Is Microdosing the Missing Link in Your Spiritual Awakening?

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
All right, Karenes pop quiz. Oh boy, today's guest is
diving into a topic that we have never covered on
the show before. What I guess?

Speaker 2 (00:10):
No, you don't guess any more?

Speaker 1 (00:11):
Hint, Just show me a guess. So we've never covered before.

Speaker 2 (00:15):
That's the thing. Okay, Well, I always learned about things
we didn't know existed, So how can I guess?

Speaker 1 (00:19):
I'll give you a hint. It's not crystal grids. Okay, Yeah,
it's not galactic soul origins either. Okay, No, and no,
we're not decoding ancient Lemurian light coodes this week either.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
All right, those none of those were my guess.

Speaker 1 (00:34):
No, I'm shocked. All right, try this. What if something
is small as a speck of dust could open the
doors to emotional healing, spiritual alignment, and divine connection.

Speaker 2 (00:46):
Oh that's just reminded me of The Little Prince. Remember
that movie.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
It's actually a book that I used to love when
I was a kid. Yeah, yeah, well, okay, that would
be cool though. Okay, ready, here, here's a lot of
dust in the house. Well here's a bigger hint. Right,
it involves mush rooms. Okay, but not the kind you
sawtey with garlic.

Speaker 2 (01:03):
Okay, you know I didn't think.

Speaker 1 (01:06):
So we are finally talking about microducing tiny amounts of
psychedelics that can lead to big breakthroughs in healing, self discovery,
and maybe even less road rates during that pesky mercury
retrogade thing that comes on. Right, These are tiny doses
of earth grown psychedelics that are helping people remember who
they truly are.

Speaker 2 (01:26):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:27):
Yeah, our guest is the founder of microdosing for healing,
and she's built an entire global community to help people
ease into this powerful practice without the need for ty
die or starting a drum circle.

Speaker 2 (01:39):
Do you think they'd help you remember.

Speaker 1 (01:41):
To take the treash out? We can ask you that. Okay, guys,
get ready, because your spirit guides might just be whispering.

Speaker 2 (01:49):
It's time needs.

Speaker 1 (01:50):
To the skeptic and physicians starts now. My name is
Will and I'm Garen. Unlike Boulder and Scully, both want
to believe. So we've embarked in a journey of discovery.

Speaker 2 (02:00):
We've talked to people deeply entrenched in the spiritual and
metaphysical world.

Speaker 1 (02:03):
We've thrown ourselves into weird and wonderful experiences. I even
joined a coven.

Speaker 2 (02:07):
Of witches and wait, you joined a coven yep.

Speaker 1 (02:10):
All in the interest of finding something, anything, that will
prove that there's something beyond this physical.

Speaker 2 (02:15):
Three dimensional world we all live in.

Speaker 1 (02:17):
This is the skeptic metaphysicians. So picture this. You're cruising
to life, doing all the things, work, family, the occasional
attempt of a social life, and something feels off, like

(02:42):
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(03:49):
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(04:11):
and trust me, they are awesome. Hey there, I'm Will
and welcome back to an eye opening, mind expanding episode
of The Skeptic met Physicians. Today's guest is a trailblazer
in the conscious use of sacred plant medicine. Casey Garrett
is a founder of Microdosing for Healing, a global community

(04:34):
and immersive education platform dedicated to introducing the practice of
microdosing in an intentional, grounded, and heart centered way. We're
not talking about party drug here. Now. Since twenty twenty,
she's guided thousands of seekers, from curious beginners to spiritual
explorers through the powerful intersection of earth medicine, emotional healing,

(04:57):
and personal transformation. Through her community immersive programs and her podcast,
Casey helps demystify psychedelic practice and reconnect us to ancient
healing wisdom that's as relevant today as ever. So get
ready to journey inward because this conversation might just change
your perspective, one microdose at a time. Welcome to the show,

(05:18):
Casey Garrett. How you doing today.

Speaker 3 (05:19):
Oh, I'm so happy to be here. Thanks for having me.

Speaker 2 (05:22):
Well, we're happy to have you here.

Speaker 1 (05:23):
I'm especially excited because this is a topic that really
wanted to dive into for a long time, but we've
not had the opportunity. We've not found the right person
to talk through it with you. So with you on
the show now, we have the opportunity. Because truth be told,
we are clueless about this. Right. We know about silo sybon,
we know about adiahasca, we know about all that kind
of stuff, but microdosing is a world that we've been

(05:47):
curious about but scared about at the same time too. Right,
because we don't want a trip per se, but we've
heard so many great things about it, So can you
explain to us just what exactly are we talking about
when we see microdosing?

Speaker 3 (06:00):
Absolutely, and first of all, you are my people.

Speaker 1 (06:02):
I would you.

Speaker 3 (06:03):
Everybody I work with is like, do I have to trip?
I'm kind of curious and I'm drawn, but I'm afraid
to go on a psychedelic journey. So absolutely so. Microdosing
is the taking the small sub perceptual dose. It's usually
about one tenth the dose of what a high dose
journey would be. And so while you're going to feel

(06:25):
definite benefits and effects, you're not going to feel altered
and trippy in any way. That's the number one thing.
A lot of people I work with are like, I
am running a company, I have a bunch of kids.
I can't be off my game. Ever, I have to
be on all the time. With mushrooms, they realized they're
not off their game. They're actually more on their game

(06:48):
than they have ever been. So it's very much the
opposite of an alcohol experience that kind of dolls you
and takes you outside of yourself. Microdosing brings you back
more into yourself. And your instinct.

Speaker 1 (07:00):
So you're not losing control at all, like with alcohol
or any other type of drug. It's actually giving you
more control. Yes, because you're more connected.

Speaker 3 (07:10):
You're more connected, you're more intuitive, you're more articulate, you're
more focused, you're almost better at most things.

Speaker 2 (07:17):
So you're not having any of that like throwing up
and just blacking out or anything like that.

Speaker 3 (07:22):
No, no hangover the next day, Nope. Okay, most people,
the vast majority I have worked with, had stopped drinking
some altogether.

Speaker 1 (07:32):
Oh why, I mean, because I didn't need it to
sound like that. That sounded really weird. That's not a
bad noe. I'm just saying that true. Like we when
we go out for a drink, it's a social thing.
How would microdosing replace that?

Speaker 3 (07:45):
Great question? As soon as I started during twenty twenty
twenty twenty one, it was I was in California at
the time. We were locked down for ages. There a
lot of people in my initial groups were coming with
the intention they said, you know, I have been kind
of hitting the wine a little too hard here in lockdown.
What they found was when they started microdocing a few

(08:06):
weeks months later, they would go, Wow, I haven't had
a drink like I just kind of stopped effortlessly drinking,
or they moved from drinking four or five times a
week to once or twice a month when they went
out to dinner to enjoy a great meal or special occasion,
they didn't need the social lubricant of alcohol. They didn't
need the relaxation and the sedation of alcohol, nor did

(08:29):
they need the escape as much anymore. So you can
drink absolutely, but I find now that I've witnessed so
many people, I think what happens is mushrooms have a
very high bright resonance. People practice, they get lighter, they
get more radiant, they look younger, they feel better, and
it's this cascading effects you. I'll take the blocks that

(08:58):
reaction a lot, and alcohol is actually really aging. It's
very dense. It kind of brings you down. It feels
good at the time, but a lot of people find
as they get back in touch with their body and
their own energy. And I'll have drink of lass of
wine once in a while because I love wine, but
I'll feel it in my body for the next few days,
so I still love it once in a while. But

(09:20):
to drink several times a week. A lot of people
find that they just let it go very easily.

Speaker 2 (09:25):
So now are they replacing the alcohol with the microdosing
or is it just your microdose for a little while
and then stop and never really care for alcoholic.

Speaker 3 (09:34):
Yeah, well, it's interesting they lose, it's just kind of effortless.
But when there is a friction. Alcohol was such a
part of their social life. It's so strange to be
out in a dinner cocktail party and walk around with
my sparkling water. They don't find the need to have
a social lubricant anymore. The social conditioning of dating and
not drinking or going to the drinking exactly.

Speaker 1 (09:56):
Why you're not drinking exactly alcohol.

Speaker 2 (09:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (09:59):
In fact, minds me. When we first met, you were
on a new alcohol kick for a while. Oh and
I was like, oh, red flag, red flag.

Speaker 2 (10:09):
That's funny, isn't it.

Speaker 1 (10:10):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (10:11):
So, but I guess what I'm asking is, is alcohol
replaced with mushrooms? Do you have to continually do the microdosing?

Speaker 3 (10:18):
Great question. Yes, this is another big thing that it's
very mind bending for people to get their head arounds
because we're so steeped in pharmaceutical culture. A lot of
people think that if they're odd medications on their microdoceine
to say, going off their antidepressants and then in the
micro dose instead. It bends people's minds because the goal

(10:40):
of microdocene is to not need to microdose anymore. You
only do it for as long as you feel is appropriate.
But when you stop microdocene, you don't give up all
of the benefits that you gained. For example, I had
a grandma seize your disorder that I had since I
was a kid. I was medicated for it. Heavy pharmaceuticals

(11:01):
never quite got at what was underneath, you know. They
never really diagnosed me, if anything, and I did a
lot of different healing modalities of my life, but they
never completely went away. When I started micro dosing mushrooms,
they stopped immediately and I've never had one since. And
after a while, when I decided to stop micro dosne,
I was really curious if they would come back, and

(11:24):
they never did.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
They never came back.

Speaker 3 (11:25):
Oh, and so micro dosing, it's not the mushrooms that
are doing something to you. The mushrooms are tapping into
your innate healing potential, helping you reset your nervous system
and so a whole host of symptoms heal and you
don't need to keep relying on the mushrooms to maintain.

Speaker 1 (11:44):
Did you do it every day? You microdosed every day
for how long?

Speaker 3 (11:47):
Yes? When I was first starting out, I didn't know
anybody that was doing it other than the person that
introduced me to it, and so we were just kind
of linging it. There was one book that mentioned it briefly,
oh On, doctor James Fadoman and mentioned it in his
book Psychedelic Explorers Died. There was a little bit about microdoscene.
I was practicing five days a week, so I would
dose five days a week and take two days off.

(12:09):
And so that's a really common one for our community.
Typically starts at for four or five days a week
dosing when they first start out.

Speaker 2 (12:15):
Gotcha, And then for how many weeks would you say
you did it?

Speaker 3 (12:19):
We start for six weeks. And it's interesting, like some
people have so many benefits come in the first six
weeks that have an amazing, incredible transformative experience in the
first six weeks. Other people it takes longer, and it'll
take three to four months to get connected with the
medicine field. Benefits that's about the standard, and we reassessed,

(12:40):
take a break and see if they want to continue
or not.

Speaker 1 (12:42):
So we're not talking years, we're talking months. That's amazing.

Speaker 2 (12:46):
Oh wow. So you talk about how it taps you
into your own healing. Could this help with symptoms of
perimenopause or menopause?

Speaker 3 (12:56):
That is the most popular question right now. I need
that so many times a week because so many women
are talking about it more. You know, it's very in
right now, and more people feel comfortable talking about it,
and so they're coming and saying, I'm having all of
these symptoms. What is hormones and what can mushrooms help?
Where do I need hormone therapy? And where can mushrooms help.

(13:18):
So there's a whole host of things, particularly mood and inflammation.
We can get a lot of weird inflammation in perimenopause
like muscle aches, frozen shoulder body aches, chronic fatigue that
mushrooms can support a lot, and also mood swings.

Speaker 2 (13:35):
Mood swings too, the meds aren't that's the that's the
only thing that my friend No complained about that mood. So,
but everything else.

Speaker 1 (13:42):
Right, body ache, fatigue, muscle.

Speaker 2 (13:44):
Aches and aside I think the reason it's so popular
now it's because the women that are currently going through
gen xers and we were loud, still loud now, I.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
Was just gonna say, still loud. I don't have fomo
at all. So let's talk about men's stuff like perfect example,
if a man has prostate is shoes asking for a friend, right,
could something like this be a benefit to the high
blood pressure? Things like that.

Speaker 3 (14:10):
I would say the number one thing I hear from
men is men sleep better. That's the big one because.

Speaker 2 (14:17):
A lot of as your friend, right.

Speaker 3 (14:20):
Friend, a lot of men don't feel anxiety the way
women feel anxiety. It just manifest differently. For a lot
of men. They're very anxious, but they're not aware of
it because it comes out in their sleep. They can't
get deep sleep, rim sleep, they don't dream, and they're
also waking up through the night. When you start microdosing,
it resets your nervous system. All of a sudden, they're like,

(14:41):
oh my god, I slept more than seven hours. I'm
having dreams. A lot of men are just really stoked
to sleep again, and they getting fascinated by the fact
that they're dreaming again for the first time since they
were kids.

Speaker 1 (14:52):
I would love to say, and I feel the anxiety
when I wake up. I wake up all ten stop
from the anxiety. Things like that, getting closer.

Speaker 2 (14:59):
To being you know, on board, you know the saying,
if something sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
Are there any negative side effects or things that would
be able to turn for someone who's interested in trying this.

Speaker 3 (15:11):
That's a great question, And the benefits are so broad.
Who has this not worth? The main contraindication I have
seen is if somebody is pinned at the top of
their emotional spectrum. For example, they just lost a loved
one and they're in deep grief, or a spouse just
left them and they're in a peak phase of emotionality.

(15:35):
Sometimes mushrooms can bring things up that are ready to
be healed in a powerful way. We have to make
sure we're resourced and have the network and support to
handle the uprise and emotional capacity. If someone is kind
of in the throes of deep grief, I'll oftentimes start
with breath work, start with meditation, start with yoga, start

(15:57):
with just getting out in the morning sun, connecting with nature.
And then once you're kind of in a place where
you can hold emotion again, then we'll start microdosing. It's
really people's ability to feel is one of the gauges.

Speaker 2 (16:13):
This would be something we should never do together at
the same time because we are both so emotional feeling people.
If anything goes.

Speaker 1 (16:20):
Awry, it might actually be good, uh, send our daughter
to camp.

Speaker 3 (16:23):
It's actually most uncomfortable for people who can't feel very,
very repressed because they don't know, like they've never really
allowed themselves to cry, They've never really allowed themselves to
feel discomfort or anger. People who are very emotional are
actually kind of better at it. Because you're fluent, you're emotional.

Speaker 1 (16:41):
We would be genius level genius. All right, Well, I
do want to dive into the spiritual aspects of it.
But before we do that, one more question that I have,
because again I have a friend who would be very
interested in this answer. If someone's taking medications currently, is
there anything that would prevent that person from microdosing while

(17:01):
they're on the medication. We need to take a quick pause,
but we'll be right back right off to these messages.
Hey there. Before we get to the interview, we have
a small ask. We know that there are tons of
options out there, and having you decide to come along
on our journey of discovery. That's an absolute honor for us.

(17:24):
But if you know someone who would benefit from hearing
the messages that we are sharing on the show, why
don't you do them in us a favor and share
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forward this episode to that person. That's it, just a
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(17:44):
help get the word out about us, but it also
might just change someone's life for the better. Hey, thanks
to your help on this. Without further ado, let's get
out to the interview. If someone's taking medications currently, is
there anything that would prevent that person from microdocing while
they're on the medication?

Speaker 3 (18:05):
Sometimes okay the answer yes. So pharmaceuticals are not impossible,
but they're another wriggle and a variable. We've had tons
of experience. We've always had people in our community on
different pharmaceuticals, and we have professional support in our community
and pharmacists trained both in Western pharma and psychedelics. I'd
love to give a shout out to my colleague Christen

(18:26):
Spear she's a pharmacologist. She's amazing, and she just created
this amazing tool that people can go in and put
their medications and supplements, cross check it with psilocybin, and
get a report for a few bucks. It's kind of
a self self help kind of thing. And that's as
Psychedelic Interaction dot com.

Speaker 2 (18:45):
That's fantastic.

Speaker 1 (18:45):
Great, that's great, okay, because that was a big question
of mine because my friend is on a lot of
medication and you just never know, right, So I'm interesting
to find out how that works. So let's dive into
the spiritual. This is the skeptic when physician's after in
the show. A lot of people know about psilocybin as
a way to broaden their spiritual growth. How does microdosing

(19:06):
compare to taking a goddess level type of dose, for example.

Speaker 3 (19:11):
It's all a continuum in my experience. So a lot
of people who are familiar with psychedelic journeys, who were
kind of the first wave of psychedelics back in the
fifties and sixties, there wasn't a such thing as microdosin, right,
But if we dial back to antiquity, if we dial
back to indigenous cultures, they all had a form of

(19:33):
microdosine in the form of purification processes to get to
the high dose experience. They had a write of passage
to go with that. We're just lacking that in our culture,
especially in America. We want to go big right from
the start. So microdosing really serves as this beautiful introduction

(19:53):
to connecting with the medicine. It's really gentle, it's soft,
but you can start to understand how the medicine is
to speak to you and how spirit is going to
speak to you. The spirit of the medicine. For example,
some people are very mental people. They'll automatically notice shifts
in their thinking. They're like, I'm just connecting the dots more.
I'm seeing things from a different perspective. I'm having beautiful

(20:16):
ideas that I didn't expect other people. It's very somatic,
and the medicine works through their body and really expands
their body as a lot of physical health and healing
other people, it's very spiritual and mystical from the start.
They'll start microdocne and nature just comes alive. There's birds
landing near them, their pets can't get enough of them.
The animal world just doesn't seem to have fear for

(20:38):
them anymore, and so it's really fascinating to hold space
for as social groups of people because the medicine is
so unique to each person. It gives me science and
clues and ultimately how the medicine is going to work
with them in a high dose experience, are they going
to have a really mystical experience or is it going
to be a more somatic, physical experience.

Speaker 1 (21:00):
You would then recommend beginning microdocene with an eye towards
taking a full journey at some point in the future,
because that's what's going to really open up your spiritual world,
is that higher dosage. So this prepares you for that
imminent journey.

Speaker 3 (21:15):
Some people just microdose and nu's enough for them. I
work with a lot of people who are clairboyance and psychics,
and they're already really open. They have had meditation practices
for forty years. They can really go pretty far with
just micro docene. But even skeptics and people who never
thought they would do a journey, after they microdose for
a while, they'd come to trust the experience and they're drawn.

(21:39):
That was totally me. I thought I would never do
a psychedelic journey, but after I had such a beautiful
strength with micro docene. I was like, all right, maybe
a little higher, maybe a little higher, right, And that
was when I had big spiritual expansions. Was when I
started to work at higher levels.

Speaker 1 (21:55):
Gotcha, only experience with silas ibin was in college. And
you know those trips. That's not really meant for spiritual expansion.
That's meant for, like I mentioned earlier, the party drug,
and I puked my guts out. So is there a
way to do this?

Speaker 3 (22:10):
Without great question? Most people get nauseous due to the
kitan in the mushroom. Some people lack a digestive enzyme
that can break down the mushroom to get to the psilocybin.
For people who get really nauseous from the kite, you
can use a different formulation or a finished medicine, like

(22:32):
a chocolate or a shoe.

Speaker 1 (22:34):
They have chocolate mushrooms.

Speaker 3 (22:36):
Now, oh, they have mushroom everything.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (22:39):
Well, I mean, so we've had mushroom tea, but it's
not the magic mushroom tight It was like lions tail, right,
And you could.

Speaker 3 (22:47):
Take psilocybin into tea.

Speaker 1 (22:48):
Also, because I think we put it on a pizza
and ate.

Speaker 3 (22:51):
The pizza as you do in college, right exactly.

Speaker 1 (22:54):
I think a friend of mine actually took it out
of the bag and just start chewing it. And I
tried it. It was a pungent taste. It was really difficult.
So we put on pizzas just you have to taste it.
I mean, I heard that's what people do. I would
never do anything illegal, absolutely not. That brings up a question,
was my next question. Yes, go ahead.

Speaker 2 (23:10):
So the legality of it? Is this something that is
it legal? Is microdosing legal? Is going on a bigger
spiritual journey with the full dosing legal?

Speaker 3 (23:23):
It depends where you are, which is so human of
us to draw little lines on the earth and go
you could do it here, you can't do it here,
and you could do it here. A couple of states,
Colorado and Oregon, have passed legislation statewide. It is legal
through legalized models and decriminalized other cities around the country.

(23:45):
It's happening. It's very mushroomy actually, the way it's happening.
It's really hard to keep up with because different cities
across the country are decriminalizing, but for the most part,
it is still illegal. Unfortunately, laws that were never relevant
in the first place, So as classified as a Schedule
one drug, even though it meets none of the criteria
to be a Schedule one. It was very It was Nixon.

Speaker 1 (24:08):
I was just going to say it was back in
the Nixon administration that trying to control those hippies. Yeah,
we've had a conversation with someone that came on to
talk about MDMA. We got a lot of educate, a
lot of knowledge from that conversation. So I assume it's
similar to this. But we are sitting in the state
where it is not currently legal anywhere. Are we out

(24:29):
of luck or is there any way that we can
bend the rules a little bit?

Speaker 3 (24:33):
Yeah. People, at the end of the day, it's you
and a relationship. How you approach it. It's your medicine, it's
your spirit It's religion for some people. I mean for me,
it truly is a is a spiritual sacrament intricately linked
to my spiritual practice. So there are some religious protections.
There are churches bringing up some of them are kind

(24:55):
of open source affiliations where you can hold dear practice
underneath a divine sacrament and spiritual practice. So that's one
avenue that people like I live in Florida. There are
churches that have set up to practice with mushrooms or
ayahuasca in a church setting. When I first started, we

(25:16):
taught people to grow mushrooms at home. In almost every state,
I think forty eight out of the fifty states, you
can buy it cultivation kits, and then you buy spores separately.
And there's only two states in the country where you
can't legally buy psilocybin spores, which is interesting. I'm curious,
says are Louisiana.

Speaker 4 (25:37):
I believe yep, okay, right, yes, so it's possible to grow,
especially for microdocing, once you get the hang of cultivation
at home.

Speaker 3 (25:48):
No, it's not legal in most of the countries, but
it's personal use. There are some religious protections and hopefully
is changing soon. One step forward, two steps back, three
steps forward, and so hopefully soon people will recognize the values.

Speaker 1 (26:03):
And in large part this type of what we're talking
about is microdosing. Right, The amount of medicine that is
involved in microdosing is pretty decriminalized in almost everywhere because
it is such a low dosage or my just wishful thinking.

Speaker 3 (26:19):
Yes, I know, hundreds of guides all over the country
and we're all at this point and the only time
we've ever heard of someone getting in trouble it was
almost by accident. It was like they were growing their
mushrooms and there was a fire at their house when
they were away, and the fire department was like, what
is this?

Speaker 2 (26:36):
What it is?

Speaker 3 (26:37):
Most of this law enforcement is not going out trying
to criminalize people, especially for their own healing and their
own spiritual practice. I think it's just people are far
ahead of where the law is and we're in such
a strange place right now, especially here in the US.
So when we're talking about microdosing, how much is it?
Like is it like half a mushroom? I'm just curious, like,

(27:00):
what does that look like? How much does that look like?
It's small When people are starting out, if they're growing
their own you get a little scale, you know, you
dry them, dehydrate the mushrooms, and then I have a scale.
But there's a lot of medicine makers now out there
that you have websites, they have religious protections, they have
memberships where you can access safe sourcing online and have

(27:20):
it shipped to you pre doosed, so that way, when
you're first starting out, you're not chopping and guessing. Sometimes
people are like I nibble, and I'm like, don't nibble.
Most people, I find the microdosing range in terms of
the mushroom itself, it's usually between one hundred and one
hundred and fifty milligrams is a general starting point. I

(27:41):
work with a lot of people that tend to be
pretty open, who are kind of very spiritual people, creative people.
I work with a lot of artists, and they tend
to need a much lower dose. A lot of our
community starts at like fifty milligrams or one hundred milligrams.

Speaker 1 (27:54):
Okay, And when you say predose or whatever is it,
they ship out like a pill or something.

Speaker 3 (28:00):
Like that, usually in the form of capsules, just because
it's easy to grow your own mushrooms, and then they
dehydrate them and grind them up and put them into capsules.
Capsules are very common. But there's also tinctures. There's chocolate,
there's gummies, there's tablets. Yeah, it depends on the medicine maker.

Speaker 2 (28:19):
I like tinctures. That just sounds cool. You feel like
there's like a dropper bottle and a pestel.

Speaker 1 (28:24):
In fact, the last time I did a trip in college,
we would say the word tincture a lot. I think
it's fun to say.

Speaker 2 (28:30):
It gives us aura tink shit little models.

Speaker 1 (28:34):
This sounds kind of exciting because it seems like an
interesting way to dip your toe into this kind of thing.
Right I'm not really interested in tripping unless it's in
a very controlled environment and it's for a very spiritual reason.
All the benefits that you're talking about are exciting to
me because not only does it give you help benefits,

(28:56):
but also the spiritual aspect, which is what I'm most
focused on right now. It's kind of a cool entry
way into something. And there are people out there who
believe this kind of thing is a crutch, that spirituality
should come from within and only within. There's no need
to bring anything into make that move any faster. What

(29:17):
would you say to those folks that believe that this
was just a crutch.

Speaker 3 (29:22):
I love that question because it comes up both in
the scientific community and among psychiatrists and psychologists. They're like,
is this a shortcut? We should need something outside of ourselves.
In the religious community that just published a fantastic piece
by Michael Pollen around psilocybin experiences, they brought together a

(29:44):
bunch of pastors and rabbis and had them trip.

Speaker 1 (29:47):
Get out of here, or I want to be in
that room watching.

Speaker 3 (29:53):
It was just published very recently, in the last few days,
and it was incredible to read, and it kind of
shifted their I said about practice is very spiritual and
very religious and originally back in the day, there's great
evidence now that psychedelics were part of Christianity. It was

(30:14):
the original sacrament.

Speaker 1 (30:16):
I mean, how else is mosic going to see? I'm
burning bush for God's sakes.

Speaker 3 (30:22):
But it kind of eliminates the middle man of our
church structure because it is all about your divine connection
with source within yourself. It's the sacrament that helps you
access that. A lot of people as they developed spiritually
in my program, you come to realize your guides, your angels,
whatever your connection is, it was there all along, and

(30:44):
it was your own fear often your own fear, your
own grief, your own trauma that kept you from hearing
it and connecting to it. As you work through and
release a lot of the fear and density, you realize
it was there all along. It's just a stronger connection now, gotcha.

Speaker 2 (31:00):
Oh, I have a question, how long does this stay
in your system, in your I don't know blood you're
in Like people that work can get random drug tests.
How does it work?

Speaker 3 (31:16):
Great question. I've worked with a lot of people who
work for the government, so they want to know this question.
It's fifteen hours. It's what the pharmacists have told me.
Whether it's a microdose or a hydros journey. Psilocybin clears
from your body very quickly and it doesn't get retained
in your hair or skin.

Speaker 1 (31:35):
Awesome, all right, So I have heard it, say so
first of me. Back up, I've heard a couple of
different things, and I'll address each one separately. First, I've
heard that human beings have more in common with fungi
than almost any other.

Speaker 2 (31:53):
Entity or a fungus among us.

Speaker 1 (31:55):
So I would assume that there's some sort of brethren
there that connects us in therefore makes it a little
bit more of a connective tissue that makes it better
for us to do this kind. I'm trying to convince
Karen right now, So just help me here.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
I've never heard. I've heard pigs. They have a lot
of kind of pigs. I'm not where we have a
lot of some.

Speaker 1 (32:12):
People do they just say around what have you heard
about that truth?

Speaker 3 (32:16):
Yeah, fink, I are amazing. They're so much older than us.
They've lived through five extinction events and carry this wisdom
on a cellular level across time. I think they're coming
back in this moment because they know we need a
little help. Right right, we're kind of in an evolutionary

(32:37):
moment right now where we're kind of going, we're branching
off and becoming the next iteration of humans. Paul Stammet's
one of the most famous mycologists who's kind of been
beating the dram up psilocybin for a very long time
on his own for a long time. He calls psilicydein
Einstein molecule, because it really does make you smarter. It

(32:58):
makes you better and in every way physically better. Your
instincts get dialed up, your reflexes improve, but also you're smarter,
and you're more empathetic, wow, and emotionally fluent. These are
all the qualities that humans really need.

Speaker 2 (33:15):
And the little lower thing.

Speaker 3 (33:20):
Tinctures and serums.

Speaker 2 (33:22):
Guys, I've been waiting that. I just took it longer
than I thought.

Speaker 1 (33:26):
I didn't want to interrupt her. So then my second
point is I've heard that microdosing, and I think you
kind of alluded to it earlier on where it connects
you more. It makes you feel more grounded, more centered.
It gets you more in step with who you truly are.
I know a lot of people, me included, have a

(33:48):
little bit of a social anxiety disorder type of thing
happening where I'm very gregarious, I'm very outgoing, but there
are times when I feel like, right, is this something
that could help you in that scenario?

Speaker 3 (34:01):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (34:02):
Absolutely, this is like a magic thing. I have to think, Yes,
it's a magic pill.

Speaker 3 (34:07):
Anxiety is an interesting one when I'm talking to people
for the first time and I'm asking what brings them.
Almost always when people say, I ask people, when you
get out of balance, which way do you go? Do
you get sad and inward and kind of isolate yourself
overeat binge on Netflix like is that you?

Speaker 1 (34:26):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (34:26):
In those cases, mushrooms are almost always supportive when you
tend to go inward with anxiety, if you get out
of balance and you kind of express outward. It depends
on the anxieties. For example, people who tend to lash
out at others road ragers, as people tend to not

(34:46):
It's interesting mushrooms don't talk to them as much, which
is really interesting to witness right, because it's like spirit
always has the last a right. So with anxiety, I
notice for certain things like anxiety, public speakers people who
speak on a lot of stages and they're like, I've
done this my whole life and I still am so
nervous and anxious every single time. It's really good for

(35:10):
social anxiety stage right, public speaking. It's also really good
for specific anxiety. I've had people who can't drive on
freeways because they get so anxious driving when it's like
heavy traffic, or they have to drive in a city.
They find themselves driving fine. They don't have bad anxiety.

Speaker 1 (35:27):
Bridge user and that the must speak of anybody or anything.

Speaker 3 (35:30):
But yes, the healing happens because underlying that is nervous
system dysregulation. When you regulate your nervous systm Paul Stammet's
who I just mentioned, is a great example of this.
He had extreme stutter when he was a kid, and
he found as a kid, he was like it would
get worse every time it was like a girl I
was interested in talking to you, it would get way worse.

(35:53):
And he did a high dose psilocybin journey when he
was a teenager and his stutter cleared. Wow. Years He
was like, mushrooms healed my stutter. But then he came
to realize that mushrooms didn't heal it stutter. Mushrooms healed
his underlying anxiety which was causing the stutter.

Speaker 1 (36:12):
What about meditation does it help deepen meditation? Hey there,
it's Will just stepping in here for a second to
ask you for a favor. See, the main reason we
do this show is to help others in their spiritual awakening,
and nothing makes us happier than to hear or read
messages from those that are resonating with the messages we're
sharing on the show. So if you have a moment,

(36:33):
we'd love for you to contribute to the show by
heading to Skepticmanaphysician dot com and sending us a voicemail
or an email from our website, or if you prefer,
we love for you to leave us a review on
Apple Podcasts or any other podcasting platform that supports them.
Karen and I love hearing from those that are moved
to message us. It truly does fuel our passion. You

(36:58):
are the reason we do this show, and knowing what
you like and don't like, that's going to help us
craft the very best show we can so that we
can help raise the vibration of the planet together.

Speaker 3 (37:11):
A lot of people who are regular meditators find themselves
getting to a new place in their meditation and they
can drop in more quickly.

Speaker 1 (37:18):
Oh, I think the only question I have left now?
Do you have a friends and family discount? Because we're
friends now right? No, it sounds incredible. How is it
that this is not more widely known.

Speaker 2 (37:33):
Because Big Pharma doesn't want us to heal all the
way so they can keep selling medicines.

Speaker 1 (37:38):
Maybe we can have the excellent.

Speaker 2 (37:41):
That's just my two cents.

Speaker 3 (37:42):
I mean, just a few days ago, I, along with
fifty of my colleagues were shut down and banned on
Instagram for exactly the reason you just shared. There's so
much positive benefit, there's so much healing. People are really
starting to learn about this work and how excessible it is,
and just a few days ago we all got shut down.

Speaker 1 (38:05):
Wow. Oh, we don't want to be on Instagram anyway.

Speaker 3 (38:10):
We're just like mushrooms though, we just pop up.

Speaker 1 (38:13):
As long as it's moist warm.

Speaker 3 (38:15):
Right.

Speaker 1 (38:15):
Not long ago, I went to a mushroom farm for
the first time. They were SHUTALKI mushrooms. It was astounding,
the sheer will to survive, the will to come. I mean,
there was rows upon rods. They were doing them on
cedar wood logs. It wasn't in the ground. I think
I kind of expected when someone said, Okay, you're gonna
do a shoot at a mushroom farm, I thought we're
gonna be digging through the dirt like truffles and things

(38:36):
like that. But no, it was a greenhouse and it
was rolled upon row of these logs, and there was
like dozens of mushrooms growing out of these logs. It
was astounding and gorgeous. And then they gave us a
whole bushel of them and they were amazing, so good.
They were so clean, because you know when you buy
them at the store, you gotta wipe off the dirt

(38:56):
from the mushrooms. These were completely clean. Well, it's l
J mushroom to look up leja E L l I
J A I Y mushrooms and Georgia. They're amazing. I'll
send it to him to see what you say.

Speaker 3 (39:08):
I love it so much. One of the things we're
jamming on a lot. So I have a professional group
of micro dosing guides. There's forty of us center from
all over the world who do this work as micro
doosing guides. Lately, we've been really excited about combining different
functional mushrooms with psilocybin in stacking. What I think is
going to happen in the future is we're going to

(39:28):
start pairing different mushrooms for different health conditions. For example,
I credit my seizure's healing because I stacked psilocybin with
Lion's main.

Speaker 1 (39:36):
Got it.

Speaker 3 (39:37):
Anybody that has a nervous system condition, migraine, headaches, TBI, stroke, recovery, concussion,
anything underlying nervous system, Lion's maine and psilocybin together is beautiful.
But there's so many other functional mushrooms like turkey tail
and cortis aps chaga rachi that when you stack them
together they amplify in it.

Speaker 2 (39:57):
And they're using mushrooms in Japan to to work with cancer.

Speaker 1 (40:01):
Turkey tales specifically, right, that's right, Yeah, it was.

Speaker 2 (40:03):
A different one, but Turkey Tale, yes, but that's not
the one, gotcha. That's the mosk going on.

Speaker 1 (40:07):
So a little bit out of the norm question. But
let's say someone has a physiological something. Would microdosing help
a tumor or something like that. Would a psilocybin or
micro dosing have any effect on something like that.

Speaker 3 (40:22):
They have done testing on turkey tail. A turkey tail
has had a positive impact on tumor cessation and shrinking tumors.
I don't know that they've tested psilocybin on tumors specifically yet.
There's so much research going on right now, which is
amazing and hopefully it will continue. But they have done
research on psilocybin therapy for cancer patients. And I've worked

(40:47):
with people moving through a cancer journey with micro dosing
as well. They find it really supportive all along the
arc because it shifts your perspective and you can hold
your diagnosis much differently than you were.

Speaker 1 (41:01):
Wow, this is incredible stuff. I know that you help
people go through these kinds of things. So if someone
wanted to do that, when is the journey? Is it
an app they download or do you reach out to
them on a phone call or how does it work?

Speaker 3 (41:14):
Yeah? So our community, we have a global community with
over thirty countries. People can come in and it's really accessible.
We just structure it like a membership, so it's like
a microticing membership, and so people can come. They get
access to safe sourcing, professional resources, and we come together
two or three times a month for live coaching calls.
Myself and the guides in our community are there to
answer questions that people have and support them, provide them

(41:37):
with resources. Then if they want to go deeper, we
all host like six week programs and different niche programs
for different things. And then I also have a training
program to start training other people who want to do
this work too as a profession for the first time.
We're starting at this summer. That's a different access points folks.

Speaker 1 (41:56):
And do you provide the microdose tablets to the folks
that are.

Speaker 3 (41:59):
Met We don't because that's how we're able to be
so public about what we do. The medicine makers and
the cultivators tend to stay separate and do things separately.
Some of them have religious protections that enable them to
source people within the US. We have a dedicated partner
who sources them. That way, give them the resources they need.

Speaker 1 (42:21):
Should be able to refer someone to someone or something
like that. Okay, exactly got it. That makes perfect sence.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
Yeah. Absolutely, What have we.

Speaker 1 (42:28):
Not talked about, Casey that you want to make sure
that the audience really truly gets from this conversation just.

Speaker 3 (42:34):
How much is possible? I think what has been so
eye opening for people once they start practicing is so
much of our Western medical system has been fixing things
that are wrong and making things manageable. We've kind of
operated from that perspective. It's not about not drinking, being sober.

(42:55):
It's not really about thriving. It's about not drinking for
a lot of people, just managing pain, managing depression. But
once people start microdosing, it shifts you. There is so
much more that's possible for my life to not just
be less depressed. I can actually thrive in this life,
and I can wake up feeling good and inspired and

(43:16):
vibrant every day, which is so different than the mindset
that we've been conditioned to believe.

Speaker 1 (43:22):
Now, for those that might still have a little bit
of fear left in them, is there any reason whatsoever
to be afraid of this?

Speaker 3 (43:31):
No, there's not, and it takes education and comfort. I
always invite people. It's very very common in our community
that people just go. It just keeps coming to me,
Like I just see mushrooms everywhere and I'm having dreams
about them, and I go to the mall and they're
like in the window, and I'm just like, it might
be time. And so usually people are It's funny, like

(43:54):
they call you to it and you come across it,
and then looking back, it's like, oh, they found me
right at the right time time, Like my life was
about to go through this massive change that happens all
the time and you needed the support. You just didn't
know it at the time. And so it's one of
those things that people get called and they come to
it at the right time. It's not a practice that

(44:15):
although I wish I could convince certain people in our
government right now use pleasure rooms. It really thrives and
works best when people connect individually and are called to it.
So I always invite people to just learn, but you
don't have to start practicing. Come into our community and listen,
listen to the experience and learn. People who had a

(44:36):
lot of fear or wanted to wait after a call
or two, just hearing what's possible, and the experience is
so different than what they thought it was going to
be Most people get really comfortable and ask the same
question that you asked it, which is why has this
been hidden from us for so long?

Speaker 1 (44:53):
Is there any way to overdose on this stuff? No,
there's no way to overdose.

Speaker 3 (44:58):
No, they've tried, they've tested. Yeah. Actually, psilocybin was ranked
they ranked as a professor in the UK ranked like
the world's most safest drugs possible. And although I don't
like classifying mushrooms as a drug, in this case it
was like, yeah, the fourth safest drug that was There
was literally no way to overdose. It's kind of like

(45:20):
eating too many oranges.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
Wow, it's probably better than aspirin this time in this
way because aspirin will actually mess you.

Speaker 3 (45:26):
Up in terms of side effects.

Speaker 2 (45:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:30):
Absolutely. And what was the other question that came up
to me when we're asking that overdose saying, oh, is
it habit for me?

Speaker 3 (45:36):
So this is another thing. I love this question because
even in the field today, there's still a lot of
misconception around that. A lot of us are taught to
take breaks, you know, so we don't develop tolerance to
the mushrooms and you don't want it to become habit
for me. But I've witnessed over my years supporting people

(45:57):
that over time, when people come back to micro saying
is not only is it not habit forming, they require
a much lower dose because they're more dialed into the metacos,
they have less density, they've worked through some layers. So
it's hint of the opposite of habit forming. I think
humans will binge on anything that's true, cookies, movies, you

(46:22):
name it. I find sometimes when people abuse mushrooms, it's
more our human tendency to abuse than it is a
quality of the mushrooms that is addicting.

Speaker 2 (46:33):
Anybody do you think this could help with You know,
we keep hearing in the news so much about the
opioid situation that we have. Do you think this could
help people get off or release that addition to opioids?
I think mushrooms.

Speaker 3 (46:49):
I'm biased. It's what I do. Mushrooms, particularly microdos and
can prevent so many addictions in the first place from happening.
Because almost all addictions is disconnection from self and other.
Zil A Simon is such a relational medicine. It changes
your relationship to yourself. It helps people love themselves again,

(47:09):
It helps people love other people again. And you're less
likely to fall into addictions if you have that healthy
relationship to self in the first place. In terms of
active addictions, yes, there's a couple guides in our community
who specialize in working with people with addictions of all types.
It's really good to break addictions because addictions are tied

(47:33):
to that ruminating, looping mind. Resetting your nervous system can
really help that. And then there's some bigger medicines that
are showing remarkable pattern breaking addiction. I Begain, for example,
is becoming more widely known than as a shrub from
Africa that is tremendously effective for also illegal right now

(47:56):
in the United States. Hopefully that will be changing too.
But I Begin is deeply effective for opioid addiction.

Speaker 1 (48:04):
I love it's sister medicine for baldness regain.

Speaker 2 (48:10):
Can mushroom micro dosing help with that?

Speaker 1 (48:13):
Yes, it can improved joke, it'll deepen the humor factor.
What I love the most about this is the personal factor,
getting in touch with yourself, getting more in tune with
who you are, the centeredness, the balance of it. In
my journey, currently, I'm in a very big look inward
phase where I'm looking inside seeing things I haven't seen

(48:37):
in a long time and working through them and moving
forward a better person. And I think something like this
might help me to do something like that. It's something
I've been curious about for a long time. I just
have to get the wife on board and then it
will be good, all.

Speaker 3 (48:51):
Right, love it well.

Speaker 1 (48:52):
If someone wanted to join your community or reach out
to ask you any questions, what's the best way for
someone to do that.

Speaker 3 (48:57):
I am super accessible online because my name is spelled
so weird visa to find me. I'm on all the
platforms that allow me to be there.

Speaker 1 (49:06):
No Instagram, we won't be putting that in the show notes.

Speaker 3 (49:08):
My new Instagram is Casey.

Speaker 1 (49:10):
Dot Garrett, so okay, we might put that one up.

Speaker 3 (49:13):
But Microdocing for Healing is honestly the best place to go.
That's our home base, website, and have so many free resources,
many many podcast episodes. So that's another thing people say
oftentimes as they binge on the podcast episodes and really
get to hear and learn from a variety of people
different micronocan perspectives to get comfy. So that's there for people,
and then we have lots of options and access points

(49:35):
from there, folks, excellent.

Speaker 1 (49:36):
We're going to add direct links to your platform and
socials I know show notes. All you need to do
is go to Skeptic Metaphysition dot com, go to her
episode page. You'll see those links in there, so it's
easy for you to connect. Casey, this has been eye
opening and mind expanding. I think I said something like
that in the beginning of the episode. I thank you, wow, wow,

(49:57):
I'm psychic. Thank you so much for coming on and
clearing a lot of misconceptions up for us and helping
us showcase another another avenue that's available to people that
maybe people weren't so sure about. So thank you for
your expertise. Thank you, heyther On, Will, and I'm welcome

(50:18):
back to another exciting, eye popping, consciousness expanding open episode
of Fantastic Metaphysicians. Let's try it again, all right, hey
there On Will And.

Speaker 2 (50:37):
That's probably my eyes. Yeah, okay, are you?

Speaker 3 (50:39):
Are you too?

Speaker 2 (50:40):
One measure?

Speaker 1 (50:42):
Not yet, but we can talk later. Allright, here we go.

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