June 5, 2025 • 63 mins
This week, I spoke with Krista Williams, one-half of the Almost 30 Podcast, which is all about dating in your 30s.
In this episode, Krista and I talk about:
- Dating & relationships
- Healing in relationships and solo
- Dating in your feminine & with intention
- Dating in your 30s
- Self sabotage
- Male and female friendships
- Experiencing desire
- Dating dismissive attachment style
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Links:
Where you can find Krista:
Where you can find Rochelle:
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to the Rochelle Christian podcast,
formerly the Emotional Masterypodcast.
I'm Rochelle, your host.
I'm here to help you come backto your body, take charge of
your emotions and live life onyour terms.
This podcast is a space for raw, real conversations about what
it means to trust yourself, leaninto your power and create a
life that feels aligned andalive.
(00:24):
We'll explore human design,astrology and other tools to
help you understand your uniqueenergy.
More importantly, though, we'regoing to talk about what it
means to actually live andembody these aspects.
So each week, I'm going toshare stories, lessons, guidance
to help you navigate life'schallenges and really own your
magic.
So if you're ready to step up,take control and show up as the
(00:46):
most authentic version of you,let's begin.
Welcome to another episode onthe podcast.
Today I have Krista Williams on,and I am obsessed with this
episode.
We recorded this about a monthago and their newest book just
came out yesterday, june 3rd, soif you have not gotten it, head
down to the show notes and grabtheir book.
But this conversation is reallycentered around dating, our
(01:08):
dating experiences, and, asalways with this podcast episode
, there's so much divine timingin editing and putting it out,
and Krista just brings so muchbeautiful wisdom perspective
around dating, around settingintentions and doing karmic work
and allowing things to be fun.
And I think that in reflection,I started their book in the
(01:30):
first you know couple chapterson the Saturn return and for me,
I have Saturn in my fifth houseand if you're familiar with
astrology, the fifth house isfun play dating and with Saturn
there it always makes it alittle bit serious.
So I've always taken datinglike very seriously and it's a
reminder to like lighten up,it's a reminder to feel
empowered.
(01:51):
It's a reminder that, like, Iget to choose, I'm not just
sitting here waiting or whatever.
I think I've been verydisempowered or I've allowed
myself to be disempowered a lotin dating in my past and so just
reminding myself that I amempowered, I get to choose, I
get to show up, I get to do thework, I get to have fun, all
those things.
So I don't really have.
(02:11):
We talk a lot about a certaindating situation that I had last
month.
In this episode I don't reallyhave an update for you Because
today I've been just super rawand emotional.
My kids are out of town and Ithink when they they're gone and
I'm just kind of hanging around, there's the loneliness creeps
in and there's just been a lotof shit coming up today.
So I'm not even going topretend to give you an update or
have anything real, because Idon't think it would be a true
(02:33):
reflection of anything that I'mactually moving through in the
moment.
Just more lessons on emotions,more lessons on moving through
things and showing up forourselves and doing the work and
you know we talk about that inthis conversation about doing
the work, while dating duringthe work in a relationship,
doing the work solo and singleand every way that we do the
work is so important.
We also talk about dating andyou're feminine and with
(02:55):
intention, dating in your 30sself sabotage, which is huge for
me personally, I always facethis male and female friendships
and how they can help beexpanders for us, experiencing
desire, which is huge.
And we talked about datingdismissive, avoidant attachment
styles and I so appreciate thisconversation because Krista
talks about how she has dated alot of dismissive, avoidant
attachment styles and I alsohave done this a lot in my past
(03:18):
which is always a mirror, right?
People that we bring into ourlives are always mirrors for us,
and so if we're constantlycalling in dismissive attachment
.
We kind of have to askourselves, like, where am I
putting out that frequency to?
And so I've noticed that myself.
I've really had to get clear andhonest with myself over the
last few years of just like,where am I actually being
dismissive?
Where am I not showing up?
Where am I just letting thingslie, maybe, and not being
(03:42):
vulnerable and honest and real?
And I think that can be such ahard part of dating.
It can be such a hard part oflike the relationship dynamic,
because when we're entering orwe're just like meeting somebody
, it's like being vulnerable isscary and also, if we're not
vulnerable, I think we'remissing a huge piece of the
whole dating experience.
And so, yeah, just so much hasbeen coming up.
(04:03):
And again, this conversationwas really, really beautiful.
I really loved it.
Again, divine timing on likewhen it comes out and what I'm
going through.
It's just a really beautifulreminder just to like have fun
right.
Like I get to do this, I get toheal myself, I get to date, I
get to experience different menand different experiences and
different opportunities and Iget to like do this with honesty
(04:24):
and integrity and all thethings.
And again, it's always going tobe a mirror of our deep work,
of what is, of what is going onin us and how, you know, we can
show up for ourselves and healthat wounded part of ourselves.
So check out the book that theyjust released.
I'll have the link down below.
Follow Krista on Instagram ifyou're not already at itskrista,
(04:45):
and then head over and check meout.
Follow me at rochellechristiane.
That's r-o-c-h-e-l-l-e, dotc-h-r-i-s-t-i-a-n-e.
I also am in the process ofputting out Holistic Human
Design Academy.
It's available for the wholecourse, but I am actually
putting out Human Design 101 asa solo program that you can
(05:08):
purchase for self-study.
So you can head over to mywebsite, rochellechristiancom,
go to offers and just click onthat Human Design and Astrology
101.
And that's going to beeverything you need to know to
set the foundations of humandesign and astrology.
If that's where you're at inyour experience.
I thank you so much for beinghere, as always, and I will talk
to you soon.
Well, welcome to the podcast.
(05:31):
Today I have Krista Williamsand I'm so excited to have you
solo on the podcast.
I had you and Lindsay on in2021, I think Actually, it's
kind of interesting this littlejournal I got when I first
started like really gettingserious about the podcast, and
my very first entry was myinterview.
You can't see it, it's blurredout, but almost 30 interview was
the first one I had in here andI'm closing out, you're the
(05:55):
last one, so it's kind ofperfect.
What were the questions?
Oh my gosh, I was so nervoustoo.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
It was like, you're probably like how did you start?
Speaker 1 (06:03):
a podcast I have.
What are your daily routines?
What keeps you grounded?
What's your most memorableinterview?
What's your relationship withyour emotions?
I try to be creative.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Those were good, great questions.
Those would be normal today.
You know it's so funny to eventhink about for me cause I'm
like what would me in 2021 say?
You know it's podcasting andbeing someone that's been
recorded over the years since2016,.
You know, for 10 years I'vebeen recorded.
I have this like log of historyof information about me.
It's kind of scary if you thinkabout it.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
To go back and like look at all of it, I can imagine
, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
I'm like, what did I say then?
And you know what I think thescariest and weirdest part is is
that so I was in a long-termrelationship for 10 years before
the podcast and then throughthe podcast and I got, we broke
up like two years ago and youknow it, just when it's right,
it's right and I just I feltlike I knew and I did know at
(07:09):
the time.
You know, I'm not like negatingmy truth and my journey of it,
because he was very much asoulmate of mine, but it was
like just funny that I was likegiven like relationship advice
and like little did I know thatlike I was not in the place to
be giving relationship advice.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
But I think we're speaking from our own experience
, right, and that's also reallyimportant too.
So I think that's it's abeautiful thing to like also to
have that documented, to like goback and be like, oh wow, look
what I was going through backthen.
I don't know, I think it's oneof the cool things I mean, you
know with my kids, like maybethey'll listen to it one day,
and it's just yeah, mom's crazydude, yeah yeah, so I was going
(07:42):
to have start and have youintroduce yourself, but you just
like mentioned relationships,and so one of the questions that
I had for you today was likewhat has it been like to be
single and like dating in thisera of your life?
In like thirties?
I've been single for like seven, going on eight years, so like
it's such an interesting, I feellike an age to be dating too
and just what's going oncollectively everything.
(08:03):
So I'd be just curious to seelike what you've learned or what
you feel like lessons arecoming at you.
This is the only thing I wantto talk about.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
So I'm so great.
Everyone else will be like oh,tell me about you know how do I
meet my soul?
And I'm like let's talk aboutdating, just because it's so new
and fresh for me.
So I um.
So first of all, my name'sKrista.
I'm a co-host of Almost 30.
I'm a teacher, healer, coach.
I live in Los Angeles and I wasmarried.
So I was together with my ex for10 years.
(08:33):
Before that I was in a yearrelationship.
Before that I was in afive-year relationship.
I've been in relationshipssince I was 15.
So it was kind of my drug, itwas kind of my natural way of
being was to be in partnershipand to always be constantly
clocking who I was againstsomeone and against my partner.
So it deeply impacted theperson that I am today.
(08:54):
And to go from that deeprelationship of 10 years to
being single was quite thetransition, you know, and I will
say that it was a beautifultransition.
I did a lot of the healing inthe relationship.
So when we broke up I actuallyfelt free and I felt really,
really good.
I took a year off completelyfrom dating and from meeting
(09:14):
anyone else just to heal andrecalibrate.
Only are you in therelationship but you're in their
energy field.
So you're constantly clockingyour energy to their energy and
your field to their field.
What you believe to their like,your psychic thoughts are in
their thoughts.
It's just deep, deep connection.
(09:36):
So I had to come back home tomyself in that year and really
discover who I was, what I liked, what I didn't like, what I
felt about something.
I had to refine my voice, I hadto reclaim my body, all of that
kind of stuff.
So that was the first year.
And then after that, I knew Iwanted to start dating when I
went to Europe, because I wasjust like, let's do this.
And so I had my retreat.
(09:57):
I have retreats every year.
I go to Europe.
In the fall for my retreats, Ihave one in Switzerland this
year and then one in Ibiza and Iwas like, okay, I'm going to
get on the apps when I go toEurope.
So I started dating on the apps.
When I was in Europe I met somepeople you know had really
great connections and I thinkwhat I realized, and what I
realized throughout this processof dating, is I was just
(10:20):
meeting people where myfrequency was and as I've
evolved and grown, I've metbetter and better men higher
caliber of men, more availablemen, more kind men, more loving
men and it has been such alearning process.
For me, relationship is thedeepest portal for
transformation for me.
I love to be in relationship,but I would say dating has shown
(10:43):
me all of the places that Istill need healing me, all of
the places that I still needhealing, all of the places where
I still need to love myself,all of the places where I
negotiate my authenticity forattachment.
It shows me where I lose myvoice for approval.
It shows me where I coulddeepen my relationship with
(11:04):
myself and my truth and it'sbeen really, really powerful on
that side of the healing part ofall the places where I'm like
I'm not there yet.
And then it's also reallyshowed me all these beautiful
aspects of me and my femininity.
I was in my relationship for along time and I would say in
that relationship I was more inmy masculine.
I would say in my businessearly on I was more in my
(11:27):
masculine and now dating, it'sbeen so beautiful to be in my
feminine, to have cultivated myfeminine on my own and then be
in my feminine with men now, andI never thought I'd have that
chance in life and I neverthought that would be a part of
my experience because I thoughtI'd be with my partner forever.
So now to have this reallybeautiful opportunity to feel
(11:48):
what it feels like to be in mylover archetype or in my queen
archetype or in these differentlike versions of me that are
just so fun and can get turnedon and experienced when I'm in
dating.
And so it's the range of it,it's the full gamut of it, it's
the pain, it's the beauty of it,it's the full gamut of it, it's
the pain, it's the beauty, it'sthe process.
But I would say, overall, I'mhaving so much fun because I
(12:09):
determined and decided and thisis the last thing before I
started dating that I was goingto have fun.
I was like, no matter what, I'mgoing to make every situation
positive.
And that sounds like I'mbypassing.
I'm not.
I'm meeting every moment of thework, but I just committed.
I was like, even if I'm gettingghosted, it's going to be funny
to me and I'm going to laugh andI'm going to be like oh, he
(12:31):
liked me too much, so he ghostedme Like whatever, and just like
, I just make it playful and Imake it interesting and I trust,
I think that I deeply in everycell of my body, know that I'm
going to be with the man of mydreams and the man that is meant
to be the father of my children, and that I know that's a faded
on my path.
So this process I can enjoybecause I know that's coming so
(12:54):
much.
And I wish for every woman toenjoy the process, to have
lightness with the process, tosee themselves as the prize to
be able to be in their feminine,to experience the beauty of
what it is to be a woman and todeeply trust that what they have
coming for them won't miss them.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
I love that and I mean just as like a listener for
years, like seeing I feel likeyou are very conscious right Of
like your emotional experience,like entering into these
situations.
I know for me for a long time itwas like I took it so seriously
, right, and like I think thatit's like you said, it's always
a mirror and you know that kindof evolution of where you start
(13:30):
and like the men that you meet,that being a reflection of you
and where you've come.
And I I've noticed from myjourney every man that I meet,
current, like now is just, itjust gets keeps getting elevated
.
The level of respect.
The last date I went on I likecalled my friend, I was like I
didn't know that men could be sokind and respectful and like
appreciative and caring likewhoa.
(13:51):
But then, right, that's thatreflection and it's it gets to
be fun, but like I like that youacknowledge that sometimes
there's a lot of pain in it tooit is hard to face those like
sides of ourselves that likehold trauma or insecurities, and
it's just like it can be reallychallenging.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Yeah, and I love that you said that about that man,
because you know there's a lotof narrative and conversation
around men today.
That's really negative and youknow, I do believe that men are
struggling and men are in needof more love and more work and
more time and more care and moreattention.
But I also believe that thereare really good men out there
(14:32):
that are amazing and deep andspiritual and loving, and I just
don't see us as I see us, asdifferent.
I definitely believe that menand women are very different,
but I also see us as very, verythe same.
We all want to be loved, we allwant to be seen.
We all want to be seen.
We all want to be respected, weall want to be adored.
We all want to be these verybasic things, and I think there
are so many amazing men in theworld that I've met in the
process.
(14:52):
A lot of them are none of themare my man.
But it's like when we can havethat frame like you're talking
about, where you meet this manand you call your friend and
you're like he is such anamazing, kind man, like wow, you
know that's the, and thenmetabolizing it like this is
normal, this is so normal for meto be respected and loved and
adored by men.
Then you can just continue tohave even better experiences
(15:14):
until you get to the experiencewhere you're with the person
that eventually you know is yourpartner for however long, but
is the person that you feel likeis your soul home.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Yeah, yeah.
And it's like that lesson of um, like obviously not attachment
Cause, like I did have a momentafter that day where I had like
self-sabotage myself a littlebit, where I just got my ego was
like I don't, like I want to bedone, I've been sitting for so
long, right, and then I, likeyou were like is he the one, or
what was your?
thing, Well, yeah, cause it waslike every single thing that he
(15:46):
like showed up, as waseverything I've written down
that I want in a partner.
So, of course, then everythingin me was like got all excited.
But what I learned from thatand I'm still talking to this
person, but I've, I've relaxed alittle bit, but it was what
I've learned is, like I justthat reflection of like it, like
it's possible, like the thingsthat you're wanting, whether
(16:07):
it's the one or not, it's justlike, like you said, it's
elevated, that perspective, thatmindset of like oh, it's, it is
possible, it is out there, yeah, and that's what you know and
that's I've, I've, I've had todo that, I've had to check
myself so much because the heart, you know, will open and find
someone that we are interestedin and we're excited about.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
And then the mind is like okay, now, now, if they do
this, that means they like me,if they don't do this, that
means they don't like me.
And now we have to do this.
And now it's like, and it'slike whoa, and I think it's
beautiful.
Dating when you're older, I've,I love it.
I love dating as myself.
I love dating with boundaries.
I love dating with standards.
I love dating with pleasure inmind.
(16:45):
I love dating with my, you know, feminine, whatever.
But you also have so much moreguard and you have so much more
protection and so, as much asyou have your highest self
present and choosing, you alsohave so much protection and it
just you have to meet your fearway more, because you're way
more scared, because you've beenhurt more in your life.
(17:06):
So it's powerful that you'renoticing that and you know that
you're kind of clocking it,because also, if this is your
person and in 10 years you'regoing to be like damn, I wish I
would have just had fun and,like you know, I keep with every
man.
I'm like, oh, if this is my man.
(17:27):
I want to literally just savorevery single step of our falling
in love and our story and ourjourney.
And I don't want to rush it andI want to be here as long as we
can Because I think you knowwhen you're scared, you want to
like lock it in, you want to getmarried, you want to find the
answer, you want to find outwhere you're going, you want to
like figure it all out, but it'slike actually the dance is like
the most fun.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Yeah, that's been a huge lesson, is exactly what you
said.
Like just like, because I thinkmy go-to is always like I need
it now, it needs to happen now.
I've been waiting, like youknow, but it's.
It has been this slow likenothing.
That's going to happen rightnow, in this moment, out of this
, energy is going to besustainable 100%.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
And what's the energy you're bringing in is fear.
Oh, yeah, for sure, if you wantlove, you can't bring fear in.
And I'm not saying that I'mperfect, you know what I mean,
but I just have continued tolean and that's also the
over-functioning.
Is that wounded feminine.
The over-functioning is thewounded feminine, and I no
longer am available to be in thewounded feminine with any man,
(18:27):
because the wounded feminine islike okay, whoa, I like him.
Okay, when is our next date?
Okay, what are we going here?
Okay, can you make a plan?
Okay, so we're going to do this.
Okay, I don't like, when youtalk, do this, I don't let let
it all breathe.
Like, let him breathe, let himstep in.
Like, let him lead, let him bepresent, let him be a
(18:49):
participant, trust his instincts, trust his timing, trust his
guidance.
You know, I I think we justkind of are over-functioning and
fear just really shuts down andI'm not saying this about you
at all, I'm just saying ingeneral really shuts down the
masculine and we want amasculine man that's going to be
present and clear and all thesethings.
But then when they kind of tryto show up, we're like no, you
have to do it faster, yeah, I'mexcited for you.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Thanks, me too.
Yeah, I think that that thatdynamic um with the masculine
and feminine, is veryinteresting, right, cause I
think we're a society more sonow of like women who are more
in the masculine.
I mean, that's always been and Ithink it's always not always
not for everybody, but for mostpeople I think that's always
been what's valued growing up,because I know I was always like
(19:35):
that too, but like even thelittle things of allowing
somebody to like open the doorfor me, that was so hard at
first.
Right, because I'm just like, Ican do Like, why are you doing
it Right?
But then you learn to like, andso it is this beautiful shift
of like letting him do thingsright and like allowing him to
take over, cause, like you said,the masculine like wants to be
(19:56):
in that space.
It's like that provider energy,and I think back to like your
point earlier there are so manymen out there that are truly
amazing, but again, that woundedversion of like the feminine
and masculine don't allow it tobe seen and appreciated, right,
and I think that's what's sobeautiful.
It's like you can see that andappreciate it.
It's just like completelychanges the dynamic.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Yeah, I think women are so powerful, we're so
capable, we're so strong, we cando it all.
We can, you know, watch thekids and be attuned to the
husband and be working our jobsand be a friend and be a good
sister and be a good aunt Likewe just can do everything.
And men are incredible.
It's nothing about men, but Ithink our capacity has really
(20:41):
just kind of suffocated men andreally not allowed them to step
into where they can lead in ourlife and where they can support.
And so the more that we cansoften into being helped and the
more that we can receive,because so many women are burnt
out and desperate for help,desperate for support, desperate
for, you know, a partner.
And I do believe men need tostep up, for sure, one hundred
(21:05):
percent, I'm not saying that,but I do believe we as women can
really take responsibility andallowing and creating a space
and environment where the mancan lead and step in and be
respected and adored and lovedfor all the care that they can
provide.
And if we want to create a safecontainer for the masculine to
step up, we have to first createa safe container for ourselves
(21:26):
to be in our feminine and boththe masculine to step up, we
have to first create a safecontainer for ourselves to be in
our feminine, and both themasculine frame and the feminine
frame and its healthiestversions only exist with safety.
The reason why women are more intheir masculine is because we
are not safe.
We are not in relationshipswith men that make us feel safe,
we are not in systems that makeus feel safe, we are not safe
in the environments that we'rein.
(21:46):
And a lot of men are not intheir masculine.
They're more in their femininebecause they don't feel safe.
So they're trying to receivelove, being in like a wounded
kind of feminine state.
So by creating safety withinourselves, within our system,
within our, you know, internallandscape, is the way that we
can create that more balanced,harmonious relationship between
(22:06):
our masculine and feminine andthe more we can cultivate that
in our partners as well.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Yeah, yeah, that's so important.
When you so you said that youhad done like a lot of the work,
like within your relationship,as far as like this kind of
masculine feminine dynamics orlike the safety work, or was
that something that you had toreframe a little bit, when you
took a little bit of time off,like after, before you started
dating?
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yeah.
So I did a lot of the work in.
We did some workshops together,him and I, on some masculine
feminine relationship dynamicsand stuff by people like John
Wineland, which were really good.
I've read a lot of JohnWineland's work, david Data's
work, alison Armstrong's workreally really powerful, really
love that work, david Data'swork, alison Armstrong's work
really really powerful, reallylove that.
And then I actually did a lotof my own work after.
(22:53):
So an example of that was I wentto this week-long retreat with
this feminine embodiment teacher.
She's like a pleasure andintimacy coach and I paid for
her to work with me one-on-onefor a week and in this week we
worked on pleasure and intimacy.
I worked on my feminine, Iworked on my masculine, and so
we both sort of played in thedynamics of what it feels like
for me to be fully surrenderedto my feminine and then fully
(23:13):
surrendered to my masculine andlike how that interplays with
each other.
So it was really this likeweek-long immersion where I was
able to really embody theenergies and understand the
energies from an embodimentperspective versus just the mind
, because I think a lot ofpeople can understand what I'm
talking about from a mindperspective and can kind of like
(23:35):
you know, speak to it in thatway, but now in my body I'm able
to like drop into my masculinefully and I'm able to drop into
my feminine fully and,especially with men, I'm able to
be in this really beautifulplace of like a surrendered
feminine that can cultivate andcall forward a man's masculine
without him even knowing.
And so there's a lot of likesomatic work there.
(23:57):
It's a lot of Tantra, it's alot of Tao, it's a lot of um, um
, it's like Eastern typetradition stuff that I did at
this immersion.
And for anyone that wants tokind of deepen and cultivate
this work, I think AlisonArmstrong, John Wineland, david
Data is really powerful to readand then even just like
practicing, being in your ownenergy and meditation,
(24:19):
cultivating and just callingforth your feminine, feeling
what that energy feels like,feeling how it wants to move,
and then kind of switching tothe masculine, seeing what that
feels like, seeing how it wantsto move, and then kind of
switching to the masculine,seeing what that feels like,
seeing how it wants to move, andjust trusting yourself and
playing with it.
It can be a dance, it can be anexploration.
It doesn't have to be right, itdoesn't have to be wrong
because, importantly, lastly, Ithink for all of us, my balance,
(24:39):
my perfect balance betweenfeminine and masculine, looks
different than yours.
You may have more feminine andI may have more masculine.
I may have more masculine, youmay have more feminine, whatever
you know.
So it's like we all are kind oflike a different range and
gauge and I think if we'recomparing ourselves to someone
else all the time, we might notbe following the right path.
So it's really good for us totune into ourselves and see what
(25:03):
feels good for us, naturally,what feels good for us in
relationship.
How can we play with, sort of,the energies in our lives?
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Yeah, I love that.
I think that, for sure, thesomatic work is so important
because there is such adisconnect oftentimes from our
logical, like thinking mind andthen our body, and that was
something I was thinking abouteven like yesterday and today.
It's like sometimes the mindcan be like so logical and so
reasonable and everything canmake sense.
And then I have had thatthought where I'm like man, my
(25:31):
body is so abandoning me rightnow, but it's just hold it.
It's like bringing up my traumaor my fears and my nerves in my
mind.
I'm like why am I nervous orwhy am I feeling like this?
Right, and so I think, likeacknowledging that and coming in
, and I love the, the um, thebooks and the references you
gave too, because it's sohelpful to.
I mean, just a book is such abeautiful expander as far as,
(25:52):
like an individual, you knowwhether you can go to a retreat
or not.
I think just having that inyour hand and coming into that
space is so powerful.
But yeah, I think that I lovethat you mentioned that, because
that's, I think, such animportant piece of the work,
because, like now, even when Ifeel that way, I just have to
like speak out loud and be likeI acknowledge that my body is
nervous right now and I'm notgoing to let it, or I try not to
(26:13):
say negatives, because Inoticed, yeah, yeah, yeah, and
you're like, and I'm going topunish it.
Oh my gosh, last week, when Iwent on that date afterwards,
I'm like I literally kepttelling myself I'm like I'm not
going to bring my trauma in here, I'm not going to put it on
this man, and then like, ofcourse, that's what I did, cause
my mind didn't hear like thenegatives.
That was a huge wake up call.
I was like, okay, really beintentional, more intentional
about how I say things.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Okay, so did you so?
Meaning you over?
You felt like you overshared,or what what's?
Speaker 1 (26:36):
going to be pulled out from under me and my body
gets really frantic and my mindstarts spinning and so I've done
a lot of work about coming intomy body.
But I felt that coming andthings were going really well
and I wanted to have aconversation too early.
That wasn't appropriate, butactually the emotional
(26:58):
experience wasn't appropriate tothe situation and I kept
telling myself just let it go,don't say anything, don't say
anything.
Of course it just gotoverwhelming.
I said something and it justcompletely it did what I knew it
was going to do.
And I think that was probablyme self-sabotaging and like I'm
not that part of me that wasafraid of something being good.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
I think those little parts that you know.
So you know, oftentimes it'slike could be a little part of
us.
That's like going to see youknow.
Oftentimes it's like could be alittle part of us.
That's like going to see youknow it's almost like protecting
you.
It's like, hey, this happenedto me.
Like are you cause someonethat's you know unsafe is going
to run or it can't handle, it isgoing to go?
(27:38):
So in a way it's sort ofhelpful Cause.
It's kind of like hey, this iswhat I've been through.
Can you hang or not?
It's obviously not.
It doesn't feel like it's idealfor you.
And what you're saying and whatI'm reading and I think too,
what can also happen is is thatwe're kind of looking for the
love and validation and carethat you could give that part of
(27:58):
like.
You know this will never happenagain because I know when to
leave.
Like I want you to know partthat like we will leave.
I know the signs.
Now I am different.
I am the one that will take usout and I'm the one that will
leave.
And once she's safe and secure,she's not looking for someone
else to like make sure that youguys are safe, because she knows
she's with you.
(28:19):
She's like no, I know and trusther as my inner mother that we
will leave if something happensand I don't even need to get
validation from anyone else.
But otherwise it's like are yougoing to hurt me?
Are you going to hurt me?
And it makes so much sense thatyou would do that.
It's, it's so normal and Ithink it's actually, in a lot of
ways for the right person, areally beautiful opportunity to
be with you and to to know youmore deeply.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
Yeah, yeah for sure, and we kind of moved through
that and again, I don't knowwhat it's going to end up being
or it's like still super early,but I think part of me needed to
have that experience right, tobe like this is a part of me and
it might show up again, butlike the fact that we could talk
it out and have a conversationaround it is telling so yeah, I
mean that's, and I think too.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
I think this is maybe just my experience in the world
that I'm in, because I'm in somuch depth that everything feels
normal to me.
Like you know, if I hear aboutsomething, I'm like it's not
like I'm normalizing or I'mcutting down what anyone says,
but I'm like people have.
If you're being present andattuned to your life, you're
aware of really traumatic thingsyou've been through, and if
you're not, then you're notaware of things.
(29:32):
You know what I mean.
I'm like I actually want to bewith someone that's attuned and
aware to things that they'vebeen through and is able to be
conscious about abuse or orneglect or all these things.
Because otherwise, if you'recomplete, if you're like no life
has been good and perfect mywhole life, I'm like that scares
me.
You know, I'm like that's scaryto me.
I love my life.
It's stunning and beautiful andI live better than I could have
(29:52):
ever imagined, and I alsorecognize I've been through
things in my life too.
So it's not like you have tohate your life, but I just think
that people that have done themost work are aware of things
that they've been through, and Ithink if we're people are
truthful, I don't think anyonein life would say that their
life has been perfect.
Speaker 1 (30:11):
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
I think we all have pain orthings that we don't like about
ourselves or don't want to faceand, like you said, if you're
not acknowledging that or seeingthat, it's a little bit harder
to maybe show up, or I guess itjust wouldn't be a person maybe
that you would attract.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
Yes, totally A hundred percent.
And so how did he respond?
Speaker 1 (30:28):
So in the moment, um cause this all happened like via
text and it like shouldn't havehappened via text.
I was just like in a weirdthing.
Um.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
So at first it was kind of like I would say that's
a good indicator and I don'tknow if this to be true, and I'm
not judging I'd say that's agreat point because that could
be a potential self-sabotage ifit's done kind of in text or
something.
Because if we, if we want trueintimacy, we're going to be in
person.
Yeah, you know, we're going tobe like attuning to them,
because then we're aware of howthey're receiving it, how it's
(30:58):
being processed, we're with them, we're there for the healing
and it could.
You know, I think that's agreat call and obviously you
didn't do anything wrong at all.
But I'm just saying I'm likethat's a great call out that you
have.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's why I think I was kind of
like after the situation, likeit was definitely aware, but
yeah, I think in the moment itwas like I don't want to say
off-putting, but like he justneeded to take.
But after the fact is, you know, like I said, we've talked
about it, we're going to seeeach other, like next week, so I
(31:29):
don't know what did he say.
So he said, basically reflectedthat you know, it had been just
like one date that we had goneon and it was a conversation
that maybe was a little bit toopremature to be having,
considering and the fact that itshould be in person, like he
kept saying he wanted to have itin person versus like via text,
which is, you know, accurate,it's true, um, totally fine.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
Yeah, I would always.
And you know, and I know we'renot, we can not talk about.
I'm just like such a curiousperson.
I'm always like I would, youknow, and the way that I always
just like to move things is justwith self-responsibility,
accountability and lightness.
It's like, you know, like thankyou so much for just handling
that in the best way that youdid.
Like I recognize that there wasa part of me that felt really
close to you and felt safe toyou and I really loved our first
date and I think a part of mewas just kind of feeling
(32:19):
vulnerable and feeling like Iwanted to share something and
just so, you know you're exactlyright, we should have done that
in person.
And next time I'll know, andyou know that's pretty much the
depths of it and I'm justappreciate how you were and just
kind of clocking andrecognizing and taking
accountability and just bringingforward something in like a
neutral way because you know youshouldn't feel shamed about
what you did.
He handled it beautifully.
(32:40):
You have a second date.
Don't like shame spiral in it,because that's part of the
pattern too is to do to say thething and then shame spiral to
have.
You know what I mean so justforgiving yourself and having
lightness to it, and you know,inviting them in in a way is so
nice.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Yeah, I definitely was like angry at myself that
that day.
I was like why'd I do that?
I you know I sabotaged and allthat kind of stuff.
But yeah, it's you know movingpast it no it's exactly totally
fine.
Yeah, um, how?
How much do you feel like?
This is something I think aboutlike how much do you feel like
your friendships, whether maleor female, have helped you show
(33:21):
up, I mean in any area of yourlife?
But since we're talking aboutdating specifically like dating,
you know, showing up in datingas like that confident sort of
like energy that you canapproach it in the way that you
do you know it's interestingwith the male friends things is,
I cause I was in relationshipfor so long and we started
dating like a little aftercollege.
Speaker 2 (33:40):
I didn't really.
I kind of lost my male friends.
Um, I'm from the Midwest too,so and this could be just how I
experienced the Midwest, but youdidn't really have.
If you got married and had afamily, you didn't really stay
in relationship or friendshipwith women that weren't married
or friends with your wife orwhatever.
So I kind of lost all my malefriends, or the male friends
(34:00):
that I had, and I was friendswith my husband's friends.
They were great, but it wasn'tlike a deep, intimate
relationship.
And so when I became singleagain, I actually didn't have
many guy friends.
I had a few gay guy friends,but I didn't have any
heterosexual male friends.
And I actually started to openup my aperture to have male guy
friends in the past couplemonths I would say the past five
(34:24):
months and it's actually beeninstrumental to me in my dating
process and in my process ofbeing with men, because what I
was doing before was I wasmeeting every man and I was like
, hello, are you my husband, areyou my like, are we going to
date and I would just kind oflike meet them with agenda and
goal.
And this was happeningsubconsciously.
It wasn't like I would meetthem and be like hi, are you my
(34:46):
husband?
I would just kind of be lookingat them if they were worth my
time to invest in or not.
And now that I've, you know, Ihave these amazing male friends
in my life.
It's helped me to becomfortable around men all the
time.
It's helped me to feel likemyself around men all the time.
It's helped me to develop trustwith men.
It's helped me to see softersides of men.
It's helped me to be inmasculine energy and not have it
(35:09):
be sexual, and it's helped meto just be and see men in a
completely different way.
So I'm so deeply grateful forthe male friends in my life, for
helping me to be better indating, because I think before
too, I would get nervous.
Like a hot guy would come up tome and I'd be like and now,
like any man at any level ofhotness or wealth or success
could come up and I'm like, hey,how are you?
(35:30):
Because I've metabolized theenergy of the masculine around
me and I I don't feelintimidated by anybody.
So masculine friends and men,friends have helped me so deeply
.
And then I think my friends havetaught me, um, how to be loved
and how to be, how to trust.
You know, like Lindsay is anexample, my podcast co-host and
(35:50):
best friend Like she's been myNorth star for how I want to be
in my relationship.
Like she was here staying at myhouse like two weeks ago, and
she was at the house and I justwas thinking to myself I'm like
I would, can't wait for myhusband to be around me and have
it feel like this becausearound her I feel so mentally
free, I feel so expressed, Ifeel so just myself and it's
(36:18):
created like obviously there'sgoing to be romantic interest
and you know it's different witha man, but I just am like, wow,
I just I want to feel thismyself and free like I do with
my partner.
So I think we can use ourfemale relationships to help us
feel how we want to feel, inthat freedom and that safety and
that spaciousness and that seenness.
And then I think our malerelationships can help us really
(36:39):
metabolize masculine energy sothat we can feel more
comfortable and safer on themasculine, especially if we've
been in situations where wehaven't felt safe or we haven't
felt seen by men.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
I love that.
Yeah, my male friendships havebeen like some of the most
healing, like non-sexualrelationships I've ever had, and
it's so beautiful to experiencethat.
I love that.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
Yeah, I think I've had to metabolize.
I will say that sometimes Ithink someone wants more.
So I think you have to kind ofbe with those boundaries or
those conversations, and I dothink that's true.
But if you can be in truth andhonesty about things and kind of
still move the energy, and evenit's helped me to be like, oh,
there's a charge here and wedon't need to do anything about
(37:24):
it, it's okay.
And I think growing up, if Imet a man and had a charge here
and we don't need to do anythingabout it, like it's okay, you
know.
And I think growing up, if Imet a man and had a charge with
him, I'm like, oh, we need todate, like you know what I mean.
And now I'm like, oh no, youcan have chemistry with someone
and they could, they don't haveto be your husband.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
Yeah, yeah, um, I I always think about like, just
like the energy of desire whenit comes to things like this,
right, cause it's like a hugelesson of like not having to do
something with every singledesire that comes through your
body, Right, and just likesometimes just letting it live
in there, um, but I mean, Ithink definitely, communication
is huge in all aspects, right.
Whatever relationship you enterinto, I think that's going to be
(37:59):
a huge key piece of it.
Um, and I know you're connectedwith Lacey Phillips and you've
had her on the podcast andeverything like that, but I love
her concept of expanders andeven what you said about Lindsay
just being like feeling thatsort of like safety and like
seen this and like just being inyour system around her can be
an expander for you.
Romantic relationships, too,because it's the same energy,
right, wherever we're in, and Ilove that, and every time, I
(38:21):
like witness something that isexpanding and it like clicks,
like that, it's just, it's sobeautiful to be able to like
pull that into your body, likenow.
Right, and even femalefriendships can be healing for
romantic relationships.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
Yeah, it's huge and you know to speak to desire and
kind of that initial part of ittoo.
You know I've been working alot with desire because I think
we as a society and culture arepeople that love to be in a
state of desire, satisfaction,desire, satisfaction, desire,
satisfaction.
(38:55):
And that happens with socialmedia, that happens with food,
that happens with sex.
Like you get turned on, youwant to come right away.
You get hungry, you want to eat.
You you know, think about yourphone, you want to be on it.
It's like we just are so quickto move through desire and that
desire feeling is like such analive feeling, it's such a pull
(39:16):
you forward feeling and I'vetried to be holding the frame of
desire way longer and sculptingmyself to hold more desire and
to hold more tension and to notwant to just have it end right
away, because then the cyclebegins and then you're
technically like an addict todopamine and so I really am like
being in desire longer and evenin.
(39:39):
You know I'm dating someoneright now and we're long
distance and so there's like abuilt desire of the distance and
it's like how can I be presentand attuned to my life and enjoy
the fact that there's somethingthat I desire and there's
something that I'm interested inand there's something that I'm
excited about and not want it tobe like I miss you, I want to
go to you.
Know it's like no, like Oohcool.
(39:59):
Like I love that I'm wantingsomeone, I love that I'm
desiring someone, like this isbeautiful, Like I'm in this
state of aliveness because of itand I don't want it to be
satisfied in this moment, inevery single moment, and I think
the more we can expand ourcapacity for desire and like
excitement and vitality, themore beauty we have and the more
exciting life becomes, becauseonce we have the satisfaction,
(40:21):
then we're just kind of back onthe rat race again.
So I live in a state ofconstant desire, I think, which
makes me feel like vital andalive.
Speaker 1 (40:32):
I love that, yeah, and I think when we're
constantly giving it, like, likeyou said, that dopamine and
kind of what we were talkingabout before we got on with,
like the kids and that's what itis right it's this constant
dopamine hit and I think that'swhy there's so much, you know,
whether it's anxiety ordepression, because it's
constantly chasing something,you know, instead of, like you
said, like kind of living inthat desire, which is actually a
really beautiful thing, and youknow, like I was talking about
(40:54):
earlier, like it's been a hugepart of my lesson is like being
able to be in that and not haveto have the thing right now,
right, like it's okay toexperience that like slowness of
it, but, yeah, that's beautifullessons.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
Yeah, it's that slow burn and it's that the
experience of and I think aboutthat with dating too, because I
think a lot of us for women, youknow, we're like, okay, we meet
them, and we're like I likethem.
Okay, now, what's our next date?
Or when are we going to getmarried, or what is the next
thing.
And you know, we're kind ofjust like I, just it's like no,
like this unraveling, unfoldingthe story of it all is happening
(41:30):
right now and it's so beautifuland it's luscious and it's just
pleasurable and I just want thebest things in life to last as
long as possible and I I don'twant my fear to make things
collapse and get smaller and endthings collapse and get smaller
(41:50):
and end.
Speaker 1 (41:51):
Yeah, did you ever feel like you were in a place of
like experiencing, experiencingrelationships or dating in that
way, or is this, or you've kindof always been able to enjoy
that process.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
Um, I would say no, I mean no, I wouldn't say I think
in my process of my, you know,we waited for like eight years
till we got engaged, so I wasn'tever in a rush with that.
For some reason which you knowcould have been assigned
subconsciously, I think indating I definitely have found
(42:18):
myself not rushing to marriageor not rushing to relationship,
but definitely when I felt therewas wobbliness on their end or
unavailability, I would getanxious and want the next step
for sure.
So I now know that I was inwith someone that was
unavailable or someone that wasan avoidant If I was anxious
(42:40):
about the fact that we didn'thave a next step in place.
And you know that's been mypattern is, to date, avoidance.
I'm not anxious per se, becauseI've sort of been trained out
of my anxiousness being withavoidance for so long.
I won't show it, I won'texpress it.
I I kind of an avoidant myself,to be honest.
(43:01):
But I would internally be like,okay, why don't we have a plan?
Why aren't we doing this?
What's going on with that?
And I noticed myself in eachdating scenario when I would
lead and I would kind oftransition from being in the
receptive mode of them, planningthem leading, then determining,
(43:21):
and I would be like, oh, whatabout us going on a trip here?
Or what about me coming here?
Or what about you know?
Then it would always get wobblyand it's you know again, these
are not the right men, they'reunavailable for the most part.
But I was like, oh, I don'twant to be in a place where I'm
forcing anything, I'm rushinganything, I'm trying to make
(43:42):
something happen that isn'thappening organically and
naturally or through theirdesire first.
So I've definitely had to workon it.
For sure, I wouldn't say thatI'm like perfect, um, but I
think being older has helped mebe much better with it than I
was younger and I was moreunconscious, um to it.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Do you feel like dating maybe more dismissive men
was like a protective thing.
Speaker 2 (44:10):
I would say, yeah, so I um.
So the men that I would date, Ihaven't.
I dated men that areemotionally available and I've
dated men that are, you know.
But I think, yeah, I think themen that I dated I dated since
my relationship ended have beenavoidant because it feels safe
for me, because then I know thatwe're not going to go deep and
(44:32):
I know that we're not going tobe more intimate than this wall
that you have up, and so thatfeels safe for me because you
know, to be honest.
So, on the one part of thepositive side of it, none of
these men are my men and none ofthese men are the men I'm meant
to be with.
So there's a good part of it.
So, subconsciously I'm like,okay, cool, you have this
(44:52):
boundary, great, I can look goodbecause I can be the one that's
trying to get in and trying togo deeper.
But you're going to stop meevery time, even though I know
you're not my man.
So there's that beautiful partof it where it's like my
subconscious also knows thatthey're not my man.
Um, but yeah, it was definitelyto protect myself, definitely
to avoid my own going deep, myown being intimate, my own
availability.
(45:13):
I would say that I just now, inthe past couple months, have
made myself available for depthand intimacy and true
relationship, and for me thatmeans showing someone all of my
sides and all of my parts.
It means not just my perfect.
You know, krista, on a pedestalpart of I have all these
(45:34):
amazing qualities and I have allthese amazing things.
It's like the messiness, therawness, the imperfection, the
true me, and that's scary,because when that part's
rejected it's such a differentexperience than when, like you,
like the facade you put up isrejected.
And I think before inrelationships I had my facade up
(45:54):
for way longer, and so now I'mlike, oh no, I need you to know
the me, who I am, throughoutthis entire process, because
that's just faster and I don'treally know how to fake it much.
I don't know.
I can't fake it as long anymore.
Speaker 1 (46:13):
Yeah, it's exhausting , I feel like to to like not
show up fully, and then you knowif it does progress past a
certain point, and then you'rekind of having to go back and
then show things they're likewell, where'd that come from?
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Yeah, literally literally yeah, they're like
whoa, whoa, whoa.
You're like I didn't tell youabout this thing, like, yeah,
and I think everyone does it indating and, and you know, online
(46:43):
dating makes it um, onlinedating is its own portal and you
know it's all in its own plan.
But if you are looking at alist of physical attributes and
a list of these attributesschool, religion, all of that
and like, how do you get to knowsomeone's soul?
You know from that.
So it's now we're kind oftrained to present the things
rather than presenting who weare energetically.
And I think that's what I'velearned so much in my process is
(47:04):
, like, you know, my ex was myentire list and that list was a
list I wrote when I was 23, 24,which was great, he was an
amazing man.
And now my list is so different.
My list is so much soul texture, emotional texture, heart
texture, frequency texture,values, texture, and with online
(47:27):
dating it's like I did it for,I think, a few months.
I haven't done it.
I did it for I think like fourmonths and I haven't done it
since, because what I found wasthat my ego was looking at all
the things on someone's profilebut like I can't meet someone's
soul, you know, and when I'm outin the world.
I can meet them and right awaybe like, even though you're
(47:47):
nothing like what I thought mytype was, your soul feels good
with my soul and that's what Iwant to do, and I think I've
given myself permission to knowthat, like, the frequency is
what I'm looking for, not justthe list.
Speaker 1 (48:02):
Yeah, I've also moved away from online dating too,
because that same thing it's.
It's so hard to connect withsomebody when you're just
looking at statistics.
Like my son would be like mom.
Why is everyone you date likesix foot five or whatever.
And then when the people I meetin real life, I'm like those
things actually don't evenmatter.
I'm five, three, you could befive, five and still be taller
than me.
It really doesn't make adifference.
(48:24):
Um, and so it's.
But you're right, like I thinkhaving that connection like like
soul to soul, likeenergetically, actually in
person, like even the one that Idated, like I've known him for
like a year, which I also thinkhelped with the little like
freak out that I had, cause healready knew who I was before,
an emotional experience of me,right, but yeah, I love that, I
(48:45):
think it's.
I mean, I think both yourintention behind it and for
anyone listening to that maybe,is dating like you said, like
making a list has been.
I mean I think that's sohelpful and also like keeping it
open, because every like,whenever I've made a list, the
person I meet like matches mostof that, and then I realized, oh
well, I actually like thisneeds to be a priority too, like
the ability to commit or theability to want to be clear, the
(49:07):
ability to communicate, likethose things are important, not
just you know your whatever, andhave dating help you make your
list and help you cultivate andrefine your list and help you
show aspects of you.
Speaker 2 (49:20):
And just, I see every date as every first date, in a
selfish way, as like growth forme.
How much am I being myself?
How honest am I being?
How truthful am I being?
How in honest am I being?
How truthful am I being?
How in integrity am I being?
You know what I mean.
Like it's like how am I being?
And then, obviously, as I getto know them more, I'm more
available for um being fullypresent and attuned to that.
(49:44):
I'm being fully present andattuned, but it's like I'm more
available to let that aspect ofit go and see them.
Um, but I don't think onlinedating is necessarily bad.
Like it was a beautiful portalfor me to meet great men that I,
you know, had greatrelationships with, but I felt
like at the end I was like I'mnot your cup might go.
Speaker 1 (50:04):
just your cat the cup Did you?
I was like I saw it start tomove and like it might go off
the table.
Dude, honestly we might snap.
Speaker 2 (50:17):
I had to mute it for a bit because she was meowing.
It's all good, it's fine, butfor people that are online
dating, it's like just having anintention around it.
I think a lot of what peoplewill do is they'll be like I
hate online dating, it's theworst, you know, blah, blah,
blah, and then they'll go on it.
It's like, if you don't like it, don't do it.
And after I online dated, Itold God I am not online dating
and I'm available for you tobring men into my life in the
(50:39):
flesh, and I'm available forkarmic relationships.
I'm available to clear up karmain this lifetime.
But I'm no longer available forthe portal of online dating.
And the reason why it's workedfor me off of being online is
because I'm not messing around.
I'm not saying it out of fear,I'm saying it out of empowerment
, I'm saying it out of clarity,I'm saying it out of truth and
I'm also available forrelationships that aren't just
(51:01):
like the most perfect one everLike.
If I was to be like God, I'mnot available for online dating
and I only want my soulmate Sure, maybe that's going to happen.
But I'm also available to likehelp people.
I'm available to be expandersfor men.
I'm available to like supportmen in the process.
I'm available to see stuff thatI haven't seen Like.
It isn't just about finding theone for me, it's about learning
and it's about growth and it'sabout making myself and my work
(51:24):
better.
Speaker 1 (51:25):
Yeah, I remember listening to one episode of the
podcast, like I don't know, Idon't.
It was maybe like five yearsago and I was on a walk and I
remember hearing you talkingabout like being intentional and
something along those lines.
Right Of like setting intentionfor something.
I remember thinking to myselflike wow, like I wish I could be
that intentional about things,but like I found like I could
never like I'm air quoting itlike because it is all just part
(51:46):
of the process, I guess, but Inever took the time to set an
intention before I did something.
You know what I mean.
But even just like a few weeksago, I remember like sitting
with my journal and it'ssomething that now I can look
back and now I I can pull inthat intention a lot easier.
So, like, as you're saying that, like I've definitely done that
with like speaking things outloud and be like this is what
I'm available for.
And like right before you knowthe last like date I went on, I
(52:09):
remember I was like with myjournal and I just like was like
you know what Like source got.
I was like I am so good Likebeing single, like I've been
single for seven and a halfyears, like I'm comfortable with
myself, I've kind of done thatwork.
So like, if this is it, it'skind of like one of those worst
case scenarios, right, like if Iend up single for the rest of
my life, like what's the worstcase?
(52:30):
Like boom, like three dayslater I got this message and
again, not to say that it'sanything, but like I think just
bringing that intention in andjust like having that connection
to something bigger than thesituation, to like zoom out and
just be able to appreciate it, Ithink the surrender is huge too
, and I think people are talkingabout surrender a lot and I
(52:51):
don't think people understandsurrender, isn't I'm letting go
because I want an outcome?
Speaker 2 (52:57):
It's literally letting go because you're
unattached to the outcome, causeyou don't you, you're not
expecting to get the outcome atall.
So you being like life is good,I could be single, great, like
that's so powerful and such apowerful place to be.
And I think, even if he's yourman or not, you should want to
feel good in every moment.
(53:19):
So I'm going to feel good, evenif he's my man or not.
If he's my man, great.
If he's not my man, great.
I still feel good and I thinkthat's such a beautiful,
beautiful thing that I think Iwork on and I strive to be and I
strive to learn and do more ofI think I'm, I think there's
always room for more surrender,but I think I'm pretty, pretty
surrendered.
(53:39):
But you know there's always, wealways do grip in somewhere.
Us humans, we always findsomewhere to grip.
Speaker 1 (53:44):
Yeah, ego is always going to act up a little bit,
for sure, for sure.
Well, I love that we talkedabout dating, like before we got
on.
I was hoping that we would likekind of circle onto this.
Speaker 2 (53:54):
Oh, this is this is the only place I want to live.
Me and my friend, Sahara SaharaRose, who's one of my best
friends, Like we like, becausewe we started.
We kind of got into the datingportal together, Like I left my
marriage in November, she lefthers in December, and so we've
been on our journey like, justas like besties, and every
(54:14):
single podcast we are like wecan you know everyone's like, oh
, what about?
And we're like, let me tell youabout this date.
I went on.
All we want to do is processdating because it's fascinating,
it's fun, it's interesting,it's human nature.
Speaker 1 (54:27):
It's like so fun Is there like one experience that
was just like wild in likewhatever way you can get.
That means to you?
Speaker 2 (54:38):
Um, you know there was.
I remember when I went to on atrip or I was in, I had a
retreat and usually after myretreats I'm very hard open, I'm
very, I'm in a really beautifulfrequency because I've been
around women all week.
I've been just like in myDharma and I remember the
psychic.
A psychic before I left waslike oh, she's like the man
(54:59):
you're going to be with, he'slike a Brown man and he's like
an athlete and like doesn'tspeak English, we'll sing all
this stuff.
And I was like this is like thecraziest thing I've ever heard
in my life.
I was like what is she talkingabout?
And then I was in Paris and Iremember we went to this
restaurant and then we left therestaurant.
(55:21):
Nothing happened.
I was like I'm going to meetthis other guy that I met and
then our friends were like, hey,we just got to this restaurant,
will you come back?
And I remember I went back tothe restaurant and I was like I
have like the calling to like doa lap and all my friends like
no, like wherever I go I do alap.
I'm just like like just showingwhat's, showing everyone what
I'm working with and just seeingwhat's up.
(55:42):
So I do a lap and there's themost gorgeous, like brown skin,
tall man that I've like everseen and I was like, oh hello.
And I just was like doo-doo-doo, just walked by and sat down
and he sent a drink over and weended up hanging out that night.
Like his name was like Giovanni, he was like an athlete every
(56:03):
single thing that the psychicsaid and he ended up living like
20 minutes away from my dad inFlorida and so he was in there
for a trip like work, like dah,dah, dah, dah.
So we hung out all the next dayand had this like love affair in
Paris, and then I was flyingback to see my dad that next
(56:23):
week and he was at home, so wegot to spend more time together.
It was just this moment of thisconnection that was really
beautiful and really deep andreally just like magical.
That like I would have neverthought I would be available for
like a love affair with, likean Ecuadorian athlete that was
like named Giovanni, you know,years ago, and I was like, oh, I
(56:45):
love that this is a part of mylike life story, like I'm just
open and available for abeautiful experience with a
beautiful man that feels honestand true, that feels magical and
fun and all these things.
And it was just like I was like, oh, this is what it's like to
just like say yes to life.
Speaker 1 (57:01):
Yeah, I love that.
And predicted by a psychic,predicted by a psychic, of
course.
What do you?
Speaker 2 (57:05):
mean, of course, she's like he's an acquired,
like she said everything abouthim.
She's like he's this, he's thatand I was like what are you
talking about?
And so when I'm so, it's hardwith psychics, because then when
you meet them, you're likeyou're who the psychic told me,
you know.
Speaker 1 (57:20):
And then you're like are you my man?
And I'm like did you tell him apsychic?
Told him, told you about him.
Speaker 2 (57:24):
No, that's one thing to all the ladies listening.
Keep it to yourself.
Speaker 1 (57:30):
This is also.
I love having male like reallyclose friends, because sometimes
I'll call my male friend, I'llbe like, and I'll say a
situation, he's like Rochelle,like, don't say that to them.
I'm like, okay, thanks.
Speaker 2 (57:39):
No, literally.
I mean your man.
Nothing's going to scare yourman away.
Yeah, I don't ask forhoroscopes.
I don't ask for birthdays.
I don't tell them about psychicreadings that involve them.
I don't.
It's just like my husband Iwould.
I told him stuff at.
You know it went after yearsand years of dating.
I just think, unless your manis very spiritually attuned,
(58:01):
it's a lot of information to belike a psychic.
They don't.
The way that they understandpsychics is is interesting and I
think we put so much weight onpsychic readings.
Like I take psychic readings solightly now.
I mean, for every psychic I'vemet, I'm I'm married 50 times
over right now.
So it's like yeah some I believe, some I don't.
Speaker 1 (58:18):
you know what I mean, Whatever, yeah, it's also like
I feel like, um, I don't know ifintuitive is the word I'm
looking for, but you can takewhatever meaning you want from
it, right, like I think that itcan be applied to like so many
different situations, like I'vehad psychics tell me certain
things about men I'm going tomeet, but it's like, but it
could also apply to like threeor four of them.
So it's like which one were youtalking about?
(58:39):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (58:40):
Yeah, I mean totally.
There's one, there's onespecific person that I think
like 12 psychics have told meI'm going to be with at this
point and I'm just like it'sliterally, it's like all the
same type, the one person thatnumerous ones have told you
about.
Yes, huh, numerous many.
Yeah, I can't even tell you, Idon't even want to describe it,
(59:01):
cause it's like annoying at thispoint and I'm like, and it's
also, it's also a type that I'mnot interested in at all.
It's like, and so I'm like, hmm, free will says no to that.
Speaker 1 (59:14):
We all have it.
Speaker 2 (59:15):
I know we all have it .
Speaker 1 (59:16):
I'm like yeah, I would love to talk about the
book, obviously before we likesign off, because it is in about
a month it's coming out.
So I would love to just know,like I mean whatever you want to
tell us about it, like thewriting process, what it was
like to write it with Lindsayand not just like yourself.
And you know, obviously nowwith like touring and kind of
(59:38):
traveling and talking about itmust be such a exciting, maybe
little nerves in there.
I don't know what the processis like.
Speaker 2 (59:43):
Yeah.
So you know, when we startedthe podcast, we were on our
closet floors, we were at rockbottom and we felt so lost in
life and over the past you know,nine years of building the show
and changing our lives with thewisdom and the insight from our
guests.
We wanted to have everythingwe've learned to go from
completely lost to a life thatwe loved in a guidebook, and so
(01:00:04):
this is a guidebook for yourconscious awakening.
It's like a spiritual guidebookto adulting.
We have sections on the body,on purpose, on career, on your
soul, on friendships, on purpose, on career, on your soul, on
friendships, on romanticrelationships, on money.
Like it's like so much of thegoodness and wisdom from the
podcast mixed in with storiesfrom lindsey and I that we've
(01:00:25):
never told before, mixed in withour own teachings, and it's
powerful.
Like I'm so hard on there's noone that's harder on themselves
than me and I think it'sliterally such an amazing book.
I'm so proud of it and I'm soexcited for people to have it.
So it's called Almost 30.
It's a definitive guide to alife that you love for the next
(01:00:45):
decade and beyond, and you canget it wherever you get books
almost30.com slash book Ifpeople want to come.
You can also join camp whichwe're doing a virtual retreat in
May, may 18th, which is goingto be really incredible and,
yeah, I'm excited for people tohave it.
It's been a nerve wrackingprocess, I think, to promote it
and share it.
Writing it was a joy, but youknow, it's all a growth edge and
(01:01:05):
I'm really grateful to haveopportunities in my life where I
can grow.
Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
Yeah, I love that and even just kind of tying into
what we were talking about, youknow in the beginning, the the
slowness of doing something likethis, Right Cause I mean you
guys started writing it whatlike a couple of years ago or a
year ago, or yeah, I think likeyou're right.
Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
I think 23.
So I think I just got divorcedand Lindsay just got pregnant.
Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
Wow, wow, I know, yeah.
What do you feel?
Like your, like your sad andreturned self would say if they
read this book.
Speaker 2 (01:01:37):
It's a great question I haven't been asked.
I think my sad and returned myGod, I mean the deepest truth
that I know that I keep comingback to related to this book is
that if I would have read thiswhen I was going through deep
times of transformation andchange, my life would be
completely different.
I would feel like a completelydifferent person.
(01:01:58):
I would feel at peace and atease.
I would be able to have mymental health through the
process.
So I think she would be like,feel less alone.
I think she'd be like oh, I'mnot behind, I'm just becoming.
You know, it's a part of theprocess to be here and I feel so
seen and heard and yeah, itsounds cliche but it's so real
like I wish I would have knownthat all the change I was going
(01:02:20):
through was for purpose.
I wish I would have known thatmy world crumbling down around
me was all for good and I wish Iwould have known that my soul
knew what it was doing the wholetime.
Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
I love that.
I can't wait to read it and andI've you know, I've been fans
of you guys since, like my sonis almost nine, and I remember
being pregnant, listening tostop cast you guys.
Speaker 2 (01:02:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
It's been like one of the beginning, since the
beginning, like definitely fullcircle moment.
So I appreciate so much havingyou on here.
Speaker 2 (01:02:51):
It's been.
I mean talk about dating allday.
Speaker 1 (01:02:54):
You're going to have to now keep me updated with
what's going on now.
Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
Now I'm locked in.
Speaker 1 (01:02:59):
Yeah, when the episode comes out, I'll give you
a little update.
Everyone will need to knowyou'll have to put it in the
intro.
To be honest, I'll have to havehim on, yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
Literally I'll be like you know what she said that
thing, yeah, I loved her.
You know what she said thatthing, yeah, I loved her.
Speaker 1 (01:03:14):
We'll see.
Speaker 2 (01:03:15):
Yeah Well, thank you so much, thank you so much, bye
guys you.
Welcome to the Rochelle Christian podcast,
formerly the Emotional Masterypodcast.
I'm Rochelle, your host.
I'm here to help you come backto your body, take charge of
your emotions and live life onyour terms.
This podcast is a space for raw, real conversations about what
it means to trust yourself, leaninto your power and create a
life that feels aligned andalive.
(00:24):
We'll explore human design,astrology and other tools to
help you understand your uniqueenergy.
More importantly, though, we'regoing to talk about what it
means to actually live andembody these aspects.
So each week, I'm going toshare stories, lessons, guidance
to help you navigate life'schallenges and really own your
magic.
So if you're ready to step up,take control and show up as the
(00:46):
most authentic version of you,let's begin.
Welcome to another episode onthe podcast.
Today I have Krista Williams on,and I am obsessed with this
episode.
We recorded this about a monthago and their newest book just
came out yesterday, june 3rd, soif you have not gotten it, head
down to the show notes and grabtheir book.
But this conversation is reallycentered around dating, our
(01:08):
dating experiences, and, asalways with this podcast episode
, there's so much divine timingin editing and putting it out,
and Krista just brings so muchbeautiful wisdom perspective
around dating, around settingintentions and doing karmic work
and allowing things to be fun.
And I think that in reflection,I started their book in the
(01:30):
first you know couple chapterson the Saturn return and for me,
I have Saturn in my fifth houseand if you're familiar with
astrology, the fifth house isfun play dating and with Saturn
there it always makes it alittle bit serious.
So I've always taken datinglike very seriously and it's a
reminder to like lighten up,it's a reminder to feel
empowered.
(01:51):
It's a reminder that, like, Iget to choose, I'm not just
sitting here waiting or whatever.
I think I've been verydisempowered or I've allowed
myself to be disempowered a lotin dating in my past and so just
reminding myself that I amempowered, I get to choose, I
get to show up, I get to do thework, I get to have fun, all
those things.
So I don't really have.
(02:11):
We talk a lot about a certaindating situation that I had last
month.
In this episode I don't reallyhave an update for you Because
today I've been just super rawand emotional.
My kids are out of town and Ithink when they they're gone and
I'm just kind of hanging around, there's the loneliness creeps
in and there's just been a lotof shit coming up today.
So I'm not even going topretend to give you an update or
have anything real, because Idon't think it would be a true
(02:33):
reflection of anything that I'mactually moving through in the
moment.
Just more lessons on emotions,more lessons on moving through
things and showing up forourselves and doing the work and
you know we talk about that inthis conversation about doing
the work, while dating duringthe work in a relationship,
doing the work solo and singleand every way that we do the
work is so important.
We also talk about dating andyou're feminine and with
(02:55):
intention, dating in your 30sself sabotage, which is huge for
me personally, I always facethis male and female friendships
and how they can help beexpanders for us, experiencing
desire, which is huge.
And we talked about datingdismissive, avoidant attachment
styles and I so appreciate thisconversation because Krista
talks about how she has dated alot of dismissive, avoidant
attachment styles and I alsohave done this a lot in my past
(03:18):
which is always a mirror, right?
People that we bring into ourlives are always mirrors for us,
and so if we're constantlycalling in dismissive attachment
.
We kind of have to askourselves, like, where am I
putting out that frequency to?
And so I've noticed that myself.
I've really had to get clear andhonest with myself over the
last few years of just like,where am I actually being
dismissive?
Where am I not showing up?
Where am I just letting thingslie, maybe, and not being
(03:42):
vulnerable and honest and real?
And I think that can be such ahard part of dating.
It can be such a hard part oflike the relationship dynamic,
because when we're entering orwe're just like meeting somebody
, it's like being vulnerable isscary and also, if we're not
vulnerable, I think we'remissing a huge piece of the
whole dating experience.
And so, yeah, just so much hasbeen coming up.
(04:03):
And again, this conversationwas really, really beautiful.
I really loved it.
Again, divine timing on likewhen it comes out and what I'm
going through.
It's just a really beautifulreminder just to like have fun
right.
Like I get to do this, I get toheal myself, I get to date, I
get to experience different menand different experiences and
different opportunities and Iget to like do this with honesty
(04:24):
and integrity and all thethings.
And again, it's always going tobe a mirror of our deep work,
of what is, of what is going onin us and how, you know, we can
show up for ourselves and healthat wounded part of ourselves.
So check out the book that theyjust released.
I'll have the link down below.
Follow Krista on Instagram ifyou're not already at itskrista,
(04:45):
and then head over and check meout.
Follow me at rochellechristiane.
That's r-o-c-h-e-l-l-e, dotc-h-r-i-s-t-i-a-n-e.
I also am in the process ofputting out Holistic Human
Design Academy.
It's available for the wholecourse, but I am actually
putting out Human Design 101 asa solo program that you can
(05:08):
purchase for self-study.
So you can head over to mywebsite, rochellechristiancom,
go to offers and just click onthat Human Design and Astrology
101.
And that's going to beeverything you need to know to
set the foundations of humandesign and astrology.
If that's where you're at inyour experience.
I thank you so much for beinghere, as always, and I will talk
to you soon.
Well, welcome to the podcast.
(05:31):
Today I have Krista Williamsand I'm so excited to have you
solo on the podcast.
I had you and Lindsay on in2021, I think Actually, it's
kind of interesting this littlejournal I got when I first
started like really gettingserious about the podcast, and
my very first entry was myinterview.
You can't see it, it's blurredout, but almost 30 interview was
the first one I had in here andI'm closing out, you're the
(05:55):
last one, so it's kind ofperfect.
What were the questions?
Oh my gosh, I was so nervoustoo.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
It was like, you're probably like how did you start?
Speaker 1 (06:03):
a podcast I have.
What are your daily routines?
What keeps you grounded?
What's your most memorableinterview?
What's your relationship withyour emotions?
I try to be creative.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Those were good, great questions.
Those would be normal today.
You know it's so funny to eventhink about for me cause I'm
like what would me in 2021 say?
You know it's podcasting andbeing someone that's been
recorded over the years since2016,.
You know, for 10 years I'vebeen recorded.
I have this like log of historyof information about me.
It's kind of scary if you thinkabout it.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
To go back and like look at all of it, I can imagine
, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
I'm like, what did I say then?
And you know what I think thescariest and weirdest part is is
that so I was in a long-termrelationship for 10 years before
the podcast and then throughthe podcast and I got, we broke
up like two years ago and youknow it, just when it's right,
it's right and I just I feltlike I knew and I did know at
(07:09):
the time.
You know, I'm not like negatingmy truth and my journey of it,
because he was very much asoulmate of mine, but it was
like just funny that I was likegiven like relationship advice
and like little did I know thatlike I was not in the place to
be giving relationship advice.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
But I think we're speaking from our own experience
, right, and that's also reallyimportant too.
So I think that's it's abeautiful thing to like also to
have that documented, to like goback and be like, oh wow, look
what I was going through backthen.
I don't know, I think it's oneof the cool things I mean, you
know with my kids, like maybethey'll listen to it one day,
and it's just yeah, mom's crazydude, yeah yeah, so I was going
(07:42):
to have start and have youintroduce yourself, but you just
like mentioned relationships,and so one of the questions that
I had for you today was likewhat has it been like to be
single and like dating in thisera of your life?
In like thirties?
I've been single for like seven, going on eight years, so like
it's such an interesting, I feellike an age to be dating too
and just what's going oncollectively everything.
(08:03):
So I'd be just curious to seelike what you've learned or what
you feel like lessons arecoming at you.
This is the only thing I wantto talk about.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
So I'm so great.
Everyone else will be like oh,tell me about you know how do I
meet my soul?
And I'm like let's talk aboutdating, just because it's so new
and fresh for me.
So I um.
So first of all, my name'sKrista.
I'm a co-host of Almost 30.
I'm a teacher, healer, coach.
I live in Los Angeles and I wasmarried.
So I was together with my ex for10 years.
(08:33):
Before that I was in a yearrelationship.
Before that I was in afive-year relationship.
I've been in relationshipssince I was 15.
So it was kind of my drug, itwas kind of my natural way of
being was to be in partnershipand to always be constantly
clocking who I was againstsomeone and against my partner.
So it deeply impacted theperson that I am today.
(08:54):
And to go from that deeprelationship of 10 years to
being single was quite thetransition, you know, and I will
say that it was a beautifultransition.
I did a lot of the healing inthe relationship.
So when we broke up I actuallyfelt free and I felt really,
really good.
I took a year off completelyfrom dating and from meeting
(09:14):
anyone else just to heal andrecalibrate.
Only are you in therelationship but you're in their
energy field.
So you're constantly clockingyour energy to their energy and
your field to their field.
What you believe to their like,your psychic thoughts are in
their thoughts.
It's just deep, deep connection.
(09:36):
So I had to come back home tomyself in that year and really
discover who I was, what I liked, what I didn't like, what I
felt about something.
I had to refine my voice, I hadto reclaim my body, all of that
kind of stuff.
So that was the first year.
And then after that, I knew Iwanted to start dating when I
went to Europe, because I wasjust like, let's do this.
And so I had my retreat.
(09:57):
I have retreats every year.
I go to Europe.
In the fall for my retreats, Ihave one in Switzerland this
year and then one in Ibiza and Iwas like, okay, I'm going to
get on the apps when I go toEurope.
So I started dating on the apps.
When I was in Europe I met somepeople you know had really
great connections and I thinkwhat I realized, and what I
realized throughout this processof dating, is I was just
(10:20):
meeting people where myfrequency was and as I've
evolved and grown, I've metbetter and better men higher
caliber of men, more availablemen, more kind men, more loving
men and it has been such alearning process.
For me, relationship is thedeepest portal for
transformation for me.
I love to be in relationship,but I would say dating has shown
(10:43):
me all of the places that Istill need healing me, all of
the places that I still needhealing, all of the places where
I still need to love myself,all of the places where I
negotiate my authenticity forattachment.
It shows me where I lose myvoice for approval.
It shows me where I coulddeepen my relationship with
(11:04):
myself and my truth and it'sbeen really, really powerful on
that side of the healing part ofall the places where I'm like
I'm not there yet.
And then it's also reallyshowed me all these beautiful
aspects of me and my femininity.
I was in my relationship for along time and I would say in
that relationship I was more inmy masculine.
I would say in my businessearly on I was more in my
(11:27):
masculine and now dating, it'sbeen so beautiful to be in my
feminine, to have cultivated myfeminine on my own and then be
in my feminine with men now, andI never thought I'd have that
chance in life and I neverthought that would be a part of
my experience because I thoughtI'd be with my partner forever.
So now to have this reallybeautiful opportunity to feel
(11:48):
what it feels like to be in mylover archetype or in my queen
archetype or in these differentlike versions of me that are
just so fun and can get turnedon and experienced when I'm in
dating.
And so it's the range of it,it's the full gamut of it, it's
the pain, it's the beauty of it,it's the full gamut of it, it's
the pain, it's the beauty, it'sthe process.
But I would say, overall, I'mhaving so much fun because I
(12:09):
determined and decided and thisis the last thing before I
started dating that I was goingto have fun.
I was like, no matter what, I'mgoing to make every situation
positive.
And that sounds like I'mbypassing.
I'm not.
I'm meeting every moment of thework, but I just committed.
I was like, even if I'm gettingghosted, it's going to be funny
to me and I'm going to laugh andI'm going to be like oh, he
(12:31):
liked me too much, so he ghostedme Like whatever, and just like
, I just make it playful and Imake it interesting and I trust,
I think that I deeply in everycell of my body, know that I'm
going to be with the man of mydreams and the man that is meant
to be the father of my children, and that I know that's a faded
on my path.
So this process I can enjoybecause I know that's coming so
(12:54):
much.
And I wish for every woman toenjoy the process, to have
lightness with the process, tosee themselves as the prize to
be able to be in their feminine,to experience the beauty of
what it is to be a woman and todeeply trust that what they have
coming for them won't miss them.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
I love that and I mean just as like a listener for
years, like seeing I feel likeyou are very conscious right Of
like your emotional experience,like entering into these
situations.
I know for me for a long time itwas like I took it so seriously
, right, and like I think thatit's like you said, it's always
a mirror and you know that kindof evolution of where you start
(13:30):
and like the men that you meet,that being a reflection of you
and where you've come.
And I I've noticed from myjourney every man that I meet,
current, like now is just, itjust gets keeps getting elevated
.
The level of respect.
The last date I went on I likecalled my friend, I was like I
didn't know that men could be sokind and respectful and like
appreciative and caring likewhoa.
(13:51):
But then, right, that's thatreflection and it's it gets to
be fun, but like I like that youacknowledge that sometimes
there's a lot of pain in it tooit is hard to face those like
sides of ourselves that likehold trauma or insecurities, and
it's just like it can be reallychallenging.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Yeah, and I love that you said that about that man,
because you know there's a lotof narrative and conversation
around men today.
That's really negative and youknow, I do believe that men are
struggling and men are in needof more love and more work and
more time and more care and moreattention.
But I also believe that thereare really good men out there
(14:32):
that are amazing and deep andspiritual and loving, and I just
don't see us as I see us, asdifferent.
I definitely believe that menand women are very different,
but I also see us as very, verythe same.
We all want to be loved, we allwant to be seen.
We all want to be seen.
We all want to be respected, weall want to be adored.
We all want to be these verybasic things, and I think there
are so many amazing men in theworld that I've met in the
process.
(14:52):
A lot of them are none of themare my man.
But it's like when we can havethat frame like you're talking
about, where you meet this manand you call your friend and
you're like he is such anamazing, kind man, like wow, you
know that's the, and thenmetabolizing it like this is
normal, this is so normal for meto be respected and loved and
adored by men.
Then you can just continue tohave even better experiences
(15:14):
until you get to the experiencewhere you're with the person
that eventually you know is yourpartner for however long, but
is the person that you feel likeis your soul home.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Yeah, yeah.
And it's like that lesson of um, like obviously not attachment
Cause, like I did have a momentafter that day where I had like
self-sabotage myself a littlebit, where I just got my ego was
like I don't, like I want to bedone, I've been sitting for so
long, right, and then I, likeyou were like is he the one, or
what was your?
thing, Well, yeah, cause it waslike every single thing that he
(15:46):
like showed up, as waseverything I've written down
that I want in a partner.
So, of course, then everythingin me was like got all excited.
But what I learned from thatand I'm still talking to this
person, but I've, I've relaxed alittle bit, but it was what
I've learned is, like I justthat reflection of like it, like
it's possible, like the thingsthat you're wanting, whether
(16:07):
it's the one or not, it's justlike, like you said, it's
elevated, that perspective, thatmindset of like oh, it's, it is
possible, it is out there, yeah, and that's what you know and
that's I've, I've, I've had todo that, I've had to check
myself so much because the heart, you know, will open and find
someone that we are interestedin and we're excited about.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
And then the mind is like okay, now, now, if they do
this, that means they like me,if they don't do this, that
means they don't like me.
And now we have to do this.
And now it's like, and it'slike whoa, and I think it's
beautiful.
Dating when you're older, I've,I love it.
I love dating as myself.
I love dating with boundaries.
I love dating with standards.
I love dating with pleasure inmind.
(16:45):
I love dating with my, you know, feminine, whatever.
But you also have so much moreguard and you have so much more
protection and so, as much asyou have your highest self
present and choosing, you alsohave so much protection and it
just you have to meet your fearway more, because you're way
more scared, because you've beenhurt more in your life.
(17:06):
So it's powerful that you'renoticing that and you know that
you're kind of clocking it,because also, if this is your
person and in 10 years you'regoing to be like damn, I wish I
would have just had fun and,like you know, I keep with every
man.
I'm like, oh, if this is my man.
(17:27):
I want to literally just savorevery single step of our falling
in love and our story and ourjourney.
And I don't want to rush it andI want to be here as long as we
can Because I think you knowwhen you're scared, you want to
like lock it in, you want to getmarried, you want to find the
answer, you want to find outwhere you're going, you want to
like figure it all out, but it'slike actually the dance is like
the most fun.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Yeah, that's been a huge lesson, is exactly what you
said.
Like just like, because I thinkmy go-to is always like I need
it now, it needs to happen now.
I've been waiting, like youknow, but it's.
It has been this slow likenothing.
That's going to happen rightnow, in this moment, out of this
, energy is going to besustainable 100%.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
And what's the energy you're bringing in is fear.
Oh, yeah, for sure, if you wantlove, you can't bring fear in.
And I'm not saying that I'mperfect, you know what I mean,
but I just have continued tolean and that's also the
over-functioning.
Is that wounded feminine.
The over-functioning is thewounded feminine, and I no
longer am available to be in thewounded feminine with any man,
(18:27):
because the wounded feminine islike okay, whoa, I like him.
Okay, when is our next date?
Okay, what are we going here?
Okay, can you make a plan?
Okay, so we're going to do this.
Okay, I don't like, when youtalk, do this, I don't let let
it all breathe.
Like, let him breathe, let himstep in.
Like, let him lead, let him bepresent, let him be a
(18:49):
participant, trust his instincts, trust his timing, trust his
guidance.
You know, I I think we justkind of are over-functioning and
fear just really shuts down andI'm not saying this about you
at all, I'm just saying ingeneral really shuts down the
masculine and we want amasculine man that's going to be
present and clear and all thesethings.
But then when they kind of tryto show up, we're like no, you
have to do it faster, yeah, I'mexcited for you.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Thanks, me too.
Yeah, I think that that thatdynamic um with the masculine
and feminine, is veryinteresting, right, cause I
think we're a society more sonow of like women who are more
in the masculine.
I mean, that's always been and Ithink it's always not always
not for everybody, but for mostpeople I think that's always
been what's valued growing up,because I know I was always like
(19:35):
that too, but like even thelittle things of allowing
somebody to like open the doorfor me, that was so hard at
first.
Right, because I'm just like, Ican do Like, why are you doing
it Right?
But then you learn to like, andso it is this beautiful shift
of like letting him do thingsright and like allowing him to
take over, cause, like you said,the masculine like wants to be
(19:56):
in that space.
It's like that provider energy,and I think back to like your
point earlier there are so manymen out there that are truly
amazing, but again, that woundedversion of like the feminine
and masculine don't allow it tobe seen and appreciated, right,
and I think that's what's sobeautiful.
It's like you can see that andappreciate it.
It's just like completelychanges the dynamic.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Yeah, I think women are so powerful, we're so
capable, we're so strong, we cando it all.
We can, you know, watch thekids and be attuned to the
husband and be working our jobsand be a friend and be a good
sister and be a good aunt Likewe just can do everything.
And men are incredible.
It's nothing about men, but Ithink our capacity has really
(20:41):
just kind of suffocated men andreally not allowed them to step
into where they can lead in ourlife and where they can support.
And so the more that we cansoften into being helped and the
more that we can receive,because so many women are burnt
out and desperate for help,desperate for support, desperate
for, you know, a partner.
And I do believe men need tostep up, for sure, one hundred
(21:05):
percent, I'm not saying that,but I do believe we as women can
really take responsibility andallowing and creating a space
and environment where the mancan lead and step in and be
respected and adored and lovedfor all the care that they can
provide.
And if we want to create a safecontainer for the masculine to
step up, we have to first createa safe container for ourselves
(21:26):
to be in our feminine and boththe masculine to step up, we
have to first create a safecontainer for ourselves to be in
our feminine, and both themasculine frame and the feminine
frame and its healthiestversions only exist with safety.
The reason why women are more intheir masculine is because we
are not safe.
We are not in relationshipswith men that make us feel safe,
we are not in systems that makeus feel safe, we are not safe
in the environments that we'rein.
(21:46):
And a lot of men are not intheir masculine.
They're more in their femininebecause they don't feel safe.
So they're trying to receivelove, being in like a wounded
kind of feminine state.
So by creating safety withinourselves, within our system,
within our, you know, internallandscape, is the way that we
can create that more balanced,harmonious relationship between
(22:06):
our masculine and feminine andthe more we can cultivate that
in our partners as well.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Yeah, yeah, that's so important.
When you so you said that youhad done like a lot of the work,
like within your relationship,as far as like this kind of
masculine feminine dynamics orlike the safety work, or was
that something that you had toreframe a little bit, when you
took a little bit of time off,like after, before you started
dating?
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yeah.
So I did a lot of the work in.
We did some workshops together,him and I, on some masculine
feminine relationship dynamicsand stuff by people like John
Wineland, which were really good.
I've read a lot of JohnWineland's work, david Data's
work, alison Armstrong's workreally really powerful, really
love that work, david Data'swork, alison Armstrong's work
really really powerful, reallylove that.
And then I actually did a lotof my own work after.
(22:53):
So an example of that was I wentto this week-long retreat with
this feminine embodiment teacher.
She's like a pleasure andintimacy coach and I paid for
her to work with me one-on-onefor a week and in this week we
worked on pleasure and intimacy.
I worked on my feminine, Iworked on my masculine, and so
we both sort of played in thedynamics of what it feels like
for me to be fully surrenderedto my feminine and then fully
(23:13):
surrendered to my masculine andlike how that interplays with
each other.
So it was really this likeweek-long immersion where I was
able to really embody theenergies and understand the
energies from an embodimentperspective versus just the mind
, because I think a lot ofpeople can understand what I'm
talking about from a mindperspective and can kind of like
(23:35):
you know, speak to it in thatway, but now in my body I'm able
to like drop into my masculinefully and I'm able to drop into
my feminine fully and,especially with men, I'm able to
be in this really beautifulplace of like a surrendered
feminine that can cultivate andcall forward a man's masculine
without him even knowing.
And so there's a lot of likesomatic work there.
(23:57):
It's a lot of Tantra, it's alot of Tao, it's a lot of um, um
, it's like Eastern typetradition stuff that I did at
this immersion.
And for anyone that wants tokind of deepen and cultivate
this work, I think AlisonArmstrong, John Wineland, david
Data is really powerful to readand then even just like
practicing, being in your ownenergy and meditation,
(24:19):
cultivating and just callingforth your feminine, feeling
what that energy feels like,feeling how it wants to move,
and then kind of switching tothe masculine, seeing what that
feels like, seeing how it wantsto move, and then kind of
switching to the masculine,seeing what that feels like,
seeing how it wants to move, andjust trusting yourself and
playing with it.
It can be a dance, it can be anexploration.
It doesn't have to be right, itdoesn't have to be wrong
because, importantly, lastly, Ithink for all of us, my balance,
(24:39):
my perfect balance betweenfeminine and masculine, looks
different than yours.
You may have more feminine andI may have more masculine.
I may have more masculine, youmay have more feminine, whatever
you know.
So it's like we all are kind oflike a different range and
gauge and I think if we'recomparing ourselves to someone
else all the time, we might notbe following the right path.
So it's really good for us totune into ourselves and see what
(25:03):
feels good for us, naturally,what feels good for us in
relationship.
How can we play with, sort of,the energies in our lives?
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Yeah, I love that.
I think that, for sure, thesomatic work is so important
because there is such adisconnect oftentimes from our
logical, like thinking mind andthen our body, and that was
something I was thinking abouteven like yesterday and today.
It's like sometimes the mindcan be like so logical and so
reasonable and everything canmake sense.
And then I have had thatthought where I'm like man, my
(25:31):
body is so abandoning me rightnow, but it's just hold it.
It's like bringing up my traumaor my fears and my nerves in my
mind.
I'm like why am I nervous orwhy am I feeling like this?
Right, and so I think, likeacknowledging that and coming in
, and I love the, the um, thebooks and the references you
gave too, because it's sohelpful to.
I mean, just a book is such abeautiful expander as far as,
(25:52):
like an individual, you knowwhether you can go to a retreat
or not.
I think just having that inyour hand and coming into that
space is so powerful.
But yeah, I think that I lovethat you mentioned that, because
that's, I think, such animportant piece of the work,
because, like now, even when Ifeel that way, I just have to
like speak out loud and be likeI acknowledge that my body is
nervous right now and I'm notgoing to let it, or I try not to
(26:13):
say negatives, because Inoticed, yeah, yeah, yeah, and
you're like, and I'm going topunish it.
Oh my gosh, last week, when Iwent on that date afterwards,
I'm like I literally kepttelling myself I'm like I'm not
going to bring my trauma in here, I'm not going to put it on
this man, and then like, ofcourse, that's what I did, cause
my mind didn't hear like thenegatives.
That was a huge wake up call.
I was like, okay, really beintentional, more intentional
about how I say things.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Okay, so did you so?
Meaning you over?
You felt like you overshared,or what what's?
Speaker 1 (26:36):
going to be pulled out from under me and my body
gets really frantic and my mindstarts spinning and so I've done
a lot of work about coming intomy body.
But I felt that coming andthings were going really well
and I wanted to have aconversation too early.
That wasn't appropriate, butactually the emotional
(26:58):
experience wasn't appropriate tothe situation and I kept
telling myself just let it go,don't say anything, don't say
anything.
Of course it just gotoverwhelming.
I said something and it justcompletely it did what I knew it
was going to do.
And I think that was probablyme self-sabotaging and like I'm
not that part of me that wasafraid of something being good.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
I think those little parts that you know.
So you know, oftentimes it'slike could be a little part of
us.
That's like going to see youknow.
Oftentimes it's like could be alittle part of us.
That's like going to see youknow it's almost like protecting
you.
It's like, hey, this happenedto me.
Like are you cause someonethat's you know unsafe is going
to run or it can't handle, it isgoing to go?
(27:38):
So in a way it's sort ofhelpful Cause.
It's kind of like hey, this iswhat I've been through.
Can you hang or not?
It's obviously not.
It doesn't feel like it's idealfor you.
And what you're saying and whatI'm reading and I think too,
what can also happen is is thatwe're kind of looking for the
love and validation and carethat you could give that part of
(27:58):
like.
You know this will never happenagain because I know when to
leave.
Like I want you to know partthat like we will leave.
I know the signs.
Now I am different.
I am the one that will take usout and I'm the one that will
leave.
And once she's safe and secure,she's not looking for someone
else to like make sure that youguys are safe, because she knows
she's with you.
(28:19):
She's like no, I know and trusther as my inner mother that we
will leave if something happensand I don't even need to get
validation from anyone else.
But otherwise it's like are yougoing to hurt me?
Are you going to hurt me?
And it makes so much sense thatyou would do that.
It's, it's so normal and Ithink it's actually, in a lot of
ways for the right person, areally beautiful opportunity to
be with you and to to know youmore deeply.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
Yeah, yeah for sure, and we kind of moved through
that and again, I don't knowwhat it's going to end up being
or it's like still super early,but I think part of me needed to
have that experience right, tobe like this is a part of me and
it might show up again, butlike the fact that we could talk
it out and have a conversationaround it is telling so yeah, I
mean that's, and I think too.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
I think this is maybe just my experience in the world
that I'm in, because I'm in somuch depth that everything feels
normal to me.
Like you know, if I hear aboutsomething, I'm like it's not
like I'm normalizing or I'mcutting down what anyone says,
but I'm like people have.
If you're being present andattuned to your life, you're
aware of really traumatic thingsyou've been through, and if
you're not, then you're notaware of things.
(29:32):
You know what I mean.
I'm like I actually want to bewith someone that's attuned and
aware to things that they'vebeen through and is able to be
conscious about abuse or orneglect or all these things.
Because otherwise, if you'recomplete, if you're like no life
has been good and perfect mywhole life, I'm like that scares
me.
You know, I'm like that's scaryto me.
I love my life.
It's stunning and beautiful andI live better than I could have
(29:52):
ever imagined, and I alsorecognize I've been through
things in my life too.
So it's not like you have tohate your life, but I just think
that people that have done themost work are aware of things
that they've been through, and Ithink if we're people are
truthful, I don't think anyonein life would say that their
life has been perfect.
Speaker 1 (30:11):
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
I think we all have pain orthings that we don't like about
ourselves or don't want to faceand, like you said, if you're
not acknowledging that or seeingthat, it's a little bit harder
to maybe show up, or I guess itjust wouldn't be a person maybe
that you would attract.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
Yes, totally A hundred percent.
And so how did he respond?
Speaker 1 (30:28):
So in the moment, um cause this all happened like via
text and it like shouldn't havehappened via text.
I was just like in a weirdthing.
Um.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
So at first it was kind of like I would say that's
a good indicator and I don'tknow if this to be true, and I'm
not judging I'd say that's agreat point because that could
be a potential self-sabotage ifit's done kind of in text or
something.
Because if we, if we want trueintimacy, we're going to be in
person.
Yeah, you know, we're going tobe like attuning to them,
because then we're aware of howthey're receiving it, how it's
(30:58):
being processed, we're with them, we're there for the healing
and it could.
You know, I think that's agreat call and obviously you
didn't do anything wrong at all.
But I'm just saying I'm likethat's a great call out that you
have.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's why I think I was kind of
like after the situation, likeit was definitely aware, but
yeah, I think in the moment itwas like I don't want to say
off-putting, but like he justneeded to take.
But after the fact is, you know, like I said, we've talked
about it, we're going to seeeach other, like next week, so I
(31:29):
don't know what did he say.
So he said, basically reflectedthat you know, it had been just
like one date that we had goneon and it was a conversation
that maybe was a little bit toopremature to be having,
considering and the fact that itshould be in person, like he
kept saying he wanted to have itin person versus like via text,
which is, you know, accurate,it's true, um, totally fine.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
Yeah, I would always.
And you know, and I know we'renot, we can not talk about.
I'm just like such a curiousperson.
I'm always like I would, youknow, and the way that I always
just like to move things is justwith self-responsibility,
accountability and lightness.
It's like, you know, like thankyou so much for just handling
that in the best way that youdid.
Like I recognize that there wasa part of me that felt really
close to you and felt safe toyou and I really loved our first
date and I think a part of mewas just kind of feeling
(32:19):
vulnerable and feeling like Iwanted to share something and
just so, you know you're exactlyright, we should have done that
in person.
And next time I'll know, andyou know that's pretty much the
depths of it and I'm justappreciate how you were and just
kind of clocking andrecognizing and taking
accountability and just bringingforward something in like a
neutral way because you know youshouldn't feel shamed about
what you did.
He handled it beautifully.
(32:40):
You have a second date.
Don't like shame spiral in it,because that's part of the
pattern too is to do to say thething and then shame spiral to
have.
You know what I mean so justforgiving yourself and having
lightness to it, and you know,inviting them in in a way is so
nice.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Yeah, I definitely was like angry at myself that
that day.
I was like why'd I do that?
I you know I sabotaged and allthat kind of stuff.
But yeah, it's you know movingpast it no it's exactly totally
fine.
Yeah, um, how?
How much do you feel like?
This is something I think aboutlike how much do you feel like
your friendships, whether maleor female, have helped you show
(33:21):
up, I mean in any area of yourlife?
But since we're talking aboutdating specifically like dating,
you know, showing up in datingas like that confident sort of
like energy that you canapproach it in the way that you
do you know it's interestingwith the male friends things is,
I cause I was in relationshipfor so long and we started
dating like a little aftercollege.
Speaker 2 (33:40):
I didn't really.
I kind of lost my male friends.
Um, I'm from the Midwest too,so and this could be just how I
experienced the Midwest, but youdidn't really have.
If you got married and had afamily, you didn't really stay
in relationship or friendshipwith women that weren't married
or friends with your wife orwhatever.
So I kind of lost all my malefriends, or the male friends
(34:00):
that I had, and I was friendswith my husband's friends.
They were great, but it wasn'tlike a deep, intimate
relationship.
And so when I became singleagain, I actually didn't have
many guy friends.
I had a few gay guy friends,but I didn't have any
heterosexual male friends.
And I actually started to openup my aperture to have male guy
friends in the past couplemonths I would say the past five
(34:24):
months and it's actually beeninstrumental to me in my dating
process and in my process ofbeing with men, because what I
was doing before was I wasmeeting every man and I was like
, hello, are you my husband, areyou my like, are we going to
date and I would just kind oflike meet them with agenda and
goal.
And this was happeningsubconsciously.
It wasn't like I would meetthem and be like hi, are you my
(34:46):
husband?
I would just kind of be lookingat them if they were worth my
time to invest in or not.
And now that I've, you know, Ihave these amazing male friends
in my life.
It's helped me to becomfortable around men all the
time.
It's helped me to feel likemyself around men all the time.
It's helped me to develop trustwith men.
It's helped me to see softersides of men.
It's helped me to be inmasculine energy and not have it
(35:09):
be sexual, and it's helped meto just be and see men in a
completely different way.
So I'm so deeply grateful forthe male friends in my life, for
helping me to be better indating, because I think before
too, I would get nervous.
Like a hot guy would come up tome and I'd be like and now,
like any man at any level ofhotness or wealth or success
could come up and I'm like, hey,how are you?
(35:30):
Because I've metabolized theenergy of the masculine around
me and I I don't feelintimidated by anybody.
So masculine friends and men,friends have helped me so deeply
.
And then I think my friends havetaught me, um, how to be loved
and how to be, how to trust.
You know, like Lindsay is anexample, my podcast co-host and
(35:50):
best friend Like she's been myNorth star for how I want to be
in my relationship.
Like she was here staying at myhouse like two weeks ago, and
she was at the house and I justwas thinking to myself I'm like
I would, can't wait for myhusband to be around me and have
it feel like this becausearound her I feel so mentally
free, I feel so expressed, Ifeel so just myself and it's
(36:18):
created like obviously there'sgoing to be romantic interest
and you know it's different witha man, but I just am like, wow,
I just I want to feel thismyself and free like I do with
my partner.
So I think we can use ourfemale relationships to help us
feel how we want to feel, inthat freedom and that safety and
that spaciousness and that seenness.
And then I think our malerelationships can help us really
(36:39):
metabolize masculine energy sothat we can feel more
comfortable and safer on themasculine, especially if we've
been in situations where wehaven't felt safe or we haven't
felt seen by men.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
I love that.
Yeah, my male friendships havebeen like some of the most
healing, like non-sexualrelationships I've ever had, and
it's so beautiful to experiencethat.
I love that.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
Yeah, I think I've had to metabolize.
I will say that sometimes Ithink someone wants more.
So I think you have to kind ofbe with those boundaries or
those conversations, and I dothink that's true.
But if you can be in truth andhonesty about things and kind of
still move the energy, and evenit's helped me to be like, oh,
there's a charge here and wedon't need to do anything about
(37:24):
it, it's okay.
And I think growing up, if Imet a man and had a charge here
and we don't need to do anythingabout it, like it's okay, you
know.
And I think growing up, if Imet a man and had a charge with
him, I'm like, oh, we need todate, like you know what I mean.
And now I'm like, oh no, youcan have chemistry with someone
and they could, they don't haveto be your husband.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
Yeah, yeah, um, I I always think about like, just
like the energy of desire whenit comes to things like this,
right, cause it's like a hugelesson of like not having to do
something with every singledesire that comes through your
body, Right, and just likesometimes just letting it live
in there, um, but I mean, Ithink definitely, communication
is huge in all aspects, right.
Whatever relationship you enterinto, I think that's going to be
(37:59):
a huge key piece of it.
Um, and I know you're connectedwith Lacey Phillips and you've
had her on the podcast andeverything like that, but I love
her concept of expanders andeven what you said about Lindsay
just being like feeling thatsort of like safety and like
seen this and like just being inyour system around her can be
an expander for you.
Romantic relationships, too,because it's the same energy,
right, wherever we're in, and Ilove that, and every time, I
(38:21):
like witness something that isexpanding and it like clicks,
like that, it's just, it's sobeautiful to be able to like
pull that into your body, likenow.
Right, and even femalefriendships can be healing for
romantic relationships.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
Yeah, it's huge and you know to speak to desire and
kind of that initial part of ittoo.
You know I've been working alot with desire because I think
we as a society and culture arepeople that love to be in a
state of desire, satisfaction,desire, satisfaction, desire,
satisfaction.
(38:55):
And that happens with socialmedia, that happens with food,
that happens with sex.
Like you get turned on, youwant to come right away.
You get hungry, you want to eat.
You you know, think about yourphone, you want to be on it.
It's like we just are so quickto move through desire and that
desire feeling is like such analive feeling, it's such a pull
(39:16):
you forward feeling and I'vetried to be holding the frame of
desire way longer and sculptingmyself to hold more desire and
to hold more tension and to notwant to just have it end right
away, because then the cyclebegins and then you're
technically like an addict todopamine and so I really am like
being in desire longer and evenin.
(39:39):
You know I'm dating someoneright now and we're long
distance and so there's like abuilt desire of the distance and
it's like how can I be presentand attuned to my life and enjoy
the fact that there's somethingthat I desire and there's
something that I'm interested inand there's something that I'm
excited about and not want it tobe like I miss you, I want to
go to you.
Know it's like no, like Oohcool.
(39:59):
Like I love that I'm wantingsomeone, I love that I'm
desiring someone, like this isbeautiful, Like I'm in this
state of aliveness because of itand I don't want it to be
satisfied in this moment, inevery single moment, and I think
the more we can expand ourcapacity for desire and like
excitement and vitality, themore beauty we have and the more
exciting life becomes, becauseonce we have the satisfaction,
(40:21):
then we're just kind of back onthe rat race again.
So I live in a state ofconstant desire, I think, which
makes me feel like vital andalive.
Speaker 1 (40:32):
I love that, yeah, and I think when we're
constantly giving it, like, likeyou said, that dopamine and
kind of what we were talkingabout before we got on with,
like the kids and that's what itis right it's this constant
dopamine hit and I think that'swhy there's so much, you know,
whether it's anxiety ordepression, because it's
constantly chasing something,you know, instead of, like you
said, like kind of living inthat desire, which is actually a
really beautiful thing, and youknow, like I was talking about
(40:54):
earlier, like it's been a hugepart of my lesson is like being
able to be in that and not haveto have the thing right now,
right, like it's okay toexperience that like slowness of
it, but, yeah, that's beautifullessons.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
Yeah, it's that slow burn and it's that the
experience of and I think aboutthat with dating too, because I
think a lot of us for women, youknow, we're like, okay, we meet
them, and we're like I likethem.
Okay, now, what's our next date?
Or when are we going to getmarried, or what is the next
thing.
And you know, we're kind ofjust like I, just it's like no,
like this unraveling, unfoldingthe story of it all is happening
(41:30):
right now and it's so beautifuland it's luscious and it's just
pleasurable and I just want thebest things in life to last as
long as possible and I I don'twant my fear to make things
collapse and get smaller and endthings collapse and get smaller
(41:50):
and end.
Speaker 1 (41:51):
Yeah, did you ever feel like you were in a place of
like experiencing, experiencingrelationships or dating in that
way, or is this, or you've kindof always been able to enjoy
that process.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
Um, I would say no, I mean no, I wouldn't say I think
in my process of my, you know,we waited for like eight years
till we got engaged, so I wasn'tever in a rush with that.
For some reason which you knowcould have been assigned
subconsciously, I think indating I definitely have found
(42:18):
myself not rushing to marriageor not rushing to relationship,
but definitely when I felt therewas wobbliness on their end or
unavailability, I would getanxious and want the next step
for sure.
So I now know that I was inwith someone that was
unavailable or someone that wasan avoidant If I was anxious
(42:40):
about the fact that we didn'thave a next step in place.
And you know that's been mypattern is, to date, avoidance.
I'm not anxious per se, becauseI've sort of been trained out
of my anxiousness being withavoidance for so long.
I won't show it, I won'texpress it.
I I kind of an avoidant myself,to be honest.
(43:01):
But I would internally be like,okay, why don't we have a plan?
Why aren't we doing this?
What's going on with that?
And I noticed myself in eachdating scenario when I would
lead and I would kind oftransition from being in the
receptive mode of them, planningthem leading, then determining,
(43:21):
and I would be like, oh, whatabout us going on a trip here?
Or what about me coming here?
Or what about you know?
Then it would always get wobblyand it's you know again, these
are not the right men, they'reunavailable for the most part.
But I was like, oh, I don'twant to be in a place where I'm
forcing anything, I'm rushinganything, I'm trying to make
(43:42):
something happen that isn'thappening organically and
naturally or through theirdesire first.
So I've definitely had to workon it.
For sure, I wouldn't say thatI'm like perfect, um, but I
think being older has helped mebe much better with it than I
was younger and I was moreunconscious, um to it.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Do you feel like dating maybe more dismissive men
was like a protective thing.
Speaker 2 (44:10):
I would say, yeah, so I um.
So the men that I would date, Ihaven't.
I dated men that areemotionally available and I've
dated men that are, you know.
But I think, yeah, I think themen that I dated I dated since
my relationship ended have beenavoidant because it feels safe
for me, because then I know thatwe're not going to go deep and
(44:32):
I know that we're not going tobe more intimate than this wall
that you have up, and so thatfeels safe for me because you
know, to be honest.
So, on the one part of thepositive side of it, none of
these men are my men and none ofthese men are the men I'm meant
to be with.
So there's a good part of it.
So, subconsciously I'm like,okay, cool, you have this
(44:52):
boundary, great, I can look goodbecause I can be the one that's
trying to get in and trying togo deeper.
But you're going to stop meevery time, even though I know
you're not my man.
So there's that beautiful partof it where it's like my
subconscious also knows thatthey're not my man.
Um, but yeah, it was definitelyto protect myself, definitely
to avoid my own going deep, myown being intimate, my own
availability.
(45:13):
I would say that I just now, inthe past couple months, have
made myself available for depthand intimacy and true
relationship, and for me thatmeans showing someone all of my
sides and all of my parts.
It means not just my perfect.
You know, krista, on a pedestalpart of I have all these
(45:34):
amazing qualities and I have allthese amazing things.
It's like the messiness, therawness, the imperfection, the
true me, and that's scary,because when that part's
rejected it's such a differentexperience than when, like you,
like the facade you put up isrejected.
And I think before inrelationships I had my facade up
(45:54):
for way longer, and so now I'mlike, oh no, I need you to know
the me, who I am, throughoutthis entire process, because
that's just faster and I don'treally know how to fake it much.
I don't know.
I can't fake it as long anymore.
Speaker 1 (46:13):
Yeah, it's exhausting , I feel like to to like not
show up fully, and then you knowif it does progress past a
certain point, and then you'rekind of having to go back and
then show things they're likewell, where'd that come from?
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Yeah, literally literally yeah, they're like
whoa, whoa, whoa.
You're like I didn't tell youabout this thing, like, yeah,
and I think everyone does it indating and, and you know, online
(46:43):
dating makes it um, onlinedating is its own portal and you
know it's all in its own plan.
But if you are looking at alist of physical attributes and
a list of these attributesschool, religion, all of that
and like, how do you get to knowsomeone's soul?
You know from that.
So it's now we're kind oftrained to present the things
rather than presenting who weare energetically.
And I think that's what I'velearned so much in my process is
(47:04):
, like, you know, my ex was myentire list and that list was a
list I wrote when I was 23, 24,which was great, he was an
amazing man.
And now my list is so different.
My list is so much soul texture, emotional texture, heart
texture, frequency texture,values, texture, and with online
(47:27):
dating it's like I did it for,I think, a few months.
I haven't done it.
I did it for I think like fourmonths and I haven't done it
since, because what I found wasthat my ego was looking at all
the things on someone's profilebut like I can't meet someone's
soul, you know, and when I'm outin the world.
I can meet them and right awaybe like, even though you're
(47:47):
nothing like what I thought mytype was, your soul feels good
with my soul and that's what Iwant to do, and I think I've
given myself permission to knowthat, like, the frequency is
what I'm looking for, not justthe list.
Speaker 1 (48:02):
Yeah, I've also moved away from online dating too,
because that same thing it's.
It's so hard to connect withsomebody when you're just
looking at statistics.
Like my son would be like mom.
Why is everyone you date likesix foot five or whatever.
And then when the people I meetin real life, I'm like those
things actually don't evenmatter.
I'm five, three, you could befive, five and still be taller
than me.
It really doesn't make adifference.
(48:24):
Um, and so it's.
But you're right, like I thinkhaving that connection like like
soul to soul, likeenergetically, actually in
person, like even the one that Idated, like I've known him for
like a year, which I also thinkhelped with the little like
freak out that I had, cause healready knew who I was before,
an emotional experience of me,right, but yeah, I love that, I
(48:45):
think it's.
I mean, I think both yourintention behind it and for
anyone listening to that maybe,is dating like you said, like
making a list has been.
I mean I think that's sohelpful and also like keeping it
open, because every like,whenever I've made a list, the
person I meet like matches mostof that, and then I realized, oh
well, I actually like thisneeds to be a priority too, like
the ability to commit or theability to want to be clear, the
(49:07):
ability to communicate, likethose things are important, not
just you know your whatever, andhave dating help you make your
list and help you cultivate andrefine your list and help you
show aspects of you.
Speaker 2 (49:20):
And just, I see every date as every first date, in a
selfish way, as like growth forme.
How much am I being myself?
How honest am I being?
How truthful am I being?
How in honest am I being?
How truthful am I being?
How in integrity am I being?
You know what I mean.
Like it's like how am I being?
And then, obviously, as I getto know them more, I'm more
available for um being fullypresent and attuned to that.
(49:44):
I'm being fully present andattuned, but it's like I'm more
available to let that aspect ofit go and see them.
Um, but I don't think onlinedating is necessarily bad.
Like it was a beautiful portalfor me to meet great men that I,
you know, had greatrelationships with, but I felt
like at the end I was like I'mnot your cup might go.
Speaker 1 (50:04):
just your cat the cup Did you?
I was like I saw it start tomove and like it might go off
the table.
Dude, honestly we might snap.
Speaker 2 (50:17):
I had to mute it for a bit because she was meowing.
It's all good, it's fine, butfor people that are online
dating, it's like just having anintention around it.
I think a lot of what peoplewill do is they'll be like I
hate online dating, it's theworst, you know, blah, blah,
blah, and then they'll go on it.
It's like, if you don't like it, don't do it.
And after I online dated, Itold God I am not online dating
and I'm available for you tobring men into my life in the
(50:39):
flesh, and I'm available forkarmic relationships.
I'm available to clear up karmain this lifetime.
But I'm no longer available forthe portal of online dating.
And the reason why it's workedfor me off of being online is
because I'm not messing around.
I'm not saying it out of fear,I'm saying it out of empowerment
, I'm saying it out of clarity,I'm saying it out of truth and
I'm also available forrelationships that aren't just
(51:01):
like the most perfect one everLike.
If I was to be like God, I'mnot available for online dating
and I only want my soulmate Sure, maybe that's going to happen.
But I'm also available to likehelp people.
I'm available to be expandersfor men.
I'm available to like supportmen in the process.
I'm available to see stuff thatI haven't seen Like.
It isn't just about finding theone for me, it's about learning
and it's about growth and it'sabout making myself and my work
(51:24):
better.
Speaker 1 (51:25):
Yeah, I remember listening to one episode of the
podcast, like I don't know, Idon't.
It was maybe like five yearsago and I was on a walk and I
remember hearing you talkingabout like being intentional and
something along those lines.
Right Of like setting intentionfor something.
I remember thinking to myselflike wow, like I wish I could be
that intentional about things,but like I found like I could
never like I'm air quoting itlike because it is all just part
(51:46):
of the process, I guess, but Inever took the time to set an
intention before I did something.
You know what I mean.
But even just like a few weeksago, I remember like sitting
with my journal and it'ssomething that now I can look
back and now I I can pull inthat intention a lot easier.
So, like, as you're saying that, like I've definitely done that
with like speaking things outloud and be like this is what
I'm available for.
And like right before you knowthe last like date I went on, I
(52:09):
remember I was like with myjournal and I just like was like
you know what Like source got.
I was like I am so good Likebeing single, like I've been
single for seven and a halfyears, like I'm comfortable with
myself, I've kind of done thatwork.
So like, if this is it, it'skind of like one of those worst
case scenarios, right, like if Iend up single for the rest of
my life, like what's the worstcase?
(52:30):
Like boom, like three dayslater I got this message and
again, not to say that it'sanything, but like I think just
bringing that intention in andjust like having that connection
to something bigger than thesituation, to like zoom out and
just be able to appreciate it, Ithink the surrender is huge too
, and I think people are talkingabout surrender a lot and I
(52:51):
don't think people understandsurrender, isn't I'm letting go
because I want an outcome?
Speaker 2 (52:57):
It's literally letting go because you're
unattached to the outcome, causeyou don't you, you're not
expecting to get the outcome atall.
So you being like life is good,I could be single, great, like
that's so powerful and such apowerful place to be.
And I think, even if he's yourman or not, you should want to
feel good in every moment.
(53:19):
So I'm going to feel good, evenif he's my man or not.
If he's my man, great.
If he's not my man, great.
I still feel good and I thinkthat's such a beautiful,
beautiful thing that I think Iwork on and I strive to be and I
strive to learn and do more ofI think I'm, I think there's
always room for more surrender,but I think I'm pretty, pretty
surrendered.
(53:39):
But you know there's always, wealways do grip in somewhere.
Us humans, we always findsomewhere to grip.
Speaker 1 (53:44):
Yeah, ego is always going to act up a little bit,
for sure, for sure.
Well, I love that we talkedabout dating, like before we got
on.
I was hoping that we would likekind of circle onto this.
Speaker 2 (53:54):
Oh, this is this is the only place I want to live.
Me and my friend, Sahara SaharaRose, who's one of my best
friends, Like we like, becausewe we started.
We kind of got into the datingportal together, Like I left my
marriage in November, she lefthers in December, and so we've
been on our journey like, justas like besties, and every
(54:14):
single podcast we are like wecan you know everyone's like, oh
, what about?
And we're like, let me tell youabout this date.
I went on.
All we want to do is processdating because it's fascinating,
it's fun, it's interesting,it's human nature.
Speaker 1 (54:27):
It's like so fun Is there like one experience that
was just like wild in likewhatever way you can get.
That means to you?
Speaker 2 (54:38):
Um, you know there was.
I remember when I went to on atrip or I was in, I had a
retreat and usually after myretreats I'm very hard open, I'm
very, I'm in a really beautifulfrequency because I've been
around women all week.
I've been just like in myDharma and I remember the
psychic.
A psychic before I left waslike oh, she's like the man
(54:59):
you're going to be with, he'slike a Brown man and he's like
an athlete and like doesn'tspeak English, we'll sing all
this stuff.
And I was like this is like thecraziest thing I've ever heard
in my life.
I was like what is she talkingabout?
And then I was in Paris and Iremember we went to this
restaurant and then we left therestaurant.
(55:21):
Nothing happened.
I was like I'm going to meetthis other guy that I met and
then our friends were like, hey,we just got to this restaurant,
will you come back?
And I remember I went back tothe restaurant and I was like I
have like the calling to like doa lap and all my friends like
no, like wherever I go I do alap.
I'm just like like just showingwhat's, showing everyone what
I'm working with and just seeingwhat's up.
(55:42):
So I do a lap and there's themost gorgeous, like brown skin,
tall man that I've like everseen and I was like, oh hello.
And I just was like doo-doo-doo, just walked by and sat down
and he sent a drink over and weended up hanging out that night.
Like his name was like Giovanni, he was like an athlete every
(56:03):
single thing that the psychicsaid and he ended up living like
20 minutes away from my dad inFlorida and so he was in there
for a trip like work, like dah,dah, dah, dah.
So we hung out all the next dayand had this like love affair in
Paris, and then I was flyingback to see my dad that next
(56:23):
week and he was at home, so wegot to spend more time together.
It was just this moment of thisconnection that was really
beautiful and really deep andreally just like magical.
That like I would have neverthought I would be available for
like a love affair with, likean Ecuadorian athlete that was
like named Giovanni, you know,years ago, and I was like, oh, I
(56:45):
love that this is a part of mylike life story, like I'm just
open and available for abeautiful experience with a
beautiful man that feels honestand true, that feels magical and
fun and all these things.
And it was just like I was like, oh, this is what it's like to
just like say yes to life.
Speaker 1 (57:01):
Yeah, I love that.
And predicted by a psychic,predicted by a psychic, of
course.
What do you?
Speaker 2 (57:05):
mean, of course, she's like he's an acquired,
like she said everything abouthim.
She's like he's this, he's thatand I was like what are you
talking about?
And so when I'm so, it's hardwith psychics, because then when
you meet them, you're likeyou're who the psychic told me,
you know.
Speaker 1 (57:20):
And then you're like are you my man?
And I'm like did you tell him apsychic?
Told him, told you about him.
Speaker 2 (57:24):
No, that's one thing to all the ladies listening.
Keep it to yourself.
Speaker 1 (57:30):
This is also.
I love having male like reallyclose friends, because sometimes
I'll call my male friend, I'llbe like, and I'll say a
situation, he's like Rochelle,like, don't say that to them.
I'm like, okay, thanks.
Speaker 2 (57:39):
No, literally.
I mean your man.
Nothing's going to scare yourman away.
Yeah, I don't ask forhoroscopes.
I don't ask for birthdays.
I don't tell them about psychicreadings that involve them.
I don't.
It's just like my husband Iwould.
I told him stuff at.
You know it went after yearsand years of dating.
I just think, unless your manis very spiritually attuned,
(58:01):
it's a lot of information to belike a psychic.
They don't.
The way that they understandpsychics is is interesting and I
think we put so much weight onpsychic readings.
Like I take psychic readings solightly now.
I mean, for every psychic I'vemet, I'm I'm married 50 times
over right now.
So it's like yeah some I believe, some I don't.
Speaker 1 (58:18):
you know what I mean, Whatever, yeah, it's also like
I feel like, um, I don't know ifintuitive is the word I'm
looking for, but you can takewhatever meaning you want from
it, right, like I think that itcan be applied to like so many
different situations, like I'vehad psychics tell me certain
things about men I'm going tomeet, but it's like, but it
could also apply to like threeor four of them.
So it's like which one were youtalking about?
(58:39):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (58:40):
Yeah, I mean totally.
There's one, there's onespecific person that I think
like 12 psychics have told meI'm going to be with at this
point and I'm just like it'sliterally, it's like all the
same type, the one person thatnumerous ones have told you
about.
Yes, huh, numerous many.
Yeah, I can't even tell you, Idon't even want to describe it,
(59:01):
cause it's like annoying at thispoint and I'm like, and it's
also, it's also a type that I'mnot interested in at all.
It's like, and so I'm like, hmm, free will says no to that.
Speaker 1 (59:14):
We all have it.
Speaker 2 (59:15):
I know we all have it .
Speaker 1 (59:16):
I'm like yeah, I would love to talk about the
book, obviously before we likesign off, because it is in about
a month it's coming out.
So I would love to just know,like I mean whatever you want to
tell us about it, like thewriting process, what it was
like to write it with Lindsayand not just like yourself.
And you know, obviously nowwith like touring and kind of
(59:38):
traveling and talking about itmust be such a exciting, maybe
little nerves in there.
I don't know what the processis like.
Speaker 2 (59:43):
Yeah.
So you know, when we startedthe podcast, we were on our
closet floors, we were at rockbottom and we felt so lost in
life and over the past you know,nine years of building the show
and changing our lives with thewisdom and the insight from our
guests.
We wanted to have everythingwe've learned to go from
completely lost to a life thatwe loved in a guidebook, and so
(01:00:04):
this is a guidebook for yourconscious awakening.
It's like a spiritual guidebookto adulting.
We have sections on the body,on purpose, on career, on your
soul, on friendships, on purpose, on career, on your soul, on
friendships, on romanticrelationships, on money.
Like it's like so much of thegoodness and wisdom from the
podcast mixed in with storiesfrom lindsey and I that we've
(01:00:25):
never told before, mixed in withour own teachings, and it's
powerful.
Like I'm so hard on there's noone that's harder on themselves
than me and I think it'sliterally such an amazing book.
I'm so proud of it and I'm soexcited for people to have it.
So it's called Almost 30.
It's a definitive guide to alife that you love for the next
(01:00:45):
decade and beyond, and you canget it wherever you get books
almost30.com slash book Ifpeople want to come.
You can also join camp whichwe're doing a virtual retreat in
May, may 18th, which is goingto be really incredible and,
yeah, I'm excited for people tohave it.
It's been a nerve wrackingprocess, I think, to promote it
and share it.
Writing it was a joy, but youknow, it's all a growth edge and
(01:01:05):
I'm really grateful to haveopportunities in my life where I
can grow.
Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
Yeah, I love that and even just kind of tying into
what we were talking about, youknow in the beginning, the the
slowness of doing something likethis, Right Cause I mean you
guys started writing it whatlike a couple of years ago or a
year ago, or yeah, I think likeyou're right.
Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
I think 23.
So I think I just got divorcedand Lindsay just got pregnant.
Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
Wow, wow, I know, yeah.
What do you feel?
Like your, like your sad andreturned self would say if they
read this book.
Speaker 2 (01:01:37):
It's a great question I haven't been asked.
I think my sad and returned myGod, I mean the deepest truth
that I know that I keep comingback to related to this book is
that if I would have read thiswhen I was going through deep
times of transformation andchange, my life would be
completely different.
I would feel like a completelydifferent person.
(01:01:58):
I would feel at peace and atease.
I would be able to have mymental health through the
process.
So I think she would be like,feel less alone.
I think she'd be like oh, I'mnot behind, I'm just becoming.
You know, it's a part of theprocess to be here and I feel so
seen and heard and yeah, itsounds cliche but it's so real
like I wish I would have knownthat all the change I was going
(01:02:20):
through was for purpose.
I wish I would have known thatmy world crumbling down around
me was all for good and I wish Iwould have known that my soul
knew what it was doing the wholetime.
Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
I love that.
I can't wait to read it and andI've you know, I've been fans
of you guys since, like my sonis almost nine, and I remember
being pregnant, listening tostop cast you guys.
Speaker 2 (01:02:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
It's been like one of the beginning, since the
beginning, like definitely fullcircle moment.
So I appreciate so much havingyou on here.
Speaker 2 (01:02:51):
It's been.
I mean talk about dating allday.
Speaker 1 (01:02:54):
You're going to have to now keep me updated with
what's going on now.
Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
Now I'm locked in.
Speaker 1 (01:02:59):
Yeah, when the episode comes out, I'll give you
a little update.
Everyone will need to knowyou'll have to put it in the
intro.
To be honest, I'll have to havehim on, yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
Literally I'll be like you know what she said that
thing, yeah, I loved her.
You know what she said thatthing, yeah, I loved her.
Speaker 1 (01:03:14):
We'll see.
Speaker 2 (01:03:15):
Yeah Well, thank you so much, thank you so much, bye
guys you.
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