Nicholas Remy - The Underwater Club - The Scuba GOAT Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Matt Waters (00:07):
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Scuba
go Podcast where we explore thefascinating world of Scuba
diving and ocean exploration.
This week we are talkingphotography and rebreathers with
multi award winningphotographer, Nicholas roaming.
With a passion for the ocean andits inhabitants. Nicholas
captures the beauty of theunderwater world through his
lens and is eager to share hisart with fellow enthusiasts.

(00:27):
However, Nicholas is not just aphotographer, but a bit of a
super geek. He analysessituations, technical products,
heck, anything that needsanalysing gets analysed. He also
loves to help aspiringphotographers capture that
perfect underwater image. And sowith his expertise in underwater
photography, love for the ocean,and abilities to formulate plans

(00:50):
and procedures, he has createdthe underwater club. Now, the
underwater club is an onlinecommunity that anyone can
subscribe to, regardless of yourlevel of experience. Over the
last couple of years, he hastirelessly devoted himself to
producing detailed bite sizevideos and a multitude of
classes to share his expertisewith all club members. Welcome

(01:10):
to the show, buddy.

Nicholas Remy (01:13):
Thank you, Matt.
Nice to meet you in person.

It's been a while I think I've been I've been
watching what you and Lena havebeen doing since I got to
Sydney, which is what almostfive years now. I think

you're right. I think we've been I think we've
got to Sydney sort of a decenttime though. Yeah, yeah. Five
years ago, something like that.
Yeah.

Yeah. Well, I only came for a visit initially. And
then hey, presto, here we are.
Yeah, right. Why don't you startoff the show. Let's have a
little bit about you. Why are wesat here and gonna talk about
stuff?

Okay. Well, my name is Nikolas Remy. A French
born gay. I'm 39 years old now.
What can I say? I've got alovely two Cheeky monkeys at
home, keeping me busy andentertained.

By Cheeky monkeys, you mean kids? Right?

wasn't clear. And I've got a wife as well, who
happens to be a diver,underwater photographer and
entered river diver as well.
Yeah. So I have lots of thingsin common. And yeah, the main
reason I came the same time asyou to Sydney was essentially my
passion for diving. And yeah,look, a few years later, I
decided to make underwaterphotography a full time thing

(02:33):
for myself. And I guess that hasto do with the fact the fact
that we're talking now. Yeah,but Yeah, happy days. Yeah,

yeah. The thing that caught my attention when
you were doing all the socials,because obviously, when you get
bored in an evening, we all doit. We just got to scroll
through socials, your photos popup, and you delve a little bit
deeper. And the first thing Iremember seeing of you guys, and
I mean, yourself, and Lena wasgoing dive in getting these
amazing, amazing shots. But youwere doing it on rebreathers. So

(03:05):
that was the different thingthat caught my attention. Right?
Initially, it wasn't the shotsinitially, it was the fact you
were doing it on rebury. That'sbecause obviously, I've been
told by many people, if you'reon a rebreather, there's no
bubble as you get closer to thecritters, blah, blah, blah,
blah, blah. It's exactly whatyou've been doing. Right?

That's right.
Yeah. Yeah, I mean, we reverse,really, that the the
photographer's best friends, aslong as I guess you can, you
know, sort of keep yourattention, giving them a little
bit of attention that they needto sort of keep diving safe.
They're just fantastic for forfor underwater photography. I
mean, you get closer towildlife, you spend much more
time in the water, you don'thave to worry too much about,

(03:41):
you know, you don't have toworry so much about things like
caravans. The opportunities arevery different. And that's,
yeah, that's why we both we willreproduce on a regular basis.
Every every time we divebasically.

Yeah, yeah. And you gotta get a couple of hours on
the water as well. Yeah,

I mean, it's, it has to do a little bit with the
Cheeky monkeys I talked about atthe beginning. We we've been
together and I much before wehad, you know, projects of
starting a family diving hasbeen our thing since nearly the
beginning. And at some point,we're like, okay, we would like
to have kids together. And then,you know, we looked around what

(04:21):
others were doing, and usuallythey were giving up on diving or
sort of, you know, full onpassion, right? And then
without, okay, there's lots of,I guess, life adjustments we're
very much willing to do, butstopping diving is not an option
at all. So we're thinking, okay,and the thing is, I guess if
there's one person in therelationship diving, not the

(04:42):
other, you can always, you know,lock some time for you and have
a bit of me time, but we wantedto keep diving together. And we
thought, okay, what's our youngparent life going to be like in
terms of diving? And we thought,we need to just look at time for
diving Every weekend, we wereboth working full time. So every

(05:02):
weekend, there will be a timefor that where we won't be
parents will be diverse. And wesaid, well, let's say Saturday
morning, we have to look to sometime, Saturday morning, we'll
find a babysitter, and maybewe'll trust them with the kids
for Health Day, how they seemedlike, what we were comfortable
to do. Not not a full day, buthave they seemed reasonable. And

(05:23):
then we said, okay, so if weleave the kids to the
babysitter, we drive to whereveris the shortest dive site, we go
in the water, we dive, well, onehour on the boat, maybe, then we
want to have another dive, weall do service interval, we
actually don't have time. And wedon't want our dive routine to
be one hour per week. So we'relike, Okay, what else could we

(05:45):
do? Well, to save time, you savetime by not exiting the water,
not preparing your gear, notchanging things and all that.
And long story short, you know,time after time, we said, Okay,
well, why don't we just spend agood three hours in the water.
And this way we make 100%, themost of the time that we're
giving ourselves to keep onenjoying diving. And that's what

(06:07):
took us the

happy days. So the bank balances well, in the
negatives, having bought acouple of rebreathers.

Yeah, and that's, that's probably a thing about,
about us as divers. When I chatwith, you know, other divers
very quickly, you start talkingabout travel, where you've been
and all that. And I think I'vebeen diving now since 16 years,
something like that. And I thinkpeople are always surprised to
see how little I have travelled,you know, compared to how long

(06:37):
I've been diving. And that'sbecause, yeah, our live setup
has been around. How can we lockin as much diving hours as we
can per week. And that mayimply, you know, not being able
to travel so easily outside?
Yeah. And that's why Sydney soso that's also why we came to
Sydney. Because we realised thatwell, if we only have going to
dive three hours per week in oneshot, and we have to be in a

(07:00):
city that's big enough for bothof us to find a job. Yeah. Where
in the world could that be? AndSydney ticks the box really well
for those things.

Nice one. Nice one.
What does it was it Lena doesthen what's the what's the job
that she's doing?

She's smoking in it. She's doing project
management. Nice.

Okay, so does she get to choose like Project
lengths and then just have alittle bit of time off and crack
on with it, load more dive inand then pick up the next job.
For

now, I think that would be a good thing for her.
That would be a great setup forher. But for now what she's
doing is she's a full timeemployee. Okay, so it's more,
it's more a weekend thing forher plus the odd trip every year
or something like that. Yeah,

yeah. And what were you doing before you went full
time on what we're going to talkabout?

Yeah, I was doing at CMOS Linna. Actually, we, we
started working in the samecompany. And we've been doing it
together, sort of together for afew years, until I finally
choose to switch back.

Yeah, run away. So where did it all start? Then?
Because you mentioned you'vebeen driving for 16 years? Yep.
What did you learn? Um,

so funnily enough, not too far from here.
Okay. So, long time ago, westarted dating back in the day
we were, we were studying in thesame engineering school back in
France. And the school had anexchange programmes with a few
universities and one of them wasWollongong University. All
right, and we thought, wow,Australia, Hey, that sounds you

(08:30):
know, I had a family history of,you know, being an expat living
abroad. And after a few years inFrance, being a student doing
those things, I was like, yeah,it tickles me. I want to go
travel again. And, and some guyfrom the same engineering school
came back from Wollongong andyou say, Wow, guys, you have you
can believe in the lifestylethere. It's so amazing. And all

(08:51):
that. And I spoke with him and Iwas like, you have to go and
that sounds fantastic. And luckyfor me, Lena was didn't have
much, much experience travellingat the time, but she said, Oh,
you're going we'll go with you.
Okay, you know, for for, youknow, we were just a young young
couple with not so much history,but then she said, I'll go as
well. Alright. And then wejumped on a plane to Australia.

(09:12):
And a bit before we did that,actually. She told me Hey, did
you ever try Scuba diving? AndI'm like, No, but I've always
meant to at some point, youknow, probably and she said, You
know what, Australia apparentlyis pretty good for that. Like,
Ah, okay. And, yeah, long storyshort, we ended up in
Wollongong. And, I mean, beforethat, we were travelling a

(09:34):
little bit before settling downhere. And at some point on the
trip, it was my birthday. Andsuch a lovely girlfriend. She
had planned to try die for mewhen she didn't know. And then
we were in Kangaroo Island andshe said, hey, you know what?
Tomorrow we're going to Dave,we're going to be this guy here.
He's going to teach us and we'regoing to dive brilliant. No, I
was terrified. You know, I waslike decompression sickness, how

(10:00):
am I going to cope with thesafety stubs and all those
things? I was very stressedactually. And then he took us to
a dazzling two metres depth, youknow, and I managed to survive
and a lot of these

brilliant and never looked back,

never looked back. I mean, then we went to
settle down in Wollongong welearnt diving investment not too
far from here. Yeah. Loved it.
Lots of diving during the year.
And then we went back to Francebecause family reasons,
essentially. And then we doveessentially in the Mediterranean
Sea for about 10 years until wecame back here.

Okay. Okay. What do you see in the med?

Ye that much?

Plenty of RX. Yeah.

Some RX? Yeah, definitely good RX. Yeah, the
thing is, I'm sure the med haspotential to be sensational. But
it's a sea that has beensurrounded by so many people.
For a long time over history.
There's been lots ofoverfishing, pollution at times
where we didn't know better, wedidn't know what we were doing.

(11:05):
And you can see the results. Soback in Hong Kong, we were
diving invest points. You know,we jump in the gutter, one of
the popular spots today. Andoften enough, you will see a sea
dragon, you would see a big bluegrouper coming right at your
face. A big blue ray at a timewhen I was very short. sighted.
Yeah, yep. short sighted. Butyou didn't need a prescription

(11:29):
mess because the things were somassive that you will see
anyways, right? Yeah. And thenwe go to France will end next to
Cannes, we find the dive shopthey take as diving. And for
young divers, we're just openwater certified. You know, we're
not used to going deep and doingthose things. The guy pulls us
down from zero to 14 metres veryfast. And we are like, you know,

(11:52):
a bit stressed. But okay. Andwe're thinking that we're going
to 40 metres, we're going tohave to tell that out to all our
dive buddies, and I'm sure we'regoing to see some crazy things
at 40 metres, where we saw onelobster, and maybe two siblings,
and that was it. They were like,Oh, crap. And then we asked
ourselves are we actually goingto keep diving or do we just

(12:13):
keep on the regular basis? Or dowe keep that for you know, the
trip to the Red Sea once a yearand that's it. But eventually we
decided we really liked being inthe water and, you know, that's
for we kept looking diving, butfor sure the the med as a few as
a few things we really liked,you know, big dramatic

(12:33):
landscapes. Nice gorgonians butfrom a wildlife perspective, get
not not comparable to the

or what's your what's your favourite so far?
Wildlife?

Like animal? Ah, I think I there's a few but I
think I really liked the I wasgoing to say with your leafy
lettuce, the leafy Seadragon

PVC dragon.

Yeah, so lovely.

I've yet to take those off. We're gonna go we're
gonna go this year, but I've gotGalapagos trips. So that's where
we go next year. Yeah, it's not.
It's not a bad excuse not to goto the South Australia. Yeah.

And it's really easy to go. I mean, you as long
as you know where to go. We cantalk about that. It's from the
shore shadow, easy and beautifulcreatures.

I think that's the beauty here as well. You've just
mentioned depth. But along thecoastlines here in Australia,
you don't need a lot of depth tosay such a vast array of
critters and creatures.
Biodiversity is insane. And

we were really fortunate. I've read somewhere
that in Sydney Harbour Sydney'snatural harbour there's more
fish species than in the worldMediterranean.

That doesn't surprise me. Yeah, there
probably is more fish in my baththat I don't own than what's in
the Mediterranean.

Yeah, possibly.
Now we've very gifted on this. Ihave landed in Sydney, like I
said, more than five years ago,a bit more than five years ago
now. And I thought, okay,there's like, what 30 shore dive
sites, that will certainly be agood, good basis to keep us
entertained. And then a bunch ofother boat dives. And we're

(14:24):
thinking okay, and there's somewreck dives as well. And in
those five years, I think I'vedone one, maybe two bad days and
that's it, because they're notgood but because the show diving
is so good, so spectacular, thatyou know for what I do, which is
photography. I enjoy so muchgoing there spending three hours
or even even more and you know,having those amazing, amazing

(14:46):
things to further if

I'm making the most of this week because my other
half jazz, she's away in NewZealand for the week with work,
right? So I'm gonna go and hitClifton gardens a few times and
just spend all the time I'm inthe world on my camera and
macro. Because she's not amassive macro fan. So she gets
bored if I'm taking a shot so

much time. Yeah.
Yeah, I mean, especially thattime of the year the water is
very warm. Seven,

while speaking to Ken, Ken Tang pillar. Oh, this
one. I think they did a nightdive on Saturday, it was like
2021 degrees. Nice. I'm not evengonna bother with a wetsuit.
I'll just pull the shark skinon.

Yeah, that is.
But I've been there yesterdayevening, actually. Oh, yeah. So
by the way, if, if I'm askingyou to repeat something, I may
still have water in between theears. So don't don't take
offence.

That's all right.
Like mine on age.

But um, yeah, there was fantastic bit a bit
murky, but there's always somuch to see.

Yeah, yeah, to get all the usual critters. Yeah.

And that's a good time in the year for angler fish
for fish. And that's a timewhere this is you can see them
meeting or you know, having abit of an interesting behaviour.
And yesterday evening, Lindashowed me one push me to
actually just next to eachother. And it was like, Gee,
that might be the moment thatmight be the time a year or one

(16:12):
very lovely yellow with, likestripes on his hands. And
another one, which was more palepink with dark brown stripes
next to each other. So I startedtaking photos and waiting but
nothing happened. Well, that'swhat they did. So if you go in
the main domain GT dementiadissection, where most of the
fishermans are, if you looktowards the inside of the Hubble

(16:36):
that would be on the pillars onthe right. If they don't move
there will be there.

Yeah, yeah. Okay.
I'll have a look. We went outthere last week. And there was
there were two side by side downtowards the end of the jetty a
yellow one and a black one, muchsmaller black one. If they
weren't getting jiggy, jiggy,migraine, no official like
bliss, anything.

But the thing is that it's when they finish the
it's it's dinnertime. Yeah.

Ciao. Literally.
Yeah. Okay, cool. Okay, so theunderwater club? Yes. What's
this all about?

So, the underwater club is, is is a big
term in my relationship withdiving and underwater
photography. Many years, it'sall been about just enjoying
myself taking photos. And youknow, the best way I could spend
my time was being in the wearertaking photos. And the next best

(17:32):
way was possibly being next toLinda while she was taking
photos, and perhaps I waslooking for, you know, stuff for
her to photograph watching overher, helping her with lighting
and doing those things together.
Yeah, but that was really thatwas that was really neat. And
then COVID came, and likeeveryone had a bit more, a bit
less work, actually, yeah, but abit of more free time on my on

(17:53):
my hands, a good time to a goodtime to reflect. And I had, I
guess I had grown a little bitfrustrated that myself on the
way I had, I was managing mytime. So I came to Australia to
enjoy diving in Sydney,essentially, because I knew it

(18:15):
was so good, plus the odd divetrip once a year maybe. And then
I realised that guess whatdiving is really so good. And we
know about it because weexperience it. And we have a
lovely community of people withthe visibility group in
Facebook, where you can exchangetips share what you've seen in a
dive. So you know what'shappening there in the
community, in the dive sites.

(18:37):
And because of the routines thatwe had managed to set up, you
know, around our kids, our divewas going to be Saturday
morning, and that's it. So iffor whatever reason, Saturday
was a crappy time to dive, youknow, tire change, big rain,
whatever the case might be yourbig swell in the wrong
direction. That's where we'regoing to dive if there was some

(18:57):
crazy good conditions or someinteresting wildlife spotty, the
middle of the week, or on Sundayevening. Too bad too sad. I
couldn't go diving. And I wasworking a lot. my corporate job
was very, very demanding. Andvery interesting at the same
time, but busy days withcustomers during during the
normal nine to five and busyevenings because it's a I used

(19:20):
to work for a European company.
So in the evenings, I wascatching up with colleagues with
Europe. So very, very packedlifestyle. And I realised at
some point that, you know, in aregular week, there was very few
time for me to say hey, I reallywant to do what I want to do,
which is more diving. And it wasthinking again, I chose to
become the father. I love myCheeky monkeys. And it just to

(19:42):
have this IT job. Well, it's agreat job, but I love my kids
even more. So if there's onething I'm going to change, it's
the job and the public key. Howcan I you know, make a living
around underwater photographyand And nowadays, as you as you
know, you can't, you can'treally pay all your bills by

(20:06):
just setting photos. That issomething that was possible
maybe 20 years ago. Butnowadays, you have to do a few
different things to, to make upyour new lifestyle, basically.
So I started to think, what aresome of the things that I'm good
at, and that I would enjoy doingfor the time that I'm not taking

(20:26):
photos in my new life. And itstruck me that in all, all the
all the jobs I've had, during mycorporate career, there was one
thing in common, very, verydifferent jobs. But one thing is
common, is that I was on aregular basis having to explain
complex topics, in a simple way.

(20:50):
Because the person I was goingto explain it to was less
technical or less expert me onthe topic. And, and I guess that
was my talent, there wassomething I was good at doing.
And I realised as well, that wassomething I really liked to
doing. I really enjoyed thatprocess to, you know, be with
the person, hear theirquestions, put myself in their

(21:11):
shoes, and see, okay, how can Itake that person with me to
understanding this new thingthat they need to understand? I
really enjoyed that process. Sothen I told myself, well, I'm
going to teach underwaterphotography, that's, that's
something I would enjoy doing alot. And then came the question.
And this took this process tookquite a few months to get the

(21:33):
final ID, but dedicated came thequestion of, how am I going to
teach. So typical example.
There's a few underwaterphotographers teaching this way
you organise a trip, you take,you take, you know, a number of
students on a trip with you.
When you're on the trip, youhave workshops, you have
classes, you show themtechniques, and you explain a

(21:54):
few things. And that issomething I'm going to do on a
case by case basis. For example,in next January, I'm going to do
that with Linda resort during 10days. But that's going to be
another thing, because I'verealised that there is another
way to learn underwaterphotography, which is
essentially how I've learned butupgraded in a way. So

(22:18):
essentially, the, theobservation I came to was that
all the moments where I learned,I learned a lot with reading
books, I'm very analyticalperson. So I guess that that's
how I'm comfortable learning.
And I realised that all the ahamoments where I realised that
I've been improved, I've beenable to master a new technique

(22:42):
to take better photos of thesubject or the situations, the
aha moments was not underwater,the aha moment attends at home,
talking with someone in the bar,in between dives. In the water
was the time where I would testthe idea that I had before, hey,
if I would put my stroke thisway, I'm going to project the

(23:02):
animal's shadows here, thendoing that I'm going to help the
silhouette of the animal pop outfrom the background will be less
distracting. So I had all theseideas in between dives. And then
it will just be a case ofpractising in the world to just
test the ideas that test myunderstanding was okay. And then
that's how I came down to theidea of founding, creating the

(23:24):
underwater club. So theunderwater club is in simple
terms. It's an online underwaterphotography school, where I've
created I've put basicallyeverything I know in terms of
underwater photography, in theformat of essentially video
lessons. And, and it's about togo live in a few weeks time now.

Yeah, congratulations, a lot of hard
work on it.

Yeah. When we started, I had to, you know, of
course, asking his opinion a fewtimes, because there will be a
bit of time during which hewould have, you know, to cope
with me not having an income andinvesting my time on something
else. Yeah. Which he reallyliked the ID. The only thing is
at the beginning, I told her,Okay, I'm going to do a bit of

(24:16):
concept and design on thewebsite, you know, make sure I
have the right components. Iknow how to build it. And then
there will be a time where I'mgoing to put together these,
these online courses. I'm goingto script them. I'm going to
film the videos, I'm going toedit them and all that. And then
you know, just package it on thewebsite launch and that's it.
The gender workload is life. AndI told her, yeah, the course is

(24:39):
production. It's going to takeabout five to six weeks. She
said okay, yep, that's fine. Wecan we can deal with that. Okay.
It took a year and a half.

Hey, she's not divorced, so you must be doing
something right.

It's something.
Yeah, I was very nervous to tellhim where or hadn't let's say I
had registered the firstrecorded the first course. And I
realised that we need much moretime to do the whole thing again
to her. I said, Look, this iswhat I've been doing. This is
the time I've taken to recordthese first few lessons. For

(25:16):
example, at the beginning, whenwe, when we drafted the, the
plan of the courses and thelessons, we would say, okay,
there will be a lesson on, let'ssay, portrait photography, how
do you turn? You know, how doyou move away from just an ID
shot of a fish into a reportwent with character. And I said,

(25:36):
well, the video is probablygoing to be three minutes long,
you know, a script detail, speakquickly, and three minutes that
that's it. And then 40 minutesof video, you need selections
too much time to film, butthat's going to be quick enough.
The video is about 15 minutes,because there's actually so much
to say on the topic, especiallyif you want the person listening
to be able to, you know, not belost in translation or not lose

(26:00):
track of what's being beingsaid. So, I asked her, I said,
Do you still want to moveforward? Are you still happy for
me to spend well, much more timein building this? And she looked
at all the plan I put together?
And she said, Well, we'veeverything you've scripted here,
there's enough to fill two ormaybe three underwater

(26:20):
photography books. So you don'twrite two or three books in one
month. It does take time. Soyeah, that no, that makes sense.
Keep going. And you know, thumbsup, then they went.

As that saying goes behind every good man, there's
an even better woman. And I'mjust sitting here listening to
you talk through this. And Ihave exactly the same at home.
With reconstructing my travelcompany and, and jazz, just keep
going, keep going, keep going.
And those Fuckit moments whereyou've had a shit day and walk

(26:53):
away from the computer, there'salways she's always there to
say, All right, I will come backto it tomorrow. Keep going.

We're lucky and we are very, very lucky. It's
that it's that emotionalsupport, I mean, to start so
that that sounding board youhave as well, not being just
with yourself testing the ideas.
And I mean, I also have testedquite a few ideas with with
friends. But the thing is withfriends, people sometimes are
just polite. Yes. So you know,you don't you don't you're not
always sure that exactly howthey how they feel. Although I

(27:23):
did ask for you know, brutallyhonest feedback and and I've got
some of it. I have tested theideas and the format,
interviewing a few people, quitea few people actually a while
ago, including yourself. Yep, Iremember. Yeah, but but
definitely having a littlesupport for a number of a number
of many ways actually has beenfantastic.

I just want to say that person. So excuse me. So
with with regards to the dive inand the photography, did the
photography start online beforeor did the dive in introduce you
to photography,

and the photography started just
essentially before, but justjust a little bit before? I came
very late to photography are youdoing? Yeah, you're right. But I
want to hear how you started aswell. But um, I guess for me, I
used to play around with mymom's camera when it was a kid,
you know, old film camera, andthey enjoyed it. But also

(28:30):
remember from from the time thatthe camera was only capable of
taking Okay, shots during theday. If it was, you know, dinner
time, it was a bit dark in theplace. Unless you had the flush
going on. Everything didn't lookgood, basically. And you've had
the flush going on people had afunny face. It just didn't
affect Well, I don't really likethe sort of I don't really like

(28:55):
the sort of results that thecamera can take in many
situations. So I went a bit awayfrom from a from photography at
the time. And then, I guess, oneyear before we moved to
Australia as the first time asstudents, I stumbled upon a
photography magazine, you know,in in the station about it out

(29:18):
of curiosity, because I wasgoing to take the train with
Lynne at the time. And, youknow, we didn't have
smartphones, iPhones, I wasgoing to get bored with the
magazine to write something thatmade us so different. That's
good to get bored. Sometimes itis fantastic. But anyway, so I
pulled this magazine. I can'tremember why. But it was in

(29:39):
France. It was the biggestpornographic magazine and the
most popular one. So the nameThe name meant something for me.
And then I read this article,and it was about some guy at the
time that he was what 2006 So itwas, you know, digital seminars
were starting to become morepopular and more affordable for
people. And someone was doingSomething really interesting. He

(30:01):
had device here designed adevice where he could what was
it, he was going to pop achampagne bottle. And there was
a device going to capture thesound of the popping and trigger
a very very fast flash that wasgoing to freeze the motion of

(30:24):
that the champion of the corkarticle, yeah, the cork
instrumentation and you will beable to photograph it. And I saw
this crazy photo where you havethe cork frozen with the
champion coming and the guy didsomething else he did like used
like, like, again, not notagain, with big bullets, the

(30:45):
small one, you know what I mean?
Or like a little pellet. Yeah,pellet pellet gun to shoot on,
dices on the few objects, and itwould capture crazy motion where
the pellet starts to crush onthe dice. Okay, so not so
artistic, but very interesting,technically. And it was like GE
cameras have come a long way.
That's really cool. And it wasmore of my, I guess, my

(31:05):
technical mindset that wasinterested in the in the science
and and all that. So I was like,okay, that's really cool. You
can really have fun with thosethings. No. And then I started
reading more magazines. And Igot into just the technicalities
at the beginning was like, okay,and then I started reading the
reader's courier section of themagazine where people would send
photos and, and the journalistwould critique the photos. There

(31:29):
was like, Okay, that'sinteresting composition that I
started to get into it. And butat the time, it was just, it was
just land photography, but I wasreally getting hooked. And, and
then Linda told me this thistime when we were booking our
tickets to Australia, and shesaid, Hey, did you know that
Australia was really good fordiving? And it was like, Okay,

(31:49):
I've always been fascinated bythe water. I've always I grew up
in Africa, in in a place where Iwas not far from the sea. But we
only had big rolling waves. Sothere was never a place where
the weather was clear for me togo snorkelling. So I've always
meant all my childhood to go andsee what was there. There was no
clear weather for me to go. Workin Africa, Cameroon.

Oh, really? That's a random one. How do you end up
there?

My parents were working there. Okay. Yeah. So
childhood in Cameroon, there wasa river by the place we, in my
early years, we were living in,in the, in the bush in the
jungle, there was a nice riverwith nice fish going there.
Sometimes a snake, sometimes afew other animals. But again,
the river was murky, and notvery safe to swim into for other

(32:37):
reasons as well. So crocodilesand stuff like that, right? So
so I've had all these childhoodwhere I wanted to get in the
water, but I couldn't. So theonly thing I could do is just,
you know, walk on the rocks,look in the puddles be like, oh,
there's a fish. There's a craband being excited about that. So
when you say diving, I was like,Yeah, that sounds really scary.
But at some point, I do want todo something like that. I do.

(32:59):
And I was getting hooked. We'velearned photography. And before
we could go to Australia, I hadan internship for six months
working in, in an IT company aswell in Paris back in the days.
And so I was having was going tospend six months, every day, one
hour commute in the in the metrotrain. And I thought, Okay, I've

(33:19):
learned a fair bit aboutphotography, with magazines, and
all that. If I'm going to godiving, I might as well learn
underwater photography. And thenI picked the first book, a book
with 150 pages of underwaterphotography. And I read it in
the in the daily commute, andwas like, that's fantastic.
That's I was really gettinghooked. And I finished the first

(33:40):
book, which was like thebeginner level book. Then I
bought the advanced book, and Iread it as well. It was like,
wow, split shots, macro shots,before getting in the water
before getting certified. Yeah.
Yeah, so I was I was gettinghooked in a very twisted way.
But yeah, by the time I gotcertified, I knew how to use an
underwater camera. I just didn'thave one.

Yeah, that's, that's the problem. What was the
first one you got?

It was a good one, though. It was the Nikon D
300. I was I was so so hooked.
So we had a little comeback tothe camera, and I for for our
most of our time in Australia.
But then I had a side job, youknow, after the university so I
could save a bit of money. And Iwas clear that I wanted the

(34:28):
proper DSLR so I saved all thatmoney. And then when I could
finally afford it, bang Detroit100 And like five lenses. Yeah.
And it was so crazy excitedabout, you know, all the
photography time that whenever Iwould go somewhere, had a bag
full of all the lenses, which istotally nonsense because there's
no place where you're going touse a macro lens, a short macro

(34:50):
lens, a long macro lens, a wideangle lens, a fisheye lens and a
portrait lens and a telephotolens, right. But it was carrying
the whole thing. Sometimes itwas like gee, it's really heavy.
One time we were stepping in onthe way back to France with Lena
in Hong Kong for a few days, wehad a bit of vacation in Hong
Kong. And I loved the town. Wehad fantastic time there. But

(35:11):
then I realised that it wasreally hot. And it was carrying
what 10 kilogrammes ofphotography gear in my backpack.
And there was not a fly. No,Hong Kong is very concrete,
right? There's no birds. There'sno, I couldn't see much flies in
the city. And then I realised,man, maybe I don't need that
macro lenses to macro lenses inmy bag after all.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've done the same after I've
travelled with all these lenses.
And you spent two or three weeksaway and come back and realise
you've only used one lens in theentire time that you've been
away? Yeah, yeah. It's a steeplearning curve.

We got, I guess you said the beginning when you
when you get when you get thehook, right? You see all those
nice photos. You know, Skyphotography, animals, portraits,
black and white weddings,wildlife in Israel, those things
and when you do everything, thenyou realise that good especially
somehow to get really good atsomething.

I've learned very quickly to think about what I'm
going out to do. And there'salways gonna be something you
want us to photograph thatyou've got the right lens for,
but it's better than carryingthat 10 kilos. Yeah.

How did you get into photography yourself?

Very similar to you to be honest. Yeah. Yeah, I
didn't go balls out and spend1000s on a nick on straightaway
though, I've got a GoPro. But asa kid, I did exactly the same.
My dad, he played around withphotography and enjoyed it. And
he had an old DSLR. And I usedto play around with it a little
bit. Never understood it. Butevery Christmas we'd get like a

(36:46):
disposable Polaroid or somethinglike that in the Christmas
stocking. Or one of those? Idon't know. How old are you? 39.
Okay, to remember the olddisposable cameras that you
could mount like six bulbflashes on the top. And when
they got used they were gone. Sohe didn't have developed so
yeah, and he didn't give me whenI got and 10 years. 10 years on

(37:08):
it. Yeah, camera. Yeah, gottago. But yeah, I used to get
those as well. And we'd have thedisappointment of taking the the
old rails or the old rolls ofinstead of camera to film,
sorry, to the local pharmacy andwait a week to see what you've
got. You know that a 36 You'dget to two photos that are okay,

(37:30):
that's about it. So it neverreally grabbed me in a great way
until I started goingunderwater. And I say I got a I
got a GoPro. In fact, it was theyear I left the military and
went on a six month divingholiday on my own just headed

(37:51):
for Thailand. Right. And I tooka GoPro with me it was the first
GoPro that I bought.

Oh, that's when you went you became divemaster.
And you started teaching, right?

Yeah, just Yeah, I was on holiday and then just
randomly got asked if I'd liketo take over a dive master
position eventually. And insteadof going back to the UK after
six months holiday, I thought,Okay, I'm gonna stay there's
beers, beaches, women in bikinisliving the dream that I had to
I. But yeah, so I started with aGoPro, and then it was or maybe

(38:28):
in 2015 2016, something likethat. I picked up a Canon g7 X
mark two. And that's when Istarted to kind of focus on what
I was trying to do with it. Andeventually ended up with a
couple of strobes, whichcompletely threw me off. First
god knows how long the roadYeah, and then about a year, 18

(38:51):
months, no 18 months ago now, Ilove the camera, Canon M six
mark two. And that just threw mestraight back into learning how
to use a camera again, becauseyou go from a compact to a, you
know, a mirrorless andeverything changes.

So, it's the next level of complexity, right? It
is

yeah. And you kind of get up to the I got up to the
maximum that I could do with acompact and then thought, right?
I've got to take the leap. I'mgonna get a mirrorless because
it's it's lighter and smaller,easier to carry on overseas
trips, all that kind of stuff,blah, blah, blah. And stumped
for that one look good camera.
But it put me right back intothe novice group again. Yeah,

it's I remember when when I finally got my D
free Android, my first DSLR thething we had before was like,
back at the time it was populartype of camera it was called the
bridge camera. So it's like acompact with with a very big
zoom lens, basically. And it wasvery easy to use. You know, you
would see what you're shootingbasically the lecture on the
compact camera, like on acompact camera. And the day I

(39:54):
started using the DSLR was likegee, there's a steep learning
curve, but same thing with yourmirrorless cameras those things
have so many options, you can doeverything manually. But until
you figure out those options,and the SEC, they become like,
second nature that you you'refamiliar with them? Well, you're
going to miss shots, you'regoing to be having to practice a
lot before you get differentpotential basically. Yeah,

yeah, I've kind of, I've got the, I think I'm about
70% of the way with a wideangle. And I'm still way below
50% of the way with a macrohere. So you know, that's why
I'm going to go into a couple ofdives this week and just focus
on the macro and play aroundwith a straight positionings and

(40:34):
the camera settings and all thatkind of stuff.

Yeah, give them guidance would be a good place
for for practising those skills.
Because if you did have toposition the strobes in a way
that you get your subject nottoo much of the world around it
to clear photos and all that soit's a good when you I guess
when you dive in in a lovelytropical place, you go to valley
for example. You don't have toposition your strobe so
perfectly, as long as you getsome light on the subject,

(41:00):
you're good to go. Basically,you go to Clifton gardens, while
getting the light isn't just onething and then you want to
minimise how much excavatoryou've got and and that
definitely is a good way tosharpen your skills. Definitely
then doing that in Cliftongardens next time you go to bury
your goodness, where tropicalGalapagos and places like that
you're going to take fantastic

shots. Yes, hopefully. Otherwise, it's a
very expensive wasted trip.

If you want to double up on, you know, on the
on the landings, the underwaterclub is coming soon. Yeah.

I'm always up for learning. I think. Even if
you're a master of somethingnew, there's always something
else you're gonna learn

that there is an end, there's two things I've
noticed not only in my way oflearning, but with chatting with
friends that have diversephotographers as well is when
you don't practice some skillsfor a while. It just you know,
it just just goes away. I mean,doesn't go really away. But it
wears out a little bit sitter's.
And I find myself even when Iwas learning everything by

(42:03):
books, if let's say I was doingmacro for a long time at home
because there was only a macroto shoot. And then there was
going on a trip where I mightsee Manta rays or big rugby
wideangle I would go back to mybook and I would relearn
basically or refresh whatever Ilearned by you before basically
nontheless trip. Yeah. And andthat's one of the things I like
with with the underwater club isthat I think lots of people are

(42:26):
doing, you know, infrequentdiving, or infrequent in the
sense that they will go in atropical destination once in a
year or twice in a year maybe.
And I think having the ocean youknow, to go back to your
courses, go back to yourlearning, when you need it
happening is going to be pretty,pretty handy in those cases.

So have you have you structured the delivery? How
many videos are there? How manydifferent levels? What kind of
people? Is it targeting?

I've got in total? About 40? Lessons?

40? Yes. fucky. Now you have been busy. I've been
busy.

40 Each of the lesson is split into smaller
videos as well. Okay, so howmany think more than 100? In
total? Probably okay. But thereason for that is? Well, first
of all underwater photography iscomplex and on wide topic, as
you know. And the other thingis, I wanted to make sure that
the you know, the videos wouldbe the knowledge would be well,

(43:26):
you'd be able to consume it in abite sized format. So if you're
at home, you know, after days ofwork, you're on your couch, you
have time you want to spend onehour learning underwater
photography, pop your TV open,open the Android app on your
phone airplay, and you'rewatching the big screen, you're
relaxing, yeah, but if you're onthe daily commute, and you just
have 10 minutes of your time,then most of the time, the

(43:49):
subsections of a lesson are lessthan 10 minutes long. So there's
always a time where you canspend a few minutes if you have
a few minutes to spare. That'stime you can spend learning or
practising in the world ofphotography. So that's about,
you know, the volume of thecontent. And the I guess the way
I've structured it, the way thatthe way I've digested in pieces,

(44:11):
in terms of structure, askedmyself a lot of questions about
what's the right way to presentunderwater photography. And I
think I think that there is notone way. I think we all there's
no there's various ways you canlearn. Some people will start
with macro, some people will gowide angle, some people will not
choose a strobe or video lightat all for years, because maybe

(44:33):
they should very close to thesurface. Some people well,
there's various learning paths.
And the way I've presented itthen is to say there's an app,
the lessons are presented as amap. So you're looking at a mind
map basically, where you can seethemes. So a theme might be
wideangle. A theme might belighting as a skill and the

(44:55):
world lighting. Another onemight be the equipment the
photography equipments. Andwithin those themes, you can see
with the lessons positions onthe map how they relate to each
other. So for example, beforeyou start learning about how to
turn a fish ID shot into anactual portrait with character,
you might want to learn how toposition your strobes. And you

(45:17):
might ask yourself, Hey, do Iwant to use once robot to
strobes? So the residents arearranged and the mindmap in a
way that tells you that youprobably want to have those
skills before but you don't haveto, because perhaps you know,
some of those things. Or youjust want straight to understand
what are the artisticconsiderations in making a
portrait, as opposed to thetechnicalities of hey, one

(45:40):
stroke, two strokes how toposition the strobes. So I
really wanted to organise it ina way that no one feels they
have to go in a special order.
Yeah, they see the map, the mapis clickable. So you can click
and have a pop up telling you,hey, this is what it is about.
And then if you click you havemore details about the contents
in exactly what you're going tolearn. You have guidance on

(46:02):
whether you should know, thispiece of information before
taking this lesson to make themost of it or not. And, again,
this is a freely I always sayfree flowing is free flowing.
Yeah.

It sounds fantastic. Thank you, quite
frankly, I've not seen it yet.
But it sounds fantastic. I'm avery visual learner. Yeah. And
that that kind of mapping, Iwould say, excites me over the
idea of having chapter subchapter in the least watch this,
watch this, watch this

100% Here, I think for learners like you, I'm
the same. And I think mostpeople benefit from having a
visual layout of how theconcepts connect to each other,
the mind map really to say,okay, because when you start,
you're like, Hey, Mr. diver, Iwant to I want to learn
photography. You don't know whatyou don't know. Yeah. You know,
how do you know that? How wouldyou know that? You know, there

(46:57):
are specific skill sets andtechniques and best practices in
working with a model. You seebeautiful photos of wreck with a
model looking positioned in theright place with the leg
straight and all that. If youdon't know any better, you're
like, well, that person musthave just been taking photos of
diver passing by. Absolutelynot. All those good shots.
They're all staged, most of themare staged. And you don't know

(47:20):
those things if you're abeginner. But if you're starting
off and you're like, okay, hereis everything I can learn. Well,
I'm keen for whitening, go towhitening go sounds good. As a
start, you got to wait and getyour light. Okay, close focus,
wide angle. All right, shallowwater wide angle, you can see
the themes that you could getstarted. There was a reason for
camera settings for an angle. Ifyou just want a bit of technical

(47:41):
guidance on the settings thatwould work well. And then you're
like working with Moodle? Ah,there is such a thing. You have
to work with the Moodle.
Interesting. What is it aboutyou go there, and then you
realise that there's a handsignals. There is best practice
in how the Moodle positionthemselves where they were,
where they look, and all thethings?

Yeah, yeah. I mean, ours do you think you've put
into this in a year and a half.

The thing is, I don't think I know too much.
Basically, I think I'm at 30minutes of, of work for one
minute of video. And I've got 16hours of video in total. And
that's just the beginning.
Because people joining you andthe workload as becoming
members. We'll also have accessto monthly webinars where we get

(48:26):
together we talk aboutparticular topic, we dive into
some techniques, we exchange, wedo things like that, so that
there's going to be more, more,let's say more video contents.
And I really want to make itsomething that lives for
example, because the day thatespecially technical aspects,

(48:47):
but not only that are going tobecome things are going to
change. So for example, there isa course where it's all about
photography equipments. So Icover basically every single bit
of kit that you might find in anhour, the other photographers
bag, because again, you don'tknow what you don't know, why
would someone need to focuslight? Why do they have arms?

(49:08):
What do they need floats for andall those things. So I cover all
those bits. In each and everylesson, I explain what are the
specs that you find in one ofthe things like a stroke, for
example, what are the importantones, so that you know, as a, as
a consumer as a photographer,you're equipped to decide what's
important when you're going tobuy your stroke. And what was it

(49:30):
what are we seeing again?
Talking about equipment.

Yeah. We're talking about the the add ons, so you're
gonna have the monthly webinarsand stuff like that.

Yeah, correct.
And in one of those lessons, I'mtalking about cameras. So I'm
going through the various typesof cameras that you might use
for underwater photography, yourGoPro your compact with DSLR
mirrorless and I'm comingPreparing them side by sides for
the various, you know, let's saycreate area, autofocus, image
quality, things like that. AndI'm seeing for example, as of

(50:09):
today for underwater photographyDSLRs have an advantage over
mirrorless for such and suchthings. But I know very well
that next year, I might recordthe video again to say something
different because the technologyis catching up. Yeah. So this is
a big body of knowledge, but I'mgoing to make it to evolve it as
well over time. Yeah.

And when people go, they've got to give allowance
for the advance of technology,because no one can keep up with
it. It's so fucking fast. Yeah.
Interesting. Yeah. Veryinteresting. So you mentioned
that the underwater club isgoing to be a membership. So is
it subscription based?

Yes, it's going to be a subscription base.
Because I thought aboutdifferent models, different ways
of doing it. But I really thinkthat as you want the knowledge
to stick, as the sort of photosthat you're going to take, over
time, are going to change whenyou travel, you need to be able

(51:11):
to go back to the knowledge andthe learnings. And so that's
the, that's the weight. People,they basically get access to the
content, they become members,this gives gives them access to
the courses. And this theybecome part of a community as
well. So they get access to themonthly webby now. And there is
also something very close to myheart as part of the underwater

(51:32):
club that that will be formembers. There is a dedicated
members forum, where we exchangeabout photography, but I want to
do it in a very specific way. Iwant this to be a place where
we're going to give each otherconstructive feedback on our
photography, because I thinkthat is a massive, massive,
massive way to progress. Yes.
And so that that would besomething very important. At the

(51:56):
beginning, I would probablymyself be doing most of the
feedbacks. So today, I do it ina one to one basis, someone can
hire me for a one hour two hourcoaching session, we talked
about underwater photography.
But I think there's a lot oflearning that can be had from
reading a constructive critiqueof someone else photos by first

(52:20):
person. So there will be thatcomponents. But I also want over
time to take on board overmembers of the club with me to
be concrete to formulatecritique themselves. Yeah.
Because I think even if you're,you know, very beginner in
underwater photography, ofcourse, the critique, if it's
given from a place of care withrespect, it's perfect. It's very

(52:43):
useful. But you're a veryexperienced photographer
yourself. spending the time toformulate a constructive
critique onto someone elsephotos is also a great way to
keep on learning. Yes. And Ithink that's, that's going to be
a very beneficial, like avirtuous circle that would be
taking place between members.

I think that benefit is circular as well,
because a lot of people are tooover critical of their own
shots. Yes. So being able tocritique other people's work,
and then hear honest and openopinions of their work rather
than Oh, that's good, man. Yes,you know, and just make you

(53:24):
rethink and reevaluate,actually, I'm a little bit
better than what I thought Iwas, you know,

yeah, it's too is too easy. When you when you get
a hang on to the technicalities,to see the defects to say out,
then the composition is notright. You're not exactly on the
third, or it's a little bitoverexposed there. Or here,
there's a fish to take thesecats. But look at competition
winning shots, in manycompetitions among the top

(53:53):
winners, you see the effects onthe photos. Yeah. So in that,
that's, that's the, that's theartistic sensitivity that we all
have, that we can exchange whenwe critique each other. But when
you're on your own watching yourphotos, you don't get those
things.

So he tried to tell me that those awards that you've
won, you've got defects on yourphotos.

I do sometimes.

I do. Sometimes I can say

I do sometimes.
But I'm a bit like you I'm overcritical of myself. Yeah. And
there are photos where, whereyou know, I'm like, now, Miss,
there's a fish shark tail. I'vegot a photo, for example, that
did very well in a few contests.
It's like a big school ofgreatness shots in southwest
rocks. The lighting is great.
The look of the shark, you knowthe layout. Everything is good,

(54:40):
but there is one shark in thecorner. Who has a tail cats with
this 20 sharks in the photos.
Yeah, for that reason. When Itook that photo, I was like,
man, you know, stop making thefinal case. Fortunately, I
didn't delete it. And then as Iwas building the underwater
club, and I spent nearly twoyours going back into my photos

(55:01):
because I needed to findmaterials to illustrate what I
was teaching, basically. And Iwent back to our photos and I'm
like, Hey, wait a minute, itstill looks quite okay, this
photo actually. And some friendsI'm like, Okay, actually these
10 photos of sharks fromSouthwest rocks. They they look
good, actually. Maybe notcompetition material, but they
look really good. So I asked afew friends in a WhatsApp group.

(55:23):
Hey, what do you think if therewas one photo that stands out?
What do you think this is? A fewpeople pointed this one. And
then a few others pointed overphotos. And the last one I was
like, Yeah, well, I'll try theother ones in competitions this
year. And next year, I'll trythis one that I'm still not
convinced about the shark. We'vegot Tellarites Elia. Well, I

(55:45):
entered it in ocean for the restof the year. And I won first
place in the conservation hopecategory. And I think that
contest is I think it's thebiggest contest in terms of
ocean imagery in the world. Ithink. So there was like, man,
okay, I can still see the defecton the photo myself. But having
listen to other people tellingme no, it's really good. The

(56:05):
emotion, the emotion is excusesto defect basically.

Well, that just that just bolsters what I just
said about people being overcritical of their own work. And
by the way, well done,

thank you. But there's two sides to I think
there's two sides to the storyabout the emotion you put to
your work, right? Being overcritical, definitely looking at
the defects because you wantideally, a shot with no defects
to go to a competition and beingfixated on that you forget the
positive vibe of the emotionthat you have in the shot. But
then the other way around, issometimes you get too

(56:39):
emotionally attached to a shotbecause you struggled so hard to
create that shot. You know, likethat's the shot. That is the
best. That's the one I'm goingto enter in competitions. That's
the one I'm going to pitch tomagazines. That's That's the
shot. And sometimes you alsoneed that critical aid from
someone else to say, yeah, it'ssharp. It's called a fool. It's
a great animal. But yeah, it'slike, a good ad shot. Really?

(57:04):
That's it doesn't stand out.
Yeah. Okay. Let's talk about thewow factor. Yep. There is a
photo for example, we, which andagain, I can honestly tell all
my love and my admiration forthat photo, because it's not
mine. It's a photo by Linda. Wewere having a fantastic dive for
once in the Mediterranean Sea.
In a place where the localfishermen, the local

(57:25):
professional fisherman decidedwith each other. You know what,
let's make it a Marine Park.
Let's stop fishing in that placefor 10 years and see what
happens. And long story short,it was fantastic. And they
decided to do it again for 10years. So we went to the dive
sites. And in the med you cansee sometimes the Mediterranean
Cooper, it's called the browngrouper, dusky grouper, very

(57:45):
iconic fish from the midatlantic because it's been over
fished. It's like a puppy comingto see you in the water. So at
the time, when people didn'tknow better, they were just bear
fishing into extinction. So nowyou see more of them because
they're they've been productivefor a few years. But long story
short, if I can make long storyshort, I'm not sure about that.

That's alright, we go all the time. And

we go to the to the safe sites. And at some
point, I mean, that wasmemorable. At some points. We
see two military and groupers.
Two big ones, they were males,because they become males at the
end of their the life as theygrow. And they were doing
something and never saw usuallywhen because they must still be
a fair bit of poachinghappening. Even though they're

(58:30):
protected, they tend to stayaway from you. Okay, we will
reverse not so much. But withregular divers, they do take the
distances. In that place, thoughthey couldn't care less about
the divers, they were hammeringeach other for basically the two
groupers they were fighting froma distance when you get the
photo you you could think thatthey're kissing but they're
certainly not the fighting headon head. And you could hear the

(58:51):
noise in the water bang. And youcould see you could see the fish
scales really pop crazy action.
And Lina was holding the camerathat day she was taking photos I
was just you know over enjoyingmyself pointing creatures of
being a model. And when I sawthe action, you never know how
long it's going to last for soyou have to you have to get the

(59:12):
shots. And I saw the action Isaw I was I'm like there is no
way I'm going to be able to swimout before she takes the shots.
She will have heard from my bodyin the shot. So I said okay,
well what's the other option isthat I go in there and I
positioned myself perfectly. Imake sure I look in the right
place. I do all these thingsright. And that's what I did. So
you've got a further word togroupers their head on head

(59:34):
symmetry call centre of theframe and I'm coming in the
middle, slightly sideways andthey look right in the middle of
the fight perfect position allthat it's a perfect shot in my
view and very attached to itthen I'm in Alexei turret as
well. But never win somecompetition. It never it never

(59:54):
succeed, successes successes andand I'm not sure why some people
tell me are so great. NaturalHistory moments that she's
photographed. But there's youdiver here, you're spoiling the
thing. And I'm like, well,there's lots of photos where
with animals and the diver but Idon't know something there
doesn't work. Yeah, but we haveso much emotional attachment.
And every now and then we stillenter it in a competition to

(01:00:17):
see, you know that with thatemotional attachment tree, you
can hang it on the wall. Yes,that we can certainly do

Matt Waters (01:00:25):
that, in fact that one thing I need to do. And I've
never done it. Photos I've gotI've never actually, in fact, it
was one of my friends here inSydney, who he was the first
dude to get one printed up.
Yeah, okay. Yeah, in hisapartment as first time. It's
one of my photos in real lifeinstead of digital.

Nicholas Remy (01:00:45):
How did you feel when you say it's brilliant?

It's great. Yeah, it's awesome. So I thought I
think we need to do it.

Yeah, I think it's, it's a thing you know, you
have to do, but but do itbecause you will feel great. And
I think there's lots of, there'slots of photos that look even
better in print, then evenbetter in print than they look
in real life. I have two screensat home. And when I'm pixel
editing a photo, there is onescreen when a photo might start

(01:01:15):
to look a little bit. I don'tknow, noisy, doesn't look very
good. In terms of details. Onthe other screen, it looks
better. Yeah, differentresolution. But then most of the
time, if I print, there will besome small defects on small
noise that are just smooth inthe way by the printing process.
Yeah. And when you're freeprint, you've made a good print
big prints. Not going to stareat the photo from five

(01:01:37):
centimetres, right? You'd bestanding back, stand back and
look at it. And then you'regoing to enjoy what you see.
Yeah, yeah. Gee, I'm the worst.
Interviewee I don't bring anybeer. I don't bring any photo
shaver.

Yeah, yeah, your shit.

But again, thank you for a beer afterwards, if
you have time. Yeah.

In the meantime, I'll just drink the one beer
that's left to do lovely stuff.

Got all the thinking to do, I'm just
chatting and repairing and allthat, oh,

don't worry about that. I can, it's that's the
beauty of of doing a knot andnot doing it live, we can just
cut it out. So when people getnervous, and there's pregnant
pauses, or they do this, andthey move away from the
microphone, we can just redototal easing slowly. So how do

you know if there's a sound issue with the
easy? Is it telling us rubber?
Just editing afterwards?

Yeah, um, what the routine that we do is, I mean,
obviously, we've got theheadphones on here. So I'm
listening to what's going onwith your microphone, and
background noises like thislittle fan and all that kind of
stuff. And I just make a mentalnote. And then once we've
finished today, Rod, will sendme the raw tracks from tomorrow.

(01:02:56):
And I'll listen through to themagain, while I'm working at home
on a PC and pick up those littlebits and pieces that I want
removed. So I just note thetime, and then send the data
back to Rod. He takes out hedoes all the editing, and then
balances all the noises andotters, all that magical stuff
that needs to do and sends meback adds on the intro and outro

(01:03:16):
and sends me back the the finaledit stuff. Yeah, it's, it's
quite well,

I wish I had someone helping me with the
audio for all the, you know, forthe lessons of recorded and then
sometimes I can't remember howmany times you know, um, so I'm
doing that from from a study inmy in our house. Yeah. In the
south of Sydney. And the numberof odd noises that you've got at
home that you don't pick. Unlessyou're doing your recording
sound. I told him at some point,did you hear the parents? Like

(01:03:48):
no, did you hear the planes?
They owe the planes? No. Did youhear the people working there?
No. Did you hear the neighbourand you don't pay attention to
those random noises unlessyou're like, I need silence
here.

Have you? Have you?
Have you created a box aroundyour microphones so that you can
kind of eliminate those? No,

because I'm, you know, I'm wearing the hoodie.
Oh, you're on the rodeo. Yeah, Ineed to change my setup because
I did this way because therewill be times where I'm finding
myself holding a housing andmoving some straws and all that
and that wouldn't be practicalto have something in front of
me. But in reality, the housingthing is like one every 10
lessons most of the time andtalking. I'm displaying photos

(01:04:26):
next to me I'm displayingtalking points, but

you know what you could do? Have a chat with
Roger. Yeah. Because at thetimes when you need to do
something that you want torecord you on messing about with
gear. You could come in here anduse one of these microphones
here right there was plenty ofspace. Yeah, as we can see. I
just record it. And you've gotno noise on the outside.

Because he's got no the soundproofing.

Yeah, that's it, right like these, these boards
that he's got, you know, theythere's also the foam pad big
ones like wavy foam. When I dorecordings at home, I tend to
I've got a, like a, almost likea milk crate, which I've put the
foam on the inside and that thatsits with a microphone coming

(01:05:14):
through from the back. So thethe microphone itself is
completely enhanced by foamaround this section where I'm
tried right i right. So evenwith the window next to me if
someone's outside and theywalking past or a dog yapping at
the microphone doesn't pick itup.

Great. Okay.

All little little tricks

or tricks? You know, I've learned, I've learned
for me myself, I've done a fewthings I've learned Elementor
and all those things. I might aswell learn how to do proper
sound recording.

Yeah, yeah. Um, so I'm scratching my ass with the
Elementor. At the moment.

It should be more intuitive, right? Sometimes
you're like list of bulletpoints, and the bullets doesn't
align with the point. And you'relike, that's what you do for a
living man. Yeah. Why can't youdo each

one pack of faffing about with the flex boxes and
loot carousels? They're a greatidea. Yeah. And so, templates.
But, you know, if you make atemplate, it's a template, it's
never going to change. You know,you can't, you can't use the
same template on a differentpage and edit it because it's
going to read it the other pageas well. So I find it a bit

(01:06:20):
frustrating, a bit limited, butit's certainly better than what
it used to be.

And yeah, I mean, generally you do what you can
you can be as beautiful pagesthis way. And again, I'm lucky
about Weebly now, because she'sa bit nerdy yourself. And
there's a few situations whereI'm like, he doesn't look good
at all. She's like, let me letme look at it. And since a kid,
she's been, you know, doingprojects, like like a NAT, like
a display, like stuff like that.
So she's very visual in thatsense. Yeah. Very artistic. And

(01:06:45):
also, she's a bit nerdy. Sosometimes she does custom CSS
for me. The giveaway thingy,there's a carousel, which shows
the prizes, like good strobesand things and masks, stuff like
that. And the carousel is a is aWordPress widget, right? It's a

(01:07:05):
plugin. Yeah. And those guysdon't know what they're
thinking. But they serve thecarousel, and the images are
shrink. So basically, you cansee the prices and you think
that's okay. They're like, Oh,yeah, willing to upgrade our
software. Yeah, you should. ButI'm stuck. And then I looked at
the initial survey, I might beable to do some CSS, and then
she did she pushed the wholething and it looks okay,

brilliant. Okay, so when I get stuck, I'm going to
message you and ask for the bosslady. Lovely stuff. I hate what
we've gone. Oh, the giveaways.
Yeah, let's let's talk about thegiveaways.

So, yeah, like we said before, I'm super excited,
because the underwater club isabout to go live in a few weeks
time. So by the end of March,people will be able to go on the
underwater club.com. And theywill be able to see the courses,
see what's offered there andhopefully start their free trial
to see what it's like and becomea member. But sorry,

just jumping in have you start? Have you
selected a particular date thatit's gonna go live?

I think it's going to be most likely the 31st
of March, okay. It's probablythe 31st of March, okay. But if
you go to the underwaterclub.com before, there's a
little surprise there. I'mrunning a giveaway to celebrate
the launch. And it's very simpleto enter. It's a free giveaway.

(01:08:34):
You don't have to purchaseanything. The only thing is you
have to enter your emailaddress. join my mailing list,
basically. And this way, youwill get notified when the
underwater flood goes live whenthere's events around the
underwater climate fix likethat. And there's quite a few
nice prices for underwaterphotographers, at least
underwater. These are thingsthat will appeal to underwater

(01:08:54):
photographers.

Are we allowed to say what the price is 100% yet
go for it. Yeah.

So the top price of the giveaway is a wonderful
premium top range rich wrapFlash Pro X stronger. So retro
is a European based company.
They manufacture top qualityunderwater strobes. So
underwater flashes. And I myselfhave been using almost
exclusively a pair of theirflashes to address Flash Pro for

(01:09:21):
the last two years. Most of theworld's I'm winning with
underwater photos have beenused. I've been using these two
strobes basically. And thennearly jealous of whoever is
going to win the price. Becausethe strobe that retro is
sponsoring for this giveaway isactually even better. It's the X

(01:09:43):
version. So it's basically thestrobe I use myself, but with an
upgrade in terms of traffic, itrecycles. 20% quicker. There's a
few nice things like that. Butthe quality of light is
fantastic. It's powerful.
There's a range of accessoriesyou can fit into To destroy when
you want to go and get ongardens to be the new team, you

(01:10:04):
can focus the light, you can dolots of things around the around
the lights. So it's a fantasticstore.

What did the retailer

didn't think it's like, nearly two grants nearly
$2,000, one

stroller leash. So this is a giveaway.

It's a giveaway.
It's for free, sign me up prettybig price.

So I can I put in my 15 email addresses.

You supposed to put one. But what you can do
though, what you can do is youput your email, and that gives
you a one entry. When free entryto the giveaway. I'm asking a
little questions to whomeverwants to answer about what sort
of camera they're using forunderwater photography. If you
answer that question, you get asecond entry. And then if you
share the giveaway, by email, orby Facebook, you'll have your

(01:10:46):
own private link with friendsand you get some friends to sign
up through your link. For eachfriend you recruit you get an
extra entry. That's awesome. Soif you share a few people, then
you know you're a bit activewith that you can raise your
chances dramatically

on a the LinkedIn, because I've got quite a few
people. Yeah,

I'm sure. So the underwater club.com. Yeah. And
yeah, that's pretty much it.
Okay, so that's the first price.
But then the second price is. Sobasically with the prices, what
I did is I went to potentialsponsors. And I decided to
approach sponsors thatmanufacture the gear that I use
myself, because I wanted peopleto win things that I'm items

(01:11:24):
that I'm sure are excellent foran underwater photographer. So
the second prize is a pair ofthings. So these are the
marriage 70 quadruplets? Oh yes,you know them, right.

That's my second set. Yep.

I think someone told me that these things. They
are like, probably the mostpopular things. I don't know if
it's on the planet. I don't wantto make big statements like
that. But basically, if you goto a popular dive destination,
you'll see divemasters diving alot doing 500 days a year.
That's the sort of thingsthey're using, because they're
sort of rebel, right? Yeah. Ilove them personally, because as

(01:11:59):
a photographer, I need to doflutter kick sometimes if I
really want to dash throughappearance, but if I go diving
in Clifton garden, sort of verymucky places like that. I do
frottage, so that I glide overthe water and I don't stare up
at the bottom and you know,waste visibility and all that.
Yeah, and those things areexcellent for both for both that
sort of thing. So so I thinkthey're really good. So that's

(01:12:20):
the second price, then we've gota 200 euros voucher to use on a
retro online shop. So if youdon't get destroyed, but you
still want to buy one or youwant some accessories for your
strobe, you can use that aswell. And then we've got a mask
Ameris mask, the ultra liquidskin vision masks are just super
comfortable. And I Oh, that'sthe one I use now. And that's

(01:12:43):
the first mask can use withoutany leak. Even if I forget to
shave the previous mask if itwasn't perfectly shaved, it was
a mess. And as I'm doing very,very long day for like three
hours, four hours. I can't havea leaking mask. That's so
uncomfortable. And this onedoesn't leak. And he's very wide
vision as well. So good for youknow, seeing you're finding your
subject, finding your whateveraccessories, you've clicked on

(01:13:06):
your BCD and stuff like that.
Yeah. And the last price is abeautiful the underwater Club T
shirt. The same I'm wearingtoday. Yes.

Very good, sir.
Very good. Yeah, so everyonewho's listening in feet
underwater club.com. We'llrepeat that we'll put in the
show notes as well. Thanks. Andyeah, smash that out of the park
31st of March. So you'rehopefully going to be very busy
from April onwards?

Yes, yes, I think so. I'll be actually travelling
at the same time, because it'sgoing to be it's going to be a
busy a busy month for me, at theend of the month, I'm going to
8x in Singapore, which is thetime that we're launching the
underwater club as well. Okay.
So but fortunately, as you know,that there's there's, there's

(01:13:51):
not only me working on thisSelena is going to is going to
help me with administrating thesites. If, if I'm basically
something at edX and yeah, thenthe month of April will be, will
be very interesting. I can't, Ican't wait to have people you
know, go there, experience it.
There's a trial that you canenter for free, you can start

(01:14:13):
for free when the club is live,so you can access everything for
seven days, without having topay and this way you can test
that my style of teaching theformat of the video, the pace,
everything feels right, youknow, and then if you're
comfortable, then you stay andthen you become a member. So I
was excited enough and you know,very keen to see people, you

(01:14:35):
know, going through thegiveaway, starting to enter put
their email, ask me questions,sometimes watch the little
videos that I've put there topresent the prices. I can't wait
to see people, you know, takingthe courses interacting with
them, telling me what theythink. I'm also asking at the
end of every lesson forfeedback. So I want to keep this

(01:14:57):
improving over time. So ifsomeone You know, sees that
maybe I could have delved intomore details in one topic. I'm
quite a detail person. But ifthat's the case, that can always
be the case, I would love to getthose feedbacks. If they weren't
fully sure about something, anexplanation they gave, maybe it
wasn't so clear. Again, give mefeedback. I want to improve it.

(01:15:19):
In any ways people can interactwith me as well through the
underwater club will be there tohelp.

So awesome. And are you are you having a standard
edX? You're here? Are you havinga booth?

No, I wouldn't be just there. I would be reporting
for the photo guide.

Oh, really? Hmm. So you're going to be doing a bit
of microphone a bit or just

I think you're going to visit a few standards
related to underwaterphotography, and check what are
the news there? And we'll writean article on the way back.
Okay. Yeah. And perhaps a fewother things. But that's still
being considered. Yeah,

I did get asked if I was going this year, and I
just can't worry on the price.
I've got too much to do. But itwould have been would have been
great to get in there and justhave a wander around like that.
AWS tech. It's great to be in adive show. Right. And Singapore
is probably one of the best onesas well,

I think so. I think so that would be my first
time going. But anyways, you'regoing those places, too. You
meet passionate people. You'llyou network a little bit, you'll
find out about the latest tech.
The latest. I'm going to loveit, I'm sure.

Yeah. Have you got any Putney photos into a
competition? For IDEXX?

I haven't yet but I mean to the WeChat

effect so that they'll have a good display
wall? Yeah, I think so.

And they've got some good prices as well. So
yeah, definitely want to try myluck.

Yeah, yeah. But you don't have to enter like
political competitions like Visaor anything like that anymore.
You can leave that as normalpeople.
I the rebreather that you'reusing, which one is it?

Are you still okay? So for many years, I've
been diving exclusively with theriver river. So Revo is a fully
technical repeater. That's thesort of thing you can if you put
some trail mix in there, you cango to 200 metres with it. Oh,
that's not my thing. I'm not avery deep diver. I really use
them for photography, and longdives. But for many years have

(01:17:21):
been diving exclusively theRevo. And then in 2016, Revo has
been acquired by Maurice. And I,being very passionate, we were
very something probably justafter photography is the next
thing I'm passionate about. AndI was thinking, hey, what's
going to happen with Revo, whichwas kind of small company at the
time. You know, it was like aside project by a Belgian

(01:17:44):
entrepreneur, this guy wasgetting a bit older, wanting to
retire, what was going to happento river divers. And then
fantastic news in the industry,Marisa quires, Rivo Marisa quiet
river because they wanted tocreate a more recreational
river, but they needed to sortof get the expertise to do that.
And as a result, they came upwith the horizon, which is a

(01:18:06):
more recreational, semi closedriver. But the thing I love
about it is that there's lots ofthe design, the good design
ideas from areevo that have beenincorporated into the horizon.
And now, David, you're raisingas well.

Okay. And the horizon is a semi closed
rebreather. Did you say? Yep.
Okay. Do you want to explainthat to folks that probably
don't know too much about CCR?

Yeah, absolutely.
So. So there's two types of ribriver essentially, fully closed
rib River, like the Revo likethe inspiration like the case
and those guys fully closed rib,reverse, what they do is, it's
all it all comes from the factthat when you breathe, you
inhale, let's say air, and inair, you will have 21 person

(01:18:54):
oxygen, and the oxygen is whatyour body needs. That's what it
metabolises. When you exhale,there's still lots of oxygen
left in the gas that you'regoing to blow in the bubbles.
Let's say if you had 21 person,that would be maybe 1716 persons
left. And the concept behind theriver river is to say, hey,
let's not waste to 16 person andwe can probably find a way to

(01:19:15):
reuse them. So a closed circuitRiver, like the fully technical
ones, what they do is they takeback the guests that you've
exceeded instead of leaving thebottle, go in the water, they
find that, hey, you've used someof the oxygen, but then you have
a pure oxygen tank on yourriver, that's going to replenish

(01:19:36):
just what you what you'veconsumed a minute ago. At the
same time, it's going to usesome co2 filters to remove the
co2 co2 which is toxic, which ispart of what you're exhaling. So
in summary, it cleans up the gasremoves the toxic co2, and it
pumps up whatever missingwhatever oxygen that you have

(01:19:57):
consumed would be missingotherwise Okay, so that's a
closed circuit rebreather, theway it works means that there's
no bubbles at all coming out ofthe river. And because your body
really doesn't use much oxygen,much less than we probably think
that we in general publicprobably think you can, you
don't use much gas. So on myclosed circuit River, out, I've

(01:20:18):
got two tanks on the unit, I'vegot a pure oxygen three litre
tank and a regular air threelitre tank, the air tank is
essentially just for my my wind,my BCD, my drysuits. And for
adjustments of what I breathe,as I change that, that's it's
the pure oxygen is what really Ibreathe for being able to

(01:20:40):
survive in the water. And we'vetreated the tank, I'm able to
spend six or seven hours in thewater. If I'm really relaxed, in
one hour of diving, whatever thedepth, and we're going to
consume about 20 bars of oxygenon the three litre tank. So
that's the best efficiency youcan get off any sort of diving

(01:21:01):
apparatus and the water put up.
Now it's a bit technical to use,because you need to get the gas
exchangers the number the numberof oxygen molecules perfectly
right. As we know, if you've gottoo much oxygen and you run into
other problems too little youget into hypoxia other problems
again. So it makes closedcircuit rivers, the technical

(01:21:24):
ones a bit complicated to use.
And some people consider themdangerous. For that reason, they
do require more training andmore vigilance, now comes the
semi closed rivers, they work ina very, very different when sort
of different principle, youstill use some co2 cartridge
filters. To clean the co2 out ofyour exaile gas, you still need

(01:21:46):
that you don't want to startgetting your headaches by
breathing your co2 again again.
So that's the same. However, youdon't have to tanks, you don't
need pure oxygen tank. Thosepure oxygen tanks which are
tricky to source depending onwhere you dive and all that. You
just need a nitrox tank, onenitrous tank, you preempt the

(01:22:06):
network's tank onto yourrebreather, with what the semi
close reprieve does is it willalways flow some of that nitrox
into your breathing loop yourbreathing backs. Okay, so let's
say you have nitrox Vegito inthe tank. As you breathe, you're
going to take it down tosomething else, let's say nitrox

(01:22:28):
27. And if you keep breathing,you're going to take it down
further, maybe nitrox, 2321, andso on. So to compensate for that
your rebreather is going to keepinjecting bubbles of the netwrix
32 from the tank. So in a way ofa semi closed River, your
breathing keeps pulling down thepercentage of oxygen. But your

(01:22:51):
river keeps on pushing nitrox onthe tank to push it up, push it
back up. So that sort ofcompensate each other. But
generally speaking, you've gotlet's say if you're breathing,
if your tank is 32, natural 32%,you might be breathing only
2726 28, something like that, asa result of this process where
the semi closed river alwayspushed some gas. It pushes more

(01:23:15):
than what you need. So at somepoint, that rebreather is full
of gas, it's actually alwaysfull of gas. So you've got a few
bubbles coming out from the backof the river. So that's the
difference with a closed circuitrebreather, you do have some
bubbles coming back. But there'svery few and in that sense, you
still have the advantage ofgetting closer to wildlife. And
it's much safer because youdon't depending on the

(01:23:38):
rebreather design, of course,yet the risk of going to hypoxia
hypercapnia or hyperoxia isnonexistence.

And what's your bottom times like on the semi
close then in comparison to thefull CCR?

So that depends very depends more on depth, and
on and on the size of the tank.
So my longest dive on the CCRwas four hours 30 minutes, and I
still have plenty of gas and mytanks. So it was more a case of
I had it was dinnertime I had togo to go out here. That was the
reason. Lovely Dave Heather waswith the sea dragons in Adelaide

(01:24:14):
by the way, nice, lovely placelovely dive anyways, with the
semi closed with the horizon anddiving now. It basically depends
how much how close you want the,the guests that you're breathing
to be to what you have in thetank. So if you have nitrox 32

(01:24:35):
in the tank, and you say hey, Ireally want to breathe at least
28 It's going to use lots ofbubbles to keep you that up. If
you say that's fine, I'm goingpretty shallow. I'm happy with
nitrox. 25 then there's going tobe very few bubbles going there
to give you that 25 So longstory short if I'm sure diving
in Sydney, which is between fiveto 20 metres depth most of the

(01:25:00):
time out of a seven litre steeltank. I can do three hours in
your house on the river. Nice.
It's pretty good.

Yeah. And retail wise. What's the difference in
price between the two units?

It's run Yeah, roughly okay. So for the
marathon instant I know best.
The Revo I think brand new mightcost you up to 15 grands. Now,
if you take all the options,there are options there, but the
one that you dive would be new15 runs the horizon. I think
this is seven to eight grand,something like that. Okay, so

(01:25:40):
it's meant to be much moreaffordable. Yeah, an interesting
thing as well is because Mariusis really going full on with
this river. They're really thisis something they believe in and
they're making all efforts totry and make it something that
you know, spreads and gets lotsof support. There's quite a few
dev shops now within Australiathat have signed up for for

(01:26:00):
being part of the horizondealership basically. And as a
result, if I was flying toBrisbane to go diving on
Straddie which is a fantasticplace by the wait for Manta rays
don't have to go to Maldives.
There they are in there inBrisbane, basically, there's a
dead centre there, they doreverse they do arise and and I

(01:26:20):
can rent a river from there fromthem. I can rent horizon, the
left to travel with mine.

Right? Perfect.
Yeah, that makes sense. When'syour next trip? Check star
triple away?

Um, I haven't planned it actually. I mean, 8x
is just going to be the show andmeeting people. The thing is,
I'm very, very fortunate to saythat I'm going to become an
Australian citizen soon.

Hey, congratulations. Thank

you. I'm so happy. I'm so excited. And the
kids as well. But the thing is,we don't know yet when he's
going to be the ceremony, thecitizenship or you pledge
allegiance, your loyalty toAustralia and all that. Yeah.
And I think once I have theceremony, that will be a few
weeks for me to wait to get thepassport. Yeah, until I have the
passport. I cannot go out ofAustralia because otherwise I
cannot come back.

Really? Yeah. But your piano though you're on
permanent residency. Now.

I am. But from the time I become a citizen,
even if I don't have a passportyet, I cannot have a PR visa
anymore, because I'm a citizen.
So I cannot go back into thecountry harsh.

Because I'm a little way behind you. Were just
a PR, but probably 18 months,maybe a bit more behind you.
It's gonna be a couple of yearsbefore I get my citizenship and
blue passport. But I didn't knowthat. But

yeah, I think about the day there will be a
few months where you can'treally go out of the country. I
mean, you will visit when theybooked my trip to edX. I was I
was taking the risk becausenormally they give you an email
one month before the actualceremony. And I booked IDEXX
five weeks before it was like,gee, if in the next seven days,
they tell me that's yourceremony, whatever you do, but

(01:27:57):
they haven't saw should be fine.
But yeah, long story short, I'mnot going to book any overseas
trip in the next few weeks.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
No, that makes sense. Huh? Hey,let's get these questions out.
Yeah, it was me.
I've got to put my glasses on.
That's one of the big things. Imean, you mentioned that earlier
on, you've got to have like bothI've got a bifocal lens in your
mask. To wear glasses.

No, no. Linna used to need analysis, but she
and she and she had it at somepoint.

Did she get laser surgery and shit like that?
Yeah. See, I'm I'm I can'tremember which way around it is
long side short sighted,whatever it is. I need reading
glasses. Like these things. SoI've been told by the optician
that it's not operable. Right.
So it's kind of tough shit Matt,you're going to you're going to
grin and bear it. So I ended upgetting I got a prescription

(01:28:57):
lens from AWS Bob, big shout outto him. He's just up in mono Val
optician there and got thebifocal lenses in and it's it's
good. But your eyes continue todeteriorate further for the
first two to five years. Rightso now it's I've had the lenses

(01:29:20):
for a year. I think I might haveto get some more so it's another
another sting in the pocket. Andit's torture as well because I
used to be really good with theeyes. So take a macro Yep, was a
piece of piss. Yeah, now I'venot only got to manhandle the
camera but kind of move the headto get focused

on the lenses on the when you're watching
something close, right? Yeah,yeah,

that's why wide angle I'm taking my wide angle
shots at the moment becausethey're easier to do for me,

but you know what, what you what you might be
able to do with your with yourcamera. What's your housing
brand? Ikelite Yep. What youmight be able to do is get from
a callate a an angledviewfinder. Yeah, that has
optical correction built in.
Yeah. And if that's not thecase, I think that you can do
one that you might be able tofit there.

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Nicholas Remy - The Underwater Club

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Nicholas Remy - The Underwater Club