September 18, 2023 • 39 mins
This month, we talk with Harriet Redman, founder of one of SLN's first chapters, Wisconsibs, and founder of SLN's newest chapter, Oregon Sibs, Nikki Donnelly. We discuss why sib meeting spaces are so important and how you can get involved or start your own chapter.
Access the transcript of this episode here.
Acceda a la transcripción en español.
"The power in having people in your community that can help you navigate through this sib life." —Nikki Donnelly
"Don’t give up…there’s all kinds of reasons to stop, but don’t. Just keep going…and when you’re feeling discouraged give an SLN chapter person a call or an email." —Harriet Redman
Resources in this episode:
- SLN Chapters page
- Wisconsibs
- Oregon Sibs MeetUp
- The Sibling Survival Guide book
- Sibshops book
- Sibshops on Siblings Support Project
- Oregon FMLA information
- What About Me? by Wisconsibs
- Sibsack by Wisconsibs
- Journey Forward by Wisconsibs
- Siblings Choice Award by Wisconsibs
- Wisconsibs Read book club
- Wisconsibs event calendar
- Intro to Sibs by Oregon Sibs
- Oregon Sibs Announcement
- Contact Harriet Redman: info@wisconsibs.org
- Contact Nikki Donnelly: nikki.donnelly@oregonsibs.org
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Chris Berstler (00:03):
Welcome to the sibling Leadership Network
podcast. The sibling LeadershipNetwork is a national nonprofit
whose mission is to providesiblings of individuals with
disabilities the informationsupport and tools to advocate
with their brothers and sistersand to promote the issue is
important to us in our entirefamilies. Hello, and welcome to
(00:25):
another episode of the siblingLeadership Network Podcast.
Today we'll be talking about SLMchapters what they are and why
and how to get involved. I'mjoined today by founder of one
of our first chapters,Wisconsin's Harriet Redman and
founder of our newest chapter,Oregon sibs, Nikki Donley. Thank
you both so much for joining ustoday.
Harriet Redman (00:46):
Thanks, Chris.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Nikki Donnelly (00:48):
Thank you, Chris.
Chris Berstler (00:49):
Please tell us about yourself and your
siblings.
Nikki Donnelly (00:53):
So I'm Nikki Don Lee and recently moved to Oregon
via I was in Illinois for acouple years working on my
doctorate degree. And then butbefore that, I was from
California, and very involved,very still involved in the
California Chapter of thesibling Leadership Network. And
(01:17):
I moved to Oregon and realizethere was not a chapter here and
wanted to connect sibs in thisarea, I have a brother who is 10
years younger than me withautism. And he's the absolute
love of my life and why I'm myprofession is in special
education. And I'm currently anautism consultant here in
(01:39):
Southern Oregon. Yeah, he'sinfluenced my work so much, and
taught me everything I know, Isay, and I do have an older
sister, three years older thanme. And she, and my parents and
my brother currently live inAlabama, where when my when I
(02:02):
lived in California, my brotherlived with me for 1011 years
before he moved to Alabama, whenI moved to Illinois to pursue my
degree. So glad to be here.
Harriet Redman (02:13):
Oh, my story is a little different in that I'm
not a sibling, I'm a parentactually. And, and yet, my heart
is where siblings lead us inunderstanding how to treat
people with disabilities and andhow to manage all the many roles
(02:33):
that siblings have to manage. SoI have two grown children.
Christiana, who's 33, and heryounger brother, Philip, who's
30. And my interests began, whenPhilip was born, he was born
with a multitude ofdisabilities, and no specific
(02:57):
diagnosis. So rare chromosomalabnormality, which kind of was
one of the reasons that I wasable to pursue looking into the
research on siblings in thatthere was just really nothing to
look into with my son. But moreimportantly, I immediately
(03:19):
understood the implications ofparenting, a child with a
disability and their sibling.
And so part of that was my, mynatural, intuitive motherhood
sense. But also, my backgroundand education was in family,
education, and, of course,studying family system theory
(03:41):
and all that kind of thing. So Iknew that this would have
implications for his sister, herwhole life, because it's a
system. And I felt veryunprepared to know how to
support her as well as how toparent children who had very
different kinds of needs. Andthis was back in 1992. So
(04:07):
ancient ancient history here.
But at that time, there justwasn't much information at all a
very little research. But Isought out what I could, and I
found SIP shop, thanks to DonMeyers book, which was in a
(04:30):
bookstore that and I sat down inthe bookstore and read it from
cover to cover. And it reallyanswered many of my questions,
but also made me even hungrierto help others who like me as a
parent, but also siblings findeach other as that that is so
(04:52):
important in the strength andresilience of siblings is that
they they find each other andthey They support each other.
Chris Berstler (05:02):
Please tell us about your respective SLN
chapters and how you becameinvolved with the SLN.
Harriet Redman (05:08):
As I was looking for more information, and was
frustrated and amazed that therewas really nothing out there,
but if you think about it, thethe laws for to support people
with disabilities and integratethem in the community were
pretty fresh. And, and therewasn't a lot of data on siblings
(05:36):
growing up with brothers andsisters with disabilities. But
having said that, I did find notonly Don Meyers book, but I
found some school psychologistswho were also interested in
pursuing what could be done tohelp siblings. Long story short,
(05:56):
we decided that we would offerSIP shops, then we determined
that you can't do that endlesslywithout some sort of support. So
we started a nonprofit and wecalled the Fox Valley sibling
support network. And thoselisteners in Wisconsin might
know where the Fox Valley is.
It's it's the area between GreenBay and Oshkosh, Wisconsin, so
(06:18):
it's Northeast Wisconsin alongthe Fox River. And so that's
where we started
Nikki Donnelly (06:27):
my original connection with the sibling
Leadership Network. I think Iwas on meetup.com probably
looking for social connectionopportunities for my brother or
something when he was livingwith me many years ago. And I, I
(06:47):
just accidentally came acrossCalifornia, saline and, and I'm
from the Central Valley area ofCalifornia. And the group was
meeting in San Francisco. So itwas like a two and a half, three
hour drive. And I drove there tomeet up just because I was like,
What is this about? I want toexplore myself as a sibling.
(07:10):
Right? And what is it? What doesthat mean? And why did I never
even thought of myself as thisunique community, you know, it
just never even occurred to me.
And I connected with them. Andthen I ended up because
California is so large, there'skind of like a Northern
California group and a SouthernCalifornia group. But the Fresno
area is like right in themiddle, and you're like three
(07:33):
hours to either group, right? SoI started a, like a Central
Valley Chapter, they're notchapter but you know, area
there. And we expanded our, ourpeople connected with the
California group, right. And,really, we've, that, that grew
(07:55):
just immensely. And so Icontinued with the group. And
then when I moved to Oregon,just really wanted to create
that sense of community here inOregon. And it's really been
amazing, because I'm stillthere's, there's a couple
projects ongoing withCalifornia, then I'm still on,
(08:19):
I'm still on the board there.
But we're partnering now. Soinstead of it just being like a
California project, now, we'rebringing in our people that are
involved in Oregon as well. And,you know, we're all volunteer,
(08:39):
it is 100%, volunteer, all ofCalifornia, all of Oregon, we're
not paid for what we do. So themore people that we can have
involved, the less effort I'myou know, work in time that we
have to do, you know, because wehave great big ideas that we
want to have things that we wantto accomplish. But, you know, we
(09:00):
work and we have families and,you know, we're still many of us
are caring for our siblings orin some, some way supporting our
siblings and still are helpingthem navigate systems and so
forth. You know, and yeah, so,so time tends to be a big
(09:22):
constraint. A lot of the a lotof it so I've really, really
enjoyed just setting up thiscollaborative partnership with
with California and Oregon.
Harriet Redman (09:37):
Chris, your your audience can't see us but I'm
nodding my head with everythingthat Nikki is saying.
Collaboration, end andconnecting, partnering, taking
the small steps to get to thebig steps. It takes all of that
and and in that process. It'sit's sometimes easy to give up,
(10:01):
or just say, Well, you know how,how critical is this? Maybe it's
not so important. I better takemy time and do something else.
It is important. And it doesmake a difference. And it does
take one step at a time, with alot of people focused on the
prize, and that is connectingsiblings reassuring the
(10:26):
resiliency of siblings. Andthat's just critical not only
for the sake of siblings, butfor the where their eye is in
their eyes on the quality oflife for their brothers and
Chris Berstler (10:43):
Wisconsibs existed 10 years before getting
sistersinvolved with the SLN in Oregon
sibs is the newest SLN chapter,why did you decide to become SLN
chapters and what can a chapteror an individual sib do once
they are part of the SLN thatthey couldn't do before?
Harriet Redman (11:01):
When we started, and I mentioned that we were
called the Fox Valley siblingsupport network, we didn't
really have a vision of becomingstatewide or nationwide, we were
we were focused on the needs ofour local community. We weren't
looking outside that. But as wemoved along, as we began to
(11:25):
collaborate with more and moreand can see the value in a
broader relationship withorganizations and siblings,
from, you know, beyond our smallcommunity. It, it just seemed
like a really good idea not onlyto connect our siblings with one
(11:47):
another physically in person,but helped connect siblings
together wherever they're from.
So when, when we were approachedby some of the organizers of
other states to come togetherand think about a national
(12:07):
effort, a national movement, weweren't even talking necessarily
about an organization, weweren't sure what we were
talking about, but reallyperpetuating a movement of
sibling awareness. I thoughtthis is fantastic, because
sibling awareness is is going tobe critical, not only for each
(12:29):
individual's life, but forpolicies for research for global
connection. So yes, we weredefinitely interested in getting
something bigger started. And asit turns out, the way that
(12:50):
sibling Leadership Network choseto grow was by state chapters.
So for us, that meant we neededto think a bit broader than our
small community, we needed tothink, statewide. And so we also
changed our name from Fox Valleysibling support network to
(13:13):
Wisconsin's so that we, wepresented ourselves as a
Wisconsin chapter.
Nikki Donnelly (13:22):
So why become involved with the SLN and I
think once once I got involvedwith California, I realized,
like the power of us siblingscoming together and for for
myself, just, wow, I learned somuch about myself. Like, there's
(13:46):
this whole community out therethat probably doesn't even
realize they need community.
Right. I never thought about itbefore, you know, so. So, yeah,
I think, really, I I'm just verypassionate about the mission of
the SLN and advancing that.
(14:07):
However it need be. And, youknow, the power of us all coming
together when I look at becauseI'm currently still on the board
for the National SLN and hearingthe updates and, you know, the
policy committee advocating forevery state to include siblings
(14:29):
in the Family Medical Leave Act,you know, and I'm happy to say
Oregon just passed a FamilyMedical Leave Act for the first
time and or the Oregon MedicalLeave Act. I'm not sure what
it's called. But the first thingI did was when I saw it was
(14:49):
proposed was pulled it up andyes, siblings are included. So
kudos to Oregon for includingsiblings. Not every state does
so You know that that's anexample of having that advocates
that collectively come together?
You know, and and you're, you'repulling from the the the
(15:11):
knowledge and the skills ofpeople from now across the
United States, rather than justfrom your community or your
state, you know, you can, it's,again, that power of
collaboration, right. That's thepower coming together. And and
I'm also co chair on theresearch committee right now.
(15:33):
And, and, you know, we'rebringing in researchers from
across the United States cometogether and, and collaborate on
what are the needs, what are thestudies, or even just compiling
all of the research together inthis nice document that, that we
(15:54):
have, so that other people thatare doing research can tap into
what what we have, you know, anduse us and for recruiting and so
forth. So, yeah, that now thenational reach even being in a
small southern Oregon, I knowthat I'm connected nationwide.
Harriet Redman (16:18):
And I think that's so critical. And one of
the reasons that I was hungryfor a national presence. My
experience in looking forresearch right away when, when
my son was diagnosed, I mean,there wasn't much and part of it
(16:38):
was It wasn't pulled together.
And, and yet, as I was fosteringthis new nonprofit, I, I didn't
have time to do all thatresearch and all that searching
for research. So I was hungryfor that national presence, that
national connection to, to dothat for us, and an end to
(17:03):
inform us as a part of a largernetwork. So it was the research
and as you said, the advocacythat even as a state
organization, we don't have thecapacity to do that. All by
ourselves, we really need thethe the force of a nation wide
(17:23):
organization, like the SLN.
Chris Berstler (17:30):
Why is it important to have a place for
sibs to get together?
Nikki Donnelly (17:34):
Oh, my gosh, I'm going to jump in on this one.
Because this is I'm so sopassionate about this. For me, I
can say myself, personally, Ikind of look at this twofold
because, you know, being in theprofession. And being a sibling,
(17:55):
is is has been a very wholesomeexperience for me, I guess. And
I, as a sibling, I have learnedway more about myself, then, I,
I would have never known thisabout myself, if I've been on
this journey of learning andunderstand myself and why I do
(18:19):
some things that I do. And manyof it is related to being a CIP.
You know, I, I point out thatprobably the biggest thing that
I've learned about myself inlearning about what it means to
be a sibling and in listeningto, you know, Don Myers, my
(18:40):
present his research and soforth at conferences, as I was
just getting involved, is Inever I prided myself on being
self sufficient. Right? And Inever, like, I never looked at
it from the perspective of like,I don't like to ask for help.
(19:02):
Right? Because, not that it wasever intentionally said to me,
but I think as a young child,now remind you, I'm 10 years
older than my brother. So I, Iwasn't young, you know, I, when
my brother was, was starting togo through assessments and
(19:23):
diagnosis when he was two orthree, I was 1213. So I was very
aware. But I also, I think, wasvery aware that it was very,
very taxing a time for myparents, right? And in what what
all they had, like him beingkicked out of preschools, and,
you know, just trying to managetheir work life balance that I
(19:46):
just kind of got this like, Oh,if I if I need something, it's a
burden for somebody else. Sonow, you know, I've learned to
navigate that through my life.
And so the power are for mepersonally and just
understanding myself has beenone of the the, the absolute
greatest gifts that siblingLeadership Network and has has
(20:11):
given to me. And I'm extremelythankful for and I in turn when
it gives that back to othersiblings,
Harriet Redman (20:21):
everyone needs to feel they belong. And that's
what I observe with withsiblings who find us. And we, we
have programs starting at agethree all the way through
adulthood. And when they findother siblings, and they find,
they may not even have thoughtof themselves as a sibling, or
(20:44):
as we say, or Wisconsin, or asaid, until they hear other
people start to describe theirexperiences. And then it dawns
on them, oh, I'm a sieve. Andlook at all these people around
me. They're okay. This is goingto be okay. And that feeling of
(21:07):
belonging and relating, and theyou said power, the reassurance.
The empowerment that offers isimmeasurable. And, and it might
be just a little flicker, itmight be just a little moment,
(21:28):
that makes a huge, hugedifference. Recently, we have a
new board member, and she wasseeking out information for her,
her nephew who is the brother ofa young boy with autism. And in
her journey to find us for him,she realized that she too, was a
(21:52):
sibling. And just, I wish youwere here to tell you how that
made her feel pretty empowered,pretty excited. And, and like, I
found something I didn't know Iwas looking for. And it feels
really good. I think anotherreason that it's important to
(22:12):
connect with other siblings Isthat you, you have someone to
reflect on someone to feed backthe way you see yourself,
though, the way as you weresaying before Nikki, to discover
yourself, discover yourstrengths, discover what role
you're playing, even to definethose roles is absolutely
(22:37):
important. And, and I, I dothink that as a parent, I am
able to help siblings reflectthat as well, because it's just
another perspective. And I'malso an advocate for siblings
that their voice within a familyneeds to be heard that parents
(23:01):
need to listen to those siblingsregardless of their age. And,
and understand them for theirroles and their perspectives.
for lots of reasons, includingthat they have the longest
relationship with their otherchild with a disability. That's
critical.
Chris Berstler (23:19):
In your opinion, what is the best thing about
your chapter and why should andhow can siblings in your area
get involved?
Nikki Donnelly (23:27):
I think right now with Oregon, we're, we're we
are just starting to bloomright. And so there's so we're
so open for ideas andopportunities. And, you know,
come Come be with us and bringyour idea and we're gonna help
(23:49):
help nourish it right to bringit into fruition. And so, yeah,
and as far as connecting withus, right now we're on
meetup.com and it's Oregonsibling Leadership Network and
we have a Facebook page. Oregonsibs. All one word.
Harriet Redman (24:13):
Since we've been operating for more than 25
years, we have, to some degree,reached our vision. And our
vision was to have programmingfor siblings of all ages. So one
of the exciting things about usis that we have programs
available from age three all theway through adulthood. For three
(24:37):
year olds, it's a program calledSIP sack and it's a tangible bag
of materials that reallyemphasize the relationship with
their sibling with disability,how much love there is in their
family for them as well as theirsibling with a disability using
(24:58):
the word disability and Andhelping parents through the
activity book for children hearand be open to communication
with their brother or with theirchild with you as a brother or
sister with a disability. So allthe way from age three through
childhood through teenagethrough adulthood, we emphasize
(25:21):
that, for adults, we haveprograms for helping them with
future preparation. We call itjourney forward. And, and now
the the, the main focus is,we've got these programs, now we
need to get them out further andfurther, throughout Wisconsin
(25:43):
and elsewhere to where we alwaysclaim that we don't care if you
live in Wisconsin, but if youlike Wisconsin, or you're a
Packer fan, or you drink beer,you can be a Wisconsin, that's
good with us. So we really arepretty open with that. But in
the process, we also want toreach each and every sibling we
(26:07):
can, here in Wisconsin andbeyond
Chris Berstler (26:11):
what current issues are unique to siblings in
your area?
Harriet Redman (26:15):
Well, I'll start and it's probably not news that
services, especially housing,caregiving, all of those
services are so difficult to toget for their brother or sister
with a disability. So and asthose systems and services are a
(26:44):
scant, those responsibilitiesthen come to the family. And
their parents are getting older,they're getting older, they're
busy. Those are all bigchallenges for our adult
siblings. And we recently did afuture planning program is
(27:06):
really Forward program as a liveworkshop. And the siblings
attending that were the youngestgroup of siblings ever, ever to
go through the program. So it'snot just older siblings that are
realizing the magnitude of it,the scarcity of Cisco Systems
(27:28):
and services, but the agingpopulation is is really becoming
much more evident. And it'shere, it's a it's a caregiving
crisis. It's a housing crisis.
And that's really concerning,not only adult siblings, but
even teenagers and, andchildren, young children
understand the, the, the weightof responsibility, that that
(27:53):
they either perceive, or theyknow they have,
Nikki Donnelly (28:03):
we're still learning about the needs in our
area. In fact, we are partneringwith California, we're putting a
research team together to kindof learn about just survey
siblings in California andOregon and, and we'll be open to
other states if anybody elsewants to join in for that. But I
can say, hey, you know, I'mreflecting on our little Oregon
(28:27):
startup board. We all havesiblings that are in different
states. And us we're Oregon isvery rural, as well, right.
Unless you're up in the veryNorth Portland area, you know,
we have little pockets of largertowns, but for the most part
where it's very, very rural. Soyeah, and and just learning and
(28:50):
understanding how to connectthat way. Thank goodness for
virtual sessions. Right. Butthen, you know, you hope, you
know, there's there's lots andlots of rural places in Oregon
that do not have internetaccess. Even that's a barrier.
So
Harriet Redman (29:07):
right, Wisconsin, too. Yeah. When we
were 10 years into our, ourjourney, our Wisconsin's
journey. When we were when wefelt we were ready to add adult
sibling programming. So we did aquite a number of focus groups
of adult sibs and professionalswho had, who were aware of
(29:32):
siblings that that were in thepicture. And they were concerned
about the quality of care fortheir brothers and sisters. And
while we didn't see in ourmission that that we we could
change the quality of care thattheir brothers and sisters were
getting. We did give siblings atool that other chapters could
(29:58):
could read. replicate. And thatis we give siblings an
opportunity to nominate qualitycaregivers, people who are
caring for their brothers andsisters, we call it the siblings
Choice Award. And we give it inNovember, which is national
family caregiver month, Ibelieve it's called. But it it
(30:19):
just gives siblings another toolto have a little power to
emphasize the importance ofquality care for people with
disabilities, because they docare about their brothers
sister, even if they don't wantto be, you know, they don't want
their sister illumine with them.
And their sister doesn't wantthat either, or whatever the
(30:42):
case is. They do care. And thisis one tool they have control on
they can acknowledge andrecognize and honor people who
are providing that care. Andit's small, and we don't there's
no cash prize or anything. It'ssmall, but it is it says to the
world. Similarly, as you'rewatching, they care about this
(31:06):
issue.
Chris Berstler (31:09):
Does your chapter have any upcoming events
are initiatives that you'relooking forward to?
Harriet Redman (31:15):
Well, we have a lot of stuff coming up because
of our lifespan of programming.
So September always means thatwe're kicking off CIP shops, and
we have those monthly for agessix to 12. Don't one of them is
with a conference. And we loveto do those where autism
conference might be taking placesome part of the state or we
(31:36):
have a circles of life, which isany diagnosis, we will provide
the sub shop at thoseconferences. So we have one of
those coming up in September aswell. We are we have started a
adult book club calledWisconsin's read. And so I
(31:57):
always look forward to thosethey they even though I'm not a
sibling, they, they graciouslylet me part of that. And it does
not matter what the book is, andand we don't pick books that are
necessarily about siblings. Butit does not matter what the book
subject is. The conversationalways ends up being a sibling
(32:19):
conversation. And it'swonderful, it is absolutely
wonderful. And anybody can jointhat. We will be meeting
September 20. I'm not sure wehave a book for this month. But
those are, those are fantastictoo. And we're also working on
putting our journey forwardprogram online, that will be a
(32:42):
few months down the road. ButI'm working on that. And I'm
looking forward to that.
Nikki Donnelly (32:48):
We have upcoming Oregon intro to sibs, it's
virtual. So we invite anybodyfrom everywhere, there's only
one slide that kind of talksabout statistics in Oregon. So
the rest of it is is pertinentto anybody. And that information
(33:08):
actually just went out in theSLN September newsletter, so but
it is Monday, September 25, at6pm. Pacific Time. And other
than that we are we have amental health professional that
we're partnering with and doingit's like a six week meeting one
(33:33):
time a week kind of workshop.
And so we're, we're before weput it out to public, we're
piloting it with board membersso that we can kind of fine tune
it and and it's for siblings toto really dive into those that
want to go deeper into to thismental health aspect of it. So
(33:55):
that'll be coming in the future.
Chris Berstler (34:00):
what advice or resources would you recommend to
any listeners out there who livein a state without an SLN
chapter?
Nikki Donnelly (34:09):
reach out to the SLN and start one yourself if if
you don't have the bandwidth todo that, because you know, it's
a task I'm still working on. Youknow, this is all currently kind
of self funded. So there's moneythat takes into like setting up
a Google Suite and you know,having a meetup site and so
(34:32):
forth. So if that's not in yourbandwidth, then connect with
another state. You know, andthen as as you grow, like maybe
people in your state that areconnected with another state,
then then it kind of you can youcan spread the love across more
(34:53):
people and you don't have to doit all on your own. I was very,
very fortunate when I moved toOregon and realize there was not
a chapter I reached out to theSLN. And I said, Hey, and they
said, Well, we actually hadthese couple people that have
shown interest in the past. Butagain, probably didn't
(35:14):
individually or whatever, youknow, hadn't been with the
growing of a chapter. And sowhen I reached out to them,
they're like, oh, we have thesecouple people, connect with
them. And then so it was, it wasnice that there may be people
already interested in yourstate. So if you reach out to
(35:34):
the SLN, they can, there theyhave their little tickler list.
And when I reached out, theythere, I was able to connect
already. So
Harriet Redman (35:42):
yeah, that's great advice. Nikki, we've done
that many times. Early on, andeven more recent, it's, it's fun
to find out what's going on inother states, but reaching out
to other SLN chapters, reachingout to anyone who may be
(36:04):
interested in supporting yourcause. And that that can mean
non sibs, that can mean parentsthat can mean professionals.
Just tell your story, just ifyou say it often enough, it's
always good to say that out loudand sort of therapeutic. But
also, you'll find people who areinterested in what you want to
(36:26):
see happen, have that visionready to talk about. And, and
don't be afraid to reach out topeople you didn't expect, that
would be interested. And don'tgive up. That's the other is,
there's all kinds of reasons tostop. But don't just keep going
(36:47):
and don't give yourself time bepatient. It doesn't happen
overnight. But when you'refeeling discouraged, you know,
given SLN chapter person a callor email, Nikki, myself, on the
other 27 states that have peoplewho are working on this, I'm
(37:08):
sure we'd be happy to give yousome encouragement.
Nikki Donnelly (37:12):
I want to also highlight don't forget
connecting with schools, youknow, because a lot of times,
it's special education. systemswithin schools are required to
have family component to it,right. So like we do intro to
sibs, for several schooldistricts that do parent
(37:35):
training workshops.
Harriet Redman (37:36):
And if a school is not open to you find another
school.
Nikki Donnelly (37:42):
My dream would be to have six shops as part of
you know, they have after schoolclubs and so forth, even at
elementary school, like my dreamwould be to have us at
elementary, you know, justanother after school club.
Right?
Chris Berstler (37:56):
That would have been nice growing up,
Nikki Donnelly (37:57):
right?
Yep, just the power and havingpeople in your community that
that can help you navigatethrough this this sieve life.
Harriet Redman (38:12):
And I like what you said Nikki to it. You don't
have to organize a whole bunchof stuff to seek out support.
That affirmation that you youcan get when you know one other
person who may be a sibling, ormay not. But siblings talking to
(38:35):
other siblings is so so much agift that if you are an
organizer, and you can make thatconnection happen. It's worth
every thing you did to make ithappen. All of the planning all
the all the thinking, and evenif it costs the money, it is
(38:58):
definitely worth it worth it.
That connection is so, soimportant.
Chris Berstler (39:04):
Awesome. This has been such an excellent
discussion. Thank you both somuch for taking the time to
share with us today. Anyresources that Harriet or Nikki
have discussed, will be in thedescription below. Yeah, thank
you both again, so much forbeing with us today. It's been
great.
Nikki Donnelly (39:22):
Thank you, Chris, for having us.
Harriet Redman (39:23):
It was fun.
Chris Berstler (39:25):
Find resources, tools and information about the
sibling experience on siblingleadership.org. The siblings
Leadership Network is anonprofit, and we rely on
support from our audience. Findthe donation button on our
homepage and contribute to theever growing sibling movement.
Welcome to the sibling Leadership Network
podcast. The sibling LeadershipNetwork is a national nonprofit
whose mission is to providesiblings of individuals with
disabilities the informationsupport and tools to advocate
with their brothers and sistersand to promote the issue is
important to us in our entirefamilies. Hello, and welcome to
(00:25):
another episode of the siblingLeadership Network Podcast.
Today we'll be talking about SLMchapters what they are and why
and how to get involved. I'mjoined today by founder of one
of our first chapters,Wisconsin's Harriet Redman and
founder of our newest chapter,Oregon sibs, Nikki Donley. Thank
you both so much for joining ustoday.
Harriet Redman (00:46):
Thanks, Chris.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Nikki Donnelly (00:48):
Thank you, Chris.
Chris Berstler (00:49):
Please tell us about yourself and your
siblings.
Nikki Donnelly (00:53):
So I'm Nikki Don Lee and recently moved to Oregon
via I was in Illinois for acouple years working on my
doctorate degree. And then butbefore that, I was from
California, and very involved,very still involved in the
California Chapter of thesibling Leadership Network. And
(01:17):
I moved to Oregon and realizethere was not a chapter here and
wanted to connect sibs in thisarea, I have a brother who is 10
years younger than me withautism. And he's the absolute
love of my life and why I'm myprofession is in special
education. And I'm currently anautism consultant here in
(01:39):
Southern Oregon. Yeah, he'sinfluenced my work so much, and
taught me everything I know, Isay, and I do have an older
sister, three years older thanme. And she, and my parents and
my brother currently live inAlabama, where when my when I
(02:02):
lived in California, my brotherlived with me for 1011 years
before he moved to Alabama, whenI moved to Illinois to pursue my
degree. So glad to be here.
Harriet Redman (02:13):
Oh, my story is a little different in that I'm
not a sibling, I'm a parentactually. And, and yet, my heart
is where siblings lead us inunderstanding how to treat
people with disabilities and andhow to manage all the many roles
(02:33):
that siblings have to manage. SoI have two grown children.
Christiana, who's 33, and heryounger brother, Philip, who's
30. And my interests began, whenPhilip was born, he was born
with a multitude ofdisabilities, and no specific
(02:57):
diagnosis. So rare chromosomalabnormality, which kind of was
one of the reasons that I wasable to pursue looking into the
research on siblings in thatthere was just really nothing to
look into with my son. But moreimportantly, I immediately
(03:19):
understood the implications ofparenting, a child with a
disability and their sibling.
And so part of that was my, mynatural, intuitive motherhood
sense. But also, my backgroundand education was in family,
education, and, of course,studying family system theory
(03:41):
and all that kind of thing. So Iknew that this would have
implications for his sister, herwhole life, because it's a
system. And I felt veryunprepared to know how to
support her as well as how toparent children who had very
different kinds of needs. Andthis was back in 1992. So
(04:07):
ancient ancient history here.
But at that time, there justwasn't much information at all a
very little research. But Isought out what I could, and I
found SIP shop, thanks to DonMeyers book, which was in a
(04:30):
bookstore that and I sat down inthe bookstore and read it from
cover to cover. And it reallyanswered many of my questions,
but also made me even hungrierto help others who like me as a
parent, but also siblings findeach other as that that is so
(04:52):
important in the strength andresilience of siblings is that
they they find each other andthey They support each other.
Chris Berstler (05:02):
Please tell us about your respective SLN
chapters and how you becameinvolved with the SLN.
Harriet Redman (05:08):
As I was looking for more information, and was
frustrated and amazed that therewas really nothing out there,
but if you think about it, thethe laws for to support people
with disabilities and integratethem in the community were
pretty fresh. And, and therewasn't a lot of data on siblings
(05:36):
growing up with brothers andsisters with disabilities. But
having said that, I did find notonly Don Meyers book, but I
found some school psychologistswho were also interested in
pursuing what could be done tohelp siblings. Long story short,
(05:56):
we decided that we would offerSIP shops, then we determined
that you can't do that endlesslywithout some sort of support. So
we started a nonprofit and wecalled the Fox Valley sibling
support network. And thoselisteners in Wisconsin might
know where the Fox Valley is.
It's it's the area between GreenBay and Oshkosh, Wisconsin, so
(06:18):
it's Northeast Wisconsin alongthe Fox River. And so that's
where we started
Nikki Donnelly (06:27):
my original connection with the sibling
Leadership Network. I think Iwas on meetup.com probably
looking for social connectionopportunities for my brother or
something when he was livingwith me many years ago. And I, I
(06:47):
just accidentally came acrossCalifornia, saline and, and I'm
from the Central Valley area ofCalifornia. And the group was
meeting in San Francisco. So itwas like a two and a half, three
hour drive. And I drove there tomeet up just because I was like,
What is this about? I want toexplore myself as a sibling.
(07:10):
Right? And what is it? What doesthat mean? And why did I never
even thought of myself as thisunique community, you know, it
just never even occurred to me.
And I connected with them. Andthen I ended up because
California is so large, there'skind of like a Northern
California group and a SouthernCalifornia group. But the Fresno
area is like right in themiddle, and you're like three
(07:33):
hours to either group, right? SoI started a, like a Central
Valley Chapter, they're notchapter but you know, area
there. And we expanded our, ourpeople connected with the
California group, right. And,really, we've, that, that grew
(07:55):
just immensely. And so Icontinued with the group. And
then when I moved to Oregon,just really wanted to create
that sense of community here inOregon. And it's really been
amazing, because I'm stillthere's, there's a couple
projects ongoing withCalifornia, then I'm still on,
(08:19):
I'm still on the board there.
But we're partnering now. Soinstead of it just being like a
California project, now, we'rebringing in our people that are
involved in Oregon as well. And,you know, we're all volunteer,
(08:39):
it is 100%, volunteer, all ofCalifornia, all of Oregon, we're
not paid for what we do. So themore people that we can have
involved, the less effort I'myou know, work in time that we
have to do, you know, because wehave great big ideas that we
want to have things that we wantto accomplish. But, you know, we
(09:00):
work and we have families and,you know, we're still many of us
are caring for our siblings orin some, some way supporting our
siblings and still are helpingthem navigate systems and so
forth. You know, and yeah, so,so time tends to be a big
(09:22):
constraint. A lot of the a lotof it so I've really, really
enjoyed just setting up thiscollaborative partnership with
with California and Oregon.
Harriet Redman (09:37):
Chris, your your audience can't see us but I'm
nodding my head with everythingthat Nikki is saying.
Collaboration, end andconnecting, partnering, taking
the small steps to get to thebig steps. It takes all of that
and and in that process. It'sit's sometimes easy to give up,
(10:01):
or just say, Well, you know how,how critical is this? Maybe it's
not so important. I better takemy time and do something else.
It is important. And it doesmake a difference. And it does
take one step at a time, with alot of people focused on the
prize, and that is connectingsiblings reassuring the
(10:26):
resiliency of siblings. Andthat's just critical not only
for the sake of siblings, butfor the where their eye is in
their eyes on the quality oflife for their brothers and
Chris Berstler (10:43):
Wisconsibs existed 10 years before getting
sistersinvolved with the SLN in Oregon
sibs is the newest SLN chapter,why did you decide to become SLN
chapters and what can a chapteror an individual sib do once
they are part of the SLN thatthey couldn't do before?
Harriet Redman (11:01):
When we started, and I mentioned that we were
called the Fox Valley siblingsupport network, we didn't
really have a vision of becomingstatewide or nationwide, we were
we were focused on the needs ofour local community. We weren't
looking outside that. But as wemoved along, as we began to
(11:25):
collaborate with more and moreand can see the value in a
broader relationship withorganizations and siblings,
from, you know, beyond our smallcommunity. It, it just seemed
like a really good idea not onlyto connect our siblings with one
(11:47):
another physically in person,but helped connect siblings
together wherever they're from.
So when, when we were approachedby some of the organizers of
other states to come togetherand think about a national
(12:07):
effort, a national movement, weweren't even talking necessarily
about an organization, weweren't sure what we were
talking about, but reallyperpetuating a movement of
sibling awareness. I thoughtthis is fantastic, because
sibling awareness is is going tobe critical, not only for each
(12:29):
individual's life, but forpolicies for research for global
connection. So yes, we weredefinitely interested in getting
something bigger started. And asit turns out, the way that
(12:50):
sibling Leadership Network choseto grow was by state chapters.
So for us, that meant we neededto think a bit broader than our
small community, we needed tothink, statewide. And so we also
changed our name from Fox Valleysibling support network to
(13:13):
Wisconsin's so that we, wepresented ourselves as a
Wisconsin chapter.
Nikki Donnelly (13:22):
So why become involved with the SLN and I
think once once I got involvedwith California, I realized,
like the power of us siblingscoming together and for for
myself, just, wow, I learned somuch about myself. Like, there's
(13:46):
this whole community out therethat probably doesn't even
realize they need community.
Right. I never thought about itbefore, you know, so. So, yeah,
I think, really, I I'm just verypassionate about the mission of
the SLN and advancing that.
(14:07):
However it need be. And, youknow, the power of us all coming
together when I look at becauseI'm currently still on the board
for the National SLN and hearingthe updates and, you know, the
policy committee advocating forevery state to include siblings
(14:29):
in the Family Medical Leave Act,you know, and I'm happy to say
Oregon just passed a FamilyMedical Leave Act for the first
time and or the Oregon MedicalLeave Act. I'm not sure what
it's called. But the first thingI did was when I saw it was
(14:49):
proposed was pulled it up andyes, siblings are included. So
kudos to Oregon for includingsiblings. Not every state does
so You know that that's anexample of having that advocates
that collectively come together?
You know, and and you're, you'repulling from the the the
(15:11):
knowledge and the skills ofpeople from now across the
United States, rather than justfrom your community or your
state, you know, you can, it's,again, that power of
collaboration, right. That's thepower coming together. And and
I'm also co chair on theresearch committee right now.
(15:33):
And, and, you know, we'rebringing in researchers from
across the United States cometogether and, and collaborate on
what are the needs, what are thestudies, or even just compiling
all of the research together inthis nice document that, that we
(15:54):
have, so that other people thatare doing research can tap into
what what we have, you know, anduse us and for recruiting and so
forth. So, yeah, that now thenational reach even being in a
small southern Oregon, I knowthat I'm connected nationwide.
Harriet Redman (16:18):
And I think that's so critical. And one of
the reasons that I was hungryfor a national presence. My
experience in looking forresearch right away when, when
my son was diagnosed, I mean,there wasn't much and part of it
(16:38):
was It wasn't pulled together.
And, and yet, as I was fosteringthis new nonprofit, I, I didn't
have time to do all thatresearch and all that searching
for research. So I was hungryfor that national presence, that
national connection to, to dothat for us, and an end to
(17:03):
inform us as a part of a largernetwork. So it was the research
and as you said, the advocacythat even as a state
organization, we don't have thecapacity to do that. All by
ourselves, we really need thethe the force of a nation wide
(17:23):
organization, like the SLN.
Chris Berstler (17:30):
Why is it important to have a place for
sibs to get together?
Nikki Donnelly (17:34):
Oh, my gosh, I'm going to jump in on this one.
Because this is I'm so sopassionate about this. For me, I
can say myself, personally, Ikind of look at this twofold
because, you know, being in theprofession. And being a sibling,
(17:55):
is is has been a very wholesomeexperience for me, I guess. And
I, as a sibling, I have learnedway more about myself, then, I,
I would have never known thisabout myself, if I've been on
this journey of learning andunderstand myself and why I do
(18:19):
some things that I do. And manyof it is related to being a CIP.
You know, I, I point out thatprobably the biggest thing that
I've learned about myself inlearning about what it means to
be a sibling and in listeningto, you know, Don Myers, my
(18:40):
present his research and soforth at conferences, as I was
just getting involved, is Inever I prided myself on being
self sufficient. Right? And Inever, like, I never looked at
it from the perspective of like,I don't like to ask for help.
(19:02):
Right? Because, not that it wasever intentionally said to me,
but I think as a young child,now remind you, I'm 10 years
older than my brother. So I, Iwasn't young, you know, I, when
my brother was, was starting togo through assessments and
(19:23):
diagnosis when he was two orthree, I was 1213. So I was very
aware. But I also, I think, wasvery aware that it was very,
very taxing a time for myparents, right? And in what what
all they had, like him beingkicked out of preschools, and,
you know, just trying to managetheir work life balance that I
(19:46):
just kind of got this like, Oh,if I if I need something, it's a
burden for somebody else. Sonow, you know, I've learned to
navigate that through my life.
And so the power are for mepersonally and just
understanding myself has beenone of the the, the absolute
greatest gifts that siblingLeadership Network and has has
(20:11):
given to me. And I'm extremelythankful for and I in turn when
it gives that back to othersiblings,
Harriet Redman (20:21):
everyone needs to feel they belong. And that's
what I observe with withsiblings who find us. And we, we
have programs starting at agethree all the way through
adulthood. And when they findother siblings, and they find,
they may not even have thoughtof themselves as a sibling, or
(20:44):
as we say, or Wisconsin, or asaid, until they hear other
people start to describe theirexperiences. And then it dawns
on them, oh, I'm a sieve. Andlook at all these people around
me. They're okay. This is goingto be okay. And that feeling of
(21:07):
belonging and relating, and theyou said power, the reassurance.
The empowerment that offers isimmeasurable. And, and it might
be just a little flicker, itmight be just a little moment,
(21:28):
that makes a huge, hugedifference. Recently, we have a
new board member, and she wasseeking out information for her,
her nephew who is the brother ofa young boy with autism. And in
her journey to find us for him,she realized that she too, was a
(21:52):
sibling. And just, I wish youwere here to tell you how that
made her feel pretty empowered,pretty excited. And, and like, I
found something I didn't know Iwas looking for. And it feels
really good. I think anotherreason that it's important to
(22:12):
connect with other siblings Isthat you, you have someone to
reflect on someone to feed backthe way you see yourself,
though, the way as you weresaying before Nikki, to discover
yourself, discover yourstrengths, discover what role
you're playing, even to definethose roles is absolutely
(22:37):
important. And, and I, I dothink that as a parent, I am
able to help siblings reflectthat as well, because it's just
another perspective. And I'malso an advocate for siblings
that their voice within a familyneeds to be heard that parents
(23:01):
need to listen to those siblingsregardless of their age. And,
and understand them for theirroles and their perspectives.
for lots of reasons, includingthat they have the longest
relationship with their otherchild with a disability. That's
critical.
Chris Berstler (23:19):
In your opinion, what is the best thing about
your chapter and why should andhow can siblings in your area
get involved?
Nikki Donnelly (23:27):
I think right now with Oregon, we're, we're we
are just starting to bloomright. And so there's so we're
so open for ideas andopportunities. And, you know,
come Come be with us and bringyour idea and we're gonna help
(23:49):
help nourish it right to bringit into fruition. And so, yeah,
and as far as connecting withus, right now we're on
meetup.com and it's Oregonsibling Leadership Network and
we have a Facebook page. Oregonsibs. All one word.
Harriet Redman (24:13):
Since we've been operating for more than 25
years, we have, to some degree,reached our vision. And our
vision was to have programmingfor siblings of all ages. So one
of the exciting things about usis that we have programs
available from age three all theway through adulthood. For three
(24:37):
year olds, it's a program calledSIP sack and it's a tangible bag
of materials that reallyemphasize the relationship with
their sibling with disability,how much love there is in their
family for them as well as theirsibling with a disability using
(24:58):
the word disability and Andhelping parents through the
activity book for children hearand be open to communication
with their brother or with theirchild with you as a brother or
sister with a disability. So allthe way from age three through
childhood through teenagethrough adulthood, we emphasize
(25:21):
that, for adults, we haveprograms for helping them with
future preparation. We call itjourney forward. And, and now
the the, the main focus is,we've got these programs, now we
need to get them out further andfurther, throughout Wisconsin
(25:43):
and elsewhere to where we alwaysclaim that we don't care if you
live in Wisconsin, but if youlike Wisconsin, or you're a
Packer fan, or you drink beer,you can be a Wisconsin, that's
good with us. So we really arepretty open with that. But in
the process, we also want toreach each and every sibling we
(26:07):
can, here in Wisconsin andbeyond
Chris Berstler (26:11):
what current issues are unique to siblings in
your area?
Harriet Redman (26:15):
Well, I'll start and it's probably not news that
services, especially housing,caregiving, all of those
services are so difficult to toget for their brother or sister
with a disability. So and asthose systems and services are a
(26:44):
scant, those responsibilitiesthen come to the family. And
their parents are getting older,they're getting older, they're
busy. Those are all bigchallenges for our adult
siblings. And we recently did afuture planning program is
(27:06):
really Forward program as a liveworkshop. And the siblings
attending that were the youngestgroup of siblings ever, ever to
go through the program. So it'snot just older siblings that are
realizing the magnitude of it,the scarcity of Cisco Systems
(27:28):
and services, but the agingpopulation is is really becoming
much more evident. And it'shere, it's a it's a caregiving
crisis. It's a housing crisis.
And that's really concerning,not only adult siblings, but
even teenagers and, andchildren, young children
understand the, the, the weightof responsibility, that that
(27:53):
they either perceive, or theyknow they have,
Nikki Donnelly (28:03):
we're still learning about the needs in our
area. In fact, we are partneringwith California, we're putting a
research team together to kindof learn about just survey
siblings in California andOregon and, and we'll be open to
other states if anybody elsewants to join in for that. But I
can say, hey, you know, I'mreflecting on our little Oregon
(28:27):
startup board. We all havesiblings that are in different
states. And us we're Oregon isvery rural, as well, right.
Unless you're up in the veryNorth Portland area, you know,
we have little pockets of largertowns, but for the most part
where it's very, very rural. Soyeah, and and just learning and
(28:50):
understanding how to connectthat way. Thank goodness for
virtual sessions. Right. Butthen, you know, you hope, you
know, there's there's lots andlots of rural places in Oregon
that do not have internetaccess. Even that's a barrier.
So
Harriet Redman (29:07):
right, Wisconsin, too. Yeah. When we
were 10 years into our, ourjourney, our Wisconsin's
journey. When we were when wefelt we were ready to add adult
sibling programming. So we did aquite a number of focus groups
of adult sibs and professionalswho had, who were aware of
(29:32):
siblings that that were in thepicture. And they were concerned
about the quality of care fortheir brothers and sisters. And
while we didn't see in ourmission that that we we could
change the quality of care thattheir brothers and sisters were
getting. We did give siblings atool that other chapters could
(29:58):
could read. replicate. And thatis we give siblings an
opportunity to nominate qualitycaregivers, people who are
caring for their brothers andsisters, we call it the siblings
Choice Award. And we give it inNovember, which is national
family caregiver month, Ibelieve it's called. But it it
(30:19):
just gives siblings another toolto have a little power to
emphasize the importance ofquality care for people with
disabilities, because they docare about their brothers
sister, even if they don't wantto be, you know, they don't want
their sister illumine with them.
And their sister doesn't wantthat either, or whatever the
(30:42):
case is. They do care. And thisis one tool they have control on
they can acknowledge andrecognize and honor people who
are providing that care. Andit's small, and we don't there's
no cash prize or anything. It'ssmall, but it is it says to the
world. Similarly, as you'rewatching, they care about this
(31:06):
issue.
Chris Berstler (31:09):
Does your chapter have any upcoming events
are initiatives that you'relooking forward to?
Harriet Redman (31:15):
Well, we have a lot of stuff coming up because
of our lifespan of programming.
So September always means thatwe're kicking off CIP shops, and
we have those monthly for agessix to 12. Don't one of them is
with a conference. And we loveto do those where autism
conference might be taking placesome part of the state or we
(31:36):
have a circles of life, which isany diagnosis, we will provide
the sub shop at thoseconferences. So we have one of
those coming up in September aswell. We are we have started a
adult book club calledWisconsin's read. And so I
(31:57):
always look forward to thosethey they even though I'm not a
sibling, they, they graciouslylet me part of that. And it does
not matter what the book is, andand we don't pick books that are
necessarily about siblings. Butit does not matter what the book
subject is. The conversationalways ends up being a sibling
(32:19):
conversation. And it'swonderful, it is absolutely
wonderful. And anybody can jointhat. We will be meeting
September 20. I'm not sure wehave a book for this month. But
those are, those are fantastictoo. And we're also working on
putting our journey forwardprogram online, that will be a
(32:42):
few months down the road. ButI'm working on that. And I'm
looking forward to that.
Nikki Donnelly (32:48):
We have upcoming Oregon intro to sibs, it's
virtual. So we invite anybodyfrom everywhere, there's only
one slide that kind of talksabout statistics in Oregon. So
the rest of it is is pertinentto anybody. And that information
(33:08):
actually just went out in theSLN September newsletter, so but
it is Monday, September 25, at6pm. Pacific Time. And other
than that we are we have amental health professional that
we're partnering with and doingit's like a six week meeting one
(33:33):
time a week kind of workshop.
And so we're, we're before weput it out to public, we're
piloting it with board membersso that we can kind of fine tune
it and and it's for siblings toto really dive into those that
want to go deeper into to thismental health aspect of it. So
(33:55):
that'll be coming in the future.
Chris Berstler (34:00):
what advice or resources would you recommend to
any listeners out there who livein a state without an SLN
chapter?
Nikki Donnelly (34:09):
reach out to the SLN and start one yourself if if
you don't have the bandwidth todo that, because you know, it's
a task I'm still working on. Youknow, this is all currently kind
of self funded. So there's moneythat takes into like setting up
a Google Suite and you know,having a meetup site and so
(34:32):
forth. So if that's not in yourbandwidth, then connect with
another state. You know, andthen as as you grow, like maybe
people in your state that areconnected with another state,
then then it kind of you can youcan spread the love across more
(34:53):
people and you don't have to doit all on your own. I was very,
very fortunate when I moved toOregon and realize there was not
a chapter I reached out to theSLN. And I said, Hey, and they
said, Well, we actually hadthese couple people that have
shown interest in the past. Butagain, probably didn't
(35:14):
individually or whatever, youknow, hadn't been with the
growing of a chapter. And sowhen I reached out to them,
they're like, oh, we have thesecouple people, connect with
them. And then so it was, it wasnice that there may be people
already interested in yourstate. So if you reach out to
(35:34):
the SLN, they can, there theyhave their little tickler list.
And when I reached out, theythere, I was able to connect
already. So
Harriet Redman (35:42):
yeah, that's great advice. Nikki, we've done
that many times. Early on, andeven more recent, it's, it's fun
to find out what's going on inother states, but reaching out
to other SLN chapters, reachingout to anyone who may be
(36:04):
interested in supporting yourcause. And that that can mean
non sibs, that can mean parentsthat can mean professionals.
Just tell your story, just ifyou say it often enough, it's
always good to say that out loudand sort of therapeutic. But
also, you'll find people who areinterested in what you want to
(36:26):
see happen, have that visionready to talk about. And, and
don't be afraid to reach out topeople you didn't expect, that
would be interested. And don'tgive up. That's the other is,
there's all kinds of reasons tostop. But don't just keep going
(36:47):
and don't give yourself time bepatient. It doesn't happen
overnight. But when you'refeeling discouraged, you know,
given SLN chapter person a callor email, Nikki, myself, on the
other 27 states that have peoplewho are working on this, I'm
(37:08):
sure we'd be happy to give yousome encouragement.
Nikki Donnelly (37:12):
I want to also highlight don't forget
connecting with schools, youknow, because a lot of times,
it's special education. systemswithin schools are required to
have family component to it,right. So like we do intro to
sibs, for several schooldistricts that do parent
(37:35):
training workshops.
Harriet Redman (37:36):
And if a school is not open to you find another
school.
Nikki Donnelly (37:42):
My dream would be to have six shops as part of
you know, they have after schoolclubs and so forth, even at
elementary school, like my dreamwould be to have us at
elementary, you know, justanother after school club.
Right?
Chris Berstler (37:56):
That would have been nice growing up,
Nikki Donnelly (37:57):
right?
Yep, just the power and havingpeople in your community that
that can help you navigatethrough this this sieve life.
Harriet Redman (38:12):
And I like what you said Nikki to it. You don't
have to organize a whole bunchof stuff to seek out support.
That affirmation that you youcan get when you know one other
person who may be a sibling, ormay not. But siblings talking to
(38:35):
other siblings is so so much agift that if you are an
organizer, and you can make thatconnection happen. It's worth
every thing you did to make ithappen. All of the planning all
the all the thinking, and evenif it costs the money, it is
(38:58):
definitely worth it worth it.
That connection is so, soimportant.
Chris Berstler (39:04):
Awesome. This has been such an excellent
discussion. Thank you both somuch for taking the time to
share with us today. Anyresources that Harriet or Nikki
have discussed, will be in thedescription below. Yeah, thank
you both again, so much forbeing with us today. It's been
great.
Nikki Donnelly (39:22):
Thank you, Chris, for having us.
Harriet Redman (39:23):
It was fun.
Chris Berstler (39:25):
Find resources, tools and information about the
sibling experience on siblingleadership.org. The siblings
Leadership Network is anonprofit, and we rely on
support from our audience. Findthe donation button on our
homepage and contribute to theever growing sibling movement.
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