November 4, 2025 • 24 mins
Ever had a simple task become overwhelming?
👉🏻 It’s not the task, it’s the story we’re telling ourselves ABOUT the task!
This week, Stephanie and Maren dive into the cost of “it’s so hard” and trace where the heaviness really lives: not in the action itself, in the narrative we keep rehearsing. From a timeless Zen parable about two monks to a very modern yardwork fiasco, they unpack how righteous justification sneaks in, drains energy, and keeps us resentful when a small reframe could set us free.
This episode includes a practice around questioning the belief that’s running the show, and then observing it rather than absorbing it. The payoff is real: less reactivity, clearer boundaries, more creative options, and relationships that feel lighter.
Have you ever wished you had a single compassionate line that diffuses defensiveness and preserves your energy? You’ll want to listen to today’s podcast!
If this resonated, follow, share with a friend, and leave a quick review—what story are you ready to drop?
Want more conversations like this or a topic you’d like us to unpack? Connect with us on Facebook or LinkedIn at the Soulful Leaders, on YouTube at the Soulful Leaders, or drop us a line at thesoulfulleaderpodcast.com or TSLP.life.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Stephanie Allen (00:03):
In a world where we have everything and
it's still not enough, we'reoften left wondering, is this
really it?
Maren Oslac (00:10):
Deep inside, you know there's more to life.
You're ready to leave behindthe old push your way through
and claim the deeper, moremeaningful life that's calling
you.
That's what we invite you toexplore with us.
We're your hosts, StephanieAllen and Marin Oslac.
Stephaine and Maren (00:26):
And this is The Soulful Leader Podcast.
Stephanie Allen (00:30):
Yay! Hi, have you ever really struggled with
something?
And you're like, man, this isso freaking hard, and you just
can't seem to let it go.
And you've done everything.
You might have said somethingto someone to try to make them
change, and they still keepdoing it, and you're like, frig,
this being in a relationship ishard, or this losing weight is
(00:53):
hard, or this, you know, workingout is changing my health is
really hard.
And we just say that, oh, it'sso hard, it's so hard, it's so
hard all the time.
And I wanted to start with astory with that because it kind
of leads into what Maren and Iare gonna unfold today a little
bit.
But there's a story of a...
it's a...
I think it's a Zen or aBuddhist story, and it's about
(01:16):
two monks that are going alongon a silent pilgrimage.
They're walking along the sideof a river, and they come to a
crossing and the river has beenflooded, the bridge is no longer
there.
And the older monk sees thatthere's a woman who's struggling
to try to get across the river.
Now, as Zen monks, they havetaken a vow of not only silence,
(01:39):
but also of not touchinganother female.
But this monk sees that thiswoman is really struggling, and
he picks her up and he carriesher across the river and sets
her down.
And she no more says thank youor what kindness, she's just
like totally self-righteous andindignant about the whole thing.
(02:02):
And on they go on theirpilgrimage and you know,
continue walking.
But after about an hour, theyounger monk says to the older
monk, I'm sorry, I have to breakmy silence.
This is driving me crazy.
He goes, first of all, youbroke our vow, the vow to help
or you know to pick up the womanand took her across.
And then she never even saidthank you.
He said, I am just so annoyedhow rude she was, how absolutely
(02:27):
disrespectful she was.
And the older monk turns tolook to the younger monk and
says, I put her down an hourago.
Why are you still carrying her?
And I think there's a real keyto that when we get going on in
our 'oh, it's so hard, it's sohard'.
What is it that's giving it tous?
Like what is it, what is theneed within ourselves that we
(02:49):
are expecting another in theouter world to fill it for us,
whether it's a system or aperson or I don't know, the
weather or something, but wejust get so irritated.
Maren Oslac (03:00):
So you know I think to help clarify why and how
that story applies to thehardness in our lives.
Like, it's like there's there'sthe doing - the action of
carrying this woman across theriver, right?
So there might be an actionthat needs to be taken in our
(03:23):
lives.
You mentioned losing weight orbeing in a relationship or
whatever, right?
So that's the action in and ofitself, and then what oftentimes
makes it feel so hard is thestory we tell ourselves.
Stephanie Allen (03:36):
Oh, yeah.
Oh, big one right there.
Like if you could go inside andgo, what story am I telling
myself?
What am I making this about?
Maren Oslac (03:45):
And that's what the the older monk did, right?
He didn't tell a story aboutit, he just carried her across
the river, did his thing, and helet go of it.
The younger monk told a storyabout it.
You broke your vows, and shewasn't grateful, and there was
this, and you know, like he washolding on to the story, and
(04:06):
that's what we do to ourselves,and we don't realize it because
you know that you use the wordsrighteous justification.
I've been using that.
It's so interesting becausethat's been so up in my own life
of like, where am I, where do Ifeel righteously justified to
have my opinion?
And oh my gosh, what aninteresting story that is.
(04:30):
And I realize how much anger itallows me to hold, and like
that indignation.
I'm so much better.
Oh my gosh, it causes a lot ofpain.
And you know, when you say itmakes things harder.
I have a great example.
(04:51):
I have been having yard workdone, and the young man that's
been helping me, he's awonderful teenager, and he's a
wonderful teenager, right?
So you know, he getsdistracted, and not all the
stuff that I wanted to get donegot done.
I went out and worked withhim for a few hours, and we
(05:12):
literally did in three hourswhat had like he had been taking
two weeks to do.
Normal, everyday everything,right?
So I was a little bit, youknow, I was saying that, telling
my husband, I was telling Jeff,and he looked at me, he goes,
you know what, how how much didyou pay this kid throughout the
summer?
I told him the amount. He said,if you had just called a
(05:34):
landscaping company and said,hey, I would like this done.
How much do you think it wouldhave cost you?
I was like, probably about thesame amount.
He goes, and then you wouldhave had the whole summer do
what you wanted to do.
And I just looked at him and Iwas like, it was such a simple
thing, and it just lightened myheart.
And I thought, how interesting.
(05:57):
Instead, I've been holding onto this, like, yeah, this
righteousness of like, well, youknow, how do I help him to work
better?
Meaning this kid, right?
Not mine to do, he's not mychild.
An illustration of that whole,does it need to be that hard?
(06:21):
Am I holding on to somethingthat's not even mine to hold on
to?
Can I let it go?
Is there another way?
If I didn't have thatpreconceived idea in my head, if
I had let go of it, I mighthave thought of that four months
ago and had you know a wholedifferent experience.
Stephanie Allen (06:40):
But you know, here's the thing
help a kid, or did you?
I think there's that oldsaying, it's like, you know,
everyone wants to change theworld, no one wants to change
themselves.
And it's like, how might youhave shown up to that young
person differently?
You know, there's...
and and internally withinyourself.
And I'm constantly looking atthat too, is like when something
(07:01):
is hard and it's not working,you know, we it's so easy to
say, well, it was them.
It's them, it's all them.
And it might be.
I'm not saying it's not.
But it's like, well, what mightit be calling in me to change
or do differently?
You know, I can totally... andthat's the harder path is to to
look inside and go, okay, whatif I thought differently?
(07:24):
What if I asked a differentquestion?
You know, I think you and Italked about this the other day.
It's like that young person hadjust said, hey, look, what do
you see needs to be done?
What are you looking here in myyard that I probably need to
have done?
And he may not have even said,nothing, it looks fine.
And then that could be anopportunity to say, well, let me
(07:45):
share with something.
Here's where my end goal is.
This is what I'm workingtowards.
You know, and I think that'sreally helpful is to tell
someone, hey, this is where I'mlooking towards.
Because sometimes people think,well, why are you doing it?
Like we've lost our why.
Why are you married?
Why are you losing weight?
Why, why do you want to get ingood shape or have health?
Or why do you want to have a,you know, a really a new
(08:05):
business at your age, or youknow, you've just had a career.
Why do you want to start a newbusiness now?
I don't think we ask enoughquestions to say, well, why?
And what does that mean to you?
And what stories are youtelling yourself about?
Because it's those internalfreaking stories that make it
hard.
I think that's, you know, whenwe say pick your hard. What are
(08:29):
you telling yourself?
Like, who would you be withoutthat story?
You know, Byron Katie does somegreat work.
I really love her stuff calledThe Work.
I think it's www.thework.com,check it out, because she really
has a great way of lookinginternally to ask yourself, you
know, is that true?
Like what am I...
what's really got me agitated?
And is it true?
(08:50):
And how do I know that it'strue?
And then to be able to actuallywork with it and actually turn
it around.
Meaning, you know, maybe it'sa way that you're approaching
it, or maybe it's actuallyyou're creating the hardness.
It's not hard at all.
It's food for thought.
Maren Oslac (09:09):
I completely agree with you, and I do love Byron
Katie's work.
And one of the things youmentioned is 'pick your hard.
So I want to go deeper into pickyour hard because you know,
it's like somebody listening islike, what?
Pick my hard? I'm gonna givean example.
Like, say you have a conflictwith a co-worker or a spouse or
(09:32):
a child or whomever, right?
And you get agitated with thatperson.
They're not picking theirclothes up, say, same at home or
you know, at work, they're justlike you've asked them three
times for that proposal andthey're just not getting it
done.
And you're walking around andyou're kind of like the monk,
the young monk, you're carryingthat story of what it means that
(09:58):
they're not getting whatever itis done.
They're not picking theirclothes up, they're not getting
it.
They disrespect me, it meansthey don't care about me, it
means they don't give a shitabout their job, it means that
like all of the the...
Stephanie (10:10):
AND...right there...
put a pause, get an image ofthat, all/ y'all out there
listening to that, because youimagine all those little thought
bubbles that are coming out ofthis person's head and their
energy and their behavior andthe way they're holding their
posture.
That's a lot of energy.
A lot of energy.
Maren Oslac (10:25):
So, meaning me, like I'm the one with all of
those thought bubbles and blahblah blah, right?
Now imagine how hard that is.
I get to carry that aroundbecause that's how I experience
my day.
I'm complaining about thatperson all day long, I'm
complaining about them insidemyself, I'm complaining about
them to other people, and itfeels really hard and crunching,
(10:48):
right?
And then we're told, you know,that's a reflection of you.
All you have to do is go insideand look at yourself, and it
seems so simple, and we're like,frick, that's so hard.
Stephanie Allen (11:01):
It is hard.
Maren Oslac (11:03):
And so that's where you're right.
It is hard.
My question is, is it harderthan carrying around all that
crap all day long, complainingabout people, staying up until
two in the morning because allthe mind chatter has you going,
(11:26):
waking up tired because youcouldn't get to sleep because
the mind...
like, is it...?
Stephanie Allen (11:31):
...your digestion is completely
dysfunctional? So now you're notable to digest those thoughts
as well as digest your food.
And so we hang out, we getweighted down by our job, by our
relationships, and we thinkit's the job and the
relationship or life when reallyit's the internal process that
you're hanging on, it's actuallylike a burden.
Maren Oslac (11:53):
So when Stephanie says 'Pick your Hard' that's
what she means.
At least my interpretation ofwhat you mean by that is like it
is challenging to go inside andpeel the layers, to be honest
with yourself and be like, oh,I'm complaining about that
person because I see that sideof myself and I don't like it.
Stephanie Allen (12:18):
Yeah, it brings out the worst in me.
Maren Oslac (12:20):
Right?
So it's much easier to complainabout that person than to
actually look inside.
And my question is, is it?
Because what I found for myselfis that when I do the work,
when I go inside and I choosethe hard of going inside, the
hard quote unquote, for thosewho can't see me, quote -
(12:43):
unquote hard of going inside,it's actually a lot easier, not
only on me, but on myrelationships, on the people
around me, on my digestion, onlike all the stuff.
Stephanie Allen (12:56):
Yeah, you'll get life force back.
Maren Oslac (12:58):
Oh my God...
Stephanie Allen (12:58):
You'll get you'll get some insight and
awareness.
I think, you know, like likelike you say, when we pick your
hard, it is hard to go inside.
To stop, feel the freakingfeelings.
To feel them is to heal them,and then not...
you know, I've been using thisa lot...
is to observe them, not absorbthem, but to give yourself some
space and go, look at me go.
(13:19):
There I am.
I'm just a completely hot messover whatever it is, or I'm
like, you know, I'm upset, I'msad, I'm angry, I'm afraid,
whatever it might be.
And you're like, wow, what am Ibelieving?
What am I believing right now?
And what is that doing for me?
And I'm not saying to ignoreit.
Hell no.
In fact, actually, I'm sayingthe opposite.
I'm actually going inside andworking with yourself with love,
(13:41):
compassion, and kindness, notwith fierceness, not with
harshness, but to actually justgive yourself some space to look
within and find that because itcan be it's coming up because
it wants healing, it wantstransformation.
And of course, we thinkintellectually, we go, well, I
want transformation with him orwith her or with the system or
with this.
And it's like, no, it'sactually coming up so that you
(14:03):
can transform it, so that youactually will live in a
different world.
Maren Oslac (14:07):
What you mean is you want, like when you say I
want transformation with him,with her, with the system,
whatever, you mean you wantpeople to change, right?
Stephanie Allen (14:16):
You got it.
Maren Oslac (14:16):
I want the system to change.
Stephanie Allen (14:18):
Control! I don't want to change.
Why should I have to be the onethat always changes?
I'm always the one thatchanges.
Blah blah blah blah.
I mean, I can that's myselftalking right here.
My deeper, my deeper irritatedself that says, why don't...
why is it always me?
And the answer what one of myteachers would always say is,
well, why not you?
Like, if you can, if you spotit, you got it.
(14:38):
You know, that old saying youput one finger forward, there's
three pointing back at you.
You know, it's like thetrigger.
It's like you spot it, you gotit.
It's like, well, how do I workwith it if I spot it?
In a way that's loving and kindwithin myself.
And so that I can...
I can rise above it would beanother way of transforming it.
I can rise above it.
It's still maybe there, but itno longer has me by the short
(15:00):
hairs, it's no longer pullingme.
Maren Oslac (15:03):
So the interesting thing is that when you say, you
know, control, the controlthing, the interesting thing is
that we are so busy trying tocontrol all the stuff out there.
And we can't control any ofthat.
The thing that we actually havepower over is ourselves and
what we like, we actually whenwe do this turning inward, doing
(15:24):
the work within, suddenly wehave control, right?
That's where it lives, is inhere.
And like when you said why notme?
Yeah, because me is where allof the change can happen, and
it's amazing.
And you know, for years I wouldhear people great beings talk
(15:52):
about transformation.
When you transform yourself,the world changes, and I really
didn't understand that until itstarted happening to me and
realizing that like literallywhen I change myself, the things
outside all around me change,and ideas flow, and I have more
(16:16):
energy and all of the stuff.
And so I think that as we'relooking at it, we're gonna hold
and suspend judgment for just amoment.
Like that's I think the firststep when I look at this whole
process of okay, if we weregonna break it down and be like,
(16:36):
okay, here's your answer.
Not that there's answers outthere, and here's your process.
The first step is stop.
It's funny, Stephanie and I haddone a workshop probably about
four years ago now, and we werelike, stop, drop in, stop, you
know, the whole stop, drop, androll thing, and then it became
(16:56):
stop, drop, and whatever.
It's like stop and drop in,just stop for a moment and ask
what's the story?
What's the story that's causingthe angst, the anger, the shit?
Stephanie Allen (17:08):
Yeah, and if you can look at it with love
instead of black and whiteconcrete thinking, like it's got
to be right or wrong, or goodor bad, or you know, I'm
justified, or if you can let allthat go and just observe it.
Like I said, observe, don'tabsorb, but just observe it as
if you're watching it on a moviescreen or on a TV set.
Like just observe without theneutrality.
(17:29):
And that alone, right there, isa practice.
It's like, okay, don't judgeit.
Just like, wow, that'sinteresting.
Look at how the body is beingheld, look at how the breath is
being held.
You know, look at all thosethought bubbles that are flying
around there, or that person'snot even listening to each
other.
It's like, well, what if thiswas an opportunity for growth
(17:51):
and love and connection?
Like, I think that's the otherpart of it, too, is like picking
your hard is that it to comefrom love rather than I want to
fight it or I want to run away.
Maren Oslac (18:02):
Yeah.
Stephanie Allen (18:03):
But to look at from like what would love do?
How would a loving presence bepresent to myself first?
Like, not and I'm not saying,you know, you gotta stay in a
really dangerous situation.
I'm not saying that, but it'slike most of the times it's just
irritating, it's not dangerous,it's just irritating.
And when it's irritating tosay, well, what would love do in
this moment?
(18:23):
You know, would it sayanything?
Would it just...
and it's if it's not about me,maybe it is about this other
person that's having a meltdownin front of me.
It's like, what would love do?
It's like I would listen, Iwould be kind to myself and to
them, and I would tell myselfI'm safe and go and rest within
that safe spot within me,because there is a safe spot
(18:45):
within all of us.
If you can like relax theshoulders, what's my body doing
right now?
Like, take care of yourself inthat moment without having to
react or defend.
Maren Oslac (18:55):
And I think the most interesting thing for me is
that safe spot is...
I'm gonna use the wordnever, maybe it's occasionally,
and hardly ever, ever in ourheads.
Stephanie Allen (19:10):
Oh, most definitely.
Maren Oslac (19:12):
It's in our hearts, and we're so defensive about
our hearts that we close it upand we go up into our heads, and
that actually causes a lot moreproblems because our hearts are
where always where thesolutions are, where the where
love is is where the solutionis.
(19:32):
And so when we say stop anddrop in, it's literally dropping
out of the all of the mentalgymnastics that are going on in
our heads and dropping into ourhearts and into our souls, into
a deeper part of ourselves, outof almost always when you are
dropped into your heart, that'sthe place of where you fall in
(19:56):
love.
Stephanie Allen (19:56):
And when you whether you're in love with a
person, whether you're in lovewith a project, whether you're
in love with something that isbeautiful to you, you become
very curious.
You're like, wow, look at that.
I wonder what that...?
So to me, like what when I saywhat would love do?
Well, it would be curious.
It would say, wow, I wonderwhat got them so upset.
(20:17):
I wonder what's going on intheir life, or I wonder, oh,
that's interesting, or evencurious with myself.
I wonder, I wonder if I couldjust stay relaxed and loving,
how this might completelychange.
I mean, this is again anotherone of Byron Katie's.
It says, you know, whensomeone's yelling at you or
screaming or accusing you of allthe stuff, you know, one of the
(20:38):
base, the best comebacks I'veever heard is like you just say
to them, you know, and you haveto say it from curiosity and
love...
you know, you might be right.
Like, I'm so sorry that you'refeeling this way.
And you might be right.
I'll look at that.
You're not defending it.
You're not even telling themthat they are 100% right, they
(20:59):
might be right.
That's not a hundred percent.
If you have your willingnessto stay curious to say, yeah,
you know, I'm curious, I'll lookat that, then they don't...
you didn't throw them energyfor them to throw back at you.
Maren Oslac (21:11):
Yeah, it just diffuses it, right?
Stephanie Allen (21:14):
You basically held on to your to your energy,
you didn't throw it away.
So now you have that energy tolook inside yourself, to be
curious instead of reactive.
Maren Oslac (21:24):
I love that.
And you know, when you'retalking about the the love
thing, I want you all in ouraudience, everyone think of a
time when you were when you werein like the blush of love and
how much energy you had, and hownothing bothered you, and how
creative you were, and you know,like all the things that come
(21:46):
from that, they all live insideof us. That didn't happen from
something outside of us.
So cultivating that place oflove within ourselves cultivates
all of those attributes.
It's like this amazing wealth,you know, it's like we're
looking out there for thefountain of youth.
Guess what?
You just found it.
There it is, it lives within itwithin us, each one of us.
Stephanie Allen (22:10):
So yeah, and so 'picking your hard'.
I first of all I want to thankour listeners because this came
from one of our listeners tosay...
can you talk about picking thehard, you know, finding your
hard, you know?
It's like pick your hard.
And I just want to say thankyou.
And I totally invite and giveyou all permission to give us,
you know, give us some ideas ofsome things that you would like
(22:32):
us to talk about or unpackbecause we're doing this for you
and with you.
So, and and we go through thiswith you too.
So if there's some things thatyou're just like, man, I really
want to hear more about that, orhow can I work through this,
you know, drop us an email, oryou know, get in touch with us.
(22:52):
For sure.
We'd love to, and we're sograteful that you're that you're
listening and that you areoffering us some great
insights. Remember, so when it'shard, pick your hard.
Coming back around to that,it's like when something hard is
coming up, this is what I dofor myself.
I go, there must be somethingreally great in my future.
There's my curiosity.
(23:13):
There must be something reallygreat in my future that's
coming.
I wonder what this is helpingme grow into.
And that it's preparing me sothat I can receive the incoming,
the really great future thatwants to happen.
Maren Oslac (23:31):
I love that.
So Stephanie mentioned that youcan contact us.
The way to do that is on ourFacebook page or our LinkedIn
page at The Soulful Leaders.
You can also find us on YouTubeat The Soulful Leaders, or you
can always drop us a line atwww.TheSoulfulLeaderPodcast.com
or at www.TSLP.life (TSLP is theSoulful Leader Project.) We
(23:58):
have started an entire projectaround this because it's so
important to us.
And we would love to have yoube a part of our project, which
is basically a project for life.
So we'll look forward tohearing from you, and we'll see
you all in two weeks on TheSoulful Leader Podcast.
Stephanie Allen (24:24):
And that wraps up another episode of the
Soulful Leader Podcast with yourhosts, Stephanie Allen and
Maren Oslac.
Maren Oslac (24:32):
Thank you for listening.
If you'd like to dive deeper,head over to our website
at www.TheSoulfulLeaderPodcast.com
Stephanie Allen (24:41):
Until next time.
In a world where we have everything and
it's still not enough, we'reoften left wondering, is this
really it?
Maren Oslac (00:10):
Deep inside, you know there's more to life.
You're ready to leave behindthe old push your way through
and claim the deeper, moremeaningful life that's calling
you.
That's what we invite you toexplore with us.
We're your hosts, StephanieAllen and Marin Oslac.
Stephaine and Maren (00:26):
And this is The Soulful Leader Podcast.
Stephanie Allen (00:30):
Yay! Hi, have you ever really struggled with
something?
And you're like, man, this isso freaking hard, and you just
can't seem to let it go.
And you've done everything.
You might have said somethingto someone to try to make them
change, and they still keepdoing it, and you're like, frig,
this being in a relationship ishard, or this losing weight is
(00:53):
hard, or this, you know, workingout is changing my health is
really hard.
And we just say that, oh, it'sso hard, it's so hard, it's so
hard all the time.
And I wanted to start with astory with that because it kind
of leads into what Maren and Iare gonna unfold today a little
bit.
But there's a story of a...
it's a...
I think it's a Zen or aBuddhist story, and it's about
(01:16):
two monks that are going alongon a silent pilgrimage.
They're walking along the sideof a river, and they come to a
crossing and the river has beenflooded, the bridge is no longer
there.
And the older monk sees thatthere's a woman who's struggling
to try to get across the river.
Now, as Zen monks, they havetaken a vow of not only silence,
(01:39):
but also of not touchinganother female.
But this monk sees that thiswoman is really struggling, and
he picks her up and he carriesher across the river and sets
her down.
And she no more says thank youor what kindness, she's just
like totally self-righteous andindignant about the whole thing.
(02:02):
And on they go on theirpilgrimage and you know,
continue walking.
But after about an hour, theyounger monk says to the older
monk, I'm sorry, I have to breakmy silence.
This is driving me crazy.
He goes, first of all, youbroke our vow, the vow to help
or you know to pick up the womanand took her across.
And then she never even saidthank you.
He said, I am just so annoyedhow rude she was, how absolutely
(02:27):
disrespectful she was.
And the older monk turns tolook to the younger monk and
says, I put her down an hourago.
Why are you still carrying her?
And I think there's a real keyto that when we get going on in
our 'oh, it's so hard, it's sohard'.
What is it that's giving it tous?
Like what is it, what is theneed within ourselves that we
(02:49):
are expecting another in theouter world to fill it for us,
whether it's a system or aperson or I don't know, the
weather or something, but wejust get so irritated.
Maren Oslac (03:00):
So you know I think to help clarify why and how
that story applies to thehardness in our lives.
Like, it's like there's there'sthe doing - the action of
carrying this woman across theriver, right?
So there might be an actionthat needs to be taken in our
(03:23):
lives.
You mentioned losing weight orbeing in a relationship or
whatever, right?
So that's the action in and ofitself, and then what oftentimes
makes it feel so hard is thestory we tell ourselves.
Stephanie Allen (03:36):
Oh, yeah.
Oh, big one right there.
Like if you could go inside andgo, what story am I telling
myself?
What am I making this about?
Maren Oslac (03:45):
And that's what the the older monk did, right?
He didn't tell a story aboutit, he just carried her across
the river, did his thing, and helet go of it.
The younger monk told a storyabout it.
You broke your vows, and shewasn't grateful, and there was
this, and you know, like he washolding on to the story, and
(04:06):
that's what we do to ourselves,and we don't realize it because
you know that you use the wordsrighteous justification.
I've been using that.
It's so interesting becausethat's been so up in my own life
of like, where am I, where do Ifeel righteously justified to
have my opinion?
And oh my gosh, what aninteresting story that is.
(04:30):
And I realize how much anger itallows me to hold, and like
that indignation.
I'm so much better.
Oh my gosh, it causes a lot ofpain.
And you know, when you say itmakes things harder.
I have a great example.
(04:51):
I have been having yard workdone, and the young man that's
been helping me, he's awonderful teenager, and he's a
wonderful teenager, right?
So you know, he getsdistracted, and not all the
stuff that I wanted to get donegot done.
I went out and worked withhim for a few hours, and we
(05:12):
literally did in three hourswhat had like he had been taking
two weeks to do.
Normal, everyday everything,right?
So I was a little bit, youknow, I was saying that, telling
my husband, I was telling Jeff,and he looked at me, he goes,
you know what, how how much didyou pay this kid throughout the
summer?
I told him the amount. He said,if you had just called a
(05:34):
landscaping company and said,hey, I would like this done.
How much do you think it wouldhave cost you?
I was like, probably about thesame amount.
He goes, and then you wouldhave had the whole summer do
what you wanted to do.
And I just looked at him and Iwas like, it was such a simple
thing, and it just lightened myheart.
And I thought, how interesting.
(05:57):
Instead, I've been holding onto this, like, yeah, this
righteousness of like, well, youknow, how do I help him to work
better?
Meaning this kid, right?
Not mine to do, he's not mychild.
An illustration of that whole,does it need to be that hard?
(06:21):
Am I holding on to somethingthat's not even mine to hold on
to?
Can I let it go?
Is there another way?
If I didn't have thatpreconceived idea in my head, if
I had let go of it, I mighthave thought of that four months
ago and had you know a wholedifferent experience.
Stephanie Allen (06:40):
But you know, here's the thing
help a kid, or did you?
I think there's that oldsaying, it's like, you know,
everyone wants to change theworld, no one wants to change
themselves.
And it's like, how might youhave shown up to that young
person differently?
You know, there's...
and and internally withinyourself.
And I'm constantly looking atthat too, is like when something
(07:01):
is hard and it's not working,you know, we it's so easy to
say, well, it was them.
It's them, it's all them.
And it might be.
I'm not saying it's not.
But it's like, well, what mightit be calling in me to change
or do differently?
You know, I can totally... andthat's the harder path is to to
look inside and go, okay, whatif I thought differently?
(07:24):
What if I asked a differentquestion?
You know, I think you and Italked about this the other day.
It's like that young person hadjust said, hey, look, what do
you see needs to be done?
What are you looking here in myyard that I probably need to
have done?
And he may not have even said,nothing, it looks fine.
And then that could be anopportunity to say, well, let me
(07:45):
share with something.
Here's where my end goal is.
This is what I'm workingtowards.
You know, and I think that'sreally helpful is to tell
someone, hey, this is where I'mlooking towards.
Because sometimes people think,well, why are you doing it?
Like we've lost our why.
Why are you married?
Why are you losing weight?
Why, why do you want to get ingood shape or have health?
Or why do you want to have a,you know, a really a new
(08:05):
business at your age, or youknow, you've just had a career.
Why do you want to start a newbusiness now?
I don't think we ask enoughquestions to say, well, why?
And what does that mean to you?
And what stories are youtelling yourself about?
Because it's those internalfreaking stories that make it
hard.
I think that's, you know, whenwe say pick your hard. What are
(08:29):
you telling yourself?
Like, who would you be withoutthat story?
You know, Byron Katie does somegreat work.
I really love her stuff calledThe Work.
I think it's www.thework.com,check it out, because she really
has a great way of lookinginternally to ask yourself, you
know, is that true?
Like what am I...
what's really got me agitated?
And is it true?
(08:50):
And how do I know that it'strue?
And then to be able to actuallywork with it and actually turn
it around.
Meaning, you know, maybe it'sa way that you're approaching
it, or maybe it's actuallyyou're creating the hardness.
It's not hard at all.
It's food for thought.
Maren Oslac (09:09):
I completely agree with you, and I do love Byron
Katie's work.
And one of the things youmentioned is 'pick your hard.
So I want to go deeper into pickyour hard because you know,
it's like somebody listening islike, what?
Pick my hard? I'm gonna givean example.
Like, say you have a conflictwith a co-worker or a spouse or
(09:32):
a child or whomever, right?
And you get agitated with thatperson.
They're not picking theirclothes up, say, same at home or
you know, at work, they're justlike you've asked them three
times for that proposal andthey're just not getting it
done.
And you're walking around andyou're kind of like the monk,
the young monk, you're carryingthat story of what it means that
(09:58):
they're not getting whatever itis done.
They're not picking theirclothes up, they're not getting
it.
They disrespect me, it meansthey don't care about me, it
means they don't give a shitabout their job, it means that
like all of the the...
Stephanie (10:10):
AND...right there...
put a pause, get an image ofthat, all/ y'all out there
listening to that, because youimagine all those little thought
bubbles that are coming out ofthis person's head and their
energy and their behavior andthe way they're holding their
posture.
That's a lot of energy.
A lot of energy.
Maren Oslac (10:25):
So, meaning me, like I'm the one with all of
those thought bubbles and blahblah blah, right?
Now imagine how hard that is.
I get to carry that aroundbecause that's how I experience
my day.
I'm complaining about thatperson all day long, I'm
complaining about them insidemyself, I'm complaining about
them to other people, and itfeels really hard and crunching,
(10:48):
right?
And then we're told, you know,that's a reflection of you.
All you have to do is go insideand look at yourself, and it
seems so simple, and we're like,frick, that's so hard.
Stephanie Allen (11:01):
It is hard.
Maren Oslac (11:03):
And so that's where you're right.
It is hard.
My question is, is it harderthan carrying around all that
crap all day long, complainingabout people, staying up until
two in the morning because allthe mind chatter has you going,
(11:26):
waking up tired because youcouldn't get to sleep because
the mind...
like, is it...?
Stephanie Allen (11:31):
...your digestion is completely
dysfunctional? So now you're notable to digest those thoughts
as well as digest your food.
And so we hang out, we getweighted down by our job, by our
relationships, and we thinkit's the job and the
relationship or life when reallyit's the internal process that
you're hanging on, it's actuallylike a burden.
Maren Oslac (11:53):
So when Stephanie says 'Pick your Hard' that's
what she means.
At least my interpretation ofwhat you mean by that is like it
is challenging to go inside andpeel the layers, to be honest
with yourself and be like, oh,I'm complaining about that
person because I see that sideof myself and I don't like it.
Stephanie Allen (12:18):
Yeah, it brings out the worst in me.
Maren Oslac (12:20):
Right?
So it's much easier to complainabout that person than to
actually look inside.
And my question is, is it?
Because what I found for myselfis that when I do the work,
when I go inside and I choosethe hard of going inside, the
hard quote unquote, for thosewho can't see me, quote -
(12:43):
unquote hard of going inside,it's actually a lot easier, not
only on me, but on myrelationships, on the people
around me, on my digestion, onlike all the stuff.
Stephanie Allen (12:56):
Yeah, you'll get life force back.
Maren Oslac (12:58):
Oh my God...
Stephanie Allen (12:58):
You'll get you'll get some insight and
awareness.
I think, you know, like likelike you say, when we pick your
hard, it is hard to go inside.
To stop, feel the freakingfeelings.
To feel them is to heal them,and then not...
you know, I've been using thisa lot...
is to observe them, not absorbthem, but to give yourself some
space and go, look at me go.
(13:19):
There I am.
I'm just a completely hot messover whatever it is, or I'm
like, you know, I'm upset, I'msad, I'm angry, I'm afraid,
whatever it might be.
And you're like, wow, what am Ibelieving?
What am I believing right now?
And what is that doing for me?
And I'm not saying to ignoreit.
Hell no.
In fact, actually, I'm sayingthe opposite.
I'm actually going inside andworking with yourself with love,
(13:41):
compassion, and kindness, notwith fierceness, not with
harshness, but to actually justgive yourself some space to look
within and find that because itcan be it's coming up because
it wants healing, it wantstransformation.
And of course, we thinkintellectually, we go, well, I
want transformation with him orwith her or with the system or
with this.
And it's like, no, it'sactually coming up so that you
(14:03):
can transform it, so that youactually will live in a
different world.
Maren Oslac (14:07):
What you mean is you want, like when you say I
want transformation with him,with her, with the system,
whatever, you mean you wantpeople to change, right?
Stephanie Allen (14:16):
You got it.
Maren Oslac (14:16):
I want the system to change.
Stephanie Allen (14:18):
Control! I don't want to change.
Why should I have to be the onethat always changes?
I'm always the one thatchanges.
Blah blah blah blah.
I mean, I can that's myselftalking right here.
My deeper, my deeper irritatedself that says, why don't...
why is it always me?
And the answer what one of myteachers would always say is,
well, why not you?
Like, if you can, if you spotit, you got it.
(14:38):
You know, that old saying youput one finger forward, there's
three pointing back at you.
You know, it's like thetrigger.
It's like you spot it, you gotit.
It's like, well, how do I workwith it if I spot it?
In a way that's loving and kindwithin myself.
And so that I can...
I can rise above it would beanother way of transforming it.
I can rise above it.
It's still maybe there, but itno longer has me by the short
(15:00):
hairs, it's no longer pullingme.
Maren Oslac (15:03):
So the interesting thing is that when you say, you
know, control, the controlthing, the interesting thing is
that we are so busy trying tocontrol all the stuff out there.
And we can't control any ofthat.
The thing that we actually havepower over is ourselves and
what we like, we actually whenwe do this turning inward, doing
(15:24):
the work within, suddenly wehave control, right?
That's where it lives, is inhere.
And like when you said why notme?
Yeah, because me is where allof the change can happen, and
it's amazing.
And you know, for years I wouldhear people great beings talk
(15:52):
about transformation.
When you transform yourself,the world changes, and I really
didn't understand that until itstarted happening to me and
realizing that like literallywhen I change myself, the things
outside all around me change,and ideas flow, and I have more
(16:16):
energy and all of the stuff.
And so I think that as we'relooking at it, we're gonna hold
and suspend judgment for just amoment.
Like that's I think the firststep when I look at this whole
process of okay, if we weregonna break it down and be like,
(16:36):
okay, here's your answer.
Not that there's answers outthere, and here's your process.
The first step is stop.
It's funny, Stephanie and I haddone a workshop probably about
four years ago now, and we werelike, stop, drop in, stop, you
know, the whole stop, drop, androll thing, and then it became
(16:56):
stop, drop, and whatever.
It's like stop and drop in,just stop for a moment and ask
what's the story?
What's the story that's causingthe angst, the anger, the shit?
Stephanie Allen (17:08):
Yeah, and if you can look at it with love
instead of black and whiteconcrete thinking, like it's got
to be right or wrong, or goodor bad, or you know, I'm
justified, or if you can let allthat go and just observe it.
Like I said, observe, don'tabsorb, but just observe it as
if you're watching it on a moviescreen or on a TV set.
Like just observe without theneutrality.
(17:29):
And that alone, right there, isa practice.
It's like, okay, don't judgeit.
Just like, wow, that'sinteresting.
Look at how the body is beingheld, look at how the breath is
being held.
You know, look at all thosethought bubbles that are flying
around there, or that person'snot even listening to each
other.
It's like, well, what if thiswas an opportunity for growth
(17:51):
and love and connection?
Like, I think that's the otherpart of it, too, is like picking
your hard is that it to comefrom love rather than I want to
fight it or I want to run away.
Maren Oslac (18:02):
Yeah.
Stephanie Allen (18:03):
But to look at from like what would love do?
How would a loving presence bepresent to myself first?
Like, not and I'm not saying,you know, you gotta stay in a
really dangerous situation.
I'm not saying that, but it'slike most of the times it's just
irritating, it's not dangerous,it's just irritating.
And when it's irritating tosay, well, what would love do in
this moment?
(18:23):
You know, would it sayanything?
Would it just...
and it's if it's not about me,maybe it is about this other
person that's having a meltdownin front of me.
It's like, what would love do?
It's like I would listen, Iwould be kind to myself and to
them, and I would tell myselfI'm safe and go and rest within
that safe spot within me,because there is a safe spot
(18:45):
within all of us.
If you can like relax theshoulders, what's my body doing
right now?
Like, take care of yourself inthat moment without having to
react or defend.
Maren Oslac (18:55):
And I think the most interesting thing for me is
that safe spot is...
I'm gonna use the wordnever, maybe it's occasionally,
and hardly ever, ever in ourheads.
Stephanie Allen (19:10):
Oh, most definitely.
Maren Oslac (19:12):
It's in our hearts, and we're so defensive about
our hearts that we close it upand we go up into our heads, and
that actually causes a lot moreproblems because our hearts are
where always where thesolutions are, where the where
love is is where the solutionis.
(19:32):
And so when we say stop anddrop in, it's literally dropping
out of the all of the mentalgymnastics that are going on in
our heads and dropping into ourhearts and into our souls, into
a deeper part of ourselves, outof almost always when you are
dropped into your heart, that'sthe place of where you fall in
(19:56):
love.
Stephanie Allen (19:56):
And when you whether you're in love with a
person, whether you're in lovewith a project, whether you're
in love with something that isbeautiful to you, you become
very curious.
You're like, wow, look at that.
I wonder what that...?
So to me, like what when I saywhat would love do?
Well, it would be curious.
It would say, wow, I wonderwhat got them so upset.
(20:17):
I wonder what's going on intheir life, or I wonder, oh,
that's interesting, or evencurious with myself.
I wonder, I wonder if I couldjust stay relaxed and loving,
how this might completelychange.
I mean, this is again anotherone of Byron Katie's.
It says, you know, whensomeone's yelling at you or
screaming or accusing you of allthe stuff, you know, one of the
(20:38):
base, the best comebacks I'veever heard is like you just say
to them, you know, and you haveto say it from curiosity and
love...
you know, you might be right.
Like, I'm so sorry that you'refeeling this way.
And you might be right.
I'll look at that.
You're not defending it.
You're not even telling themthat they are 100% right, they
(20:59):
might be right.
That's not a hundred percent.
If you have your willingnessto stay curious to say, yeah,
you know, I'm curious, I'll lookat that, then they don't...
you didn't throw them energyfor them to throw back at you.
Maren Oslac (21:11):
Yeah, it just diffuses it, right?
Stephanie Allen (21:14):
You basically held on to your to your energy,
you didn't throw it away.
So now you have that energy tolook inside yourself, to be
curious instead of reactive.
Maren Oslac (21:24):
I love that.
And you know, when you'retalking about the the love
thing, I want you all in ouraudience, everyone think of a
time when you were when you werein like the blush of love and
how much energy you had, and hownothing bothered you, and how
creative you were, and you know,like all the things that come
(21:46):
from that, they all live insideof us. That didn't happen from
something outside of us.
So cultivating that place oflove within ourselves cultivates
all of those attributes.
It's like this amazing wealth,you know, it's like we're
looking out there for thefountain of youth.
Guess what?
You just found it.
There it is, it lives within itwithin us, each one of us.
Stephanie Allen (22:10):
So yeah, and so 'picking your hard'.
I first of all I want to thankour listeners because this came
from one of our listeners tosay...
can you talk about picking thehard, you know, finding your
hard, you know?
It's like pick your hard.
And I just want to say thankyou.
And I totally invite and giveyou all permission to give us,
you know, give us some ideas ofsome things that you would like
(22:32):
us to talk about or unpackbecause we're doing this for you
and with you.
So, and and we go through thiswith you too.
So if there's some things thatyou're just like, man, I really
want to hear more about that, orhow can I work through this,
you know, drop us an email, oryou know, get in touch with us.
(22:52):
For sure.
We'd love to, and we're sograteful that you're that you're
listening and that you areoffering us some great
insights. Remember, so when it'shard, pick your hard.
Coming back around to that,it's like when something hard is
coming up, this is what I dofor myself.
I go, there must be somethingreally great in my future.
There's my curiosity.
(23:13):
There must be something reallygreat in my future that's
coming.
I wonder what this is helpingme grow into.
And that it's preparing me sothat I can receive the incoming,
the really great future thatwants to happen.
Maren Oslac (23:31):
I love that.
So Stephanie mentioned that youcan contact us.
The way to do that is on ourFacebook page or our LinkedIn
page at The Soulful Leaders.
You can also find us on YouTubeat The Soulful Leaders, or you
can always drop us a line atwww.TheSoulfulLeaderPodcast.com
or at www.TSLP.life (TSLP is theSoulful Leader Project.) We
(23:58):
have started an entire projectaround this because it's so
important to us.
And we would love to have yoube a part of our project, which
is basically a project for life.
So we'll look forward tohearing from you, and we'll see
you all in two weeks on TheSoulful Leader Podcast.
Stephanie Allen (24:24):
And that wraps up another episode of the
Soulful Leader Podcast with yourhosts, Stephanie Allen and
Maren Oslac.
Maren Oslac (24:32):
Thank you for listening.
If you'd like to dive deeper,head over to our website
at www.TheSoulfulLeaderPodcast.com
Stephanie Allen (24:41):
Until next time.
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