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Episode Transcript
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Stephanie (00:03):
In a world where we have everything and it's still
not enough, we're often leftwondering, is this really it?

Maren (00:10):
Deep inside, you know there's more to life.
You're ready to leave behindthe old push your way through
and claim the deeper, moremeaningful life that's calling
you.
That's what we invite you toexplore with us.
We're your hosts, StephanieAllen and Maren Oslac and this
is the Soulful Leader Podcast.

Stephanie (00:30):
Yay! So have you ever been around a lot of people and
they just...
you just like it's driving mecrazy.
I need space.
Or have said, I don't likepeople.
I just want to be by myself.
And maybe that's true.
Maybe all these things aretrue.
I'm curious though.

(00:52):
I think where we get so hung upis that there's so much going
on in the world today, we don'thave a whole lot more space to
handle more bad news.

Maren (01:04):
Yeah, there's no bandwidth.

Stephanie (01:06):
There's no bandwidth.
And we have taken on the badnews.
And we feel helpless and wehelp feel hopeless.
And so what happens when wefeel helpless and hopeless?
We either give up and go awayand isolate, or we try to fight
everybody and kind of wave ourflag and our banner and our you
know get out there, which isgreat.

(01:27):
But you know, I'm not sayingright or wrong or good or bad,
it wouldn't be either one of those.
But it gets exhausting thosetwo ways after a while.
And what if there was anotherway?

Maren (01:40):
I love that.
So what are your thoughts onthat?
What's the other way thatyou're thinking about?
Well I just think of the other way. Thereare police officers that
experience horrible things.
There are prison guards, thereare teachers, there are
therapists, there are doctors,there are lawyers, there are all

(02:03):
of those industries that we areall dealing with people's
issues and the ramifications ofpeople's issues.
And yet we still need to beable to show up in our hearts
with love and kindness andpresence to be able to take the
next action.
Clearly.
And then once all the day isdone and we go home, we have to

(02:25):
be with ourselves and we have tobe with our loved ones.
And hopefully we're bringingthe best of us forward.
The thing is, is that if we arecarrying it, we can't.
You know, it either tears usdown or we end up tearing down
other people that are that we'reclose to because we feel the
safest with.
So, yes, is there another way?
Absolutely.
What the heck is it then,right?

(02:46):
Right!

Stephanie (02:47):
Can you help?
What is it then and help menow! And I think if we can take
that part of ourselves andinstead of absorbing it, like
how how do we not absorb thehorrible things that happen in
this world to our loved ones, tothose?
How do we not absorb it and yetstill be present to it?

(03:08):
That's the practice.
And that's what I would saythat is the antidote is becoming
conscious and aware of what ismine and what is yours.

Maren (03:19):
Doing it, doing it from a place of not becoming
hard-hearted.
I think a lot of times ouranswer to the atrocities that
we're either experiencingpersonally or that we're seeing
on the news, or that, you know,all of that that starts to build
up inside of us.
The answer, like I said, was tojust numb out, to become

(03:46):
hard-hearted, to go away.
So, how do we be present to it,not go away, and then also not
be sucked into it so that it'spainful or that we want to
retaliate or you know...

Stephanie (04:01):
Learning how to deal with that stress and that
emotion.
We are not emotionallyliterate.
We are not.
What I mean by that, we don'teven know what we feel, let
alone what somebody else isfeeling.
And so when sometimes thingsstart to download and people
start having an emotionalbreakdown in front of us,
whether it's a, you know, Ialways say, well, actually,

(04:23):
they're having a breakthroughbecause they've actually allowed
this emotion to come up enoughto clear out the, you know, the
debris that's been blockingthem.
But if we can't learn how to bepresent to someone else in that
space, it's often because wedon't know how to be present to
ourselves.

Maren (04:42):
Yeah...
Because the antidote.
That's the antidote.
It is. And it takes awareness, it takes both
willingness and awareness.
And I think that a lot of usare not willing because it feels
painful in the moment.
And so I think that at leastfor me, knowing that with more

(05:08):
consciousness, with moreawareness, there isn't more
pain.
It is...
it's different.
It allows me...

Stephanie (05:18):
...
you're actually aware of thepain that you probably have been
avoiding.
Because pain exists, you maynot be feeling it, but it trust
me, it's existing.
You may be living on anotherlevel to avoid it, or you may be
numbing yourself out, whetherit's watching TV or or drinking
or eating or gossiping, you maybe doing something else to avoid

(05:40):
the pain that already is there.
And so when you say, well,that's great stuff, and you just
let me feel it, and now I'mfeeling all the freaking pain.
That's like it's always beenthere, but now it's always
feeling it because you'refeeling it.

Maren (05:53):
And it's always been there, and it's also affecting
you.
So that's the thing is we thinkthat because we're not feeling
it in the moment, it doesn't...
well if I just numb out, it'snot affecting me.
Guess what it is?
Totally is affecting you, it'staking a toll on your body, on
your relationships, on your onyour finances, on every aspect

(06:15):
of your life.
And so, yeah, it may feelpainful to actually feel it.
And like you said, then youstart to actually heal it.
So then now all of a sudden itdoesn't have the impact.
It doesn't, it's not drivingyour life from the back seat
without your awareness or yourpermission.
Well, you're actually giving itpermission by numbing out, but

(06:38):
it's beyond your awareness.

Stephanie (06:41):
So years ago, when I first started becoming a
therapist, I just wanted to be amechanical therapist, meaning I
just wanted to fix the problem.
Like, you know, there must bean exercise or a stretch or a
strengthening exercise or apostural exercise, or there's a,
you know, something that I cando manually, manipulation-wise,
that will change the problem.

(07:02):
Unbeknownst to me, um, what wasunderneath it was this
emotional roller coaster oftears and anger and fear that
were locked in my tissues.
Issues in my tissues.
And I remember going to myfirst training, and someone had
an emotional, literally anemotional meltdown.
They cried, they got angry, andI ran to the bathroom.

(07:24):
I'm like, I'm out of here.
Don't don't touch me. I havespent an entire lifetime trying
to suppress that shit downthere.
Don't touch me because it'sgonna come out.
And I'm really invested onkeeping it squashed.

Maren (07:36):
Wow.

Stephanie (07:36):
But it was literally killing me.
And I see this in my clients.
Like it's literally killingthem.
And they're like, no, I'm notgoing there.
I don't want to feel this.
And it's like, but it's alreadyhurting you.
It's already taken...
when we can start to realizethat when we start to feel
something, it's because it'sleaving us, it's actually

(07:57):
dissipating, it's going.
But we don't, we tend to thinkthat you know, when it comes up,
now it's gonna be worse andit's never gonna end.
I'm like, no, that's thestuffing that's coming out of
the out of the little, you know,stuffed teddy bear that you've
squashed it all in there.
And so why I say that, it'slike if we can start to look
within ourselves and feel thosefeelings, we'll tend to then be

(08:22):
able to be present to someoneelse's without trying to fix
them or force them or shut themdown or judge them or anything.
We can just go, oh wow, look atyou go.
God love you.
And and when there's time andspace, you give them a hug.
Like you won't run away.

Maren (08:35):
You won't take it on...
...and you won't take it on,you won't carry it with you.
You know?
I t's just the most beautifulthing.
I would say I've always beensomebody as my younger years
that would avoid pain at allcosts, conflict at all cost.
Are you kidding me?
And if someone's crying, I'mout of there.

(08:56):
And I realized like how much Ihad missed on intimacy in that.
And when I mean intimacy, Ialways say into- me- I- see.
I realized like how much thatwhen I started to look at the
sad part of myself insidemyself, and I was able to be
present to that part within meand hold that part, how I could

(09:18):
then be present to someoneelse's tears without running
away from them or withoutcarrying it from them, or
without trying to fix it or shutit down.
I could just literally bepresent with it.
It is the most beautiful thingwhen you can get there.

(09:38):
I just recently had an experience where somebody asked
me at the end of a a largeevent.
So I was I was running a largeevent, and somebody asked me how
I managed to be present, handleall of the things that went

(10:02):
wrong, all of the craziness, andstill be energized by it, not
have it take a toll on me whereI had to go and recover for a
few days.
And what you're talking aboutis exactly why and how.

(10:23):
So what I mean by that is, youknow, we oftentimes will hear
something like this and be like,well, that's great on a
personal level.
I need to work, at my you know,I just need to keep it together
at my work and and then I cango home and and numb out and et
cetera, et cetera, especiallywith some of the, you know, the
industries that you hadmentioned earlier, where we are

(10:46):
working with other people'sproblems and people at a large
scale, like a large event,right?
And all the crap that goeswrong.
And doing that inner work thatyou're talking about of being
willing to look at myself and myown issues in my tissues and
the things that are going oninside of me.
That work has allowed me toshow up to an event where

(11:12):
everything goes wrong and wehave twice the number of people
than we anticipated, and we'reneeding to manage all the
aspects of it and not take itpersonally, not get overwhelmed,
not manage it in the moment andthen go fry, be fried later.
Like I didn't take any of iton.

(11:34):
It was an amazing evening forme, and that's very unusual.
I know that, and it's evenunusual for me because I've run,
you know, I ran a five to sixhundred person event for 13
years, and so I know the tollthat it's taken on me in the
past, in my body, in myrelationships, and in all of the

(11:56):
aspects, and it was reallydifferent last night, and that's
powerful.
I want that for everybody, howto be present and observe, be
fully in it, be fully likeenjoying it and in the moment,
and then also not be impacted byit, not absorb it.

Stephanie (12:21):
Yeah, I mean, and you're human, so you are gonna
absorb things from time to timebecause we are gonna be growing
and evolving.
So, and you know, if you startto take things on, like don't
beat yourself up again.
Like say, okay, note to self, Ineed some work here, right?
It's like this is somethingthat you know, because I because
I work with lots of differentpeople in lots of different

(12:41):
industries.
I mean, you're human, you're ahuman being.
You are going to feel thingsdeeply.
That's what a human, that's thedifference between a robot and
a human being.

Maren (12:51):
I think this is so key.
Thank you for bringing that up.
And I, you know, like so oftenwe're trained that we're not
supposed to be, bring ourhumanity into business.
And it's causing all kinds ofproblems on the planet, in our
businesses, and in ourselves.

(13:11):
And this is about bringing ourhumanity, and part of humanity
is consciousness and raising ourlevel of consciousness inside
of each of us is really criticalright now.

Stephanie (13:26):
100%.
Because I mean, really, we'reat a time where AI could really
just run the business.
I mean, really, if you wantsomething that doesn't have any
emotion and, you know, yeah,just get AI to run it and let me
know how that goes.
Like I tell the story aboutwhen I, you know, I had to make
a change in my life, and I hada breakup with a partner, and we

(13:50):
were sharing some thingstogether, and I made a call to
kind of disengage from the twoof us sharing this thing.
And the customer service personon the other end, the first
customer service person on theother end, said, I'm sorry, you
know, you have to have both ofyou present in order for this to
go through.
And I'm like, well, that'simpossible.
It's not gonna happen.
And I knew they were justfollowing a mandate, they were

(14:12):
following a script.
And I probably had anemotional...
I absorbed stuff and took anemotional reaction and meltdown
and hung up and probably said afew harsh words to them.
Okay, and I forgive myself forthat.
And then I breathe.
And so, so this is what I didbecause I'm human.
I sat down, I said, okay, Iknow I need to make a change.
I've got to feel this emotion.

(14:32):
I'm deeply hurting.
I'm sad.
There's I'm feeling helpless,I'm feeling hopeless, but at the
same time, I know I need tomake this change.
And I just took a nice longbreath, breathed into it, and I
let myself feel the emotion andlet it come out because I
needed to let it move.
And then I picked up the phoneagain, I got a new person, and I

(14:54):
calmly told her the truth aboutwhat was going on.
And the first thing she said tome is she said, I am so sorry.
That has got to be so hard foryou.
I mean, if I could have leapedthrough the phone and given her
a hug and a kiss, I mean, shejust completely healed me.
She had no idea how much thatas a human being met me in my

(15:18):
heart and it moved it.
Now I also had moved my ownstuff too, but then it moved it
so that I could then ask andmake a request.
And she said, Guess what?
I have a way of doing this.
Hold, please.
I'll just make it make a couplethings over here.
She came back, she sorted thewhole thing out and it was done
without any drama.

Maren (15:36):
You made space in you for a different interaction, for a
different way.

Stephanie (15:44):
And I had to allow myself compassion at that
moment, too.
Not victim.
I mean, because it's so easy togo to I'm a victim, please help
me.
Why aren't you helping me?
Please rescue me, save me.
I did and I kind of did thatthe first time.
That's why the robot met me anddidn't really help me much.
And then I had to go in and Ihad to have compassion with
myself.
I'm like, I need to feel this.

(16:04):
This is really, this is reallyhard.
I know I need to do this.
I've got to be accountable, butI need to feel, and that's what
you just said, making space.
That is the tears, that is theanger, that is the fear, the
anxiety.
If we can give ourselvespermission to feel it with
compassion, it literally willmake space so that you will have
a deeper part of yourself comeup and take accountability and

(16:27):
responsibility.

Maren (16:28):
And I want to say it's it's feeling it not from a place
of righteousness, of "I havethe right."
Right. There is no entitlement.
Right. Because what happenswhen we feel it from that place
is that it kind of anchors itfurther into our system.
Is it like we own it as this iswho I am.

(16:48):
I'm angry, I'm this, I'm avictim, I'm a you know, and
letting go of the ownership.
Like I loved what you said of Ilet it move through me.
We feel it and let it go.

Stephanie (17:03):
Yeah, that's

Maren (17:04):
Because we don't identify with it, yes, and it
does

Stephanie (17:07):
you watch it, you watch it go.

Maren (17:11):
It does take not identifying with it.
You have to not identify, youhave to go.
Oh, look at you.
Yes, you exist in me, and now Ican let you go.
Thanks for serving me orwhatever, right?
Like letting I like that.
Watch it...
off you go!

Stephanie (17:29):
Yeah, and like I said, the more present I could,
I was to my part that washurting with love and kindness,
isn't it interesting that thenext phone call I met that
customer service person had thesame compassion, actually it was
better.
She had that wonderfulcompassion and presence that I
just practiced with myself.

(17:49):
Now, if I hadn't practiced it,I probably if...
even if that person had triedto give it to me, I wouldn't
have had space to be able toreceive it.

Maren (17:57):
No, you wouldn't have.

Stephanie (17:58):
So this is why I say the emotion, emotion isn't good,
bad, right or wrong.
It's emotion, it's energyemotion.
And if we can allow ourselvesthe space to just observe it and
go, ooh, there's a part of me,and I say that word, not it's
like I'm sad or I'm angry.
Well, now there's no, there'snothing left.
It's just all of me.
But if I can, if I can make thespace to say, there's a part of

(18:22):
me that's really scared orreally anxious, then there's
also another part of me that'switnessing it.
And that's the other part of methat I want to align with to
say, I want to come from thewitness part to witnessing the
anxious part or the scared partor the sad part so that I can
caretake it with kindness andgentleness rather than trying to

(18:47):
force myself to do somethingI'm not ready to do, or I
there's just no space.
I need space.

Maren (18:55):
It's so critical right now for us to start this
conversation of how to make thathappen.
Because I think a lot of peoplecan hear it and it makes sense.
And then the next step is okay,so what does that mean?
I don't know even right.

(19:18):
I don't even know where tostart for myself.
So I'm just gonna scrollthrough my Facebook or you know,
check out some some some way.

Stephanie (19:28):
I'm just gonna watch another movie, you know, like
exactly because when we don'tknow how to deal with it, that's
the only measures we know howto do is is to distract
ourselves from it, which makesactually perpetuates it.
It makes it worse.

Maren (19:43):
So the this these are the things that we work with.
And we have some groupprograms.
You can visit our website,www.tslp.life, to check them
out.
The one that we have coming upis called our 12 Days of
Presence.
And it's a completely freeprogram.
So we would love for you tojoin us in that and explore for

(20:05):
yourself.
Maybe it'll open a door thatwill give you a sense of
possibility.

Stephanie (20:12):
For example, in The 12 Days of Presence, it's
like...
it's about telling, tellingyourself the truth of like, hey,
this is what I really want inmy life.
This is not goal setting, it'snot you New Year's resolutions.
It's saying, it's being honestto say, I am really longing for
whatever this is, this X, youknow.

(20:34):
And if we don't look at theinternal aspects of it, we won't
have space to receive it whenit arrives.
We'll push it aside, we'llsabotage it.

Maren (20:44):
Exactly.
Like if you hadn't looked atthat with that woman, with
yourself first, you wouldn'thave been able to hear or accept
the compassion that she had.
And it wouldn't, it might, thething is that we don't realize
how much is like literally rightin front of us, and we can't

(21:05):
see it because it lives in adifferent world.

Stephanie (21:08):
Literally, it lives in a different world.
That's why we say love isblind, because it's all the
critters inside of ourselves istaking up space that we can't
see it.
It's...
we're crowded, and so we don'tlike people out here in front of
us or in the world becausethere's so many internal voices

(21:31):
inside that we don't like.
And if we start to addressthose internal aspects with love
and humor, literally withhumor, with love and compassion
and kindness and humor, then allof a sudden our outer world
starts to change.
We no longer carry it, but yetwe can still be present to it
and with be with be within itwithout taking it on.

(21:54):
So that's how we make adifference in the world.

Maren (21:58):
And that's what we give a "how-to" during The 12 Days of
Presence.
And what's nice about it isit's not like okay, you have to
do this every day for the restof your life.
You have 12 days of intentionalbeing aware of what's going on/
happening in your world.

(22:20):
Each of those 12 dayscorrelates to a month in the
following year.
So we start to bring thatawareness and have a practice of
awareness for the rest of ourlives, for the rest of...
meaning that both time-wise,the rest of our lives, and for
all the other aspects of ourlives.
And then we start to developthat, you know, we were talking

(22:43):
about like what's the how-to?
This is the beginning processof that how-to.

Stephanie (22:49):
Yeah.
And it's it, believe it or not,it will feel scary at first,
only because it's it'sunfamiliar.
And anything unfamiliar.
Anything unfamiliar or unknownis going to feel a little
uncomfortable at first and alittle scary because we haven't
been in that place before.
But once you keep practicingit, then you'll start to see the
benefits, and your lifeactually does get more

(23:11):
beautiful.
And even if it's alreadybeautiful, holy, it gets even
better.

Maren (23:18):
So true.
So we hope you can join us.
And like I said, it's acompletely free program.
Go to our website, check itout, www.tslp.life.
And hopefully we'll see you onthe 12 days of presence.
And we'll definitely see younext in two weeks, because we do
this every other week.
We'll see you in two weeks onThe Soulful Leader Podcast.

Stephanie (23:49):
And that wraps up another episode of The Soulful
Leader Podcast with your hosts,Stephanie Allen

Maren (23:54):
and Maren Oslac.
Thank you for listening.
If you'd like to dive deeper,head over to our website at
www.thesoulfulleaderpodcast.com.

Stephanie (24:06):
Until next time...

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