July 30, 2024 • 29 mins
Today we are discussing the topic of Christian leadership and discipleship.
Join us as we:
Explore how every believer can lead through discipleship, challenging traditional views with insights from 1 Timothy 6:11-16.
And discover practical strategies for mentoring others and fostering unity in the body of Christ.
Inspire and equip you to embrace your role in guiding and disciplining those around you.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to our July Rise Up Rally.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Yay, it's Rise Up Rally.
This is one of my favorites.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
So you originally, when we started doing these,
wanted music.
So do you want to go ahead andsing for us?
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Not that kind of music.
I wanted music to inspire, notcringeworthy music.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Welcome to the Sojo Show with Jen and AJ, where
you'll dig deep into God's Wordalongside two imperfect,
frequently ineloquent women, aswe discover fresh ways to walk
out God's truth together.
All right, well, welcome to therally.
(00:49):
A lot to talk about today.
A lot we do, we do.
What do you want to start with,aj?
Well, questions to start with.
Yes, let's do, let's ask them.
Your sound is cutting on andoff.
Do you have your AirPods in, byany chance?
All right, can you guys hearthis better?
Yes, yes, it was like you'reyou were talking and nothing was
(01:10):
coming out.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Okay, so I want you guys to be interactive today,
because we have a lot ofdifferent directions this
conversation could go in, and sowe're going to need you guys to
help us determine what exactlywe want to talk about.
It's like a future story?
Yeah, it really is.
This is a huge topic, so thefirst question we want to ask is
(01:33):
how do you guys defineChristian leadership?
Speaker 1 (01:39):
Or what do you think of?
What's your first thought whenyou think of Christian
leadership?
And there's no right or wronganswer to this Teachers, pastors
, yes, those who lead the church, bible study leaders,
traditional views, pastors,teachers, youth leaders, music
ministry, missionaries, yep.
So I think it is safe to saythat it would not be wrong to
(02:00):
consider, to think about whenyou first come.
Think about leadership isthinking about actual leaders in
the church, right, and thereare those called to be pastors
and elders and teachers and tolead the body.
I mean, 1 Timothy that we'restudying this month is all about
(02:24):
.
You know Paul's instruction toan actual pastor, right?
You guys all, if you're in alocal body, you have a pastor
and you have elders or deaconsor leaders in your church and
they're called to lead, and Ithink that that is definitely a
definition of spiritualleadership, right.
(02:47):
And then Ramona I like the wayRamona put this, because this is
where we're going with this.
So what first comes to mind ispeople in position of leadership
, but I think it can also applyto anyone who is stepping into
the mission that Christ calledthem to.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Yeah, yeah and really okay.
So, if we step back, we have adefinition of leader is
basically somebody who hassomeone else following them.
So at the just very basic core,the just very basic core
definition, that's what a leaderis, and that means that we all
(03:29):
have we're all leaders in somecapacity, right, because we all
have somebody following us,whether that's our children, our
grandchildren, somebody that wementor in church or work or
life or whatever.
We all have someone who is, oreven in the online space, we all
have someone who is looking tous and following us or watching
(03:54):
our example, and so this is kindof what we want to focus in on
today, because you don't have tohave a title or have to be in
Christian leadership per se forthese principles that we're
learning to apply, and so wedon't want you guys or ourselves
(04:14):
to be intimidated by a titleand feel like, okay, well, that
doesn't apply to me, because ithonestly and truly does.
Each one of us has been calledto make disciples, and that is a
form of leadership, so we'regoing to kind of get into this
today.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Yeah, yeah, alyssa, sometimes I forget that my
current ministry or missionfield is my own children.
Yeah, I'm saying yes, and so Ithink that that is.
(05:00):
I think that, in particular, isone thing that when you're in
the trenches, we are, we think,oh well, my role necessarily is
not one of leadership, or it'snot as important as those who
are outwardly and openly calledto be leaders of many.
But we are called to lead thosethat are in our sphere, whether
(05:25):
that's our children or whetherthat is other people that we
have to kind of reach out to getinto our sphere.
So that's a whole nother.
That's a whole nother topic.
But but yeah, we, we cannotforget, we cannot forget that.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Okay, so are we ready to open a can of worms, jen?
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Oh, I don't know which can you open.
Well, about several cans.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I know so in my mind, okay and this is coming from a
perspective as someone who hasbeen in overseas ministry for a
long time To me, leadership isdiscipleship, and I get that
from scripture, the GreatCommission, at its most basic
(06:12):
form.
Every single believer is to bea disciple maker, and that, to
me, is what every believer cando.
You don't have to be a pastoror a missionary or a teacher or
anything like that, you justhave to be saved, and so I think
it would be helpful for us tounderstand how we can do that,
(06:35):
what that looks like, how we cando that, whether it's with our
children or whether it's in ourlocal church or whatever.
We know that God has said gomake disciples.
So what does that look like?
How can I do that as a woman?
How can I do that with theexperiences that I have, with
the seasons of life that I'm in,or with the restrictions that I
(06:55):
have on my time?
I think that's where we need tofocus.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
I agree.
I will say that if we look at 1Timothy, I just talk about what
we're all commanded to do.
There's a small little passagein 1 Timothy 6, which kind of
encapsulates and summarizes 1Timothy pretty well, and it
talks about what we're all meantto do, and it's 1 Timothy 6, 11
through 16.
Let me just briefly rollthrough this and then I think
(07:24):
this might help us going forward, because we can recognize that
we're all meant to do this, andthen talk about how we can
practically, you know, live thisout.
So, 1 Timothy 6, verse 11, asfor you, a man of God talking
you know Paul's talking toTimothy flee these things.
Pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, steadfastness and
gentleness.
So the pursuit of these virtues.
(07:50):
Okay, that's one thing that weare called to do.
Paul encouraged Timothy and weare called to do as well.
Right, verse 12, fight the goodfight of faith.
Take hold of the eternal lifeto which you were called and
about which you made the goodconfession in the presence of
many witnesses.
So engaging in spiritualbattles.
Right, fight the good fight.
We've talked about this adnauseum.
And then also having an eternalperspective.
(08:11):
Right, he encourages Timothy totake hold of the eternal life
to have an eternal perspective.
Verses 13 and 14, he is callingfor faithfulness to the
commandments of God.
I charge you, in the presenceof God, to keep the commandment
unstained and free from reproach.
And then the last bit in 15 and16, he's acknowledging God's
(08:34):
sovereignty, which he willdisplay at the proper time, he
who is blessed and onlysovereign, the King of kings and
Lord of lords.
In these few verses, paul istelling Timothy a few things
that we all need to hear.
One pursue righteousness,pursue these virtues.
Two engage in the battle.
Fight the fight as you'repursuing it.
(08:55):
Number three keep an eternalperspective as you are battling.
Number four stay faithful tohis commands.
And number five.
Number four stay faithful tohis commands.
And number five acknowledge hislordship and sovereignty over
all.
And I think that when we dothose things personally, that
(09:16):
helps us to gain perspective andstrength to then do the
commandment that we're talkingabout today and that AJ's
talking about, which is to goand make disciples of men right,
yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Well, and I was just thinking, as you were reading
that passage in Timothy, when welive out that kind of life and
when we focus on our character,we become influential, like that
is naturally a way that we gainrespect.
We gain God's favor not thathe's, you know, giving us favor
(09:49):
because we're righteous or good,but you know he blesses a life
that is obedient to him.
And we become influential.
We have a voice in otherpeople's lives and so I think a
lot of times we people rely on atitle to be heard or a platform
to be heard, when, in reality,when we focus on cultivating
(10:14):
that character this, I mean thisis Paul's instructions to young
Timothy.
You know, when we focus on that, as he instructed him to do,
that is going to give you astrong foundation and is going
to make you influential in otherpeople's lives.
And so a lot of times ourculture, we can be so swayed and
(10:34):
persuaded that we have to dothis or that or the other to
lead somebody quote unquote when, in fact, when we focus on what
God instructs us to focus on,it happens naturally.
So that was just kind of a sidenote.
But going back to the disciple,it doesn't take someone being a
(10:56):
mega church pastor to beinfluential, all it takes is
every single person in the bodyof Christ doing their job to
focus on one person at a time.
There is great exponentialpower in that, and so that's
kind of what we want tochallenge ourselves with this
(11:17):
month is to think about who am Ileading?
Am I being intentional aboutthat?
Am I being intentional abouthow I'm leading?
Am I being a disciple maker inmy leadership, or is my
leadership more just fly by theseat of my pants, which
sometimes that's okay.
Sometimes we have to be that,but it does take some
(11:40):
intentionality.
When Jesus said go and makedisciples, do I understand what
that means?
Do I understand what that lookslike?
Do I have a few tools as to howto do that, and how do I know
if I'm hitting the target or not?
You know, how can I evaluate myactions and my choices to know
(12:03):
if what I'm doing is actuallyfulfilling that mission?
These are all the questions weneed to be asking ourselves.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
I will also say that, interestingly, when you are in
a group of people that arepracticing this, then the
organic involvement of otherpeople becomes more natural.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
We have to be intentional to make that happen,
though I mean we could.
You know, there's a millionthings that call for our time
and our attention and that wecould be spending our time in
our lives doing so.
We have to be intentional aboutfulfilling this mission and and
the you know we do become anexample to others to show them
what's possible.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
So when you know, when you are building these
relationships, then it showsother people, it encourages
other people to do the same.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
So, with that in mind , what questions or challenges
do you guys have about being adisciple or being a disciple
maker?
Okay, so we're just opening thefloor for you guys to ask your
questions, and maybe we probablywant to put them in the chat,
(13:18):
because everybody has an opinion, so we'll kind of use the chat
as our springboard.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Okay, karen, isn't it hard to always be a disciple to
someone?
Do you need to find a newcircle of people to be talking
to?
I think that we don't need tothink of it in such a strict
manner.
There's a difference betweenintentionality and you know.
We don't want to be legalisticabout it.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
Well, and I think some of that goes back to the
one anothering.
You know, as we're, as we'redoing, that it opens doors to
have relationships, which thenbecomes open door for discipling
, you know, and it can be a twoway street where you know
someone is sees our strugglesand we see their struggles and
we're both encouraging eachother and pushing each other to
(14:13):
keep up in the faith, to notgive in, to persevere, to say no
to temptation, all of thosethings that we would naturally
do in a discipleship kind ofrelationship.
Honestly, it goes back to ourdefinition of what is a disciple
.
If we are to make disciples,well, what is a disciple?
How do we make them?
(14:34):
You know, what does thatinvolve?
What does that look like?
How did Jesus do it?
How did Jesus make disciples ofhis 12 followers and beyond?
You know, there's a lot that wecould go into here, but I think
it starts with we have to haverelations.
We have to have genuinerelationships with people and
(14:57):
make ourselves vulnerable andopen our schedule to connect
with others in a real andmeaningful way.
And when we do that, then theLord can bring together those
longer relationships.
You know he can.
He can use that then to allowus to have influence in other
(15:17):
people's lives and give theminfluence in ours.
You know, but a lot of us arejust so busy that we don't, or
we're so afraid of that level ofintimacy that we don't, or
we're so afraid of that level ofintimacy that we don't have
this experience.
Julie has a good question.
Is there a point where weoutgrow needing discipleship
(15:42):
ourselves?
My kids are ages two to 19 anda lot of younger moms reach out
to me for advice, but I wouldstill dearly love to have an
older woman discipling me,challenging me to grow my faith
and helping me navigaterelationships with my adult
children.
I just don't Oops, I just don'thave a lot of this discipleship
for myself right now, but Iwould love it if the Lord brings
(16:02):
it about at some point.
My answer would be I don'tthink you ever outgrow it.
No, I think we're all as adisciple ourselves of Jesus
Christ.
We're always learning and wecan always be part of.
It is just iron, sharpeningiron, having those people, those
kinds of people, in our lives,and we never outgrow our need
(16:25):
for that, and also are thebenefits that we could receive
we're always gaining when wehave that kind of people, those
kinds of people in our lives,and I'm glad you're doing that
for other young moms, julie.
I think that is super important.
For a long time I prayed forsomeone to mentor me and
(16:46):
disciple me and it seemed likethe Lord didn't answer that
prayer and then he sent meoverseas where I was totally
alone.
I didn't have anybody.
But I will say this I wasdiscipled a lot through books
and just classic people in thefaith who had shared their
(17:08):
spiritual journey, theirinsights, how they lived out
their faith.
That's been a huge impact in mylife and sermons from godly men
.
So those are the things that ifyou are missing someone in that
capacity in your life, thereare other ways you can still
(17:29):
gain.
It just may not be somebodywith skin on in front of you.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Ramona, here's something to ponder.
In the midst of using ourspiritual gifts, how can we
carry out the Great Commissionand disciple others in the
unique circumstance where Godhas placed us?
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Well, I also like what Valerie said.
She says looking back on lastmonth, where one of the points
was to teach one another.
One way this can be done is bymaking friends with others and
then, naturally, discussingthings that are important, and
that is just.
That is so.
It seems so simple, but that isone of the biggest components
(18:10):
of discipleship is being inGod's word and then sharing what
you're reading with somebodyelse.
Just talking about it in yourdaily life, texting a friend or
telling somebody oh I read thisin my scripture time this
morning and I thought of you orI prayed for you, or just
however.
It is just sharing God's wordbecause then that opens up a
(18:34):
conversation, and that'snormally where discipleship
happens is just an everydayconversations You're.
You don't have to be in a quoteunquote disciple maker role to
have a disciple.
That you're, that you're making, if that makes sense.
It doesn't have to be anofficial capacity.
(18:57):
You can make a disciple by justsimply talking about God's
truths on a regular basis tosomeone else.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
So, yeah, I see SoJay fulfilling a lot of these roles
.
Yeah, I've had to live myspiritual life out loud or
intentionally in the presence ofsomeone who may or may not care
about God.
So, yeah, I think that having agroup, you know, like Sojo,
like your local body, like asmall group of women, like a
Bible, whatever it is, having agroup of women who stand for the
(19:29):
gospel, we're all just a littlebit different in the nuances of
theology.
I think theology is superimportant and I have an opinion
about most of the nuances.
I'll just say that.
However, I know that myopinions and AJ and I's opinions
are pretty much the same onmost things, but our opinions
(19:54):
are not going to be necessarilythe way we interpret I shouldn't
say opinions, but the way weinterpret the word may not be
the same way that you've beentaught or interpret the word.
Some of those nuances, asimportant as they are, they're
not dividers, right, it's not.
They're not.
(20:18):
They're not.
They're open-handed issues.
What's close-handed and what weall should be believing is that
we are sinners, we deservedeath, god in his goodness and
his son to be the sacrifice on across that we deserve, to take
the penalty of death and to takeaway, then our sin and shame
(20:43):
and replace it with hisrighteousness and the basics of
the gospel.
And now we stand before thethrone of God with the
righteousness of Christ on us.
If we believe the basics of thegospel, then we are.
You know, we can hash out allthe details and we can discuss
them and we can talk about themat times, but they are not
divided.
(21:03):
They're, they should not divideus.
Those are the beautiful thingsto talk about in the, maybe in a
discipleship relationship.
Yeah, what's yourinterpretation of this versus
this Right?
And then a lot of it's going todepend on your background.
It's going to depend on youryou know your parents, if they
taught you your church, if it,if you grew up in your own
(21:26):
spiritual maturity because thespoiler alert your, the nuances
of theology are probably goingto change over time and if they
don't, then that may mean thatyou're not digging quite deep
enough, because we do tend tounderstand things more as we dig
deeper.
Okay, so I just kind of want tobring it and just make sure
(21:47):
that we understand that beingwith a group of people that
believe the gospel is importantand will make us grow and will
stretch our thinking on theseother things.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, I'm really glad youbrought that up, jen, because I
was actually thinking that wayback at the beginning of this
conversation.
There are certain things thatjust should not divide us.
You know, we should be okaywith having other people in the
body of Christ who thinkdifferently or, like you said,
(22:19):
who interpret things differently, and this is one of the things
that I see a lot of in theonline space.
We can get into these littlecamps and it's like we start
lobbying these darts at peoplein other camps who don't think
exactly like we think, when inreality, guys, we're all.
If we're saved by the blood ofJesus, we should be united
(22:43):
against the common enemy, whichis Satan, who is wreaking havoc
in our world.
That is where we should bestanding together, like not
lobbying at each other becausewe don't view things the same.
So I wanted to leave you guyswith a resource, though, because
I know some of the questionsprobably in your mind are okay,
(23:05):
I want to be a better discipler,how do I get started?
So, first off, this issomething that coming in
September, so next month isgoing to be our last Sojo Strong
pillar, and then in September,we're going to change things up
in the academy so that we startimplementing a little better.
(23:26):
And this is one of the thingswe're going to do we're going to
try to structure the academywhere there's more discipleship
and more of that.
So just kind of hold on for asecond, but in the meantime I
wanted to share this book withyou because this is a very
simple, simple guide to startinga discipleship kind of
(23:52):
relationship with somebody else.
You can either start it withone person or you can start she
recommends no more than fivepeople, a group of five people,
so you can start it with twopeople, one it doesn't matter.
But basically what this, whather structure is, if you don't
want to buy the book, shebasically gives a reading plan
(24:17):
where you hit the highlights ofscripture over the course of a
year and everybody goes throughthis reading plan and you meet
every week to talk about whatyou're reading and how it
applies to your life.
And each day's reading youjournal, you journal how the
Lord's speaking to you, or youjournal your thoughts.
(24:38):
You journal you know how you'reconvicted, whatever it is, and
that's what you talk about whenyou come together.
So it's a very simple, simple,simple way of doing discipleship
.
It's centered around the wordof God, which personally I think
any discipleship group needs tobe.
Any discipleship relationshipneeds to be centered around the
(25:00):
word of God, whether it's anofficial one or not.
And it's doable, it's superdoable.
You're just reading the samepassages and then you're coming
together and you're talkingabout it, and so, if you want
more details, this is the book.
It's called Disciple Her.
It's by Candy Gallanty andshe's a pastor's wife in
Tennessee.
My husband has gone to fortraining.
(25:25):
It's Gallanty G-A-L-L-A-T-Y.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
And it's K-A-N-D-I.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
K-A-N-D-I.
Yes, so that is it's just.
It's super simple.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
It's not like a huge curriculum that you have to go
through and like all theselessons, it's just reading the
Bible together, yeah, and but,but even the basics that, um, as
I said, just starting in theword is really important and, um
, and we are going to be doingsomething really, really, I
think, really cool the last fourmonths of the year.
(26:06):
Yeah, um, it's going to be verycohesive and very exciting and
I'm really pumped about it, evenas we're prepping for it and
we're going to try toincorporate some of this into it
.
For those who are interestedand wanting to grow in this way,
(26:27):
I am pretty, I'm pretty excitedabout it.
I do want to, I do want to justsay out loud what Carrie this
last comment here, carrie, thatSatan would like nothing better
than to tear the church apartyeah, that's true.
We just have to, you know, beprepared and we have to put on
the armor of God on a regularbasis.
We have to be ready for thebattle.
(26:50):
This might have been a littlebit more of an uncomfortable
topic than some of the ones,because this is a topic that's
going to stretch us if we startto really implement what we
learn, but it's also somethingthat is necessary for the
kingdom.
I mean this is, I mean God doesnot call us just to be the
(27:10):
cul-de-sac.
You've heard me say this before.
I know I have, because I say itall the time we're not.
We don't just study the Bible,we don't just and that's why and
Sojo Academy has done that fora long time We've done a lot.
We do the Bible study andthat's important.
It's important to know the word.
That's not all.
It is we on that informationright?
(27:34):
We don't just sit on our growthand sit in the beauty of our
sanctification.
No, we have to be a highway.
We have to go out and pour itout and throw stuff off of each
exit to people.
We're a highway.
We are not a cul-de-sac, we arenot stale.
We are moving and we aregrowing and we are pushing
others into growth.
What a beautiful picture thatis, what a beautiful idea of it.
(27:58):
Doesn't take me standing infront of 500 people, 500 women
to it doesn't require that.
It requires one intentionalrelationship and as we build
that, god will multiply Love.
That.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
Yeah, and just one final thought.
As you were talking, jen, aboutthe highway, I was thinking
we're soldiers, you know, we'rewarriors.
We aren't called to sit, we'recalled to do spiritual battle.
And that means that, ladies,you've been activated, you're on
active duty, so let's get afterit.
Yep, absolutely, and we loveyou guys.
(28:41):
Yes, see you guys next week.
Y'all have a good one.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
Bye.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
Hey guys, it's AJ here with a personal question.
Do you ever long to connectwith other women over God's word
?
If so, I'd like to personallyinvite you to be part of our
online Bible study community.
Sojo Academy is where Jen and Imeet via Zoom every week with
our global community to discussGod's word, pray and share what
we are learning with each other.
In Sojo Academy, you'll get afresh Bible study every month,
(29:10):
as well as weekly meetups, biblejournaling kits, accountability
community and an entire libraryof workshops and Bible study
tutorials.
Jumpstart your walk with Godand come hang out with us live
this week.
Visit SojournAcademycom andwe'll see you inside.
Welcome to our July Rise Up Rally.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Yay, it's Rise Up Rally.
This is one of my favorites.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
So you originally, when we started doing these,
wanted music.
So do you want to go ahead andsing for us?
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Not that kind of music.
I wanted music to inspire, notcringeworthy music.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Welcome to the Sojo Show with Jen and AJ, where
you'll dig deep into God's Wordalongside two imperfect,
frequently ineloquent women, aswe discover fresh ways to walk
out God's truth together.
All right, well, welcome to therally.
(00:49):
A lot to talk about today.
A lot we do, we do.
What do you want to start with,aj?
Well, questions to start with.
Yes, let's do, let's ask them.
Your sound is cutting on andoff.
Do you have your AirPods in, byany chance?
All right, can you guys hearthis better?
Yes, yes, it was like you'reyou were talking and nothing was
(01:10):
coming out.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Okay, so I want you guys to be interactive today,
because we have a lot ofdifferent directions this
conversation could go in, and sowe're going to need you guys to
help us determine what exactlywe want to talk about.
It's like a future story?
Yeah, it really is.
This is a huge topic, so thefirst question we want to ask is
(01:33):
how do you guys defineChristian leadership?
Speaker 1 (01:39):
Or what do you think of?
What's your first thought whenyou think of Christian
leadership?
And there's no right or wronganswer to this Teachers, pastors
, yes, those who lead the church, bible study leaders,
traditional views, pastors,teachers, youth leaders, music
ministry, missionaries, yep.
So I think it is safe to saythat it would not be wrong to
(02:00):
consider, to think about whenyou first come.
Think about leadership isthinking about actual leaders in
the church, right, and thereare those called to be pastors
and elders and teachers and tolead the body.
I mean, 1 Timothy that we'restudying this month is all about
(02:24):
.
You know Paul's instruction toan actual pastor, right?
You guys all, if you're in alocal body, you have a pastor
and you have elders or deaconsor leaders in your church and
they're called to lead, and Ithink that that is definitely a
definition of spiritualleadership, right.
(02:47):
And then Ramona I like the wayRamona put this, because this is
where we're going with this.
So what first comes to mind ispeople in position of leadership
, but I think it can also applyto anyone who is stepping into
the mission that Christ calledthem to.
Speaker 2 (03:05):
Yeah, yeah and really okay.
So, if we step back, we have adefinition of leader is
basically somebody who hassomeone else following them.
So at the just very basic core,the just very basic core
definition, that's what a leaderis, and that means that we all
(03:29):
have we're all leaders in somecapacity, right, because we all
have somebody following us,whether that's our children, our
grandchildren, somebody that wementor in church or work or
life or whatever.
We all have someone who is, oreven in the online space, we all
have someone who is looking tous and following us or watching
(03:54):
our example, and so this is kindof what we want to focus in on
today, because you don't have tohave a title or have to be in
Christian leadership per se forthese principles that we're
learning to apply, and so wedon't want you guys or ourselves
(04:14):
to be intimidated by a titleand feel like, okay, well, that
doesn't apply to me, because ithonestly and truly does.
Each one of us has been calledto make disciples, and that is a
form of leadership, so we'regoing to kind of get into this
today.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Yeah, yeah, alyssa, sometimes I forget that my
current ministry or missionfield is my own children.
Yeah, I'm saying yes, and so Ithink that that is.
(05:00):
I think that, in particular, isone thing that when you're in
the trenches, we are, we think,oh well, my role necessarily is
not one of leadership, or it'snot as important as those who
are outwardly and openly calledto be leaders of many.
But we are called to lead thosethat are in our sphere, whether
(05:25):
that's our children or whetherthat is other people that we
have to kind of reach out to getinto our sphere.
So that's a whole nother.
That's a whole nother topic.
But but yeah, we, we cannotforget, we cannot forget that.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
Okay, so are we ready to open a can of worms, jen?
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Oh, I don't know which can you open.
Well, about several cans.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I know so in my mind, okay and this is coming from a
perspective as someone who hasbeen in overseas ministry for a
long time To me, leadership isdiscipleship, and I get that
from scripture, the GreatCommission, at its most basic
(06:12):
form.
Every single believer is to bea disciple maker, and that, to
me, is what every believer cando.
You don't have to be a pastoror a missionary or a teacher or
anything like that, you justhave to be saved, and so I think
it would be helpful for us tounderstand how we can do that,
(06:35):
what that looks like, how we cando that, whether it's with our
children or whether it's in ourlocal church or whatever.
We know that God has said gomake disciples.
So what does that look like?
How can I do that as a woman?
How can I do that with theexperiences that I have, with
the seasons of life that I'm in,or with the restrictions that I
(06:55):
have on my time?
I think that's where we need tofocus.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
I agree.
I will say that if we look at 1Timothy, I just talk about what
we're all commanded to do.
There's a small little passagein 1 Timothy 6, which kind of
encapsulates and summarizes 1Timothy pretty well, and it
talks about what we're all meantto do, and it's 1 Timothy 6, 11
through 16.
Let me just briefly rollthrough this and then I think
(07:24):
this might help us going forward, because we can recognize that
we're all meant to do this, andthen talk about how we can
practically, you know, live thisout.
So, 1 Timothy 6, verse 11, asfor you, a man of God talking
you know Paul's talking toTimothy flee these things.
Pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, steadfastness and
gentleness.
So the pursuit of these virtues.
(07:50):
Okay, that's one thing that weare called to do.
Paul encouraged Timothy and weare called to do as well.
Right, verse 12, fight the goodfight of faith.
Take hold of the eternal lifeto which you were called and
about which you made the goodconfession in the presence of
many witnesses.
So engaging in spiritualbattles.
Right, fight the good fight.
We've talked about this adnauseum.
And then also having an eternalperspective.
(08:11):
Right, he encourages Timothy totake hold of the eternal life
to have an eternal perspective.
Verses 13 and 14, he is callingfor faithfulness to the
commandments of God.
I charge you, in the presenceof God, to keep the commandment
unstained and free from reproach.
And then the last bit in 15 and16, he's acknowledging God's
(08:34):
sovereignty, which he willdisplay at the proper time, he
who is blessed and onlysovereign, the King of kings and
Lord of lords.
In these few verses, paul istelling Timothy a few things
that we all need to hear.
One pursue righteousness,pursue these virtues.
Two engage in the battle.
Fight the fight as you'repursuing it.
(08:55):
Number three keep an eternalperspective as you are battling.
Number four stay faithful tohis commands.
And number five.
Number four stay faithful tohis commands.
And number five acknowledge hislordship and sovereignty over
all.
And I think that when we dothose things personally, that
(09:16):
helps us to gain perspective andstrength to then do the
commandment that we're talkingabout today and that AJ's
talking about, which is to goand make disciples of men right,
yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Well, and I was just thinking, as you were reading
that passage in Timothy, when welive out that kind of life and
when we focus on our character,we become influential, like that
is naturally a way that we gainrespect.
We gain God's favor not thathe's, you know, giving us favor
(09:49):
because we're righteous or good,but you know he blesses a life
that is obedient to him.
And we become influential.
We have a voice in otherpeople's lives and so I think a
lot of times we people rely on atitle to be heard or a platform
to be heard, when, in reality,when we focus on cultivating
(10:14):
that character this, I mean thisis Paul's instructions to young
Timothy.
You know, when we focus on that, as he instructed him to do,
that is going to give you astrong foundation and is going
to make you influential in otherpeople's lives.
And so a lot of times ourculture, we can be so swayed and
(10:34):
persuaded that we have to dothis or that or the other to
lead somebody quote unquote when, in fact, when we focus on what
God instructs us to focus on,it happens naturally.
So that was just kind of a sidenote.
But going back to the disciple,it doesn't take someone being a
(10:56):
mega church pastor to beinfluential, all it takes is
every single person in the bodyof Christ doing their job to
focus on one person at a time.
There is great exponentialpower in that, and so that's
kind of what we want tochallenge ourselves with this
(11:17):
month is to think about who am Ileading?
Am I being intentional aboutthat?
Am I being intentional abouthow I'm leading?
Am I being a disciple maker inmy leadership, or is my
leadership more just fly by theseat of my pants, which
sometimes that's okay.
Sometimes we have to be that,but it does take some
(11:40):
intentionality.
When Jesus said go and makedisciples, do I understand what
that means?
Do I understand what that lookslike?
Do I have a few tools as to howto do that, and how do I know
if I'm hitting the target or not?
You know, how can I evaluate myactions and my choices to know
(12:03):
if what I'm doing is actuallyfulfilling that mission?
These are all the questions weneed to be asking ourselves.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
I will also say that, interestingly, when you are in
a group of people that arepracticing this, then the
organic involvement of otherpeople becomes more natural.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
We have to be intentional to make that happen,
though I mean we could.
You know, there's a millionthings that call for our time
and our attention and that wecould be spending our time in
our lives doing so.
We have to be intentional aboutfulfilling this mission and and
the you know we do become anexample to others to show them
what's possible.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
So when you know, when you are building these
relationships, then it showsother people, it encourages
other people to do the same.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
So, with that in mind , what questions or challenges
do you guys have about being adisciple or being a disciple
maker?
Okay, so we're just opening thefloor for you guys to ask your
questions, and maybe we probablywant to put them in the chat,
(13:18):
because everybody has an opinion, so we'll kind of use the chat
as our springboard.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Okay, karen, isn't it hard to always be a disciple to
someone?
Do you need to find a newcircle of people to be talking
to?
I think that we don't need tothink of it in such a strict
manner.
There's a difference betweenintentionality and you know.
We don't want to be legalisticabout it.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
Well, and I think some of that goes back to the
one anothering.
You know, as we're, as we'redoing, that it opens doors to
have relationships, which thenbecomes open door for discipling
, you know, and it can be a twoway street where you know
someone is sees our strugglesand we see their struggles and
we're both encouraging eachother and pushing each other to
(14:13):
keep up in the faith, to notgive in, to persevere, to say no
to temptation, all of thosethings that we would naturally
do in a discipleship kind ofrelationship.
Honestly, it goes back to ourdefinition of what is a disciple
.
If we are to make disciples,well, what is a disciple?
How do we make them?
(14:34):
You know, what does thatinvolve?
What does that look like?
How did Jesus do it?
How did Jesus make disciples ofhis 12 followers and beyond?
You know, there's a lot that wecould go into here, but I think
it starts with we have to haverelations.
We have to have genuinerelationships with people and
(14:57):
make ourselves vulnerable andopen our schedule to connect
with others in a real andmeaningful way.
And when we do that, then theLord can bring together those
longer relationships.
You know he can.
He can use that then to allowus to have influence in other
(15:17):
people's lives and give theminfluence in ours.
You know, but a lot of us arejust so busy that we don't, or
we're so afraid of that level ofintimacy that we don't, or
we're so afraid of that level ofintimacy that we don't have
this experience.
Julie has a good question.
Is there a point where weoutgrow needing discipleship
(15:42):
ourselves?
My kids are ages two to 19 anda lot of younger moms reach out
to me for advice, but I wouldstill dearly love to have an
older woman discipling me,challenging me to grow my faith
and helping me navigaterelationships with my adult
children.
I just don't Oops, I just don'thave a lot of this discipleship
for myself right now, but Iwould love it if the Lord brings
(16:02):
it about at some point.
My answer would be I don'tthink you ever outgrow it.
No, I think we're all as adisciple ourselves of Jesus
Christ.
We're always learning and wecan always be part of.
It is just iron, sharpeningiron, having those people, those
kinds of people, in our lives,and we never outgrow our need
(16:25):
for that, and also are thebenefits that we could receive
we're always gaining when wehave that kind of people, those
kinds of people in our lives,and I'm glad you're doing that
for other young moms, julie.
I think that is super important.
For a long time I prayed forsomeone to mentor me and
(16:46):
disciple me and it seemed likethe Lord didn't answer that
prayer and then he sent meoverseas where I was totally
alone.
I didn't have anybody.
But I will say this I wasdiscipled a lot through books
and just classic people in thefaith who had shared their
(17:08):
spiritual journey, theirinsights, how they lived out
their faith.
That's been a huge impact in mylife and sermons from godly men
.
So those are the things that ifyou are missing someone in that
capacity in your life, thereare other ways you can still
(17:29):
gain.
It just may not be somebodywith skin on in front of you.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Ramona, here's something to ponder.
In the midst of using ourspiritual gifts, how can we
carry out the Great Commissionand disciple others in the
unique circumstance where Godhas placed us?
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Well, I also like what Valerie said.
She says looking back on lastmonth, where one of the points
was to teach one another.
One way this can be done is bymaking friends with others and
then, naturally, discussingthings that are important, and
that is just.
That is so.
It seems so simple, but that isone of the biggest components
(18:10):
of discipleship is being inGod's word and then sharing what
you're reading with somebodyelse.
Just talking about it in yourdaily life, texting a friend or
telling somebody oh I read thisin my scripture time this
morning and I thought of you orI prayed for you, or just
however.
It is just sharing God's wordbecause then that opens up a
(18:34):
conversation, and that'snormally where discipleship
happens is just an everydayconversations You're.
You don't have to be in a quoteunquote disciple maker role to
have a disciple.
That you're, that you're making, if that makes sense.
It doesn't have to be anofficial capacity.
(18:57):
You can make a disciple by justsimply talking about God's
truths on a regular basis tosomeone else.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
So, yeah, I see SoJay fulfilling a lot of these roles
.
Yeah, I've had to live myspiritual life out loud or
intentionally in the presence ofsomeone who may or may not care
about God.
So, yeah, I think that having agroup, you know, like Sojo,
like your local body, like asmall group of women, like a
Bible, whatever it is, having agroup of women who stand for the
(19:29):
gospel, we're all just a littlebit different in the nuances of
theology.
I think theology is superimportant and I have an opinion
about most of the nuances.
I'll just say that.
However, I know that myopinions and AJ and I's opinions
are pretty much the same onmost things, but our opinions
(19:54):
are not going to be necessarilythe way we interpret I shouldn't
say opinions, but the way weinterpret the word may not be
the same way that you've beentaught or interpret the word.
Some of those nuances, asimportant as they are, they're
not dividers, right, it's not.
They're not.
(20:18):
They're not.
They're open-handed issues.
What's close-handed and what weall should be believing is that
we are sinners, we deservedeath, god in his goodness and
his son to be the sacrifice on across that we deserve, to take
the penalty of death and to takeaway, then our sin and shame
(20:43):
and replace it with hisrighteousness and the basics of
the gospel.
And now we stand before thethrone of God with the
righteousness of Christ on us.
If we believe the basics of thegospel, then we are.
You know, we can hash out allthe details and we can discuss
them and we can talk about themat times, but they are not
divided.
(21:03):
They're, they should not divideus.
Those are the beautiful thingsto talk about in the, maybe in a
discipleship relationship.
Yeah, what's yourinterpretation of this versus
this Right?
And then a lot of it's going todepend on your background.
It's going to depend on youryou know your parents, if they
taught you your church, if it,if you grew up in your own
(21:26):
spiritual maturity because thespoiler alert your, the nuances
of theology are probably goingto change over time and if they
don't, then that may mean thatyou're not digging quite deep
enough, because we do tend tounderstand things more as we dig
deeper.
Okay, so I just kind of want tobring it and just make sure
(21:47):
that we understand that beingwith a group of people that
believe the gospel is importantand will make us grow and will
stretch our thinking on theseother things.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, I'm really glad youbrought that up, jen, because I
was actually thinking that wayback at the beginning of this
conversation.
There are certain things thatjust should not divide us.
You know, we should be okaywith having other people in the
body of Christ who thinkdifferently or, like you said,
(22:19):
who interpret things differently, and this is one of the things
that I see a lot of in theonline space.
We can get into these littlecamps and it's like we start
lobbying these darts at peoplein other camps who don't think
exactly like we think, when inreality, guys, we're all.
If we're saved by the blood ofJesus, we should be united
(22:43):
against the common enemy, whichis Satan, who is wreaking havoc
in our world.
That is where we should bestanding together, like not
lobbying at each other becausewe don't view things the same.
So I wanted to leave you guyswith a resource, though, because
I know some of the questionsprobably in your mind are okay,
(23:05):
I want to be a better discipler,how do I get started?
So, first off, this issomething that coming in
September, so next month isgoing to be our last Sojo Strong
pillar, and then in September,we're going to change things up
in the academy so that we startimplementing a little better.
(23:26):
And this is one of the thingswe're going to do we're going to
try to structure the academywhere there's more discipleship
and more of that.
So just kind of hold on for asecond, but in the meantime I
wanted to share this book withyou because this is a very
simple, simple guide to startinga discipleship kind of
(23:52):
relationship with somebody else.
You can either start it withone person or you can start she
recommends no more than fivepeople, a group of five people,
so you can start it with twopeople, one it doesn't matter.
But basically what this, whather structure is, if you don't
want to buy the book, shebasically gives a reading plan
(24:17):
where you hit the highlights ofscripture over the course of a
year and everybody goes throughthis reading plan and you meet
every week to talk about whatyou're reading and how it
applies to your life.
And each day's reading youjournal, you journal how the
Lord's speaking to you, or youjournal your thoughts.
(24:38):
You journal you know how you'reconvicted, whatever it is, and
that's what you talk about whenyou come together.
So it's a very simple, simple,simple way of doing discipleship
.
It's centered around the wordof God, which personally I think
any discipleship group needs tobe.
Any discipleship relationshipneeds to be centered around the
(25:00):
word of God, whether it's anofficial one or not.
And it's doable, it's superdoable.
You're just reading the samepassages and then you're coming
together and you're talkingabout it, and so, if you want
more details, this is the book.
It's called Disciple Her.
It's by Candy Gallanty andshe's a pastor's wife in
Tennessee.
My husband has gone to fortraining.
(25:25):
It's Gallanty G-A-L-L-A-T-Y.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
And it's K-A-N-D-I.
Speaker 2 (25:36):
K-A-N-D-I.
Yes, so that is it's just.
It's super simple.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
It's not like a huge curriculum that you have to go
through and like all theselessons, it's just reading the
Bible together, yeah, and but,but even the basics that, um, as
I said, just starting in theword is really important and, um
, and we are going to be doingsomething really, really, I
think, really cool the last fourmonths of the year.
(26:06):
Yeah, um, it's going to be verycohesive and very exciting and
I'm really pumped about it, evenas we're prepping for it and
we're going to try toincorporate some of this into it
.
For those who are interestedand wanting to grow in this way,
(26:27):
I am pretty, I'm pretty excitedabout it.
I do want to, I do want to justsay out loud what Carrie this
last comment here, carrie, thatSatan would like nothing better
than to tear the church apartyeah, that's true.
We just have to, you know, beprepared and we have to put on
the armor of God on a regularbasis.
We have to be ready for thebattle.
(26:50):
This might have been a littlebit more of an uncomfortable
topic than some of the ones,because this is a topic that's
going to stretch us if we startto really implement what we
learn, but it's also somethingthat is necessary for the
kingdom.
I mean this is, I mean God doesnot call us just to be the
(27:10):
cul-de-sac.
You've heard me say this before.
I know I have, because I say itall the time we're not.
We don't just study the Bible,we don't just and that's why and
Sojo Academy has done that fora long time We've done a lot.
We do the Bible study andthat's important.
It's important to know the word.
That's not all.
It is we on that informationright?
(27:34):
We don't just sit on our growthand sit in the beauty of our
sanctification.
No, we have to be a highway.
We have to go out and pour itout and throw stuff off of each
exit to people.
We're a highway.
We are not a cul-de-sac, we arenot stale.
We are moving and we aregrowing and we are pushing
others into growth.
What a beautiful picture thatis, what a beautiful idea of it.
(27:58):
Doesn't take me standing infront of 500 people, 500 women
to it doesn't require that.
It requires one intentionalrelationship and as we build
that, god will multiply Love.
That.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
Yeah, and just one final thought.
As you were talking, jen, aboutthe highway, I was thinking
we're soldiers, you know, we'rewarriors.
We aren't called to sit, we'recalled to do spiritual battle.
And that means that, ladies,you've been activated, you're on
active duty, so let's get afterit.
Yep, absolutely, and we loveyou guys.
(28:41):
Yes, see you guys next week.
Y'all have a good one.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
Bye.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
Hey guys, it's AJ here with a personal question.
Do you ever long to connectwith other women over God's word
?
If so, I'd like to personallyinvite you to be part of our
online Bible study community.
Sojo Academy is where Jen and Imeet via Zoom every week with
our global community to discussGod's word, pray and share what
we are learning with each other.
In Sojo Academy, you'll get afresh Bible study every month,
(29:10):
as well as weekly meetups, biblejournaling kits, accountability
community and an entire libraryof workshops and Bible study
tutorials.
Jumpstart your walk with Godand come hang out with us live
this week.
Visit SojournAcademycom andwe'll see you inside.
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