EP 46 Michael London

Episode Transcript
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Intro/Outro (00:02):
Let's drop the green flag on this episode of
the talent tank podcast withyour host Wyatt Pemberton
bringing you the best, fastest,most knowledgeable personalities
and Ultra4 and off road racing.

Wyatt Pemberton (00:20):
Alright, alright. Alright, here we go
everybody welcome back. Welcomeback to the show the talent tank
we're gonna take in, you know,another dive in not you just dip
our toes in and get them wet alittle. And looking back at me
right now is this guy, MichaelLondon. driver of the 4825 EMC
racer good looking fella that Iknow almost nearly nothing about

(00:42):
which this is gonna be superfun. I'm kind of a no, I'm on.
I'm on the edge of my seat aboutwhat this guy's got going on.
Because he he's he's popped upon my radar enough times that
he's got a pop up on otherpeople's radars. Michael, how
are you?

Michael London (00:55):
I am good, man.
How are you? I'm well, talkingto you. And we're

gonna knock out this episode 46. And, and you
know, I always try to carry newguys and get the story like how,
how you found your way to ultrafor and how you ended up in the
fold. And you've been? I think,you know, you showed up at kth
like 2018. And then you raced itin 19 and 20 and 20. Others. So
got we've got a lot of ground tocover. But you're known for out

(01:25):
the bat, the thing that strikesme about you and why you've
popped up on my radar becauseyour car is a very good looking
car, you drive a two seat Jimmychassis in the MC. And it's that
I call it battleship gray. Butit's kind of you know, what
would you call a lusterlessgray.

Unknown (01:43):
It's kind of got some digital cammo in there. And it's
it's kind of a flat gray color.
Take you know, and we'llprobably get into this later.
But I kind of cut my teeth andcar stuff doing show cars. So we
got to look cool, right? Andthen I was gonna joke is when is
when we show up at races likeclay, we have no idea what we're
doing. But we're going to lookcool anyways. So I take a lot of

(02:04):
pride in that. But

yeah, I want to hear you because we all have
that first experience of beingat our first race where we're
like driver record and, and nothaving been around it. And yours
is fairly recent, right? It'sonly a few years ago, so I'm
very excited about that. Yourace them to the GSM livery
which is

Unknown (02:24):
Yep, that's great squad Motorsports. That's, uh, that's
me and whoever I can con intoshowing up to help me out. Oh, I
love them. It's you know, we'llget into it later. But it's
become it's become kind of onebig family with the border belt
Foundation, and just kind of awhole thing with all kinds of
stuff. Those guys got classelevens and dirt bikes, and
we're having a really good timewith all of it. But yeah, man,

(02:45):
we just really like we got outof cool, man, and we got to look
cool. And then we'll figure outhow to race later. Yeah,

so where are your bill? So I which I mean,
we're gonna get there where yourbill is just an amazing charity.
They do a lot of good stuff fora lot of great folks. And I know
a lot of great folks that havegotten involved with them. And
it's been really cool to seetheir inputs into that
organization, how it's changedthem, and how it's helped them.
So it's always that you're givento a charity and you're

(03:13):
supporting a charity and you'reputting your time into it to
help others. But invariably,

Unknown (03:19):
it helps you Sure, sure. Yeah. Yeah, sure. Does,
man.

Well, we will get there man. So today, you're
gonna be talking your bags hereand you're gonna be getting on
the road in a couple days. Yougot San Felipe a this weekend.
You guys are headed south of theborder. You live in Moab today.
So you live Are you alreadyliving off road Mecca?

Unknown (03:37):
I do. Man. I got a love hate relationship with this
town. But I'm here right now.
We've been here a couple ofyears, had a chance to leave the
rat race to kind of the DC area.
like Oh, hell, I grew up comingout to Moab. So we just came out
here. My kids crushing it. I gota 17 year old. He's a junior
high school. He's thriving. Butyeah, man, I have a love hate

(03:59):
relationship with town. It'sit's a really great place to be
outdoors. But you know, I don'twant to get too much into
politics of it. But the

spectrum.

Unknown (04:09):
Yeah, yeah, man, they don't want us here anymore.

And I will tell you, you know, myself included
and everyone listening likethey're pretty jealous that you
literally have a race in yourbackyard. So there's at least
one race a year you don'ttravel.

Unknown (04:23):
Right, man that is so cool. It's 15 minutes and I
could I could actually drive myrace car if I went on the power
lines. I almost did it just forthe hell of it. I could drive my
car to DFE I didn't do it but itcan be done.

That's awesome.
People like they're hating on merad

Unknown (04:42):
it's a great place to live. It's a great place to live
man. It's just it's it's atourist town. You know, you're
literally on an island is twohours to your real town to get
any union real shopping oranything like that diamond is a
road trip. But

So how long have you lived in my lab?

Unknown (04:57):
I've lived here just over two years.

Okay. You guys moved out there from the DC
area?

Unknown (05:03):
Yeah, yeah. But I I'm not complaining man, I'm, uh,
you know, we were sitting intraffic for, you know, two hours
a day go go one way. And youknow, this is you walk in the
DMV here and it's one lady andthere's nobody at the line in
the counter and, you know,there's, there's, there's a
really nice, there's a lot tolike about my lab even outside
of off roading, but I feel likeit's maybe a little bit too
small for me.

I'm gonna pull the the DC line right here
that's in Vogue, right now.
We're gonna circle back to that.
Cool. So right now, so your,your preference for sampling.
They told me about the GSMMotorsports effort to run down
south of the border and race theEl Rey,

Unknown (05:38):
man, I'm stoked. It's, uh, you know, I think it's every
kid that likes off roads dreamto go to a race in Baja, we were
set to do it 29 or wheneverCOVID happened like right before
it last week. We had everythinglined up, house registered all
that and then and then thathappened. And that kind of
bummed us out for the rest ofthe season. And this year,

(06:00):
we're, I think right now we'refourth and national points.
That's a lot of there's there'sa lot of racing left, but we're
going to Mexico man where wedon't have a whole lot of help.
But we're stoked. We're gonna goand I know if it was easy, I
guess everyone would do it. Soit's been a lot of work to get
to this point. But man, I spentall day on the trailer today,

(06:22):
the cars ready to go. I'mwaiting for my buddy to show up
here this weekend. And we'regonna head down and link up with
Beckham from water bill inTucson. Get down and get it
done. And then crossover. Wheredo you guys crossover? Well,
I've never been there. But we'regonna try to link up with Yeah,
we're gonna try to link up Iguess there's a liaison. That

(06:42):
ultra force kind of worked withthe tourism industry to meet us
all kind of like 12 1230 andkind of smooth out the process
to getting over so I

did see an email on that. And then I saw
some Facebook on that. You'reabsolutely right so far has done
a good job. I remember a fewyears ago, it was Terry Matt and
funny enough his work, I'm surewill, his name will come up we
get in this conversation basedon knowing you and where you're
built. But he was running behindand he crossed over on his own
at night in the dark solo. Andhe got robbed. And he wrote, you

(07:18):
know, it was a really bad deal.
But at the same time, it's like,Terry, you really you can only
blame yourself on that. Likethey saw you that man they saw
you coming a mile away. Like youknow, it's it's it's truly you
know, I believe it's safe downthere. And that's why we're
racing down there but it is itis safe, but you've got to watch

(07:40):
your P's and Q's you've got togo in groups you've got to look
out for each other and theninvariably stuff will walk off a
chase tracks that's just that'sjust the way Mexico is but if
everyone's you know watchingtheir stuff and watch out for
each other then it is safe. It'syou know, at least what we're
told and what we're seeing. Butyeah, if you're gonna go solo,
you are gonna you're like theslowest buffalo they're gonna

(08:01):
snag

Unknown (08:08):
I don't know what year that was. Maybe that was 2019 it
was a he's always getting intosoccer man,

God he is he is. So just before we went we
started record everybody sittinghere talking to Michael and
we're going through theheadshots and headshots are kind
of a big thing for me, I makesure you know it's a certain
look and I'm going after youknow, because it becomes the
artwork not just on social medianot just on the talent tank comm

(08:35):
it's also embedded in the IDthree tag the audio so that's
where all of the you know, theall the other stream platforms,
whoever you're listening to onit today, you know, if you're
listening on Apple or Spotify orwhatever, that's how that
picture shows up. Like on yourradio is because I've gotten the
artwork right and the artwork tome is getting the guy's face

(08:58):
you're just getting the bestpicture and you know, not
everyone is photogenic or noteveryone is at events where
they're getting good picturesand not everyone is in front of
Alan Johnson when he's doingheadshots so to speak is his
sneak attack so Michael has areally good one here but it but
he's kind of looking he'slooking a little too far away
and I call it a three quarteringaway look you know if anyone

(09:20):
shooter you know what a threefiring away is. And so he's kind
of the street corner away andI'm kind of going to crop it I'm
like well, I really liked it tobe more of your face you're good
looking dude, you're not uglylike most of us are some of the
guys like a really good threequarter in a way that I've got
is like a Phil McCarty. Likeeveryone knows what it looks
like from side and he's uglyfrom now. But yours is I'm like

(09:44):
okay, I'm telling you this andnow I'm like, but the problem
with the the crop out is in yourbackground is just this big mane
of blonde hair and it'sterrible.

Unknown (09:53):
Now, it's just

now in Terry, not the Terry ruins the picture.
He just doesn't make it usablefor him. I'd like

Unknown (10:02):
Scala has a mind of its own and creeps in.

Yeah, I remember when he had short hair.
So it's Yeah, that was that wasa long, long, long, long, long,
long time ago. So how do youknow that? You know, Terry just
through through warrior built?

Unknown (10:17):
Yeah, man. I mean, dude, that's I mean, you know
stoked to be on this show.
Because this show I listen to itevery week and it's always guys
I look up to you know, and itwas I don't really know
everybody off road racing knowswho Terry is. And when we were
when we were kind of partneredup with warrior bill, you know,
it was it was JT and a coupleother guys like man you got to
get Terry in your car Jerry'she's got a really good

(10:38):
relationship with those guys andI kind of didn't know that and
then we started talking, youknow, he wasn't sure if he could
get in the car and hammersbecause he has a lot of other
obligations you know, he's Thisis his livelihood, you know, and
I get that and we ended upspending a little bit of time
together I went out to do alittle shock tuning and we did
the Thanksgiving deal out atDave's place and Carrie and I
got in the car and we hit it offpretty quick and then I think he

(10:59):
wasn't scared for his life afterriding with me for a few minutes
and we did the hammer stayingand then you know an hour I
think we're gonna race the wholeseason together so

here is what I did notice about you is you your
hashtag game is like on pointyour social media hashtag game
is something else and you you'vegot one like I just laughed at
it had another note Terry but itwas like there's something about
amigos like

Unknown (11:33):
there's no talent no drama all amigo or no no egos

no egos just amigos

Unknown (11:43):
BB man we have so much fun in the VIP race, you know
hammers is stressful, but wewere just cruising man. We're
just like talking about life. Idon't even think we talked about
the race the whole damn daywe're looking at you know, the
mountain the snowcappedmountains. We're like, Dude,
this is amazing. And we just gotout of the car and that that was
the most fun I've had and onsometimes I'm not convinced it's
a whole lot of fun. We had agood time. Well, don't don't

drop too much.
Because I'm not talking about kwage this year. So but back into
the into San Felipe Bay. Youguys got crossover, like
Wednesday? Is that your plan?

Unknown (12:15):
Yeah. Wednesday morning, Wednesday morning.
We'll be there. We're going topre run. Thursday, Terry Terry's
doing the Sonora on the otherside of the peninsula. So he's
gonna show up and get in the carlike Friday.

Oh, really? So Oh, yeah. I didn't know. I
didn't know there was a Terrytie in that was current. Okay.

Unknown (12:35):
Yeah, yeah, man. He's meeting me down there. But he's
not going to be able toprerunner anything with us or I
don't even think he's going tobe around for qualifying. So
we're going to go down there.
And

that might be a bit rough. That might be a good
thing now.

Unknown (12:48):
We'll run a lap, at least Thursday. kind of do the
Mexican thing. Hopefully. tacosand the beer and all that hang
out and I will qualify it Fridayand race Saturday man or woman.
We're coming home Sunday. It's akind of a quick trip, but I'm
really looking forward to it.
Man.

I'm absolutely looking forward to it. We've got
the Wednesday night hereWednesday night. We're gonna do
the bintray session about thisthis race and we're gonna see
what East Coast racers are gonnatalk smack about? Yeah,

Unknown (13:14):
I'm sure yeah.

I love you know, I throw this out here
every now and then. You know,the Casey Gilbert phone calls.
And I got one this week. Caseygoing? Hey, man. Uh, well, it's
like it's actually starts outthis way. Hello. Hi. Yeah.
Thinking about this. Why don'tyou do that show earlier in the
week, so that you can have somemore people on it more volume,

(13:37):
but not the guys on the roaddriving. They're already at the
race. I'm like, well, Casey,this is a good point. I'm glad
you're bringing this up to my tomy attention. One, the earlier
day I could do it would beTuesday. Okay. That is the one
day of the week. I cannotschedule anything I've fully
committed on Tuesday. So thatputs it on Monday. Well, most in
ultra for mean the ultra forteam that work for over four.

(14:00):
They're not even showing up tothe site until Monday, Tuesday,
sometimes Wednesday. So I'mwaiting to ensure that the
information I have when we kindof go live that night is like
the best. It's like how manylaps how many miles on a lap
right enable details or nuancesthat ultra for needs to ensure
get out there. We make sure weget it on there so that on

(14:20):
Thursday morning, it's kind ofout of court on Monday we like
okay, it's doing laps.
How many miles? JT is not eventhere. He's still flying. You
know, and so that that's alwaysin case he's like, Okay, good
point.

Unknown (14:38):
Gotcha. Yeah, you got the last minute registration.
You guys too, right? Yeah. Canyou keep it a secret?

Well, I don't even know that. That's the case.
I think it's really the case ofyou know, I love Alan Johnson.
He's on top of it. Andespecially now that he is
officially full time with ultrafour. As those things come in.
It's a little hard to constantlyupdate the website. You know,
every single time he looks at anew email, then he needs to run
to the website. I know they'reworking on a new website that
was supposed to kind of do thatautomatically as you register

(15:08):
because you registered throughthe website, and then it popped
up. But we're still on themanual process, but I do know
Yeah. Allen has said, Hey, themost current list is what's up
there. So that's what we go withit in various ways. There'll be
four or five there'll be somestragglers that

Unknown (15:23):
yeah, that's why somebody shows up at the race.
They can't do that. This one.
Yeah. They won't like your race.

So in the fuel, you got to schedule fuel to get
it down there. vp is deliveringagain, so you had to get your
own son. I don't know what thelast day for that was. I feel
like that it already passedthough.

Unknown (15:43):
You got your fuel ordered, right? Yeah, yeah,
sure. Now we're good. Yeah, wedid that we did. Now they've
been great this year, man. Itwas you know and again like I
said, Tell JC gets there and hegets eyes on now everything's
off for anyone's guess. Butthey're, they're really good job
at letting everybody know, youknow, hey, here's gonna be the
mileage. You know, if you got aplan for you got to plan for

(16:04):
fuel and stuff when you can'thaul it with yourself. That's
right. I think they're doing asgood a job as they can. So

yeah, and that's a no simply pays a little
bit of unknown quantity versuslike rush. They'd never been
there before. I'll tell you JTright now him and good B. And
bird which is a L rod. Yeah.
They are at the buffalo chip inSouth Dakota right now. Sturgis,
South Dakota working on thetrack for was that a month from
edge? It's coming up prettyquick for Mike August. Yeah. So

(16:32):
they're working on that tracknow and building you know, a
little bit of So myunderstanding is it starts on
the short course but then itgoes way out and and good to be
sent me some really goodpictures they are on the
insiders group have some ideasof kind of what the train looks
like. It looks nice hilly, nicetransitions. No trees. So yeah,
I'm kind of really excited forthat course. Because it's kinda

Unknown (16:59):
it looks really cool.
It looks really cool.

And then the other new news I saw this week
was nationals has officiallylanded on Oklahoma.

Unknown (17:10):
I saw that I heard that last night.

Did you remember? A year ago?

Unknown (17:14):
No, man I went. So we you know, the only thing we
raised last year was kayo. h iwent to the Nationals last year
kind of pitted for cage. Okay,so you've been wanting to go
anyways, I've been there. Ithink it's a really great place
to race man. I'm just worried,you know, the volatility of the
weather. There's What?

What you know, like tornadoes.

Unknown (17:38):
Dude, you saw the videos from you know, a few
years ago, and those cards arejust over the hood and mud and
stuff. And it's just like, oh mygod. First the first race we
ever get. I think the first timeI've ever met Hartman man, it
was a dirty turtle and he hauledhis car down there and he didn't
take out the trailer. He waslike oh, not doing it. I was
like that's pretty gangster moveman.

Yeah, rush Yeah, we just since we just
coming out rush Kentucky thatwas you know, flashback to that.
I mean, one lap in and the onlycars that you could see what
they were was it was it was jhandsome j you could still see
his car because he rolled on lapone. So he was the only one I
still kind of clean. I thinkthat was just to make sure the
sponsor logos were still clean.
One lot longer than everybodyelse. Give the sponsors what

(18:24):
they wanted. No. Yeah, I mean,yeah. David Hartman. I didn't
know I mean, I can absolutelysee David not not unloading but
Oklahoma. It is a drivers track.
It is a really it's kind of gotthe best of kyivstar Racing non
kayo h it's really really goodin that regard. It's just kind

(18:45):
of near near nowhere and itdoesn't have good spectator
viewing that

Unknown (18:49):
I think that's the kind of a bummer man was you know, I
think everybody wanted it to belike Reno you know, wherever it
is. And that's, you know, thegrandstands and all that stuff,
but was I guess we'll see manwe're gonna party.

I didn't that's the other side is a lack of
accommodations real close on.
And there's the one casino butit's our it's pretty booked up,
then. So you got to go prettyfar. So I don't know. It'll
still be worth it. It won'tmatter. I mean, we will be
around our friends. We're gonnabe ripped out there's gonna be
great race. Caspian burn.

Unknown (19:19):
Yeah, it's gonna be great, man.

It can't be mad. Funny story. This is how so
how this went down. I amactually pretty busy at your
work, and surprisingly enough,then. And this past week, Jesse
Williams over on race on therocks podcast. He covers all the
rock bouncers could do. He postsup I believe it was in the
insiders group about who doesmarketing the best, like who's

(19:43):
the best marketing in our genre?
And I think we all kind of knowwho the number one is. But under
that, it's like we're all kindof sucking. Right. So it's it's
Lauren Haley, Lauren, you knowwith Lauren's merger in
partnership with Vaughn gettingthe the getting RTR media
machine. I mean, they, I thinkthey have more people on staff

(20:03):
and marketing than they do onmechanics to race. I mean, they
are, they're selling content andgiven Ford and monster and RTR.
And I mean, covering the broncothey are, they are a marketing
machine outside of that. I'm notsure who it is. So it was a
great question from from Jessewho that was, but I think that
got something going in yourhead. You started thinking about

(20:25):
what am I doing from you know, Ineed to be doing more marketing,
I need to be doing bettermarketing, right?

Unknown (20:32):
Yeah, man, it's, you know, and I've learned it from
your show, actually, you know,when you're talking, you listen
to miles and Pam, and I'mtalking about Hey, come talk to
us. Because we don't know, youknow, and, and I've been pretty
bad. And, you know, for me, it'sjust about the foundation and
the guys, man, it's not, I don'teven know, and we'll maybe we'll
get to this later if I if I evenwant to drive the car in the

(20:54):
future. But it's like, man, ifyou guys, you know, people don't
know, what were your beltsabout? And what GSM is about and
kind of how we work together andwhat was driving us to go do
this, then that's, that's mydeficiency, right? I need to
absolutely raise my hand. And,and we're bad at that. You know,

I think a lot of people are but I mean, you
hit you hit the nail squarely onthe head. So you called me the
other night? I guess what isthat Monday night? Tuesday
night? You called me the othernight? And or no, you text me
and said, Hey, can I talk to youwhen you have a chance to then I
call you and we missed and youcall me right back? And you
start saying Hey, man, you know,I need to do a better job at
marketing. What should I do? Ithink was your question, or

(21:34):
roughly? And I'm like, Hey, I'lldo you one better. I want to
answer it. Let's mark it youright now. Come on the show this
week. And we're gonna talkabout, you know, gray squad
Motorsports is who MichaelLondon is. And then we're going
to talk about the foundationwith warrior. And here we are,
and you're like, No way. No way.

Unknown (21:53):
Dude.
That's not always calling, butI'm not gonna tell you no.

Yeah, I gotta say no. And, you know, we talked
as we talked about Terryearlier. Yeah, I listened to
your show. By the way. Thankyou. Thank you so much for
liking the show and supportingthe show and agreeing to come
on, especially since we reallydon't know each other. I mean,
I'm not scared to new people.
And you're clearly aren'teither. You said, I look up to
these guys. And I'm gonna tellyou, I look up to you. And I
look up to you in such a regardthat, you know, I was you 15

(22:20):
years ago, you know, I went to arace, or I thought about going
to race or I thought I was goingto race. Me being any number of
guys that are in the sport andshowing up on day one with a car
that I didn't know anythingabout, you know, I knew about
the car, but I didn't know. Ididn't know how it worked. I
didn't know how this, this wholething goes down. I didn't know

(22:42):
about how the pitting works. Ididn't know how to all of that.
And I love that our group meanyou are not scared of that
challenge.

Unknown (22:54):
Right. Right.

It's kind of it's a fraternity, right?

Unknown (22:58):
It is. It totally is.
And, you know, people, we cameat it with like, no, no egos or
anything, but we were also like,yeah, we're off roaders, man,
you know, we got this. Yeah,man, there's a lot of X's and
O's, you got to learn. And welearned a lot of them the hard
way. But you know what, one ofthe most important things I
learned is just ask peoplebecause everybody wants to help.

(23:19):
You know, my dad had a prettygood line at, here's the first
cable he ever raised. He waslike, man, he was just blown
away by the camaraderie and thepitch and stuff. And he's like,
if you ever lose faith inhumanity, just come hang out
here for a week, you know, andjust see how everybody bent over
backwards for you, man. And wedidn't ask enough questions when
we first got started. But ittook about one race to figure

(23:43):
that out. Man, that's I thinkthat's my favorite part is just
learning all the moving parts,man. You know, because it's a
lot more than just showing upwith a car and step on the gas.
Well, yeah,

for sure. And then afterwards is not always
about just cleaning the mud offof it. It's about going to the
cooler and grabbing that beerand drinking it with other guys
on the crew. Right?

Unknown (24:04):
Yeah, man, the camaraderie and stuff and the
Brotherhood and, dude, that'swhat keeps me going. As I look
back at you know, any day we'reat a race and we might have not
been having a good day, youknow, something, something would
probably wasn't going right. Buteverybody's smiling. You know,
my friends are there, myfamily's there. And it's like,

(24:25):
this is what it's about, man.
It's about getting everybodytogether and solving problems
and then moving forward. Like,you know, man, sometimes it's
just like, this sucks. You'rehaving a bad day, but you look
back and it's like, dude, we'rehaving a blast. Let's face it. I
mean, bracing Come on, and we'redoing it with our friends and
family. So

yeah, it's it's not exactly as Matt How would
say embracing the suck. It's, itmight suck but it sure beats a
good day and work

Unknown (24:55):
anytime, anytime.

So I gotta get a jab in there before we jump
back to Basically history buthow does it feel to have the
king sandbagger? Casey Gilbertin your class? He raced against
in a way

Unknown (25:10):
I got a Casey Grover story for the for the first race
we ever race and I don't know ifyou might talk about that yet
but

I see racing games hockey.

Unknown (25:18):
Yeah, it was the first time we ever raced we had a The
only ultra four car I couldafford. It was well used, and
not very well loved. And wedidn't know man. Like I said, we
didn't. We're like, dude, I grewup off roading. But we we rolled
it off the trailer, put it infor low and that was it. You
know, we're crawling rocks. Wedidn't I've literally never

(25:39):
raced anything in my life or puta four wheel drive car high
range until we are first off.

Trial by Fire.

Unknown (25:47):
I love it. Dude, we were as we were finishing that
race or as Casey Gilbert wasfinishing that race. We were
finishing our first lap. AndI'll never forget we had our
tower spotter, go That was 54this is dirty turtle man. I
don't know if it was like fivemile laps. It took us 54 minutes
to do one lap man. And Iremember they're like Gilbert

(26:10):
skin right of when we're like,cool. We didn't know he was but
now he's fast. He's a great guy.
I love I love watching all ofhis pictures of him getting
shipped stock in places and he'salways up to something out in
the woods.

Oh, he's a disaster. But I'm I mean, you've
come a long way since then. Imean, you guys finished fifth at
a finished it is very beefy. Andthen kayo h was was good deal.

Unknown (26:36):
Man, we we ended up we ended up 10th at co h we started
91st Yeah, so we had a powersteering pump. We sent it off
that big jump that alright andget the belt. We quit funny man.
We're sitting the car thereready to qualify. And we
qualified super early in themorning. Terry goes there must
not expect much out of us, manbecause first thing in the

(27:00):
morning and all this class guysare going and we just launched
it off that first job. And whatwe didn't know at the time is
when we when we landed our brandnew power steering pump. Let go.
I got about halfway up that rockwall and I couldn't turn the car
so we had to shut it down. Sothat bumps back to 91st man but
dude, we got to get to 10 fromthere we were we were moving

(27:22):
during the race.

Yeah, you guys finished 13th overall, but 10th
in class. I mean yeah, that'syou guys had a damn good day. I
do want to I'm we're gonna talkabout KLA trainer moment. But I
need to jump back. So you're yougrew up in Colorado Springs. You
talked about wheeling,

Unknown (27:39):
right? I did, man.
Yeah, yeah, I grew up offroading with my dad now in
Colorado Springs, most of mylife. Did you know The level
brothers? I did, man. And what'sfunny is we're pretty confident
Brad's just a couple yearsyounger than me. But they they
grew up across town for me. Butlater on is you know, Brad got
out on his own. And he funnyenough story, man is where my

(28:03):
grandmother used to live beforeshe passed. He lived right
across the street from Oh, wow.
So Brad, Brad's been great to meman. I reached out to him when
we first started to get someadvice. And he's always super
helpful, man. Just a really gooddude. But yeah, we grew up kind
of doing the same stuff in thesame town. But we are just far
enough away from each other thatwe didn't really run in the same

(28:24):
circle. So

yeah, you know, 40 years ago, you might have
passed each other in the grocerystores, little kids and you you
would write the you guys wouldbe you know, door to door today
and race it in, you know, thesame class and tell me about
that. I grew up in ColoradoSprings

Unknown (28:40):
was great man were my mom's family goes back like I
think I was fifth generation onher side. from Colorado Springs.
My dad was my dad was a militaryguy. And that's how he ended up
his family ended up there but itwas good man. I still I still
own a house there. That's youknow, I don't know that I'm
gonna live there again or not,but it's always gonna be home.

(29:01):
You know, the Pikes Peak is homenow I see it I'm like that's
that's the house and I've gotnothing but a big giant family
and all my best friends arestill out there and it was great
man. We were in the we were inthe woods wheeling every weekend
as a little kid, so much so thatI kind of shunned it as a
teenager You know, it was likewe we've come out here to Moab

(29:22):
twice a year. Like when I hadSpring Break man we were going
to Moab and it was like you knowyou get 1516 years old you want
to chase girls hang out withyour buddies. You know, I was
like, Dad I don't know if wehave to go to Moab again, I
don't want to go off roadinganymore. It's kind of you know,
because that's all we did manand my dad you know we started
out it was a it was a way to getto see really cool places. You

(29:45):
know, we can fish and if youwant to go to Wheeler lake or
Grizzly or Holy Cross city, man,you got to have a you got to
have a capable four wheel drive.
And that's that's kind of how westarted was to just get to cool
places. You know, my dad's Iguess I'm a lot like him and
that The next thing I know he'sgot a pretty gnarly rig and he's
the president of the car,Colorado four wheel drive,
Association, whatever. Nowwe're, we're traveling all over

(30:06):
the country off road. And thenlike I said, I kind of shunned
it as as a younger guy. And whenI had my kids, man, I was like,
I got it. I got to show theseguys these places. So I bought a
Jeep, you know, what you do youbuy a Jeep, and Well, here we
are, but it gets out of hand.
And yeah, it always gets out ofhand right?

turns into something else. Then next thing
you know, you're buying it forfour cars. And that's it, man
calling your friends into goingto Mexico and,

Unknown (30:35):
exactly, it'll be fine.
It's like, Yeah.

Like we've heard the story somewhere. So
when did you finally get out ofColorado Springs? I know you end
up in DC did you end up? I thinkyou're a military guy. I'm
fairly certain.

Unknown (30:50):
I was I joined the military man. I went to, you
know, basic training, went toschool and all that and my first
duty assignment was off Vegas.
Rough. I was like, I'm 21 yearsold, and I've got to go to Las
Vegas. So when did that for afew years, man and I end up in
Omaha. Oh,

were you Air Force then?

Unknown (31:10):
I was Yeah. Okay.

So you're an officer?

Unknown (31:12):
Yeah. Yeah, I was at off it. First duty station was
Nellis. And then I got out. Thatwas right around 911. I was
actually out processing whenthat happened. I ended up moving
back home to Colorado Springsfor a few years. And then I
ended up on the East Coast forseveral you like many former

(31:32):
servicemen looking for a job andyour skill set based on your
skill set, you

end up your private contractor for the
military, or the government orsomebody?

Unknown (31:40):
Yeah, so I'm, I'm self employed. I'm an independent
contractor. I do. You know,somewhere along the lines, I got
the Air Force. I started workingfor some special mission units
and stuff. So I got Yeah, I justkind of fell into the civilian
side of that. And I selfemployed man, I do training,
advisory and consulting for alot of different units. But

(32:01):
that's fun.

keeps me busy.
Keeps me traveling, meeting coolnew people every day. Yeah,
yeah. Yeah. And then handing offyour skill set to them. Right?
Yeah, that's great. Man. Thatwas always fun. You know, I love
teachers. By the way, I knowmyself, if I can't teach
anything, like, I do not haveany patience on the worst.
Everything from simple, youknow, teaching my kid math,
like, how to use an impact guy.

(32:24):
I mean, it's Yeah, I just had nopatient. Give that to me. You
know?

Unknown (32:28):
Yeah, just throw yourself right.

But you guys that do you know, you're, you
know, in your genre, yoursubject matter expert, and then
to find guys that one or that,but then to can be able to
convey that to other folks iseven just a cooler detail. So
that's what you do today, right?

Unknown (32:47):
Yeah, man, I got to travel all over the world and
consulting and advising andtraining and helping out
wherever they need me.

Yeah, they've asked you everywhere, DC though.
So let's talk about DC for aminute. So you're there during
basically the, certainly most ofthe Trump years. Were there more
years before that?

Unknown (33:05):
Yeah, man. I was there for I think eight years. And
I've only been here two. Soyeah, that's part of Obama. And

then most of all, the Trump I guess. Yeah. I
mean, what was the feel and inDC when there was the change?
When we went from Obama toTrump,

Unknown (33:24):
you know, it DC proper, which I I then and still kind of
avoided like the plague was,

as you should we all should?

Unknown (33:34):
Yeah. You know, I think you know, how that goes out
there. But it's funny man,because I lived in in a little
town called Warrington. And, youknow, I don't know how familiar
you are with kind of NorthernVirginia. But even when you're
out in the rolling hills, andit's kind of horse country.
You're still surrounded by like,millions of people, there's just
trees between you but that kindof that that line, man were kind

(33:58):
of DCMS and it was a realVirginia starts is definitely
pretty stark contrast.

My Word is pretty, definitely a little bit
better descriptor. You got twokids, right? I mean, you've got
but one's fairly grown. Right?
I'm gonna say

Unknown (34:19):
yeah, yeah, he's 26.
man. He's awake. Okay. Yeah, helives in Colorado Springs full
time.

That's kind of gonna date you. I mean, it's
kind of gonna be like an oldguy. No, do not look like an old
guy. Like an old dude. Look atthis hair.

Unknown (34:34):
I had a barber recently. She's like, She's
like, why did you go gray? And Idid and I went gray in high
school. And she's like, honey,that ain't gray. That's why I
was like, Well, alright, fairenough.

Why can't you like Santa Claus?

Unknown (34:49):
Colonel Sanders, man.
Yeah,

you're here.
You're high and tight. Right?

Unknown (34:56):
Yeah, so I had a kid young I had I was 20 years. He's
in Colorado Springs man. He's,he's literally a rock star man.
He plays the drums in a coupleof bands. They actually I think
their album Tuesday, justreleased and I think they've
already moved like 100,000copies or something. He's
killing it and he's COVID kickedoff. They were in Canada on

(35:20):
schedule to spend that summer inEurope touring and then they
kind of that how that went. Butnow he's doing his thing, dude,
he's, he's touring thecountries. He's been around the
world and he's playing thedrums. So super proud of them.

So not unlike you. I mean, you you toured the
world. You are a rock star.

Unknown (35:40):
he's a he's a, he's an amazing drummer, man. And then I
have a 17 year old here with mein Moab. That is, he's a junior
in high school. So he's got onemorning here.

So are you just you have have him out in the
shop or engine? Is he learningthat? Or is he

Unknown (35:56):
the man? No one for a lot. Moderate, okay, moderate
inches, you know, we're tryingto get him in the car. You know,
like, dude, get in here.
Hopefully, that's where, youknow, we can go next step maybe.
But he he's super handy. He'sbeen around forever. He, he's a
big help. He's a big house andhe came out to hammers and man

(36:18):
it was it was cool to see him.
You know, he just looked aroundto come up just a few minutes to
get his bearings and he kind ofknew what to do and that, you
know, I know a lot of grown menthat can do.

Pre started. So when's his 18th

Unknown (36:36):
he just turned 17 man two weeks ago. So he's April.

Okay, so you can get him for mid the last
half the next season. There wego. And certainly make that a
little segue here. So in jumpjumping around a little bit, we
were talking about marketing,you're racing the whole West
series this year. So that putsyou at Callaway stuff put you up
Moab that puts you in Sanfleabay for next year. You've

(37:01):
already kind of said hey, I'mnot going to race the full
series but I'm going to pick andchoose my races that make the
most sense for warrior bill andfor coverage and for media. So

Unknown (37:11):
yeah,

I assume you qH is clearly on there that's
that's the big one for me meant400 and I think I saw on maybe
on a questionnaire or maybe weyou said it you're looking at
Nora Yeah, that'd be a that'sjust a fun one. That's That's a
good one to do for fun. Whatelse lands in your bucket list
of races to hit during that

Unknown (37:32):
man I think you just named them all man we wanted to
do the minute we wanted you tomake because it's the mat right?

Oh God it is.

Unknown (37:38):
Yeah, Nora I mean you're every person that's ever
been and I haven't been buteveryone's like Dude, that's the
most fun you can have a raceYeah, I hear that from from
several people and brand youknow i he's like man level we've
had this conversation a coupletimes he's like we do it with
five people because you knowit's always intimidating like

(38:00):
Dude, I don't need I don't haveto help I don't how do we how do
you even pull that off? He'slike two guys in the race car
three guys in the chase truckand go you know

Yeah, and they take your bread and Roger they
take their sons in there theythey do it on razor? Yeah, this
year. I think Brad was on abronco but I think I definitely
saw by a man in their four seatrazor bit so I don't know
exactly levels they're alwaysthey're always at a race doing
something but I saw it'ssomething that they do with
their boys so I can see thatbeing you know nor will be at a

(38:31):
point where you realize you mayhave missed some school but I
think he's gonna learn morelearn more you eat and Dustin
region in Mexico with his badthen he will get out of those
two or three days in school.
Okay, mom's you didn't hear thatyour mouth smile.

Unknown (38:47):
Now, you're absolutely right now that's hammers. This
is the first time you got to goand I was like, man, you'll
never forget the week we spenttogether at hammers, but you
will never remember what you didthat week at school. So I wrote
all this teachers are takingthem out of school for a week.
It's called whatever. He's agreat student, man. He's a
straight A student anyways, andMike, we're fine. Yeah, we
didn't he had it. He had ablast. Where did

you guys pit at hammers? You guys are in hammer
town north.

Unknown (39:12):
Yeah. So we were it was me and Hartman and Kevin Condon.
We're all under one tent. Right.
And Cade was right. And TK wasjust right next to me. So So you
guys are kind of on that

first row, outside of the short course.

Unknown (39:27):
Yep, yep. So

facing the 18 wheelers like the Yep, yep.
Okay. I know. I know about whereyou were. You were I mean, I
didn't see you. But Portia wasover in that area. He was at the
very end of that row, whichwould be the north end of it. I
wish I knew the street names. Idon't know the street names. I
know there's a spider tracks ina worn way. That's all I get. I
don't know what those

Unknown (39:48):
are. I couldn't tell you there. But yeah, man. It
was. We had a Kevin Condon who'sgot a new I think was his first
year racing. He's the guy thathad that unfortunate. He was
shocking and and wanted that.
Jimmy's car up pretty bad. Ifyou remember any of that. I
don't know. Yeah, he was outbrand new car man and they got
it ready man, they raced it. Andthen Dave Hartman was right next
to me. And Kate was just on theother side of me so Hartman's a

(40:12):
character I like that guy yeahloving man.

So guys got to stick together yeah yeah he's
he's one of them other guys itlooks he's a lot older than he
looks Yeah, yeah, he looks likea young guy. I so so you guys,
you and your son you live intheir mo Are you given him the
same you know kind of a outdooryou know push that your dad gave

(40:39):
you or you guys out you knowenergy, you know hitting some
slick rock on a regular basisor?

Unknown (40:45):
Yeah, man. We spent a lot of time out on the trails
man I bought a so his firstvehicle is my old TJ avid TJ on
curries and five speedssupercharged it's a handful, you
know, outside of Moab. I don'tthink I'd let him drive it
because it's so highly it's ahighly modified gj right? I

(41:05):
taught him how that's how helearned how he learned how to
drive on that vehicle. I waslike dude, if you can drive this
you're golden. I mean, that'sthat's his daily driver man he's
cruising out we take that outquite a bit I got a foresee cam
and I did wasn't a big side byside guy until I moved here. And
I was like, wait a minute, thesethings are street legal. So I
got I bought a four seat cannonand put plates on it and started

(41:28):
modifying it and dude that islike my goat that's my daily
driver man. Unless the weather'sbad. I just drive the camera
everywhere grocery store,doctor's office What are and a
call to trail mo man and we weloaded up with a cooler and we
that's kind of our jam as welljust go see the sights, man just
because you could you could justcover so much ground and spent

(41:49):
all day I want to list names as

just comfortable. And I'm so envious
of you guys that live inlocations where you can do that
the first time. You know, I'mrolling into Lake Havasu City to
go see easy Rick and freakinrazor rolled up the light next
to me and I'm like, I was gonnaget in trouble. No, they're
legal in the red. And he did. Hetook off in the light and I'm

(42:10):
watching me I'm pulling 24,000pounds in race. He takes off I
see the plate and I'm like, Ididn't think plated. What the
hell? Yeah.

Unknown (42:22):
The first few the first few times I was driving it
around. I know I was completelylegal at the license plate
registration insurance all thatI still felt like I was doing
something wrong, you know? Like,but it's it's great, man. Yeah,
if I ever moved here, if I evermoved to a state where I I can't
drive it every day. I don't Idon't think I'd own it. I
wouldn't trailer it to thetrail. You know, but it's It

(42:42):
sure is cool to cruise aroundtown. And, and then.

So I know more police are pretty strict, strict
and stringent on, you know, likemud flaps and all of that. How
do they handle that for therazors?

Unknown (42:55):
You know, I think as long as you're legal and
respectful manner, they'repretty, pretty mellow. You know,
it's not really the local lawenforcement, in fact that the
one and only conversation I everhad with the police chief here,
we're standing in line at arestaurant, he's wearing a king
off road racing shop. And he youknow, we started talking and
he's like, Yeah, man, it's a lotof these guys are off rotors. So

(43:18):
they get it. But you know, thecity council's a whole nother?
Well, that's it. That's right.

Yeah. And that's kind of the problem with
the liberal cities.

Unknown (43:29):
Right. And, you know, man, I mean, a lot of it, you
know, I'll say the offercommunity, you know, some of
that is self induced man, youknow, it is out people do people
do come here, and they're notstreet legal. And they're
ripping around town all hours ofthe night, and they got their
music playing and their buggywhips lit up and they're, you
know, or going off trail or Ican't tell you how many times

(43:51):
I've been in one of the nationalparks where it's clearly
illegal. You have all noticedmorning in the world to not
drive a side by side in there.
And people still do it. And it'slike, you know, we keep we can't
have the high ground with thesepeople that are trying to shut
this down when got, you know, atleast common denominator out
here acting like they own theplace. So I get both sides. But
you know, this is a this is thistown. Tourism in this town is

(44:14):
built on off roading. And it'sin danger, man, it really is.
Easter Jeep Safari was, youknow, canceled them back on and
canceled them back on andcanceled and back on and then
ultimately that being on Butyeah, I mean,

yeah, why give them mo and I think we as a
community do a pretty good jobpolicing. But we just can't be
everywhere all the time.

Unknown (44:36):
Right, right.

Yeah. It seems to be there's always somebody
somewhere that especially whenit comes to side by sides, you
can walk into a player stealer.
They pass it back to you know, acredit check and you roll out
with one. That's how you getone. Did you imagine if that's
all it took to get a trophytruck. Right? And that you could
do it on payments or 4400 carright? You might have, you know,

(44:59):
just Hey, you, hey, come race4400 because you can pay 500
bucks a month on it.

Unknown (45:10):
No, you're right, man. You're right.
You're right.

But on the other side, I kind of want that
to happen. Like

Unknown (45:21):
she already got a trophy truck for 500 a month.
I'll go in.

I still have money for beer left. Yeah,
definitely. Yeah, I'm one ofthose guys. I can afford the
truck. I can't afford to raceit.

Unknown (45:34):
That's it, man. I was out. I was out at Nick Nelson
shop over the winter. He's gotthat really cool. All Wheel
Drive trophy truck sittingthere. And he's like, it's for
sale. Like, dude, if I had that.
I couldn't do anything with it.

Yeah, you know, it's in my shop just like it
sits in Nick's shop. Nick is anamazing fabricator. Great dude.
built that thing. It is amazing.
But he, you know, with what hedoes, he can't afford. It looks
great sponsor. And when he's init. God, he's fast as hell. But
yeah, it's they're expensive. Imean, for me, 4400 is expensive.

(46:08):
I mean, it's, it's not for thefaint of heart. I don't know, if
somebody told me what he wastrying to convince me about. It
was kind of some budget stuffaround racing. I was like, man,
whoever told you racing, likecheap. You know, it you

Unknown (46:26):
expect it's so expensive. And it takes there's
so much there's so much workthat goes into it? You know, you
know? Yeah, well,

that's the other thing is time. Well, I
mean, it isn't just dollar cost.
It's right. It's It's time cost.
And, and what that does with, ifyou aren't working on that car,
especially on a small team,where it's just you and cannon
buddies into it, that's how Iwas, if you're not working on
the car, then no one's workingon the car. And if you're

(46:53):
working on the car, thennobody's at home, and you're not
with the kids and you're notwith your wife, you're not
there, right, you're, you'reabsent. On one side of the coin,
or the other side of the coin,there's, there's not two of you
can't clone each other. And someof these guys, you know, if you
got the shop at your house, I'venever been in a situation where
I've had to shop at my house, myshop, you know, I've got a big

(47:13):
shop, but it's 18 miles away. Sowhich is sometimes good. But
then it's also sometimes badbecause you're kind of in your
head, when you're there, youturn on that, that other side of
your your mind and you crank,you know, some AC DC in the back
or some Led Zeppelin and you goto a different place. And next
thing, you know, six hourslater, you're still working and

(47:35):
your wife's now called you 30times but because the phone is
sitting over on the workbenchacross the shop, you didn't see
that she she called and then sheshows up thinking that maybe a
car fell on you and you're notsure if she's, you know, she's
crying because she's excited yousaw your she's crying because
you weren't crushed by a carlike but, but I know you've

(47:56):
written down some stuff that I'dread that but you you struggled
with that you know all your timeworking, working abroad for for
the government, you know, it'syou know, you're guilty on one
side of the coin or the othereither, you know, you've got
this, this dedication todedication, a country and this,
you know, this feeling andbelief that you've got to do
what you're doing, you signed upfor it, you have this this level

(48:18):
patriotism in your heart, oryou're at home with your wife
and the you know, the kids andboys, and then you're missing
that other side. So that's partof, you know, part of the
warrior built issues, you know,what's going on mentally the
middle, the middle fights thatguys set up. So how have you
dressed that in your life?

Unknown (48:37):
Yeah, it's tough man.
Or, you know, we're, I guesswe're getting out of Afghanistan
now. But a lot, you know,there's a lot of guys who've
been going there for 20 years.
And a lot of Americans kind offorgot, you know, that that was
even happening. And it's, Iknow, I spent way more time over
there. And in places that, youknow, looking back, it's just
like, I was there doing theright thing doing doing what I

(49:01):
do and doing it with my brothersbut man a family share, pay? And
I don't know, you know what theanswer to that is other than
organizations like warrior bill,guys can lean on each other guys
can talk about things, fromdeeply personal to just be
asking about, you know, racingor whatever. When I first met a

(49:23):
link up with Nick Hamm, thefounder of barbell foundations,
like me, and this guy justclicked, you know, and I've seen
what he does. One of the mostselfless individuals I've ever
met, I mean, what they do forpeople, and 95% of it, nobody
knows, except for the guy thatdid it for, you know, his family
that and that's I'm just, I wasall in on on working with them

(49:46):
and trying to support them. Andif we're all just one big family
man, and there's thatbrotherhood that just comes from
kind of our backgrounds and whatwe do for a living anyways, and
then combine that with otherthings like, you know, other
commonalities, whether it beRacing or

I think what you're hitting on there is the
stressors aren't unique. Fromguy to guy to guy. Yeah, I mean,
a guy may feel I mean, I mean, Isee I'm clearly see it in. And
you know, some of the other guysthat I know doing this is that
you feel like you're you're,you're at this alone, right that
no one can help you becauseyeah, I am who I am, I'm, I'm

(50:24):
tough, I can control this, I canhandle this, I nothing's gonna
beat me, yada, yada. But at thesame time, there's 1000s and
1000s of other humans that havedone and gone through very
similar or same or close to, I'mnot gonna say anyone any unique
individual has does not have aunique story. They absolutely

(50:46):
do. Everyone has their ownlittle different version of it.
But the fact is, you can help orpeople can help you sure there
is options for getting yourmental health, getting yourself
right in the world. And findingfinding purpose again, or
finding your place or like Isaid, just helping other folks.

(51:06):
And I think that's the that'sthe coolest thing I've seen out
of your brain to begin andinvolvement. He's a guy that
struggles somewhat mentallyaround that stuff. And just as a
good friend of mine, I supporteverything that he's doing. And
I've seen like, what when hestarted getting involved warrior
built what it did to my friend,right what I saw, yeah, do to
him. I was like, y'all don'thave to sell me on anything.

(51:29):
Like I witnessed atransformation. Somebody that
doing wrong, he had purposeevery day, he had passion every
day, but there were days that itwasn't as prevalent. And guess
what, he was struggling withsomething. And it was just under
the surface. And then he found atight group to work through. And
I think it's awesome. I mean, Ithink it's awesome that you guys
have those groups.

Unknown (51:51):
Yeah, you got it, man.
I mean, there's a lot of them.
So there's a lot of help thatpeople can can reach out, you
know, but like you said, it's,you know, the guys that do kind
of that that line of work or aretype A guys anyways, and
sometimes they're too cool forhelp. But I think I think that
that stigma is kind of gettingover man. And at least it needs
to be and I think a lot of guysthat I really respect that. You

(52:13):
know, kind of the ultimate toughguys in my eyes. Hey, man, it's
okay to lean on your brows andask for some help and talk about
some stuff. So I'm super excitedto be involved with it. And and
man, I'd want to raise we startracing. And just release for me,
man, you know, therapy. Let'sgo. Let's go do something.

Perhaps it's been great. It's been great. So
what was the catalyst that getsyou to go to King of the
hammers? 2018 as a spectator?
Who got you there? How do youhow do you show up?

Unknown (52:42):
You know, I don't know if you remember man. But it
seemed to me that ultra forracing was on like cable TV
every week. It was they had aseries Yeah. So I was I was
watched that man. And I'd belike, this is cool. You know,
and I had a buddy at the time Iwent from a, you know, Ford or
jku on one tons and 40 twos to abuggy and I was cruising that

(53:04):
buggy and super happy. And Istarted watching Oliver for on
TV. And I was like, This isinsane. And I heard a king of
the hammers from way back andwatch all the YouTube videos.
But the the week I look forwardto that show every week. I was
actually overseas man and and mytrip got cut short. So I was
coming back and I called mybuddy Nate and he's he's a guy

(53:26):
that if Terry's not in the rightseat, Nate is nice been, you
know, we've all got we've allgot that guy in our life that we
can call and he's gonna do youknow, hey, let's go do something
really dumb. And he's like, I'min you know? Let's go. Right?
He's He's that we grew uptogether, man. He's, he's, he's
been a real important part of mylife, my family's life. And I

(53:46):
call him I said, Hey, man, I'mcoming home early. We're going
to King of the hammers. I'mmaking Vegas. He's like, see you
there. So we went out. Wewatched. I watched we did what
everybody does when you go toKenya and for the first time you
go to back door, I went to backdoor, we watched the UFC guys
come down. I watched the guyflop on that first ledge, coming

(54:06):
down to the big drop. And ittook him forever. And he finally
got him righted. And then hedrove I don't know, what is
that? 2030 feet, and he floppedagain. And I was like, all
right, dude. Like,

I can do better than these

Unknown (54:17):
guys. We could do this man. Like, we've been doing this
anyways. You know, we hung outwatched as much of the race as
we could we're, you know, thatwas our first time ever being
here is like sensory overload.
You know, we're like, this isamazing. So we're get back to
Vegas. And we do what guys do inVegas, we sit down a bar and we
start drinking. I'm like,Alright, dude. When I get home,

(54:38):
I'm selling my body, a unit thatI've been working with at that
time frame and just taking abunch of losses. And I knew that
a guy that ran a charity thatwas helping those families out.
And I was like, why isn'tanybody you know, like the
marathon runners do why isn'tanybody doing these endurance
races for charity. I was like,what I'll do it. Like we'll do
it. That'll make that'll We'lldo it. And then we can go race

(55:00):
and we'll raise some money andwe'll give this shot. And that's
what we did. Man, I went homeand sold my buggy and bought the
only ultra for car before. Andwe went and raced out a couple
of times, figured out we weredoing it the hard way, with a,
you know, a car that needed alot, a lot of work and wasn't
very competitive. You're stillhaving fun. We're having a

(55:20):
blast, a blast, but, you know,we want to do well because it's
whether you show up and youknow, it's it's actually
heartening, man. He's like,dude, you're doing this the hard
way. Because we're alwaysworking on something always
chasing some problem, you know,and I started talking to Randy
rod about it and didn't have apretty good friends, man. And he
put me in a car took a long timeto get it, to me put me in a

(55:42):
really competitive car withthings that work of art. Those
guys, they killed it. I'mprobably saved between the prep
and the original build and thecrap and kind of my OCD. And so
it's finished every raciststarted. So knock on wood. I can
tell you that next week. But

hey, you've

Unknown (56:01):
we went to hammers to watch? Or like, do we got this?
Then it was kind of like, hey,let's drink some whiskey. And
like, we're gonna, this is whatwe're gonna do. And then we're
doing it, man. So. So walk me

through the racing racing for miles for
dollars. I've heard the concept.
I'm just not familiar with itfor you. And I caught wind of it
for you. ways that you know, usas a community are in the racing
family can raise dollars towardsfor warrior bill and where it
goes to these, you know,families that have suffered
losses abroad.

Unknown (56:37):
Sure, man. So the concept was, you know, there's a
there's a website, and there's afew different ways to do it. But
there's a there's a site calledup legit, and they handle
everything, the money, they'rejust they handle people go on
there. And what do you do? Whatyou do is you basically, you set
up a campaign. In our case, wedo it the first hammers we did
really well, we did pretty goodfor worrying about this last

(56:58):
one. But I think we started alittle late, people can go on
and they can, they can pledge aflat rate, or they can pledge
any amount per mile that wefinished hammers. And then at
the end, we tally it up, and itall goes directly to the
charity. We're just the kind ofvehicle literally out there
doing the work, but they themoney just gets passed through.
We don't touch it. It goes itall goes to before you go too

(57:18):
much further, when you reach outto me about hey, what I need to
know about marketing stuff, andhey, I said come on. You
actually have a website. Mostmost race teams do not have
their own website. Yeah, theyhave a Facebook page or
whatever. But you actually havea website. It's race. Je s m,
which stands for gray squadMotorsports.

So race gsm.com you go there, you've got to it's
just one page, but at least it'sgot pictures. It shows the 4825
Virginians car, but right upthere on the upper right in big
red box as pledged here. Youclick that and it takes you to
that basically hammers forheroes proceeds benefiting the
warrior belt foundation. And youhave the ability to a pledge

(58:01):
money towards towards youcompleting stuff. Right, right.
Yeah, yeah,

Unknown (58:07):
yeah. And we we did pretty well, man. We you know,
what's funny is the first timewe did it, we didn't finish
hammers in the first car. And wemade for for a different
charity. We made about 25 grandfor a day's worth of outracing
hammers. It's Dude, it's great.
It gives us you know, it givesus a goal. It gets money to do
the right charities that aredoing stuff for for the right

(58:29):
people, and

you need to get it updated for for San fleabay.

Unknown (58:35):
Well, we're not doing that we're not doing the charity
thing for San Felipe Bay.

Oh, man, I was gonna donate right here while
I'm looking at it.

Unknown (58:41):
No, I appreciate that.
That was kind of like one of thereasons we're going to get them
in and then no, or at some ofthese longer races is that we
can we can ask people to getbehind us and cheer us on. And
you know, the first year we didit, man, we asked all kinds of
algebra guy we had. We had allkinds of people sign up and move
the way we had the pledge set upas you could pick your favorite
driver didn't have to be mebecause nobody knows who the

(59:02):
hell I am. They could pick yourfavorite driver and pledge we're
changing their mileage. We areand I appreciate it. But we
could change. You could pledge.
KC Gilbert did it. Hartman a lotof people we had a lot of people
kind of get on board with us.
And you as Yrp go Hey, man, myfavorite. You know 4600 driver,
pick him. I'm betting he's gonnayou know, I'll give him $1 a

(59:28):
mile and see how he does andthat's I think that's why we did
so well the first time but Ithink it's a cool concept man.
It's nothing new but nobody'sdoing it an ultra for we are
Yeah, I

mean, yeah, let me know the next time are you
posting the insiders group onFacebook, you know, when the
next one is you guys have set upand ready to go. I mean, there's
a there is 88 miles, you'resupposed to do this coming
Saturday. So I mean, we could wecould have bet on that. I think
it's just saying how I mean Idon't know if I will put money
on you to win but you're smart.
Yeah. I mean, it's out there. Imean, it's you guys are racing

(01:00:04):
for laps. 20 miles here in aweek. I mean, such an effort now
I'm just playing with you. Yeah,please keep the community like
up and aware when you guysdecide to roll it out again.
Absolutely. Mint 400. You know,next spring would be great.
That'd be a really good one.
That's such a fun deal. So, soyou're going through the old

(01:00:25):
car, then you end up with thenew car talking to the Randy's
crew. And enough peopleconvinced you that Yeah, and you
can commit yourself right? Youneed the new car, you need the
the Jimmy's car, supercompetitive. We've seen what
cades done with it kids, greatdriver, and great equipment.
There's a long pedigree ofpeople that have had lots of
success in Jimmy's cars. So zerodoubt about that. Now on prep,

(01:00:50):
do you prep yourself? Or do youhave a I don't, man,

Unknown (01:00:53):
I don't have one. If I had the time, it would take me
three times longer than it doeseverybody else. I am involved. I
do a lot of it. But lately, I'vebeen sending the car to Clint
Kenan from Kenan racingfabrication, which I don't know
if you know who he is. I don'tthink I'm going to get him in
trouble. But he works full timefor Lauren and Vaughn. Monday

(01:01:16):
through Friday. He was involvedin my build. He's a really great
guy. And he reached out to meearly on this season was like
man, what can I do to help? AndI was like, Oh, I'm glad you
asked man. Cuz you know, likeyou said I'm constantly
traveling and when I'm when I amhere I'm a single dad. I bet
like it's it's a lot and I'mworking out of a two car garage.

(01:01:38):
So I've leaned on a lot ofpeople to help and Clint has
been absolutely amazing with theprep so that's his night and
weekend job down there and ithink i think i drive him nuts
because man a poor dad driveshome you know he he commutes up
to his house which is not anhour and a half two hours away
from the phone however shop andthen he works on my car until he
goes to sleep and then I try toget down there and help and his

(01:02:02):
great family and that you know Igotta love that guy's he's he's
young man it's like a you knowyou forget kids 21 Clinton other
young guy, and it's just reallymeticulous. You know, he he's
been around for racing forever.
And sometimes, man, you know,like, I'll just send the card on
there just having a look at it.

(01:02:24):
Because you I'm sure you ifyou're like me, man, you as soon
as you get another set of eyeson something you're like, dude,
I looked at that 100 times. Ididn't see that.

Wyatt Pemberton (01:02:32):
Yeah, that's some some of that too close to
the trees to see the forest orvice versa. But yeah,
absolutely. Person eyes Always.
Always does wonders, you know,you have your checklist and on
my checklist guy you as youcheck down, invariably
something's in that's the thing.
It's something always getsmissed or in even the ones that

(01:02:52):
nothing gets missed. You geteverything. Then you still have
the 30 cent fuse or the 10 centO ring that ends up desire.
That's when it wants to exitstage. Right?

Unknown (01:03:02):
Yeah. But he's helped me out a lot, man. I've all been
all the guys at Jimmy's have hadyou know, they were all they've
all had their hand in the bill.
They've all had their hand inprep in some way or another.
Nick Nelson's helped out with abunch of stuff. You know, it's
just man, I'm all ears. And it'sreally cool to be surrounded by
people that know what they'redoing. Want to help. So

my buddy Mike C word over there. Yeah, he's a
Texan. Miss that guy. I want toget to see him and him and
Laurie. You know, they're justgood people. It was really cool
to see when he moved up there.
But I catch up with him in that.

Unknown (01:03:34):
Yeah, but he's a great guy, man. And he's, he was he
was really man when when we cameacross that finish line the
first time and that cars wedidn't the car that the 48 p
were driving now, I didn't driveit until qualifying. Because we
were having some transmissionissues. And I kind of no faith
and that's when we didn't do thecharity thing that year because
I was like, dude, I'm not gonnaask people to bet on us and put

(01:03:59):
a charity out there and nevereven get to the start line and
this car like we literallypicked it up on our way to
hammers and but man, we cameacross that line and they might
see Where's their man? And heyou know, it was like, we got a
little emotional man because hegot it he put a lot of time all
those guys did. You know like Isaid, I think that thing's a
work of art man.

Those guys are those guys are artists and they
treat them like their babies tolike, like when they when they
leave, you know, they talk aboutmy like, that was my baby. That
was summer 2019 took him from aninfant all the way up to

Unknown (01:04:35):
I'm on right with you, ma'am. I can order great people.
And he brought with me in thecar once last year, and we had a
great time and

I like it. So okay, so let's let's jump
forward. We'll we'll skip somestuff. We'll skip some parts
here. So qH this year. Tell meabout it. So you guys again, you
finished 10th 13th in EMC walkme through that race. How did
that race go for you?

Unknown (01:04:59):
Well qualifying we kind of learned the flighted man
because we were I think we wereon pace to just crush it and
qualify. And I was just like I,you know, I'm sitting there. I'm
like, sitting here waiting forthe green flag and I'm like,
Alright, man, I'm just gonnastand it. Mechanical issue
bumped us back. So you're like,well, this is gonna suck

(01:05:22):
fighting through all thistraffic and Gus, but Terry and I
talked about it and we're like,Hey, man, let's just know one
thing that I've tell everybodyand meet me in tears talking
about it several times is one,Bro, I can't afford another one
of these. So if I want this up,it's over. It's over. I will
never race again. So I'm gonnaerr on the side of caution, man.

(01:05:42):
I'm a little more conservativethan a lot of guys, I think but
it's like, dude, I would ratherrace a bunch more than get first
place and or maybe wreck thiscar. We were cruising man,
obviously. But we got abouthalfway back to the main on lap
one. There's a helicopter otherscenarios. We're doing a whole

(01:06:04):
lot better. And we think we are.

So that's what I was gonna ask. Like, when you
take a back of the pack, right?
Yeah, I mean, you're, you're 91off the line are somewhere in
there. And you're going to comeacross 13th in the MC 10 thing.
In 1400. That means you passedat some cars.

Unknown (01:06:23):
We passed a lot of cars, man. How did that we were
we were crews. It felt awesome.
It felt awesome. And what wascool is some you know, we picked
them off a lot in the desert.
But when we hit the rocks, man,we think it outer limits. We got
around an entire pond boy. Youknow, it was just like Terry,
you know, Terry jumps out andyou see something and he's like,
come on, and we just, it wascool, man. We shot her. I

(01:06:45):
couldn't even tell you. We musthave passed 10 cars just right
there at once one spot, youknow, and we just kept doing
that and kept doing that. Andright about the time he goes,
man, we're all we're done. We'regood. We've been through
everything. I flopped it. Oh. SoI don't even know how or why man

(01:07:06):
fatigue. I completely missed theline tried to drive out of it,
put it on its lid. And dude, wewere at like the end of
sunbonnet. All we had to do wasget back on the dirt and drive
it home. And it took us becausewe were wedged. We were wedge
pretty bad. And the winch didn'twant to we can't break one
slides. And I think it took us3545 minutes to get back on our

(01:07:30):
background are all fours.

How many people got by Yeah.

Unknown (01:07:33):
At that point? Yeah, not very many. But you know, at
that point, man, I was blown. Iwas like, man, because I just
recruited back and this is youknow, I looked at one of the
things I learned, you know,tearing off talking about the
sense he's pushing me pushing mepushing me and I want I just
want to finish you know, I justmy mind is like, dude, let's
just get the car home. And he's,he's yelling at me. He's like,

(01:07:56):
Man, you need to be making uptime right here. And I'm like,
we're good. I'm trying to getthe car back in the day, man.
I'd have to look at it again.
It's been a while but thedifference between tanton like
fifth was just seconds. And Iyou know, it just goes to show
you that we just one one mistakeand you're screwed because we
had a really good race man. Justone one screw up and it was 100%

(01:08:19):
my fault. Put it on its lid in abad spot. Yeah, we just do all
the hard stuff. Be features likeI'm not worried about these
rocks. You only roll over onflat ground.

Well, he know you want to talk about Yeah, I
mean, that's a that's a prettybad deal. But we can talk about
one of the most famous ones wasJosh Bleiler rolling on that
ledge you were just talkingabout? Right? Yeah, minutes ago,
dropping into a backdoor. Well,I saw he's just for no reason.

Unknown (01:08:57):
I mean, that's right.
That's

basically first of all the oil runs out. Like
Dang it, you know, so you onlyget a kick yourself at that
point, right? It's like, yougotta blame yourself on that
man. So you guys get it togetherand you live out after the
desert and you get in? What wasyour level of elation as you
pulled across the stage? Andthen having the conversation

(01:09:21):
with the you know, theannouncers who was the announcer
that stuck his head his mic inyour window at that point?

Unknown (01:09:27):
I don't remember man.
That's good. Somebody I'm notfamiliar with.

Well, I think that sometimes you know, like
it's like your wedding nightright? You don't I don't
remember much from it. But yeah,you're you've made it right. You
just went through this gruelingmarathon and you're there

Unknown (01:09:40):
It felt great man and you look down and you see you
know Excel the guys from Jimmy'sand all the wire bill guys there
and my kids there and now wefinished mme, and that's we
wanted to make as much money forthe foundation as we could. And
that's the best we could do,man.

I think y'all killed it man. I think That's I
think that's all right thereason why you're doing it and
then there's something else ontop of it you know many of us we
just get in the car forourselves you're getting in the
car you know representing youmuch more than that way way way
much more than that but I don'twant to go too far down that

(01:10:18):
path but from day one decidingyou know, you you you catch your
the K wage bug on TV, you'veseen it on it's like CSI, CBS
Sports, they ran you know, theroad to the hammers. You know, a
lot of will Gentile stuff inthere. Just absolutely love that
series. It did. It seemed likeit took a while. Ah, it took
over for kind of the next level,we got a lot of new blood in the

(01:10:39):
field. Like, if I look at theUTV entry list, and even some of
the MC stuff. I don't know. Idon't know the guys, you know,
and that's why, you know, you'rea great example, you get you on
here. My first season I broughtmate Jesse on, who's this guy, I
don't know this guy. I reallygrabbed somebody on the field
that can talk about what it'slike today to go from where you

(01:11:01):
were at. into now you're thisultra for off road racer. how
cool that is on the current now.
Yeah, yeah, you're just cheeseand you're in? Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Unknown (01:11:19):
No, you know what, man?
I'm not. And I told him I toldthat to miles, man. I'm like,
dude, I tell Mike Mike's earslike don't ever say that again.
But I'm like, dude, I'm notlike, I don't fancy myself like
a racer like I like i'd love allfor like off roading is kind of
my lifestyle has been forever.
This is just kind of taken it toas far of a level as I can take

(01:11:41):
it to at least, you know, but

Well, I'm here to disagree with everything
you're saying. Right now, rightnow your fourth and fourth
international points. headedinto San fleabay. You had a 10th
place cailleach finish which outof a racist started around 100.
Around 40 finished in the MC andyou end up in that and you

(01:12:05):
started at the back of the pack.
I mean, I'm gonna tell you rightnow that you've got to be a
wheel man to pull that off. Andthen you go into Moab. And you
had a great finish there. Dude,you're looking like a champ
you've got kind of a world isset up in front of you, in my
opinion. And again, that's why Iknew your name. I was like, Who
is this guy like I've seen this.

(01:12:26):
So let's have this conversation,man. Just Just such fruit as
timing on on reaching out thisweek, as we kind of you look
through your race program,which, you know, it's it's
thrown together, right? It's,you're still a dude having fun,
and you're convincing yourfriends to go have fun with you.
And, and hopefully you're gonnahave alijah having fun with you.

(01:12:46):
What's kind of the next stepsafter you you've talked about or
alluded to? I shouldn't saytalking about like some easter
eggs about not driving you ifElijah likes it. And you guys
raised snore together. What'sthat future look like? What's
mentally Where you going? I'mnot saying you're an old guy.
Cuz I again, we talked aboutthis earlier. I don't think
you're old. At all. You're farfrom it. I'm gonna guess. Are

(01:13:08):
you are you 4041 4246? Man? 46I'll see I spotted you five
years and then you can claim.

Unknown (01:13:17):
I look like I'm 60. So you're I don't know if you're
drinking over there.

It's a water.
It's It's sweet. And time isjust Oh, God. Yeah, guy. So
yeah, what is you've alluded toEaster eggs out there. I love to
hear this. Plotting, planning anexit strategy. I want to hear
how

Unknown (01:13:40):
Yeah, so I just you know, like I said, Man, I'm I'm
an enthusiast. I love to learnabout this stuff. I have so much
fun. Just like some of the mostfun I've ever had it races was
going to help K and are going tohelp Dave and there's no
pressure to drive. Right? Youcan I think that the thing I
enjoy the most about this wholeprocess. Man is learning the

(01:14:02):
stuff. There's so many X's andO's going to split time who's
going to be where? Who's doingwhat, you know, there's so many
moving parts and who's watchingthe left tires? Who's washing
the right tires? And so yes,

the game

Unknown (01:14:15):
of the game. I try to be man and and i think that's
maybe, you know, I appreciateyou saying I'm a wheel man. But
I think what probably what moreof our success is just that I
try to study and I take it veryseriously man and I you know the
in car videos, I watch them overand over and over again and try
to you know, try to do better.
And I talked to people and Iasked a lot of questions and I

(01:14:39):
really enjoy that part of itmore so than I actually enjoy
like driving.

Gotcha. So I'll put you on the spot right here
on that. What is like your toptwo questions to top two answers
that you've asked people youdidn't know to get answers that
have helped your race proven

Unknown (01:15:00):
Well, I asked you, you're crushing it, man. It's
like, you are a super big fan.
But I you know what, a lot oftimes, man, I'll ask him, it'll
be kind of people that maybehave a little bit of preview
into my program or theirfriends. But maybe you have a
lot more experience like, whatam I? What am I doing wrong? Or
I'll just I'll just spend, youknow, an evening with, you know,

(01:15:23):
Nick Nelson. I mean, I get him alot of stuff. Randy rod knows a
lot of stuff about off roadracing. And it's fun to just sit
down, drink beer with him andjust kind of pick their brains
and layers. Yeah.

Yeah, that was always the thing. And you know,
and I know, you've heard it ifyou've been a fan of this as
well, that's really what I'veloved about the show is the
ability to ask guys thosequestions. Like, what is the
nugget that you think is maybe alittle bit of a strategic
advantage for you? Or what wasit something that is super
painfully obvious today? Butlast week, before you talk to

(01:16:03):
Lauren Healy, it wasn't obviousat that point. Things like
things along those lines that webecause we've all learned for
the most part, through trial anderror.

Unknown (01:16:13):
Right, right. Yeah.
What's sometimes the hard way?
You don't always have to dothat. But we do. Right. That's
how most people do, includingme. I try to ask, I try to ask
people and I really enjoy that.
So we can kind of get back toyour original question. And what
I would like to do is, you know,is to keep the keep the whole
thing go on with where Bell andgray squad and keep it. I love
being involved in the programand all that stuff. You know,

(01:16:36):
you might talk to me next yearnow, I'll change my mind. But I
think ultimately, I want to kindof run the X's and O's and the
playbooks on the program andtake care all the details and
stuff, because that's kind of mywheelhouse. And let's get a
couple of young kids in there.
You know, whether it's minehopefully, or, you know, I'm

(01:16:56):
already kind of watching otherguys and stuff. But I would kind
of like to get back to offroading for with my buddies
around a campfire, drinking abeer, and then doing the racing
thing kind of without.

So just get back, get back to leaf looking.
And then

Unknown (01:17:12):
racing. I mean, I, every time I'm ripping my hair
out over something. And youknow, Randy, or somebody calls
me I'm like, Hey, man, can wejust saw these race cars and go
back to camping, and jeeps andstuff? But yeah, that's just me
being silly. Maybe next year

that lasts about two years. And then next
year, like I need any race car.
Racing, it has to do with thepeople. You just want back. You
just want to back back in thepurview with your friends.

Unknown (01:17:41):
That's right. And that's kind of how we started
this whole conversation, right?
It's all about the people. And Ithink as long as that's, that's
the goal, man, and you're alwaysgonna have fun, but I don't
know, brother, I I would beperfectly happy to. I'm always
going to be involved on the car.
I would really enjoy being atthe events and I really enjoy

(01:18:01):
all the stuff that goes into it.
But it doesn't have to be it'snot my I don't raise from my
ego, man. It's not my it's notlike my ego is not like no.

I mean, it's it's from your own hashtag pile
here. It's a no egos justamigos. Like, I mean, it's quite
possibly one of my favoritehashtags. I've

Unknown (01:18:24):
seen

no egos just amigos. You know? Hell,

Unknown (01:18:30):
hell yeah. Yeah, man.
It mean, you're out there andwe're having a good time, and
we're doing some good stuff orgood people, then that is that
is the win.

So so you know, we've certainly definitely
covered all all, all the warriorbuilt stuff. And as we talked
about, you know, the wholegenesis of this call, was you
call me earlier in the weekabout your marketing? What What
do I need to do for marketing orsomething along those lines? Now
that we've had this column out,you've had a week to think
about, you know, having this youknow, this this interview? What

(01:19:02):
are some of the marketing thingsyou've stumbled on? As a new guy
for the most part in the sport,trying to push marketing of
yourself that you automaticallyand already see even veterans
not doing? What are some of thethings that you've seen? Or you
recognize even,

Unknown (01:19:17):
you know, what my struggle was? Like? I don't, I
guess it was assuming, you know,especially through the charity
stuff, when you're doing that,the pledges through is like, me
just assuming that friends,because I have social media and
because I have a website, haveany idea what I'm doing, you

(01:19:38):
know, and they don't, they don'tand it's you know, it's a good
friend of mine. On the eastcoast was like, Man, you need to
do good old guerilla marketingand that that was just like he
just text people. And I did manwhen it was like pledge time for
hammers. I'm thinking all thesepeople friends and family. I'm
like, why aren't they come on,man pledge a quarter, you know?

(01:20:00):
So I just started textingpeople, but I, you know, that's
something I still struggle withman and I'm and I'm trying to
learn is that if you talk tohim, it's like, they're like,
what are you doing with this?
You know, and it's like, man,how do you not know that? And I
know only you. I mean, likefriends of mine. No, absolutely,
it's like, so you know, that'sthe struggle is when you put
this stuff out there and someguys are really good at it, man.
I'm watching. You know, KevinJones, ultra for Jones doing his

(01:20:23):
thing that he's that I just, Ijust met him for the first time
ever heard VFE. And, man, Ireally admire what he's doing
with social media stuff. Ofcourse, you know, that guy,
Lauren bond, all those guys areon a whole nother level. But

yeah, I think I might, yes, he he is, you know,
for like the bintray sessions.
You know, I put it out there.
Hey, when we were doing rush,hey, what what West Coast guys?
Hey, if you want to come on theclubhouse thing, hit me up, I'll
make you whatever the admin,moderator, whatever, when you're

(01:20:58):
already on the stage. And wewill have you'll be in the
conversation versus it. Let's dothat hit me up. He was the first
one.

Unknown (01:21:07):
After four days over man

he was. And then and then maybe a day later,
he sends me a text a picture ofhis basically, it wasn't a
yellow legal pad. But it was youknow, a notepad with all his
notes. And who his picks werefor each class what they'd
finished kiawe chin what they'dfinished nbfc and if they were

(01:21:30):
there, or reasons why they're onis this, he sends it to me and
it is a full Notepad. And I'mlike,

Unknown (01:21:35):
I'm sure

this dude is prepared. I mean, he was
prepared. And then I didn't evenask him any of that stuff. I
asked him some stuff. He wasprepared, but you got to keep
people on their toes. Man. Loveit. So Mr. Mica, London. Did we
cover kind of everything youwanted to cover?

Unknown (01:21:55):
Man?

I'm just watching. I remember you want to
cover

Unknown (01:21:58):
cute. Um, I'm stoked.
Thank you for having me on.

Well, we're not done yet. But we're almost
because I got the last thing andthis is the thing. I've started
trying to pop three songs thatkind of say who you are right
now. Like, what are youlistening to right now that are
right now? And I know. I know.
And this goes a different placebefore you even answer that.
I'll give you a chance to thinkabout it while I'm talking. You
have said in your notes to methat you are this underground

(01:22:23):
music snob.

Unknown (01:22:29):
music's now I'd like to say dude,

yeah, I want to get into like, like, What? What
is an underground music snob?

Unknown (01:22:36):
No, I don't mean underground. I just mean like,
nobody would know the acting andsuspect. Yeah,

I'm thinking like, GarageBand you know,

Unknown (01:22:44):
I know man. No, I should have been more clear on
that. I'm just like an Americanmusic kind of nerd. Like whether
it's, and I can't answer yourquestion specifically. Dude.
It's everything from HankWilliams, senior to freakin Wu
Tang clan, and I can talkprobably pretty intelligently
about everything in betweenthere. I'm a huge music nerd.

(01:23:06):
You won't catch me.

So you're you're about to go get in the
ring with Mike Tyson. What'syour walk up song?

Unknown (01:23:15):
ring with Mike Tyson my walk up song. Oh my goodness,
dude. It would probably besomething by the descendents.
Which is a punk band. It wouldprobably be plus Mike Tyson.
This is size Have you everdiscussed song called everything
sparked by the descendentsbecause I'm about to get knocked
out. So

maybe you ever been off? Okay. Same question
because I'm gonna get threesongs I you same question. But
in the ring is Ronda RouseyRonda Rousey? I would probably
do

Unknown (01:23:51):
we go song was like from sturgill Simpson yesterday
or something? Yeah,

yeah. Like, all the way down.

Unknown (01:23:57):
Yeah, that's my that's the jack. Yeah. Fair ones. He
does. Yeah, I

can see that one being being a good one.
Okay. Because this man has neverbeen in a fight ever in his
life. physical fight. That's whyI'm gonna use him and he's gonna
get a carrot on this one. Samequestion. Walk it music in the
ring. But it's Dave Cole.

Unknown (01:24:20):
It's good call. I could get in a lot of trouble there.

Yeah, that's the last question. He's never
fought anyone so he doesn't knoweither. I should ask him why

Unknown (01:24:34):
fight me if I answered that question. Let's see man.
Ah, what would be a good one?
There were probably we mighthave to pause out there why I
gotta think about Africa.

Yeah, cuz I mean, I started pondering this,
you know with as I started thisback with good baby, and then
Jeremy and then every day itkind of changes a little bit.
But for me like I do, I like getin the shop and I put on zeplin
and just in the box set and justlet it roll all the way through,
you know, the 60s, the 70s. Imean, obviously, I do have some

(01:25:17):
favorites in there, but then Iknow I get in the car. I do not
listen to zeplin when I'mdriving, it's his shop music.
And yeah, I got in mentally, Ican remember. Like, where I'm at
in the transmission pull processwhen cashmere came on, you know?

Unknown (01:25:35):
Right? Yeah, we'll

stuff like that. But I, I heard a guy sing.
And I wish I had knew who thename of the artist was. But he
sang a song It was Stairway toHeaven was the music. But the
words he had different words forit. And I couldn't figure out
how he did it.

Unknown (01:25:55):
Like,

I couldn't, you know, understand, like what I
mean, like the mental part ofhis plane, Stairway to Heaven,
but he's singing a differentsong. Yeah, right. And I'm like,
Okay, this dude can not onlywalk chew bubblegum, but he can
also solve quadratic equations.
Riding a unicycle I like thisblew my mind. I was I was

(01:26:18):
commuting on on the highway. I'mlike, going through what was
this guy going through mentallyto build a place Stairway to
Heaven and sing a different songthe way in the thing was, it
actually sounded good. Yeah, but

Unknown (01:26:33):
it was good, man. So what's your number three? My
number three song would probablybe if it's Dave Cole. He's never
been in a fight. I mean, he's abig dude. But he is. You know, I

can I can't go like LL Cool J mama say knock
you out. Like that's like,that's like too obvious.

Unknown (01:26:54):
You know? No, no, man, it would be like, it would be
like, gonna be a big rock star.
Probably what Dave listens to?

I don't know what day listens to I'll have to
also test tasting mass and giveme his top songs.

Unknown (01:27:13):
I don't know what we're getting.

Well on. On that note, Mr. London. Thank you
for thank you for hitting me up.
It couldn't have been moreperfect timing. I was literally
based on how I messed upscheduling for the last two
weeks. And it was it was a twoweek. Why? Why drop the ball.
You bailed me out huge. You youcall it the right time. You had
a need. And I had a need andsymbiotically. We, we worked it

(01:27:38):
out. I got to meet you.
Hopefully, a whole bunch ofother people are gonna listen to
him, like who is this guy, andthen they're gonna walk away.
And we're like, oh, that's thewarrior belt guy. We need to
support him and support ourtroops and support all our guys.
Thank you for your service allthose years. And thank you for
continuing to the guys that arestill going outside the wire

(01:27:59):
today. Thank you for doing thetraining with them and giving
them passing on your skills tothose guys. So that you know
they're better prepared for whatthey're going to face. And yeah,
from the bottom of my heart,thank you for helping all the
guys that come back and, andhave things they need to check
off to, to ensure that, youknow, they're positive and

(01:28:20):
smiling and everythingeverything's gonna be all right,
right.

Unknown (01:28:24):
Yeah, man. Yeah, thank you for having me on. Man. This
is really cool. Like I said,it's I listen to every week,
man, it's it's generallysomebody I look up to or want to
learn something from and thenit's really rad to be here. So

well, safe travels this week. Good luck.
Yeah, I'm probably gonna, youknow, I think you're gonna have
to be my pick on Wednesday nightand the bench bench racing
session for to win the 1400class. I think I'm gonna call
that right now. So people hearme say it now. And then. And
then when you hear the bintraysearch traffic, somebody else
would be that guy. Right.

Unknown (01:29:00):
That's all right.
That's

all man. Thank you. Again. Thank you for coming
on. Absolutely. Good luck thisweek in San fleabay safe drive.
And on that note, everybody, weout.

Intro/Outro (01:29:11):
Thank you for listening and taking a dive into
the tail end team. Please likeand subscribe on Instagram at
the tail end. or our website,the talent tank.com

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