EP 44 John Goodby

Episode Transcript
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Intro/Outro (00:02):
Let's drop the green flag on this episode of
the talent tank podcast withyour host Wyatt Pemberton
bringing you the best, fastest,most knowledgeable personalities
and Ultra4 and off road ra ing.

Wyatt Pemberton (00:20):
Alright, alright. Alright, here we go.
Everyone back at it. Thanks fortuning in pallant tank another
episode coming at you. Oh man wegot this guy behind the scenes
another kind of behind thescenes guy but he's not easy. He
runs a show over at NorCal rockracing. He's been involved with
ultra forces before before wasultra for his series is
definitely older. JOHN Goodby aot of people know you as the is

(00:45):
he timing guy. But you're notust the timing guy. How you
oing john? I'm pretty good,an. So you're coming to us live
rom Las Vegas? Yeah, but you'reot from you're not from Vegas.
ou don't live in Vegas? Why areou in Vegas? I'm here for
olley LS fest West not nottrippers and blow. No, no, not

(01:05):
eally my forte. Your forte. Andhat are you doing there to
olly LS fest so started out aouple of years ago on the West
oast originally they contactedltra for and me to do a build
or them for the off roadection at their show. And by
ill that's a course you You areyou can run some heavy
quipment. You tend to be theuy on the dozer build the

(01:27):
umps. Yeah, yeah, we have areat team or really just one
ne person me and another guy,hris l rod from alward Pro
traps. Most people know him asird and I pretty much build
verything together but there'sozers moving old for vans it's
sually hammer I and Holly'sontracted us for last couple of
ears to do their build for themor the off road show here. So
hat's super cool. So I didn'tnow I've seen the rod stuff

(01:50):
ike Nick Nelson that you knowlways Pippen rod straps. So
e's also a heavy equipmentperator today. That's a bird
hat's bird he's a man like soe you know since I started in
orkout rock racing, he's beennly from the beginning like he
s literally the last loneoldier of knockout rockers and
olunteers not volunteer anymorebviously but had limit straps
nd tie downs and everything canell yeah closing closing the

(02:12):
oop. Well gosh, you guys I meanou hear that? I didn't realize
hat but you can support l rodsnd put a rod straps on your ar.

Unknown (02:20):
I mean, if you if you watch a king of hammers 2020 I
mean that strap held Markos cartogether. That's that's his
trap. That was when Marcusclipped the tree and came in
floppy jalopy on the rightfront. Yep. And the upper arms
broke off and holding holdingthose limit strap was literally
l rods bow straps for a goodlittle pitch there. That is a
great pitch. That's a greatstory. Everyone knows everyone

(02:43):
knows the Marco story but didn'trealize that that was it. Wow.
Um, I would normally just calldown to California and in order
me up a set of straps from a wasthat over there in a Norco
though? Yeah, yeah, one of thoseguys. Yeah, one of those guys.
There's a bunch of guys thatmake straps. hE hE ruffstuff
specialties actually, not thatI'm pitching roughed up, but

(03:03):
they stalk his dog or his trapsand stalk and he's got a patent
on some of the stuff that's inthose traps to help him from
Terran. And he's put a lot ofthought into it and start making
the wide straps for tires andwhatnot. He's He's, he's rad.
he's a he's a machine man. Like,we'll do 15 hours in the dozer
together and get off and do itagain next day. Wow. Well, I'm
just making mental notes. Well,okay, so you guys are well, both

(03:26):
of you two together in this tripdown there in Vegas. Are you
solo? So yeah, I'm actually so Ihave another guy with me right
now. But he's helped me outbefore. Chris is actually he
works with me full time. And wedid pools as a regular business
that we started there. I startedand he's been working for me. So
we didn't finish our projects.
So he's home. And I'm here. Youjust had a big race this past

(03:46):
weekend. Yeah, yeah, we hadaround one of the 2021 knockout
rock racing series up infriendly Nevada. And in for
everyone. Listen, you're you'reright. It wasn't this past
weekend for you. This was aweekend that weekend ago, but I
we're recording after you know,we're recording very, very close
to when the singer so we get youknow, the most current the best
up to date information. But uh,so yeah, so you put on that race

(04:09):
who end up winning the 4400 racethere. jp Gomez. He did. I think
he's going on like his uh, Ithink he's got three or four
championships with Norco crazy.
Again, I'm one of those guys whoI don't necessarily always
remember who wins by definitelyremember who puts on the biggest
show. And Ron prindle put on thebiggest show. Yeah, he cleared

(04:30):
that out. That's I mean, he wasmaking up time on those guys.
And he just he went for it. Andthen you had who rolled you had
you had a couple of good rollson and heat one. You had Marcos?
Marcos? No, no, no. Marcos wasin there. Marcos rolls rolls but
roll rolling the main that wasin the main on like lab. I don't

(04:51):
even know three maybe who werewho rolled in heat one though.
Brian Thompson I believe that'swho it was. Okay. So yet
newstar Yeah, you guys had whenthe camera could zoom in and no
one said it on that theannouncer never said it. But
when the cameras zooming in, oryou got was the belly of the
car? Oh, they all kind of lookthe same belly in the black car.

(05:13):
Yeah, I mean, technically,that's a UFO car indirectly, you
know, I mean, it was a brother.
So Joe Thompson so definitely, Imean, I guess the billing could
be the same. Just go back. 10years. Yeah, right. gin minus
point, like, Yeah. Is that bigbefore Go man has he? Yeah, it
was I think it was before U of Oso I don't know whatever that

(05:33):
whatever that acronym be. But Ithought was pretty cool to saw.
See Kevin Yoder out there.
yoders machine man. He's raisedthem from the very beginning.
Like he's literally from thefirst pre NorCal rockeries and
which we'll get into later.
Yeah, Kevin's been there. He'sbeen. He's been a soldier and
he.

(05:53):
He kills it. He gets he lays itout on the line. And he actually
hit he had a pretty good show.
There he stuff the front end alittle nosewheel in the
Rockpile, too. Yeah, he had apretty good
video there. How long does ittake you to set up for that
event? For NorCal round? Fernleyis a new new location. So we've
only raised her three times. Andwhen I first went there in

(06:13):
October last year, gettingtrying to get to the COVID
stuff. That area never beentouched. It was robbed at
Northern Nevada desert. So itwas a it was it had been
untouched, like no water. Nope,no course. So we cut in just
just shy of a two hour course infour days. And then we had

(06:36):
another rate with Norco side byside, which is a branch of
Markel rock racing. We ran thata month before up there were
just side by side classes. Andthe track was 10 times what it
was the first one in October.
And then this last one,with the Wild West closing down
and the date change. Literally,I got the phone call on
Thursday, pre race week. SoSaturday morning and loaded up,

(06:58):
went straight there built a fiveacre parking lot because I
wanted more parking, and prepthe track and then went back on
Wednesday morning and workedWednesday to practice start at
two o'clock on Friday. So alongthose lines in you drop the the
easter egg there about you know,the Nationals is you know, shut
down. And I know there's ascramble in the discussion about

(07:19):
where this is going. I've seenFernley throw out there thrown
out there numerous times onsocial media and I've never
heard anyone say it to me inperson or at least on the phone
or anything like that is iscertainly a hack now that you've
been there you've put on racesthere. Is that a viable location
for an old for nationals? Ithink yeah, I think when I built

(07:39):
that place originally when Ifirst one I first pre sighted
The location is basicallyPrairie City on steroids. So I
built a spectator Hill that'sthree times the size of the
grass areas at Prairie City tofiddle with ever been there we
call spectator Hill and then Itear the hill out. So there's
actually you can set an easy upup and still see over the, you
know, on the top tier, you canstill see over the second tier

(08:01):
with an easier but it'sdefinitely something there. It's
it's got a great future andpotential like I when I tell
people what I want to do there,everyone sees the vision I think
my vision is, is pretty solidfrom building tracks, you know,
a little bit of everywhere. So Ithink is definitely viable. I
mean, that's the stuff that Daveand I have to talk through zoo.
And there's obviously some otherlocations on the table, but it's

(08:21):
for sure for sure. It'd beamazing, but we'll see. I
wouldn't try to back you intoyou know, alluding to anything
with friendly. I just seen itfloated and since not having
been there in this weekend.
Was it was it you text me rightbefore the greenfire heat one?
And I did not I was followingSam fleabay and following rush

(08:43):
and then I didn't I don't knowescaped me. I flip it open. And
there it is. Everyone is stagedto the line. It's like the Gomez
fleet. I'm like, Oh, I'mwatching this
for four laps of this and justoh man. It was great. Dan wyrick
in heat one walking away. Andthen just getting real back in.
Just he just got real. I mean,he had he got he was so far out

(09:05):
front. I'm like oh yeah, he'sgood. And then yeah, he just got
reeled in man, but Dan waskicking himself Yeah, yeah, I
don't watch many races so likeit's sometimes you tell me ask
me questions like knowing whowon? Technically only reason I
really know how one is because Ijust read the checks.
So So is that your thing? Isthat where you get the pleasure

(09:27):
the satisfaction the you know,the the fulfillment is from the
executing the prep the plan andthen getting it going? And then
once it's going it's the shipthe ship left port, the train
left the station? Yeah, no, Imean, once we get going, I mean,
bird takes over on the track andI don't go on the track anymore.
I pretty much let him just heruns the track handles recovery

(09:49):
handles between him and mytiming my timing team. I don't
even do time anymore aroundevents. So between the stagers
and timers and my pre stagersand and bird and
They just they handle thetraffic and I put up the fires
outside the fences, I guessyou'd say. And it's an amazing
team. You know, with this, it's,it goes pretty well, I feel now
we run a real tight crew. Imean, there's,

(10:11):
there's like seven, you know,seven core staff maybe running
that event. Maybeyou're pulling off a damn big
event. And we're, you know,we're dealing Yeah, we're doing
27 races and eight hours. That'salways impressive. I'm always
impressed. You know, anyone thatputs those on, I would struggle
I get where there's, there'scalls to be made in making calls

(10:32):
in like the heat a momentwithout all the information or
with partial information. I knowthat's, that's hard. And it
makes the second guessing theMonday quarterbacking afterwards
be all that much. tough to dealwith, right? Oh, yeah. I mean,
do you know just some of thestuff that happens on the track?
I get? No, I have no idea what'sgoing on. I mean, sometimes I
won't see a race at all. So it'spretty tough. I have to rely on

(10:55):
on unburdened what he saw andyou know, he's my head. attrack
official, I guess you'd comparehim to DT before. He's a little
more rash and a little moreaggressive than JT JT is a
little more people pleaser.
bertel tell you how it is if youlose them, and he's got a yellow
flag out. You better hide inyour truck. You can get this JT

(11:16):
I you know, I love JT great,buddy. I go anywhere if that guy
do anything for him, but hetalks a big game.
Yeah, yeah. The knife edge ham,you know? Yeah. I love JT. He's
not as scary as he used to be. Ithink that's right. I think he
is he mellowing in his old age?
Yeah, I think Yeah, that'd bethere. scarier. People have been

(11:37):
on staff. So he got he gotdemoted and scariness level
as he turned 50 yet, I don'tknow. I mean, he's probably like
170 by now. He's like a vampire.
is if he's in Texas, I'm easilyat least 170 by now. Right?
amount of birthdays. He has. Oh,well. Yeah, he has 365 of those

(11:58):
a day. I mean, yeah, you'reright. I was going to show it
with 170 cuz I figured somepeople miss him sometimes.
Sometimes. Yes. He's a greatguy. I really do like the the
team that ultra for has has puttogether but you ended up you in
that mix. We'll get there downthe road. We'll go back to to
Current Affairs and so Holly LSfest you got down there. Okay,

(12:21):
so you leave your race. Youbroke down. You know, break it
down. Saturday, Sunday. You getback from Fernley get back to
your place you live. You liveoutside Folsom, California,
right outside Sacramento. Yeah,I'm a little east on McCarren
Park like shingle springs camphard border now. That's the road
that you when you head out ofFolsom towards Tahoe. head
toward the Eldorado forest. Yep,highway 50. Like I'm for exits

(12:45):
from, like, I used to liveacross the freeway from Prairie
City. Literally, you can see myhouse from Prairie City. Like if
you knew which way you'relooking. And I moved up, and I
grew up in that town and Folsombut I needed some dirt. I needed
some land. So I moved up thehill on I made it for exits. I
went real far.
Not real far. Oh yeah. Of allthe towns in California that I

(13:08):
was. I haven't spent a ton oftime outside of Johnson Valley
and hammer town. The most timeI've spent California has been
in Folsom. And it was years andyears of going there to visit
the California independentsystem operator, California so
and back when they were on blue,blue ravine road, and then the
bunker was over there. And thenthey moved everything over to

(13:30):
iron point with the new facilityand controlling all the
electricity that comes in andproduced in and consumed in the
state of California. That'scrazy. I don't even know that
was there. That's funny. That'sI mean, I grew up in Folsom. And
when we moved there, I mean, Iwas four years old. So I mean, I
watched that town grow. I've hadmultiple houses and areas that I

(13:54):
used to ride a dirt bike in. Imean, I used to ride my dirt
bike where the hospital is,right. And so that town is it's
definitely grown. My parents arestill in the same house. My
school bus went through theprison, you know, and picked up
the kids that the kids thatlived there. The state workers
lived in the prison grounds andyeah, it was a it was a cool
town. Yeah. famous, famous songright now. Yeah, Johnny Cash.

(14:15):
Yeah, they built the trailer.
They built a new bike trailActually, that's there. So Oh,
no kidding. Yeah, yeah, there'sa giant gas trail now. Yeah, so
that's pretty cool.
Now is the like there's thelakewater really down here. I
don't know if the like rightnow. It's more like a puddle.
But yeah, yeah, like that lookspretty good. It's like it's a
good leg glide, good fishing, alot of good recreation. That's

(14:37):
amazing place. Definitelyamazing place to grow. I'd fly
out there I would have work soI'd be at Cal ISO during the
day. And thenI would schedule the fly back
not the next day but thefollowing day, and I would leave
and I would head to head up tothe elder out of Tahoe to
actually down a mountain house.
Not to the cat house but toschaefers and help

(15:00):
racecars and DSI.
Oh good. And then they do thedrive back and kind of work
vacation day outwest around racecars into a business trip.
That's aleveraging some good stories
about trying to get back throughthe Eldorado and like in
wintertime when snow. And yeah,the Caltrans workers out there

(15:20):
like walking in Yeah, like,Where do you think you're going?
Yeah. And I got to catch aflight in the morning, man.
Yeah, I've been I've been inmany places, obviously, you
know, Gene racing my whole life.
And I mean, Folsom is centrallylocated now or an hour or
Domingo snowy Elena 35 minutes,or I can, if you want to go to
San Cisco, you can be there anhour. You know, it's pretty

(15:41):
centrally located airports. Andour you know, 40 minutes away
like, I don't know, man, I'vebeen in a lot of places in this
country. And I don't know whereelse to go. I don't think I'm
leaving. No. Wait for exits fromFolsom, I guess. But besides
that, besides it, I mean, you'reyou're close to wine country.
You can go down to Fairfield ifyou want to get yourself some,
you know, some jelly bellies. Imean,

(16:03):
there's a button. There's aBudweiser plant down there. Oh,
it's not that I drink butthere's one down there.
Do you not drink you drink? No,no, I'm not a big drinker. Now.
I like beer. I mean, I'll drinkother stuff. firewall, but yeah,
I tried at races. I try to keepit pretty chill. I drink a lot
of water. That's kind of mydrink. Lrr bit. So he's gonna

(16:24):
have a firewall out. I'll havethose. Yes, I struggled with.
You know, I'm no secret. I'm adiabetic. And so when I was I
was having a lot of problemswith meds and getting my meds
right. I was hungry. So Iactually stopped drinking for
quite a while. Once we got thosemeds right. Back to the beer.
Yeah, no game on. Hi, Game on.

(16:46):
We're good. Yeah, so you grew upin Folsom? Oh, life. Where did
you go to college? You have adegree in business management?
Yeah. I went to CSU CaliforniaState University. So Sacramento
You didn't even you really dolove that area? You didn't get
involved? Yeah, there's storiesbehind that. Yeah, usually
that's the you know, like youdidn't you didn't want to get

(17:09):
away from home you didn't wantto get from your parents or or
it's a significant other rightyou've got a girlfriend and they
didn't go somewhere. It's got tobe some reason right? Yeah, the
cell the real story is i was imean go for backwards in my
life. I was racing motocrossstill, and I want to go down to
Southern California. That'swhere the mecca was. But um, my

(17:30):
family business was here. And Iwas racing motocross, I thought
I was gonna, I thought I wasgonna be you know, Ricky
Carmichael. Right. So just likeeveryone else does. So I played
around junior college for youknow, I took a couple extra
shifts, you know, so, you know,one class here, one class there,
you know, it's more important torender by. So by the time I was
getting ready to transfer, getout junior college, I was

(17:52):
getting older. And I just prettymuch told myself, I swear, I
told my parents, they swear Ididn't tell them. But you know,
if I didn't make it, like alegit pro by, you know, 2021 I
was going to hang it up. And,and I think that's about time I
transferred at Sac State. AndI hung the boots up and put my
head down and finished schooland started my first company and
help with the family company.

(18:12):
And it made sense to stay homeand the business program is tax
day, it's really, really good.
And full circle, my grandmaactually got her master's from
there. So my grandma got towatch me walk at Sac State where
she got her master's. So likekind of full circle of that's
how that's how I stayed. I thinkthis is a very cool your grain
to go down is you mentioned youknow, your family, your family

(18:35):
had a business and I know youtoday to be an entrepreneur with
multiple things, kind of like afreelancer, kind of like a
mercenary for hire, but also,you have multiple avenues that
you've started. Talk us throughthat you're living, I guess
under that guise, of being yourown boss every single day,
because some people are I mean,some people have that, that

(18:57):
that's the only thing that theycan do. And that's the only
thing they see themselves doing.
And that's their drive. And thenyou got other people are like,
man, I just want my eight tofive.
I wish I mean, I would know thateight to five look like I don't
even know what I don't know, toseven to seven looks like. But
you know, a family coming. Mydad's a hard worker. Mom's
right. Mom ran the company withthem. As excavation company we

(19:18):
did. We did finish grading onproduction houses and we hit we
were a medium sized company. Andthe ML man just is a machine
like he he would still work tothis day if he could see,
unfortunately got maculardegeneration of his eyes. So
he's going blind slowly. But Imean, he was on a tractor. I
mean, he's 79 and he was on atractor probably till he was 75.

(19:41):
And still I work in every guy wehad. So the family company was
huge. We actually recently justshut the doors down, not COVID
not liberals just dis businessdecisions, you know, capital. I
mean, guess the liberalsCalifornia. being compliant with
equipment and trucks and stuffis a bunch of money to spend at
the end of the year of the endof 2020 and
I just made a I made a decisionbetween another business I have

(20:04):
and racing and everything else Iwant to do in my life it just it
was it was too much too muchwork for me and I wasn't good.
And honestly, I wasn't goodenough on on equipment to make
up for my guys when they would,you know, call in sick or they
were just dragging ass for lackof terms. I wasn't I wasn't my
dad, I wasn't I wasn't amachine. I mean, I spent more

(20:25):
time on my dirt bike and Itransitioned in the building the
race tracks and whatnot, Ididn't spend the time on the
finish grading aspect of thatbusiness. So I just, I just flat
out wasn't as good as I neededto be to bail out anything we
need to do. So between that andCalifornia compliance and trucks
I would have been, you know,well over half a million dollars

(20:45):
stay in business and just wasn'ton paper didn't make any sense.
I just so we almost 50 years, weshut the door. It was kind of
almost like a failure, but notand. But my parents are happy.
They're they're okay. They'reold. So we're cranking I'll say
it this way. If anything isconstant in life, it's change.

(21:06):
Nothing's nothing's forever.
Yeah, there's really nothing isforever and and that said, it is
um, you said that your your yourfamily business 50 years closed,
but on the flip side, thatallows you to make the next
business and make the nextbusiness and make the next Yeah,
and that's a left a left thedoor open like so I guess go
back to the part of the reasonis the game changed, right? I

(21:27):
mean, the grading business whenyou when you have a painter or
drywall guy or, or a rooferthose guys show up and pick up
trucks, right and have materialsdelivered in their, you know,
their overhead is a couple guysX amount of dollars an hour and
they show up in their truck andthey do their thing and they
leave you know, even in theconcrete world, it's like that.
But with the escalation side,we're showing up with a quarter

(21:48):
million dollars in equipment,and we're the least paid trade
on that job. You know, andthat's when my old man and he
did all those years, he made itwork made a great living, you
know, you know, he always workedand we and it was okay, you
know, we weren't, we weren't,well, rich weren't poor, right.
But with the game changing andthe cost of equipment, operating
costs and fuel and everythingelse and being in being the
cheapest trade like a painterpaints a house for 10 grand, you

(22:11):
know, and they do for day, butwe go on to finish grade 10
houses before landscapers getthere. And we're in there for
like five grand for 10 houseslike it was dirt is drastic. So
there's some guys out there weare all we're competition state
and they you know, they'rethere. They're growing and
picking up our slack and, youknow, more power to them.
Because not all the deals abunch of trucks and a bunch of

(22:32):
tractor breaking all the time.
Yeah, thin margin. Now, as youmove forward with all the new
equipment, the tunes theprogramming, they're not easy to
just fix in the field, you got ahome to the dealership. And
there's, there's, I mean, thejohn deere is in the middle of
multiple lawsuits over theproprietary Enos of their
software. And the ability toeven work on your stuff now is

(22:55):
how to call, you know, thisafternoon from a friend that
he's been doing. He's like, Man,I'm about to hang it up. working
on cars. He goes, these guyskeep bringing me tractors, and
I'm making way more moneyrepairing tractors than I was
ever making, you know, carrepairs. I was like, well, don't
do anything new. And he goes on,man, I can't work on new stuff.
I don't have, you know, the johndears code reader was $7,000.

(23:18):
Like, yeah, I'm not going to dodiagnostics. I can't justify
that they can take that shit tothe dealer. Yeah, it's, it's
insane. You know, I mean, justjust a carb compliance that, you
know, California Air ResourceBoard. I mean, it's just insane.
I mean, taking trucks that areoff the road, you know, two or
three truck fleets and just, youknow, when these guys were on a
low mileage program for like,5000 miles a year for as long as

(23:41):
we could do you know, it'splaying the game is destroying
owner operators of any businessof any kind of trucking. Do you
think the future when they getthere? And I don't think it's
anytime soon? I think it's the10 year is kind of the horizon?
I see for it and what seems likewe're reading on the hydrogen in
the trucks on the road. InCalifornia, that seems to be the

(24:03):
place where everyone's going.
And everyone's developing,trying to put in hydrogen fuel
stations trying to put inhydrogen manufacturing. Yeah,
maybe. I mean, I don't I mean, Idon't know. I haven't kept up on
that stuff. So it's just thatwas for Mountain rightfield.
Sorry. Yeah. I don't know. Imean, it's not my it's not my
gig, right. I mean, my otherstuff. My other businesses are
what they are and the gradingsucks, but we are I mean, I

(24:26):
actually have something forcedout of that. After king of the
hammers hand swipe, I handed alittle bit earlier as as Chris a
bird. We started digging pools,sorry, had a bunch of equipment.
So we just literallytransitioned my buddy has a book
company couldn't couldn't thediggers couldn't keep up. So I
told him before we got to Keioage before we left. I said he
figured out he had three weeksto figure it out. I'm gonna like
bed for 20 days. So you figureit out. And when I get home,

(24:49):
I'll dig him. He called meduring race week. He's like when
you go home. I'm like, you gotanother six days, man. He's
like, well Hurry up. So we gothome and I think we are I think
we'reStart in our 12th and 13th pool
tomorrow, since we've beenworking in the hammers. So not
bad for a couple man crew, or aone man crew more or less,
because I leave him by himselfquite a bit, is the margin

(25:09):
they're good or reasonablybetter. I'm in the same spot I
was before you know that I'vebeen paying the truck drivers
did all the dirt. And now like,now I got to buy trucks. I'm
almost in the same spot I wasbefore. But I'm able to leverage
some of the equipment I alreadyhave. And I'm gonna liquidate
some of that and hopefully have,you know, come out and try to
be, you know, not a bunch ofpayments and keep on operating.

(25:30):
That was our biggest thing is myold man is, you know, we've been
a cash based company forever. Sowe owned everything. So you
know, to have payments was notin our business plan by any
means. I gotcha. Yeah. So thethe concrete business I'm
involved in, we own our not allof our equipment, we own chunks
of it. And we would move itaround, not ourselves. We had

(25:53):
guys that we would call theyshow up with a truck, wherever
it is. Sometimes it'd be a rolloff, sometimes it'd be a bigger
truck sometimes would be alowboy and move the stuff for
us. And it was just a flat rate.
Yep, every day, and then we justdidn't have to worry about any
of that. And then didn't have toworry about getting you haven't
got houseless or, or commercialvehicle enforcement here in

(26:17):
Houston, pulling your truck overand then hassling it. We just
didn't we just don't worry aboutit. It's a Hey, we got this,
this mini x here, we need tomove here tomorrow. We've got
this, these skid steers here, weneed to move over there in two
days. I mean, yeah, that makessense. I mean, there's there's a
way to do it in the in the poolthing in business is pretty
competitive. So you have to ownyour own trucks. You can't You

(26:38):
can't be paying an hourly rateof trucks. I mean, I'm finding
that out real fast, we got dumptrailers and stuff. But
obviously that is a haul as muchmaterial. So that's when I get
home for a short period of timeI'm home. I'm going to work on
dry get that all ironed out. Butit's funny, I don't know you
work for a Cochrane company,because that's my other
business. Well, back in.

(26:59):
So I got involved in I wasbuying a company in 2017. And
then we dissolved kind of mybuying out of that in the
beginning of 2020. The guydecided it was a five year
buyout. We were a little over ayear and a half in and he came
to the realization he did notwant to, he didn't want to
retire it. Like once he wasfaced with, you know, three and

(27:20):
a half years he was going to bedone. He couldn't and now we're
well that would have ended theend of this year would have been
when the buyer was completelyin, he's going stronger than
ever. Yeah. He just had nointerest in. And the thing was,
as I was that far into it. Iwasn't loving it. I liked it.
But I didn't love it. I'm backdoing what I did for 20 years,

(27:42):
and I love doing that. So I'mgood there. But the labor like
you rob labor, and we struggledwith that every single day, you
know, you'd had an SME broughtthis up to me yesterday,
yesterday. Similarly, it waslike, you know, we had, you
know, Hispanic crews be the bethe Guatemalan or from Honduras,
or they were truly from Mexico.
And you'd have a foreman speaksEnglish. Yep. Good. And but

(28:06):
every day, he showed up with 10different nudes, or eight of the
same dudes, two new ones. And itwas like constantly this
constant, having to retrainpeople every day, and they do
stuff wrong. So you always hadthis, it was just, it's freaking
constant. just deal with islike, how can you guys keep
getting this wrong? Well, it'sbecause every single day is a
different set of dudes. So yeah,it's constructions. It's a game,

(28:29):
right? I mean,I don't know, I consider myself
a fixer, I guess, in my aspectof life. So if it's a challenge,
you know, and I can fix it, thenthat's what we do. So that's
kind of where the concretecutting comes in. You know, I
mean, concrete is one of thosethings, you get three to four
hours of working time, andthat's it. So you're on fire the
whole time. It's kind of likepromoting a race, right? You're

(28:50):
always you're always chasingsomething. So it kind of all
goes hand in hand. And if you'reon a dock project, it's two
hours, and the concrete can't beabove 91 degrees. Well, if you
pour in the summertime inHouston anyway. It's over 95 in
the morning, so yeah, you know,I can't tell you how I do not
miss the leaving my house atthree in the morning to start to

(29:12):
drive an hour to get first

trucks there by 4 (29:16):
30am. Poor from 4:30am and you're like
wrapping up, you know, a 500yard pour it you know, 1011
noon. The finishers are there.
They're going to be there tilllike three and then you still
have to go to other job sitebids other. Yeah. Hey, so tell
me about your concrete business.

(29:38):
So we're a little smaller scale.
We started out as curbing, Ibought a Kirby Machine Company,
you know, just like landscapecurbing between your grass and
your planner, you know, lowextruded curbs. Okay, so I
bought a company did that. Gosh,2009 You know, I'm coming up on
20 years. So we bought thiscompany and then I knew nothing
about concrete. I'll still go onthis.

(30:00):
Cool, am I a childhood friendwas doing concrete and I'm like,
Hey man, I got to get a concretelicense for this curb thing. I'm
like, Hey, you wanna you want toleave the guys you're working
with and come work for me sohere we go on a Ford Ranger with
a lumber rack and my my Chevytruck and and we went forward
and we and I had everyone fromevery one of my friends work in

(30:20):
we've just we went for just alldid all high end stamped, taught
are taught myself how to detailcolor sealing acid stain, did a
couple classes here and theredid some did some stamp testing
of density of the rubbers, likeliterally before the economy,
you know, did our tank and wejust we went for like pool decks
patios, walkways, driveways, andjust, you know, to cruise and

(30:43):
just when we went it was if itwasn't stamped concrete, and it
wasn't decorative and highsquare footage. We didn't touch
it. That's awesome. Yeah, thoseguys are, you know, artisans.
For sure, yeah. I had teachmyself how to detail and fix
things that when you're whenyou're stamping concrete, and
you miss in color and fixed infull with like full finishing
concrete more or less. I mean, Iliterally had to teach myself

(31:03):
this stuff. It was crazy. Who isgood time when I was young. And
it was, I didn't nothing. Imean, I didn't I didn't know I
didn't I didn't know how to rodI did not occur to join, I did
not finish. I mean, I knewnothing like it was literally
relying on my friends. And I hadthe business and I had the
business mindset. And I said,Hey, I can pay you guys as much.
And as we get bigger, we'll growand we did pretty good till the
economy, you know, took a tankand then things change. We

(31:25):
survived. And my God, my buddywent on somewhere else to go to
bigger, better things. And Ikept going and hired more guys.
And I mean, I think we're almoston 20 years. I think I can't
remember. It's been a long time.
balinska I don't know how youdidn't have enough have enough
spare time. But you mentioned tome a while back a conversation
that you also have a like a rapcompany.

(31:50):
Yes, like get a rap but a vinylbombing you never know, you
know, maybe one of my secrettalents. So my buddy had a bunch
of machines in his house and hewasn't running them anymore. He
got into the green business, andmy cane and he was just a friend
of mine banners and stickers andone on there just sitting. He's
like, just come get him I don'teven care. I'm like, okay, so I

(32:11):
got a shop in my house. And so Ibuilt a cleanroom in my shop and
we're actually up and runningpretty solid right now we're
doing a bunch of stuff with withGomez. And we wrapped their cars
from a lab, actually. And thoseare the first I did all three
cars over the weekend in like 26hours, we wrapped all three
cars. I mean, I mean wrappedaround stuff and did more across

(32:32):
stickers and stuff not but neverdid like a full car like that. I
mean, literally neighbors likewhat's going on, you know, Jason
laughing their, their shopmanager brings over the cars and
drops him off my neighbor's car,like what is going on. And we
went for it and wrapped the carsand now we're doing a bunch of
graphics and logos and Ryandeltapoint you know, he's
everyone knows who he is redline projects. He's worked on

(32:53):
the from the very beginning ofNorCal pretty much and worked
for OLED for four and he's beenhelped me the design expert
aspect and we just print awayand at night, I go out there in
the shop and we do some printingand do some weeding and it's I
like it. It's fun. It'sdifferent, you know, and it's
probably the only thing in mylife that's not time sensitive.
Yeah, man. You mentioned RobRyan del Conte. So I shared an

(33:16):
RV with him recently at hammersfor for five or seven days or
something. Yeah, well, that guygot he's awesome. He is he is a
solid dude. I mean, he showed upwith NorCal rays. I don't know
how many years ago now. I waslike, do you know? I mean, he's
still skinny little guy. Andhe's like, I want to take
pictures. I'm like, Well don'tdie. And he's like, okay, and I
mean, and he's got a great Imean, obviously he's behind a

(33:38):
lot of stuff a lot for and he'sbeen behind me for a long time.
I mean, we learned or helearned, you know, Adobe and
Photoshop and how to build awebsite. I mean, literally stuff
that. I mean, he's had a cameraand we just went for it. And his
skill sets really high now and Imean, I couldn't do without him.
I an old four couldn't dowithout him and the poor guy.
He's he spreads thinner than heis skinny. Yeah, right. Great

(34:00):
guy. redline projects. Yeah, I'msure you guys have seen him on
on Instagram. You've definitelyseen his pictures if you didn't
know who it was behind there. Iactually didn't know who was
behind there until not that longago. Yeah, he's, he's solid.
He's a like I said he's got agreat eye. We do a lot of cool
stuff together. He's local to mefor now. All the T shirt designs

(34:21):
behind Norco. I mean, I thoughthim I mean him and I was go
through and pound it out andfigure it out. The only shirt he
doesn't design is actual actualevent shirts, which is a
cartoony style shirt and thesame guy has been doing those
shirts for me from the verybeginning and every adventure
he's done. So otherwise Ryandoesn't. I feel like he told me
or maybe Roxy told me he's donesome of the hammer shirts to

(34:43):
someone. He made them behind thescenes a lot ultra for stuff
also. Yeah, I think I think heis I don't is he? He's
definitely he's definitely roxiois, you know, Roxy things it's
funny. He goes oh my god, Ryan Iwas like, yeah, your guy Ryan.
Yeah, RoxyDude, he was mine first.
Our guys super weird. AlrightRoxy, watch it will break your

(35:06):
other leg, right? Yes,seriously?
I'm a buyer that knee scooter.
She's gonna hear that $2 it's inthe mail. Oh, I love it. Yeah, I
mean, she had surgery. And thenI think she's still kind of
limping around. I know. Shewasn't she was in Kentucky, but
But yeah, I mean, she steppedout of her RV onto a rock. I
mean, how freaky she is that outof the hammers. That's a good
wife. That's a solid cover up.

(35:29):
So, you know, we'll go withthat.
For Robert.
He was he was already, you know,taking care of her anyway. I
mean, she runs the show, but uh,Oh, God, I I read a meme today
that made me think about her.
And I'll look up here in asecond at the read it out. But
nonetheless. So there you've gotthe rap video going you tell me

(35:52):
about it. Haha. Okay. And Iswear, and we did not have a
good connection. So this wasn'tlike me standing in the bathroom
pee. And while you were talking,I was ignoring you. I just
didn't catch it. But I thoughtand I didn't when I saw the
cars. Nothing stood out. But Iswear you told me that you
wrapped one of them in polkadots. Yeah, well, it wasn't
technically polka dots. Thedesign was like a matrix like a,

(36:13):
I guess maybe a polka dotmatrix. And it was done by Dell
Dell quanta in andit was on JPS car and they came
to they pick the cars up andwent to go test it and JP show
up to the yard and he goes Thoseare my panels are they? And the
guys are like Yeah, he's like,it looks like freakin polka
dots. And he's like, that's notgonna work. And this is like I'm

(36:34):
leaving for my lab to go Whelanfor a couple days for once. You
know and Chris Burnett, the raceteam managers like Hey, man, you
gotta rewrap JPS car. I'm like,there's no way man. I'm leaving
tomorrow. So he's like, Well, doyou have any black material? I
said, Yeah, I got some glossblack. So one of the guys came
by and picked up some glossblack and he had some guys in
the shop in the yard between allyou know, they're all their

(36:55):
stuff they got going on. Theywrapped the cars black and
stickered them. So so it gotredone. So got covered already
done. Yeah, but we're all stayedthe same. And then Marcus, his
car was a little satin blackwith stickers on it. And that
was pretty simple. But uh, yeah,JP, I didn't want to be in his
head. You know, I mean, as dumbas it sounds, it's important to
me, you know, when you get thecards comfortable on as dumb as

(37:17):
a rap sounds? I mean, if hedoesn't like the rap, I mean,
who knows? You know, I'm notgonna be the guy that JP watered
his car up, because he all hecould think about was his polka
dotted.
He didn't get for the cameras,right? Yeah, you know, and
obviously, they're contenders atevery event they go to. So I
mean, it's important for me tothem for them to look good. And
if I'm going to do it, it needsto be 100%. So it's important to

(37:39):
me. And so I wish I could haverewrapped the cars I would have
highlighted was already travelplanned. And I was going and we
have a new design coming out andhopefully the cars be, I'll get
all the panels back when I gethome and get those reroute for
sampling for them and get themall cleaned up. There'll be
perfect. No, I really liked thatI really liked that you're
you're passionate about to thepoint that you recognize that

(38:01):
you have the self awareness thatyou could impact someone else's
race in that regard. And a lotof people just don't live in
that world today. Right?
They're, you know, very, youknow, they're self absorbed in
what they have going. And it's afunny joke. It's a funny joke.
But yeah, it's important, youknow, I mean, you got to become
fooled. I mean, it's everythingit goes from if you're a racer,
I mean, all these racers canrelate, you know, I mean, I came

(38:21):
from BMX and motocross and younever raced with a new helmet,
you throw it on the ground, youknow, it's just, you know, new
driving the suit you tuck androll. I don't know. I mean,
whatever the wherever thedriving rules are, but you know,
I mean, I dropped brand new $100right helmets all the time. My
dad just looks at me I'm like,it's better to be on the ground
and on my head. I think a lot ofthat stuff mental and those
guys, you know, all the driversnow. They're all they're all

(38:42):
they're a game and I think thatanything is and it sounds dumb,
but the rap but I think thatanything can be in their head.
And if you can alleviate thatfor your drivers, you know, as a
as whatever part of the team youare. That's That's huge. I think
not nothing fair. So, before weYeah, I want to talk about like
San Felipe and some upcomingstuff, but I want to actually

(39:02):
jump back you run in thebusiness, your concrete going
you were dirt biking it what Atwhat point, you know, I guess
you use the word 2021. So about2001 2002 somewhere in there.
You got into concrete. I know byby oh eight you'd started NorCal
rock racing. So in that windowthere you're in your 20s How did

(39:24):
you I mean, we're in based onlocation in Folsom. I assume
you're recreating up on theRubicon I assume you're messing
around Eldorado forest. I know.
Your price still right in yourmoto. How did you I guess make
the transition to get intowheeling concrete Coby is
cranking we're doing our thingoh three was my last new bike. I

(39:46):
didn't I haven't touched herbike since 2003. I've literally
wrote Yamaha yz f 250. In ohthree and that was it. I haven't
seen one haven't touched one saton one started one nothing. And
about that same time.
Some people know right?
cooked from the rock zombies hewas working for me as a salesman
from a concrete company we'reall friends I've known Rob six
years old actually awesome dudeused to announce for me just got

(40:08):
burnt out with life and familyhe he was working for me he's
like hey man, you gotta go We'lland I was like okay like I've
been through Sierra track withmy dad and Jeepers and there's
pictures of me you know fiveyears old in the back of a Jeep
CJ seven you know head bobbingback there with my old man and
there's some car check picturesmy old man got lifeflight out
here tracks I mean, I've beenthrough all those trails for

(40:29):
days and Rubicon beef, you know,pre 10 years old, but not even
knowing any of it. So no three,Rob's like me really getting a
wheel and I was like okay, soI'm like checking it out. And so
you know there are zombies Ithink it started and maybe that
time not sure. And you know, Ifeel the charity and all those
guys and fill out a buggy orJeep for sale. Someone else had
one sign up buying them 79 cJseven tub back half. Keith bill

(40:54):
Papa Smurf in the wheelingcommunity was a fabricator.
We're going to his house dataguy. Amazing fabricator. Rob
cook. He's the big he's the bigbig Rob. He looks like if like
he looks like Danny Edwards ifDanny Edwards gain 200 pounds,
right? Yeah, yeah. Cuz initiallyI didn't I didn't know not being

(41:17):
a rock so I'm you're around thatcrowd. Yeah, well, I got those
two guys interviews for a while.
Yeah, no big Rob. He's He's oneof the founders of that club.
Solid dude. Yeah, so I boughtthis this TJ thing dropped off
keys garage. And like all we hadwas pirate you remember those
days obviously and I'm like, Iwant to link it I want to get

(41:39):
the best we can make it rightand you know people are falling
and readers and that's it. Sothe readers for ln t figured out
the front he for links the frontwe buy a thorough buy through
2003 ish by thought of why 350sM 465. Mike what's you know
what's next, you know, concretecrank and so on. Like, let's
just make it the best we can,you know, 17 inch Bill steens 42

(41:59):
inch TSL MRT beadlocks at fiveoh, atlis 6014 bolt like,
literally I go the first time ontrail, I show up this little
slice. And I'm like, What's thehardest thing? Like all I see is
videos like show me this. Showme what the hardest part is
here. So I didn't have thelearning curve, you know,
driving around to it. And I'm 33years and struggling theater
because I showed up in a buggy.
I was ready to party. That's howwe started. That's awesome,

(42:21):
though, right? Yeah. Yeah. Imean, I'll be the first one a
minute. I'm not a rock crawlerby any means. But I mean, rock
racing was the first day I wasout. That was me. That wasn't
rock racing back then. But itwas me in that area. I mean, we
were all on pirate. What wasyour name on pirate? There was
just good. Be dirty. It'd be 50I think yeah, that's what I
thought. Yeah, that was mentallywhat was in my picture. And

(42:42):
yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, Iwasn't in the beginning. But I
was in there. I think I had alow number not too super high.
But uh, we just wheeled them andI mean, I wheeled every weekend
like it wasn't a weekend like Iworked and left on Friday, and I
will that's all I did. Andthat's how she all started and
then I can tell you as to howNortel started I mean goes from

(43:02):
there actually Yeah, absolutely.
That's that's what this isright. So I'm wheeling doing
stuff going to pismo and I'm inPismo Beach all my friends we go
there Thanksgiving right that'sup huge down there. I go down
there and racing guys have comphold on I got this for 65 and if
you know anything anything abouta Granny Granny first a second
the model the stop and startover? some reason these guys up

(43:24):
the hill the photo by 350 andI'm like man, this is fun. Mike
I gotta go faster. So I get homeand I got a I think I don't a 98
Camaro. You know t tops didn'thave a small back then but it
would have flowednot like you have today. I mean,
you're new here. Are youSpeedwagon playing is just
behind you as you walk right?

(43:47):
Yeah, so I got home I got thisCamaro back in the garage. I'm
looking the motor and I'mlooking back and forth motor the
Jeep Jeep Camaro back and forthand like, man, they got to put
these LS isn't these things likesomeone's got to do this stuff.
And this is like 2005 and six, Imean, LS swap in a Jeep was, as
everyone knows, I mean, it wasthat was that was like, I don't

(44:08):
even it's like new phone. Youknow, it was amazing. So, you
know, all we had back then waseBay. So I get on eBay and I buy
a buy an LS one out of a Camarowith a fall of 60 from Florida
from a wrecking yard andprobably stolen who knows kids
study on the wrecking yard. It'seBay I buy I get it.
I get it home and I'm lookingI'm like I don't know. I mean, I

(44:31):
was mechanically inclined isfrom dirt bikes put up. Never
done a motor swap. So me mybuddies, they come over, you
know, hey, we are swapping up LSone two a 465. Colin, we call
the how engineering or thing ishow the computer company like h
o w e ll not the steering. Andthey're the only ones that have
harnessed for a five wireharness for an LS I call them

(44:51):
and they're like, yeah, wehaven't first hand cars. My
perfect one put them this rockcrawler that I go, okay. I think
it'll work. I'm like alright,sweet. We did the motor, swap my
garage andWent back to pismo and I had a
LS one man i was i was king shitand a rock buggy, right? And,
and they just kept snowballingfrom there really, that was like
oh six, and then I put anautomatic in it. kept that with
put a 400 in there. And then Iwas like, it's probably 2007 and

(45:16):
I said, someone's got a raciststuff like someone's got to do
this. There's racing somewheresomewhere in this country for
this stuff. Yeah, we wererunning zarei in Middle America,
but uh, you guys were kind ofahead of the curve out there on
the west coast. I mean, it wasnot racing wise, though. zarei
had the game right. So I get onthose interwebs and I start
searching and get on YouTube andXRP right. So I found XRP. And

(45:39):
I'm like, oh, man, in the vividvideo. My head is RJ Brown. I
believe in the yellow truck.
When in doubt on the step up,right, or cannabis sport. I
guess that's his claim to fame.
Also, I know he did much afterthat. But that's all I remember.
And so and I remember looking attheir schedule, and I said, west
coasts, and I'm like their WestCoast series and they came to

(46:00):
Salt Lake City, Utah. I'm like,you're missing some states man.
West Coast is a little fartherwest than that. So motocross
background, I go to PrairieCity, you know, hangtime
warcross nationals there. Andthis time, I think war vor was
still running strong back then.
But I didn't know they were. Igo to the state with a business.

(46:22):
You know, management in my headand I write a business plan for
this racing. I'm like, I'm gonnapull on these races and I'm
gonna be the biggest promoter inthis park. You know, like, I
think I'm gonna wipe out HankDamn, you know Hangtown ama
motocross national, like it gotmy bigger than this. And I go in
there and these guys, I'm, I'm21. See? I'm like late 20s, I
guess. And they're like, Who'sthis kid? Like, well, you look

(46:44):
like a good plan. We're gonnalet you try it. So they gave me
a permit. Then in 2008, October10 2008, I run my first race.
And I literally build amotocross track with two rock
piles that are like six rockslong. And there's two piles and
the lid is everything you can doto get over them. And that race
is actually called xR. A No,that's x. All right. It was

(47:08):
called X to rock racing. Becausein my head x t rock racing was I
think it was extreme orsomething at a marketing buddy
that was partners with me andpartnerships and partnerships,
but we said x t rock racing cuzI was gonna travel the country
with this right? I mean, so x twas the name like we were going
to we're taking the next level.
We did the race, I lost a bunchof money, partnerships and
partnerships 2009 I got anotherpermit with the park and I had

(47:33):
to make a new name. Norcorockeries was born. And then
there you go. And you go, howmany events have you put on
under NorCal name to date?
Hundreds since then, so we didthe one and then 2009 in the
park. We did a three raise so Iliterally came out of the box
with a three raise series in2009 and got some great traction

(47:56):
2010 The park was doing Parkimprovements and let me have one
race and then I believe ultrafor started in 10 or 11 and I
lost also a min on there I wasdoing real good. And then I had
that one race and lost myseries. And then 2011 I've done
three plus two ever since. Sothat's that come up. I mean you

(48:18):
do 10 years 330 races thing howmuch time you have doing 30
races. Yeah, and what's crazyabout precis is we build and
complete tear down just like inthe average every race I do
personally I flatten that placeback out like we're never there.
Wow. What's the diesel bill onthat? I'm most most races are
anywhere from 15 to like 3000 Isee that depending on equipment

(48:42):
I have so you do the infieldcore set k wage so start the
start finish the basically thebig dick in the desert. How long
does that take you guys toremember to build that every
time every year we keep ongetting cut on time. So we
usually here's the plan for fivedays from start to finish but
now we get bigger equipment alittle bigger budget so we're

(49:04):
able to do things a lot fasternow. But in the beginning Yeah,
we're like full six days ondozers So speaking of equipment
for each of these races, so yougo local rental company I
haven't delivered. Yeah, usuallyI try to keep the money local
like anywhere we go whereverwhatever race it is, I try to
give the support the localeconomy, the caterpillars,

(49:24):
obviously Well, we're now in andthey got rental accounts
everywhere. And I have anational account so I can rent
from any car dealership with myaccount not to go through the
local dealership. scramble, Ican just call and get my account
number and they know we're goodfor credit and they just send
out the equipment. That's fun.
So you took something that youlearned growing up working for
your dad doing leveling all thedirt work from that you said you

(49:46):
weren't good at it, but then youlearned how to make jumps and
ramps and basically cool shit.
Yeah, I mean, I was really goodwith a shovel, you know, in the
BMX days, so I could build Icould build the job. Just take
me a week, but uh, yeah, it'sfunny, my own
Wasn't a he wasn't a realteacher. And that might be maybe
why I wasn't as good as I neededto be on grading tractors, but
um, I would say I'm probably 95%self taught in every big, big

(50:10):
piece of equipment because ofthe gradient. We don't have the
equipment. So I mean, now webuild tracks with D sixes. I
mean, we never own somethingthat big. Our biggest dozer and
fleet was like d3. Okay, okay.
Yeah. So when you guys arebuilding, let's say, tracks, you
use total stations, do you? It'sall I write it's all field all
by Phil. No burden. I do it allby Phil. We know what the degree

(50:32):
feels like. And now all the newdozers got these degree gauges
on the dash and I'm like, Man,what degree was that face? I'm
like, so then we start trying tobuild these degrees. And I'm
like, just shut that I'm like, Iput duct tape over the screen a
couple years ago, cuz I justkept looking at the screen, like
trying to figure out whatdegrees I was at. Make sure the
blade was level. And I'm like, Idon't even need this stuff. I
can feel it. I literally justcover the screen. And I mean, I

(50:52):
have a dozer right now here. AndI was like, I just want to cover
the screen up because it drivesme nuts. Because every material
pushes different, you know, andyou can feel it but the screen
you want to look at the degrees.
You're like, oh man, I'm 3% tothe left. My god, I gotta fix
that. But really, when you feelyou feel it, it's all about you.
It's all about the level. Thethe other day

(51:16):
the butt dyno and yeah, butdon't know, but level. Now that
I've now that that got got intomy head that was you know, mill,
so that to me in a conversation,I was like, I've never heard
that before. Now, I've heard itlike 10 times in the last week.
Like, was I just not listeningbefore? Like, whatever, by you.
I was there. I mean, I think Iwould have caught that. But I

(51:37):
didn't. So yeah, what is the bigshow that they put out in Vegas?
It's like, every two years everyfive years? Not like concrete
world or whatever. But it's thebig heavy show. It's a conexpo.
That's it? Yep. Every threeyears, every three years. And
then was it supposed to be lastyear and they cancelled it
because of COVID. They shut itdown in the middle of it in

(52:00):
COVIDor something like that. And I
mean, the equipment. I mean, youcan go out and basically get in.
Everyone hauls in everything.
Normally, I'd say it's Sema for,for construction. Yeah,
something else. I think that'spretty cool. I mean, I do like I
do, like, you know, run a dozermuch better than a skid steer,
but I will run a dozer, I canrun a track hoe, if someone will

(52:23):
give me one bit the building ofthe tracks like I don't think I
can get, you know, as I see,like, not the jumps, the jumps
would be easy. I could do jumps,it's the bank, the banks that
you guys do. Yeah, I'm very muchin awe of that you don't lay it
out that it's free hand andyou're you push into you get it
right, I'd be out there withlike, a roll of a roll string, I

(52:47):
drive in a piece of rebar, andthen get my sweep so that I know
that it's a you know, it'seither, you know, perfect 150
foot, you know, horseshoe or anopen or close at the end, you
know, like, or closes and thenyou roll everybody as they come
around in the hangar we're out.
I don't know. Yeah, we've hadsome turn tunes like that, and
on the lake bed, just because ofspace restrictions. But, uh, you

(53:10):
know, and bird night, but wewere, I mean, if you ever
watched us build, I mean, welook like two, two drunk people
on dozers like we criss crosseach other. I mean, sometimes we
bump you know, a little bump andrun but I mean, between him and
I like I mean, we know we're atall time and you know, we rough
you know, I helped them rougheverything in and he's getting
to the point now, he justfinishes everything, it's hard

(53:32):
to have multiple, multiplepeople finish in turns or jumps.
So he's pretty much handledtaking that over and just
finishes everything up. And thenall you get on the water truck
or something else. And you know,and I just let him do his thing.
And he kills it. I mean, wewe've got to the point of the
jumps and the lips. And we'vegot to the point that all the
cars fly somewhat flat. I mean,long as everyone's suspension

(53:53):
tuning at this point, but backin the day, I mean, with nose
divers, but now now, I mean, thetabletop we built this year was
insane. I mean, the video clipsof everyone just going for the
distance that it was wasamazing. It's it's cool to watch
you know, it's a finishedproduct for us and everyone
enjoys it and the cars fly andit's it's what it's all about.
One you're given the racers whatthey want, you're really giving

(54:15):
the fans what they want. Andthen you're giving the marketing
partners what they want thoseconstant videos and clips and
pictures of their racers, theircars, whatever sponsor that they
have dollars behind and theyhave skin in the game sailing, I
mean sailing and and I want tosay it was uh oh, who's uh,
who's Cody Eddington's marketingguy? Robert Mansfield. Mansfield

(54:37):
he put together I'm fairly sureas Robert I think I know a clip
you're talking about he clippedwho who went further and it was
he did for the other races butthe 4400s I want to say wasn't
Marcos went the farthest likeyeah, Mark goes went big. Yeah.
So yeah, Lorna. I mean,everyone. I mean, it's just it's
it's, it's rad to see and it's IIt's cool to watch the guys

(55:00):
actually take off with theirfoot in it. You know, I mean, to
see the guys actually just, youknow, do something cool for the
fans. And for everything else,you know, the content that comes
out of out of It's amazing. Canwe do something? Can I make a
request? And you know, I makerequests all the time and Dave
will tell me fluckey why we'renot doing that? Yeah.
Some are, you know, a littlecrazy. What about, uh, you know,

(55:22):
you can get the, you know, the,like football field marketing or
baseball marking little thingwith white, and Marcus off some
2550 7500 100? Yeah, down theface of your jump. And then on
the live show, you know, and youmay maybe get tribe, or Cody
Wagner with laser net to burnout some, you know, two foot or

(55:44):
three foot tall distancemarkers, you have spray painted,
and then stick them into theground. Yeah. And so when the
cameras see and they were like,Oh, you know, probably insurance
would be like, no, you're reallytrying to push them all the way
until they wreck somebody isgonna go, it'll be who's racist
over in the first 500 I want todo a show like that mixed into

(56:05):
the hammers. You know, maybeevery night, there's something
packed, you know, like, youknow, yet the front door, back
door shootout, whatever it'scalled, whatever year it is.
And, you know, like, you haveall these nights of things going
on, I've always wanted to dosomething on that and create a
real short course, an idea hasbeen been tossed out there. And
you know, it may have came outthat there was a slug bug race

(56:25):
this year under the lights,which, I mean, I'm gonna say
that I'm pretty sure that cameout of my mouth just not was
like bugs.
So that thing was,it was cool. But I think I could
pack that place. If we did likea two lap, fastest lap short
course. Long Distance jump inthose two laps, and just fill
that place up, you know, andhave something just super rad

(56:47):
under the lights. Do youremember the Laughlin leap? I do
remember the wall family Iwatched many times they judge
how far the you know, in wasn'ta night King will put the
markers out and it'd be longestdistance and came with us some
money at it. And yeah, I mean,that's literally been my plan
for a while and JT use, youknow, go there. Dave was kind of

(57:07):
good with it. And we just,there's just so much stuff
packed on the week. And youknow, I feel like it's gonna
sound bad all the racers, but ifwe did it on early in the week,
if your car broke in those twohot laps, you weren't gonna make
it anyway, man, like, sorry foryour luck. But like, at least
you had a chance to lay it allout there and, you know, maybe
win some real money and, and bepart of a show that, you know,

(57:28):
you may be, you know, top 20guy, but you know, you're not,
you're not in the show at thesame time. So it'd be something
cool to highlight, but you know,it fell through and now we got,
you know, 15 events in a 10 dayperiod. Now, unfortunately, the
hammers need going ask people tobe on that lake bed for so many
days. That just keeps gettinglonger and longer and longer.
Yeah, I mean, burden I did 22days this year. I've done the

(57:52):
longest I've spent 31 which I'llnever do again. But uh, we're
gonna definitely cut that down.
We did some work some propertiesaround there for a week, this
year, but we're gonna definitelycut that down to like 11 or 12
days from here on out. I justcan't do it anymore. Well, I
want to get off on a sidetracktangent here. Yeah, I'd seen you

(58:13):
know, I've got a prerunnerthat's, you know, a street
runner. It's not I wouldn't it'snot a real prerunner I mean, I
guess it does have 18 inches offront and rear travel on 40 so
it's, it gets after it. It likesit likes the hammers. But you
also have a prerunner I loveyour prerunner tell us about
this bad boy white Chevy it's ayeah oh three Chevy cat I

(58:35):
extended cab four wheel drive 20I don't know 2628 inches of
travel in the rear trailingarms. That's a dr dt tech front
end bypass coil or package 16 or18 inches of the travel on the
front bumps on all four corners.
Five three, just a stock fivethree ish full sleeper truck I
mean full cage Okay. Here BrianKirby did amazing dash in it for

(58:59):
me Holley EFI dash, all embeddedaluminum. The original
fabricator was in Vf fab out ofnot San Luis Obispo but in that
area, the same fabricator thatbuilds rugged radios crazy
builds his name's Nick amazingfabricated never met him bought
bought the kid from the truckfrom a kid that his high school
truck and Nick had worked on ahere and there and it was it was

(59:22):
be a diva diva bed kit and abill whole back half and and i
think Sandy Sandy Cohen had hishands on the geometry and the
trailing arms and the shocks andit's all sleeper the shocks are
under the bed. You don't evensee him carries 230 sevens in
the rear, some ammo cans, fuelcell training coolers, literally
I mean, I've had a bunch of carsand off road world is literally

(59:43):
the hands down the funniestthing I own in my fleet
funnest thing ever, but so Iknew you had one. I didn't know
what yours was though. I knewyou had this program because
I've only seen videos frominside of it. So I knew
That I knew that was why Ididn't put together so there I
am. I'm walking through hammertown and this looks like aside

(01:00:06):
from it has pretty big tiresunderneath it It sits pretty
stockish in height like heightit's not it's not lifted it's
not real high but it does sitlow on the rear and you're like
okay, that's it's got somethinggoing so there I am walking I
think I was on my way over tothe fun hover compound to see
Lauren who is up never beenthere because he's a very

(01:00:26):
scheduled at media circus in aweek. But as I'm walking by I
see it see see this truck andthis cat I'm checking out I
bought my phone I take a coupleof pictures I see the it's
linked and I'm like man becauseI'd love to do that to mind wow
is for caged in that horse.
Heylook go on like what it's I can

(01:00:48):
tell I'm the one being yelledat. At this point. It's you hang
your head out there you'reeating lunch and you saw my
reflection off of a vehicle nextto it you're like who's looking
at my truck and you saw my hatand you knew exactly who it was
so you go to harass me like atotally scared me invited me in
for lunch. I didn't end upeating with you but I hung out

(01:01:11):
with you for a little bit andthen we talked about the truck
but and then we went out and youlet me kind of crawl all over it
inside it andand that is it's nice. It's an
amazing truck. You know PRP madesome made some awesome seeds for
and then we got it we got itdown. Jason Vander Veen from bt
wire he went through gutted likenormally my projects I'm pretty

(01:01:34):
pretty thorough. So first when Ifirst got it it went down to
Kirby and Brian Kirby down southhe you know, he preps Adler's
cars and whatnot and amazingfabricator you know built one of
the first if S cars out theretook it down them they're heated
the dash has guys got to thebottom prepped it weld washers
made sure everything is all goodbecause I knew nothing about any

(01:01:55):
of it made sure the rack wasgood in and the or the steering
assist I was in there andprepped it all took the shocks
the king did all did all thatyou know that groundwork for me
and I brought it home and thenI want to rewire it because of
all the stuff in it and you knowthe great supporter of us and so
I dropped off of Jason's houseand and I'm like alright man,
we're just gonna we're gonna ripthe harness out of it motor

(01:02:17):
harness and we're just gonna youknow, clean up some stuff Well,
it turns into a full painlesskit full Holly kid stripped
everything out realize that youknow, rewire everything from
front to back. You know, Kalisends out some intake injectors
and we pull the timing cover offI'm like hey man, let's just put
a cabinet thing you know stillkeep it a five three and didn't
want to put a bunch of power init cuz I didn't want to deal

(01:02:38):
with the you know transfer caseand the foil 60 blowing up so I
was trying to keep it somewhatmild because in the dirt it's a
rock star in asphalt it's not Imean, you probably driven plenty
of vehicles like that. And so weget into it pull the timing
cover off and I swear the kidtold me had the motor rebuilt at
some point in time I have noidea how many miles are on the
truck itself.

(01:03:00):
Pull the timing cover off andlook like a Pennzoil commercial.
It was full of sludge andwhatnot or Jiffy Lube commercial
where those old ones wereyounger and I was like well well
your exhaust bolts and traineebolts away from pulling it out
so we started it took them amotor guy motor guys amazing.
I'm like well let's just cleanit up. So here we are a full
rebuild on a five three cam init cleaned up the heads, all

(01:03:23):
Holly uppers and I'm you knowHolly owns sts turbos. So I call
the VP over there and I'm like,Hey, you know, what do you think
about one of those sts exhaustturbos and he's like, what do
you mean I'm gonna build thisprerunner and build and I'll
think about doing a single turboHe's like, Alright, I'll send
you on out you know, I'm likewell, you know, we'll figure it
out. So So box shows up atJason's house and he opens it up

(01:03:46):
he goes, What is this I'm likewell you know you need a little
power so it's running fivepounds of boost sts exhaust
turbo on the back behind theBehind the cab and now a little
mile cam and it's rad I mean, Imean, I know it'd be like that
make big power but bigger carsbig bills and I want to take I
want to go inside of a cobbleand that thing and just have a
good time and if it breaks downI can find out what three Chevy

(01:04:08):
the transfer case for trainingand put it in there and get
home. So that's that's my plan.
Yeah, it's really reliable andfun. So have you had it in
Mexico yet? No, no, I literallyfinished it. We got done wiring
and tune and James Caulfield youhad on another day he he did
some tuning on it and I broughtto the hammers with like four
miles on it, and I left thehammers with 252 Yeah, that and
now I ran into you over at Gomezbrothers, maybe a day or two

(01:04:34):
later, the guys over there.
We're working on working onsomething on your back end. What
was that about? Yeah, well, likeyou're saying are the rear is a
little low, so rebid withoutchalking with King and as I
drove it more, the rear startedfading a lot more. So I needed
more spring in the rear so we,you know, we go over there to to
the boys and, you know,everyone's got a full service

(01:04:58):
truck with the crane and theirpit so it's just, you know,
convenient to get over there.
Without much travel in the rear,I couldn't get the shocks off at
King. I mean, they're their bigold jack when you lifted up high
enough. So we hung out with thecrane and pulled it off and put
some springs on it. And it's Imean, it's better. It's still it
still needs some love needs, youknow, it's an older build. So
it's got small bypasses on it,so it needs some real shocks for
what it is man and what I'm intoit. It's It's fun. It's amazing.

(01:05:21):
Yeah, they're they're good. Ican't imagine them. Well, I'll
put it this way. So I actuallybought a daily driver here
recently to stop putting mileson my freerunner I, I don't plan
and I don't intend to ever sellthe thing I absolutely love.
It's the funnest vehicle I'veever owned in life. And I've
just hit 83,000 miles on it. Andit's a 13 and I'm like, I'm

(01:05:46):
putting 100 miles on it today.
With our we moved offices and 50miles each way. I'm like, this
is stupid. This is stupid to bewearing. We're not a truck. I
plan to keep forever on forwearing out. 40 inch tires. 100
miles a day. This is this isstupid. So I got something else.
But yeah, like back to yourtruck. That's, they are so much

(01:06:07):
fun. Yeah, and it's sleepers on30 sevens won't fit 40s I don't
think yeah, it's it's, it's it'srad. It's it's a fun truck. And
I mean, I have a 4400 car that,you know, I built when I you
know, had gone a car accidentand quit racing or didn't get to
race it and yeah, it's rad. Imean, I want to go Mojave trail.
I just want to, I want to driveit. I want to do some cool

(01:06:28):
stuff. I want to I want to youknow, like, Phil takes the
gladiator out, which alreadytakes Gladiator and does his
overlanding stuff. Like I wantto do that. But I got no one to
deal with. So I got to findsomeone to buy prerunner Yeah.
No, I mean, seriously, I thinkwhat you're talking about, fix
your rear springs, do thebypasses and then get it get one
was roof top, get a roof top tipfor it. Hang in there, just just

(01:06:49):
below the top of the cab, takethat thing to Mexico, park it on
the beach. That's what I want todo to mine. I mean, now that
I've got it retired from dailyduty, that's what it needs it
needs. If I want to take my kidsand go over to you know, the
beach here and stay the nightand go camping or whatever,
dude, we've got it. We've got afun vehicle for it. But yeah,
I've got a I got a brand newarea. Robert from area bfhi gave

(01:07:12):
me a brand new pop up tent. Oneof his actually malaba the dome,
his brothers bought a home forme. And I got put on the
gladiator we built but it prerenders an option to you know,
to do that. So I'm prettyexcited. I'm not like big
Overlander but I mean, JT andI've talked about the trip, and
you know, either doing razors orthe chase truck or pre runners,
you know, um, you know, JT, he'sgot 19 projects, too, so he can,

(01:07:35):
he can stay concentrated on onejust like me, I have a group
that you know, want to do, and Imean, JT knows Mexico, and I'm
getting to know it now. And Ithink it has been amazing. You
know, I don't want to do thedrive back because everyone
dreaded the drive back as primadonnas that sound but there's
plenty of trucks to go to Caboempty or go full and they come
back empty. So you know, getdown there and you know, send

(01:07:55):
the trucks back to San Diego orin sanada and take a flight and
enjoy your trip home and spend acouple days in Cabo and just
have a good time. I mean, I'mnot a big relaxer, but I feel
like that's on my list. Hey,keep me in mind for that and
then I'll come in and give meenough heads up I'm start making
them the modifications to mytrek for something like like
that. I mean, I'm you know,we're goal oriented. I posted a

(01:08:17):
video earlier because it camefrom all German Motorsports they
put up a video Yeah, I got on.
I'm on their news newsletterlist. I think a lot of people
are a bit it's AGM and it'sprep, and it doesn't any starts
at and if you have three monthsor three weeks or three days to
prep, that's how long your prepsgonna take. So
if you'll give me a heads uplike I'll start getting some

(01:08:39):
stuff going like Okay, wait sixmonths. Okay, okay, so I'll
order stuff but then it's goingto happen in like the last six
days so but I just need to knowwhen that's gonna be for sure.
Yeah, I mean, I want to do andyou know, Dave's always days
always invert adventure likethat. That's right up his alley,
you know, we have a greatrelationship so that that kind
of stuff works and Dave's gottons of assets down there. And

(01:08:59):
so it was JT so it's like I wantto go with someone that has that
ability and has those resourcesyou know, and I mean, I'm all
about the adventure but theadventure alone is not you know,
that's an adventure but it'sdifferent not not my type Yeah,
I'm with you and then you're theHartman's live down there now
Yeah, apartments are down thereand you know, I mean, I got I
got some buddies in Cabo atleast you have vacation spots I

(01:09:21):
got some friends that arefarther down if I you know had
to reach out andbut yeah, that's why I want you
don't want to do resorts I wantto camp I want to camp on the
beach to the resort you know,like vice versa you know not I
don't want to go down and stayin five star resort but I don't
want to go down and camp everynight either. You know, I want
that heavy, heavy medium mix,you know, get a shower here and
there. And you know, I got tospend you know, 14 days and the

(01:09:42):
1000 with gravel last year. So Igot to run sanka teen I got to
run all this Tinker team modelsix times. This we did quite a
bit of pre run and so I know Iknow the ones the one pretty
well right now at least to thanka team. So I'm pretty solid
there. I pretty much tell everytalk with Dan will get food for
the guysBut outside of that stretch,
we're on our own. Yeah. Why Ican cross over to San Felipe. I

(01:10:04):
know I know that side too. And Iknow this gets you powerline
road to get over there. That'sthat's always interested in
three in the morning. So youbrought up, you know, ultra
Well, we brought 4400 Yeah. Yourace skiing in the hammers?
couple times three times back inthe early days. 910 and 11.
Yeah. How did that work out foryou? Yeah, so that's that's a
that's a good story. So I don'tknow I just I LC kid, you know,

(01:10:27):
back then. Back then, you know,it was it was not the fastest
100 guys but the top 100 guysand qualify, right? I mean, it
wasn't it was 100 cars and thatwas it. There was no give there
was no no extra qualifyinganywhere else so many is either
you're qualified or ELC q Nelsonq was like 25 to 40 cars back
then it was insane. You know, Imean, I remember when Lauren

(01:10:49):
shut up and knowing who he wasand the guy qualifies LC Keaton
wins. But Saul was in that realmand and i don't know what nine
was, but I'm pretty sure 1010was the year that I think I
qualified my car four times.
Well, you know, sothis is how Roxy's relationship

(01:11:10):
started up, you know, I've justused the the staging lineup, so
you had a bullhorn, she's outthere yelling you know, you
can't see her over a tire butshe's out there Yellen sees hear
this noise. I feel like you justcalled her poor Roxy. So I line
up and out with the firstqualifying run. I think I roll
something happens I roll set andthen one of the runs I get all
the way to back door and Daveand Jeff was back there back

(01:11:34):
then. And they stopped me rightat the bottom back door and
they're like hey, we gotta waitfor this recovery like they
literally stopped me in themiddle of my qualifying run now
like nowadays, everyone needs torestart and go all over. Like I
sit at the bottom of backdoorand wait for these guys to clear
a car. So we're just sittingthere you know, trucks
overheating because that's howit was back then. And and we're
sitting there sitting theresitting there and we one shot

(01:11:55):
back door right which is was youknow, something didn't happen
back then. slawson Yeah, yeah.
Well,before slawson right so saucer
one shouting back door. We getto the second ledge and we're
going right? So in 2010 like,right line was like the night
before was amazing. Right linewas killer. During qualifying
that day, everyone was goingleft line. I'm like, whatever

(01:12:16):
I'm gonna do what I pre ran, Igo right line. What I do fully
upside down on the roof, infront of everybody. You know,
all by myself staying on top ofthe car. You know, this
literally had a killerqualifying run there. Like,
you're like in the top,whatever. You know, I got to
that point in the bottom backdoor. They had my time, stop
like you're killing you're goingfast. You know, so I roll or

(01:12:37):
whatever. And then I find Ithink it was Tim hammock from
me, Dustin and Tim and thebrothers. And then Tim had a
qualified LLC. Bob didn't gethis car done. So what do we do
we get my car. Tell Dave Hey, Iwant to change the numbers what
Tim's gonna call from my car. SoI get in the passenger seat of
my own car, never sit never satover there. And Tim and I
realized that like 30 carslater, and Roxy's like what is

(01:13:00):
going on? I'm like, don't worryabout it. We're here.
We're a lot to drivers. So Tim,so I ride in the passenger seat
and I think I don't know wedidn't we didn't qualify. I
don't I don't even know whathappened at that point. And then
Kevin Yoder had a spot and himand I are both on pit bull tires
Michaels helping us out andKevin didn't have his car done.

(01:13:22):
So I call Kevin and Mike getyour butt down here man like I
am all you got to spot I got acar. So he drives all night
night before the race onThursday gets down there and I
started the first lap and I gofor it and that's the year we
all set our limits for I don'tknow how many hours maybe like
10 I brought the car back in thefirst lap and I think I started

(01:13:42):
in 98 and I brought the car andlike the mid 30s I gave it to
Kevin and I said here Good Goodluck man. They had like one
break lexical issue like car wasbroken half you know i pre ran
coming out of sunburn on theback section there and not being
desert section yep oil smoothwhen I pre ran
driver Hey man like we're allgood I know where we're at I hit

(01:14:04):
him like this hold on man. Thisis what I do like I'm good at
going fast.
We made about halfway halfwaydown across the thing and we
bumped in Broncos and the truckwas flat obviously you know and
then we hit so hard that it flexthe chassis so hard that it
alternator hit the upper linkand smashed a brake line ripped
it off but at full bump that waslike three and a half inches
away. SoSo I bring the car to Kevin I'm

(01:14:26):
like we need brakes and this andthat and blah blah blah and he
gets out there and gets top ofjack north or jack or somewhere
up there and just the thing isquits fuel pumps don't want to
run I mean, but we had a goodrun. It was fun. And then they
got there must been 2011 cuz2010 I got the hard luck award.
You remember that? I do. I doremember getting that so I mean,
it Yeah, I remember that beinggiven out. Yep. So I ran out I

(01:14:48):
ran. I got up back door.
Obviously one of the top wouldbe turned right over the
Sandhills at. I broke an axle inour school bus or whatever.
That whatever that route was atthat time, so I was in three
wheel drive. And Jeff and Davelike you're not gonna make it
I'm like I'm gonna make it so wewent back door and the second

(01:15:09):
ledge my lead my co driver likethis no one looked at Kodak back
then but I did. And so I get it.
He's like you're not gonna makeit the sand hill on my my ass.
I'm gonna get the sandal. So Iget top of the sand hill. I'm so
excited. I dropped down thebackside and going left to go
towards a whatever that littletrail is we dropped down back
then. Remember the name, but uh,and I blow front right tire 42
is pit bull. So now I got a flatand I got dropped off. Not tank

(01:15:32):
trap. What's that trail rightthere? It's a notch off to the
passenger side. Not sure it was.
No, no, it's on the backside.
What is the name of that trail?
I'm on the right hand side. Butwhen you drop that ledge, you
even had a front right flat. Sodo I hit that rock so hard? I
thought it came into the car.

(01:15:53):
And I do the whole rest of thedesert section. It's all twists
and turns on the front rightflat tire and I get to the
finish line Dave like you madeit you know everyone's cheering
Yeah, that was a fat hiddendodgeball
hard luck award last one not toqualify.
Literally all that prep and timeand, and Dave's like just be
ready. Be ready to start inmind. someone's not going to

(01:16:14):
show up you can race. So here Iam. On the schoolyard waiting
for corporate dress for prom.
waiting. Everyone starts Davejust looks at me. Cyber Oh, that
was that was my career. And thenyou turn then that was it.
That's all she wrote. I wasbuilding a new car and and had
some other life stuff happen.

(01:16:37):
And and then yeah, I mean,that's it. That's gateway. And
now I build it or build theshort course or whatever, which
in shall we say you go but youwhen you go back to Norco, you
still got your Nortel seriesgoing on. And somewhere in
there. You actually went andinvested in a good timing
system. Yeah, yeah. So I mean, Iwanted to make it more legit.
And stopwatches weren't cuttingit. And everyone was kind of

(01:16:59):
having timing issues. And ultrafour was kind of still I don't
know, what if they were reallykicking the series off yet. But
yeah, so I went and found atiming system for motorcross
and, and I spent the money andand taught myself and did some
online classes and went for it.
And Dave's like oh man, you gottransponders. I'm like, Yeah,
he's like, can you come time Iracism I guess you're I don't
know how to do them. But we'llyou know, figure it out. Like
you at least we have something'sbetter than a stopwatch. And

(01:17:21):
that was a that will definitelythere's not enough money in this
world to time a race forTherefore,
I love Dave Cole, we have agreat relationship. But he wants
his results in two minutes afterthe race. And there's there's

(01:17:44):
too many too many things. Toomany things you if the
transporters are reading orone's not reading or one falls
off, there's just too manyvariables. And I never want to
put someone there putting themwrong. And I thought and thought
and thought to make sure thatdidn't happen. And they happen
here and there. But uh, yeah, itwas a very timing is is insane,
man. It's, it's the mostimportant part of the race, no

(01:18:06):
matter what you do, or say, thatmakes or breaks everything. And
obviously over time, we've hadthat trial and error, right?
Yeah, that's so that's kind ofanywho you were for the longest
time, but not knew you knew you.
And then was the 29th sorry,2019 king of the hammers. Was
that the bat or 22? They blendedtogether. 2020. Where? Yeah,

(01:18:27):
2020 was the one where betweenMarcos and Eric Miller and Josh
Bleiler, Bleiler wins, Marcusrips that arm off. And it comes
down to, you know, Eric, beingyou know, second place until a
day later, you know, when wefigure out figure out the timing
that there was thisit was actually more than that,

(01:18:48):
because JT sins sins, me the,well, people are going all the
way to YouTube. And they're,they're going off the live feed,
and they're checking it acrossthere. And then, you know,
people are hounding JT and atthat point, people were coming
to me that if it weren't with atalent tank would have never
launched had it not been for theissues around hammers that you

(01:19:10):
feel like drivers want, theywanted a place to talk like
that. And not not get any voice.
They needed a voice and, and Iwas already kind of in that
spot. And I'm, you have had, youknow, a good relationship with
Dave and a bad relationship withDave and currently Dave and I

(01:19:30):
are on the outs but those fenceswill get mended or bridges will
get built back. I'm not worriedabout that. Yeah, we're both
good guys. And but we're bothhardhead so I get that so don't
take wouldn't have existed ithad not been for that but so JT,
you know. Yeah, I'm there'stexting, maybe going back maybe
was a phone call. JT goes, man,I've got the spreadsheet. Let me
let me send it to you. And hegoes, verified. Yeah, we're

(01:19:52):
good. And he sends it to me andwithin five minutes, and I'm, by
the way, Dave is an Excel gurutoo. So Dave, just hadn't seen
Thing is, within the first fiveminutes of me looking at it, I
was like, Hey, you got Marcoslooks like he leaves the line
at, I don't know, 29th spot. Andit was some other car and, and

(01:20:12):
I'm like this jumps out here theand you just you run some, some
splits and little formulas offthe times and you realize it
throws red flags. And there waslike five cars that had red flag
issues go back to JT and youguys knew of like three of them.
And two of them weren't known.
But Marcos was one of them. Andit was like it changed the
podium. And so it was like, Idon't want to. So the best part

(01:20:34):
about that before you go anyfarther is I the last year that
we timed in my team time was2019. Yeah, it was the it was
the brand name. Yeah, but youwere but you were thrown under
the bus. And all I did in 2012was supply the transponders.
Yeah, that's that was it? That'sexactly right. And so, so there
was that. And so it was aproblem. And everyone's like,

(01:20:57):
you know, the sanctity of theresults, right? was, you know,
was was challenged? Yeah. Andthat was a that was a thorn in,
ya know, that was a thorn inDave's side. But it was also
this this issue with, you know,the drivers and then even then
the sponsors? He knows, becausethere was I think there was
something they put out, youknow, press releases like a

(01:21:18):
week, and then turns out theydidn't win some things along
those lines. Well, then what wehad another we had a timing
issue, the very next race, andthen it was like, okay, we ended
up with with with USAC. But notI'm happy with you sec. I think
that was the smart call. It'snot there anymore. But yes,
yeah. But it was it was removingit was a de risking you for de

(01:21:39):
risking it. Right? Do you feelwas able to look and say we have
this neutral third partyverifying This is announced,
we're going to take theirresults, which worse is handling
in house, but there's a cost tothat. Right. And I get saved
trying to save the cost? Yeah,but you ended up
going down this path becausejohn good B ends up being the

(01:22:00):
one who looks at it ends upbeing the scapegoat. Yeah. And
that wasn't it at all? No, yeah.
And my thing is, it goes backto, like, we talked about the
wrap stuff earlier aboutgraphics and stuff is like, I
have skin in the game, right?
These are my, these are myfriends, my peers, you know, a
lot of these guys I see outside,you know, of the world, and they
raised my series, you know, and,and I can say, Intel, this year,

(01:22:24):
a side by side event, which wasa whole different ballgame. I
never put the wrong top three onthe podium ever at a NorCal
race, you know, and we had some,you know, bumps and scrapes and
battles before stuff. And Idon't know if I could ever take
100% blame of any of those. ButI had skin in the game and that
and it mattered to me, but Iwasn't there. But I'm never I'm
black and white. Right? It'sit's, there's no gray area,

(01:22:45):
timing is timing. And I don't Imean, I can manipulate whatever
I wanted to in that system. Butthere was never that way. And I
wanted the guys to have a fairrace and and be treated and, and
they're paying the money to bethere. And they should have a
legit scoring system. And that'show it all started. You know,
and and it was hard because youknow, if it's if it's money
race, you can't read the cars,you can't, you can't get your

(01:23:07):
manual backup 100%. And like, Imean, I always had a team
scoring with me. And Davidalways, you know, there was, if
you have too many people or youknow, whatnot, or what why is
this person here and like,because we need a team, this
takes a team, everyone's hereand they spend the money because
it's the most important part.
You know, you can't there's no,there can't be gray area and
timing. So I'm glad someone elseis doing it. And the amount of
the amount of time and effortthat I have in it or having it

(01:23:30):
with them. It there's not enoughmoney in the world to stress for
that. It's just it. There's notknowing and you brought you
brought from the crux of theissues. You know, it's not like
we're road racing Porsches here.
It's not at all it's no, you'reoff road racing sledgehammers,
and you're bashing them onrocks, or you go to nice coast

(01:23:51):
racing, you're running themthrough what we saw this past
week, you know, just mud slop.
You know, these guys look like Isaw the video on the Internet of
ultra for racing from Kentucky,it was pigs rolling around in
the mud. That's, I mean, youfigure the transponder in it
reading correctly every time. Sothe scoring guys have to some
cars, if they didn't read theythey've got to look at a clock

(01:24:13):
and throw in a manual entry. Andthat, you know, there's some
accuracy to that and someinaccuracy to that it's
sometimes better than nothing.
But it's not foolproof, and Ithink we need to step back and
like look at that and go, isthere a better system out there?
Have we made the best system outof the best system that's out

(01:24:33):
there? And this is still wherewe're at and we should be okay
with this is what it is? And Ithink that's, at least for me, I
think that's where it got Imean, I've written down some of
the issues the Nationals, andwhat I saw out of the USAC stuff
was they kept not not only didthey have the transport the
transponder didn't work. Theyhad redundancy with a video.
They had video sitting at startfinish. And the times were

(01:24:57):
synced up. So I was like okay,It was very cool to see the
transparency in ultra for makingthat change to Lin confidence
back to timing. So you youmentioned you sex not there
anymore. So filming there's anew is a new company is live
live timing I think it is. It'swho they are. The guys are

(01:25:18):
software programmers, they knowtheir system. They seem to be
legit. They're still workingthrough some of the stuff but
I think it's good. I mean, Iliterally I mean, I just look at
him eyes laugh I watched the guyMoab run up and down the start
finish line, make sure I want totransponders on make sure
they're working. You know, and Idid that at kth. I did it every
race and I don't envy whatthey're doing. But it's a is I

(01:25:40):
don't think it's USAC anymore. Ithink it's a it's called Live
timing. And the guys seem legit.
I talked to him when Iquestioned him. And, you know, I
played down and he didn't know Iwas so I got to answer quote
asked questions. If I knowanything about and back. I
didn't know anything about whatthey were doing. And he answer
all the questions correctly. Sothe thing is, is anyone that's
not an industry or in our, inour in our field, if there is a
non read in the camera and as amud car, and you can't read it

(01:26:04):
and you don't know that car, youdon't know it's Eric Miller's
front end.
That I mean, thankfully, thebackup camera or the camera
footage, and JT can figure thatout, obviously, I mean, he knows
the cars just as well as anyoneelse. That's part of the hard
part, you know? Absolutely. Andso we, I mean, you see how they
can take you but I'll say thefirst place I saw that being
used Michael, mechanical andthrown in there, Alan O'Neal at

(01:26:28):
Nationals. That was kind of hisjob. What I witnessed was the
start finish, guys, if theydidn't get a read, and he was
the one he knew what the carswere, he knew who the driver
was. And he would call out whoit was. And then if the
transponder was correct, rightthat they got this check, right?
Yeah, that's who it was. But ifit didn't read, they already had
the name. But I can imagine youmiles and Pam go through that.

(01:26:52):
Especially like a race like wejust saw at a rush Kentucky
where after turn two or turnthree, you know, just after
where we're handsome j rolls thecars. They're all Brown. Right?
You have to at that point, youneed to you're going off of
silhouette, you know the shape,like you can tell that, you
know, a Trent five car fromMiller car from, but a lot of

(01:27:14):
them still look the same oncethey're all rolled around in the
same brown mud. Yeah, yeah. Imean, and that was that was the
shark fin thing the GT broughtin, you know, the shark fin in
the back of the cars. But theproblem with the manual backup
is if you are looking at theshark fin that's not an accurate
time either. You know, youalready missed him by seconds.
Yeah. So they're alsocompetitive now that the races

(01:27:34):
are coming down to secondsseconds matter. You know, what
did the sample you pay 250 aweek in a week ago, it came down
to Menzies winning over 280miles oberleutnant millon, he
won, if I that I may be wrong,somebody correct me and yell at
the radio right now. I think itwas like 28 seconds. Yeah, I
mean, I've watched him in PhilBurton and UTV You know, that's

(01:27:57):
a desert champion multiple yearsin a row I watched him come to
the back of the pack and win by20 seconds after Vegas to Reno I
mean, just all the racing andall the fields to get the guys
everyone has to step up the gameso that it's important you know,
and ultra for Best of the desertscore whatever it may be it's
it's definitely insane andthat's why the short course
that's why you know, we venturedout and had some desert stuff

(01:28:19):
Dave and I and and that didn'tgo well for us and it wasn't our
forte and we let that go and andbut short courses it's easy it's
it's the lap traffic but youknow who lens it's not that hard
to mess up and really that weuse transponders just for
laptops people can know how fastthey are fast or you know and
qualify and do some other coolstuff with it and and but that's

(01:28:39):
why I like short course I mean Idon't I dread doing endurance
races as as as a promoter at thetop you know me helping is one
thing but endurance or desert isnot doesn't sound fun logistics
none of that none of that soundsa very amazing short courses
easy a spectator friendly, youknow, and 123 is pretty pretty
easy to distinguish. So what doyou think about the guest

(01:29:02):
series? I guess I mean, I thinkit's good I mean, there's a void
to be filled right? I mean, abunch people try to jump on the
bandwagon and fill in that voidand and I'll be the first to
admit that I flew down a coupleweeks working in the hammers and
looked at all the same tracksand you know, I thought about us
you know, socail series or howare you on you know, SoCal rock

(01:29:22):
racing or SoCal anything butlogistically for me I mean,
Northern California is my homeand and I've kind of owned the
Northern California area and andin short course racing and
I don't have the time or corethe or the I guess the drive to
do another series down there. SoI'm glad they they picked it
back up and it looks like theyhad a good turnout. I don't know

(01:29:44):
what what gas is gonna makebetter than Lucas did. But
there's a void to be filled andI wish the best form and I know
Dave's behind the scenes and,and guys with the same cruiser
on it, so it shouldn't be thatfar off of Lucas.
Gotcha. Oh, that's what Ithought. But I didn't know if
they had you involved with, uh,with track maintenance. Yeah, we

(01:30:06):
talked about it for a littlebit, but they have all their own
guys. AndI mean, I honestly don't have
time to, you know, prep allthose tracks and everything we
do and yeah, they Daveintroduced me the other guy and
and he's like, I'm What are yougonna do for maintenance? And he
said he, he's got also holdLucas crew. I said go then for
my work for me. Yeah, freeze me.
Yeah.
Yeah, I mean, and, you know, andto me, I used to do a lot of

(01:30:29):
stuff for Dave and I still doDave, you know, help them out.
And it's, it's for fun. Youknow, it's not a business. But
at this point, that that kind ofventure would be full business
decision. And I don't thinkthey'd like those numbers on
paper. Yeah. Well, I don't thinkanyone likes those numbers. On
paper, right? Yeah. Well, Imean, you got to prep the track
and water. Yeah, exactly. So um,I've got a handful more more

(01:30:53):
questions here as I get to theend of the session, but I want
to jump into is basically myshow, I've asked you everything
you you know, I wanted to know,is there anything that you want
to bring up and they would covereverything that you want to
cover? Now go into my last lastthings I want to get out of,
you? know, I think we're good. Imean, just so what makes a good

(01:31:13):
course, in your opinion, a goodold, I'm going to call for that.
Not not a desert course not ashort course, in ultra for what
makes it and I bring this up inthe context of we've got to move
nationals. There's aconversation about you know, the
drivers love Oklahoma. But itsucks for everything else.
Right. Hotels, spectators. It'sjust it's not that good for

(01:31:39):
that. Reno, Reno seemed like ithad everything right. Wild West
had great for spectators, thecrews love it. It was really
hard on cars. That was the onlynegative I heard. I want to hear
from john gibby. What, in youropinion, makes a great ultra for
course, for a nationalchampionship, right? I mean,

(01:31:59):
location is key, like Oklahomamakes sense for location right
middle the country. It makessense. But does it? I don't know
that. I see. Now granted, yeah,it's Central. But a majority of
the racers andShannon Welch's who told me this
and I went and looked at it anda majority of the ultra for
racers. They're from your neckof the woods, right? They're
from Northern California is theglut of ultra for racers come

(01:32:21):
out of there and it's the RenoTahoe area and then the
Sacramento area. The old Piratesof the Rubicon area. I mean,
there's there's so many racersfrom that area. There's some So
Cal guys are some Arizona guys,there's some Colorado guys. And
then there's a spring in NewMexico. Yeah, then there's a
sprinkling over the rest of thecountry. But the glut of them

(01:32:42):
are in NorCal. So from a centrallocation, I don't feel that
Oklahoma's real central In myopinion, I think there may be
like a that would be the peoplepleaser statement out of me, I
guess. Yeah. But that's what I'mgetting at. I mean, obviously,
it'd be amazing to have it youknow, on our side but as far as
the National and nationalchampionship track I mean short

(01:33:06):
course is probably it's got tobe a spectator friendly event
for all for all reasons rightfor exposure for content for
spectators for drivers that youknow people will reach the
drivers I mean, and be able towatch them and do the battle on
the course I mean, short coursemakes sense was why was why was
so good. I had a lot of seating,a lot of grandstands had

(01:33:28):
amenities. Cell phone servicewas terrible there. But I mean,
it is what it is. But I think anational championship should
have everything it should beshort course should be fast as
you slows be technical, heshould have rocks. I mean, it
could be it should be somethingthat, you know, while bless was
or something we built, and toshow all talents, you know, and
and i think that I mean, it'd berad if it was on the side. I

(01:33:51):
don't know where and when Imean, they firmly firmly is an
option then I got a lot of workto do because it places new, but
I don't know. I don't know ifthat's on the table. Women.
That's that's all up in there.
Rumor and conjecture.
Yeah, yeah. All right. So I'mgonna start a new thing. This is
a you're the guinea pig. And I'mgonna ask everybody else

(01:34:13):
hopefully in the future, I'lltry to remember to do this.
We'll see. This is the one thingI'm going to change up on this
one. As we close out, I think,you know, the music that we
listen to says a lot about ourmindset at this point or
juncture in our life, right, youknow, various things and I was
going back to I swear it waslike a mini trucking magazine

(01:34:35):
from the 90s where on like, whenthe last pages it showed, like,
what's in the CD changer andlike listed the 10 CDs they were
listening to and they were allWest Coast stuff. You know, I'm,
yeah, I'm in Kansas, right? Wehad George Strait, and that was
every single year George Straitnow, so I'm gonna ask you a
question, john.
Top three songs. Man, that's atough one. If anyone knows me,

(01:34:58):
well, I'm I'm theNo radio on while I'm driving
because I'm either on the phoneor I'm thinking so, I mean if
you go like to old Rubicon daysI mean, it might be I come in a
sluice box and I'm coming out ofIndia so maybe ludicrous move
out the way. All right? Somesome like old school rap. So
move bit if so I'm not reallygood with song names either or

(01:35:21):
who sings them. I got a funnystory about that got me in
trouble quite a bit, actually.
But, uh, I don't I mean, youknow, maybe some, like, if I
want to get going, or if I'm inthe dozer and I'm, I've seen
something going it's, you know,like Pandora, like a, like an
offspring or Green Day mix, youknow, like that, to see that
kind of punk like old schoolpunk that actually it was, you

(01:35:43):
know, beaten, not, you know, notmetal, but you know, that kind
of music. I couldn't tell you asong in that realm. But in
there, and then I feel likelately it's been if I am
driving, I've been caught with aradio on lately, which is kind
of rare. And it's been justcountry like, and I don't really
have a genre, I just kind oflisten to everything. And you

(01:36:03):
know, I mean, my dad was GarthBrooks fan. So I got to see
Garth Brooks a couple times. Andlike Florida, there's a lime.
They're pretty rad. I got to seethem at SEMA. That might have
gotten trouble because I mighthave recorded the beginning
intro like, hey, check this out.
I'm at some concert. I don'teven know where it is. I know
the song sounds familiar. Andsend it to somebody else. And
she was like, that's my favoriteband. And like, goes the same

(01:36:24):
every year with me. And this isthe one year that she doesn't go
and, and she's like, real cool.
So you're under their face.
Right? Yeah, they didn't go overso well. So yeah, that's I mean,
I think I don't Yeah, butthat's, that'd be my music. I
guess. If it's on. That's what,that's where we go. I asked you
the question. So I can't makefun of your choices. I just I

(01:36:45):
wouldn't be neutral on them. Butnow I know, a play for you. You
know what? Well, next time I seeyou. Yeah. I mean, it could be
some like NWA and the prerunnerwhen we're when we're passing
everyone on billing road. Imean, you can choose a song but
you can guess which one it is,you know? Yeah, exactly.
It's just, you never know. Like,I don't put some, you know, have

(01:37:07):
this funny, I got these harddrives of music for my buddies
used to be DJs. And they'renever on anything. And I never
put music on my phone or iPadsever, but whatever's in my
iTunes account. If you playedthe playlist on my phone, you'd
be like, I don't even know wherethe music came from. I'll be on
the airplane listening liketrying to sleep. And it goes
from Britney Spears to StoneTemple Pilots to to Garth Brooks

(01:37:28):
to I mean, her Beastie Boys likeit's like one song of like,
every like, I don't even knowhow I got on my phone. It's
like, that is what I got.
Musical. Tourette's is insanelyout of control. And then also
there's like a whole album ofCCD or was that created? CCR?
Creedence Clearwater Revival?

(01:37:49):
Yeah, like and I don't know whothey are, but they're like,
awesome. There'll be a wholealbum for them. And then also in
one run random mic to short songwill come on. Like, it's just,
it's insane. But yeah, I mean,you know, I wasn't a little
writer world. You know, I wasyoung kids. I mean, to short
Tupac. I mean, all that youknow, everyone thinks they're
gangsters some point in theirlife right?
Yes, especially if you grew upin you know, the 90s right. I

(01:38:13):
mean, if you live next to FolsomPrison I mean, how much harder
can you get? Yeah.
Oh, man. Well, Mr. JOHN good beWow, I thoroughly enjoyed our
conversation man. I didn't knowyou like I don't know you. I
mean, here's the thing aboutthat. I feel like I know you I
feel like I knew you beforehandlike cuz you're a friendly guy

(01:38:34):
gonna walk up to you and I havewalked up you the first I didn't
even start with this the firstplace we met physically and
shook hands 2020 Ultra fornationals in Oklahoma. That's
not even that's what is thateight months ago nine months ago
it's not that long ago the firsttime we physically shook hands
so everybody that's how friendlythis guy is that you know that

(01:38:57):
was the first time the secondtime I ran into him physically
in person was at hammers thisyear and him yelling at me
inviting me in for lunch sogreat guy john goobie Thank you
for coming on the talent tankand man just kind of fill us in
on who you are what you do andjust everything about you. I
mean you just very very curiousto me. No worries. Yeah, I mean
this really i mean you know Icreated one more thing about

(01:39:19):
Norco rockeries and I created aseries or tried to create a
series that you are raised youknow as a racer my whole life I
wanted to create something thateveryone else wanted to be part
of you know and whether it begrassroots or compete with ultra
for which you know our be afeeder series whatever it is
like I want to create a seriesthat you could come everyone's
family just like ultra for buteven closer and you know kept

(01:39:40):
kept the cost low. The reasonintense and the payouts high and
you know, it's not about themoney because we're racing you
can afford it but it's nice totake home a couple $1,000 check
and and that's what I tried tocreate and Norco rock racing is
still grassroots but you know,it's legit when you show up to
show the battle. I mean, there'sstill some of the fastest guys
in theContrary there, I can attest to
watching your heat races thispast weekend. Online. You got

(01:40:03):
you had a live feed. That wasnew. That was a throw in like
open wheel tire to tire. legit.
And again, Ron prindle in theold hippie Hiller you know what
a shit like when he went for it?
I mean, I almost found myselfjumping up and down like it was
legit. Well, congrats on pulloff that race. Be safe, have fun

(01:40:24):
and Holly LS fest this week, andhopefully everyone everyone
hears this, we'll find out thatit's super successful. And the
track you built was exactly thatsuper successful. And we never
hear another word about it,right? Yep. That's all we need.
Yes, it's more of a demo now andjust but uh, there's some big
some big gap doubles in thecontent coming out for some of

(01:40:44):
the terror crew and other guyswould be hired is going to be
insane. There's not there's notabletops it's literally all big
gaps and a big nasty set ofwhoops, with a jump going into
them. So that's what theywanted. So I sort of built I
will check out their Instagrambefore that stuff goes live
because our crew is good aboutposting some some amazing stuff.
Oh, man, what a show. Glad I wasable to get you on here, john,

(01:41:05):
and thank you for taking thetime out of your busy schedule
between your own racing. You'rehosting your own races, LS fest
ultra for stuff plus business,concrete and wraps and man
you're you're busy guy. Oh nowhen you sleep, but man, thank
you for coming on. Yeah, Iappreciate it. Thanks for having
me. All right, not everybody. Onthat note, we're out.

Intro/Outro (01:41:29):
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