July 28, 2025 • 32 mins
Geoffrey D. Calhoun welcomes back friend of the show, screenwriter Katie Presto, for a no-holds-barred breakdown of the new Fantastic Four film. From emotional arcs to cosmic stakes, they cover what worked, what surprised them, and why the movie isn’t the camp-fest some critics claim it to be.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
00:22 – First reactions and the film’s 60s retro-futurism
03:05 – Why the Thing’s arc is the emotional core
06:20 – Reed and Sue’s realistic relationship struggles
11:40 – The space birth scene: creative or confusing?
17:14 – The film’s family theme and emotional payoff
20:09 – Franklin’s powers and tragic comic book future
21:08 – Is Reed neurodivergent? A subtle exploration
27:02 – The director’s surprising TV background
About the Guest:
Katie Presto is a screenwriter and longtime friend of the show. She brings a sharp eye and grounded insight into storytelling, structure, and character, especially in genre films. About the Host:
With films on network television, streaming platforms, and in theaters, Geoffrey D. Calhoun is a screenwriter, author of The Guide for Every Screenwriter, and a passionate mentor in the industry. He hosts The Successful Screenwriter podcast to empower writers and filmmakers at every level.
Resources Mentioned in the Episode:
🌐 Podcast Website
📸 Instagram @screenwriterpod
🎵 TikTok @screenwriterpod
If you loved this breakdown or have your own take on the new Fantastic Four, comment, share, and subscribe. Don’t forget to let us know if we missed anything in those post-credit scenes!
#FantasticFour2025 #ScreenwritingPodcast #TheSuccessfulScreenwriter #ComicBookMovies #MovieBreakdown
🎬 Get Free Script Leads — be the first to know which producers are requesting scripts and accepting submissions.
If you enjoyed this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe. Share it with a fellow screenwriter who’d find it valuable!
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
- Why the Thing’s character arc hits differently this time
- The subtle emotional depth behind Reed and Sue’s relationship
- How world-building and set design enhance story
- Casting choices that seemed risky but paid off
- How the theme of “family” drives the entire film
00:22 – First reactions and the film’s 60s retro-futurism
03:05 – Why the Thing’s arc is the emotional core
06:20 – Reed and Sue’s realistic relationship struggles
11:40 – The space birth scene: creative or confusing?
17:14 – The film’s family theme and emotional payoff
20:09 – Franklin’s powers and tragic comic book future
21:08 – Is Reed neurodivergent? A subtle exploration
27:02 – The director’s surprising TV background
About the Guest:
Katie Presto is a screenwriter and longtime friend of the show. She brings a sharp eye and grounded insight into storytelling, structure, and character, especially in genre films. About the Host:
With films on network television, streaming platforms, and in theaters, Geoffrey D. Calhoun is a screenwriter, author of The Guide for Every Screenwriter, and a passionate mentor in the industry. He hosts The Successful Screenwriter podcast to empower writers and filmmakers at every level.
Resources Mentioned in the Episode:
- Fantastic Four (2025)
- The Guide for Every Screenwriter by Geoffrey D. Calhoun
- Matt Shakman’s filmography (Wandavision, Succession, Game of Thrones)
🌐 Podcast Website
📸 Instagram @screenwriterpod
🎵 TikTok @screenwriterpod
If you loved this breakdown or have your own take on the new Fantastic Four, comment, share, and subscribe. Don’t forget to let us know if we missed anything in those post-credit scenes!
#FantasticFour2025 #ScreenwritingPodcast #TheSuccessfulScreenwriter #ComicBookMovies #MovieBreakdown
🎬 Get Free Script Leads — be the first to know which producers are requesting scripts and accepting submissions.
If you enjoyed this episode, please rate, review, and subscribe. Share it with a fellow screenwriter who’d find it valuable!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Stuck in Act two, not sure if that twist actually works,
or maybe your characters are just fine. That's where Virtual
Jeffrey comes in. He's a screenwriting assistant we've trained to
help you workshop scenes, fixed pacing, punch up dialogue, or
just get on stuck. If you're a member of the
successful sprint Edder, you've already got access. If not, it
(00:21):
might be time to level up. All right, welcome to
the podcast. I'm so excited to have a friend of
the show, Katie Presto, Thanks for being on with us.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Thanks for having me Jeffrey.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Oh man, it's been a while, so glad to have
you back. You have been missed, my dear, oh thank you.
All right, So she reluctantly agreed to watch.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
I was gonna go see it.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
All right, So we watched Fantastic Four. A ton of
spoilers here, guys, So if you haven't watched it yet
or your plan on watching it, you know, come back
to this episode. But we are going to definitely break
down some of the stuff we saw. I mean, what
are your first thoughts on the Fantastic Four.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I really loved the movie as a whole, especially the
sixties theme, like the set design that was really cool.
I was like, I want that in my health and
that in my house.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I agree with you. The set pieces and the and
the design of the show was incredible. Yeah, you know.
One of the things I like to go and see
what other other people are saying, not so that I
become contrarian, but just so that I could just get
a feel of what the vibes are. And I'm hearing
(01:31):
people review it as campy, and I'm like, you're way off.
This is not camp This is called world building. That's
what they did is they created this what feels like
a real sixties sci fi future city that is that
way because Reid Richards is a super genius and a
(01:52):
different way than Tony Stark is and and help kind
of create that that that that world, right, So, I
mean it just feels like like a real place that
you could be living in. This is at camp.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
And it kind of made sense using that time that
decade because that was sort of when the Space Race
was happening and all that. So it kind of melded
the two futuristic and then the things that actually were
going on at that time in our world together. No.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
I think it's great. I mean, they're playing giving homage
to really the birth of the Fantastic Four, which was
in the sixties, Golden Age era of comics. I think
it's great. I have to confess that I have been
a fan of the thing since I was little. I've
always always loved the thing. And to see how he
(02:43):
is so accurate and well played.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
And I was going to talk to you about that
because I heard before I saw the film a lot
of people like, oh, I don't like the way he
looks and all this, and I was like, looking at
the comics, he looks pretty close to what they had
in the in the original comics, I thought.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
I mean in the books, you know, he's got these
baby blue eyes, and the books that are so soulful
that they really pop, and they always highlight with the
orange rock that he has. And so you can see
when you look at Ben Graham the thing that you
can see this as a man of the beautiful heart,
suffering behind this hard shell which is manifested through the
(03:23):
rock in his body. And they were selling this of
that in the movie without overplaying. Why I thought it
was interesting is because when you bring in that character
to a film like this, the desire is to really
want to show that lost soul craving connection, right, and
so it's so easy to ham that up right, And
(03:46):
in the early iterations it was kind of hammed up.
But here instead of you know, really showing that, we're
four years later, so he's had time to process it, right.
It's not the original incarnation of him dealing with this curse,
which is one of the subtle themes of the film.
(04:07):
He's coming to accept it. So when he has this
little talk with Reed, he has his heart to Harley,
it's not your fault, man to have that moment. And
then to show him just in scenes where he's walking
down the street at night by himself, this giant, hulking creature,
and you see those sad blue eyes, and then he's
(04:29):
wearing a suit because he's trying to look normal. I mean,
it's chef's kiss. It's beautiful, it's solemn, it's sad, but
there's heart there. And then to bring Natasha Leone in
as a potential interest was amazing.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Yes, and I feel like they would make a good
couple just their personality.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
It was a surprise to me because in the comic
books the thing ends up dating a blind girl, and
he falls in love with her, and because she can't
see him so and she sees Ben for who he
really is, which is this big old teddy bear. And
then there's a big shock that, you know, he's this giant,
hulking rock man. But but to bring her in and
(05:10):
to see beyond it, you know.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
And yeah, and I liked that they didn't harp fun
you know, oh, like she's with other men who look
more normal than me, or you know what I mean.
Like it was she accepted him right away, and and
it just it wasn't too much of the oh poor
me kind of thing like you said it was. He
had already gone through that face.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
It was like a subtle little love soap opera going
on in the background. This is kind of cool for
r you know, a superhero film. So that's my little thing.
I've always loved the thing because he's he just has heart,
and we got to see that instead of, you know,
the annoying, irritated guy trapped in rock we get to
(05:55):
see different aspects of him not brought to not brought
to the to the films in the past. So I
love the theme of that. And then the fact that
there's a little bit of a of a of a
of a theme of curse there with him and then everybody,
including with that bleeding into you know Johnny who's like
(06:18):
terminally single, right, and that's a little bit of discuss
and then Read right, you could say his is that
he is a brilliant man that gets stuff wrong. And
that is amazing because like, when have you seen that
really played out? Usually when they're the Tony Starts, they're
super smart and everything always goes right.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Yeah, yeah, I mean I like that it was more
grounded in reality. You know that they're fallible.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Like I thought it was great and it made me
as a parent in seeing Read and Sue fighting over
their baby.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Yeah man, and to see.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Yeah, I was like, that's that's really well written. There's
subtlety there, and they love each other and you can
tell that they love each other, but they're still hurting
each other and it's not on purpose. It's not malicious, right,
I mean, that's real relationship. I mean it was written like, wow,
these people get it.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
You know that part. I'm specifically thinking about a part
where they have a conversation and I was like, this
is a conversation I've had, you know, this is absolutistic, and.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
I hate the term. I hate to use the term
female rage right because coming from a guy doesn't sound right.
But I really feel that there's this argument that him
and Sue are having where he's already admitted his faults
and his flaws and the dark places he allows his
mind to go, which you know is aligned for her,
(07:48):
and he goes there anyway, and she gets pissed off,
and he's trying to apologize, and she's getting more pissed
because like she's she's accepted what it is and we
want to stop talking about it, but he won't stop
because he's obsessing over it. And she gets so pissed
she blows up and disappears and is like, yes, I
have seen that happen in real life. Usually it's a
(08:11):
door slamming. So yeah, it's just I do know some
of the most realistic writing I've seen Dialogue.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
Think so too. Yeah, I agree, And I also like
that it's sort of a standalone like you don't need
a whole lot of there's no real background that you need.
You can kind of just jump right in, so you
don't have to watch like twenty five films to be
like Okay, I understand this film.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
No, you're absolutely right. And the way they introduce it
is great because you get this really like this series
of shots that they open after about five minutes of
really newsreels. Well, it wasn't really newsreels. It was the
introduction in the talk show. Then using that as a
gimmick to bring in a bunch of newsreels to recap
the Fantastic for I thought was a great in. Yeah,
(08:58):
and bringing in one of them my favorite crap villains
from The Fantastic Four was a mole man played by
Paul Walter Hauser, which was like brilliant casting. I couldn't
believe it because again, that's another character that you could
bring in who is super cheesy with the stupid glasses
and the inferior complex inferiorready complex, but coming in and
(09:22):
then you just make him snarky and you just give
him a little bit of that. You know, I don't
like Read because Read is so smart, so I.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Think I would have liked to see a little bit
more of him.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Yeah, yeah, he's great. He's so great, So I thought
it was cool we got to bring that in and
and see more of that.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
What did you think about Julia Garner as silver Surfer,
so not in.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
It as much as I had hope. Right, Yeah, that
was the thing is they did a lot of like
a lot of the casting in this was like Pedro
Pascal is huge, Let's make him read Richards. We all
Evan Moss Backrock has done this incredible job. Let's bring
him in his Ben Gram. And so when you see
like Julia Garner was huge and the Ozarks, let's make
(10:09):
her silver server. So when you see these things step back,
you're like, oh, they're just casting the most popular people
that have the most heat Hollywood. And then so I
sit down and I think, well, you know what's going
to happen here, And then they all delivered, and I
was like, holy crap, this was actually like really good casting.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
This wasn't just Trump, who I would have thought, like,
that's not my first thought for that character, but yeah,
it was. I thought she did a really good job
with it.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
I thought it was great. I mean, you know, again,
not a lot of time in the film, so when
you get somebody in there, but you know, her delivery
about Harold and Harolding and Galactus harolding and your end
and giving this this this almost sympathetic delivery to the speech.
(10:57):
You know, I think she sold it. I think you
could really see it in her eyes, which I thought
was really cool. Really giving that away and then giving
her own little arc. It makes you want more from
the character and you can never go wrong from that. Yeah,
so I would love to see some more shallow ball,
but I hate for them to be like, let's do
a shallaball TV show, Like I don't need that.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Yeah, who don't need to go that far?
Speaker 1 (11:21):
Just give me a little bit more, because I mean,
she is a godlike character. Yeah, so it's hard to
work around that. Like at one point, Silver Surfer lived
on Earth and flew around Earth solving crimes, and you're like,
I mean this is like what are you doing? Yeah,
we don't need this, Yeah we got a spider Man.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
What did you What did you think about her having
the baby in space? I was like when he when
he said he said something about you need gravity to
push the baby out, and it just stuck and I
was like I thought about it for twenty minutes. I
was like, you do. I don't think you do. And
then I was sort of distracted by like whether or
(12:01):
not you could or couldn't push it bit.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
So that was a I'd say for me on the film,
that was the weakest part. But then I understand why
they're doing it because quote, the Fantastic Four was birthed
in space, because that's why they got the cosmic race.
So it makes sense thematically to have the baby birth
in space. Like, I get it, I get what led
them there. In the writer's room, yeah, I think though,
(12:24):
you gotta have gravity. So my thing with Reid is
they're always trying to show in subtle ways how he's
so smart. And one of the cool things about Reid
Richards' ability is he can constantly increase his intelligence. So
like Tony is this smart, and Tony's always going to
be this smart Tony Stark, He's not going to be
smarter than that. Reid is the smartest man in the
(12:47):
universe because his power is plasticity, and your brain's intelligence
is dependent on how many folds do you have in
your brain, So when Reid can't figure out a problem,
he creates more folds in his brain until he solves
the problem. We're not going to show that. It's going
to look stupid, right, We're not gonna watch them all.
(13:07):
Let me just create some more folds. Hey, I got
the answer. So I think what they're trying to do
there is they're trying to show him multitask at the
same time. So he's trying to slingshot around this black
hole star and at the same time create gravity for
his wife to give birth. So he does them both,
like literally at the same time. So it's just showing
you how smart he is because we you know, he
(13:30):
has machines he's made, and we're just supposed to accept
that he's made all these machines like this, you know,
CT scanner and things like that, but we're not really
watching him show off his wits and his smarts. In
that moment, we get to see it, and I thought
that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
Yeah, that makes sense and why they chose to kind
of add that in there. But I was just thinking,
don't let Katie Perry see this movie. You don't need
any ideas.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
That's hilarious and it would and it would of course
bomb social media because everyone's going after her because she
has too much exposure. Yeah, it's this weird bell curve
of exposure. Like I would be worried about Pedro Pascal
because he's had so much exposure that I'm concerned that eventually,
you know, the audience people are going to turn against
(14:19):
him becau they've seen him too much. I mean, because
he watched it happen to everybody. Jennifer Lawrence, it happened
to her, like you don't want to be around too much.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
And I was just talking about that with somebody so far.
I mean, I'm not sick of them, you know what.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
I yeah, sure, because I get it.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
I don't know. I feel he's able to really transform
into any character that he is and sometimes, you know,
and the last of us, I feel like he carries
the show.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
Right, and he only did it for a season. See
maybe that was the smart play. Yeah, so that makes
total sense. I see what you're saying. And yeah, I'm
not sick of them either, and I don't I don't
want to be that guy's like I was sick of
him as like I just see it, like when I
seeing somebody everywhere. Yeah, I like, yeah, like because that
was that was Katy Perry. Katy Perry could do no wrong.
And how people like get off the stage and you
(15:08):
like feel bad because she's just trying to do her thing. Yeah,
you guys used to like her and then you saw
her too much. It's crazy. So yeah, I think that
was great. I loved the Johnny Storm crush, you know,
because they bill him as a bachelor, different from how
he was played in the past, which I liked because
(15:28):
in the past he was played a little bit more
playboy ish and we didn't see other time. We got
to see more of the brain behind Johnny, which I
thought was really cool.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
Yeah, Johnny, I feel was a good he was. He
was a good support system all around. But then he
had all of his little funny moments too. He he
wasn't you know, he was getting sort of rejected in
a way too, So yeah, a little. It wasn't like
he was like a bachelor macho who was just batting
(16:01):
off women, you know.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Yeah, No, like she was. She had no interest in him.
At one point, I swear to god, I heard her
and fly away and I was like, amazing, Cherry on top,
thank you Space Alien lady. No, it was it was great.
I love the way they did his special effects. The
flames looked like it was from the comic books, which
I thought was awesome because he could change it up
(16:23):
like that. He wasn't just a big Fireball.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Oh there's there's a moment where you know, they had
to talk about the fact that they wanted the baby
to save the earth. You know, they had to tell everybody. Yeah.
I was like, this is where a PR person is essential,
because you would never tell the world that.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Yeah, well their PR lady was there and she and
she was on the floor like, oh my god.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
No. I love the twist Man and how it reflects
the theme of family, right, because that's the theme. You've
got Challa Ball like silver Surface. Family was spared because
of her sacrifice, but she never gets to see them again,
so she's alone.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Right.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
You've got de Lactus who's living in this solitary life
with this unending you know, desire for food and you
know eating plan. It's this this crave that he has
and and it's a curse, right, and he's stuck with her,
so obviously they can't stand each other. That's pretty damn dysfunctional.
(17:30):
And and then you have the Fantastic Four family, which
is great. You know ratings who have real marital issues.
Johnny and Ben are are you know, like uncles that
tease each other. It's awesome, and it was it was real,
like good playing and teasing, and then they.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Talk about they have like the real family and then
the Chosen family.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
Yeah, exactly. So I think them coming out saying, hey,
we're not going to sacrifice our child, but we're not
going to sacrifice you to keep our child, you know,
bringing the planet together as we are all a family.
I mean, so precious. You're getting all of these positive
messages from these superhero movies for a reason because we
(18:12):
need them right now going on. We need people to
be brought together. We need people to see their humanity.
So it's more than just like hey, let's go shoot
that bad guy. Let's find ways to bring people together.
So I thought it was beautiful and having having Sue
deliver that speech was was was great. I mean what
a I mean, I love Vanessa Kirby, and I think
(18:35):
what a strong performance and to see her fighting for
her child was I was so moved by that.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Yeah, especially in the final moment where she's fighting for
her child and just giving everything she has like true
mama bear and just like right like everything, all the
energy she has, even if it means that she might.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Die, Yeah, even though she's going to stroke out, Yeah,
she is that she is fighting an intergalactic god for
her baby is amazing, and we all knew where it
was going, but we were there, we were rooting for anyway.
Speaker 2 (19:10):
Yeah, and in the end, I was just like, put
the baby on her, let's see the baby's powers.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
All right? Do you do you want to know about Franklin?
Speaker 2 (19:20):
Yeah? All right?
Speaker 1 (19:21):
So in the in the there's lots of different timelines
and multiverses and short stories and stuff that were done
that get reccon and get thrown out to get redone.
But in one of them, Franklin has this this cosmic energy, right,
the cosmic the power cosmic is what they call it.
But essentially it makes you godlike characters. So Silver Surfer
(19:41):
has a bit of it, and look how powerful they
are and they just have like a spec right, So
Franklin has that, But Franklin has the ability to kind
of create whatever he wants to create. So at one
point in the comic books, Galactus is killed, like Galactus
is going to eat another Earth, and the superheroes come
(20:02):
together and they kill Galactus in this big event. Right,
But here's the problem. Galactis is what prevents the universe
from over expanding. So he comes in and he eats
planets in order to create balance in the universe. So
when you don't have a galactus, you do not have
(20:22):
balance in the universe. And that's a big problem. There
must always be a galactus.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
It's like the spiders that keep all of the bugs
away in your house exactly.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
He doesn't want to do it, but he has to
do it. So Franklin becomes Galactus. He chooses to become Galactus.
He wipes himself of memory that he was ever Franklin Richards.
He grows into the size of Galactus, and then he
goes and eats planets.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
And and Sue have ultimate.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
So sad. Yeah, And so then Read and Sue live
out the rest of their lives knowing that they killed Galactus,
only to lose their son to become the thing they destroyed.
So yeah, super super sad story, but little bit. Yeah,
but that's how powerful Franklin is. So you know, we'll
see what's going to happen. Because of the big spoiler
at the end of the movie. You have Victor von
(21:16):
Doom playing with playing with little Franklin, so obviously he's
going to use him for whatever his nefarious plans are.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
I had another thing that I noticed, and I was
wondering if you caught this when Reid was talking. He
was having a private moment with his son and he
was talking to him and he was saying to his
son that he's always been different. And I was thinking
about what he was saying, and I was like, are
they is he like suggesting that ried is neurodivergent.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
I was getting that feeling too, I mean, as any
as any I'm at the point now, you know, my
son's on the spectrum and I'm about ready to go
get the test because I'm like, I'm so weird. I'm
just not I'm not a normal guy. And so I'm
just like, yeah, I'm probably gonna go do it and
just find out.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
But yeah, I was picking that up too. He's like,
I don't think the same way, and I've always been
so and that's how you feel. So I think I
think that's pretty accurate.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
Yeah, And it was. It was just very subtle, but
I was like.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
I noticed it, you know, I like that little authenticity. Yeah,
and then he put a button on it, if you
happen to be a space gud, I would like to
know if you were a space guy. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
I got to.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
It's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
There's something though that visually was bugging me, and I
wonder if you do this so and I don't know
if this is something that guys do, but at one
point Reid had his tie tucked into one of No,
it's like that's a thing.
Speaker 1 (22:46):
Yeah, working in the working in a lab. Like if
you had any teachers, if you had any shop teachers
from my generation who were from the fifties and sixties,
and they're like, all right, we're gonna go work the
wood build to and so they don't get hot and
drilling today. Yeah, they put their they tuck their tie
in their shirts so they don't get.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
That is such a cool detail.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's just a throwback thing. But yeah, yeah,
you don't see because everything I mean, when I think
of guys my age when I was younger, they were
all in suits, you know, they all had buttoned down
shirts with ties. And then I was talking to a
guy my age the other day. He was wearing like
a Metallica T shirt, you know, and I was wearing
(23:29):
i don't know, like a Mountain Dew T shirt. And
I'm like, you know, here we are, look at look
at compared to what we're supposed to be respectable adults.
We realized that, right, Yeah, so it's just like there's
a little bit of fashion that's been lost there, I
guess over over the over the generations. But yeah, that's
what that was.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
And then the other thing they thought was kind of
interesting is that he was using a chalkboard, even though
they have all this technology. And I was like, I
think it's because it looks really dramatic when you figure
out a formula, you know, a chalkboard's just way more drim.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
It's tactough man, right, because you get to put in
the sound effects of the chalk scraping on the blackboard,
where if you're on a giant race board, what it's squeaky. Yeah,
like that's annoying. And then you get the you get
the stretch his arm out and wipe it off. And yeah,
I think the chalkboard thing was cool and it did
lend itself to the sixties and Tony's thing was the hologram, right,
(24:22):
so you kind of show the opposite there by giving
them a chalkboard, and I just love that. I hope
we get to see a scene where read in some
version of Tony get to interact because there's so different characters,
but they're both so very intelligent that I think they're
both such great actors that you could really, you could
really see them playing that scene. So I hope to
(24:44):
find something like that. Yeah, in one of the futures,
it's got to be brother.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
It would be an interesting pair up in the future.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
I mean, I have to ask you, what do you
think about the rock Beard.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
I don't know. I felt weird about it.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Like I've never seen that before and I've read like
lots of the books.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
It was like I had an uncomfortable feeling about it,
Like you know how some people have was it culture cophobia?
They don't like the holes orre I kind of think
I feel like how they might feel about it.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Right, So does he have like spikes coming out of
his armpits?
Speaker 2 (25:15):
Then?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Like, how does this look?
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Let's just stop right there, Okay, we'll stop. Let's stop
at the upper body, We'll.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Stop at the mine. Don't let the mind under your guys. Yeah,
that's hilarious. No, but I think I was. I was
really pleasantly surprised at how incredibly subtle it was. I
would say, if anything was all underplayed, which was which
was really nice because it gave it that, hey, this
(25:42):
feels like a real family thing, whereas before, you know,
it's been it's been more comedic, it's been more like chopstick,
and this is like, no, man, let's just settle in
and enjoy this light drama.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Yeah, so it's surprising that someone described it as campy.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Yeah, I'm people hate on purpose and then try and
get things to start like going viral so they can
have attention. But sure, I have no interest in that.
I want to just talk about the film, and yeah,
the themes were great that I didn't really see a
lot of visual subtext. Did you see anything that really
leaped out at you? I mean outside of like Galactus's
(26:21):
eyes being like, hey, this is his power bar. You know,
his eyes light up, so you know he's fully powered.
And then when Sue was going at him, you start
to see his eyes flicker, so that's telling you like, Okay,
she's really messing him up. Outside of that, I really
wasn't you know, I wasn't seeing too much there that
was probably by design.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
I can't think of anything offhand. I'm sure I'll do
something later, but.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
I mean I'm sure the director could have done. I
mean the director I just did a great job. I'll
tell you about him. His name is Matt Shackman and
he comes from TV man. I was like, this is
this big like feature breakout put that guy?
Speaker 2 (27:00):
What's his show that everybody? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (27:02):
You ready, I'm gonna hit you with it? All right?
So he's done wan division Okay, No, it gets better.
He did he did the great He did Game of Throne.
What Yeah, he did It's Always Sonny. This guy has
been around.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
How many seasons?
Speaker 1 (27:19):
He did forty three episodes on It's Always Sonny in Philadelphia.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Wow, that's a comedy.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Yeah, he did Succession the Boys, the guys you know
these TV directors. Yeah, these TV directors they get around
when they start getting on shows like that, and that's
I mean, the guy's got a set of skills. And
then to come and bring all that into you know,
because when you're a TV director, you're a chameleon. You
have to be able to go through and what's the
(27:44):
vision for this show and then copy that vision and
then try and put something else that you can put
into it without it being you know, cut. And then
to come in and to do something like this, It's impressive.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Yeah, no, I really enjoyed this film, like I wasn't.
I was gonna see it, but I wasn't like, oh
I can't wait, And actually I would go see it again.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
I would too, man, I mean it had I mean
it had Herbie in it. I was like brand Herbie
the Robot. Oh so Herbie the Robot was not a
comic book character. No, no, he So the fantastic for
TV show that came out when I was a kid
did not have Johnny in it had Herbie the Robot
because the cartoon network was not the cartoon. The network
(28:31):
itself that put it out was worried that kids were
going to set themselves on fire because they think we're stupid,
and that kids are going to set themselves on fire
to be the human torch, which no kid would have done.
But whatever, I don't on a TV show. Okay, it's
a few, A small percentage of kids might have done.
It was Generation X, we were crazy, so it is possible.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
Probably a good choice, I'll give you that.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
So they did it with Herbie. So you know, I
grew up I thought Herbie was the cutest robot and
so then to see him in this movie and they
brought him back.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
It was so when he saw when he saw Glack
this coming, I was just like, oh, he's like, I
can't do anything. We come on do something.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
I know. It was so sad, but but super adorable.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Man.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
I mean when I saw when I saw Herbie putting
the putting the baby the cradle together, that.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Was so cool.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
All right, is there anything else that got you said?
I think it's pretty good. I think the midag point
was definitely the birth scene. I think that was all
rather dramatic. I I get it. I wasn't like, do
we have to be here doing this moment? No, but
you know it was. It was a creative decision.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
I think the resurrection and the death and resurrection at
the end of Sue was awesome. I mean, that's that's
that's classic storytelling, you know, bringing.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
Silver Surfer coming in at the end to.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Right, and I mean, like we all, I don't know,
I don't want to speak for you, but I feel
like we all saw that coming. No one was convinced
that Johnny was going out that way.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
I love that. That was his arc though, is that
he mans up to do it?
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (30:08):
And then they and then they bring shall Ball in
there to get it done. It all makes sense. So
watching the film, I didn't feel like there was a
lot of surprises coming. No, but you know, at the
same time, I appreciated it.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Yeah, exactly, because you sometimes when you don't get the
thing that you expect, you're like, well, yeah, I did
want that thing.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
I was hoping for a bit of subversion. I mean
I was hoping like, Okay, are they going to twist
this and change this to the unexpected? And I think
what they did with the marketing to make up for
that is in the marketing, you think that everyone on
Earth dies and then the Fantastic Four flies out and
ends up on our realm because of how the ending
(30:50):
of Thunderbolts is. Right at the end of Thunderbolts, they
show up. So the marketing was positioned in a way
that you think everything is going to go to hell.
So I think that helped a little bit. But yeah,
I mean in general, I mean where you think the
movie's going, it's going, And I'm okay with that because
it is so grounded.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
Yeah, and sometimes you just need to have films like that.
Not everything has to be like, oh, what a.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Twist yeah, not everything has to be a heady art film. Yeah,
I got you, man, Sometimes you just want some good
old comfort. Any any final thoughts, Katie.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
I enjoyed the film, and I'm glad that you pushed
me to go see it.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Hey, I only stayed for one post credits scene? Was
there another one?
Speaker 2 (31:36):
I stayed for one too. I read on time that
there were two.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
All right, we met, I mean I had to listen.
I bound an entire bottle of water and a good
old popcorns. Yeah, there was no sitting around.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
I kind of I read that. I don't know if
there was a second one, but it said that there
was the mid post credits, which were the important ones,
and then like a light hearted thing, it sounded like, okay,
so just like a little like maybe people listening and
can tell us what we.
Speaker 1 (32:05):
Missed, you know, yeah, comment below and let us know
what we missed and save us like five bucks from
going to the theater, well more like twenty five bucks
if you're gonna get like popcorn.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
And stuff and you have to yeah mandatory.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
Hey, if this episode helped you out, share it with
a writer who needs it. And if you haven't yet,
follow and leave a quick rating. It helps more screenwriters
like you find the show. Finally, you can also connect
with me on Instagram at screenwriter Pod. Thanks again for listening,
keep writing,
Stuck in Act two, not sure if that twist actually works,
or maybe your characters are just fine. That's where Virtual
Jeffrey comes in. He's a screenwriting assistant we've trained to
help you workshop scenes, fixed pacing, punch up dialogue, or
just get on stuck. If you're a member of the
successful sprint Edder, you've already got access. If not, it
(00:21):
might be time to level up. All right, welcome to
the podcast. I'm so excited to have a friend of
the show, Katie Presto, Thanks for being on with us.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Thanks for having me Jeffrey.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Oh man, it's been a while, so glad to have
you back. You have been missed, my dear, oh thank you.
All right, So she reluctantly agreed to watch.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
I was gonna go see it.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
All right, So we watched Fantastic Four. A ton of
spoilers here, guys, So if you haven't watched it yet
or your plan on watching it, you know, come back
to this episode. But we are going to definitely break
down some of the stuff we saw. I mean, what
are your first thoughts on the Fantastic Four.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I really loved the movie as a whole, especially the
sixties theme, like the set design that was really cool.
I was like, I want that in my health and
that in my house.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I agree with you. The set pieces and the and
the design of the show was incredible. Yeah, you know.
One of the things I like to go and see
what other other people are saying, not so that I
become contrarian, but just so that I could just get
a feel of what the vibes are. And I'm hearing
(01:31):
people review it as campy, and I'm like, you're way off.
This is not camp This is called world building. That's
what they did is they created this what feels like
a real sixties sci fi future city that is that
way because Reid Richards is a super genius and a
(01:52):
different way than Tony Stark is and and help kind
of create that that that that world, right, So, I
mean it just feels like like a real place that
you could be living in. This is at camp.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
And it kind of made sense using that time that
decade because that was sort of when the Space Race
was happening and all that. So it kind of melded
the two futuristic and then the things that actually were
going on at that time in our world together. No.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
I think it's great. I mean, they're playing giving homage
to really the birth of the Fantastic Four, which was
in the sixties, Golden Age era of comics. I think
it's great. I have to confess that I have been
a fan of the thing since I was little. I've
always always loved the thing. And to see how he
(02:43):
is so accurate and well played.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
And I was going to talk to you about that
because I heard before I saw the film a lot
of people like, oh, I don't like the way he
looks and all this, and I was like, looking at
the comics, he looks pretty close to what they had
in the in the original comics, I thought.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
I mean in the books, you know, he's got these
baby blue eyes, and the books that are so soulful
that they really pop, and they always highlight with the
orange rock that he has. And so you can see
when you look at Ben Graham the thing that you
can see this as a man of the beautiful heart,
suffering behind this hard shell which is manifested through the
(03:23):
rock in his body. And they were selling this of
that in the movie without overplaying. Why I thought it
was interesting is because when you bring in that character
to a film like this, the desire is to really
want to show that lost soul craving connection, right, and
so it's so easy to ham that up right, And
(03:46):
in the early iterations it was kind of hammed up.
But here instead of you know, really showing that, we're
four years later, so he's had time to process it, right.
It's not the original incarnation of him dealing with this curse,
which is one of the subtle themes of the film.
(04:07):
He's coming to accept it. So when he has this
little talk with Reed, he has his heart to Harley,
it's not your fault, man to have that moment. And
then to show him just in scenes where he's walking
down the street at night by himself, this giant, hulking creature,
and you see those sad blue eyes, and then he's
(04:29):
wearing a suit because he's trying to look normal. I mean,
it's chef's kiss. It's beautiful, it's solemn, it's sad, but
there's heart there. And then to bring Natasha Leone in
as a potential interest was amazing.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Yes, and I feel like they would make a good
couple just their personality.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
It was a surprise to me because in the comic
books the thing ends up dating a blind girl, and
he falls in love with her, and because she can't
see him so and she sees Ben for who he
really is, which is this big old teddy bear. And
then there's a big shock that, you know, he's this giant,
hulking rock man. But but to bring her in and
(05:10):
to see beyond it, you know.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
And yeah, and I liked that they didn't harp fun
you know, oh, like she's with other men who look
more normal than me, or you know what I mean.
Like it was she accepted him right away, and and
it just it wasn't too much of the oh poor
me kind of thing like you said it was. He
had already gone through that face.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
It was like a subtle little love soap opera going
on in the background. This is kind of cool for
r you know, a superhero film. So that's my little thing.
I've always loved the thing because he's he just has heart,
and we got to see that instead of, you know,
the annoying, irritated guy trapped in rock we get to
(05:55):
see different aspects of him not brought to not brought
to the to the films in the past. So I
love the theme of that. And then the fact that
there's a little bit of a of a of a
of a theme of curse there with him and then everybody,
including with that bleeding into you know Johnny who's like
(06:18):
terminally single, right, and that's a little bit of discuss
and then Read right, you could say his is that
he is a brilliant man that gets stuff wrong. And
that is amazing because like, when have you seen that
really played out? Usually when they're the Tony Starts, they're
super smart and everything always goes right.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Yeah, yeah, I mean I like that it was more
grounded in reality. You know that they're fallible.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Like I thought it was great and it made me
as a parent in seeing Read and Sue fighting over
their baby.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Yeah man, and to see.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Yeah, I was like, that's that's really well written. There's
subtlety there, and they love each other and you can
tell that they love each other, but they're still hurting
each other and it's not on purpose. It's not malicious, right,
I mean, that's real relationship. I mean it was written like, wow,
these people get it.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
You know that part. I'm specifically thinking about a part
where they have a conversation and I was like, this
is a conversation I've had, you know, this is absolutistic, and.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
I hate the term. I hate to use the term
female rage right because coming from a guy doesn't sound right.
But I really feel that there's this argument that him
and Sue are having where he's already admitted his faults
and his flaws and the dark places he allows his
mind to go, which you know is aligned for her,
(07:48):
and he goes there anyway, and she gets pissed off,
and he's trying to apologize, and she's getting more pissed
because like she's she's accepted what it is and we
want to stop talking about it, but he won't stop
because he's obsessing over it. And she gets so pissed
she blows up and disappears and is like, yes, I
have seen that happen in real life. Usually it's a
(08:11):
door slamming. So yeah, it's just I do know some
of the most realistic writing I've seen Dialogue.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
Think so too. Yeah, I agree, And I also like
that it's sort of a standalone like you don't need
a whole lot of there's no real background that you need.
You can kind of just jump right in, so you
don't have to watch like twenty five films to be
like Okay, I understand this film.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
No, you're absolutely right. And the way they introduce it
is great because you get this really like this series
of shots that they open after about five minutes of
really newsreels. Well, it wasn't really newsreels. It was the
introduction in the talk show. Then using that as a
gimmick to bring in a bunch of newsreels to recap
the Fantastic for I thought was a great in. Yeah,
(08:58):
and bringing in one of them my favorite crap villains
from The Fantastic Four was a mole man played by
Paul Walter Hauser, which was like brilliant casting. I couldn't
believe it because again, that's another character that you could
bring in who is super cheesy with the stupid glasses
and the inferior complex inferiorready complex, but coming in and
(09:22):
then you just make him snarky and you just give
him a little bit of that. You know, I don't
like Read because Read is so smart, so I.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Think I would have liked to see a little bit
more of him.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Yeah, yeah, he's great. He's so great, So I thought
it was cool we got to bring that in and
and see more of that.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
What did you think about Julia Garner as silver Surfer,
so not in.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
It as much as I had hope. Right, Yeah, that
was the thing is they did a lot of like
a lot of the casting in this was like Pedro
Pascal is huge, Let's make him read Richards. We all
Evan Moss Backrock has done this incredible job. Let's bring
him in his Ben Gram. And so when you see
like Julia Garner was huge and the Ozarks, let's make
(10:09):
her silver server. So when you see these things step back,
you're like, oh, they're just casting the most popular people
that have the most heat Hollywood. And then so I
sit down and I think, well, you know what's going
to happen here, And then they all delivered, and I
was like, holy crap, this was actually like really good casting.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
This wasn't just Trump, who I would have thought, like,
that's not my first thought for that character, but yeah,
it was. I thought she did a really good job
with it.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
I thought it was great. I mean, you know, again,
not a lot of time in the film, so when
you get somebody in there, but you know, her delivery
about Harold and Harolding and Galactus harolding and your end
and giving this this this almost sympathetic delivery to the speech.
(10:57):
You know, I think she sold it. I think you
could really see it in her eyes, which I thought
was really cool. Really giving that away and then giving
her own little arc. It makes you want more from
the character and you can never go wrong from that. Yeah,
so I would love to see some more shallow ball,
but I hate for them to be like, let's do
a shallaball TV show, Like I don't need that.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Yeah, who don't need to go that far?
Speaker 1 (11:21):
Just give me a little bit more, because I mean,
she is a godlike character. Yeah, so it's hard to
work around that. Like at one point, Silver Surfer lived
on Earth and flew around Earth solving crimes, and you're like,
I mean this is like what are you doing? Yeah,
we don't need this, Yeah we got a spider Man.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
What did you What did you think about her having
the baby in space? I was like when he when
he said he said something about you need gravity to
push the baby out, and it just stuck and I
was like I thought about it for twenty minutes. I
was like, you do. I don't think you do. And
then I was sort of distracted by like whether or
(12:01):
not you could or couldn't push it bit.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
So that was a I'd say for me on the film,
that was the weakest part. But then I understand why
they're doing it because quote, the Fantastic Four was birthed
in space, because that's why they got the cosmic race.
So it makes sense thematically to have the baby birth
in space. Like, I get it, I get what led
them there. In the writer's room, yeah, I think though,
(12:24):
you gotta have gravity. So my thing with Reid is
they're always trying to show in subtle ways how he's
so smart. And one of the cool things about Reid
Richards' ability is he can constantly increase his intelligence. So
like Tony is this smart, and Tony's always going to
be this smart Tony Stark, He's not going to be
smarter than that. Reid is the smartest man in the
(12:47):
universe because his power is plasticity, and your brain's intelligence
is dependent on how many folds do you have in
your brain, So when Reid can't figure out a problem,
he creates more folds in his brain until he solves
the problem. We're not going to show that. It's going
to look stupid, right, We're not gonna watch them all.
(13:07):
Let me just create some more folds. Hey, I got
the answer. So I think what they're trying to do
there is they're trying to show him multitask at the
same time. So he's trying to slingshot around this black
hole star and at the same time create gravity for
his wife to give birth. So he does them both,
like literally at the same time. So it's just showing
you how smart he is because we you know, he
(13:30):
has machines he's made, and we're just supposed to accept
that he's made all these machines like this, you know,
CT scanner and things like that, but we're not really
watching him show off his wits and his smarts. In
that moment, we get to see it, and I thought
that makes sense.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
Yeah, that makes sense and why they chose to kind
of add that in there. But I was just thinking,
don't let Katie Perry see this movie. You don't need
any ideas.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
That's hilarious and it would and it would of course
bomb social media because everyone's going after her because she
has too much exposure. Yeah, it's this weird bell curve
of exposure. Like I would be worried about Pedro Pascal
because he's had so much exposure that I'm concerned that eventually,
you know, the audience people are going to turn against
(14:19):
him becau they've seen him too much. I mean, because
he watched it happen to everybody. Jennifer Lawrence, it happened
to her, like you don't want to be around too much.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
And I was just talking about that with somebody so far.
I mean, I'm not sick of them, you know what.
Speaker 1 (14:31):
I yeah, sure, because I get it.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
I don't know. I feel he's able to really transform
into any character that he is and sometimes, you know,
and the last of us, I feel like he carries
the show.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
Right, and he only did it for a season. See
maybe that was the smart play. Yeah, so that makes
total sense. I see what you're saying. And yeah, I'm
not sick of them either, and I don't I don't
want to be that guy's like I was sick of
him as like I just see it, like when I
seeing somebody everywhere. Yeah, I like, yeah, like because that
was that was Katy Perry. Katy Perry could do no wrong.
And how people like get off the stage and you
(15:08):
like feel bad because she's just trying to do her thing. Yeah,
you guys used to like her and then you saw
her too much. It's crazy. So yeah, I think that
was great. I loved the Johnny Storm crush, you know,
because they bill him as a bachelor, different from how
he was played in the past, which I liked because
(15:28):
in the past he was played a little bit more
playboy ish and we didn't see other time. We got
to see more of the brain behind Johnny, which I
thought was really cool.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
Yeah, Johnny, I feel was a good he was. He
was a good support system all around. But then he
had all of his little funny moments too. He he
wasn't you know, he was getting sort of rejected in
a way too, So yeah, a little. It wasn't like
he was like a bachelor macho who was just batting
(16:01):
off women, you know.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Yeah, No, like she was. She had no interest in him.
At one point, I swear to god, I heard her
and fly away and I was like, amazing, Cherry on top,
thank you Space Alien lady. No, it was it was great.
I love the way they did his special effects. The
flames looked like it was from the comic books, which
I thought was awesome because he could change it up
(16:23):
like that. He wasn't just a big Fireball.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Oh there's there's a moment where you know, they had
to talk about the fact that they wanted the baby
to save the earth. You know, they had to tell everybody. Yeah.
I was like, this is where a PR person is essential,
because you would never tell the world that.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Yeah, well their PR lady was there and she and
she was on the floor like, oh my god.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
No. I love the twist Man and how it reflects
the theme of family, right, because that's the theme. You've
got Challa Ball like silver Surface. Family was spared because
of her sacrifice, but she never gets to see them again,
so she's alone.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Right.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
You've got de Lactus who's living in this solitary life
with this unending you know, desire for food and you
know eating plan. It's this this crave that he has
and and it's a curse, right, and he's stuck with her,
so obviously they can't stand each other. That's pretty damn dysfunctional.
(17:30):
And and then you have the Fantastic Four family, which
is great. You know ratings who have real marital issues.
Johnny and Ben are are you know, like uncles that
tease each other. It's awesome, and it was it was real,
like good playing and teasing, and then they.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Talk about they have like the real family and then
the Chosen family.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
Yeah, exactly. So I think them coming out saying, hey,
we're not going to sacrifice our child, but we're not
going to sacrifice you to keep our child, you know,
bringing the planet together as we are all a family.
I mean, so precious. You're getting all of these positive
messages from these superhero movies for a reason because we
(18:12):
need them right now going on. We need people to
be brought together. We need people to see their humanity.
So it's more than just like hey, let's go shoot
that bad guy. Let's find ways to bring people together.
So I thought it was beautiful and having having Sue
deliver that speech was was was great. I mean what
a I mean, I love Vanessa Kirby, and I think
(18:35):
what a strong performance and to see her fighting for
her child was I was so moved by that.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Yeah, especially in the final moment where she's fighting for
her child and just giving everything she has like true
mama bear and just like right like everything, all the
energy she has, even if it means that she might.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
Die, Yeah, even though she's going to stroke out, Yeah,
she is that she is fighting an intergalactic god for
her baby is amazing, and we all knew where it
was going, but we were there, we were rooting for anyway.
Speaker 2 (19:10):
Yeah, and in the end, I was just like, put
the baby on her, let's see the baby's powers.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
All right? Do you do you want to know about Franklin?
Speaker 2 (19:20):
Yeah? All right?
Speaker 1 (19:21):
So in the in the there's lots of different timelines
and multiverses and short stories and stuff that were done
that get reccon and get thrown out to get redone.
But in one of them, Franklin has this this cosmic energy, right,
the cosmic the power cosmic is what they call it.
But essentially it makes you godlike characters. So Silver Surfer
(19:41):
has a bit of it, and look how powerful they
are and they just have like a spec right, So
Franklin has that, But Franklin has the ability to kind
of create whatever he wants to create. So at one
point in the comic books, Galactus is killed, like Galactus
is going to eat another Earth, and the superheroes come
(20:02):
together and they kill Galactus in this big event. Right,
But here's the problem. Galactis is what prevents the universe
from over expanding. So he comes in and he eats
planets in order to create balance in the universe. So
when you don't have a galactus, you do not have
(20:22):
balance in the universe. And that's a big problem. There
must always be a galactus.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
It's like the spiders that keep all of the bugs
away in your house exactly.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
He doesn't want to do it, but he has to
do it. So Franklin becomes Galactus. He chooses to become Galactus.
He wipes himself of memory that he was ever Franklin Richards.
He grows into the size of Galactus, and then he
goes and eats planets.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
And and Sue have ultimate.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
So sad. Yeah, And so then Read and Sue live
out the rest of their lives knowing that they killed Galactus,
only to lose their son to become the thing they destroyed.
So yeah, super super sad story, but little bit. Yeah,
but that's how powerful Franklin is. So you know, we'll
see what's going to happen. Because of the big spoiler
at the end of the movie. You have Victor von
(21:16):
Doom playing with playing with little Franklin, so obviously he's
going to use him for whatever his nefarious plans are.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
I had another thing that I noticed, and I was
wondering if you caught this when Reid was talking. He
was having a private moment with his son and he
was talking to him and he was saying to his
son that he's always been different. And I was thinking
about what he was saying, and I was like, are
they is he like suggesting that ried is neurodivergent.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
I was getting that feeling too, I mean, as any
as any I'm at the point now, you know, my
son's on the spectrum and I'm about ready to go
get the test because I'm like, I'm so weird. I'm
just not I'm not a normal guy. And so I'm
just like, yeah, I'm probably gonna go do it and
just find out.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
But yeah, I was picking that up too. He's like,
I don't think the same way, and I've always been
so and that's how you feel. So I think I
think that's pretty accurate.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
Yeah, And it was. It was just very subtle, but
I was like.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
I noticed it, you know, I like that little authenticity. Yeah,
and then he put a button on it, if you
happen to be a space gud, I would like to
know if you were a space guy. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
I got to.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
It's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
There's something though that visually was bugging me, and I
wonder if you do this so and I don't know
if this is something that guys do, but at one
point Reid had his tie tucked into one of No,
it's like that's a thing.
Speaker 1 (22:46):
Yeah, working in the working in a lab. Like if
you had any teachers, if you had any shop teachers
from my generation who were from the fifties and sixties,
and they're like, all right, we're gonna go work the
wood build to and so they don't get hot and
drilling today. Yeah, they put their they tuck their tie
in their shirts so they don't get.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
That is such a cool detail.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's just a throwback thing. But yeah, yeah,
you don't see because everything I mean, when I think
of guys my age when I was younger, they were
all in suits, you know, they all had buttoned down
shirts with ties. And then I was talking to a
guy my age the other day. He was wearing like
a Metallica T shirt, you know, and I was wearing
(23:29):
i don't know, like a Mountain Dew T shirt. And
I'm like, you know, here we are, look at look
at compared to what we're supposed to be respectable adults.
We realized that, right, Yeah, so it's just like there's
a little bit of fashion that's been lost there, I
guess over over the over the generations. But yeah, that's
what that was.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
And then the other thing they thought was kind of
interesting is that he was using a chalkboard, even though
they have all this technology. And I was like, I
think it's because it looks really dramatic when you figure
out a formula, you know, a chalkboard's just way more drim.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
It's tactough man, right, because you get to put in
the sound effects of the chalk scraping on the blackboard,
where if you're on a giant race board, what it's squeaky. Yeah,
like that's annoying. And then you get the you get
the stretch his arm out and wipe it off. And yeah,
I think the chalkboard thing was cool and it did
lend itself to the sixties and Tony's thing was the hologram, right,
(24:22):
so you kind of show the opposite there by giving
them a chalkboard, and I just love that. I hope
we get to see a scene where read in some
version of Tony get to interact because there's so different characters,
but they're both so very intelligent that I think they're
both such great actors that you could really, you could
really see them playing that scene. So I hope to
(24:44):
find something like that. Yeah, in one of the futures,
it's got to be brother.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
It would be an interesting pair up in the future.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
I mean, I have to ask you, what do you
think about the rock Beard.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
I don't know. I felt weird about it.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Like I've never seen that before and I've read like
lots of the books.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
It was like I had an uncomfortable feeling about it,
Like you know how some people have was it culture cophobia?
They don't like the holes orre I kind of think
I feel like how they might feel about it.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Right, So does he have like spikes coming out of
his armpits?
Speaker 2 (25:15):
Then?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Like, how does this look?
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Let's just stop right there, Okay, we'll stop. Let's stop
at the upper body, We'll.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Stop at the mine. Don't let the mind under your guys. Yeah,
that's hilarious. No, but I think I was. I was
really pleasantly surprised at how incredibly subtle it was. I
would say, if anything was all underplayed, which was which
was really nice because it gave it that, hey, this
(25:42):
feels like a real family thing, whereas before, you know,
it's been it's been more comedic, it's been more like chopstick,
and this is like, no, man, let's just settle in
and enjoy this light drama.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Yeah, so it's surprising that someone described it as campy.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Yeah, I'm people hate on purpose and then try and
get things to start like going viral so they can
have attention. But sure, I have no interest in that.
I want to just talk about the film, and yeah,
the themes were great that I didn't really see a
lot of visual subtext. Did you see anything that really
leaped out at you? I mean outside of like Galactus's
(26:21):
eyes being like, hey, this is his power bar. You know,
his eyes light up, so you know he's fully powered.
And then when Sue was going at him, you start
to see his eyes flicker, so that's telling you like, Okay,
she's really messing him up. Outside of that, I really
wasn't you know, I wasn't seeing too much there that
was probably by design.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
I can't think of anything offhand. I'm sure I'll do
something later, but.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
I mean I'm sure the director could have done. I
mean the director I just did a great job. I'll
tell you about him. His name is Matt Shackman and
he comes from TV man. I was like, this is
this big like feature breakout put that guy?
Speaker 2 (27:00):
What's his show that everybody? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (27:02):
You ready, I'm gonna hit you with it? All right?
So he's done wan division Okay, No, it gets better.
He did he did the great He did Game of Throne.
What Yeah, he did It's Always Sonny. This guy has
been around.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
How many seasons?
Speaker 1 (27:19):
He did forty three episodes on It's Always Sonny in Philadelphia.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Wow, that's a comedy.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Yeah, he did Succession the Boys, the guys you know
these TV directors. Yeah, these TV directors they get around
when they start getting on shows like that, and that's
I mean, the guy's got a set of skills. And
then to come and bring all that into you know,
because when you're a TV director, you're a chameleon. You
have to be able to go through and what's the
(27:44):
vision for this show and then copy that vision and
then try and put something else that you can put
into it without it being you know, cut. And then
to come in and to do something like this, It's impressive.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Yeah, no, I really enjoyed this film, like I wasn't.
I was gonna see it, but I wasn't like, oh
I can't wait, And actually I would go see it again.
Speaker 1 (28:07):
I would too, man, I mean it had I mean
it had Herbie in it. I was like brand Herbie
the Robot. Oh so Herbie the Robot was not a
comic book character. No, no, he So the fantastic for
TV show that came out when I was a kid
did not have Johnny in it had Herbie the Robot
because the cartoon network was not the cartoon. The network
(28:31):
itself that put it out was worried that kids were
going to set themselves on fire because they think we're stupid,
and that kids are going to set themselves on fire
to be the human torch, which no kid would have done.
But whatever, I don't on a TV show. Okay, it's
a few, A small percentage of kids might have done.
It was Generation X, we were crazy, so it is possible.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
Probably a good choice, I'll give you that.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
So they did it with Herbie. So you know, I
grew up I thought Herbie was the cutest robot and
so then to see him in this movie and they
brought him back.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
It was so when he saw when he saw Glack
this coming, I was just like, oh, he's like, I
can't do anything. We come on do something.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
I know. It was so sad, but but super adorable.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Man.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
I mean when I saw when I saw Herbie putting
the putting the baby the cradle together, that.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Was so cool.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
All right, is there anything else that got you said?
I think it's pretty good. I think the midag point
was definitely the birth scene. I think that was all
rather dramatic. I I get it. I wasn't like, do
we have to be here doing this moment? No, but
you know it was. It was a creative decision.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:43):
I think the resurrection and the death and resurrection at
the end of Sue was awesome. I mean, that's that's
that's classic storytelling, you know, bringing.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
Silver Surfer coming in at the end to.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Right, and I mean, like we all, I don't know,
I don't want to speak for you, but I feel
like we all saw that coming. No one was convinced
that Johnny was going out that way.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
I love that. That was his arc though, is that
he mans up to do it?
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (30:08):
And then they and then they bring shall Ball in
there to get it done. It all makes sense. So
watching the film, I didn't feel like there was a
lot of surprises coming. No, but you know, at the
same time, I appreciated it.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Yeah, exactly, because you sometimes when you don't get the
thing that you expect, you're like, well, yeah, I did
want that thing.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
I was hoping for a bit of subversion. I mean
I was hoping like, Okay, are they going to twist
this and change this to the unexpected? And I think
what they did with the marketing to make up for
that is in the marketing, you think that everyone on
Earth dies and then the Fantastic Four flies out and
ends up on our realm because of how the ending
(30:50):
of Thunderbolts is. Right at the end of Thunderbolts, they
show up. So the marketing was positioned in a way
that you think everything is going to go to hell.
So I think that helped a little bit. But yeah,
I mean in general, I mean where you think the
movie's going, it's going, And I'm okay with that because
it is so grounded.
Speaker 2 (31:10):
Yeah, and sometimes you just need to have films like that.
Not everything has to be like, oh, what a.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Twist yeah, not everything has to be a heady art film. Yeah,
I got you, man, Sometimes you just want some good
old comfort. Any any final thoughts, Katie.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
I enjoyed the film, and I'm glad that you pushed
me to go see it.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Hey, I only stayed for one post credits scene? Was
there another one?
Speaker 2 (31:36):
I stayed for one too. I read on time that
there were two.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
All right, we met, I mean I had to listen.
I bound an entire bottle of water and a good
old popcorns. Yeah, there was no sitting around.
Speaker 2 (31:50):
I kind of I read that. I don't know if
there was a second one, but it said that there
was the mid post credits, which were the important ones,
and then like a light hearted thing, it sounded like, okay,
so just like a little like maybe people listening and
can tell us what we.
Speaker 1 (32:05):
Missed, you know, yeah, comment below and let us know
what we missed and save us like five bucks from
going to the theater, well more like twenty five bucks
if you're gonna get like popcorn.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
And stuff and you have to yeah mandatory.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
Hey, if this episode helped you out, share it with
a writer who needs it. And if you haven't yet,
follow and leave a quick rating. It helps more screenwriters
like you find the show. Finally, you can also connect
with me on Instagram at screenwriter Pod. Thanks again for listening,
keep writing,
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