June 12, 2025 • 43 mins
OVERVIEW
If you or your child is interested in racing bikes (road, mountain, cyclocross, track) as an under-18 competitor, this is the podcast for you! CTS Coach Adam Pulford is one of the top coaches to Junior and U23 Cyclists in the United States. Much of this work is through the DC Devo Cycling Team in Washington, D.C. In Episode 252 of "The Time-Crunched Cyclist Podcast", Adam is joined by Chris Hardee, Justin Mauch, and Ryan McKinney of DCDevo to answer listener questions on how the development pathway works in cycling, how to get started, and what to look for in a development program.
TOPICS COVERED
- Age-specific aspects of training junior cyclists
- How many hours should junior cyclists train?
- How do you find a good junior program?
- What to look for in a junior development program
- Cyclocross and High School Mountain Bike as entry point
- Should your kid be riding/racing with grown men/women?
ASK A QUESTION FOR A FUTURE PODCAST
LINKS/RESOURCES
// General Recommendations by Age (hours per year):
- Under 12 (U12):
Volume: ~100-150 hours/year
Weekly Average: ~2-4 hours/week
- Ages 13-14 (U14):
Volume: ~150-250 hours/year
Weekly Average: ~4-6 hours/week
- Ages 15-16 (U16):
Volume: ~250-400 hours/year
Weekly Average: ~6-10 hours/week
- Ages 17-18 (U18/Juniors):
Volume: ~400-600 hours/year (competitive juniors)
Weekly Average: ~10-12 hours/week
Elite or highly competitive juniors could range up to ~600-800 hours/year
- Training for Junior Cyclists: How LUX Cycling Trains Juniors to Join World Tour Teams - CTS
- Case study: A Finnish junior’s eight-year road to cycling’s World Tour
- Building An Annual Training Plan For Cycling
- Training Periodization, Intensity Distribution, and Volume in Trained Cyclists: A Systematic Review
GUESTS
Chris Hardee, Justin Mauch, and Ryan McKinney of DCDevo
HOST
Adam Pulford has been a CTS Coach for nearly two decades and holds a B.S. in Exercise Physiology. He's participated in and coached hundreds of athletes for endurance events all around the world.
Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Google Podcasts, or on your favorite podcast platform
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
From the team at CTS.
This is the Time Crunch Cyclistpodcast, our show dedicated to
answering your trainingquestions and providing
actionable advice to help youimprove your performance even if
you're strapped for time.
I'm your host, coach AdamPulford, and I'm one of the over
50 professional coaches whomake up the team at CTS.
In each episode, I draw on ourteam's collective knowledge,
(00:30):
other coaches and experts in thefield to provide you with the
practical ways to get the mostout of your training and
ultimately become the bestcyclist that you can be.
Now on to our show.
Now onto our show.
Junior cycling is something thatis near and dear to my heart.
(00:51):
It's fun at times, challengingat times, yet it seems to be
rewarding all the time.
Now, most of you listeningright now are not juniors.
So why am I taking a wholeepisode on this topic?
Well, because some of you askedfor it.
Like many of the topics andquestions covered on this
podcast, it's from our audiencereaching out to learn more about
(01:12):
something.
Recently, we've had severalinquiries about juniors training
programs, how to find a gooddevelopmental program and when
it's appropriate to start racing.
So I'm pretty solid on thecoaching and physiology side of
things for junior stuff, but thedevelopmental aspect is a much
bigger picture.
It takes a village to do itright, and a giant part of that
(01:33):
village is the parentsthemselves.
It's that family unit.
Now the other large part ofthat village are the directors
and coaches that work on theseprograms, getting the athletes
to the races and getting themthe support that they need when
it matters most.
I couldn't think of any bettervillage people to help answer
these questions than the ones Iwork with on the DC Devo Race
(01:55):
Academy.
So I have recorded a podcastwith them ahead of time.
Their names are Chris Hardy Sr,justin Mock and Ryan McKinney.
I recorded this ahead of timeand then I did this intro just
afterwards because I didn't knowexactly what I was going to get
when I recorded with them.
You'll see that they are just amix of amazing people all
(02:18):
together.
We went a little long.
The goal is to shape it down,so it's not going to be super
long.
The end product I'm not toosure what it is right now as I
read this intro to you, buthere's a few things that and a
few reasons why I think thatthis podcast and this episode is
so important.
Because, number one, kids arethe future generation of the
(02:39):
sport and we want to see themflourish.
If you have kids, it's good toknow the options and
opportunities out there forprograms and proper development
in this sport.
Now, even if you don't havekids, you may learn a thing or
two if these juniors show up onyour group ride or you start
racing with them at some localrace.
And lastly, at least the way Icoach juniors up until they're
(03:01):
around 17 or 18 years old coachjuniors up until they're around
17 or 18 years old.
They look very similar to a timecrunched athlete in terms of
their volume, uh per uh per week, and their total annual hours.
Okay, so we may be able totease out some training tips for
anybody listening to thispodcast.
So, with that being said, uh,let's get into the show, let's
(03:23):
have you learn who thesedirectors are and let's learn
more about junior racingprograms.
So, chris, can you tell us howDC Devo Race Academy started and
what is Project?
Speaker 2 (03:35):
2028?
As a project of the DC VeloCycling Club in the DC area,
which is one of the largest,most established clubs in the
region, and so the idea back in2018 was to start and support a
(03:56):
junior team.
Dc Velo is generally anestablished master's club, so
for two years it was the DC Velojunior team established masters
club so for two years it wasthe DC Velo junior team.
And then we wanted to create anidentity for the junior racers
to have their own team and theirown, their own kit, like, like
and to and to mimic some of theestablished teams, the top teams
(04:19):
in the United States, like HotTubes, lux and others.
At the time, we had, just byluck and through the great
grassroots programs in the DCarea like Rock Creek Velo,
baltimore Youth Cycling.
We had a group of very talentedjunior boys at the time, so
they formed the first group ofDC Velo, which then became DC
(04:44):
Diva Riders, and we recruitedfrom riders that they knew
generally within thePennsylvania and DC area and
immediately had significantsuccess at the national level,
winning the 15-16 nationalchampionships.
Then we also had a group ofreally talented young girls who
(05:06):
had grown up in these sameprograms the Rock Creek Velo,
catherine Sarkisov, and then heryounger sister, alyssa, lydia,
and then Lydia's brother, nathan.
These are all riders who hadgrown up training together and
racing together.
They are extraordinary riders.
They've won multiple nationalchampionships.
Cyclocross road racing have doneextremely well in Europe.
(05:29):
They've been consistently onthe US national team and then
those riders just based on howgreat those riders are boys, and
has ended up being the topjunior girls team in the country
.
So right now I think we havehalf of the US national team
(05:55):
coming from our team and theworld's team.
So this year we won everynational championship.
The boys are also incredible.
For the boys there's more of anopportunity for the 17 and 18
boys.
There are other programs likeHot Tubes, ef, cycling.
We have relationships withthose teams.
We're not proprietary about ourriders.
We've had riders who are 15, 16boys that come through our
(06:18):
program and then they go to EF,like Jacob Hines from Baltimore.
Luca went to Hot Tubes and wedon't mind that because those
teams have more resources tosupport European racing for the
boys than we do.
We do that for the girls andthat's the national and
international focus is really afocus for us on the girls
program, but we support the boysjust as well.
(06:39):
So that's the origin.
It was a master's, established,well-resourced master's team in
this area, looking to create anational level platform for the
top regional junior cyclists,which has then expanded to be
more of a national program,particularly on the girls' side.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
I want to say thanks everybody for joining us.
Can we just go quick around thehorn of who we have on this
call, and that's Ryan McKinney,justin Mock and Chris Hardy.
And Chris, because I'm startingwith you on the first question
just make a quick intro of whoyou are, what your role is on
the team and what your day jobis.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yeah, my name is Chris Hardy.
I'm one of the managers, alongwith Ryan and, I guess, justin,
what are you?
Director sportif?
The three of us run the team.
And Ryan and I were involved instarting the team, even Ryan
before me, I think.
I joined a year after he did.
I have, along with all theseguys, a long background in
competitive cycling from back inthe 90s.
(07:38):
I was a Cat 1 cyclist and won alot of races.
And my son became a competitivecyclist and raced at a very
high level, raced in Europe andwas one of the early riders on
the team.
He's left the team and he's incollege, but I've stayed
involved in the program.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
All right, mr McKinney.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
Hey, yeah, I'm Mr McKinney.
For my day job I am a middleschool science teacher, but I am
all in on cycling and have beensince I was 13 years old and
way back then the mentors thathelped me kind of navigate this
very outside of the norm sportin the United States were just
(08:20):
people that changed my life.
My life and this program kindof came out of that wanting to
give back and be a mentor andhelp guide junior cyclists
through what can sometimes bejust an absolutely, you know,
confusing and disorientingexperience, even though they
have a passion for the sport.
(08:40):
So give them kind of a northstar if, if, you will.
Speaker 4 (08:43):
So yeah, we have an attorney we've got a school
teacher and now we got Mr Mock.
Yeah, so, justin Mock.
I grew up in the DC area racing.
I think my first race I was 11.
Uh, first USAC race.
Um, fell in love with it, racedmore and more until, uh, you
know, graduating juniors racingsome domestically and
(09:05):
internationally had a great time, decided to move on past the
sport and Ryan called me one dayand was like, hey, we're
getting this team rolling and Ikind of want to take it to the
next level and bring some morehelp in.
And I thought that would be areally cool opportunity to share
(09:25):
my experiences, kind of help,like Ryan said, be a North Star,
share what I did wrong and tryand guide these kids to not make
mistakes that you know I mayhave made, and not just cycling
(09:45):
guidance, but try and shapethese kids into really good
people.
And I'd like to really umhighlight that in in what we do
on DC.
Devo is, you know, shaping kidsinto being quality adults.
Um, and I really like to seethat these graduating classes we
have.
Not everyone goes on continuingcycling, go off to college,
(10:09):
whatever, move on in life tosomething new and just seeing
the good people were growing outof the sport is really cool
yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
And I got to echo that.
I mean, I think, like when I'mat the races and observing other
teams bigger teams, smallerteams it's like the quality of
our kids, like the quality ofthe people of our kids, it's
like super high, like I actuallyenjoy hanging out with who they
are, cause they're funny,they're smart, they can break
down a race, they care aboutstuff, as opposed to just some
(10:39):
jokesters out there that canstill be in the junior world.
So I think we're, you guys,have done a fantastic job of not
only, uh, creating success onthe team but also just create an
environment to grow good peopleand I think that that, you know
, that's a huge part of adevelopmental program, because
you want, you want people thatare, you know, helping them
become better people.
You want directors that arehelping them become uh, so that
(11:02):
whatever we learn in sport, wecan bridge over to the rest of
them.
As we are kind of poking aroundhere, we'll get into the
questions and since I had Chrisqueued up for that first big
picture of sorts, I'll come backto mock for this first question
and this, this, all three ofthese questions, by the way, for
our audience members are comingfrom you, so you have written
(11:24):
in, you've asked about, um,junior development, junior
coaching and how does it work.
So this first one is uh, I'lljust read the original question
and I'll have mock uh start toanswer it and I will chime in
here too, cause there's somecoaching stuff on it.
So uh, first question is canyou talk about the specifics of
coaching young athletes?
We know younger athletes needmore variety for proper athletic
(11:45):
development and it should befun and social.
When all of that is done right,there must be a physiological
driven part of coachingstructure for proper development
into a better racer.
It would be interesting to hearfrom you about this topic.
Cheers Tonko so Mach.
When I kind of read thatquestion about coaching young
(12:08):
athletes need for variety andsome of the physiological
aspects that drive thatdevelopment, where do you want
to start on answering that?
Speaker 4 (12:24):
The importance, like in the question, is the variety
In coaching a young athlete.
The motivation has to be comingfrom themselves.
It can't be from their parents,it can't be from their coach,
it can't be from their team.
The motivation, if it's comingfrom those sources, this rider's
(12:46):
either quitting cycling whilethey're still a junior or, as
soon as they're done as a junior, is quitting cycling.
The sport is far too hard, uh,far too many days where you're
like, you know, off the back,you've flatted out of a race,
you've crashed out of a race,pouring rain, you know weather's
awful, you're heading outtraining, you're just going to
quit.
So, uh, motivation has to comewithin, um.
(13:09):
But as another part of thatquestion is like the healthy
movement outside of just, youknow, going and pedaling your
bike for zone two, consistency,like go do long training hours,
um, but the core work, makingsure you're stretching and doing
those things as well as notjust being only a road rider, I
(13:33):
think it's good A lot of ourriders do cyclocross in the
winter and what that does foryour body and running toughens
your bones and just makes youstronger across the board.
It's not just about pedaling,um yeah, fully agree with that.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
And I think, to touch on some of those points, I
think depends on how young theyactually are, because, uh, chris
, remind me, uh, what are theages that we start taking on
athletes on DC Devo 15.
So some of the riders, the Ithink the youngest was Ethan.
I think I started talking tohim when I was like 12, right.
What I told his dad was listen,I'll talk to him once in a
(14:16):
while, but I'm not even going towrite a training program
because I want him playingbasketball, I want him riding
his bike, his mountain bike, allthe bikes, right, and volume's
going to kept low and just doother stuff.
And that was the approach forthe first, probably year and a
half, and then we stepped up thevolume a little bit and started
to ride the bike more, get intoraces, focus on fun for the
races and then keep on doingother stuff playing basketball,
(14:38):
playing soccer, doing that kindof thing.
And so Lydia as well, lydiaCusack.
She was a soccer player beforeshe started to do bikes more
full time and I was encouragingher, along with her parents, to
just keep on doing soccer aslong as it was fun, just keep on
going with it, just keep onplaying different sports of
(15:00):
movement patterns for kids andmotor skill development of all
the things is really importantdown the road.
Um, because whether they are,you know, go on and race, cycle,
cross or just road or mountainbike, but reaction times and
bone structure and full range ofmotion, this is what we want.
So I think the in terms of thatstructure, I don't.
(15:21):
What I can say is like keep themmoving, keep them doing things
when they're young, up to maybelike 16, then 17, where they can
start to specialize a littlebit more.
But this is what I was sayingin the in the um introduction is
for 14, 15, 16 year olds.
They kind of follow what I seeas a time crunched, cyclist sort
(15:42):
of pattern.
They're doing volumes that aremaybe six to 10 hours a week,
oftentimes right, and andthey're not going super epic,
they're not going super long upuntil their bodies can tolerate
it, and in that way you know,then, what we're working on is
the process, the fun likebouncing, making training
(16:04):
sessions that are moreskill-based, more fun-based.
Students, you know, circle atdeath and some of these other,
like skills on the bike versusjust chasing volume.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Observing junior cycling and the development of
junior cycling and from all theteams that we've been involved
in, and then seeing what they'redoing in Europe.
There is, I think that's true.
I think what there's, a balance, though, because when they, if
you're looking to get to thelevel where you can race
successfully at 17, 18, whereyou're trying to make national
team at 17, 18, really this isgoing to depend on the type of
(16:33):
rider and what their ambitionsare.
I mean, there's some juniorswho just want to have a good
time in the sport, and that'stotally great.
To get to the level wherethey're going to race on like
the national team, or they'regoing to be a contender at
nationals, the volume that I'veseen for a lot of riders
increases significantly, um,after like around 15 years old,
and then and then it's achallenge like the the best
(16:55):
riders are the riders that wehave to hold back.
I'm sure, like that's yourexperience as a coach like ones
who are, like you know, lookingat the, the volume or some of
the rides that these young girlslike Alyssa and Lydia would do,
they would just go out and domonster rides I don't know what
their total volume is and theywould do.
Early on they were doing gravelraces that were long and hard,
with, like men at high speeds.
(17:16):
They were winning, you know,the monster cross gravel race,
which is a three hour long race.
Like that's the level that theywere at when they were 15 years
old.
Like they won that race in thepro women when they were 15.
Right, so riders can't thinkthat they're going to be able to
do all the sports and not rideand compete against somebody
like that.
It's not going to happen.
So then it becomes.
(17:39):
You know one way to avoid, likethe, you know, just always
riding doing.
One thing is what you're sayingis they all did different things
on the bike they're mountainbiking, they're cyclocross,
they're gravel racing, they'reroad racing and they're getting
in a lot of the variety that way, when they are forced to make a
decision to stop doing othersports.
Like Alyssa was a top ski racer, so was Catherine Sarkisov,
(18:03):
lydia was a great soccer player,cora is a great soccer player.
Ultimately, they have to becomebike racers.
Catherine Sarkisov, lydia was agreat soccer player, gore is a
great soccer player.
Ultimately, they have to becomebike racers.
Right, that's just theunfortunate fact that parents, I
think, have to understand,because there are too many good
juniors, like the top juniorsnow, that are going to, like the
17-year-old boys that theseguys you're going to face off
against, they're going to proteams in Europe right, I'm
talking about the top four orfive.
(18:23):
In the US it's not as deep here, but those are the ones who are
going to be dictating the speedof the race.
So, like the 17-year-olds aregoing to go into a race that's
going to be run at a much fasterpace than a pro one-two race
with men or women.
You know there has to be thatsense of realism from the
parents and from the ridersabout what they're kind of
getting themselves into.
And then it's a tricky balancethat coaches like yourself and
(18:50):
others have to manage.
Like you have to do enough butyou don't want to burn out
somebody young, and we've seenthat happen with lots of riders,
sometimes of their ownmotivation.
They're just out there justgrinding away all the time
because they're self-motivated,but ultimately it's just too
much and they need to be heldback.
So it's a hard sport thatrequires a lot of training and
it's not like other sports whereyou can really afford to do a
bunch of different things, likedifferent ball sports, like you
have people who are good atfootball, good at this or good
(19:11):
at that.
If you're going to be a cyclist,you're going to be a cyclist.
I think that's my view.
Maybe maybe some of you woulddisagree.
And it's like I guess it's thequestion of what age you start
doing that Cause obviouslythere's.
There's some top riders we'veheard about, like Remco and
others, who they have theability and they jump into the
sport when they're 17 and comein from other sports and
dominate.
But that's so far outside thenorm that if you do that norm,
(19:33):
you know the usual course andyou show up at a 17, 18 race,
you're just going to get blownout, you know.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Yeah, and I think too , you hit the nail on the head.
It depends on that age, andwhat's tricky about juniors is
their growth rate and their rateof development is all over the
place.
When we're talking kind of that13 to 16, a lot happens there.
And so, like ballpark here,like 13 to 14-year-olds
generally, maybe 200, 250 hoursa year and that's like maybe six
(20:02):
hours of training.
But you go up to 15, 16, andall of a sudden we're like 300,
400 hours of training, right.
And then all of a sudden that'slike the determiner or decision
point of okay, are we going totake this to the next level and
grow bigger.
And then what I would do is I'dtake that, that individual
athlete and try to grow thetotal annual hours by 10 to 15%
each year.
So then you move up to likethat 600, you know, maybe 600
(20:26):
hours for a 17 year old andgoing up to potentially 800
hours for an 18 year old.
If they've chosen that path andif they've have been racing and
doing something on a bike forsince age 10, which some of
these riders that we're talkingabout have in 800 hours, it's a
lot of fricking training.
So we're all over the placewith, like this, general
(20:46):
ballpark of uh you know,competing to get the
participation trophy, to gettingserious to elite.
But I think what's sointeresting, fascinating and
rewarding about this age groupis stuff happens so quickly and
their dose response to trainingis very different than us
middle-aged folk who are alltalking on this podcast right
(21:08):
now.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Because those changes happen so quickly.
You can't make anything ofeither your success or failure
at a young age, like when you're13 or 14, versus even when
you're 15.
You see all the time, theseriders who are winning races
when they're 13 or 14.
It's just because they'redevelopmentally so much more
advanced than you know, theirtheir peers.
They've just grown faster, uh,but then other riders catch up
(21:32):
and everything flips around andthat does.
It's not sustainable.
So people need to be patientand they need to focus on the
training and just really likeinto race and ride at that age
and not be put under anypressure by parents or anything
else for like results, even upto 15, because then that's going
to all flip around Right.
And sometimes these youngerriders who are smaller riders,
(21:52):
who are like just trying to like, hang in there with these
bigger guys.
They end up being strongbecause they build the
resilience you know and ifthey're not quitting and they're
doing that, then those arepeople could go on to become
really good riders.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Completely agree.
And so to Tonko, thank you forwriting that in Cause.
I mean, it's a, it's a very bigquestion.
I think we touched on a fewthings, uh, you know, directly
related to that.
I take that individual approach.
I kind of see like what, whatother sports have they been
doing, how long they've beenriding, and then kind of grow
them from there and beconservative but also focus on
the process, focus, focus on thegamification of learning how to
(22:24):
actually race.
That's another huge componentof it, of which we'll get into
that, maybe a little bit more inquestion too.
So I'm going to, I'm going tokick it over to McKinney for
this one, because we got to.
We're the time crunch, cyclist,ryan, we got to keep going here
.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
That's right, keep it going.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
That's right, so here's.
Here's the second question.
This one's coming from Kim andshe says my kids are 12 and 14,
just getting into cycling andcurious about racing.
I know you coach juniorathletes.
How do we find a good juniorprogram?
What should we look for in aprogram and when should they
start racing?
Anything else I should thinkabout?
(22:59):
Sorry, I'm new to this wholething.
Thanks, uh, thanks, and anyadvice is appreciated, kim.
All right, ryan.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Yeah, ryan, yeah, yeah, kim.
Uh, first of all, it's ablessing if your children are at
all interested in cyclinganyway.
So, yeah, knowing where to takethat interest and that
curiosity is so important and itreally, in my experience, it
depends on a lot of differentthings.
Um, you know what is doable foryou and your family, like how
(23:26):
far are you willing to go tomake this interest in cycling
possible for your, for yourchildren?
So the first thing to do is seeif there's any information at
your local bike shop is a greatplace to start.
The next place to look would beany junior programs like NICA
is a great school-based programfor mountain biking.
(23:49):
The next thing to do is look atlocal cycling clubs, depending
on where you are in the country.
As far as what you should lookfor in a program, the first one
is one that is fun andinteresting and inviting and one
(24:10):
that you know wants to helpyour child or children learn how
to be safe on a bike, how to,you know, ride within a group in
a safe way and buildcamaraderie and community while
doing those things.
And then, once that kind offoundation is established, then
(24:35):
you can start thinking like,okay, my child knows how to ride
safely on their bike, they knowhow to ride in a group, and
then you can say like, okay,racing that's a thing, and I
don't want to say like that'sthe only route, because there
are different types of racing.
What I was just talking aboutwas mostly road racing, but a
(24:56):
great way if your child is justinterested in what a race might
feel like is trying out mountainbiking or cyclocross racing,
and here in our community in themid-Atlantic we have just this
amazing cyclocross communitythat embraces the junior
(25:17):
programs in this area.
It's just the big funnel intocycling in this area.
Cyclocross racing is mostly donein parks, so it's a fully
closed course, so it's supersafe for the racers.
But it also demands a lot ofthe riders.
It teaches them incredible bikehandling skills.
(25:41):
It teaches them when to put alot of power into their pedaling
and when to be in a state offinesse where they're having to
kind of move their way throughtechnical obstacles.
They're going to have to getoff their bike and run.
So it's a great avenue intocycling.
(26:02):
Super fun experience, um, intocycling super fun, um experience
.
And then, as far as anythingelse to think about, uh, if I
was a parent who had childreninterested in cycling, I would
caution you, um, to justunderstand that the sport is uh,
as Chris and Adam and Justinhave said, it is a, it's a.
(26:23):
It's a really tough sport andthat motivation piece that was
referred to earlier, um, isreally important.
This is not a sport thatparents can say, you know you're
going to be a cyclist, and hereyou go, like, go get after it.
Um, because it's a grueling,brutal sport, uh, and if the
motivation is coming fromanywhere other than the child,
(26:47):
it's not going to be sustainable.
All that said, it is awonderful, awesome community
where people you know push eachother to limits they didn't know
they could reach, and you knowthat's the really great side of
it.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
Yeah, that's well.
That is an all encompassinganswer.
One thing I'll add to that isin my intro I said, you know,
this thing takes a village, likeyou know, developing an athlete
from you know, super young upuntil, if they go, elite and all
that kind of stuff.
And in that village, you knowit's, it's the parents, first
and foremost, because I meanthey're getting them to the
races, and foremost cause I meanthey're getting them to the
(27:26):
races and and I mean they'retaking huge polls, but then it's
directors and coaches andguidance counselors like you
that are doing a huge efforts atthe races themselves.
So I think, yeah to the Ryan'spoint, kim.
It's like look for a dynamic,communicative, open-minded group
like these three here, and oneof the ways is just like get to
the races, get some of thoseexposures, um, and organically,
(27:48):
that's a really great, great wayto do it.
Uh, to you, chris, because youare kind of like whenever I have
a question I reach out to youand you always have an answer,
um, but is there like a clubfinder sort of website on like
usacling or anything from awebsite that somebody could just
Google, I believe?
Speaker 2 (28:07):
USA Cycling's website has a list of what they call
the Centers for Excellence.
We're one of those, but thereare lots of junior programs
around the country that havethat label and there's so many
great junior programs and mostof them focus on cyclocross and
they're also mountain bikeprograms and I fully agree that
(28:29):
that's where to start as ajunior Cyclocross.
It's so much fun.
The kids like it.
They train together in a park acouple days a week.
It's just super great and it'sa type of event where you can
race it really hard, but you canalso just go out there and just
give it your best shot.
Everybody has a good time.
Different kids are afterdifferent things.
(28:50):
Some are just really trying togo out there and just hammer
everybody.
Others are trying to go outthere and the courses are super
fun.
Obstacle courses and mountainbiking is the same way.
So it's it's competitive, butit's it's not competitive Like
in road racing.
Road racing you're either inthe race or you're kind of out
the back, and it's kind ofeither or and it can be
demoralizing.
And it's also the other events,as Ryan was saying, they're
(29:12):
technical but they're at muchslower speeds, so they're much
safer.
You don't have the issues thatyou do on the road.
But there are many, many clubsIn the DC area.
I mean our club wouldn't existwithout Rock Creek Velo or now
BYC we're getting riders fromand we've all benefited from
that and it's a huge, awesomeprogram.
They take the kids out on theroad.
It's been a project of somereally awesome parents that have
(29:34):
stuck with it over the yearsand have cycled through there.
My son went through that.
All of our top riders Sarkisovs,cusacks, everybody came out of
Rock Creek Velo.
You know the same with BoulderJunior Cycling out in Boulder
and there's some other programslike that up in the Midwest.
There's some really bigprograms.
So you can find these by goingto the USA Cycling website or
(29:57):
also just Googling JuniorCycling Clubs and there's going
to be a great program in yourarea if you're in a fairly
populated area.
And then the NICA mountainbiking series for middle schools
and high schools.
That's the biggest, mostsuccessful junior development
program right now in the UnitedStates.
They have huge turnout andthose races are again.
(30:17):
They're super fun.
Kids are out there having agreat time just hanging out with
their friends and you also havesome super high-level racing
going on and kids who go fromthat to like national level
competition.
You know riders like KateCourtney other top riders have
come out of this programs sothat that's like a real bright
spot in US cycling.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
No, that's great and, kim, super good question.
Tons of resources out there,google it, go to USA Cycling and
, heck, if you can't findanything, reach out to me, and I
will likely just reach out toChris Hardy and, uh, find
something that fits for you aswell.
So, moving on to the thirdquestion, which is it's a.
This is also a very goodquestion and hits on, uh, like a
(30:57):
really unique aspect of oursport, and I want, I want
everybody to chime in on thisone and I'll I'll start with you
mock, um, but cause racing as ajunior and kind of like
caddying up as you go.
I think this, this pertains.
So here's here's the originalquestion.
Uh, my kids are racing asjuniors and the team they're on
encourages riding and racingwith grown adults.
Is this normal?
(31:18):
Shouldn't kids just race kids?
I know you've mentioned workingwith juniors in the past, so
please shed some light on this.
Or maybe I just need to relax.
If this is how it's done, mykids are 15 and 16.
Thanks, robert.
So a block Is that a normalaspect of the sport and why is
it?
Speaker 4 (31:36):
You're not going to be able to have juniors ride
together every day of the week.
Our juniors are kind of spreadout across the area.
It's not football practice,it's not, you know, five nights
a week, uh, football practicewith all your teammates.
It's not that.
You know.
I lived out in NorthernVirginia.
There's no way I'd be gettinginto DC to do these RCV group
(31:58):
rides.
So the local group ride I wasdoing was the rest and bike club
.
I was the only junior, sototally normal.
Speaker 1 (32:07):
How did you identify that that group ride was
appropriate for you?
Like speed wise, group wise,safety wise.
Like, how was that done?
Speaker 4 (32:15):
It's probably my coach telling me to go do the
group ride.
My coach knew about the ride.
Um, I was on NCVC as a junior.
We had the NCVC adult team too.
So you kind of mix and minglewith those riders and find
mentors.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
There's lots of different types of group rides.
Some are less safe than others,some are more mellow, so you
can inquire in the communityabout which ones to start out
with.
If you have a junior, it's veryimportant because, as Justin
was saying, the juniors.
There are not enough juniorsfor juniors to ride together,
and also there are not enoughjuniors for juniors to race
(32:53):
together, except for at the bignational events.
So to learn to race a bike,you're going to have to race
with men.
That's just the fact.
And those races unfortunately,like at the beginner levels, are
not entirely safe.
That's an aspect of the sportthat parents and riders have to
figure out what they want to do,and that's going to go back to
(33:14):
what we were talking aboutearlier, which is what is the
objective of the rider.
And if you don't want to dothat, stick with cyclocross and
mountain biking.
And then, if you get strongenough and you're older, then
you want to jump into that Ifthey really want to be
successful on the road.
All of our riders were racingand doing well in men's racing
when they were like 15 years old, like our girls were winning
you know all the women's raceswhen they're at that age.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
Yeah, I was just going to say it's common for
girls to jump in the threes withthe men.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
Our girls, when they were 16, were racing in men's
three races.
Right, that's how crazytalented they are and we had
encouraged that.
We talked to them.
I remember talking to theirparents like this is what they
got to do because the women'sfield is too small and it's not
competitive enough for them.
They need to build the speed,because what they were looking
to build to is racing in Europe,where you're going to be racing
in the fields of very fastgirls but where you have 90 in
(34:03):
the field and if you're racingin a field of like 15 or 20, and
you're by far the strongestrider, you might as well be out
riding by yourself.
And that's kind of what's theirexperience.
Often when racing in the women'sfields, they need to ride in a
race that's got a lot ofdynamics, a lot of attacking,
recovery, managing your bike,and now they're great bike
handlers.
They can manage a field.
If riders want to develop now,they have to be aiming to get up
(34:26):
into the men's races.
You know when we were liketrying to get our 15, 16s get to
be a Cat 3, race in the men'sCat 3 races.
Start doing well in thosepodium in the men's Cat 3.
By the time you're 17, cat two,you know, and on up right and
then, because that's the levelof riders that they're racing
against, if they really want todo well at nationals, if they
want to try to get on like thenational team, because those
(34:47):
guys are all like cat ones bythe time they're 18 I think.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
For from robert's point of view, you know, here in
the united states it is unusualfor for children in sports to
be competing against adults.
So, robert, I hear you, butcycling is such a unique kind of
group, and also the physics ofthe sport make it so that we can
(35:15):
compete against each other atdifferent age groups.
So it seems strange, but itdoes make a lot of sense.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
It's a function of the numbers or the lack of
numbers for the juniors in theUnited States.
In Europe and Belgium it's notpermitted for juniors to race
with adults, right, they have 15, 16 categories and they race
together.
They don't race up even withthe 17, 18s, 17s, 18s race
together and they can't race upeven with the 17, 18s, 17s, 18s
race together and they can'trace you, 23 or elites.
But they have 80 to 90 kids ineach of those categories and
(35:45):
those races and those races aresuper competitive.
Here there's just not enoughjuniors, unless you go to the
big race, like the three or fouror five in the country
nationals, Valley of the Sun,their Lago Vista in Texas and
others where you're going to geta field sizes where you can
actually learn the sport.
So it's just a function of bikeracing in the United States
(36:05):
compared to Europe.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
And that was that was the main point I was I was
hoping we'd hammer out is isexactly that, chris.
But I think, to McKinney'spoint, the way we do it or the
way our culture does it in theUnited States is drastically
different than Europe.
But there's also some beautybehind that too, because I think
the sport of cycling itself hasthis like accessibility to it.
(36:27):
I think that there's a there'sa lot of beauty behind that too,
and so I think you, you leaninto that.
But, yeah, robert, um, it'sweird, but it's also really cool
because we're open to havingthese age categories like get
those experiences so they canincrease, you know, up in
category and get more high levelcompetitions and stuff.
(36:48):
But, Ryan, lastly, do you, Imean, is that the way it was
when you were a junior, climbingthe ranks as well?
Speaker 3 (36:53):
Yeah, absolutely, that's all.
In fact, there was very littlesupport in the mid-Atlantic area
for junior cyclists when I wasyoung, and I'm sure Chris
probably feels the same way, butthat's all I did.
The only junior races I did waswhen there was, you know, the
(37:13):
big national events, and thatwas it.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Other than that, that there was a junior category
here, um, but it had maybe sixor seven riders, so it wasn't
even worth to, I mean reallyparticipating in and so I think,
like you know, with, with allthat being said, I mean it's,
it's um, you know, with whatwe're doing, like on the dc devo
race academy, I mean it is, inmy opinion, very special and but
(37:40):
I'm I'm close to the sport, I'min it.
You know, juniors are both likefrustrating and rewarding all
at the same time to coach and Iabsolutely love it.
So here's the shameless plug Ifpeople are like you know what I
really love bikes and I want tosupport like, if they want to
support DC Devo as like anindividual club, chris, how
(38:02):
would they do that?
And also, like big picture here, what else could listeners do
to ensure that the future of thesport is successful and has
these opportunities long term,to keep on racing up, take it to
the next level if that's whatthey want to do, or just be in
love with bikes for longevity?
Speaker 2 (38:23):
I think the main thing they can do to make the
sport successful would if theyhave kids that are interested in
the sport or if they want tointroduce their kids to it, just
to find some of these reallygreat grassroots programs and
help keep those programs goingand support those programs.
I think those are extremelyimportant.
Contribute to NICA and then forprograms like ours we exist to
(38:45):
provide a platform for that nextlevel of talented riders who
want to race nationally andinternationally.
We depend on those programs.
I mean, we do our fundraisingthrough, largely supported by
the DC Velo generous members onthe team who are have been super
supportive of the program overthe years, and we do some
fundraising on on Facebook andInstagram.
Speaker 4 (39:07):
One thing I'd add to that, uh, chris, is if, if
you're someone who hasexperience that happens to be
listening to this, you know,came up through the ranks, is
it's not just money, it's timethis team, like if it wasn't for
the three of us, uh, and Adamtoo, subbing in the time is a
really hard thing.
(39:27):
We're, all you know, busypeople with things in our life,
um, but I do think that thejuniors find it valuable for us
to be there and be supportingand like giving our knowledge.
So valuable for us to be thereand be supporting and like
giving our knowledge.
So, uh, you know, and it feelsreally good when I am able to
make the time to go be at theraces.
Uh, so, time, if you're, ifyou're someone that thinks could
(39:53):
help find a local program andask like, hey, do you guys need,
you know, an extra hand.
Speaker 1 (39:55):
Yeah, yeah, and I think this is one quick story of
just like our nationalchampionships um, a few weeks
ago.
Here in this, to pull the veilback on how some of this works
is like we had a meeting on zoombefore that.
Mckinney was leading right, allthe riders jumped on, we jumped
on.
We had a game plan for the raceitself.
Hardy got there for the timetrial because the rest of us
(40:17):
weren't there yet.
We couldn't make it because wewere doing our other jobs.
And Hardy basically high fivesmock, who comes in and takes the
rain for like the, the crit,and I met him for the crits and
then the road race.
Mock goes to a wedding afterthe crits and he comes back like
in time, and then I had to takethe boys, cause that was like
the early race.
I high five him.
(40:39):
He takes the girls for the roadrace that day and like we just
make it work.
And so there's no like supermagic recipe we're not a high
budget team but like we make itwork and you keep it chill for
the riders so that they canfocus on their performance, and
that that passion in that timeis probably more valuable than
the money itself, even thoughyou need the money to fund the
(41:00):
thing.
So mock, I mean kudos forsaying that if you have that
expertise and you have timeavailable, it goes a long way,
because kids will remember thatforever.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
It really is about cultivating a fun, supportive
environment for young people whohave an interest and a drive to
do something that is physically, mentally, emotionally
challenging and helping themreach new heights.
And then, when that supportleads to successes, it really is
(41:37):
just a feeling that you can'tget from any other effort, and
so just a really, reallyfantastic experience to grow
with these young people andtheir families into, you know, a
sport that we all love, andthat's what this is all about.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
All right, last last little bit and then we'll wrap
up.
If someone hears this andthey're in the mid Atlantic
region, chris, how does it work?
If they want to get their kidinvolved in their uh, 15 years
old, what do they do?
Speaker 2 (42:04):
I mean, they could reach out to us on our, you know
, dm us on our Instagram page atDC, uh, devo racing Academy.
And uh, yeah, that's probablythe best way and we respond.
Speaker 1 (42:23):
We've.
I just had an inquiry fromsomeone today who is interested.
Yeah, and I'll add in I meanwe've got a rider from Montana
right, so it doesn't even haveto be our region itself, because
we do get to bigger nationalraces and then partner with USA
Cycling to get to internationalstuff.
Well, gentlemen, I thank you somuch for your time.
We will get this out to themasses and I do think our
audience members at least theones who wrote in, but those who
are hanging on and stilllistening to us go along.
Hopefully you learn something.
(42:43):
If a junior shows up to yourrace or your group ride, it's
not that abnormal, especiallyhere in the United States.
So lean in, help the kid Ifyou've got some of that
expertise, and let them go andgrow into that next future
generation.
To let them go and grow intothat next future generation.
So to you guys, thank you foreverything, including all your
efforts on this program.
It is absolutely fun to be justa little spoke in this wheel,
(43:05):
so thanks for putting this on.
Speaker 3 (43:06):
Yeah, thank you.
Speaker 1 (43:10):
Thanks for joining us on the time crunch cyclist
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(43:32):
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This is the Time Crunch Cyclistpodcast, our show dedicated to
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I'm your host, coach AdamPulford, and I'm one of the over
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(00:30):
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ultimately become the bestcyclist that you can be.
Now on to our show.
Now onto our show.
Junior cycling is something thatis near and dear to my heart.
(00:51):
It's fun at times, challengingat times, yet it seems to be
rewarding all the time.
Now, most of you listeningright now are not juniors.
So why am I taking a wholeepisode on this topic?
Well, because some of you askedfor it.
Like many of the topics andquestions covered on this
podcast, it's from our audiencereaching out to learn more about
(01:12):
something.
Recently, we've had severalinquiries about juniors training
programs, how to find a gooddevelopmental program and when
it's appropriate to start racing.
So I'm pretty solid on thecoaching and physiology side of
things for junior stuff, but thedevelopmental aspect is a much
bigger picture.
It takes a village to do itright, and a giant part of that
(01:33):
village is the parentsthemselves.
It's that family unit.
Now the other large part ofthat village are the directors
and coaches that work on theseprograms, getting the athletes
to the races and getting themthe support that they need when
it matters most.
I couldn't think of any bettervillage people to help answer
these questions than the ones Iwork with on the DC Devo Race
(01:55):
Academy.
So I have recorded a podcastwith them ahead of time.
Their names are Chris Hardy Sr,justin Mock and Ryan McKinney.
I recorded this ahead of timeand then I did this intro just
afterwards because I didn't knowexactly what I was going to get
when I recorded with them.
You'll see that they are just amix of amazing people all
(02:18):
together.
We went a little long.
The goal is to shape it down,so it's not going to be super
long.
The end product I'm not toosure what it is right now as I
read this intro to you, buthere's a few things that and a
few reasons why I think thatthis podcast and this episode is
so important.
Because, number one, kids arethe future generation of the
(02:39):
sport and we want to see themflourish.
If you have kids, it's good toknow the options and
opportunities out there forprograms and proper development
in this sport.
Now, even if you don't havekids, you may learn a thing or
two if these juniors show up onyour group ride or you start
racing with them at some localrace.
And lastly, at least the way Icoach juniors up until they're
(03:01):
around 17 or 18 years old coachjuniors up until they're around
17 or 18 years old.
They look very similar to a timecrunched athlete in terms of
their volume, uh per uh per week, and their total annual hours.
Okay, so we may be able totease out some training tips for
anybody listening to thispodcast.
So, with that being said, uh,let's get into the show, let's
(03:23):
have you learn who thesedirectors are and let's learn
more about junior racingprograms.
So, chris, can you tell us howDC Devo Race Academy started and
what is Project?
Speaker 2 (03:35):
2028?
As a project of the DC VeloCycling Club in the DC area,
which is one of the largest,most established clubs in the
region, and so the idea back in2018 was to start and support a
(03:56):
junior team.
Dc Velo is generally anestablished master's club, so
for two years it was the DC Velojunior team established masters
club so for two years it wasthe DC Velo junior team.
And then we wanted to create anidentity for the junior racers
to have their own team and theirown, their own kit, like, like
and to and to mimic some of theestablished teams, the top teams
(04:19):
in the United States, like HotTubes, lux and others.
At the time, we had, just byluck and through the great
grassroots programs in the DCarea like Rock Creek Velo,
baltimore Youth Cycling.
We had a group of very talentedjunior boys at the time, so
they formed the first group ofDC Velo, which then became DC
(04:44):
Diva Riders, and we recruitedfrom riders that they knew
generally within thePennsylvania and DC area and
immediately had significantsuccess at the national level,
winning the 15-16 nationalchampionships.
Then we also had a group ofreally talented young girls who
(05:06):
had grown up in these sameprograms the Rock Creek Velo,
catherine Sarkisov, and then heryounger sister, alyssa, lydia,
and then Lydia's brother, nathan.
These are all riders who hadgrown up training together and
racing together.
They are extraordinary riders.
They've won multiple nationalchampionships.
Cyclocross road racing have doneextremely well in Europe.
(05:29):
They've been consistently onthe US national team and then
those riders just based on howgreat those riders are boys, and
has ended up being the topjunior girls team in the country
.
So right now I think we havehalf of the US national team
(05:55):
coming from our team and theworld's team.
So this year we won everynational championship.
The boys are also incredible.
For the boys there's more of anopportunity for the 17 and 18
boys.
There are other programs likeHot Tubes, ef, cycling.
We have relationships withthose teams.
We're not proprietary about ourriders.
We've had riders who are 15, 16boys that come through our
(06:18):
program and then they go to EF,like Jacob Hines from Baltimore.
Luca went to Hot Tubes and wedon't mind that because those
teams have more resources tosupport European racing for the
boys than we do.
We do that for the girls andthat's the national and
international focus is really afocus for us on the girls
program, but we support the boysjust as well.
(06:39):
So that's the origin.
It was a master's, established,well-resourced master's team in
this area, looking to create anational level platform for the
top regional junior cyclists,which has then expanded to be
more of a national program,particularly on the girls' side.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
I want to say thanks everybody for joining us.
Can we just go quick around thehorn of who we have on this
call, and that's Ryan McKinney,justin Mock and Chris Hardy.
And Chris, because I'm startingwith you on the first question
just make a quick intro of whoyou are, what your role is on
the team and what your day jobis.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yeah, my name is Chris Hardy.
I'm one of the managers, alongwith Ryan and, I guess, justin,
what are you?
Director sportif?
The three of us run the team.
And Ryan and I were involved instarting the team, even Ryan
before me, I think.
I joined a year after he did.
I have, along with all theseguys, a long background in
competitive cycling from back inthe 90s.
(07:38):
I was a Cat 1 cyclist and won alot of races.
And my son became a competitivecyclist and raced at a very
high level, raced in Europe andwas one of the early riders on
the team.
He's left the team and he's incollege, but I've stayed
involved in the program.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
All right, mr McKinney.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
Hey, yeah, I'm Mr McKinney.
For my day job I am a middleschool science teacher, but I am
all in on cycling and have beensince I was 13 years old and
way back then the mentors thathelped me kind of navigate this
very outside of the norm sportin the United States were just
(08:20):
people that changed my life.
My life and this program kindof came out of that wanting to
give back and be a mentor andhelp guide junior cyclists
through what can sometimes bejust an absolutely, you know,
confusing and disorientingexperience, even though they
have a passion for the sport.
(08:40):
So give them kind of a northstar if, if, you will.
Speaker 4 (08:43):
So yeah, we have an attorney we've got a school
teacher and now we got Mr Mock.
Yeah, so, justin Mock.
I grew up in the DC area racing.
I think my first race I was 11.
Uh, first USAC race.
Um, fell in love with it, racedmore and more until, uh, you
know, graduating juniors racingsome domestically and
(09:05):
internationally had a great time, decided to move on past the
sport and Ryan called me one dayand was like, hey, we're
getting this team rolling and Ikind of want to take it to the
next level and bring some morehelp in.
And I thought that would be areally cool opportunity to share
(09:25):
my experiences, kind of help,like Ryan said, be a North Star,
share what I did wrong and tryand guide these kids to not make
mistakes that you know I mayhave made, and not just cycling
(09:45):
guidance, but try and shapethese kids into really good
people.
And I'd like to really umhighlight that in in what we do
on DC.
Devo is, you know, shaping kidsinto being quality adults.
Um, and I really like to seethat these graduating classes we
have.
Not everyone goes on continuingcycling, go off to college,
(10:09):
whatever, move on in life tosomething new and just seeing
the good people were growing outof the sport is really cool
yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
And I got to echo that.
I mean, I think, like when I'mat the races and observing other
teams bigger teams, smallerteams it's like the quality of
our kids, like the quality ofthe people of our kids, it's
like super high, like I actuallyenjoy hanging out with who they
are, cause they're funny,they're smart, they can break
down a race, they care aboutstuff, as opposed to just some
(10:39):
jokesters out there that canstill be in the junior world.
So I think we're, you guys,have done a fantastic job of not
only, uh, creating success onthe team but also just create an
environment to grow good peopleand I think that that, you know
, that's a huge part of adevelopmental program, because
you want, you want people thatare, you know, helping them
become better people.
You want directors that arehelping them become uh, so that
(11:02):
whatever we learn in sport, wecan bridge over to the rest of
them.
As we are kind of poking aroundhere, we'll get into the
questions and since I had Chrisqueued up for that first big
picture of sorts, I'll come backto mock for this first question
and this, this, all three ofthese questions, by the way, for
our audience members are comingfrom you, so you have written
(11:24):
in, you've asked about, um,junior development, junior
coaching and how does it work.
So this first one is uh, I'lljust read the original question
and I'll have mock uh start toanswer it and I will chime in
here too, cause there's somecoaching stuff on it.
So uh, first question is canyou talk about the specifics of
coaching young athletes?
We know younger athletes needmore variety for proper athletic
(11:45):
development and it should befun and social.
When all of that is done right,there must be a physiological
driven part of coachingstructure for proper development
into a better racer.
It would be interesting to hearfrom you about this topic.
Cheers Tonko so Mach.
When I kind of read thatquestion about coaching young
(12:08):
athletes need for variety andsome of the physiological
aspects that drive thatdevelopment, where do you want
to start on answering that?
Speaker 4 (12:24):
The importance, like in the question, is the variety
In coaching a young athlete.
The motivation has to be comingfrom themselves.
It can't be from their parents,it can't be from their coach,
it can't be from their team.
The motivation, if it's comingfrom those sources, this rider's
(12:46):
either quitting cycling whilethey're still a junior or, as
soon as they're done as a junior, is quitting cycling.
The sport is far too hard, uh,far too many days where you're
like, you know, off the back,you've flatted out of a race,
you've crashed out of a race,pouring rain, you know weather's
awful, you're heading outtraining, you're just going to
quit.
So, uh, motivation has to comewithin, um.
(13:09):
But as another part of thatquestion is like the healthy
movement outside of just, youknow, going and pedaling your
bike for zone two, consistency,like go do long training hours,
um, but the core work, makingsure you're stretching and doing
those things as well as notjust being only a road rider, I
(13:33):
think it's good A lot of ourriders do cyclocross in the
winter and what that does foryour body and running toughens
your bones and just makes youstronger across the board.
It's not just about pedaling,um yeah, fully agree with that.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
And I think, to touch on some of those points, I
think depends on how young theyactually are, because, uh, chris
, remind me, uh, what are theages that we start taking on
athletes on DC Devo 15.
So some of the riders, the Ithink the youngest was Ethan.
I think I started talking tohim when I was like 12, right.
What I told his dad was listen,I'll talk to him once in a
(14:16):
while, but I'm not even going towrite a training program
because I want him playingbasketball, I want him riding
his bike, his mountain bike, allthe bikes, right, and volume's
going to kept low and just doother stuff.
And that was the approach forthe first, probably year and a
half, and then we stepped up thevolume a little bit and started
to ride the bike more, get intoraces, focus on fun for the
races and then keep on doingother stuff playing basketball,
(14:38):
playing soccer, doing that kindof thing.
And so Lydia as well, lydiaCusack.
She was a soccer player beforeshe started to do bikes more
full time and I was encouragingher, along with her parents, to
just keep on doing soccer aslong as it was fun, just keep on
going with it, just keep onplaying different sports of
(15:00):
movement patterns for kids andmotor skill development of all
the things is really importantdown the road.
Um, because whether they are,you know, go on and race, cycle,
cross or just road or mountainbike, but reaction times and
bone structure and full range ofmotion, this is what we want.
So I think the in terms of thatstructure, I don't.
(15:21):
What I can say is like keep themmoving, keep them doing things
when they're young, up to maybelike 16, then 17, where they can
start to specialize a littlebit more.
But this is what I was sayingin the in the um introduction is
for 14, 15, 16 year olds.
They kind of follow what I seeas a time crunched, cyclist sort
(15:42):
of pattern.
They're doing volumes that aremaybe six to 10 hours a week,
oftentimes right, and andthey're not going super epic,
they're not going super long upuntil their bodies can tolerate
it, and in that way you know,then, what we're working on is
the process, the fun likebouncing, making training
(16:04):
sessions that are moreskill-based, more fun-based.
Students, you know, circle atdeath and some of these other,
like skills on the bike versusjust chasing volume.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
Observing junior cycling and the development of
junior cycling and from all theteams that we've been involved
in, and then seeing what they'redoing in Europe.
There is, I think that's true.
I think what there's, a balance, though, because when they, if
you're looking to get to thelevel where you can race
successfully at 17, 18, whereyou're trying to make national
team at 17, 18, really this isgoing to depend on the type of
(16:33):
rider and what their ambitionsare.
I mean, there's some juniorswho just want to have a good
time in the sport, and that'stotally great.
To get to the level wherethey're going to race on like
the national team, or they'regoing to be a contender at
nationals, the volume that I'veseen for a lot of riders
increases significantly, um,after like around 15 years old,
and then and then it's achallenge like the the best
(16:55):
riders are the riders that wehave to hold back.
I'm sure, like that's yourexperience as a coach like ones
who are, like you know, lookingat the, the volume or some of
the rides that these young girlslike Alyssa and Lydia would do,
they would just go out and domonster rides I don't know what
their total volume is and theywould do.
Early on they were doing gravelraces that were long and hard,
with, like men at high speeds.
(17:16):
They were winning, you know,the monster cross gravel race,
which is a three hour long race.
Like that's the level that theywere at when they were 15 years
old.
Like they won that race in thepro women when they were 15.
Right, so riders can't thinkthat they're going to be able to
do all the sports and not rideand compete against somebody
like that.
It's not going to happen.
So then it becomes.
(17:39):
You know one way to avoid, likethe, you know, just always
riding doing.
One thing is what you're sayingis they all did different things
on the bike they're mountainbiking, they're cyclocross,
they're gravel racing, they'reroad racing and they're getting
in a lot of the variety that way, when they are forced to make a
decision to stop doing othersports.
Like Alyssa was a top ski racer, so was Catherine Sarkisov,
(18:03):
lydia was a great soccer player,cora is a great soccer player.
Ultimately, they have to becomebike racers.
Catherine Sarkisov, lydia was agreat soccer player, gore is a
great soccer player.
Ultimately, they have to becomebike racers.
Right, that's just theunfortunate fact that parents, I
think, have to understand,because there are too many good
juniors, like the top juniorsnow, that are going to, like the
17-year-old boys that theseguys you're going to face off
against, they're going to proteams in Europe right, I'm
talking about the top four orfive.
(18:23):
In the US it's not as deep here, but those are the ones who are
going to be dictating the speedof the race.
So, like the 17-year-olds aregoing to go into a race that's
going to be run at a much fasterpace than a pro one-two race
with men or women.
You know there has to be thatsense of realism from the
parents and from the ridersabout what they're kind of
getting themselves into.
And then it's a tricky balancethat coaches like yourself and
(18:50):
others have to manage.
Like you have to do enough butyou don't want to burn out
somebody young, and we've seenthat happen with lots of riders,
sometimes of their ownmotivation.
They're just out there justgrinding away all the time
because they're self-motivated,but ultimately it's just too
much and they need to be heldback.
So it's a hard sport thatrequires a lot of training and
it's not like other sports whereyou can really afford to do a
bunch of different things, likedifferent ball sports, like you
have people who are good atfootball, good at this or good
(19:11):
at that.
If you're going to be a cyclist,you're going to be a cyclist.
I think that's my view.
Maybe maybe some of you woulddisagree.
And it's like I guess it's thequestion of what age you start
doing that Cause obviouslythere's.
There's some top riders we'veheard about, like Remco and
others, who they have theability and they jump into the
sport when they're 17 and comein from other sports and
dominate.
But that's so far outside thenorm that if you do that norm,
(19:33):
you know the usual course andyou show up at a 17, 18 race,
you're just going to get blownout, you know.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Yeah, and I think too , you hit the nail on the head.
It depends on that age, andwhat's tricky about juniors is
their growth rate and their rateof development is all over the
place.
When we're talking kind of that13 to 16, a lot happens there.
And so, like ballpark here,like 13 to 14-year-olds
generally, maybe 200, 250 hoursa year and that's like maybe six
(20:02):
hours of training.
But you go up to 15, 16, andall of a sudden we're like 300,
400 hours of training, right.
And then all of a sudden that'slike the determiner or decision
point of okay, are we going totake this to the next level and
grow bigger.
And then what I would do is I'dtake that, that individual
athlete and try to grow thetotal annual hours by 10 to 15%
each year.
So then you move up to likethat 600, you know, maybe 600
(20:26):
hours for a 17 year old andgoing up to potentially 800
hours for an 18 year old.
If they've chosen that path andif they've have been racing and
doing something on a bike forsince age 10, which some of
these riders that we're talkingabout have in 800 hours, it's a
lot of fricking training.
So we're all over the placewith, like this, general
(20:46):
ballpark of uh you know,competing to get the
participation trophy, to gettingserious to elite.
But I think what's sointeresting, fascinating and
rewarding about this age groupis stuff happens so quickly and
their dose response to trainingis very different than us
middle-aged folk who are alltalking on this podcast right
(21:08):
now.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Because those changes happen so quickly.
You can't make anything ofeither your success or failure
at a young age, like when you're13 or 14, versus even when
you're 15.
You see all the time, theseriders who are winning races
when they're 13 or 14.
It's just because they'redevelopmentally so much more
advanced than you know, theirtheir peers.
They've just grown faster, uh,but then other riders catch up
(21:32):
and everything flips around andthat does.
It's not sustainable.
So people need to be patientand they need to focus on the
training and just really likeinto race and ride at that age
and not be put under anypressure by parents or anything
else for like results, even upto 15, because then that's going
to all flip around Right.
And sometimes these youngerriders who are smaller riders,
(21:52):
who are like just trying to like, hang in there with these
bigger guys.
They end up being strongbecause they build the
resilience you know and ifthey're not quitting and they're
doing that, then those arepeople could go on to become
really good riders.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Completely agree.
And so to Tonko, thank you forwriting that in Cause.
I mean, it's a, it's a very bigquestion.
I think we touched on a fewthings, uh, you know, directly
related to that.
I take that individual approach.
I kind of see like what, whatother sports have they been
doing, how long they've beenriding, and then kind of grow
them from there and beconservative but also focus on
the process, focus, focus on thegamification of learning how to
(22:24):
actually race.
That's another huge componentof it, of which we'll get into
that, maybe a little bit more inquestion too.
So I'm going to, I'm going tokick it over to McKinney for
this one, because we got to.
We're the time crunch, cyclist,ryan, we got to keep going here
.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
That's right, keep it going.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
That's right, so here's.
Here's the second question.
This one's coming from Kim andshe says my kids are 12 and 14,
just getting into cycling andcurious about racing.
I know you coach juniorathletes.
How do we find a good juniorprogram?
What should we look for in aprogram and when should they
start racing?
Anything else I should thinkabout?
(22:59):
Sorry, I'm new to this wholething.
Thanks, uh, thanks, and anyadvice is appreciated, kim.
All right, ryan.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Yeah, ryan, yeah, yeah, kim.
Uh, first of all, it's ablessing if your children are at
all interested in cyclinganyway.
So, yeah, knowing where to takethat interest and that
curiosity is so important and itreally, in my experience, it
depends on a lot of differentthings.
Um, you know what is doable foryou and your family, like how
(23:26):
far are you willing to go tomake this interest in cycling
possible for your, for yourchildren?
So the first thing to do is seeif there's any information at
your local bike shop is a greatplace to start.
The next place to look would beany junior programs like NICA
is a great school-based programfor mountain biking.
(23:49):
The next thing to do is look atlocal cycling clubs, depending
on where you are in the country.
As far as what you should lookfor in a program, the first one
is one that is fun andinteresting and inviting and one
(24:10):
that you know wants to helpyour child or children learn how
to be safe on a bike, how to,you know, ride within a group in
a safe way and buildcamaraderie and community while
doing those things.
And then, once that kind offoundation is established, then
(24:35):
you can start thinking like,okay, my child knows how to ride
safely on their bike, they knowhow to ride in a group, and
then you can say like, okay,racing that's a thing, and I
don't want to say like that'sthe only route, because there
are different types of racing.
What I was just talking aboutwas mostly road racing, but a
(24:56):
great way if your child is justinterested in what a race might
feel like is trying out mountainbiking or cyclocross racing,
and here in our community in themid-Atlantic we have just this
amazing cyclocross communitythat embraces the junior
(25:17):
programs in this area.
It's just the big funnel intocycling in this area.
Cyclocross racing is mostly donein parks, so it's a fully
closed course, so it's supersafe for the racers.
But it also demands a lot ofthe riders.
It teaches them incredible bikehandling skills.
(25:41):
It teaches them when to put alot of power into their pedaling
and when to be in a state offinesse where they're having to
kind of move their way throughtechnical obstacles.
They're going to have to getoff their bike and run.
So it's a great avenue intocycling.
(26:02):
Super fun experience, um, intocycling super fun, um experience
.
And then, as far as anythingelse to think about, uh, if I
was a parent who had childreninterested in cycling, I would
caution you, um, to justunderstand that the sport is uh,
as Chris and Adam and Justinhave said, it is a, it's a.
(26:23):
It's a really tough sport andthat motivation piece that was
referred to earlier, um, isreally important.
This is not a sport thatparents can say, you know you're
going to be a cyclist, and hereyou go, like, go get after it.
Um, because it's a grueling,brutal sport, uh, and if the
motivation is coming fromanywhere other than the child,
(26:47):
it's not going to be sustainable.
All that said, it is awonderful, awesome community
where people you know push eachother to limits they didn't know
they could reach, and you knowthat's the really great side of
it.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
Yeah, that's well.
That is an all encompassinganswer.
One thing I'll add to that isin my intro I said, you know,
this thing takes a village, likeyou know, developing an athlete
from you know, super young upuntil, if they go, elite and all
that kind of stuff.
And in that village, you knowit's, it's the parents, first
and foremost, because I meanthey're getting them to the
races, and foremost cause I meanthey're getting them to the
(27:26):
races and and I mean they'retaking huge polls, but then it's
directors and coaches andguidance counselors like you
that are doing a huge efforts atthe races themselves.
So I think, yeah to the Ryan'spoint, kim.
It's like look for a dynamic,communicative, open-minded group
like these three here, and oneof the ways is just like get to
the races, get some of thoseexposures, um, and organically,
(27:48):
that's a really great, great wayto do it.
Uh, to you, chris, because youare kind of like whenever I have
a question I reach out to youand you always have an answer,
um, but is there like a clubfinder sort of website on like
usacling or anything from awebsite that somebody could just
Google, I believe?
Speaker 2 (28:07):
USA Cycling's website has a list of what they call
the Centers for Excellence.
We're one of those, but thereare lots of junior programs
around the country that havethat label and there's so many
great junior programs and mostof them focus on cyclocross and
they're also mountain bikeprograms and I fully agree that
(28:29):
that's where to start as ajunior Cyclocross.
It's so much fun.
The kids like it.
They train together in a park acouple days a week.
It's just super great and it'sa type of event where you can
race it really hard, but you canalso just go out there and just
give it your best shot.
Everybody has a good time.
Different kids are afterdifferent things.
(28:50):
Some are just really trying togo out there and just hammer
everybody.
Others are trying to go outthere and the courses are super
fun.
Obstacle courses and mountainbiking is the same way.
So it's it's competitive, butit's it's not competitive Like
in road racing.
Road racing you're either inthe race or you're kind of out
the back, and it's kind ofeither or and it can be
demoralizing.
And it's also the other events,as Ryan was saying, they're
(29:12):
technical but they're at muchslower speeds, so they're much
safer.
You don't have the issues thatyou do on the road.
But there are many, many clubsIn the DC area.
I mean our club wouldn't existwithout Rock Creek Velo or now
BYC we're getting riders fromand we've all benefited from
that and it's a huge, awesomeprogram.
They take the kids out on theroad.
It's been a project of somereally awesome parents that have
(29:34):
stuck with it over the yearsand have cycled through there.
My son went through that.
All of our top riders Sarkisovs,cusacks, everybody came out of
Rock Creek Velo.
You know the same with BoulderJunior Cycling out in Boulder
and there's some other programslike that up in the Midwest.
There's some really bigprograms.
So you can find these by goingto the USA Cycling website or
(29:57):
also just Googling JuniorCycling Clubs and there's going
to be a great program in yourarea if you're in a fairly
populated area.
And then the NICA mountainbiking series for middle schools
and high schools.
That's the biggest, mostsuccessful junior development
program right now in the UnitedStates.
They have huge turnout andthose races are again.
(30:17):
They're super fun.
Kids are out there having agreat time just hanging out with
their friends and you also havesome super high-level racing
going on and kids who go fromthat to like national level
competition.
You know riders like KateCourtney other top riders have
come out of this programs sothat that's like a real bright
spot in US cycling.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
No, that's great and, kim, super good question.
Tons of resources out there,google it, go to USA Cycling and
, heck, if you can't findanything, reach out to me, and I
will likely just reach out toChris Hardy and, uh, find
something that fits for you aswell.
So, moving on to the thirdquestion, which is it's a.
This is also a very goodquestion and hits on, uh, like a
(30:57):
really unique aspect of oursport, and I want, I want
everybody to chime in on thisone and I'll I'll start with you
mock, um, but cause racing as ajunior and kind of like
caddying up as you go.
I think this, this pertains.
So here's here's the originalquestion.
Uh, my kids are racing asjuniors and the team they're on
encourages riding and racingwith grown adults.
Is this normal?
(31:18):
Shouldn't kids just race kids?
I know you've mentioned workingwith juniors in the past, so
please shed some light on this.
Or maybe I just need to relax.
If this is how it's done, mykids are 15 and 16.
Thanks, robert.
So a block Is that a normalaspect of the sport and why is
it?
Speaker 4 (31:36):
You're not going to be able to have juniors ride
together every day of the week.
Our juniors are kind of spreadout across the area.
It's not football practice,it's not, you know, five nights
a week, uh, football practicewith all your teammates.
It's not that.
You know.
I lived out in NorthernVirginia.
There's no way I'd be gettinginto DC to do these RCV group
(31:58):
rides.
So the local group ride I wasdoing was the rest and bike club
.
I was the only junior, sototally normal.
Speaker 1 (32:07):
How did you identify that that group ride was
appropriate for you?
Like speed wise, group wise,safety wise.
Like, how was that done?
Speaker 4 (32:15):
It's probably my coach telling me to go do the
group ride.
My coach knew about the ride.
Um, I was on NCVC as a junior.
We had the NCVC adult team too.
So you kind of mix and minglewith those riders and find
mentors.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
There's lots of different types of group rides.
Some are less safe than others,some are more mellow, so you
can inquire in the communityabout which ones to start out
with.
If you have a junior, it's veryimportant because, as Justin
was saying, the juniors.
There are not enough juniorsfor juniors to ride together,
and also there are not enoughjuniors for juniors to race
(32:53):
together, except for at the bignational events.
So to learn to race a bike,you're going to have to race
with men.
That's just the fact.
And those races unfortunately,like at the beginner levels, are
not entirely safe.
That's an aspect of the sportthat parents and riders have to
figure out what they want to do,and that's going to go back to
(33:14):
what we were talking aboutearlier, which is what is the
objective of the rider.
And if you don't want to dothat, stick with cyclocross and
mountain biking.
And then, if you get strongenough and you're older, then
you want to jump into that Ifthey really want to be
successful on the road.
All of our riders were racingand doing well in men's racing
when they were like 15 years old, like our girls were winning
you know all the women's raceswhen they're at that age.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
Yeah, I was just going to say it's common for
girls to jump in the threes withthe men.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
Our girls, when they were 16, were racing in men's
three races.
Right, that's how crazytalented they are and we had
encouraged that.
We talked to them.
I remember talking to theirparents like this is what they
got to do because the women'sfield is too small and it's not
competitive enough for them.
They need to build the speed,because what they were looking
to build to is racing in Europe,where you're going to be racing
in the fields of very fastgirls but where you have 90 in
(34:03):
the field and if you're racingin a field of like 15 or 20, and
you're by far the strongestrider, you might as well be out
riding by yourself.
And that's kind of what's theirexperience.
Often when racing in the women'sfields, they need to ride in a
race that's got a lot ofdynamics, a lot of attacking,
recovery, managing your bike,and now they're great bike
handlers.
They can manage a field.
If riders want to develop now,they have to be aiming to get up
(34:26):
into the men's races.
You know when we were liketrying to get our 15, 16s get to
be a Cat 3, race in the men'sCat 3 races.
Start doing well in thosepodium in the men's Cat 3.
By the time you're 17, cat two,you know, and on up right and
then, because that's the levelof riders that they're racing
against, if they really want todo well at nationals, if they
want to try to get on like thenational team, because those
(34:47):
guys are all like cat ones bythe time they're 18 I think.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
For from robert's point of view, you know, here in
the united states it is unusualfor for children in sports to
be competing against adults.
So, robert, I hear you, butcycling is such a unique kind of
group, and also the physics ofthe sport make it so that we can
(35:15):
compete against each other atdifferent age groups.
So it seems strange, but itdoes make a lot of sense.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
It's a function of the numbers or the lack of
numbers for the juniors in theUnited States.
In Europe and Belgium it's notpermitted for juniors to race
with adults, right, they have 15, 16 categories and they race
together.
They don't race up even withthe 17, 18s, 17s, 18s race
together and they can't race upeven with the 17, 18s, 17s, 18s
race together and they can'trace you, 23 or elites.
But they have 80 to 90 kids ineach of those categories and
(35:45):
those races and those races aresuper competitive.
Here there's just not enoughjuniors, unless you go to the
big race, like the three or fouror five in the country
nationals, Valley of the Sun,their Lago Vista in Texas and
others where you're going to geta field sizes where you can
actually learn the sport.
So it's just a function of bikeracing in the United States
(36:05):
compared to Europe.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
And that was that was the main point I was I was
hoping we'd hammer out is isexactly that, chris.
But I think, to McKinney'spoint, the way we do it or the
way our culture does it in theUnited States is drastically
different than Europe.
But there's also some beautybehind that too, because I think
the sport of cycling itself hasthis like accessibility to it.
(36:27):
I think that there's a there'sa lot of beauty behind that too,
and so I think you, you leaninto that.
But, yeah, robert, um, it'sweird, but it's also really cool
because we're open to havingthese age categories like get
those experiences so they canincrease, you know, up in
category and get more high levelcompetitions and stuff.
(36:48):
But, Ryan, lastly, do you, Imean, is that the way it was
when you were a junior, climbingthe ranks as well?
Speaker 3 (36:53):
Yeah, absolutely, that's all.
In fact, there was very littlesupport in the mid-Atlantic area
for junior cyclists when I wasyoung, and I'm sure Chris
probably feels the same way, butthat's all I did.
The only junior races I did waswhen there was, you know, the
(37:13):
big national events, and thatwas it.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Other than that, that there was a junior category
here, um, but it had maybe sixor seven riders, so it wasn't
even worth to, I mean reallyparticipating in and so I think,
like you know, with, with allthat being said, I mean it's,
it's um, you know, with whatwe're doing, like on the dc devo
race academy, I mean it is, inmy opinion, very special and but
(37:40):
I'm I'm close to the sport, I'min it.
You know, juniors are both likefrustrating and rewarding all
at the same time to coach and Iabsolutely love it.
So here's the shameless plug Ifpeople are like you know what I
really love bikes and I want tosupport like, if they want to
support DC Devo as like anindividual club, chris, how
(38:02):
would they do that?
And also, like big picture here, what else could listeners do
to ensure that the future of thesport is successful and has
these opportunities long term,to keep on racing up, take it to
the next level if that's whatthey want to do, or just be in
love with bikes for longevity?
Speaker 2 (38:23):
I think the main thing they can do to make the
sport successful would if theyhave kids that are interested in
the sport or if they want tointroduce their kids to it, just
to find some of these reallygreat grassroots programs and
help keep those programs goingand support those programs.
I think those are extremelyimportant.
Contribute to NICA and then forprograms like ours we exist to
(38:45):
provide a platform for that nextlevel of talented riders who
want to race nationally andinternationally.
We depend on those programs.
I mean, we do our fundraisingthrough, largely supported by
the DC Velo generous members onthe team who are have been super
supportive of the program overthe years, and we do some
fundraising on on Facebook andInstagram.
Speaker 4 (39:07):
One thing I'd add to that, uh, chris, is if, if
you're someone who hasexperience that happens to be
listening to this, you know,came up through the ranks, is
it's not just money, it's timethis team, like if it wasn't for
the three of us, uh, and Adamtoo, subbing in the time is a
really hard thing.
(39:27):
We're, all you know, busypeople with things in our life,
um, but I do think that thejuniors find it valuable for us
to be there and be supportingand like giving our knowledge.
So valuable for us to be thereand be supporting and like
giving our knowledge.
So, uh, you know, and it feelsreally good when I am able to
make the time to go be at theraces.
Uh, so, time, if you're, ifyou're someone that thinks could
(39:53):
help find a local program andask like, hey, do you guys need,
you know, an extra hand.
Speaker 1 (39:55):
Yeah, yeah, and I think this is one quick story of
just like our nationalchampionships um, a few weeks
ago.
Here in this, to pull the veilback on how some of this works
is like we had a meeting on zoombefore that.
Mckinney was leading right, allthe riders jumped on, we jumped
on.
We had a game plan for the raceitself.
Hardy got there for the timetrial because the rest of us
(40:17):
weren't there yet.
We couldn't make it because wewere doing our other jobs.
And Hardy basically high fivesmock, who comes in and takes the
rain for like the, the crit,and I met him for the crits and
then the road race.
Mock goes to a wedding afterthe crits and he comes back like
in time, and then I had to takethe boys, cause that was like
the early race.
I high five him.
(40:39):
He takes the girls for the roadrace that day and like we just
make it work.
And so there's no like supermagic recipe we're not a high
budget team but like we make itwork and you keep it chill for
the riders so that they canfocus on their performance, and
that that passion in that timeis probably more valuable than
the money itself, even thoughyou need the money to fund the
(41:00):
thing.
So mock, I mean kudos forsaying that if you have that
expertise and you have timeavailable, it goes a long way,
because kids will remember thatforever.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
It really is about cultivating a fun, supportive
environment for young people whohave an interest and a drive to
do something that is physically, mentally, emotionally
challenging and helping themreach new heights.
And then, when that supportleads to successes, it really is
(41:37):
just a feeling that you can'tget from any other effort, and
so just a really, reallyfantastic experience to grow
with these young people andtheir families into, you know, a
sport that we all love, andthat's what this is all about.
Speaker 1 (41:53):
All right, last last little bit and then we'll wrap
up.
If someone hears this andthey're in the mid Atlantic
region, chris, how does it work?
If they want to get their kidinvolved in their uh, 15 years
old, what do they do?
Speaker 2 (42:04):
I mean, they could reach out to us on our, you know
, dm us on our Instagram page atDC, uh, devo racing Academy.
And uh, yeah, that's probablythe best way and we respond.
Speaker 1 (42:23):
We've.
I just had an inquiry fromsomeone today who is interested.
Yeah, and I'll add in I meanwe've got a rider from Montana
right, so it doesn't even haveto be our region itself, because
we do get to bigger nationalraces and then partner with USA
Cycling to get to internationalstuff.
Well, gentlemen, I thank you somuch for your time.
We will get this out to themasses and I do think our
audience members at least theones who wrote in, but those who
are hanging on and stilllistening to us go along.
Hopefully you learn something.
(42:43):
If a junior shows up to yourrace or your group ride, it's
not that abnormal, especiallyhere in the United States.
So lean in, help the kid Ifyou've got some of that
expertise, and let them go andgrow into that next future
generation.
To let them go and grow intothat next future generation.
So to you guys, thank you foreverything, including all your
efforts on this program.
It is absolutely fun to be justa little spoke in this wheel,
(43:05):
so thanks for putting this on.
Speaker 3 (43:06):
Yeah, thank you.
Speaker 1 (43:10):
Thanks for joining us on the time crunch cyclist
podcast.
We hope you enjoyed the show.
If you want even more actualtraining advice, head over to
train rightcom backslashnewsletter and subscribe to our
free weekly publication.
Each week you'll get in-depthtraining content that goes
beyond what we cover here on thepodcast.
That'll help you take yourtraining to the next level.
(43:32):
That's all for now.
Until next time, train hard,train smart, train right.
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