Back To Life, Back To Reality

Episode Transcript
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Christian Young (00:18):
all rise.
The pod is now a session.
Welcome back to another episodeof the Supreme Court of
Basketball podcast.
Me and the fellas back foranother episode here.
New year, same us, we back yo.

Henri Taylor (00:31):
We back.
We're back in the center, let'sget to it.
Shit, you know.

You're welcome.
Shit, yeah For real shit.

Y'all get to peer into our everyday conversations
and shit that we do, like itain't even you know it's.
It's the shit that we do.

Robaire Taylor (00:43):
It's a show technically At the end of the
day, two of us being Laker fans.
What's going on?
I'm going to take that victoryany way I can.
Lakers against Golden State.
We pulled out a victory on aSaturday night.
What do you guys think about it?
And San.

Fran, I guess, got a good road victory, a solid
road victory last night, yeahfor sure.

I think it's interesting because we still
they're starting to play alittle better, I think, as the
trade deadline is getting closer.
It's still kind of like whatexactly are we?
And then you got AD coming outbasically begging for another
big, like hey, I'm not gettingoff that horse, so it'll be
interesting to see how they playthat.
But just from the game itself,the fact that they beat the

(01:29):
Warriors, you know it didn'thurt their staff Only had 13
points shot, you know, fairlyterrible from the field, so that
that made it a little biteasier for us.
But a win is a win, especiallyin the West.
It's interesting because everygame you can literally go from
third or fourth place to play inin a couple of games.
So you really just don't havethat room for error.
So any time they can get a win,especially on the road,

(01:50):
especially against the Warriors,I'm taking it.

Yeah, yeah, same here.
I think that you know these arestarting to be crucial games,
like you said, because it's socrucial to every game that you
can jump from.
We don't want to be in theplay-in, I'm tired of being in
the play-in.
I think that with LeBron andhis age, we don't need any extra
games if not necessary.
So you look at it right now, Ithink we can, if we keep things

(02:17):
up and start playing a littlebit better, playing better
defense, and we'll see if we'llmake a move.
You know, before the tradedeadline, which I don't know who
we would go for, I think it isgoing to be needed for the
playoffs, but I'll take this win, I'll take it and if we can
somehow, you know, compete andtake the take over from uh
denver I believe they're in thefourth spot I think we'd be okay

(02:39):
.
I just want to stay away fromthat bottom half to where we
have to be in the playoff to theplay-in, and you know I'll take
any victory that we can,because it's not often you see
Steph have an off night likethis and AD, I think for the
Lakers to be successful, he'sgoing to have to play like this.
You know, not necessarily 35 anight, but he has to be the one

(03:02):
putting up the shots.
Lebron James has to feed off ofhim the rest of the team.
Lebron James, you know he canfacilitate, but AD has to be
that guy moving forward if we'regoing to have a chance.
You know, and I think that youknow, I agree, the big man.
We do need it.
You know we shouldn't be inthis predicament.
I still say why not DwightHoward?
That's a conversation foranother time.

I think that would be great right now?
Yeah, definitely.
But the good news right now, asit stands in January, where we
are before the All-Star break,lakers are out of the play-in
picture.
They're clearly a playoff team.
You don't have to worry aboutthat at this point.
If the playoffs started today,they'd be in a good position to
have to worry about playinggames.

(03:49):
That's a bit of a plus.
They didn't run off three in arow, shit.
That's a hell of a start.
Going into All-Star weekend,which is the next two weekends
from now, I want to say I don'tknow.

There's something about the two-week
game's difference from the playbeing in the playoffs.
In the play it is a tight race.

But I'm just saying right now, if the playoff
started today, the Lakers areout of.
You know, don't have to worryabout a playing game, they'd be
clear.

I mean actually yeah, yeah, just keeping the
momentum.
One you you got to get, it wasnice to see, you know.
And then one you got to get, itwas nice to see Max Christie
contribute again.
They gave the kid money.
We all thought, okay, not a badidea Trying to get him more
involved.
Dalton Connect kind of had anice hot start, kind of cooled
off, kind of fell out of therotation a little bit.
So for him to come back and henormally plays really well at

(04:40):
home, so to get 13 points out ofhim, him shooting three for
seven from three on the road.
I'll take it again.
I think the lakers have toreally figure out who they are
and what they want to be movingforward.
The dorian finney smith pickupgood, but where are you going
with this?
Like, if you have watched thelakers, if you're a laker fan,
you realize that we have notbeen the best for lebron or ad.

(05:03):
So I think they owe it to themto try and figure it out.
The key is the balance and Ithink the challenge is going to
be.
You're still dealing with RobPalenka and I think Rob got
burned with Russ Brooke and he'snow just like I'm not doing it,
I'm not going all in.
But if you don't go all in,eventually you're going to miss
the boat.
And LeBron, at age 40, to bestill putting up 25 points, 12

(05:31):
assists, five boards in a gamethat that that's on her.
There will be a study on thatman someday because, oh yeah,
the way that he is still able tocontribute at a at an all-star
level maybe not the superstarthat we know him to be, but to
be 40 years old and to still bewindmilling on kids coming in
the league, and it's like that'sbeyond impressive.
So I hope they figure outsomething and really get into

(05:54):
the construction of a team.
Ad came on and in his interview,said that that bubble team was
really the best construction ofa team he's seen in terms of the
Lakers, because you had alittle bit of everything.
You had your bigs, you had twobigs to play alongside them.
You had your shooters who wereI happen to be wing defenders,
like in kcp's case.

(06:14):
You get a guy like a jr uh jrsmith who could come in and
knock down a couple shots.
You they that.
Just that team, I think, wasunderrated because we got so
focused on the bubble itselfthat we forgot to look at all
the pieces, and I think theworst offenders of that were the
lakers themselves, when theyjust let it all go away.
So I don't know, we'll seewhere that.

(06:35):
Yeah, they just dissolved thatteam without.

Yeah, yeah I mean, that is, to this day, one of
the biggest mysteries inbasketball in recent years, like
how they dissolved that teamwithout trying to run it back
first.
That, should it, still bogglesthe mind, like they really had
the perfect construction of achampionship team.
I mean, they literally won thechampionship.
Now you can, you can try andand dismiss it, or, um, I mean,

(06:58):
we've heard it.
I mean, and let's be honest,man, I I won't even say
dismissing it, um, because thereis some truth to it.
Let's be honest.
Like the reason why the Lakerswant to win outside of the
bubble would be largely tolegitimize that championship.
It counts.

Yeah, and it was a real championship.

No doubt Other teams were competing Like people
who were claiming that it was abullshit championship, Like had
you been in that position, youwouldn't be saying that the
problem is you weren'tcompetitive thing is the players
are actually the biggestadvocates of like.

What you don't realize is that it's the first
time in nba history where theplaying field was even we,
completely even, yeah, same yeahsame place, yeah, same time,
same opportunity.
Travel from east coast to west.
You know how we are literallysitting here and it almost feels
like going to the park andtaking your five and saying,
okay, let's see who won thetournament, so right and but

(07:49):
yeah, but but an actualchampionship.

Outside of that would I mean, let's be honest,
it will legitimize it like itstill counts for sure, but it is
a little bit different.
I won't say lesser than, but itis.
It's a different kind ofchampionship, but but again,
that's the thing because it'snot the norm.

So now we want to get to a normal championship,
right?

but that team could have competed in any
environment and it would havebeen successful.
That's why I still can'tunderstand why they broke.
It didn't make any system.
Um, with the exception maybe,like a danny green, who his time
had passed for the most partlike, but he could still
contribute on the perimeterdefense, like he was still one
of the better defenders.
Um might not be able to knockdown an open shot to save his
life, but you know shit?

How do you get that system?
I mean to me, for me, lookingat it, I think we were very
Golden State-esque in that theway we played defensively,
offensively, the way we movedthe ball with that team, the way
that we could run the floorwith the bigs that we had,
because they weren't just someslumbering bigs that just sat in
the paint, they can move, theycan get up and down the court.

(08:50):
We got a lot of fast breakpoints out of that, out of our
defensive sets.

I just really loved that team and all you had
to do was tweak it a little bitand run it back, but the fact I
mean, it's so so minor tweakswould have been good enough for
that team to run it back Somevery minor tweaks.

Yeah Well for a championship team to really just
got it and start after.
Most people at least run itback a little bit, and there's
always a few guys that won'tmake it to the next round.
But the fact that they didn'trun that back and let's see what
it was, that's what's so mindboggling.
And the fact we won't even goback to that, that's what's so
mind-boggling.
And the fact we won't even goback to that.
We saw we had the most successout of that.

(09:25):
You know, with that team withmultiple bigs that are athletic
enough to get the boards, and ittook off the pressure of AD and
LeBron, because we know LeBronhe was older then and not to
expect a certain level ofdefense from him, but we still
were a great defensive team atthat time.

You and I feel like that lost opportunity.
Running that team back has kindof haunted them the last four
years, five years since thepandemic like they haven't been
able to find their footing.
Yeah, it just it's just beenterrible decision making like
again.
Shit, how do I again?
I don't want to be too criticalof russ because he takes a lot
of criticism and it's undue forthe most part.
Um, russ is one of the all-timegreat players.

(10:05):
It just wasn't a good fit.
I don't give a damn how greathe is as an individual player or
was it just we know it was abad fit, it was just a bad place
where he was still in his mind.

He still was that russ.
You know what I mean?

like that's, like you see how he's playing
now I think they entertainedthat for a minute, but I think,
because we see how he's playingnow, it's clearly a bad fit.
Clearly a bad fit.
One you were home.
Two, you were a Laker and youwanted to impress because you're
home and you wanted to be lovedat home, but at that point in
your career you were not hittingshots.

(10:38):
You go back to the games theLakers played against them and
you see LeBron sagging off andyou've had this since Magic took
over, where it was likeshooting was just not something
that you guys have prioritized,and so what you bring in as
another ball-dominant person whogets downhill.
You got LeBron.
For that it was bad.
It was bad conceptually, it wasbad in execution, it was bad in

(11:02):
the amount of resources it tookto get him.
And then, I mean, we went tothose games.
You literally would hear peopleplea.
I've never felt so bad for aplayer in my life because you
would literally hear peoplepleading as if their life
depended on it, don't you?
And it was like wow, this isactually.
That was the first time I cangenuinely say I felt bad for

(11:25):
somebody playing professionalbasketball making millions of
dollars, because it was likeyou're home, this is where you
grew up.
This is what every NBA playerdreams of being able to play for
your home team, and that hometeam is the Lakers.
It was a bad fit.
And then LeBron and AD let's behonest, they punted on them.
You know what I mean.
It was just like fit.
And then LeBron and AD let's behonest, they punted on him.

(11:45):
It was just like this ain'tworking, this ain't working.
So now it's like you're gettingit from the fans.
You can tell your own playersaren't rocking with you.
You get Darvin in and Darvinkind of okay, yeah, I'm going to
ride with you, but bad is a badfit.

(12:07):
So I think the difference is,when it came to Denver, denver
wanted him.
Jokic arguably best player inthe league wanted him and made
it clear that I want this guy,and I think that alone changes
your perspective on how you feelabout what's happening and who
you are as an NBA player.
You know we saw it with peoplelike Melo.
We got Melo way too late and werelied on him entirely too much
.
If Mello had been a part ofthat bubble team or if that was

(12:29):
one of the minor tweaks you made, you brought in a Mello to just
hit an open shot and post.
That would have been far better.
But by that time it was, youknow, dream team versus drill
team and we out here trying toget Mello to put up 45.
And it's like how, why?
Drill team and we out heretrying to get mellow to put up
45.
And it's like how, why?
So there's been some mishaps inin the front office that

(12:50):
haven't been made up for and Ithink that's where why we are
where we are.
But these next moves, withthese couple of uh, first round
picks, are going to determineeverything in the near future
will that determine what we look, how we?

well, because I already have my stance on robin
lincoln, I think, at this pointright now, yes, you know he's
done some good, but to me someof his missteps far outweigh
everything that he's done asgood, as far as even, because we
have to go back and really lookat this thing.
When we say magic, well, see,magic was still a part when the

(13:22):
bubble.
I believe when the bubble'sstill around, there are some
things that magic was able to dowhile he was there that helped
bring this team.
But since magic's departureit's like rob palinka, the moves
he made.
Coaching, you know coachingmishaps.
We, you know, we'll see afterthis season we can go and
reevaluate.
You know how our current coachis doing and what he's done, and

(13:44):
so far, I mean, I guess, by thestandards of the today's lakers
, he's doing well.
But I think we owe it to, youknow, not only as a fan, but we
owe it to ad and lebron, becausead, for the last two seasons,
two seasons plus, he's actuallybeen healthy.
You don't want to squander thatand I think you know I don't
how long before AD kind of getsfed up, like you know what I'm

(14:07):
wasting my talents.
I'm being.
I think we're there, so do wewant to leave that?
I mean, could we see a casewhere AD goes to a contender and
I think it's possible, I thinkthat it's very possible that he
will go after this season if hedoesn't see some of the moves,
like some real moves, being made, because Golden State look at
them they're still making moves,but AD and LeBron is not enough

(14:30):
, and I think you know that issomething that the Lakers can't
take for granted at all, becauseif we take it for granted, ad
is going to request a leave andI think we as an organization we
would not come back for him.
I think you don't squander that,because lebron james will see.
We know he's not going to goanywhere, but we're talking

(14:51):
about a 40 plus year old lebronjames.
What do we expect really?
I mean, everything he's givenus right now is just like icing
on the cake.
You just hope that he can holdup for the next couple years.
I mean, it's like something,nothing we've ever seen, so I'm
not quite sure about it, but youknow what it is, man.

It's the expectations that kill you and
not to harp too much again onLaker rosters of old, including
that bubble championship team,but I only bring that up to say
it was, if you look at this teamnow, like it's been a complete
reconstruction.
There are only two players fromthat championship team.
If memory serves me correct,it's LeBron and AD.

(15:28):
That's it.

That's it.

Everyone else is new.
It's a complete reconstruction,right?
So in the cases of bothWestbrook and Carmelo, too much
was expected of them at thatpoint in their careers and maybe
Russ rightly so.
So he was still kind of youngum I wouldn't say he was in his
prime um but russ was stillcapable of being a high level

(15:53):
competitor and contributor, butjust maybe, maybe too much was
thrust upon him in terms ofexpectations.
Uh, ad is one of those guyswe've.
I'm not sure if we expected toomuch or it's just he just
hasn't delivered enough.
I don't think our expectationof him is crazy or outlandish.
I just think he has not livedup to it for whatever reason.
But it's the expectation andthe expectation of Laker fans

(16:16):
and Laker brass to expect LeBronto be anywhere near this level.
For all we know he could jumpoff the diving board in the
second half of the season.

Right right.

I think that so to expect LeBron going forward to
be the LeBron he is even now, Imean that's a crazy expectation
and that's what kills you.

Right.
I think that the issue is ontop of what we expect of him
offensively, we still have someexpectations of him defensively
and he hasn't been lebron hasn'tbeen that defensive guy for
some time now.
But the lakers, we're stilllooking for him and you know to
your point, when we talked aboutwestbrook, we we were expecting
him to be the third option.

(17:03):
But he plays a similar stylegame, the downhill game.
They just wouldn't.
It doesn't translate well forthat lakers team.
We needed someone that was, youknow, a shooter that can really
stand out in the perimeter andstill play defense, and we
didn't go after that.
And there were some guys thatwere available during that time,
but I think it was just a bigname, big splash.

(17:24):
They were trying to wakesomething up.
They were just trying to makeany type of move, to kind of
move the needle and geteverything going, because
remember what the previousseason looked like.
So I think that was more of thereason.
But I remember do you rememberbeing at the game?
I think that was towards theend of the season after that
year and they literally booed.
I think West Westbrook, it wasjust like as soon as he touched

(17:46):
the ball, and this is a homegame.
It was so shocking because I'venever witnessed something like
that as a Lakers fan, wherewe're just oh, he got the ball,
like boo, as soon as he gets theball.

It's a homer too.
Yeah not to that extent, and Ithink the bigger problem was you
know we're sitting here andtalking about who was available
To me.
Arguably the bigger problem iswho we had, because you didn't
have to go get Rush.
You could have kept somebodylike Alex Caruso.
Yeah, you know what I mean.
This guy has gone to Chicago,left his imprint, he's in OKC.

(18:23):
That was homegrown.
Who wanted to be here?
Who was willing to take a pricecut?
Who was willing?
And if you look at, you knowbecause now everything's about
analytics and eventually we'lltalk about how basketball is
dying and I'm sure that'll comeup.
But if you think about that,you know, in terms of a plus
minus, he may have been LeBron'sgreatest teammate ever, so may

(18:45):
have been LeBron's greatestteammate ever.
So you couldn't argue that itwasn't working.

You're saying it, Alex Caruso.
Wow, that's a bold statement.
His best teammate ever Shit.
No, no, no.

Oh, you mean from a politics standpoint?
Oh yeah, plus minuses.

Yeah, of course, yeah.

People love that.

Yeah, no, not his best teammate but from that
perspective he would bear outthat he might be his best
teammate.

Because that was the one thing they were
always harping on.
He may have been the best, butit showed on the court.
They had a chemistry far better.
I mean even you yeah, we likeAustin Reeves.
He's good, but what Caruso wasdoing with him and how he spread
the floor and everything it wasmind-boggling.

All the spread, the floor and everything it was.
It was mind-boggling.
And then you all, movement wasbeautiful.

I mean, yeah, like there was a game, yeah,
yeah a different flair and Ithink, when you start to look
back and you go back and go okay, kuzma, yeah you, you probably
would want a guy like that rightnow, even, even, but it he's a
plus minus nightmare though,like well, I was gonna say
talking about metrics.
But if you, if you look at, butif you look at just the guys

(19:49):
that we've had, kcp is reallywho you would want back kcp,
definitely lonzo I took him backin the heart.

He wasn't on that team still, and you can
have a guy like him because he'sone of those guys who impacts
the game, like caruso.

You don't really see it in stat sheet, it doesn't
seem like it's tangible, butthey completely changed the game
and even, like you know, I'm abig KCP fan.
I've always been an advocatefor him, since Detroit Again.
Everywhere he goes he kind ofleaves his mark.
I mean, we haven't heard muchof him as of late, but he's one
of them players where a good fithe can be a difference maker

(20:22):
for you.

Plug and play, yeah, yeah, he can be a major
difference maker.

But you're right, caruso, the Lonzo balls, the
KCPs Again, even Danny Green asdown as I was on him is a guy
who can still get out there anddefend on the perimeter and
that's a major contribution.
But the Lakers have notprioritized scoring.
That's been part of the issue.
And you bring in guys whoaren't great shooters, like I
mean not scoring, shooting inparticular as part of the

(20:50):
scoring.
They haven't prioritized thatand they've been, I mean, from
the field.
The Lakers have not really.
They haven't really addressedtheir shooting needs since that
time.

Still guys in the league, like Luke, who has
moved from place to place.
You can't tell me you couldn'thave made some strides to get
some of these guys, even DoranFinney and Smith, where he is
right now.
He's a good fit.
But I think we need to get backto specialized skill Because
you have two guys who absolutelycommand a double team, who

(21:23):
absolutely your defense has toprepare for you.
Take a JR Smith right now, withthis Laker team and even on his
decline, where he was in thatbubble, just being able to
stretch the floor and be able toshoot is small things.
I think the clock is ticking onPalenka because you just

(21:44):
haven't.
You're borrowing from KobeCaché, in my opinion, where it's
just like I'm not sold.

I'm just not sold.
I think it's time to move on.
But do you think that Genie,this might not be the time, but
yeah, genie's guy, I mean,clearly we know that because,
let's you know, we don't have togo back into it.
But remember, you know the sagawith with, you know magic and
the infamous, you know down thetunnel to really sit back and
look at that, because Rappaportis living off of you know Kobe's

(22:16):
legacy but there's been somemajor missteps and I don't know
if he truly has that foresightthat's needed for GM to be able
to see real talent, to know whatpieces fit, to be creative, to

(22:41):
go get the guys necessary.
I don't think that he has thatand that's something that was
the lakers hallmark you know.
Of course we had, you know thelate great, you know jerry west
and what he was able to do withthe franchise for so long, and
we had mitch cup check, which Imean I'd say you know, for all
intents and purposes, he, he wasgood.

I think Mitch was just more conservative in
general.
He had a very pure approach toand maybe it was boring for the
Lakers and what the Laker brandis.
But if you look at his tenureuntil you got to the Mozgovs and
the Luau Dings where it wasjust like hey, I'm on my way out
, let's sabotage this as best aspossible.
Until you got to that point.

(23:24):
It was like his moves were weredecent and they were
conservative, but it was.
You could tell that in thosemoments they built a team.
Yeah, and there were pieces fora team.
It wasn't this collection ofavengers that were just gonna
come together and make this allwork, and I think that's where
the problem was, where they,where they really tried to go.
After um Hurley last year, Iwould have put that type of

(23:45):
effort into Sam Presti.

Yeah.

You know what?

If you've had too many options, let's not
forget.
I mean, the Clippers coachcould have been the Lakers coach
.
It's like he doesn't goingafter the talent, whether it be
a coach or he doesn't put thattype of effort and I don't
understand that and it's likeyou give a half hearted like
effort towards it and it's verydisrespectful to some of the

(24:12):
guys and they're like OK, I seewhere this is and that goes back
to an entire episode on that,like if we go back and think
about the moves the Lakers didand didn't make and who they let
go of, I think that's a fullepisode in and of itself because
there are so many layers tothat.

You look at the Brandon Ingrams and all of that
.
So maybe that's something we'llrevisit.
But, man, when I tell you you,you you've got the opportunity
to make more mistakes than, Ithink, anybody in league history
.

I mean, I don't even Rob Palenka, I don't even
need them to bring the band backtogether.
It's just a couple of thoseplayers that make all the
difference in the world, and RobPalenka has not been really.
I mean, we criticize MitchKupchak, who was effective, but
he wasn't a.
He wasn't a.
He wasn't about bold sweeping.

He was?

you know he was Tony Gwynn.
He'll get you singles anddoubles.
He's not a home run hitter.
Like, if you want a home runhitter of a GM to go out there,
you want a Barry Bonds, you wantan Aaron Judge.
He wasn't that dude, like hewasn't gonna make those big,
bold moves.
I mean, though, he did get youChris Paul, the NBA just kind of
the NBA muffed that for theLakers.
That wasn't, that wasn't on him.
I I mean, if nothing else, thatis part of his legacy.

(25:23):
Like Mitch did make some moves,but did he make the most bold,
sweeping moves?
Like they weren't.
He wasn't going out on a limb,he did kind of.
He tended to play it safe, nodoubt.
But Palenka, my only issue withhim is we might feel like he's
run his course, but has he wornhis welcome with Jeannie?
Like that's my issue?
I'm not.
Has he kind of ingratiatedhimself into her circle to the

(25:44):
point where she can't get rid ofthem, cause she seems like the
type where, if you're coolenough with her, it'll supersede
business, like her friendshipand that relationship is more
important to her than business,and that's the problem with her
and that's why it's a bad lookfor her as an owner who happens
to happens to be a female not afemale owner, I'm not putting
that on her, but an owner whohappens to be a woman.

(26:06):
It's kind of a bad look thatshe's kind of surrounded herself
with a whole bunch of yes, menwho are just her friends and her
personal life.
And I'm not sure if again, isRob Plinker her friend, because
if so, he's here for the longhaul, much like the Ram body.

I'm getting into all of those little things.
It's Much like, much like theRambon, all of those little
things.
Yeah, like I'm so attached toyou personally.
But yeah, I think, when you,when the brain trust of the
Lakers involves a man who isknown for broken glasses and
clotheslines, you, you got toevaluate like he and his wife.

Nonetheless, yeah, yeah, we have to not
forget that the two biggestmoves in recent history with the
lakers didn't come from robbelanger, ad lebron james.
That was not his, that wasn'this baby, that was magic and
that thing was set two, threeyears in advance.
And that's what it takes.
You have to start looking atthe moves ahead of time and then

(27:02):
and paying attention to thepieces and draft picks and
knowing what you're going afterand have some type of vision, if
you will, for the future, andthat I don't think that yeah,
magic was a student of Dr Buss,clearly.

Yeah, he wasn't awake until the summer, when
free agency is up and we can goafter the free agents.
Magic was very much abouthaving a vision to execute for
the future where, as opposed to,maybe, a rob plinker who just
kind of reactive and whatever wecan get, whatever is out there,
we'll try to snatch the topveterans and it's like, yeah,
you ain't even getting that I'meven getting getting played.

You know you get the ad trade.

Josh hart was not necessary for that you know, I
mean another, mean Another oneof those.

Yeah, he's one of them.

It's kind of like you threw that in.
This man has basically told hisentire team I'm out.
This man literally wore athat's All Folks shirt on the
last game.
It was like and you threw thatin to sweeten the deal, but
that's the difference between anexperienced GM and a Sam
Presley.
Yeah yeah, that was a JamesDolan movie.

He threw him way too much Like yeah, the deal
was already done.

You still throw it .
It's sweet.
They're like why are?

you doing it Right?
Yeah, if this was, if this wassugared, we'd need water,
because this is just entirelytoo sweet, because but look at
what that's turned into for NewYork now and how much of a
staple he is being playingalmost 40 minutes.
That's a guy you let walk outunnecessarily.
So it's those types ofdecisions when you look back,

(28:32):
whenever this thing is all saidand done, you'll be able to look
back and go on one end, you gotthe ring, but when you look
over the body of work, it'll bequestionable.
But yeah, bringing it back tojust what we see is, every time
we get to see LeBron and Stephgo at it, I think it's a treat.
It is a treat.
I think they are Place.
Yeah for sure, they're in aplace where they realize that

(28:55):
these these days are numbered,and so every time we get to see
that we just need to be a fanand just really soak it in and
win, lose or draw is this, thiswill be something We'll look
back at and be able to say welived through, we were involved
in.
So good on the Lakers.
We'll see how the rest of theseason kind of pans out and see
what happens before and afterall start breaking, we'll just

(29:17):
keep going.

Yeah, I mean currently in fifth right now,
seven games above .500.
I mean that's a good startconsidering where they were
Brand new coach.

Yeah, absolutely.

And we'll see how long that shit lasts.
I mean, you know, yeah.

And I mean even the fact that he got back to it
Another year like this, they'llbe calling for his head.
Yeah Well, even the fact youknow I will commend him on it
feels like they have somewhat ofan identity that he has in his
mind.
I don't feel that it's asdisjointed as it was, but bigger
than that.
Just, I mean everybody's awareof the fires that we've been

(29:56):
dealing with here in Californiato lose a home and granted, it
wasn't a home he bought but herented but his entire life being
in a home and being able tostill be able to
compartmentalize that tragedy,that catastrophe, manage being a
father, a husband and all thesethings and still come out and
put that.
I think that's commendable andI think it's just a good time to

(30:19):
remind everybody.
We have been going through itout here where we're from in
California, but you know, peopleare resilient.
A lot, of, a lot of efforts aregoing on, so shout out to, to
Coachdick and everybody else.

Oh, no doubt as a man you got to commend him for
it.
If nothing else, Maybe as acoach.
You can't criticize him.

Everybody who's dealing with the aftermath of
that and prayers and thoughtswith people as they choose and
figure out how to rebuild.

So shout out to y'all we wouldn't want to go
without acknowledging, you knowand as much as I want to bite
the head off of our leadershipin california local uh and state
um, I mean, listen, your prayerhas to be for them to get it
together.
Whether you like them or not,you got to be rooting for them
because it's in our, it's in ourown best interest right, yeah,

(31:06):
like it's.
It's a catastrophic failurethat everybody can see, but you
still got to root for them tofigure something out.

I understand.

California is going to be ablaze every three
or four years.
That's just what it is, but wegot to figure out a better way,
yeah but what makes it bad isthis is the winter time.
Oddly enough, that is the mostlikely time.
Forly enough, that is the mostlikely time for wildfires,
because it is so dry.

It's the driest time of the year there's been no
rain, except for last night.
That was our first touch ofrain.
Oh no, it certainly doesn'thelp.
That was a hot spit.

The lack of rainfall certainly doesn't help
anything.
It contributes to that dryness,but yeah, but again, in terms
of just the management of water,our water shelves and reserves,
we got to be better with thatkind of shit.
There's no reason that firemenshould be able to tap a hydrant
and not have water.
They're literally 19th centurystyle, going in a line, an

(32:09):
assembly line, passing downbuckets and bags, like that's an
.
That's an embarrassment to the,to the entire nation, that
california, who we always claimis like one of the richest
economies, it can be its owncountry, blah, blah.
I'm not sure how true that is.
Now, I'm not sure what our gdpwould be.
I'm sure it's probablyagriculture still, um, we,
california still feeds the world.

(32:31):
But the problem is that, again,events of this magnitude
shouldn't be happening with theregularity that it does happen
in this state.
We should have figured outsomething like we got to have
some sort of plan for our waterand how to use it, for people to
have access to it.
No, you know, we're going tocatch on fire Every few years.
It'll be a real bad fire.
Now it's all over the place.

(32:52):
It's not just LA, it's SanDiego, it's Riverside, which I
believe some of this shit isflat out arson.
I don't believe it.
It's not just natural wildfire.
I'm not falling for it.
It's not like these embers.

No, let's fly out to San.

Diego, we done with Palisades.

I think that we know what makes this so
different is because all theresidential areas that were
burned usually it's a lot ofbrush and it's a lot of a few
homes that are way up in thehills, secluded area, but these
are, I mean, like.
Alcatina is like no more.
You know we're talking aboutwhole infrastructures of cities.

(33:33):
It's just raised yeahcompletely raised.
And then, on top of that, you,you, you, you, to put that
together with the issues thatwe've been having with the
insurance, and you know, I'mpretty sure, yeah, they're going
to probably pay out this time,but just imagine what's going to
happen moving forward.
They're going to discontinuefire insurance because it's so
much of a liability, becauseit's happening at a rate that is

(33:55):
, I mean, unseen and unheard of,and even in California history.
That is the issue.
Then, on top of that, I'mreally curious to see what's
going to happen with, you know,a lot of these corporations that
are going to come and try toswoop up and take this land.
You know.

Los Angeles is going to have right.

It's going to have a totally different look
than we're used to and it's sounfortunate because it was just
all the people that you know hadthat a lot of elder people, you
know a lot of Black communitieson top of that, and now to be
in historic black communities,totally gone.
And we'll see over the nextyear or two.
Are people going to come backand rebuild or are we going to

(34:35):
have a, you know, somewhat of amass exodus based off this?
Because I mean, you have tostart looking at it.
It's going to come down to uh,you know, can I put up with this
anymore?
Can I even want to rebuild.

Yeah, I mean, that's an inconvenient truth
that we don't talk enough aboutthe homes that we.
Can I put up with this anymore?
Can I even afford to rebuild?
That's an inconvenient truththat we don't talk enough about
the homes that we are living innow.
If they went away today, wewouldn't be able to go buy them
back, and I think that's whatpeople are forgetting.
You get the older couple who'sin their early 70s, who bought
this in the 80s, 70s.

(35:07):
These are million dollarproperties.
Now they don't have this kindof capital, they don't have the
type of money.
So you literally couldn'tafford your own home.
And with the way this thing isburned down and bear to your
point how insurance isstructured.
And you know, if you reallydon't know.
Everybody talks about I gotfull coverage, I got, but what
does that entail?
And most people truly don'tunderstand what their insurance

(35:30):
covers.
Until you deal with somethinglike this and realize, oh, you
weren't actually covered forthat at all in some instances,
or the cost of rebuilding.
People don't understand howpolicies are written to say, hey
, it's not what it would cost torebuild today, it's what you
paid for.
So that number kind of becomesirrelevant.

Yeah, it's like okay, I can't rebuild this same
house for $250,000, $300,000.
And I think people that don'tlive in Southern California,
those are multi-million dollarhomes.

But honestly, Robert, a multi-million dollar
home doesn't mean anything inCalifornia.
People don't understand.
Outside of California you canlive in a million dollar home
and your neighbor's stillcrackheads.
It don't mean shit.
A million dollars is in thehood.
Still you can spend that in thehood easily.
That ain't even like you'reliving in the Palisades, You're
not in Brentwood.
You quite literally can pay amillion bucks for a home and be

(36:26):
smack dab in the hood.

You know, pay a million bucks for a home and
yeah, and be smack dab in thehood you know what I mean.
Literally, there was a home inpalisades yeah, one bedroom, one
bath, one bed, one bath,estimated seven million.
Yeah, so we're talking aboutnot just, you know, mid-level
homes, you know million dollars.
I guess that would beconsidered oh yeah, that's some
really good.
That's prime real estate though,yeah, multi-million dollar
malibu palisades, yeah, wipedout, and even those guys you

(36:50):
know because we have tounderstand, not everyone you
know had that money, some thatyou know, some of that was
inheritance you know passed downand they're looking like, yeah,
I'd rather take that money thanI'm gonna get from the
insurance company and I'd rathergo elsewhere, you know, maybe
out of state, and I'd have achoice they don't want to.

I'd have a choice.
That's the worst part, yeah.

I would love to rebuild.
This is the home I grew up in.
It's what my parents left me,and I can't afford to stay here.
So Texas, here I come.

Arizona, here I come and they're going to do
this forward.

progress of, you know, california city, 2028 huh
you know what and not to beconspiratorial, but time will
tell you won't have to be.
You won't have to beconspiratorial, we'll know.
The proof is going to be in thepudding in the years to come.
But I will say, another problemwe had was the insurance
companies who bailed on some.
I mean, and listen, this wasn'tjust they didn't bail on people

(37:47):
who were poor, who didn't haveresources, they bailed in zip
codes that are prime real estatein southern california prior to
these fires, which is kind ofweird and coincidental.
But you know, again, not to betoo conspiratorial, but you know
, that's weird in and of itselfthat that they would abandon
those zip codes in particular.
Like we're talking about themalibus, we're talking about
palisades, like I was being toldby insurance companies that

(38:11):
they were flat out just notoffering insurance in those
areas anymore.
I'm like all of a sudden thestate goes up in flames or you
know a lot.
You know I won't say the cityin general, but parts of the
city I never thought would belike the hollywood sign and up
and like it like this the citywas burning.
This wasn't.
It wasn't countryside, rural,this wasn't somewhere in the
like this this city was burning.
This wasn't.
It wasn't countryside, rural,this wasn't somewhere in the
mountains Like this was.

(38:31):
I mean, it was way too close tohome.
I had never seen that before inmy lifetime.

The interesting part about that being, as
someone who is a former licensedinsurance agent, when you think
about insurance, where peopleget in trouble is that you know,
know, everybody looks at theinsurance company themselves as,
oh, you guys are trying to getover.
But you got to understand, froman insurance standpoint, you,

(38:56):
insurance is nothing more thanrisk and it's reactionary, right
the way policies are written,all this stuff it all comes from
something that has happened inthe past that has cost companies
millions and billions ofdollars to where it's like we
won't get caught with that again.
You decide to build a house ina hillside covered by dry brush
because you want to overlook acliff.

(39:17):
Yeah, when you think that, justfrom a risk standpoint, if an
earthquake comes, knocks, thatyou get a mud slide or something
, okay, part of this house iscoming down if you're surrounded
by brush, not going to be easyto get to you.
So there's levels that are justkind of weird, but you're right
, yeah.

Yeah, underwriters certainly take that into
account.
No, doubt.

Yeah, sure, yeah.
There were a lot of people who,all of a sudden, it was like we
ain't doing this, no more,we're done.
I mean we've seen, inCalifornia specifically, we, we
ain't doing this, no more, we'redone.
I mean we've seen, inCalifornia specifically, we've
seen insurance companies simplyleave the state, like we're done
here, because the risk isn'tworth the reward.

Policies only work when we can make a profit.
And there's no profit to bemade if this goes up.
So at a clip that we're havingfires, how often we're having
fires, I mean it's likeclockwork.
And that's where I canunderstand.
I mean being homeownersourselves.
I don't like it, but I canunderstand from a business
standpoint.
Like you know, we're on thelosing end every time, like
clockwork in California.
So I get it, but it's more of asituation.

We've got to take care of the people.

You have to figure something out because,
well, you heard, you know thefire, the fire chief, you know
that was one of the things whereshe just flat out like we were.
They failed us.
You cut the budget whencalifornia has grown, you know,
exponentially over the last 10years.
Plus you cut all the funding,knowing that we're having fires.
You know almost twice theamount that we have annually but
we're not, which means youdon't have enough personnel to
go ahead and clear, brush thingslike that and to you know, kind

(40:52):
of discover hot spots thatcould be potential hot spots at
least, and deal with it beforeit gets bad.
So all those budget cuts play arole in that.
But it doesn't make any sense.
I'm like, why would you knowingI mean, if you were you're
talking about just a mayor andthe governor you know California
when it comes to, you know alot of these fires it's
happening quite often why wouldyou cut, you know almost a

(41:19):
billion dollars in budget cutsto the fire department?
It doesn't make any sense.
And, like you said, I'm nottrying to be a conspiracy
theorist.
You know we can proof of beingthe put and we'll find out in
the next couple of years whatwill be, you know the end, all
with that, but it's just it.
It seems kind of funny becausewe're getting closer to that
2028.
Here's 25.
It takes about three years toget everything in play.
Yeah, I'm just saying, and yousaw it coming, we knew about the

(41:40):
insurance the prior year.
I mean you have, you know,major hitters like Allstate
State Farm just discontinuing,like you are no longer
underneath our care, wow.

It won't be anybody's coincidence at all.
We find ourselves in the middleof Smart City and Olympic
Villages.
What did you?

say On your homeowners insurance?
Have you guys received any typeof revision in your plan
recently due to the fires?

No, but thank God we would know.
We have a great relationshipwith our insurance company and
our representatives speak to herquite frequently Every time I
mean shit, there's always goingto be increases.
We just got an increase in ourcar insurance and I'm like God
damn, when does it end?
They're going to bleed you dryout here in California one way
or another.

Whether it's home insurance, whether it's
auto insurance, they're gonnableed you dry out here in
california one way or another.
Home insurance, whether it'sauto insurance, they're gonna
bleed you.
They're gonna nickel and dimeyou to the death.
But um, not to mention, yougotta pay for the olympics.
We're gonna see the falloutafter that, like we'll see when
it's here, but afterwards yougot three years to get together.

I mean it certainly don't help anything,
or maybe it does help, I don'tknow.
I don't know what the plans are.

Time will tell.
There's some money that's goingto be shelled out during that
time, that's for certain.

We'll have to see how it all plays out.

Fingers crossed, prayers up for everybody
affected again, including theleadership, because again we've
got to be rooting for them,whether you like them or not.
Hope they get it together.
Totally agree, we don't havethis problem the next year, two
years, yeah, yeah.

As we've been sitting here talking, we kind of
started with basketball and thekind of segue into the fired
thing.
But we were talking basketballand I mentioned those two names,
bronwyn and Steph.
I feel like we're at a pointwhere basketball is starting to
die.
Slow down, I think it's.
It's it's been a slow burn, butit's it's coming to that place

(43:34):
of this.
This is not the sport we lovedwhen we grew up.
You know, we met each otherwhen we were walking to go grab
shoes at footlocker.
There was there's just adifferent feel.
So I wanted to kind of justthrow that out to you guys.
Hey, why is basketball dying?
Because it is.
It is.
It's not a question of is it?
I, you know, you guys know melove, absolutely love basketball

(43:57):
, coach 20 years, played alittle bit in high school.
But even my appetite forbasketball, which is something I
never thought I'd say, isMinimal.
I'm just not.
I'm not there anymore.
So I'm interested to hear fromyour perspectives why do you
think basketball is dying?

Well, let me start with this because, in the
spirit of full disclosure,anybody under the command of my
voice, who can hear me, who willhear me in the future, I'll be
honest enough to say I have notwatched the game in its entirety
, with the exception of being atone personally.
Like I have not and I haven'thad much interest in it, and I
cannot tell you until theplayoffs start that I plan on

(44:34):
watching many basketball gamesbecause it's completely
unrecognizable from the game Igrew up watching and loving from
them.
Nbc oh my God, that was theprime.
You just you really had to beon.
You had to have been there fromMarv Albert broadcasting from
the from the Madison the uh,madison square garden against
the bulls, especially in hisexcitement.
You can tell whenever jordanhit the court marvel's gonna be
fired up on tens.

(44:54):
But yeah, it's a.
It's a far cry from the game wegrew up watching.
The anticipation of going outand getting player signature
shoes and trading cards and Imean jerseys.
Like there isn't much, like yougotta.
The mere fact that we'rewatching Steph Curry slowly take
his last breaths in terms oflike his NBA life, I mean I
didn't think we'd see hisdecline this soon.

(45:14):
I mean maybe it's not, maybe hejust had a bad night.
It's been a series of them, butyou can tell Steph has lost a
step.
He ain't the same Steph he is.
Maybe he's being overused soit's burning him.
I'm not sure exactly what theproblem is.
He's being dependent on toomuch, but as one of the marquee
players and KD has beenrelatively quiet in the last few
years, we ain't heard much fromhim in terms of like Not

(45:38):
shocking for whatever reason.
Three of your marquee players inthe league of this era.
Kd LeBron is the.
Lebron, at 40 years old, isstill kind of the poster boy.
He's still the pitch man forthe nba.
That in and of itself isproblematic.
Like somebody else should havebeen taking that torch.
And anthony edward tell, giveme one of the foreign guys, for

(46:00):
christ's sake.
Like somebody has to step upand be the nba's new pitch man,
because it can't, you can't keepcount on lebron.
But yeah, in terms of the styleof play, everything about the
game and again, thisconversation, chris, we talked
about a million many times.
That's a multi-layered onion.
I don't even know where tostart to peel that one because I
don't know.
Yeah, what is what contributedto the downfall of the NBA?
What was it?

(46:21):
Low management?
Is it the lack of competitive?
The competitive nature and thefire and that, that passion?
Is it?
Uh, players being paid too muchand not having the same hunger?
Is it?
Is it?
I mean like I don't even know.
Like they say, a snake rotsfrom the head down, a fish rots
from the head down, but I'm notsure.
Is it from the head down?
Is the nba affecting all theother levels of playing

(46:42):
basketball in general in thiscountry?
Or does it start at the root,at the beginning stages, at the
aau stage, at the high schoolstage?
Does it start there and workits way up to the nba?
Like, I'm not sure, I'm not.
How does that flow work?
Like that this conversation is.
There's so much into it fromyou might even argue there was a
time like when you might havesaid like it's not available,

(47:04):
it's not as available as itshould be.
I might argue now it'soversaturated.
You can find a game on justabout any network, any streaming
service, like they they're got.
The nba is all over the placeand we're still having a problem
.
Maybe it's much ado aboutnothing here in the states
because we're looking at it froma very uh, myopic view.
We, we look at it from ourperspective as as, as americans,

(47:26):
we don't see how the game isplaying out on the world stage.
Maybe there's far moreenthusiasm for the game now
because of the foreign influence.
Maybe, if you look at, Francemaybe when being his contingency
is is fired up about basketball, maybe a Yoko?
Uh, yoko and other foreignplayers have got their country
Luca, yeah Right, but maybe,maybe country luca, yeah right,

(47:50):
but maybe, maybe, maybeworldwide it's not suffering as
much as we think it is.
It's actually, it's actually inand it's still in a growth
phase, but it's so hard tofigure out what is the?
What is the cause and what,like we, there are plenty of
symptoms, but what is the causeof the problem and it's it's
hard to get down to and I'vewrecked my brain thinking about
it, but I know one for me is thestyle of play.
The three-point marathon backand forth, is just not it for me

(48:10):
.
Um, that's just not.
I mean, I can finish on nba 2klike I ain't gonna watch that
and I mean these, these areskilled players, or at least
they should be.
So I don't know, man, I gottaturn over y'all because I I
can't tell you exactly what itis.
There's so many differentsymptoms.
I don't know what is the rootcause, what is the sickness and
it I don't know how, if we'llever get down to it in in one
discussion and certainly not onone show.

(48:32):
We can't do it.

We got to break this down over a series of shows
this is many pieces to it andI'm going to go in a different
direction.
Um, I want us to really sitback and look at the style of
play from the 90s, 80s and 90sand, and really, you know, early
mid-2000s and maybe up to about2013, 15.

(48:53):
There is a.
This was a man's sport.
I'm not saying it's still, thatit's not now in its current
form, but when you think about,you know we were talking about,
you know, the Garden and youknow those Bulls versus the
Knicks teams and things likethat, the Pacers these were full
grown men playing on the courtand it was a much more physical

(49:17):
game.
Yes, it was, and there was, youknow, for the fan to watch that
, because we want to thinkthey're talking about scoring
and scoring this.
We want to get the scorescoring, get the numbers up.
But I think that a competitivegame was just more, if not more,
exciting than watching a highscoring game to see the defense,
to see, you know, the roughingit down to the paint and and

(49:39):
have to fight and be moreefficient for your shots,
because at the time you did.
You know, I think that stephcurry, you know obviously he's
an outlier because he's just thegreatest shooter ever.
But when you watch those gamesyou had specialists.
That guy you know he can playsome defense, but he was a
shooter.
He can shoot, he can hit theoutside shot.
You had rebounders.
You had guys that you know andI hear you hear the talk about

(50:02):
these guys are more athleticallygifted than you know the
players of the past.
But we're talking about IQ, Ithink, iq-wise.
That's why LeBron James, stephCurry and you know, kd are able
to still flourish in the leaguetoday, because I think it's
easier for them.
I think it's that much easierfor them because they can see it
.
It's like you guys yeah, you'reathletic, but you don't have

(50:24):
anything to go with it.
The IQ and I don't know ifthat's due to your point does
that go back to the NBA?
Because I think that the NBAdictate the styles in high
school and in college.
I think the NBA when you thinkabout it, because you're coming
up, you're looking at the gameand saying, well, this is what

(50:45):
type of player I need to be tomake it to the league.

This is where I want to get to Right.

So I have to play this style and you have
coaches, because money, I think?
Well, it's not.
I think the money and theincentive to be a better player
is gone because they're getting,I mean, and including now the
NIL that's happening in college.
These guys are seeing money ata younger age and the motivation

(51:10):
is it money or is it the willand motivation to want to be a
great player?
Guys like Kobe and LeBron itwas about legacy always.
You know the money's going tobe there, they're going to get
the big contracts and thingslike that, but the money wasn't
the factor.
And I think that you'restarting to see a lot of guys,
because there's no way, henryand Chris, that we should still
see LeBron, the NBA riding offof that.

(51:33):
And let's go back to the DreamTeam.
When you think about when youknow the Dream Team did it with
Magic and Jordan and everythingwe were, I mean obviously we
were dominant.
We were, I mean obviously wewere dominant.
But you see, in the years tocome, later, you know you start
moving into the LeBron era andyou know you had Duncan and

(51:54):
everybody on that team andCarmelo and we ended up losing.
You saw that the world hadstarted playing a game that
almost looks, you know,reminiscent of the past games,
how we used to play it.
They started to become morephysical, but we backed off the
physicality we off of.
You know, getting back to thefundamentals and you're starting
to see, you know the benefitsof it in other games, in other

(52:15):
countries, how they started offthere.
Obviously they're playingbasketball at a younger age,
more professional ball, but alsothey're still working on the
fundamentals and it translatesnow because they're playing a
much.
You know the European.
You know we used to talk aboutthe Europeans.
We used to say they were soft,they couldn't play in the league
.
You know now that's not eventhe case.
Now what's going on?

(52:37):
They seem like they're the moreaggressive style player and
with a great base and a greatfooting.
I just don't.
I'm trying to look at at it.
I'm trying to really understandit for what it is and still be
appreciative, because I stilllove the sport.
But it's hard when you justwhen you've seen Jordan, when
you've seen Magic, when you'veseen Cody, when you've seen the

(52:58):
young LeBron, when you've seenthe D-Wades and the Mellos, and
you saw that style of play andthe competitiveness to it and
you see how they went hard, howdefense was played, versus now
it's just getting up and downthe court and we can look at
that and say it's part of it isbecause Golden State they had so
much success, but nobody reallyspeaks of the defense that they

(53:20):
played.
It was always about at the clickthey can score and at the rate
they can put up shots and itbecame contagious and everybody
bought into that, not reallysitting and saying, unless you
have a clay and staff, it's notgoing to work.
These, they're exceptionalshooters.
These guys are two of the bestever.
So to mimic and try to takeaway from that and say we're

(53:41):
going to do that because it wassuccessful for them, I think
that was part of the downfalland we started.
You know, you start looking atsome of the.
You know when you think aboutsome of the rule change and how
that affected the game to allowa faster paced game to get up
and down.
I think that played a role intoit.
And all of this, as you look atit now, culminates to what you

(54:05):
see and I don't know.
You know, like you said,there's so many layers, appeal.
I don't know if this plays arole into what's going on with
and I'm going to go there alittle bit to go on with the
young men.
You know we're talking aboutleadership in the household and
leadership in our communitiesplay a role into what you're

(54:29):
seeing as far as the mentaltoughness of, you know, the
player, the physical toughnessand us giving out these prizes
for every little thing withouthaving to go with, like, through
any type of adversity, comingup through high school and, you
know, in college, like I thinkthere's so many.
I think there's not a wronganswer, honestly, because
there's so many factors in theplaying into this.
It's not just, you know, we cansay high school and AAU and

(54:56):
things like that.
There's so many pieces to thispuzzle that we can't just sit
there and negate one and say no,that's not the reason.
I just truly believe that.
And ultimately, too,environment is playing a role.
Ultimately, I mean, you can saywhat you want.
That is, I think that may be amajor factor as well the
environment and what these kidscoming up playing basketball,

(55:16):
what they're saying.
I remember that golden era ofjust being able, like you said,
to hear Marv Albert 4-3, just toknow a triple header with the
Lakers and Lakers, celtics,Bulls, you know all these things
of the 90s.
That really what we're still.
I believe, honestly, the NBA isstill living off the 90s.

(55:36):
We're still living off thatJordan era.
We're still living off that youknow we're talking about.
When it comes to shoes, when itcomes to any type of, you know,
jersey sales, things like that Iremember I mean you know us
trying to figure out and get thelatest shoe, not because it's a
Jordan retro, but because ithad that.

(55:57):
You know that it had that powerto know what was coming out,
whose new shoe, who you know,nike apparel, all these
different apparel, all thatstuff.
You can't tell me that today,me that today, and I don't, you
know, I don't have the numbersin front of me, but I don't
think that it's stronger todaythan it was yesterday,
yesteryear, like in the 90s andearly 2000s.
I don't think that we're thereand it's just so unfortunate

(56:21):
because the product that we'reputting on it looks so bad.
You know, yeah, I mean I andit's sad because, chris, here it
is.
We're now the older men sayingthe same thing.
You know, we used to have thosetalks.
You would hear the young, theolder men say when we were
younger, like you know.
Oh, man, back in the day this istoo flashy and this is yeah,

(56:41):
but I to some degree Iunderstand it now but I didn't
agree with it then because Istill would say you know,
between the 80s and 90s it'ssome of the greatest basketball
I've ever played, I've ever seenand I'll take that to the grave
, but you know it is what it is.
A couple of things havehappened though.

I think when I look at this yeah, I think from
my standpoint you know, beingsomebody who has been tied to
basketball in a lot of ways andcoming from a role player
perspective let's not pretend inany way shape, form or fashion
I was.
You know I'm not going the AlBundy route, but back in my day
when I no, that's not who I wasand I understood that and I

(57:21):
think there's value inunderstanding that.
But when I look at it, one ofthe major things, specifically
from the NBA standpoint, is younow have franchises within
franchises and that dynamicchanged a lot.
Because if you look at how therules are constructed, you know,
in a Jordan era, when Jordanstarted getting funky and
getting down the middle of thefloor, he was guaranteed to be

(57:42):
on his back within the next playor two, within the next play or
two, all right, and that wasperfectly acceptable.
There was a physical league, itwas a, there was a sense of
pride, there was and, to thatpoint, okay, was that
necessarily right or wrong?
Yeah, that's up for you todecide.
But the league itself is sayingthat's not an option because
there's an owner paying this man258 million dollars.

(58:04):
So if you think you're about to, you know, knock him down and
have a hip replacement on the,on the, on the, on the docket
coming up for him because you,your pride was hurt.
We're not doing that.
I think that shift did changesome things in the league one.
Two you mentioned the warriors.

(58:24):
Both you guys brought up thewarriors and and how play and
what they were.
The problem with that is westarted to romanticize and we
made the exception the rule, andthe proof in that is, if you
look at the NBA today, when youlook at the guys who are vying
for MVP, it's typically back towhat it was when we first

(58:45):
started to like basketball.
It's the big man, I mean theJoel Embiid, the Jokic.
We've gotten back to afundamental understanding of hey
, the one thing we can't teachis this size.
Now big men are more refinedthan they were back in the day.
You know, you look at a Shaq.
Shaq was brute force.
He understood how to use hisbody, he understood what he was

(59:08):
and, yeah, you can go to aKareem who had an amazing skill
set and a shot that's never beenreplicated.
I don't think there is asignature shot.
That is the one signature shotin basketball that, in my
opinion, nobody's ever comeclose to coming to Everybody has
a Jordan fadeaway.
Nobody has a Kareem hook shotNobody, yeah.
Coming to Everybody has aJordan Fadeaway.
Nobody has a Kareem HookshotNobody, yeah, they haven't even

(59:28):
attempted to mimic that at all.

Maybe, because, it's not sexy for whatever
reason.

Well, I mean, it's just something that, for
whatever reason, hasn't beenreplicated and that in and of
itself, gives it something.
The other side to that is thereis a two-way issue here,
because we both mentioned NBAand that's kind of what the
focal point of my question was.
But fundamentals made adifference.
You listen to a guy like Kobetalk.

(59:55):
You know Kobe went to seek outthe Hakims of the world because
he understood that Dream Shakewas magical and deadly.
Tracy McGrady same thing.
You started to have guys whounderstood hey, these guys have
a skillset.
Tim Duncan, for as boring as hewas, you know people will argue
with you hey, was Tim reallybetter than Kobe?
I don't know.

(01:00:15):
Yeah, and what?
What does that come down to?
He was highly effective, butTim Duncan understood.
I'm not the most athletic, big,but I can get this footwork
going.
And I mean, even if you thinkof guys who, when you look back
and you're just talking aboutfootwork, skillset and
dedication, you look at adefender like a Tony Allen,
where are those guys that youlook like?

(01:00:38):
A versatile big like a ZachRandolph, where are more of
those guys at?
Yeah, you know what I mean.
There were just components tothe game back then and you look
at just the overall sell One.
We live in a social media,internet-driven society, so the
probability of you walking to ashoe store and going to stand in

(01:00:59):
line to get the new summeredition shoe, the new Barkley
that came out we took that walkwith Rita go grab that Barkley
because he had to have it freshoff a paycheck that's not
happening.
These kids don't have thatbecause it's not something that
has to be that way.
I think the NBA did adisservice to itself when you
got rid of things like Christmasjerseys, signature shoes.

(01:01:20):
When's the last time you saw areally nice MLK Day shoe come
out or a Christmas edition of ashoe?
Those things drove engagementand so, even from that
perspective, what they tried todo is speed the game up because
of the Warriors.
But that that was a very wellrun system.
That was plug and play and itwas predicated on defense.

(01:01:40):
That led to easy offense.
But to the casual viewer yousee they hit 25 threes.
But from a coaching perspective, one more looking at this team
has something going on to wherethey were open for 20 of 25
threes People aren't taking thatinto account where it's like
these shots aren't highlycontested and nobody.

(01:02:03):
No, they're getting the ball upand down the floor.
They're lulling you intoplaying their style because they
do it all day.
For four quarters yeah, you ledat halftime.
Yeah, you led at the end of thethird.
And then how many times have welooked up and it was a tie game,
and now the Warriors win by 18?
And it's because they stuck totheir system.
And the system was great, somuch that it can go from

(01:02:24):
Harrison Barnes to an Iguoddollar, to Andre Wiggins, to,
you know, just plugging guys in.
And I think that's what weforgot, because the style was so
infectious and really what theyplayed on was your dream of
basketball.
They played on looking up yourfive, going out, bombing and

(01:02:47):
having a good time at it.
But the nuance of defense wasnot something that was
advertised nearly as much, andso the league said this is what
is driving engagement.
We saw that because Steph allof a sudden became the highest
selling jersey.
All right, the Warriors wereeverywhere.
It was the Splash Brothers, allof these little things that
came as a result.
You made the exception the rule, only to realize it wasn't

(01:03:08):
sustainable, because peopledon't shoot 40, 30 for their
career, at a clip to where youknow there were specialized guys
.
You used to have a michael red,you used to have a chris molyne
, you used to have a ray alley,you know you, you had guys who
were just this was kind of mycalling card and that was
perfectly fine.

(01:03:28):
But we got into a space wherenow we basically got rid of a
dwight and a javel because youcouldn't pull from three, yeah,
and now we're begging to havethose guys back and I think that
, yes, fixing the three-pointissue, whatever that means, but
I don't know how do you talkabout I'm?
going to fix and I'm like whatare you going to do?

(01:03:49):
You're going to put the lineback further right, yeah yeah,
so I think you have.
You're in a catch 22 with thatbecause it's it's so far out of
control.
But it's more than just threepoint.
It's a lack of skill set.
The physicality isn't thereanymore, so it drives this high
scoring.
You know it's a simple changeyou could bring back as a hand

(01:04:11):
check.

Robaire Taylor (01:04:11):
Yep, when you stop?

Christian Young (01:04:14):
being able to touch players.
The scoring went through theroof Because no point guard can
guard anybody.
Kyrie can't guard Luka to savehis life.
They happen to be on the sameteam.
Now, good for you, but Stephcan't guard Kyrie.
Like, come on, that's not evenwhat we're trying to accomplish
anymore.
We've made it so much so thatwe've adjusted the rules to
ensure that there's not anadvantage.

(01:04:34):
But that's not true.
The big man will always have anadvantage if he is.
I mean, you put Shaq.
You drop Shaq in any air andtell me where he wouldn't thrive
.
You could put Shaq in today'sair and where it'd be hard is on
defense, cause now somebody hasto pull up from three, so you'd
have to figure out a mismatchand everything, but just brute
force down on a block.
You still wouldn't be able todo anything.
You couldn't counter, chat atall.

Henri Taylor (01:04:56):
There's nothing you'd be able to do, pull that
out and go two for three.

They he gets a dunk, we get a three in that and
that's kind of what got you towhere you are today.
So it is.
It is more nuanced, it is abigger issue that they need to
be able to really get back tosome of the basics, not even
just on the court, but how theyadvertise the commercials.

Everything right, yeah yeah, I'm talking about a
complete overhaul, like thereneeds to be some kind of return
to what worked back in the 90sbecause, right, there was a
reason it worked now.
Granted, you had, you had theactual, you had the marquee
players, you had the michaeljordans, you had the charles
barkley, shaquille o'neal, youname it like an nba was really
good about marketing thoseplayers and building their

(01:05:38):
brands.

But you ask players now and the goat is is
paul george right?
Right for a lot of these kids.
And don't get me wrong, I lovepaul george's game.
It's fluid in it, but it justshows the shift in what what
they value is his fluidityversus yeah right, which is
crazy to me that and I get it.

There's one thing to see that and appreciate it.
That means these kidsunderstand enough about the game
that you can appreciate it.
The problem is like, if paulgeorge is your goal, what are
your real aspirations?
And that's not shittingittingon Paul George, that's asking a
legitimate question.
Like we shouldn't be looking atguys who, I mean, it's one
thing to be fluid with your playand have finesse, but what did

(01:06:16):
it result in for his career?
Like I mean, do you want to bea winner or do you want to look
good?

playing Aspire to four contracts.

Cool Four contracts.
I want to look fly, you know, Iwant, I want his movement, I
want to mimic his movement, butyeah, but what does it get you
in the long run?
But, um, back to what you weresaying.
I know I've been guilty of ittoo in the past.
I've laid, I've laid blame atthe feet of the golden state
warriors and steph curry inparticular.
We, a lot of us, have done this, um, errantly, because you to

(01:06:43):
blame him is super reductive andit's a it's over, it's um, it's
an oversimplification, to saythe least.
Um, because, again, it's nottheir fault.
That the only thing, other teams, because, like anything,
whether it's the nba, nfl andmusic industry, everything is
kind of a copycat league.
When something is working,people are going, people are

(01:07:03):
going to try to replicate that.
That's just how it should work.
So that's, that's how, that'show things go and business,
whatever, whatever's working,people are gonna try to
replicate that.
That's a given.
You should expect that.
But the problem is, uh, a lotof these kids, other teams,
players, the only takeaway wasthe high scoring, the
three-point shooting, the action, the, the, the ball movement,

(01:07:25):
the back and forth up and down,but again, like you mentioned,
like the philosophy, yeah, notthe transition nothing not the
defense easy not the playersthey can plug in.
Yeah, the plug and play the highiq uh players that they had,
because I mean the warriors weretargeting certain kind of
players and they literally Imean we tend to overlook their
bench.
I mean they had guys likeandreala, sean Livingston,

(01:07:50):
leandro Barbosa.
They had guys come off thebench who would be starters
anywhere else, who acceptedtheir role, and just all kinds
of guys.
Oh my goodness.
They can plug them in and theycan contribute, and I mean even
now, to some degree they'regetting contributions from guys
you wouldn't expect them to beaverage and double digits of who
anywhere else.
They might be seen at the endof the bench like flat out, yeah

(01:08:11):
, but um there's a I don't knowman.
Again it's so multi-layered Idon't know, I don't even know
where to start, like the,because again the anticipation
isn't there for anything, any ofthe products, the players, like
the signature shoe thing, Imean that's something.
That else completely, becausesneaker head culture has kind of
fucked that up.

(01:08:31):
Um, it's hard to anticipate ashoe release nowadays, if it's
not a jordan right?

yeah, it's like ron has been dominant, yeah
yeah, there ain't.

There's nothing to really be excited about.
Yeah, I've been like, yeah, Ineed to have that shoe.
Yeah, that too, in terms of thedesign innovation.
I mean, a lot of these shoesare for performance.
Where the shoes we were buyingwere performance and they can be
worn with an outfit, they werefashion as well, but the focus
now is on these shoes.
Yeah, now these shoes arepretty much just for performance

(01:09:03):
, and that's not a problem withthat.
For ballplayers, the problem is, we ain't all ballplayers, you
know.

They're not a problem with that for
ballplayers.
The problem is we ain't allballplayers.
You know Nike used to havesomething for everyone, if
everyone's fourth Jordan, butyou had different levels and
they were still cool.
Now the question I would askyou guys is this do you think
we'll see a time where we'll getback to basketball how we used
to love it as far as where thebig man games worked from inside
out?
Because I'm looking at nowwe're talking about when Steph
Curry and the Warriors wereplaying and winning.
There was a time where, you know, the big man role was

(01:09:38):
diminished.
So you had to try to create adifferent style of game.
And of course you had, you know, your world-class backcourt.
But when you think about it now, because you see the big guys
that are coming back into playskilled big men, they never left
.
You have to right.
But when you think about it now, you see if you could have a

(01:09:59):
person like wimby with you know,let's just say he had a younger
chris paul.
Imagine if wimby had a youngerchris pa Paul and you had a
system which can still play andset out, because, you think
about it, when you have adominant big man, you can still.
It still opens up shots, itstill opens up the perimeter,
you still have lanes, there'sstill a great system that you
can run out of an offensive set,that you can get up out of that

(01:10:23):
, and I think that was the thing.
There was a lack of big mantalent and the league we kind of
panicked and they were tryingto figure out how do we keep the
game going and keep it excitingwith lack of a big man.
But now the reemergence of thebig man is happening.
I think that some of the rulesneed to reflect that and we need

(01:10:43):
to get back to it because Iwant to see that.
I think that if you look at thechampions, I mean there's always
a big man.
The last couple of years it wasa big man's game, even if you
look at it dealing with you knowhe's not a typical big man, but
you still had.
You know you still had theTimberwolves.
They had big men, they stillwere playing a big man game.

(01:11:05):
I just think that, looking atthe game moving forward, they're
going to have to and that'sgoing to be up to the
commissioner to startimplementing.
You know, something that wouldallow a little bit more
physicality.
You know went away.
That really opened it up, whereit was just like free lanes all

(01:11:28):
day.
You can just get to the basketwho was good.
You know we're tired, we'reworried about fouling it and
even if it does, because theywere trying to stop going to the
you know, the free throw linethey're trying to keep the fast
paced game.
It's just looking forward andmoving forward.
We can't continue because Ithink even you know the new fans
, because we're still all livingoff.

(01:11:49):
Honestly, even you know thekids today they're still looking
at the Kobe era, but today'sgame don't look like the Kobe
era.
That don't look like that atall.
And you know we do have to getback.
I think back to the basics.
I think that's where it's goingto start, getting back to the
basics.
That's just my opinion.
I think that's where it's goingto start getting back to the
basics.

That's just my opinion.
History repeats itself in somesense.
So my answer to that is I thinkwe'll get closer to what we
used to see, but it won't everbe fully back there, because the
amount of money that playersmake alone dictates how you're
able to play them.
You have gotten to a point towhere, like I said, you play for

(01:12:30):
the Lakers but LeBron is afranchise, ad is a franchise In
and of themselves.
So it's kind of like and yousee that even just the
relationship between GM andplayer, where it's like, I can't
really go against you withoutfear for me getting knocked out
the window.
So I think we can get to abetter place, but I think what

(01:12:50):
we were accustomed to is gone,and that may still be okay
because we still have thebenefit of the nostalgia and
being able to live through that.
But this product that they haveon the floor now, when the
players are like, why are weplaying this all-star game?
That one right after Kobe, wasmagic, like.
That was just a perfect kind ofretro.

(01:13:12):
But you notice the difference.
It took for that man to have toleave us, for people to find a
reason to ignite their passionin playing again and that's all
that was.
It was back to true,traditional.
It felt like look, it felt likeus getting up on a Saturday
morning and walking to the parkand being like, hey, there's six
teams out here.

(01:13:32):
If we don't win, we're done,because you've got to wait for
four more teams to get off thefloor again.
Nobody got that time.
Hey, we've got to win this game.
You might not see the court forthe rest of the day.
Right, we've just got to winthis game, because if this game,
because, if not, yeah, if wewant to keep this team, because,
yeah, somebody might pick youup, a guy has to leave, but we

(01:13:52):
we used to get out there andjust we have to win this game.
And I think that's what thatfelt like, and that there was a
level of competitiveness, out ofrespect for what he did and who
he was, that superseded theirown desire, because now players
will tell you like I'm actuallybeing punished, the rest of the
squad is in Miami or Cancun orTulum or wherever they're at,
and I'm out here answering yeah,so what do you think this game

(01:14:15):
is going to be?
Like Whack as hell, like allthe other ones have been.
We just put up about 485 points, but I could have been on a
beach somewhere, and so I thinkthere's a way to be better.
But you know, in anotherepisode we'll have to discuss
what that MBA, because even youknow the way that there's a
several episodes, yeah.

(01:14:38):
There's a lack of teaching thatis going on at the lower level
because they're looking at aJames Harden step back, not
realizing that's not legal inhigh school.
But I'm not going to touch thattoday, that's a whole other
conversation.

A cup of coffee.
But yeah, your old step likeokay, am I putting in three more
steps and the shot would havespent.

And a lot of it and part of it is and I got to
say, for us now we're in thatunk generation, we're the old
heads For sure A lot of it isprobably the nostalgia and we're
comparing and contrasting it tothe game we grew up watching
and we love so much.
But to speak to that nostalgia,I want to switch gears a bit
but stay in the same lane.
Yeah, because we are at acertain age and we have an

(01:15:19):
appreciation for the time wegrew up in.
It was that you really had tobe there in the 90s.
It really was kind of like thepinnacle of human existence, if
you ask me.
But I think there might bescientific research to back that
up.
But, um, uh, speaking ofnostalgia, what's the flashback
y'all have in that era, back inthe 90s, 80s, that y'all whether
it's a shoe, it could be aplayer, a jersey, uh, a

(01:15:41):
television show, like what'ssomething that y'all that at
least that's been maybe inrecent days or weeks that has
you know that there's been a newmind.
You've thought about that.
You know it's kind of come upin conversation and something
that yeah.
So just to follow up questionis it just basketball or just no
, it can be.
It can be just a flashback, ingeneral, I mean, to a moment in

(01:16:02):
time.
I'm going to go.

Yeah, Because it was so funny.
I was having this conversationwith my daughter and it was such
a weird feel.
So we get an ice cream truckthat comes out here like at 8, 9
o'clock at night and I'm justkind of like it's raining.
I have no clue what type of icecream you're selling, my man,
but I was having a conversationwith my daughter.

(01:16:25):
Oh, I know what kind of icecream.

Yeah, Y'all got an idea.
I was having a conversationwith my daughter.

Oh, I know what kind of ice cream I had.
Ice cream man, yeah.

Right, we all got an idea.
Yeah, we all.
Good, we know what time thatshit is.

Right.
So I was talking to my daughterand I was like when we were
kids playing outside, there wasa donut truck that came through.
Mm-hmm oh, some of the bestdonuts I've ever had in my life
as an adult.
I was like I have no clue wherethese donuts were coming from.

(01:16:55):
There was a gutted van withjust racks put in it with donuts
as sweet and as soft as theycould be.
I was like that was such a timeto be a kid and to have a
dollar, not 15, not 20.
A dollar, a dollar, yeah.
When if you had three or fourfriends who had a dollar too and

(01:17:20):
y'all just y'all out, yeah.

As Gil Scott Heron would say, yeah, back when the
buck stopped here, you couldactually buy something with it
Like, yeah, let's get theseBoston baked beans, let's get
these lemon heads, let's getthese nachos.
Alexander the Great.

Listen, and a buttermilk and a maple bar, and
that was just something recentwhere I was like it goes back to
you just had to be there.
So for me, that flashback isjust being able to be a kid with
a dollar, a dollar, and to beable to Lottery winnings back

(01:17:55):
then.
Yeah, we grew up.
You went in the house.
Yeah, it's a good chance.
That was a death sentence.
Yeah, don't get thirsty.
You better grab this water hosebecause if you go in, you're
going to have to clean up.
Yeah, you're going to have toclean up.
Such and such is coming over,so go clean the kitchen or do
this.
And you just feel like, nah, atall costs, if I had that dollar
, don't let me have saved it,because everybody used theirs

(01:18:15):
before and I got two.
You'll see me tomorrow Twowhole dollars, shit.

That's a small fortune for a young boy back in
the day A lady at the casino.

Yeah, you know.
But yeah, that's my flashbackman, just meaning, just
remembering how simple it was tobe a kid with a dollar or two
and to be adequately fed and orentertained, you know, with a
dollar or two.

So that's, that's mine for this week in the
words of Wu-Tang can it be thatit was all so simple?
Can it be?
Yes, okay, I'm going to go inthere.
I know you guys remember thisSummertime it's hot outside.
Do we remember the flip-flopNike jerseys and wetting the

(01:19:05):
jersey because it was so hotoutside and wedding the jersey
because it was so hot outside,putting on our Nike jersey and
Nike shorts with some ChrisRebbers or whatever Nike shoes
you had on and your Nike hat orvisor and making a run.
We're going to the basketballcourt.
It's Saturday morning and thatwas the place to be, and they go
up there.
Now, mind you, I don't know,you know, with this new

(01:19:26):
generation, but back then youplaying with grown men 13, 14,
it didn't matter.
You want to get on the court,you had to go up against grown
men and I think you know thisword young blood, oh yeah.

Yeah, pretty much.
Yeah, wake up.

And for us not to.
It didn't intimidate us at all.

It was like no, it was just learning.

It was learning the game, yeah, and you got
roughed up a little bit and hewas like, oh no, you know, just
to be able to get a rebound onthat grown man like, yeah, I got
that to be able to box out andget them right.
It was the competitive naturein us to want to play because,
like you were saying earlier,andre, if you lost you had to
wait at six, seven games beforeyou had another chance to get
your run.

You might wait till tomorrow In all reality.

We'll do this again Sunday.

But just to do that, walk to the park, get
hungry, go to the donut shop orgo to Burger King because they
have them dollar whoppers.
And to go and get something toeat, go to Thrifty, get to get a
squirt bottle top, get a twoliter of Dr Pepper and go home

(01:20:37):
and just eat until our stomachsbusted.
And to have a two liter each.

Just to do that on my stomach, laying on my
stomach on the floor.
And we had a video games, butthat was on the floor, and then
you know it would be young.

And we had our.
You know, we had our videogames, but that was after the
fact, that was like after theday was gone.
You know, we had our, got ourruns in and we would play some
NBA live.

More of a consolation prize if we tried
All right.
We got to go in the house,let's do it.
Dare I say house?

let's do it.
Yeah, there I say, let's gobefore that.
What about bulls versus blazers?
We?
I mean, we get some ncaa supernintendo, come on now, let's.
You know, let me go ahead andget nostalgic on you guys, but
yeah, it was a good time, but itwasn't nothing like.
And also, one thing, too, wasto wake up and that nike
commercial came on when theywent through their campaign of,

(01:21:26):
like, entering all the sportsyou know.
Remember I think you had thesong you know and we all shine
on.
Do you remember my goodness?

oh, bear man yeah that yeah man, you're gonna
trigger something.

Yeah, yeah, that was magical saturday and you
knew that you could see forpeople that are be listening.
We come from a generation wherebeing in a house and not being
able to go outside was likedeath sentence.
Saturday mornings, you had tobe on the court and be outside
and be ready to do everythingwith it.
Oh yeah, that was just likeputting shoes on.

(01:22:00):
That was the first thing.
So that's what I remember Just.
I mean just thinking about itand hearing that Nike commercial
in my head To this day.

I mean just thinking about it and hearing
that Nike commercial in my headTo this day man it still, it
triggers something.
It was a magical time yeah.

Because you know what you're going to hear.
You know, marv Albert, you knowtoo, and they're going to just
remind her.
You know, I think of Dukebasketball like my yeah.

It reminds me of my early days of falling in love
with Duke basketball andChristian Laettner and Grant
Hill were they were.
They were gods to me at thatpoint.
But yeah, that was yeah,definitely that triggers that.

It's the thought of it, guys.
That's what I'm saying.

Side note, we used to hoop with the armor.
God on that.
I mean to think about how thethe amount of clothing we had on
when we would go play.
You got on a heavy t-shirt,sometimes a jersey on top of
that, and we used to actuallyplay in our NBA jerseys.
Not, hey, I'm going to the ballLike we.
Actually, you got this Zoe andthese shorts on and you are

(01:23:03):
literally playing in officialNBA gear.
But I think back, and a lot oftimes we had on two pair of
shorts.

Kept a pair underneath, whatever we were
wearing.

We didn't know where we were going after.
Yeah, we're literally pullingoff jeans, basketball shorts at
the ready, two pair of shortsunder.

Under your nylon sweats and shit the swishy ass
nylons.
You got shorts on.
You had to have your basketballshorts on.
Yeah, you had to.
You had to have your basketballshorts on underneath you,
whatever I tell you we werebulletproof, yeah, yeah no doubt
what's yours.
For me, man.
Uh, you made an interestingpoint.
I was thinking of something alittle bit different.
Um, not so much the value of adollar back then, but I I always

(01:23:46):
talk to my kids about the valueof the freedom that we had was
more.
I mean, that was way more thana dollar.
I mean monetarily, before a kidagain back then you're talking
about 80s, late 80s, mid to late80s.
Yeah, a dollar was everything.
Like you, you thought you couldbuy your own house and a car
with that money back in the day.
But what I value the most Iremember is a conversation I had

(01:24:11):
with my daughter last weekabout how we'd get up and go out
and play and I'm not sure if itwas just because our parents
weren't aware as much Maybe itwasn't in the news cycle about
the dangers of kids beingoutside, left to their own
devices and their little friendgroups and the potential of

(01:24:34):
adults harming children.
Maybe it wasn't as prevalent orit just wasn't as talked about.
That it was kind of somethingthat wasn't on our radar.
So for that reason our parentsafforded us a level of freedom
that we understood it.
I mean, we appreciated it backthen.
But I have a.
I value it a whole lot more now.
It may have been too muchfreedom, but literally we'd be
able to get on our bikes knowinggood and hell.

(01:24:57):
Well, we shouldn't have beenleaving the block or our, our
little you know our communitybut we'd end up.
You know, yeah, don't leave thisstreet or don't go past this
street.
We damn near at fucking santamonica beach.
You know, yeah, don't leavethis street or don't go past
this street.
We damn near at fucking SantaMonica Beach.
You know what I'm saying.
Like, yeah, mobbing a group ofkids on bikes and skateboards
and scooters several miles awayfrom home.

(01:25:18):
Way too young to be out thatfar away from home.
No cell phone, no way to get incontact with anybody Right To
put in a pay phone.
Yeah, you might have to dialcollect if you were thinking
about calling home like that,which would.
It really wasn't on our mindfor the most part, but we had no
way to be contacted in a caseof an emergency and that never,

(01:25:38):
that never even occurred to us,obviously because we didn't have
the foresight to know aboutcell phones and, uh, any any
kind of mode of communication atthat time, but it was just the
ability to go outside and theworld was literally like it was
your oyster, like it was the newadventure every day and you
were given the freedom to gooutside and explore, and that

(01:25:58):
may have been doing part to thefact that there was still some
semblance of community.
It was still.
I think we were the lastgeneration to grow up, Nosy
neighbor?

Yeah, we still.
It was up at six o'clock withher cup of coffee looking at
everything where everybody was.

I still say we're the last generation to have some
semblance of a neighborhood.
Before it just became the hood,you actually had neighbors that
you knew and in some cases youtrusted them.

You trusted them .
You knew them by their names.
Right, you knew them by theirnames first and last name.

You knew the entire family so you can trust
that your kid was safe at theirhome around their kids.
You knew those kids as well.
The community kids, the adultsactually looked out for the kids
.
I remember we talked about thisall the time living in the
jungles, how we would be outsideand we would.
Our mother would basically usethe local gangbangers as a page
to go and retrieve us.

(01:26:47):
Hey, homie, you so-and-so son,your mom wants you back at home.
You need to get back home.
It's getting dark.
Like I don't even know thisdude, like who the fuck did you
tell me to get back home?
You know, you know your mom'sfriend, right well, she wants
you to go back home becausey'all, y'all been outside all
day.
It's seven o'clock, it'sgetting dark.
You need to head back, littlehomie it was valid.

Yeah, you got my mom's first name.
You actually right my timeright.
You've been outside since 8 35hell okay, I gotta go to some
degree.

this is just an adult telling you what to do.
You minded that instruction,because what else are you gonna
do?
But I remember like there wassome level of care, like there
was some looking out for thekids in the neighborhood.
Adults would not let you wanderaimlessly and just do what you
wanted to, though we did anyway.
Yeah, because we just weren'tsupervised all day, but we took
our freedom and ran with it andwe had a blast.

(01:27:34):
I mean just thinking of all theshit we did in a day.

Yeah, it was.
We'll have to recap some ofthat for the rest of the show.
Yeah, man, just yeah, yeah,yeah.

One day is yeah.
One day is a lifetime for thesekids.
Nowadays, it's like youcouldn't imagine the shit we got
into the mischief.

The fun, and all that on the verge of jail.

Yeah, for real.
And some of that stuff was justgood, old, clean, harmless boy
fun.
It was pretty standard stuff.
But that's what I remember isjust the amount of freedom that
we had and we were afforded at avery young age, at a time where
our parents again probably werewere naive to the possible
dangers and the threats thatwere lurking, or they just you

(01:28:15):
know, again they, they grew uplike us, being outside playing,
so they they took it as as itwas.
so it is yeah kids, kids will bekids and we'll go out and play.
So that's, that's my flashback,man, just the that time and
this before even I want to saythis is I'm talking about a time
before being a, an adolescent,but the time before being a
teenager I'm talking about beinga small child outside.

(01:28:37):
You know, this is back in thelate 80s and mid to late 80s.

We outside just roaming, you know what I mean in
the world yeah, let's not takefor granted, for those that
didn't grow up in SouthernCalifornia, the 80s, and not the
late 80s going into the 90s,this was the emergence of you
forget about that to the drugsof the gangs oh, definitely that
was the height of the gangculture in Southern California

(01:29:04):
some of the best times of innerchildhood.
That's the irony of it right itwas.
It was a great time, some ofthe best times of inner
childhood.
I know it sounds crazy.
Yeah, that's the irony of it.
Right, it was a great time.
It couldn't have been anybetter.

For sure.
Yeah, man, I think that I likethat.
I think we should bring that tomake that a reoccurring segment
because it was a good littleflashback there.
But anything in closing fellas,I think this was a good one.

No, I'm just happy to be back in the saddle man uh
, same here trying to get to, Imean, a level of mastery.
You know it'll take some time,but I want to put in again my
you know, some hours towardsthat 10 000 to get to that level
where we kind of mastered thisgame.
We figured out exactly who ourmarket is, who we're serving,
who we are.
Get more comfortable on the mic, you know what I mean.
I hope a day comes where I'm,I'm not even being mindful of
having a mic in front of me andhaving an ear set on and we're
just having a conversation likewe do when we're on the phone.

(01:29:53):
We and that can go on for hoursabout any and everything from
eating out to, you know,traveling to whatever it is.
That that's on the docket fairday that we end up just talking,
going into organically andnaturally.
But, um, it's just good to beback and, uh, familiarizing
myself back in these settingsagain, which is my own garage,
quite frankly.
It ain't like I'm going to astudio or nothing, but it just

(01:30:13):
getting familiar with thisenvironment again.
Not yet, yeah, being back hereon the mic tinkering with my,
you know, tinkering with my micsand shit like that and all my
equipment, which is that can befun in and of itself, but it's
just fun to get back with usdoing this because we needed it.
You know, maybe everybody elsedoes too, for that matter, I
hope.
Hopefully, everybody else feelslike they need it too.
They want to hear from us moreoften, so that's just going to

(01:30:36):
be back today I was so excitedand so happy.

I don't know it's been a long time.
I'm not saying that I wasn'thappy, but I have something to
look forward to on a SundayOther than you know.
Know, I love my family, butjust something for us, you know,
because we're older and youknow, of course we have our own
families and lives.
But just to do this and youkind of give people a peek into
our world, you know, and just tobe here and doing what we

(01:31:03):
actually like, doing this, youknow, and it for you guys,
you'll start hearing some of theslang and words that we use
that we've kind of came up withover the years.
Like, if I were to sum today up, it was I know I'm taking back,
you know, in the words of UncleRon dope is the day you guys
dope is the day, you know, andyou know.

(01:31:24):
I think that's fitting becausewe were in the conversation
about, you know, watchingbasketball in the 90s and
growing up and things, and UncleRon and his back-of-the-day
shot just reminiscing about thatand us having those
conversations.
It was dope as the day.

So I fully concur, man, it's just good to
be back.
What you guys don't realize iswe would literally five, six,
seven, eight hours of full-onconversation like this and we
finally decided to bring it tothe mic.
So just looking forward togetting back, to giving it to
you and growing in this thing,man.
So everybody be safe, take care, we'll see you next episode.

Y'all, we out y'all.

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