Unlock the secrets of longevity and cognitive health with our special guests, Nicholas Tubach and Dan Weiner. In this episode, we promise you'll gain invaluable insights into the critical role the gut microbiome plays in overall well-being. Nicholas shares his unique journey from the humanities to biotech, driven by a passion for optimizing human health, while Dan reveals how the immune system influences aging, obesity, and diabetes. Prepare to be fascinated by their groundbreaking work with Propion, a company pioneering in gut microbiome science to promote whole-body health.
Discover how tryptophan metabolites, especially indole-propionic acid, are revolutionizing our understanding of gut and brain health. Learn about the innovative products that Nicholas and Dan are developing, which aim to enhance longevity and cognitive function by targeting immune cells, reducing inflammation, and strengthening the gut barrier. Explore the unique benefits of their proprietary blend, which combines pea protein, nitric oxide boosters, and antioxidants to redirect tryptophan metabolism toward beneficial pathways, potentially boosting melatonin and serotonin production.
Finally, join us as we discuss the exciting future plans for Propion. Nicholas and Dan share their vision for expanding product development into skincare, pharmaceuticals, and even pet food. They also delve into their plans to make their products more accessible by developing pill forms. This episode offers a compelling look at how optimizing the gut microbiome could be the key to unlocking a healthier, longer life. Don't miss the pre-sale information for their dark chocolate flavored blend, starting this Friday at propion.com!
Discover how tryptophan metabolites, especially indole-propionic acid, are revolutionizing our understanding of gut and brain health. Learn about the innovative products that Nicholas and Dan are developing, which aim to enhance longevity and cognitive function by targeting immune cells, reducing inflammation, and strengthening the gut barrier. Explore the unique benefits of their proprietary blend, which combines pea protein, nitric oxide boosters, and antioxidants to redirect tryptophan metabolism toward beneficial pathways, potentially boosting melatonin and serotonin production.
Finally, join us as we discuss the exciting future plans for Propion. Nicholas and Dan share their vision for expanding product development into skincare, pharmaceuticals, and even pet food. They also delve into their plans to make their products more accessible by developing pill forms. This episode offers a compelling look at how optimizing the gut microbiome could be the key to unlocking a healthier, longer life. Don't miss the pre-sale information for their dark chocolate flavored blend, starting this Friday at propion.com!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello everyone, welcome to another episode of
the Stephen McCain podcast,where I bring you people making
world-class decisions in thefield of human optimization and
performance.
Today's episode is going to beabout the microbiome and the
importance of keeping a healthymicrobiome.
If you've ever had anythinglike dysbiosis small intestinal
(00:21):
bacteria overgrowth you knowthat you do not want to mess
with your gut.
It is now considered one of thehallmarks of aging, and keeping
this thing in tip top shapeactually has a lot more
downstream health effects inmany different ways, and my
guests today are some of thesmartest guys in the room, and
they're going to talk about anew gut metabolite.
(00:43):
That is really something thatcould be interesting, and so
it's my first time to ever havetwo people on the show.
And just to let you know, wemight get a little bit into the
weeds with some science, but hey, that's what we do here.
So my first person I want tointroduce is Nicholas Tubach.
He's a good friend of mine.
Actually, we're in a fulldisclosure.
(01:04):
He and I are in a littlebusiness together, trying to
create a longevity series, andwe also have Dan Weiner.
So, nicholas, welcome to theshow.
Thanks, hey, stephen.
How are you doing?
Good?
And Dan, welcome to the show aswell.
Yeah, thanks for having me.
I appreciate you guys coming on.
(01:26):
So, nicholas, why don't youtell us a little bit about your
bio, who you are, why you're inthis industry and what you're
doing?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
I was originally born in Berkeley, california, and I
also went to UC Berkeley where Istudied molecular and cell
biology and techentrepreneurship and one of the
things running in the background.
I was mostly a humanitiesperson, growing up, studying
English literature, history.
Those were my main subjects inschool.
But when I got to college, oneof the topics that started to
(01:52):
really sit in my mind was humanoptimization, maximizing your
brain's operating power, orslowing ager, aging slower.
Sorry, I'm somebody who wouldlike to stay as young as I can,
as long as possible, and that iswhat got me into biotech.
(02:14):
This is the third company thatI've started.
Naturally, I've only startedthem in the last few years and
so you wouldn't have heard anybig names yet.
But I became interested inusing chemicals as a way to
augment human biology.
So that led me down the road ofwhat can we do to protect our
(02:34):
brain as we age, optimizesynaptic function, just that
main topic and that's where mymain interest lies is in
neurology and neurobiology.
But I'll stop there and I'lljust link that later to why
Propion was founded down thecall.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Fantastic, dan, what about you?
Tell us a little bit aboutyourself.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Yeah, hi.
I'm an associate professor atthe Buck Institute for Research
on Aging, also affiliated withUniversity of Southern
California and the University ofToronto.
I started my career off as amedical doctor.
I graduated from the Universityof Ottawa after studying
immunology during myundergraduate degree at
(03:14):
University of Toronto and thenfrom there I went on to study
anatomical pathology and thendid a research postdoc at
Stanford University, trying tounderstand how the immune system
controls diseases like obesityand diabetes.
During that time we made a lotof interesting discoveries,
especially in how immune cellscalled T cells and B cells and
we can get into this more laterhow they control inflammation
(03:37):
and throughout the body,especially in tissues like fat
tissue and also the intestine,and then from there this
intestinal immune system, oncewe realize it has implications
controlling health, healthyaging and disease.
It's one of the things westarted focusing in on and
that's one of my major areas ofresearch right now the immune
system in obesity, diabetes andAIDS.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Interesting Great field if you can make some
changes.
Obesity is a massive topic.
I would be interested inhearing your thoughts on these
GLP-1 agonists and GIP-1s, butmaybe we'll pin that for later
because I want to get in to thiscompany that you guys have
started and it sounds reallyexciting.
Nicholas, maybe tell us alittle bit about Propion and
(04:22):
what it does.
What is this company and tellus about it?
Speaker 2 (04:25):
maybe tell us a little bit about Propion and
what it does.
What is this company?
And tell us about it?
Yeah, first of all, dan isextraordinarily humble.
He's a professor at threedifferent universities,
collaborates with NASA andSpaceX on studying how the
immune system operates inmicrogravity environment.
The number one thing I'll sayis that starting Propion with
him is an incredible privilegefor me, having just come out of
school.
The purpose of Propion is reallysimple it's to help you age
(04:48):
slower and live longer andpotentially even amplify your
health when you're older.
And it's not just me sayingthat.
Dan here is my scientificco-founder and he and I have
begun developing.
Actually, we're fully completedwith developing one product,
but we've begun developing.
Actually we're fully completedwith developing one product, but
we've begun developing thesocietal interest in this
(05:09):
science that could genuinelyslow down how you age and the
mechanisms behind that are allthings that Dan will talk about.
But I first approached him toadvise me on immunological
pathways in Alzheimer's disease.
To advise me on immunologicalpathways in Alzheimer's disease,
so how the immune system worksin the brain and what
inflammatory mechanisms arebeing over-activated.
(05:30):
Potentially that could betargeted to reduce inflammation,
reduce cognitive decline forpeople with Alzheimer's.
And as we got to talking aboutdifferent ways to enhance
neuroprotection for example, thebrain's resilience to toxins or
inflammation, actuallydown-regulating inflammatory
pathways directly by targetingimmune cells.
(05:51):
Or neuroregeneration,reintroducing cognitive function
to the brain Propion came froma branch of research that was
really about neuroprotection,and when we talk about the gut
microbiome, we're not justtalking about the gut itself, a
totally closed system.
We're really talking about wholebody health, and a big part of
that is the brain and how notjust the way the gut functions,
(06:14):
but as being part of gutmicrobiome science, because your
gut microbiome is where youabsorb those ingredients from.
However, when you get anutritional supplement company,
they aren't saying this is allabout the gut.
So really, when you say we're agut microbiome science company,
(06:36):
I'd say we're really a wholebody health company with
technology that originates fromthe gut microbiome.
And this technology that I'mreferring to are molecules that
were originally discussed inliterature as being highly
neuroprotective.
What that means is that theyprotected neurons' ability to
survive and function in the faceof toxin.
And then it turns out that it'sactually the gut that is
(06:59):
producing these molecules andthat they have additional
functions in the epithelialbarrier of the gut, so the gut
wall, as well as proteinreceptors in the skin, the liver
and that's whole axis.
Right there really means thatit's our company is about
enhancing whole body function,and that's why we talk about
(07:21):
this as a longevity company asopposed to just a gut microbiome
health company.
So these metabolites that I'mreferring to, these molecules
that are neuroprotective, thatoriginate from the gut
microbiome and also stimulateregenerative function, that is
what this company is all about,and the vision that I have for
it is that propion really couldbe in every household in America
(07:43):
, because what all I justdescribed it applies to
absolutely everybody.
There's not a person in theworld to whom brain function,
gut dysbiosis, gut function, thegut-body axis isn't relevant to
, and I think we're bringingsome highly unique technological
insight in the form of aconsumer product or multiple
(08:06):
consumer product to everyone inthat way.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
So yeah, if you've ever been around anybody with a
compromised gut, you canliterally see their brain change
, their behaviors change, andyou clearly also.
If you know what you're lookingfor, you'll see immune system
issues as well.
It is disastrous, especiallywhen you think about how
non-discretional people are withwhatever they eat.
(08:30):
You go to a restaurant and youare rolling the dice, so to
speak.
The food.
There's so much stuff that issprayed on our food.
There are so many really likebad things for the gut and the
environment.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
I don't think you should necessarily blame it all
on the consumer, though, becausea lot of it is just the choices
that were faced with.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Oh, no, I'm not a hundred percent.
I had what's his name, DavePascoe on the podcast and he's
ranked in the top five top sixof the regeneration Olympics.
That guy grows his own food.
He's controlling a lot, and sonot everyone is up for that kind
of thing.
Not everyone's goal is to benumber one on the longevity
board.
Like people have busy livesthey have to go about and do
(09:10):
their thing.
So let's get to this.
What is Propion?
What are we talking about here?
Speaker 3 (09:18):
I can tell you a bit about some of these metabolites
and what they do.
The first as people get olderor people when they start
developing chronic diseases likeobesity, diabetes, insulin
resistance, cardiovasculardisease, their gut changes,
especially their gut bacteria.
Usually what happens is thatthe gut microbiome, it will
(09:39):
shrink in diversity to matchthese changes in dietary and
environmental patterns.
These dietary patterns could beeating more things like
processed foods, saturated fats,sugar.
Environmental patterns could bethings like taking a round of
antibiotics.
All of these things haveprofound effect on your gut
microbiome.
(09:59):
So one of the family ofmetabolites that gets
downregulated across suchconditions are tryptophan
metabolites, and that's what thetarget that propane is trying
to go after right now.
So tryptophan just a little bitof background broken down by
pathways inside your body andalso pathways inside the gut
microbiota.
(10:19):
Inside your body they're brokendown by things like in the
intestine.
They can form molecules likeserotonin, where they cause a.
By things like in the intestine.
They can form molecules likeserotonin where they cause a
controlled motility in the gut.
They can be broken down fartherup in the brain where they can
form things like melatonin,which is an antioxidant to
control sleep-wake cycles.
But they can also bemetabolized through a whole
battery of other metabolites,through these enzymes called TDO
(10:41):
and IDO.
In addition to these endogenouspathways inside the body,
tryptophan can also bemetabolized by the gut bacteria
into a whole slew of beneficialmetabolites.
Some of these will be thefamous ones of these things like
indole-3-aldehyde, andespecially this molecule called
indole-propionic acid.
(11:02):
So these are the ones thatwe're really interested in,
these beneficial metabolitesthat are produced by gut
bacteria, and how do thesethings work?
So basically Do you want that?
Speaker 1 (11:13):
slide.
Should we pull up a slide?
You want me to pull up a slidefor you guys?
Speaker 3 (11:19):
Yeah, you can pull up a slide now, I think, where I
can talk about how these thingsactually function.
I'll just go through it brieflythough.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
Yeah, bring it up.
So for everyone that'slistening to this, we're
actually pulling up a slide thatyou'll be able to see if you're
watching this on YouTube, butwe'll try to talk it out.
Is this the right slide?
Speaker 3 (11:40):
tube, but we'll try to talk it out.
Is this the right slide?
Yeah, yeah.
So I'll just just in brief.
Metabolites, indole propionicacid produced by these bacteria
in the gut I'm going to callthat IPA for now, and something
like indole-3-aldehyde I'll callas I3A.
So these metabolites, they bindto receptors in the gut lining
and also to the gut immune cellswhich line the intestine.
They also they also bind to, asI mentioned, to targets in the
(12:08):
brain Nicholas alluded to liverskin as well.
In the gut, as that diagramshows, they induce this cytokine
called IL-22.
It should be in there, if it'snot.
That's the main cytokine thatit induces.
So what it does?
It binds to these targets.
One of them is called the AHR,the other is called the PXR.
These are present in theepithelial lining, these are the
cells that line the intestineand also in some of the immune
(12:30):
cells themselves, and so whenthey bind in the immune cells
they produce this moleculecalled IL-22.
This is a highly reparativecytokine.
It induces repair programs inyour intestine.
It strengthens the gut barrier.
It acts on specific cells inthe intestine to produce
antimicrobial peptides and thesekind of prevent dangerous
(12:50):
bacteria from entering.
These molecules are also verystrong antioxidants actually
some of the strongestantioxidants known where they
can reduce free oxygen and freenitrogen.
Radical similar metabolitesthat are also produced through
this tryptophan metabolismpathway can also produce glp-1.
I remember at the beginning youwere interested in glp-1, so
(13:12):
this would be harnessing.
This pathway would be like anatural way to boost glp-1
production.
There's also also been a wholenumber of preclinical studies on
these molecules, especially IPA.
They show that they can reducefat and cholesterol production,
also reduce scarring, also knownas fibrosis, especially in
things like the liver, and canreduce kind of glucose
(13:36):
absorption from the gut.
So there's a whole diversearray of mechanisms that play
here and this slide nicelysummarizes a bunch of them here.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
Yeah, so basically, all these benefits that you're
referring to are from thePropion-1 molecule.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
Yes, and Propion-1 is what we call
Indole-3-Propionic-A.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
Got it, and so your product?
Is it straight Propion-1 or isit some sort of prebiotic that's
creating Propion-1?
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Our first product is a blend of precursor ingredients
that helps your body assemblePropion-1 naturally.
Dan can get a little bit moreinto how it works.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Got it Okay, yeah, so real quick.
So your product is somethingthat helps the body make or the
gut make propion-1, and thenpropion-1 is decreasing a bunch
of negative things like thesefatty acid synthesis,
cholesterol synthesis, lipidperoxidation, and it's
increasing all of these otherbeneficial things that Dan
(14:38):
alluded to.
And it's increasing all ofthese other beneficial things
that Dan alluded to.
Now, what if because it seemslike from this slide that all of
this has to do with Propion-1actually targeting or hitting
the inner gut lining what ifyour inner gut lining is
compromised?
Is that an issue?
Is this something that you needa healthy gut in order to
(14:59):
benefit from?
That's a really good question.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
One of the things that, especially with the
propion blend product, one ofthe advantages that we have here
is that we're actually feedingthe raw precursors, or the foods
that these beneficial bacteriaactually like to eat.
So we're actually feeding thesebacteria that might be reduced
with age or obesity or includinga number of other conditions
(15:24):
where the gut barrier may not beintact.
These bacteria are oftenreduced and by giving them the
foods they like to eat, they'llactually expand, and there has
been preclinical studies showingyou can expand these bacteria
giving the right precursoringredients, and so we expect
that a blend product thatnourishes these bacteria will
help them be more comfortablewithin the gut as well.
(15:46):
So it should be okay, I imagine.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Okay, got it.
Yeah, like the microbiome, forI always think of a good analogy
.
It's a rainforest and therainforest has so many different
species and they all keep eachother in check, but when some of
them get the species geteradicated or something happened
, the antibiotics come in andmaybe just nuke certain bacteria
.
Now that you don't haveeverything in check and you
(16:09):
start having certain bacteriathat become opportunistic right
Like they start taking over,Things aren't being held in
check there.
You don't have massivediversity and your product is
what you're saying is that itwill actually increase the
bacteria that is beneficial tomaking Propion-1, right,
Fantastic.
So tell me about the actualproduct.
(16:31):
What are you guys putting inthere?
What is this prebiotic sort ofsolution?
Speaker 3 (16:36):
I can describe some of this.
So, as I mentioned, we'reinterested in boosting these
beneficial bacterial metabolitesand we do this.
These bacterial metabolites arederived from this amino acid
called tryptophan, and so we'veworked with people in Europe and
we've developed this technology, which we call like a
tryptophan diversion technology.
(16:56):
So I'll just be clear so ourproduct there's no wasted
ingredients in here.
Every ingredient here has apurpose and the way this works
is that we've got a proteincarrier in here and we've got
amino acids, like specific aminoacids, including tryptophan
itself would be in here.
This would be like the rawbuilding block that the bacteria
need as well.
Also, we've got otheringredients which help divert
(17:19):
the metabolism of tryptophantowards it funnels, the
metabolism towards the bacteriathat need it, and of course, we
also have superfoods andantioxidants in there that also
protect the tryptophan moleculeand its products from degrading.
There's also B vitamincomplexes in there, which helps
fuel the bacterial metabolisminto producing our desired
(17:40):
metabolite.
As I mentioned, everything istitrated and it's optimally
designed to fuel bacterialproduction of these beneficial
indole molecules, especially IPA, and so that's.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
And I want to just interrupt you, dan, to say that
when he says that everyingredient there is formulated
to increase levels of thisbeneficial metabolite, that
actually also means in olderpeople as well, who do, just by
virtue of having aged, have acompromised gut microbiome.
And, stephen, you were askingabout whether the product would
(18:13):
only work to produce more ofthese beneficial metabolites in
people who have perfect gutmicrobiomes.
The product was tested inpeople who are, on average, age
68, which I can tell you thereare a lot of reports of people
just getting increasedgastrointestinal problems in
their early 60s and having thatjust increase linearly or
exponentially as they age.
(18:34):
So these people are reflectiveof not a perfect gut microbiome.
These gut microbiomes have beendecreased in quality and
composition by the effect oftime and the product was shown
to be beneficial and actuallyincrease levels of these
metabolites in that population.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Got it?
Yeah, and I saw a little bit ofa presentation that you guys
sent me, so bear with me if I'mnot up to full speed on stuff,
but it seemed like your productwas a blend of a pea protein, a
nitric oxide booster and thenmaybe some antioxidants.
(19:09):
Am I correct in that?
Speaker 3 (19:12):
in there, for example , like nitric oxide boosters can
jam up one of the enzymes likeIDO or TDO.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
They can work in that metabolism to slow it down, to
divert metabolism more towards,and I think you'll have to
explain why blocking the IDO andTDO pathways is important and
relevant.
Okay, so Do that.
Yeah, toss that out there.
And that's nobody.
Nobody knows what that means.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Okay, so IDO and TDO these are, as I mentioned at the
beginning.
These are like some of theendogenous pathways.
These are some of the pathwayswhere tryptophan is metabolized
into molecules like tinerine andquinoloolic acid.
These are molecules that areused for other purposes in the
body.
More than the vast majority ofyour tryptophan metabolism goes
(20:03):
through these pathways.
Very little and I say don'tquote me on this exactly, but I
think it's around 2% or so goesto the bacterial pathways which
produce these beneficialmolecules of interest, and so
that's why it's important to getyou know this won't nothing
completely jams it up.
It'll slow it down a little bitso that more tryptophan is
(20:24):
available to go towards thebacteria to produce these
beneficial metabolites and sothat 98% of it doesn't go
specifically to these PDO-IDOpathways that are inside the
body.
One of the other things thathappens as well by shunting some
of the metabolism away fromthis TDO and IDO is you may get
increases in things like pathway, like melatonin, for example,
(20:46):
may be potentiated from this, aswell as possibly serotonin as
well in the gut, because theseare metabolized through
different enzymes that aren'tPDO and IDO.
But yeah, so that's how itwould work, or how it funnels,
and so these ingredients aretitrated and I think the
proprietary thing we have aboutthe blend is the ratio of all
these ingredients and the waythey act together to
(21:08):
specifically funnel tryptophantowards these beneficial
bacterias and then to boostmetabolism inside these bacteria
to generate optimal levels ofour anti-aging and anti or
pro-health metabolites.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Got it Okay.
So let me, I have a fewquestions.
So, rather than just suckingdown a bunch of tryptophan,
which what you're saying, is Notdone.
You don't want to do that?
Yeah, and look if anybody's, ifanybody's messed around with
SSRIs or kratom or certainthings like that where they've
tinkered with their serotoninpathways and they ruin their gut
mobility motility, theycouldn't you try to get off of
(21:45):
some of that stuff and you can'tsleep because you're it's
messing with that wholetryptophan conversion to
serotonin, conversion tomelatonin and stuff.
But so what you're saying isyou're saying, okay, you're
going to input some tryptophan,but what your proprietary blend
is doing is routing it moreeffectively towards a pathway,
(22:07):
this propion pathway, that isnow going to do something with
all of these gut liningreceptors, that is going to
initiate a systemic beneficialnet, positive for many things.
Am I correct in that?
Speaker 2 (22:20):
That's exactly right.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Okay, perfect, all right.
Is anybody else doing this onthe market?
Are you guys, the only onethat's?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
talking about propion .
There's nothing on the markettoday that specifically targets
propion-1.
And, just to reiterate, we callindole-3-propionic acid
propion-1.
And right now there is nothingavailable on the market which
targets this molecular pathway,which really means that people
not taking this product are notaccessing 100% of what they can
(22:49):
be doing to slow down theiraging process, given the
pathways that Dan describedearlier about how the Propion-1
molecule interact with the gutlining and interacts with the
different cell types immune celltypes, insulin-secreting cells
to boost function of all ofthose things.
Really, if you're not takingthis product, you're missing out
on something key that you couldbe doing.
Speaker 1 (23:11):
Yeah, and look, let me ask you this, because I am
not protein-starved.
I work out almost seven days aweek now and I am on it and
protein is a huge boon for me.
Like I'm creating muscleprotein synthesis.
Quite often I pay attention tonitric oxide, I test it, so I'm
always tinkering with differentsupplements in that regard and I
(23:35):
take some antioxidants,astaxanthin, a couple other
things.
Let's say I'm going to trypropion.
I'm going to try it.
Do I need to take it inisolation so that I get the
appropriate amounts of propionor regeneration, so I don't
cloud it out with any of theseother sort of things?
Would that be a better practice?
Speaker 2 (23:56):
So there's a yes and no answer there.
The yes is that we recommendthat you take it at night.
That's when a lot of these wayswork best, as a once daily,
preferably before night, thing.
But if you're really busy andyou don't want to do that and
actually I also take itsometimes before night as a way
to not be hungry when I go tosleep I know you're not supposed
(24:16):
to eat a big meal super late inthe day but introducing some
protein and some key ingredientsand potentially activating
GLP-1, I find it a lot easier togo to sleep not feeling hungry
but not necessarily beingoverstuffed.
But then going back to ifyou're somebody really busy who
needs to put this into yourdaily shake of the day or take
(24:39):
it when you take your othervitamins or other anti-aging
supplements.
Dan has this explanation forwhy that's okay as well.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Dan.
Speaker 3 (24:49):
Yeah, if you look at most of the anti-aging stuff on
the market right now, I thinkprobably the biggest ones would
be things like resveratrol, akg,anything from the NAD family
NAD so that would be like NR orNMN Senolytics some of those
would be like that and alsoketone bodies.
These are all kind of the youknow the breadth of many of the
(25:11):
more popular anti-aging thingsin the market right now.
All of these, they work andthey target important pathways
in the body.
None of them are directlyharnessing the benefit of the
microbiota like we are, and sopeople ask me should they stop
taking their current anti-agingor pro-health regimens if they
want to take propion?
And I tell them no, because, ifanything, there's a potential
(25:34):
for synergy for these.
So, even so, NAD, for example.
There may be potential forsynergy because we found one
study where one of the moleculesproduced by propion, which is
IPA, can potentially slow downdegradation of NADs.
If you're taking propion, youmay get an even benefit even a
better benefit from your NADsupplements, for you're taking
propion.
You may get an even betterbenefit from your NAD
supplements.
For example, some of thebacteria that they do that
(25:57):
produce propion, like thelactobacilli and some of the
clostridium species.
These also act to strengthenthe intestinal barrier and boost
metabolism, for example.
And so if you've got somethingthat potentially can improve
mitochondrial metabolism andyou're taking AKG with that,
which is also in themitochondrial metabolism family,
(26:20):
you may get some beneficialadditive effects even and so I
tell people not to worry aboutthat right now but whether you
should start combining them allat once.
I think there would be anargument that could be made to
spacing them out, especiallybecause our product is designed
with specifically titratedratios of ingredients.
(26:42):
And so if we've got the rightamount of protein carrier, if
you start eating a huge mealwith it and that could
potentially alter it, but theother thing I would add is that,
stephen, you are in the 99.9999, like almost as much repeating
You're really in.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
There are other people who do the level that you
do, but very small fraction ofpeople are really actively
engaged with their health.
You've made it essentially yourentire life, and one of the
things that we want to do withPropion Blend, which is this
blend of precursor ingredientsthat gives your gut what it
needs to create the Propion-1molecule, is we're making this
(27:22):
something that is geared towardseveryone, whether it's your
average person in middle Americawho doesn't know what NAD,
doesn't know what NMN is, stilllikes to eat hamburgers all the
way up to people like you andeverybody in between and I'm
somebody who's in between, there, where I haven't been an
(27:45):
Olympian athlete like you and Idefinitely don't get regular
exosome treatments or thinkabout my diet in such a
carefully constructed way.
I'm mostly somebody who'sreally busy and is thinking
about what they can do.
That's easy to hit a lot ofdifferent points through,
whether it's to the gut,microbiome or some other axis.
But really, what can I do thathas the maximum impact for my
(28:09):
body?
Yeah, yeah.
As a 32 hours of exercise.
What are the 15 minutes ofexercise that I can get in?
That's going to keep me strongor whatever.
And so I think Propion blends.
It's really comfortably forthat type of customer and in
that range of products as well,and, as Dan is saying, there's
potentially synergistic effectswith other products as well.
But if you're already somebodywho's doing the absolute 100% of
(28:32):
what they need, I can't saythat we're going to add 10 years
to your life, Stephen, becauseI think you're already there.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
I still have very good habits and I do prop myself
up with a lot of these greatthings and I take all those
things you guys said earlier.
Except for resveratrol I'vegiven up on that one for now.
I don't know if we want to godown that rabbit hole, but but I
agree with you and I think thatlook the I will say this the
moment your gut is compromised,you are, you are going down.
It is, it's the whole.
(29:14):
What is it?
Socrates who said it?
That?
That all the what was thewhat's, the famous quote about
the gut.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
Oh, I don't know.
But also, like when you getinto Ayurvedic health, the gut
is the number one thing thatthey talk about it's it is.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
I cannot tell you.
I have had people very close tome that have had SIBO and
dysbiosis and gut issues and manit just.
I've had my buddy's, an Olympicgymnast.
He still can't get abs becausehis gut got so compromised and
he's built perfectly everywhereelse.
If I have a client, I have anactor who wants to take his
shirt off and for a role, I haveto ask him about his digestion.
(29:52):
I just literally had one ofthese actors.
That's why I'm talking aboutthis.
He was like I just had thispooch.
I said what's going on with yourdigestion?
He had zero motility and I'mlike are you on any?
Are you taking Kratom?
Are you on some sort of SSRI?
Are you doing something?
He said no and it turns out hewas eating out every single meal
.
I said you need to startcontrolling your meal, you need
to cook, you need to get verycomfortable with cooking.
(30:13):
And I told him how to make itreal simple and I said you need
to do some jump rope, you needto bounce, you need to actually
reach literal motility.
Yeah, literally.
And guess what?
He all of a sudden, it allstarted coming around for him.
But if I would have known aboutyour guy's product, I would
have said, hey, try this.
These come from very reputablepeople that I highly respect,
and so let's talk about yourproduct real quick.
(30:36):
So you have a product now.
Is it ready to go?
Can people buy it?
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Yeah, so today is Monday and we are going to be
launching pre-sales on Fridaythrough our website which you
can visit, and it is probioncomP-R-o-p-i-o-ncom and we're
launching pre-sales and theproduct will ship out around
eight to ten weeks from now.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Okay, and in what are they buying?
Are they buying a one monthsupply of none?
Speaker 2 (31:07):
yeah, 30 day, 30 day supply 30 scoops of propion
blend, which you're supposed tomix into water or sugar-free
almond milk is the other thingthat we recommend.
It tastes really good.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
That's what I use.
That's my jam right there.
Let me ask you this why did younot also include some sort of
brown rice with the pea and makeit a complete protein?
Or does it not matter, becausethe pea has the amino acids you
need?
Speaker 3 (31:32):
The pea protein has most of the major amino acids.
I think it's maybe relativelydeficient in methionine, might
be the one or two that it'sreduced in, but we were
considering supplementingmethionine in there.
However, if you look at studiesthat are coming out now,
relative methionine restrictionis actually pretty good for
longevity.
So we were thinking that youcould take a near complete
(31:55):
protein which has a little bitless methionine in there and get
a relative restriction andstart boosting your longevity
through that regard as well.
So we try to put scientificinput into all of our decisions
on what goes into the blend.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
Fantastic.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
And look, it's not a protein plus shake.
It's that the protein in thereis an actual functional
ingredient.
Speaker 1 (32:16):
Exactly, it's a propion drink, not a muscle
building drink.
Right Period.
Speaker 3 (32:21):
Although there are preclinical studies out there
that preclinical meaning theseare done in mice.
Whether they hold in humans,who knows right now but at least
in mice that if you supplementmice with IPA you can actually
boost muscle strength, boostmuscle.
This is just the metaboliteright Boost muscle strength,
boost muscle mass and reduce,dampen inflammation in the
(32:43):
muscle.
And they go through mechanismsup there.
So there are studies out inmice which would support healthy
muscle building with themetabolites themselves.
That's the goal of this thingis a.
It's a metabolite, ananti-aging gut metabolite
technology.
Which is why I was hooked intothis, because it's new and
different from whatever is outthere.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Yeah, look, dan, you sound like you are one busy guy
working with NASA and SpaceX andwhat you teach at three
universities.
You this must, you must reallybelieve in this product.
If in this product, if you'rethat busy and you're getting on
my podcast to talk about that,I'm honored to have someone like
some brains like you guys onthe podcast, but you must have
(33:23):
pretty high hopes for thismolecule.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Yeah, one of the things that got me really
excited about this is that Ilike a big picture advancement,
so things that are new andexciting and are different from
what's out there already.
Even if you look across myscientific career and some of
the major findings I've made inresearch, some of these would be
identifying adaptive immunecells like T cells and B cells,
controlling insulin resistanceand obesity, showing that the
(33:48):
gut immune system actually cancontrol disease throughout the
body and not just in the gut.
Another thing we've done islook at mechanical forces, how
that shapes inflammation, andalso, just most recently, our
paper on the immune system andmicrogravity.
I consider all of these thingsreally new, big picture ideas.
This isn't a sequel or likeright now in Hollywood or
(34:09):
whatever.
All these sequels or part threeor part four or something.
These are like I like big,original ideas, and that's what
I think propion blend is.
It's not just anotherresveratrol or any NADNR in a
man.
It's not another senolytic or aketone body or AKG.
This is a pathway that's notyet mainstream in products that
are out there.
(34:29):
I consider it somethingoriginal and that's why I
initially wanted to work withpropion.
I like to work on new thingsthat are amongst the first out
there, and so that's what got mereally excited, and what I hope
to accomplish is, as Imentioned, I started my career
off as a medical doctor and thenI became a scientist, and at
times I was doing practicingmedicine and science, and one of
(34:52):
the reasons I went into all ofthis is try to help as many
people as possible, and I think,with a product like this, which
potentially interfaces with somany important and relevant
components to healthy aging, Ithought this was my chance to
translate some of the researchI've done, especially in the gut
immune system, and to somethingthat could basically help
(35:13):
people live healthier, longerlives.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Fantastic, fantastic, speaking my language.
I love meeting people like you,people that have serious
cognitive horsepower and thatthey want to do something good
with it.
I'm really impressed.
I've heard Nicholas talk aboutPropion for God how long now I
don know Like.
I met you, nick, at Radfest.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
Years ago.
Speaker 1 (35:35):
Yeah, and I remember when I first saw you, I was
standing in line to get a coffeeand you were taking out your
business card and you weregiving an elevator pitch to
somebody about Propion.
I remember thinking like lookat this young kid, this guy,
like he's going places, like Ireally was impressed.
And then the next year you cameup and you said, you told me,
you said everybody at thisconference is learning how to
(35:57):
not age and you're the onlyperson I see that's actually
doing.
What are you doing?
And we just got on a call andwe've been friends ever since
and so I have to say I really amimpressed with what you guys
are doing.
This sounds like it's somethingthat is really well thought out
and it's actually targetingsomething the microbiome, which
(36:18):
I think is such an important anda lot of times under
appreciated part of health,because it does really affect so
many things.
What do you?
What's the future for you guysin terms of what's the real sort
of vision for this companymoving forward?
Are you guys going to have moreproducts?
Are you going to have versiontwo of certain things?
Speaker 2 (36:41):
Yeah, we're taking things one step at a time.
So we're launching this product, propion Blend.
We're in talks with a couple ofdifferent people, companies who
are interested in licensingthis from us and putting it on
their websites that have lots oftraffic, affiliate networks,
(37:01):
etc.
And then we're going to move onto developing a second product,
this science, into a pill sothat it's potentially more
accessible, just say, runningout the door or something, or
for people who don't like, forpeople who don't drink products,
we're looking at how to applyit in skincare.
We're also looking into avenuesin defense and pharmaceuticals,
(37:25):
and so there's a lot in thepipeline.
But again, just taking thingsone step at a time, exploring
partnership opportunities asthey come to us and doing our
best to stay sane while we dothis all as well.
Yeah, good luck with that.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
The other thing, nicholas.
We've got the current Blendproduct.
We also have a second Blendproduct that we're also
developing at the same time, sowe hope to introduce two Blend
products.
Both of them will have the sametryptophan diversion technology
background, but one might bedesigned for people who want to
even a little bit extra boost ontheir tryptophan metabolites
(38:01):
beyond what we can provide inthe initial blend.
And then, of course, the pillproducts.
But the potential for this islarge, because Nicholas was
talking to me also about whetherwe want to go into pet food
products, skin care, and sothese are the things we're
thinking of down the road, butit's definitely one product that
I'm focusing on right now.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
Yeah, pet food could be massive, honestly, like dog
food, and my God that could be,especially if you show that,
like what you guys do, you showthat this stuff actually works.
But, man, guys, this is, thisis fascinating stuff.
So one more time somebody,let's say somebody's interested
uh, pre-sale goes on this friday.
They go to propion I'm going tobring that up again dot com,
(38:46):
and then the product will arrive.
You said 10 weeks from now,approximately Eight to 10 weeks.
Yeah, eight to 10 weeks.
Okay, fantastic.
And then for everyone elselistening, I will include
everything we discussed in theshow notes and that will be at
stephenmccaincom backslashPropion and Propion is
(39:07):
P-R-O-P-I-O-N.
If you just want to buy theproduct and pre-order it this
Friday, p-i-o-n.
If you just want to buy theproduct and pre-order it this
Friday, go to propioncom.
P-r-o-p-i-o-ncom.
Guys, fantastic.
Speaker 2 (39:21):
I really look forward to seeing you.
Thank you so much for having us, Stephen.
This was a great conversation.
Yeah, my pleasure.
Speaker 1 (39:25):
I really wish I could have dived into so much more
with you guys, but I don't wantto abuse your time.
But if someone wants to reachout to you personally, where can
they find you?
How can they get ahold of you?
Nick, how do you start with you?
Speaker 2 (39:37):
I'm easy to find on LinkedIn.
You can always.
If you have a question for Dan,I can forward it to him.
Also, if you want to just getin touch with Stephen, you and I
are in contact all the time,and so he can easily reach out
to me.
Speaker 3 (39:54):
Yeah, fantastic guys, dan it.
Yeah fantastic guys.
Damn, are you gonna sayanything, or you know?
I just wanted to thank you forhaving us on.
I mean, uh, yeah, we want to.
As I said, I started my careeras a as a physician, and this is
one of the one of the dreamsthat we had was to try to
develop products that couldreally help promote healthy
aging and across across manypeople, especially as people get
older and become morevulnerable to things, and the
chance to develop something thatmight improve their resilience
(40:16):
and healthy aging.
This is like what we've dreamedabout, and also wanted to follow
up on what you said aboutNicholas and yeah, that was one
of the reasons.
When he approached me, I agreedthis was a genius kid from
Berkeley, and when an undergradcomes to you with ideas like
that, we were working on some ofthe stuff tangentially already.
But when someone comes up toyou with ideas like that, we
were working on some of thestuff tangentially already.
But when someone comes up toyou with a genius idea like this
(40:37):
, it doesn't happen that often.
I felt the same way as youabout Nicholas as well.
I just wanted to bring that up.
It's been a pleasure alsoworking with such a genius kid
from Berkeley as well.
Speaker 2 (40:49):
Thanks, dan, that's.
Nice.
Speaker 3 (40:50):
It's thanks, dan, that's nice.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
Dan and I make a good team.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
Dan and I make a really good team you guys seem
like you guys got a great thinggoing, so I'm really happy you
guys came on and I'd love to tryyour guys product and we're
happy to send you a bottle,stephen, we really so.
Speaker 2 (41:06):
We're selling right now in one month and three month
quantities, so one in threebottles and I recommend taking
that.
We went through extensive tastetesting with the product.
We've developed a really gooddark chocolate flavored blend.
If you mix it in almond milk,for example, like it'll just
taste like a chocolate smoothie.
So I reckon I recommend gettingthe three month supply because
(41:28):
that's where you'll actuallystart to see like cellular
effect is the longer you take it.
That's where those moleculesbuilding up will have the chance
to work over time on your body.
But yeah, I encourage you tojust at least try the product
and again go to propioncom andcheck us out.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:42):
And when it's delicious, you have compliance
and I imagine you need probablythree months to change the
microbiome.
It's not going to happenovernight.
Right, and start feeding thosethings that they take a while to
propagate, right?
We're talking about man, nickDan.
Fantastic, thank you so muchfor coming on.
Everybody listening, we reallyappreciate you.
Go to stephenmccaincom,backslash Propion, or this
(42:04):
Friday, go to propioncom.
This podcast will be releasedright before that.
Get your three months deliciousdark chocolate supply and mix
it with some almond milk.
And guys for coming on and lookforward to seeing what goes on
with your company and maybehaving you guys on in the future
as you start to expand and sure, yeah.
So thanks again everybody forlistening to the steven mccain
(42:26):
podcast.
Thanks, nick dan, and we'llcatch you on the next one.
Stay healthy, everyone cheersand we'll catch you on the next
(42:55):
one.
Stay healthy, everyone Cheers.
Bye.
Hello everyone, welcome to another episode of
the Stephen McCain podcast,where I bring you people making
world-class decisions in thefield of human optimization and
performance.
Today's episode is going to beabout the microbiome and the
importance of keeping a healthymicrobiome.
If you've ever had anythinglike dysbiosis small intestinal
(00:21):
bacteria overgrowth you knowthat you do not want to mess
with your gut.
It is now considered one of thehallmarks of aging, and keeping
this thing in tip top shapeactually has a lot more
downstream health effects inmany different ways, and my
guests today are some of thesmartest guys in the room, and
they're going to talk about anew gut metabolite.
(00:43):
That is really something thatcould be interesting, and so
it's my first time to ever havetwo people on the show.
And just to let you know, wemight get a little bit into the
weeds with some science, but hey, that's what we do here.
So my first person I want tointroduce is Nicholas Tubach.
He's a good friend of mine.
Actually, we're in a fulldisclosure.
(01:04):
He and I are in a littlebusiness together, trying to
create a longevity series, andwe also have Dan Weiner.
So, nicholas, welcome to theshow.
Thanks, hey, stephen.
How are you doing?
Good?
And Dan, welcome to the show aswell.
Yeah, thanks for having me.
I appreciate you guys coming on.
(01:26):
So, nicholas, why don't youtell us a little bit about your
bio, who you are, why you're inthis industry and what you're
doing?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
I was originally born in Berkeley, california, and I
also went to UC Berkeley where Istudied molecular and cell
biology and techentrepreneurship and one of the
things running in the background.
I was mostly a humanitiesperson, growing up, studying
English literature, history.
Those were my main subjects inschool.
But when I got to college, oneof the topics that started to
(01:52):
really sit in my mind was humanoptimization, maximizing your
brain's operating power, orslowing ager, aging slower.
Sorry, I'm somebody who wouldlike to stay as young as I can,
as long as possible, and that iswhat got me into biotech.
(02:14):
This is the third company thatI've started.
Naturally, I've only startedthem in the last few years and
so you wouldn't have heard anybig names yet.
But I became interested inusing chemicals as a way to
augment human biology.
So that led me down the road ofwhat can we do to protect our
(02:34):
brain as we age, optimizesynaptic function, just that
main topic and that's where mymain interest lies is in
neurology and neurobiology.
But I'll stop there and I'lljust link that later to why
Propion was founded down thecall.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Fantastic, dan, what about you?
Tell us a little bit aboutyourself.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Yeah, hi.
I'm an associate professor atthe Buck Institute for Research
on Aging, also affiliated withUniversity of Southern
California and the University ofToronto.
I started my career off as amedical doctor.
I graduated from the Universityof Ottawa after studying
immunology during myundergraduate degree at
(03:14):
University of Toronto and thenfrom there I went on to study
anatomical pathology and thendid a research postdoc at
Stanford University, trying tounderstand how the immune system
controls diseases like obesityand diabetes.
During that time we made a lotof interesting discoveries,
especially in how immune cellscalled T cells and B cells and
we can get into this more laterhow they control inflammation
(03:37):
and throughout the body,especially in tissues like fat
tissue and also the intestine,and then from there this
intestinal immune system, oncewe realize it has implications
controlling health, healthyaging and disease.
It's one of the things westarted focusing in on and
that's one of my major areas ofresearch right now the immune
system in obesity, diabetes andAIDS.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Interesting Great field if you can make some
changes.
Obesity is a massive topic.
I would be interested inhearing your thoughts on these
GLP-1 agonists and GIP-1s, butmaybe we'll pin that for later
because I want to get in to thiscompany that you guys have
started and it sounds reallyexciting.
Nicholas, maybe tell us alittle bit about Propion and
(04:22):
what it does.
What is this company and tellus about it?
Speaker 2 (04:25):
maybe tell us a little bit about Propion and
what it does.
What is this company?
And tell us about it?
Yeah, first of all, dan isextraordinarily humble.
He's a professor at threedifferent universities,
collaborates with NASA andSpaceX on studying how the
immune system operates inmicrogravity environment.
The number one thing I'll sayis that starting Propion with
him is an incredible privilegefor me, having just come out of
school.
The purpose of Propion is reallysimple it's to help you age
(04:48):
slower and live longer andpotentially even amplify your
health when you're older.
And it's not just me sayingthat.
Dan here is my scientificco-founder and he and I have
begun developing.
Actually, we're fully completedwith developing one product,
but we've begun developing.
Actually we're fully completedwith developing one product, but
we've begun developing thesocietal interest in this
(05:09):
science that could genuinelyslow down how you age and the
mechanisms behind that are allthings that Dan will talk about.
But I first approached him toadvise me on immunological
pathways in Alzheimer's disease.
To advise me on immunologicalpathways in Alzheimer's disease,
so how the immune system worksin the brain and what
inflammatory mechanisms arebeing over-activated.
(05:30):
Potentially that could betargeted to reduce inflammation,
reduce cognitive decline forpeople with Alzheimer's.
And as we got to talking aboutdifferent ways to enhance
neuroprotection for example, thebrain's resilience to toxins or
inflammation, actuallydown-regulating inflammatory
pathways directly by targetingimmune cells.
(05:51):
Or neuroregeneration,reintroducing cognitive function
to the brain Propion came froma branch of research that was
really about neuroprotection,and when we talk about the gut
microbiome, we're not justtalking about the gut itself, a
totally closed system.
We're really talking about wholebody health, and a big part of
that is the brain and how notjust the way the gut functions,
(06:14):
but as being part of gutmicrobiome science, because your
gut microbiome is where youabsorb those ingredients from.
However, when you get anutritional supplement company,
they aren't saying this is allabout the gut.
So really, when you say we're agut microbiome science company,
(06:36):
I'd say we're really a wholebody health company with
technology that originates fromthe gut microbiome.
And this technology that I'mreferring to are molecules that
were originally discussed inliterature as being highly
neuroprotective.
What that means is that theyprotected neurons' ability to
survive and function in the faceof toxin.
And then it turns out that it'sactually the gut that is
(06:59):
producing these molecules andthat they have additional
functions in the epithelialbarrier of the gut, so the gut
wall, as well as proteinreceptors in the skin, the liver
and that's whole axis.
Right there really means thatit's our company is about
enhancing whole body function,and that's why we talk about
(07:21):
this as a longevity company asopposed to just a gut microbiome
health company.
So these metabolites that I'mreferring to, these molecules
that are neuroprotective, thatoriginate from the gut
microbiome and also stimulateregenerative function, that is
what this company is all about,and the vision that I have for
it is that propion really couldbe in every household in America
(07:43):
, because what all I justdescribed it applies to
absolutely everybody.
There's not a person in theworld to whom brain function,
gut dysbiosis, gut function, thegut-body axis isn't relevant to
, and I think we're bringingsome highly unique technological
insight in the form of aconsumer product or multiple
(08:06):
consumer product to everyone inthat way.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
So yeah, if you've ever been around anybody with a
compromised gut, you canliterally see their brain change
, their behaviors change, andyou clearly also.
If you know what you're lookingfor, you'll see immune system
issues as well.
It is disastrous, especiallywhen you think about how
non-discretional people are withwhatever they eat.
(08:30):
You go to a restaurant and youare rolling the dice, so to
speak.
The food.
There's so much stuff that issprayed on our food.
There are so many really likebad things for the gut and the
environment.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
I don't think you should necessarily blame it all
on the consumer, though, becausea lot of it is just the choices
that were faced with.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Oh, no, I'm not a hundred percent.
I had what's his name, DavePascoe on the podcast and he's
ranked in the top five top sixof the regeneration Olympics.
That guy grows his own food.
He's controlling a lot, and sonot everyone is up for that kind
of thing.
Not everyone's goal is to benumber one on the longevity
board.
Like people have busy livesthey have to go about and do
(09:10):
their thing.
So let's get to this.
What is Propion?
What are we talking about here?
Speaker 3 (09:18):
I can tell you a bit about some of these metabolites
and what they do.
The first as people get olderor people when they start
developing chronic diseases likeobesity, diabetes, insulin
resistance, cardiovasculardisease, their gut changes,
especially their gut bacteria.
Usually what happens is thatthe gut microbiome, it will
(09:39):
shrink in diversity to matchthese changes in dietary and
environmental patterns.
These dietary patterns could beeating more things like
processed foods, saturated fats,sugar.
Environmental patterns could bethings like taking a round of
antibiotics.
All of these things haveprofound effect on your gut
microbiome.
(09:59):
So one of the family ofmetabolites that gets
downregulated across suchconditions are tryptophan
metabolites, and that's what thetarget that propane is trying
to go after right now.
So tryptophan just a little bitof background broken down by
pathways inside your body andalso pathways inside the gut
microbiota.
(10:19):
Inside your body they're brokendown by things like in the
intestine.
They can form molecules likeserotonin, where they cause a.
By things like in the intestine.
They can form molecules likeserotonin where they cause a
controlled motility in the gut.
They can be broken down fartherup in the brain where they can
form things like melatonin,which is an antioxidant to
control sleep-wake cycles.
But they can also bemetabolized through a whole
battery of other metabolites,through these enzymes called TDO
(10:41):
and IDO.
In addition to these endogenouspathways inside the body,
tryptophan can also bemetabolized by the gut bacteria
into a whole slew of beneficialmetabolites.
Some of these will be thefamous ones of these things like
indole-3-aldehyde, andespecially this molecule called
indole-propionic acid.
(11:02):
So these are the ones thatwe're really interested in,
these beneficial metabolitesthat are produced by gut
bacteria, and how do thesethings work?
So basically Do you want that?
Speaker 1 (11:13):
slide.
Should we pull up a slide?
You want me to pull up a slidefor you guys?
Speaker 3 (11:19):
Yeah, you can pull up a slide now, I think, where I
can talk about how these thingsactually function.
I'll just go through it brieflythough.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
Yeah, bring it up.
So for everyone that'slistening to this, we're
actually pulling up a slide thatyou'll be able to see if you're
watching this on YouTube, butwe'll try to talk it out.
Is this the right slide?
Speaker 3 (11:40):
tube, but we'll try to talk it out.
Is this the right slide?
Yeah, yeah.
So I'll just just in brief.
Metabolites, indole propionicacid produced by these bacteria
in the gut I'm going to callthat IPA for now, and something
like indole-3-aldehyde I'll callas I3A.
So these metabolites, they bindto receptors in the gut lining
and also to the gut immune cellswhich line the intestine.
They also they also bind to, asI mentioned, to targets in the
(12:08):
brain Nicholas alluded to liverskin as well.
In the gut, as that diagramshows, they induce this cytokine
called IL-22.
It should be in there, if it'snot.
That's the main cytokine thatit induces.
So what it does?
It binds to these targets.
One of them is called the AHR,the other is called the PXR.
These are present in theepithelial lining, these are the
cells that line the intestineand also in some of the immune
(12:30):
cells themselves, and so whenthey bind in the immune cells
they produce this moleculecalled IL-22.
This is a highly reparativecytokine.
It induces repair programs inyour intestine.
It strengthens the gut barrier.
It acts on specific cells inthe intestine to produce
antimicrobial peptides and thesekind of prevent dangerous
(12:50):
bacteria from entering.
These molecules are also verystrong antioxidants actually
some of the strongestantioxidants known where they
can reduce free oxygen and freenitrogen.
Radical similar metabolitesthat are also produced through
this tryptophan metabolismpathway can also produce glp-1.
I remember at the beginning youwere interested in glp-1, so
(13:12):
this would be harnessing.
This pathway would be like anatural way to boost glp-1
production.
There's also also been a wholenumber of preclinical studies on
these molecules, especially IPA.
They show that they can reducefat and cholesterol production,
also reduce scarring, also knownas fibrosis, especially in
things like the liver, and canreduce kind of glucose
(13:36):
absorption from the gut.
So there's a whole diversearray of mechanisms that play
here and this slide nicelysummarizes a bunch of them here.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
Yeah, so basically, all these benefits that you're
referring to are from thePropion-1 molecule.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
Yes, and Propion-1 is what we call
Indole-3-Propionic-A.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
Got it, and so your product?
Is it straight Propion-1 or isit some sort of prebiotic that's
creating Propion-1?
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Our first product is a blend of precursor ingredients
that helps your body assemblePropion-1 naturally.
Dan can get a little bit moreinto how it works.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Got it Okay, yeah, so real quick.
So your product is somethingthat helps the body make or the
gut make propion-1, and thenpropion-1 is decreasing a bunch
of negative things like thesefatty acid synthesis,
cholesterol synthesis, lipidperoxidation, and it's
increasing all of these otherbeneficial things that Dan
(14:38):
alluded to.
And it's increasing all ofthese other beneficial things
that Dan alluded to.
Now, what if because it seemslike from this slide that all of
this has to do with Propion-1actually targeting or hitting
the inner gut lining what ifyour inner gut lining is
compromised?
Is that an issue?
Is this something that you needa healthy gut in order to
(14:59):
benefit from?
That's a really good question.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
One of the things that, especially with the
propion blend product, one ofthe advantages that we have here
is that we're actually feedingthe raw precursors, or the foods
that these beneficial bacteriaactually like to eat.
So we're actually feeding thesebacteria that might be reduced
with age or obesity or includinga number of other conditions
(15:24):
where the gut barrier may not beintact.
These bacteria are oftenreduced and by giving them the
foods they like to eat, they'llactually expand, and there has
been preclinical studies showingyou can expand these bacteria
giving the right precursoringredients, and so we expect
that a blend product thatnourishes these bacteria will
help them be more comfortablewithin the gut as well.
(15:46):
So it should be okay, I imagine.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Okay, got it.
Yeah, like the microbiome, forI always think of a good analogy
.
It's a rainforest and therainforest has so many different
species and they all keep eachother in check, but when some of
them get the species geteradicated or something happened
, the antibiotics come in andmaybe just nuke certain bacteria
.
Now that you don't haveeverything in check and you
(16:09):
start having certain bacteriathat become opportunistic right
Like they start taking over,Things aren't being held in
check there.
You don't have massivediversity and your product is
what you're saying is that itwill actually increase the
bacteria that is beneficial tomaking Propion-1, right,
Fantastic.
So tell me about the actualproduct.
(16:31):
What are you guys putting inthere?
What is this prebiotic sort ofsolution?
Speaker 3 (16:36):
I can describe some of this.
So, as I mentioned, we'reinterested in boosting these
beneficial bacterial metabolitesand we do this.
These bacterial metabolites arederived from this amino acid
called tryptophan, and so we'veworked with people in Europe and
we've developed this technology, which we call like a
tryptophan diversion technology.
(16:56):
So I'll just be clear so ourproduct there's no wasted
ingredients in here.
Every ingredient here has apurpose and the way this works
is that we've got a proteincarrier in here and we've got
amino acids, like specific aminoacids, including tryptophan
itself would be in here.
This would be like the rawbuilding block that the bacteria
need as well.
Also, we've got otheringredients which help divert
(17:19):
the metabolism of tryptophantowards it funnels, the
metabolism towards the bacteriathat need it, and of course, we
also have superfoods andantioxidants in there that also
protect the tryptophan moleculeand its products from degrading.
There's also B vitamincomplexes in there, which helps
fuel the bacterial metabolisminto producing our desired
(17:40):
metabolite.
As I mentioned, everything istitrated and it's optimally
designed to fuel bacterialproduction of these beneficial
indole molecules, especially IPA, and so that's.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
And I want to just interrupt you, dan, to say that
when he says that everyingredient there is formulated
to increase levels of thisbeneficial metabolite, that
actually also means in olderpeople as well, who do, just by
virtue of having aged, have acompromised gut microbiome.
And, stephen, you were askingabout whether the product would
(18:13):
only work to produce more ofthese beneficial metabolites in
people who have perfect gutmicrobiomes.
The product was tested inpeople who are, on average, age
68, which I can tell you thereare a lot of reports of people
just getting increasedgastrointestinal problems in
their early 60s and having thatjust increase linearly or
exponentially as they age.
(18:34):
So these people are reflectiveof not a perfect gut microbiome.
These gut microbiomes have beendecreased in quality and
composition by the effect oftime and the product was shown
to be beneficial and actuallyincrease levels of these
metabolites in that population.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Got it?
Yeah, and I saw a little bit ofa presentation that you guys
sent me, so bear with me if I'mnot up to full speed on stuff,
but it seemed like your productwas a blend of a pea protein, a
nitric oxide booster and thenmaybe some antioxidants.
(19:09):
Am I correct in that?
Speaker 3 (19:12):
in there, for example , like nitric oxide boosters can
jam up one of the enzymes likeIDO or TDO.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
They can work in that metabolism to slow it down, to
divert metabolism more towards,and I think you'll have to
explain why blocking the IDO andTDO pathways is important and
relevant.
Okay, so Do that.
Yeah, toss that out there.
And that's nobody.
Nobody knows what that means.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Okay, so IDO and TDO these are, as I mentioned at the
beginning.
These are like some of theendogenous pathways.
These are some of the pathwayswhere tryptophan is metabolized
into molecules like tinerine andquinoloolic acid.
These are molecules that areused for other purposes in the
body.
More than the vast majority ofyour tryptophan metabolism goes
(20:03):
through these pathways.
Very little and I say don'tquote me on this exactly, but I
think it's around 2% or so goesto the bacterial pathways which
produce these beneficialmolecules of interest, and so
that's why it's important to getyou know this won't nothing
completely jams it up.
It'll slow it down a little bitso that more tryptophan is
(20:24):
available to go towards thebacteria to produce these
beneficial metabolites and sothat 98% of it doesn't go
specifically to these PDO-IDOpathways that are inside the
body.
One of the other things thathappens as well by shunting some
of the metabolism away fromthis TDO and IDO is you may get
increases in things like pathway, like melatonin, for example,
(20:46):
may be potentiated from this, aswell as possibly serotonin as
well in the gut, because theseare metabolized through
different enzymes that aren'tPDO and IDO.
But yeah, so that's how itwould work, or how it funnels,
and so these ingredients aretitrated and I think the
proprietary thing we have aboutthe blend is the ratio of all
these ingredients and the waythey act together to
(21:08):
specifically funnel tryptophantowards these beneficial
bacterias and then to boostmetabolism inside these bacteria
to generate optimal levels ofour anti-aging and anti or
pro-health metabolites.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Got it Okay.
So let me, I have a fewquestions.
So, rather than just suckingdown a bunch of tryptophan,
which what you're saying, is Notdone.
You don't want to do that?
Yeah, and look if anybody's, ifanybody's messed around with
SSRIs or kratom or certainthings like that where they've
tinkered with their serotoninpathways and they ruin their gut
mobility motility, theycouldn't you try to get off of
(21:45):
some of that stuff and you can'tsleep because you're it's
messing with that wholetryptophan conversion to
serotonin, conversion tomelatonin and stuff.
But so what you're saying isyou're saying, okay, you're
going to input some tryptophan,but what your proprietary blend
is doing is routing it moreeffectively towards a pathway,
(22:07):
this propion pathway, that isnow going to do something with
all of these gut liningreceptors, that is going to
initiate a systemic beneficialnet, positive for many things.
Am I correct in that?
Speaker 2 (22:20):
That's exactly right.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Okay, perfect, all right.
Is anybody else doing this onthe market?
Are you guys, the only onethat's?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
talking about propion .
There's nothing on the markettoday that specifically targets
propion-1.
And, just to reiterate, we callindole-3-propionic acid
propion-1.
And right now there is nothingavailable on the market which
targets this molecular pathway,which really means that people
not taking this product are notaccessing 100% of what they can
(22:49):
be doing to slow down theiraging process, given the
pathways that Dan describedearlier about how the Propion-1
molecule interact with the gutlining and interacts with the
different cell types immune celltypes, insulin-secreting cells
to boost function of all ofthose things.
Really, if you're not takingthis product, you're missing out
on something key that you couldbe doing.
Speaker 1 (23:11):
Yeah, and look, let me ask you this, because I am
not protein-starved.
I work out almost seven days aweek now and I am on it and
protein is a huge boon for me.
Like I'm creating muscleprotein synthesis.
Quite often I pay attention tonitric oxide, I test it, so I'm
always tinkering with differentsupplements in that regard and I
(23:35):
take some antioxidants,astaxanthin, a couple other
things.
Let's say I'm going to trypropion.
I'm going to try it.
Do I need to take it inisolation so that I get the
appropriate amounts of propionor regeneration, so I don't
cloud it out with any of theseother sort of things?
Would that be a better practice?
Speaker 2 (23:56):
So there's a yes and no answer there.
The yes is that we recommendthat you take it at night.
That's when a lot of these wayswork best, as a once daily,
preferably before night, thing.
But if you're really busy andyou don't want to do that and
actually I also take itsometimes before night as a way
to not be hungry when I go tosleep I know you're not supposed
(24:16):
to eat a big meal super late inthe day but introducing some
protein and some key ingredientsand potentially activating
GLP-1, I find it a lot easier togo to sleep not feeling hungry
but not necessarily beingoverstuffed.
But then going back to ifyou're somebody really busy who
needs to put this into yourdaily shake of the day or take
(24:39):
it when you take your othervitamins or other anti-aging
supplements.
Dan has this explanation forwhy that's okay as well.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Dan.
Speaker 3 (24:49):
Yeah, if you look at most of the anti-aging stuff on
the market right now, I thinkprobably the biggest ones would
be things like resveratrol, akg,anything from the NAD family
NAD so that would be like NR orNMN Senolytics some of those
would be like that and alsoketone bodies.
These are all kind of the youknow the breadth of many of the
(25:11):
more popular anti-aging thingsin the market right now.
All of these, they work andthey target important pathways
in the body.
None of them are directlyharnessing the benefit of the
microbiota like we are, and sopeople ask me should they stop
taking their current anti-agingor pro-health regimens if they
want to take propion?
And I tell them no, because, ifanything, there's a potential
(25:34):
for synergy for these.
So, even so, NAD, for example.
There may be potential forsynergy because we found one
study where one of the moleculesproduced by propion, which is
IPA, can potentially slow downdegradation of NADs.
If you're taking propion, youmay get an even benefit even a
better benefit from your NADsupplements, for you're taking
propion.
You may get an even betterbenefit from your NAD
supplements.
For example, some of thebacteria that they do that
(25:57):
produce propion, like thelactobacilli and some of the
clostridium species.
These also act to strengthenthe intestinal barrier and boost
metabolism, for example.
And so if you've got somethingthat potentially can improve
mitochondrial metabolism andyou're taking AKG with that,
which is also in themitochondrial metabolism family,
(26:20):
you may get some beneficialadditive effects even and so I
tell people not to worry aboutthat right now but whether you
should start combining them allat once.
I think there would be anargument that could be made to
spacing them out, especiallybecause our product is designed
with specifically titratedratios of ingredients.
(26:42):
And so if we've got the rightamount of protein carrier, if
you start eating a huge mealwith it and that could
potentially alter it, but theother thing I would add is that,
stephen, you are in the 99.9999, like almost as much repeating
You're really in.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
There are other people who do the level that you
do, but very small fraction ofpeople are really actively
engaged with their health.
You've made it essentially yourentire life, and one of the
things that we want to do withPropion Blend, which is this
blend of precursor ingredientsthat gives your gut what it
needs to create the Propion-1molecule, is we're making this
(27:22):
something that is geared towardseveryone, whether it's your
average person in middle Americawho doesn't know what NAD,
doesn't know what NMN is, stilllikes to eat hamburgers all the
way up to people like you andeverybody in between and I'm
somebody who's in between, there, where I haven't been an
(27:45):
Olympian athlete like you and Idefinitely don't get regular
exosome treatments or thinkabout my diet in such a
carefully constructed way.
I'm mostly somebody who'sreally busy and is thinking
about what they can do.
That's easy to hit a lot ofdifferent points through,
whether it's to the gut,microbiome or some other axis.
But really, what can I do thathas the maximum impact for my
(28:09):
body?
Yeah, yeah.
As a 32 hours of exercise.
What are the 15 minutes ofexercise that I can get in?
That's going to keep me strongor whatever.
And so I think Propion blends.
It's really comfortably forthat type of customer and in
that range of products as well,and, as Dan is saying, there's
potentially synergistic effectswith other products as well.
But if you're already somebodywho's doing the absolute 100% of
(28:32):
what they need, I can't saythat we're going to add 10 years
to your life, Stephen, becauseI think you're already there.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
I still have very good habits and I do prop myself
up with a lot of these greatthings and I take all those
things you guys said earlier.
Except for resveratrol I'vegiven up on that one for now.
I don't know if we want to godown that rabbit hole, but but I
agree with you and I think thatlook the I will say this the
moment your gut is compromised,you are, you are going down.
It is, it's the whole.
(29:14):
What is it?
Socrates who said it?
That?
That all the what was thewhat's, the famous quote about
the gut.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
Oh, I don't know.
But also, like when you getinto Ayurvedic health, the gut
is the number one thing thatthey talk about it's it is.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
I cannot tell you.
I have had people very close tome that have had SIBO and
dysbiosis and gut issues and manit just.
I've had my buddy's, an Olympicgymnast.
He still can't get abs becausehis gut got so compromised and
he's built perfectly everywhereelse.
If I have a client, I have anactor who wants to take his
shirt off and for a role, I haveto ask him about his digestion.
(29:52):
I just literally had one ofthese actors.
That's why I'm talking aboutthis.
He was like I just had thispooch.
I said what's going on with yourdigestion?
He had zero motility and I'mlike are you on any?
Are you taking Kratom?
Are you on some sort of SSRI?
Are you doing something?
He said no and it turns out hewas eating out every single meal
.
I said you need to startcontrolling your meal, you need
to cook, you need to get verycomfortable with cooking.
(30:13):
And I told him how to make itreal simple and I said you need
to do some jump rope, you needto bounce, you need to actually
reach literal motility.
Yeah, literally.
And guess what?
He all of a sudden, it allstarted coming around for him.
But if I would have known aboutyour guy's product, I would
have said, hey, try this.
These come from very reputablepeople that I highly respect,
and so let's talk about yourproduct real quick.
(30:36):
So you have a product now.
Is it ready to go?
Can people buy it?
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Yeah, so today is Monday and we are going to be
launching pre-sales on Fridaythrough our website which you
can visit, and it is probioncomP-R-o-p-i-o-ncom and we're
launching pre-sales and theproduct will ship out around
eight to ten weeks from now.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
Okay, and in what are they buying?
Are they buying a one monthsupply of none?
Speaker 2 (31:07):
yeah, 30 day, 30 day supply 30 scoops of propion
blend, which you're supposed tomix into water or sugar-free
almond milk is the other thingthat we recommend.
It tastes really good.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
That's what I use.
That's my jam right there.
Let me ask you this why did younot also include some sort of
brown rice with the pea and makeit a complete protein?
Or does it not matter, becausethe pea has the amino acids you
need?
Speaker 3 (31:32):
The pea protein has most of the major amino acids.
I think it's maybe relativelydeficient in methionine, might
be the one or two that it'sreduced in, but we were
considering supplementingmethionine in there.
However, if you look at studiesthat are coming out now,
relative methionine restrictionis actually pretty good for
longevity.
So we were thinking that youcould take a near complete
(31:55):
protein which has a little bitless methionine in there and get
a relative restriction andstart boosting your longevity
through that regard as well.
So we try to put scientificinput into all of our decisions
on what goes into the blend.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
Fantastic.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
And look, it's not a protein plus shake.
It's that the protein in thereis an actual functional
ingredient.
Speaker 1 (32:16):
Exactly, it's a propion drink, not a muscle
building drink.
Right Period.
Speaker 3 (32:21):
Although there are preclinical studies out there
that preclinical meaning theseare done in mice.
Whether they hold in humans,who knows right now but at least
in mice that if you supplementmice with IPA you can actually
boost muscle strength, boostmuscle.
This is just the metaboliteright Boost muscle strength,
boost muscle mass and reduce,dampen inflammation in the
(32:43):
muscle.
And they go through mechanismsup there.
So there are studies out inmice which would support healthy
muscle building with themetabolites themselves.
That's the goal of this thingis a.
It's a metabolite, ananti-aging gut metabolite
technology.
Which is why I was hooked intothis, because it's new and
different from whatever is outthere.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Yeah, look, dan, you sound like you are one busy guy
working with NASA and SpaceX andwhat you teach at three
universities.
You this must, you must reallybelieve in this product.
If in this product, if you'rethat busy and you're getting on
my podcast to talk about that,I'm honored to have someone like
some brains like you guys onthe podcast, but you must have
(33:23):
pretty high hopes for thismolecule.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Yeah, one of the things that got me really
excited about this is that Ilike a big picture advancement,
so things that are new andexciting and are different from
what's out there already.
Even if you look across myscientific career and some of
the major findings I've made inresearch, some of these would be
identifying adaptive immunecells like T cells and B cells,
controlling insulin resistanceand obesity, showing that the
(33:48):
gut immune system actually cancontrol disease throughout the
body and not just in the gut.
Another thing we've done islook at mechanical forces, how
that shapes inflammation, andalso, just most recently, our
paper on the immune system andmicrogravity.
I consider all of these thingsreally new, big picture ideas.
This isn't a sequel or likeright now in Hollywood or
(34:09):
whatever.
All these sequels or part threeor part four or something.
These are like I like big,original ideas, and that's what
I think propion blend is.
It's not just anotherresveratrol or any NADNR in a
man.
It's not another senolytic or aketone body or AKG.
This is a pathway that's notyet mainstream in products that
are out there.
(34:29):
I consider it somethingoriginal and that's why I
initially wanted to work withpropion.
I like to work on new thingsthat are amongst the first out
there, and so that's what got mereally excited, and what I hope
to accomplish is, as Imentioned, I started my career
off as a medical doctor and thenI became a scientist, and at
times I was doing practicingmedicine and science, and one of
(34:52):
the reasons I went into all ofthis is try to help as many
people as possible, and I think,with a product like this, which
potentially interfaces with somany important and relevant
components to healthy aging, Ithought this was my chance to
translate some of the researchI've done, especially in the gut
immune system, and to somethingthat could basically help
(35:13):
people live healthier, longerlives.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Fantastic, fantastic, speaking my language.
I love meeting people like you,people that have serious
cognitive horsepower and thatthey want to do something good
with it.
I'm really impressed.
I've heard Nicholas talk aboutPropion for God how long now I
don know Like.
I met you, nick, at Radfest.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
Years ago.
Speaker 1 (35:35):
Yeah, and I remember when I first saw you, I was
standing in line to get a coffeeand you were taking out your
business card and you weregiving an elevator pitch to
somebody about Propion.
I remember thinking like lookat this young kid, this guy,
like he's going places, like Ireally was impressed.
And then the next year you cameup and you said, you told me,
you said everybody at thisconference is learning how to
(35:57):
not age and you're the onlyperson I see that's actually
doing.
What are you doing?
And we just got on a call andwe've been friends ever since
and so I have to say I really amimpressed with what you guys
are doing.
This sounds like it's somethingthat is really well thought out
and it's actually targetingsomething the microbiome, which
(36:18):
I think is such an important anda lot of times under
appreciated part of health,because it does really affect so
many things.
What do you?
What's the future for you guysin terms of what's the real sort
of vision for this companymoving forward?
Are you guys going to have moreproducts?
Are you going to have versiontwo of certain things?
Speaker 2 (36:41):
Yeah, we're taking things one step at a time.
So we're launching this product, propion Blend.
We're in talks with a couple ofdifferent people, companies who
are interested in licensingthis from us and putting it on
their websites that have lots oftraffic, affiliate networks,
(37:01):
etc.
And then we're going to move onto developing a second product,
this science, into a pill sothat it's potentially more
accessible, just say, runningout the door or something, or
for people who don't like, forpeople who don't drink products,
we're looking at how to applyit in skincare.
We're also looking into avenuesin defense and pharmaceuticals,
(37:25):
and so there's a lot in thepipeline.
But again, just taking thingsone step at a time, exploring
partnership opportunities asthey come to us and doing our
best to stay sane while we dothis all as well.
Yeah, good luck with that.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
The other thing, nicholas.
We've got the current Blendproduct.
We also have a second Blendproduct that we're also
developing at the same time, sowe hope to introduce two Blend
products.
Both of them will have the sametryptophan diversion technology
background, but one might bedesigned for people who want to
even a little bit extra boost ontheir tryptophan metabolites
(38:01):
beyond what we can provide inthe initial blend.
And then, of course, the pillproducts.
But the potential for this islarge, because Nicholas was
talking to me also about whetherwe want to go into pet food
products, skin care, and sothese are the things we're
thinking of down the road, butit's definitely one product that
I'm focusing on right now.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
Yeah, pet food could be massive, honestly, like dog
food, and my God that could be,especially if you show that,
like what you guys do, you showthat this stuff actually works.
But, man, guys, this is, thisis fascinating stuff.
So one more time somebody,let's say somebody's interested
uh, pre-sale goes on this friday.
They go to propion I'm going tobring that up again dot com,
(38:46):
and then the product will arrive.
You said 10 weeks from now,approximately Eight to 10 weeks.
Yeah, eight to 10 weeks.
Okay, fantastic.
And then for everyone elselistening, I will include
everything we discussed in theshow notes and that will be at
stephenmccaincom backslashPropion and Propion is
(39:07):
P-R-O-P-I-O-N.
If you just want to buy theproduct and pre-order it this
Friday, p-i-o-n.
If you just want to buy theproduct and pre-order it this
Friday, go to propioncom.
P-r-o-p-i-o-ncom.
Guys, fantastic.
Speaker 2 (39:21):
I really look forward to seeing you.
Thank you so much for having us, Stephen.
This was a great conversation.
Yeah, my pleasure.
Speaker 1 (39:25):
I really wish I could have dived into so much more
with you guys, but I don't wantto abuse your time.
But if someone wants to reachout to you personally, where can
they find you?
How can they get ahold of you?
Nick, how do you start with you?
Speaker 2 (39:37):
I'm easy to find on LinkedIn.
You can always.
If you have a question for Dan,I can forward it to him.
Also, if you want to just getin touch with Stephen, you and I
are in contact all the time,and so he can easily reach out
to me.
Speaker 3 (39:54):
Yeah, fantastic guys, dan it.
Yeah fantastic guys.
Damn, are you gonna sayanything, or you know?
I just wanted to thank you forhaving us on.
I mean, uh, yeah, we want to.
As I said, I started my careeras a as a physician, and this is
one of the one of the dreamsthat we had was to try to
develop products that couldreally help promote healthy
aging and across across manypeople, especially as people get
older and become morevulnerable to things, and the
chance to develop something thatmight improve their resilience
(40:16):
and healthy aging.
This is like what we've dreamedabout, and also wanted to follow
up on what you said aboutNicholas and yeah, that was one
of the reasons.
When he approached me, I agreedthis was a genius kid from
Berkeley, and when an undergradcomes to you with ideas like
that, we were working on some ofthe stuff tangentially already.
But when someone comes up toyou with ideas like that, we
were working on some of thestuff tangentially already.
But when someone comes up toyou with a genius idea like this
(40:37):
, it doesn't happen that often.
I felt the same way as youabout Nicholas as well.
I just wanted to bring that up.
It's been a pleasure alsoworking with such a genius kid
from Berkeley as well.
Speaker 2 (40:49):
Thanks, dan, that's.
Nice.
Speaker 3 (40:50):
It's thanks, dan, that's nice.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
Dan and I make a good team.
Speaker 1 (40:53):
Dan and I make a really good team you guys seem
like you guys got a great thinggoing, so I'm really happy you
guys came on and I'd love to tryyour guys product and we're
happy to send you a bottle,stephen, we really so.
Speaker 2 (41:06):
We're selling right now in one month and three month
quantities, so one in threebottles and I recommend taking
that.
We went through extensive tastetesting with the product.
We've developed a really gooddark chocolate flavored blend.
If you mix it in almond milk,for example, like it'll just
taste like a chocolate smoothie.
So I reckon I recommend gettingthe three month supply because
(41:28):
that's where you'll actuallystart to see like cellular
effect is the longer you take it.
That's where those moleculesbuilding up will have the chance
to work over time on your body.
But yeah, I encourage you tojust at least try the product
and again go to propioncom andcheck us out.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:42):
And when it's delicious, you have compliance
and I imagine you need probablythree months to change the
microbiome.
It's not going to happenovernight.
Right, and start feeding thosethings that they take a while to
propagate, right?
We're talking about man, nickDan.
Fantastic, thank you so muchfor coming on.
Everybody listening, we reallyappreciate you.
Go to stephenmccaincom,backslash Propion, or this
(42:04):
Friday, go to propioncom.
This podcast will be releasedright before that.
Get your three months deliciousdark chocolate supply and mix
it with some almond milk.
And guys for coming on and lookforward to seeing what goes on
with your company and maybehaving you guys on in the future
as you start to expand and sure, yeah.
So thanks again everybody forlistening to the steven mccain
(42:26):
podcast.
Thanks, nick dan, and we'llcatch you on the next one.
Stay healthy, everyone cheersand we'll catch you on the next
(42:55):
one.
Stay healthy, everyone Cheers.
Bye.
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