September 19, 2023 • 21 mins
Ever wondered how successful professionals maintain a work-life balance while ensuring safety in their field? Join us this week as we have Perry, a seasoned safety professional, who shares his intriguing strategies on managing work, family and personal care. Touched by faith, Perry starts his day with a sprightly morning routine and makes sure to have separate 'date days' with his daughters. He offers a refreshing take on how to counterbalance family time with high-demand occupations, and the significance of self-care in this mix.
Beyond that, we dive into Perry's perspective on cultivating a safety culture within his organization. Hear from him on the critical role of empowering employees to voice their concerns before an incident happens, and the importance of understanding an individual's risk tolerance to build a safety-focused environment. Perry highlights the significance of fostering trust and relationships in the workplace to ensure safety- a lesson he has learned from his rich experience in the field. Tune in to gain some truly eye-opening insights on creating a harmonious blend of safety, professionalism, and family life.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
In our business when I think about safety
professionals, I always like tohighlight who are those people?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
I think they're mothers, fathers, law
enforcement firemen, peoplebehind the scenes like people
who sell PPE.
They're a piece of us.
And then the connection withthe foreman superintendent
nurses.
You know all these people thathave to take care of somebody
(00:53):
when it comes to their lives,right, and I think we work as a
big part of our day.
So when you talk about eight,10, sometimes 12 hours, you only
have 12 more hours left.
You have to sleep, you haveyour family, you got to eat.
It's very hard, perry, in whatwe do, to come to work with too
(01:21):
much on your mind.
I guess what I wanna ask youhow is it that when you, you
know what does your day, howdoes your day start?
Do you take a breather in themorning?
I know you're a Christian.
I don't know if you read yourword in the morning.
I know I do, but you know whatdo you do to get your day
started off so that you'reprepared to serve people.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah, absolutely so.
Yeah, the first thing I do whenI get up is I do have the daily
verse that comes up on my Bibleapp, that you version app, and
it is something that I do everymorning.
I wanna make sure that that'show I start my day, and a little
bit of prayer and just, yeah,get going on my day starting
(02:05):
with that.
So, yeah, I am a Christian andI'm very proud to be serving you
know an amazing God, and, yeah,it's an important part of my
day because it does.
It starts it out in such animportant way that, yeah,
nothing goes first.
That's it.
(02:26):
That's the first thing thathappens in the morning for me.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Super, super, super important.
This was the attractive thingthat I think when me and Perry
first met.
You know, sometimes you knowthe spirit when they hit each
other.
It's a feeling man, and it's agenuine feeling and there's
really nothing we can do aboutit.
But when it's living insomebody that's so important,
(02:53):
it's cause it's nothing fake.
You know, you have really haveno control over it when it comes
out.
So when they meet up it'ssomething nice.
So really, really again glad tohave you.
I know you said you're married,you got a family some kids tell
us about that.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Yeah, my wife Stephanie.
We've been married, let's see,coming up on 19 years, and we've
known each other since 98, whenwe started going to college
together.
And then, yeah, after college,we started dating and then got
married in 2004.
And we didn't have kids foreight years.
(03:34):
So we now have two girls.
Zora is 12, or sorry, she's 11.
And so it seems like she'sgoing on 20.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
I know that feeling.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
And Hazel is eight years old.
She's actually turning ninehere in October.
Yeah, these girls are amazing.
So one quick thing I wannashare that this is something
that you and I haven't talkedabout, but just something really
cool.
That we're doing is I like todo date night or date day with
each one of my daughters, andthe way we make it work is the
(04:12):
first Saturday of each month ismy wife, we go on a date, and
then the second Saturday of themonth is my oldest daughter,
zora, and then the thirdSaturday is my youngest daughter
, hazel.
And then the fourth Saturday isfamily day night or day day,
whatever we decide to do andthen on the fifth Saturday if
(04:36):
there is a fifth Saturday,that's my day.
I get to do what I want.
So you know, video games.
Whatever I decide to do issomething I get to do on the
fifth, which is usually two orthree times a year at most.
But it's a fun thing we've beendoing for a few years now and
(04:56):
it's a way for me to be able toget a little closer to my
daughters each separately and beable to have that special time
with each one of them.
So it's a fun thing I get to dothere with my daughters, you
just gave us some strategieshere.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Sometimes.
You know I've been married for23.
And well, tell her congrats,because you know my first five
years was, you know, because ofme.
You know was rough man and I'msad to say that, but it is what
it is.
Man, and definitely we've grown.
(05:36):
But what you talk about you knowreally mixing it up in your
life Because at the end of theday, we come to work, we go home
, they see us less than our workdoes and we've got to really be
.
What do you want to say?
You've got to make sure youmake time for the family.
(06:01):
However it is that you do, Ireally like what you had.
You separate that relationshipand you spend that time.
But when I think, when the kidsand the wife are made important,
those extra four hours that youmay not be there, it doesn't
even matter, because they knowthat when their time is up, dad,
(06:24):
husband, is dedicated to me andthey're making sure they're
making time for me.
So I really think that'simportant because all the way
from the craft on up, we workmajor hours, especially during
the summer, and sometimes it cancreate relationship issues,
whether it's with the kids, thewife or whatever it may be.
(06:46):
So what you just hit on is likethese are the things that we
need to give the people that wecall our brothers and sisters,
these safety professionals thatyou.
There's nuggets that I hopethat we can get out of this
podcast right, and it doesn'talways have to be something
that's breaking down a cut orwhatever.
(07:08):
It's these other things that Idon't know if you talk enough
about them, and it's also thesethings that cause these this new
mental thing, this new mentalhealth and wealth and all these
things.
So I'm really glad that youbrought that up about your
family and how you make sure youare deliberate with making time
(07:29):
for them Awesome.
The other thing I wanna talkabout is so you came up with a
great idea, a great move forempowerment because, like we
were talking earlier last year,double the year before, which
(07:51):
was 2021, in deaths, and I would, if I can remember, three or
four of those were here andthere's a lot in Colorado, you
know, and I'm glad OSHA, I'mglad the government is sort of
picking up on the responsibilityand the accountability of
(08:15):
frontline supervisors, ownersand people that are watching
this very thing happen.
And I think it's so importantyou, me, everybody out there
watching that we have to beginto make sure that when there's
an accident happening, peopleare standing around watching it.
They are just as accountable.
And how do we motivate andempower them to speak up before
(08:42):
and not after?
Do you run into seeing?
When you come to the incident,you find out that like three or
four guys might have seensomething and it's like they're
really not involved, but theyare, because we always talk
about you have the right to sayno or stop work or this
(09:03):
responsibility that we reallywant our people to have, right
if you see something, saysomething, that culture that
really takes time for anorganization to really instill
that in their people.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
It's not gonna happen overnight.
And that's part of what our jobis in safety is to help really
change that mentality.
Or look at these guys and showthem the importance of a life
and really show them what thatrisk is on that for that job
(09:38):
that they're doing, that theycould get hurt or they could get
killed, and really understandthat not having that risk
tolerance Right.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
You know, when we talk about risk tolerance it's
some people don't understandthat a lot.
You know what that is, some ofit's.
You know part of how we werebrought up, what we do, what
we're into it's really what Ifind for myself is that when you
(10:11):
got a guy with a high risktolerance, my, I guess my
strategy is to teach the foremanor the superintendent to
recognize that.
Some of the things that Irecognize.
That may be simple stuff, butit's like when you see a guy
continually walk over a hazard,it's gonna become a problem at
(10:33):
one point.
Sometimes I think that I usedto be that foreman, that
superintendent.
You get so overwhelmed with whatis the priority.
I just had that one day saythat at the end of the day, I'm
working for a company whobelieves in safety, so I need to
be.
I need to have that first inmind and, plus, that's my job,
(10:58):
right?
So really trying to, like yousaid, just trying to reach out
to it, it really does.
It's sometimes frustrating.
It's nice to see progress butman, you're right, man, that
culture thing really it reallytakes time and you gotta do the
right things and if anythinggoes wrong it sets you back very
(11:21):
quickly whether you've beenworking on this thing for months
, years, and if one of themdon't trust you, man, it falls
out, it falls off, and then yougotta pick it back up to try to
run that through.
So, going back to this,thinking inside the box.
I was thinking about this lastnight and you know, I mean it's
(11:46):
crazy that thinking inside thebox and thinking outside the box
right, there's these twosayings that we brought up when
I was really thinking deep onthis and what I was thinking was
it's like us as safetyprofessionals and anybody who's
dealing with the plan of work.
We sort of really have to bethinking outside the box prior
(12:09):
to them getting in the box,because I think that if we can
keep them thinking inside thebox, we take the constraints
that actually make you thinkoutside of the box, which we
don't want them to do.
So I really I guess you knowgoing into this whole thing, did
(12:30):
you ever really think thatthinking inside the box had a
constraint to you?
That's a great question, becausewhen you, I didn't mean to cut
you off, but when you'reconstrained or you're put into a
place where you need to thinkabout some options, now you're
(12:51):
going to innovate.
The problem with thatinnovation is is it the right
innovation?
Because our people, we knowthey're a get it done type of
mentality.
Shall we say right, they'recreative, they're very creative,
but we need to make sure thatthey think inside the box.
Call us involve some people tomake sure that's the right thing
(13:13):
to do than to be spontaneous onbeing creative, because
sometimes that creativity mighthave been okay but some corners
weren't covered.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
So when you were thinking about this.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
Did that ever come to mind?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
Yeah, the little meaning.
With think inside the box Imean the obvious think inside
the trench box and think insidea safety device that's intended
to protect an employee and itcould be a shoring system.
But the original intent was atrench box because that's the
most common device, the easiestdevice to get our hands on in
(13:48):
our world.
But it's also the concept ofthinking inside the box.
We don't have to think outsidethe box, we don't have to think
about new, creative ideas.
This system that's beeninstalled over and over and over
works, so use what works.
Think inside the box because itworks, because this system has
already been designed by anengineer.
(14:08):
It's already something that canwork and will work if it's used
.
That's the important aspect ofthink inside the box.
Is that double meaning and howimportant it is to utilize a
system that works.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Wow, that's powerful.
So when this actually started,I was in a situation where come
up on a scene and guys were inthe box, but there were some
things that were going onoutside, about a foot and a half
outside Right, and when youlook outside the box and you
(14:43):
look at the edges, you can tellthey're not very stable.
So the innovation of the formand he stayed inside the box.
What he did was is he put marksinside the trench box so that
guys knew that I don't want youto go past this line.
(15:04):
And, man, it made a very, verybig difference because guys felt
that okay, maybe I got my legsin and I'm just going to just
create just a little bit, youknow.
But this here it created aboundary, is what it did, and
(15:25):
they were able to grasp it andutilize it throughout the rest
of the project and, like yousaid, staying inside that box,
it works.
You know, I just got to tweaksomething because you think,
just because you're here, okay,well, I'm going to take a foot
away from you.
Okay, I'm going to take a footaway from you.
(15:46):
Let me catch you going pasthere and I'm going to keep you
accountable to that.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
Well, that's normalizing what is actually the
compliance level, whereas whattypically happens on the job
site is they're normalizing alittle bit of deviance, right
Normalization of deviance Rightand a little bit of change over
time turns into large changeswhere people could get hurt.
Right, you know like an examplewould be.
(16:12):
Well, they left that trench boxoff the floor.
Maybe at first it's at two feet, because that's what the rule
is, but then all they'retweaking it up to two and a half
feet, maybe up to three feet attimes, and before you know it,
each time it gets higher andhigher, and then all of a sudden
you're at four foot of exposureand now it's really dangerous,
(16:33):
right, and now you have to tryto communicate to the team like
guys, that's not the way we dothings.
So it takes a lot of times,some time, for that type of
deviance to start adding up tobeing something very dangerous,
whereas you know that risktolerance is allowing that
deviance and allowing thatnormalization of that new
(16:53):
standard, that new system thatthey're getting used to over
time, because they've seen thatpositive reinforcement of
negative behaviors, and thosecontinue to change their normal,
and their normal is now gettingmore and more dangerous as they
go but they don't realize itbecause they're tolerant to that
(17:14):
risk, right.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
Wow, that's where the care factor comes in, you know,
because most of the time youknow when you go to the job you
always got those ones right.
They want to talk, they want todo the right thing, they want
to make sure, but they don't.
They're not ready to speak upyet, but they're bringing up
(17:36):
some things that, like you said,can materialize into a big
situation.
And my brother always says thatnobody cares about what you
have to say until you show howmuch you care.
And creating that relationshipas a safety professional is so
important because now you haveanother eye that is helping you
(18:04):
make the environment, thecompany, the culture a little
more safer, a little better.
And now you're gaining groundthrough the relationship.
And how is it that over timeyou've gained the relationships
that you're gaining?
(18:24):
Because I think that carefactor in that relationship is
very key to our system, becauseyou and me both know that we
can't be everywhere at the sametime.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Right, really good point.
And relationships are so keyand it takes a lot of time and a
lot of effort to work on thoserelationships and you get to
know them, you get to know theirfamily and you get to know some
of their ticks.
What are some of the thingsthat make them tick?
Could be something as simple asthis guy likes that special
(18:58):
safety glass, that and you'reable to remember that and take
care of these guys in a specialway.
And if they ask for something,then you follow through.
So you create trust in thatrelationship and it starts to
grow over time.
So such an important part ofour job is to build trust and
(19:21):
really take care of these people, because they are people, they
are, they have families, theyhave a livelihood and we show
that we care, we truly careabout them because of all these
things that we do to show thatwe care.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Very, very important, very, very important.
I always say relationships areworth more money than you can
ever imagine.
It's really helped me.
I think another thing thathelped me personally too, is you
(19:58):
don't know everything out there, right, when you start asking
the craft of hey, how did you dothat?
And being interested in exactlywhat they're doing, it helps
out.
Every once in a while, gettinginvolved just for a little bit,
maybe help the guys and, likeyou said, really trying to find
out who's who, what do you like,what does he like, because
(20:21):
that's the conversation theyneed.
I'm a believer that every timeI come on site, I don't need to
be talking about safety, becausein the reason why I say that, I
say that to say that sometimesyou gotta make people, you gotta
let people know they'reimportant and if I can let you
(20:44):
know you're important, safetywill sneak its way in on you
because you're gonna startcaring about yourself.
You're gonna start caring aboutwhat I think about you and
you're gonna start caring aboutwhat other people are thinking
about you, and it's gonna helpguide you into a certain way
(21:05):
when it comes to being able toexecute when the light isn't
shining on you, and that's wherewe gotta get to is like when
somebody is doing the rightthings in dark places.
In our business when I think about safety
professionals, I always like tohighlight who are those people?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
I think they're mothers, fathers, law
enforcement firemen, peoplebehind the scenes like people
who sell PPE.
They're a piece of us.
And then the connection withthe foreman superintendent
nurses.
You know all these people thathave to take care of somebody
(00:53):
when it comes to their lives,right, and I think we work as a
big part of our day.
So when you talk about eight,10, sometimes 12 hours, you only
have 12 more hours left.
You have to sleep, you haveyour family, you got to eat.
It's very hard, perry, in whatwe do, to come to work with too
(01:21):
much on your mind.
I guess what I wanna ask youhow is it that when you, you
know what does your day, howdoes your day start?
Do you take a breather in themorning?
I know you're a Christian.
I don't know if you read yourword in the morning.
I know I do, but you know whatdo you do to get your day
started off so that you'reprepared to serve people.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah, absolutely so.
Yeah, the first thing I do whenI get up is I do have the daily
verse that comes up on my Bibleapp, that you version app, and
it is something that I do everymorning.
I wanna make sure that that'show I start my day, and a little
bit of prayer and just, yeah,get going on my day starting
(02:05):
with that.
So, yeah, I am a Christian andI'm very proud to be serving you
know an amazing God, and, yeah,it's an important part of my
day because it does.
It starts it out in such animportant way that, yeah,
nothing goes first.
That's it.
(02:26):
That's the first thing thathappens in the morning for me.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Super, super, super important.
This was the attractive thingthat I think when me and Perry
first met.
You know, sometimes you knowthe spirit when they hit each
other.
It's a feeling man, and it's agenuine feeling and there's
really nothing we can do aboutit.
But when it's living insomebody that's so important,
(02:53):
it's cause it's nothing fake.
You know, you have really haveno control over it when it comes
out.
So when they meet up it'ssomething nice.
So really, really again glad tohave you.
I know you said you're married,you got a family some kids tell
us about that.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Yeah, my wife Stephanie.
We've been married, let's see,coming up on 19 years, and we've
known each other since 98, whenwe started going to college
together.
And then, yeah, after college,we started dating and then got
married in 2004.
And we didn't have kids foreight years.
(03:34):
So we now have two girls.
Zora is 12, or sorry, she's 11.
And so it seems like she'sgoing on 20.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
I know that feeling.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
And Hazel is eight years old.
She's actually turning ninehere in October.
Yeah, these girls are amazing.
So one quick thing I wannashare that this is something
that you and I haven't talkedabout, but just something really
cool.
That we're doing is I like todo date night or date day with
each one of my daughters, andthe way we make it work is the
(04:12):
first Saturday of each month ismy wife, we go on a date, and
then the second Saturday of themonth is my oldest daughter,
zora, and then the thirdSaturday is my youngest daughter
, hazel.
And then the fourth Saturday isfamily day night or day day,
whatever we decide to do andthen on the fifth Saturday if
(04:36):
there is a fifth Saturday,that's my day.
I get to do what I want.
So you know, video games.
Whatever I decide to do issomething I get to do on the
fifth, which is usually two orthree times a year at most.
But it's a fun thing we've beendoing for a few years now and
(04:56):
it's a way for me to be able toget a little closer to my
daughters each separately and beable to have that special time
with each one of them.
So it's a fun thing I get to dothere with my daughters, you
just gave us some strategieshere.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Sometimes.
You know I've been married for23.
And well, tell her congrats,because you know my first five
years was, you know, because ofme.
You know was rough man and I'msad to say that, but it is what
it is.
Man, and definitely we've grown.
(05:36):
But what you talk about you knowreally mixing it up in your
life Because at the end of theday, we come to work, we go home
, they see us less than our workdoes and we've got to really be
.
What do you want to say?
You've got to make sure youmake time for the family.
(06:01):
However it is that you do, Ireally like what you had.
You separate that relationshipand you spend that time.
But when I think, when the kidsand the wife are made important,
those extra four hours that youmay not be there, it doesn't
even matter, because they knowthat when their time is up, dad,
(06:24):
husband, is dedicated to me andthey're making sure they're
making time for me.
So I really think that'simportant because all the way
from the craft on up, we workmajor hours, especially during
the summer, and sometimes it cancreate relationship issues,
whether it's with the kids, thewife or whatever it may be.
(06:46):
So what you just hit on is likethese are the things that we
need to give the people that wecall our brothers and sisters,
these safety professionals thatyou.
There's nuggets that I hopethat we can get out of this
podcast right, and it doesn'talways have to be something
that's breaking down a cut orwhatever.
(07:08):
It's these other things that Idon't know if you talk enough
about them, and it's also thesethings that cause these this new
mental thing, this new mentalhealth and wealth and all these
things.
So I'm really glad that youbrought that up about your
family and how you make sure youare deliberate with making time
(07:29):
for them Awesome.
The other thing I wanna talkabout is so you came up with a
great idea, a great move forempowerment because, like we
were talking earlier last year,double the year before, which
(07:51):
was 2021, in deaths, and I would, if I can remember, three or
four of those were here andthere's a lot in Colorado, you
know, and I'm glad OSHA, I'mglad the government is sort of
picking up on the responsibilityand the accountability of
(08:15):
frontline supervisors, ownersand people that are watching
this very thing happen.
And I think it's so importantyou, me, everybody out there
watching that we have to beginto make sure that when there's
an accident happening, peopleare standing around watching it.
They are just as accountable.
And how do we motivate andempower them to speak up before
(08:42):
and not after?
Do you run into seeing?
When you come to the incident,you find out that like three or
four guys might have seensomething and it's like they're
really not involved, but theyare, because we always talk
about you have the right to sayno or stop work or this
(09:03):
responsibility that we reallywant our people to have, right
if you see something, saysomething, that culture that
really takes time for anorganization to really instill
that in their people.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
It's not gonna happen overnight.
And that's part of what our jobis in safety is to help really
change that mentality.
Or look at these guys and showthem the importance of a life
and really show them what thatrisk is on that for that job
(09:38):
that they're doing, that theycould get hurt or they could get
killed, and really understandthat not having that risk
tolerance Right.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
You know, when we talk about risk tolerance it's
some people don't understandthat a lot.
You know what that is, some ofit's.
You know part of how we werebrought up, what we do, what
we're into it's really what Ifind for myself is that when you
(10:11):
got a guy with a high risktolerance, my, I guess my
strategy is to teach the foremanor the superintendent to
recognize that.
Some of the things that Irecognize.
That may be simple stuff, butit's like when you see a guy
continually walk over a hazard,it's gonna become a problem at
(10:33):
one point.
Sometimes I think that I usedto be that foreman, that
superintendent.
You get so overwhelmed with whatis the priority.
I just had that one day saythat at the end of the day, I'm
working for a company whobelieves in safety, so I need to
be.
I need to have that first inmind and, plus, that's my job,
(10:58):
right?
So really trying to, like yousaid, just trying to reach out
to it, it really does.
It's sometimes frustrating.
It's nice to see progress butman, you're right, man, that
culture thing really it reallytakes time and you gotta do the
right things and if anythinggoes wrong it sets you back very
(11:21):
quickly whether you've beenworking on this thing for months
, years, and if one of themdon't trust you, man, it falls
out, it falls off, and then yougotta pick it back up to try to
run that through.
So, going back to this,thinking inside the box.
I was thinking about this lastnight and you know, I mean it's
(11:46):
crazy that thinking inside thebox and thinking outside the box
right, there's these twosayings that we brought up when
I was really thinking deep onthis and what I was thinking was
it's like us as safetyprofessionals and anybody who's
dealing with the plan of work.
We sort of really have to bethinking outside the box prior
(12:09):
to them getting in the box,because I think that if we can
keep them thinking inside thebox, we take the constraints
that actually make you thinkoutside of the box, which we
don't want them to do.
So I really I guess you knowgoing into this whole thing, did
(12:30):
you ever really think thatthinking inside the box had a
constraint to you?
That's a great question, becausewhen you, I didn't mean to cut
you off, but when you'reconstrained or you're put into a
place where you need to thinkabout some options, now you're
(12:51):
going to innovate.
The problem with thatinnovation is is it the right
innovation?
Because our people, we knowthey're a get it done type of
mentality.
Shall we say right, they'recreative, they're very creative,
but we need to make sure thatthey think inside the box.
Call us involve some people tomake sure that's the right thing
(13:13):
to do than to be spontaneous onbeing creative, because
sometimes that creativity mighthave been okay but some corners
weren't covered.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
So when you were thinking about this.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
Did that ever come to mind?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
Yeah, the little meaning.
With think inside the box Imean the obvious think inside
the trench box and think insidea safety device that's intended
to protect an employee and itcould be a shoring system.
But the original intent was atrench box because that's the
most common device, the easiestdevice to get our hands on in
(13:48):
our world.
But it's also the concept ofthinking inside the box.
We don't have to think outsidethe box, we don't have to think
about new, creative ideas.
This system that's beeninstalled over and over and over
works, so use what works.
Think inside the box because itworks, because this system has
already been designed by anengineer.
(14:08):
It's already something that canwork and will work if it's used
.
That's the important aspect ofthink inside the box.
Is that double meaning and howimportant it is to utilize a
system that works.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Wow, that's powerful.
So when this actually started,I was in a situation where come
up on a scene and guys were inthe box, but there were some
things that were going onoutside, about a foot and a half
outside Right, and when youlook outside the box and you
(14:43):
look at the edges, you can tellthey're not very stable.
So the innovation of the formand he stayed inside the box.
What he did was is he put marksinside the trench box so that
guys knew that I don't want youto go past this line.
(15:04):
And, man, it made a very, verybig difference because guys felt
that okay, maybe I got my legsin and I'm just going to just
create just a little bit, youknow.
But this here it created aboundary, is what it did, and
(15:25):
they were able to grasp it andutilize it throughout the rest
of the project and, like yousaid, staying inside that box,
it works.
You know, I just got to tweaksomething because you think,
just because you're here, okay,well, I'm going to take a foot
away from you.
Okay, I'm going to take a footaway from you.
(15:46):
Let me catch you going pasthere and I'm going to keep you
accountable to that.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
Well, that's normalizing what is actually the
compliance level, whereas whattypically happens on the job
site is they're normalizing alittle bit of deviance, right
Normalization of deviance Rightand a little bit of change over
time turns into large changeswhere people could get hurt.
Right, you know like an examplewould be.
(16:12):
Well, they left that trench boxoff the floor.
Maybe at first it's at two feet, because that's what the rule
is, but then all they'retweaking it up to two and a half
feet, maybe up to three feet attimes, and before you know it,
each time it gets higher andhigher, and then all of a sudden
you're at four foot of exposureand now it's really dangerous,
(16:33):
right, and now you have to tryto communicate to the team like
guys, that's not the way we dothings.
So it takes a lot of times,some time, for that type of
deviance to start adding up tobeing something very dangerous,
whereas you know that risktolerance is allowing that
deviance and allowing thatnormalization of that new
(16:53):
standard, that new system thatthey're getting used to over
time, because they've seen thatpositive reinforcement of
negative behaviors, and thosecontinue to change their normal,
and their normal is now gettingmore and more dangerous as they
go but they don't realize itbecause they're tolerant to that
(17:14):
risk, right.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
Wow, that's where the care factor comes in, you know,
because most of the time youknow when you go to the job you
always got those ones right.
They want to talk, they want todo the right thing, they want
to make sure, but they don't.
They're not ready to speak upyet, but they're bringing up
(17:36):
some things that, like you said,can materialize into a big
situation.
And my brother always says thatnobody cares about what you
have to say until you show howmuch you care.
And creating that relationshipas a safety professional is so
important because now you haveanother eye that is helping you
(18:04):
make the environment, thecompany, the culture a little
more safer, a little better.
And now you're gaining groundthrough the relationship.
And how is it that over timeyou've gained the relationships
that you're gaining?
(18:24):
Because I think that carefactor in that relationship is
very key to our system, becauseyou and me both know that we
can't be everywhere at the sametime.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Right, really good point.
And relationships are so keyand it takes a lot of time and a
lot of effort to work on thoserelationships and you get to
know them, you get to know theirfamily and you get to know some
of their ticks.
What are some of the thingsthat make them tick?
Could be something as simple asthis guy likes that special
(18:58):
safety glass, that and you'reable to remember that and take
care of these guys in a specialway.
And if they ask for something,then you follow through.
So you create trust in thatrelationship and it starts to
grow over time.
So such an important part ofour job is to build trust and
(19:21):
really take care of these people, because they are people, they
are, they have families, theyhave a livelihood and we show
that we care, we truly careabout them because of all these
things that we do to show thatwe care.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Very, very important, very, very important.
I always say relationships areworth more money than you can
ever imagine.
It's really helped me.
I think another thing thathelped me personally too, is you
(19:58):
don't know everything out there, right, when you start asking
the craft of hey, how did you dothat?
And being interested in exactlywhat they're doing, it helps
out.
Every once in a while, gettinginvolved just for a little bit,
maybe help the guys and, likeyou said, really trying to find
out who's who, what do you like,what does he like, because
(20:21):
that's the conversation theyneed.
I'm a believer that every timeI come on site, I don't need to
be talking about safety, becausein the reason why I say that, I
say that to say that sometimesyou gotta make people, you gotta
let people know they'reimportant and if I can let you
(20:44):
know you're important, safetywill sneak its way in on you
because you're gonna startcaring about yourself.
You're gonna start caring aboutwhat I think about you and
you're gonna start caring aboutwhat other people are thinking
about you, and it's gonna helpguide you into a certain way
(21:05):
when it comes to being able toexecute when the light isn't
shining on you, and that's wherewe gotta get to is like when
somebody is doing the rightthings in dark places.
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