March 10, 2025 • 30 mins
The Tech Chef Podcast takes listeners deep into the world of hospitality technology with episode 92 featuring Jason Marsh of Flow Immersive. The episode kicks off with an introduction to the latest trends in restaurant and hospitality tech. Skip Kimpel, the host, sets the stage for a discussion about immersive data visualization, a groundbreaking approach to understanding complex data in a more engaging way. Jason shares the fascinating journey of Flow Immersive, starting from its inception at a hackathon to its current capabilities that allow users to interact with data in 3D space using AI. This technology, he explains, transforms dull business meetings into lively discussions, where stakeholders can visualize and manipulate data dynamically, fostering better decision-making and collaboration.
As the conversation unfolds, listeners gain insights into the practical applications of this innovative technology across various industries. Jason emphasizes how immersive data experiences can enhance understanding in sectors like hospitality. He illustrates this with an example of a life expectancy dataset visualized in 3D, showcasing how historical data can reveal trends and insights that are not visible in traditional 2D formats. This immersive approach encourages shared understanding, which is crucial for data-driven decisions in business environments. The episode also highlights the importance of collaboration and how immersive experiences can lead to more effective teamwork.
Listeners are invited to think about the future of data presentation and how immersive technology can become a staple in boardrooms. The discussion wraps up with Jason expressing his vision for Flow Immersive to integrate seamlessly into everyday business practices, making data visualization a natural and intuitive experience. This episode serves as a compelling invitation for listeners to explore the evolving landscape of hospitality tech and embrace the future of data interaction.
Takeaways:
- Flow Immersive started nine years ago when the speaker wanted to build Ironman and invited others to join in.
- The speaker believes immersive data visualization is the future of data interaction and collaboration.
- Businesses can use Flow Immersive for better data interpretation, especially in supply chains and financial services.
- Augmented reality provides a shared data experience in meetings, allowing for interactive discussions and real-time collaboration.
- The future of data visualization will be about integrating technology seamlessly into the human experience, making it feel natural and engaging.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
You are listening to the TechChef Podcast.
This is episode number 92.
Monday, March 10, 2025 thisshow is.
Powered by Growth AdvisorsInternational network where travel
and hospitality companies cometo grow.
For more information pleasevisit gainadvisors.com hello, this
(00:22):
is Jason Marsh, CEO of FlowImmersive and you're listening to
Skip on the Tech Chef Podcast.
Off premise Strategy, Business continuity.
How about a taste test ofrestaurant technology?
Drive thru or curbside?
Mobile apps or AI?
It's all on the menu.
(00:43):
Cook it up for the date.
It's a recipe for success.
You're in good hands with theTech Chef.
Make a plan to be your best.
Strategize with the Tech Chef.
Welcome to the Tech ChefPodcast where innovation meets hospitality.
(01:05):
I'm Skip Kim, your host andthis show is your go to source for
the latest trendsrevolutionizing restaurants, hotels,
resorts and entertainment venues.
In every episode we explorethe cutting edge of hospitality tech.
From AI powered solutions toimmersive guest experiences and even
emerging technologies youmight not even be aware of.
(01:28):
We bring you insights fromindustry pioneers, bold inventors
and the minds shaping the future.
Whether you're leadingoperations, passionate about technology
or just eager to stay ahead ofthe curve, this is where inspiration
meets action.
So grab a seat at the tableand let's dig into the future of
hospitality.
(01:49):
Well, today is the day MRTAC begins.
We dropped this podcast thismorning so so you could listen to
it on the way to the show andhear about another one of our strategic
partners that was justannounced today.
This is some of the mostamazing data visualizations that
you will ever see.
(02:09):
Jason Marsh, co founder andCEO of Flow Immersive, joins us to
talk about their product whichis focused on immersive data visualization.
What does that mean?
Well, he shares how FlowImmersive started as a vision to
manipulate data in 3D space,evolving to utilize utilize AI for
real time data interaction.
(02:30):
The conversation highlightshow immersive data experiences can
transform business meetings bymaking data more engaging and interactive.
Jason explains that thistechnology allows users to visualize
complex data sets in a waythat is far more comprehensive than
traditional charts.
The episode dives into thepotential applications of this technology
(02:52):
in industries likehospitality, emphasizing the importance
of collaboration and sharedunderstanding in data driven decisions.
What if you could step insideyour data?
Jason Marsh reveals how FlowImmersive is revolutionizing data
visualization right now righthere on the Tech Chef podcast.
(03:16):
Mr.
Jason Marsh, great to have youon the Tech Chef Podcast.
I am fascinated by your product.
The very first day I saw itcan you go ahead and share a little
bit about your background andhow Flow Immersive really came to
be.
Yeah, thanks, Skip.
It's really great to be here.
Flow Immersive started nineyears ago.
(03:39):
Actually a little bit morethan that.
I got up at a hackathon andsaid, I want to build Ironman and
anybody who want to join me,come do this thinking.
When I said that was beingable to manipulate symbolic information,
data visualizations,information in 3D space, hopefully
(04:02):
with our hands that somedaythat wasn't.
Hand tracking, wasn't that biga thing back then.
I actually didn't realize howimportant AI would be in that equation.
That, Jarvis, is a reallyfundamental piece of that puzzle.
And that virtual realitywasn't as key a use case as augmented
reality.
So now today we're actuallyseeing the results of that vis come
(04:24):
together, which is datavisualization floating above a table
in between us, where we canhave a great data conversation and
collaboration around it andbeing able to manipulate it, especially
with voice, with an AI thatcan update the data sets, manipulate,
process any way you can thinkof and spin the data around to make
(04:46):
it particularly relevant tothe conversation you'd like to have.
What was that aha moment thatmade you realize immersive data visualization
was actually the future?
Oh.
So one of the firstvisualizations, first data sets I
put into our application as westarted to see it come together,
was a life expectancy data setfor the last 200 years.
(05:10):
This data set, just to giveyou a sense of, I'll paint the picture
for you, it's a 3D scatterplot line chart.
Across the front width axis is200 years.
Down the depth axis is 40 or50 selected countries that I just
picked out.
And then the height axis islife expectancy.
(05:33):
And when you look at thisvisualization, the first hundred
years pretty flat across allthe countries, it's life expectancy
is around 35.
And then around the turn ofthe last century, around 1900, you
start to see this upward curve.
And with some big exceptions,which we'll talk about, but you see
this upward curve go all theway to present day where Japan is
(05:55):
at 80 years life expectancy.
And in seeing that all in oneview, I don't have to wait for an
animation to play it.
It's detailed because it's 3D.
We can see so much more detailthan you could put on a flat screen.
And when you saw the scope ofhumanity's increase in life expectancy,
(06:18):
it's like humanity's greatestachie, frankly, life Expectancy helps
us understand how a society isdoing in terms of wars and famine
and disease.
And to see that success acrossthe entire planet is just an amazing
visualization.
Then you see the details.
(06:38):
You get this big chasm thatoccurs in 1918 for the Spanish flu
across almost every country.
And then you see anotherchasm, certainly in Europe for the
early 1940s, which is WorldWar II.
And then you see the basicwrestler curves.
But then you see these exceptions.
You see this huge plunge inHaiti in 2010 for the earthquake,
(07:04):
or 1994 in Rwanda for the genocide.
And you can see so much bigpicture and so much detail all in
one view.
I remember being in VR justwalking underneath it and exploring
and clicking on each dot tosee what was going on, each place.
And, and that was the, the inspiration.
(07:24):
That was the moment.
Like, oh, this is something special.
I've never seen anything likethis before.
And now with AI, each one ofthose dots or sections, you can actually
ask it.
You click on a, this plungingpoint in the, in the data and just
ask it what happened here?
And the AI knows what youselected and can start to tell you,
(07:44):
you know, more details aboutwhat happened at that genocide or,
or, you know, AIDS crisis insub Saharan Africa or whatever it
is you're pointing to.
All right, I'm getting wayahead of myself here, but to your
point, the first time I triedyour product, I tried it in on a
Magic Leap device.
I was in augmented reality.
I was blown away.
(08:05):
To be able to walk through thedata, to be able to touch data, to
be able to look at things in adifferent way, it is mind blowing.
And that kind of brings thingsaround here.
We talked about, you know,your historical example, but from
a business perspective, howcan businesses use this to interpret
their data?
Actually, a pretty large scopeof things that we have done and seen
(08:28):
customers use our product for,perhaps supply chains.
An example I've got in mindfor a customer right now, where you're
looking at raw materialsources spread across the globe.
You're looking at processingfacilities, distribution facilities,
and customer sites, whetherthey're retail or warehousing or
(08:51):
whatever.
And then just the amount ofcomplexity that goes into a sophisticated
product.
Say, think of an auto.
Yeah.
Think of an automobile, for example.
So many parts are coming fromso many different places.
Being able to see that move,see them moving across the globe.
But it's not just a map.
(09:13):
Now, the, you know, certaindelays can be represented in a vertical
axis or certain financialimplications can be represented by
the thickness of the lines andhow the Lines animate and you're
suddenly seeing a set of multidimensional data that you just, you
(09:34):
don't get on a flat screen.
But the power of being able tosee the relationships across those
things.
For this particular examplethat I have in my mind, a customer
said, okay, take a weatherdata set and map that onto the globe
on top of it.
So now it's a transparentlayer and you can see what kind of
impacts that has had.
(09:55):
Also with this thirddimension, we do something called
additional dimensions, whichenables you to do, I call them sparklines,
where you've got a little,instead of just seeing a dot on a
map, you see a little line chart.
You know, maybe it's only aninch big or maybe even smaller, but
it represents some aspect ofthe data changing over time.
(10:19):
You know, it could beproduction delays, it could be, you
know, costs or even somethinglike a, you know, weather temperature
data or something that givesyou yet another dimension.
And this is how we see relationships.
So, so supply chain is a good example.
Financial services being ableto see wide set of stocks or other
(10:43):
equities laid out on the depthaxis, seeing sales data around the
country.
And I think that's where itreally comes down to this, this level
of detail.
Right.
If you just look at your salesnumbers for the year, you know, it's
another bar chart, anotherPowerPoint deck and everybody's falling
asleep and oh yeah, yeah, yournumbers went up great.
(11:03):
But it could be that there's awhole bunch of risk that got lost
when you oversimplified thatdata into a bar chart.
And you, so with flow you canstart to drill into the quarter,
drill into the, the you know,weak, drill into the day, drill into
every single transactionbecause every single transaction
can appear on the map to havetens of thousands, 50,000 dots on
(11:26):
a map simultaneously with ouradditional dimensions.
We move it so that the dotsdon't overlap each other in horrible
ways.
You can still select any dotand see what that transaction was.
And one of the things that youmight see is, gee, we had two really
big sales the last week of thequarter and the whole quarter's numbers
would have been horriblewithout those.
(11:48):
But that got lost in the oversummarized PowerPoint slide.
Now I can click, click on thatdot, see who it was, see what they
bought and understand the riskthat, that, you know, that kind of
a sales cycle looks like toyour business.
And you would have lost thatrisk if you just, you know, used
(12:09):
your typical PowerPoint deck.
So is this a single userexperience or can you show it to
a group Just walk me through that.
I want to understand if I'm ina professional business scenario,
how do I present this data andthis really cool aspect and storytelling
to other people?
Actually, my first sentence Iusually use when I introduce flow
(12:30):
is that we've created a datacollaboration and conversation environment
where we think that it's thebest way you can have that data conversation
you can imagine.
For us, we think thataugmented reality is the best way
to do that.
To float the data above aconference room table, everyone can
(12:52):
stand around it with augmentedreality or pass through headsets
where you can all see the data.
Everybody's got a virtuallaser pointer.
Everyone can click andinteract and explore, do real time
filtering.
And anytime anyone interacts,everyone sees what they're doing.
So it's like having a physicalstructure, it's a symbolic structure,
(13:14):
but we imitate theconcreteness of having such a thing
in the room.
And if someone is remote, theyactually also appear in the meeting,
in the room as an avatar witha laser pointer.
So whether you're in headsetsin the room, whether you're remote
in, in some sort of headset,or on a phone or a computer, just
(13:36):
on a website, on, through theweb, you can also be a member, a
fully participating member ofthat meeting.
And it's really thecollaboration that stands, stands
apart from just buildinganother data visualization, you know,
another cool chart, in our opinion.
Well, that goes to the point,and don't take offense of this, but
(13:58):
is this just a cool new shinypenny in the room or is this truly
a business application that'shere to stay?
I think a lot of us, a lot oftime, we think of technology as cool,
but it doesn't need to beanybody who's doing something amazing
and impressive.
(14:18):
We go cool.
Even a cool person has acertain quality to them, right?
Well, I have to submit to youthat a definition of cool is mastery
and control.
Someone who's just nailed thatskateboard trick and you just go,
wow, that was amazing.
That was cool.
Because they had control overthe, over gravity in a way that's
(14:40):
just kind of mind blowing, right?
And when you think about Ironman flicking atoms, flicking atoms
to create a new element andtalking to Jarvis, we vicariously
experienced that cool as that.
Mastering control as cool.
That's what we've built.
I say we encoded thatthroughout the product.
(15:03):
Giving everybody that sense ofmastering control is not just a novelty
that's going to wear off.
It's how you create efficiency.
And the efficiency is buildingthe best possible mental model for
yourself and your audience andknowing that they're seeing the data
(15:23):
the way you're seeing it, thatthey're coming up, they've got in
their mind a very similarrepresentation to yours.
That shared mental model.
Yeah, it goes way beyond cool.
That's where we get somethingthat's got really lasting value and
is actually going to changethe way we think about data for all
the knowledge workers of the world.
(15:45):
Cool.
All right, on that point,we're going to take a little break.
When we come back, we're goingto dig specifically into enterprise
and hospitality applicationsand start talking to the audience
which the majority of ourlisteners are really in the restaurant
and hotel side of it.
And we're going to discoverkind of the application side of how
it can help them.
So everybody hold on, we'll beright back.
(16:07):
Hey, since I have you here, ifyou're headed to Mirtech in Vegas
this year, March 10th through12th, you gotta swing by Magic Gate's
experience zone.
We're talking next levelrestaurant tech, VR training that
actually works, AR remotesupport that makes troubleshooting
a breeze.
And some seriously cool datatools to keep your ops running smooth.
(16:28):
Plus you can mess around withfuturistic stuff like augmented reality,
virtual reality and haptic devices.
It's all hands on, no boringdemos, just straight up cool tech
that you need to see.
Come check it out.
Jason, with Magic 8 focusingon hospitality tech, how do you see
immersive data solutionstransforming industries like hotels,
(16:49):
resorts, restaurants or otherentertainment venues?
Restaurants and hospitalityare such a data driven industry.
I mean, you've got thisconstant set of inputs with labor
and food costs and actuallychanging rapidly, especially food
costs these days in the United States.
(17:11):
And all of those inputs, datainputs and then the outputs on what
the market will bear, what'shappening with competitors, what's
happening with certain localities.
There's so many inputs intothe prices that are charged and the
(17:34):
financial bottom line.
Those include, you know,supply chains as well as, you know,
weather, maybe even impactsthat are, you know, happening more
often these days with weather,you know, weather related to flights
and, you know, airports andchallenges there.
(17:54):
Being able to see that in away that helps you make decision
to understand what'shappening, but even better, understand
what kind of risks could beimpacting your bottom line in the
future.
You need to have greatconversations around data and that's
what we're focused on.
Well, just to give thelisteners a little bit of a hint,
most of our audience is headedto Mirtech right now, on the plane
(18:20):
on their way there, or theycould already be in Vegas Flow, Immersive
and Magic 8.
We've actually constructed aFlow story specific to the restaurant
industry.
So if you're coming for a demoat the Myrtek XR Experience Zone,
this is one of the things thatyou can see is how you can tell a
story with your data,specifically around restaurants.
(18:40):
I think it's going to spark alot of ideas out there.
So that kind of leans intosome of the challenges that flow
faces when introducing theproduct to enterprise clients who
may be hesitant about XR adoption.
What do you have to say tothose folks?
Well, it has been hard tobring these larger VR headsets into
(19:03):
knowledge worker environments,you know, our modern office.
And so there is a newgeneration of smart glasses that
is just coming online now.
A number of both small, smallcompanies and some very large ones
are, have announced and areshowing some of what they're working
(19:25):
on.
You know, Meta has shown theirOrion smart glasses, augmented reality
glasses.
The, that particularparticular next generation device
is still a few years out, butthere's a, even in these next few
months we're going to see alot of these glasses.
They basically look likeglasses, maybe a little thick, you
(19:45):
know, but, and this firstgeneration is more likely to be tethered.
It will have a, a cable toconnect to your phone or, or other
computing device.
But they're light, they'reconvenient, they're really, they're
see through so you can see theroom and everything around you very
easily.
We see that that change intechnology is going to really increase
(20:08):
adoption.
And just think of a conferenceroom where you're having a meeting
and then use a couple of theseor four of these pairs of glasses
sitting on the conference room table.
And the presenter says, okay,we're gonna do the data, data portion
now.
Grab your glasses, put them onand there's the data.
You have that conversation for15, 20, 30 minutes around the data.
(20:31):
That feels like a verydifferent thing than struggling to
get into a VR headset andunderstand the controllers and all
of that kind of thing.
That's a big one way we'rereally overcoming some of the barriers
to adoption then AI is huge.
Just being able to talk to thedata and have it reprocess it and
(20:52):
answer your questions and show you.
It's not just verbalquestions, verbal answers that come
back.
It'll actually just throw itback into 3D space.
You can see that, hey, we'veisolated on this point, that point
and we've run this, you know,Python code to, you know, process
to find the, you know,averages or Means or, or relationships,
(21:13):
the ease of use and power,thinking of mastering control, the
power of, in the hands of theend users is just really fabulous.
And that bar of power and easeof use, that's where we start to
scale.
So do you see the future of XRdriven data visualization really
(21:35):
becoming a standard such asPowerPoint, or do you think this
is still.
It's going to be a little more focused.
I do believe eventually wewill be getting rid of monitors.
That day is coming, similar tothe day of getting rid of phones.
I don't believe you'll beholding that rectangular device in
your hands, just your thoughtson where it's headed and where this
(21:57):
plays out in the future.
I think seeing our informationaround us in an appropriate level
of detail for most of our dayis going to feel just very natural.
I just wrote an article acouple of weeks ago and I call it
(22:18):
the Future of Data is Humanand the Future of Technology is Human,
where the technologies justkind of disappears instead of.
For all these years, we havemodified our human, modified the
human in order to interactwith technology instead of the other
way around.
(22:38):
And a spoken interface withsomething that really takes advantage
of the way our brains viewinformation and think about symbolic
information.
That combination feels like magic.
It no longer feels like high tech.
It just does what you want itto do in, in the way you want it
(23:00):
want to do it.
Your brain is no longertranslating 2D screens into 3D, you
know, rich mental models because.
And it's, that's what it does.
That's what we do right now.
And, and we've all gotten usedto flat screens, but that's not the
way our brains think.
That's not the way our brains evolved.
And so as we get closer tothis, to this vision of smart glasses
(23:24):
with augmented reality and aspoken interface, that magic really
settles in and just becomespart of the normal human experience.
So since you're building Ironman out in the background, if you
could fast forward five years,what do you hope that Flow Immersive
will actually have achieved?
I can hope, I can dream.
(23:45):
That will be an important partof the boardrooms throughout America
and the world and a naturalpart of how we interact with our
Fitbit data, our weather data,our stock data, our fantasy football
data.
(24:05):
It's just the way we're usedto seeing the things that, the symbolic
information that helps us keepour lives organized and engaging.
So as we start to wind downthe show, let's talk about the devices
that Flow works on.
Do you need a headset device?
Can you run it on a computer?
(24:25):
What does that scenario look like?
You can run it on almost anydevice now and certainly very comfortably
on a computer with a browser.
On a phone again in a browseron Android it's single click and
you see it in augmentedreality on your phone.
With Apple devices you need tohave a augmented reality aware browser.
(24:49):
They're free and open sourceto grab one of those.
But it's got to work reallywell on existing phones and flat
screen browsers or laptops.
Then in addition to that, it'sa really beautiful experience on
the Meta Quest headsets, onthe HTC Vive headsets.
(25:10):
Some nice advantages to thosedue to security, especially in some
enterprise situations that'sthere's real value in the HTC product
line around that worksbeautifully on Magic Leap and we're
working on the implementationsright now for these next generation
of smart glasses and we'll beable to be talking about those in
(25:31):
a short number of months.
Oh, we might have to talkoffline about that because the audiences
seeing some really coolaugmented reality devices at the
show that I'll have there.
So let's continue that discussion.
Speaking of which, just thismorning, right before the kickoff
of Mirtech 2025, we announcedour strategic partnership between
Magic8 and Flow Immersive.
What excites you the mostabout partnering with us and how
(25:53):
do you see that reallybenefiting the hospitality segment?
Having someone of yourexpertise to help us, you know, really
dig in and get beyond thecool, get beyond the proof of concepts
into real world, even missioncritical use cases.
There's no way we could dothat without that kind of expertise.
(26:15):
So partnerships for Flow areincredibly important and what you've
accomplished so far and whatwe'll accomplish together is, yeah,
is very exciting.
We are extremely excited to beable to present this to our clients
and other colleagues.
I just want people toexperience the technology and that's
really part of the experiencezone that we're creating is we just
(26:36):
want people to see cool tech.
We don't want them to sitthrough a boring demo.
We want them to experience adifferent way of looking at things.
And this for sure.
I'm a data guy, so I guessmaybe that's why I'm so excited about
this product because this is acompletely different way of not only
looking at the data, but beingpart of the data, if that makes sense.
(26:57):
You know, as you walk throughthat experience you are embedded
in it, which brings a wholedifferent mindset to how you look
at things.
It goes back a little bit tothat human, those human factors and
the feeling of this experienceis so different than a PowerPoint.
Even just the interactivityand having everyone engaged in the
(27:17):
meeting instead of sittingback looking at their watch, that
alone is hugely different.
But yeah, our brains love tosee, see color and patterns and then
if it's at the same time waysthat we can help make better decisions
to run our businesses, then itjust feels like a huge win all the
(27:39):
way around.
Well, and I know Bill Morton'ssitting in the back of this conversation
listening, so Bill has beenamazing, walking me through how to
program the system, how tobring in data sets and all the little
intricacies that you've developed.
Jason, with the colors and thedifferent types of charts and the
transition, that's extremelyimportant, the transition and the
(27:59):
animation in between thecharts helps to really emphasize
some of the visuals thatyou're seeing.
So fantastic product,fantastic company you have.
Thank you so much forpartnering with us.
We're really excited aboutthis and I can't wait to share some
of the excitement that we hadat the show and share it with you
and your team and look forwardto a long, successful relationship
(28:22):
with each other.
Wowee, wow, wow, wow.
Talk about innovation.
And guess what?
If you are headed to the showtoday, you too can witness this amazing
data visualization tool.
If you have any questions forme or any of our guests, we'd love
to hear from you.
You can find me at boothnumber 305 over the next couple of
(28:45):
days or you can reach out tome on social media.
I Skip Kimple and MagicGate Tech.
We're on X, Facebook,Instagram and LinkedIn.
For past episodes and show notes.
Head over to Skip Kimble.comand to catch all the latest episodes,
visit MagicGate.com and ofcourse you can always reach out to
me directly via email.
(29:05):
Skip magic8.com so I got a bigquestion for you.
Did you book your demo spotfor the show?
If not, you need to.
We are fully booked for todayand tomorrow we just open up a couple
more spots.
So reach out to me if you wantto get in on this tech revolution.
Everybody have a great showand I look forward to seeing you
(29:27):
on the flip side.
Make sure you come by thebooth and say hello.
Next Tuesday we will be doinga Murtech recap show.
So until then, stay safe, stayhealthy and stay hungry.
My friends, are you ready tolevel up your tech game and understand
(29:47):
the world of xr?
Dive into the world ofextended reality with Magic Gate's
XR Bootcamp Master theconcepts of virtual reality, augmented
reality and mixed reality injust weeks.
No special equipment orprevious knowledge is required.
Limited seats are available tosign up now at bootcamp.magicgate.com
(30:07):
that's bootcamp.magicgate.comyour future in XR starts there.
You are listening to the TechChef Podcast.
This is episode number 92.
Monday, March 10, 2025 thisshow is.
Powered by Growth AdvisorsInternational network where travel
and hospitality companies cometo grow.
For more information pleasevisit gainadvisors.com hello, this
(00:22):
is Jason Marsh, CEO of FlowImmersive and you're listening to
Skip on the Tech Chef Podcast.
Off premise Strategy, Business continuity.
How about a taste test ofrestaurant technology?
Drive thru or curbside?
Mobile apps or AI?
It's all on the menu.
(00:43):
Cook it up for the date.
It's a recipe for success.
You're in good hands with theTech Chef.
Make a plan to be your best.
Strategize with the Tech Chef.
Welcome to the Tech ChefPodcast where innovation meets hospitality.
(01:05):
I'm Skip Kim, your host andthis show is your go to source for
the latest trendsrevolutionizing restaurants, hotels,
resorts and entertainment venues.
In every episode we explorethe cutting edge of hospitality tech.
From AI powered solutions toimmersive guest experiences and even
emerging technologies youmight not even be aware of.
(01:28):
We bring you insights fromindustry pioneers, bold inventors
and the minds shaping the future.
Whether you're leadingoperations, passionate about technology
or just eager to stay ahead ofthe curve, this is where inspiration
meets action.
So grab a seat at the tableand let's dig into the future of
hospitality.
(01:49):
Well, today is the day MRTAC begins.
We dropped this podcast thismorning so so you could listen to
it on the way to the show andhear about another one of our strategic
partners that was justannounced today.
This is some of the mostamazing data visualizations that
you will ever see.
(02:09):
Jason Marsh, co founder andCEO of Flow Immersive, joins us to
talk about their product whichis focused on immersive data visualization.
What does that mean?
Well, he shares how FlowImmersive started as a vision to
manipulate data in 3D space,evolving to utilize utilize AI for
real time data interaction.
(02:30):
The conversation highlightshow immersive data experiences can
transform business meetings bymaking data more engaging and interactive.
Jason explains that thistechnology allows users to visualize
complex data sets in a waythat is far more comprehensive than
traditional charts.
The episode dives into thepotential applications of this technology
(02:52):
in industries likehospitality, emphasizing the importance
of collaboration and sharedunderstanding in data driven decisions.
What if you could step insideyour data?
Jason Marsh reveals how FlowImmersive is revolutionizing data
visualization right now righthere on the Tech Chef podcast.
(03:16):
Mr.
Jason Marsh, great to have youon the Tech Chef Podcast.
I am fascinated by your product.
The very first day I saw itcan you go ahead and share a little
bit about your background andhow Flow Immersive really came to
be.
Yeah, thanks, Skip.
It's really great to be here.
Flow Immersive started nineyears ago.
(03:39):
Actually a little bit morethan that.
I got up at a hackathon andsaid, I want to build Ironman and
anybody who want to join me,come do this thinking.
When I said that was beingable to manipulate symbolic information,
data visualizations,information in 3D space, hopefully
(04:02):
with our hands that somedaythat wasn't.
Hand tracking, wasn't that biga thing back then.
I actually didn't realize howimportant AI would be in that equation.
That, Jarvis, is a reallyfundamental piece of that puzzle.
And that virtual realitywasn't as key a use case as augmented
reality.
So now today we're actuallyseeing the results of that vis come
(04:24):
together, which is datavisualization floating above a table
in between us, where we canhave a great data conversation and
collaboration around it andbeing able to manipulate it, especially
with voice, with an AI thatcan update the data sets, manipulate,
process any way you can thinkof and spin the data around to make
(04:46):
it particularly relevant tothe conversation you'd like to have.
What was that aha moment thatmade you realize immersive data visualization
was actually the future?
Oh.
So one of the firstvisualizations, first data sets I
put into our application as westarted to see it come together,
was a life expectancy data setfor the last 200 years.
(05:10):
This data set, just to giveyou a sense of, I'll paint the picture
for you, it's a 3D scatterplot line chart.
Across the front width axis is200 years.
Down the depth axis is 40 or50 selected countries that I just
picked out.
And then the height axis islife expectancy.
(05:33):
And when you look at thisvisualization, the first hundred
years pretty flat across allthe countries, it's life expectancy
is around 35.
And then around the turn ofthe last century, around 1900, you
start to see this upward curve.
And with some big exceptions,which we'll talk about, but you see
this upward curve go all theway to present day where Japan is
(05:55):
at 80 years life expectancy.
And in seeing that all in oneview, I don't have to wait for an
animation to play it.
It's detailed because it's 3D.
We can see so much more detailthan you could put on a flat screen.
And when you saw the scope ofhumanity's increase in life expectancy,
(06:18):
it's like humanity's greatestachie, frankly, life Expectancy helps
us understand how a society isdoing in terms of wars and famine
and disease.
And to see that success acrossthe entire planet is just an amazing
visualization.
Then you see the details.
(06:38):
You get this big chasm thatoccurs in 1918 for the Spanish flu
across almost every country.
And then you see anotherchasm, certainly in Europe for the
early 1940s, which is WorldWar II.
And then you see the basicwrestler curves.
But then you see these exceptions.
You see this huge plunge inHaiti in 2010 for the earthquake,
(07:04):
or 1994 in Rwanda for the genocide.
And you can see so much bigpicture and so much detail all in
one view.
I remember being in VR justwalking underneath it and exploring
and clicking on each dot tosee what was going on, each place.
And, and that was the, the inspiration.
(07:24):
That was the moment.
Like, oh, this is something special.
I've never seen anything likethis before.
And now with AI, each one ofthose dots or sections, you can actually
ask it.
You click on a, this plungingpoint in the, in the data and just
ask it what happened here?
And the AI knows what youselected and can start to tell you,
(07:44):
you know, more details aboutwhat happened at that genocide or,
or, you know, AIDS crisis insub Saharan Africa or whatever it
is you're pointing to.
All right, I'm getting wayahead of myself here, but to your
point, the first time I triedyour product, I tried it in on a
Magic Leap device.
I was in augmented reality.
I was blown away.
(08:05):
To be able to walk through thedata, to be able to touch data, to
be able to look at things in adifferent way, it is mind blowing.
And that kind of brings thingsaround here.
We talked about, you know,your historical example, but from
a business perspective, howcan businesses use this to interpret
their data?
Actually, a pretty large scopeof things that we have done and seen
(08:28):
customers use our product for,perhaps supply chains.
An example I've got in mindfor a customer right now, where you're
looking at raw materialsources spread across the globe.
You're looking at processingfacilities, distribution facilities,
and customer sites, whetherthey're retail or warehousing or
(08:51):
whatever.
And then just the amount ofcomplexity that goes into a sophisticated
product.
Say, think of an auto.
Yeah.
Think of an automobile, for example.
So many parts are coming fromso many different places.
Being able to see that move,see them moving across the globe.
But it's not just a map.
(09:13):
Now, the, you know, certaindelays can be represented in a vertical
axis or certain financialimplications can be represented by
the thickness of the lines andhow the Lines animate and you're
suddenly seeing a set of multidimensional data that you just, you
(09:34):
don't get on a flat screen.
But the power of being able tosee the relationships across those
things.
For this particular examplethat I have in my mind, a customer
said, okay, take a weatherdata set and map that onto the globe
on top of it.
So now it's a transparentlayer and you can see what kind of
impacts that has had.
(09:55):
Also with this thirddimension, we do something called
additional dimensions, whichenables you to do, I call them sparklines,
where you've got a little,instead of just seeing a dot on a
map, you see a little line chart.
You know, maybe it's only aninch big or maybe even smaller, but
it represents some aspect ofthe data changing over time.
(10:19):
You know, it could beproduction delays, it could be, you
know, costs or even somethinglike a, you know, weather temperature
data or something that givesyou yet another dimension.
And this is how we see relationships.
So, so supply chain is a good example.
Financial services being ableto see wide set of stocks or other
(10:43):
equities laid out on the depthaxis, seeing sales data around the
country.
And I think that's where itreally comes down to this, this level
of detail.
Right.
If you just look at your salesnumbers for the year, you know, it's
another bar chart, anotherPowerPoint deck and everybody's falling
asleep and oh yeah, yeah, yournumbers went up great.
(11:03):
But it could be that there's awhole bunch of risk that got lost
when you oversimplified thatdata into a bar chart.
And you, so with flow you canstart to drill into the quarter,
drill into the, the you know,weak, drill into the day, drill into
every single transactionbecause every single transaction
can appear on the map to havetens of thousands, 50,000 dots on
(11:26):
a map simultaneously with ouradditional dimensions.
We move it so that the dotsdon't overlap each other in horrible
ways.
You can still select any dotand see what that transaction was.
And one of the things that youmight see is, gee, we had two really
big sales the last week of thequarter and the whole quarter's numbers
would have been horriblewithout those.
(11:48):
But that got lost in the oversummarized PowerPoint slide.
Now I can click, click on thatdot, see who it was, see what they
bought and understand the riskthat, that, you know, that kind of
a sales cycle looks like toyour business.
And you would have lost thatrisk if you just, you know, used
(12:09):
your typical PowerPoint deck.
So is this a single userexperience or can you show it to
a group Just walk me through that.
I want to understand if I'm ina professional business scenario,
how do I present this data andthis really cool aspect and storytelling
to other people?
Actually, my first sentence Iusually use when I introduce flow
(12:30):
is that we've created a datacollaboration and conversation environment
where we think that it's thebest way you can have that data conversation
you can imagine.
For us, we think thataugmented reality is the best way
to do that.
To float the data above aconference room table, everyone can
(12:52):
stand around it with augmentedreality or pass through headsets
where you can all see the data.
Everybody's got a virtuallaser pointer.
Everyone can click andinteract and explore, do real time
filtering.
And anytime anyone interacts,everyone sees what they're doing.
So it's like having a physicalstructure, it's a symbolic structure,
(13:14):
but we imitate theconcreteness of having such a thing
in the room.
And if someone is remote, theyactually also appear in the meeting,
in the room as an avatar witha laser pointer.
So whether you're in headsetsin the room, whether you're remote
in, in some sort of headset,or on a phone or a computer, just
(13:36):
on a website, on, through theweb, you can also be a member, a
fully participating member ofthat meeting.
And it's really thecollaboration that stands, stands
apart from just buildinganother data visualization, you know,
another cool chart, in our opinion.
Well, that goes to the point,and don't take offense of this, but
(13:58):
is this just a cool new shinypenny in the room or is this truly
a business application that'shere to stay?
I think a lot of us, a lot oftime, we think of technology as cool,
but it doesn't need to beanybody who's doing something amazing
and impressive.
(14:18):
We go cool.
Even a cool person has acertain quality to them, right?
Well, I have to submit to youthat a definition of cool is mastery
and control.
Someone who's just nailed thatskateboard trick and you just go,
wow, that was amazing.
That was cool.
Because they had control overthe, over gravity in a way that's
(14:40):
just kind of mind blowing, right?
And when you think about Ironman flicking atoms, flicking atoms
to create a new element andtalking to Jarvis, we vicariously
experienced that cool as that.
Mastering control as cool.
That's what we've built.
I say we encoded thatthroughout the product.
(15:03):
Giving everybody that sense ofmastering control is not just a novelty
that's going to wear off.
It's how you create efficiency.
And the efficiency is buildingthe best possible mental model for
yourself and your audience andknowing that they're seeing the data
(15:23):
the way you're seeing it, thatthey're coming up, they've got in
their mind a very similarrepresentation to yours.
That shared mental model.
Yeah, it goes way beyond cool.
That's where we get somethingthat's got really lasting value and
is actually going to changethe way we think about data for all
the knowledge workers of the world.
(15:45):
Cool.
All right, on that point,we're going to take a little break.
When we come back, we're goingto dig specifically into enterprise
and hospitality applicationsand start talking to the audience
which the majority of ourlisteners are really in the restaurant
and hotel side of it.
And we're going to discoverkind of the application side of how
it can help them.
So everybody hold on, we'll beright back.
(16:07):
Hey, since I have you here, ifyou're headed to Mirtech in Vegas
this year, March 10th through12th, you gotta swing by Magic Gate's
experience zone.
We're talking next levelrestaurant tech, VR training that
actually works, AR remotesupport that makes troubleshooting
a breeze.
And some seriously cool datatools to keep your ops running smooth.
(16:28):
Plus you can mess around withfuturistic stuff like augmented reality,
virtual reality and haptic devices.
It's all hands on, no boringdemos, just straight up cool tech
that you need to see.
Come check it out.
Jason, with Magic 8 focusingon hospitality tech, how do you see
immersive data solutionstransforming industries like hotels,
(16:49):
resorts, restaurants or otherentertainment venues?
Restaurants and hospitalityare such a data driven industry.
I mean, you've got thisconstant set of inputs with labor
and food costs and actuallychanging rapidly, especially food
costs these days in the United States.
(17:11):
And all of those inputs, datainputs and then the outputs on what
the market will bear, what'shappening with competitors, what's
happening with certain localities.
There's so many inputs intothe prices that are charged and the
(17:34):
financial bottom line.
Those include, you know,supply chains as well as, you know,
weather, maybe even impactsthat are, you know, happening more
often these days with weather,you know, weather related to flights
and, you know, airports andchallenges there.
(17:54):
Being able to see that in away that helps you make decision
to understand what'shappening, but even better, understand
what kind of risks could beimpacting your bottom line in the
future.
You need to have greatconversations around data and that's
what we're focused on.
Well, just to give thelisteners a little bit of a hint,
most of our audience is headedto Mirtech right now, on the plane
(18:20):
on their way there, or theycould already be in Vegas Flow, Immersive
and Magic 8.
We've actually constructed aFlow story specific to the restaurant
industry.
So if you're coming for a demoat the Myrtek XR Experience Zone,
this is one of the things thatyou can see is how you can tell a
story with your data,specifically around restaurants.
(18:40):
I think it's going to spark alot of ideas out there.
So that kind of leans intosome of the challenges that flow
faces when introducing theproduct to enterprise clients who
may be hesitant about XR adoption.
What do you have to say tothose folks?
Well, it has been hard tobring these larger VR headsets into
(19:03):
knowledge worker environments,you know, our modern office.
And so there is a newgeneration of smart glasses that
is just coming online now.
A number of both small, smallcompanies and some very large ones
are, have announced and areshowing some of what they're working
(19:25):
on.
You know, Meta has shown theirOrion smart glasses, augmented reality
glasses.
The, that particularparticular next generation device
is still a few years out, butthere's a, even in these next few
months we're going to see alot of these glasses.
They basically look likeglasses, maybe a little thick, you
(19:45):
know, but, and this firstgeneration is more likely to be tethered.
It will have a, a cable toconnect to your phone or, or other
computing device.
But they're light, they'reconvenient, they're really, they're
see through so you can see theroom and everything around you very
easily.
We see that that change intechnology is going to really increase
(20:08):
adoption.
And just think of a conferenceroom where you're having a meeting
and then use a couple of theseor four of these pairs of glasses
sitting on the conference room table.
And the presenter says, okay,we're gonna do the data, data portion
now.
Grab your glasses, put them onand there's the data.
You have that conversation for15, 20, 30 minutes around the data.
(20:31):
That feels like a verydifferent thing than struggling to
get into a VR headset andunderstand the controllers and all
of that kind of thing.
That's a big one way we'rereally overcoming some of the barriers
to adoption then AI is huge.
Just being able to talk to thedata and have it reprocess it and
(20:52):
answer your questions and show you.
It's not just verbalquestions, verbal answers that come
back.
It'll actually just throw itback into 3D space.
You can see that, hey, we'veisolated on this point, that point
and we've run this, you know,Python code to, you know, process
to find the, you know,averages or Means or, or relationships,
(21:13):
the ease of use and power,thinking of mastering control, the
power of, in the hands of theend users is just really fabulous.
And that bar of power and easeof use, that's where we start to
scale.
So do you see the future of XRdriven data visualization really
(21:35):
becoming a standard such asPowerPoint, or do you think this
is still.
It's going to be a little more focused.
I do believe eventually wewill be getting rid of monitors.
That day is coming, similar tothe day of getting rid of phones.
I don't believe you'll beholding that rectangular device in
your hands, just your thoughtson where it's headed and where this
(21:57):
plays out in the future.
I think seeing our informationaround us in an appropriate level
of detail for most of our dayis going to feel just very natural.
I just wrote an article acouple of weeks ago and I call it
(22:18):
the Future of Data is Humanand the Future of Technology is Human,
where the technologies justkind of disappears instead of.
For all these years, we havemodified our human, modified the
human in order to interactwith technology instead of the other
way around.
(22:38):
And a spoken interface withsomething that really takes advantage
of the way our brains viewinformation and think about symbolic
information.
That combination feels like magic.
It no longer feels like high tech.
It just does what you want itto do in, in the way you want it
(23:00):
want to do it.
Your brain is no longertranslating 2D screens into 3D, you
know, rich mental models because.
And it's, that's what it does.
That's what we do right now.
And, and we've all gotten usedto flat screens, but that's not the
way our brains think.
That's not the way our brains evolved.
And so as we get closer tothis, to this vision of smart glasses
(23:24):
with augmented reality and aspoken interface, that magic really
settles in and just becomespart of the normal human experience.
So since you're building Ironman out in the background, if you
could fast forward five years,what do you hope that Flow Immersive
will actually have achieved?
I can hope, I can dream.
(23:45):
That will be an important partof the boardrooms throughout America
and the world and a naturalpart of how we interact with our
Fitbit data, our weather data,our stock data, our fantasy football
data.
(24:05):
It's just the way we're usedto seeing the things that, the symbolic
information that helps us keepour lives organized and engaging.
So as we start to wind downthe show, let's talk about the devices
that Flow works on.
Do you need a headset device?
Can you run it on a computer?
(24:25):
What does that scenario look like?
You can run it on almost anydevice now and certainly very comfortably
on a computer with a browser.
On a phone again in a browseron Android it's single click and
you see it in augmentedreality on your phone.
With Apple devices you need tohave a augmented reality aware browser.
(24:49):
They're free and open sourceto grab one of those.
But it's got to work reallywell on existing phones and flat
screen browsers or laptops.
Then in addition to that, it'sa really beautiful experience on
the Meta Quest headsets, onthe HTC Vive headsets.
(25:10):
Some nice advantages to thosedue to security, especially in some
enterprise situations that'sthere's real value in the HTC product
line around that worksbeautifully on Magic Leap and we're
working on the implementationsright now for these next generation
of smart glasses and we'll beable to be talking about those in
(25:31):
a short number of months.
Oh, we might have to talkoffline about that because the audiences
seeing some really coolaugmented reality devices at the
show that I'll have there.
So let's continue that discussion.
Speaking of which, just thismorning, right before the kickoff
of Mirtech 2025, we announcedour strategic partnership between
Magic8 and Flow Immersive.
What excites you the mostabout partnering with us and how
(25:53):
do you see that reallybenefiting the hospitality segment?
Having someone of yourexpertise to help us, you know, really
dig in and get beyond thecool, get beyond the proof of concepts
into real world, even missioncritical use cases.
There's no way we could dothat without that kind of expertise.
(26:15):
So partnerships for Flow areincredibly important and what you've
accomplished so far and whatwe'll accomplish together is, yeah,
is very exciting.
We are extremely excited to beable to present this to our clients
and other colleagues.
I just want people toexperience the technology and that's
really part of the experiencezone that we're creating is we just
(26:36):
want people to see cool tech.
We don't want them to sitthrough a boring demo.
We want them to experience adifferent way of looking at things.
And this for sure.
I'm a data guy, so I guessmaybe that's why I'm so excited about
this product because this is acompletely different way of not only
looking at the data, but beingpart of the data, if that makes sense.
(26:57):
You know, as you walk throughthat experience you are embedded
in it, which brings a wholedifferent mindset to how you look
at things.
It goes back a little bit tothat human, those human factors and
the feeling of this experienceis so different than a PowerPoint.
Even just the interactivityand having everyone engaged in the
(27:17):
meeting instead of sittingback looking at their watch, that
alone is hugely different.
But yeah, our brains love tosee, see color and patterns and then
if it's at the same time waysthat we can help make better decisions
to run our businesses, then itjust feels like a huge win all the
(27:39):
way around.
Well, and I know Bill Morton'ssitting in the back of this conversation
listening, so Bill has beenamazing, walking me through how to
program the system, how tobring in data sets and all the little
intricacies that you've developed.
Jason, with the colors and thedifferent types of charts and the
transition, that's extremelyimportant, the transition and the
(27:59):
animation in between thecharts helps to really emphasize
some of the visuals thatyou're seeing.
So fantastic product,fantastic company you have.
Thank you so much forpartnering with us.
We're really excited aboutthis and I can't wait to share some
of the excitement that we hadat the show and share it with you
and your team and look forwardto a long, successful relationship
(28:22):
with each other.
Wowee, wow, wow, wow.
Talk about innovation.
And guess what?
If you are headed to the showtoday, you too can witness this amazing
data visualization tool.
If you have any questions forme or any of our guests, we'd love
to hear from you.
You can find me at boothnumber 305 over the next couple of
(28:45):
days or you can reach out tome on social media.
I Skip Kimple and MagicGate Tech.
We're on X, Facebook,Instagram and LinkedIn.
For past episodes and show notes.
Head over to Skip Kimble.comand to catch all the latest episodes,
visit MagicGate.com and ofcourse you can always reach out to
me directly via email.
(29:05):
Skip magic8.com so I got a bigquestion for you.
Did you book your demo spotfor the show?
If not, you need to.
We are fully booked for todayand tomorrow we just open up a couple
more spots.
So reach out to me if you wantto get in on this tech revolution.
Everybody have a great showand I look forward to seeing you
(29:27):
on the flip side.
Make sure you come by thebooth and say hello.
Next Tuesday we will be doinga Murtech recap show.
So until then, stay safe, stayhealthy and stay hungry.
My friends, are you ready tolevel up your tech game and understand
(29:47):
the world of xr?
Dive into the world ofextended reality with Magic Gate's
XR Bootcamp Master theconcepts of virtual reality, augmented
reality and mixed reality injust weeks.
No special equipment orprevious knowledge is required.
Limited seats are available tosign up now at bootcamp.magicgate.com
(30:07):
that's bootcamp.magicgate.comyour future in XR starts there.
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