July 4, 2025 • 32 mins
"Just because you're going for therapy doesn't mean there's something wrong with you. It means you're trying to do something good for yourself." Tamsin & and our guest Helen Stuart discuss how therapy can transform co-parenting after divorce.
Helen Stuart
Helen has always advocated for good mental health, and vocalised the importance of ease of access to mental health support throughout her career. This has seen her working across community, outreach, counselling and domestic abuse prevention roles. Now Helen brings her wealth of knowledge, managerial experience through TLC: Talk, Listen, Change, and personal connections to mental health to drive Now You’re Talking’s success.
Helen is passionate about leading a socially responsible, business for good, enabling contributions to made back to TLC making the charity’s mission possible.
Tamsin Caine
Tamsin is a Chartered Financial Planner with over 20 years experience. She works with couples and individuals who are at the end of a relationship and want agree how to divide their assets FAIRLY without a fight.
You can contact Tamsin at tamsin@smartdivorce.co.uk or arrange a free initial meeting using https://bit.ly/SmDiv15min. She is also part of the team running Facebook group Separation, Divorce and Dissolution UK
Tamsin Caine MSc., FPFS
Chartered Financial Planner
Smart Divorce Ltd
P.S. I am the co-author of “My Divorce Handbook – It’s What You Do Next That Counts”, written by divorce specialists and lawyers writing about their area of expertise to help walk you through the divorce process. You can buy it here https://yourdivorcehandbook.co.uk/buy-the-book/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tamsin Caine (00:04):
Hello and welcome to the Smart Divorce Podcast and
I'm delighted to again bejoined by the very lovely Helen
Stuart.
We are going to be talkingtherapy again today, but more
from the perspective of adultshaving therapy and why they
should consider it when they'regoing through divorce to help
(00:27):
out their entire family.
So, Helen, welcome.
Helen Stuart (00:31):
Lovely to see you again.
Thank you so much.
Tamsin Caine (00:34):
Do you want to just for people who didn't
listen, foolishly didn't listen,to the last episode that we
recorded together.
Do you want to just give abrief introduction about who you
are and how you came to?
Just give a brief introductionabout who you are and how you
came to to set up Now You'reTalking.
Helen Stuart (00:50):
Yes, so my name is Helen Stuart.
I am the managing director ofNow You're Talking.
We are a therapy platform thatconnects individuals to
therapists, and we try and makethat as safe and ethically
responsible as possible bymaking sure everybody on our
site is fully vetted we'vechecked all their qualifications
(01:10):
so you don't have to and tryand make it as simple as
possible.
As we know, going into therapycan be quite scary, so we want
to try and hold people's handsthrough that.
Um.
So we recognized that there wasa need for this within the
market and decided to set up.
Now You're Talking, and Isuppose the unique thing about
us is when you work with us.
66% of our profits arereinvested back into our parent
(01:33):
charity Support Safe, healthyPeer Relationships
oh, that's so lovely.
I love that.
I love that it's a service thatdoes an amazing thing for
people and gives back.
I mean, you can't ask for muchmore than that, can you?
So I guess therapy 20, 30 yearsago was something very, very US
(02:00):
, not something we particularlyembraced in the UK.
Uh, you were more thought that,oh crikey, if you need therapy,
like think you, it must bereally serious, whereas I think
in the US more sort of everybodyhad a therapist and it was more
(02:20):
kind of normal and and thatthat was kind of what you did.
Are things changing in the UK?
Yeah, I think so.
I think it's that it's slow, Iwould say, um, and there's also
a real like north-south dividewhen it comes to the therapy
that I'm finding as well.
Um, so I think that, well, youabsolutely were.
(02:43):
I think in the US it's veryopenly talked about lots of
people going to have a therapist.
It's part of kind of theirhealth and well-being routine.
I think in the uk, yes, it'sdefinitely been seen as
something that people go tocrisis point um, not as
something that people do as likea maintenance thing.
(03:03):
Um, and quite often, actually,you know, therapy is great in a
crisis, but it would work muchbetter we'd gone before the
crisis happened, which I know isreally hard to kind of predict.
You can kind of feel thingsspiraling.
That's when it's going to helpthe most.
But yeah, in terms of like thisnorth south divide, I do find
that kind of um especially, I'vebeen doing some work well in
(03:24):
London and that is becoming moreacceptable.
People are talking about itmore um.
I definitely think that in thenorth we've still got this bit
of a mantra of like we're reallytough and we don't have to do
anything, we'll be fine, um, butyeah, it is changing um slowly.
I think there's more openconversations about it.
(03:45):
I mean it's funny becauseobviously what I do, I talk to
my friends about it all day long, so I'm almost in a bit of a
bubble with it and thinking thatit is changing, um, but I've
been doing quite a bit of stuffon um, social media and LinkedIn
and talking to people as wellabout kind of what those fears
are, about accessing them, andthere is, I think ultimately it
(04:05):
is the stigma to itself.
Tamsin Caine (04:07):
I think you're right unfortunately on your
platform, because there are lotsof different types of therapy
aren't there, and it is reallyimportant to find the right one
for you, the right one thatworks for you.
So do you have different typesof therapists on your platform
or is it just?
Is it just one type?
And how should people go aboutworking out what's what's going
(04:29):
to work for them?
Helen Stuart (04:31):
So I think in the therapy world it can feel a
little bit overwhelmingsometimes if you start really
getting down into kind of themodalities of therapy.
So you have kind of in-personcentered therapy, which is very
much about sort of being led bythe client, and that's quite
good um for when you're kind ofwanting to kind of work through
(04:51):
issues, kind of have someonekind of support you through that
, and then you go into kind ofmore um structured types of
therapy.
So that could be behavioraltherapy, could be um EMDR
therapy, like therapy, andthat's very specific focus to a
lot of times used with trauma.
Um, you know you've gotpsychodynamic, which is, uh, you
(05:14):
know, a little bit more umknowledge, I would say in terms
of a therapy type needintegrative therapists as well.
They kind of blend a lot of thedifferent therapy styles.
So there's lots of differenttypes um, and what I would say
is that we have a bit of a menuum on our website so people kind
of say which kind of um typethat they do.
(05:36):
But quite often it's just aboutkind of talking to somebody.
So unless you are, you know,have a trauma or you want
specific, I would say, um, youknow, taking that first step and
talking to a therapist talkingabout their style and I think
(05:56):
style is probably a better wayto encompass it, because I think
he kind of sounds a bit what Idon't understand what that means
.
But actually each therapistwill have their own different
style and what we do I knowyou're talking is that you're
able to kind of book aconnection call with um
therapists, so you and that'sfree of charge, so you get a bit
of a feel about what theirstyle is.
(06:18):
You, some therapists that canbe, um, you know, quite
directive and quite challenging,and that works really well for
people.
Sometimes people feel likethat's what they need, whereas
you've got others that are verymuch there to listen and guide
you and, um, you know, offer,offer that space to feel safe.
I mean, both of them offer aspace to feel safe, but they
(06:39):
will be slightly different senseof how they communicate and how
they work with you.
Tamsin Caine (06:43):
You know that makes that makes complete sense.
You know, in the past, likeI've tried, I tried talking
therapy and I just that for mepersonally that didn't work
because it wasn't.
I didn't feel like I wasworking like I needed.
I needed more from it and Iended up with doing hypnotherapy
(07:04):
, which like yeah, like howsomething was happening and
changes were being made.
But I also know lots of peoplewho've worked with talking
therapists and that's workedtremendously well yeah and I
have sent people tohypnotherapists where they've
gone (07:20):
"That was madness.
Not for, not for me.
Helen Stuart (07:24):
And that's it.
I think we're all reallydifferent and we'll all respond,
you know, differently to things.
You know, I think that I've hada bit of a blend of physical
therapists over the years and atdifferent times of my life I've
needed different people.
So it's just about kind offinding what suits you for that
moment.
But also, you know, being ableto kind of speak quite openly
(07:46):
when that doesn't feel right foryou as well, is really
important, and I think for usthat is our number one priority
is that this is only going towork if this feels like the
right for you, and that will bedifferent for lots of people.
Tamsin Caine (08:01):
Yeah, definitely, definitely, definitely.
So this series of the podcastwe're talking about co-parenting
and we talked last time abouthow therapy might work for
children themselves.
But when I think about howtherapy might help the parents,
to help the children through, tohelp them become more resilient
(08:26):
, I guess it's that put your owngas mask on first before you,
um, before you help anybody elsethat kind of thinking really.
So yeah, would your thought bearound that?
Helen Stuart (08:39):
so I think, following on from um the
previous series, when we talkedabout sort of therapy for young
people that are going through adivorce, I think that we spoke
about there was this tendency tomaybe overly lean on children
as a support because they're inthe house and they're there.
(09:00):
So I think being really clearabout the boundaries of that is
really important.
And I think when you knowpeople are going through a
turmoil, and especially adivorce, there is so much to be
done, you know there arepaperwork, there's meetings, all
these different things that arehappening, and you just get
pushed to the bottom of thatpile.
(09:20):
Now I don't necessarily thinkthat therapy during a divorce
might be helpful.
Actually, I think it'ssomething we can kind of look at
afterwards and kind of worktogether and kind of make sense
of it.
But you know, I think we oftenjust go oh, that doesn't mean
that we don't need it.
(09:40):
When it comes to co-parenting,depending on kind of the
breakdown of that relationship,you know, if that has been, you
know, pushed more by one person,if the breakdown, you know, is
to do with infidelity, youknowparents you can be, because
there is no point you being thebest parent for your children or
(10:10):
your child if you can't be bestco-parents as well, because it
just contradicts each other.
So, actually having therapy tokind of work through some of
those conflicts and again Ispoke last time that it's not a
magic wand, it takes time butbeing able to compartmentalize,
you know, okay, that's whathappened in our relationship and
(10:31):
I, you know you could feelreally sad about that, you could
feel really angry lots ofdifferent emotions actually.
When it comes to being aco-parent, we both need to show
up, we both need to be on thesame team and we both need to
become we and same team.
And children, you know they areseeking stability all of the
time and if they can findstability within quite a rocky
(10:52):
period, you know you can setthings up for them to make sure
that they can.
You know, look back on that andthink actually, you know my
parents did the best that theycould and they tried to do that
in the most supportive waypossible.
Um, so therapy can really helpkind of work through some of
those issues, um, and sort ofstart you off on it on a stead
(11:12):
of.
You know we're doing thisbecause I want to show up at the
best I can for my children
yeah, I love that absolutely.
There are going to be situationswhere there's been a traumatic
relationship, where there's beendomestic abuse in that
relationship and co-parentingjust isn't going to be possible.
(11:33):
Parent who's experienced thatthe victim survivor.
How can therapy help them toparent their children in the
best possible way, knowing thatco-parenting is not going to be
a physical option for them?
I think that's a really important question
because there are multiplelayers in that isn't there, and
(11:57):
so I think, first and foremost,I think there is the, the trauma
to address and kind of workwith.
You know, um, domestic abuse umis incredibly uh, you know it's
a horrendous thing for anyoneto go through um, and I think
that being able to kind of havesome time to really try to work
through that not only to um youknow help you in terms of being
(12:22):
a better parent because you'vekind of worked through some of
those traumas also to hopefully,you know, have some better
understanding of kind of youknow how that situation panned
out and what happened, as wellas kind of coping mechanisms
with that.
So I think that's kind of thefirst area I think.
Secondly, I think what's reallyimportant when it comes to
(12:43):
domestic abuse is to talk aboutsafety, um.
So when it comes to trying tohave you know however that may
look like in terms of aco-parent relationship,
especially with domestic abuse,that could be incredibly complex
in terms of how that wellthat's going to play out um.
So about kind of safety, about,are you feeling safe within
that relationship?
(13:05):
Is the child feeling safewithin that as well to try and
kind of work through that um.
I think there is so muchcomplexity with trying to clear
my throat.
I think there is so muchcomplexity when it comes to um
domestic abuse and that umhaving something that can kind
(13:28):
of guide you, that isn't someonewho's like an immediate network
as well, because actuallypeople have their own opinions,
people form their own judgmentson people and actually that
can't that's not sometimes veryhelpful, especially having
someone that's outside of thatsituation.
Tamsin Caine (13:44):
Um can really support that as well no, I think
, I think you're absolutelyright.
I think that that's massivelyimportant.
This is the, I guess, milliondollar question that you're
probably not going to be able toanswer.
But, um, if somebody isconsidering therapy, they're
going through divorce and andthey're finding it tricky and
(14:07):
they feel like they need somesupport.
How often should they havetherapy and how?
This is probably the how long'sa piece of string, but how, how
long would you expect it totake?
Yeah, bearing in mind that wehave sort of said it's important
to have kind of maintenancetherapy and to keep yourself on
(14:29):
an even kind of throughout, but,yeah, actually deal with what's
going on.
What would you suggest?
Helen Stuart (14:36):
well I would say, I think, for for people to go,
specific circumstance, I thinkevery fortnight is probably a
good place to start.
So go in every two weeks,because that then gives you kind
of a good space between yourappointments to then maybe put
some of the things into actionor some of those reflections and
kind of space for you to kindof think about what's been
(14:58):
talked about.
But you know some people, butyou know some people.
You know, for whatever reasonsthat could be financial reasons,
or you know other reasons canbe, that's not, that's not
possible, and it might be thatit's months long.
Um, well, you know all peoplepeople with me as well, um, so I
think fortnightly is a goodkind of baseline, is probably
quite hard in terms of a placeto start, um, in terms of how
(15:21):
long.
So, yeah, um, but I would say,if you are serious about keeping
therapy, you really do have tocommit to it because, um, what
you don't want to do is sort ofhave a couple of sessions
scratch the surface and it feellike you know you've not, you
(15:43):
went with it because you haven't.
You know it's really scary tolay yourself down for some day
and you know if you're goingthrough trauma that maybe you
don't want to talk about becauseit's really hard and you know
you you're worried about openingPandora's box.
You know all those differentthings.
You know it can be really scary.
(16:04):
But if you really commit tothat and you say, do you know
what?
I'm committed to doing this fora good length of time, you
might not need it everyfortnight eventually, you know
you could reduce that down toevery once a month, you know.
I know some people do like tocheck in every three months, you
know.
So it moves as you kind of growand kind of go through that
(16:24):
process.
But yeah, I would say that ifyou can really try and kind of
commit yourself to, you know atleast you know six to eight
sessions in the beginning toonce you've kind of passed that.
Because the start of therapy isvery much about you telling your
story.
It's about kind of it's gettingto know your therapist, getting
(16:45):
to know you.
You know, and it's a lot whenyou first start.
You know, depending on howyou've ended up or come to
therapy, whatever that is,there's a lot of laying bare in
the beginning, you know, andit's building trust with that
therapist and what you don'twant to do is to that point
where you're actually going tostart being able to take
something from it, maybe to makesome changes.
(17:07):
You know, um, have some copingmechanisms, all those kind of
things, and sort of stop thatprocess.
So yeah, I would say, um, ifyou could commit to it and, and
you know, really do it for aconsiderable amount of time,
that's kind of best way toapproach it that makes sense and
is there.
Tamsin Caine (17:26):
So I had a friend who was having therapy and
they'd uncovered some trauma intheir past and and there was it
was.
It was progressive for probablysix months, and then I would
say they carried on seeing thembut actually no changes were
(17:49):
being made.
And it wasn't particularly, itwasn't moving them forward after
a certain point but they didn'twant to go back to having to
explain all of the things and torelive the trauma with another
therapist.
What would your view on that be?
(18:10):
Is there a point that you canget to with a therapist where
it's like the work with thatperson is done and you need to
move on?
Helen Stuart (18:19):
yeah, I think it's really important, um, a really
great, a really great question.
I think, yeah, it probably canget to that point where you feel
like you've taken it as far asyou can.
What I would say is I wouldabsolutely have an open
conversation with your therapistand say, look, this is how I'm
feeling, because it might bethat they've got, you know, um,
some other tools within theirbag that they're able to be like
(18:41):
, okay, well, we can try thisand we can do something
different to avoid, kind of youhaving to go to somebody else
and kind of start again.
Um, or it might be that you takea little bit of a break and you
kind of, you know, have, takesome time for yourself and then
if you feel like you want tokind of start that with somebody
else, then start it.
But, you know, be again honestwith that new therapist and
(19:04):
explain, like in a way that youcan move forward without having
to unpack a lot of that traumaagain.
There are ways that they canhelp facilitate that um.
But yeah, first and foremost, Iwould say, have a conversation,
because more often than not,there will be, um, you know,
something within their skill setthat they'll be able to kind of
change and do something alittle bit differently that's
(19:24):
good advice, that, and I think alot of people feel that's a
difficult conversation becausethey feel that it's criticism of
the therapist.
Tamsin Caine (19:35):
But the other option is you, you're gonna
leave and go, yeah, well, so atleast you give them the
opportunity the therapist tomake changes and to be there for
you and to help you throughwhatever's not working any
longer.
Helen Stuart (19:50):
So it does make complete sense and I think I can
speak, you know, for for a lotof um therapists that would say
that they would always welcomethat conversation.
You know it might be adifficult conversation.
You might find that therapistswill often kind of feel the same
way too sometimes.
But again, if they're kind ofvery client-led, they're kind of
going with you.
So, too, that could be a reallywelcome conversation.
(20:12):
But also, you know, a really umhelpful way to find, you know,
a new way of working with eachother.
You know it's all aboutultimately.
You know you are paying for aservice and you've got to be
able to get out of it.
You know the value that you'veseen.
So it's really important thatyou're able to have that, that
(20:32):
chat, and you can even um, youknow there's like like some
contracting that you can do withtherapists at the beginning and
you start to say this is what Ineed or how to work, and you
can kind of revisit that as well.
Every therapist is different.
There's also a way of doingthings as well.
Tamsin Caine (20:51):
Yeah, no, that's fair enough.
There are lots of divorcecoaches out there now and a lot
of them I know and a lot of themare absolutely fantastic.
It's very difficult becausethere are so many professionals
in the area of divorce and youcould end up with a lot, and
people obviously have a limitedresource in most cases and kind
(21:15):
of want to pick the right personfor the right job and the right
people in their team that theyneed.
So how does the therapistdiffer from a coach?
Because there are coaches, youknow you could have a coach for
absolutely everything now andand divorce coaches are
incredibly valuable and doingdoing an amazing job.
(21:36):
But when might I need atherapist rather than a divorce
coach?
Helen Stuart (21:40):
So I think that with a therapist, they will work
with you more over through thatemotional pain.
You know there is a lot ofcomplex emotions with divorce
and I think a big thing which Ihaven't talked about as much,
but that grief around kind ofthe the ending of that
relationship and, um, you knowgrief when remember the name for
(22:04):
it now but when somebody'sstill there you're not, but
you're not with them in arelationship or you know, and
that sort of thing, um, and theywill help you work with kind of
both past and present and kindof working through some of those
emotions.
Um, but also I think that themain thing is is that a
therapist will be trained towork therapeutic way and be able
(22:40):
to adjust and of very sort ofin present, um, and kind of work
through your like differentgoals and you know kind of you
know what you're looking for inthe next chapter of your life.
You know now this year thisdivorce has happened.
You know how you can move on tothe next chapter.
So I think they're both reallyum, really great uh,
professionals to have around andyou can use them for those
(23:04):
different things.
But I definitely think, ifthere are some, really I don't
think you can go to a coach andbe ready to move forward if
you've not really addressed kindof those issues in the
beginning.
You, you know, if there istrauma, if there is, you know,
working through that grief,working through some of those
emotional complexities, they candefinitely complement each
(23:28):
other, is what I would say.
But there is a time and a placefor both of those professionals
.
Tamsin Caine (23:33):
Yeah, agreed, because if you're dealing with,
if you're dealing with deeptrauma, you can't make good
decisions.
You can't're dealing with deeptrauma, you can't make good
decisions, you can't think ofthe future and you can't move
forward.
And you need to address andrecover from and be helped to
recover from that before you canstart moving forward.
And absolutely right, and thecoaches are.
(23:55):
They are a brilliant form ofemotional support and can kind
of talk you through mistakesthat you've made in previous
relationships and help prepareyou for your next chapter and
the next things you're going todo.
And some of them can give givesome incredible practical
support in getting through thedivorce.
But, as you say, they're nottrained as therapists, they
(24:17):
can't look back with you anddeal with, help you to deal with
past trauma on a good coach.
Helen Stuart (24:24):
You know we often get um referrals through from
coaches because they arebrilliant at identifying what
actually, you know this isn'tgoing to work because there are
some deep-rooted issues thatkind of need to be worked
through.
Um, you know, so we work withsome brilliant coaches that um
refer people on to us that thatwould be better off having some
(24:46):
therapy before kind of moving onto the coaching coaching side.
Tamsin Caine (24:50):
And divorce coaches was something I had
never heard about until, uh,probably about six months ago,
and I met a couple at anetworking event and I was like,
oh you're, you're great, what agreat idea oh, there is some
amazing divorce coaches outthere and you know we work with
with quite a number, butprobably I didn't know about
(25:11):
them until I started doing thatwork, this work, but that still
would be sort of six or sevenyears ago, yeah, but it's that
they're definitely.
You know they can help do someof the work that previously you
might have relied on yoursolicitor for, yes, and that
they're the wrong person, and Ithink therapy almost falls into
(25:35):
that bucket of.
In the past you might have usedyou tried to use your solicitor
.
You don't want to be deeptrying to use your solicitor to
deal with emotional part of ofyour divorce.
Yes, you will spend an absolutefortune with a box of tissues
(25:56):
in your solicitor's office andthey cannot help you to move
through.
Yeah, as a therapist andhowever you feel about therapy,
you need to kind of get over itand just go in, go in and see
somebody and I think once peoplehave experienced therapy, that
perhaps be less of a stigma andthat's it, isn't it?
Helen Stuart (26:19):
I think you know your solicitor is there to do
the practical stuff, you know,to kind of move you through that
process.
And I think if you were to kindof, you know, write down the
money that was spent, becauseyou'd spent, you know, an hour,
but you know crying, be reallyupset, glad to actually the
money that was spent on on thedivorce people would probably go
well, I need to spend thatmoney.
(26:39):
You know, crying, be reallyupset, glad to actually the
money that was spent on on thedivorce.
People would probably go, well,I need to spend that money, you
know, with somebody trained tokind of talk me through that,
because actually you're not.
Yes, you're offloading, butyou're not actually getting
anything like through from thatprocess, which which sounds
really harsh to say, but I thinkit's the reality of it.
Um and again, I think coachinghas become, which is quite
trendy, I would say, these days.
(27:00):
I think if you've got a coach,it people are like oh, you know,
you're trying to do better withyour life, whereas I think
we've still got this thing that.
Well, if you've got a therapist, then there's something wrong
and I think it's about trying tokind of rebalance that as well,
because actually both areworking towards kind of um, you
know, trying to create the bestversion of yourself, but just in
different ways yeah, absolutely.
Tamsin Caine (27:22):
I do think it helps some celebrities.
They're now coming forward andtalking about the therapy that
they had and have on an ongoingbasis because, yeah, it makes it
a bit more although maybe not,I was thinking to say a little
bit more normal, but a bit likeyou don't have to be in a really
(27:42):
bad place, you don't have to bein the Priory because you've
got a therapist.
And I think that was the sortof thought was you know, if you
need to see a therapist, theremust be something serious wrong
with you.
Helen Stuart (28:02):
Whereas it's that at all.
No.
And then Emma Willis and herpartner have just done a really
interesting documentary he'sseen it where they are following
people inside therapy rooms,kind of sitting and listening
and and and their firstappointments, and so that is
really interesting and I thinkthat gives a really practical
insight into what it's like froma celebrity point of view, from
(28:23):
such a real people.
Um.
So yeah, that's.
I think that's been a great,great, um, great addition to the
therapy world, absolutely.
Tamsin Caine (28:31):
I like them too.
They're a.
They're good value for money aswell.
They are um, we're coming tothe end of our time together.
Is there anything that you wantto add to what we've talked
about today?
Helen Stuart (28:43):
yeah, I think I think the most important thing
is is you know it'sunderstanding that this sort of
incredibly difficult thing to gothrough, you know, a divorce,
trying to navigate, co-parenting, trying to navigate.
You know your own emotionstrying to navigate co-parenting
trying to navigate.
You know your own emotionstrying to navigate your
children's emotions.
You know grandparents' emotions, you know.
I feel like that's a wholedifferent kind of topic on top
(29:05):
of that as well.
You know, because it's a lot,and I think you have to remember
that you are really importantin that process and your mental
well-being is really importantand you have to take care of
yourself and there are optionsout there for you to be able to
do that in a way that suits youand that can be a great tool for
(29:30):
you to kind of work throughthis, whether that comes to you
being able to process some ofthe trauma process process, the
grief process, those complexemotions, whether that's you
know understanding what yourrole will be when it comes to
co-parenting.
You know all of those thingsthat kind of come with a divorce
.
I think that therapy can be ahuge um, you know catalyst and
(29:52):
help you make some of thosechanges.
So you know, please, I just Iwant to end this by saying that
just because you are going fortherapy or thinking about
therapy does not mean there issomething wrong with you.
It means that you're trying todo something good for yourself,
to better yourself and to helpkind of navigate and work
through what you're goingthrough.
And actually there is nothingmore commendable than kind of
(30:14):
putting yourself first andrecognizing that you need that
support.
Tamsin Caine (30:18):
Yeah, absolutely it's.
It's like taking exercise oreating well and drinking plenty
of water.
You know it should be part andparcel of of looking after
yourself, making sure you're inthe best possible condition that
you can be for your children,for your family, but also so
that you can make the bestpossible decisions in your
divorce for your, your and yourfamily's future as well.
(30:40):
So, helen, thank you so much.
It's been fantastic to talk toyou again.
I really appreciate you joiningme and thank you for listening,
and if you have enjoyed today'spodcast, please do leave us a
five-star review, because ithelps us to get the word out to
even more people.
Many thanks, helps us to getthe word out to even more people
.
(31:03):
Hi, and I hope you enjoyed thatepisode of the Smart Divorce
Podcast.
If you would like to get intouch, please have a look in the
show notes for our details orgo onto the website www.
smartdivorce.
co.
uk.
Also, if you are listening onApple Podcasts or on Spotify and
you wouldn't mind leaving us alovely five-star review, that
(31:25):
would be fantastic.
I know that lots of ourlisteners are finding this is
incredibly helpful in theirjourney through separation,
divorce and dissolving a civilpartnership.
Also, if you would like somefurther support.
We do have a Facebook group now.
It's called Separation, divorceand Dissolution UK.
(31:47):
Please do go on to Facebook,search up the group and we'd be
delighted to have you join us.
The one thing I would say is doplease answer their membership
questions.
Okay, have a great day and takecare.
Hello and welcome to the Smart Divorce Podcast and
I'm delighted to again bejoined by the very lovely Helen
Stuart.
We are going to be talkingtherapy again today, but more
from the perspective of adultshaving therapy and why they
should consider it when they'regoing through divorce to help
(00:27):
out their entire family.
So, Helen, welcome.
Helen Stuart (00:31):
Lovely to see you again.
Thank you so much.
Tamsin Caine (00:34):
Do you want to just for people who didn't
listen, foolishly didn't listen,to the last episode that we
recorded together.
Do you want to just give abrief introduction about who you
are and how you came to?
Just give a brief introductionabout who you are and how you
came to to set up Now You'reTalking.
Helen Stuart (00:50):
Yes, so my name is Helen Stuart.
I am the managing director ofNow You're Talking.
We are a therapy platform thatconnects individuals to
therapists, and we try and makethat as safe and ethically
responsible as possible bymaking sure everybody on our
site is fully vetted we'vechecked all their qualifications
(01:10):
so you don't have to and tryand make it as simple as
possible.
As we know, going into therapycan be quite scary, so we want
to try and hold people's handsthrough that.
Um.
So we recognized that there wasa need for this within the
market and decided to set up.
Now You're Talking, and Isuppose the unique thing about
us is when you work with us.
66% of our profits arereinvested back into our parent
(01:33):
charity Support Safe, healthyPeer Relationships
oh, that's so lovely.
I love that.
I love that it's a service thatdoes an amazing thing for
people and gives back.
I mean, you can't ask for muchmore than that, can you?
So I guess therapy 20, 30 yearsago was something very, very US
(02:00):
, not something we particularlyembraced in the UK.
Uh, you were more thought that,oh crikey, if you need therapy,
like think you, it must bereally serious, whereas I think
in the US more sort of everybodyhad a therapist and it was more
(02:20):
kind of normal and and thatthat was kind of what you did.
Are things changing in the UK?
Yeah, I think so.
I think it's that it's slow, Iwould say, um, and there's also
a real like north-south dividewhen it comes to the therapy
that I'm finding as well.
Um, so I think that, well, youabsolutely were.
(02:43):
I think in the US it's veryopenly talked about lots of
people going to have a therapist.
It's part of kind of theirhealth and well-being routine.
I think in the uk, yes, it'sdefinitely been seen as
something that people go tocrisis point um, not as
something that people do as likea maintenance thing.
(03:03):
Um, and quite often, actually,you know, therapy is great in a
crisis, but it would work muchbetter we'd gone before the
crisis happened, which I know isreally hard to kind of predict.
You can kind of feel thingsspiraling.
That's when it's going to helpthe most.
But yeah, in terms of like thisnorth south divide, I do find
that kind of um especially, I'vebeen doing some work well in
(03:24):
London and that is becoming moreacceptable.
People are talking about itmore um.
I definitely think that in thenorth we've still got this bit
of a mantra of like we're reallytough and we don't have to do
anything, we'll be fine, um, butyeah, it is changing um slowly.
I think there's more openconversations about it.
(03:45):
I mean it's funny becauseobviously what I do, I talk to
my friends about it all day long, so I'm almost in a bit of a
bubble with it and thinking thatit is changing, um, but I've
been doing quite a bit of stuffon um, social media and LinkedIn
and talking to people as wellabout kind of what those fears
are, about accessing them, andthere is, I think ultimately it
(04:05):
is the stigma to itself.
Tamsin Caine (04:07):
I think you're right unfortunately on your
platform, because there are lotsof different types of therapy
aren't there, and it is reallyimportant to find the right one
for you, the right one thatworks for you.
So do you have different typesof therapists on your platform
or is it just?
Is it just one type?
And how should people go aboutworking out what's what's going
(04:29):
to work for them?
Helen Stuart (04:31):
So I think in the therapy world it can feel a
little bit overwhelmingsometimes if you start really
getting down into kind of themodalities of therapy.
So you have kind of in-personcentered therapy, which is very
much about sort of being led bythe client, and that's quite
good um for when you're kind ofwanting to kind of work through
(04:51):
issues, kind of have someonekind of support you through that
, and then you go into kind ofmore um structured types of
therapy.
So that could be behavioraltherapy, could be um EMDR
therapy, like therapy, andthat's very specific focus to a
lot of times used with trauma.
Um, you know you've gotpsychodynamic, which is, uh, you
(05:14):
know, a little bit more umknowledge, I would say in terms
of a therapy type needintegrative therapists as well.
They kind of blend a lot of thedifferent therapy styles.
So there's lots of differenttypes um, and what I would say
is that we have a bit of a menuum on our website so people kind
of say which kind of um typethat they do.
(05:36):
But quite often it's just aboutkind of talking to somebody.
So unless you are, you know,have a trauma or you want
specific, I would say, um, youknow, taking that first step and
talking to a therapist talkingabout their style and I think
(05:56):
style is probably a better wayto encompass it, because I think
he kind of sounds a bit what Idon't understand what that means
.
But actually each therapistwill have their own different
style and what we do I knowyou're talking is that you're
able to kind of book aconnection call with um
therapists, so you and that'sfree of charge, so you get a bit
of a feel about what theirstyle is.
(06:18):
You, some therapists that canbe, um, you know, quite
directive and quite challenging,and that works really well for
people.
Sometimes people feel likethat's what they need, whereas
you've got others that are verymuch there to listen and guide
you and, um, you know, offer,offer that space to feel safe.
I mean, both of them offer aspace to feel safe, but they
(06:39):
will be slightly different senseof how they communicate and how
they work with you.
Tamsin Caine (06:43):
You know that makes that makes complete sense.
You know, in the past, likeI've tried, I tried talking
therapy and I just that for mepersonally that didn't work
because it wasn't.
I didn't feel like I wasworking like I needed.
I needed more from it and Iended up with doing hypnotherapy
(07:04):
, which like yeah, like howsomething was happening and
changes were being made.
But I also know lots of peoplewho've worked with talking
therapists and that's workedtremendously well yeah and I
have sent people tohypnotherapists where they've
gone (07:20):
"That was madness.
Not for, not for me.
Helen Stuart (07:24):
And that's it.
I think we're all reallydifferent and we'll all respond,
you know, differently to things.
You know, I think that I've hada bit of a blend of physical
therapists over the years and atdifferent times of my life I've
needed different people.
So it's just about kind offinding what suits you for that
moment.
But also, you know, being ableto kind of speak quite openly
(07:46):
when that doesn't feel right foryou as well, is really
important, and I think for usthat is our number one priority
is that this is only going towork if this feels like the
right for you, and that will bedifferent for lots of people.
Tamsin Caine (08:01):
Yeah, definitely, definitely, definitely.
So this series of the podcastwe're talking about co-parenting
and we talked last time abouthow therapy might work for
children themselves.
But when I think about howtherapy might help the parents,
to help the children through, tohelp them become more resilient
(08:26):
, I guess it's that put your owngas mask on first before you,
um, before you help anybody elsethat kind of thinking really.
So yeah, would your thought bearound that?
Helen Stuart (08:39):
so I think, following on from um the
previous series, when we talkedabout sort of therapy for young
people that are going through adivorce, I think that we spoke
about there was this tendency tomaybe overly lean on children
as a support because they're inthe house and they're there.
(09:00):
So I think being really clearabout the boundaries of that is
really important.
And I think when you knowpeople are going through a
turmoil, and especially adivorce, there is so much to be
done, you know there arepaperwork, there's meetings, all
these different things that arehappening, and you just get
pushed to the bottom of thatpile.
(09:20):
Now I don't necessarily thinkthat therapy during a divorce
might be helpful.
Actually, I think it'ssomething we can kind of look at
afterwards and kind of worktogether and kind of make sense
of it.
But you know, I think we oftenjust go oh, that doesn't mean
that we don't need it.
(09:40):
When it comes to co-parenting,depending on kind of the
breakdown of that relationship,you know, if that has been, you
know, pushed more by one person,if the breakdown, you know, is
to do with infidelity, youknowparents you can be, because
there is no point you being thebest parent for your children or
(10:10):
your child if you can't be bestco-parents as well, because it
just contradicts each other.
So, actually having therapy tokind of work through some of
those conflicts and again Ispoke last time that it's not a
magic wand, it takes time butbeing able to compartmentalize,
you know, okay, that's whathappened in our relationship and
(10:31):
I, you know you could feelreally sad about that, you could
feel really angry lots ofdifferent emotions actually.
When it comes to being aco-parent, we both need to show
up, we both need to be on thesame team and we both need to
become we and same team.
And children, you know they areseeking stability all of the
time and if they can findstability within quite a rocky
(10:52):
period, you know you can setthings up for them to make sure
that they can.
You know, look back on that andthink actually, you know my
parents did the best that theycould and they tried to do that
in the most supportive waypossible.
Um, so therapy can really helpkind of work through some of
those issues, um, and sort ofstart you off on it on a stead
(11:12):
of.
You know we're doing thisbecause I want to show up at the
best I can for my children
yeah, I love that absolutely.
There are going to be situationswhere there's been a traumatic
relationship, where there's beendomestic abuse in that
relationship and co-parentingjust isn't going to be possible.
(11:33):
Parent who's experienced thatthe victim survivor.
How can therapy help them toparent their children in the
best possible way, knowing thatco-parenting is not going to be
a physical option for them?
I think that's a really important question
because there are multiplelayers in that isn't there, and
(11:57):
so I think, first and foremost,I think there is the, the trauma
to address and kind of workwith.
You know, um, domestic abuse umis incredibly uh, you know it's
a horrendous thing for anyoneto go through um, and I think
that being able to kind of havesome time to really try to work
through that not only to um youknow help you in terms of being
(12:22):
a better parent because you'vekind of worked through some of
those traumas also to hopefully,you know, have some better
understanding of kind of youknow how that situation panned
out and what happened, as wellas kind of coping mechanisms
with that.
So I think that's kind of thefirst area I think.
Secondly, I think what's reallyimportant when it comes to
(12:43):
domestic abuse is to talk aboutsafety, um.
So when it comes to trying tohave you know however that may
look like in terms of aco-parent relationship,
especially with domestic abuse,that could be incredibly complex
in terms of how that wellthat's going to play out um.
So about kind of safety, about,are you feeling safe within
that relationship?
(13:05):
Is the child feeling safewithin that as well to try and
kind of work through that um.
I think there is so muchcomplexity with trying to clear
my throat.
I think there is so muchcomplexity when it comes to um
domestic abuse and that umhaving something that can kind
(13:28):
of guide you, that isn't someonewho's like an immediate network
as well, because actuallypeople have their own opinions,
people form their own judgmentson people and actually that
can't that's not sometimes veryhelpful, especially having
someone that's outside of thatsituation.
Tamsin Caine (13:44):
Um can really support that as well no, I think
, I think you're absolutelyright.
I think that that's massivelyimportant.
This is the, I guess, milliondollar question that you're
probably not going to be able toanswer.
But, um, if somebody isconsidering therapy, they're
going through divorce and andthey're finding it tricky and
(14:07):
they feel like they need somesupport.
How often should they havetherapy and how?
This is probably the how long'sa piece of string, but how, how
long would you expect it totake?
Yeah, bearing in mind that wehave sort of said it's important
to have kind of maintenancetherapy and to keep yourself on
(14:29):
an even kind of throughout, but,yeah, actually deal with what's
going on.
What would you suggest?
Helen Stuart (14:36):
well I would say, I think, for for people to go,
specific circumstance, I thinkevery fortnight is probably a
good place to start.
So go in every two weeks,because that then gives you kind
of a good space between yourappointments to then maybe put
some of the things into actionor some of those reflections and
kind of space for you to kindof think about what's been
(14:58):
talked about.
But you know some people, butyou know some people.
You know, for whatever reasonsthat could be financial reasons,
or you know other reasons canbe, that's not, that's not
possible, and it might be thatit's months long.
Um, well, you know all peoplepeople with me as well, um, so I
think fortnightly is a goodkind of baseline, is probably
quite hard in terms of a placeto start, um, in terms of how
(15:21):
long.
So, yeah, um, but I would say,if you are serious about keeping
therapy, you really do have tocommit to it because, um, what
you don't want to do is sort ofhave a couple of sessions
scratch the surface and it feellike you know you've not, you
(15:43):
went with it because you haven't.
You know it's really scary tolay yourself down for some day
and you know if you're goingthrough trauma that maybe you
don't want to talk about becauseit's really hard and you know
you you're worried about openingPandora's box.
You know all those differentthings.
You know it can be really scary.
(16:04):
But if you really commit tothat and you say, do you know
what?
I'm committed to doing this fora good length of time, you
might not need it everyfortnight eventually, you know
you could reduce that down toevery once a month, you know.
I know some people do like tocheck in every three months, you
know.
So it moves as you kind of growand kind of go through that
(16:24):
process.
But yeah, I would say that ifyou can really try and kind of
commit yourself to, you know atleast you know six to eight
sessions in the beginning toonce you've kind of passed that.
Because the start of therapy isvery much about you telling your
story.
It's about kind of it's gettingto know your therapist, getting
(16:45):
to know you.
You know, and it's a lot whenyou first start.
You know, depending on howyou've ended up or come to
therapy, whatever that is,there's a lot of laying bare in
the beginning, you know, andit's building trust with that
therapist and what you don'twant to do is to that point
where you're actually going tostart being able to take
something from it, maybe to makesome changes.
(17:07):
You know, um, have some copingmechanisms, all those kind of
things, and sort of stop thatprocess.
So yeah, I would say, um, ifyou could commit to it and, and
you know, really do it for aconsiderable amount of time,
that's kind of best way toapproach it that makes sense and
is there.
Tamsin Caine (17:26):
So I had a friend who was having therapy and
they'd uncovered some trauma intheir past and and there was it
was.
It was progressive for probablysix months, and then I would
say they carried on seeing thembut actually no changes were
(17:49):
being made.
And it wasn't particularly, itwasn't moving them forward after
a certain point but they didn'twant to go back to having to
explain all of the things and torelive the trauma with another
therapist.
What would your view on that be?
(18:10):
Is there a point that you canget to with a therapist where
it's like the work with thatperson is done and you need to
move on?
Helen Stuart (18:19):
yeah, I think it's really important, um, a really
great, a really great question.
I think, yeah, it probably canget to that point where you feel
like you've taken it as far asyou can.
What I would say is I wouldabsolutely have an open
conversation with your therapistand say, look, this is how I'm
feeling, because it might bethat they've got, you know, um,
some other tools within theirbag that they're able to be like
(18:41):
, okay, well, we can try thisand we can do something
different to avoid, kind of youhaving to go to somebody else
and kind of start again.
Um, or it might be that you takea little bit of a break and you
kind of, you know, have, takesome time for yourself and then
if you feel like you want tokind of start that with somebody
else, then start it.
But, you know, be again honestwith that new therapist and
(19:04):
explain, like in a way that youcan move forward without having
to unpack a lot of that traumaagain.
There are ways that they canhelp facilitate that um.
But yeah, first and foremost, Iwould say, have a conversation,
because more often than not,there will be, um, you know,
something within their skill setthat they'll be able to kind of
change and do something alittle bit differently that's
(19:24):
good advice, that, and I think alot of people feel that's a
difficult conversation becausethey feel that it's criticism of
the therapist.
Tamsin Caine (19:35):
But the other option is you, you're gonna
leave and go, yeah, well, so atleast you give them the
opportunity the therapist tomake changes and to be there for
you and to help you throughwhatever's not working any
longer.
Helen Stuart (19:50):
So it does make complete sense and I think I can
speak, you know, for for a lotof um therapists that would say
that they would always welcomethat conversation.
You know it might be adifficult conversation.
You might find that therapistswill often kind of feel the same
way too sometimes.
But again, if they're kind ofvery client-led, they're kind of
going with you.
So, too, that could be a reallywelcome conversation.
(20:12):
But also, you know, a really umhelpful way to find, you know,
a new way of working with eachother.
You know it's all aboutultimately.
You know you are paying for aservice and you've got to be
able to get out of it.
You know the value that you'veseen.
So it's really important thatyou're able to have that, that
(20:32):
chat, and you can even um, youknow there's like like some
contracting that you can do withtherapists at the beginning and
you start to say this is what Ineed or how to work, and you
can kind of revisit that as well.
Every therapist is different.
There's also a way of doingthings as well.
Tamsin Caine (20:51):
Yeah, no, that's fair enough.
There are lots of divorcecoaches out there now and a lot
of them I know and a lot of themare absolutely fantastic.
It's very difficult becausethere are so many professionals
in the area of divorce and youcould end up with a lot, and
people obviously have a limitedresource in most cases and kind
(21:15):
of want to pick the right personfor the right job and the right
people in their team that theyneed.
So how does the therapistdiffer from a coach?
Because there are coaches, youknow you could have a coach for
absolutely everything now andand divorce coaches are
incredibly valuable and doingdoing an amazing job.
(21:36):
But when might I need atherapist rather than a divorce
coach?
Helen Stuart (21:40):
So I think that with a therapist, they will work
with you more over through thatemotional pain.
You know there is a lot ofcomplex emotions with divorce
and I think a big thing which Ihaven't talked about as much,
but that grief around kind ofthe the ending of that
relationship and, um, you knowgrief when remember the name for
(22:04):
it now but when somebody'sstill there you're not, but
you're not with them in arelationship or you know, and
that sort of thing, um, and theywill help you work with kind of
both past and present and kindof working through some of those
emotions.
Um, but also I think that themain thing is is that a
therapist will be trained towork therapeutic way and be able
(22:40):
to adjust and of very sort ofin present, um, and kind of work
through your like differentgoals and you know kind of you
know what you're looking for inthe next chapter of your life.
You know now this year thisdivorce has happened.
You know how you can move on tothe next chapter.
So I think they're both reallyum, really great uh,
professionals to have around andyou can use them for those
(23:04):
different things.
But I definitely think, ifthere are some, really I don't
think you can go to a coach andbe ready to move forward if
you've not really addressed kindof those issues in the
beginning.
You, you know, if there istrauma, if there is, you know,
working through that grief,working through some of those
emotional complexities, they candefinitely complement each
(23:28):
other, is what I would say.
But there is a time and a placefor both of those professionals
.
Tamsin Caine (23:33):
Yeah, agreed, because if you're dealing with,
if you're dealing with deeptrauma, you can't make good
decisions.
You can't're dealing with deeptrauma, you can't make good
decisions, you can't think ofthe future and you can't move
forward.
And you need to address andrecover from and be helped to
recover from that before you canstart moving forward.
And absolutely right, and thecoaches are.
(23:55):
They are a brilliant form ofemotional support and can kind
of talk you through mistakesthat you've made in previous
relationships and help prepareyou for your next chapter and
the next things you're going todo.
And some of them can give givesome incredible practical
support in getting through thedivorce.
But, as you say, they're nottrained as therapists, they
(24:17):
can't look back with you anddeal with, help you to deal with
past trauma on a good coach.
Helen Stuart (24:24):
You know we often get um referrals through from
coaches because they arebrilliant at identifying what
actually, you know this isn'tgoing to work because there are
some deep-rooted issues thatkind of need to be worked
through.
Um, you know, so we work withsome brilliant coaches that um
refer people on to us that thatwould be better off having some
(24:46):
therapy before kind of moving onto the coaching coaching side.
Tamsin Caine (24:50):
And divorce coaches was something I had
never heard about until, uh,probably about six months ago,
and I met a couple at anetworking event and I was like,
oh you're, you're great, what agreat idea oh, there is some
amazing divorce coaches outthere and you know we work with
with quite a number, butprobably I didn't know about
(25:11):
them until I started doing thatwork, this work, but that still
would be sort of six or sevenyears ago, yeah, but it's that
they're definitely.
You know they can help do someof the work that previously you
might have relied on yoursolicitor for, yes, and that
they're the wrong person, and Ithink therapy almost falls into
(25:35):
that bucket of.
In the past you might have usedyou tried to use your solicitor
.
You don't want to be deeptrying to use your solicitor to
deal with emotional part of ofyour divorce.
Yes, you will spend an absolutefortune with a box of tissues
(25:56):
in your solicitor's office andthey cannot help you to move
through.
Yeah, as a therapist andhowever you feel about therapy,
you need to kind of get over itand just go in, go in and see
somebody and I think once peoplehave experienced therapy, that
perhaps be less of a stigma andthat's it, isn't it?
Helen Stuart (26:19):
I think you know your solicitor is there to do
the practical stuff, you know,to kind of move you through that
process.
And I think if you were to kindof, you know, write down the
money that was spent, becauseyou'd spent, you know, an hour,
but you know crying, be reallyupset, glad to actually the
money that was spent on on thedivorce people would probably go
well, I need to spend thatmoney.
(26:39):
You know, crying, be reallyupset, glad to actually the
money that was spent on on thedivorce.
People would probably go, well,I need to spend that money, you
know, with somebody trained tokind of talk me through that,
because actually you're not.
Yes, you're offloading, butyou're not actually getting
anything like through from thatprocess, which which sounds
really harsh to say, but I thinkit's the reality of it.
Um and again, I think coachinghas become, which is quite
trendy, I would say, these days.
(27:00):
I think if you've got a coach,it people are like oh, you know,
you're trying to do better withyour life, whereas I think
we've still got this thing that.
Well, if you've got a therapist, then there's something wrong
and I think it's about trying tokind of rebalance that as well,
because actually both areworking towards kind of um, you
know, trying to create the bestversion of yourself, but just in
different ways yeah, absolutely.
Tamsin Caine (27:22):
I do think it helps some celebrities.
They're now coming forward andtalking about the therapy that
they had and have on an ongoingbasis because, yeah, it makes it
a bit more although maybe not,I was thinking to say a little
bit more normal, but a bit likeyou don't have to be in a really
(27:42):
bad place, you don't have to bein the Priory because you've
got a therapist.
And I think that was the sortof thought was you know, if you
need to see a therapist, theremust be something serious wrong
with you.
Helen Stuart (28:02):
Whereas it's that at all.
No.
And then Emma Willis and herpartner have just done a really
interesting documentary he'sseen it where they are following
people inside therapy rooms,kind of sitting and listening
and and and their firstappointments, and so that is
really interesting and I thinkthat gives a really practical
insight into what it's like froma celebrity point of view, from
(28:23):
such a real people.
Um.
So yeah, that's.
I think that's been a great,great, um, great addition to the
therapy world, absolutely.
Tamsin Caine (28:31):
I like them too.
They're a.
They're good value for money aswell.
They are um, we're coming tothe end of our time together.
Is there anything that you wantto add to what we've talked
about today?
Helen Stuart (28:43):
yeah, I think I think the most important thing
is is you know it'sunderstanding that this sort of
incredibly difficult thing to gothrough, you know, a divorce,
trying to navigate, co-parenting, trying to navigate.
You know your own emotionstrying to navigate co-parenting
trying to navigate.
You know your own emotionstrying to navigate your
children's emotions.
You know grandparents' emotions, you know.
I feel like that's a wholedifferent kind of topic on top
(29:05):
of that as well.
You know, because it's a lot,and I think you have to remember
that you are really importantin that process and your mental
well-being is really importantand you have to take care of
yourself and there are optionsout there for you to be able to
do that in a way that suits youand that can be a great tool for
(29:30):
you to kind of work throughthis, whether that comes to you
being able to process some ofthe trauma process process, the
grief process, those complexemotions, whether that's you
know understanding what yourrole will be when it comes to
co-parenting.
You know all of those thingsthat kind of come with a divorce
.
I think that therapy can be ahuge um, you know catalyst and
(29:52):
help you make some of thosechanges.
So you know, please, I just Iwant to end this by saying that
just because you are going fortherapy or thinking about
therapy does not mean there issomething wrong with you.
It means that you're trying todo something good for yourself,
to better yourself and to helpkind of navigate and work
through what you're goingthrough.
And actually there is nothingmore commendable than kind of
(30:14):
putting yourself first andrecognizing that you need that
support.
Tamsin Caine (30:18):
Yeah, absolutely it's.
It's like taking exercise oreating well and drinking plenty
of water.
You know it should be part andparcel of of looking after
yourself, making sure you're inthe best possible condition that
you can be for your children,for your family, but also so
that you can make the bestpossible decisions in your
divorce for your, your and yourfamily's future as well.
(30:40):
So, helen, thank you so much.
It's been fantastic to talk toyou again.
I really appreciate you joiningme and thank you for listening,
and if you have enjoyed today'spodcast, please do leave us a
five-star review, because ithelps us to get the word out to
even more people.
Many thanks, helps us to getthe word out to even more people
.
(31:03):
Hi, and I hope you enjoyed thatepisode of the Smart Divorce
Podcast.
If you would like to get intouch, please have a look in the
show notes for our details orgo onto the website www.
smartdivorce.
co.
uk.
Also, if you are listening onApple Podcasts or on Spotify and
you wouldn't mind leaving us alovely five-star review, that
(31:25):
would be fantastic.
I know that lots of ourlisteners are finding this is
incredibly helpful in theirjourney through separation,
divorce and dissolving a civilpartnership.
Also, if you would like somefurther support.
We do have a Facebook group now.
It's called Separation, divorceand Dissolution UK.
(31:47):
Please do go on to Facebook,search up the group and we'd be
delighted to have you join us.
The one thing I would say is doplease answer their membership
questions.
Okay, have a great day and takecare.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark
My Favorite Murder is a true crime comedy podcast hosted by Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark. Each week, Karen and Georgia share compelling true crimes and hometown stories from friends and listeners. Since MFM launched in January of 2016, Karen and Georgia have shared their lifelong interest in true crime and have covered stories of infamous serial killers like the Night Stalker, mysterious cold cases, captivating cults, incredible survivor stories and important events from history like the Tulsa race massacre of 1921. My Favorite Murder is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.