April 30, 2025 • 28 mins
Financial coach Justin shares his journey from struggling with personal finances despite a banking career to helping others achieve financial freedom through his new book "Level Up Your Finances."
• Justin discovered he was $700 short each month despite his banking background, leading him to find a better approach to money management
• After paying off $100,000 in debt, Justin has spent 15 years as a financial coach helping clients repay over $10 million in debt
• The Financial Freedom Pyramid consists of five levels: awareness, knowledge, commitment, momentum, and freedom
• Most people get stuck between knowledge and commitment, entering a cycle of regret that leads to frustration and failure
• Accountability is the key bridge between knowledge and commitment that helps people maintain progress
• The four "SLOW" thieves of momentum: Situational principles, Life circumstances, Out of gas, and Weak results
• Personal finance must align with your own principles rather than following someone else's plan exactly
• Taking ownership of your financial journey by establishing your own goals and principles is crucial for long-term success
For free resources including a budget builder, financial freedom pyramid checklist, and money confidence quiz, visit levelupyourfinances.com.
Justin's book "Level Up Your Finances" is now available on Amazon.
Our Profit Coaching program is enrolling new practices now.
We specialize in helping therapy practices like yours achieve financial clarity, so you can focus on what you do best—helping your clients and managing your team- while we help handle all the businessy stuff they didn’t teach you in grad school.
To see if your practice might be a good fit, schedule a free consultation at therapybusinesspod.com.
Meet with one of our coaches
*Intro/outro song credit:
King Around Here by Alex Grohl
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
My name is Craig and I'm the owner of Daisy Financial
Coaching.
Our team is on a mission tomake your therapy practice
permanently profitable.
If you own a solo or grouppractice, we're here to help you
build a business that createsmore time, makes more money and
serves more people.
This is the Therapy BusinessPodcast.
All right, justin, one of mygood friends is here.
(00:27):
Justin, how are you doing?
Doing great man.
How are you, craig?
I'm good.
I'm good.
We've been connected.
So, justin, you're your coach,a financial coach.
We've been connected for solong.
We meet once a month just totalk business and to pick each
other's brains.
So, as you've been writing thisbook, it's been kind of cool on
the back end to just watch, andI mean, honestly, it scares me
(00:49):
from wanting to write a bookbecause all the work that you've
had to put into it over theyears, what led you to decide,
hey, I'm going to jump out andwrite a book.
What sparked the whole thing?
Speaker 2 (01:00):
No, absolutely.
It's interesting.
As a kid, reading was not on mylist of fun, unless it was a
sports magazine or a video gamemagazine.
I really had zero interest inever reading.
And then in college I grew aninterest in reading and the more
I read books, the more I saidit'd be kind of cool to write a
book someday.
So it's on the proverbialbucket list and, long story
(01:20):
short, I just always said Iwanted to write a book and three
years ago it's like you knowwhat, it's time, it's time to
write it.
I felt like God was pointing mein that direction to write a
book and literally it was 35months ago to the day.
We announced it from the firstwords to actually saying hey, we
got a book, we want people tocheck out.
(01:41):
We think it will be lifetransformational for you.
Yeah, it was about a three-yearprocess.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Man, which is crazy because it's felt long, but also
, again, just being on the backside of it, it doesn't feel like
it's been that long, but maybejust yeah, I haven't had to go
through the trudgery, the pit,the work and the rewrites and
all that stuff, which anotherconversation for another day is
learning, all that is involvedin writing a book.
In fact, we may have to bringyou back to talk about that,
(02:08):
because I'm sure there's somepeople listening who maybe
that's on their bucket list aswell.
But tell me about you and yourbusiness.
I know you, but listeners, tellus about you and what you do
and who you are.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
No, absolutely Craig.
So I've been a full-timefinancial coach for over 15
years and my heart and mypassion is always helping
hurting people.
I just happen to know a thingor two about money, where my
wife and I as you'll find in thebook we talk about we and here
I am my banking career is doingawesome, but our finances at
(02:52):
home are not doing awesome, andI woke up one day I'll never
forget getting a yellow pad outgoing.
Something just doesn't feelright about my finances and I
wrote it all down and found outoh, my goodness, we're almost
$700 short a month.
That's not counting Christmasvacations, car repairs, car tags
, all the other stuff you knowthat we talk about with sinking
funds and the non-monthlyaccounts and uh, etc.
(03:13):
Etc.
And so, um, bottom line is I'mgoing to stop right.
There are you hearing that textbeing?
I thought I turned off all mynotifications and it is no, it'm
not sorry about that.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
Yeah, it's not picking up on here um let me um.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
I don't know why I actually silenced this while
this is going off sorry aboutthat.
Uh, you're gonna hate that Ithought that was coming in like
a lot and I'm like, oh great, sodo I redo the question again
and hopefully that won't Um yeah, we can um.
I don't, we don't do that, butthat's all right, we'll pick up.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
Uh, I made a timestamp so I know to go back,
we can.
I can ask you again who you are.
Um, if it's easier for you andwe can just rehash where you
started, that's fine.
Or we can plug in wherever youfeel.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yeah, I think we could plug in right after the
$700 short a month and then Ican pick up from there.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Great, all right, I'll let you just launch it and
we'll go.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
So we found that we were $700 short a month.
And again, that's not includingthings like car registrations,
christmas school supplies,vacations right, it's just bills
.
And we're $700 for the month.
And I'm like, oh wow, how is aguy like me with a business
degree at that time about sevenyears of banking experience?
How are we here?
(04:38):
And so I kind of went on aquest to go how does money work?
Because what I'm doing is notworking.
And so my wife and I began tofind what works and by a lot of
hard work and God's grace, wepaid off that $100,000 in debt.
And, like I said, I've been acoach now for 15 years.
Part of the time we were stillgetting out of debt as a coach,
and then we got out of debt andnow we're out of debt on that.
(05:02):
And my heart and passion is somany people want help with their
finances but they don't knowwhere to turn to and what.
I'm convinced of, craig, andyou probably are too, because
you're a coach and youunderstand this I am convinced
everyone needs a coach, and thereason why is no one is
disciplined in every area oflife.
Every one of us is disciplinedin one or two areas, but most of
(05:24):
us aren't disciplined in moneyand what I've discovered you can
go to a podcast, which is great, or a book, like I have or
other people have in classes.
But oftentimes having thataccountability someone walking
alongside you, helping you wherethings don't make sense,
cheering you on when you'redoing a good job, pick you back
up when you've made a mistakeand I've just really learned
(05:46):
that with accountability andcoaching it can help take people
who never thought it waspossible to get out of debt and
gain what we call financialfreedom and do that.
And that's just my passion ishelping people who feel like
they failed to go from failureto freedom.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Yeah, that's fantastic and you're right, and
I think even the audience hereis therapists, so they
completely agree with that.
Everybody needs somebodymentality in that you know
there's there's so many barrierseven internally that can
prevent us.
I had a one of my coaches causewe all need coaches who helped
me realize that money, managingmoney is, is a skill.
(06:22):
It's a skill that we are notborn with, that's not innate to
us.
No one is just suddenly bornknowing how to invest in their
retirement and manage theirmoney well and pay off debt.
So it's a skill that needshoning and crafting and we all
need that support and somebodyjust needs to teach us those
skills.
And that's what you've beendoing, and it's incredible to
see just the lives you'vechanged.
(06:43):
I know I think I saw your booksays over $10 million in debt
paid off.
Is that right?
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Yeah, and that's just during the sessions when
they're my client Often clientsafter a period of time they kind
of go on their own.
And what's been so neat?
As we've announced the launchof our book, I have had a
multitude of past clients frommany years email me, message me,
going.
Hey, I haven't told you, butwe're actually debt free now.
(07:08):
I've had some clients go.
We've even paid off the house.
I'm like whoa, and so it's justbeen neat.
I mean I hear that all the time, but because of the book launch
, we've actually heard even morestories of people that I
haven't heard from in a while.
So it's just a lot of funhearing people.
You know years later how thismessage has still impacted them.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, that's awesome.
That's awesome.
So your book Level Up yourFinances.
I'm a huge believer thateveryone needs to find their own
money journey, and so I thinkit's.
I love hearing differentperspectives on personal
finances.
You know there's so many gurus,people who've written books,
who have YouTube channels, whohave podcasts, and so I'm all
(07:49):
about let's find whatmethodology works for each
individual.
So tell me about level up yourfinances.
What is what's in that book?
What is your approach?
What is it going to teachpeople?
Maybe they haven't heardelsewhere, or maybe reinforcing
things they've heard before too?
Yeah, talk to me about what'swhat.
What will people find if they,when they pick up their copy of
the book?
Speaker 2 (08:03):
I think that's a great question because you
already know this A lot of whatI do is right akin to Dave
Ramsey.
My running joke is the onlydifference between Dave and I is
I've got more hair and he's gotmore money.
And so I'm like how do I writea book that's not Dave Ramsey
2.0?
And I don't need to be the nextfinancial expert.
We've got enough of those outthere.
So what can be different thatother financial books either
(08:26):
don't touch a lot on or don'ttouch at all on?
So the first part of the bookgoes through your how-tos,
because we still got to know thehow-tos how do we budget right,
how do we save, how do we getout of debt.
But the other half of the bookfocuses a lot on how do we stay
committed when the going getstough, and if and when we need
accountability.
What does that look like?
(08:47):
And accountability is one ofthose words.
It's kind of like going to thedentist, and if there are any
dentists listening I'm notpicking on you guys, but most
people when they hear dentist,they go.
Well, same could be true withaccountability.
It's like I know I could use it, but I don't know right.
(09:08):
And so we really try to take theshame or the guilt away of
getting accountability, becausethere are stories throughout the
entire book on every incomelevel single, married, widowed,
divorced, parents of kids, largeincomes, small incomes, average
incomes of just how gettingsome accountability in life can
be all the difference maker.
I mean, for example, dave'spopularized the debt snowball, I
popularized the debt snowball.
(09:28):
I bring up the debt snowballand some of the earlier readers
have got to read it.
Go man, you explained the debtsnowball better than Dave and I
go.
No, I didn't, um, I just saidit a little different or a
different few word choices andit clicked this time.
Um right, uh, and so that's thebook.
Uh, we talk about five levels.
We call it the financialfreedom pyramid.
(09:49):
There are five levels to gofrom not doing well financially
to financial freedom, and thosefive levels are awareness,
knowledge, commitment, momentumand freedom.
So awareness we start there.
That's where we got to getaware and you know, as a coach,
oftentimes people are unaware ofwhat they really make for an
(10:12):
income, what they really spend.
A lot of people that I meetthem they're like I'm not a big
spender, I don't go to big malls, I don't get, I don't have a
Lexus, I don't go on fancyvacations, why am I broke?
Well, once they start trackingtheir expenses and they go oh my
gosh, you and I know this Ididn't know how much I was
spending on eating out or onlinesubscriptions or Amazon fill in
(10:34):
the blank.
So the first level is gettingcrystal clear awareness of where
we're at.
The second level is knowledge,and that's how do we budget, how
do we save, how do we get outof debt?
So that's where we learnedthose basic principles so we
could obtain financial freedom.
But awareness and knowledge isnot enough and, honestly, this
is where a lot of people stop.
(10:57):
Next level is commitment, andit's the fork in the road moment
.
And there's fork in the road ofam I really going to follow
through on what I learned in thecommitment level?
And if you make a yes decisionto that, every paycheck, every
month, you're going to seeresults, which leads you to
momentum, and that's where youget traction.
And that traction you go.
Yes, this is what I was hopingwould happen.
The picture is starting tobecome a reality and if you keep
(11:19):
doing that, that's when youachieve financial freedom.
Problem.
That all sounds great until andthat's what I call the cycle of
regret.
The cycle of regret is we getaware, we get knowledge, but you
know what?
I'm not going to do this orthat or this or that, and we
(11:40):
begin to reject what we learnedin the knowledge level.
And so then we go from gettinghope to now it's just a wish,
and that rejection turns intofrustration and despair, and if
we don't turn the ship aroundnow, we feel like a failure.
Now the shame comes in.
Now we go.
Why bother?
And what ultimately ends uphappening is then we go.
(12:01):
I'm going to work on some otherarea of my life because I've
obviously failed finances again.
And then a month later, yearslater, you know, after paycheck
to paycheck, still there.
Okay, I'm going to try again.
And we keep repeating the cycle.
So how do we break the cyclebetween, and bridge the gap
between, knowledge andcommitment?
Accountability and it's thataccountability that really helps
(12:23):
.
And again, as therapists, theyknow we can really hold people
accountable in a loving, caringway.
It's amazing how far we can gowhen we have accountability 100%
.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
I think you're right, accountability can sometimes
come with that stigma.
But I think therapistsunderstand that too, because
therapy comes with a stigma alot of times and there's a lot
of fear of even jumping intothat pool.
But man, I've seen that so manytimes that we think it's the
knowledge piece.
I mean, how many people have wetalked to who who are like well
, I'm just going to watch thisthing and try it on my own, or
(12:58):
I'm going to listen to thisthing and try it on my own,
which you know, I'm rooting forthem.
But we, we both know thatlong-term change typically
doesn't happen just trying it onour own, and that
accountability piece really is,is key.
So, people listening thosethose five stages, they've got
the knowledge maybe, and nowthey're at that, that commitment
phase, and they're looking foraccountability.
(13:18):
Where do where do they start tofind that?
I mean, is it a friend, is itobviously a coach?
Who were what do you typicallyrecommend?
Or even in the book?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
where do you talk about?
You know, that was the thing inthe book too.
I didn't want to limit it tojust coaching.
I mean, obviously I'm going toselfishly say I like coaching
right, I'm a coach, so it's kindof hard not to say that.
But it can be a friend, apastor, a mentor.
We actually have a wholechapter on what I call the
accountability gap and how do webridge that gap, and we talk
about characteristics to lookfor for accountability, and so
(13:50):
to me it's more about who meetsthese character qualities of a
good accountability partner.
And if you can't find it, goget a coach.
You know another way of sayingit is at some point you have to
say my DIY isn't working, andwhen you have that moment, then
go looking for it.
The example I give for me, Ifeel really good about my
(14:13):
ability, with money, to staytrue to my goals and our budget.
Eating, on another hand, not somuch.
So my wife and I, literallyyears ago, we traded services
with a personal trainer and thefirst thing she had us do you
guessed it, track what we eat.
And you know what was crazy,Craig, I sounded like my clients
(14:35):
Well, I don't overeat that much.
And the first day I tracked it.
I had a bad day at the office,just bad day.
I get home, I'm tired and whatdo I do to soothe myself is I
eat a lot of food before bed.
The next day was a great,fantastic day and I wanted to
(14:56):
end the day on a celebration.
Guess what I did celebrate Morefood and a lot of it.
By like Thursday.
I'm like, oh wow, I'm like myclients again.
I didn't think I was overeatingthat much, but as I started,
tracking and awareness came inand just blew my mind.
(15:18):
But I wasn't going to do thatwithout being nudged by my
trainer.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
Yes, yes, I'm the same way.
And, uh, I took me 37 years tostart exercising and I got stuck
in that cycle of regret, whichI love that because it just
articulates so well the thefeeling I had where I would get
on these kicks where I'd starttrying to eat better and work
out, and it would last for maybea month, and then all of them
(15:45):
like, well, I don't have abs, sothis stinks, and I'd give up.
And it wasn't until I finallywas like I need the
accountability pieces.
I should have known I'm a coach, I should have known I need
somebody to hold me accountable.
And I did.
And that's that's where thepivotal change happened, cause,
like you said, it's, it's justforcing you to pay attention and
having someone who's there, notonly because if I'm answering
(16:06):
to someone I'm usually going I'ma good student, so I like to.
I like to do my homework andace the test but also, when
things aren't going right,somebody to troubleshoot it with
me.
I found was was huge.
It's like, hey, I'm not losingweight as fast as I thought I
would.
And it's like, okay, let's lookat it.
Do we need to adjust yourcalorie intake?
Do we need to adjust yourworkout regimen.
(16:27):
What do we need to fix?
That was a game changer,because those were the moments
where I would have quit had Inot had somebody to guide me
through.
What do we do to pivot so thatthis sticks?
Speaker 2 (16:38):
Absolutely.
You know, I heard from a guyyears ago there's two things we
like to do is look good and beright and so, and then when
you're paying for the privilege,you're right, you're going to
take it more seriously.
And you know, I know for a lotof people, whether it's going to
a therapist or going to afinancial coach or a business
coach, there's a lot of oh mygosh, I'm afraid I'm going to
get my hand slapped and like allthe shame and the barrier to
(17:00):
that right.
But then, once it becomesclients, what they don't realize
and this is what I love aboutcoaching, and I'm sure the same
is true of therapists as wellwhen they do fall down because
they can and they will, the waywe approach it, if done right,
can be so life-giving.
So my favorite client storywith this, I'll never forget it
I had this couple I was meetingwith and as the session began
(17:22):
they go.
You're not going to be veryhappy with this.
I'm like, okay, and Craig,you've been there, you know what
it is.
They got a couple extra thingson Amazon.
(17:43):
They swiped a credit card whenthey shouldn't for a car.
It wasn't like they went toVegas, right, it was just a
little overspending and they gowhat, I'm glad you did that?
And they're like what, oh, yeah, I'm glad you did that.
You're kidding I go.
Well, let me ask you how does itfeel after that decision?
Oh, it's horrible, awesome.
Um, are you gonna do it again?
(18:04):
Well, no, okay, what do youneed for me?
You're not gonna yell at me, Ican.
If you charge extra.
Uh, I might.
Um, I go now.
In three months, if we're doingthe same thing over and over
again, the conversational tonemay change.
I go, but if you learned yourlesson well, wife, the best
teacher here.
Okay, at the end of thatsession, craig, I'll never
(18:28):
forget the wife going.
Can I be honest, I go.
What's that?
I was so many times tempted tosay we're not coming today,
we're just done.
I was so ashamed of what we did.
I feel so much better how youframed this.
And show me how to turn thisinto a win.
I cannot wait for the nextsession.
By the way, can I bring my kidsso you can personally teach
(18:50):
them?
Wow, again, the fear of theirmistake almost held them back
from meeting, but they steppedthrough.
They took the courage to stepthrough and then, as a coach,
like your therapists do?
We walked them through.
Yeah, that wasn't good, buthere's how we can reposition
that and rethink that.
And it made all the differencein the world for them to keep
(19:13):
going, where that would havebeen a place.
They would have said I'm out,I'm done.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Wow, and I've, man.
That story really doeshighlight something that's just
kind of I think I've been awareof, but it's come into mind
feeling like a revelation here.
But it's that it takes time, noone.
I think the idea is oh great,here's my plan, I'm going to
figure out this plan, I'm goingto implement it and boom, I'm
good with money, we're going topay off debt and there's going
(19:38):
to be no problems.
And it's a learning process.
I mean, I think of learning thebass guitar and how many sour
notes I hit and how much likehow, how hard it was and all
these humps I had to get through.
And I'm still learning, I'mstill growing and I've been
playing it for 25 years.
So I think that's so huge thatit's not.
It's not a failure.
(19:58):
When you have those bad months,how you react to it, how you
recover from it is when you getinto that psych, that the
negative cycle.
Are you going to push throughagain, the accountability to
help you push through.
But even on your own, are yougoing to push through?
Are we going to throw our handsup in defeat and fall back into
that cycle?
So, giving ourselves grace,it's we're learning, we're
learning how it goes, and that'sa win.
(20:18):
When we fail, it's a win,because it's it's we're priming
the pump to be successful.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
Yeah, that that's fantastic.
So I want to go back tomomentum in your pyramid, the
five keys.
So momentum, that is such awall, and all of a sudden I'm
back to phase one again.
And so do you talk about thatin the book with momentum, of
(20:56):
how to maintain it, or what'syour advice on that, or what do
you even speak to in it?
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Yeah, we talk about what I call overcoming the four
thieves of momentum, and there'sfour thieves that will slow you
down, and slow is an acrostic Sis for situational principles,
l stands for life circumstances,o for out of gas and W weak
results.
So in the book we talk abouthow to overcome each one of
(21:21):
those.
So I'll give the situationalprinciple ones, for instance and
I got that from a term that'sused a lot situational ethics.
And that's where I got the ideaof situational principles,
because I've seen as a coach,where people get started, like
you said, they're on fire, theydo really good and then they
fall off the wagon and thenthey'll blame a personality like
Dave Ramsey or myself, or inthe exercise world we always
(21:44):
hear it as well.
This is not sustainable.
So what I have is I got aclient who's in the story or in
the book and I've got permissionto use a story.
This couple had over $100,000 indebt First six months.
They are crushing it, sellingstuff, working extra.
They're doing all the stuff weasked to do and they are paying
off debt like it is on fire.
They are doing it great.
(22:05):
I'm preparing for the daysession.
I pull up their budget form.
To my horror, I see two new carloans and the credit card went
up and I went huh, interesting.
So we get into the session andthe husband and I are a similar
personality and we gel reallywell together and he's like well
, did you look at the budget?
I go yep.
Well, that whole plan is justunsustainable.
(22:28):
I go stop.
What the problem is is not theplan.
There is a principle mismatch.
Your principles aren't liningwith these principles and you're
trying to use this process forprinciples that don't agree.
So I gave him a homeworkassignment Go on a date, make
sure it's in the budget anddetermine what are your
(22:50):
principles that, when it comesto your personal finances, you
are going to stick with.
Upon knowing your principles,now get a process and a plan
that follows through theprinciples, because same thing
with diets.
This is where I saw this andI'm no different because, again,
it's something I've always hadto work on is I see people they
(23:12):
find this diet and they get alljacked up and excited about the
first two weeks.
They get all the results thatthey were hoping for, but they
lose the momentum and theyalways come back to not
sustainable and I'm almostconvinced every diet I think
works.
Yeah, but we got to stick withit through the hard parts.
(23:32):
And the one way you can stickthrough it with the hard part,
two things to stick with it.
One, obviously, accountability,but two, getting your
principles to be your principles, not theirs.
And these are my things.
So, for instance, when Ifollowed Dave Ramsey for the
first time, I was a banker I wasgiving people debt.
When I said debt is no more, itis off the table, that is how I
(23:57):
got out of debt.
One of the things was to saydebt can no longer be a
possibility.
To do this, and it worked, andso getting those principles
assigned again is one of theways to keep the momentum going
and not lose.
It is by not having a situationof principles, instead getting
your principles solid, and then,once we know what the
principles are, let's find aprocess and a plan that lines up
(24:20):
with those principles.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
I think personal finance is personal and I think
you know there's I love that youtouch on that piece of what is.
What is our principles?
You know I can tell somebody,you could tell somebody, getting
a car loan is a is just not afinancially wise decision.
But what do they believe?
We can say?
Here's how the fastest way toget out of debt is don't spend a
single dime on anything ever Uh, what Dave says beans and rice.
Don't do any of that, you'regoing to get out of debt fast.
(24:51):
But what are their principles?
Is that aligned with theirvalues?
Is that aligned with who theyare, their personality?
Do they need to strike adifferent balance?
It's giving them autonomy andownership of their own money
journey.
They're not doing Justin'smoney journey, they're doing
their money journey.
And I think that is completelywhere momentum can get lost in a
(25:13):
lot of when people are doing iton their own or don't have
something like your book toguide them through that piece of
.
What does it look like for me?
And if my principle is toborrow money on cars, then I
guess that's my principle andwe'll go through and we'll help
them figure out how what thatlooks like.
But there may not be the best.
We might try and discourage it,but I think that's key.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
Well and you said a good word there ownership, when
they take ownership.
So in chapter two of the bookwe talk a lot about goal setting
and again, goal setting.
That's been something writtenabout.
There's lots of ways to dogoals, but that's one of the
things we talk about.
It has to be your goals, not mygoals.
I can guise you to what somegood goals are, I can draw out
of you why those goals should beimportant for your specific
(25:57):
situation.
But until you take 100%ownership and these are my goals
, these are my principles untilyou do that, it's easy to be
wishy-washy or again have to doit from a principle.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
Yeah, and I like that so much and I think hearing
that hopefully people hear thisand it gives them, allows them
to sigh and, just you know,release some of the pressure of
I have to do it this way.
I have to do the debt snowball.
We've we've come across peoplewho are wanting to pay off debt
and they've been trying to dothis debt snowball.
But maybe they have, like thismedical debt that's further down
(26:31):
on that.
You know, we had a client onetime who they lost a child and
they had this medical debt tiedto it and it was just so
emotionally draining that wepopped it to the top and we're
like let's pay that off firstbecause it's into you.
It is a priority to get thisthing out of your life.
But they were so stuck on.
Well, this is how we have to doit, this is the way we've been
(26:53):
told.
Autonomy, ownership, I think,is so key.
So I'm really glad to hear thatyou hit on that Cool.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
Very cool yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Awesome.
I could pick your brain forever, uh, as you know, um, but I
want to drive people to purchaseyour book.
So, as of the release of thisepisode, we're talking, it's
releasing next week, but thisepisode is going to release.
The book should be out andavailable on Amazon.
Tell us what.
I guess they go to Amazon.
We're going to link it in theshow notes, but how else can
people get in touch with you?
(27:20):
What else?
How else can we contact you andget some more guidance and help
on this?
Speaker 2 (27:25):
Absolutely so.
If you just go to the websitelevelupyourfinancescom, you can
buy now through there and it'lltake you right to the Amazon
link.
Boom, there you go.
There's also free resources.
We just need first name email.
We have a budget builder.
We have the financial freedompyramid checklist and money
confidence quiz how confidentare you in your money game?
(27:45):
Seven quick questions, itdoesn't take that long and
you'll get a score going.
How do I rank?
And they will walk you through.
What level of accountabilityshould you consider based on
your score?
It's really simple.
I mean you can answer it rightaway.
You get email results rightaway, all free.
Go to levelupyourfinancescom toboth get your resources and buy
the book.
Speaker 1 (28:04):
Wow, I can't recommend it enough.
I've already pre-ordered mine.
I'm ordering some for my wholeteam here and I guarantee
there's going to be pieces of itthat we pull that we're going
to start doing it the Justin waywith our client.
Just to recommend it.
I love some of the.
I've already took copious noteson ways I think we can probably
incorporate some of the thingsyou taught.
So thank you for sharing yourknowledge.
Everyone go out and buy thebook.
(28:25):
I highly recommend it, Probablythe best investment you can
make in yourself this year.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Awesome, craig.
Thanks so much for having andagain, just love seeing the
growth in what you're doing andthanks for letting me be on here
.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
Thanks for joining us on the Therapy Business Podcast
.
Be sure to subscribe, leave areview and share it with a
practice owner that you may know.
If your practice needs helpgetting organized with its
finances or just growing yourpractice, head to
therapybusinesspodcom to learnhow we can help.
My name is Craig and I'm the owner of Daisy Financial
Coaching.
Our team is on a mission tomake your therapy practice
permanently profitable.
If you own a solo or grouppractice, we're here to help you
build a business that createsmore time, makes more money and
serves more people.
This is the Therapy BusinessPodcast.
All right, justin, one of mygood friends is here.
(00:27):
Justin, how are you doing?
Doing great man.
How are you, craig?
I'm good.
I'm good.
We've been connected.
So, justin, you're your coach,a financial coach.
We've been connected for solong.
We meet once a month just totalk business and to pick each
other's brains.
So, as you've been writing thisbook, it's been kind of cool on
the back end to just watch, andI mean, honestly, it scares me
(00:49):
from wanting to write a bookbecause all the work that you've
had to put into it over theyears, what led you to decide,
hey, I'm going to jump out andwrite a book.
What sparked the whole thing?
Speaker 2 (01:00):
No, absolutely.
It's interesting.
As a kid, reading was not on mylist of fun, unless it was a
sports magazine or a video gamemagazine.
I really had zero interest inever reading.
And then in college I grew aninterest in reading and the more
I read books, the more I saidit'd be kind of cool to write a
book someday.
So it's on the proverbialbucket list and, long story
(01:20):
short, I just always said Iwanted to write a book and three
years ago it's like you knowwhat, it's time, it's time to
write it.
I felt like God was pointing mein that direction to write a
book and literally it was 35months ago to the day.
We announced it from the firstwords to actually saying hey, we
got a book, we want people tocheck out.
(01:41):
We think it will be lifetransformational for you.
Yeah, it was about a three-yearprocess.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Man, which is crazy because it's felt long, but also
, again, just being on the backside of it, it doesn't feel like
it's been that long, but maybejust yeah, I haven't had to go
through the trudgery, the pit,the work and the rewrites and
all that stuff, which anotherconversation for another day is
learning, all that is involvedin writing a book.
In fact, we may have to bringyou back to talk about that,
(02:08):
because I'm sure there's somepeople listening who maybe
that's on their bucket list aswell.
But tell me about you and yourbusiness.
I know you, but listeners, tellus about you and what you do
and who you are.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
No, absolutely Craig.
So I've been a full-timefinancial coach for over 15
years and my heart and mypassion is always helping
hurting people.
I just happen to know a thingor two about money, where my
wife and I as you'll find in thebook we talk about we and here
I am my banking career is doingawesome, but our finances at
(02:52):
home are not doing awesome, andI woke up one day I'll never
forget getting a yellow pad outgoing.
Something just doesn't feelright about my finances and I
wrote it all down and found outoh, my goodness, we're almost
$700 short a month.
That's not counting Christmasvacations, car repairs, car tags
, all the other stuff you knowthat we talk about with sinking
funds and the non-monthlyaccounts and uh, etc.
(03:13):
Etc.
And so, um, bottom line is I'mgoing to stop right.
There are you hearing that textbeing?
I thought I turned off all mynotifications and it is no, it'm
not sorry about that.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
Yeah, it's not picking up on here um let me um.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
I don't know why I actually silenced this while
this is going off sorry aboutthat.
Uh, you're gonna hate that Ithought that was coming in like
a lot and I'm like, oh great, sodo I redo the question again
and hopefully that won't Um yeah, we can um.
I don't, we don't do that, butthat's all right, we'll pick up.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
Uh, I made a timestamp so I know to go back,
we can.
I can ask you again who you are.
Um, if it's easier for you andwe can just rehash where you
started, that's fine.
Or we can plug in wherever youfeel.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yeah, I think we could plug in right after the
$700 short a month and then Ican pick up from there.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Great, all right, I'll let you just launch it and
we'll go.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
So we found that we were $700 short a month.
And again, that's not includingthings like car registrations,
christmas school supplies,vacations right, it's just bills
.
And we're $700 for the month.
And I'm like, oh wow, how is aguy like me with a business
degree at that time about sevenyears of banking experience?
How are we here?
(04:38):
And so I kind of went on aquest to go how does money work?
Because what I'm doing is notworking.
And so my wife and I began tofind what works and by a lot of
hard work and God's grace, wepaid off that $100,000 in debt.
And, like I said, I've been acoach now for 15 years.
Part of the time we were stillgetting out of debt as a coach,
and then we got out of debt andnow we're out of debt on that.
(05:02):
And my heart and passion is somany people want help with their
finances but they don't knowwhere to turn to and what.
I'm convinced of, craig, andyou probably are too, because
you're a coach and youunderstand this I am convinced
everyone needs a coach, and thereason why is no one is
disciplined in every area oflife.
Every one of us is disciplinedin one or two areas, but most of
(05:24):
us aren't disciplined in moneyand what I've discovered you can
go to a podcast, which is great, or a book, like I have or
other people have in classes.
But oftentimes having thataccountability someone walking
alongside you, helping you wherethings don't make sense,
cheering you on when you'redoing a good job, pick you back
up when you've made a mistakeand I've just really learned
(05:46):
that with accountability andcoaching it can help take people
who never thought it waspossible to get out of debt and
gain what we call financialfreedom and do that.
And that's just my passion ishelping people who feel like
they failed to go from failureto freedom.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Yeah, that's fantastic and you're right, and
I think even the audience hereis therapists, so they
completely agree with that.
Everybody needs somebodymentality in that you know
there's there's so many barrierseven internally that can
prevent us.
I had a one of my coaches causewe all need coaches who helped
me realize that money, managingmoney is, is a skill.
(06:22):
It's a skill that we are notborn with, that's not innate to
us.
No one is just suddenly bornknowing how to invest in their
retirement and manage theirmoney well and pay off debt.
So it's a skill that needshoning and crafting and we all
need that support and somebodyjust needs to teach us those
skills.
And that's what you've beendoing, and it's incredible to
see just the lives you'vechanged.
(06:43):
I know I think I saw your booksays over $10 million in debt
paid off.
Is that right?
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Yeah, and that's just during the sessions when
they're my client Often clientsafter a period of time they kind
of go on their own.
And what's been so neat?
As we've announced the launchof our book, I have had a
multitude of past clients frommany years email me, message me,
going.
Hey, I haven't told you, butwe're actually debt free now.
(07:08):
I've had some clients go.
We've even paid off the house.
I'm like whoa, and so it's justbeen neat.
I mean I hear that all the time, but because of the book launch
, we've actually heard even morestories of people that I
haven't heard from in a while.
So it's just a lot of funhearing people.
You know years later how thismessage has still impacted them.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, that's awesome.
That's awesome.
So your book Level Up yourFinances.
I'm a huge believer thateveryone needs to find their own
money journey, and so I thinkit's.
I love hearing differentperspectives on personal
finances.
You know there's so many gurus,people who've written books,
who have YouTube channels, whohave podcasts, and so I'm all
(07:49):
about let's find whatmethodology works for each
individual.
So tell me about level up yourfinances.
What is what's in that book?
What is your approach?
What is it going to teachpeople?
Maybe they haven't heardelsewhere, or maybe reinforcing
things they've heard before too?
Yeah, talk to me about what'swhat.
What will people find if they,when they pick up their copy of
the book?
Speaker 2 (08:03):
I think that's a great question because you
already know this A lot of whatI do is right akin to Dave
Ramsey.
My running joke is the onlydifference between Dave and I is
I've got more hair and he's gotmore money.
And so I'm like how do I writea book that's not Dave Ramsey
2.0?
And I don't need to be the nextfinancial expert.
We've got enough of those outthere.
So what can be different thatother financial books either
(08:26):
don't touch a lot on or don'ttouch at all on?
So the first part of the bookgoes through your how-tos,
because we still got to know thehow-tos how do we budget right,
how do we save, how do we getout of debt.
But the other half of the bookfocuses a lot on how do we stay
committed when the going getstough, and if and when we need
accountability.
What does that look like?
(08:47):
And accountability is one ofthose words.
It's kind of like going to thedentist, and if there are any
dentists listening I'm notpicking on you guys, but most
people when they hear dentist,they go.
Well, same could be true withaccountability.
It's like I know I could use it, but I don't know right.
(09:08):
And so we really try to take theshame or the guilt away of
getting accountability, becausethere are stories throughout the
entire book on every incomelevel single, married, widowed,
divorced, parents of kids, largeincomes, small incomes, average
incomes of just how gettingsome accountability in life can
be all the difference maker.
I mean, for example, dave'spopularized the debt snowball, I
popularized the debt snowball.
(09:28):
I bring up the debt snowballand some of the earlier readers
have got to read it.
Go man, you explained the debtsnowball better than Dave and I
go.
No, I didn't, um, I just saidit a little different or a
different few word choices andit clicked this time.
Um right, uh, and so that's thebook.
Uh, we talk about five levels.
We call it the financialfreedom pyramid.
(09:49):
There are five levels to gofrom not doing well financially
to financial freedom, and thosefive levels are awareness,
knowledge, commitment, momentumand freedom.
So awareness we start there.
That's where we got to getaware and you know, as a coach,
oftentimes people are unaware ofwhat they really make for an
(10:12):
income, what they really spend.
A lot of people that I meetthem they're like I'm not a big
spender, I don't go to big malls, I don't get, I don't have a
Lexus, I don't go on fancyvacations, why am I broke?
Well, once they start trackingtheir expenses and they go oh my
gosh, you and I know this Ididn't know how much I was
spending on eating out or onlinesubscriptions or Amazon fill in
(10:34):
the blank.
So the first level is gettingcrystal clear awareness of where
we're at.
The second level is knowledge,and that's how do we budget, how
do we save, how do we get outof debt?
So that's where we learnedthose basic principles so we
could obtain financial freedom.
But awareness and knowledge isnot enough and, honestly, this
is where a lot of people stop.
(10:57):
Next level is commitment, andit's the fork in the road moment
.
And there's fork in the road ofam I really going to follow
through on what I learned in thecommitment level?
And if you make a yes decisionto that, every paycheck, every
month, you're going to seeresults, which leads you to
momentum, and that's where youget traction.
And that traction you go.
Yes, this is what I was hopingwould happen.
The picture is starting tobecome a reality and if you keep
(11:19):
doing that, that's when youachieve financial freedom.
Problem.
That all sounds great until andthat's what I call the cycle of
regret.
The cycle of regret is we getaware, we get knowledge, but you
know what?
I'm not going to do this orthat or this or that, and we
(11:40):
begin to reject what we learnedin the knowledge level.
And so then we go from gettinghope to now it's just a wish,
and that rejection turns intofrustration and despair, and if
we don't turn the ship aroundnow, we feel like a failure.
Now the shame comes in.
Now we go.
Why bother?
And what ultimately ends uphappening is then we go.
(12:01):
I'm going to work on some otherarea of my life because I've
obviously failed finances again.
And then a month later, yearslater, you know, after paycheck
to paycheck, still there.
Okay, I'm going to try again.
And we keep repeating the cycle.
So how do we break the cyclebetween, and bridge the gap
between, knowledge andcommitment?
Accountability and it's thataccountability that really helps
(12:23):
.
And again, as therapists, theyknow we can really hold people
accountable in a loving, caringway.
It's amazing how far we can gowhen we have accountability 100%
.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
I think you're right, accountability can sometimes
come with that stigma.
But I think therapistsunderstand that too, because
therapy comes with a stigma alot of times and there's a lot
of fear of even jumping intothat pool.
But man, I've seen that so manytimes that we think it's the
knowledge piece.
I mean, how many people have wetalked to who who are like well
, I'm just going to watch thisthing and try it on my own, or
(12:58):
I'm going to listen to thisthing and try it on my own,
which you know, I'm rooting forthem.
But we, we both know thatlong-term change typically
doesn't happen just trying it onour own, and that
accountability piece really is,is key.
So, people listening thosethose five stages, they've got
the knowledge maybe, and nowthey're at that, that commitment
phase, and they're looking foraccountability.
(13:18):
Where do where do they start tofind that?
I mean, is it a friend, is itobviously a coach?
Who were what do you typicallyrecommend?
Or even in the book?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
where do you talk about?
You know, that was the thing inthe book too.
I didn't want to limit it tojust coaching.
I mean, obviously I'm going toselfishly say I like coaching
right, I'm a coach, so it's kindof hard not to say that.
But it can be a friend, apastor, a mentor.
We actually have a wholechapter on what I call the
accountability gap and how do webridge that gap, and we talk
about characteristics to lookfor for accountability, and so
(13:50):
to me it's more about who meetsthese character qualities of a
good accountability partner.
And if you can't find it, goget a coach.
You know another way of sayingit is at some point you have to
say my DIY isn't working, andwhen you have that moment, then
go looking for it.
The example I give for me, Ifeel really good about my
(14:13):
ability, with money, to staytrue to my goals and our budget.
Eating, on another hand, not somuch.
So my wife and I, literallyyears ago, we traded services
with a personal trainer and thefirst thing she had us do you
guessed it, track what we eat.
And you know what was crazy,Craig, I sounded like my clients
(14:35):
Well, I don't overeat that much.
And the first day I tracked it.
I had a bad day at the office,just bad day.
I get home, I'm tired and whatdo I do to soothe myself is I
eat a lot of food before bed.
The next day was a great,fantastic day and I wanted to
(14:56):
end the day on a celebration.
Guess what I did celebrate Morefood and a lot of it.
By like Thursday.
I'm like, oh wow, I'm like myclients again.
I didn't think I was overeatingthat much, but as I started,
tracking and awareness came inand just blew my mind.
(15:18):
But I wasn't going to do thatwithout being nudged by my
trainer.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
Yes, yes, I'm the same way.
And, uh, I took me 37 years tostart exercising and I got stuck
in that cycle of regret, whichI love that because it just
articulates so well the thefeeling I had where I would get
on these kicks where I'd starttrying to eat better and work
out, and it would last for maybea month, and then all of them
(15:45):
like, well, I don't have abs, sothis stinks, and I'd give up.
And it wasn't until I finallywas like I need the
accountability pieces.
I should have known I'm a coach, I should have known I need
somebody to hold me accountable.
And I did.
And that's that's where thepivotal change happened, cause,
like you said, it's, it's justforcing you to pay attention and
having someone who's there, notonly because if I'm answering
(16:06):
to someone I'm usually going I'ma good student, so I like to.
I like to do my homework andace the test but also, when
things aren't going right,somebody to troubleshoot it with
me.
I found was was huge.
It's like, hey, I'm not losingweight as fast as I thought I
would.
And it's like, okay, let's lookat it.
Do we need to adjust yourcalorie intake?
Do we need to adjust yourworkout regimen.
(16:27):
What do we need to fix?
That was a game changer,because those were the moments
where I would have quit had Inot had somebody to guide me
through.
What do we do to pivot so thatthis sticks?
Speaker 2 (16:38):
Absolutely.
You know, I heard from a guyyears ago there's two things we
like to do is look good and beright and so, and then when
you're paying for the privilege,you're right, you're going to
take it more seriously.
And you know, I know for a lotof people, whether it's going to
a therapist or going to afinancial coach or a business
coach, there's a lot of oh mygosh, I'm afraid I'm going to
get my hand slapped and like allthe shame and the barrier to
(17:00):
that right.
But then, once it becomesclients, what they don't realize
and this is what I love aboutcoaching, and I'm sure the same
is true of therapists as wellwhen they do fall down because
they can and they will, the waywe approach it, if done right,
can be so life-giving.
So my favorite client storywith this, I'll never forget it
I had this couple I was meetingwith and as the session began
(17:22):
they go.
You're not going to be veryhappy with this.
I'm like, okay, and Craig,you've been there, you know what
it is.
They got a couple extra thingson Amazon.
(17:43):
They swiped a credit card whenthey shouldn't for a car.
It wasn't like they went toVegas, right, it was just a
little overspending and they gowhat, I'm glad you did that?
And they're like what, oh, yeah, I'm glad you did that.
You're kidding I go.
Well, let me ask you how does itfeel after that decision?
Oh, it's horrible, awesome.
Um, are you gonna do it again?
(18:04):
Well, no, okay, what do youneed for me?
You're not gonna yell at me, Ican.
If you charge extra.
Uh, I might.
Um, I go now.
In three months, if we're doingthe same thing over and over
again, the conversational tonemay change.
I go, but if you learned yourlesson well, wife, the best
teacher here.
Okay, at the end of thatsession, craig, I'll never
(18:28):
forget the wife going.
Can I be honest, I go.
What's that?
I was so many times tempted tosay we're not coming today,
we're just done.
I was so ashamed of what we did.
I feel so much better how youframed this.
And show me how to turn thisinto a win.
I cannot wait for the nextsession.
By the way, can I bring my kidsso you can personally teach
(18:50):
them?
Wow, again, the fear of theirmistake almost held them back
from meeting, but they steppedthrough.
They took the courage to stepthrough and then, as a coach,
like your therapists do?
We walked them through.
Yeah, that wasn't good, buthere's how we can reposition
that and rethink that.
And it made all the differencein the world for them to keep
(19:13):
going, where that would havebeen a place.
They would have said I'm out,I'm done.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Wow, and I've, man.
That story really doeshighlight something that's just
kind of I think I've been awareof, but it's come into mind
feeling like a revelation here.
But it's that it takes time, noone.
I think the idea is oh great,here's my plan, I'm going to
figure out this plan, I'm goingto implement it and boom, I'm
good with money, we're going topay off debt and there's going
(19:38):
to be no problems.
And it's a learning process.
I mean, I think of learning thebass guitar and how many sour
notes I hit and how much likehow, how hard it was and all
these humps I had to get through.
And I'm still learning, I'mstill growing and I've been
playing it for 25 years.
So I think that's so huge thatit's not.
It's not a failure.
(19:58):
When you have those bad months,how you react to it, how you
recover from it is when you getinto that psych, that the
negative cycle.
Are you going to push throughagain, the accountability to
help you push through.
But even on your own, are yougoing to push through?
Are we going to throw our handsup in defeat and fall back into
that cycle?
So, giving ourselves grace,it's we're learning, we're
learning how it goes, and that'sa win.
(20:18):
When we fail, it's a win,because it's it's we're priming
the pump to be successful.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
Absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
Yeah, that that's fantastic.
So I want to go back tomomentum in your pyramid, the
five keys.
So momentum, that is such awall, and all of a sudden I'm
back to phase one again.
And so do you talk about thatin the book with momentum, of
(20:56):
how to maintain it, or what'syour advice on that, or what do
you even speak to in it?
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Yeah, we talk about what I call overcoming the four
thieves of momentum, and there'sfour thieves that will slow you
down, and slow is an acrostic Sis for situational principles,
l stands for life circumstances,o for out of gas and W weak
results.
So in the book we talk abouthow to overcome each one of
(21:21):
those.
So I'll give the situationalprinciple ones, for instance and
I got that from a term that'sused a lot situational ethics.
And that's where I got the ideaof situational principles,
because I've seen as a coach,where people get started, like
you said, they're on fire, theydo really good and then they
fall off the wagon and thenthey'll blame a personality like
Dave Ramsey or myself, or inthe exercise world we always
(21:44):
hear it as well.
This is not sustainable.
So what I have is I got aclient who's in the story or in
the book and I've got permissionto use a story.
This couple had over $100,000 indebt First six months.
They are crushing it, sellingstuff, working extra.
They're doing all the stuff weasked to do and they are paying
off debt like it is on fire.
They are doing it great.
(22:05):
I'm preparing for the daysession.
I pull up their budget form.
To my horror, I see two new carloans and the credit card went
up and I went huh, interesting.
So we get into the session andthe husband and I are a similar
personality and we gel reallywell together and he's like well
, did you look at the budget?
I go yep.
Well, that whole plan is justunsustainable.
(22:28):
I go stop.
What the problem is is not theplan.
There is a principle mismatch.
Your principles aren't liningwith these principles and you're
trying to use this process forprinciples that don't agree.
So I gave him a homeworkassignment Go on a date, make
sure it's in the budget anddetermine what are your
(22:50):
principles that, when it comesto your personal finances, you
are going to stick with.
Upon knowing your principles,now get a process and a plan
that follows through theprinciples, because same thing
with diets.
This is where I saw this andI'm no different because, again,
it's something I've always hadto work on is I see people they
(23:12):
find this diet and they get alljacked up and excited about the
first two weeks.
They get all the results thatthey were hoping for, but they
lose the momentum and theyalways come back to not
sustainable and I'm almostconvinced every diet I think
works.
Yeah, but we got to stick withit through the hard parts.
(23:32):
And the one way you can stickthrough it with the hard part,
two things to stick with it.
One, obviously, accountability,but two, getting your
principles to be your principles, not theirs.
And these are my things.
So, for instance, when Ifollowed Dave Ramsey for the
first time, I was a banker I wasgiving people debt.
When I said debt is no more, itis off the table, that is how I
(23:57):
got out of debt.
One of the things was to saydebt can no longer be a
possibility.
To do this, and it worked, andso getting those principles
assigned again is one of theways to keep the momentum going
and not lose.
It is by not having a situationof principles, instead getting
your principles solid, and then,once we know what the
principles are, let's find aprocess and a plan that lines up
(24:20):
with those principles.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
I think personal finance is personal and I think
you know there's I love that youtouch on that piece of what is.
What is our principles?
You know I can tell somebody,you could tell somebody, getting
a car loan is a is just not afinancially wise decision.
But what do they believe?
We can say?
Here's how the fastest way toget out of debt is don't spend a
single dime on anything ever Uh, what Dave says beans and rice.
Don't do any of that, you'regoing to get out of debt fast.
(24:51):
But what are their principles?
Is that aligned with theirvalues?
Is that aligned with who theyare, their personality?
Do they need to strike adifferent balance?
It's giving them autonomy andownership of their own money
journey.
They're not doing Justin'smoney journey, they're doing
their money journey.
And I think that is completelywhere momentum can get lost in a
(25:13):
lot of when people are doing iton their own or don't have
something like your book toguide them through that piece of
.
What does it look like for me?
And if my principle is toborrow money on cars, then I
guess that's my principle andwe'll go through and we'll help
them figure out how what thatlooks like.
But there may not be the best.
We might try and discourage it,but I think that's key.
Speaker 2 (25:34):
Well and you said a good word there ownership, when
they take ownership.
So in chapter two of the bookwe talk a lot about goal setting
and again, goal setting.
That's been something writtenabout.
There's lots of ways to dogoals, but that's one of the
things we talk about.
It has to be your goals, not mygoals.
I can guise you to what somegood goals are, I can draw out
of you why those goals should beimportant for your specific
(25:57):
situation.
But until you take 100%ownership and these are my goals
, these are my principles untilyou do that, it's easy to be
wishy-washy or again have to doit from a principle.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
Yeah, and I like that so much and I think hearing
that hopefully people hear thisand it gives them, allows them
to sigh and, just you know,release some of the pressure of
I have to do it this way.
I have to do the debt snowball.
We've we've come across peoplewho are wanting to pay off debt
and they've been trying to dothis debt snowball.
But maybe they have, like thismedical debt that's further down
(26:31):
on that.
You know, we had a client onetime who they lost a child and
they had this medical debt tiedto it and it was just so
emotionally draining that wepopped it to the top and we're
like let's pay that off firstbecause it's into you.
It is a priority to get thisthing out of your life.
But they were so stuck on.
Well, this is how we have to doit, this is the way we've been
(26:53):
told.
Autonomy, ownership, I think,is so key.
So I'm really glad to hear thatyou hit on that Cool.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
Very cool yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
Awesome.
I could pick your brain forever, uh, as you know, um, but I
want to drive people to purchaseyour book.
So, as of the release of thisepisode, we're talking, it's
releasing next week, but thisepisode is going to release.
The book should be out andavailable on Amazon.
Tell us what.
I guess they go to Amazon.
We're going to link it in theshow notes, but how else can
people get in touch with you?
(27:20):
What else?
How else can we contact you andget some more guidance and help
on this?
Speaker 2 (27:25):
Absolutely so.
If you just go to the websitelevelupyourfinancescom, you can
buy now through there and it'lltake you right to the Amazon
link.
Boom, there you go.
There's also free resources.
We just need first name email.
We have a budget builder.
We have the financial freedompyramid checklist and money
confidence quiz how confidentare you in your money game?
(27:45):
Seven quick questions, itdoesn't take that long and
you'll get a score going.
How do I rank?
And they will walk you through.
What level of accountabilityshould you consider based on
your score?
It's really simple.
I mean you can answer it rightaway.
You get email results rightaway, all free.
Go to levelupyourfinancescom toboth get your resources and buy
the book.
Speaker 1 (28:04):
Wow, I can't recommend it enough.
I've already pre-ordered mine.
I'm ordering some for my wholeteam here and I guarantee
there's going to be pieces of itthat we pull that we're going
to start doing it the Justin waywith our client.
Just to recommend it.
I love some of the.
I've already took copious noteson ways I think we can probably
incorporate some of the thingsyou taught.
So thank you for sharing yourknowledge.
Everyone go out and buy thebook.
(28:25):
I highly recommend it, Probablythe best investment you can
make in yourself this year.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Awesome, craig.
Thanks so much for having andagain, just love seeing the
growth in what you're doing andthanks for letting me be on here
.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
Thanks for joining us on the Therapy Business Podcast
.
Be sure to subscribe, leave areview and share it with a
practice owner that you may know.
If your practice needs helpgetting organized with its
finances or just growing yourpractice, head to
therapybusinesspodcom to learnhow we can help.
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