Speaking of Cults
A podcast about cults, coercive control and recovery. Formerly called the Sensibly Speaking podcast, in this weekly show host Chris Shelton interviews cult survivors, psychologists and other professionals and specialists about the topics of cult recruitment, retention and recovery. This also includes non-religious cults and extreme political movements including the more divisive elements of MAGA and left-wing culture war issues. There is nothing off-limits but we always try to be respectful of the people involved even if we do not respect the beliefs or actions involved.
Episodes
This week I welcome Ben Eisenberg, someone who grew up in and around Landmark and its teachings, which did not help him in his early life. He's spent quite some time sorting this out and shares his journey with us today including a surprising outcome when he pushed for some change. Enjoy!
Ben's article on Medium: https://medium.com/@beneisenberg_10514/my-experience-growing-up-in-landmark-education-landmark-worldwide-1aae2ea2582e
This week we went live for the 100th episode of the Speaking of Cults podcast. I have some personal reflections and experiences to share as a cult expert and human in this world which I hope will be of some use to my listeners.
This week I welcome back Shannon Grover and Bryce Blankenagel to discuss the details of Mormon missionaries and what they actually are called upon to do. It's straight up slave labor under the guise of religious dedication and the Mormon Church is making billions off this free labor. Tune in and find out what is going on and how the Mormons are hiding their blatant abuse and criminality in plain sight. It's quite something.
Shannon...
This week I welcome Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis, authors of the new book The Myth of Good Christian Parenting, a deep exploration of the myths that permeate Christian communities throughout the world about what is "good parenting" but which is, in fact, just child abuse. I hope you'll give this one a listen and consider what we have to say. Enjoy!
Link to book on Amazon: https://a.co/d/0wrQkhl
In the Church Libr...
This week I welcome Cheryl Hope and Richard Marsh from the Get a Life Podcast to discuss the Plymouth Brethren Christian Church (formerly Exclusive Brethren), a religion/business group with a fascinating background and even more wild structure which survives to this day through the Hales family in Australia. Cheryl and Richard have quite a bit to share about this. Enjoy!
Get a Life Podcast: @getalifepodcast
We are now back for 2026. This week I welcome back Zach Elwood to discuss so-called "body language experts" and the pseudoscience they push as "infotainment" which actually creates a pretty skewed idea of how people work and what deceptive behavior is all about. We cover a lot in a little bit of time. Enjoy!
Zach's YouTube: @PeopleWhoReadPeoplepodcast
Munecat video: https://youtu.be/Y0VQyEY-B2I?si=Em_PyU9HGJnSyPYQ
This week I welcome ex-Scientologist Mitch Brisker to discuss his many and varied experiences in dealing with David Miscavige, the leader of Scientology, and how he would be sent to Utah to learn from the Mormons how to produce and present Scientology better to the world. We talk about a lot of things in this podcast around this, including Scientology's future. Enjoy!
This week I welcome back therapist and author Rachel Bernstein to discuss her newly released workbook on cult recovery, titled Restart and Restore. We go over what this workbook is useful for and cult recovery in general and cover a surprising amount of territory for such a short show. Enjoy!
Rachel's website: https://rachelbernsteintherapy.com
Rachel's new book: https://www.amazon.com/Restart-Restore-Journal-Survivors-Manipulatio...
This week I welcome back Jennie Gage, creator of Life Take Two on YouTube and a former Mormon MAGA tradwife who has been helping explain that world to us. We cover a lot more territory this week and I think you'll find it very relevant to some of the social insanity that has overtaken the US in the last decade.
Jennie's channel: @lifetaketwo7662
This week I welcome back Jon Atack to help me dissect the Code of Honor, one of Scientology's earliest and most successful attempts to undermine people's sense of agency and morality. Enjoy!
Jon's channel: @jonatackfamilyfriends6176
This week I welcome Patty Moher, a former Scientologist staffer and kind of amazing person to talk to. We had a great chat about all things Scientology and I hope you'll enjoy it as much as we did.
This week I welcome back Bryce Blankenangel and Shannon Grover for another deep dive into Mormon history and culture, this time digging into a truly horrifying piece of history known as the Meadows Mountain Massacre. This is a bit tough of a listen in places but I think a very good show and I appreciate my guests broad knowledge on this topic.
Glassbox podcast: https://glassboxpodcast.com
This week I welcome journalist Tony Ortega to discuss his career, his interest in Scientology and get his perspective on issues related to the church and its leadership. Enjoy!
Tony's Substack: https://tonyortega.substack.org
Unbreakable Miss Lovely: https://shorturl.at/lKYPw
This week I welcome back Jon Atack to discuss his new book about the common origins of Naziism and Scientology, and then go deep into the REM Model of Human Behavior which I created and how that explains so much of what Hubbard was about, as well as how to undo cultic manipulations. Enjoy!
This week I welcome Zach Elwood, host of the People Who Read People podcast and a very fun guest to discuss the entrepreneurship of influence that is quite popular on social media these days especially as personified by Chase Hughes. Zach discusses his history with NLP and we talk deeply about the consequences of these practices. Enjoy!
Zach's channel: @PeopleWhoReadPeoplepodcast
This week I welcome Jennie Gage, an ex-Mormon/MAGA/trad wife who has a story to tell about her upbringing in the Mormon world, how she was literally trafficked before escaping into abject poverty to rebuild her life from scratch. As part of this, we go deep into the MAGA/Evangelical mindset, since there are such whopping contradictions between what Christian Nationalists say and what they do that it's impossible for most people to ...
This week I welcome Bethany Leger, host of the Stop the Shunning podcast and a former member of the Jehovah's Witnesses. She has a few interesting twists in her childhood growing up in the JWs and we had a lot to discuss in recovering from the cult experience.
Bethany's channel: https://youtube.com/stoptheshunning
This week I welcome Michael Shemwell, host of the Shunned podcast and a former member of the Jehovah's Witnesses. We met while filming the Jubilee production about cults and here discuss our mutual experiences and the ups and downs of cult recovery. Michael's podcast: https://shunnedpodcast.com
This week I welcome back Pamela Nickel Williams, whose new memoir about her time growing up in and around Scientology has now been released. Pam has quite a story to tell and I hope you'll give it a look.
Pamela's Website: https://clearlyliesaretrue.com
This week I welcome back podcast favorite Jon Atack to discuss his brand-new book, "If Scientology Ruled the World: Nazi Occultists, Sex Magick, Space Aliens, and the Second Coming." This book is as wild as it sounds and uncovers some things I can almost guarantee you have never heard or seen before regarding the common origin story of the Nazi's Aryan race theory and Hubbard's ideas about body thetans and spiritual rehabilitation....
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