Is The Triple Crown Of Hiking "Dumb"?

Today on The Rock Fight Colin & Shawnté discuss the following topics that have come out of the outdoor adventure community over the past week:

• Fake summit selfies! Scandal breaks in the mountaineering world as a climber is accused of faking summits. (08:44)
• Nepal pimps other peaks! Nepal is issuing free permits to 97 other mountains to try and relieve some of the traffic on Everest. Will it work? (17:32)
• The Rock Fight Lightning Round! Today's topics: a bear kills Japanese hiker, a rattlesnake kills a Tennessee hiker, and SUPs are killing more people than ever before. (24:30)
• Is completing the Triple Crown of Hiking 'dumb'? A recent blog post ponders the motivation of those who pursue thru hiking the PCT, CDT, and AT. Do we agree? (29:12)

For The Parting Shot, Shawnté reflects on Hurricane Katrina's 20 year anniversary while Colin follows up on Kilian Jornet's new venture.

Thanks for listening! The Rock Fight is a production of Rock Fight, LLC.

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Episode Transcript

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Rock fight. Rock fight. Rockflight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock

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Welcome to the rock fightwhere we speak our truth, slay sacred
cows, and sometimes agree todisagree. This is an outdoor podcast
that aims for the head. I'mColin True, and joining me today.
She packs it out and she pooslike a pro. It's Shantae Celebr.
Wow. I just. I just have tosay, for the record, Owen, again,

(03:14):
I didn't say it. Do you noticeI've been very scared lately?
You sent the picture of it.
I didn't send you a picture ofanything. What are you talking about?
Pack it out like a pro. Thatwas in the image you sent to our.
I did not send that.
Who said that?
That was a group chat. Dougsent that. I think I assumed it was
you. Wow. Just throwing meunder the bus left and right. They're

(03:35):
like toilet bus. What is goingon here?
All right. Is it that like much?
I feel like the listeners needto know that there's more to me than
just.
Just wait till they hear gear. Abby.
Oh, man. Wow. I'm getting areputation here.
I apologize. I really didthink you sent that.
Because it wasn't me.
You have to admit. That wouldbe something you would send us.
I think it was Doug. So sorry.Schnitzbahn. We're. We're throwing

(03:56):
you under the poo bus.
Should we. Should we rerecordthe open?
No. Colin. Should we?
No, it's all right. I couldbe. I could be wrong. It's okay.
It's good. You know I was wrong.
It's good practice for you. It is.
I was wrong. It was DougSchnitzman. Who? Schnitzman is the
one who packs it out and poolike a pro. All right. It's not Shantae.

(04:16):
I mean, I do. Colin.
Yeah?
I feel like you and I saw anews story today. You know, we're
recording this a few daysbefore. We always record on Mondays.
Our special time. It is. Anddo you see the Leadville. Leadville
results? We got some records smashed.
I did.
And I know you love. You lovean outdoor feat. You love when people

(04:38):
push to their limits. Colin.And achieve. So what did you think?
We got some records here.
I genuinely do love an outdoorfeed. As much as maybe I sound like
I don't. I think it's coolbecause these people who do these
things, obviously it'simportant to them. They put in the
time they went out there. Theyworked really hard. And Ann Flower
set a new course record forthe women at leadville. Finishing

(04:59):
in 1758. Broke a 31 year oldcourse record.
31, yeah. Amazing. Absolutely incredible.
The legend Ann Tracin's recordat Leadville. And then David Roach
on the men's side finished in1512 which was a 16 minute improvement
over Matt Carpenter's 2005record. 15.
Like I'm trying to imagine,you know, I've, I've hiked over part

(05:23):
of the course while I was onthe CT and even then I remember seeing
people just day like running,just running a little day run up
to Hope Pass and I was justbreathing heavy, sweating. Parts
of my body were activelydisintegrating on the trail. Like
how are you guys doing this?And I'm a trail runner. I'm like
there's no way. I just madcredit to all these people because

(05:43):
not only am I never breaking arecord, uh, but I would probably
die just trying to not break arecord and run the whole hundred
miles.
It's impressive for sure. Imean I guess I, and I look at both
of these and I don't knowwhere we're going with the whole.
And we gotta get theprogramming reinders but like I,
I just, I'm gonna pontificatefor a second. Cause I don't know
where we're going with thewhole endurance thing because it's

(06:03):
not like ultras aren't weirdanymore. Ultras were like the weird
kind of like oh my God, thosecrazy people who are running so far
and it's amazing, right? Andthat was what frankly one of the
attractions to it that I hadwhen I kind of got into them. And
now it's like every year it'slike the, the, the, the times are
getting faster. I mean DavidRoach ran, he wrote an average 907
minute mile in Leadville,Colorado. Like the course is over

(06:27):
10,000ft. All of it.
Yep.
So I'm just, I'm not alleginganything. I don't know what's going
on. I would say I thinkthere's a PED scandal coming at some
point in the ultra world. Ijust don't know how this happens.
Continues. Lance Armstrong ofUltras. Oh no.
But congrats to them. But I dothink even if you know and I don't
know anything, but I thinkthat man it just seems like the more

(06:48):
and more competitive thesegets, like wow. It's either people
are getting real strong outthere or something else going on.
You know at some point AI isgoing to win the Ultras Chat GPT
in the lead with a 14 hour finish.
Well, hey, everybody. TodayShantae and I are going to be digging
into some other headlines andstories that come out of the outdoor
adventure community. Butfirst, I can mention a few programming
reminders on Monday. Did youmiss Monday's episode of the Rock

(07:10):
Fight? Maybe you also missedTuesday's newest open container.
Rude.
Did you know that we'relaunching a new show?
I did.
With Shantae Salibare? Like ina mat. Maybe even days away, Weeks
away.
Days a week, Two weeks a day.
Something like that.
We're just going to thrust.Thrust it upon you. That is not.
Not at all what I want.
And you give me grief for thepoo comment. All right, so the takeover

(07:33):
of outdoor podcast here on theRock Fight Podcast network is happening.
Make sure you're listening toall of our shows and. And Shantae,
can you let our listeners knowwhere they can reach out to us and
follow along with all of our exploits?
Oh, heck yeah. All right, soyou know what you can do? You can
sign up for our newsletter byheading to Rockfight Co. Colin works
very hard on that every week.I want to give him kudos for his

(07:54):
excellent work on the newsletter.
Thank you.
You're welcome. Follow us onInstagram to get video clips from
all of our podcast episodes,including one that I really love
of Colin just railing againste bikes, in case you didn't hear
that.
Mountain bikes.
E. Mountain bikes. Sorry. EMountain bikes. Very specific.
Yes.
Yeah. Old man Colin yelling atthe sky. And then email [e-mail]

(08:17):
with your thoughts, concerns,questions, questions for gear Abby
and. And your love letters andyour venmos. You know, anything you
want to send to us withinreason, we're ready for it.
Everything goes tomyrockfightmail.com gear Abby. Questions.
Send them in. We're alreadyrecording episodes, so you may as
well send in some questions.If you want to talk to schnitzbahn,
send it in. You want to answerto. You want to say I'm a dick for

(08:39):
saying that there might bedoping in ultra running, Send it
in. We want to hear it.
Definitely send that one in.The opening shot on today's episode
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(10:06):
Salty. When did Lem's get so sexy?
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That's right, the new teddyfrom Lem's Shoes. Okay, first story
of the week. Lots of bigmountain and alpinism news this week,
starting with a story in theTimes about Italian climber Marco
Confort. Confortolo ConformaConfortola. I was putting the accent

(10:29):
in the wrong place.Confortola, who is being accused
of using Stolo andphotoshopped images to fake a number
of his climbs. Confortolaannounced last month that he has
ascended all 14 of the world's8,000 meter peaks, a feat that was
considered to be even moreimpressive considering he lost all
of his toes after a climb onK2 in 2008. Another climan, Simone

(10:50):
Moro, alleges that ConFrotolomade up six of his ascents by photoshopping
himself into the summit photosof other climbers. I'll link the
article in the show notes soour listeners can see an example
of which is. I mean, it'spretty damning if you look at the
one that the example theygave. So what do you think here,
Shantae? I personally want tonot care about big mountain accomplishments

(11:13):
anymore.
We know.
Well, I think it's cool and ithappens, but I also don't think someone
should be lauded for somethingthey didn't do.
Well, sure. I mean, first Ijust want to know, Marco, did you
use a Strava mule for these?It feels like this is the test case,
Right?
Can you imagine that phonecall? Listen, here's what I need
you to do. Have you heard of Kenchachanga?

(11:35):
Are you into ltse?
Yeah. Are you willing to buyan international.
Plane ticket for many of them?In fact, are you willing to lose
at least one, if not three toes?
Maybe die? We don't know.
Yeah, up to you, you know.Okay, so, so. So, jokes aside, I
think it's pretty ballsy ofSimone Moro, who is a very highly
regarded alpinist himself. Heis. This isn't just some chump on

(11:58):
the side of the street beinglike, that guy's a liar. Or, you
know, he, you know, for him tomake the accusations, I doubt he'd
do it without feeling prettysure of it. You know, he kind of
line lists some of the reasonswhy the photos, yada, yada, I don't
know. But also, I honestlylike what I get from this is that
I hate that big mountainsespecially have become this so hissing

(12:18):
match. Yeah, I did it bigger,faster, better than you, and my style
was more pure and blah, blah,blah, who gives a shit? Who cares?
I mean, here I'm with you onthis because where is the intrinsic
motivation? Why is it alwaysabout men and their egos? Sorry.
That really is what a lot ofthis boils down to. I love the mountains.
I love pushing my own limitsout there, which are admittedly far,
far lower than either of thoseguys limits. But I have zero desire

(12:42):
to turn my experiences in themountains into some sort of competition.
I don't. You know, I'll poston Instagram some pretty shots with
some very, like, vague, youknow, wordy, you know, flowery thing
that I've thought of. Butthat's really just a log for me to
be able to go back and seethese places and to share it with
the people who follow me andlike, hey, you know, I don't even

(13:02):
usually say where I'm at. It'sjust a vibe. But it's this whole
idea of the mountains as apissing match of like using them
to boost your ego that reallybothers me. And I don't. I don't
love that. And so it's like, Ireally hope this guy didn't make
this up. But if you look atthe, that, that photo you're talking
about, it's the cropped. Theone right where it looks like he
cropped off of the other guys.I mean, that's from a summit a couple

(13:24):
years back, but, you know,it's. It doesn't sound great. And
it's like, come on, buddy, Ireally hope you didn't like make
this up. It's hard enough todo this stuff and to do any 8,000
meter peak, much less all ofthem. And I sure hope you're not.
This is the whole idea ofstolen valor. Right?
Right.
Don't be that guy.
Yeah, I mean, like I say, I'mnot. I'm. I'm trying to not care
as much about this stuff. Ithink that's partly. That's a very

(13:46):
us way of approaching it.Because, you know, I prefer like
my outdoor experiences to befor me. That's why I'm on a podcast
every week talking about themclearly. Right. But the like.
Tell me more about yourexperiences, Colin.
I need everyone to know aboutthe hour long mountain bike ride
that I did this weekend. Boy,was it epic. No, but the thing to
remember here too, and I'mkind. I am kind of here for this
in a lot of ways. Nothing yousaid is wrong, but it is a competitive

(14:09):
sport, especially in Europe.Right? They hand out the golden ice
axe. I don't want to. Is itthe Pla d'? Or? Yeah. Right. And
so if you're. Simone. SimonMorrow. God, I'm terrible at the
name today. Sorry, everybody.But it's. You might be pissed because
like, what if you've donesomething really cool this year and
this guy's like, hey, check meout. Here I am on Lozi. And it's

(14:31):
like, no, man, that picturewas taken by somebody else six years
ago. I see why it gets to thispoint because it does become a. It
is a pissing match because itis competitive, because it is people
taking things away from eachother. Now we have another conversation,
if that's worth it. Becauseit's one thing when it's a sport
in a controlled environmentand there's trainers around to help
people get hurt. It's anotherthing where people are going up to

(14:53):
8,000 meters and potentiallydying to accomplish these things,
only to then argue about itbased off of photographs that come
out as well. But I do see whymaybe this becomes a big deal for
some folks.
Oh, yeah, no, not at all totake away from Simone. Just saying,
hey, man, I'm calling you outon this it's. Yeah, it is, it's just.

(15:14):
It's not the way I enjoy thesport. I think alpinism is an incredible
pursuit. You know, I verylightly engaged in it myself, but
not anywhere near that level.But I think that it's. It's incredible
to watch the things people doaccomplish and that the way the human.
I mean, I remember when EdVisters did all those peaks without
oxygen. I thought it's apretty incredible feat. And. But

(15:37):
there was a bit of a humilityto how he talked about it. And so,
you know, even though it isthis kind of of big groundbreaking
thing, yada yada. And you see,you know, the, there's people who
go up these peaks every day.You've got the local Sherpa and other
folks who are local in thisregion that are going up and climbing
these peaks all the time withtheir clients. They've barely get
the glory. I mean, we've seena couple Sherpas sort of step into

(15:59):
the spotlight, but it's reallyabout these other people getting
up there and being like, I didit better, I did it faster, I did
it more. And I just.
I know, I know what we'regoing to do.
Okay, we're going to start.Are we having a climb off?
Yeah, basically we're going todo the World Mountaineering League,
right. And there's going to beregional competitions and then every

(16:21):
year you get. This will alsohelp. Our next story is going to
be about, you know, reducingcrowding on Everest. And it's like,
this is going to help withthat because it's going to be like,
all right, listen, you'regoing to get to the point where you're
going to have two people thatget through. We can do a men's and
women's division, whatever wewant to do. And we set them off at
the same time. And whoevergets to the summit, then you get
the golden axe.
You know, I want to know whocan do it the most stylishly, like

(16:41):
who's out there wearing their.We were just talking about Owen,
perhaps the stylish Owen. Likemaybe someone's out there dressed
in business CAs and you know,they could show us something we don't
know.
Think about what Kai Lenny isdoing in surfing. When you see like
these big wave surfers andthey're going down the face of these
monster waves that could liketake out a city if they broke in

(17:01):
the right place. And peopleare clinging to like, I just gotta
get to the end of this wave. Idon't wanna get dest. And then Kylani's.
Are they like doing aerialsand like zipping around and stuff
like that? It's like. So Ithink that we need a little that
mountaineering, you know, whatare you doing? Make it entertaining
for the crowd.
Yeah, I just, I'm just sick ofseeing people like beat each other,
beat each other up over thesecontrived things. I mean, yeah, move

(17:26):
on, get on with your life. Doyour thing. Don't let someone else's
bullshit steal from your shine.
Our next story. According toan article on BBC.com in an effort
to reduce the impact on MountEverest, Nepal is making it free
to climb 97 other mountains intheir portion of the Himalaya range.
Nepalese Everest permit willcost you $15,000 starting in September.

(17:46):
And eight of the world's 10highest mountains are in Nepal. So
this is an opportunity to luresome of that traffic away from the
world's highest mountain. Inthe last two years, only 68 permits
were issued for those 97 nowfree peaks. So, you know, obviously
there wasn't a lot of demand.But I think Nepal is hoping that
the free permits will have animpact and lure some of those climbers
off of Everest. You know, whatdo you think about Nepal pimping

(18:08):
some of these other peaks?Should we go climb one of these mountains?
Like, hey, it's free, let'sgo. It's free. Yeah, we just have
to fly over there and takesome time off work and. No, I mean,
we should have a mountain.Yeah, exactly. Lims the shoe of the
Himalaya. We'll work on it.Guys, I've got some ideas, but no,
I mean, mountains are thebest. You know what, I would love

(18:30):
to. I just watched some stuffset in Switzerland the other night
and all I wanted to do is jumpinto my tv. So anyway. But I mean,
honestly, I highly doubt thisis going to relieve any of the pressure
on Everest. The only thingthat's going to relieve the pressure
on Everest is them shuttingdown Everest and saying, you cannot
climb here right now from thisside of the. You know. And both countries
that have access would need todo that. Rich people, heavily sponsored

(18:53):
athletes are going to justkeep doing what they do. It is a
beacon, it is a magnet. Andthere's a reason people haven't really
flocked to these other peaks.And that's because, like, everybody
is aiming for this big cookiethat is Everest. So I don't know.
I have to believe that any. Iwould love to go anywhere in the
Himalayas. So I am, I am thetarget audience here. I've always
wanted to go. I would be happyto go to a peak that I can go visit

(19:17):
for free and I wouldn't mindpaying for it. Just not 15,000.
And I can walk up and I can.
Crucial difference. Yeah, youcan. We could teach you how to swing
some ice. No, no.
And I've done. I've climbedsome big mountains, like, but it
just, you know, I wouldrather, I want like, you know, Rainier,
Shasta level, like, you know,you know, sort of mountaineering.

(19:38):
I don't, I don't want middle aged.
Mountaineering is what you mean.
I love that. Let's start that.
Yeah, I think it's a greatidea. I'm in. I mean, I've hiked,
I've hiked Kilimanjaro. Iwould not call that mountaineering
in any, any respect of theword. But I did like the idea of
climbing in another country.That was pretty fun. But yeah, anyway,
I mean, I am curious, like, mythought is what kind of infrastructure

(20:00):
exists that may or may notexist in these less traveled areas?
So if they're saying only 68people in two years have even applied
for a permit in these places,how remote is it? And you can imagine
the Himalaya are prettyremote. Can these places sustain
a big increase in traffic?
Are they just expecting like,no one to show up? Like someone goes

(20:21):
to get like, oh, yeah, no, weweren't serious about that. Go climb
Everest.
Yeah, come for free. We'llgive you all a free outfit. If, you
know, no one's going to.
Come see that half dead yak,you can, you can use that.
Yak. That's such a sad image.I don't know. But it does make me
think about how people becomereally obsessed with climbing a particular

(20:41):
peak. You know, down here byus, I'd say Baldy is that way, Whitney
a little further north. Orpeople who hike the same trail, you
know, year after year. A lotof people do this on the John Muir
Trail, New Mopo, for instance.These are awesome places. But you
know, in Everest, you know,the whole region is. I, like I said
I would always. I've beenwanting to go there since I was a

(21:01):
kid. But have you consideredperhaps that there are other places
that are amazing as well? Andalso, how about you stop hogging
all the permits to theseplaces? Not Everest, because there's
nobody hogging a $15,000permit. But, but it's the same mindset.
It's like, that's the one. Ionly want that one. I don't care
about the rest of them. I mustonly get this one. You know what?
There's pretty. There's prettyincredible places in the same vicinity.

(21:22):
You don't get a JMT permit.Oh, my gosh. Go hike. This is the
High Sierra route. Go hikeyour own. Make your own loop. Even
better. It doesn't need tohave a name.
Way more fun too, by the way.
Yeah, way more fun. I've doneit a million times. It's just go
out there and seek beautywherever it may be. And it may be
a free mountain in the Himalaya.
I don't want to spoil myparting shot, but there is. There
is definitely some. There'sjust, There's. There's a mindset,

(21:45):
I guess, is that of peoplethat the way they kind of approach
these things and it's, youknow, I think it takes visiting some
of those kind of classicplaces after a while and then seeing.
Seeing that like, oh, butactually I did this other thing,
which was maybe not as hard,maybe it was harder, whatever. But
just for whatever reason,doesn't have the notoriety that the
one thing that that otherthing did.
It's the notoriety.
You get sucked in. I mean,it's funny. Like, I tell people there's

(22:06):
a little tiny mountain behindmy house in the wintertime. I give
them, look at Catalina islandin one direction and then the other
direction, I'm looking at,like, the San Bernardino is covered
in snow and. And everything,and all the deserty kind of peaks
in between. And it's like,that's great.
It doesn't get much betterthan this.
You know what I mean?
I agree 100%. I mean, there's.I went up just. I was up in Mammoth
Lakes this weekend, and I wentup one morning up the Duck Pass Trail

(22:30):
and did a loop up there.
It's like the only place I'vebeen in the Sierra, by the way, that
area. Yeah, great area.
Wow. We have to expand your vision.
Agree.
There's some incredible stuff.But, yeah, just. I've been up there
a million times. I've donethat trail a million times, but it
doesn't, you know, I decidedto do something off the beaten path.
And I was like, I don't know,we'll see if I like. And I loved
it. I was so glad that I did adifferent route this time. And I

(22:51):
was like, oh, all these timesI've done the same old, same old
when I could have had. It justtriggers something in your brain,
that idea of novelty,something you haven't seen before.
Open. Open your minds. Well, Ithink we Will come back to this a
little bit, but I think peopleneed to expand the way they view
outdoor objectives.
The classics are great for theclassics. Like, I mean, that's why
I hiked Baldy a few weeks ago.I hadn't done it before, and it's

(23:12):
like, I hadn't spent any timesort of in that area of the mountains.
Like, all right, what am Igoing to do? I've never been there
before. I'll go hike Baldynow. It's like, okay, now I kind
of see what this area is allabout. And when you look on the map
and you look at the differenttrip reports or whatever, you can
start to kind of be like, oh,I see. What's peak doing over here?
Oh, the elevation gate's kindof the same as like, bal. Okay. I
kind of know what to expect,but it looks like probably way fewer
people. People are going tothis spot and it just like, yeah,

(23:34):
go check it out. But then,anyway, I'm giving advice.
Yeah, I mean, I'll. To wrap upthe segment, I. Years ago, I wrote
a piece for Alpinist magazinewhen RJ Secor, who wrote the classic
Sierra Peaks Passes Trailsbook that everybody. It's like the
bible of the Sierra. When hepassed, I wrote about him. And I

(23:55):
wrote about this concept ofwalking through the Sierra, hiking
through, climbing up in theSierra and looking at things and
wondering, like, what is itlike there? What is it like here?
Looking at a map andwondering, what is it like? And there
was always this idea that RJhad said he liked knowing that there
were peaks out there that hedidn't know or that maybe people
had never been on. And I cameaway feeling that same feeling. Like,

(24:18):
I like that there's a littlemystery, but I also like that I can
continue expanding myexperience. Experience out there.
So anyway, we know what thatmeans. Yeah.
It's time for the rock fightlightning round. All right, first
story. According to a CBS Newsstory, a Japanese hiker was found

(24:41):
dead after a bear dragged himfrom the trail into the forest o'.
Shantae. Between bison, goringand this story, are the animals starting
to turn against us?
I mean, maybe rightfully so. Imean, I feel awful for that guy.
That had to have been soterrifying and how horrible for the
people who love him. But,yeah, I mean, at the end of the day,
we're kind of screwing withtheir habitat and ours, so I get

(25:02):
why they're a little saucy,you know?
Well, it continues, right? Wehad a lot of animal interactions
in the lightning round.Because ABC News has reported that
a hiker in Tennessee has diedafter picking up and being bitten
by a rattlesnake. Theoperative part of that sentence is
picking up the rattles.Rattlesnake. Now the death was likely
because of an allergicreaction to the snake's venom. So

(25:23):
Shantae, are the some hikersjust making this too easy for the
animals?
Maybe we need to in order toget the point across, make a new
rattlesnake emblazoned flagthat just says don't pick me up.
Like I have a dog that doesn'tlike people. We put a little handkerchief
around his neck that's likedon't pet me. You know, kind of like,
hey, we need to put.
I appreciate that when peopledo that. I don't touch the dog. I
don't even say hi buddy. Hilittle buddy. I want that.

(25:45):
No, he doesn't want that. ThenI'm telling you, he doesn't want
that. So we need volunteers togo out and put little anchor shifts
around all the rattlesnakes.
And on the bison, those can be bigger.
Yes. All right, last lightninground story. According to the Coast
Guard's 2024 recreationalboating statistics, boating deaths
are at a 50 year low. However,not when it comes to stand up and

(26:07):
paddling. In an article onpaddlingmag.com about those coast
Guard stats, stand upPaddleboarding saw a 164 increase
in fatalities from 2023 to2024. Shantae, are animals using
the sups to take us out?
It's the orcas. Oh my God. 164increase in sub deaths basically
just confirms what I feltlike. The one and only time I got

(26:31):
on a paddle board and wobbledmy way down the dish, which is. Oh
God. This is how I die.
Really?
Yeah.
So fun.
I. You know what? I think itwould be fun if you're not me any
other person. I got up thereand the entire time where you know,
we're floating down and in myhead I'm like, this is supposed to
be fun, right? People lovedoing this. I could tell it's a good

(26:52):
workout. I enjoyed that partof it. But it took a good five minutes
for my legs to stop feelinglike jello. And then the whole time
I just realized my butt wasclenched. Like the next day. Weird
muscles hurt because I was soclenchy. I loved it when we just
got on our knees to float backthe rest the of.
Well, by the way, that that164%, it was literally like like
11 to 29. So it wasn't like.

(27:14):
Yeah, but it's not like 750people are dying. But I think I would
be number 12. So I feel likeI'm glad I've given that ghost up.
Today's top stories on therock fight are brought to you by
Oboz, who wants to share theirlove of hiking. And we want to help
them by uncovering all thedifferent reasons we love to take
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(27:36):
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Always. Number two, CampfireSmoke is the original cologne. Ah.
Do you like that smell? Youlike coming and smelling like campfire
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I love it. I love when I comeback from a trip and all my stuff
just still smells weakslightly. I honestly love it, but

(27:59):
I'm a freak that way. Allright, number three, you enjoy the
moment your boots officiallysmell like adventure. That I don't
like.
You don't like that?
Pass on.
You don't want your boots tosmell like adventure?
Nope.
What should they smell like?
They should smell neutral. Iwant them to smell neutral. I don't
want to smell them. I don'teven wear boots, so I'm fine.

(28:20):
There's a tip. Oboes work onthe adventures. Normal neutral smell.
I need neutral smelling oboes.That's next on your list. So anyway.
But number four, I see whereyou've gone with this.
You like this.
Yeah. And your boots willdefinitely smell like adventure if
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(28:43):
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(29:05):
quality footwear for the trailand the cupid to the outdoor world.
Oboz love hiking.
All right, main story today. Arecent post on the website Halfwayanywhere
poses the question for ourmain story today. If you're not familiar
with Halfway Anywhere, as Iwasn't until just a few days ago.
A few hours ago, actually.It's the website for thru hiker Tyler
Fox. And in a post that wentup last month, Fox makes the case

(29:27):
that the triple crown ofhiking is Dumbledore Dumb Fox makes
an interesting case that isn'treally about the Triple Crown, but
about the made up accoladesthat those of us in the adventure
community tend to put anoutsized importance on. I might fall
into that camp, maybe.
I believe you do.

(29:49):
In this case, it's thebragging rights that some cling to,
and I'm paraphrasing and kindof summarizing it, but basically
the bragging rights that somecling to after they hike the at the
CDT and the pct. So, Shantae,let's do a little quick test, right?
As someone who spent a lot oftime in the PCT and has been on parts,
if not all of these trails,you come across an Instagram profile

(30:10):
of someone, maybe you knowthem, maybe you don't. But in the
bio of this profile are thewords Triple Crown backpacker or
Triple Crown hiker. Maybe italso has the year in which they completed
each trail. What is your kneejerk reaction as a backpacker?
I mean, honestly, at thispoint I don't even notice it because
so many hikers list out notjust the Triple Crown, they'll list

(30:31):
out any hike, like longer hikethat they've done and the year that
they completed it. So it'sbecome sort of, and I don't mean
this in a negative way, butit's become background noise. So
I'm not looking at somebody'sprofile and saying like, oh wow,
it's just there. And don't getme wrong, it is a huge accomplishment
to cover thousands of miles oftrail, especially for those people

(30:52):
who somehow bang it out in ayear doing what's called a calendar
year Triple Crown. Thatrequires crazy planning, endurance,
and honestly, a little bitmore than a bit of favor from the
weather gods. But I don'tthink more or less of you if you've
hiked the AT ct, PCT or anyother trail. I just think you've
probably done a much betterjob than I have of prioritizing hiking
over anything else in yourlife. And honestly, I'm a little

(31:14):
bit jealous of that.
Well, that might be whatthey're going for, right?
Yeah. Get it, buddy. Get it.I've got some bills to pay, but I
mean, for me, what's specialabout hiking long trails? So yeah,
you're right. I have been onall three of those trails and others.
But what's special about themis being able to sort of be immersed
in the outdoors and the simpleact of walking, which is one of my

(31:36):
favorite things to do has beensince I was a kid. And it's it's
an unusual experience to beable to spend weeks or even months
on foot. I really do think,and I know for me, I find a lot of
camaraderie with other peoplewho've done that. It's a very unique
experience, does change youand shape you in ways that you couldn't
comprehend beforehand. But forlike, I don't judge anyone based

(31:58):
on that and for anybody whodoes, you know, judge people and
there are many people who doon what you have or haven't hiked.
Like, how many people, whenthey meet me and they know I hike,
will be like, well, what longtrails have you done? It's, it's
crazy how common that is inthe through hiking community.
I think that's what he'sgetting at, right? It's sort of like
this sort of. Yeah, and thatpart. And that's, listen, in terms

(32:19):
of the take it itself, likefar be it for me to look down my
nose at a hot take becauselike, I'm the guy who said that,
you know, mountain bikesuspension is pointless and skiing
at a resort is not an outdooractivity. So I am definitely a. Yeah,
you.
Are the king of hot take.
I like the hot take. I like, Ilike putting a controversial topic
out there into the outdoorcommunity and receiving back both

(32:41):
the laughs, high fives and thehate that comes with it. Where I
have maybe it's a bit of asort of a half baked hot take in
a lot of ways because I thinkthe, you know, the triple crown of
it all, like, and he kind ofdefends like doing the triple crown
of calendar year. Like that'sokay. Like, look at the end of the
day, all of these things, it'sall arbitrary. It's all the same,
right? It's. This is thebackpacking through hiking equivalent

(33:02):
of the 13.1, 26.2, you know,sticker on the back of a car. I hate
those too. I mean, do youreally? Well, okay, that sounds terrible.
Such a hater. I feel like Isay that once an episode now.
This is great. It's working.The. No, but it's not that I hate
it and I appreciate the urgeand the want to celebrate the accomplishment,

(33:23):
but I think there are just toomany people out there who kind of
have that sort of this sort ofimplication that you are a lesser
than backpacker unless you cananswer that question. And there's
enough for every sort of, youknow, single mom who's working and
has a job and kids andeverything else, who does a marathon
and is so proud of that andthey put the sticker in the car,
which is like. That is like,yes, good for you. Made that Time

(33:44):
to make that happen. In theface of all these challenges, there
is absolutely some douchebagwho probably leaves his kid in the
VIP tent.
Of the Iron man for 10 hours.
Possibly who's prioritizingthat 26.2.
Right.
And I just, generallyspeaking, I don't really know what
stickers like that, or evenkind of takes like this are supposed
to sort of elicit from me.Like, what's the reaction you want

(34:05):
me to have? Cuz it's like apolitical sticker. Like if I see
the opposing campaign stickeron a car, am I supposed to go, man,
you know, kind of like thatguy now? Like, no, like, what are
you trying to do with thisinfo? What am I supposed to do with
the information?
All right. In some people'sdefense, I don't have these things
listed in my bio, but I thinkthat some people do this because

(34:27):
it does. You become part of acommunity. And so if you think about
the ways we exist in thisworld, people really do. Most people
want to belong to something.Totally. I mean, it's why people
join gangs. That is the honesttruth. It is, it's sense of belonging,
protection, things like that.But it's this idea of being a part
of something larger thanyourself. So I do think that when

(34:48):
people, you know, have theseachievements and they choose to list
them out, that's. That's abeacon for other people who either
have done them or want to,that you are. We're like kind of,
there's some overlap for us inthis world. We somehow cross paths.
And so I think it's the samewith those 26.2 stickers and things
like that. It's. It's the sameconcept. So I think for some people

(35:11):
it really is about that. It'sabout broadcasting to other people.
Like, hey, I think we might belike the same kind of people. Do
you see me? I see you. Andthen, yeah, there's gonna be the
douchebags. And so like, forme, it doesn't, I don't ever. I've
had people say they don't wantto go backpacking with me because
they're like, oh, well, you'vedone long trails and you know, you're

(35:33):
so accomplished as abackpacker, blah, blah, blah, whatever
that means. I'm like, but Iwant to spend time with you. That's
why I'm asking you. It remindsme of when, when I very first met
Liz Thomas. Liz Snorkel.Thomas, who's a very accomplished
through hiker, a book author,and she's the co founder and runs
Treeline Review.
Shout out, Liz Thomas.
Shout out to Liz, one of my.My favorite hiking buddies. But when

(35:57):
Liz and I first met, it was. Iwas interviewing her for. I don't
remember if it was for outsideor somebody. And she wanted to go
hiking. And I was like, oh, mygosh, I can't hike with you. You've
set fast, you've set fkts,like on the Appalachian Trail, you've
created routes, and I can'tkeep up with that. And she convinced
me. We went on a waterfallhike after we became friends, and

(36:19):
I was kind of huffing to keepup with her, and I could see her
slow down this, like, casuallope and I'm just like, mouth breathing
behind her. And I said, hey,if you want to go ahead, I'll meet
you up there. And she's like,no, the whole point is that I want
to walk with you. Like, yeah,sure, I can do all these badass things,
but the point is being together.
I could totally smoke you onthis trail, but I don't want to right

(36:40):
now.
Know she could. And then.Yeah. And then I eventually. Then
we eventually started doinglike, crazy long shit together and.
And I got on her. I got on herspeed. I could never set enough kt,
but I finally was able tocrack the code and hike long days
with Liz.
But what I find fascinatingabout this topic is I feel like the
more you do outdoors and themore you sort of get into this, because

(37:02):
I. I was that guy. I've talkedabout this in the podcast before.
If I. You go back and look atmy, like, Facebook memories from
like 2008, and 98% of them aremy, you know, quote unquote humble
rags about like, oh, I'm gonnago do this mountain. And I'm just
sitting there reading them nowgoing, oh, Colin, you were such a
douchebag. What were youthinking? And it was exactly what
you're saying. It was the. Iwant the people who don't do this

(37:23):
stuff to think, wow, thatguy's a badass. And the people who
do that stuff to be like, ah,he's one of us. And what I feel like
I've learned from continuingto live and do these sports is actually
the more confident you get,the less you feel like you have to
say anything.
Yep.
And I think that's. I thinkthat's part of the point that Tyler's
trying to make here is alittle bit of that kind of like,
yeah, this may be for somepeople, this doesn't quite, to your

(37:43):
point, doesn't really meanwhat you think it means or should
be, maybe have such anoutsized importance that it does.
And I just, and I don't reallyknow what the so what of this is
because I think there is a. Ithink that's sort of like the next
evolution of like, hey, thisis. I'm doing this for me and it
betters my life. And if itcomes up, I'm happy to talk with
you about it. But for the mostpart, I don't need to sort of like
meet you and say, oh, so youhave not hiked the triple crown as

(38:08):
I have. Yeah. You think by theend of the third trail you'd be like,
hey, cool man, I'm good now, right?
Yeah. I have nothing to prove.Well, that's the thing is that I
think I've talked, talkedabout this a lot when I do a lot
of presentations and educationand, and I say to people, like, if
you're going to go off on, youknow, for instance, a long trail.
Yeah.
Think about before you headout there. Yeah, you've got logistics

(38:29):
and prep and physical prep andeverything to do before you go out
there. But do a little bit ofsoul searching as well, because you
have to understand why you'redoing this. Are you doing this to
prove a point to somebody? Areyou doing this to show off? Are you
doing this for a feather inyour cap? Then you're going to hit
some real issues. If you startto have problems on the trail, if
you have to leave early, thatcan really screw somebody if they

(38:49):
have to leave an endeavor,whether it's a through hike or bike
packing or whatever it is,early. If you're not firmly rooted
in why you're out there, andif the only reason you're out there
is for the carrot at the endof the trail, that's gonna be. You're
gonna feel the sting of thatat the end. Like there wasn't anything
deeper. And I think for mostpeople there is something deeper,
but some people just don't gothere. They don't understand, like,

(39:11):
what is my real motivation fordoing this? You know, it goes back
even to that whole likeconquering the mountain business
that you and I have talkedabout. Like, I, I hate that language.
You're not conquering themountain. Doesn't care that you're
there. It's something insideof you. So I just say like, you know,
know why you're going to dothese things and have a deeper meaning
than just because somebodysaid I should do it or because I

(39:32):
want to be better than otherpeople. Like, there's got to be something
deeper motivating you.
Yeah. And then eventually justend up paying $15,000 for a Everest
permit to go stand in line at8200 meters or whatever it is. So.
Sounds like fun.
Good times.
Very expensive fun.

(39:55):
All right, time for theparting shot. Do you want to. You
want to go first? Yours is alittle bit more serious than mine.
Mine is more serious. Yeah.No, it's just so. Yeah, I love. I
love ending on a Colin. AColin rant. So I can't wait to hear
what you have to say. I knowthe topic. I didn't. Didn't read
your notes on it, but here.My. My little parting note is the
other day I got a message fromwriter, podcaster, TV host Bharatunde

(40:19):
Thurston, who is an awesomedude if you don't follow him on social
media. At the very least, you should.
Yeah, I got this update too,from him, and it's. His stuff is
always amazing.
He's always spot on. Andthat's why, like, I. I'll always
listen when he says something.So he was telling me about the upcoming
Katrina 20 impact ride. So Imet Bharatunde a couple years ago
when I was on the very firstepisode of his PBS show, America.

(40:42):
Speaking of humble br. Namedrop a little bit here.
No, no, I'm gonna. I'm gonnacome back to it, but not to me, but
to it as a concept. Butanyway, since, I mean, he's always
impressed me as a thinker and.And a doer. He's like the big idea
guy that actually gets shitdone. And he really does believe,
and I believe him, that we canall do better by ourselves in the

(41:02):
planet, especially if we findthese sort of commonalities and work
together. Anyway, so what hewas reaching out to us about, he
said, you know, it's been 20years since Hurricane Katrina, which
is wild to think about, reallyis. And in observance of that anniversary,
Taproot Earth, which is aclimate justice nonprofit based in
the Southern US Is organizinga collective action that asks people

(41:25):
to join up with others. Theyespecially encourage this to be a
collective thing, a communitything, to bike, paddle, run, walk,
roll, otherwise move 7 milessometime during the week of August
24th to the 31st, which isnext week. 7. The 7 miles represents
the 144 miles swath ofdestruction that Katrina caused,

(41:45):
divided by the 20 years of itsaftermath. Now and you can also donate
to Taproot if you want tosupport their community based work
where they're creatingsolutions to issues brought by climate
change. It's a pretty coolorganization and it really feels
like human, like on a humanlevel, people led, which I think
is what we need to see,especially as the, you know, systems
around us are kind of failingus. Anyway. That's all to say it's

(42:09):
fun to do things like climbpeaks and participate in races and
hike long trails for their ownsake, but I always appreciate it
when people use these effortsto kind of amplify and, and fund
some sort of greater good. SoI'm going to encourage people to
head over to Taproot Earth,that is their website, learn a bit
more about what they do in theKatrina 20 impact ride. And if you

(42:29):
haven't, I'm bringing it back.If you have not watched either season
of America Outdoors withBaratunde, it is honestly such a
fantastic show. I loved it somuch. I was probably the weakest
link. I mean, he basicallytravels around the country and meets
with people who have variousconnections to the land along with
honestly very diverseperspectives that might not agree
with your own. But he managesto find the connective tissue that

(42:52):
sort of binds us all togetherin ways that I think are surprising
sometimes. My episode was thefirst one in the first season set
in Death Valley and I took himto Darwin Falls to talk about water
in the desert. But also thisidea of Death Valley being a dead
place, it's not really. And itwas probably one of my favorite outdoor
experiences in my entire life.He is such a lovely person. It was

(43:14):
such a lovely thing to do. Soyeah, go watch that. Even if you
don't watch my episode. It'san amazing show.
Well, unfortunately can't seeit anymore because we've defunded
pbs. So.
Yeah, also speaking of fundingthings we care about.
Yeah. All right, well, I'mgoing to bring us back down to Earth
now because my parting shot isnot nearly as good as your parting
shot. So last week we talkedabout Killian Jornay's new 14 or

(43:38):
link up project.
Here in the US which you're soexcited about.
So excited about it. And alsowas excited to learn that also last
week Killian Jornay hosted aReddit AMA chante. Coincidence? Not
at all, actually. But duringthe ama, someone asked Killian the
following question. Questionwas, hey, Killian Coloradan here.

(44:00):
Which 14ers do you plan to door are the most excited about? To
which Killian answered, I'mexcited about all of them. No, seriously.
Probably the most technical orthe most exciting because there's
always some more spice and funto it. So in Colorado, probably around
Longs, Sangre de Cristo, elks,and in California, the High Sierra
is the most technical of all.But then the daily adventures make

(44:23):
them all special. But thereyou have it, Colorado people. Your
endurance, Lord and savior,declared California the most technical
of all. Oh, how this must burnfor the Colorado 14er obsessives.
And by the way, I do want tosay the whole column, the whole fourteener
phenomena is completelyarbitrary and weird and no one else
cares about something thatthey have zero control over. Like

(44:45):
14 or obsessives do. But anyway.
Wait, wait. What do they havezero control over?
It's just. They're just mountains.
Oh, you mean their height. Itjust is what it is, people like a
list, man. It gives yousomething to frame your objectives
around. It's like. I don't know.
You're right.
Listen, I spent a year. Myfriend brooke found a 1947 Girl Scout
handbook. And yeah, it was soincredible. A hundred different badges

(45:08):
listed in there. We decided tospend a year trying to earn as many
as we could on our. You know,following the directions in the book.
Harder than you'd think, Ibet. But very hard. We blogged about
it. It was called Year of theScout. It's actually still on the
Internet. If you. Maybe thatshould be your next book. That's
what my publisher would likeme to write about. But that's actually
how I got my. My book deal wasthey. My. Casey sent them my book

(45:32):
and. Or my blog or blog about it.
Oh, it's amazing.
Anyway. But that was a. That'sa totally arbitrary thing to do.
I love. I don't know. I'm not.I can't slag on. For framing their
objectives around concrete things.
You are 100% right. But I dofind it funny because the only people
who really care about 14ersare people in Colorado.
I think you're right. Yeah.There's not. It's not the same here.
We have a lot of them, butit's not the same here.

(45:53):
No one's in Washington goinglike, oh, Rainier, that 14,000 foot
volcano. They're like, no,it's the big freaking volcano. People
climb it, you know?
Yeah, Whitney, People justclimb. Because it's. Whitney, they
don't even think of it.Barely. People use the term fourteener
in California. I think itreally is a Colorado thing. I remember
being out there and climbingfourteeners. And having to say the
word fourteener a lot. And Iwas like, man, we just don't say

(46:14):
this much, us Mount Langley.That 14.
No, I mean, there's 58 ofthem. Right? I mean, that's why.
And it's like. I mean, andthat's why in the northeast, there's
the 4,000 foot. I get it. Butjust remember, though, when Killian
is speeding through Colorado,it's because he's biding his time
before arriving where he trulywants to be, which is California.
Oh, burn. I love you, Colorado.

(46:38):
I love you too, Colorado. Igenuinely do. I just love. I love
poking Colorado because theythink they're so cool. Anyway, so
that's the show for today.Hey, we want your emails. Send us.
Send it to us. Coloradopeople. Send us your emails. Myrockfightmail.com
TheRockfight's a production ofRock Fight LLC. For Shante Salavera,
I'm Colin True. Thank you forlistening. I don't think he's climbing

(46:59):
14ers. Maybe he is. ChrisDemaikz is here to sing the Rock
Fight Fight song. We'll seeyou next time, rock fighters.
Rock fight. Rock fight. Rockfight. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock
fight. Welcome to the rockbike where we speak our truth Slay
sacred cows and sometimesagree to disagree we talk about human

(47:22):
powered outdoor activities andpig bites about topics that we find
interesting like pop culturemusic, the latest movie reviews,
ideas that aim for the headthis is where we speak our truth.
This is where we speak ourtruth. Rock fight. Rock fight. Rock

(47:43):
fight. Welcome to the Rockflight. Rock flight, Rock flight
Welcome to the Rock flight.Rock flight. Rock flight. Rock flight.
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