August 2, 2025 • 15 mins
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In this episode, Jocelyn unpacks a crucial distinction in the world of education: the difference between professional learning that simply ticks a box and learning that leads to lasting transformation in classrooms. Drawing on her experience as both a teacher and professional learning facilitator, Jocelyn explores the essential elements of impactful PL—from long-term commitment and real-world relevance to leadership support and collaborative action. If you’ve ever sat through a PD session wondering, “Will this actually make a difference?”, this episode is for you.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jocelyn (00:00):
Welcome, welcome, welcome to the Structured
Literacy Podcast.
I'm Jocelyn.
I'm so pleased that you'vejoined me for this episode
recorded here in Tasmania, thelands of the Palawa people.
Today we're diving into a topicthat I know will resonate with
every single listener thedifference between professional
(00:22):
learning that actuallytransforms practice and
professional learning that'sjust well a ticker box exercise.
I can't tell you how many PLs Isat through that were nothing
but a waste of time.
Someone would turn up and givea presentation that I felt had
nothing to do with the work Iwas doing in the classroom, and
even when it did relate, we'dask questions about classroom
(00:44):
practicalities that very oftenthe person couldn't answer.
Now, I'm not here to criticiseanyone.
It was just that what they hadto say didn't connect with my
job and the problems that I wastrying to solve, and this most
often happened when someone fromoutside the school asked, or in
some cases demanded, to addressthe staff.
This was very often someonefrom regional office, and it's
(01:07):
not just regional visitors thatsee us trying to look polite
while we're secretly planningtomorrow's lessons as we pretend
to take notes.
We can have an informedconsultant or a guest engage
with us, and it's the same.
We've all spent days of ourlives at system-imposed or even
highly anticipated PL orconferences and, while we may
(01:29):
have had a good time, we saw thesame outcomes as the mismatch
sessions Time spent with nooutcome seen.
And here's the thing Whetherthe PL is imposed by someone
else because they think we needto hear it, or we've asked to do
the PL, the positive benefitsof the time and money investment
(01:50):
often don't last beyond thatday.
We do the thing and then we goback to business as usual no
measurable outcomes anywhere, nodevelopment of professional
knowledge, no visible adjustmentto our practice.
The problem with most PL is notthat it was imposed on us or
that it was off-site or that itwas connected to a commercial
(02:10):
program.
The problem is that it'stransactional.
Transactional PL is an exchangeyour time and or money for some
knowledge or strategy, and theneveryone goes home feeling good
that they've done a thingknowledge or strategy and then
everyone goes home feeling goodthat they've done a thing.
And before you send me emailsI'm well aware of the irony of
(02:32):
this discussion I make a livingpartly through providing
professional learning.
Aren't I a part of this problemof transactional PL?
Well, yes, sometimes that'strue, and more so in the past
than now.
Not intentionally, of course,but the nature of my work
particularly online courses andpublic workshops means that
there will be a proportion ofpeople who do the day or the
(02:54):
course and then go back tobusiness as usual, and much of
that comes down to things that Ican't control.
But equally, there are peoplewho take what was shared and use
it to transform their practice.
They send me emails sayingthings like I've regained my
love of teaching or I've totallychanged my practice and I'm now
(03:16):
getting outcomes that I neverthought were possible.
So what's the differencebetween those who had a
transactional experience andthose who had a transformational
one?
Well, the main difference isthat those who transformed
(03:38):
practice engaged over the longterm and they knew what problems
they were trying to solve overthe long term.
And they knew what problemsthey were trying to solve.
And it's no accident that myteacher-long courses have been
12 weeks long.
It's no accident that they'vefocused on practical application
of research findings aroundreading and writing.
The most impactful professionallearning that I facilitate has
(04:00):
lasted longer than a term andhas focused on action.
Has lasted longer than a termand has focused on action.
The people who get the most outof professional learning
experiences are those who dothings in their school or work
as a team to adjust or try newpractices.
This brings us to the firstcondition for professional
learning to be transformational.
(04:21):
Transformational PL reflectsthe very nature of professional
capacity, that is, that we learnby doing.
Of course we need theory andknowledge of frameworks that's a
must.
But real learning, deeplearning, happens when we
ourselves take action, predictwhat we think will happen and
(04:42):
then evaluate.
It's this learning by actionthat helps us really understand
the why of our role.
Seeing really is believing, asI discuss in my book Reading
Success in the Early PrimaryYears, understanding the why
behind our instructionaldecisions is crucial.
When teachers understandcognitive load theory and how
(05:04):
students actually learn to read,they make fundamentally
different decisions about theirpractice.
This deep understanding can'tbe developed in a one-done
session.
(05:29):
The next factor intransformational professional
learning is still about the why,but not the instructional why.
It's about our why, and thistoo relates to the nature of
professional knowledge.
The building of professionalknowledge doesn't begin with the
first slide of a PowerPoint.
It starts with knowing what theproblem is that we are trying
to solve, because that's thehook, the motivator, the
(05:50):
relevance To be a reflective andprofessional learner, we need
to be able to define theproblems in front of us.
For a time as we're learningour craft, we don't know what we
don't know.
We don't know the instructionallandscape well enough to know
what is and isn't working, so wedon't know how to define those
(06:12):
problems.
And here's where leadership andskilled coaching comes in.
The schools who have engaged inthe most transformative
experiences are those with aprincipal or head of school was
close to curriculum, passionateabout instruction and committed
to taking decisive action.
Leaders in my Leading LearningSuccess program tell me that the
(06:34):
lack of understanding of thewhy behind instruction is one of
the biggest barriers to gettingeveryone on the same page and
getting real outcomes.
When team members understandnot just what they're supposed
(06:57):
to do but why they're doing it,when they can connect their
actions with the outcomes oftheir students, everything
changes.
The best leaders also know thatchange is hard, that slow and
steady wins the race and that wedon't change for the better
unless we have an unapologeticfocus on excellence.
Great leaders also see PL as amechanism for achieving existing
(07:17):
strategic priorities, notticking compliance boxes.
The best PL isn't an extraburden.
It meets us right where we arein the classroom.
The goals of transformationalprofessional learning align with
our existing well-definedproblems of practice and clearly
(07:38):
articulated priorities.
Research consistently shows usthat professional learning is
most effective when it'ssustained, collaborative and
focused on specific studentlearning outcomes.
One-off sessions, no matter howengaging, simply cannot create
(08:02):
the conditions necessary fordeep learning and lasting change
.
Developing my own understandingof the nature of professional
knowledge, what it is, how weget it and what practices get us
where we want to go to developit has changed how I show up for
leaders and schools.
I've learned to ask betterquestions, be more direct in my
(08:27):
discussions with school leadersabout what it takes to get
results.
I'm also much more selectiveabout what I say yes to.
I no longer say yes to we havea professional learning day
planned.
Can you come and run a workshop?
Because I know that thatdoesn't sit within my
professional integrity, becauseI'm here to help people get real
(08:50):
transformative outcomes.
So my consultancy and PL workhas shifted to longer-term
relationships that help teachersgrow confidence through
understanding why theirstrengths actually are their
strengths, so that they can growand transfer their knowledge,
have deeper conversations withtheir colleagues and have enough
(09:11):
safety to be vulnerable abouttheir problems of practice so
that they can deeply engage withthe action and real development
that makes transformationalchange a reality.
Leaders often tell me howimportant shared language and
vision of instruction is andagain, one-off PL doesn't do
(09:31):
that because it takes time,sustained effort and a
commitment to going deeper thansurface-level implementation to
get where we want to go.
So how do we move fromtransactional to
transformational professionaldevelopment undertakings?
(09:53):
Here are key elements that needto be in place.
You have to have long termcommitment.
This professional learningneeds to happen over months, if
not years, not hours.
Real change takes time to embed.
We need to have a problemfocused approach.
So start with the problemsyou're actually trying to solve
(10:14):
that relate to teachers' realeveryday work, not with what
someone else thinks.
You need to know we need to beaction-oriented.
Professional developmenthappens through doing so.
We have to have the opportunityto try things out, reflect,
adjust and try again.
There needs to be collaboration.
(10:36):
Teachers learn best when theycan discuss, question and work
through their challengestogether, and for that to be
effective, we need to equip ourteachers with the tools,
techniques and strategies forhigh quality collaborative
discussion.
Leadership needs to support thisjourney, but leaders also need
(10:58):
support themselves.
Without leaders who understandthe vision and can support the
journey, transformation isnearly impossible.
But we also have to acknowledgethat leaders are very often new
into this structured, explicitteaching space and that many
leaders have never had theopportunity for high quality
(11:20):
professional developmentthemselves about how to get the
best out of their teams.
So leaders need to support.
But leaders also need support.
Everyone needs to get what theyneed.
No one's just thrown in thedeep end.
There needs to be connection topractice.
Everything must connect back towhat happens in the classroom
(11:40):
with students, and we have toknow how to measure our impact.
There is nothing more deeplysatisfying than helping another
human grow in confidence andcapacity.
You know this.
You do it every day withstudents and me I get to do that
(12:01):
with you.
I feel truly blessed to do thiswork.
I believe in education.
I believe we can achieve ourgoals of having every student
leave primary school a confidentreader and writer.
I believe in teachers andleaders and and yes, that
includes you.
So this goal oftransformational professional
(12:27):
learning is precisely why I'vecreated Leading Learning Success
, my 12-month whole schoolprofessional development program
that builds an understanding ofthe why of instruction through
quality learning about cognitionand how this connects to
literacy, through qualitylearning about cognition and how
this connects to literacy.
This also aims to build greatconversation, build leadership
(12:47):
and coaching capacity and tohelp everybody get what they
need to achieve the goalsthey're already working on in
their school.
I know that leaders know thatthis work is important.
I also know they just need alittle help to make it happen.
(13:10):
So, as you reflect on theprofessional learning activities
in your school, in your systemor even in your own classroom,
ask yourself is thistransactional?
Are we trading time and moneyfor someone to tell us about
techniques and share someknowledge?
Or is it transformational?
(13:30):
Is it helping us to take theaction we need to in the
classroom to ensure that we aregoing to get these outcomes,
that we're not hoping for thebest, we're actually going to
get the best?
Are we ticking boxes or are wegenuinely growing our capacity
to serve students better?
When you're making your choices, choose professional learning
(13:54):
that honours yourprofessionalism, builds your
capacity and connects to thereal work you do every day.
Thanks so much for listening tothis episode of the Structured
Literacy Podcast.
It has been a pleasure to bewith you here today.
I will see you next week.
Until then, happy teaching, bye.
Welcome, welcome, welcome to the Structured
Literacy Podcast.
I'm Jocelyn.
I'm so pleased that you'vejoined me for this episode
recorded here in Tasmania, thelands of the Palawa people.
Today we're diving into a topicthat I know will resonate with
every single listener thedifference between professional
(00:22):
learning that actuallytransforms practice and
professional learning that'sjust well a ticker box exercise.
I can't tell you how many PLs Isat through that were nothing
but a waste of time.
Someone would turn up and givea presentation that I felt had
nothing to do with the work Iwas doing in the classroom, and
even when it did relate, we'dask questions about classroom
(00:44):
practicalities that very oftenthe person couldn't answer.
Now, I'm not here to criticiseanyone.
It was just that what they hadto say didn't connect with my
job and the problems that I wastrying to solve, and this most
often happened when someone fromoutside the school asked, or in
some cases demanded, to addressthe staff.
This was very often someonefrom regional office, and it's
(01:07):
not just regional visitors thatsee us trying to look polite
while we're secretly planningtomorrow's lessons as we pretend
to take notes.
We can have an informedconsultant or a guest engage
with us, and it's the same.
We've all spent days of ourlives at system-imposed or even
highly anticipated PL orconferences and, while we may
(01:29):
have had a good time, we saw thesame outcomes as the mismatch
sessions Time spent with nooutcome seen.
And here's the thing Whetherthe PL is imposed by someone
else because they think we needto hear it, or we've asked to do
the PL, the positive benefitsof the time and money investment
(01:50):
often don't last beyond thatday.
We do the thing and then we goback to business as usual no
measurable outcomes anywhere, nodevelopment of professional
knowledge, no visible adjustmentto our practice.
The problem with most PL is notthat it was imposed on us or
that it was off-site or that itwas connected to a commercial
(02:10):
program.
The problem is that it'stransactional.
Transactional PL is an exchangeyour time and or money for some
knowledge or strategy, and theneveryone goes home feeling good
that they've done a thingknowledge or strategy and then
everyone goes home feeling goodthat they've done a thing.
And before you send me emailsI'm well aware of the irony of
(02:32):
this discussion I make a livingpartly through providing
professional learning.
Aren't I a part of this problemof transactional PL?
Well, yes, sometimes that'strue, and more so in the past
than now.
Not intentionally, of course,but the nature of my work
particularly online courses andpublic workshops means that
there will be a proportion ofpeople who do the day or the
(02:54):
course and then go back tobusiness as usual, and much of
that comes down to things that Ican't control.
But equally, there are peoplewho take what was shared and use
it to transform their practice.
They send me emails sayingthings like I've regained my
love of teaching or I've totallychanged my practice and I'm now
(03:16):
getting outcomes that I neverthought were possible.
So what's the differencebetween those who had a
transactional experience andthose who had a transformational
one?
Well, the main difference isthat those who transformed
(03:38):
practice engaged over the longterm and they knew what problems
they were trying to solve overthe long term.
And they knew what problemsthey were trying to solve.
And it's no accident that myteacher-long courses have been
12 weeks long.
It's no accident that they'vefocused on practical application
of research findings aroundreading and writing.
The most impactful professionallearning that I facilitate has
(04:00):
lasted longer than a term andhas focused on action.
Has lasted longer than a termand has focused on action.
The people who get the most outof professional learning
experiences are those who dothings in their school or work
as a team to adjust or try newpractices.
This brings us to the firstcondition for professional
learning to be transformational.
(04:21):
Transformational PL reflectsthe very nature of professional
capacity, that is, that we learnby doing.
Of course we need theory andknowledge of frameworks that's a
must.
But real learning, deeplearning, happens when we
ourselves take action, predictwhat we think will happen and
(04:42):
then evaluate.
It's this learning by actionthat helps us really understand
the why of our role.
Seeing really is believing, asI discuss in my book Reading
Success in the Early PrimaryYears, understanding the why
behind our instructionaldecisions is crucial.
When teachers understandcognitive load theory and how
(05:04):
students actually learn to read,they make fundamentally
different decisions about theirpractice.
This deep understanding can'tbe developed in a one-done
session.
(05:29):
The next factor intransformational professional
learning is still about the why,but not the instructional why.
It's about our why, and thistoo relates to the nature of
professional knowledge.
The building of professionalknowledge doesn't begin with the
first slide of a PowerPoint.
It starts with knowing what theproblem is that we are trying
to solve, because that's thehook, the motivator, the
(05:50):
relevance To be a reflective andprofessional learner, we need
to be able to define theproblems in front of us.
For a time as we're learningour craft, we don't know what we
don't know.
We don't know the instructionallandscape well enough to know
what is and isn't working, so wedon't know how to define those
(06:12):
problems.
And here's where leadership andskilled coaching comes in.
The schools who have engaged inthe most transformative
experiences are those with aprincipal or head of school was
close to curriculum, passionateabout instruction and committed
to taking decisive action.
Leaders in my Leading LearningSuccess program tell me that the
(06:34):
lack of understanding of thewhy behind instruction is one of
the biggest barriers to gettingeveryone on the same page and
getting real outcomes.
When team members understandnot just what they're supposed
(06:57):
to do but why they're doing it,when they can connect their
actions with the outcomes oftheir students, everything
changes.
The best leaders also know thatchange is hard, that slow and
steady wins the race and that wedon't change for the better
unless we have an unapologeticfocus on excellence.
Great leaders also see PL as amechanism for achieving existing
(07:17):
strategic priorities, notticking compliance boxes.
The best PL isn't an extraburden.
It meets us right where we arein the classroom.
The goals of transformationalprofessional learning align with
our existing well-definedproblems of practice and clearly
(07:38):
articulated priorities.
Research consistently shows usthat professional learning is
most effective when it'ssustained, collaborative and
focused on specific studentlearning outcomes.
One-off sessions, no matter howengaging, simply cannot create
(08:02):
the conditions necessary fordeep learning and lasting change
.
Developing my own understandingof the nature of professional
knowledge, what it is, how weget it and what practices get us
where we want to go to developit has changed how I show up for
leaders and schools.
I've learned to ask betterquestions, be more direct in my
(08:27):
discussions with school leadersabout what it takes to get
results.
I'm also much more selectiveabout what I say yes to.
I no longer say yes to we havea professional learning day
planned.
Can you come and run a workshop?
Because I know that thatdoesn't sit within my
professional integrity, becauseI'm here to help people get real
(08:50):
transformative outcomes.
So my consultancy and PL workhas shifted to longer-term
relationships that help teachersgrow confidence through
understanding why theirstrengths actually are their
strengths, so that they can growand transfer their knowledge,
have deeper conversations withtheir colleagues and have enough
(09:11):
safety to be vulnerable abouttheir problems of practice so
that they can deeply engage withthe action and real development
that makes transformationalchange a reality.
Leaders often tell me howimportant shared language and
vision of instruction is andagain, one-off PL doesn't do
(09:31):
that because it takes time,sustained effort and a
commitment to going deeper thansurface-level implementation to
get where we want to go.
So how do we move fromtransactional to
transformational professionaldevelopment undertakings?
(09:53):
Here are key elements that needto be in place.
You have to have long termcommitment.
This professional learningneeds to happen over months, if
not years, not hours.
Real change takes time to embed.
We need to have a problemfocused approach.
So start with the problemsyou're actually trying to solve
(10:14):
that relate to teachers' realeveryday work, not with what
someone else thinks.
You need to know we need to beaction-oriented.
Professional developmenthappens through doing so.
We have to have the opportunityto try things out, reflect,
adjust and try again.
There needs to be collaboration.
(10:36):
Teachers learn best when theycan discuss, question and work
through their challengestogether, and for that to be
effective, we need to equip ourteachers with the tools,
techniques and strategies forhigh quality collaborative
discussion.
Leadership needs to support thisjourney, but leaders also need
(10:58):
support themselves.
Without leaders who understandthe vision and can support the
journey, transformation isnearly impossible.
But we also have to acknowledgethat leaders are very often new
into this structured, explicitteaching space and that many
leaders have never had theopportunity for high quality
(11:20):
professional developmentthemselves about how to get the
best out of their teams.
So leaders need to support.
But leaders also need support.
Everyone needs to get what theyneed.
No one's just thrown in thedeep end.
There needs to be connection topractice.
Everything must connect back towhat happens in the classroom
(11:40):
with students, and we have toknow how to measure our impact.
There is nothing more deeplysatisfying than helping another
human grow in confidence andcapacity.
You know this.
You do it every day withstudents and me I get to do that
(12:01):
with you.
I feel truly blessed to do thiswork.
I believe in education.
I believe we can achieve ourgoals of having every student
leave primary school a confidentreader and writer.
I believe in teachers andleaders and and yes, that
includes you.
So this goal oftransformational professional
(12:27):
learning is precisely why I'vecreated Leading Learning Success
, my 12-month whole schoolprofessional development program
that builds an understanding ofthe why of instruction through
quality learning about cognitionand how this connects to
literacy, through qualitylearning about cognition and how
this connects to literacy.
This also aims to build greatconversation, build leadership
(12:47):
and coaching capacity and tohelp everybody get what they
need to achieve the goalsthey're already working on in
their school.
I know that leaders know thatthis work is important.
I also know they just need alittle help to make it happen.
(13:10):
So, as you reflect on theprofessional learning activities
in your school, in your systemor even in your own classroom,
ask yourself is thistransactional?
Are we trading time and moneyfor someone to tell us about
techniques and share someknowledge?
Or is it transformational?
(13:30):
Is it helping us to take theaction we need to in the
classroom to ensure that we aregoing to get these outcomes,
that we're not hoping for thebest, we're actually going to
get the best?
Are we ticking boxes or are wegenuinely growing our capacity
to serve students better?
When you're making your choices, choose professional learning
(13:54):
that honours yourprofessionalism, builds your
capacity and connects to thereal work you do every day.
Thanks so much for listening tothis episode of the Structured
Literacy Podcast.
It has been a pleasure to bewith you here today.
I will see you next week.
Until then, happy teaching, bye.
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