Is Leadership Right for You? The Truth About Moving Up (And Why Many Fail)

Are you ready to step into a leadership role—or are you being pushed into one for the wrong reasons? In this episode of The Salesforce Career Show, we uncover the reality of leadership and whether it’s the right path for you.

Join host Josh Matthews, co-host Josh LaQuire, and leadership expert Whitney Faires as they dive deep into the challenges of Salesforce leadership, career progression myths, and how to thrive as a people leader. Learn the key skills that separate great leaders from struggling managers and how AI is reshaping business, hiring, and career development.

We also break down highlights from the Salesforce Spring 2025 Release Notes and introduce our new segment: AI Spotlight, where we explore the latest in AI for leadership and career growth.

🎧 Subscribe now to stay ahead in your Salesforce career!

(Relevant topics: Salesforce leadership, career growth, people leadership skills, becoming a manager, Salesforce career advice, AI in business, AI in leadership, Salesforce Spring 2025 Release.)

Episode Transcript

Josh Matthews (00:00):
Are you ready to uncover the truth about people
leadership?
Many aspiring leaders step intothe role for all the wrong
reasons.
It could be money, it could becareer progression or simply
being asked to.
But what truly definesexceptional leadership and how
do we know if it's right for us?
Whitney Farris, aninternationally recognized coach

(00:21):
, keynote speaker and leadershipexpert, will deep dive with us
into the leadership dilemma withinsights that could redefine
your career path.
Today, we're also going to bejoined by co-host Josh LaQuire.
Everybody hopefully by nowalready knows Josh.
He's pretty freaking awesomeand he's going to help us break

(00:41):
down some not all some of theSalesforce Spring Release Notes
for 2025.
And we introduce a new segmentto our show, the AI Spotlight.
So stay tuned till the end andbe sure to like and subscribe.

Josh LeQuire (00:55):
And now it's the Salesforce Career Show.

Josh Matthews (01:00):
Okay, well, welcome Whitney and welcome Josh
.
Josh, congratulations, you wonthe big spot, the hot seat, here
on the Salesforce Career Show.
For those who might belistening to us for the very
first time, maybe you can justgive us a quick 15-second bio.
Who are you, how long have youbeen in the ecosystem and why
are you even here on the show,buddy?

Josh LeQuire (01:24):
on the show, buddy .
Well, josh, thank you forinviting me.
It's a pleasure to be here.
I appreciate all the nicethings you said about me.
The checks in the mail.
I am the founder and operatorof C-Currents.
We're a Salesforce consultingpartner.
This is the second Salesforceconsulting partner I founded and
led.
I had the coterie before.
We're a product developmentoutsourcing organization.
I've been working in Salesforcesince 2011.
I've been building apps since2003.

(01:45):
And I'm excited to be here totalk about Salesforce and how we
can help you beef up yourcareer and get you going in the
ecosystem.

Josh Matthews (01:54):
I love it.
And then we've got Whitney.
Whitney, we're so excited tohave you here today because you
have had an exceptional careerso far as an executive, working
in HR, working in healthcare,and you've got a pretty
interesting relationshipindirectly with the Salesforce
ecosystem as well.
So welcome to the show.

(02:15):
I gave a little bit of a minibio, but why don't you share the
audience a little bit aboutwhat you're most passionate
about and why you do what you dohelping people as a coach and a
keynote speaker?

Whitney Faires (02:27):
Yeah Well, first of all, thanks for having me,
and I feel like I'm sort of partof making history here with the
new co-host, so I appreciate.
I will try not to mess up.
The first episode for you, josh.

Josh LeQuire (02:37):
I think you're going to be fine, you're already
making me look a lot better.
Thank you, I appreciate that.

Whitney Faires (02:43):
Of course, but what I'm most passionate about
is helping people reach theirmaximum potential, and I spent
gosh 10 years in sales and salesleadership and I just saw so
many people that were hungry fordevelopment.
They had big goals for theircareer but sometimes getting

(03:04):
there is just really hard to doand it can be very uncertain and
difficult to navigate.
And so, after sales leadership,I hopped into an operations
role, launched a financefunction and then I moved into
what I was really passionateabout was people, and I led an
org health team and then wasalso chief of staff to the CFO
of a fortune 500 company.

(03:24):
So I've kind of hopped aroundand I actually think that my
experience has always been dothe work that inspires you
You're passionate about.
Obviously, we all need to makemoney, but the two can coexist,
but it takes a little bit ofvision and intentionality to to
see your career where you wantto go.

Josh Matthews (03:42):
Yeah, I absolutely agree with that.
I mean you can't just hope forthe best.
Crossing your fingers isn't theway to approach your career and
no one should approach theircareer like that.
Some of us have been reallylucky at certain stages in our
life where things fell in ourlap.
There are all these stories ofthe accidental admin who worked

(04:03):
at an organization and maybethey were doing customer service
and someone asked them to helpout with Salesforce and they
jumped in and they kind ofwrapped their arms around it,
fell in love with the product,fell in love with the kind of
role and did that for years.
They never intended to get intoproduct ownership or Salesforce
administration or anything likethat.

(04:24):
But then years go by and all ofa sudden they're thinking what
comes next?
Because maybe the next thing isnot going to fall in their lap
right, they're going to have toactually do something about it.
Talk, if you can, a little bitabout that, because I think we
all can recognize here.
Because I think we all canrecognize here.

(04:48):
It's pretty obvious thatusually we think to get more
money to get the type offulfillment or a claim that we
want in a career.
So many of us and I certainlywas one of.
These folks believe that theonly way there is to take your
boss's job at some point.
Can you talk about that for alittle bit?

Whitney Faires (05:06):
Yeah, for sure.
I think that I often see twotypes of people those that are
very passive about their career.
They want to do more, but theydon't spend a lot of time really
mapping out that path.
And I don't mean it has to be a10-year plan, but just thinking
about what might be the nextthing or two I would look at

(05:28):
right.
Maybe that is moving up andtaking my boss's job.
Maybe that's taking a lateralmove that offers diversity of
experience that's going to helpme get ready for the job to down
the road right.
So sometimes people take thispassive approach where they're
not sure what to do next, sothey just kind of say, oh, my
career will figure itself out.
And then, of course, you havethe opposite, where either

(05:51):
someone has overengineered andbeen like I'm going to get this
job by this date and this is howit's going to go, or they're
getting pulled into the nextrole.
And in all those situations thekey is just really stopping to
pause and say, okay, is thisright for me?
And just really beingthoughtful about am I ready for

(06:12):
it, is this the work that I liketo do?
And when you talk about gettingpulled into your boss's job, or
I'm just going to go do thatjob.
I think about people leadership,and not all individual
contributors are going to lovethe work of a people leader.
It's totally different and, yes, there's certainly like
transferable skills and a lot ofsimilarities.

(06:33):
But when you move to thatpeople leadership role, your job
is not to execute on a dailybasis.
Your job is to develop thepeople in your organization to
drive better results, to drivethe result, which means if
you're the person that loves toget in there and run the meeting
, you're going to have to pullback and be willing to prep the

(06:56):
person maybe sit in the meeting,add some commentary, but not
just take over and run it,because otherwise, as a leader,
it's a.
It's a.
It's a slow, steady decline,because if everyone's depending
on you sitting in that meeting,you can't be everywhere, and so
over time your results willplateau, because I hit that.

Josh Matthews (07:14):
I mean, I can tell you right now that happened
to me in my early days.
You know I it was.
I thought that I'd beenpromoted to be a leader because
of a couple of things.
My sales results, my numberswere great.
I went the extra mile.
I ran trainings.
I did these sorts of thingsbecause I really desired it.
I was in my late 20s, early 30s,chomping at the bit.

(07:36):
I felt here we go, let's climbthis ladder.
I worked for a Fortune 500company and was a manager there
and I wanted to be a VP and ittook some it.
It actually didn't take a lotof time to figure out my
failings because they were soobvious around me.
You know, I still felt like Iwas cut out for leadership but
I'd been doing it the wrong way.

(07:57):
The idea of empowering othersand helping them and putting the
spotlight on them and helpingthem and putting the spotlight
on them man, that's clearlywhere it was at and I felt, I
think, too much of a grip aroundthe bat.
I wanted things done, but Iwanted it done.

(08:17):
My way Didn't always resonatewith all of my employees and you
know it's.
It's shame on me, but lessonlearned, can you talk a little
bit more about what someonemight need to do when, let's say
, someone's already in thatposition and they're facing
those challenges and they'redoubting themselves?
You're a coach, so I imagineyou can coach people up and

(08:38):
through it.
But have you experienced inyour time as a I mean you're a
certified professional coachhave you experienced in your
time as a I mean, you're acertified professional coach
Like I imagine, that you've runinto situations where you're
talking to people and it's likeI got to tell you I don't know
if this is the right role foryou.
I don't know if this is theright job.
Let's look at ways of being anindividual contributor again.

(08:59):
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat?

Whitney Faires (09:01):
Yeah, you know well, I always say there's two
things that most often determinesuccess Is someone willing to
put in the work to get there isthe first question, because if
there's no willingness to growand develop and grind it out to
get to where you want to be,you've got nothing.
And piece is is competency.

(09:24):
There are certain times incertain roles, you're like this
person they really don't havethe skills and some of the
skills aren't teachable, and soyou have to really reevaluate,
making that move maybe back to arole that's better suited for
them sooner.
But aside from that, they'rewilling and they have baseline
competencies.
You can develop leaders.
I mean leadership is a learnedskill, in fact.

(09:45):
I won't get off on a tangent onthis, but I will say I think
one of the biggest Okay, you can.

Josh Matthews (09:50):
Tangents are loud .

Whitney Faires (09:52):
One of the biggest misses that I think
companies make is we assumegreat individual contributors
immediately translate into greatpeople leaders.
We don't need to teach them theskill of leading people.
We absolutely do.
There's teaching them how tomanage the business and there's
teaching them how to lead people.
There are two differentverticals of skill sets that
typically people leaders willwill grow into as they get more

(10:16):
experience in more development,and so oftentimes we say they're
great, they've, they've been inbusiness a long time Great
business acumen, people likethem, they can connect and
they're a great IC.
Okay, that that's a phenomenalfoundation.
I'll take that.
But how do we teach them how togive feedback effectively?
How do we teach them to createa vision that inspires people?

(10:38):
You know all the, and I couldgo on about the skills, but you
get where I'm going with it.
And so like when I see somebodyand, believe me, I've had them.
I've had people that are like Iwas running after this job for
years I get it and I'm thinking,what did I do?
I hate, I hate the day-to-dayof this.
I'm sitting there watchingpeople make mistakes, and so I

(10:59):
think part of it is firstunderstanding, okay, what was
your expectation of the job,because sometimes I got to
provide the harsh reality thatthat is not what a people
leadership role is.
You're not just brought in torun the meeting, close the deal
and then out you go.
You're a problem solver.
I mean people leadership isbasically a lot of ongoing

(11:20):
problem solving developing yourpeople, diagnosing the skills
that they need to improve to bebetter at their jobs.
Obviously figuring out what'sgoing on in the business when
you're not always front andcenter with a customer, because
you have a whole team, and sohelping them understand, okay,
what really does peopleleadership look like is a great
start.
And then we have to assesstheir skills, and a lot of times

(11:43):
I do that through gettingfeedback from them, from their
leaders, from their directreports, and then going you know
, of course, benchmarking theirlevel of experience and I can
ask them questions to understandokay, how good are they at
coaching employees?
What is their strategy?
Do they have a process?
So then we can work on actuallybuilding those skills to be
successful.

Josh Matthews (12:08):
And that makes sense.
I'm just going to jump in herefor a second Whitney, real quick
, because everything you'resharing, I mean, it's brilliant
stuff and it all makes sense.
But what about those folks?
I mean, how would you addressour audience today so that they
as individuals, like, noteverybody can afford a great
coach and not everybody, even ifthey they can afford it, they
might find that they're a littlebit resistant to it and it may

(12:29):
take them months to open up,right, everyone's a little bit
different.
What can someone do today tokind of go through a little bit
of a checklist or a process totruly understand who they are?
I'm a huge fan Everybody wholistens to this show knows that
I'm a huge fan of people takingpersonal accountability right,

(12:52):
like really owning their stuffand also just understanding who
they are.
Like, do you know who youactually are?
Do you understand yourbehaviors, your patterns, what
you like, what you don't like?
So, with that in mind, what aresome tactics I suppose that
people can apply to figuringthis out when they don't have a
Whitney Ferris in in their uh,you know, on their roster of

(13:16):
advisors?

Whitney Faires (13:17):
Yeah, yeah.
So first thing I'd encouragethem to do is ask I just let me
narrow it down to like threequestions Uh, am I energized by
developing people?
Is that something that I thinkI I'm?
I'm excited about theopportunity to get on the phone
every day or be in, be with myteam every day and help them
grow, versus take over thebusiness?
Um, am I?

(13:39):
So?
That's number one.
Um, how interested am I inshifting from the star player to
the team player, the supporter?
Because that's the reality ofpeople leadership.
When your people are shining,you stand behind them, and when
they are facing fire, you standin front of them.
That's your job.
Ultimate accountability.

(14:00):
They get the glory, you takethe hits.
How does that resonate with you?
And then, can you redefine whatsuccess looks like when we're
individual contributors?
Oftentimes we have all thesemetrics and we can really see
clearly how's it going.
We can manage the businessreally tightly, whatever our job
is, and all of a sudden,success looks like the growth of
your people.
It looks like the wins in theirbusiness.

(14:22):
It isn't this one-to-onecorrelation.
So am I good with that?
Do I feel like I'm in a placewhere that is something?
That challenge inspires me andso that, I think, tells you a
little bit more about is thissomething that's right for me
right now and I say right now,because it might not be that
today is where you feel likemaking that shift.
You love what you do Fine, butin the future, kind of use that

(14:45):
as a bit of your compass, if youwill.
And then once you jump intothat role, there are core skills
in people leadership right,being able to coach people so
you see them do something.
They're talking about goinginto a meeting.
How do you coach and guide themright?
Coaching, giving feedback.

(15:06):
We've all had someone thatgives us really harsh feedback
or that doesn't feel good andwe're resistant, and we have
someone that knows how to giveit to us.
So it's specific, it's it'sactionable and we know what
behavior we're going to dodifferently.

Josh Matthews (15:18):
It's very hard to to to be able to coach others
If you've never been coachedright.
It's really difficult.
Anyone can become a manager andanyone can be promoted to
leadership, but they can'tnecessarily be effective in
either role if they haven't hadthe right behaviors modeled for
them.
So do you recommend people whoare sort of on that cusp of like

(15:42):
, wow, I really want to go forit, they've answered.
I'm want to go for it, I've.
They've answered.
You know, I'm happy to redefinemy success.
I'm energized by helping people.
I'm I don't need to be the starplayer, I'm happy to be the
supporter.
Now I need to get there Right.
Do you think that gettinginvolved with a personal coach
is the, you know, one of thebest ways to go if they don't

(16:04):
have that mentor on site withtheir organization?

Whitney Faires (16:07):
Yeah, um, I would say as much as I'd love
you know to say coaching is thenumber one thing.
You don't have to have that Um,it's helpful.
But there's two things that youcan easily do.
We all have seen great leadersin our organizations or
organizations we've previouslyworked for.
I rarely see leaders that whensomeone comes and says I'm
stepping into this job and Ineed to learn a few things from

(16:28):
you, can I get 30 minutes everyyou know month or so to ask you
some questions.
That's, that's number one.
Um, I also I encourage peopleif they're thinking about a
people leadership role orthey've just stepped into one,
look on the.
You know, you know who the topperformers are.
Or you can ask somebody in yourorganization and just call

(16:49):
those people up.
We all are, have drive time towork.
We're, you know, taking a walk,where we have dead time during
between meetings.
You can pick up the phone andsay hey look, I'm new to this
role and I want to be excellentat it.
And I hear you're great.
Can I learn from you?
And I always say just come withsome specific questions Like
what's been, what has been thetop two skills that have helped

(17:11):
you be successful as a peopleleader?
Great, how do you do that?
And you can start a knowledgethat way.
And then, of course, like youcan, on LinkedIn learning, you
can Google it.
You find all these thoughtleaders.
There's a lot of-.

Josh Matthews (17:25):
Or perplexity.
I'm going to strongly recommendpeople do this.
On perplexityai, it has beenfor me and many people that I've
kind of turned them onto itlike such a game changer and I'm
going to drop a little bit.
I'm sorry I'm interruptingWhitney, but I want to drop a
little thing that I learned justyesterday from the.

(17:45):
He's an amazing guy.
It's David Giller.
He was on our show two yearsago.
He's a friend.
He's recently moved to Tel Avivthis last summer.
Most people will know himthrough his organization,
brainiate, and as a thoughtleader on Salesforce and AI.
We were catching up.
Yesterday.
I was on a little walk and Ithought I'm going to give David
a call and he was talking aboutbuilding a GPT where you're

(18:11):
basically uploading anythingthat you can find for free
around one specific thoughtleader If they've got PDFs of
transcripts, if they've goteBooks that you can upload and
you can put them all into the AIand you just give it
instructions Anytime.
I prompt inside here.

(18:31):
I want you to act as the personwho wrote all of this
information and you can havethis body of knowledge where
people can go again.
I'm sorry this is AI spotlightoriented stuff, but I think it's
apropos when we're thinkingabout really creative ways to
capture information and have itreadily available.
You can say today, someoneraised their voice.
I didn't know what to do.

(18:51):
Blah, blah, blah, blah.
What would you have done?
And you might be shocked at howclear and successful the
response is if you actually takethat advice.

Josh LeQuire (19:04):
So I'm going to back you up on that, actually,
because you did ask the questionto Whitney earlier.
How do folks help themselves athome if they don't have a
Whitney Ferris?
And, honestly, this technologyis so prevalent and available.
That's an excellent idea to getan outside perspective, I think
.
Whitney, I want to call outsomething you had mentioned
before.
I'm thinking about leadershipfrom all these different

(19:25):
dimensions.
Right, it's the subject matter,expertise, it's the passion,
it's the ability to developtalent, to recognize talent as
well, to bring that into theorganization and retain talent.
It's the ability to enablepeople we work in our world, in
Salesforce development.
You're either an employeeinside of a company that's

(19:46):
providing business analysis,solution, architecture,
development type solutions verykind of technical solutions that
meet business needs orrequirements or you're working
for a consultancy and that couldbe a smaller business like mine
you know that's not anAccenture or KPMG or Capgemini,
or could be one of those orsomething in between, right?

(20:06):
So I do think you know thereare all these different kinds of
dimensions.
What company am I working in?
What kind of opportunities dothose present?
Is leadership right for me, isit not?
But I do think you hit on theright, right notes here.
That leadership and I reallylearned this when I started
getting into leadership roles inmy career and, of course, now
going into business and kind ofmore of the entrepreneurial lens

(20:29):
and kind of smaller businesslens you have to really love
what you're doing and you haveto really understand how to put
people in places to succeed, howto build systems for them to
succeed, and you have to be agood listener, right, when you
want people.
You talked about great leadersand modeling their behavior and
learning a lot from them.

(20:50):
The greatest leaders I've everworked for were compassionate,
humble.
You know.
How are you doing?
What can I do to help you?
You know kind of servantleaders to an extent, and I
don't yeah, I'm not familiarwith the latest terminology and
not sure if that's kind of, youknow, sort of out of date.
My kids tell me all the time Iuse all the wrong language and

(21:11):
wrong lingo.
So I'm sure I'm doing it here,but, yeah, exactly, but that
growth mentality, I think youknow that's, you know,
personally important to me,right, like when I have teams
that I'm working with, whetherit's my, even my client teams or
even the teams that work hereat C-Currents or we work with in
partnership.
It's hey, you know, how can wefind what we're passionate about

(21:32):
, what objective we can rallyaround, how can we set the path
forward for everybody to succeed, how can we look ahead and know
what we're trying to achieveand make sure we're tracking
progress and also giving eachother honest feedback about
what's working, what's notworking, right?
So I really do like that.
You called that out because Ithink that's in our business,
you know, when you have,especially on the technical side

(21:55):
, you know you've got peopledeveloping applications or maybe
even people on the sales side,it's I have to, you know, get
into a management role andsucceed.
Josh and I were talking aboutthis earlier and a lot of people
I work with will recognize this, because we talk about this all
the time.
The best way to ruin adeveloper's, promote him or her,
to manage your position right,like I've seen.
I've seen this happen countlesstimes where we've taken a

(22:18):
really good technical expert,put them in a people role and
it's like oh, how do what do?
What do I do?
Like I got to manageperformance, I've got to help
enable people, I've got to doall this.
So really just calling out, Ido think you know what.
What you've called out here isvery wise, sage advice and for
folks who are listening in thework that we do, you know, take
that into consideration becauseit does take passion, it does

(22:40):
take looking around the corners.

Josh Matthews (22:45):
It does take, take.
How can I help my team andenable it to succeed?
You're going to have a lot moreenergy for for the work when
you actually care about it.
Like, just, it's as simple asthat.
I wanted to ask you, whitney,most people are familiar with
the peter principle and I alwaysbotch it, right.
I.
I always botch um what it is.
So I pulled it up and it is uh,um what it is.

(23:06):
So I pulled it up and it is uh,blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Basically, people are arepromoted right to their um, to a
level of incompetence, right.
I mean, you're familiar withthat.
I'm assuming, like, can youtalk a little bit about that?
I know you've seen it, right,you were, you were an executive.
Of course you've seen it, and Ithink about a lot of the folks

(23:26):
that I saw back when I wasworking in corporate America.
It's like someone did well insales, now they're a manager.
This person did well on sales,now they're a manager.
This one person did goodoperationally in technology, now
they're an architect or they'rerunning a PMO, and nobody liked
them anyway, but they were justreally good because they saved
time and they were on budgetRight, but then people start

(23:49):
bailing under them.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthe Peter principle so that
everybody really understands,and maybe a story or something
of where you've seen it and howyou know?
This shows for people who arethinking about being leaders,
but it's also for leaders.
You know we have a lot ofpeople who are leaders, who
listen to this program andthey're ultimately the ones
responsible for the promotions.

(24:10):
It's on them, to an extent, tohave done a quality evaluation
of these employees.
I it's not like I'm going to bea leader now and now I'm a
leader.
You know someone has to giveyou the thumbs up.
What can leaders do to protectthese people's careers and
ensure that they're actuallyengaged in the right kind of

(24:31):
work for their personality,their behavioral style, their
skill set and where they are inlife?

Whitney Faires (24:47):
would say, first of all, the biggest risk is
that we promote people that welike, uh, or we promote them
because they have this trackrecord and we're like they're.
They're just a winner.
They're just a winner.
They're going to win at thenext job.
They will and they may win, andthey may win by doing it well
and they may win by, like yousaid, they, they.
They aren't somebody thatpeople want to work for, or
sometimes there's a biasinvolved in there and you have
to watch out for that too.

(25:08):
So I think one of the things Ialways suggest for leaders is,
before you look at who do I wantto put in this role, define the
person you need.
Uh, and typically we're talkingabout if you're moving into a
management role, the personabove you is leading a lot of
other people leaders so theyshould be stopping and looking

(25:30):
at what actually does my teamneed?
Because my team needs diversityof thought and experience at
some level.
I'm not saying there isn't abunch of core skills, right, but
what does my team need as faras the people leader, community?
And then, in this role, what isreally needed, and that's the
skills, that's maybe theattributes, things like the

(25:50):
level of energy or theperspective or the experience
that that person brings.
And so when you define thatfirst, without immediately
jumping and going, oh hey, thisperson, that woman, this guy,
they're all high performers,we're going to see if they want
the role and we're going to tapthem on the shoulder, then we
have some relatively objectiveas objective as you can be
criteria that we said these areimportant and then, hey, let's,

(26:12):
let's go talk to people, but weneed to compare them against
those criteria, versus lettingour emotions or the pressure
that sometimes comes even higheror sideways from people saying
you got to put this person inthe role.
They're amazing, right, um sothat's awesome Like this.

Josh Matthews (26:28):
This is wisdom.
People need to hear this stuff.
I mean, I hope this, I hopethis episode blows up and that
that thing you just said rightnow, because the two things, my
biggest two takeaways right nowand there's a lot, cause you're
you're.
You're very experienced, verywise, very smart.
But if I'm going to synthesizethe main thing, it's think
before you act.

(26:48):
Right, it's like put a littlebit of.
It's fine to have a roadmap,but you've got to have a
destination first and you haveto understand what you want it
to be like when you get there.
You don't do that.
You're screwed Like you reallyare, or at least you're rolling
the dice, and you're playingagainst the house too.

(27:09):
The odds are not in your favor.
The statistics show.
What is it?
48% of people aren't at the jobthat they started 18 months
later.
That's a horrendous record,right?
Yeah, horrendous record right.

Josh LeQuire (27:23):
Yeah, whitney, I've got a question for you With
that in mind.
There's obviously the strategiclook ahead for the company, the
position, the role, thecapability for leadership.
How much is it incumbent uponthe organization to develop the
leader if they're promoting theminto the role, versus finding

(27:44):
the leader with that skill set?
I'm really curious to get yourperspective on that, because I
think a lot of times when wepromote people because of
relationships or for otherfactors, we kind of ignore the
fact that this person will needdevelopment, just like the
people on my team that I need todevelop in their roles.
So any thoughts on that?

Josh Matthews (28:04):
Yeah, let's hear that.

Whitney Faires (28:06):
Yeah, so uh, well, I think as an organization
, we always have the coreresponsibility for making sure
when we change somebody's careerpath and hey, that means their
life, because most of us aremaking money, like we love our
work, but we're making money tosupport somebody or do something
that's important to us too, weowe it to that person to create
some sort of structure to fostertheir success.

(28:31):
Now, absolutely not everycompany, especially small
companies, are going to havesome beautiful development
program that holds everyone'shand through all the skills that
they need.
That's not realistic and I getthat.
But we as a hiring managershould be able to have an
outline of a plan for the skillswe're going to develop.
But first we have to assessthose skills, because they might

(28:52):
have some of those skills.
But the diagnosis of skills,our plan for how we're going to
develop them in their role.
So if it's not a program, itshould be a group of mentors
with specific guidances toskills they should help them
through.
It should be the leader always,even if the program's in place,
it should still be the leader,and so I would say that the one

(29:13):
thing I say, too, is what'sreally tough about leaders
hiring other people.
Leaders.
Is that the best way you cancoach and guide people that work
for you, whether an IC or aleader, is to observe them doing
whatever you're trying to coachthem on right?
Is that the best way you cancoach and guide people that work
for you, whether an IC or aleader, is to observe them doing
whatever you're trying to coachthem on right?
So if I want to see how goodsomebody is at hiring top talent

(29:34):
, I mean, yeah, I look at theirtrack record, but I actually
want to look at things like Iwant to do an interview with
them.
I want to watch them, do aninterview and co-interview
somebody so I can see howthey're thinking and what
they're asking.
And that's what can make itreally hard when you're hiring
people leaders is you don't havethe ability to necessarily see
them and all those skill sets tojudge their readiness.
But what that means is whenthey join your team, how do you

(29:56):
find little opportunities If youcan't observe directly?
You're kind of breaking downhow they've done things in their
day-to-day in a way that'sinquisitive, not micromanagement
, because I know it's probablywhere people's heads go is like
I don't need someone asking meall about my day, but there's a
way that good leaders can do it,so they can figure out how
competent are they in doing this, because I want them to be
successful, and so that's onething I would add in for all the

(30:20):
leaders out there.
How do you know people are goodat the aspects of people
leadership unless you'reunderstanding how they're doing
it or seeing it?

Josh Matthews (30:29):
Yeah, it's so smart.
I mean, you've got to.
We used to just say, like lookunder the covers, like see
what's going on, right, andthey're actually you know the
education system, a lot of theyou know grade schools and even
high school and even college.
Now, system a lot of the gradeschools and even high school and
even college.
Now they want to see your workright.
When I jumped on this little AIdev project which, if you're

(30:52):
watching this on YouTube, makesure you like and subscribe, but
you can check it out I built alittle website for one of my
sons and when I was in there andgetting things done, you know
you can ask, like, can youexplain this?
Like explain the logic behindthis decision, and it'll show
you.

(31:12):
And that's what they're doingin the schools nowadays.
It's like two plus two is four.
It's like, okay, there's rotememory, but I want to see if you
can actually synthesize thealgorithm and break it down, why
, why two plus two actuallyequals four, right?
So they're doing more and moreof that.
Of course, you know we all havecalculators, so we don't need
that anymore, but you know it'sstill this idea of like, how are

(31:35):
they coming to this?
Because we can see and I see itwhen I interview people, like I
see it all the time they have agreat answer, but when you
press, there's more greatinformation and you press again
and it's still pretty good, andthen you press again and it all
falls apart.
It's like the five whys andactually when you were talking
just now, you know, talkingabout observation, it made me

(31:58):
think of this book, is it?
What?
Is it the five dysfunctions ofa team?

Whitney Faires (32:03):
Yes.

Josh Matthews (32:04):
Yeah, so you so.
Okay, so you've read that and Idon't remember the entire.
I don't remember the entirebook, but I do remember at the
beginning.
Basically this you know persongets hired and goes in for two
weeks, keeps his trap shut andhe just watches and there's, you
know the bad apple in thecorner messing around and

(32:26):
grumbling and he just wanted tosee how it all worked before he
even put his foot down.
So critical.
I I just been promoted tonational director of of, uh, the
Bayside groups, um tech staffdown in Australia, and I went
down and I you know it wasn'thuge but I had three offices of
of scientific recruiters, right,chemists and this sort of stuff

(32:48):
.
And I went in and I met withone, one of the owners, and he
gave me specific instructionsmove this guy here, do this, do
that, do this, do that.
And it was my first time.
They didn't know me from Adam.
They'd seen some emails from meCause I'd only been with the
company maybe a month up inBrisbane.
And I went in and I did what myboss told me.
I didn't know to push back.

(33:10):
And I went in and I startedmaking changes and boy, that was
a rough start.
I got through it, but I losteveryone's respect very quickly.
They had already lost mine.
No offense to some of them, butthey'd already lost mine.
Their numbers were terrible,their work habits weren't good
Sorry guys, but it wasn't goodand so I went in with my

(33:32):
sledgehammer and it took a whileto bring it all back.
So when you're a new leadersettling in, taking a breath,
blow it down, figure it out,observe and don't rush the
results.
Generally, in my experience,painful experience is more

(33:57):
likely how you're going to bearthe most fruit from that
specific team.
I'm kind of wondering if you'dlike to share with everybody,
whitney, where they can find outmore information about you.
And then also some final wordsPeople.
This show is not over, right.
We're going to keep going, butwe are going to dive a little

(34:18):
bit into some of the SalesforceSpring Release and some AI
Spotlight stuff and, whitney, Ihope that you'll stick around
and love to get your perspectiveon some of these things.
But do you have some?
Is there something that wehaven't covered so far that you
believe would be really superimportant for people who've been
sitting with us for this longto take away and do something

(34:41):
with?

Whitney Faires (34:42):
Yeah, well, I was actually gonna say to, in
response to the point that youjust made, that you highlight
something really important thatyou are going to make mistakes
as a people leader.
We all do.
Uh, I, I, like you, I went intomy first people leadership role
and I I didn't do it right init.
It was it stung, but you canrecover.

(35:03):
And so, uh, we've talked aboutall the challenges of people
leadership.
I'll leave you with this If youare motivated to do it and
willing to learn, you can do it.
We make it sound hard, becauseit is.
It is really hard.
There's no formula for success,because you're leading human
beings in a dynamic environmentand so you, you have to be able

(35:25):
to flex and adjust.
But the reality is, if you'retapped on the shoulder for that
job and you want to do it, orit's something you're working
towards, you're building yourskills, believe in yourself and
and be committed to justgrinding it out, and so you get
to a place where you feel asconfident as a people leader as
you are.
Uh, are in that role thatyou're in today, and I will cap

(35:47):
it off with saying it is ajourney.
You are not gonna go from whereyou are to then, a quarter or
two or even a year later, beingyour boss?
You're not.
There is an evolution, and socontinuous improvement is what
it's all about, and justcontinuing to elevate your
skills and grow right.
Be someone that people want towork for.

(36:08):
So I appreciate you having me, Iwill stick around.
You can always find me atwhitneyferriscom Tons of
information about all theservices that I offer, and you
can reach out to me there aswell, and, of course, on
LinkedIn.
I'd love for you to follow meand see some of the content I'm
putting out around leadershipand being at your best.

Josh Matthews (36:26):
Fantastic.
Thanks so much for being on theshow.
Definitely connect with Whitney.
Go ahead and hit her up.
You can follow her or connectwith her on LinkedIn.
Be sure to do that.
And we're going to now diveinto Salesforce Spring Release
Notes, and this is not going tobe a fully comprehensive thing,

(36:47):
but merely just a couple thingsthat Josh found very helpful.
Josh LaQuire, it's going to bea little weird with two Joshes
up here.

Josh LeQuire (36:55):
Fair enough, but I think you need nicknames Josh.

Josh Matthews (36:58):
Yeah, right, well , you can have a nickname.
I'm going to keep mine.
Sorry, buddy, go for it Josh.
What's going on with SalesforceSpring Release 25?

Josh LeQuire (37:07):
Goodness, I remember when release notes used
to be I don't know nearly 100pages.
This one was about 880 pageslong, I think, in the PDF.
So lots to cover.
The general themes are more AI,more agents, more Einstein
capabilities.
If you haven't heard yet, thisis a big push by Salesforce is

(37:31):
to use generative AI LLMs aspart of workflows.
I think what was mostinteresting and this will
translate a little bit in aminute to the AI corner is we're
seeing more AI in the setupfunctions of Salesforce.
So not just for sales agentsand service agents to summarize

(37:51):
and transcribe calls, tocomplete a set of actions to be
able to assist customers better,but now we're seeing better
capabilities for administratorsand developers to be able to go
in and actually buildapplications on Salesforce.
So some of those things includeprobably one of the bigger

(38:13):
features is especially foradmins, who are probably really
like this is you can actuallyuse natural language prompts to
generate flows.
I think that's a pretty biggame changer.
Flows I've seen a lot of flows.
I've seen a lot of really badflows.
I think that's a pretty biggame changer.
Flows I've seen a lot of flows.
I've seen a lot of really badflows.
I've seen a lot of things thatdon't quite work.
I actually think this could besuper helpful for, especially

(38:35):
for companies that don't havedevelopers on staff, or maybe
the admin is the superhero ofthe organization.

Josh Matthews (38:41):
That's pretty powerful, and I will say, we had
a wonderful episode on the Joshforce channel and you can also
find it on our, you know, on thepodcast, whether you're
listening on Apple or Spotify orwhatever your favorite platform
, is all about Salesforce flowsand I remember Stacey Whitaker,
who was our guest of that day,talked about.

(39:02):
You know, sometimes some likebig flows that might be an 80
hour project, it might be ahundred 120 hour project, and
now with the, the LLMs uh, theLLM layer, um, or the generative
AI chat layer, involves I meanyou can, you can push things out
really fast and I think duringAI spotlight I'll even give a

(39:23):
little example it's not onSalesforce, but stay tuned and
we will give a little bit of anexample how this guy me, the
non-developer actually was ableto develop something.
So what else is going on there?
So we've got flows and can Iask you, josh, do like, how is
this going to impact SIs ingeneral?
Right, if building things arefaster, we all know clients are

(39:46):
getting slower to sign contracts.
We've all seen that, right, andwhen they finally sign, they
always want everything right now, because they've been sitting
on their thumbs for two months,three months or six months
longer.
It's like it used to just besign, let's go, post COVID,
let's go, we're going to go,come on.
And now it's like hurry up andwait for months, sometimes a

(40:10):
year, I mean.
I get these calls from myclients all the time.
So how is, how is this layergoing to help SIs deliver?
You know awesome applicationsand what's that.
You know what are the changesthat they might need to adapt to
because of this?

Josh LeQuire (40:27):
Well, how much time do you have, josh, because
we could talk about this andthen we're going to ask
something else.

Josh Matthews (40:31):
30 seconds yeah.

Josh LeQuire (40:33):
I think the short version is this is going to make
us work faster and better.
The platform is getting broaderand broader, deeper and deeper.
I don't think generative AIdevelopment capabilities are
going to eliminate jobs, butmake us do more in shorter
periods of times.
It will make the nature ofchanges we deploy to the

(40:53):
business more iterative andagile.
I think things that used totake us two or three weeks will
now take us minutes, and you'regoing to see the pace of change
just go through the roof, whichI think is going to make,
honestly, developers and adminsmore valuable.
There's a lot of mixed opinions, josh.
You've talked to people.
We talked about it this week.

Josh Matthews (41:10):
Yeah, I'm going to jump in on this real quick,
because it's definitely a mixedbag.
I mean, the reality is I ransome deep seek research and I
really dove into what's going tohappen to careers due to AI in
the next three years, and then Inarrowed that search.
This was all on perplexity,using the deep seek model and,

(41:36):
by the way, I just boughtlearnperplexityai, so I don't
know, maybe I'm going to dosomething with that.
I couldn't believe it wasavailable.
I got it for 12 bucks, so it'snot why I'm pitching it.
I'm pitching it because I thinkit's the best research tool
that anyone can get for about240 bucks a year.
It's pretty amazing.
I did this big research andeventually created a decent

(41:59):
sized blog about it.
We're going to go over all ofthose results from that search
four weeks from today.
Two weeks from now, we've gotan AI company.
We're going to go over all ofthose results from that search
four weeks from today.
Two weeks from now, we've gotan AI company that's going to be
joining us, sensha, with thetwo Davids, and it'll be two
Davids and two Joshes.
And then, four weeks from now,we're going to really go over

(42:20):
what impact AI is going to haveon careers, and I have to tell
people because I feel like if Isit on it for a full month like
I'm doing everyone a disservice.
I want full transparency.
So let me just be really clear.
If you are not getting involvedin AI in any capacity right now
, this does not mean you need tolearn agent force.
But if you are stumbling aroundand messing around with GP a

(42:46):
little bit but not actuallylearning how to use it, you will
be left in the dust.
The numbers are absolutelythreatening for those who don't
adapt.
We're talking about somewherebetween a 20 and 35% reduction
in forces for those who don'tget on the bandwagon and
anywhere from like a 20 to 40%increase in compensation for the

(43:10):
early adopters who get involvedin it.
Now, learn this.
Now.
You want to know how to do it.
Get on perplexity or GPT andask it.
Tell them what you do, tellthem your job right and and say
I need help.
Can you structure some trainingfor me so I can really get my
arms around all the LLMs, how Ican use it in my job and so

(43:32):
forth?
Do it today and you will beshocked.
I I think everyone knows thatabout.
I think it was four weeks agoor two weeks.
I think it was two weeks ago, Ican't even remember, but I
committed to spending 20 hoursof AI through the month of AI
learning.
Guess what, by the way, we're inspring release notes slash AI

(43:52):
spotlight right.
Thank you, josh.
So much for that right.
So much for planning.
But I have to get this messageacross If you guys take one
thing from anything that I sayon this show, there's a lot to
take from Josh and from Whitneytoday.
If you're going to take onething from Josh Matthews today,
it's this Get on the AIbandwagon or die, and I'm not

(44:17):
even freaking, joking.
We're not talking about threeyears.
Your job might be threatened.
We're talking about a massivereduction in the next 12 months.
Next 12 months.
Get on it today and don't wait.
Okay, that's my soapbox and wecan go back.
Do you guys want to sayanything about that?
Again, we're going to have awhole show on it.

Josh LeQuire (44:38):
You know actually, Whitney, since you're here,
what are implications forleaders with AI and leadership.
I would love your take on that,because this is a hot topic in
our world right now.

Whitney Faires (44:51):
Yeah, it's a hot topic in my world for sure, and
when I launched my company andtransitioned out of corporate,
everyone was like you got to useAI.
And so I actually found thisguy who came and recommended to
me that could teach me how tocreate personas in chat, gpt,
how to use it, the different AItools and without a doubt, it
has been a massive acceleratorin my business.

(45:12):
But for leaders, the ability tobrainstorm different things in
chat, gpt or look up things,research things in perplexity,
it's real value added.
It's something like you couldjust do it on your phone in the
moment.
You know it doesn't have to bethis big, like you set aside a
time and do it.
It's like, hey, I need, I needa.
You know three steps to coachan employee.
Or, you know, I don't know ifyou always want to go, how would

(45:34):
you handle it, because younever know what you're going to
get but there's a lot you can do.

Josh Matthews (45:50):
Leaning on it it gets you thinking, for sure,
definitely.
And I think people should gocheck out Mark Good.
Mark Good and I are going to becatching up, I think tomorrow
or in a couple of days, but heruns AI Force and he can teach
you through some of his courses.
You know how to use GPT, youknow as it relates to a
Salesforce professional.
By the way, guys, we're notpaid for advertising here.
We really try and keep it cleanand just tell you, like where
you can go to get some help.
Right, we spend money here onthis show.

(46:10):
We don't make money, so youknow so, but definitely do
something to serve, to serveyourself and you're, and be kind
to your future self by doingsomething for yourself with ai
today.

Josh LeQuire (46:21):
Go ahead, josh yeah, and I'm going to get back
to release notes and AI in aminute, but I want to also
piggyback a little bit on someof the stuff Whitney was saying,
because I can say for me, as aprofessional services provider,
a consultant, a managed servicesprovider, this has just
transformed how I'm even able toenable my teams and build

(46:44):
systems for my teams to succeedand our engagements, generating
documents when we talk aboutrequirements, user stories,
solution, architecture, we talkabout building backlogs,
managing backlogs, stuff thathonestly would take us 20, 40,
60, 80 hours we can now dowithin minutes.
I mean, it is a game changer.

(47:05):
And I think what's importantfor me, too is quality is kind
of a hallmark of how we deliverfor our clients.
So a lot of you folks out therewho work in consulting probably
it's no secret your firstconsulting gig, or maybe even
your 10th, whether it's a smallcompany or a Capgemini, you get
thrown into the wolves.
You may ask your boss what do Ido?

(47:28):
How do I do it?
I don't know.
You figure it out.
Well, those days are over,because we now have agents we
can deploy to help coach ourteam members.
I have an architect agent, Ihave an analyst agent, I have a
developer agent Now.
Granted, how this is going toshape our careers and how this

(47:48):
is going to shape our jobs isnot that these things take over
and do it.
These things guide us.
The word co-pilot is actuallyspot on right.
These are not people who aredoing the job, they're just
helping us to do our job better.
So these are tools for leaders,left and right, in my opinion,
in any job, in any capacity.

Josh Matthews (48:07):
Definitely.
And I was at the keynote whenBenioff was introducing
AgentForce at Dreamforce thislast year and the thing that was
I don't even remember what itsaid it was like agents helping
humans or it was something likethat.
It was something about humansand agents or agents guided by

(48:30):
humans and I thought, well,that's really smart, because no
one wants to feel like they'regoing to be displaced.
What's going to happen issomeone's going to know this
stuff and you don't.
And if you don't, you will be,and that's the reality.

(48:51):
But it's okay, you know.
I mean, look, doctors aren'texactly doing, uh, taking
appendix out the way they did onmy dad's in 1965.
Right, you know, by the time Ihad mine out, I guess it runs in
the family and it was 1984 andI've got a scar this big.
And now someone who gets it.
The scar is this big, it's tiny, it's a pinhole you can't even
see.
So just adapt, don't make a bigdeal out of it, just get

(49:14):
involved.
That you've created all ofthese agents Like.
I want to hang out with youmore and you show me what you've
done, like for real, because Ineed to do that for myself even
more.
But it's just learning.
You know all these people whoare like, what's the next cert I

(49:35):
should get?
I mean, yeah, you can go getyour AI specialist if you want,
like that's fine, or you couldjust spend 20 hours on something
.
Just get good at this stuff.
It's just part of learning.
No-transcript, right?
Did you think it was going tobe the same?

(49:57):
I talked to a developmentcompany I'm helping out this one
organization and they want toget this app built.
And I talked to this oneorganization and it was like
pulling teeth to get them toadmit what kind of tech stacks
they work with.
I was not impressed.
It's like this stuff's 25 yearsold.
You don't have to do that.

(50:17):
What about micro architecture?
What about rust, like?
What about a go gen and thingslike that.
Like, come on, you know, staywith the times.
And uh, I want to hear moreabout what you've got going on.
But maybe we can wrap uprelease notes here.
Yeah, just a few minutes, andthen we'll dive into a tiny

(50:38):
little bit more AI, somethingfun that I think people will
think is really cool for theaverage listener, and then we'll
wrap up the show and we'll beback in two weeks.
So go for it.

Josh LeQuire (50:47):
Josh Sounds great and I promise at the end of the
show I'll give folks listeningsome really good things you can
do at home to accelerate yourworkflow and get some immediate
value out of AI.
So we'll parking lot that for aminute.
I do want to talk about releasenotes a little bit.
The pace of change fromSalesforce is getting faster and

(51:07):
faster.
The number of features aregetting larger and larger.
It's amazing.
I think.
One thing I'm really excitedabout in these releases and this
is going to be the nerdydeveloper side of me and people
I work with with is SLDS2, thelightning design system two.
This is a fresh look forlightning at Salesforce.
If you folks were watching theDreamforce presentations and

(51:31):
other presentations thatSalesforce offers about product
releases and updates, youprobably noticed the UI looked a
little different.
I remember seeing this andthinking, man, where do I get my
hands on that?
Like, what is this?
It's here and it's nowavailable for testing.
So not to pile on to the AIlearning and keeping up with the

(51:51):
latest and greatest, but if youare a front-end developer, if
you want to create somebeautiful experiences in
Salesforce, check out SLDS2.
Go to lightningdesignsystemcom.
You'll see it there.
It is beautiful and I'm excitedabout that.
I think there's going to besome capabilities there.
Generally speaking.
To summarize the rest of whatyou need to know a lot of data

(52:13):
cloud updates, a lot of Einsteinupdates, a lot of agent force
capabilities for the industriesWhether you're looking at health
cloud, communications cloud andthe other ones really take a
look at those.
If you watch Salesforce's adminrelease note videos, you'll see
a lot about list views a lot ofgreat capabilities there.
I've seen some good discussionson LinkedIn about the power of

(52:35):
using simple solutions like listviews.
Those are all spot on.
You don't need to over-engineera solution if a ListView can do
the job.
And updates to creating customreports or at least doing custom
report types.
You know it's a little bitnicer interface to build, so too
many features to talk about.
Those were a few things thatstood out.
I'll publish a blog post.

(52:56):
Share it out if you want tolook later.
And Josh, I think you're onmute.

Josh Matthews (53:03):
Oh god, I'm learning this stream yard thing,
man, like we.
You know, when you podcast forfour years and all of a sudden
you have to be on camera,usually I'm sitting back in my
chair with a cigar, you know, ina t-shirt, barefoot, with my
feet up.
This is a totally differentthing.
It's I got to shave and is myhair okay, so whatever.
But I've got an idea for peoplethat we can jump into.

(53:28):
It's kind of tied to releasenotes and I think that they
might be kind of stoked to seeit.
So here's what I'm going to doNow.
If you're listening to thepodcast, you won't be able to
see it.
So I'm just going to talk usthrough really, really quickly.
It's kind of a bit of afollow-up to when Whitney and I
were talking a little bit aboutfinding a mentor, and so I'm

(53:52):
going to present a blankperplexity screen and on this
screen you join perplexity.
It's twice.
You can do a few things forfree, but you can jump in here
to perplexity and click create aspace, and then you can go
ahead and drop in custominstructions.
So this, these are, this iswhere you would put all your,

(54:16):
all of your specificinstructions right, act as if an
expert on whatever.
Whatever you're going to uploadand communicate in this style
and then, once you've createdthat space, you can go to you
click on your space.
I've got one for YouTube shortsdescriptions and I've got one

(54:36):
for NPC writing and so on.
Youtube shorts descriptions andI've got one for NPC writing
and so on.
But you can just go ahead andcreate a new thread inside that
space and click attach file andthen you can upload.
You can go ahead and upload therelease notes if it's in PDF
800 pages and then you can askthat agent anything that you

(54:57):
want about those release notes.
Pretty amazing.
What do you guys think?
Something that you might dosomeday?

Josh LeQuire (55:06):
I did it already for these notes.

Josh Matthews (55:09):
I love it.

Josh LeQuire (55:09):
It's easier than reading 880 pages, although I
did skim through and look at thetable of contents and clicked
into some of the headlines.
But at the end of the day, thisis another productivity game.
Why sit down, whitney?
You talked about leadersconstructing agendas for
meetings and putting togetherpresentations.
Man, I'll tell you, I can'tremember the last time I had I

(55:31):
actually sat down and spent 10hours going, slide by slide, to
figure out what bullet comeshere, what bullet goes next.
I've been using AI to do thisstuff for a long time and it
does a pretty good.
It's not flawless I played moreof the role of editor and
change things that it spits out,but, man, it just takes me a
lot less time and I love it.

Whitney Faires (55:50):
Yeah.
The efficiency gains aretremendous and I totally agree.
You throw something big inthere and you ask the questions,
you get the summary and I meanit saves you so much time and
you're able to pull in differentperspectives.
If you're I mean I get thereleases I'm taking a different
approach, like if you throw acouple of things in there and
you have it summarize key themes, like you can draw on some

(56:12):
great information with afraction of the investment of
time.

Josh Matthews (56:17):
Yeah, absolutely.
Guys, can I show you somethingfun Again?
I already alluded to it at thestart.
I've already created a separatevideo.
It wasn't on the podcast, but Ithink it'd be kind of fun for
our audience, at least thosethat are re-watching this on
LinkedIn Live the event, whichyou can check it out.
You can follow me, follow Josh,follow Whitney, and I

(56:39):
definitely recommend followingJosh for us.
Honestly, I don't love mychannel too much.
We're going to change thethumbnails.
We're going to reorganize it.
I've got people working on itright now.
But what I do want to share isthis pretty dope thing called
lovable, lovabledev, and let mego ahead and share my screen

(56:59):
real quick.
First I'm going to.
The first thing I'm going toshare is what I actually built,
and what I built was a littleapp called mayonnaisecom, as in
John Mayer mayonnaise, and thisis an app for my son, who, john
Mayer.
He plays guitar and drums and alittle bit of piano.

(57:19):
John Mayer's his favoriteartist and my friend, mike
Wakuna, told me about lovabledev, and so I jumped on and I just
said, hey, I want to build thisapp and this is what it can do.
And it just said great, let'sstart building it and and
started going off, and so inhere you can jump to all of the
different albums.

(57:40):
You can go to your favoritesongs, you can pop out the
chords and you can even go, youknow, you can click a button to
go directly to a different pageof the lyrics.
You can pop out the scales.
It tells you the scales and thekey that it's in.
There's a night mode, which isgreat, and then you can sort it

(58:01):
however you want, by title or byalbums, all albums and so forth
.
So it's not a very robust app,but for someone who just wants
to like, imagine you're a buskerand you just need to remember
what the key changes are, it'skind of of cool.
So I wanted to share that and Idid that inside of, uh, lovable

(58:23):
dot dev, which is, I mean, hereI'll show you real quick
because it's pretty, it's prettydope present.
Here we go.

Josh LeQuire (58:32):
I think that's really awesome, josh, and you
reminded me I need to go book mydead and company uh shows at
the sphere before they.

Josh Matthews (58:38):
they stopped playing there, yeah man All he
actually went to that.
I think it was this summer.
He went out and saw, saw thedead and friends.
So here I've scrolled it to thevery top and I just said can
you create a guitar tab app thatis just for one musician, john
Mayer and it said yeah, I can doit.
Features for the first versiondesign elements.

(58:58):
And here it is.
And now I'm just saying like,okay, tabs didn't populate,
let's do this instead.
I'm barely talking to it.
Great, add 20 more songs,remove the text about looking
for full lyrics and blah, blah,blah, blah, blah.
And it's just building it thewhole time.
So check out lovabledev.
Give yourself look as a verygood friend of mine.

(59:20):
I was talking to him yesterday.
He was in Dubai, so I got totalk to my friend in Tel Aviv.
I got to talk to my buddy inDubai and we were talking about
other development projects andhe's like Josh, you're not a web
developer or you're not adeveloper.
Like, have fun with it, butlike, don't kill yourself.
But our audience is you guysmake stuff, you know, and
personally I found it to be asfun as like getting hooked on a

(59:43):
Harry Potter video game orsomething like it was like, oh,
this is fun, I'm going to golike keep rolling Right, so
check that out.
Any thoughts or comments beforewe wrap up?
We are at the hour, whitney.
Last words.

Whitney Faires (59:56):
Well, I was going to say I'm going to need
AI to teach me how to play theguitar so I can use your app.
All know can do that.
Well, the last thing I'd say ismy motto for a very long time
has been dream the dream, buildthe plan and bet on yourself in
big ways.
So, whatever it is AI orleadership, whatever it is I'd

(01:00:18):
say go chase it, but do it withintentionality.

Josh Matthews (01:00:21):
I love it.
Thank you, very right.

Josh LeQuire (01:00:24):
That dream, the dream, bet on yourself.

Josh Matthews (01:00:25):
And yeah, that's a massive motto.
I love that thing.
What about you, Josh?
Again, welcome to your firstepisode as co-host.
I hope you had fun.

Josh LeQuire (01:00:35):
Oh, I had a blast.
We could geek out on this stuffall day long.
I love the topic of leadership.
Thank you, whitney.
Your insights have beenincredibly valuable.
I've written down a lot ofnotes and you've reminded me to
think of some things I need tothink of in terms of listening a
bit more and being able todevelop people a little more.
I have a problem, especially asa small business owner, doing

(01:00:55):
way too much.
That's a persistent challengeof mine.
A small business owner doingway too much.
That's a persistent challengeof mine.
So thank you for helping me towork through that.
So I think the last thing I'llsay, josh, what you did with
Mayor Nays is the directioncompanies are going.
This is why it's important tounderstand AI.
For example, if you're amarketer, the old school
approach is run an ad to landingpage, capture some leads and

(01:01:18):
hope it works, or send an emailblast out to a segment of your
database.
You know what it's going to betomorrow Creating an interactive
experience, deploying a websiteclick, click, done.
So the times are changing.
You know there's a lot of thisgoing on.
I love seeing you do what youdid.
I hope it inspires people.

Josh Matthews (01:01:40):
I love it.
You do what you did.
I hope it inspires people.
I love it.
Guys, thank you for listeningto the Salesforce Career Show.
We'll be back in two weeks withSencha the two Davids from
Sencha and be sure to like andsubscribe.
Thank you, whitney Farris.
You've been awesome.
Thank you, joshua Quire.
We'll see you guys soon.
Bye for now.