Ever wondered why communicating with teenagers can feel like walking on eggshells? Join us as we sit down with Emily Powell, a therapist specializing in teen and young adult care, to uncover the unique challenges and rewards that come with talking to teens. We talk plainly about the things that make adolescents prone to volatility and hostility, and why adults often feel intimidated by their pursuit of autonomy and independence.
In our enlightening conversation, Emily shares her personal journey that led her to become a therapist, and how she cultivates a warm and open environment in her sessions. We also discuss the power dynamics between a therapist and client, and explore ways to create a comfortable and safe therapeutic space. With insights from Emily's background as a ballet dancer, you'll walk away with a deeper understanding of how to communicate effectively with the teens in your life and a newfound appreciation for the world of therapy for young people. Don't forget to learn more about Emily at http://www.emilypowellcounselingservices.com
This is a show where ideas come together. The guest statements expressed on The Savvy Communicator Podcast are their own and not necessarily the views of The Savvy Communicator.
Thanks for joining us! Become part of the conversation at www.savvycommunicator.com, and follow me on social media: my handle is @savvycommunicator.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi and welcome to the Savvy Communicator podcast.
I'm your host, amy Flanagan.
Today's question reaches a lotof us right in our living rooms
How do you talk to your teen?
My guest expert today is EmilyPowell, a therapist focusing on
teen and young adult care.
Emily, thank you so much forbeing here.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Thank you so much for having me.
I'm excited for ourconversation.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Thank you.
Yeah, I am too, So I'm justgonna plunge into it and just
ask you.
you know, a lot of people saythat teens are the hardest
people to communicate with.
Is that?
Speaker 2 (00:36):
something you agree with?
Not.
It's a hard question because Ican see why they might be
difficult to communicate with.
Developmentally they are in avery unique phase of life And
with that comes kind ofdifficult and sometimes hot
style communication.
At the same time I love workingwith them because I love the
(00:59):
way that they're thinking.
at that time They have a lot ofabstract knowledge but at the
same time they think in terms ofblack and whites.
you know, like I hate you mom orI love you mom very kind of
back and forth And that can be,like I said, volatile and
hostile at time, but I lovebeing able to work with them and
(01:20):
kind of see how they'rethinking and walk in their shoes
a little bit.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Why do you think we as adults just feel so
intimidated?
You know you talked a littlebit about how they're thinking
and the fact that it can be verychangeable from time to time,
but I know from my ownexperience.
I have nephews that are growingup to be teenagers and all of a
sudden I'm just second guessingmyself all the time.
I don't want them to think thatI'm weird, i don't want them to
(01:48):
think that I'm not listening tothem or that I don't care about
them.
but all of a sudden I feel likeyou know, you can give a
five-year-old a hug and say Ilove you very much, and it
doesn't work with a 15-year-oldnecessarily.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah, that's such a good point.
At that stage, developmentally,teens are really searching for
autonomy and independence And atthe same time they're still
living with a lot of confines ofyou know maybe what their
caregivers are wanting andneeding from them.
They're not officially adultswhere they can legally have
(02:22):
independence yet, but again,developmentally they really want
to feel empowered to make theirown decisions.
So a lot of times when they'reconstricted by school and
after-school activities and allthe things that they need to do
in their house with theirparents and everything, i feel
(02:43):
like they are lacking some ofthat independence that they so
desperately want.
So that's kind of a lot of thetimes where some of that
hostility comes in.
They're trying to assertthemselves that they don't want
to be seen as a child anymoreand they want some freedom.
But there are rules with beinga teenager and they're still
(03:04):
living in their parent home andall of that.
Yeah, they're.
With what you said in terms oflike you know that you can give
your five-year-old nephew a hug,but not so much your
15-year-old nephew, i think ofthe perfect example in showing
some of that independence thatyour nephew oh, 15 years old is
probably wanting right now.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
Okay, well, that's good to know.
Did you always know that shewanted to work with teens and
young adults?
Speaker 2 (03:33):
No, not necessarily.
I've always wanted to be atherapist.
I was lucky in the sense that Ireally liked my psychology
class in high school and it wasvery interesting to me to kind
of understand a little bit moreabout how humans relate to one
another and relate to themselves.
So I did know that I wanted tobe a therapist from kind of a
(03:55):
young age.
I also notoriously maybeoversensitive some people might
call me, my family members callme very sensitive and so what
did I decide to do with thatsensitivity?
I turned it into my professionbecause, you know, being a
therapist is so much aboutempathy and sensitivity and
(04:16):
relating to folks.
So I knew I wanted to be atherapist.
But in terms of the populationthat I wanted to work with,
that's been grown as I've gottenmore clinical experience and
have had the ability to workwith some really amazing teens
and young people in theirhealing journey.
So that's just been furthersolidified through my clinical
(04:38):
experience.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
So that's fantastic, because I think a lot of people
and I think teenagers certainlyfeel this is that a lot of
adults Just want to run in theother direction.
You know they don't, they don'twant to take them on
necessarily.
So the fact that you go in andembrace that and embrace who you
are to bring it to them, ithink it's just wonderful.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Yeah, i definitely hear what you're saying in terms
of them moving Against and awayfrom teen, that a lot of our
society and parents, kind oflike you said, tend to get
nervous around those teenageyears.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
Yeah, so I was looking at your website and one
of the things I think you reallytake great strides to
communicate Is a sense ofcomfort, a sense of feeling that
you can come in and Speak andthat you know you're there to
listen.
You Emphasize that a lot.
(05:35):
Do you get a lot of trafficfrom your website?
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Most, mostly from my website and from my social media
.
Yeah, i try to convey thatsense of warmth and openness and
Therapy, supposed to be a spacethat people feel like they can
share some of their mostvulnerable thoughts and emotions
, without that judgment thatthey might be receiving from a
(06:01):
friend or a family member.
So, yeah, i'm glad that thatkind of was able to come through
a website.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Yeah, so in theory you might get a Client from
Instagram then yeah, that mightbe.
You know how they getcommunication.
I'm Gen X right you know, istill remember the phone book
right, and So it's reallyinteresting to me to be like no,
(06:30):
this is how it's done.
Somebody might find you onInstagram first before they find
your website, before they findyour phone number.
Yeah, and I think that's reallycool that you have that, and
very savvy, yeah as well.
Yeah, so Did you decide thattherapy was for you when you
(06:50):
were in your high schoolpsychology class?
Did it take a little whilelonger?
I?
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Think I'm trying to remember it definitely sparked
my interest in in my high schoolPsychology class, but I don't
think I knew how to turn it intolike a career path.
And then in College I majoredin Psychology and I admired in
sociology, gender and sexualitystudies and Public health, so
(07:21):
the kind of like intersection ofall of those allowed me to see
like a really Clear path tobecoming a therapist.
I love talking to people, ilove communicating with people
and I love hopefully makingcommunication more accessible
for folks too.
Like a lot of the work we do intherapy is rooted in
(07:41):
relationships and is rooted incommunication.
Yeah, i think that's kind ofwhen I solidified it was
probably during college,studying a wide array like Human
interaction actually, yeah,that makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Has there ever been a time when you have felt that
You weren't sure what to say,whether that's in, with a client
, or out?
a lot of people freeze duringthat moment, and one of the
things that I'm hoping to dowith this podcast is to teach
people Techniques for gettingover that hump, you know,
(08:16):
recognizing that it's there Andthat it's okay to be there and
working through it.
So has there ever been a timethat you've experienced where
you just, you know, weren't surewhat to say?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Yeah, absolutely All the time to me.
You know people are coming to mewith really vulnerable stories
and emotions and They're at apoint oftentimes where they're
unsure of kind of who to turn toyou or how to go glide that,
and sometimes it takes me aminute to Listen and truly Hear
(08:52):
what they're saying before Ijump to and communicating or
vocalizing something, um, ithink that's a really crucial
part of therapy in general isJust pausing.
There's a lot of silence inthere.
We're both people in the roomare Kind of metabolizing what's
(09:13):
being said and what's being felt, um, and and that silence is
welcomed and actually encourageda lot of times to, with some of
that discomfort, sit with thoseFat or heavy feelings, because
a lot of time, like you said, weeither freeze or we try to kind
of like chew it away altogether, so Kind of like jump into
(09:38):
saying something that maybe wedon't, we haven't fully
articulated in our thoughtprocess yet, and then it comes
out in a way that we don'treally need it to.
So that pause and silence is ahelpful tool for me as a
therapist to.
With that discomfort before Imove into vocalizing anything.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
So it's really learning to be comfortable with
silence and Not being afraid toto take that time And sort of
get through it is what I'msaying.
Would that be correct?
Speaker 2 (10:14):
Yeah, and another thing I might add to this too is
just working with keys Andreally working with people in
general and theme.
Just from my own experiences oftherapists, what I see
happening is that when peoplereach out in a time of need,
maybe they're really strugglingwith a situation, maybe they're
(10:37):
struggling generally with theirmental health.
When they reach out to anotherperson, that person tends to
want to immediately fix theissue.
So let's say, just for a team,let's just give an example.
Let's say that team comes backfrom school and they've had a
terrible day and maybe they havea lot of social stuff going on
(11:01):
and maybe kids are being mean tothem or maybe they're
struggling academically.
Whatever, they come back fromschool and they say to their
parent I hate school, i neverwant to go back to school like I
hate all these kids at school.
A lot of times as a parent, theymight say, oh my gosh, i have
to go talk to your principal, wecan't keep doing this.
(11:21):
Or oh my gosh, we're going toget you a tutor, you're failing
this math class.
They jump the solution becausethey want to ameliorate the
issue and they don't want to seetheir team in pain anymore.
Right, they're talking to theteams in therapy, what I'm
realizing is that the team justwants to feel hurt, and that's
(11:43):
why they come to them, right.
They just want a parent or atherapist to say, oh my gosh,
that's so tough.
I can see why you would feel sodefeated right now or so
frustrated, and that feels a lotmore comforting than those
solutions or those quickstatements of like, oh, i'm
(12:04):
going to go beat up the kids,we're making fun of you, or you
know what I mean.
So really, we want the goal tobe feeling heard, feeling
validated, instead of trying tocreate solutions or jump to
problem solving.
I think that can be kind oflike a key takeaway in terms of
(12:25):
how to communicate with fanswhen they are so worked up, and
so maybe making like a dramaticscene out of something that an
adult could see is just a smallissue, you know.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
Embrace the silence is first thing that you
mentioned.
And then for the second thing,it's don't immediately try to
fix the problem, just listen andvalidate.
This funny story came to mindwhere the singer Pink.
She has a young daughter and Ithink she was around six years
(13:00):
old when this happened.
But she said that her daughtercame home from school and was
crying because somebody had beenmean to them and that her
immediate thing was to pack upthe kid in the car go and she
stopped herself and she was like, well, i can't beat up a six
year old, so I'm not sure whatto do.
And then she was able to sortof step back and think about the
(13:26):
goal that she wanted, and itturned out that the goal was
just that she wanted to be heardand the next day they were best
friends.
And I'm not saying that happenswith teens, because it's so
much more difficult, as I'm sureyou know.
But yeah, that story justpopped into my mind.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
And another thing that hearing that story made me
think of like another little kidis going back to that idea of
like the freedom and autonomythat teens want.
It can be really amazinglyaffecting for a parent or, you
know, an adult figure in thisteen's life to ask seeing, what
do you need right now?
(14:06):
How can I best support you?
And by asking the teen thatquestion, the power and autonomy
is in their hands.
They feel empowered to say youknow, i think I just need like,
can I have a hug?
which would be really nice ifour teens like ask that it might
not be that, like it might bemore, like I just need time
alone or like I need to go to myroom and isolate or whatever.
(14:28):
But just asking the teen whatis it that you're needing right
now can feel really empoweringand it can feel like the parent
is really listening to what theteen is feeling and needing.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Okay, so don't follow your instincts.
basically is what we'rethinking is might be the advice
that you're talking about.
Right And I think you know thatsilence, yeah, and that silence
, and that pause can be helpfulin not jumping to these like
kind of natural instincts thatwe might hop on Sure, sure.
(15:07):
That's great, those are greattips.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
So, also.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
I'm looking at your website and it was that you have
a really artistic side.
You do ballet, you travel, lotsof stuff like that.
Are you a ballet dancer or areyou just a big fan?
Speaker 2 (15:24):
So I used to be all through my like high school into
college year I was a balletdancer Pretty intensely.
But as I moved further intocollege and kind of sought out
different passions and hobbies,i stopped dancing.
I also had some injuries, sothat didn't help.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
But I do love.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
I love ballet and I hope to start taking more like
adult classes, just because itwas such a passion of mine, kind
of learning how to reintegratemy previous creative passions
into my adult life and my career.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
Yeah, Now I really understand that.
I was an actor for many yearsand definitely completely
dedicated to college and thetime after and then I went to
grad school for it And it'samazing what kind of happens
organically that can get you offthat path.
But at the same time I findthat I use acting techniques
(16:22):
pretty much every day in thework that I do.
And do you feel the same way Ido?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
think so.
I think it taught me so muchabout who I am and how I am as a
person too That I do feel likeI carry a lot of it with me,
both for the good and bad,because ballet is intense and
it's very strict andperfectionistic.
So I think I'm learning on kindof letting go some of those
(16:51):
tendencies too, but I do findmyself referencing ballet in my
experience as a dancer a lot.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
That's fantastic.
I think that's really great tostill keep that part of you
nearby and just see how itinforms everything that you do.
So, like we talked about yourwebsite, you really go to an
effort to make sure that peoplefeel comfortable just reading
about you or just watching avideo about you.
Does that extend to when theycome to meet you?
(17:25):
What kind of steps do you taketo ensure that that comfort goes
beyond into meeting you, intothe environment?
Speaker 2 (17:36):
Yeah, that's such a great question.
So I hear a relationalframework to ground my
therapeutic work.
So what that means is lookingat the relationship between the
client and the therapist as thecatalyst for healing and as the
catalyst for growth.
So I try and extend thatframework into everything I do,
(17:58):
between the way I set up mytherapy office or some of the
things that I say within ourfirst session.
So, for example, throughout ourwork in therapy, i will often
check in, asking questions like,how do you feel about our
relationship right now?
Like, do you feel like, is thereany way that I can support you
further Or is there anythingthat I'm doing or saying that
(18:21):
you would prefer to change?
I also might think about if thetherapy concession is in person
.
I might think about how thedistance between our seats feel.
Does there feel like there's areally big power dynamic, Like
if you think of like a veryFreudian therapy room, like
there would be a big red chairand the therapist would get to
(18:45):
sit in that chair and the clientmight be sitting on the couch.
After laying on the couch inold times, which we don't do
anymore, I try to even thinklike for my teen clients,
sometimes I'll do things likewhere you sit in my therapy
chair, you know if it's like abigger, cozier chair.
I try to really level the powerdynamic, because what's often
(19:09):
not talked about is the alreadyexisting power dynamic between a
therapist and client.
So, you know, a client is in avulnerable moment and they go to
seek out this expert or thisprofessional in mental health
And sometimes even with thatthere's like a lack of
understanding that, like yourtherapist is also a human with
(19:29):
like many imperfections andthings that they're working on
too.
So I try to bring in as muchcommon humanity and like as much
of my personality as I can forthe clients to realize okay,
like she's not just like allknowing, like God's figure, like
she's a human right.
Yeah, i constantly check inwith the clients in terms of how
(19:50):
they're feeling about thephysical distance between us how
they're feeling in thetherapeutic space.
If there's anything that I coulddo to make them feel a little
bit more comfortable, even ifit's, you know, opening the
shades or closing the shade likeI don't know anything like that
I try to just bring a certainlevel of comfortability into
this space so that they can feellike my.
(20:12):
The word that I love most isempowerment.
I want my clients to feelempowered when they're with me.
Often times they're coming inwith life experiences that have
left them feeling chronicallydisempowered, right, whether
it's some form of trauma andabuse, which is, of course,
disempowering, or maybe just theway that they've been raised or
(20:35):
parental wounds throughouttheir life.
So I really try to empower themto feel safe within the
therapeutic space, knowing thatthat safety and trust takes time
to build, especially with folkswho have endured trauma Of
course.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
So really you face those things head on.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
I think a lot of times.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
Our instinct is to not do that, and sort of hope it
works out, hope that that willcome over time and they'll
realize whether it's arelationship at work, a
relationship with a friend orsomebody that you're dating or
hoping to date.
A lot of times we just, i thinkkind of, you know, close our
(21:20):
eyes and grit our teeth and belike, hopefully that'll come,
but you're like said, facingthat and you're doing things.
Something as simple as saying,do you want the shades open or
closed, gives some of thatautonomy, some of that
empowerment over, and thatsounds like a tip that we could
(21:40):
all adopt.
And I think that too, assomebody who's worked in
communications for a long timenow that it's always once you
hit it head on, it becomeseasier, Even if you think this
is a huge deal.
I'm about to tell this personthat I'd like to go on a date
with them.
I'm about to tell this personthat I need to set a boundary at
(22:03):
work.
Maybe and I don't have to do it, maybe they'll just figure it
out by other things that I sayor other things that I do.
Yeah, hearing that you justsort of face that and kind of
charge through it is a reallygood tip, i think.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
Yeah, and what you're saying is like, oftentimes with
like anxiety around specificthings we have to do, we want to
avoid it because thattemporarily alleviates the
anxiety, right.
But then we get into this likeanxiety, like avoidance cycle,
and the anxiety just increasesand increases and increases.
As we all know, when weprocrastinate having hard
(22:41):
conversations, that conversationjust takes up more space in our
head and we think about it more, get more frustrated.
So leaning into that discomfortand addressing it head on it
can be really beneficial, buthard, Like I'm not trying to
globs over, but No, yeah.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
No, definitely It is hard, but I think, like anything
else, and tell me what youthink.
I think you know, like learninghow to do anything else, the
more you do it, the easier itbecomes and the more comfortable
that you feel.
That doesn't mean that thefirst time is going to feel easy
and comfortable, but that it'ssomething that can be practiced.
(23:21):
Yeah, and it's something thatshould be practiced Totally.
What do you think?
Speaker 2 (23:26):
Yeah, I agree.
I think, in terms of likecommunication in general, I
think there's a lot of fear fearof judgment, fear of the way
that I'm going to react to ourcommunication, especially when
we're communicating and need,because that makes us feel
really vulnerable and like opento rejection.
But I think that we can practiceit and we do practice it in
(23:46):
therapy a lot.
We'll do things like that wecall like role play of.
Like pretend that your mom issitting in that chair across
from you How are you going tosay what you need to say, how
are you going to assert yourneeds And how might your mom
react?
You know So, almost like withyour history of theater and
performance, like we can bringin some what we call psycho
(24:06):
drama into the room and rehearsethese behaviors and these
conversations that might betriggering, and then we process
it after.
What came up for you when youwere practicing that What types
of doubt might have you had Andhow did your body respond?
Did you feel your heart beating?
Like how might you address thatwhen you had the actual
(24:29):
conversation?
So there's a lot we can do interms of practicing
communication within the therapythat speaks.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
That's fantastic.
It's wonderful to know thatthose are all tools going on,
because I would imagine thatwith every, since every client
is different, the tools that areneeded are different.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Yeah, absolutely Yeah .
Speaker 1 (24:53):
We're going to take a quick break.
My guest is Emily Powell,therapist working with teens and
young adults.
You're listening to the SavvyCommunicator podcast.
Find us on Instagram at SavvyCommunicator.
All one word, We'll be rightback.
Welcome back to the SavvyCommunicator.
(25:25):
We're here with Emily Powelland Emily.
I want to just ask you the bigquestion What can we do as
adults to give teens and youngeradults the communication that
they really deserve?
Because lots of things and lotsof techniques have come and
gone and they're still feelingthat they need things we're not
(25:51):
giving them Right.
So what would you advise?
Speaker 2 (25:57):
I think that there's real power in trying to connect
with your team And a lot oftimes, kind of like what we
talked about throughout thispodcast so far, is a lot of
times there's this urgency tolike run from teams because we
don't know how they're going toreact, necessarily, but our
underlying goal is connection.
(26:17):
We can hopefully begin toreally hear and listen to teams
and validate their experience.
Even if they feel silly ordramatic to us as a doll, it's
real for them And their worldsdo feel very influenced by maybe
these quote unquote like minorthings that might be happening
(26:39):
at school or major thingsobviously.
But we want to see the teamseriously and really validate
their pain and their happinessand their experience.
So I want to get a little bitof an anecdote to kind of paint
a picture maybe for some of theparents or people who have to
(27:00):
visit their life.
So no, please, yes.
So what I see a lot of timeswith mental health in general is
this feeling of needing to turninward based on a lack of
proper communication.
That happens kind of throughoutthe person.
So, just by way of example, iwant you to think about a five
(27:26):
year old kid.
So this five year old is reallyvulnerable and little and still
kind of a toddler growing upinto a kid.
And let's say that there's abig thunderstorm, kind of like
child runs into their parentsroom.
Let's say it's like late atnight the child is freaking out.
(27:47):
They're like, yeah, it's reallyloud, there's going to be
something going to fall in thehouse.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
They're really worried about this thunder.
They're not used to it.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
And there's kind of two ways that a parent could
respond.
The parent might be working,they're busy, maybe they're
making themselves dinner, maybethey're dealing with other kids,
a ton of other things, right?
And they might look at the kidand be like it's Lee, go back to
bed, you're being ridiculous.
It's the weather, like calmdown, right, and in that moment
(28:18):
the kid learns okay, i'm kind ofcrazy for being scared and I'm
going to go back in bed And nexttime the tap, and I'm certainly
not going to run to mom anddad's room, right?
The other response would be forthe parent to say my gosh, yeah,
it really is scary, and whydon't we come play with you?
(28:41):
Or would it feel good if Iscratched your back?
Or maybe we could read anotherstory.
So the second option is muchharder because it takes more
time and emotional energy forthe parent or caregiver.
Or it's the option that kind ofleaves the kid feeling heard
and valued and like their needsand their fears are important.
(29:04):
So fast forward to, let's say,10 more years of this behavior
pattern from the parents, right?
So maybe the parents are superbusy, maybe they're dealing with
their own stuff, maybe they'redealing with their own
relationship.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
You know, now.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
But with years and years of accumulation of maybe
being turned down or theirfeelings and needs being
unimportant, the team begins toturn inwards and they want to
ice-leap more.
That's when we see behaviorslike cell harm starting.
That's when we see likerestricting or having disordered
(29:42):
relationships with food comingin.
That's when we see maybeturning to like drugs or alcohol
or just feeling generallyanxious, depressed, isolated.
So with that example what I'mtrying to show is that, yes, it
takes time and energy And a lotof times maybe as a parent you
(30:03):
don't have that time and energy,so it's not easy.
But what we really want to dois make sure that the kid knows
that their feelings and theirexperiences are real and valid
And we hear them and we'rewilling to kind of sit with them
and witness that pain and fear.
(30:23):
So that's kind of like my go-toexample of demonstrating the
power of connection and theimportance of really listening
when your kid comes to you,because if you don't, your kid
is going to stop coming to youaltogether.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Yeah Well, that's an excellent, excellent analogy.
I really appreciate that Soundsgood.
Let's close with a basicquestion What's your favorite
ballet?
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Oh gosh, probably Sleeping Beauty.
It's such a good one Trying tothink I also I mean the
Nutcrackers it's like amazing,because as many times as I
performed in the Nutcracker,like the songs and the energy in
that show just like make me sohappy and bring back so many
(31:15):
different memories.
So, yeah, i would say those two.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
That's great, that's great You got to perform with
the Nutcracker.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Yeah, the good old days.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
So, emily, thank you so much for being here today.
Speaker 2 (31:31):
Thank you so much for having me.
It was so nice to chat.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
It was very nice to chat.
I appreciate it.
So thank you to our audience.
Go to wwwsavvycommunicatorcomIt's all one word And become
part of the conversation itself.
Do you have questions from thisepisode?
We'd like to hear them.
Go to our forum.
All the links will be in theshow notes and we'll see you
next time.
Thanks,
Hi and welcome to the Savvy Communicator podcast.
I'm your host, amy Flanagan.
Today's question reaches a lotof us right in our living rooms
How do you talk to your teen?
My guest expert today is EmilyPowell, a therapist focusing on
teen and young adult care.
Emily, thank you so much forbeing here.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Thank you so much for having me.
I'm excited for ourconversation.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Thank you.
Yeah, I am too, So I'm justgonna plunge into it and just
ask you.
you know, a lot of people saythat teens are the hardest
people to communicate with.
Is that?
Speaker 2 (00:36):
something you agree with?
Not.
It's a hard question because Ican see why they might be
difficult to communicate with.
Developmentally they are in avery unique phase of life And
with that comes kind ofdifficult and sometimes hot
style communication.
At the same time I love workingwith them because I love the
(00:59):
way that they're thinking.
at that time They have a lot ofabstract knowledge but at the
same time they think in terms ofblack and whites.
you know, like I hate you mom orI love you mom very kind of
back and forth And that can be,like I said, volatile and
hostile at time, but I lovebeing able to work with them and
(01:20):
kind of see how they'rethinking and walk in their shoes
a little bit.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Why do you think we as adults just feel so
intimidated?
You know you talked a littlebit about how they're thinking
and the fact that it can be verychangeable from time to time,
but I know from my ownexperience.
I have nephews that are growingup to be teenagers and all of a
sudden I'm just second guessingmyself all the time.
I don't want them to think thatI'm weird, i don't want them to
(01:48):
think that I'm not listening tothem or that I don't care about
them.
but all of a sudden I feel likeyou know, you can give a
five-year-old a hug and say Ilove you very much, and it
doesn't work with a 15-year-oldnecessarily.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah, that's such a good point.
At that stage, developmentally,teens are really searching for
autonomy and independence And atthe same time they're still
living with a lot of confines ofyou know maybe what their
caregivers are wanting andneeding from them.
They're not officially adultswhere they can legally have
(02:22):
independence yet, but again,developmentally they really want
to feel empowered to make theirown decisions.
So a lot of times when they'reconstricted by school and
after-school activities and allthe things that they need to do
in their house with theirparents and everything, i feel
(02:43):
like they are lacking some ofthat independence that they so
desperately want.
So that's kind of a lot of thetimes where some of that
hostility comes in.
They're trying to assertthemselves that they don't want
to be seen as a child anymoreand they want some freedom.
But there are rules with beinga teenager and they're still
(03:04):
living in their parent home andall of that.
Yeah, they're.
With what you said in terms oflike you know that you can give
your five-year-old nephew a hug,but not so much your
15-year-old nephew, i think ofthe perfect example in showing
some of that independence thatyour nephew oh, 15 years old is
probably wanting right now.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
Okay, well, that's good to know.
Did you always know that shewanted to work with teens and
young adults?
Speaker 2 (03:33):
No, not necessarily.
I've always wanted to be atherapist.
I was lucky in the sense that Ireally liked my psychology
class in high school and it wasvery interesting to me to kind
of understand a little bit moreabout how humans relate to one
another and relate to themselves.
So I did know that I wanted tobe a therapist from kind of a
(03:55):
young age.
I also notoriously maybeoversensitive some people might
call me, my family members callme very sensitive and so what
did I decide to do with thatsensitivity?
I turned it into my professionbecause, you know, being a
therapist is so much aboutempathy and sensitivity and
(04:16):
relating to folks.
So I knew I wanted to be atherapist.
But in terms of the populationthat I wanted to work with,
that's been grown as I've gottenmore clinical experience and
have had the ability to workwith some really amazing teens
and young people in theirhealing journey.
So that's just been furthersolidified through my clinical
(04:38):
experience.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
So that's fantastic, because I think a lot of people
and I think teenagers certainlyfeel this is that a lot of
adults Just want to run in theother direction.
You know they don't, they don'twant to take them on
necessarily.
So the fact that you go in andembrace that and embrace who you
are to bring it to them, ithink it's just wonderful.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Yeah, i definitely hear what you're saying in terms
of them moving Against and awayfrom teen, that a lot of our
society and parents, kind oflike you said, tend to get
nervous around those teenageyears.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
Yeah, so I was looking at your website and one
of the things I think you reallytake great strides to
communicate Is a sense ofcomfort, a sense of feeling that
you can come in and Speak andthat you know you're there to
listen.
You Emphasize that a lot.
(05:35):
Do you get a lot of trafficfrom your website?
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Most, mostly from my website and from my social media
.
Yeah, i try to convey thatsense of warmth and openness and
Therapy, supposed to be a spacethat people feel like they can
share some of their mostvulnerable thoughts and emotions
, without that judgment thatthey might be receiving from a
(06:01):
friend or a family member.
So, yeah, i'm glad that thatkind of was able to come through
a website.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Yeah, so in theory you might get a Client from
Instagram then yeah, that mightbe.
You know how they getcommunication.
I'm Gen X right you know, istill remember the phone book
right, and So it's reallyinteresting to me to be like no,
(06:30):
this is how it's done.
Somebody might find you onInstagram first before they find
your website, before they findyour phone number.
Yeah, and I think that's reallycool that you have that, and
very savvy, yeah as well.
Yeah, so Did you decide thattherapy was for you when you
(06:50):
were in your high schoolpsychology class?
Did it take a little whilelonger?
I?
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Think I'm trying to remember it definitely sparked
my interest in in my high schoolPsychology class, but I don't
think I knew how to turn it intolike a career path.
And then in College I majoredin Psychology and I admired in
sociology, gender and sexualitystudies and Public health, so
(07:21):
the kind of like intersection ofall of those allowed me to see
like a really Clear path tobecoming a therapist.
I love talking to people, ilove communicating with people
and I love hopefully makingcommunication more accessible
for folks too.
Like a lot of the work we do intherapy is rooted in
(07:41):
relationships and is rooted incommunication.
Yeah, i think that's kind ofwhen I solidified it was
probably during college,studying a wide array like Human
interaction actually, yeah,that makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Has there ever been a time when you have felt that
You weren't sure what to say,whether that's in, with a client
, or out?
a lot of people freeze duringthat moment, and one of the
things that I'm hoping to dowith this podcast is to teach
people Techniques for gettingover that hump, you know,
(08:16):
recognizing that it's there Andthat it's okay to be there and
working through it.
So has there ever been a timethat you've experienced where
you just, you know, weren't surewhat to say?
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Yeah, absolutely All the time to me.
You know people are coming to mewith really vulnerable stories
and emotions and They're at apoint oftentimes where they're
unsure of kind of who to turn toyou or how to go glide that,
and sometimes it takes me aminute to Listen and truly Hear
(08:52):
what they're saying before Ijump to and communicating or
vocalizing something, um, ithink that's a really crucial
part of therapy in general isJust pausing.
There's a lot of silence inthere.
We're both people in the roomare Kind of metabolizing what's
(09:13):
being said and what's being felt, um, and and that silence is
welcomed and actually encourageda lot of times to, with some of
that discomfort, sit with thoseFat or heavy feelings, because
a lot of time, like you said, weeither freeze or we try to kind
of like chew it away altogether, so Kind of like jump into
(09:38):
saying something that maybe wedon't, we haven't fully
articulated in our thoughtprocess yet, and then it comes
out in a way that we don'treally need it to.
So that pause and silence is ahelpful tool for me as a
therapist to.
With that discomfort before Imove into vocalizing anything.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
So it's really learning to be comfortable with
silence and Not being afraid toto take that time And sort of
get through it is what I'msaying.
Would that be correct?
Speaker 2 (10:14):
Yeah, and another thing I might add to this too is
just working with keys Andreally working with people in
general and theme.
Just from my own experiences oftherapists, what I see
happening is that when peoplereach out in a time of need,
maybe they're really strugglingwith a situation, maybe they're
(10:37):
struggling generally with theirmental health.
When they reach out to anotherperson, that person tends to
want to immediately fix theissue.
So let's say, just for a team,let's just give an example.
Let's say that team comes backfrom school and they've had a
terrible day and maybe they havea lot of social stuff going on
(11:01):
and maybe kids are being mean tothem or maybe they're
struggling academically.
Whatever, they come back fromschool and they say to their
parent I hate school, i neverwant to go back to school like I
hate all these kids at school.
A lot of times as a parent, theymight say, oh my gosh, i have
to go talk to your principal, wecan't keep doing this.
(11:21):
Or oh my gosh, we're going toget you a tutor, you're failing
this math class.
They jump the solution becausethey want to ameliorate the
issue and they don't want to seetheir team in pain anymore.
Right, they're talking to theteams in therapy, what I'm
realizing is that the team justwants to feel hurt, and that's
(11:43):
why they come to them, right.
They just want a parent or atherapist to say, oh my gosh,
that's so tough.
I can see why you would feel sodefeated right now or so
frustrated, and that feels a lotmore comforting than those
solutions or those quickstatements of like, oh, i'm
(12:04):
going to go beat up the kids,we're making fun of you, or you
know what I mean.
So really, we want the goal tobe feeling heard, feeling
validated, instead of trying tocreate solutions or jump to
problem solving.
I think that can be kind oflike a key takeaway in terms of
(12:25):
how to communicate with fanswhen they are so worked up, and
so maybe making like a dramaticscene out of something that an
adult could see is just a smallissue, you know.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
Embrace the silence is first thing that you
mentioned.
And then for the second thing,it's don't immediately try to
fix the problem, just listen andvalidate.
This funny story came to mindwhere the singer Pink.
She has a young daughter and Ithink she was around six years
(13:00):
old when this happened.
But she said that her daughtercame home from school and was
crying because somebody had beenmean to them and that her
immediate thing was to pack upthe kid in the car go and she
stopped herself and she was like, well, i can't beat up a six
year old, so I'm not sure whatto do.
And then she was able to sortof step back and think about the
(13:26):
goal that she wanted, and itturned out that the goal was
just that she wanted to be heardand the next day they were best
friends.
And I'm not saying that happenswith teens, because it's so
much more difficult, as I'm sureyou know.
But yeah, that story justpopped into my mind.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
And another thing that hearing that story made me
think of like another little kidis going back to that idea of
like the freedom and autonomythat teens want.
It can be really amazinglyaffecting for a parent or, you
know, an adult figure in thisteen's life to ask seeing, what
do you need right now?
(14:06):
How can I best support you?
And by asking the teen thatquestion, the power and autonomy
is in their hands.
They feel empowered to say youknow, i think I just need like,
can I have a hug?
which would be really nice ifour teens like ask that it might
not be that, like it might bemore, like I just need time
alone or like I need to go to myroom and isolate or whatever.
(14:28):
But just asking the teen whatis it that you're needing right
now can feel really empoweringand it can feel like the parent
is really listening to what theteen is feeling and needing.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Okay, so don't follow your instincts.
basically is what we'rethinking is might be the advice
that you're talking about.
Right And I think you know thatsilence, yeah, and that silence
, and that pause can be helpfulin not jumping to these like
kind of natural instincts thatwe might hop on Sure, sure.
(15:07):
That's great, those are greattips.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
So, also.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
I'm looking at your website and it was that you have
a really artistic side.
You do ballet, you travel, lotsof stuff like that.
Are you a ballet dancer or areyou just a big fan?
Speaker 2 (15:24):
So I used to be all through my like high school into
college year I was a balletdancer Pretty intensely.
But as I moved further intocollege and kind of sought out
different passions and hobbies,i stopped dancing.
I also had some injuries, sothat didn't help.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
But I do love.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
I love ballet and I hope to start taking more like
adult classes, just because itwas such a passion of mine, kind
of learning how to reintegratemy previous creative passions
into my adult life and my career.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
Yeah, Now I really understand that.
I was an actor for many yearsand definitely completely
dedicated to college and thetime after and then I went to
grad school for it And it'samazing what kind of happens
organically that can get you offthat path.
But at the same time I findthat I use acting techniques
(16:22):
pretty much every day in thework that I do.
And do you feel the same way Ido?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
think so.
I think it taught me so muchabout who I am and how I am as a
person too That I do feel likeI carry a lot of it with me,
both for the good and bad,because ballet is intense and
it's very strict andperfectionistic.
So I think I'm learning on kindof letting go some of those
(16:51):
tendencies too, but I do findmyself referencing ballet in my
experience as a dancer a lot.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
That's fantastic.
I think that's really great tostill keep that part of you
nearby and just see how itinforms everything that you do.
So, like we talked about yourwebsite, you really go to an
effort to make sure that peoplefeel comfortable just reading
about you or just watching avideo about you.
Does that extend to when theycome to meet you?
(17:25):
What kind of steps do you taketo ensure that that comfort goes
beyond into meeting you, intothe environment?
Speaker 2 (17:36):
Yeah, that's such a great question.
So I hear a relationalframework to ground my
therapeutic work.
So what that means is lookingat the relationship between the
client and the therapist as thecatalyst for healing and as the
catalyst for growth.
So I try and extend thatframework into everything I do,
(17:58):
between the way I set up mytherapy office or some of the
things that I say within ourfirst session.
So, for example, throughout ourwork in therapy, i will often
check in, asking questions like,how do you feel about our
relationship right now?
Like, do you feel like, is thereany way that I can support you
further Or is there anythingthat I'm doing or saying that
(18:21):
you would prefer to change?
I also might think about if thetherapy concession is in person
.
I might think about how thedistance between our seats feel.
Does there feel like there's areally big power dynamic, Like
if you think of like a veryFreudian therapy room, like
there would be a big red chairand the therapist would get to
(18:45):
sit in that chair and the clientmight be sitting on the couch.
After laying on the couch inold times, which we don't do
anymore, I try to even thinklike for my teen clients,
sometimes I'll do things likewhere you sit in my therapy
chair, you know if it's like abigger, cozier chair.
I try to really level the powerdynamic, because what's often
(19:09):
not talked about is the alreadyexisting power dynamic between a
therapist and client.
So, you know, a client is in avulnerable moment and they go to
seek out this expert or thisprofessional in mental health
And sometimes even with thatthere's like a lack of
understanding that, like yourtherapist is also a human with
(19:29):
like many imperfections andthings that they're working on
too.
So I try to bring in as muchcommon humanity and like as much
of my personality as I can forthe clients to realize okay,
like she's not just like allknowing, like God's figure, like
she's a human right.
Yeah, i constantly check inwith the clients in terms of how
(19:50):
they're feeling about thephysical distance between us how
they're feeling in thetherapeutic space.
If there's anything that I coulddo to make them feel a little
bit more comfortable, even ifit's, you know, opening the
shades or closing the shade likeI don't know anything like that
I try to just bring a certainlevel of comfortability into
this space so that they can feellike my.
(20:12):
The word that I love most isempowerment.
I want my clients to feelempowered when they're with me.
Often times they're coming inwith life experiences that have
left them feeling chronicallydisempowered, right, whether
it's some form of trauma andabuse, which is, of course,
disempowering, or maybe just theway that they've been raised or
(20:35):
parental wounds throughouttheir life.
So I really try to empower themto feel safe within the
therapeutic space, knowing thatthat safety and trust takes time
to build, especially with folkswho have endured trauma Of
course.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
So really you face those things head on.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
I think a lot of times.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
Our instinct is to not do that, and sort of hope it
works out, hope that that willcome over time and they'll
realize whether it's arelationship at work, a
relationship with a friend orsomebody that you're dating or
hoping to date.
A lot of times we just, i thinkkind of, you know, close our
(21:20):
eyes and grit our teeth and belike, hopefully that'll come,
but you're like said, facingthat and you're doing things.
Something as simple as saying,do you want the shades open or
closed, gives some of thatautonomy, some of that
empowerment over, and thatsounds like a tip that we could
(21:40):
all adopt.
And I think that too, assomebody who's worked in
communications for a long timenow that it's always once you
hit it head on, it becomeseasier, Even if you think this
is a huge deal.
I'm about to tell this personthat I'd like to go on a date
with them.
I'm about to tell this personthat I need to set a boundary at
(22:03):
work.
Maybe and I don't have to do it, maybe they'll just figure it
out by other things that I sayor other things that I do.
Yeah, hearing that you justsort of face that and kind of
charge through it is a reallygood tip, i think.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
Yeah, and what you're saying is like, oftentimes with
like anxiety around specificthings we have to do, we want to
avoid it because thattemporarily alleviates the
anxiety, right.
But then we get into this likeanxiety, like avoidance cycle,
and the anxiety just increasesand increases and increases.
As we all know, when weprocrastinate having hard
(22:41):
conversations, that conversationjust takes up more space in our
head and we think about it more, get more frustrated.
So leaning into that discomfortand addressing it head on it
can be really beneficial, buthard, Like I'm not trying to
globs over, but No, yeah.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
No, definitely It is hard, but I think, like anything
else, and tell me what youthink.
I think you know, like learninghow to do anything else, the
more you do it, the easier itbecomes and the more comfortable
that you feel.
That doesn't mean that thefirst time is going to feel easy
and comfortable, but that it'ssomething that can be practiced.
(23:21):
Yeah, and it's something thatshould be practiced Totally.
What do you think?
Speaker 2 (23:26):
Yeah, I agree.
I think, in terms of likecommunication in general, I
think there's a lot of fear fearof judgment, fear of the way
that I'm going to react to ourcommunication, especially when
we're communicating and need,because that makes us feel
really vulnerable and like opento rejection.
But I think that we can practiceit and we do practice it in
(23:46):
therapy a lot.
We'll do things like that wecall like role play of.
Like pretend that your mom issitting in that chair across
from you How are you going tosay what you need to say, how
are you going to assert yourneeds And how might your mom
react?
You know So, almost like withyour history of theater and
performance, like we can bringin some what we call psycho
(24:06):
drama into the room and rehearsethese behaviors and these
conversations that might betriggering, and then we process
it after.
What came up for you when youwere practicing that What types
of doubt might have you had Andhow did your body respond?
Did you feel your heart beating?
Like how might you address thatwhen you had the actual
(24:29):
conversation?
So there's a lot we can do interms of practicing
communication within the therapythat speaks.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
That's fantastic.
It's wonderful to know thatthose are all tools going on,
because I would imagine thatwith every, since every client
is different, the tools that areneeded are different.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Yeah, absolutely Yeah .
Speaker 1 (24:53):
We're going to take a quick break.
My guest is Emily Powell,therapist working with teens and
young adults.
You're listening to the SavvyCommunicator podcast.
Find us on Instagram at SavvyCommunicator.
All one word, We'll be rightback.
Welcome back to the SavvyCommunicator.
(25:25):
We're here with Emily Powelland Emily.
I want to just ask you the bigquestion What can we do as
adults to give teens and youngeradults the communication that
they really deserve?
Because lots of things and lotsof techniques have come and
gone and they're still feelingthat they need things we're not
(25:51):
giving them Right.
So what would you advise?
Speaker 2 (25:57):
I think that there's real power in trying to connect
with your team And a lot oftimes, kind of like what we
talked about throughout thispodcast so far, is a lot of
times there's this urgency tolike run from teams because we
don't know how they're going toreact, necessarily, but our
underlying goal is connection.
(26:17):
We can hopefully begin toreally hear and listen to teams
and validate their experience.
Even if they feel silly ordramatic to us as a doll, it's
real for them And their worldsdo feel very influenced by maybe
these quote unquote like minorthings that might be happening
(26:39):
at school or major thingsobviously.
But we want to see the teamseriously and really validate
their pain and their happinessand their experience.
So I want to get a little bitof an anecdote to kind of paint
a picture maybe for some of theparents or people who have to
(27:00):
visit their life.
So no, please, yes.
So what I see a lot of timeswith mental health in general is
this feeling of needing to turninward based on a lack of
proper communication.
That happens kind of throughoutthe person.
So, just by way of example, iwant you to think about a five
(27:26):
year old kid.
So this five year old is reallyvulnerable and little and still
kind of a toddler growing upinto a kid.
And let's say that there's abig thunderstorm, kind of like
child runs into their parentsroom.
Let's say it's like late atnight the child is freaking out.
(27:47):
They're like, yeah, it's reallyloud, there's going to be
something going to fall in thehouse.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
They're really worried about this thunder.
They're not used to it.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
And there's kind of two ways that a parent could
respond.
The parent might be working,they're busy, maybe they're
making themselves dinner, maybethey're dealing with other kids,
a ton of other things, right?
And they might look at the kidand be like it's Lee, go back to
bed, you're being ridiculous.
It's the weather, like calmdown, right, and in that moment
(28:18):
the kid learns okay, i'm kind ofcrazy for being scared and I'm
going to go back in bed And nexttime the tap, and I'm certainly
not going to run to mom anddad's room, right?
The other response would be forthe parent to say my gosh, yeah,
it really is scary, and whydon't we come play with you?
(28:41):
Or would it feel good if Iscratched your back?
Or maybe we could read anotherstory.
So the second option is muchharder because it takes more
time and emotional energy forthe parent or caregiver.
Or it's the option that kind ofleaves the kid feeling heard
and valued and like their needsand their fears are important.
(29:04):
So fast forward to, let's say,10 more years of this behavior
pattern from the parents, right?
So maybe the parents are superbusy, maybe they're dealing with
their own stuff, maybe they'redealing with their own
relationship.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
You know, now.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
But with years and years of accumulation of maybe
being turned down or theirfeelings and needs being
unimportant, the team begins toturn inwards and they want to
ice-leap more.
That's when we see behaviorslike cell harm starting.
That's when we see likerestricting or having disordered
(29:42):
relationships with food comingin.
That's when we see maybeturning to like drugs or alcohol
or just feeling generallyanxious, depressed, isolated.
So with that example what I'mtrying to show is that, yes, it
takes time and energy And a lotof times maybe as a parent you
(30:03):
don't have that time and energy,so it's not easy.
But what we really want to dois make sure that the kid knows
that their feelings and theirexperiences are real and valid
And we hear them and we'rewilling to kind of sit with them
and witness that pain and fear.
(30:23):
So that's kind of like my go-toexample of demonstrating the
power of connection and theimportance of really listening
when your kid comes to you,because if you don't, your kid
is going to stop coming to youaltogether.
Speaker 1 (30:42):
Yeah Well, that's an excellent, excellent analogy.
I really appreciate that Soundsgood.
Let's close with a basicquestion What's your favorite
ballet?
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Oh gosh, probably Sleeping Beauty.
It's such a good one Trying tothink I also I mean the
Nutcrackers it's like amazing,because as many times as I
performed in the Nutcracker,like the songs and the energy in
that show just like make me sohappy and bring back so many
(31:15):
different memories.
So, yeah, i would say those two.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
That's great, that's great You got to perform with
the Nutcracker.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Yeah, the good old days.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
So, emily, thank you so much for being here today.
Speaker 2 (31:31):
Thank you so much for having me.
It was so nice to chat.
Speaker 1 (31:34):
It was very nice to chat.
I appreciate it.
So thank you to our audience.
Go to wwwsavvycommunicatorcomIt's all one word And become
part of the conversation itself.
Do you have questions from thisepisode?
We'd like to hear them.
Go to our forum.
All the links will be in theshow notes and we'll see you
next time.
Thanks,
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