separation. And God, I pray that you would
give every person who feels hollow and feels alone one of
those moments where they meet you, they encounter the living
holy God and Father. I pray there are people who, not
(48:53):
because Chad and I are cooler fun talkers, but because you
choose to use these conversations.
I pray there are people who are far from you now who get to
experience that fullness of lifethat Jesus, only you can provide
and then got to pray. You would use us to share your
gospel with the other people in our lives and got to pray, you
know, years and years and years from now and as we all are in
(49:13):
the Kingdom, we can all celebrate the the role that we
played in bringing our family and our friends and our
coworkers and our neighbors justone step closer to you, Jesus.
So I think don't let us ever forget how grateful we should be
for how much you've done for us and with us and through US to
Jesus. We pray all these things, Your
name, your power alone. Amen.
(49:34):
Amen. Amen.
Thank you, my friend. I want to encourage you.
You're listening to this today. I want you to think about what
God's done in your life and let this be an opportunity to have
gratitude for His goodness. Thank you for listening to the
Rev RX Podcast. We hope you enjoyed what you
heard today, and if so, we'd love it if you would hit that
subscribe button so that you'll never miss a new episode from
(49:56):
us. Also, feel free to leave us
reviews and comments as we'd love to hear from you.
Be blessed and be the very best you.
Hello and welcome back to another episode of the Rev RX
Podcast. My name is Chad Potts and I'm
your host today. I'm so excited to bring you a
gospel shaped conversation with my new friend Brian.
You see, Brian Smith is a student pastor just up the road
from me in Georgia in a town called Dunwoody.
But what you're going to love about him is his testimony
(00:33):
that's going to just shake you to your core because he grew up
in the Bible Belt, but he was the self-proclaimed atheist.
Yet God never gave up on him. He pursued him and threw some
friends who loved him without anagenda.
He came to know the Lord, proceed to call to ministry and
now is serving in that role. You're going to love to hear the
(00:56):
difference that God made in his life.
I think you're going to relate to every part of his testimony.
And I can't wait for you to watch this all the way to the
end so you can see how this story ends.
Without further ado, I introduced to you my new friend,
Brian Smith. Brian Smith, Brother, what a
privilege it is to have you hereon the show from just up the
road in Dunwoody, GA Thank you for being here.
(01:20):
I'm excited about it. Well, I heard your story and it
was on a different podcast and I'm like, what is up with this
guy from Dunwoody? You have an you have just a
powerful story of God changing your life and using you in a
mighty way. And man, I want to get into that
story because that's what I wantto talk about today.
But before then, hey, tell us who you are, but where you're at
(01:40):
and the good things that the Lord's using you to do there in
Dunwoody. Yeah, so I'm originally from
South Georgia, a little town called Brunswick.
It smells awful, but it's on thecoast, so it's beautiful.
It does. Yeah.
I, I, I came with the faith whenI was 20 years old, like I'd say
when I was, I was 20. I turned it was in that summer
of that, that year. But I'm a, I'm a student pastor
(02:04):
at a church called Dunwoody Baptist in Dunwoody, GA.
We're in the interim season. So I'm, I'm currently the
primary communicator. So I'm trying to juggle students
and called big church, which is probably not the right word, but
students say in big church. At the same time, my wife and I
have been married, I think for, oh, I should know this by now.
(02:25):
16 years, 16 or 17 years. And then we got 4 kids.
I got a 10 year old, twin 10 year olds, an almost 13 year old
and then an almost 3 year old. So we got a gaffe.
You do All over the place. Well, yeah.
Bless you brother, man you. You got your hands full and you
(02:45):
know God's using you and he's using your story because one of
the things that I want to go into is about your upbringing
and smelly old Brunswick. You know, I, I've, I'm a couple
hours from the coast here in middle Georgia and love the
coast, but you're right, man, itstinks down there.
Yes, thanks dude. But you grew up in Brunswick and
you know, you didn't grow up, you're in a Bible Belt, right?
(03:06):
But you didn't grow up as faith with faith to part of your
story. Can you tell us a little bit
about that? It's.
One of those things that like I,I don't really know why it
wasn't part of our, our family. Because you've been in the in
the South in like in the the Bible belt, Bible Belt, it's
always around, right? There's churches are everywhere.
Churches always around. But it just wasn't important to
(03:27):
my parents. Like they taught me I when I was
a little kid. They taught me that.
Now I lay me down to sleep prayer.
Sometimes we pray that prayer, and they taught me the scary
version of it. Like, I know there's a new nice
version, but the one they taughtme was that, you know, I pray
the Lord, if I should die beforeI awake, I pray the Lord my soul
to take. And I remember as even as a
little elementary school kid hearing those words and be like,
(03:50):
God, please don't take my soul. Please don't take my soul.
Like, why is that on the table? Yeah.
Like, I don't want that. So it's not like my parents were
like, against faith. It just didn't matter.
My mom is like going to make this.
It's it's true, but a joke. But I, I don't know if I knew
that Easter was like a religiousthing until I was, you know,
(04:14):
middle school. It was, it wasn't, it was like,
man, we hate the church and we hate God and we hate Christians.
It was more like they we treatedthem like almost like this is a
matter. It's just a dumb thing.
We did have the the churches andtown used to do like hell houses
or judgment house, just not so like, you know, like as a kid
(04:35):
you would go to like the Jay CS haunted house and then you would
go to the church to go to their judgement house because it was
just as scary as the IT was likea it felt like a scary haunted
house because you get to walk through hell at the end, But
that's kind of it was very shallow.
Any parts of the faith? Yeah, yeah, you know, and I and
I love that you defined that because it's not like you were
(04:56):
anti faith. It just, you know, you do your
thing, I do mine and that's not my thing, you know, and I'm
around that a lot too. And you know, I kind of joke
you're in the Bible Belt, you know, but yeah, I mean it, it's
this is spiritual apathy. You know, it is kind of a the
word that comes to mind or the phrase that comes to mind.
And you know, there, there's a lot of people out there that are
maybe in that same boat. You know, you're just, you're
(05:18):
not anti Christian. You're just that's that's not
your thing. And so that's how you grew up.
And, you know, as, as you Share your story, and I've been
fortunate to hear it now, you know, as you Share your story,
you talk about as you went through school, you kind of had
these thoughts about Christians,right?
Like kind of some, you know, some ideas about who they were
(05:39):
and kind of why they believe what they believed.
Can you take us into that a little bit?
Because I find that very interesting and very relatable.
Yeah, I, like I said, I I have abizarre, I hold on to memories.
I'm sure everyone does anyway. But I, my dad, I remember one
time we are, we, we're driving somewhere.
And then like one of those little moments of like
(06:00):
contemplation, I think it was quoting A Steely Dan song.
I don't know where this came from, but he said to me, I
thought he was out of the blue. He was like, son, I'm not sure
if there's a heaven, but I know that there's a hill and it like,
was it? That was a terrifying thing to
hear as a little kid because I, I especially as a young person,
I, I hated the idea of death. I'm so scared of that idea.
(06:22):
I have an uncle who is a, a grave digger.
It always sounds funny when I say that he's awesome.
Uncle Terry TNT vault Monument, like buried people for a living.
He would talk about funerals allthe time and we were really
close. His son, my cousin, we're super
tight. We're we're like best friends.
And so it wasn't like totally uncommon to go to the graveyard
and sit in the car by Terry, youknow, put out chairs or dug a
(06:44):
grave. And so I don't know if I was
around death more or maybe everyone has those those fears.
But like, I hate it. I hate I would wake up at night
with like cold sweats, even as alittle kid.
And I had those moments where it's like, it almost feels
better to not be born because once you're born, you have to
die. And like, why?
And I would go to my mom and my dad and say, like, I, I'm that
(07:07):
fear was like real in me. And they would say like doing
the best they can to like comfort a little kid who's like
having like an existential fear moment, right?
My mom is a that's going to, it's a long time.
Like you're so young. That's a long way away.
And it didn't help because that's the problem, right?
Like it is a long way away, but it's inevitable and it's right
(07:28):
there and, and, and I hate it. I'm so scared of it.
And as I got older, fear in me like became more like anger,
like I anger like I was, I was mad about it.
I don't like that. I didn't like the idea of of
like people on as if any faith acting like they weren't afraid
of death. In my mind.
(07:48):
I just assumed that all, all of faith, all of especially
Christians were people doing everything they could to ignore
just the reality of death. Like all of it is fear.
You're scared, all of you were scared and you refuse to make
you're scared. And I'm tired of feeling scared
so I'm going to be mad instead of scared.
Yeah, yeah. And that's that's how I kind of
felt about all of it. Yeah, and you know, there's
(08:10):
that's a real that's a common conception really of the
Christian faith or of faith in general, is that it's just the
answer to the existential crisisthat we have to come come to at
some point to realize, you know,hey, we're all going to die.
And, and I'm man, I understand that waking up in the cold
sweats because there's been times childhood and then even
like young adult years where, you know, before Jesus really
(08:31):
got a hold of my life where I would wake, I would let my mind
go there. And I'm like, you know, what if,
what if this is it? And then like, you know, you
live and like you go through theday-to-day and you stress and
you go to work and you pay your bills and you know, like then
someday you're going to die. And then that's, that's it.
And you're no more. It's all pointless.
(08:52):
Yeah, you're it's all pointless and and you're just lying to
yourself. And I didn't like it.
Yeah, yeah. So you know, yeah, it's that
concept of his fate just being used to to make us feel better
about the and you know, it's that's a common thing.
And and and I think that's very relatable too, because that's
one of the one of the skeptics that that I kind of follow are
(09:12):
ex skeptics. You could say, you know, that
that's one of the big things. And so you had this fear and you
you kind of thought of Christianity, I guess, maybe as
a fear based type thing. Yeah, but it and it, you know,
you, you fear. And then, hey, here in the Bible
belt too. Another thought that takes me to
is a lot of times we accept Christ because we don't want to
go to hell. It's not that we, you know, I'm
(09:36):
not, I'm not saying people, I'm not saying that's not real, but
I'm saying, you know, that's, that's, that's the way a lot of
times we get people is, you know, those judgement houses and
that makes you just scared to death.
If you're walking through hell, then literally and you know, I
don't want to, I don't want to go there.
I better do whatever it takes tonot go there.
You. Know and if that becomes the
reality of what our Christian walks about, we're missing so
(09:57):
much. Not that that can't be a
starting place, but from someoneon the outside looking in, that
makes total sense. It, it also made me feel like I
couldn't because later on I got invited to church and my dad
even talked to me about this, about being cautious around
Christians. But it also kind of made me feel
like I couldn't trust them because I didn't believe they
were being honest. It's like you believe in God or
whatever you don't really. Like, if I, if I could get
(10:19):
inside your brain, I would find out that you really didn't.
And I didn't. So made me feel like they were
like slimy in a way. Like I can't trust.
Yeah. Phony.
That's right. Yeah.
Yeah, you know, and and they want you to come along and you
know, they they wanted you to bea part of them, but it was just
more so about, you know, they wanted something from you almost
(10:44):
Yeah, yeah. And I get that.
Yeah. So you talk about too how you
were a little bit of a I'm not putting words in your mouth, a
little bit of a bully towards kind of a class clown, but with
a mean spirit. Tell us about that with towards,
towards some of the, some of thefaith-based guys, because I
mean, let's face it, if you wantto get into somebody's kitchen
these days, you know, you bring up faith and that really does
(11:05):
it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You know, I'm not a great. I was never a good student, but
I was always a fast talker. I felt like as a kid sometimes
being like quick to speak, like it gets you in trouble, but also
it opens up a whole lot of doorsfor you.
And I found out, I can't tell you like a specific time or
whatever, but like, I mean, every young person goes to this,
(11:25):
right? You want to fit in.
And I, I found out the easiest way to make friends was to try
to be funny. And the easiest way to make
people laugh is to be mean to someone else sometimes.
Yeah. And also there's a whole lot
more to it. And then I'm going to over
analyze myself. I have a learning disability.
It's called dysgraphia, which islike, it's kind of like inverse
(11:46):
dyslexia. So like when I write things, it
looks crazy. Like sometimes I can't remember
like what direction the letters to, like the word was is
supposed to be. And I'll write like, numbers for
letters, like FS for fives and fives, refs and sevens and s s.
So I like, I also struggle with feeling like I was dumb.
Like I didn't want to feel dumb.Like something was wrong with
(12:07):
me. And I had to take all these
tests and it was, you know, thisthing.
So I wanted to fit in and I didn't want to feel dumb.
And the best way I figured out to, like, kind of deal with that
was pick whoever the people I thought were the the people I
wanted to be around and then tryto make them laugh.
Right. Like, I wanted to make myself
feel smarter than other people. Yeah.
(12:28):
And I hope that this group of people will be like, hey, you
should come and hang it. Like we'll protect you.
Like, come and be part of our proud.
So I just, yeah, I don't know, man.
I still have that. Some people will run from
confrontation. And sometimes I look forward.
And especially if it's going to be like a verbal thing, I was
confident. I'm going to make you look dumb
and I'm going to feel so good about it.
And I would argue with people about things that, like, I
(12:51):
didn't believe in. I just wanted them to feel
wrong. Yeah, I don't think it sounds
crazy to me, man, but if you make them.
Feel wrong, then that makes you feel better.
It makes you feel right. Yeah.
Yeah. And I like the idea of being
smarter than them. We've all been there.
But we want to be, we want to besmart ones in the room.
We want to be the liked ones in the room.
And a lot of times we have to belittle others to make that
(13:12):
happen. And.
What we like about the right people too, right Like you want
the right people to like you. Exactly.
So you know, you went through this and then at some point you
kind of you use that word atheist, right?
You know, it kind of started as a little bit of a, you know,
maybe an agnostic or just a apathy towards fate.
But at some point you grasped a hold of that phrase atheist.
(13:33):
Tell us about that and and kind of why you chose that and what
that meant to you. But what was that like to go,
you know, from apathy to atheismand then how you describe
yourself? Yeah, I, you know, I'm trying
to. I don't, I don't know when I
first heard that word or, or learn the word, but like I said,
I like, I like sports, but I wasn't, I wasn't great at them,
you know, but I like that This Is Us versus them kind of
(13:54):
mentality, you know, competition.
Yeah. It felt like to me it was like
if you're going to have to pick a team that was a team that was
easier to to pick and it was a little like a like stand like
standoff fishing and unique yournovel almost.
So I know like in 8th grade, it probably wouldn't be this.
In 8th grade, I got invited to athing at a church.
It was called Power team. I don't know if you guys ever
(14:15):
had power team in Dublin. Yes.
Well, in, in Rome, where I grew up, we had the power team come
to our church and man, I, I was,I was enthralled.
I loved it. So I went, I went.
They I got invited. You know, it's just, it's like
WWE guys, maybe I don't know who, they're big, huge muscle
dudes who. Break.
Just break stuff. They break boards.
(14:35):
And that's what I remember, yeah.
Giant blocks of ice on. Fire and they think they came to
our school even. Yeah.
That would be cool. So people were like, you gotta
come to see these guys break things.
And it's like, well, of course we're gonna come and see guys
break things. And I remember him.
It was 7th grade actually. And I remember them doing the
whole thing. And at the end they were like
giving them their, their, I knowthe words testimony now, right,
(14:57):
But I know what they were just talking right.
And they're like, I was, I had these drug issues and I had
these all these problems in my life.
Now I met Jesus and then they did a, a, a old school close
your head, bow your eyes and I like it.
It did mess me up like I had I had it was emotional and then I
was in the same way I was just Ifelt like I was being
manipulated, like I hate. I didn't like that.
(15:18):
And how do you think that was a catalyst to be like, like,
don't, like, do that again, you know, like don't.
Not go in there, yeah. Don't dip your toe back in that
pool. So I was kind of trying to build
a wall because I didn't like theway I felt after that.
And so like there were, there were a lot of times, 9th, 10th
and 11th grade where like, you know, I liked saying like, Hey,
(15:39):
I'm an atheist because it felt like it wasn't something you
should say. Do what?
I mean, just for the fun of being like, I'm not scared of
this thing. And you guys, you can say
whatever you want to say but I'mwilling to be like death sucks
and y'all are scared and I, I won't I, I put in words.
It just made me feel better about all that.
(16:01):
Well, and, you know, you kind ofgave yourself a title and it was
one that stood out. Yeah, I put a jersey on, right?
I kind of put a jersey on and I was like, this is the team now.
Yeah, and, and bless those guys,Power team.
Yeah, I'm sure God used them in some cool ways.
Yeah, yeah. I remember thinking how cheesy
it was if I'm honest. But I love seeing them, like,
bash the things and smash the boards and, you know, do all
(16:23):
that stuff. I love that part.
But yeah, like that, you know, it seemed a little forced.
You know, they're telling their testimony and, you know, there's
big guys and they're crying. And it's like, I can relate to
that. And, you know, not to the point
where it just, like, pushed me away.
But I can see how that would have because you don't.
People don't like the feeling ofbeing manipulated.
Yeah, and I'll tell you what it like I've never seen anything
like it. Like I never heard people talk
(16:44):
about the past and what the bad,you know, I hadn't seen that
before. So it wasn't like I was like,
Oh, this is cheesy. It was like almost too real.
You know what I mean? It's like when you have that
that like tank like that, that we call them tanker swords,
right? Those things in your mouth and
you keep pushing on it and you're like don't want to
because it hurts, but you kind of it's like one of those things
I was. Like I can't not.
Yeah, I don't like that you're pushing here.
(17:05):
And then and that's a that was apivotal moment, you know, it
sounds like and you know, kind of in your walk and, and kind of
helped you choose that jersey. Yeah, pushed me like I don't
want that again. Yeah, yeah.
Then as you got into high school, you befriended some some
guys, right? I want to talk about the
importance of who you surround yourself with.
(17:25):
Yeah, man. Because here you are.
Brian the Atheist. Yeah, I'm not sure that's what
you. That's probably not what they
called you, but that's what I'm calling you, Brian the atheist.
Brian, a smart mouth jerk. But but you were friends with
some guys that were pretty good guys, right?
Can you tell us about that? Yeah, man, like I and it was, it
was summer after 7th grade and 8th grade, they redistricted our
(17:48):
schools and got sent to a new middle school for 8th grade.
And like that whole like I want to fit in thing was so strong.
And now I'm at a new school withnew people and there are people
from the island that go to the school.
So they're like, you know, way richer and different and like to
fit into that school seems so much different to me than it did
at the first middle school was at it was it was even called
Jane Macon, which sounds like a just a real fancy Jane Macon
(18:11):
middle school. Gentleman and a scholar.
Yeah, it just sounds nice. Yeah.
And it was real easy to see who the, the like the guys were that
like everyone liked. It was super obvious who they
were. I just try to force my way in,
like every way. I feel like I just made myself
sit at the table. I did everything I could to be
(18:32):
around him. I changed like the way I
dressed, the way everything I did.
I was trying to fit in with these guys and not all of them,
like a lot of them made mistakes.
They got older. Like the core dudes that were
part of that group and from my perspective just happened to be
Christians. I almost had the reverse
situation a lot of parents have where it's like my kids hanging
with the wrong crowd. The cool kids happened to be the
(18:54):
good crowd at my school and their middle schoolers.
We did all sorts of dumb stuff as we got older, but even in 8th
grade, especially my, my friend Alex and Marcus, my cousin TJ
was, we went to a different school, but he ended up hanging
out with those guys as well. But like they were like goofy
and authentic in a way that I, Iwasn't.
And it was my first time hangingout with Christians that I was
like, like these dudes don't seem scared.
(19:16):
I don't know, like they didn't seem, they seem different than
when I thought they were going to be like and I had to hang out
with them because I didn't I wanted to fit in and they with
people that you needed to fit inwith.
They were, they were the ones you needed to that you needed to
open that door. So, yeah.
And yeah. So that was kind of it that I
want to sit there a minute because that's interesting.
(19:38):
You found these guys and and they were they, they were, they
were maybe not what you thought that Christians were about on
this side of things. All right, so I'm skipping a
little bit, you know, on this side of things.
Now you're a pastor. What's your, how do you, how do
you look back at that and make sense of that?
You know that I think there are probably a lot of people,
(19:59):
they're skeptical about Christians, but then there were
some you were drawn to. And how do you, how do you make
sense of that? I think one of those guys who
ended up being like one of my best friends, like his parents,
his his parents have been divorced.
His dad had had a couple of relationships.
They lived with a step dad and his mom.
My parents didn't get along. They lived in separate rooms.
(20:22):
They fall all the time. And there's probably a whole lot
of anger and stuff in me becauseof that jazz too.
But all the all like the anger and the fear and the like I want
to fit in that I had like built up.
I know, man, for an eighth grader because I'm talking so
deep, but didn't I didn't have the words for it.
I just this is all the things I felt right.
He didn't have like he was a cool skin school and he didn't
care. He wasn't trying to be cool.
(20:43):
He wasn't like trying to fit in.He wasn't trying to impress
anybody. He wasn't trying to act like
things are good at home. He wasn't he was just him.
He just being there and and being a dude it, it was like,
it's like I met a new type of person is what it felt like in
some ways, because some of the other friends in the group were
(21:03):
probably more similar to me thannot.
But there's a few of them that were like they didn't care
because they didn't care. They were kinder because they
didn't care. They were like cooler.
They like they had a piece like I would say now looking back,
right, they have that piece thatI was like desperately longing
for and even they was a great piece, you know what I mean?
It was like. A lot.
(21:25):
Well, I think we're all after that.
Yeah. And I talk to men every day that
are after that. We didn't, we never grow out of
it until we find that the sourceof true peace.
I love that because, yeah, there's these caricatures of
Christians. Yeah.
And some, let's face it, some people live that out, you know,
some people are living out that caricature because that's what
they know. But then when you when you meet
(21:45):
the real deal, like when you when you meet the one that's you
know, and I don't a lot of different words for it.
When you meet the one that's sold out and when you meet the
one that has that piece that's found, you know, that
relationship with Christ and it comes out of them.
It oozes out of them. It's contagious and and there's
something attractive about that,isn't there?
(22:06):
Yeah, yeah. I mean, I knew something was
like, as I got older, I, I kept a like a journal.
I'd write stuff in it. And there's a whole lot of like,
I know something's missing, right?
And it was I felt like hollow and I felt like I had met a real
people didn't mean like I feel like a hollow person who like
encountered a solid person sometimes.
(22:27):
And I was like, whoa, what it What is this?
Yeah, give me some of that, right.
Yeah, yeah, because even though I didn't want to be, I didn't
read all the time, you know? And and then, you know, you
these were friends that you carried, carried with you.
And they're, they're reached a point in time where you were you
were getting ready for graduation.
Can you talk to us about that? I love.
(22:48):
Yeah, I love some of this. Didn't think you were going to
graduate but. No, yeah, bye.
So I was, I started hanging out with those guys in 8th grade, In
9th grade, you know that our friends group was pretty
solidified and the whole time wewere in high school, they are
super involved in church. And they weren't perfect, man.
I've talked to some of the guys now and they were like, we
(23:10):
didn't even try. And I'm like, that's kind of the
point. They weren't, they weren't over.
They they, they can invite me tocamp sometimes and they invite
me to come to the church group stuff.
And I think I went once and samething.
People were crying. I didn't like it.
So I didn't go anymore. So they weren't like, they
weren't like, hey, Brian, here'sa Bible verse or hey, Brian,
let's pray together. None of that.
They were just kind of being friends.
And they also had there's a whole part of their life I never
(23:32):
really was evolved in back then.I never saw what they did at
church for what it was like for them or not.
But we were just real close. The more I hung out with them,
the more they they shaped me. But I was still dull, broken
center me. So yeah, Senior High School.
I was in a sociology college class that I I needed to
graduate my teacher, poor Miss McNair.
(23:56):
I mean, I'm also from a small town and had this big ego and
this big pride thing. I felt like I was too smart for
my school and my town. And so like, I just didn't do
anything like I, But sometimes Itold my teachers that begin
like, I'm too smart for this. I'll pass whatever test you want
to give me, but I'm not doing like word searches, like I'm a
grown up. I don't need this junk in my
life. And Miss McNair, like, I guess
(24:17):
an adult now, I'm like, man, you're the perfect kind of
teacher that you're kind of a teacher we need.
But she did not care. She was not moved by my pride or
charisma or small town. This kid thinks he knows
everything. And so at the end of the class,
I think I, it was either 40 or 30 was by like total grade.
I needed 70 to graduate. And in my high school, the last
week of school, seniors didn't come to school.
(24:38):
And it was like all graduation practices.
And then for some reason that the families let seniors rent
houses on the island. They'd all live over there for a
week. So before that final week of
school, you would get your, yourgrades.
So now your official grades, like here's your grade from each
class. You shouldn't even be in that
situation where you don't know if you're going to graduate or
not. But I got my, my thing from Miss
(25:00):
McNair and it said like, Hey, itsaid my score, what grade was,
you know, whatever. And I was so mad at like I
blamed her. I was like, why would, why would
she do this to me? And then I knew that the school
would send something to my parents until like, I've raced
home as fast as I could and was like waiting in the mailbox and
trying to take this letter out because I don't want my parents
(25:22):
find out that I failed. And then that whole week, like
it's senior week that's supposedto be like, it's your last week
of high school and everyone's, you know, making memories and
this is the teen ROM com movie week of life, right?
I was like, and everyone's goingto find out that I'm like, I'm a
shame, like I am phony. I acted like I was smarter than
everybody. I was better than everybody.
And I did all this stuff and I'mwhatever.
(25:43):
And I'm not going to graduate high school.
I didn't want anyone to know about it.
And we want to find out about it.
We, we would go in the mornings to school for graduation
practice. And I remember there's a couple
times administrators would walk in and tap someone on the
shoulder and take him out. And I was just waiting, man.
Like, like, I was going to throwup every second we were in that
room. Like, they're going to come and
(26:04):
tap my shoulder. And then in front of all these
people, I'm going to be finally embarrassed.
And like, you know, that was awful.
And they never came and got me. And I was like, even on
graduation night, I was convinced, dude, that they
didn't. Like, embarrassing me in front
of the school wasn't enough. Like it had to be the whole
town. And like, Doctor Turner's going
to Call My Name and I get up there.
He was going to stay in front ofeverybody, but not Brian.
(26:25):
He didn't like passed this, thislike easy class because he
thought he was better than everybody.
And like, we got to teach him a lesson.
And then graduation night happens and I, they gave me a
diploma and I like, I like, I cannot tell you how like I was.
I was just convinced it all was going to fall apart.
I was terrified of everybody finding out.
(26:48):
Waiting on the other shoe to drop.
Well, yeah. And then I thought like, right
after graduation for a while, like I did it like I fooled all
these people, like I am better than this dumb small town and
these dumb small town teachers. And like she talked a big game.
But in the end, I won. Like I beat.
I felt like I won. And they just, you know, either
they gave me a diploma because they didn't want to deal with me
or they gave me a diploma because they knew I was right.
(27:09):
Like just all sorts of weird ego, you know, stuff mixed into.
And mashed them like the power team.
So the the the sometime that that summer after we graduated
high school, that my friend group, my cousin Alex, Marcus
and Jordan, these guys like theystarted going to a church in
town that started like a contemporary service And they
(27:30):
were playing like, you know, regular church songs now, like a
modern worship music at the time, Chris Thomas songs.
I don't know what they were. They were singing those songs
and they only had an orchestra up to that point.
And the church really needed someone to like come help run
sound for that new modern worship service.
And I don't, you know what they did, but they convinced the
church to, to hire me to come and run sound for services.
(27:54):
And there's a whole lot into that story.
But there was a one of the Sundays about a year after I
graduated, maybe like almost a year that I've been running
sound up in the balcony at FirstBaptist Brunswick.
And I saw one of my teachers. It's like she went to church
there. And I eventually was like, I got
(28:14):
to find like, what happened? How did I, how did I graduate?
And so I, I went and found her. She was my economics teacher
whose class sitting at class I ignore.
I slept through it all the time.Like my little sister still
tells a story about like she wasin 9th grade when I was a senior
and she would come into the sameteacher's classroom and I would
(28:35):
just be sleeping on the back desk.
And the teacher was like, nobody, wake him up.
Let's just see how long he'll sleep, you know, and, and I was
really disrespectful and unkind to this poor lady.
It was, you know, anyway, because I went and found her and
I was like, hey, what happened? Do you know about this?
Do you know how I wasn't supposed to graduate?
Like, what did the teachers talk?
You know, does anyone know what happened?
(28:55):
And she was like, yeah, of course we everyone talks like,
yeah, everyone knew that you weren't supposed to graduate.
Like the teachers knew. I knew.
And she didn't say it, but she should have been like, yeah,
Miss McNair is doing the right thing too.
So I was like, well, so how did I graduate?
And she was like, you, you don'tknow.
And I don't know why what happened.
(29:18):
And, and those that friend groupwho I kind of like brought me in
and, and that group of Christiandudes, like I said, you weren't
really trying to do. I mean, they were trying.
They weren't over the top. I think.
I guess she had told them, hey, your friend Brian's not going to
graduate. I didn't, I didn't tell anybody.
I didn't go to anything there and ask her to give me chances
(29:40):
or extra credit. I just was going to sit in my
failure on my own. And she told some of these
friends, which, you know, it wasa kind of bold thing to do
anyway, and they prayed togetherand they decided they were going
to go talk to Miss McNair for me.
So like my friends, without telling me, went and asked like
her. Like they went on on my bath.
(30:01):
That teacher who I was so rude to went on my behalf and said,
like, hey, we really believe that there there's more to
Bryant than all this stuff that he's kind of built up.
And I don't know, they convincedher when no one ever told me.
Like they for, you know, a year or so, like they didn't like
hold it over my head that I didn't know any of it, you know,
and. Then it's amazing.
(30:21):
Yeah, dude, suddenly, like all the stuff that that preacher was
talking about, about like, you know, Jesus loving you before
you could love him, helping you before you could help anyone,
like standing in, you know, the gap for you.
Like all of it felt like it hit me in that moment, like, oh,
like, that's what these people did for me.
And that like, I mean, that was kind of the first step to like,
(30:44):
I don't know, making my heart like beat a little bit, you
know, like be real, like it was.And Mary, like I said, I like to
think I'm smart, but I know I'm not.
But it really was God being like, here's look, this is how
it works. You couldn't do it on your own.
So someone else did it for she feel like and it it opened it up
to me a whole bunch man. Isn't that the gospel story?
(31:06):
Yeah, right. Yeah, we can't do it on our own.
We need others. We need someone to advocate for
us. Yeah.
Yeah. That's what.
Yeah. Jesus is our advocate, man.
Man, that's powerful. The power of friends, too.
I'm reminded. And and sometimes you use this
parallel of the man who was brought to Jesus and lowered
through the roof. And of course, we've seen, you
know, social media memes, you know this.
(31:27):
It matters who you surround yourself with, you know, find
you some friends that will that will lower you through the roof.
Yeah. And you know, like you, you've
experienced that in a lot of ways, you experienced that with
your graduation like that shouldn't have happened, but but
and they, and then you experienced it too with, you
know, they, they did lead you tothe Lord.
Yeah. You know, and, and not in a way
(31:49):
that was just bashing you over the head.
Like, dude, wake up. You know, wasn't preaching to
you What? They were just your friend and
they cared for you and they loved you and they didn't have
an agenda. Like that's the thing that comes
to mind for me. They're we're not going to be
front, we're not going to be friends with Brian so that he
can be a Christian and so he canbe a check mark and a notch in
(32:11):
our belt and all these things. Just going to love them.
And you know, we're going to, we're going to live the life in
front of them and we're going todo what's best for Brian.
And it's not reminded. Go ahead.
I would say, I, I talked to, I said my cousin, we're supposed
to probably Alex. We're super close.
I did a, we did a series at church a couple months ago about
(32:31):
like people sharing their testimonies.
And I was, I was sharing that story and my wife called Alex up
and had him come for one of the services.
It was cool. So Trigger was like, Hey, here's
here's one of the guys I was talking about.
He's right here. Sure.
He shot my cousin to get him to say stuff too.
And he's like, only God could change Brian's mind because he
was too hard headed. Like in some ways it was like,
you know, we tried, but it wasn't going to work.
Only God had to get to him. But I talked to those guys and
(32:53):
like, if they were here, they were like, we didn't really do
anything. And I'm like, dude, you don't
even know who like how much you like, I wouldn't have come to
Jesus. And if I hadn't come to Jesus,
then I, I wouldn't be on the like the, the path that he's got
me on. I wouldn't have met my wife.
I wouldn't have like none of what I have none of like the
blessings I've got to experienceand like the strength and the
hardships I've got to experience.
Like it wouldn't have happened if I didn't have these friends
who were like, just like living out middle school faith and high
(33:17):
school faith in best that a middle school high schooler
could. You know, I don't think they
even understand how big of a deal it is to me.
Yeah, Yeah. Well, super powerful and, and,
and I want to revisit that in a minute, but one will give you an
opportunity to, you know, where did it go from there?
Because that was kind of the first point where, you know, God
began softening your heart And, and I love that, you know,
(33:37):
there's sometimes things happen like this, right?
And sometimes things happen gradually with God.
And so I'd love for you to kind of talk about that.
So your heart was softened in that moment.
But then there was more to the story.
Yeah, I would say that that because it's it's different
looking back now, right. But that first power team, I
know me a power team, but it wasthe first time I'd like seen
there something more than what Ithought there was, right.
(34:00):
And then just hang out with dudes.
And then that I mean, that moment hit me hard because even
if you like don't go to church, I didn't go to church at all,
right. I still like I heard about
David. You hear stuff.
Right as part of our culture. And, and so there's a couple
things that caught me real off guard when I came to church.
The Bible wasn't what I thought it was.
(34:23):
And I heard, you know, these people like just do a good job
of, of preaching it and reading it and like, there are real
people in it who have real struggles.
And I was like, all right, that's different.
And yeah, there were, there weresome people at the church who
weren't like super cool or superkind.
Like I, I wore a hat one time. I didn't know you weren't
supposed to when a lady got mad at me and I didn't, I didn't
(34:44):
even know, right? Like what if?
You weren't being disrespectful,you just didn't know.
And I think I said this earlier,like my dad was like, be
careful. Like they always want something
from you. I'm assuming they're just going
to try to take money from you. Like I kind of thought church
people were all like the worst type of car salesman man.
I know people have bad church experiences, but do that little
church love lost little punk kidright from the start.
(35:06):
Like enough that like I wanted to be just to even though I was
still like, this is dumb. I just like life better around
the church people. Like even though the oldest
church lady was kind and I was it, it just that shook me,
right. So I was shook by the kindness
and by the like authenticity of the the stuff that was happening
(35:26):
in the Bible. And then that moment with Miss
Greiner and then all of it like just kind of stacked right.
And then one day that the the past was he was walking through.
I know like I know now it's called like the Romans Rd. but
he's walking through you know you know Romans 623 we've all
sinned falls towards the glory of God wages of sin is death.
That's 323 sorry whatever the but to get to God's eternal
(35:48):
life, Christ Jesus at the right moment.
Jesus died for the sinners and professor mouth.
He believed in heart. He was doing the gospel like
here's this is how it works. You're a Sinner.
You got to confess you could be saved and it it rocked me same
thing. Like I was I was crying.
It's not coming on my nose kind of thing.
I was up in the balcony, you know, at the church and work in
(36:11):
the sound booth and just overwhelmed by all of it.
And he did the like, if you wantto pray to see Jesus, I want you
to stand up right now. Walk down the aisles.
I stood up and I was hit man with that same pride piece.
That's like, this is the heat. Like, dude, this is what he
does. He puts on a suit and he
manipulates people. Like that's what that's what
they're doing. Like you, they're playing songs
(36:32):
that make you feel this way and the lights look this way.
So you feel like it's all fake and you are too.
You should know better. Like you should know better.
This is not how it is. I sat down and I was frustrated
with myself again for like giving in, man.
I got my car and I was driving home on this road called 341 and
(36:53):
I don't like, I don't, I'm a bigtalker band, but I don't got
good words. I don't got.
I do not have good words for this part.
I I'm a fellow Georgian, I understand.
This part I, I just got overwhelmed, man.
I, I had like a I'm trying to try to put in the words for what
it was then, but I, I just, I had an encounter with this the
living God, like the holy. I don't know, like it wasn't
(37:14):
like lights. It wasn't anything.
I just could not go any further.Like I had pulled my car on the
side of the road. I couldn't go back home.
I couldn't go back to the church.
I was, I just was stuck at all in some ways.
I couldn't move. I couldn't go anywhere.
I didn't know what I I don't know.
And I had to pray. That's what I feel like I had to
do. And I didn't know what to pray.
And when I prayed was Jesus, if you're real, save me and man,
(37:35):
like I know, I know, like my past was still with me.
My struggle, all the stuff was still there.
But like for me, at least in that moment, something changed.
Like I, I left church, one person I stopped on the side of
the road and I was a different person when I came home.
And I made a whole bunch of awful mistakes as a young
(37:55):
believer too. But like, like the like that
hollowness, that emptiness that I was feeling was like starting
to get full. Did you do what I mean?
Like I don't know how to put in words like, but yeah, it was, it
was like it was an instant moment for me, but it was a
(38:17):
whole lot of build up and then obviously a whole lot of process
afterwards, right. But that was like the moment
everything changed for. Me and we all, you know, if
we're believers, we all have that moment where we can point
to we should, where everything changed.
Yours was a long time coming, you know, with all the ways that
(38:38):
God was, you know, call it what you will.
It was the grace of God in your life through all of those things
kind of leading you to Him untilthe time was right.
And man, what a powerful. I've got tears in my eyes right
now. Like just what a powerful story,
what God can do. And it's hard to put in the
words, isn't it? Because my my 8 year old little
girl, she just asked Jesus into her heart and I get to baptize
(39:01):
her this weekend which is cool. That's awesome.
We were doing a video like tell us about, you know what, what
that meant to you. Bless her heart.
She just had a hard time puttingin the words.
She's like, I just, I don't knowhow to say it.
I just don't know how to say it.I'm like, I hear you, girl.
Like I, you know, on this side of things, looking back, it's
easier to describe, but in the moment, you just know things are
(39:21):
different. You know that what you were
looking for has been found. And man, that's a that's a
powerful testimony of what God can do in the hearts of someone,
in the heart of someone who wasn't interested in him but yet
kept pursuing him. And I see that pursuit alter
your story. I see a God pursuing you.
(39:44):
And I'm reminded that God died for us while we were still
sinners. Yeah.
God loved. Us first that that you know, God
proves his own love or God demonstrates his own like he
didn't have to the King of Kingsdoesn't need to prove anything
to anybody, but he chose to prove his love to you.
That why you were still a Sinner.
Like what kind of God proves hislove to people who can't love
(40:07):
him back? Like, you know, I mean like,
that's, yeah. What's wild?
And and and knowing, like givingyour life for people who you
know will never come to you. Yeah, yeah.
That's that's an amazing kind oflove.
And I'm reminded of the love that your friends showed you.
You know, they weren't trying tohold that over your head.
They weren't doing it for a pat on the back.
(40:28):
They weren't doing it to show you how good of a friend they
were. They were doing it because it
was best for you, knowing that you may never know about it and
you may never appreciate what they did for you.
And that was OK because that's not why they did it.
It was love that led them. And so.
Yeah. And what, what didn't, what it,
what a God we serve. Yeah.
Right. You were atheist,
(40:50):
self-proclaimed atheist and cameto know the Lord and now here
you are serving as pastor. When did that call come?
I'm just curious. Man, it, it's, there's a whole
lot of stuff to that too, right I.
Have loaded question right. I know, right?
I, I went, I have two undergrads, 1 is an outdoor
(41:10):
education and 1 is in psychology.
And I had this goal like right after I got saved, I started
working in summer camps. I loved, I loved that that
world. I had this goal of like doing
like adventure based counseling.I wanted to kind of pursue, but
all throughout college I worked at churches.
I worked at church in Millsville.
I got a pretty young Christian. The other thing guy did, man is
(41:31):
he put real clear, like the samething.
I'm going to talk backwards, back headed, but he put real
clear, like disciplers in my life, you know, So I had a guy
named Curtis Wright when I got saved, who like instantly
invited me in to to like opportunities to like
participate in like playing in the band.
And he had me the first chance to ever lead a Bible study when
I didn't know nothing. I remember talking about the
Narnia books and how much I loved him at like a college
(41:54):
Bible study thing. And he was like, well, Brian,
you know, that's like supposed to help people understand Jesus.
And I was like, it is, you know,but like, he, he.
Was a good story. Yeah, when I went to college,
there's another guy named Jeff Simmons who was a pastor of
church there who let me be a worship leader of this little
small church. And man, he had, he still does,
dude. He'd like, you know, people
(42:14):
might look at his church and sayit's not influential.
But I can tell you, man, in the Kingdom, like he's doing, he's
faithful and he serves and he loves these people in in in this
town that are often overlooked. I had these great disciplers in
my life who kept giving me opportunities in school, spoke
at us as a youth group at another church in town.
(42:36):
At the end of the night, anothercollege student came up to me
and he was like, Brian, this is super weird, dude.
I don't think you should be a pastor.
Like it was one of those things and just kind of rode well off.
Graduate high school, got married at high school, graduate
college and was married. Went to work at a place called
Project Adventure, visit adventure based counseling and
about a year into it, the state of Georgia pulled funding for
(42:57):
adjudicated youth. That's what we served kids that
were in prison. And so the company which it's
it's up in Connecticut. We're like a Georgia branch of
it was going to close that branch down and we're trying to
decide what we're going to do next.
And my wife was like, I think this is what you should do.
I think this like God has you remember Micah told you you
should be a pastor. I think you should.
It was just one of those kind ofconversations confirmations.
(43:21):
Yeah, there's a there's a big old church in town called 12
Stone. And I sent a Facebook message to
one of the pastors and said something like, I don't have any
experience. I just kind of feel like this is
what God wants me to do. And they were like, all right,
come on. It's like that's kind of how it
worked for me. Yeah.
Well, and and you know, that's The thing is it that happened
with me too, when I when I was feeling called into ministry,
(43:43):
all of a sudden God put the exact people I needed in my life
at the exact period I needed. Them you.
Know and you look back and like that's no that's no coincidence
like there's no way that that that was not by God's design and
hey you never know the power of a Facebook message that's how I
asked out my wife for the first time so.
Hey I I asked my wife out on AOLand said no MSN instant
(44:04):
messenger. So yeah, there you go.
Love technology, right? Well, thank you for sharing your
raw, your real, your authentic. Thanks man.
You know, there's people out there with, with, with stories
to tell and they Polish them up.Dude, this is the real deal.
This is the work of God in a young man who had no interest in
(44:26):
being worked on. My God, but yet God pursued him,
chased him until his heart was ready.
And what I want to encourage ourlisteners with is you know, you
may find yourself on one end of this journey or somewhere in the
middle, you may find yourself a skeptic.
You're not real sure about this whole faith thing.
You're not sure about the Christianity thing.
(44:47):
You got the caricature of Christians that you've been
looking at and and and y'all want to encourage you with
Brian's words that hey, he thought that too.
But then when he realized and got to know some people and
stepped foot in that church, that things became real to him
and he began to see that authentic Christian life lived
out. So don't let a bad experience
(45:08):
keep you from pursuing God further.
Or maybe you find yourself as you're kind of just fickle about
faith. You know, you're not anti faith.
You're not really even skeptical.
It's just something other peopledo and you're just not
interested in that. To each his own, right?
I want to encourage you that you're never going to, you're
never going to be fulfilled by the things of this world.
(45:30):
Stop chasing the things of this world because they'll never fill
you up. They may make you feel good for
a minute, but you're going to beempty again.
And Brian said it so clearly. Well, I was empty.
And then all the sudden when I had that experience with the
living God, when the Holy Spiritwas there meeting with me,
speaking with me, I was full. I love that.
(45:54):
I love that because that it showthat shows us, you know, and and
it's not about what God can do for us, but that just shows you
right there that hey, that's what we're all looking for.
That's what we're all chasing. And you know, your circumstances
may not be what you want them tobe.
You may be living a life you notyou would have never chosen.
But regardless, you can have peace and joy and you can
(46:16):
experience the love of Christ. And that's the game changer.
And if you're a Christian, I only encourage you by the
friends that Brian had because, hey, how you live your life
matters. There's people watching.
There's people that you know that that are in need of a touch
from God and God uses you. There is no Plan B and you were
(46:39):
it. And so, hey, be on the lookout
for opportunities not to bash people over the head with the
gospel, not to judge them and talk about how ungodly they are
with the love on them and to do what's best for them.
And Brian, your story brings allthat together.
And I just want to thank you forsharing it with us today.
Thanks, man. Hey, I wanted, I don't, I don't
(47:04):
do this often, but I wondered, can you pray for us?
Can you pray us out as we'd say in student ministry?
Yeah. Can you pray us out?
Because man, I just want to hearyou talking to God on behalf of
the listeners that are listeningto this today.
Yeah, man, let's pray. I want to be a good Christian
and take my hat off. I don't want to get in trouble.
(47:24):
You good, you good. I, I want to take a moment right
now and I just want to say how grateful we are, I am to have
these kind of conversations for a chat with podcast for all the
listeners who are paying attention and, and hearing what
you are all about God. But I can't say thank you enough
(47:45):
for the way that you you pursuedme that you, you proved your
love to me before I ever even got it.
I, I hope God, I never grow likehard hearted to how good you
are. Thank you for the the friends
that you put in my life. Thank you for using them to to
chase after me and God thank youfor for their faith, for the the
the cross where you died for their sins as well can just.
(48:09):
But God, I pray would be that all of us listeners who are
followers of Jesus, God, I pray that all of us hear the gospel
like it was the very, very firsttime we've ever heard it before.
Don't let our hearts grow like hard at all to how different and
how radical and how unique you truly are.
And then, Father, I want to prayfor anyone who's listening, who
knows what, what, what it feels like to be hollow and and
(48:30):
hopeless and alone. And I want to pray for the
people who don't have great church stories, who gave it a
try and just felt like it didn't, you know, work.
They just felt more judgement and more hate and more
separation. And God, I pray that you would
give every person who feels hollow and feels alone one of
those moments where they meet you, they encounter the living
holy God and Father. I pray there are people who, not
(48:53):
because Chad and I are cooler fun talkers, but because you
choose to use these conversations.
I pray there are people who are far from you now who get to
experience that fullness of lifethat Jesus, only you can provide
and then got to pray. You would use us to share your
gospel with the other people in our lives and got to pray, you
know, years and years and years from now and as we all are in
(49:13):
the Kingdom, we can all celebrate the the role that we
played in bringing our family and our friends and our
coworkers and our neighbors justone step closer to you, Jesus.
So I think don't let us ever forget how grateful we should be
for how much you've done for us and with us and through US to
Jesus. We pray all these things, Your
name, your power alone. Amen.
(49:34):
Amen. Amen.
Thank you, my friend. I want to encourage you.
You're listening to this today. I want you to think about what
God's done in your life and let this be an opportunity to have
gratitude for His goodness. Thank you for listening to the
Rev RX Podcast. We hope you enjoyed what you
heard today, and if so, we'd love it if you would hit that
subscribe button so that you'll never miss a new episode from
(49:56):
us. Also, feel free to leave us
reviews and comments as we'd love to hear from you.
Be blessed and be the very best you.
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