Navigating Success with Nick Robbins: From NFL to Marketing to Real Estate, Exploring Skill Stacking and AI's Future Impact

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right, here we are.
We're in another episode hereat the Stoic Agent podcast.
I got a really unique guesthere and the story will come out
actually how we met.
I hadn't actually prepared alot of stuff for this interview
because I knew it was gonna be asuper organic and neat
interview to have, but I gotNick Robbins here, who I
actually just met in personfirst time.

(00:23):
So welcome to the podcast bro.

Speaker 2 (00:25):
I appreciate it, man, Very excited to dig in Awesome.

Speaker 1 (00:29):
So let's start off.
We always like to start offwith who you are, kind of like,
where you came from, and you cangive us the short version.
We got a long form here, so ifyou, as long as you wanna, go
give us a little background onwho you are and brought you here
.

Speaker 2 (00:43):
Yeah, absolutely.
So quick background of how wegot together here is about a
decade ago I got a job inprofessional sports, started
working in the MBA and up tillthat point in my life I had made
some questionable decisions,we'll say you know, I took seven
years to get a four year degreeyou know, six community
colleges, two universities, thatkind of stuff Got a job in

(01:04):
professional sports and had amentor over there who taught me
how to show up on time, makecalls and taught me how to sell,
and that really was one of themost important things that's
ever happened to me.
And then, from there, worked inthe MBA, then got a job in the
NFL and then from there, Istarted being like, hmm, what do
I wanna do next in life?
And I started learning about aconcept that I would love to get

(01:24):
into, about skill stacking.
Not sure if you're familiarwith that the value of skill
sets over anything else.
Right.
And at the time I'd realized,okay, I know how to sell, what
else can I do to expand my skillsets to help go make more money
?
Cause I was concerned aboutmoney at the time, right, and I
was like huh, marketing, onlinemarketing and I had a buddy who

(01:47):
knew a little bit about SEO andhe'd been kind of an
entrepreneur, and he was like,hey, man, quit your job, move to
Utah, let's start a marketingbusiness.
And I was like, okay, let's doit right.
And there was a trigger thatled to this, though.
In 2014, I was working for theTampa Bay Buccaneers, was the
number one sales rep on thestaff and I made $43,000 that

(02:08):
year, including commissions, foran NFL franchise working 60, 70
hours a week.
So I knew how to work hard.
I knew how to sell Cause forthose of you watching, if you
guys know anything about theBuccaneers at the time, this was
pre-Tom Brady.
This was Greg Siano Merse0-1-14, very difficult sale.
Anywho, he'd seen me my businesspartner.

(02:28):
He'd seen me learn how to sell.
He said come work with me.
And so as soon as I got that,within two weeks of me getting
that final W-2 in December, Iwent and I moved mid January to
Utah to start the marketingagency, and then, from there,
all kinds of stuff took place.
But long story short, we gotall into paid advertising,
online marketing, and we reallykind of blew up.

(02:51):
We went from zero to a milliondollar, or a zero to $100,000 a
month in 10 months, and thenfrom there we blew up and we've
done over $18 million in thelast seven years, and then last
year I ended up selling theagency and going on real estate
and that's how we ended upmeeting.

Speaker 1 (03:05):
Oh, so talk to me a little bit about.
So who was the guy that?
What was the relationship?
He was an old friend of yours.

Speaker 2 (03:14):
Yes, he has an old friend who had started a
business and then got bought outof it, and so I'd seen him kind
of make in the entrepreneurgame before and he was like I
know online marketing and I needa salesman.
And I was like let's do it.
So I was single at the time,just jumped off a cliff, tamp at
Utah and we just got after it.

Speaker 1 (03:32):
So did you guys simply work with people who
didn't know how to online market, or were you selling a product
yourselves?
Great, question.

Speaker 2 (03:39):
So what we did originally was we were gonna
sell SEO and websites and wewere gonna sell them to local
businesses right, you know, thecar detail or dentist, that type
of stuff and what I came tofind was that I didn't know how
to sell SEO and websites tolocal businesses.
And there was actually a periodthere for about 10 months or it
was almost a year, where I'dsold $0 worth of stuff and on

(04:03):
the side I was actually gambling.
I was playing daily fantasy,sports, draft kings and fan duel
because my cousin was aprofessional gambler, and so
like I had 2000 bucks that I hadsaved from my bankroll and that
was like my living money.
I was making like a couplethousand bucks a month off that.
Anywho, I realized that Ididn't know how to sell SEO and

(04:23):
websites.
But then I got introduced tothis thing called Facebook
advertising by a guy you mightknow, billy Jean.
You know Billy Jean ismarketing, yeah, so I was one of
Billy Jean's really early guys.
I've known him for a long timenow and he taught me about
Facebook advertising and forsome reason that just clicked
for me and I was like, oh, I putup an ad and I do a funnel and
then that's it.

(04:43):
Like his SEO had all thesebacklinks and I'm like I don't
know how long it's gonna takeand all that stuff.
But as soon as I got introducedto Facebook advertising from
Billy man, that's when we wentfrom zero to 100K in 10 months
and then we blew up and we endedup doing 3 million 1.7 million
our first full year withFacebook advertising, then 3
million, then 3 million and thenwe just continued to grow.

Speaker 1 (05:03):
Oh yeah, and where did you reach where you were
like I don't wanna do thisanymore.
What prompted that?

Speaker 2 (05:10):
Yeah, that's a great question.
So it actually happened twice.
So I first sold 40% of myequity share in the agency in
late 2019.
And the plan was I was gonna gowith my wife over here and we
were gonna go travel and we hadall this travel plan for 2020.
We were gonna go, I was gonnaspeak in Columbia, we were gonna
go to Italy, we had all thesethings planned.

(05:31):
And then we all know whathappened in 2020, right and so
from there I was like, okay, andwe gotta make a game plan
change.
And at the time, I was runningan agency mastermind, so working
with other marketing agencies,helping them grow, and the
results were astronomical, Imean crazy.
Not only did some of thesepeople go from like making 5,000
a month to 300,000 a month andbeyond in like a six 12 month

(05:54):
period.
They also became some of myclosest friends, and so that
kept me close to the agency gameand I'd always still been
friends with my old businesspartner because he's been one of
my best friends for a long time.
And in early 2021, we basicallytraded some equity in a few
different areas and I was backin the game again and then I
left again.

Speaker 1 (06:13):
I guess it's a peelin' pack a little bit more.
Did you just go?
Did you get tired of it?
Or like, why are you not doingit still?

Speaker 2 (06:21):
Yeah.
So there were a couple ofthings.
The biggest was I was tired ofnot having a compounding asset
vehicle on the back end, and sowhat we were selling was
service-based work, and I didn'thave any equity in any medical
practices.
I didn't own anything that wasinherently sellable.

(06:41):
So I started thinking aboutwhat is sellable, compounding
assets, what can take place inthe next three, five, 10 years
and the agency world.
You're mainly selling labor,unless you create your own
software.
Unless you have something else,you're mainly selling labor and
private equity big companiesthey don't like to buy that
right, because then youbasically got key man risk.
If you lose a media buyer, ifyou lose something like that,

(07:02):
you're gone.
And it got to a point where itwas like, okay, I either need to
own equity in medical practices, or we need to develop some
sort of software, or I need tosell, because I just wanted to
start putting my skill setsomewhere else, because at the
time I'd been blessed to savesome money, make some money,
things like that.
So I just started thinkingabout what my end game was and I
came to realize like I just asmuch as I love the actual

(07:23):
particular field of medical wewere working in.
I just didn't want to be in themedical arena.
It's just not something Iwanted to do from that angle.

Speaker 1 (07:31):
So you took the skill set that you learned and we're
gonna talk about this skillstacking for sure.
And then you, what was realestate?
You're like, this is how we met.
We're gonna eventually get tothis.
This is how we met.
So then you said, okay, I'mable to use this skill of doing
the ads which is an incredibleskill set, by the way, which I'm

(07:51):
gonna learn more from you and Ican't wait to do that.
And then you said real estate'sthe way to go.
Had you always kind of beeninterested in real estate, or is
it just that was the avenue tokind of get you to that
compounding thing you're talkingabout?

Speaker 2 (08:03):
Great question.
So I actually still rememberthe day.
It was September 14, 2021.
I had a conversation with AlexBecker, who I think you know in
the marketing world, and I wasin Texas and it actually
happened to be about crypto, butit was about investing and to
that point, I had basically justbeen storing cash for the most
part, like I had started buyingsome investment properties, but

(08:25):
kind of like on a whim, justkind of shotgun, buying them.
I'm the kind of guy who's like,well, if I'm gonna buy one, I
might as well buy two.
So I signed on to the first day.
Site unseen, I still have neverseen our investment properties,
but regardless, I had thisconversation with Alex and we
were talking about investing incompounding assets and where the
world is going, where truewealth is created, and it opened
my eyes to this world ofinvesting that I hadn't really

(08:48):
had that lens on before, and soafter that I became obsessed.
I started studying cryptomarkets, I started studying real
estate, I started studyinghedge fund guys Warren Buffett,
all of that type of stuff theguys who were truly wealthy with
the compounding assets and thenI lost a bunch of money in 2022
on crypto, which was good.
I still hold a good amount.
I still believe in blockchaintechnology, for sure, but I

(09:08):
bought some NFTs that wereseveral thousand dollars that
aren't worth anything anymore.
I'm not afraid to admit itGuilty.
Yeah there you go right, we getcaught up in the craze.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
I bought one, I bought Real Vision.
So it was my membership andthen I got that on the side, but
anyways.

Speaker 2 (09:25):
But at the time I was still.
I'm very conservative by nature, so I like to have a war chest,
but I was still buying stocksand real estate and so we have
seven investment properties.
And what really led me to howwe where we are today is I was
reviewing recently or not toolong ago, the actual internal
rate of return of our investmentproperties, when I included

(09:45):
everything the cash flow, theappreciation, the tax benefits,
all that stuff and I was likeman, I need a thousand of these
units.
And I was like this is where Ishould place the marketing
skillset and sales skillset Ihave.
And that's when I was like thisis it, let's do it.
You know, and I spent a lot oftime thinking about it and I was
like this is it, I want to beon real estate.
You know it's from the, so Iwant to attach it from it's.

(10:08):
Not only do I want to have thereal estate from the compounding
assets standpoint, but, as aside note, I'm very involved in
the AI world.
I have a lot of friends who aredeep down that world and it
scares the garbage out of me,it's.
It can be terrifying.
I think it's going to end upbeing good, but anything that
can be done on a computer.
It's going to be a good thing,and I think it's going to be a
good thing, and I think it'sgoing to be a good thing and

(10:30):
what I've done on a computer isgoing to be replaced, and so I
started thinking about it.
I was like man I want hardassets and I want to start
getting involved with likeplumbing and roofers and
electricians, cause it's goingto be a while before AI replaces
that.
They're going to replace themarketers and the media buyers
and the copywriters and thesales people and that type of
stuff soon.
I think it's going to be awhile till we teach the AI how

(10:50):
to fix a toilet, and so that wasanother reason why I was just
like, okay, in 10 years, what doI want to own a lot of?
And I was like real estate.

Speaker 1 (10:58):
I love the forward thinking on that.
Yeah, cause I've gone deep inmy head about where this whole
thing is going.
Yeah, and it's interestingCause I think you know people
focus on if it bleeds, it leadstype deal, so they kind of think
about the worst case scenario,terminator style for AI you know
.
But I mean, I want to have apositive outlook and I think

(11:22):
it's going to solve a lot ofproblems and it's going to
create some too Definitely, andI have faith in humans.

Speaker 2 (11:28):
Overall, I think that humans will make the right
decision over time.
There might be, as there alwayshas been in human history, some
issues that arise until you know, the right idea ends up winning
out.
But the real thing too, therefor me was like I just don't
want to compete with these guys.
I don't want to compete withSilicon Valley and the tech
bro's, like I saw a huge,massive, massive arbitrage

(11:51):
opportunity and inefficiency inthe real estate market, cause
when you're a deal, I mean youcan't it's hard to get even
accurate square footage on ahouse, right, like I mean,
sometimes you know one soft oncewebsite has it as this, the
property appraiser has it as theseller saying it's this, right,
so the inefficiencies in themarket are massive in my opinion
, right, especially if youcompare it to something like the

(12:12):
stock market, where it's likeyou're competing with hedge
funds and algorithms and likeall these bots and stuff, and so
that was another reason why, aswell, that I wanted to go down
there.
I just didn't want to competewith the AI guys.
Yeah, well, yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:24):
Yeah, it's.
That's one way to go with it.
Let's go back to this skillstacking.
I don't want to, I don't wantto leave this, so so drop us
this, this concept.

Speaker 2 (12:34):
Skill stacking, skill crafting, to me, is the number
one thing that anyone shouldlearn if they want to make more
money and provide more value inlife.
Right, this should be taught atthe educational level.
It should be taught in highschool.
And what it really is is, ifyou stack strategically, stack
skills together on top of eachother, then you lead to

(12:55):
exponential non-linear resultsin the amount of value that you
provide.
So I'll give you an example ofthe skill stack that I created
over time.
First I learned how to sell,which gives me a certain level
of earning power, value providedto society, to the marketplace.
Then I learned how to book myown appointments through
marketing, which 10X it wasn't,it wasn't a 2X, it was a 10X,

(13:16):
because if you can sell and youcan book your own appointments,
it's an exponential increase toyour earning power.
Then I was able to build my ownproducts.
So then I started sellingservices, courses, coaching,
things of that nature.
So now not only do I have theability to sell, I can get
appointments for that sale and Ican develop the product and
sell it on the backend Anotherexponential increase.

(13:37):
Then I learned how to replacemyself and build sales teams
right, because I've had salesteams for years and years.
I haven't taken too many directsales calls in a long time.
You were when we actually spokewas one of the first ones.
Right, because I was testing anew area.
Right, it was one of the firstones I'd had in a while.
Right, because I taught, wasable to teach, sales people how
to do it, so then I could havemultiple people selling my
products, I could fill theircalendars and then I could also

(13:58):
have the product being fulfilledon the backend, right.
And so if you stack theseskills on top of each other, it
just leads to exponentialreturns, and this can be with
anything, right.
So, like, I taught her acopywriter she's so good one of
my favorite people, unbelievable.
She came to us with no skillset in the copywriting game.
She was a former Hollywoodwriter, and so she was one of

(14:19):
those people who was underpaid,didn't make any money, you know
that type of stuff.
And I was like, look, if we cantake what you know and I teach
you sales copy, you're gonnamake way more money.
And so first I taught her salescopy, and then I taught her how
to build funnels, and then Itaught her the tech to the
funnels right, and now she's ata point where she's learning how
to train her own copywriters,again replacing herself, and
each one of those things led toexponential increases.

(14:41):
You can do this with accountingif you go from like accounting
to you know, being a CFO to likelearning how to do you know,
hire more CFOs and all that typeof stuff right.
So it doesn't matter whetheryou're a coder, anything.
If you strategically stackskills on top of each other, you
can lead to massive results.

Speaker 1 (14:58):
I love that concept.
I go to because I usually tryto think about golf anyway I can
.
Is this like the different,like?
Let me ask you this do youthink that you will always they
talk about, like people whoreally do well, the top guys?
It ends up being here in theend because they all have the

(15:19):
skill set right, but they talkabout that you will.
Your, your weakness will alwaysbe the thing that's Exploited
when the pressure comes on.
So, with all these skills thatyou developed is, do you think
that, like, things start tobreak down If you don't do this?
Or if, like, if you could bethe best driver of the golf ball
, your irons could be good, butif you're not good at chipping,

(15:41):
your scores are gonna suffer.
So you need to work on that.
Is this?
Is this a similar kind of it'son that?

Speaker 2 (15:46):
on that realm.
In golf, you need to have thefull round, full rounded thing,
and it's because it's a solosport.
Yeah, and so you have to be inthose areas.
In business, there are certainskill weakness effects that need
to be improved if you're gonnascale.
At least I've had to learn.
I had to learn some level ofcontrol over my numbers, for
example, and understanding themath and the data behind those.

(16:06):
Yeah, but when it comes tothings like operations, which is
not a strong skill set of mine,I still want to fill that gap.
But that's where we usually doguy go to other people.
So it would be creating awell-roundedness and you still
need to know where those go.
But I think the delineationbetween the solo sport versus
the team sport is a little bitdifferent there.
Yeah, but it is that because inbusiness, your week when the
pressure is on the weakest partof the business is always what's

(16:27):
gonna break.
Yes, you know, and so whetherit's you or someone else needs
to fill that gap.
You need to be aware of it.
Yeah, if you can't solve it,you need to find the person who
can.

Speaker 1 (16:35):
I I love that and that's why I have Candice, so.
But you know, goes back to tothat I need to learn this stuff
as well and that's one of thethings we've been work.
One of our coaches we worked onwith Candice is she just really
loves to do the do you know, soshe'll learn something and she

(16:56):
wants to do it.
It's like you got to get out ofthat role of doing the do.
You have to know how to do itand then teach someone else and
then hold them accountable andand you know, that's how you
build it out right.
So I want to shift gears, but alittle bit into the same vein.
So I didn't know that that Iwas your.
I was a test case for you, yeah.

Speaker 2 (17:16):
I'd had a few other ones.
Right, it was, it was more.
I just had a couple of calls,remember we talked about the
pilot program was right insteadof soda, but for this particular
one that's why I was on thecall, you know, because I was
like, okay, I want to have theconversations, I want to see
what's being had here, I want tosee how this goes right,
because we want to eventuallywant to expand to, you know,
every county in the UnitedStates Hopefully right and grow
from there.
But yeah, it was the first time, it was a test case, so I was

(17:38):
still really going through theprocess of how I wanted it to go
.

Speaker 1 (17:41):
Let me.
Let me ask you this, becausewe've had such a connection on a
number of different levels Doyou think that the universe
somehow like?
I wanted to talk to you alittle bit about Synchronicity,
if you familiar with any ofyoung stuff, yes, so is that.
Do you?
You believe that, like therewas something of like?

(18:02):
Because here's the other dealwith that which I let you know
For you, all of you out there.
He sent me an email, right, andI get these all the time.
I get them all the time and I'mlike, oh, that's just
somebody's copy and you know, ifthey send it out to enough
people, they're gonna.
Oh, there's a solution of myproblem.
I need more listings and I'mlike I'm always looking for more

(18:24):
opportunities, but at the endof the day, I Can see usually a
sales letter and I, there's justso much bots and sales letters
and all that.
But for some reason, and Istill you said SEMA actually
didn't put the right county inthere.
But then you said sometimes wedo that the Alex Becker move of
misspelling something orsomething.
So that wasn't, that was just athat was a mistake.

Speaker 2 (18:46):
That was, that was 100.
Was it a mistake that thatparticular time?

Speaker 1 (18:50):
It was a mistake.

Speaker 2 (18:51):
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
I don't think so Right, because I don't open
those things, mm-hmm, I don'teven open them, because I
usually, but I'm sure you hadsome good thing in there, some
title or something.
I was like, oh, that'sinteresting, a little different
to catch the eye.
So what, let's?
I want to go a little sidewayswith this.
Maybe the audience wants you totalk more about Facebook ads

(19:12):
when we get to that later.
But like what is?

Speaker 2 (19:15):
that.

Speaker 1 (19:16):
What is that?
Synchronously like, how did,how did like.
Is this just like the?
The universe put us together.
I was ready to meet you, youwere ready to meet me, and we
can tell the story too, of like,our like back and forth about.
You know, we're not gonna tellyou too much about our business
relationship, but there was some.
Yeah, let's maybe talk aboutthat a little bit.
Yeah, like meant to be.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
I 100% believe so it's.
There's a lot to unpack on thisparticular concept and it's
something that I've thoughtabout for a very long time, and
it's the the idea For me.
Anyways, I have this internalcertainty, right, I'm very
spiritual person.
I have this internal certaintythat if I show up and I do what

(19:58):
I believe is good and right inthe world which are all
definitions anyways, likecontext, good is another kind of
.
You could have a wholeconversation about what's good,
right, but in regardless, Ibelieve in a certainty that the
universe will connect me withthe people, the place of the
resources and things I need thatwill help me achieve bigger
goals, and also that we canprovide value to Right, and so,
whether it's I'm providing youvalue, you're providing me value

(20:20):
.
I strongly believe in that typeof situation, and not only that,
but you know how ourconversations kind of evolved,
and I showed up on Our last calland I was like, hey, here's
what I want to do, right,because I started thinking about
this more, and I was like youknow what?
There's more than meets the eyehere, and so, for me, I Do
believe in synchronicity.
I do believe that we are hereto, you know, meant to have this

(20:41):
conversation right, becauseit's pretty rare to be able to
hit it Off kind of like how wehave.
I feel, anyways, and I'mexcited to see where it goes.

Speaker 1 (20:49):
And that's so.
It's the internal certaintythat that's the base of it, that
if I show up and want to do mybest, that good, I know, we know
it.
I guess we could again.

Speaker 2 (21:01):
That's a belief that we can get there right and this
is an interesting concept for me, so I've told you a little bit
you know, off-camera about mypersonal development and how I'm
obsessed with it and how Ithink it's the number one thing
Missing from.
You know humanity in a lot ofways and I can talk in the
future later, if we have time,about my long-term vision for
that.
But regardless, when I gotstarted on the entrepreneurial

(21:23):
journey about eight years ago, Ihad no money.
I was, you know, $20,000 indebt.
I had $2,000 that I had chargedyou a credit card, that I was
gambling every night hoping thatyou know, lebron James Didn't
miss a free throw in my bankroll.
Poof gone.
You know what I mean likeliterally be gone.
And at that time I stillbelieved that because the books
told me to all the the greatbooks.
So I just believe, believe, andI didn't have any evidence of

(21:46):
it and so I just believed in it,blindly faith.
You could say that things wouldwork out, that if I just kept
showing up.
I always told myself I don'tknow when XYZ is gonna happen,
but I know I'm not gonna stopand I know that if I keep going
I'm gonna get there and overtime things started happening.
It might not have happened thetimeline that I wanted or
expected, but things startedhappening.

(22:06):
And then, bam, things startedclicking.
And when I'm at Billy Jean Ithink that was another example
of synchronicity synchronicityat the time, right where he came
into my life and I was likethat's it, I need to attach my
thing because you can just feelit, you can see it right.
And this happened over and overand over and over again.
And Now I'm in a point wherethere's evidence that it works

(22:27):
in my eyes, so I continue to.
That certainty has beendeveloped.
It went from putting faith inother people's belief in it into
now I have my own internalevidence of taking place of like
, hey, if I just wake up, getafter it, no, I'm not gonna quit
and put myself out there,something good's gonna come back
.
And so that evidence has led tojust a massive internal
certainty and it only growslarger.

(22:47):
And and even talking with thebiggest, most successful people
that I know and have been around, that level of certainty is
what keeps them calm, cool andcollected and continues to let
them grow and grow.
Now, looks back or have thiscertainty.
Oh my gosh 100%, massive.

Speaker 1 (23:04):
How would he put it?

Speaker 2 (23:06):
boy?
That's a good question.
How would he put I'm trying tothink of the backer way you
would describe this he would Inregards to that internal
certainty he would be all aboutif you cut off everything.

(23:27):
So he's very, very extreme.
Right, you cut off everything,you focus everything on one
thing.
If you just focus, you actuallyreally focus.
One of the biggest things I wentfrom Becker and this kind of
goes into that certainty aspectis he looked at me one day and
he told me and we were at amastermind and he was like the
reason why I beat everyone isbecause I get more done in four
hours and most people get donein two weeks.
And it was because of thatfocus, that certainty.

(23:50):
So he would say you know, ifyou cut off everything, if you
cut the BS, if you stop eatingthe crappy food, if you cut off
the video games and you actuallyget after it, then that
certainty it's almost guaranteedto happen.
But most people are eitherunwilling or unable to cut off
all the vices and all theinstant gratifications and
things like that.

Speaker 1 (24:08):
So would you say that he believes in will, his, his
extreme will to put in more timethan anyone else?

Speaker 2 (24:17):
Yeah, is going to produce the results that he
wants and at least put him in a,at least put himself in a place
where, mentally and physically,yeah, he knows he's done
everything and he's because, ifthe if, if you think about the
highest levels ofentrepreneurship, if it's the
goal is to see around cornersand basically to be able to
anticipate the future of wherethings are going.
Because it's not a Laboristthing.

(24:39):
Right, the top entrepreneursare not laborist.
They're the ones who have theclearest lines of thinking,
they're the ones who have thedeepest thinking, and so if you
are able to cut out All the BSand you're able to think
properly, then, yes, it would bea form of will, I would say, to
be able to get things done, butalso just having the clearest,
sharpest thinking so that youcan take the action and get the
result and Basically, get moredone in an hour than most people

(25:00):
get done in days.

Speaker 1 (25:04):
Okay.
So Because when I think ofbecker who I'm a fan of, by the
way Similar to like a GrantCardone super fan, not quite the
way I would operate, but Iwould say, hey, man, I would
look anything I say, because nowthis is out there, I would say
I would say, right to that, hey,like, not quite the way it
operate, man, but I have madrespect and I appreciate you

(25:25):
know how much focus you have onwhat you're doing, because focus
is, I, in my opinion, asuperpower.

Speaker 2 (25:32):
Right, it really is a super power, if you can,
especially in today's worldright because it wouldn't.

Speaker 1 (25:37):
But what would a superpower be?
It's basically something that alot of people don't have, yeah,
or it wouldn't be super power,right I?
Where is the delineation inthere?
So it seems like you went morein a spiritual path and it's not
only to talk about people andit's not kind of what we're
talking about here, but likethat, where did that spiritual

(25:59):
path or the like we talk aboutfaith, right, that there it is a
spiritual thing.
Where did that kind of start todevelop for you and how was
that really helped to continueto?
Like, does it bring you morepeace around that focus?
Like it's not just about themoney, like where?

Speaker 2 (26:16):
did that start to?

Speaker 1 (26:17):
come in for you.

Speaker 2 (26:18):
Yeah, great question, and so I know exactly where it
really started.
So when I was much younger, mydad was very big into like the
Tony Robbins, the Carlton Sheets, the Earl Nightingales of the
world.
He used to play those tapes forme when I was like 12, 11.
We would drive back and forthto school.
It didn't mean anything at thetime but I still, looking back,

(26:40):
I still believe that there was aseed that was planted by those
things always being played.
And then I got into like theMLMs when I was 18 and I was
like if you just find fivepeople who get eight people,
you're going to get rich, andI'll never forget Melaleuca.
But where it really allconnected for me and just took
off like a rocket ship was whenI was 22 years old, maybe 23, I

(27:01):
can't remember anymore.
Right around that time I got aDUI.
I had made some dumb decisionswhen I was younger, you know,
and I was a bit of a wild childfor sure early on, and I got a
DUI and this was kind of likethe cap.
I'd been arrested three timesin 18 months at that point, all
for just drunk and public stuff.
And one DUI I like never hurtanybody at Fort, I think the
heavens, but regardless.

(27:22):
A week after that I was given abook called A New Earth by
Eckhart Tolle and it was givento me by a fraternity brother
who had six months prior He'dactually driven off a cliff
while in mushrooms, like heliterally, literally driven off
a cliff and survived, and so I'dwatched his transformation over
six months, because he used tobe Mr Party guy and then it mean

(27:44):
him or similar in a lot of ways.
And then over the next sixmonths he was just like straight
A.
You could tell something wasway different about him and he
had found out about the DUI.
I tried to keep it under wrapsfrom the fraternity at the time
but like he was kind of like oneof the big brother.
Anyways, like as it was abusiness fraternity, it wasn't a
social fraternity, so they, itwasn't something I wanted out
there.
Either way, he knew I told himabout it.

(28:04):
He handed me this book and Istarted reading it and every
single page of that book wokesomething up with inside of me
that's still difficult todescribe to this day.
You know, I used before thecamera where I was, like it went
from, like, you know, wizard ofOz, everything's black and
white and also you can see incolor.
And I started learning about,like, why I thought the way that
I thought and what the ego was,and that we're not the one.

(28:27):
You know, that mindless monkeythat's running around throwing
coconuts in our brain, that'sjust bouncing from one thing to
the other.
That's not actually you, who'sthe person, who's watching the
person think, and that rightthere, that moment, when I first
read about the observer, itcompletely changed my life.
There was something deeper thatwas going on here and that led
me down a monstrous spiritualpath, and that's when I started

(28:47):
studying all of the religions.
I read the dominant Pada and Istarted looking into the Bible
and I started studying theBuddha and Krishna and all these
types of things.
And it's just one of thosethings that with the
spirituality side, so thatawoken it right.
And for me, with spirituality,there's a quote by Wayne Dyer
that I live by and I think aboutoften, and that is how can we

(29:09):
be so pessimistic in a worldwhere we know so little and, at
the end of the day, when peopleact as if they know everything,
like I, I struggle with blackand white because we don't even
know what makes our heartbeatright, like I mean, when people
don't speak in terms of contextor you know continuums and
different things, like it's Ijust, I just disagree with it.

(29:30):
So I'm just always like, if wedon't know anything about what's
going on in the world, likethen why would we ever be upset?
And so then that just takes medeeper and deeper down the
spiritual path.
I'm a huge Wayne Dyer, fan ofthat Eckhart Tolle, wayne Dyer
and there's so many in between.
But they've just ignited thatflame of spirituality and
there's more to life than justthe money or just girls or
anything like that.

Speaker 1 (29:50):
I love the way your mind works, man, it's funny so
much just came up when you, whenyou brought up this.
So my dad actually introducedme to Wayne Dyer.
It was the first place wherethis started for me when I was
10 years old.
Yeah, I remember listening to acassette and he went through
that thoughts become things andhe did remember the lemon.

Speaker 2 (30:10):
when he talks about the lemon, oh, yeah, and you can
taste it Salivating Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (30:16):
And then, before I was the exit, I was in Plymouth,
massachusetts, where I listenedto that tape the first time and
he said, alex, if you, he'slike, this stuff that you're
listening to here right now issomething that adults never even
you know he's like, this isamazing stuff, incredible, yeah.
And so that led me down theroad of Carlos Castaneda.

Speaker 2 (30:32):
I don't know if he was a big castanet fan.

Speaker 1 (30:34):
You don't touch that one when you change the way you
look at things, the things youlook at change type thing.
Oh and by the way, as a sidenote, I sold Carlton Sheets of
property here, just over thebridge.

Speaker 2 (30:42):
Did you really?
Oh, my gosh yeah.

Speaker 1 (30:45):
I have a story around a guy that is a good friend of
mine, who came back from thedead, who was Carlton's partner
I'll tell you about him anothertime who envisioned that he was
going to come to Florida andmeet a very wealthy man.
And he did.
He met Carlton, became hisbusiness partner.
That's crazy.

Speaker 2 (31:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:03):
So, at anyhow, circling back to that ego and
where because I got my owntheories on kind of where ego
came from what are your thoughtson that?
You said the person observingthe thought.
Did you mean that, or was thatjust a?

Speaker 2 (31:22):
I don't know about person, but whatever the soul,
the spirit I look at, it more asa spirit, the real you.
Yes, the real.
You source, source energy.
I use the term God sourcepretty much interchangeably.
In a lot of ways, that's whatwe're really connected to.
Is that source?
Observing the thoughts that aretaking place?

Speaker 1 (31:42):
Do you have any ideas on like where that came from?

Speaker 2 (31:45):
Yeah, I do actually.
So my thoughts are if we lookat evolution which I know, we're
talking about spirituality andGod and creation, this isn't an
evolution versus creationconversation.
However, if you look atevolution and the way that the
brain operates, the brain islike two million years old and
it's meant to keep you alive.
It's not meant to keep youhappy.

(32:06):
So the brain is a wonderful,it's a wonderful servant, but a
horrible master.
And so I look at the runningthoughts as the brain.
It's trying to protect us, it'strying to keep us out of harm's
way, and there were times where,if you had a saber, two tiger
chasing, you probably shouldfreak out and go into fight or
flight mode and survive.

(32:26):
But in today's world,unfortunately, there's people
that can't even go to thegrocery store without getting
into that fight or flight mode,and it's not necessary.
And so when I think about thethoughts, I look at it as an
evolutionary, wired thing thattook place to keep us alive over
the years, right, but it's alsothe more that it evolved, the

(32:48):
more it takes away from our truenature and our true self if we
don't learn what it's there for.
So I think that's the answer towhere you're going with the
question a little bit, butthat's how I view the brain.
It's a two million year oldbrain.
It's not meant to keep us happy, it's meant to keep us alive
and the biggest thing is we needto understand that and realize
it.
As far as the ego there and itdoes serve a purpose in a lot of
ways.

Speaker 1 (33:06):
Yeah, I've got a little theory that it's the
concept of time right, meaning,they believe and I heard this
somewhere, I don't know exactlywhere I heard it, but it really
resonated with me that pre manlike you were talking about, so
this brain has been around for along time, and then you have

(33:28):
the reptilian brain, which isway back there, which is like
run or fight what are the other,you know?
Or just chill out in the sun, Ihave to worry about anything, or
I got to run or I got to fight,like that's that which is the
fighting thing you're talkingabout, like people that haven't,
you know, mastered that it'slike it's, this is a threat or
it's cool.
I heard, and it reallyresonated with me, that the

(33:51):
concept of time was firstbecause before agriculture it
was in Northern Africa wherethey found that one of pre man
would bury ostrich eggs withwater inside them.
So what that depicted and thatwas before agriculture, like
okay, I'm going to plant a crockand then it's going to come

(34:11):
later, right Way beforeagriculture, and so that that's
where the concept of time camein, that in the future I'll need
this, and that's kind of mybelief on kind of where it
started.
What do you, what do you thinkabout that?

Speaker 2 (34:26):
Man, we might open Pandora's box here, but I love
discussing time in general andwhat, where time comes from and
what that's about, right,because so I love the idea of,
like, when we had to startgathering for the winter,
predict where things are going,because, yeah, 500 years ago,
even they might not have reallyhad much concept of time, people

(34:47):
didn't have a watch like, oh,it's going to be sunny in a
little bit, but it wasn't reallyuntil agriculture and things
like that we started thinkingabout time, but the other side
of it, or not the other side,but a different view on time.
That fits with with what youjust stated, is time being an
emotion, and so let me get.
Let me explain, right.
What is it like when you arehaving an amazing date or

(35:08):
spending time with your bestfriend, or you are skiing or
doing a hobby that you love?
How quickly does time move?
Interesting, yeah.

Speaker 1 (35:15):
So it meets instantly .

Speaker 2 (35:17):
Well, no, it moves.
It moves fast, right.
So by not, how quickly doestime go?
All that trip ended too soon.
This had this went to buy toofast, right.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
It'll give you the flip side really quick right.

Speaker 2 (35:27):
So versus you're sitting, the first thing that
came to mind, like, let's say,you're going to like traffic
school or something like that,you got a ticket, you know, and
time takes forever.
Yes, and it's based on theemotion that we're describing,
based on the event that's takingplace, because why is it and
this really goes back torelativity in Einstein and some
of that stuff it's like why isit?
When we're in some events, timeseems like it moves, like this,

(35:47):
but in others it takes forever?
So then that's our emotionalstate that's leading to that,
and so it's like time is justthis whole crazy thing that can
break down.
But when I started thinkingabout it like that, I was like,
oh my gosh, like what is time?

Speaker 1 (36:00):
Exactly so.
We've really been sitting herefor about three hours, right,
because this feels awesome.

Speaker 2 (36:04):
Yeah, exactly I would have said, I would have been
surprised.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
Let me ask you this so I want to stay on this
concept of ego.
So I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I,
I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, Ican't.

Speaker 2 (36:26):
So that's interesting .
You bring up Stuart Wilde, andyou're one that not many people
have ever met know that name,and so I've listened to a lot of
his stuff on YouTube, and he'sgot a lot of great stuff.
What's interesting to me aboutStuart is he went a little crazy
later on in his life.
So did Alan Watts too.

Speaker 1 (36:39):
Did he go crazy, or was he just talking about the
sea's giant?

Speaker 2 (36:44):
Well, I mean he went.
I mean he went a little deepinto the spectral realm and
talking about all the differentthings, things like that.

Speaker 1 (36:49):
Yes, but I mean the alcoholism you know, I know
Stuart became an yeah him andAlan Watts, who's another.

Speaker 2 (36:55):
Alan Watts is one of my favorite thinkers that I've
listened to as well too.
But yes, I am familiar withStuart Wilde and I've listened
to a lot of his stuff, and a lotof it I actually think is
really good.
Some of the stuff about theastral planes and you know all
the different things going on isa little out there.
I'm always interested inhearing what people have to say
about things.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
Yeah, he did go some of his latter stuff and I didn't
know he was drinking.

Speaker 2 (37:17):
Yeah, it's a ladder.

Speaker 1 (37:18):
Maybe, maybe that was just a ether induced dream.

Speaker 2 (37:21):
Maybe yeah, it's, and yeah, I love a lot of his stuff
, though.

Speaker 1 (37:27):
So he talked about the ego kind of coming, wrapping
him back around and back intoEckhart, and I hadn't read a New
Earth and I love that.
You saw that we've seen so manybooks Like that was one of the
things that attracted me to theconversation with you in the
beginning, where I was like thisguy's an interesting guy
because I saw some of yourstatue.

Speaker 2 (37:43):
That was like the first thing that you were said
to me.
It was like nice bookcollection there, you know, and
he saw the statue.
So I remember you said, oh,that's for secrets, Look at all
this stuff Anyway it would go on.
Yeah, that's one of the firstthings you said to me.

Speaker 1 (37:53):
And then, and then you know your click funnels
thing with Russell Brunson,which I want to, I want to get
into him a little bit later.
Who do you think?
Do you think that I meanobviously it was the biggest
impact on you?
Does it still have?
Because I always say people askme about the ego and I'm like,
oh man, it's such a tough thingto describe.
You know, most people think it'sa puff the chest, like that's
just an expression.
You know it is, it is part ofit, but it's like such a, it's

(38:16):
like the tip of the iceberg ofwhat it is.
Would you still advise peopleif they were to say what is ego
Like?
That would be?
You would go to a new earth,would you say to go power of now
first, so that you could kindof get a premise and a
foundation.

Speaker 2 (38:29):
You know it's a great question.
Before I prescribed a book, Iwould ask them why do you want
to know about the ego, what'sthe, what's the meaning behind
it?
And so, over the years, I'vehad so many people ask me about
how do you stay patient, how doyou stay calm, how does this
that right?
Team members, friends, familymembers and I started learning.
Okay, I need to ask them whythey're looking to learn deeper

(38:52):
about a subject before Iprescribe a specific book.
And also, depending on theirreally how far they are on a
journey is that will depend onwhat book I subscribe as well to
or prescribe, right.
And so the answer is yes ifyou're further along down the
line, but it really depends onwhy.
What are you looking to do?
What's the question for it?

(39:13):
And then I have different booksthat are like super easy to read
or to more medium, to harder tounderstand, cause I will say a
New Earth is a.
I don't want to say it's adifficult read, but it's a
different read.
If you're not prepared for thattype of writing, okay, you know
.
But if someone comes from likea Wayne Dyer background or they
know who Stuart Wild is like,yeah, go read a New Earth for
sure.

Speaker 1 (39:33):
Yeah, I send him to Stuart Wild cause I'm like he's
entertaining he is.

Speaker 2 (39:37):
He's great man, he's always yelling, he's got a great
voice and I love, I love Stuartstuff, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:42):
And he's such a neat journey.
It's neat to and Jorge alwaystalk an eye about, or Jorge and
I talk about storytelling.
He's just he's an incrediblestoryteller.
He was a comedian and all thatkind of stuff too.
Stand up and that.
What would you say?
The difference between thepower now, where did a new earth

(40:04):
, kind of take it to a new levelfor you?

Speaker 2 (40:06):
Yeah, so the power of now really describe the idea of
thoughts and being present inthis moment and being aware of
what's going on with yourthoughts, things like that.
A new earth is what took myunderstanding of the ego to a
much deeper level, because ittalks a lot about that and it
talks about where it comes fromand why people start to fight

(40:27):
and why wars start to happen.
At the end of the day, all thewar is is egos fighting each
other.
It's people trying to prove apoint, trying to take resources,
for whatever reason, and so itbuilds upon it.
I think it also isself-sufficient on its own, for
sure, but the power of now forme was more about how to think
properly, how to shift yourthoughts, how to shift out of

(40:48):
bad states, and a new earthreally got me to the point where
it's like this is why it's allhappening, if that makes sense,
okay.

Speaker 1 (40:55):
I like that.
It's going up on the top of thepack.

Speaker 2 (40:58):
Yeah, it's a great buck man.

Speaker 1 (41:02):
So let's bring it back here so that maybe some
folks out there that are this isthe Stoic agent.
I'm in real estate.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
We're in real estate.

Speaker 1 (41:11):
We're doing this, you know, and kind of along the
lines of, you know, our Jim Rohn, which are you know, like
anything Jim Rohn like you know,the degree of your personal
development is going to be anequal portion the degree of your
success.
So I want to help people outthere understand that it is.
They want to know where thebest leads are.
They want to know you know,what do you say here?

(41:32):
How do you do this?
How do I say this?
To get somebody to do something, and I'm like you got to start
first with you, 100%.
If you want to enroll peopleinto anything, you have to be
enrolled in what you're doing,which is back to that Alex
Becker of like will focus andthat you know we've been talking

(41:55):
about the same thing here.
But I want you to go into it oflike, why you've had such great
success with different thingsright, and that personal
development side.
Why do people shy away fromthat and they just want the
magic lead?

Speaker 2 (42:13):
Man.
I got so much to say on thistopic.
It's a great question.
I think that, going back to theego, a lot of people think, oh,
I don't need no help, I don'tneed that.
Oh, that Tony, like all theseTony Robbins, because he's easy
for people to hate on, becausehe's the biggest, probably in
the space.
Right, and, by the way, I thinkTony Robbins has had a bigger
impact on me than anyone.
I had talked about it in NewWords, but Tony Robbins is

(42:33):
really the guy who's done.
I mean, he took it to the nextlevel for me.
But when it comes to people'sreluctance for personal
development, I think thatthey're afraid to have humility
and ask you know what's wrongwith me and really attack some
of those weaknesses because wetry and protect ourselves from
it.
And I think this is a really bigproblem in today's world
because most people aredistracting themselves with

(42:54):
instant gratification to getaway from having to deal with
their thoughts and deal withwhat's actually going on
internally.
And I think that if people areunwilling to have humility or
recognize that they could bebetter or anything like that,
it's almost like they eitherdon't know what they don't know
or the ego is trying to protectthem from that.
Because when people are like,oh, I don't need a self-help
seminar or blah blah and but yetlike they're the angriest

(43:15):
person alive, so okay, you keepbeing angry.
You know what I mean and allthat stuff and I is that answer
question Because I can talk moreabout why I believe personal
development.
Without that it's going to bealmost impossible to succeed in
business or at least get goingwith it, at least at the levels
that you know most peopleprobably aspire to.
That's my initial thoughts onit.

Speaker 1 (43:34):
I guess, yeah, absolutely I guess maybe dig
into because I'm thinking aboutWill and I'm thinking about Alex
Becker, right, who maybewouldn't have this conversation.
I don't know.
I'd love to sit with him andsee what his thoughts were on
this.
Maybe you can get me and havehim on my podcast.
But do you think that personaldevelopment helps us with our

(43:56):
focus?
Because, like that's the Beckerwe've gotten down to of, like I
will do in four hours Is itthat personal development helps
us understand that the thoughtsare happening and the
distractions are simply usshying away from pain or
whatever it is, and so thatpersonal development helps us to
stay more focused?

Speaker 2 (44:14):
simply, I do.
I think that it's almostimpossible to stay focused
unless you know that you'reunfocused.
And being able to identify thatwithin yourself is going to be
difficult without a certainlevel of personal development.
Right, because people aren'tgoing to be thinking about how
do I optimize my focus and howdo I optimize my day and how do
I create essentialism in my life, which I don't know.

(44:35):
If you ever read that book, orone of my all time favorites too
, by Greg McCown, right?
How do I know what's importantnow?
How do I create thisindomitable will unless they're
actually personal development,focused and minded right?
And there is a danger that Iwill say and this is something I
know Becker would say to, eventhough I know he's read a
bazillion books and all stuff ispersonal development can turn
into mental masturbation, right,where it's like you hear a

(44:55):
bunch of stuff we don't actuallydo anything.
Right?
But back to the focusing how doyou improve your focus if you
weren't working on yourself?
Right, and you're thinkingabout improving your focus.
So I do think it's a precursorto actually getting to that
point.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
And so there comes some faith, faith and faith that
working on me is actually goingto help me.
Yes, you have to believe 100%,yeah, 1 million percent.

Speaker 2 (45:22):
You have to believe, right, like I tell this, I've
told us a lot over themastermind and I brought this up
a lot during the pandemic yearsbecause I was working with
agencies and a lot of themworked with local businesses,
like, for example, the agencythat I was involved in.
We lost 45% of clients over amillion dollars year in revenue
in 45 days, right, because ofthe shutdown.

(45:44):
And so, like, what do you do?
And one of the things that'sgoing back to belief that I
would talk about with them isyou got to have hope in
something.
Hope is not a strategy, buthope gets you to wake up in the
morning to take the action ittakes in order to get to where
you want to go.
So I use hope, beliefinterchangeably in a lot of ways
, but hope is like, if you don'thave hope that you can create a

(46:06):
better life, that you can getto the next level, that you can
make something happen.
It doesn't matter what kind ofleads I give you.
I give you the most teetopleads in the world.
You're not going to close thembecause you don't believe in
yourself and you don't believein where you can go, and at
first you just have to have,like blind belief, or you need
to borrow confidence fromsomebody else.
And it's like if you come workon a team or with you, like with
your agents, like, hey, likeyou might not have full faith in

(46:27):
yourself yet because you don'thave the evidence to prove it,
but I believe in you and Ibelieve if you just follow this
process I've laid out for you,you're going to get there and
then, okay, I'm going to havethe blind faith, and then they
can create the evidence, facebelief, and then they can go to
that next level.

Speaker 1 (46:40):
I love that.
So let's unpack some dire andthis is kind of what you're
talking about, and I've saidthis over and over and over and
I get this blank stare frompeople when I say it and it took
me a while to like and thequote is you can't solve a
problem with the same mind thatcreated it.

Speaker 2 (47:01):
Get the get out of here.
That is literally like thething that I say.
That's amazing, okay, sorry,like I love that quote, I live
by it, I talk about it all thetime and I tell that to anyone
who will listen if they need toread more books.
Like the only way you're goingto solve the problem you have is
by getting new lines of thoughtpatterns coming into your brain
, and those thought patternsaren't going to come from you.

(47:22):
It's a source you knowconnection to God or spiritual,
and a meditation session, right,but it's likely you need to go
seek outside sources will comein, right.
I think Einstein said that.
Maybe Dyer talked about it aswell.
But it's basically like youcan't solve the problem using
the same line of thinking youused to create it, so you need
to get outside sources.
I sorry, I got really excitedwhen he said that because, like
not very many people do I knowactually use that quote, but I

(47:45):
say it all the time.
My team members, everyone.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
So I love it.
I think I love it, man we justit's crazy how much like we're.
We have in common yourdispenser fan.
Oh yeah, Absolutely.
So that's basically basicallybreak the habit of being you who
and then people like, well,what do you mean?
It's like dig into that, like isit's tough to break the habit?

(48:09):
Because we, we think we are whowe think we are, but we I am
not actually who I think I am,I'm something.
I'm actually the observer ofthat.
So I guess you know we could godown the line with that.
But I wanted to ask you thisbecause you had a similar
epiphany experience that I did.
By the way, I got my first DUIat 22.

(48:29):
I didn't have a second one.

Speaker 2 (48:31):
I don't have a second one, yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:34):
But it didn't have the effect on me that yours did.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
It took me a little bit longer.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
About another two years, about a year and a half.
So I kept going because I waslike, oh, whatever, and I it was
in North Carolina and I waswhatever.
I got a DUI down there.
Then I lost my license in NewHampshire because of reciprocity
and then I got two driving witha suspended license.

(48:59):
The second one that I got isactually a felony offense,
because it's three.
Well, it wasn't felony, no, itwas basically like go to jail
type thing in New Hampshire, butanyways it was.
I remember the moment here too,where my dad said to me he's
like you're at a crossroads andhe talked about the Crewchef

(49:23):
letter.
I don't know if you've everheard about the Crewchef letter.

Speaker 2 (49:24):
I don't know that.

Speaker 1 (49:25):
Crewchef took over from whoever he took.
I think it might have beenStalin, I'm not sure, but it was
basically you get a pass on thefirst one and it was a letter.
So it was the letter.
Was you open If, when you reachthis really tough problem in
your life, open this letter fromme.

(49:46):
And the letter was everybodyreaches, everybody makes
mistakes, keep going, do yourbest type thing and don't do
that again type deal.
And then he said if you runinto a problem again, open the
second letter.
So he ran into a problem againand you open the second letter

(50:07):
and it said write two letters.
So it's basically like you'redone and I don't know where I
was kind of fully going withthat, other than it's an
epiphany moment like you havethis Unfortunately, sometimes
people get really sick orwhatever, and I know you had
things with SEMA.
You obviously were on thatjourney before, but it did
readjust you.
Oh yeah, right, when your wifegot sick.

(50:29):
So is that sometimes what ittakes and like maybe you could
speak to somebody out there oflike, don't let it come to that
second letter, to like take theaction now because you're
probably going to get testedreally hard later.
Does life want to do that to you.
Is that the evolutionaryprocess?

(50:50):
What are your thoughts?
That's a great question.

Speaker 2 (50:52):
I thought about this a lot and it all comes down to
pain, right?
I think it's the Tony Robbinsquote where it's essentially
when the pain of remaining thesame is more than the pain of
change, that's when you'llchange right.
Or is less than the pain ofchange, that's when it'll change
right.
And so if people aren't inenough pain so like you and I,
when we're hit, those moments wemight have been in so much pain

(51:14):
internally is like, hey, Ican't keep going like this.
This is an issue, you knowwhether it's shame or you know
being whatever right.
Hey, I might die.
Like type situation, at least,was for me.
You know, if I kept going downthis path, the pain was so
strong that I had no choice butto change, and unfortunately,
most humans do get to that pointbefore they actually make
massive shifts in their life.

(51:34):
And so what I've learned to doand this is what I would
encourage everyone to do is, ifyou are in a situation where you
are unhappy with your finances,your weight, your relationship,
whatever it might be, use thepain and turn it up in order to
take action.
We hear a lot about just thinkpositive thoughts and do
positive.
I'm the most positive person,probably like alive, maybe not

(51:57):
more positive than you actuallyget it, but you know what I'm
saying.
But like I'm very optimisticbut also very realistic and I
also I use pain often to helpdrive me to action in a good way
.
And so if you can channel thepain, you can turn up the heat
on it, right.
So if I'm unhappy with whereI'm with my finances, I don't
let them get to a point whereit's, like you know, a point of
no return type situation.

(52:17):
I'll turn up the pain now andI'll go drive it for action, you
know.
And so, unfortunately, I don'tknow if it's an evolutionary
thing or why humans let it do it, but it really isn't until rock
bottom where we need to change.
But I've learned not to let itget to that point in any area of
life at this point, becauseI've been at some rock bottoms
and so now I'm just focused onif I feel like I'm dipping below
where I need to be in any ofthe areas mind, body, spirit,

(52:38):
you know well that type of stuffThen I turn up the pain and I
just move forward.

Speaker 1 (52:44):
This is.
We're going to be getting inthe stoicism here.
So do you think that's becauseof that reptilian move away from
pain that it's threat?
And actually pain is becauseit's not really a saber-toothed
tiger.
Pain is a sign of somethingthat we can move through,
because it's going to help usevolve.

Speaker 2 (53:03):
I think it depends on the situation, but yes,
definitely, I think that's like.
It's very interesting when youthink about what's fulfilling in
life.
The most fulfilling things arealmost always at the aftermath
of getting through the deep pain.
If you think about it, ifyou're out with your buddies or

(53:25):
you're camping or you're arounda campfire or you're drinking
beers, you're never like man.
Remember that time when lifewas so easy and everything was
just awesome?
All the time it's like no.
Do you remember when we startedat a call floor and we almost
went bankrupt and I had to hire10 people and we had to hire?
This is all true stories.
We had to fire someone forsmoking meth and we had to fire.
Trying to keep a call floorstaffed is brutal.
All these things are.

(53:46):
Remember when we lost 60 grandin a month and I need to make
80k to make payroll in two weeks?
Those are the things that arepainful in the moment.
It's interesting that painshould be a trigger for us to
let's go, because that's wherethe fulfilling is.
If you're able to anchorfeeling good to moving through
the pain like you're describinghere, that's when you can really
get places in life.

(54:06):
In my opinion, it's like man,this is what heart feels like.
This is it.
This is like let's go.
I know what's on the other sideof this.
The more you start toaccumulate those experiences and
evidence in your life, the moreoften you're able to handle
bigger and bigger issues thatget thrown at you.
So yeah, that's my firstthoughts there.
I could go deeper on thatespecially if this idea of pain

(54:27):
and moving through it Let me seeif I can prompt you to go a
little deeper, For instanceevery time I tell you bring
something, oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (54:34):
I do my Wim Hof breathing.
I was listening to Huberman theother day and he was talking
about if you guys don't knowAndrew Huberman, maybe check him
out with Huberman Labs,Stanford.
He's got multiple degrees, butanyways, he was talking about
cold baths and that you want tocontinue to put yourself, even

(55:00):
though people would say, oh, youguys are at this spot or
wherever, and it's like, well, Imoved through a lot of pain to
get here, or discomfort, if youknow, let's call it discomfort.
Is that a good thing?
I mean, Goggins has taken it tothe next level, right when I
think he loves.
He's like he just loves thesuck.

(55:20):
He's addicted to the suck, butit's made him Goggins rather
than David, right?
So talk about that a little bit.
Is that kind of what we'retalking about here?
That you want to continue toput yourself through physical
stuff and that way you're goingto have less of the mental pain
because you're going tostrengthen your mind to that

(55:41):
discomfort?

Speaker 2 (55:42):
So, yeah, I think that there's physical and
there's mental pain, right Likeyou can put yourself through
mental you know tough situations, mentally or physical.
I think the physical connectionbetween doing hard things
physically absolutely makes youstronger mentally, without a
question.
Right, for example of this is,I mean, when I woke up hungover
on the floor in Sat County.

(56:04):
You know that physical pain ofjust like, just feeling it
throughout my body andeverything there led to so much
mental strength during mybusiness years, eight years
later.
I didn't know at the time itwould, but I'm like, hey, you
know, oh, we lost the clienttoday.
Well, it's better than being,you know, next to some guy
pissing next to me in a, youknow, in a jail cell on the
floor type situation.
Now, when it comes to thingslike cold baths and putting

(56:27):
yourself in very difficultsituations, I started doing
CrossFit and, like I really ambig on just like extreme mental
or physical exertion, because Ido think it helps create the
improve the mental capacity onthings, without a doubt, just
like I think the more that youput yourself through mentally,
as long as you don't break likeyou can stretch what you're
capable of right, and so you canstretch the problems you're

(56:48):
able to handle by taking a moremental.
That's more responsibilities ormore sales calls, or bigger
deals, or whatever it might be.
So I think there's absolutelysomething to that and I like to
look at it where for mepersonally.
Have you ever read the bookanti fragile?

Speaker 1 (57:01):
No.

Speaker 2 (57:02):
I've read it Naseem Taleeb or Naseem Taleeb right.

Speaker 1 (57:06):
Who is Neval's mentor ?

Speaker 2 (57:09):
Yeah, did you ever see Neval's mentor?
I've had a lot of conversationswith him.
Yeah, I'm sure he knows him alot.
There's a book he did on antifragility, which is basically
where if you're anti fragile,the more that you get thrown at
you, the stronger you get.
So there's like a substance outthere where it's like you just
keep throwing stuff and you justlike get stronger, like I just
picture a superhero, so you justabsorb the, whether it's a

(57:32):
physical pain or a mental pain,and that's actually a core value
that I described myself as likeI'm anti fragile.
Like anything gets thrown at me, all it's going to do is make
me stronger.
We've all heard those, thosequotes like whatever doesn't
kill you makes you stronger, andlike, yes, if you use it
appropriately.
But I look at everything from ananti fragile standpoint.
It's literally one of my valuesthat I try and embody.

(57:52):
It's like, okay, great, this isjust going to make me stronger,
let's go add it to the hatch.
And so I love cold basketball,doing a lot of type of stuff and
just taking on, sometimes morethan you feel comfortable taking
on too, cause that's the onlyway that you're ever going to
grow.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (58:06):
I mean the obstacles away comes the 100% right.
Like it.

Speaker 2 (58:11):
Rather than deviating from challenges like or
something that's uncomfortablelike, move towards it which is
so much what our brain is likewhat we talked about earlier is
not wired for that.

Speaker 1 (58:29):
Let's shift gears into I'm going to go in a little
bit of economics, because youbrought up Nassim and he talked
about risk assessment and thatkind of thing, which kind of we
talked.
You know, the brain is very andgoing back to Stuart, he's like
it's actually the brain or theego it's.
It's valuable, it's a tool.

(58:50):
It's really good at balancingthe checkbook.
It's not always good atbalancing your relationships.
So I guess, when, as you'veworked through, have you, have
you like a set, were there anyrisks to you other than, I guess
, if you're at kind of a certainamount of rock bottom and
you're and you're not rockbottom, but you know you're

(59:10):
gambling, you know to make aliving right, like in hoping and
wishing, like you know, how doyou, how do you now assess risk?
and what you're, what you,what's your kind of your compass
for what you want to?

Speaker 2 (59:25):
take on.
Yeah, one of my favorite topicsright now is risk, because risk
is something that every singleone of us calculates, whether we
know it or not, on a dailybasis.
Walking outside, walking acrossthe street, there is a risk to
be had, and most people arehorrible at understanding the

(59:46):
data behind the risk, right?
The easy example of this is thepeople who are terrified to fly
on airplanes, yet they have noproblem getting in a car, even
though you're, like, 37 timesmore likely to get hurt in a car
than you are in an airplane.
There's no risk assessmentthere, right, and that's okay.
Most people don't train theirbrains to think about it.
But it's interesting to bringup the gambling.
So my cousin, who was my mentorand basically helping me along

(01:00:06):
the line here, has been aprofessional gambler for 14
years.
So we're talking statisticalprojection algorithms, risk
management, bankroll equityvalue, like positions, like I
mean, it's treated like abusiness, it's all the way
through, and so that was one ofmy some of my first
introductions into understandingrisk, and so whenever I'm going
to anything, I always thinkabout risk, because and this

(01:00:29):
ties into decision making, whichI don't know if you've ever
thought about decision making,but that's something else that
no one ever talks about how doyou make decisions and how do
you make a good decision?
How do you filter yourdecisions through?
But part of my filteringaspects that I have whenever I'm
making a decision is the riskaspect, especially when we're
talking about business oranything financially related.
And so when I was gettingstarted, I knew that the biggest

(01:00:50):
risk I had was that I could geta job the next day as a sales
rep, and so that's where havingthe skill set was very
beneficial to me at the time,because everyone needs to get
salespeople.
You need them, I need them, wealways need them right.
It's still.
It's to me.
If anyone ever asks like whatshould I do?
I just want to make money.
I'm like go learn how to sell.
Like you'll be okay, you knowpretty much forever if you learn
how to sell right Withincontext, of course.

(01:01:12):
So back then there wasn't muchrisk.
These days, what I think aboutnow is I think about when I'm
thinking about risk first, Ithink about the reversibility of
the decision, right, and sowhat I mean by that is how
reversible is what I'm about todo If I'm going to launch a new
funnel and spend $10,000 on ads.
No big deal.
That's not a huge deal to me,right?

(01:01:32):
I mean $10,000, it's all incontext how much that money is
to people.
But like I'm not going to blowup the business, I'm not going
to do anything crazy, right?
If I'm working with medicaldoctors and all of a sudden I'm
going to stop working withmedical doctors and shift
completely gears and work with acompletely different market,
well, there's some much biggerirreversible risks that takes
place there.
I'm going to lose all thisclientele, I'm going to lose all

(01:01:53):
the market, that type of stuff,right.
So I grade the decision makingbased off of what the risk is
going to look like, and I startwith the reversibility of the
risk, and then the next thing Igo into is what's the likelihood
of achievement?
A lot of people don't alwaysthink about this stuff.
You know it's like I'm notnaive to think that you know
every single funnel, every newproduct line or every new

(01:02:13):
expansion is actually going towork out.
I try and really think aboutwhat's the likelihood that I'm
actually going to make this workright.
And then the next thing that Igo into when it comes down to
risk is how much time, money andresources is it going to be
From me, from the team?
They could be applied elsewhere.
Because another thing thatpeople don't think a lot and I
try and often remind myself ofthe risk is every decision you

(01:02:37):
make is risky because wheneveryou focus your attention on one
area, it means you're, bydefinition, saying no to a
million other things that couldlead to you know a better risk.
So I'm not sure this is the wayyou want to go with it, but I
love talking deeply about riskbecause I look at it in all
aspects of life and now in realestate and investing and things
like that.
Like there is a lot of inherentrisk involved.

(01:02:57):
There can be downside risks tothings.
If I buy a property at the topof the market, an appreciation
goes under and I'm only buyingfor appreciation.
I don't have cash flow on theproperty.
There's huge risk there, rightTaking on a huge project in a
market that you know massiveinterest rates, like all the
multifamily stuff.
I don't know if you're seeingwhat's going down with some of
the multifamilies that you knoware coming up on their refi,
their balloon payments.

(01:03:18):
They need to pay back in thenext year or two and they got in
at 2 and 3%.
What's going to happen when yougo from 3% on a multi to a 7%?
All your cap rate or your cashflow is gone, your overnight
underwater, you know.
And so, yeah, I could keepgoing on this, but like I love
the topic of risk, Let me askyou this Do you think so we can
help these folks?

Speaker 1 (01:03:38):
Because these are our thoughts, so like.
So we want to give them somesome actual, palpable, tangible
philosophies and simple stuff.
We can't solve a problem in thesame mind they created.
How do you, how do you solveyour mind?
Well, you got to work onyourself and you got to figure
out that you're the observer.
That kind of stuff, Would yousay.
That skill mitigates riskAbsolutely 100%.

(01:04:00):
So if you're getting the salesskills, absolutely mitigates
that you, that your company goesunder.
Well, you can go sell someplaceelse 100%.
So if you don't up your skills,then you're at a job that
doesn't take a lot of skills,right, but you have, and also
you haven't taken any risk,which is risking ego, to learn
something new 100%.

Speaker 2 (01:04:21):
Skill mitigates risk.
I think Buffett as a quote andthis is totally paraphrasing it,
but essentially it's like it'sonly risky if you don't know
what you're doing.
And I love that you know he'slike, but it's sock markets only
risky if you don't know whatyou're doing.
Right.
But back to what you're sayingabout the ego and learning new
skills.
I'm convinced personally thisis just through observation that
most humans are afraid of thatsuck phase and looking bad and

(01:04:46):
that's why they don't go learnnew skills.
That's why they don't try newventures.
That's why they don't go outand do new things.
They're afraid to suck atsomething at first and be the
new, the rookie on the block,right, when in reality, the only
way to actually get good atsomething is to first suck.
Everyone sucks in the beginning, but most people are unwilling
to do that, whether it's fear ofostracization from society or
their husband or their spouse isunfortunate.

(01:05:07):
I've worked with so manyentrepreneurs where the spouses
have not been aligned in regardsto what they want to do and
that's brought them down.
I'll just come back where it'ssafe, right and so, yes, I think
skill mitigates risk and I alsothink that it's okay to suck.
Of course you're going to suck.
It would be unreasonable for youto believe you were good.
I was talking to my wife aboutit, where in the last two months
we've got three propertiesunder contract and we're

(01:05:30):
actually four.
We just closed on one right andjust in the last two months we
were evaluating our 60 days andI was like I should be at like
20, but it's unreasonable for meto expect to be doing $200,
$300,000 a month in the last 60days right For where things are,
and so with that I remindmyself it's unreasonable.

(01:05:51):
I've been in the investing gamefor only a couple of years.
I've been focused on it heavilyfor a little less than a year
and really over the.
I mean, we took time off withmy wife and everything going on
there, but like it would beunreasonable for me to expect to
where I would need to be, andso I think that if people
understood that and it's okay tosuck, maybe they would feel
more comfortable going out andjumping in and learning

(01:06:12):
something new.

Speaker 1 (01:06:15):
Do you think that has a lot to do with status?
100%, Everything does as amarketer, Like because we know
it's sales oh my gosh, it's allstatus.

Speaker 2 (01:06:22):
It's status, right, everything's status.
And what's interesting aboutthe status side of things is
this goes both ways.
It's not just the Lamborghinisand the Jets and the girls.
It's the mom who wants to drivethe minivan who's like oh, I
can't be seen in the, I can't beseen in a Ferrari.
Right, like it's everywhere.
Everything comes down to status, which is so interesting when
you really think about it.
We're so.

(01:06:44):
I'll share this with you becausethis is something that I will
actually learn at Landmark Forum.
I don't know if you're familiarwith what they're.
You know we're at Earhart and STraining and everything.
But this concept that all of usare walking around terrified of
what each other think abouteach other, what we all think
about each other, right, isamazing to me when, in reality,

(01:07:04):
no one's thinking about you,they're thinking about what
you're thinking about them.
And I remind myself of that sooften when we're sitting at home
and worried about aconversation we had with
somebody and how they might be,they took it the wrong way, or
they're upset and I'm like, oh,that person sitting in the house
worried about a conversationthey had and how they're being
viewed, right, and we're allterrified of each other.
You know seven million of uswalking around and it's like why

(01:07:25):
do we care so much about whateach other think?
Because it ties directly intostatus.
I think about that oftenbecause I'm not a saint.
I worry about it sometimes.
I worry about it as well.
You know much less than I usedto and I'm always trying to chip
away at that.
You know ego side of thingsright.
But it's like, why are we alsoworried about what we think of
each other when, like, no one'sactually thinking about us?
They're thinking about what youthink about them, and that's a

(01:07:47):
concept I think of all the time.

Speaker 1 (01:07:49):
Russell Brunson brought that up.
I never understood that reallywith the sales side, that people
buy things based on status.
But status isn't always that.
Some people buy the Lamborghiniand can't afford it because
they want to have seemingly ahigher status.
Some want to buy theLamborghini because it shows
their status as being wealthy.
Others can afford theLamborghini but actually drive

(01:08:10):
the minivan because they don'twant their neighbors to think
that their status is 100%.
I never really kind of thoughtabout it all.
It really does come down to alot of what we do and think and
believe is status, and that'swhat you do, I mean as a
marketer.

Speaker 2 (01:08:28):
Sometimes it's sad when I have to see what takes
place with copywriting and whatit takes to actually move people
.
I've come to just live with it,as long as I'm not lying or
misportraying the truth.
I'm going to give you anexample.
So we worked with a medicalclinic that was focused on
weight loss.
It was Mediweight Loss was theclinic and it was the franchise

(01:08:49):
with a bunch of locations.
Anyways, when we had firstoriginally launched an ad, we
said free weight lossconsultation.
Come in, lose weight.
Blah, blah, blah.
Ads didn't go so well.
It was like $40 cost per leadand this was several years ago
on Facebook and I rememberlooking at the ads and I was
working with our copywritingteam and I looked at it and I

(01:09:10):
was like you know, no one wantsto lose weight, no one wants to
think about their losing weight.
What if we said free metabolicimbalance consultation and all
we did was shift the wordsweight loss to metabolic
imbalance?
The kid you not, swear to God,$40 cost per lead to $4 cost per
lead blew up overnight.
Same exact backhand sale tookplace, but just by shifting the

(01:09:32):
term from weight loss tometabolic imbalance, because
every female it's not every, andthis is no offense females but
like.
This is human nature, and thisis my observation, and I've run
a lot of ads at this, so I canspeak to this they don't want to
think they have a weight lossproblem.
They think they have a thyroidproblem or their metabolism is
imbalanced.
Well, guess what happens if youlose a bunch of weight?
Your thyroid improves and yourmetabolism improves.

(01:09:53):
So it's the same thing.
And so that's just one exampleof a mini that I could give in
regards to what it takes to movepeople.
But yeah, and that also,anyways, also comes back to
status Right, because that tiesright back into it.
You don't want to tell peopleah, you know, I, I didn't go
lose weight.
It's like, no, I've got ametabolic imbalance problem, you
know, that's why I can't loseweight, you know.

(01:10:15):
And so it's just.
That's the one example alwayssticks in my head because I
still can't believe that, andthat's when I knew I was like
man, this is going to be fun.
This is going to be fun to see.

Speaker 1 (01:10:24):
I simply changed a few words.
Yep, and, yeah, the descriptionof it same backhand product,
nothing else changed.

Speaker 2 (01:10:31):
Yeah, and that's happened.
I've seen that happen so manytimes when you do things, so
into status.

Speaker 1 (01:10:39):
My mentor, one of my mentors, carlos German and I'm
sure he didn't come up with thishimself, but he said people are
motivated by three things money, recognition and impact.
What do you think about that?
Because I think that the statusis recognition, right?
Oh, I'm being recognized asbeing part of the pack, or maybe

(01:10:59):
I'm being recognized as beinghigher, or I'm being put on a
pedestal.
What do you think about thatconcept of?
Would you if I ask you this doyou think there's something else
that motivates people otherthan recognition, money or
impact?

Speaker 2 (01:11:13):
You know, the one thing that I depending on the
context of when that wasdescribed I think that avoiding
pain and avoiding loss, lossaversion, is one of the biggest
things that motivates people.
So because, while I agreerecognition, money, impact I
could argue that all three ofthose are directly correlated to
status too, you know, becausethey're all for status.

(01:11:35):
Why do you want to have animpact?
Because you want to increaseyour status.
Yeah, you want to feel good,but, come on, we all feel good
when everyone else feels good,right, but loss aversion, as far
as moving people, is huge,right, and so I think Brunson
talked about this, but basically, no more than 3% of the
population actually wants toimprove.
There's like 97% who just wantto find a new way.

(01:11:56):
That's his whole newopportunity thing.
He's like you don't want animprovement offer, you want a
new opportunity offer, right,you don't want to get better at
something with a whole new wayof doing it.
And so this concept of lossaversion and new opportunity
really moves people.
Because you've heard thatpeople are much.
They will fight much harder notto lose a dollar than they will
to gain $10.
You know, and so that would bethe one thing that would add,

(01:12:18):
you know in a quick context onthat all of which leads to
status Goes back to status.
All of them point straight tostatus.

Speaker 1 (01:12:24):
Okay, that's interesting.
So the concept of impact Iwanted to dive into that because
I think we go for me, building,you know it goes this is back
to his name escapes me for asecond, but it'll come in a

(01:12:48):
second is that we don't buildbusinesses, we build people and
people build businesses, right.
So in order to build people, weneed to build ourselves first.
So what do you think about that?
Do you think that becauseyou've built multiple businesses
and now you know we need to,like I have a lot of people come
to me that want to start teams?
Right, they want to start teamsbecause a lot of them want

(01:13:12):
money and they want it easier.

Speaker 2 (01:13:14):
They got other people doing things yeah.
Seriously, like they think oh,you just started a team, I'm
going to start a team that seemslike the way to go.

Speaker 1 (01:13:23):
I'm going to make more money because other people
are going to sell propertiesthat I'm not going to have to.

Speaker 2 (01:13:27):
It's possible, yes, of course.

Speaker 1 (01:13:29):
Well, yeah, I mean, but dig into that a little bit,
I guess.
Do you think they're in?

Speaker 2 (01:13:36):
gosh, it's, it's um, but anyways yeah, so I can talk
a lot about this.
It is a skill, first andforemost.
Naval brought this up in hisamazing book, the Dominic of
Naval.
I had already seen this.
He confirmed what I hadobserved and been a part of, and
that is that scaling labor andhumans is by far the hardest
part of business.

(01:13:57):
Humans in general, they'reirrational, we're erratic, we're
all irrational, myself included.
Right, we're not logical, basedon emotion, all that stuff.
So it's a very difficult thingto scale labor.
But, with that said, that isalso where you're gonna get the
biggest leverage.
I mean, there's the four formsleverage, but massive leverage
will come from having humans whowant to fight on your behalf

(01:14:17):
and who want to work for you andwho see the vision you know,
and so with that, you arebringing up the, the teams,
right.
I just heard quote recently andI love this.
But it's also like Steve Jobsdidn't build the iPhone.
He built the team that builtthe iPhone right, and so that's
the truth.
But it's also way more difficultthan what I think people seem

(01:14:39):
to think it is, and Especiallyif you've never been in a
position where you actually haveto run teams of people you
really don't understand at alland I say this with love like I
hear employees who like, oh yeah, this business owners rich.
I'm just not gonna show uptoday, and it's like the local
freaking you know deli orsomething.
It's like, no, I don't thinkyou understand how this works,
right, but regardless, it alsobecomes some of the most

(01:15:02):
rewarding stuff when you areable to work with people, help
them grow Facilities, things.
But, my gosh, it doesn't makethings easier.
It's significantly morechallenging, but it's also one
of those things where you gainleverage and that can lead to
more exponential results in thefuture and you know we were
talking about it yesterday.

Speaker 1 (01:15:18):
We had this whole vision board thing which we went
over the 10 C's and I'll showyou the vision board in that.
But I had a vision, you know,going on four years ago and I
was a completely differentperson then.
I still had done Listen toStuart Wilde and a lot of this
stuff, but I still had a lot ofego and I still do and I love
your humility around that,knowing like I'm a rational 100%

(01:15:42):
.

Speaker 2 (01:15:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:15:48):
Yes, right, like I don't know, and I'll have folks
come to me on the team.
I had to have one yesterday andshe's like, are you so wise and
you send me this thing?
But I was wondering if and I'mlike I am Not wise I mean I've
learned some things along theway and I'm imparting that on
you and but also know that whenI impart this Stuff on you, it

(01:16:10):
helps to me to continue tocrystallize into me.
So it's not all for you.
Like I do care about you and Iwant you to grow and that means
a lot to me to see you grow.
Like that, I feel that I knowexactly where I'm going with
this, other than it just impactlike.
Well, I'll talk about humilityfor a second.

Speaker 2 (01:16:28):
Yeah, please, because you know, to me and I actually
said this to to my dad, who's inacquisitions for me right the
other day and I was talking tohim about the number one thing
that I'm looking for and I thinkthat is most important to grow
anywhere in life and that is theconcept of humility.
They be able to take feedbackand implement it without being

(01:16:50):
instantly triggered.
And the reason why I brought itup to him is because I'm giving
a lot of feedback and it's kindof an interesting dynamic
because it's okay, here I am,like you know, teaching my dad
how to do stuff right and hereto work and how to grow and do
these things, etc.
Right.
But the reason why it popped upfor me was that's.
You know, I'm part of amastermind.
We're part of a group that youknow real estate investing.

(01:17:10):
You know All that stuff I'mlearning from from people are
doing way more than me.
I believe in investing inyourself.
I've spent over half a milliondollars myself and personal
development coaches and alldomains, any who.
I Was talking with him aboutsales and he was giving me some
feedback on stuff and I've beenthe one running masterminds for
several years and what was funnywas my initial response was

(01:17:31):
like man, do you think you mean,I'm the absolute?
But it was a split second and Iwas like he's right, he's
giving good advice, is here.
And what I found interesting inthat moment was going back to
what I talked about before.
Where I'm not or I'm notperfect, was I'd immediately had
like this visceral responselike man, who do you mean you're
coaching me on how to sellstuff?
What's going on, you know?
But it was gone immediately.

(01:17:52):
And then I took the feedbackand I wanted right.
So it didn't hang, it didn'tlinger, but I just got to
thinking about like man, if I'mstill susceptible, is, after all
, this money I paid and I'mpaying this guy.
Don't learn from it.
It's still there.
Think about other people, right?
And so humility is one of themost important things I look for
in anybody Humility.
Everyone always says integrity.
I feel like that should be anobvious one.
Right, you got to do the rightthing and you know being a

(01:18:14):
person of your word, buthumility is really the big one.
Do you, does the person that onmy team or myself?
Do we always have an excuse forwhy it's not again?
Do we always pop back?
Do we always, you know, or dowe take the feedback and
implement it?
You know, and I just think it'sso critical when I look at the
employees who, several of whichhave gone on to create Amazing
businesses, lead amazing careers, do all kinds of cool stuff,
they were always the ones whoare constantly asking for more

(01:18:37):
and asking for feedback.
And so I just think humility issuch an amazing character trait
to develop and it's hard,because it's hard to be told
that you're doing somethingwrong or an effective or not
well by anyone, even if yourespect the person.
And so I bring that up becauseI'm like man, like I remember
the split second response, likeman, that was weird and that the
observer came in and it's like,why would you even think that?

(01:18:57):
Like, of course, you're here tolearn, you know, and so,
anyways, I just wanted to bringthat up.

Speaker 1 (01:19:01):
I love that.
Yeah, we have a model of hungry, humble and coachable Mmm.
I like that.
So if and I think those are youknow, hunger is not something
you can teach.
Yeah, like you know.
I mean, some people are doingit to feed their family and
others can.
Why is that?
Why?

Speaker 2 (01:19:20):
isn't.
So this is a great question andI agree with you with hunger
right and you know I'll hearTony Robbins.
I remember he said this like adecade ago.
He's like the number onedifference between the people
making those who don't is hunger.
This insatiable hunger.
Is it something that can't betaught?
How does it get lightened?
Is it a flame that can be litby somebody at some point?
Do they need to be in aspecific scenario in order to

(01:19:40):
create it?
Why do some people seem to havehunger and some don't?
I'm curious your thoughts onthis.
It's something I've struggledwith it's interesting man.

Speaker 1 (01:19:55):
I don't I.
I think sometimes it comes fromand I'm meant to be asking the
questions, but I appreciate.

Speaker 2 (01:20:03):
I'm genuinely curious .
I want to hear it because I'mstruggling.

Speaker 1 (01:20:06):
I think that it comes from different places.
Meaning it, I Summed and I aska lot of questions now.
I used to not ask as manyquestions and I saw that that
comes down to you're gonna findout a lot more.
You're gonna ask toughquestions now so that you don't
have really tough situationslater.

(01:20:26):
And that's kind of what I wasdoing with you.
You know, because I've had somany of these things of like you
know, this is gonna solve a lotof your problems and I didn't
ask enough questions, right, andI wasn't.
And I did it with you and I wasreally look back on a lot of
our conversations it was like itwas such a I think I was in
such a good place like hey, man,like Listen, I've been, I've

(01:20:48):
been approached by so manydifferent people and I'm going
on a side note.
But back to hunger.
Sometimes it comes from youabsolutely have to feed your
family, right, you are gonnalike a mother their child.
I have a daughter, but before Ieven had a daughter, my
daughter has special needs.
I'm like, and I have enoughright enough, that hunger in me

(01:21:13):
is something that my dad kind oftaught me.
I remember him on theracquetball court, just all over
the place diving for things,and it was like I always wanted
to be like my dad, so that thatkind of came from that.
I think back on that it's likeI'm just gonna go hard.
I don't know what that was, Idon't know where he got it from.
So that's one.
I think we learn it from ourparents to a certain degree.

(01:21:35):
And then I think there'ssomething innately in some of us
probably more women, to behonest that are like they got to
take care of their kids, likethis is just nurturing thing.
It's not just for me.
If it's not just for me and Iam responsible for somebody else
, I'm gonna have hunger and I'mgonna go after it.
I don't know, what do you?

(01:21:56):
What do you think, man?
I mean, it's a.
It's a tough one to crackbecause I still haven't Figured
it out hundred percent.

Speaker 2 (01:22:03):
That's why I asked I'm asking anyone that I know
who brings that up right aboutthat.
I love your point about askingquestions.
By the way you change yourquestions, change your life.
Like questions are the answer.
Like literally With that, withhunger and man.
I've thought about this so muchbecause I'm like man, if
everyone, if they just operatedlike I, like I don't get it.

(01:22:23):
But then I look in internallyand I'm like, well, I've had to
learn how to like turn off andlike slow it down.
You know what I mean.
And so I've almost had to dolike the opposite.
Sometimes, I'm gonna saySometimes I look at individuals
and I'm like man, that must benice.
I like are you really actuallyhappy right now?
Or you know with what they'redoing?
Because they're not constantlythinking about something or

(01:22:44):
growing or building and all thattype of stuff, right, and so I
know I'm kind of just ramblinghere, but, like with hunger, I
think that it can be the wayI've.
I look at almost like a flame.
I think it can be stoked in theright individual if the right
conditions are placed upon thatindividual.
Right, I do.
I truly believe this might bethe optimism in me that it is

(01:23:05):
not a either you have it or youdon't.
I think it's either you have itcurrently or you don't, based
on the conditions that you'reexperiencing within your life.
And maybe some people gothrough life and they ever
actually get to the point wherethey need to wake up every day
and attack and hunt, feel goodand get after it and grow and
push themselves to the limit,and maybe they're you know just
whatever happy with doing, withwhatever they want.
But I do think that if theright conditions are presented

(01:23:26):
amongst people, that they canthen Flip that switch on,
similar to a mother who needs toprotect their child, or a
father is about good to go tobankruptcy or whatever it might
be.
And so that's kind of been mythoughts on it.
The other side of this coin, to,because people have asked me,
like, how do you stay motivated?
Like we know, how do you keepgoing?
Like why don't you take a breakor do that stuff?
And I do take breaks and butit's like one.
I fell in love with the game.

(01:23:47):
I love business, I lovemarketing, I love investments, I
love conversations like this, Ilove personal development, all
that stuff.
And to I Found that when I so,like I'm an addiction chaser,
we'll just say it how it isright, because, but I've learned
to shift my addictions fromDestructive to positive ones and
I've been able to anchor whathappens if I work hard and build

(01:24:11):
something in the Joy that comesfrom that, in the fulfillment
to doing the work.
And so that's what keeps mehungry and going, because, like,
I know that if I stop and donothing I'm gonna be bored, I'm
not gonna go anywhere, right.
And so I always manufacture thisgun to the head, urgency of
getting things done, and so,like, whenever someone's asks
and then we're kind of going toshifting topics here, but it's
for the audience.
If you're like, hey, like howdo you, how do I get going?

(01:24:32):
It's like, well, this is anextreme example, but I heard it
from Gary Vee.
He's like picture a gun to yourfamily member's head and you
have to go solve the problem inthe next 12 months.
Would you be able to make amillion dollars?
Anyone in this country rightnow, if there was a gun to the
loved ones head in 12 months,would be able to make a million
dollars in my opinion.
Right, I think they could likewith that urgency.
But most people don't attackwith that urgency, because what

(01:24:53):
happens in the United States in2023?
If you don't do much not awhole lot someone's gonna come,
take care of you're gonna beable to get by, someone will
hand you something you know, andso, long story short, hunger is
something that eludes.
I always ask myself how dopeople get hungry, how do I find
more people like that, and canit be stoked?

(01:25:14):
Can I stoke it?
Does it?
The external conditions need tobe met.
Where does it come from?

Speaker 1 (01:25:18):
I think this is something that I've been working
on too.
I think that If you have anemployee mindset, it's it's
figuring out to how to do aslittle if you don't have upward
mobility, quite quitting.

Speaker 2 (01:25:36):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:25:36):
Yeah, exactly like you're gonna do as little as you
can to get by in some instances, but if there's a potential for
upward mobility, if there'ssomething more, so it's good.
No, what I'm trying to do andin a line with companies and
certain things that I'm doing isthere has to be something more,
meaning it's it's not gonna bejust selling houses, but maybe

(01:25:59):
you love to do that.
That.
That will have its own hunger,right, like you.
Like it goes back to our Ourgood friend of all, right, like,
do what?
The definition or people thatare successful, what they do,
what feels like play to themseems like work to others, right
?
So if you love selling housesand that's just something you
love, you're gonna go out andyou don't even.
It's not hunger, it's just likeI love to do this.

(01:26:21):
Maybe you don't love to do it,which I don't loathe it, because
I've done.
I've dug ditches in Australiaand the outback around
Aboriginals and have seen, youknow, like poverty and had flies
buzzing around me and like,okay, that's really tough.
You know scrubbing boats tough.
So that's part of what alsodrove my hunger to do this of
like I don't want to go back tothat.

(01:26:41):
So there's, there's the painright, pain aversion or, like
you know, I want to be the guyon the dock we talked about that
.
You didn't want to be the guyselling the sweets, you want to
own the sweet right.
So there's that bigger visionthat drives that hunger.
So, having people in anorganization I think they have
to be I think what helps themwith their hunger is saying, hey
, you know, down the road, thereis something more for this

(01:27:05):
daily activity, and that's thatanchoring the daily activity to
Something bigger in the future.
Hundred percent status.

Speaker 2 (01:27:13):
Yes, I All so much here comes back to status.
I agree and that's so true inevery aspect of life, like
anchoring eating the meat andrice and salad today versus
eating McDonald's, right,anchoring going to the gym to
what's gonna go in the future,which leads to another thought
that I, you know, wanted toshare at some point in this
conversation, which is so what Ithink is huge is I think the

(01:27:35):
future is going to be dictatedby people who are able to focus
in today's world and who arealso able to Forgo short-term
gratification For long-termgains, right?
So, because in today's world,where we have short-term
gratification is Everywhere, youcan get any vice that you want
at any point in time by oneclick of a button, right, and so

(01:27:59):
being able to forego thosethings for the long-term
gratification Is going to be thepeople who, I believe, run the
world, because that and thoseare directly correlated with
focus.
In my opinion, it's a loteasier to doom scroll Instagram
than it is to open a book, youknow, and so I think that that's
such an important concept intoday's world, and I wish it was
being discussed more with ourkids and children in school and
things like that, but it'ssomething I think about all the

(01:28:19):
time.
It's like, okay, how do Iforego short-term gratification
for long-term gains?

Speaker 1 (01:28:24):
Hmm, I Think along that lines, on another parallel,
that the people that are goingto make it back to our AI
Conversation, the people thatare going to make it and I see
it in our industry, and this isjust kind of a thought I'll
throw out there we can be.
I think that a real estateagent could be replaced by AGI

(01:28:47):
and even maybe not even AGI, butsomething that was able to
bring together a lot ofdifferent things that Alexa is
already listening to us on.
Right now that you want to gobuy a house, this thing can be
answer every real estatequestion that you ever did.
It also can integrate the phonewith inspection reports.

(01:29:08):
Property history blockchain isgonna do away with title.
Oh, yeah, right that it's nothard to do this.
This is not conspiracy theories.
It's not tough to like connectthe dots on this.
But anyways, back to us.
Where I say to the real estateagents out there is Is make your
skill set that much higher,because I do think that this
thing, connected with AI, isgonna be able to answer,

(01:29:30):
probably, and say well, what doyou think?
What do you think I shouldwrite an offer on this property
for?
Well, based on that, that, Imean, zillow's got the algorithm
and then and it's got this andyou know you already scan the
house, it's got you know woodrot here or this or that there
and based on the age, and da, da, da, da.
And it already checked theperson's Facebook history and
sees what you know that they gota divorce.
So we got it.
Calculates a lot of differentthings right, but at the end

(01:29:54):
there's still gonna be thatconsumer Maybe that does the
carvana and just buys the houseor it makes the offer would have
you.
But I still think that the lastbastion for the real estate
agent is gonna be in criticalthinking of saying this is what
this thing tells me I should do.
What do you think?

Speaker 2 (01:30:12):
Yeah, 100% the same.
That's the same exact way thatI look at marketers and
copywriters.
I have the same Viewpoint on it.
You also still need the realestate agent who can help
program the AI and make sense ofit.
Chat GPT can do good stuff withthe right prompts with the
right prompt, engineering right,but you still need someone
who's actually good at the thingto look at and be like, hey, is

(01:30:34):
this a good idea or not?
You know to confirm it.
And so I agree, because I agreewith everything you just said.
The very first and most obvioususe case to me For blockchain
to really take over is Titleright, because the first thing
you look at there's way too manyparties to a real estate
transaction.
It should not be this difficultall to keep track of a ledger.
I understand why it is right,but the blockchain should be

(01:30:55):
able to keep Apple leans and thetitle and all this stuff like
that's common.
Now we have to wait forgovernments to approve it, so
it's gonna be a while, probably,and all that, but that, in my
opinion, is coming.
But I agree with you 100% ifyou level up your skill set,
really what it's gonna do in alot of ways, too, is it can,
it's gonna continue To drive abigger gap between, like, those
who have a lot and those whodon't.
You know, which is anotherinteresting topic.

(01:31:15):
I don't want to say that likeI'm someone like who's against
Musker.
You know those guys because I'mnot at all.
Because if you think about thegap, yes, the gap between me and
Elon Musk, it's pretty freakinsubstantial and I do okay, but
you know it's pretty big.
But what that said, I'm stilldoing okay.
So, even though the gap andthis is something I don't get
all the rich and the poor, right, but if you look at like the
lifestyle that a lot of peoplehave and I'm not saying there

(01:31:38):
isn't poverty, there's massivepoverty but just because the gap
between me and Elon Musk is waybigger than any time in history
, right, even like peasants andkings doesn't mean that my life
is worse or not where it shouldbe, if that makes sense.
I don't think enough peoplenecessarily talk about that.
So I think that overall qualityof life is gonna continue to
improve, but there are gonna beeven more people in that musk
realm who really are the top oftheir craft, because more and

(01:31:59):
more people are Gonna have allof their needs met from AI and
all the stuff that's coming downthe pipeline, you know I think
this is our second episode, man.
I would talk so deep on it.
I love it yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:32:11):
But we have a, we got a time commitment here, so
excited actually to go out andsee some property with you and
show you this area.
And, man, I just want to sayhow interesting it was that we
met and you know, I feel, andgenuinely, like we've actually
known each other for a long time.
I think that our paths havebeen on a parallel path.

(01:32:31):
I'm a little older than you,but I think that we have very
parallel paths and I do believein the universe and I'm just
very thankful that it put ustogether because I already
Appreciate you deeply.
Thank you, absolutely.
I'm getting real.
You know sappy here, but it'strue, and I want to say thank
you for your time here because Iknow about how valuable this

(01:32:52):
has been a blast, man, I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:32:55):
And yes, episode two, let's.
Let's keep going with it.
We'll come back, and you knowwe're making regular thing over
the next several years is ourrelationship grows and we do a
lot Of big things together, sothat's, that's the goal.
Awesome.
Thank you so much.

Speaker 1 (01:33:06):
Nick, of course.

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