Gary Heidnik - 3520 North Marshall Street - Philadelphia

Gary Michael Heidnik was the epitome of evil. FBI famed profiler John Douglas even claimed that Gary "spooked him" - he was born near Cleveland Oh in  1943 and was the last man killed in Pennsylvania by lethal injection July 6, 1999,.

In between these dates what he did was fodder for movies such as Silence of the Lambs - Buffalo Bill the character was made up of six serial killers and Gary was one of these killers. He put women into a pit, chained them to walls and shocked them with water in bizarre electrical ways to punish them; he would sit back and sneer and chuckle as they "danced" in death. 
One woman would turn the tables on him however, a woman Josefina Rivera would trick him, and what she did was horrifically beautiful - she is a true here.
What happened at 3520 N. Marshall street is just about unbelievable....except that it really happened.

Episode Transcript

Unknown (00:26):
Good afternoon everybody. This is Debbie Q and
you're listening to the rightshow. Yes, I said q because
go ahead go get him go give himYes, I said you because I

(00:48):
finally separated everything. Iknow what I was meant to do took
me a while. I mean I thought itDebbie sue the one day because
Debbie Sue is my name. I gottaget this out, folks. So from now
on, if you just like crime, justget on. Start with the crime

(01:10):
tell the story. That's how theright shoe is going to be from
now on. No, none of my littleanecdotes which I will still do
in this story because I justhave to bury someone that really
fits in with it. A I'm getting Iam getting together a new
podcast because I always hadpodcast is going to be called

(01:33):
smack podcast and it's gonna beabout all my smack and I always
had like a blog. I don't havetime for I don't I I have time
for this podcast. My poorwebsite is I haven't even
updated YouTube I haven'tupdated I am terrible people
give out stickers all the time.
I don't even have stickers I'mjust you know as I can get this

(01:55):
podcast out right now. Andthat's my limit at this present
time I'm hoping that I can growand do all the things that you
know that you're really supposedto do. But I will have two
podcasts one will be the rightshow strictly true crime and
strange and unusual deaths. Andthe other will be smack podcast

(02:19):
and it'll be like in the same Idon't know. I guess I can't put
it in the true crime genre. Butit's you'll know it's me because
on Instagram I'll which is whereI'm most that I'm going to, you
know, I'll promote it and stuff.
But this way I can get out whatI want to get out. I really feel

(02:40):
the need right now to talk.
Yeah, I'm putting out whateverthe cause is to do it. I really
No, I'm not. I love all thethings like the buy my coffees
and patreon at all. And I Ireally at some point would love
to do Patreon because I wouldlike the listeners that are into

(03:00):
me. I would love to do extrathings for them. At this moment
in time. We're just gonna havetwo separate snack podcasts the
right show, and it'll beperfect. And we'll be one big
happy family. My dogs. Boy,oh boy.

(03:21):
Oh boy.
My dogs not with me gets crazy.
So that's the way it's gonna beand I think that'll work out
great. And tonight it'll be thelast night then on the right
shoe. I you know, I mean, Imight say you know, because it's
it's from Philadelphia and I'mtalking about Philadelphia, I
might say like a stray thing butit's really just going to be

(03:41):
true crime or smack and and Ireally think that'll work well
for several reasons. So here wego. Today's episode is going to
be about Gary hi Nick. Nowstrange and unusual deaths. Now
he died he was the last personto be put to death by lethal
injection in Pennsylvania. Iactually thought he was in the

(04:05):
electric chair. I don't know thelast person electrocuted in
Pennsylvania Pennsylvania is nota big death date or death row
state but he was there was threepeople in the 90s point to death
I think lethal injury Yeah,lethal injection, all of them.
One of them. I did the podcastabout Leon Moser, which who

(04:27):
killed his kids? And then Garywas the last one in 1999 I hope
I do this justice because Ireally do like the movie Silence
of the Lambs. And one of my alltime favorite scenes is when
that Buffalo Bill guy. Ted Levinis the actor's name when he does
that dance is a really it'sartistically aesthetically

(04:51):
pleasing. And so that's awesome.
Gary I Nick now I did not knowthis. He it back then. When I
was Growing up, and I was goingout with this guy we lived at
right down the street from 10thand Fisher, which I always Well,
I was so confused as a kid aboutnow to me in Philadelphia had

(05:16):
neighborhoods. I grew up inrural Park, which was in the
northeast section ofPhiladelphia, the far northeast
section. I mean, we were likeright on the border of bensalem,
which is Bucks County, but wewere in Philadelphia, you know,
we were like literally the lastof the last of the
Philadelphians there I but Ididn't realize when I lived in

(05:38):
10th and Fisher it's a sectionattend the vision they still
consider only I'm pretty surebecause all only starts bleeding
into Logan. But I did not everrealize that only was in North
Philly. The I always thoughtalanine was like its own
separate thing. I just I don'tknow, I don't know why I thought

(06:00):
that because I worked when I wasyounger. When I was only 18
years old. I worked at Einsteinhospital on it was embroidered
on it still is there. I workedas a Kelly girl representative.
And I saw I didn't truly work inhindsight, but I worked at
Einstein. That's where there's afrankford slashers one that I

(06:21):
did. And I had an incident witha state trooper that I still
don't know who it was. Somebodyon YouTube was thinking maybe
that guy was a frankfordslasher. And I don't know, I
mean, it could have been, oh,boy, it still creeps me out. But
I'm back then I live 10th andFisher with this guy. Now,
little did I know at 3520 NorthMarshall Street, which was not

(06:44):
far. Now we used to go thisplace called hunting park at
night. And when I think aboutthis, it really freaks me out it
spooks me out. It's just bizarreto me. And I'm going to call him
Tom, me and Tom went to huntingPark. And he was older than me

(07:05):
by like eight years, and we wenthunting Park and we would get
like ice cream or no they had alot of stores at the time. I
mean, this was that is the 80s.
So they they had a lot of storesacross the street from wanting
park at that time. They wereopen late at night, and we
started playing this game ofhide and seek. I had an out

(07:26):
picture this now loving park atthis time was probably 80% Black
20% White, I was very thin backthen, like very thin. I had to
take this asthma medication thatmade me extraordinarily thin. So
picture this little thin whitegirl in this, you know,

(07:48):
predominantly blackneighborhood. And I had these
shorts on that literally barely,barely covered my rear end. But
I was with my boyfriend. So Ididn't think much of it that
night until this incidenthappened. We're playing iron
seek.
I still to this day do not knowhow this happened. I look up

(08:11):
he's gone. I mean, he is gone.
And I'm like, What? I thought hewas mad suing me. So I'm looking
around and and then like peopleare starting to drive by and
they're like, yo, because a lotof prostitutes walked in that
area. And at that given second,I was looking like a prostitute.
I mean, these shorts I had on Ican remember them they were pink

(08:32):
neon up to my eyeballs. I youknow, I wore them for Tom. But
here I was lost. And Barry. Ijust remember like, people were
screaming out their windows, yo,and I'm like, oh my god. So I
quickly was very nervous. Ithought oh my god, you know,

(08:54):
he's got to be messing with me.
And I swear I was lookingeverywhere for him. So I start I
know how to get to 10th andFisher and it's a long walk
ronning Park at night withshorts on that short. I walking
across the street. And I did notknow that a mile down the road

(09:17):
was Gary Hyde Nick's house. Imean to this day, I mean, first
of all, Gary hi Nick Burfordblack woman right off the bat. I
was not his type. But just thefact I was walking across the
street with these shorts on anda gaming it's better so this

(09:39):
guy's thought that Okay, so backthen crack was huge. I mean, it
just come out. And this guy,this group, there was about four
guys and one was like I guessthe the leader and he was like
Hey yo, yo yo and then he lookedat me and He was like, Hey, I

(10:01):
gotta talk to you for a minute.
And I was I said, My head isalready exploded on man. I'm
scared. I'm like, I couldn'teven think. And this guy's
probably looking at me like thisgirl is nuts, obviously. So
first he said, Do you want threefor 10? I'll give you an extra
one. I guess they were two for10. At the time, whatever the

(10:24):
caps, I don't know. I just seenhim. I have a baggie full of
these little cap things. I'msure it was crack. And he was
like, do you want three for 10?
And I was like, I don't smokecrack. I'm I got lost. And he
looked at me. He says, You knowwhat? He said, I'm going to tell
you right now, it is reallydangerous for you to be walking

(10:46):
in this neighborhood like that.
And I said, I know. I know. Myboyfriend. I explained to him
what happened? God bless thatthese guys or night. They were
really nice guys. They reallywere concerned. Especially the
main guy. I remember him beingvery upset. And he was like, you
know, I will walk you home. Andall of a sudden I hear this

(11:08):
beat. And I turn around and Tomface a he I think his head was
about to explode. The guy likekind of stares back and he's
like, I guess that's your man.
He was curious. He I got in thecar. I thought he was gonna kill
me. He thought I ran from hethought I was playing a game. I

(11:32):
don't know what happened afterthat. I just remember him
screamingall the way home. I mean, he was
I think he was just scaredinside because he's like, do you
know what could have happened?
And then I would have had totell your mother I was lazy
person with you. And we youknow, he said it would have I
would have looked like I killedyou or something. So it was

(11:52):
just, I will never forget thatnight and I as I got older, and
I realized that, Gary, hi, Nick.
lived at 3520 North Marshall andI paint I like triangulated it
to a hunting Park and 10th andFisher I can't believe I closed
a that house was so I just hadto tell a story. Now that's the

(12:14):
kind of story that will be onsmack talk. I don't have it
fully fleshed out yet. I amgoing to try to do it every
week. Because this one I don'thave to research. It's in my
head. So let's get on with Gary.
Hi, Nick. Now this story's alittle difficult because he
really did some Oh my God, thisguy he was as I said he was one

(12:34):
of the six people to be the guythat wrote silence and lambs had
six people that influenced himof the character of Buffalo Bill
and Gary I Nick was one of them.
I think the other guy was theone that said hey, I'm he was
the one that like cut offpeople's skins and may lay him
shades and stuff. Gary my glideneck was born November 22 1943.

(12:57):
In Eastlake, Ohio. It's a suburboutside of Cleveland. He was
born to Michael and Ellen. Hi,Nick. He had a younger brother
Terry. He said he did not have agreat childhood. Now his brother
Terry claims that Gary was like,okay guy up until he fell out of

(13:22):
a tree and hit his head. Andthis is what made me I don't
know, when I heard it. It's justmaybe, I don't know. It's just
they would call him footballhead. And I can just picture
this guy with his football head.
But he said after he fell out ofthat tree, and His head was

(13:42):
misshapen from it, that'schanged him forever. But even
before that, Gary claims thathis father was very abusive,
emotionally and physically. Now,Ellen m divorced and 1946, which
is fairly early. Well now thatwas, Oh, yeah, that was fairly

(14:03):
early on. He was only three andAlan turns she became an
alcoholic, pretty bad alcoholic,and his father was abusive, and
he would do like some strangestuff like if Gary wet the bed,
he would hang the bedsheets orwhatever. He went out the window
to show all the neighbors like Iguess to humiliate him and show

(14:26):
the neighbors the wet the bed.
Also, he would sometimes dangledGary out the window. And if he
did something that he did notlike, he would put like a bull's
eye on their pants so thatpeople would kick them when they
went to school, which Oh, my Imean, that's just awful. I think
Michael or Michael Hi, Nick hadrefuted this later on, but who

(14:50):
knows, you know, I Terry saidthey weren't pretty emotionally
abused as kids, his brother andI said Gary, it was okay until
he fell out of that tree. Andthen they really, he said it
before, like he was like realinto animals. And he would let
me just trigger warnings allthis whole story has such

(15:12):
graphic depictions of rape andcruelty in general, it's pretty
severe. So be forewarned. Ifthis triggers you in any way,
please don't listen. Becausethis part made me ill that he
was really good to animals, andhe would like feed them and they
had a lot of wildlife outsidetheir house, and he would go out

(15:34):
and he just loved animals untilhe fell out of that tree. And he
said, it really changed him.
Then he started abusing theanimals. He would like beat
them, hang them from trees,smother them, he would, you
know, and you know, whensomeone's towards your animals
as a child, what's gonna happen,they turn into, I don't I don't

(15:57):
know, I would like to goactually and look at the
statistics. I don't know whatpercentage become serial
killers, or, you know, therereally isn't a lot of serial
killers out there, but who go tokill when they I would like to
see the ratio of kids thattorture animals to ones that

(16:18):
kill as adult kill in general,even if it's just one or two,
not zero killer, like, I wouldlike to see that correlation. So
he did not like school. Hebecame very abrasive. He fought
with everybody who fought withhis brother, he fought with kids
at school. And Terry always saidthey had a pretty good
relationship up until this time.
So he dropped out of school andhe went into the military.

(16:42):
During this time. He was about17 years old, and he started the
army for a little over a year.
They graded him as outstanding.
They said he was a really goodsoldier. He had no problems
following any of the trainingwhere he was good. You know, the
problem was, I guess they'd sendthem for medic training. He

(17:04):
didn't stay there long. He didget his GED. While he was in
there, he started complaining ofheadaches, dizziness, and
blurred vision and nausea. AndI'm wondering if that stemmed
from that head injury. I don'tknow. When he went to the
hospital. They said he hadgastrointestinal problems, but

(17:27):
they diagnosed him with mentalillness that was so severe, that
not only was he honorablydischarged, but they had given
him 100% disability from thearmy people, they get on or
present his ability. That meansthat they did not think he could
work. He was that mentallyimpaired, you're given that

(17:52):
disability check and 100% meansthere's something wrong with
you. I mean, whether you know,you're being diagnosed
physically or mentally, and theywere saying he was mentally
incompetent for life in general.
He started school at theUniversity of Pennsylvania. He
dropped out after one semester.
He did work at the VA for alittle while, but they said he

(18:15):
was rude and his way he did nothave a good attendance record,
they let him go. He did attemptsuicide. During this time he was
in and out. It was a roughlyfrom 1962 till, I guess when he
started kidnapping those girls.
They said he was in and out ofpsychiatric hospitals

(18:36):
constantly, always trying toattempt suicide in a variety of
ways. And his in 1970, hismother Ellen went who had really
turned into a very severealcoholic, she committed suicide
by drinking mercuric chloride,which is the chemical compound

(18:58):
of mercury and chlorine was onceused as a treatment for
syphilis, but it was no longerused because of the toxicity.
Can you imagine poisoning yourown self? I mean, I cannot
imagine. It says mark yourchloride is extremely toxic.
This is from Wikipedia directlyfrom Wikipedia, both

(19:22):
acutely and as a cumulativepoison, its toxicity is due not
just the mercury content, butalso to its corrosive
properties, which can causeserious internal damage
including old faces, stomach,mouth, throat and corrosive
damage to the intestines maycure chloride tends to

(19:42):
accumulate in the kidneys alsocausing corrosive damage.
mercuric chloride like allinorganic mercury salts does not
cross the blood brain barrier asreadily as organic mercury. So
the side effects are burningsensations in the mouth and
throat, stomach pain, abdominaldiscomfort, vomiting of blood,

(20:06):
corrosive bronchitis, severeirritation to the GI GI tract
and kidney valor, chronicexposure can lead to mercury
poisoning. wheezing yourself ispretty bad. I mean, it's almost
the equivalent of drinking anyphrase. During this time. Gary

(20:27):
wanted to meet a wife, he wantedto. He always wanted to have a
child, Gary's mind havingchildren is manly, you're seen
as kind of a power thing. He'sin and out of hospitals. He You
know, he he's obviously adepressed guy. You know, he

(20:48):
really was he was lost until hewent to California. And he heard
the voice of God talking to himto start a church, a return a
went to Philadelphia and hefiled for a church which he
called the United Church of theministers of God and this would
be what was on like, if you lookat old pictures of 3520, North

(21:13):
Marshall, you can see that thethe actual plaque, the United
Church and the ministers of God,it's there prominently with like
a whole bunch of trash and Ithere's several pictures, I
actually want to go down at somepoint and take pictures of 3520
how it looks now. Because theygot rid of his house completely.
They brought tore that down. Butthe house next door is still

(21:35):
there. I cannot imagine beingthe house next door to Gary. Hi,
Nick. Can you imagine? Boy, hedecides that he wants to start
this club. And he would alwaysprey on women that were mentally
vulnerable. Also, this is reallyinteresting. He started with his

(21:57):
money for the church, he startedan account with Merrill Lynch.
And actually the representativefrom Merrill Lynch would come to
Gary's trial many years later,because his lawyer Charles
peruzzo, was trying to say thatGary was not and he shouldn't be

(22:18):
accountable for his actions, Iguess, trying again, insanity to
play an insanity defense. Andthe reason that it did not go
through is because during thistime after we went to California
and realized that he was goingto make this wonderful church
here with followers and getbabies from women, etc. He had

(22:39):
15 $100 that he started withfrom around 1975. To when he got
caught in the late 80s. By 87.
He had amassed $550,000, the guyat Merrill Lynch said Gary was
shrewd, he was no idiot, and heknew exactly what he was doing.

(22:59):
So yes, he might have beencrazy. Yes, he might have had
many problems. He said that inthe army, they gave him LSD. He,
you know, as a typicalpsychopath, he would blame
everything on everybody else andwhat they did to him. That was
one of his complaints besideshis father abusing him. They

(23:19):
gave him LSD in the army withouthis knowledge, which they said
did happen. But they couldn'tcooperate that but he but Merle,
the guy from Maryland said, Ihave been working with Gary all
these years, and he made 15 $100turn into $550,000. So he said,
so he is no dummy that I thoughtwas fascinating. Now he

(23:43):
maintained the money was to thecharge, Gary, maintain total
control over it just as hewould. That's what he wanted.
Total Control he ran in hishouse out is the second floor to
a couple named Linda and RobertRogers. Now, Robert said that he
noticed that he just noticedthat Gary, Gary would always

(24:07):
bring home black women, but theyreally didn't seem he said it
would shock him because he wouldalways see him reading arion
type racist literature. And alsohe would be me. He made
predictions kind of likeCharles Manson about the race
war that was coming and wouldsweep the nation. And Mama was

(24:29):
like, This is so weird, becauseGary was living with this girl
named Dorothy at the time whowas like, and she had an
intellectual disability. So theytried to get Dorothy away. But
she, I don't know. I guess hehad her under his control. But
one night, Gary had gottenticked because he got into an

(24:52):
argument with Linda, the wife,he shut off all the utilities
When Robert found the out, hewent into the basement to turn
the power back on. He started toclimb in through a window to the
basement because the basementwas locked so obviously Gary and
turned off whatever and he hadlocked the basement. He goes

(25:12):
into the to the window and he isface to face with Gary. Gary has
a rifle and a pistol and he toldhim that he was going to shoot
them and tell the police and hecaught him trying to burglarize
their house. He fired thebullet. It went to Roberts
cheekbone but it it grazed it.

(25:34):
It's an art goes all the waythrough. Robert I managed to get
the gun out of Gary's and and hedid report the incident but he
never went to court for it thisguy, Robert, which some i think
is strange, but I'm telling you,there's so many times that and I
don't know, especially in thethe more violent sections, I

(25:57):
guess you'd call them more thesenior sections of Philadelphia.
I noticed like a, there wouldhave been a lot like you would
get a really bad fight. I mean,I've seen people throw bottles
at people's head and knock themout and put them into comas. And
then person just wouldn't presscharges. I don't know why it was
just like the rule of thestreets. I guess. You know, the

(26:20):
code, I don't know. And that'swhat happened here. He tried
shot it. He shot it, Robert buthe did not it just grazes is
under eye. So Gary sold thehouse. And when the buyers came
in, they said all that wasaround was garbage pornography
and bullet gazing. So they wereless than thrilled. But they

(26:43):
said that when they went to thebasement there was a like a hole
excavated in the concrete floor.
That's really weird. And thatwas what was to come because
when he got the house onMarshall Street, that's what he
would do that hole and inSilence of the Lambs have anyone
seen if they haven't watched itbecause he digs this hole and he

(27:05):
puts a girl in there but that isdirectly from what Gary Hynek
did. So then he got another golfso this went but he never really
got charged for that incidentwith Robert because Robert never
pressed charges for it. Althoughthey could have and and it would
have gotten Gary in trouble. Hestarted dating this girl name

(27:26):
and Jeanette. She was also blackand she was disabled mentally.
She could not read or write. Ofcourse this you know, this just
Gary just this is what Garywanted because it was easy to
control. These women I imagineexcept that an engineer became
pregnant. He would not let hersee a doctor and when she went

(27:50):
to the doctor, she had onlygained five pounds. She did
deliver a healthy baby girl inMarch of 1978. But they placed
her in foster care because ofher disability and Gary's mental
illness. Gary was just besidehimself. This would be the
probably this would really sethim on to the path that would

(28:15):
happen in 86. You want to kidsand he had a plan. And Jeanette
sister Alberta was a resident ofzillions Grove center in
Harrisburg Pennsylvania. He wasdetermined on getting somebody
pregnant now he got engine andsister Alberta of family leave

(28:37):
visit but she never came back.
So a week laterthe people at the facility were
just out besides themselves.
They went to Gary and andJeanette apartment in
Philadelphia Gary answered thedoor and he told them that he

(28:57):
had given Alberta a bus ticket.
He invited them in to prove thatshe wasn't in there and they
couldn't find her anywhere butthey didn't believe Gary at all.
So they they told them they wereleave them but they came back
with a police the next day whenthe police came. They looked for
the basement. They found anempty storage room where a Berta

(29:18):
was trapped. And Jeanette sisterAlberta was trapped in she was
shaking and terrorists she wasit several when the caregivers
came in she she was likeclutching on them she wouldn't
let them go. She herself saidshe was crying. It was so sad. I
think it is poor girl with amental deficiency and briars and

(29:39):
what's going on and he shovesher no back room somewhere. So
the doctors gave the woman anexamination and found that she
had been raped. Gary was broughtin and charged with kidnapping,
rape, imprisonment, unlawfulrestraint. But because I mean,
this is really a shame. I don'tknow why this state. I don't

(30:04):
know, this is confusing to me,because Alberta could not
testify. She was not competentenough to testify. And the
prosecutors felt that I guessthey felt that he could not
prove the case without hertestimony. I don't know what to
think about that. That kind ofsucks, because the judge, he

(30:24):
could only get Gary on therecklessly endangering another
person, false imprisonment, and,you know, taking custody of
somebody who was committed. Hesaid he wanted to get Gary on a
lot more. He was only able toSir, give him a three to seven

(30:45):
year sentence. He said thejudge, Judge Charles miracie,
said I knew and I sent somethingevil and Gary, and I knew that
it was only going to get worse.
And he was right. This brings usto around 1979. Gary was facing,

(31:07):
you know, seven years in prisonfor what he had done to Alberta,
he was sentencing greater Ford,he was also subject to a battery
of psychological tests. He hadan IQ of 130, which is close to
genius level. But the they alsoshare that he was highly

(31:29):
manipulative, insecure, andthere was obviously something
wrong with them. It just seemslike no matter what happened, no
matter what he did, heconstantly flew under the radar.
He wouldn't speak in jail. So hejust kind of disappeared into
there. You know what I like? Hejust didn't stand out. So he

(31:53):
kind of got away with he waslaid out. And there was no real
red flags put upon them. Now, hewanted to see his daughter, but
they his rights had beenterminated. So he couldn't.
There was a doctor who, youknow, doctors were concerned,
they said that Gary was nuts. Atthis point, there was dogs

(32:14):
present near like, at one pointhe tried to commit suicide. He
even tried to commit suicide bysmashing a light bulb and eating
it to like, rip up his throat.
And oh, he did serve three yearsfor kidnapping. We're taking
without consent, Alberta. Hewent to the VA hospital in

(32:36):
Coatesville, Pennsylvania, whichis not too far from
Philadelphia. This is when hemoved to Marshall Street, a Hey,
don't be able that he was aprofessor at the University of
Pennsylvania.
Now with the money that wasstarting to roll in from the
Merrill Lynch account, he boughta Cadillac, Lincoln and a Rolls

(32:59):
Royce. He felt that women wereimpressed when he was rolling
down the street in these cars.
And he's probably not wrong. Imean, you know, I know people go
nuts right now. And I'm notsaying he's good looking. And by
any means the guy turns mystomach in every way. But if you
were, if you were a not sointellectually, their person

(33:23):
standing on a corner, likeeither prostituting or hungry
or, you know, vulnerable in someway, and you saw a guy in a
Rolls Royce, who looked likeGary, who at the time, kind of
didn't look so, you know, alittle he didn't look like this
enraged lunatic that he was thathe was easily manipulated women.

(33:46):
Now this is oh my god is morewoman. Hey did view First of
all, it brought this brotherBishop was one of his names. He
viewed that as a big power trip.
And he also viewed havingchildren as a power trip. He

(34:08):
decided he was going to bringback a woman from the
Philippines and her name wasBetty. Now Betty would marry him
and she said on paper when likeshe was getting her visa and
flying to the United States tosee her new husband. They met by
being pen pals. She said helooked good, she said but right

(34:31):
away. It was an absolutenightmare. No more than a week
had passed. And she called himGary having sex with three
women. And he told her that tellmarriage was
in America she better get usedto it. She She consider
ourselves a walkie when shewould complain or be

(34:55):
argumentative with them. Hewould force her to stand in a
corner for hours on end, now heraved her. He, when he was
having sex with other women, hewould like, laugh at her and
like he just was obviouslyinsane. And then Betty fell out.

(35:15):
She was pregnant. She knew. Andshe started talking to other
women, other Filipino women inthe area. They told her you got
to get back out of here. So inJanuary of 96, Betty got her
passport, got a bag and said,Gary, I'm going shopping, she

(35:36):
went to a women's shelter. Thenshe got a protection order. But
she was so afraid of him thatalthough she went to the police,
and reported all like theeverything that he had done,
that he never showed up late,they did have a preliminary
hearing for her. But she just Ishe was probably too scared. I

(35:57):
mean, that's a shame. Or shejust wanted to get out of the
United States. She probably Iguess she went back to the
Philippines. But she did givebirth to a son. She did not want
Gary around him. This is whatled up to the night of him
meeting a person that wouldchange his life in many ways as

(36:21):
he would change ours. josefinorbera. Josefina Rivera was a I
think she was 25 at the time.
Yes, 25. I've seen this a coupletimes, too. It says it says in a
couple of sources on November26 1986, sex worker Josephine
Rivera was on a corner inNortheast Philadelphia, but she

(36:46):
was on the corner of third andGirard and that is not Northeast
Philadelphia josefin Rivera, itwas on the corner of third door
now I would not consider thisNortheast Philadelphia for
anything. I just spoke withsomeone who said somebody that's
not from Philadelphia, and waslooking at the map could say

(37:07):
that it was northeast Philly,but man that doesn't seem like
it. I can say that NorthernLiberties. But whatever. I'm not
going to argue that she had gotinto a fight with her boyfriend
Vincent. She was pissed. Shewent back an hour after to
apologize. And they, theystarted fighting him. She was

(37:27):
furious. So she said screw it.
I'm gonna go out. It was coldthat night, very cold. Josefina
was half black, half PuertoRican, and I've seen many
pictures of her she does have avery exotic looking face. they
admire in so many ways, becausewhat she did was downright

(37:48):
genius. I am sincere in that I'mnot just bragging saying that.
Now, this is what baffles me.
And I don't know if this seemslike Poland. I know. Cadillac
coupe. DeVille pulls up. And hesays, Are you hustling? And she
said yes. And she said she sawthis big, expensive watch on his

(38:08):
wrist. And he the caddy lookednice. So at first he looked all
fancy. Or he said, How much doyou want Annie? She named a
figure and he said, Will youtake 20? So she said, okay, she
got in the car. And she said atfirst he seemed pretty cute. You
know, when she first seen him,she said, but then like when I

(38:30):
got in the car, I seen like hiscar, his shirt was kind of
soiled. And he wasn't as cute ashe looked outside. Now, this
part drives me insane. And Idon't know. I don't know. I
mean, I don't know when you're aprostitute. I hate the fact that
prostitution is illegal. And Ihate the fact that it's so
unsafe, because it's been aroundforever, it's going to be around

(38:51):
forever. So there's an old guyor an old, I don't know, say
there's somebody that wants sex.
They either can't get it ortheir marriage is whatever,
there should be no reason thatthey should not be able to get I
never seen what was so bad abouta guy in his you know, you know

(39:12):
what, I just don't see orwhatever. I cannot see the harm
in that. It should be legal, itshould be safe. But this is a
part of driving me nuts. So shegoes with him to McDonald's. I
don't know this was reallypissed me off. I guess I'm
splitting hairs. But he gets acoffee and he drinks it in front

(39:34):
of her and he doesn't offeranything.
I don't know. I mean, is thatcommon is that I wish I could
talk to somebody who was aprostitute right now and ask
them like, what would you do ifyou got into a car and they said
let's stop at McDonald's and hedidn't buy anything and he
proceeded to drink coffee infront of you on a cold night and

(39:55):
not offer you anything. Whatwould you do? I would it would
piss me off. So So now she neverwould really go home with
anybody but I think because shewas pissed off at her boyfriend,
I think because of everythingthat happened before. She just,
you know, on that night, I thinkthat she was just like, you

(40:16):
know, whatever and let her guarddown because he said let's go
back to my house. She said Inever did that before. Or she
would make it a point not to doit when she did it that night.
And when she went in there, shesaid, the first thing she
noticed was it was like penniestaped all over the kitchen. And
then there was like some dollarbills also taped upstairs. Then

(40:39):
they had sex. And then sometimewhen she was about to leave, he
clamps these.
These metal, he puts these metalclamps around her. He puts him
in her ankles, he chains or hebrings her down to the basement,
any razor up on like it's allconnected to the pipes and then

(41:04):
to the ceiling. So she's not ina comfortable position. And then
she notices in the middle of thefloor a shallow bit. She puts
her in there and she startsscreaming she is freaking out. I
guess he had went upstairs for afew seconds. And she's she ran
to the window and startedscreaming out the window. Nobody
came except dairy. So when hecame down she was she's you put

(41:27):
like all these bricks. Oh mygod, I would have had such
claustrophobia. He put likebricks on her and he shoved her
in that little hole in thefloor, just like the one he had
previously built all this one.
It wasn't as big. So she wasreally tightly packed in there.
And there she has, she's justdragged. She's literally
trapped. She was freaking out.
She said, I don't you know,right away. I was like, What the

(41:51):
hell did I do that for? Now?
She's in the basement. And hetells her of this plot that he
has. I mean, he was like fullblown. You know, he was furious
by this time because he had feltthat any kid that he had was
taken away from him and hewanted to have a Oh, he stopped.
He wanted 10 women to bear hislittle army of children. Of

(42:15):
course he raved Josefina day andnight he beat or I mean the
first night when she hadscreamed he had beat her so
badly. I mean, she was she saidthe pain was unbelievable. He
she begged them to stop, nofood. She was hungry. She was
scared. Now Sandra Lindsay wouldbe the next person who kidnapped

(42:36):
and she would be kidnapped onDecember 3 1986. Sandra Lindsay
was his friend. But whathappened was now when she was
first kidnapped, Josefina saidit was weird because I you know,
when she came in, I was like,Well, why as she seemed like,

(42:56):
she didn't know what was goingon. And Josephine was like, I
stare and I was thinking, Whyisn't she like screaming like I
was? Well, then she really shewas mentally challenged. So he
took Sandra because she hadgotten pregnant from Gary. And
she hung out with themfrequently, like her family knew
Gary. They knew where he live.

(43:21):
And she took him but she whenshe got pregnant, she had had an
abortion. He was so off the wallfor mad when he found out he,
that's when he kidnapped her andhe brought her back to the
little pit. So now he had twopeople. The next person that
they would get would be LisaThomas, age 19. And he would get

(43:43):
her two days before Christmas on1986. He was on Lehigh Avenue
alumni. Lee I am now wow,there's a lot of weird when I
get I mean, whatever it says LeeI strangely I am. Anyway, she
was walking up and down LehighAvenue. She had dropped out of
high school when she was in 11thgrade because she was praying

(44:03):
that she later had a child andher and her boyfriend were
currently living with hermother. Hi, Nick drove up in his
Cadillac. And he said, Do youwant to see my Peter? She said
I'm no prostitute. He apologizedand it's a she wanted to ride.
Now I'm only going to mygirlfriend's house. Where's that
just around the corner? Whydon't you come and get in? I'll

(44:25):
take you there. I'm not going tohurt you. When she saw the car,
she looked at the driver. Shedidn't look too bad. He didn't
apologize to her. He took her toher friend's house. Lisa went
in. And when she glanced out thewindow she said look at that
car. And when she got out hesaid let's get something to eat.

(44:45):
Hi, Nick. Favorite McDonald'sand were Rogers. He took her to
TGI Fridays out Wow. Whoo. Heasked her if she wanted to go to
Atlantic City. She said I don'thave anything to where we can
fix That he took out a $50 bill.
It's for new clothes. He saidwhen she looked suspicious, he
was Won't you know he wasschmoozing her and he took her

(45:08):
to North Marshall string gaveher a wine cooler. He told it to
make herself comfortable. Hemust have put something into the
drink. Okay. She had taken anallergy pills as she was getting
drowsy.
She had found in high nicad ondress there. She was completely
nude. He carried her upstairsput her on the war, a waterbed

(45:30):
and they had sex. She said, Willyou take me back to my
girlfriend's house? He startedstrangling her when she asked
this and she said quit chokingme. She said, I saw a bunch of
white plastic bags. And she saidis are those body parts in those
bags? And she said, Now you'regoing to kill me. You want to

(45:52):
kill me? No, I'm not going tokill you. Trust me. I'm not
going to kill you. I'm going tointroduce you my two friends.
They're dead, aren't they? AndThomas started freaking out. He
moved the board and a half nudewoman climbed out as leaves so
much internal amazement. Thefirst woman was followed by
another also nude from the waistdown. Um, Nicole said this

(46:13):
slimmer, lighter colored one.
I'm Sandy the other one seemed alittle damn high neck stood by
beaming like a big happy host.
Turning the Lacey's a kiss mybehind which she did. Who's the
boss you are Suck my balls. Suckmy beater. And she did that too.
Then he forced her to haveintercourse with them. And they

(46:35):
ate their sandwiches. Hi, Nickleft Thomas alone with her
Marian Lindsay. What a freakinOh my God. That is unbelievable.
And now he's grabbing women leftand right. And he's just so
pleased with themselves. Now inthe meantime, this was crazy.
During all of this going on,Sandra and Lindsay's mom came to

(46:58):
the house several times. She hadtold the cops several times at
Sandra Lindsay was with Gary Hi,Nick. Now, when they went to the
police station to complain shespelled his name wrong. So
nothing ever came up. Like II've used that. Now it's a
little messed up. It used to bea some uJs portal. If you

(47:21):
plugged in any name, you couldfind any Philadelphian Anyway,
you could find out if they werein jail what they were in jail
for. or whenever they were injail. I they made it so
confusing. It's not the samesite. But I guess that's what
they have down at the station.
And when when the cop put in thename, it does not come up unless

(47:43):
you put in the exact right somany times my friend Terrance
was in jail and I wanted to givethem commissary money. I was
spelling it with an A or an Eand he spelled it the opposite
way. And it was very hard tofind him finally I got his
number. But the point is, is youreally have to have that name
down pat for it to come up. Andthat's why it wasn't coming up.

(48:06):
So but she knocked on the doorone time. You know, a cop came
with the mom, Sandra Lindsay'smother, they went to Gary Hi,
Nick's house and he just he hegave her some they gave them
some bogus letter that said youknow he had Sandra right saying
I'm fine I just took off for alittle while. And that was good

(48:27):
enough for them. So that's ashame because Sandra Lindsay
I'll just say it right off thebat she would ultimately be
killed. So the next person thathe would now this person Deborah
Dudley, she was like aHellraiser he gots ever Dudley
and they said it really is amystery where he got her way.

(48:52):
It's not as well known. Because,well, I I she would ultimately
die to she was a thorn in hisside from the beginning. She was
constantly or it seemed like inan order would develop, or Vera
was the most streetwise and shewas starting to learn how to

(49:13):
manipulate Garry at this point,she was watching him and she was
learning what to do, becausewhat she would ultimately do was
fantastic. Rivera was wasstarting to get punished less
and less frequently. She wasearning Gary's trust, but she
said this even though some womenwe refused this at the trial,

(49:34):
she said I did that so I couldsave us and and I do believe
that was her intention allalong. When you're the kind when
you're in this kind of anightmare. I do whatever you can
to get out of it. So but I thinkat the time they didn't realize.
So then they got Deborah Dudleyand she just she was constantly

(49:55):
complaining. He just say it wasclash, clash, clash with it. And
Gary, so they said that theyjust really never knew how they
got together. He did. His sexualappetite was showing no sign of
declining he would always havesex was one of them under threat
of death, or you would alsoforce them to have sex with each

(50:16):
other. He did bring like a portapotty down for the ladies and
tampons a day. You know, hedidn't let them bathe for a
long, long time he brought thembaby wipes. One time, Lisa
Thomas pulled out two wipes andinstead of one and he beat her
with a shovel because he'spulled out two instead of one.

(50:40):
They would go upstairs to washthen he would have sex alone. He
also started feeding them dogfood at this time, eat it or
take a beating and they ate itand dog food would become a
regular part of their diet. OnChristmas Day, he bought a
takeout menu from a Chineserestaurant and he let them pick

(51:04):
their meals. Next he gotJacqueline asked and she was
kidnapped on January 18 1987.
She had been working on thestreets as somebody it was. Hi
Nick I've been driving a blueDodge van with that imitation
you know there's old dodge thatlike the rate man's that's what
they call them. She had been adrove that he got her in. And

(51:27):
once he they had sexy grabs aplastic rod and hit her across
the rear end. And she said thatyou're going to get more of that
if you don't do what I tell you.
And he he then he shackled herwith muffler clamps. her ankles
were so small, she could barelyfit through the devices. So he

(51:50):
had to use a pair of handcuffs.
He for some reason at this timethought Rivera and Lindsey were
both pregnant. It was they werenot pregnant. They were just
getting sick. And it anybodythat's that stressed out and
scared. The to get pregnant isit I'm sure it happens because

(52:12):
people who unfortunatelyhorrifically are raped get
pregnant. But I think in that,you know, like they were raised,
they were held for a couplemonths to be that strong. I
mean, there's I cannot see abody getting pregnant in under
those conditions. But thisgoofball thought that they were

(52:35):
getting pregnant. You know, sohe just thinks everything's
fabulous. This is when thingsstarted to get weird. He was
really starting to punish thegirls. Hi, Nick thought that
Sandra Lindsay was pregnant, butshe was him. And she was
refusing he because I think shewas getting I think she must

(52:57):
have got either infection or shewas really sick. So he takes her
by the wrist. He dangles herlike with the, you know,
whatever clasp or Hank on the adand he has her hanging there for
so long that she developed afever Now that means inside

(53:17):
you're fighting an infection.
She started throwing up JosefinaRivera and knew that this was
not good, because suddenly thisis when Sarah Lindsay would
slumped over. She yelled athygiena to calm down. Hi, Nick
said she was kidding. But whenhe took her hand cov off she she

(53:39):
fell on the floor. He still saidshe was kidding. And he handed a
bowl of ice cream to each of thegirls. When he came back he seen
that Lindsey and still notmoved. She's that he looks up
and said oh she must have chokedon a piece of bread. Then he
carries her upstairs and theycould hear a power Saul so the

(54:03):
women are all looking at eachother scared to death. It is
then when one of the dogs namedbear came dragging down a long
white bone with chunks of redmeat clinging to it. Wow, I this
is terrible. Actually. The onepart in the wow it says hi Nick

(54:25):
disappeared of Lindsay's body.
Bear came down dragging alongwhite bone with chunks of red
meat. clinging to it. The womenlooked at the bone then looked
at each other and each thoughtthe same thing. I wish I were
close enough to grab the meat.
Man that is just terrible.
Investigators later wasn't ableto find bloodstains. So, he

(54:50):
musta got rid of the tool thathe used to carve up Lindsay he
bought a food process. And noblood stains or body parts or
found in it but they'reconvinced that that's what he
used to get to grind upLindsay's body. He makes the
process me with dog food and fedit to this the girls and he put

(55:11):
the rest in the the upstairsrefrigerator. He could not grind
the head, the hands, the feet orthe rib cage. He destroyed. He
tried to destroy that by cookingnow at this time, the smell in
the neighborhood they on NorthMarshall Street. They said now
when he had killed Lindsey, hethey the neighbor said this

(55:36):
smell was so bad that when youwould drive down the street,
like there was like this. Thiscloud of just dark wack. It was
it was this greasy, you know,death set. And it was hard. It's
Oh, that makes me so nice justto think about. His days were

(55:57):
numbered, but he didn't know it.
His plans for getting this babyfactory together were very close
to collapsing. After Lindsay'sdeath had high neck became very
paranoid. He convinced the womenwere plotting against them. So
Deborah Dudley, had found apiece of an iron pipe in the

(56:22):
floor and she said, Let's gettogether, bang him over the head
with this pipe and then alltackle Rivera. Now this is the
was kind of in the trial. Ithink some of the girls were
arguing a little that they fit,they think Josefina, I think
she was doing it because shewanted to get the heck out of

(56:43):
there. She told him because shewanted to gain his trust.
Because what if that didn'twork? And she knew that if they
hit him with that pipe, and thatdid not work. She knew that they
would be dead or that he wouldkill them one by one or torture
them even worse. So she told himwhat they were planning. And he

(57:05):
did take it out on DeborahDudley. He brought her upstairs
and she came down. She was morequiet than she usually was. And
they said What did he do and shesaid Deborah Dudley said he
showed me Sandra's head in apot. He showed me her ribs and a
roasting pan and other parts ofher body in the freezer. He told

(57:27):
me if I didn't start listening,that was going to happen to me
too. So now he introduced hisnew form of torture, electric
shock. He snipped off the plugat one end of an extension cord
and said that the wire theinsulation, the wire was bare.
He plugged the other end into asocket with the current flow

(57:47):
through the wire. He touched thebear and the women's chains and
he would just laugh and think itwas hysterical when they jumped
and screamed for extra laughs Hewould submerge them in water. I
mean, this is unbelievable. Soonly one that didn't have to go
into the water. It was Rivera.
He drilled several holes in theplywood and covering his air

(58:09):
vents. When they were in thehole they could see a little
when they when the women were inthe hall they could see a little
of what was going on in thebasement. They knew it was
coming. Thomas physically Thelargest of the three was put on
the floor the pit with askingsand Dudley in her lap through

(58:30):
one of the air holes. They couldsee the wire they watched his
inch towards their chains, whichsnaked out of the hole around a
pipe then the bot bear wiretouched a metal link. The
current shots are the bodiesthey screamed. I couldn't see
the call with the wire but I canhear her saying she had it. The
jolt went right through theDebbie's change. She took the

(58:52):
heaviest amount and she shedied. She died right there.
Thomas started screaming youkilled her. He thought the wire
was faulty. And he said nowthere's nothing wrong with her.
I don't want to hear thatbullshit. But she was dead. So
he killed her. So the next dayhe made them all go on this

(59:13):
trip. They went out to hefollowing Deborah Dudley's death
her Josefina is Rivera'slifestyle improved considerably
as secure the belief that he hadRivera cyber like she saw or
assigned some sort of form thatshe was complicit in Deborah
Dudley's dad's banking thatwould make her just as culpable

(59:35):
as he was. He then took them allto the Pine Barrens to dump
Debbie's body. They got into thecar and he was checking his
stocks. And then he was talkingabout finding a replacement for
Dudley and this is when she hadthis brilliant idea. Now, this

(59:55):
whole time she was trying to getHis dry skin is just so the last
night. One of the last nightsthey were there because they
were the day he was caught wasMarch 23 1987 because that's the
same day he would get AgnesAdams aged 24 kidnapped on March

(01:00:17):
23 rescued the same day theywere all in the hole It was
after Dudley's death. It Riverahad begged him for a couple days
she said let me go see myfamily. Let me see me. No, I
won't do nothing. You know I'min on this with you. She had
gained his trust by now. Shepromised him that she would get

(01:00:39):
him another girl if he wouldjust let her go see your family.
She would come back and theywould meet at midnight. If you
run I will kill the others. Hesaid so late that night they
left and hi next Cadillac.
Everyone was quiet andeverything was quiet in the
cellar the new arrival, whichwas Agnes Adams was in the hole.

(01:01:03):
Thomas and Atkins were curled upon the mattress after Dudley's
death. Hi, they can ease that bygiving them pillows, blankets,
and even a dv according to theplan. I Nick with john or Vera,
to see your children pick up awoman and meet them back meet
him back at the gas station atsix and Gerard around midnight.

(01:01:23):
As soon as hi Nick drove off,or Vera ran to her boyfriend's
Vincent Nelson's. When shewalked in Vincent was stunned.
He said he enseigner and fourmonths and then she comes
running in talking about chainsand people getting killed and
dead people and he said shesounded completely psychotic.
And he's like, I'm gonna go,this was his words. I'm going to

(01:01:47):
go fuck em up. And that soundslike it's I have a goal,
Philadelphia man. And I'm goingto go there with a hammer and
I'm going to kill him and shesaid no, if you do that he's
gonna kill those other girls.
She was really scared. Shewanted to go to the police. She
forced Vinson Elson to call thepolice. She called 911 handed

(01:02:09):
the phone to Rivera. The copsdid not believe her. But an
officer says they were she was aunit would come up. minutes
later officers David savage andjohn cannon pulled up. Savage
and cannon Of course, were veryskeptical. But when she showed
them the abrasions on her scarand the scars on her ankles

(01:02:32):
where the chains had been, theybecame believers that night.
Just were hi Nick said they weregoing to meet at 12 they met up
here comes the night seen thewhite Cadillac common in the
cops get out and hi Nick of allthings gets out with his hands
up and says is this about mychild support? That's how I

(01:02:55):
mean, Josefina really did. Imean, She tricked him because he
had it so far in his head thatshe was one of his and, you
know, Doom abiding by him thathe never even thought that she
was totally flipping this switchon him totally, which is so
awesome. And but she was reallyworried about the girls. They

(01:03:18):
said they're your one ID forkidnapping, rape and homicide.
So they went in and they saidsome of the people that the cops
that were in there that nightjust cannot believe their eyes.
Except for the socks. They werenude from the waist down
shackles on their feet. And theydidn't know like they were had

(01:03:41):
been half asleep when they camein and they were all screaming
when the cops woke and theydidn't realize that they were
being rescued. Then they startedscreaming like oh my god, this
is we're saved. We're saved.
We're saved. Adams was still inshock. He took my $30 get my $30
back. Don't worry about it. Hedug Bank of Kenya and tried to
unlock the bindings on Adamshands and they they were all

(01:04:05):
bruised and scarred and theylook like they look like
prisoners of war. They werestarving. Gary kept ice can't
cream in the freezer. Can we eatthat? I don't think you should
eat ice cream. He had said thecop let the doctors check you
ever but they did go up to thedining room. And when they

(01:04:25):
walked in and saw in the pot,they they said that in a metal
versing pan was looked likesomeone's ribs on the counter
was a heavy duty food processorand right there with like a lot
of like slimy looking fattymaterial. He opened the freezer

(01:04:50):
and there was a human forearmeven for the veteran savage it
was a little too much he had totry Keep from vomiting. Now I
remember when this when thisbroke March 26 1987. It was
insane. I mean, it was justabsolute insanity. There was

(01:05:13):
just cars everywhere. It wascrazy. I mean, they had caught a
real life madman, even the guyjohn Douglas, who was so
brilliantly played if anyoneseen mine hunter on Netflix,
john Douglas was the FBI guy whothat was based on the younger

(01:05:35):
guy. And he said that one guythat really freaked him out and
he met them all. I mean, he metall the serial killers was Gary
Hi, Nikki said there was justsomething about him that was so
crazy. And and I mean, he metall these arrow killers. And he
said, Gary, hi, Nick was justone of the worst. So you know,

(01:05:57):
the Philadelphia Inquirer, theDaily News, which is kind of
Yes, our tabloid press. Youngwomen found chained him human
arm found in North Philadelphiarefrigerator, har or Marshall
Street. And they just went nuts,but they were saved. I mean,
it's a shame because SarahLindsay, who could have been

(01:06:18):
saved, was murdered. And so asever Dudley
said they, you know, saved wereJosefina Rivera, Lisa Thomas.
Jacqueline asking an AgnesAdams. It's just awful. That was

(01:06:39):
the end of that. And they gotthem. They did go to now. There
was a lawyer who's pretty famousaround here, I'm not sure about
outside of Philadelphia, Charlesbruta, Jr. He was the one who
defended Gary. Hi, Nick. He saidhe wanted to. Yeah, you wanted

(01:07:06):
to declare the lives of course,every defense lawyer is trying
to get the death penalty off thetable. But it just didn't work.
It went even though they thevenue they brought in people
from Pittsburgh, Lynn Abraham,who would later be our da. She
was the judge. And she was veryno nonsense. And she she did

(01:07:29):
bring in people from Pittsburgh.
She didn't give him that. Butshe really wasn't putting up
with much and he did get thedeath penalty. I mean, like I
said, that silence in the lambswas me know that. They may be
tore down that, you know, theytore down the house. When peruta
was interviewing, and one of thethings they have is I guess he

(01:07:53):
was interviewing Gary to get hisdefense. And he said, Tell me,
Gary, what kind of seasoning didyou use? And Gary stared at
Charles bruto and said, Man,you're crazy. It's pretty nuts.
I mean, so there was the UnitedChurch and the ministers of God.

(01:08:13):
And that's why they had the guyfrom Merrill Lynch say he was
not crazy. That guy was he knewwhat he was doing. $100,000 a
cost him to represent them. Itjust didn't go well. I mean, he
can't get past any of this.
That's why he got the deathpenalty. And he did. He was

(01:08:38):
executed Garry was executed forall these crimes. On he was the
last guy x executed July 1999.
He was the last man executed inthe state of Pennsylvania by
lethal injection. July 6, July 3was when they signed the papers
and nobody reviewed it. He neverdid he no he didn't. He just

(01:09:01):
didn't even care about hisappeals he kept. Oh, it's it is
weird. I think his daughter didtry to I believe his daughter
did try to stop it at one point.
Yeah, guide neck 55 and maintainhis innocence but not fight his

(01:09:24):
execution, saying his death withn executions in the Commonwealth
is pretty accurate in a weirdway. But according to attorneys
working for Ion extorter MaxineDavidson white of Philadelphia,
I think she I read somewherethat she did try to she wanted

(01:09:49):
to see him or something. Hi,that goes around to see family
attorneys and spiritualadvisors. His execution was
witnessed by six members of thenews media Pennsylvania resumed
executing prisoners after 33years when Keith Zettel Moyer,
of zelens Grove was put to deathin May 1995. And August 1995,

(01:10:12):
which I did a case about LeonMoser who killed his wife and
two daughters. He was killed andthen high neck. They did not
none of them tried to blocktheir executions. Hi, Nick was
granted a review of competencyin April 1997. When he was
originally scheduled to beexecuted. I saw much I can't

(01:10:36):
really find anything. I thoughtI heard that his daughter, the
daughter of a man. Yeah, theappeals court said the lower
court wrongly denied a requestby Warner father. And you know
it one of those you know, itthey, his daughter went, tried
to Yeah, the daughter of Gary Ineck convicted of killing two

(01:11:00):
women won him a stay ofexecution in 1997. Despite his
request to be appointed that theappeals court said a lower court
wrongly denied her request, byrolling Her father was rational
enough to act on is that whilethere's no dispute as to get
high Nick, considerableintelligence, there's no

(01:11:23):
evidence and no finding thathigh Nick can make a rational
decision. I mean, it's wild. Iwonder when that was a male. But
that was the story of Gary hein.
Again. Yes, he was. I mean, hewas from Cleveland, but he moved
here to start his littleministry and he was completely
psychotic. He was one of the youknow, he's one of the more oft

(01:11:47):
talk around serial killers. Sothat was a long one. That was a
brutal one. And I think I knowwhich one I'm gonna do next, but
I'm gonna keep it to myselfbecause I am working on this
smack talk. So this is Debbie Qand you listening to the right
shoe, and I will start back withall my shout outs my I haven't

(01:12:12):
done one in a while the I can'teven think I'm so tired. When
you you know, I like people. I'mfull of flop there. And I can't
even think of it I'll get toeverything I promise I'm sorry.
I'm tired but everything I allthis stuff that I haven't been

(01:12:33):
doing lately, like the shoutouts and stuff I will get back
to I just wanted to get GaryHein and Galloway, talk about my
smack podcast and and then we'rejust gonna move along. I just
got to flesh out this smack byguys a little bit. But that's
why let me too, and then you caneither hear me blab or hear me

(01:12:54):
talk about true crime.