Overview: Intuitive eating coach and journalist Pam Moore joins Coach Adam Pulford to discuss the ins and outs of "Intuitive Eating", what it really means (hint: it's not just eat whatever you want whenever you want), why it might be important for your lifestyle and eating habits, and how to incorporate it into your nutrition program.
Topics Covered In This Episode:
- What is Inutitive Eating?
- Examples of cues or prompts that fit into intuitive eating
- Why we lack awareness of how we're actually eating
- Is there a place for tracking calories/macros in intuitive eating?
- Going from "the least you can get away with" to "the most I can tolerate" during exercise.
Guest:
Pam Moore started out as an Occupational Therapist before committing to her passion for writing and becoming a journalist. A regular contributor to The Washington Post, her work has also appeared in Time, The Guardian, and Runner’s World, Bicycling Magazine, and for well-known brands like Peloton. She earned a certification as an Intuitive Eating Counselor, and says, "As an occupational therapist and a journalist, I bring my intuitive eating coaching clients a deep understanding of human motivation, what it takes to make sustainable behavior change, and most importantly, how to ask the right questions and listen deeply to the answers."
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Host
Adam Pulford has been a CTS Coach for more than 14 years and holds a B.S. in Exercise Physiology. He's participated in and coached hundreds of athletes for endurance events all around the world.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
From the team at CTS.
This is the Time Crunch Cyclistpodcast, our show dedicated to
answering your trainingquestions and providing
actionable advice to help youimprove your performance, even
if you're strapped for time.
I'm your host, coach AdamPulford, and I'm one of the over
50 professional coaches whomake up the team at CTS.
In each episode, I draw on ourteam's collective knowledge,
(00:30):
other coaches and experts in thefield to provide you with the
practical ways to get the mostout of your training and
ultimately become the bestcyclist that you can be.
Now on to our show.
Now onto our show.
Welcome back, or welcome to theTime Crunch Cyclist Podcast.
(00:54):
I'm your host, coach AdamPulford.
Today we'll have a change ofpace.
We're moving away from thesuper detailed training advice
to focusing on aspects ofgeneral nutrition.
Why?
Because food is fuel for yourtraining and it's the building
blocks of recovery betweentraining sessions, beyond the
athlete's scope of just fuelinghealthy habits, and food keeps
(01:15):
us on track, not only for ourgoals in sport, but for our
happiness beyond athletics too.
Now, I'm not a fan or a hugesubscriber to any one diet or
method of eating, other thanequipping yourself with
knowledge about food and whatworks for you as an individual.
Education, awareness, trial anderror are all part of that
(01:36):
process.
I'm here today with Pam Mooreto talk more about this and help
us to look at it from perhaps adifferent angle than what
you've looked at it as anathlete and as a listener here
on the Time Crunch CyclistPodcast.
Pam's an occupational therapistby trade.
She's a former columnist at theWashington Post.
She's an endurance athlete anda podcast host herself.
(01:59):
So, pam, welcome to the show.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Hi Adam, Thanks for having me so good to be here.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Yeah, absolutely.
I'm glad this has finally cometo fruition.
You and I have worked togetherin writing some articles for
Bicycling Magazine and a fewother things, and I always enjoy
our interviews andcollaborations together.
Same Well, thanks, well, thanksFor our audience, who doesn't
(02:26):
know you like I know you.
Could you tell us a bit moreabout yourself, about your
podcast and your story of howyou came to be a thing in the
health, wellness and enduranceathlete space?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Thank you.
Wow, I'm a thing, apparently.
That's exciting.
Let's see.
On top of all the things yousaid about me in my intro, I'm
also a certified intuitiveeating counselor and, in a
nutshell, let's see, I was notathletic as a kid.
I was like picked last forevery team discovered running by
(02:59):
way of lacrosse, got intolacrosse, I think, because of
peer pressure, I don't reallyeven know.
It was a total disaster, but Irealized I liked running, I
could do it, it was simple.
So that turned into marathoning, turned into triathlons, became
a cyclist along the way andreally kind of just gradually
developed an identity as anendurance athlete through doing
endurance events, graduallytaking on more, eventually doing
(03:23):
Ironmans, and that's actually alot of what led me to Boulder.
I'm from the East Coast.
I moved to Boulder, colorado,in 2008, largely because it's an
endurance mecca, because I wasreally into like Ironmans at the
time, left my career as anoccupational therapist after
having my second child, who'snow 10 and a half.
(03:45):
For a lot of reasons, butmainly because I wanted to
explore a career as a writer,which led me to freelance health
and fitness journalism.
Because I wanted to write aboutwhat I was passionate about and
what that is is telling peopleabout healthy lifestyles.
Both, you know I've coveredfitness, as you mentioned
(04:07):
bicycling, that's how we get toknow each other covered mental
health.
I've covered nutrition topicsand my own struggles with body
image and food led me to theintuitive eating certification,
because I discovered intuitiveeating about six years ago when
(04:27):
I just you know, all my life Iwas committed to, I think, what
I would have called healthylifestyles and air quotes, which
were really just diets.
But you know it's not sexy tosay that you're on a diet or you
want to lose weight, right.
But I thought athletes look acertain way.
I don't think I look that way.
(04:53):
So my goal for the longest timewas to eat as little as I
thought I could get away with todo the sports that I was
wanting to do and couldn'tfigure out why I was often not
recovering well, fading at theend of a ride, just attributed
it to like, oh I'm just not asfit as my training buddies, I
need to work harder, and morethan once kind of dug myself
into an overtraining hole, notrealizing it.
(05:15):
It went until you know, lots ofhindsight later, yeah, exactly,
and long story short, I thinkthe pinnacle, what's the
opposite of a pinnacle, thelowest point I was going to say.
But so many of my habits weredisordered and I didn't
recognize them as such becausemost of them are normalized
culturally and, I think,especially within the athlete
(05:51):
community.
You know things like low carbeating quote unquote, clean,
avoiding sugar, intermittentfasting, skipping breakfast all
of these things that areactually really detrimental to
our performance and our mentalhealth and our relationship with
food and our bodies are sonormalized that I just thought
I'm doing it wrong, I'm notdoing it hard enough because I'd
(06:13):
be adhering to all these randomrules and then falling off the
wagon, so to speak, at somepoint, and just eating myself
into an oblivion and feelinglike garbage and then starting
over, which I think is probablypretty relatable to a lot of
people.
And yeah, ultimately got intoCrossFit, got into macro
counting from there and finallyjust got this like epiphany.
(06:34):
The macro counting had got tothe point where, like it was a
part-time job, I was with aspreadsheet at six in the
morning trying to figure out ifI could have Dairy Queen with my
kids on the last day of schoolas a celebration, and like what
I would have to eat in order toaccommodate a stupid vanilla ice
cream cone.
Right, and finally it just likehit me.
I was like damn, I'm almost 40.
At that point I was um.
(06:54):
Why am I relying on an app totell me what to eat?
This is, can I say?
Can we swear on this podcast?
Speaker 1 (07:01):
I was like this is bullshit.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
I know what I should eat, I'm just not listening to
myself.
And then I sort of dove intolike reading and researching and
learning more about what isintuitive eating and just by
following the principles.
There's 10 principles and Ithink a common myth is that
intuitive eating is eatingwhatever the hell you want,
whenever you want.
It's not that simple, but it iskind of a philosophical
(07:29):
framework for having a healthyrelationship with food that is
not predicated on weight lossand it just really changed my
life.
It changed my relationship withfood, changed the way I train
and I've been so much happierand so I was like I just want
more people to know about this.
I'm going to get thecertification and coach clients
so that I can help other peopleexperience what I've experienced
(07:51):
.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah, I mean I'll be the first to admit that there is
a lot of confusion in thenutrition space as well as the
training space, and part of mygoal and objective with this
podcast, as well as what I do asa coach, is to clean some of
that up, make it simple and givethat actionable advice to
people that are confused andpeople like you and I that have
(08:15):
struggled our whole life tryingto figure it out Right.
And I think when one of ourcollabs at bicycling we just had
a side conversation aboutintuitive eating and I thought I
was like man, it just soundslike a lot of the advice that I
give to my own athletes, becausesome of it is common sense,
what I perceive as common sense,but, like you said, it's a
framework, and I think thatthose frameworks and frameworks
(08:38):
that I've shared on this podcastbefore help people to start to
think differently aboutsomething and then have some
guiding principles to it.
So let's start with the basics.
I know you're passionate aboutintuitive eating, so, please,
what is it and why should wecare about it?
Speaker 2 (08:54):
What is it and why should we care about it?
It is essentially taking backyour agency about what you eat.
It's accepting that you, andnot some guru or plant or app or
diet or lifestyle they don'tknow more about you than you.
You get to decide what's goingto be most nourishing to you in
(09:16):
a way that also honors yourhunger, your fullness, your
energy needs and we can divemore into that, because
sometimes your hunger is not anaccurate indicator of what your
energy needs often are.
I think we've all had theexperience of coming back from a
long training day and you justdon't have an appetite.
So we can circle back to that.
(09:38):
We'll put a bit in that, butaccording to your culture, your
taste preferences and finding away of eating that adheres to
all of that.
And while, yes, food is fuel,let's accept that food is also
social.
It's okay to have cake atsomeone's birthday, even if cake
is quote unquote empty calories.
(09:59):
I don't really like that term.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Yeah, same Pam, but I do want to toot my own horn
here for just a second.
I had a podcast with ReneeEastman, a CTS coach.
We were talking about someholiday stuff and we're like,
yeah, like chill out on theholidays and go ahead.
And Renee was like go ahead andhave pie for breakfast once in
a while and I've had so manycomments from people like dude,
(10:22):
I had pie for breakfast and itwas awesome.
And it's like yeah, for sure,like, maybe not all the time,
but like once in a while forsure.
Because, yeah, there's no,anyway we'll get into it.
There's no bad food there'sthere.
There, there can be.
Um, there's no bad food.
There are habits that you canchange, right, and this is part
of what intuitive eating is moreabout.
(10:44):
So sorry, I digressed you onyour whole framework here.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
No, that's great.
Actually, I'm glad you broughtup the pie for breakfast,
because I think one of thebiggest misconceptions I hear
about intuitive eating is, if Iate intuitively, I would
intuitively eat a box of Oreos.
I would eat a Costco sizeserving of filling your favorite
quote unquote forbidden foodhere.
And the thing that I think isso hard to grasp and which was
(11:08):
hard for me to grasp for thelongest time, like there were
many, many foods that I justwouldn't keep in my house
because I was like I will eat itall at once and I don't want to
do that.
The truth is, the more yourestrict, the more you're
craving the food, Just like ifyou've ever been around a child
or, or I don't know, been achild.
We've all been a child andsometimes I act like a child.
So I.
(11:29):
I think we all do this.
You tell a kid not to dosomething.
What do they want to do?
They want to do the thing.
That's all they want to do,it's all they can think about.
So the minute you tell yourselfdessert is off limits, you might
just find that you're obsessedwith dessert.
You might also find that youare quote unquote emotionally
eating dessert every night.
Why am I doing this?
Oh, this is emotional.
(11:50):
Emotional eating is bad.
Maybe you're eating ice cream atnight because, number one,
you're obsessed, because you'vetold yourself you can't have it.
And maybe, number two, you'vebeen eating food all day that
wasn't actually satisfying.
You were eating what youthought you should eat, which
was maybe an omelet but no toast, maybe a salad with like five
crackers and maybe, before yourbig training ride, like a banana
(12:10):
.
That's not enough.
And then, after dinner, your,your body is smart, it knows
that there is a deficit and itis compensating.
And maybe it's compensatingwith ice cream.
And now you've, no pun intended, you've fed yourself this
narrative of like I'm out ofcontrol around food, I'm out of
control around ice cream, can'thave it in my house.
Well, try giving yourself fullpermission to eat all the ice
(12:35):
cream.
And this is hard.
This is easier said than donebecause we've been conditioned
in so many ways to think thatthese foods are bad and that
it's unacceptable to gain weight, because gaining weight means
all of these moral failures,which are just that's culture.
That's not true.
Right, like when you were atoddler, you didn't have
thoughts about your chubbythighs, that was just your body,
(12:56):
right?
We've been conditioned tobelieve that chubby thighs are a
sign of something terrible.
When you can get in touch withyour body's signals and you can
say all right, I'm just going tolet myself eat ice cream Now,
if you've been restricting for along time, you may find that
you're overdoing it on all ofthese foods that you've
restricted for a while, but thenit's like a seesaw.
It should equalize.
(13:17):
You know, in the absence ofmajor trauma, which can often
disconnect people from theirbodies, in the absence of
medications that can be messingwith your appetite, you should
find an equilibrium and you willfind.
You will reconnect with yourability to identify what
actually feels good to your body.
(13:38):
And I think for most people,especially athletes, we don't
feel good when we eat pie forbreakfast every day.
We're going to stop doing thatafter a while when the novelty
wears off.
And I can't, I could.
We could be on a whole hourlong podcast where I'm listing
to you, adam, all the foods thatI thought I couldn't have in
the house, that, like Iabsolutely can, I just had to
neutralize them by eating themover and over.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Yeah, yeah.
And two things.
One it's like feeling good,right Feelings.
Let's put that maybe aside fora second.
Everybody wants to feel good,but the feel good is long-term,
it's not the short term, it'snot the pleasure, it's more
about the joy, right?
That's the feeling that we'retalking about here.
So it's like number one.
Number two is when we had thisconversation, I thought, or I
(14:24):
just observed some of the advicethat I was giving to my
athletes, so I'll read a coupleof those that kind of fit into
what I think intuitive eating is, and you can tell me if I'm
right or wrong.
So the first one is I told oneof my athletes I go, don't view
foods as good or bad, just viewthem as what works for you and
(14:45):
what doesn't, what your bodyneeds and what it doesn't need.
So would that fit intointuitive eating?
Speaker 2 (14:52):
A hundred percent.
Actually, a great example ofthat is like a friend of mine
was eating a lot of energy barsthat were nut based on long
rides, and I think, from like awellness perspective, one might
think, well, that is, quoteunquote better than like a
sugary gel, right, because we've, that's a simple sugar.
Simple sugars are like theworst thing, right.
But then she's telling me Ifeel like I don't have energy, I
(15:13):
get stomach aches, I getbloated, what do you think could
be going on?
And I'm like I don't know.
If I were you, I wouldexperiment with eating more
simple carbs and less nuts andsee what happens.
And she came back and was likeI tried that a few times, it
totally worked.
And so there's the right foodfor the right time.
I think those nut bars, thoseare great for, like when you're
(15:35):
in the car for three hours andyou need a snack.
I wouldn't do that during aride, you know.
So it's just yeah, no morality.
And just how do you feel?
How does this food make youfeel?
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Yeah, and to that point, you know, in my opening
lines here you know I said a lotof this is trial and error and
a lot of it is awareness.
So when you make an error youdon't feel good or you don't
perform well.
Why is that?
Well, when you're cycling orrunning at a higher rate than
you know, sitting there or zoneone, the protein and fat will
(16:07):
slow digestion.
Simple carbohydrates will speedup digestion and therefore
you'll have less GI stress up toa point, assuming that you're
feeling that you're stayinghydrated throughout, and that's
part of the mechanism of whythat is.
But when you tune into oh, mystomach hurts, oh, my stomach
doesn't hurt, and you view thosetwo, that's intuitive eating
You're tuning into what it isAbsolutely, and because it is.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
I mean, any type of intuition is somewhat based on
past experience.
It's not, yes, it's a gutfeeling, but that gut feeling is
usually based on oh, I've beendown that road before, so you're
looking at not just what soundsgood like, what sounds like it
would taste good right now, buthow do I think I'm going to feel
three hours from now, based onwhat has happened before?
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Exactly, Let me read you another one and we'll see if
it fits.
I told one of my athletes I go,let's try to avoid getting
super hungry or empty, becauseyou'll likely eat those calories
back and then some later in theday or maybe even the next day.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
That is.
I love that one that'sunderrated, People don't know.
Yes, a hundred percent agreewith that.
Um, something that I tell myclients a lot is like, say, even
like not in an athletic context, say, you have a meeting from
five to seven.
You normally eat dinner at six,not hungry at 445.
Definitely eat.
Something Like intuitive eatingisn't just responding to hunger
cues, it's taking care offuture you.
(17:28):
It's a form of self-care to go.
I don't want to be overlyhungry when I walk in my house
at 730.
And, to your point, just eatingwhat's quickly available in the
pantry, not even having time tolike reheat your nice meal that
you had planned on or you know,cook it and you will.
You will probablyovercompensate because you've
reached this point of likebiological hunger, like that.
Oh my God, my stomach is eatingitself, feeling you don't want
(17:51):
to get there.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
No, you don't want to get there.
And I think, too, this goes alittle bit in what you were
saying before.
It was like it's not alwayseating when you're hungry, even
though that's a huge part of it.
If you come back from a fivehour ride and you're like, ooh,
I'm not hungry, for all thereasons why you're not hungry,
after you just been like, uh say, out in the heat a 90 degree
ride, you know, here on the Eastcoast, and you're super
(18:13):
dehydrated, and you're like, oh,and you're super dehydrated and
you're like, oh, my God, I justwant to barf.
You should probably put in arecovery shake and hydration to
mitigate that bad feeling in themoment.
For a longer term joyfulfeeling and kind of healthiness,
so that intuition of, oh, Ijust eat when I'm hungry it's
not necessarily the case,especially in the athlete
context where we got to hit thatrecovery window 100% percent.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
I actually was a great example of like totally
ignoring my intuition.
So even as the I guess expert,I mess it up Sometimes.
I did a really hard race thissummer.
It was like a 67 mile gravelrace at high elevation, tons of
terrain I was completelyuncomfortable with, like just a
really hard race and I had not.
My nutrition went poorly.
(18:55):
Again, a dumb thing that I didwas I ate the burrito that they
giving this like breakfastburrito before the race.
I was like I feel like that's abad idea, but I'm going to do
it anyway.
And it was a bad idea.
It threw off my whole nutritionfor the race so I couldn't eat
well during the race, atewhatever they had.
After stopped on the way homefor an ice cream sandwich and
(19:17):
called it dinner.
Such a bad idea.
And before I went to bed Ithought I know I should eat a
real dinner.
I don't have the energy.
I don't want to.
I don't care what happens next.
Well, adam, I was up at threeo'clock in the morning eating,
tried to go back to bed, was upagain at four eating, and it
wasn't a huge deal because, likewhere it was in my season, it
(19:38):
wasn't like I had to recoverquickly for my next race, but
like would have been a lot nicerto recover more quickly.
My legs were trashed for longerthan they should have.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
Exactly, exactly, yeah, don't do that.
And so the third one that I'llread you here and again.
Just observation what I tell myathletes.
Our listeners are getting thepoint here, but there's both the
science and the art of being anathlete, being a human to this.
But this one, I think, will hit.
And I told my athlete there'sno food that's off the table
(20:13):
here.
Kind of like what you said assoon as you restrict, that bad
thing starts happening.
So there's no food that's offthe table here.
Kind of like what you said assoon as you restrict, that bad
thing starts happening.
So there's no food that's offthe table.
Tune into what helps your bodyperform at its best, starting
with science and adjusting forit based on your own needs.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Yeah, I think that's brilliant.
I mean, obviously, let's justmake the caveat If you have an
allergy or a sensitivity, or forreligious reasons or ethical
reasons, of course that's goingto take precedence.
But yeah, a hundred percentwhat you said.
I have nothing to add.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Yeah, okay.
So I mean my observation, the,the, the reading kind of
preparation before this, um,this podcast, intuitive, eating
it.
It's not rocket science, okay,but it's it's awareness, it's a
lot of awareness.
Yeah, and I think that athletes, humans, americans, all of us,
(21:04):
like we, are lacking awareness.
So my question to you is why doyou think that we have this
lack of awareness as a societyand we can view it as the
athletic context or just thehuman context, and what can we
do to turn it around?
What can we do to gainawareness?
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Oh my gosh.
Why do we lack awareness?
So many reasons, depending onwhat family you grew up in.
You might've grown up in afamily that was like you can't
have dessert until you eatwhat's on your plate, or you
can't have seconds on the pastauntil you have at least three
more bites of chicken.
Those things are seen as veryhealthy.
But especially when you'retelling a kid you can't have
(21:52):
dessert until you finish yourplate, you're basically
instructing them to disconnectfrom their body because everyone
wants dessert.
Right?
I used to say, oh, I have asecond stomach for dessert.
I had actually trained myselfto think I had a second dessert
stomach and now, since I'vebecome an intuitive eater, there
are a lot of times that dessertlooks amazing and I'm just like
you know what?
I'm actually full, I don't feellike I need to eat that.
I'll be able to get a gooddessert when I need one in the
(22:15):
future.
I used to never say no todessert and I think also we
again, depending on like whatculture family you grow up in,
we are often told to ignore ourinstincts.
Right?
Like women and girls inparticular, we are really valued
for behaving well and beingquiet and being nice and making
(22:36):
life easier for other people,but anyone I mean, I think, a
lot of us to get along in theworld we have to suppress who we
really are and what ourinstincts are.
And I think it's okay to apoint like obviously there's
cultural norms, there's empathy,there's a lot of reasons why
sometimes you have to avoid yourinstincts and do the right
thing.
But that's tricky.
(22:57):
I think as kids we come intothe world being so embodied and
so attuned, like if you've everwatched a toddler, you can see
how they're feeling with theirwhole body.
You can see if they're sad,bored, happy, excited, joyful.
It's all over them and we learnto disconnect.
So to me, intuitive eating is alot of unlearning.
It's unlearning and I don'tknow about you, but like me,
(23:25):
when I was like 14, I rememberthat was the first time one of
my friends was like you're onlysupposed to eat X amount of fat
grams in a day and from there onout I got that in my head, that
number, and I was like okay, itdoesn't matter how I feel or
what I want, that number is moreimportant than anything else.
And it's weird because asathletes, it can be such an
asset to disconnect from ourbody.
If you can avoid giving intothe pain that you feel in your
(23:46):
legs on a tough climb, thatmakes you a really good athlete.
If you can look at your watchand be like this interval is
over in 90 seconds, I know I cangrind through for 90 more
seconds.
I know I can do that, that'sgreat.
But then you're like okay.
So why can't I intermittentfast?
Why can't I just be like I'mnot going to eat until 11
o'clock?
I know I can do it.
It's different.
(24:06):
It's different.
So why we disconnect?
A lot of reasons.
How can we reconnect?
I think it's different forevery person, but a simple
practice you can do would belike something you could start
doing today is if you'vehistorically been somebody who
eats according to shoulds like Ishould have a salad, that's the
(24:26):
healthy thing.
What if, just for one meal, youactually tuned in and said what
do I feel like eating?
And if that's sort ofoverwhelming, you're like whoa,
there's so many choices, I don'tknow.
Break it down, go.
Hmm.
Would I feel like something hottoday or something cold, or
even something room temperature?
Do I feel like somethingcrunchy or something chewy or
(24:46):
something smooth?
Do I feel like something spicy,something mild.
Break it down by temperature,by texture, by like mouthfeel
how hungry am I Think about.
Try that for one meal.
And when you eat that one meal,try eating it without your
phone, without a magazine or anewspaper.
(25:07):
If anybody reads those anymorenot on their phone, you know,
not in front of the TV or yourdevice Just sit there.
You don't have to like chew in amindful way, you know just try
tasting the food and try slowingdown a little bit so that you
(25:28):
can check in with your hungerand fullness.
Um, that would just be like onesimple way.
I mean there's meditation,there's journaling, there's like
a million different ways, but Ithink what I describe as an
accessible thing that somebodycould do today ways.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
But I think what I describe is an accessible thing
that somebody could do today.
Yeah, no, I fully endorse thatand I need to practice it too.
I think that some days I do itwell, some days I don't.
I cook a lot in the house butwe're busy, like Kristen and I
are just going from phone callto phone call, zoom, meeting,
podcasting, getting our workoutin walking the dog, connecting
with friends whatever we doRight, and you, you know,
(26:04):
breakfast and lunch are usuallypretty sped up.
Dinner we try to slow down and,and I think, eating slow, I
think having a slow meal, Ithink you know practicing
cooking.
That's the other thing.
Like, if you're, if you want toget good at intuitive eating,
if you want to get good at thefood, almost has to become a
hobby.
And if you're an athlete, Iwould challenge someone to find
(26:26):
more time in their day, to spendmore time you know cooking,
preparing and thinking aboutfood, because that, as I said
before, it's it's fuel for yourbody, but it's also building
blocks for your body.
As you said, it's woven intoour culture Like it's a very
it's a thing to connect overwith people.
So it's an important aspect ofour life and I'm only spending
(26:46):
one podcast on over four yearson how food works with your body
versus all the other.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
But I want to challenge you on making food a
hobby.
As an intuitive eater, I don'tknow if you have to do that.
I think if you want to, you can.
But I think that could be abarrier for a lot of people.
Some people just aren'tinterested or really don't have
the time.
And I think that, like you canstill eat healthy and in a way
that is nourishing for sports,even without making it a hobby.
(27:17):
Like, for an example, a tunamelt with some sliced up bell
peppers on the side.
That is a meal that gives yousome carbs, some fat, some
protein, some fiber.
That's a great meal and youdon't have to really know a lot
about cooking to make a tunamelt.
You know in like my single girldays a go-to dinner for me.
Not that I was like an exemplarof healthy eating back then I
(27:38):
really wasn't but like I wouldeat like an omelet with like a
banana, and I was afraid ofbread back then, so maybe I
wouldn't have eaten the bread.
But like today I would say areyou in a hurry and don't like to
cook?
Maybe on Sunday you just diceup a bunch of vegetables in
advance, saute them, add theeggs, add whatever kind of
cheese you like, make some toast.
Boom, that's a meal.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
You need more carbs.
Add a banana, add a piece offruit.
You get a lot of fiber and alot of micronutrients there.
Boom, that's a meal.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
You're right.
I mean, as you said before,some of this is unlearning,
right.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Yeah, and so in that way, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
My advice, I think, is like, if you're so sped up on
life, just like slow down andmake a sandwich, like Pam talked
about, but like slowing down isnot bad.
Speaker 2 (28:24):
I think that slowing down is not bad and slowing down
enough to go.
What do I want?
Like, do I really want this lowfat cheese or fat free cheese
on my sandwich, or do I reallywant the good Munster or the
Brie?
I'm telling you, if you put thegood Munster or the Brie on the
sandwich that you really wantedand you put the good bread that
you wanted good Munster or thebrie on the sandwich that you
really wanted and you put thegood bread that you wanted
instead of that like low carbcardboard stuff you will feel
(28:45):
more satisfied, and not just ina hunger fullness way.
Satisfaction is more than justhow full did you get?
Because I could eat a huge bowlof salad and it could make me
really full.
But will it satisfy me if whatI was really craving was a
grilled cheese?
No, it will not, and that's whenI'm going to find myself
(29:07):
raiding the pantry at 930 atnight when I probably should be
in bed with a book.
So just tuning into what'sgoing to satisfy you, your
eating experiences will just bebetter and you won't find
yourself sort of like doing thatthing that puttering around the
kitchen just looking forsomething but you're not sure
what.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
When you're satisfied all day long.
You don't.
You don't do that.
So last last topic I want toask about because, um and this
could be I think that this is alittle counter intuitive to
intuitive eating Um, but I stilluse it in my practice, and you
mentioned it before trackingcalories and counting macros.
So for, uh, listeners, whatwe're talking about is total cal
you're putting out via exerciseand activity throughout the day
(30:03):
, and for some of my athletes, Iuse this.
I'll tell you why, but I wantto hear your take on that.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
for some people, my take is fun because I would say
it depends, which is probably,you know, everybody wants an
answer, but I would like, if Iwere a cycling coach, I would
start definitely by asking theathlete what's your history?
Do you have a history of aneating disorder or disordered
eating?
Um, and if they say, even ifthey say no, I might dive in a
little more.
I would ask some specificquestions, Cause, like, if you
(30:34):
had asked me 10 years ago, doyou have a history of disordered
eating?
I would have said, oh my gosh,no, I totally did, and that
knowing that I had to, like,turn something into a coach
probably would have beentriggering for me.
So, but I do think there'sworkarounds, right, like, if you
suspect that your client hashad issues and this might bring
up some old stuff that you don'twant to, maybe they can just
(30:55):
text you a photo of what theyate each meal, rather than
asking them to weigh it andmeasure it.
You can get it, you know, I'msure you.
I think that, like, at the endof the day, you have to ask
yourself why am I doing thissport?
Am I a professional?
Speaker 1 (31:11):
I'm thinking 99.9% of your listeners are not
professionals.
Speaker 2 (31:13):
What do you think Correct?
Yep, okay, um, if you're not aprofessional and this is just
for fun, you have to take intoaccount.
Where does my mental health fitinto this?
You have to take into account.
Where does my mental health fitinto this If I am overthinking
birthday parties, graduationparties, vacations, going out to
eat?
What's happening here?
What's my definition of fun?
(31:34):
It's up to you, right?
Everybody gets to decide howmuch, for lack of a better, how
much weight they want to put ontheir diet.
You can just I would never tellsomebody you have to give up
weight loss goals or you have todo this.
You have people can do whateverthey want, whatever feels good.
But if you're finding that likeyou don't want to be giving as
much mental energy to youreating as you are, then it's
(31:55):
good enough.
You can take the good enoughapproach.
Like text your coach a pictureof your food.
They can probably look at yourmeal without knowing all of the
weights and measurements.
They could probably look atyour meal and go.
You know what?
I think you could use a littlemore protein, especially because
you're telling me that you'retired.
Oh, you just took all thesephotos of food and you know,
what I don't see is any potatoesor fruit or bread.
(32:18):
And you're telling me that yourlegs are tired but you're not
sure why.
Maybe you need more carbs.
I don't think you need to tellyour athlete necessarily you
need X calories worth of morecarbs.
But you could say to somebodywhy don't you try adding in a
piece of bread or a half apotato or a banana to every meal
or snack and then see how youfeel?
(32:38):
Now, that said, if the personhas no history of anything with
food, definitely I thinktracking for three days or a
week just to get a baseline of,like, what you're generally
eating and how you're generallyfeeling is great.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
Yeah, well, good, good to hear that that's exactly
how I do it.
I think, too, all cards on thetable, looking back on my
childhood, all the way upthrough college wrestling and
into this sport of cycling.
I went in sixth grade.
I mean, I had a full-on eatingdisorder too, and you get all
(33:12):
the crazies.
I mean I went from 160 down to119 and I grew three or four
inches in that time.
But, as you said, thosecultural norms of just like
suppressing everything,including the pain and the
hunger and everything else, youjust like go for it, right,
because that's what the greatathletes are doing.
Yeah, you have a goal andyou're going to meet it Exactly.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
Whether it's a performance goal or a weight
goal.
It's like that's how we'reconditioned and you get so much
praise for weight loss.
Yeah, it's like that's howwe're conditioned and you get so
much praise for weight loss.
Everybody's like you look great.
What did you do and like,especially for women?
I think men to a great extenttoo, but we're so conditioned to
believe that our weight is our.
I'm sorry.
Our worth is our appearance.
So when you get compliments onyour appearance, you don't want
(33:57):
to give that up.
That's social capital, I mean.
It might sound vain, but Ithink I'm just being real, like
everyone likes to hear that theylook great.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
Yeah, and I think that you know there's some
element to being an athlete.
That's part of that too.
And I think then, when it comesdown to what can I control?
Is you know these numbers right?
When you go to the numbers, yougo to the science.
Is you know these numbers right?
When you go to the numbers, yougo to the science.
And that's why and this is the,this is why I bring it up is
because it's still the numbers,it's still a science.
(34:27):
If you want to lose weight,decrease the amount of calories
that you take in and have ahealthy amount that you're
putting out, and if you'retaking in a little less each day
, you will lose weight over time.
However, I would say that,based on having the experience
that I do, I got a pretty goodradar for, uh, if something is
going to be triggering tosomebody.
(34:48):
So, as I'm talking about food,I'll see if those you know
counting macros is going totrigger anything, and I won't go
there.
But I will use the picturething and I do that for my
juniors a lot too, because thatis, you know, they always got
their phones, so we're doing itand they start to get awareness
just on that and they use thatpicture thing to get an
understanding of their habitsand how things are going.
Yeah, if I know somebody canhandle it.
(35:09):
They're good with numbers.
My fitness pal is one trackerwhere there's some good things
going on there.
That's helpful, I think.
Still, though, when it comes toperformance tracking the amount
of carbohydrate that you'reconsuming in grams on the bike
per hour you should get dialedwith that if you want
performance, right Because-.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Absolutely.
That was such a game changerfor me to go from what's the
least I can get away with towhat's the most I can tolerate.
I am so much happier.
I'm just like I can go forlonger and feel better and
recover better.
That's what I want and Ihaven't found that I have
experienced a big shift in myweight Now had I?
(35:51):
I'm not sure, but here's thething.
Like you said, if you decreasecalories gradually, you should
lose weight.
Generally, right, but to apoint, your body.
We have a set point that ourbody is kind of ready to be at,
based on genetics.
You can't veer too far from itand if you do, it's probably not
sustainable, and it is.
And while you might I thinkthis happens to a lot of
(36:12):
athletes you initially see somegreat performance gains,
especially in a sport likecycling where the power to
weight ratio is huge.
But what people forget about isthe power part of the power to
weight ratio.
If you have lost so much weightto where you're not eating
enough calories to adequatelyrecover and fuel your workouts,
you can't produce the power thatyou need.
(36:33):
Sometimes, like for a lot ofpeople, they find, oh, you know
what, when I gained a littleweight and was closer to my
biological imperative, and I wasactually performing better than
when I was in a deficit becauseI had the resources.
I had the glycogen stores.
That can be hard to accept in aculture that values thinness so
much.
And, of course, let's notignore, I guess, except for
(36:56):
mountain bikers we're wearingspandex.
That's no small thing.
It's like your body is ondisplay.
It's hard.
I hope that nobody comes awayfrom this podcast and thinks, oh
, it's supposed to be easy.
No, it's hard.
We're packing as much as we caninto a short episode, but it's
(37:17):
hard.
So I just want to acknowledgethat.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
Yeah, no acknowledgement received, and I
think listeners should too.
Living the examined life ischallenging, but it's also
rewarding, and I would muchrather live that examined life
and have a high awareness anddeal with the burden of having
that awareness rather than beingignorant and not knowing why
(37:41):
something's not working, notknowing why I'm gaining weight
or I can't hit my power numbersor I'm always sick.
You know, in, in, in.
If any of that resonates withpeople on there, like the the
struggle bus of their athleticjourney, of the ups and downs
and I can't figure it outIntuitive eating, google it,
reach out to Pam, start learningmore about it and I think to
(38:03):
like take this thing home.
My summary points here are payattention to your food.
Increase your awareness withhow food and food quantities
make you feel, perform andrecover.
Educate yourself with surenutrition labels, but slow down.
Feel the food.
Think about, like what Pam wastalking about, of, like how you
want your food to taste and feeland what are you craving, and
(38:27):
go ahead and have a little bitof that.
You just eat it slowly.
You don't have, you don't needto have massive amounts of food
all the time, and so in that wayyou'll become more intuitive
with your food.
You'll be more aware ofeverything with it.
So, pam, if there's any summarypoints from you, let's hear
them.
Speaker 2 (38:44):
Gosh, I think you did a great job.
I think, um, one thing I wouldencourage people to do if
they're walking away from thispodcast like huh, okay, but
where do I begin?
Um, I would say first are youeating three meals a day and at
least two snacks?
Like, especially if you'retraining heavily, you've got to
be eating those snacks.
(39:05):
Are you eating those?
Start with the basics, eatthose and then see how you feel
that for a lot of people, that'senough to avoid the cravings
and uncontrollable night eating.
It could just be you're notgetting enough calories.
Speaker 1 (39:22):
It's a good recipe.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
And if you're not hungry, if you say, well, I
don't need to eat till noonbecause I'm not hungry until
noon, I would challenge you.
I would say, look, if youhaven't been eating until noon
for a long time, your body getssmart.
It's like I'm not going to giveyou all my hunger signals
because you've been ignoringthem, so I'm going to stop
making them.
Sometimes it takes justreintroducing the regularity to
(39:48):
bring back the regular hungercues.
But hunger cues you might notbe aware of are like losing
concentration, being irritable,not wanting to train, having GI
issues, like being constipated,having diarrhea alternating,
getting bloated.
Oh my God, I had so many GIissues in my 20s and I didn't
know what the issue was.
I look back and I'm like, yeah,the issue was my eating was
totally erratic and I wasn'tsupporting my energy needs.
(40:11):
It's so obvious to me now.
So, anyways, I would say juststart with three meals and two
snacks, or at least one snack iftwo feels overwhelming.
And I would also say just slowdown enough, not just when
you're eating, but all day long,to listen to this voice in our
heads that I feel like many ofus have just internalized, such
as you know, it might say thingslike you can't eat pizza you
(40:34):
already had a bagel today.
Or you can't have dessert youhad dessert already.
You can't eat a donut forbreakfast that doesn't have any
protein.
Like be aware of your internaldialogue.
You don't have to change it.
The first step is just beingaware of it.
That's it.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
Yep, one of the principles of intuitive eating
is challenge the food police,and that's what you're talking
about, right, that's exactly andbefore you even challenge it,
just recognize it.
Yeah, oh, I do feel like wecould talk for hours and hours
about this, and maybe we will.
Maybe we'll do another podcaston intuitive eating part two,
but for right now, let's leaveit there, pam.
(41:13):
One thing I did want to ask,though, is your intuitive eating
coach.
If people resonate with yourmessage here and they want to
connect, find out more aboutwhat intuitive eating coaching
looks like, where should we sendthem?
How do they connect with you?
Speaker 2 (41:29):
Great question.
Come to my website.
It's pam-morecom.
You'll find everything you needthere.
Um and yeah, and there's a lotof free resources on my website
too.
If you're like, oh, that soundscool, I don't know if I want to
commit, I give away a lot ofinformation for free through my
newsletter and through mypodcast, real Fit.
So those are great resourcestoo.
Um, yeah, and honestly too,just the book intuitive eating.
(41:52):
I think the fourth edition isthe latest edition.
Check it out.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
Cool, perfect.
Well, we'll put those in ourshow notes everybody.
But if you're like me and youlisten to podcasts and you don't
ever go to a landing page, justGoogle Pam Moore intuitive
eating and you'll find it.
You'll find it.
Go check her out.
She does some really good stuff, especially in her podcast, so
also check that out, whereveryou listen to podcasts.
Speaker 2 (42:14):
Thank you so much, Adam.
It's been so much fun beinghere.
Speaker 1 (42:18):
Yeah, thanks, pam.
Thanks for joining us on thetime crunch cyclist podcast.
We hope you enjoyed the show.
If you want even moreactionable training advice, head
over to train rightcombackslash newsletter and
subscribe to our free weeklypublication.
Each week you'll get in-depthtraining content that goes
beyond what we covered here onthe podcast.
(42:40):
That'll help you take yourtraining to the next level.
That's all for now.
Until next time, train hard,train smart, train right.
From the team at CTS.
This is the Time Crunch Cyclistpodcast, our show dedicated to
answering your trainingquestions and providing
actionable advice to help youimprove your performance, even
if you're strapped for time.
I'm your host, coach AdamPulford, and I'm one of the over
50 professional coaches whomake up the team at CTS.
In each episode, I draw on ourteam's collective knowledge,
(00:30):
other coaches and experts in thefield to provide you with the
practical ways to get the mostout of your training and
ultimately become the bestcyclist that you can be.
Now on to our show.
Now onto our show.
Welcome back, or welcome to theTime Crunch Cyclist Podcast.
(00:54):
I'm your host, coach AdamPulford.
Today we'll have a change ofpace.
We're moving away from thesuper detailed training advice
to focusing on aspects ofgeneral nutrition.
Why?
Because food is fuel for yourtraining and it's the building
blocks of recovery betweentraining sessions, beyond the
athlete's scope of just fuelinghealthy habits, and food keeps
(01:15):
us on track, not only for ourgoals in sport, but for our
happiness beyond athletics too.
Now, I'm not a fan or a hugesubscriber to any one diet or
method of eating, other thanequipping yourself with
knowledge about food and whatworks for you as an individual.
Education, awareness, trial anderror are all part of that
(01:36):
process.
I'm here today with Pam Mooreto talk more about this and help
us to look at it from perhaps adifferent angle than what
you've looked at it as anathlete and as a listener here
on the Time Crunch CyclistPodcast.
Pam's an occupational therapistby trade.
She's a former columnist at theWashington Post.
She's an endurance athlete anda podcast host herself.
(01:59):
So, pam, welcome to the show.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Hi Adam, Thanks for having me so good to be here.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Yeah, absolutely.
I'm glad this has finally cometo fruition.
You and I have worked togetherin writing some articles for
Bicycling Magazine and a fewother things, and I always enjoy
our interviews andcollaborations together.
Same Well, thanks, well, thanksFor our audience, who doesn't
(02:26):
know you like I know you.
Could you tell us a bit moreabout yourself, about your
podcast and your story of howyou came to be a thing in the
health, wellness and enduranceathlete space?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Thank you.
Wow, I'm a thing, apparently.
That's exciting.
Let's see.
On top of all the things yousaid about me in my intro, I'm
also a certified intuitiveeating counselor and, in a
nutshell, let's see, I was notathletic as a kid.
I was like picked last forevery team discovered running by
(02:59):
way of lacrosse, got intolacrosse, I think, because of
peer pressure, I don't reallyeven know.
It was a total disaster, but Irealized I liked running, I
could do it, it was simple.
So that turned into marathoning, turned into triathlons, became
a cyclist along the way andreally kind of just gradually
developed an identity as anendurance athlete through doing
endurance events, graduallytaking on more, eventually doing
(03:23):
Ironmans, and that's actually alot of what led me to Boulder.
I'm from the East Coast.
I moved to Boulder, colorado,in 2008, largely because it's an
endurance mecca, because I wasreally into like Ironmans at the
time, left my career as anoccupational therapist after
having my second child, who'snow 10 and a half.
(03:45):
For a lot of reasons, butmainly because I wanted to
explore a career as a writer,which led me to freelance health
and fitness journalism.
Because I wanted to write aboutwhat I was passionate about and
what that is is telling peopleabout healthy lifestyles.
Both, you know I've coveredfitness, as you mentioned
(04:07):
bicycling, that's how we get toknow each other covered mental
health.
I've covered nutrition topicsand my own struggles with body
image and food led me to theintuitive eating certification,
because I discovered intuitiveeating about six years ago when
(04:27):
I just you know, all my life Iwas committed to, I think, what
I would have called healthylifestyles and air quotes, which
were really just diets.
But you know it's not sexy tosay that you're on a diet or you
want to lose weight, right.
But I thought athletes look acertain way.
I don't think I look that way.
(04:53):
So my goal for the longest timewas to eat as little as I
thought I could get away with todo the sports that I was
wanting to do and couldn'tfigure out why I was often not
recovering well, fading at theend of a ride, just attributed
it to like, oh I'm just not asfit as my training buddies, I
need to work harder, and morethan once kind of dug myself
into an overtraining hole, notrealizing it.
(05:15):
It went until you know, lots ofhindsight later, yeah, exactly,
and long story short, I thinkthe pinnacle, what's the
opposite of a pinnacle, thelowest point I was going to say.
But so many of my habits weredisordered and I didn't
recognize them as such becausemost of them are normalized
culturally and, I think,especially within the athlete
(05:51):
community.
You know things like low carbeating quote unquote, clean,
avoiding sugar, intermittentfasting, skipping breakfast all
of these things that areactually really detrimental to
our performance and our mentalhealth and our relationship with
food and our bodies are sonormalized that I just thought
I'm doing it wrong, I'm notdoing it hard enough because I'd
(06:13):
be adhering to all these randomrules and then falling off the
wagon, so to speak, at somepoint, and just eating myself
into an oblivion and feelinglike garbage and then starting
over, which I think is probablypretty relatable to a lot of
people.
And yeah, ultimately got intoCrossFit, got into macro
counting from there and finallyjust got this like epiphany.
(06:34):
The macro counting had got tothe point where, like it was a
part-time job, I was with aspreadsheet at six in the
morning trying to figure out ifI could have Dairy Queen with my
kids on the last day of schoolas a celebration, and like what
I would have to eat in order toaccommodate a stupid vanilla ice
cream cone.
Right, and finally it just likehit me.
I was like damn, I'm almost 40.
At that point I was um.
(06:54):
Why am I relying on an app totell me what to eat?
This is, can I say?
Can we swear on this podcast?
Speaker 1 (07:01):
I was like this is bullshit.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
I know what I should eat, I'm just not listening to
myself.
And then I sort of dove intolike reading and researching and
learning more about what isintuitive eating and just by
following the principles.
There's 10 principles and Ithink a common myth is that
intuitive eating is eatingwhatever the hell you want,
whenever you want.
It's not that simple, but it iskind of a philosophical
(07:29):
framework for having a healthyrelationship with food that is
not predicated on weight lossand it just really changed my
life.
It changed my relationship withfood, changed the way I train
and I've been so much happierand so I was like I just want
more people to know about this.
I'm going to get thecertification and coach clients
so that I can help other peopleexperience what I've experienced
(07:51):
.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah, I mean I'll be the first to admit that there is
a lot of confusion in thenutrition space as well as the
training space, and part of mygoal and objective with this
podcast, as well as what I do asa coach, is to clean some of
that up, make it simple and givethat actionable advice to
people that are confused andpeople like you and I that have
(08:15):
struggled our whole life tryingto figure it out Right.
And I think when one of ourcollabs at bicycling we just had
a side conversation aboutintuitive eating and I thought I
was like man, it just soundslike a lot of the advice that I
give to my own athletes, becausesome of it is common sense,
what I perceive as common sense,but, like you said, it's a
framework, and I think thatthose frameworks and frameworks
(08:38):
that I've shared on this podcastbefore help people to start to
think differently aboutsomething and then have some
guiding principles to it.
So let's start with the basics.
I know you're passionate aboutintuitive eating, so, please,
what is it and why should wecare about it?
Speaker 2 (08:54):
What is it and why should we care about it?
It is essentially taking backyour agency about what you eat.
It's accepting that you, andnot some guru or plant or app or
diet or lifestyle they don'tknow more about you than you.
You get to decide what's goingto be most nourishing to you in
(09:16):
a way that also honors yourhunger, your fullness, your
energy needs and we can divemore into that, because
sometimes your hunger is not anaccurate indicator of what your
energy needs often are.
I think we've all had theexperience of coming back from a
long training day and you justdon't have an appetite.
So we can circle back to that.
(09:38):
We'll put a bit in that, butaccording to your culture, your
taste preferences and finding away of eating that adheres to
all of that.
And while, yes, food is fuel,let's accept that food is also
social.
It's okay to have cake atsomeone's birthday, even if cake
is quote unquote empty calories.
(09:59):
I don't really like that term.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Yeah, same Pam, but I do want to toot my own horn
here for just a second.
I had a podcast with ReneeEastman, a CTS coach.
We were talking about someholiday stuff and we're like,
yeah, like chill out on theholidays and go ahead.
And Renee was like go ahead andhave pie for breakfast once in
a while and I've had so manycomments from people like dude,
(10:22):
I had pie for breakfast and itwas awesome.
And it's like yeah, for sure,like, maybe not all the time,
but like once in a while forsure.
Because, yeah, there's no,anyway we'll get into it.
There's no bad food there'sthere.
There, there can be.
Um, there's no bad food.
There are habits that you canchange, right, and this is part
of what intuitive eating is moreabout.
(10:44):
So sorry, I digressed you onyour whole framework here.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
No, that's great.
Actually, I'm glad you broughtup the pie for breakfast,
because I think one of thebiggest misconceptions I hear
about intuitive eating is, if Iate intuitively, I would
intuitively eat a box of Oreos.
I would eat a Costco sizeserving of filling your favorite
quote unquote forbidden foodhere.
And the thing that I think isso hard to grasp and which was
(11:08):
hard for me to grasp for thelongest time, like there were
many, many foods that I justwouldn't keep in my house
because I was like I will eat itall at once and I don't want to
do that.
The truth is, the more yourestrict, the more you're
craving the food, Just like ifyou've ever been around a child
or, or I don't know, been achild.
We've all been a child andsometimes I act like a child.
So I.
(11:29):
I think we all do this.
You tell a kid not to dosomething.
What do they want to do?
They want to do the thing.
That's all they want to do,it's all they can think about.
So the minute you tell yourselfdessert is off limits, you might
just find that you're obsessedwith dessert.
You might also find that youare quote unquote emotionally
eating dessert every night.
Why am I doing this?
Oh, this is emotional.
(11:50):
Emotional eating is bad.
Maybe you're eating ice cream atnight because, number one,
you're obsessed, because you'vetold yourself you can't have it.
And maybe, number two, you'vebeen eating food all day that
wasn't actually satisfying.
You were eating what youthought you should eat, which
was maybe an omelet but no toast, maybe a salad with like five
crackers and maybe, before yourbig training ride, like a banana
(12:10):
.
That's not enough.
And then, after dinner, your,your body is smart, it knows
that there is a deficit and itis compensating.
And maybe it's compensatingwith ice cream.
And now you've, no pun intended, you've fed yourself this
narrative of like I'm out ofcontrol around food, I'm out of
control around ice cream, can'thave it in my house.
Well, try giving yourself fullpermission to eat all the ice
(12:35):
cream.
And this is hard.
This is easier said than donebecause we've been conditioned
in so many ways to think thatthese foods are bad and that
it's unacceptable to gain weight, because gaining weight means
all of these moral failures,which are just that's culture.
That's not true.
Right, like when you were atoddler, you didn't have
thoughts about your chubbythighs, that was just your body,
(12:56):
right?
We've been conditioned tobelieve that chubby thighs are a
sign of something terrible.
When you can get in touch withyour body's signals and you can
say all right, I'm just going tolet myself eat ice cream Now,
if you've been restricting for along time, you may find that
you're overdoing it on all ofthese foods that you've
restricted for a while, but thenit's like a seesaw.
It should equalize.
(13:17):
You know, in the absence ofmajor trauma, which can often
disconnect people from theirbodies, in the absence of
medications that can be messingwith your appetite, you should
find an equilibrium and you willfind.
You will reconnect with yourability to identify what
actually feels good to your body.
(13:38):
And I think for most people,especially athletes, we don't
feel good when we eat pie forbreakfast every day.
We're going to stop doing thatafter a while when the novelty
wears off.
And I can't, I could.
We could be on a whole hourlong podcast where I'm listing
to you, adam, all the foods thatI thought I couldn't have in
the house, that, like Iabsolutely can, I just had to
neutralize them by eating themover and over.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Yeah, yeah.
And two things.
One it's like feeling good,right Feelings.
Let's put that maybe aside fora second.
Everybody wants to feel good,but the feel good is long-term,
it's not the short term, it'snot the pleasure, it's more
about the joy, right?
That's the feeling that we'retalking about here.
So it's like number one.
Number two is when we had thisconversation, I thought, or I
(14:24):
just observed some of the advicethat I was giving to my
athletes, so I'll read a coupleof those that kind of fit into
what I think intuitive eating is, and you can tell me if I'm
right or wrong.
So the first one is I told oneof my athletes I go, don't view
foods as good or bad, just viewthem as what works for you and
(14:45):
what doesn't, what your bodyneeds and what it doesn't need.
So would that fit intointuitive eating?
Speaker 2 (14:52):
A hundred percent.
Actually, a great example ofthat is like a friend of mine
was eating a lot of energy barsthat were nut based on long
rides, and I think, from like awellness perspective, one might
think, well, that is, quoteunquote better than like a
sugary gel, right, because we've, that's a simple sugar.
Simple sugars are like theworst thing, right.
But then she's telling me Ifeel like I don't have energy, I
(15:13):
get stomach aches, I getbloated, what do you think could
be going on?
And I'm like I don't know.
If I were you, I wouldexperiment with eating more
simple carbs and less nuts andsee what happens.
And she came back and was likeI tried that a few times, it
totally worked.
And so there's the right foodfor the right time.
I think those nut bars, thoseare great for, like when you're
(15:35):
in the car for three hours andyou need a snack.
I wouldn't do that during aride, you know.
So it's just yeah, no morality.
And just how do you feel?
How does this food make youfeel?
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Yeah, and to that point, you know, in my opening
lines here you know I said a lotof this is trial and error and
a lot of it is awareness.
So when you make an error youdon't feel good or you don't
perform well.
Why is that?
Well, when you're cycling orrunning at a higher rate than
you know, sitting there or zoneone, the protein and fat will
(16:07):
slow digestion.
Simple carbohydrates will speedup digestion and therefore
you'll have less GI stress up toa point, assuming that you're
feeling that you're stayinghydrated throughout, and that's
part of the mechanism of whythat is.
But when you tune into oh, mystomach hurts, oh, my stomach
doesn't hurt, and you view thosetwo, that's intuitive eating
You're tuning into what it isAbsolutely, and because it is.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
I mean, any type of intuition is somewhat based on
past experience.
It's not, yes, it's a gutfeeling, but that gut feeling is
usually based on oh, I've beendown that road before, so you're
looking at not just what soundsgood like, what sounds like it
would taste good right now, buthow do I think I'm going to feel
three hours from now, based onwhat has happened before?
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Exactly, Let me read you another one and we'll see if
it fits.
I told one of my athletes I go,let's try to avoid getting
super hungry or empty, becauseyou'll likely eat those calories
back and then some later in theday or maybe even the next day.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
That is.
I love that one that'sunderrated, People don't know.
Yes, a hundred percent agreewith that.
Um, something that I tell myclients a lot is like, say, even
like not in an athletic context, say, you have a meeting from
five to seven.
You normally eat dinner at six,not hungry at 445.
Definitely eat.
Something Like intuitive eatingisn't just responding to hunger
cues, it's taking care offuture you.
(17:28):
It's a form of self-care to go.
I don't want to be overlyhungry when I walk in my house
at 730.
And, to your point, just eatingwhat's quickly available in the
pantry, not even having time tolike reheat your nice meal that
you had planned on or you know,cook it and you will.
You will probablyovercompensate because you've
reached this point of likebiological hunger, like that.
Oh my God, my stomach is eatingitself, feeling you don't want
(17:51):
to get there.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
No, you don't want to get there.
And I think, too, this goes alittle bit in what you were
saying before.
It was like it's not alwayseating when you're hungry, even
though that's a huge part of it.
If you come back from a fivehour ride and you're like, ooh,
I'm not hungry, for all thereasons why you're not hungry,
after you just been like, uh say, out in the heat a 90 degree
ride, you know, here on the Eastcoast, and you're super
(18:13):
dehydrated, and you're like, oh,and you're super dehydrated and
you're like, oh, my God, I justwant to barf.
You should probably put in arecovery shake and hydration to
mitigate that bad feeling in themoment.
For a longer term joyfulfeeling and kind of healthiness,
so that intuition of, oh, Ijust eat when I'm hungry it's
not necessarily the case,especially in the athlete
context where we got to hit thatrecovery window 100% percent.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
I actually was a great example of like totally
ignoring my intuition.
So even as the I guess expert,I mess it up Sometimes.
I did a really hard race thissummer.
It was like a 67 mile gravelrace at high elevation, tons of
terrain I was completelyuncomfortable with, like just a
really hard race and I had not.
My nutrition went poorly.
(18:55):
Again, a dumb thing that I didwas I ate the burrito that they
giving this like breakfastburrito before the race.
I was like I feel like that's abad idea, but I'm going to do
it anyway.
And it was a bad idea.
It threw off my whole nutritionfor the race so I couldn't eat
well during the race, atewhatever they had.
After stopped on the way homefor an ice cream sandwich and
(19:17):
called it dinner.
Such a bad idea.
And before I went to bed Ithought I know I should eat a
real dinner.
I don't have the energy.
I don't want to.
I don't care what happens next.
Well, adam, I was up at threeo'clock in the morning eating,
tried to go back to bed, was upagain at four eating, and it
wasn't a huge deal because, likewhere it was in my season, it
(19:38):
wasn't like I had to recoverquickly for my next race, but
like would have been a lot nicerto recover more quickly.
My legs were trashed for longerthan they should have.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
Exactly, exactly, yeah, don't do that.
And so the third one that I'llread you here and again.
Just observation what I tell myathletes.
Our listeners are getting thepoint here, but there's both the
science and the art of being anathlete, being a human to this.
But this one, I think, will hit.
And I told my athlete there'sno food that's off the table
(20:13):
here.
Kind of like what you said assoon as you restrict, that bad
thing starts happening.
So there's no food that's offthe table here.
Kind of like what you said assoon as you restrict, that bad
thing starts happening.
So there's no food that's offthe table.
Tune into what helps your bodyperform at its best, starting
with science and adjusting forit based on your own needs.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
Yeah, I think that's brilliant.
I mean, obviously, let's justmake the caveat If you have an
allergy or a sensitivity, or forreligious reasons or ethical
reasons, of course that's goingto take precedence.
But yeah, a hundred percentwhat you said.
I have nothing to add.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Yeah, okay.
So I mean my observation, the,the, the reading kind of
preparation before this, um,this podcast, intuitive, eating
it.
It's not rocket science, okay,but it's it's awareness, it's a
lot of awareness.
Yeah, and I think that athletes, humans, americans, all of us,
(21:04):
like we, are lacking awareness.
So my question to you is why doyou think that we have this
lack of awareness as a societyand we can view it as the
athletic context or just thehuman context, and what can we
do to turn it around?
What can we do to gainawareness?
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Oh my gosh.
Why do we lack awareness?
So many reasons, depending onwhat family you grew up in.
You might've grown up in afamily that was like you can't
have dessert until you eatwhat's on your plate, or you
can't have seconds on the pastauntil you have at least three
more bites of chicken.
Those things are seen as veryhealthy.
But especially when you'retelling a kid you can't have
(21:52):
dessert until you finish yourplate, you're basically
instructing them to disconnectfrom their body because everyone
wants dessert.
Right?
I used to say, oh, I have asecond stomach for dessert.
I had actually trained myselfto think I had a second dessert
stomach and now, since I'vebecome an intuitive eater, there
are a lot of times that dessertlooks amazing and I'm just like
you know what?
I'm actually full, I don't feellike I need to eat that.
I'll be able to get a gooddessert when I need one in the
(22:15):
future.
I used to never say no todessert and I think also we
again, depending on like whatculture family you grow up in,
we are often told to ignore ourinstincts.
Right?
Like women and girls inparticular, we are really valued
for behaving well and beingquiet and being nice and making
(22:36):
life easier for other people,but anyone I mean, I think, a
lot of us to get along in theworld we have to suppress who we
really are and what ourinstincts are.
And I think it's okay to apoint like obviously there's
cultural norms, there's empathy,there's a lot of reasons why
sometimes you have to avoid yourinstincts and do the right
thing.
But that's tricky.
(22:57):
I think as kids we come intothe world being so embodied and
so attuned, like if you've everwatched a toddler, you can see
how they're feeling with theirwhole body.
You can see if they're sad,bored, happy, excited, joyful.
It's all over them and we learnto disconnect.
So to me, intuitive eating is alot of unlearning.
It's unlearning and I don'tknow about you, but like me,
(23:25):
when I was like 14, I rememberthat was the first time one of
my friends was like you're onlysupposed to eat X amount of fat
grams in a day and from there onout I got that in my head, that
number, and I was like okay, itdoesn't matter how I feel or
what I want, that number is moreimportant than anything else.
And it's weird because asathletes, it can be such an
asset to disconnect from ourbody.
If you can avoid giving intothe pain that you feel in your
(23:46):
legs on a tough climb, thatmakes you a really good athlete.
If you can look at your watchand be like this interval is
over in 90 seconds, I know I cangrind through for 90 more
seconds.
I know I can do that, that'sgreat.
But then you're like okay.
So why can't I intermittentfast?
Why can't I just be like I'mnot going to eat until 11
o'clock?
I know I can do it.
It's different.
(24:06):
It's different.
So why we disconnect?
A lot of reasons.
How can we reconnect?
I think it's different forevery person, but a simple
practice you can do would belike something you could start
doing today is if you'vehistorically been somebody who
eats according to shoulds like Ishould have a salad, that's the
(24:26):
healthy thing.
What if, just for one meal, youactually tuned in and said what
do I feel like eating?
And if that's sort ofoverwhelming, you're like whoa,
there's so many choices, I don'tknow.
Break it down, go.
Hmm.
Would I feel like something hottoday or something cold, or
even something room temperature?
Do I feel like somethingcrunchy or something chewy or
(24:46):
something smooth?
Do I feel like something spicy,something mild.
Break it down by temperature,by texture, by like mouthfeel
how hungry am I Think about.
Try that for one meal.
And when you eat that one meal,try eating it without your
phone, without a magazine or anewspaper.
(25:07):
If anybody reads those anymorenot on their phone, you know,
not in front of the TV or yourdevice Just sit there.
You don't have to like chew in amindful way, you know just try
tasting the food and try slowingdown a little bit so that you
(25:28):
can check in with your hungerand fullness.
Um, that would just be like onesimple way.
I mean there's meditation,there's journaling, there's like
a million different ways, but Ithink what I describe as an
accessible thing that somebodycould do today ways.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
But I think what I describe is an accessible thing
that somebody could do today.
Yeah, no, I fully endorse thatand I need to practice it too.
I think that some days I do itwell, some days I don't.
I cook a lot in the house butwe're busy, like Kristen and I
are just going from phone callto phone call, zoom, meeting,
podcasting, getting our workoutin walking the dog, connecting
with friends whatever we doRight, and you, you know,
(26:04):
breakfast and lunch are usuallypretty sped up.
Dinner we try to slow down and,and I think, eating slow, I
think having a slow meal, Ithink you know practicing
cooking.
That's the other thing.
Like, if you're, if you want toget good at intuitive eating,
if you want to get good at thefood, almost has to become a
hobby.
And if you're an athlete, Iwould challenge someone to find
(26:26):
more time in their day, to spendmore time you know cooking,
preparing and thinking aboutfood, because that, as I said
before, it's it's fuel for yourbody, but it's also building
blocks for your body.
As you said, it's woven intoour culture Like it's a very
it's a thing to connect overwith people.
So it's an important aspect ofour life and I'm only spending
(26:46):
one podcast on over four yearson how food works with your body
versus all the other.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
But I want to challenge you on making food a
hobby.
As an intuitive eater, I don'tknow if you have to do that.
I think if you want to, you can.
But I think that could be abarrier for a lot of people.
Some people just aren'tinterested or really don't have
the time.
And I think that, like you canstill eat healthy and in a way
that is nourishing for sports,even without making it a hobby.
(27:17):
Like, for an example, a tunamelt with some sliced up bell
peppers on the side.
That is a meal that gives yousome carbs, some fat, some
protein, some fiber.
That's a great meal and youdon't have to really know a lot
about cooking to make a tunamelt.
You know in like my single girldays a go-to dinner for me.
Not that I was like an exemplarof healthy eating back then I
(27:38):
really wasn't but like I wouldeat like an omelet with like a
banana, and I was afraid ofbread back then, so maybe I
wouldn't have eaten the bread.
But like today I would say areyou in a hurry and don't like to
cook?
Maybe on Sunday you just diceup a bunch of vegetables in
advance, saute them, add theeggs, add whatever kind of
cheese you like, make some toast.
Boom, that's a meal.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
You need more carbs.
Add a banana, add a piece offruit.
You get a lot of fiber and alot of micronutrients there.
Boom, that's a meal.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
You're right.
I mean, as you said before,some of this is unlearning,
right.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Yeah, and so in that way, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
My advice, I think, is like, if you're so sped up on
life, just like slow down andmake a sandwich, like Pam talked
about, but like slowing down isnot bad.
Speaker 2 (28:24):
I think that slowing down is not bad and slowing down
enough to go.
What do I want?
Like, do I really want this lowfat cheese or fat free cheese
on my sandwich, or do I reallywant the good Munster or the
Brie?
I'm telling you, if you put thegood Munster or the Brie on the
sandwich that you really wantedand you put the good bread that
you wanted good Munster or thebrie on the sandwich that you
really wanted and you put thegood bread that you wanted
instead of that like low carbcardboard stuff you will feel
(28:45):
more satisfied, and not just ina hunger fullness way.
Satisfaction is more than justhow full did you get?
Because I could eat a huge bowlof salad and it could make me
really full.
But will it satisfy me if whatI was really craving was a
grilled cheese?
No, it will not, and that's whenI'm going to find myself
(29:07):
raiding the pantry at 930 atnight when I probably should be
in bed with a book.
So just tuning into what'sgoing to satisfy you, your
eating experiences will just bebetter and you won't find
yourself sort of like doing thatthing that puttering around the
kitchen just looking forsomething but you're not sure
what.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
When you're satisfied all day long.
You don't.
You don't do that.
So last last topic I want toask about because, um and this
could be I think that this is alittle counter intuitive to
intuitive eating Um, but I stilluse it in my practice, and you
mentioned it before trackingcalories and counting macros.
So for, uh, listeners, whatwe're talking about is total cal
you're putting out via exerciseand activity throughout the day
(30:03):
, and for some of my athletes, Iuse this.
I'll tell you why, but I wantto hear your take on that.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
for some people, my take is fun because I would say
it depends, which is probably,you know, everybody wants an
answer, but I would like, if Iwere a cycling coach, I would
start definitely by asking theathlete what's your history?
Do you have a history of aneating disorder or disordered
eating?
Um, and if they say, even ifthey say no, I might dive in a
little more.
I would ask some specificquestions, Cause, like, if you
(30:34):
had asked me 10 years ago, doyou have a history of disordered
eating?
I would have said, oh my gosh,no, I totally did, and that
knowing that I had to, like,turn something into a coach
probably would have beentriggering for me.
So, but I do think there'sworkarounds, right, like, if you
suspect that your client hashad issues and this might bring
up some old stuff that you don'twant to, maybe they can just
(30:55):
text you a photo of what theyate each meal, rather than
asking them to weigh it andmeasure it.
You can get it, you know, I'msure you.
I think that, like, at the endof the day, you have to ask
yourself why am I doing thissport?
Am I a professional?
Speaker 1 (31:11):
I'm thinking 99.9% of your listeners are not
professionals.
Speaker 2 (31:13):
What do you think Correct?
Yep, okay, um, if you're not aprofessional and this is just
for fun, you have to take intoaccount.
Where does my mental health fitinto this?
You have to take into account.
Where does my mental health fitinto this If I am overthinking
birthday parties, graduationparties, vacations, going out to
eat?
What's happening here?
What's my definition of fun?
(31:34):
It's up to you, right?
Everybody gets to decide howmuch, for lack of a better, how
much weight they want to put ontheir diet.
You can just I would never tellsomebody you have to give up
weight loss goals or you have todo this.
You have people can do whateverthey want, whatever feels good.
But if you're finding that likeyou don't want to be giving as
much mental energy to youreating as you are, then it's
(31:55):
good enough.
You can take the good enoughapproach.
Like text your coach a pictureof your food.
They can probably look at yourmeal without knowing all of the
weights and measurements.
They could probably look atyour meal and go.
You know what?
I think you could use a littlemore protein, especially because
you're telling me that you'retired.
Oh, you just took all thesephotos of food and you know,
what I don't see is any potatoesor fruit or bread.
(32:18):
And you're telling me that yourlegs are tired but you're not
sure why.
Maybe you need more carbs.
I don't think you need to tellyour athlete necessarily you
need X calories worth of morecarbs.
But you could say to somebodywhy don't you try adding in a
piece of bread or a half apotato or a banana to every meal
or snack and then see how youfeel?
(32:38):
Now, that said, if the personhas no history of anything with
food, definitely I thinktracking for three days or a
week just to get a baseline of,like, what you're generally
eating and how you're generallyfeeling is great.
Speaker 1 (32:51):
Yeah, well, good, good to hear that that's exactly
how I do it.
I think, too, all cards on thetable, looking back on my
childhood, all the way upthrough college wrestling and
into this sport of cycling.
I went in sixth grade.
I mean, I had a full-on eatingdisorder too, and you get all
(33:12):
the crazies.
I mean I went from 160 down to119 and I grew three or four
inches in that time.
But, as you said, thosecultural norms of just like
suppressing everything,including the pain and the
hunger and everything else, youjust like go for it, right,
because that's what the greatathletes are doing.
Yeah, you have a goal andyou're going to meet it Exactly.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
Whether it's a performance goal or a weight
goal.
It's like that's how we'reconditioned and you get so much
praise for weight loss.
Yeah, it's like that's howwe're conditioned and you get so
much praise for weight loss.
Everybody's like you look great.
What did you do and like,especially for women?
I think men to a great extenttoo, but we're so conditioned to
believe that our weight is our.
I'm sorry.
Our worth is our appearance.
So when you get compliments onyour appearance, you don't want
(33:57):
to give that up.
That's social capital, I mean.
It might sound vain, but Ithink I'm just being real, like
everyone likes to hear that theylook great.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
Yeah, and I think that you know there's some
element to being an athlete.
That's part of that too.
And I think then, when it comesdown to what can I control?
Is you know these numbers right?
When you go to the numbers, yougo to the science.
Is you know these numbers right?
When you go to the numbers, yougo to the science.
And that's why and this is the,this is why I bring it up is
because it's still the numbers,it's still a science.
(34:27):
If you want to lose weight,decrease the amount of calories
that you take in and have ahealthy amount that you're
putting out, and if you'retaking in a little less each day
, you will lose weight over time.
However, I would say that,based on having the experience
that I do, I got a pretty goodradar for, uh, if something is
going to be triggering tosomebody.
(34:48):
So, as I'm talking about food,I'll see if those you know
counting macros is going totrigger anything, and I won't go
there.
But I will use the picturething and I do that for my
juniors a lot too, because thatis, you know, they always got
their phones, so we're doing itand they start to get awareness
just on that and they use thatpicture thing to get an
understanding of their habitsand how things are going.
Yeah, if I know somebody canhandle it.
(35:09):
They're good with numbers.
My fitness pal is one trackerwhere there's some good things
going on there.
That's helpful, I think.
Still, though, when it comes toperformance tracking the amount
of carbohydrate that you'reconsuming in grams on the bike
per hour you should get dialedwith that if you want
performance, right Because-.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Absolutely.
That was such a game changerfor me to go from what's the
least I can get away with towhat's the most I can tolerate.
I am so much happier.
I'm just like I can go forlonger and feel better and
recover better.
That's what I want and Ihaven't found that I have
experienced a big shift in myweight Now had I?
(35:51):
I'm not sure, but here's thething.
Like you said, if you decreasecalories gradually, you should
lose weight.
Generally, right, but to apoint, your body.
We have a set point that ourbody is kind of ready to be at,
based on genetics.
You can't veer too far from itand if you do, it's probably not
sustainable, and it is.
And while you might I thinkthis happens to a lot of
(36:12):
athletes you initially see somegreat performance gains,
especially in a sport likecycling where the power to
weight ratio is huge.
But what people forget about isthe power part of the power to
weight ratio.
If you have lost so much weightto where you're not eating
enough calories to adequatelyrecover and fuel your workouts,
you can't produce the power thatyou need.
(36:33):
Sometimes, like for a lot ofpeople, they find, oh, you know
what, when I gained a littleweight and was closer to my
biological imperative, and I wasactually performing better than
when I was in a deficit becauseI had the resources.
I had the glycogen stores.
That can be hard to accept in aculture that values thinness so
much.
And, of course, let's notignore, I guess, except for
(36:56):
mountain bikers we're wearingspandex.
That's no small thing.
It's like your body is ondisplay.
It's hard.
I hope that nobody comes awayfrom this podcast and thinks, oh
, it's supposed to be easy.
No, it's hard.
We're packing as much as we caninto a short episode, but it's
(37:17):
hard.
So I just want to acknowledgethat.
Speaker 1 (37:19):
Yeah, no acknowledgement received, and I
think listeners should too.
Living the examined life ischallenging, but it's also
rewarding, and I would muchrather live that examined life
and have a high awareness anddeal with the burden of having
that awareness rather than beingignorant and not knowing why
(37:41):
something's not working, notknowing why I'm gaining weight
or I can't hit my power numbersor I'm always sick.
You know, in, in, in.
If any of that resonates withpeople on there, like the the
struggle bus of their athleticjourney, of the ups and downs
and I can't figure it outIntuitive eating, google it,
reach out to Pam, start learningmore about it and I think to
(38:03):
like take this thing home.
My summary points here are payattention to your food.
Increase your awareness withhow food and food quantities
make you feel, perform andrecover.
Educate yourself with surenutrition labels, but slow down.
Feel the food.
Think about, like what Pam wastalking about, of, like how you
want your food to taste and feeland what are you craving, and
(38:27):
go ahead and have a little bitof that.
You just eat it slowly.
You don't have, you don't needto have massive amounts of food
all the time, and so in that wayyou'll become more intuitive
with your food.
You'll be more aware ofeverything with it.
So, pam, if there's any summarypoints from you, let's hear
them.
Speaker 2 (38:44):
Gosh, I think you did a great job.
I think, um, one thing I wouldencourage people to do if
they're walking away from thispodcast like huh, okay, but
where do I begin?
Um, I would say first are youeating three meals a day and at
least two snacks?
Like, especially if you'retraining heavily, you've got to
be eating those snacks.
(39:05):
Are you eating those?
Start with the basics, eatthose and then see how you feel
that for a lot of people, that'senough to avoid the cravings
and uncontrollable night eating.
It could just be you're notgetting enough calories.
Speaker 1 (39:22):
It's a good recipe.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
And if you're not hungry, if you say, well, I
don't need to eat till noonbecause I'm not hungry until
noon, I would challenge you.
I would say, look, if youhaven't been eating until noon
for a long time, your body getssmart.
It's like I'm not going to giveyou all my hunger signals
because you've been ignoringthem, so I'm going to stop
making them.
Sometimes it takes justreintroducing the regularity to
(39:48):
bring back the regular hungercues.
But hunger cues you might notbe aware of are like losing
concentration, being irritable,not wanting to train, having GI
issues, like being constipated,having diarrhea alternating,
getting bloated.
Oh my God, I had so many GIissues in my 20s and I didn't
know what the issue was.
I look back and I'm like, yeah,the issue was my eating was
totally erratic and I wasn'tsupporting my energy needs.
(40:11):
It's so obvious to me now.
So, anyways, I would say juststart with three meals and two
snacks, or at least one snack iftwo feels overwhelming.
And I would also say just slowdown enough, not just when
you're eating, but all day long,to listen to this voice in our
heads that I feel like many ofus have just internalized, such
as you know, it might say thingslike you can't eat pizza you
(40:34):
already had a bagel today.
Or you can't have dessert youhad dessert already.
You can't eat a donut forbreakfast that doesn't have any
protein.
Like be aware of your internaldialogue.
You don't have to change it.
The first step is just beingaware of it.
That's it.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
Yep, one of the principles of intuitive eating
is challenge the food police,and that's what you're talking
about, right, that's exactly andbefore you even challenge it,
just recognize it.
Yeah, oh, I do feel like wecould talk for hours and hours
about this, and maybe we will.
Maybe we'll do another podcaston intuitive eating part two,
but for right now, let's leaveit there, pam.
(41:13):
One thing I did want to ask,though, is your intuitive eating
coach.
If people resonate with yourmessage here and they want to
connect, find out more aboutwhat intuitive eating coaching
looks like, where should we sendthem?
How do they connect with you?
Speaker 2 (41:29):
Great question.
Come to my website.
It's pam-morecom.
You'll find everything you needthere.
Um and yeah, and there's a lotof free resources on my website
too.
If you're like, oh, that soundscool, I don't know if I want to
commit, I give away a lot ofinformation for free through my
newsletter and through mypodcast, real Fit.
So those are great resourcestoo.
Um, yeah, and honestly too,just the book intuitive eating.
(41:52):
I think the fourth edition isthe latest edition.
Check it out.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
Cool, perfect.
Well, we'll put those in ourshow notes everybody.
But if you're like me and youlisten to podcasts and you don't
ever go to a landing page, justGoogle Pam Moore intuitive
eating and you'll find it.
You'll find it.
Go check her out.
She does some really good stuff, especially in her podcast, so
also check that out, whereveryou listen to podcasts.
Speaker 2 (42:14):
Thank you so much, Adam.
It's been so much fun beinghere.
Speaker 1 (42:18):
Yeah, thanks, pam.
Thanks for joining us on thetime crunch cyclist podcast.
We hope you enjoyed the show.
If you want even moreactionable training advice, head
over to train rightcombackslash newsletter and
subscribe to our free weeklypublication.
Each week you'll get in-depthtraining content that goes
beyond what we covered here onthe podcast.
(42:40):
That'll help you take yourtraining to the next level.
That's all for now.
Until next time, train hard,train smart, train right.
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