Tough Cover Show: NBA Finals Game 7, Ace Bailey Ducks the 76ers, Phillies-Mets, and More - 06/21/25

Mark Henry Jr., Sean Barnard, and Sam Oshtry talk Game 7 of the NBA Finals as the Pacers tie up the series by throttling the Thunder in Game 6... what can we expect in Game 7? Ace Bailey ducking the 76ers before the NBA Draft... what else can go wrong? All that and more in Hour 1 of the Tough Cover!

Mark Henry Jr. and Sean Barnard talk Phillies-Mets, the Rob Thomson-Nick Castellanos story of the week, NFL QB rankings, and more in Hour 2.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Number one on your car radio preset hand the new
and improved iHeart Radio apps, w D A S and
w D two seven three D Philadelphia is Fox Sports Radio,
The Gambler.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
Right down and the language that everybody here can easily understand.

Speaker 1 (00:20):
Time to get ready for the day's action, from the
sides to the totals and everything in between. Nobody does
it better than the tough cover with Mark Henry right
here on the Gambler.

Speaker 2 (00:35):
What I know, what you dream? Hello, and welcome Radio

(01:05):
Saturday on the Sports Carousel. So we've got we've got.

Speaker 3 (01:12):
A perfect guest here to talk all things basketball WIST
Game seven.

Speaker 2 (01:18):
I don't know how many people know that reference, but
Zaza Pachulia shout out, we've played it on this show before, but.

Speaker 4 (01:24):
Played it coming in for the intro. So disappointed that
things did not go smooth on the Yeah, I had
it rolling it.

Speaker 2 (01:31):
Oh that's a great thought. I was I at like,
at like ten point fifty, I was like, oh, I
should have step out the Shawan, But Game seven nothing
like it. Two of the best words in sports and
two of the other best words in sports. NBA draft
lot of a lot of stuff to talk about here
with our guy Sam Astry. Later on in the show,
we'll get to the Phil's Biggest weekend of the year.

(01:51):
For our Phil's biggest win of the season, I'd say
last night with a Rookie of the Year movie moment
at the plate, we'll get into all things related to that.
We have NFL quarterback rankings to break down. We got
Sean Bernard back in the studio on the ones and twos,
and our guest for today is none other than Sam Austrey.
You can follow on Twitter at s Austrey Go check

(02:14):
out his stuff over at the Score. Sam. How we
doing Game seven? Eve here?

Speaker 5 (02:19):
I'm great.

Speaker 6 (02:20):
It's always great to be back with you guys on
a Saturday morning into afternoon.

Speaker 5 (02:25):
There's nothing better than a Game seven.

Speaker 6 (02:26):
There's just nothing better in any sport, but especially basketball.
Just a perfect cherry on top on one of the
all time great NBA seasons. Since I've been following the
sport as a kid, this has been one of my
favorite seasons ever. So to put the cherry on top
with a Game seven and the fifth Game seven in
the last thirty five years, So don't take this for granted,
like these are really rare in the NBA when you

(02:47):
have the opportunity to have one. I don't expect it
to be a blowout. This is gonna be a competitive,
competitive game. So savor the moment at eight o'clock tomorrow night.

Speaker 3 (02:54):
In the finals, right, fifth Game seven? That makes where Yeah,
I was gonna saund as well.

Speaker 5 (03:00):
Then, yeah, There's been a few others over the years.

Speaker 2 (03:03):
It's been nine years, sixteen.

Speaker 3 (03:07):
Yeah, and here we are on a Game seven that
a lot of us, not me included, did not think
we were gonna see. And I'll throw it to Sean.
I forget where you were at the beginning of the series.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
I know you were, I think closer to me than
the people who thought it was going to be a sweep.

Speaker 3 (03:27):
Are you surprised, especially after the way that the Pacers
choked Game four? We talked about it on this show
right after you. But I will say Sean pushed back
on me after Game four when I said I thought
the Pacers just lost the series. Sean was there to say,
I don't know if that's fair. How are you Are
you surprised after that? Are you surprised after the halliburtn

(03:48):
injury news, and here we are with a Game seven
to watch.

Speaker 4 (03:52):
Yeah, I went into the series with the expectation of
thunder and six that I gave a little bit of
respect to the Pacers, and the more that I've watched,
the more that I believed in this team, and really
the unwillingness to roll over has been such a defining
trait for this Pacers team. Really, this entire playoff r
on some of the most improbable wins that we've seen
in NBA history that they seem to just consistently pull off.
I'm not counting them out for tomorrow either for that

(04:13):
specific reason, but certainly encouraged and surprised to see the
level of fight this team has. That was a dominant
victory in Game six, and one that I think made
quite a statement for who this team is as an
NBA team. There, So shout out in the Indiana Pacers
for making things interesting and cannot wait for Sunday Night.

Speaker 2 (04:28):
And then, Sam, I know that you have been a
Pacers hater for a long time. Big time are you
coming around on the Pacers? Are you?

Speaker 3 (04:39):
Are you as shocked as everybody in the public and
in the media, certainly is that this is a seven
game series or I guess especially I should say, especially
after Game four, what happened there and then what happened
in game five?

Speaker 2 (04:53):
How shocked are you that what happened in game six?

Speaker 6 (04:56):
I think you guys only wanted me on. Yes, obviously,
you guys have been on the Pacers train that this
entire playoffs and I have not. I have not at all,
and they've they've shocked me. They've stunned me every bit
of it. I've been so impressed with them. So yeah,
I'm completely I've completely come around this team and they

(05:18):
deserve all the praise. They're like, like Sean said, this
team is just relentless on both ends. And it's really
not just like how they never give up, but it's
their play style, like how they pick up full court,
how they can adjust. For last game, they stopped picking
up full court for their pickup point in the half
court was high enough that the ball pressure really bothered
the Thunder and they were able to generate a ton

(05:39):
of turnovers, and the Thunder twenty one turnovers, and that's
usually the rare things the Thunder or not a team
that turned the ball over a lot. So I've just
been shocked and surprised, and I guess pleased in a
sense of how great this Pacers team is because it's
it defies everything you know about basketball logic and team
and team building over the last couple of decades where

(05:59):
you need a top five to six player, all of
what NBA history has told us the champions those guys
have a top five to eight player maximum.

Speaker 5 (06:09):
In the NBA.

Speaker 6 (06:09):
And if this Pacers team wins, this will be Harris Haliburn.
And it's not discrediting him at all, but he will
be the worst best player on a championship team in
over two decades, probably since that Pistons team. Yeah, and
that is just astonishing that we're at that place right now.
But that's the parody driven NBA that we have right now.
So I'm I've completely turned around this Pacers team. The

(06:31):
way they play as a group, their depth, everything, I've
been so impressed with this team.

Speaker 5 (06:35):
So I think they have a real chance to win tomorrow.

Speaker 3 (06:38):
So here's a question for both of you, and i'm
I haven't not a question I had formed in my head,
so bear with me here, But is this a blip
on the radar in terms of like the needing a
deeper team? And maybe you don't need a top five
player anymore. Is this how it's going to be going

(06:58):
forward due to the CB or something I kind of
just thought of while we were sitting here. I think
Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant or Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan
and Lebron James have been in so many finals over.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
The last since nineteen ninety I guess, so that's thirty
five years where maybe we can sean if you want
to check that out, how many finals Michael Jordan and
Lebron have been in since Jordan's first finals, which I
believe is nineteen ninety. I think it's probably more than half.

(07:34):
I think it's probably actually a good bit more than half.

Speaker 3 (07:37):
No, it's probably about half bad radio here, but it's
probably about half that Jordan and Lebron have been in finals.

Speaker 2 (07:43):
Are we in an era of the NBA where there
isn't a Jordan or Lebron?

Speaker 3 (07:48):
So with that, it's going to be more teams that
if you get eight nine guys that play as a
really good rotation and have an identity and a great coach,
and if Albern's not a top five guy, he's a
top twelve, the top twelve ish guy.

Speaker 2 (08:05):
So is this a one year thing, Is this a
CBA thing? Or is this no a lack of a
true top dog like a Lebron or a Jordan.

Speaker 4 (08:16):
Yeah enough, Just for clarity, here sixteen NBA finals appearances
between Michael Jordan and Lebron and he made his debut
in the nineteen eighty four eighty five seasons. So I've
still doing the map on what exactly that breakdown is.

Speaker 2 (08:28):
I think Jordan.

Speaker 3 (08:29):
I think Jordan's first and finals was ninety, So that
means of the last thirty five years, they've made sixteen,
so almost half almost crazy finals, and Jordan won six,
Lebron won four, so they've won ten of the last
thirty five titles.

Speaker 2 (08:44):
Then you have the Kobe Shaq Lakers who won three.

Speaker 3 (08:48):
Like you start to dwindle it down, and it's and
Golden State Warriors who had a top two player in
the world and then had two top three players in
the world. So it is most of the time it's
because there's a true top dog, or the top dogs
with another top dog, or whatever happens to be the case.
Do you think this is a I'll throw it to Sam.

(09:08):
Do you think this is a one year thing with Indiana,
a one year thing.

Speaker 2 (09:12):
I don't. I think Okase he's not as fair for
this conversation considering they have the MVP. But is this
a what we've seen it a little bit with Miami,
although Jimmy played like an MVP in the playoffs. Bad question,
long ranging question. Take it where you want to go
with this?

Speaker 6 (09:26):
No, I think I think it's a great question. It's
a great big picture question. I think it's a mixture
of both of what you were talking about. There isn't
the dominant force like a Lebron James or like a
Jordan or even when Kobe was in those three straight
finals from eight to twenty ten. There isn't that dominant
force in the NBA right now. And maybe like a
wemb becomes that guy, or maybe an anthe Enna where
it takes a crazy leap and becomes that guy. I

(09:48):
guess you could even say, but there's and Jokic is
the best player like by four in the NBA.

Speaker 5 (09:54):
But what you're seeing.

Speaker 6 (09:55):
Now is what you're seeing now is the I don't
think by far as fair.

Speaker 5 (09:59):
I who do you have to like Shay or.

Speaker 2 (10:03):
I think Shane Luca right there, Lucas is.

Speaker 5 (10:05):
A pretty good gay and those guys, I don't think.

Speaker 2 (10:11):
Lucas playoff stats are pretty insane.

Speaker 5 (10:14):
But Gianna said Luke, honestly, I got luc there.

Speaker 2 (10:17):
I probably a be honest fourth, but I I yeah.

Speaker 6 (10:20):
But but but anyway, there's there's there's not like a
dominant dominant presence. Even if you consider like a dominant presence.
What there certainly isn't is is super teams anymore. And
there's no like dynastic runs you're gonna see. You're not
gonna see a Jordan type run. You're not gonna see
a Lebron heat type run because you can't build those
super teams because of the restrictions of the of the CBA.

Speaker 5 (10:42):
So is this the new norm, is what you're asking. Yeah,
I think it is.

Speaker 6 (10:45):
I don't think you're gonna see like what you're seeing
is you haven't seen a repeat champion since twenty eighteen
twenty eighteen Warriors, and now it's just it's so much
parody in the NBA. And part of that is because
of the destruction of super teams and dynasties, but it's
also the new CBA is gonna make it even harder
where even you look at this Thunder team. Jaylen Williams
and cheded holmgerm are both do for an extension this summer.

(11:07):
They earned those extensions throughout these playoffs, regardless of what
happens in game set.

Speaker 5 (11:11):
So both those guys are about to get paid. When
those guys get paid.

Speaker 6 (11:13):
And those extensions hit in a couple of years, what
is that going to sacrifice for the Thunder depth. So
this team that is that relies on so much depth
and so much talent around the margins, they're not gonna
have that necessarily because you're gonna have to pay those guys.
And that's just the restrictions of the CBA. So I
think this is a new norm where you're gonna see
different teams every year make these improbable runs who are

(11:35):
properly built around with their depth, around a really good
player who can impact the game, like a Tyres Halliburn.
And you're just not gonna see dominant teams where the
superstars are gonna get together like they tried to with
the Suns and it was a disaster. That's not what's
what exists in this new era of the NBA.

Speaker 2 (11:52):
Two part question here for both of you guys and Sean.

Speaker 3 (11:55):
I'll let you expand on that later or here as well,
but a too far Quie you mentioned, okay, so he's
not gonna be able to keep those stuff, is okay?
See uniquely positioned though, and has kind of cracked the
code on this where they still have a I almost
just curse they still have a ton of picks coming
in and not to mention they just drafted. I had

(12:17):
Nicole topic just like my number like three player last year,
I think, and I kind of forgot he existed. It
was like a random March game and I think they
showed him on the bench and I was like, Nicole
Topin is on the thunder what are we doing here?
And I think I talked about it on the show.
But are they uniquely positioned to kind of break that

(12:40):
mold and crack that code?

Speaker 2 (12:41):
I'll get a Sean first, and it's Sam.

Speaker 4 (12:43):
Yeah. I do think they are. And you just got
to hit on your draft picks, and they've done an
excellent job of that in recent years, so the track
record pretty strong. There obviously will be financial hurdles, no
different than every team in the league. I mean, we're
looking at the Boston Celtics trying to figure things out
and get through it. After they sort of went all
in to have this championship corps and keep everybody together,
they're going to try and crack the code for how
to get around it. So we're going to see each

(13:04):
team sort of fight this battles, but I do think
Oklahoma City is in a unique spot to kind of
combat these himself. Now, as far as the overall question
with like this team based thing versus stars and all this,
I do think this is a trend that the NBA
is now going to follow, and it feels like too
often it is a copycat league where one team wins
an NBA championship and every team looks at that as

(13:24):
that is the secret right there. That it was the
Big three model for so long, where it is can
you get three stars under the salary cap and find
a way to make it work and just fill out
the roster with the rest. Then it was this concept
of you just get one star and a bunch of
role players around and to maximize each other. It's sort
of the Nicola Jokic model there. Then the Boston Celtics
are this team that is just gonna jack threes and
this is the new style, and we see this uptick

(13:46):
or increase in three point volume across the NBA. I
guess my message would be here. I don't think that
there is one blanket way that is the best way
to win basketball games. And I think every organization should
look themselves in the mirror seeing what is our best pathway,
not as what is There is no blueprint for just
the way to win. But I do think there's something
to this Pacers team not going all in on one
specific guy. And Haliburton obviously the head of the snake,

(14:09):
but it isn't on that same tier of the Shay Gilders, Alexander's,
the Luka, donc Giannis, all these guys that we just
argued about here. He's not He just isn't in that tier.
But that doesn't that hasn't hurt the team whatsoever, and
he can still put on that cap for stretches when
he needs to. So I do think team oriented basketball
is kind of shifting that pendulum back in that direction,
and I do think a lot of teams will look
at depth with a little bit of a higher focus

(14:30):
moving forward.

Speaker 6 (14:31):
Real quick, Just just to add on to that, there's
not a specific blueprint in terms of play style. But
I do think the blueprint is you're not just putting
together a bunch of superstars like we did in the
past and just say, Okay, these are the best players
on the floor. That's gonna equal success in the postseason,
because we've seen that's not the case anymore. So I
think what the blueprint is is building out a great
team where you don't have any weak links like you

(14:52):
can have. If you have a guy like Tyre's Halliburn,
who's not going to be the best player in a
lot of series, but your fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, eight
guy are all better than other teams four through eight,
then that's the that's the formula for success.

Speaker 2 (15:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (15:07):
I totally agree with both of what you said there,
But I guess we have a lot of time to
have those conversations. We have all off season to have
those conversations. We can dive deeper on that. I think
that's a really interesting topic in general kind of big picture,
but keeping a small picture, we do have a Game
seven here, and in terms of the gambling line, I

(15:27):
don't think.

Speaker 2 (15:28):
I'm touching it like I I.

Speaker 5 (15:31):
Pace this money line.

Speaker 3 (15:32):
I've kind of backed off since Game four of the
gambling side of this series.

Speaker 2 (15:39):
Didn't really bet on Game five or Game six, And
I don't have a conviction on this game. I think, okay,
see probably wins.

Speaker 3 (15:48):
And my general principle is that I don't bet underdogs
when I oh, and I don't think they have like
a forty plus percent chance of winning.

Speaker 2 (15:57):
But seven and a half a lot of points. I
think it is disrespectful. It's down from nine where it opened, Sam,
where are you? And then the totals to fourteen and
a half? Where you go? And what's your kind of
best bet here? For Game seven?

Speaker 6 (16:10):
Yeah, I've had a lot of conviction this entire postseason
of just fading the Pacers, and now it's the last
game of the NBA season and I have zero conviction.
And I'm not gonna fade the Pacers. If anything, I
think I'm actually gonna back then. I'm gonna come all
the way around on either side. And I haven't completely
placed anything yet, But by the time eight o'clock hits
tomorrow night, I think I'm gonna be on the Pacers
spread just because it's too many points. And what Game

(16:31):
seven history shows us is these games are competitive, Like
this is a game seven in the NBA Finals. Now
of these teams are gonna roll over. This isn't even
a Game seven in the second round where the Thunders
blew the doors off the Nuggets and that wasn't even
competitive at all. This is the NBA Finals. This is
gonna be a super competitive game. And I think the
oddsmakers have just disrespected the Pacers all season and they
haven't really been killed for it because betters haven't taken

(16:53):
advantage of it. But it's still like it's disrespectful. This
seven and a half point spread in the NBA Finals,
this team that has just made an improbable run. They've
been underdogs in every single game this series and won
three of them outright, That's why we're in this Game
seven position. I'm I think the Thunder win, but I
think it's like a four or five point win that
really comes down to last couple possessions sew.

Speaker 4 (17:15):
Yeah, this is certainly one where my head and heart
disagree on that. My heart here is all in on
this Indiana Pacers team. I do believe it. But there
is something in the back of my mind that could
could see a world where the Thunder just absolutely go
BTA season and that's how this ends up going down.
The talent is the clear advantage to Oklahoma City, but
I also think they've played with their food to an
extent in this series, particularly in Game six. I didn't

(17:37):
think they brought it whatsoever. And if there is one
case to continue to be made, it is about the
youth of this team. If Indiana can get it down
to crunch time, if they can weather this storm, which
I'm confident there will be one or two just runs
for the Thunder which absolutely attempt to take over the game.
If the Pacers can weather those and get them down
to crunch time, I think they win that basketball game.
So I will be riding the plus seven and a

(17:57):
half and taking a swing on Pacers' money line because
I gotta go with my heart here. But there is
something hold me back a little bit that says the
Thunder could just wake up in.

Speaker 2 (18:05):
Game sep That's kind of where I'm at.

Speaker 3 (18:08):
I think there's too high of a chance of a
Thunder beat down for me to want to place the
bet on seven half.

Speaker 6 (18:14):
It seems like we're all kind of on the same
page where we don't take any stock in that Game six.
It's that's just a young team looking young and we've
seen that really throughout the playoffs with this thunder team.

Speaker 4 (18:24):
Cred it to the Pacers though like that that wasn't
I wasn't sure the Pacers could beat the Thunder like that,
to be perfectly honest, So I do give them props
for it.

Speaker 6 (18:32):
But the Wolves did the same thing last series, and
that was a fire thing. So that's just when the
Thunder don have their foot in the gas, that's what
they look like.

Speaker 2 (18:38):
Sure, and they're at home in Game six.

Speaker 3 (18:40):
I feel like we've seen that so many times, and
we've seen the zombie Sixers do it, like multiple times
in Game six against the Hawks, when everybody in the
city wanted, you know, the whole team to go on
a plane to Jamaica instead of having to watch Game six,
and they came out and won and Tiger's Max he
won them the game, and that's happened a couple of times,

(19:02):
like Toronto. They smoked Toronto in Game six before losing
in Game seven. And it's not just a Sixers but
speaking of the Sixers, of course, it wouldn't be a
normal day in Sixer Land without never a weird storyline.

Speaker 2 (19:18):
And by the way, the Ast Bailey thing. It's like,
I it doesn't even phaze me because it wouldn't be
in the top fifty of weird storylines the Sixers have
been involved in for the last ten to fifteen years.
Sean Bernard is just such a he's such a phony
over there with the East Bailly hater. The guy was

(19:40):
an Ace super fan two days ago.

Speaker 5 (19:43):
We have a lot of receipts, Mark, we both have
a lot of seats.

Speaker 4 (19:45):
And then he just middle fingered our great organization here
in fo Yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
Great organization. He might be right. Yeah, how about that
for a take. I think might be right.

Speaker 4 (19:54):
That's a good spin zone, that's a good spin Nothing said,
nothing says winning culture like the Brooklyn Nets and Washington Wizards.

Speaker 2 (20:00):
Man, at least it's a new culture and a culture
they be part of creating. But no, Ace's team is
really really bungling this whole situation. I think, like, based
on what we know, it seems like a joke. He's
has Shreef Cooper's dad as an agent. I guess what

(20:22):
I'll say is, I'll take this at different angle. The
people who are like, oh my god, the Sixers are
gonna take Ace Bailey now like that. That tweet said
that they're still considering it. They that tweet said that
so someone could potentially trade up, and that's died down.

Speaker 3 (20:37):
And I think he's clearly falling in the draft a
little bit. But I think he's probably not gonna fall
past eight. I think I have a hard time seeing
Brooklyn passing on him if he gets that far. I
have a hard time seeing Utah pass on him, despite
the rumors. I have a hard time seeing New Orleans
pass on him at seven despite some of the rumors
there is. There was early rumors that they loved them,
and I think some of the rumors since that they've

(20:57):
refuted that. But I think he probably still goes five
to seven or eight. But I kind of just don't
think it's worth having much of a conversation about him
relating to the Sixers because it's over.

Speaker 2 (21:09):
They're not drafting him, Like it's not happening.

Speaker 6 (21:13):
This could have been This could have been a very
heated conversation if it was still a possibility of them
drafting him. But we were all together when the Sixers
got that number three pick us. They were together and
I immediately said, vg Edgecum is the guy. So in
my view, I know it's certainly not your guys. You
definitely not marks for you. I love I think the Sixers,
but I'm saying I think the Sixers dodged a bullet,

(21:35):
but by by by what happened with the A stuff,
And I don't know exactly it's one hundred percent. Is
Camp handled this really poorly? But I don't know exactly
what his camp is looking at on film, Like this
guy has this like all right.

Speaker 3 (21:49):
Thirty nine for the first twenty four games of the year,
he show fifty two field averaging twenty one and eight.
He has the talent for sure, for sure, he's not
He's not Camp, He's not Cam worries not I'm not
saying that.

Speaker 5 (22:02):
But his film. I'm just like his film, which why
there was concerns in the first place.

Speaker 6 (22:06):
I think even without all this extra curricular stuff, I
don't think the Sixers are going to take him for
a reason, because this film is concerning based on the
shot selection, based on the inefficiency, based on like his
his shot profile is just not one that you want
for a guy who's to contribute to an NBA team immediately.
That's always been my concern with Ace Bailey, and that's
why I think this Sixer should passed them. So that's
what I mean by what he's shown on film. It's
like this guy isn't some clear cut prospect. He's a

(22:29):
he's a provocative prospect that there are a lot of
people who think he's gonna be an amazing player, a
lot of people who think he's gonna be complete bufs.
So it's not like you have the surefire thing. And
that's what his camp can't under understand. Regardless of where
we stand on it, his camp needs to understand that
this guy isn't some surefire thing an NBA perse scouts
and personnel people's mind. So I think as Campus handled

(22:50):
it really for you. I also think there's the maturity
concerns which are playing out here. And that's not means
he's a bad kid or anyway he like he wouldn't
do he would do anything wrong. There's just he's a
young kid, and I think a lot of young kids
have some maturity concerns. But that's always been my point
with the Sixers drafting vg edge Comb is that they
need to win that ready guy.

Speaker 5 (23:06):
They can't baby. They can't baby some.

Speaker 6 (23:09):
Immature guy who has a long way to go to
develop as some NBA superstar, which some people like you
guys project him as.

Speaker 2 (23:16):
I did not project Ace as a superstar.

Speaker 3 (23:18):
But my difference in is in Ace is that I
think the floor is so much higher than what you're
selling it as. His defense is legitimately impactful and was
impactful in a terrible situation, averaging over steal game one
and a half blocks per game. He was the much
better defender of the two players at Rutgers, and I
think watching him on defense and watching his motor on

(23:40):
defense is why I've kind of never concerned about like
the off the court stuff for the kind of the
stuff about him as a person. Nothing about what's happened
is affecting my stance on him as a basket player.
I think he's gonna end up somewhere on the Jalen
Brown og McHale scale.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
I wouldn't call that a superstar, but i'd call that
a really really.

Speaker 5 (23:59):
Good like Jalen Brown is the Finals mvpick.

Speaker 2 (24:02):
Would you call Jylen Brown superstar?

Speaker 5 (24:04):
No, but I think he's a level above og McHale
for sure.

Speaker 4 (24:07):
Yeah, that's very beat.

Speaker 3 (24:08):
But I think Jalen's probably like a top twenty five guy,
and they're probably like top Yeah, yeah, it's probably like
ten to fifteen spots of difference. I was kind of
it's actually kind of to my point, like I was
kind of trying to give him like a little bit
of a range there. And I do think Jalen also,
I'm more or less so talking about Finals MVP Jalen.

Speaker 2 (24:28):
If you go back and look at like up to
twenty twenty two, I think it was Jalen's assist turnover
rates were still negative.

Speaker 5 (24:37):
He's he couldn't go left, he couldn't go left really improved.

Speaker 6 (24:41):
He's improved there still, but his bull handling certainly improved.
Jalen Brown's developed, his development in the NBA has been
very impressed.

Speaker 3 (24:49):
He's he averaging four or five assists per game now,
which I don't think that's something a still ever do.
But twenty twenty two, Jalen Brown was still the second
best player on a team that went to the finals,
second best player on a team that's had a lot
of playoff success up to that point. So I think
he could be that type of jail In Brown, maybe
not the one we've seen especially in last season, not

(25:09):
this season. But and then Sean, I'll pass it over
to you to tell me why everything you've been saying
in the last two months is wrong and Ace Bailey
is actually he actually sucks.

Speaker 2 (25:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (25:22):
No, I'm not backtracking off all that, but I do
want to hit pretty hard on his camp stuff. For starters,
Ace Bailey not a bad guy, but taking some very
bad advice right now. And like for starters, I don't
excuse Ace from this because you could go to CIA,
you could go to Clutch, you could go to any
agency in the world that you want, and because you
have his go ahead.

Speaker 2 (25:41):
Well, Trill did say that. Apparently Shreve Cooper's dad. I
guess there's some high school ties.

Speaker 4 (25:47):
To where he was his AAU coach.

Speaker 2 (25:49):
Apparently.

Speaker 3 (25:51):
I don't want to speak out of school. From what
I heard, this is a legend that he's like a
father figure. Maybe maybe Yeah, maybe there's.

Speaker 5 (26:02):
Not a It's not uncommon what we're seeing right now.

Speaker 6 (26:04):
Yeah, where an influential person in someone's life who grew
up with them, it becomes their their handlering guy.

Speaker 4 (26:11):
It isn't. But that's not exactly an agent like a
lot of those guys still have.

Speaker 3 (26:16):
Yeah, I think it's a personal like I think it's
like a personal relationship, and those are.

Speaker 4 (26:22):
I'm not and I'm not saying you need to turn
your back on this dude that's obviously been with you
for a huge part of the client. But you can
have another person helping make decisions here and should it
directly should this is you you like for starters here
to tie to the Sixers conversation where I do think
this is directly harmful. Is I still think the Sixers
number one goal of draft day, what their ideal night

(26:43):
would be, would be trading down a couple of picks,
still making a selection and pick up additional stuff. There
is no longer any leverage because Ace Bailey has broadcast
to the world quite clearly that he doesn't want to
come to Philadelphia. Here and the other part what I
think is incredibly short sighted by the Ace Bailey camp
here is even under the best of circumstances, in general,
high profile wings don't make day one impact in the NBA.

(27:05):
Look at Paul George, look at Kawhi Leonard, look at
Jason Tatum. Here, like the pathway to development for these
guys is you have a pretty simplified role at the
start and then you scale up year after year. There
is a perfect opportunity for him to do that in
Philadelphia if he would accept that, to get to this
rush to go to a Washington Wizards or Charlotte Hornets
or Brooklyn Nets, so you can shoot the ball twenty

(27:27):
times a game. If you think that's putting him in
the driver's seat for maximizing your earnings at the NBA level,
it's just not. I've seen cal Ubra average twenty points
per game for the Charlotte Hornets and be on a
veterans minimum next year. I've also seen Jonathan Kuminga played
a very minimized role with the Golden State Golden State
Warriors and get straight up paid. If you're that guy,
if you're this caliber of talent, you will find your

(27:47):
role in the NBA that you should not be. And
even if we're going to do the agency stance, you
directly make more money when you're drafted third verse when
you're drafted sixth here. So if your goal is still
to get him in the right spot, which I understand
that that ran hiring the priorities or whatever, you very
well or very easily could have used the sixers as
such a key leverage point, so he fumbled it from
that area as well. So I just hate every bit

(28:10):
of how this went down. I do think it's detrimental
to the Sixers from like their draft approach kind of
standpoint here, and it's just maddening that I think Ace
has people very clearly getting in the way of like
his future, which makes me frustrated for him.

Speaker 3 (28:22):
Yeah, I think it's a shame. And I will say
the one thing I disagree with. I don't think going
to a bad team is always necessarily negative for your development,
Like we have seen guys like Devin Booker play of
others I think play on some bad teams and develop
into pretty winning players or.

Speaker 2 (28:37):
Guys that went to the finals or won finals or whatever.

Speaker 4 (28:40):
I mean.

Speaker 3 (28:41):
I always said for a long time that I think
part of the problem with Ben Simmons development was that
Ben Simmons year one, one fifty two games. So from
right away, Ben Simmons was on, you know, on the
hook and on the hot seat to go win games,
go win playoff games, be the first or second best player,
don't try new things, and he should have obviously he could.

Speaker 2 (29:06):
I'm not.

Speaker 3 (29:07):
Yeah, it is forgotten though, like we won fifty plus games,
like multiple years with him as the second best player.

Speaker 4 (29:12):
Like here's a legit all star. People do forget that, Like,
so there is.

Speaker 3 (29:16):
Something to be said about, Like I do think Ben's
career and yeah, obviously there's obvious problems with him just
as a person, But Ben Ben's career I think.

Speaker 2 (29:27):
Does play out differently.

Speaker 3 (29:28):
If he goes to a bad team right away, I
think it forces him to create more for himself, It
forces him to try more things. I don't think he
would have had the same arrogance right away too, because
he walked into the league and became an All Star
immediately became the second best player on a team that
was like very quickly favored to win the East.

Speaker 2 (29:49):
I remember, like pretty quickly at that that first year.

Speaker 3 (29:53):
So yeah, I I I don't necessarily think it's like
the team building thing like I think I'm I think
it's a one size fits all. Every player is different.
For instance, like I think Trey Johnson would be best
off going to Utah or like Brooklyn or Washington where
he can basically be the face of the team and
like go develop into whatever, like elite level shot maker

(30:16):
creator guy you can be or whatever you if you're
gonna be Malik Beasley and be a role player, we're
gonna find that out. But you know, we can pretty
easily see, you know, the development in that, I think,
but uh.

Speaker 6 (30:29):
An example, I was just just thinking as you were
talking for examples, that's kind of Scoot Henderson and and
that's a pretty crowded situation at guard with with the Blazers.
But he made quite a big leap from one year one.
And I'm not the biggest Scoot Henderson guy, but he
was much better this year than last year.

Speaker 2 (30:45):
He was calling victim to the narratives, the Scoot narrative.

Speaker 5 (30:48):
No, he had a better year. You don't believe it.

Speaker 2 (30:50):
We look at his stats, it's not that much better.

Speaker 5 (30:52):
I watched more Blazers.

Speaker 2 (30:55):
He had a he had a month, he had a
he had a like finish.

Speaker 5 (30:58):
The season pretty strong.

Speaker 3 (30:59):
It was actually like February March. He ended up tailing off.
I think he shot like fifteen percent from three in
April or something like that. But he it was it's
crazy if you go look at his splits. I because
so this is how I know this.

Speaker 2 (31:14):
This is a tangent. But I was a Brandon Miller
guy in that draft.

Speaker 3 (31:18):
Like one of my biggest takes in recent years was
Miller over Scoot Skill, And yeah.

Speaker 2 (31:24):
Miller's had a weird Miller was really good as a rookie.

Speaker 5 (31:27):
He shot like fifth injuries injuries shot.

Speaker 3 (31:29):
Like eleven three is a game this year in like
the twenty games he played, so he had like he
had a really weird season and they're a dumpster fire.
But I Shrill gave me credit on a stream we
did recently where he said, like Mark was a Miller
over Scoot guy. So obviously you know, he's not totally crazy,
and I think it was in relation to the East.

Speaker 2 (31:51):
But and then I was like, oh, well, you know
Scoot is playing better, so maybe I'm on the hot
seat with that. And he's like the Scoot pr gotch
like go and we pulled up the stats live on
the stream.

Speaker 5 (32:02):
It's shocking how you're right about the stats.

Speaker 2 (32:05):
It's shocked.

Speaker 6 (32:06):
I'm telling you, Like, I remember watching him as a
rookie and then watching like more Blazers game that Blazers
games I would have liked to do this year. I'm like,
just the aggressiveness, the decision making. I don't have the
turnover numbers in front of me, But I venture to
say those were down. The shots still really never gonna
be that. I'm not saying Scoo's gonna be a great,
great player in the league, but to me, just eyeball,
Scoot had a much better year and developed year two

(32:29):
than year one. But but I get your point, one hundred,
the stats are down, You're right about that.

Speaker 3 (32:32):
The big I think he shot forty from three for
like a five or six week stretch, which I don't
think anybody thinks.

Speaker 2 (32:38):
That's a thing with him are going to be possible.

Speaker 5 (32:40):
So turnovers were down a decent bit, which is.

Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah, is important.

Speaker 3 (32:45):
They they were improved this year in general, but I
think it was mostly just uh, he had a really
really nice month and a half. And yeah, I think
that'll be interesting an interesting thing to track because Portland's
one of like many teams in the draft here and
we can transition this to a Derek Queen conversation real fast.
But I think there's a lot of teams in the

(33:07):
like middle of the draft, like Houston at ten, Houston
at ten, if you stick and pick, let's say they're
not making Kevin Durant pick or Kevin Rant trade or
Yannis trade or whatever it is, and they're just you know,
running back a similar team and they're picking ten.

Speaker 2 (33:22):
What does Houston need?

Speaker 3 (33:23):
Like Reed Shepherd couldn't get minutes last year because there
was too many guards on defense or at center. You
have Adams who you just paid as your backup center,
You're keeping Shangun around at wing, you have so many
you can't get the minutes.

Speaker 2 (33:37):
You have Brooks, you have Ease, and you have Whitmore.
You have obviously Thompson, who I almost.

Speaker 3 (33:42):
Considered, like I don't even know what it's not really
a wing or a guard or they He's kind of
like his own unicorn type.

Speaker 2 (33:48):
But what do you need if you're Houston? Like I
kind of feel the same way about Portland.

Speaker 3 (33:53):
Like Portland you have Simon's and Scowed and Shade on
and you have a bunch of wings now you have
or you have Klinging and Ayton at the beate. Like
there's a lot of these teams in the middle of
the draft, So I feel like, are weird fits for
whoever they draft?

Speaker 2 (34:10):
And Queen is probably gonna go in that range. Where
are you thinking Queen goes?

Speaker 3 (34:15):
Where are you hoping he goes kind of what's your
outlook on Queen A couple or I guess a week
away from the draft, less than a week away.

Speaker 2 (34:21):
From the draft.

Speaker 5 (34:22):
Yeah, I got a run in a couple minutes. Butal quick.

Speaker 6 (34:24):
First, I just want to say that I've been doing
my draft prep over the last three or four weeks,
and you pitched me on Jayce Richardson months and months ago,
and I was like, oh, yeah, I think.

Speaker 5 (34:34):
It could be a good player, could be a good player.
We'll see your dog loves the Jayce s Ritcherson takes.

Speaker 2 (34:42):
Piece is a dog, Yeah.

Speaker 5 (34:44):
Chase's a dog. So and then I was like, oh,
I think could be a good player.

Speaker 6 (34:46):
But really diving into the film and everything over the
last three weeks, I love Jayce Richardson. I am fully
bought in on him. I can't believe he didn't get
a draft green room invite. Some of the guys who
got there's twenty four guys got a green room invite,
and Jase Richardson didn't. If he slips past twenty four,
that would be a massive steal forever got some I
think is his floor is a really good role player

(35:08):
in the NBN.

Speaker 5 (35:09):
I don't think he's gonna be some like star by
any stretch, not at all.

Speaker 6 (35:12):
But I think he's gonna be contributing player to a
really good team then yet, so you yeah, go ahead,
a little.

Speaker 2 (35:17):
Bit smaller Jerry McCain, without the zest of the TikTok.

Speaker 6 (35:20):
I said, I said a little bit. He can't shoot
like Jerry McCain. That's I mean, not off the dribble,
not off the dribble like Jerry McCain. Three, but a
lot of them were. He can play off the ball,
which is what I like about.

Speaker 2 (35:32):
Down the stretch though, when they gave him more, when
they gave him more on ball opportunities, I thought he
really improved on that down the stretch And kind of
similar to McCain, McCain was a kid who right away
wasn't like the leopard or kind of like guy controlling
the ball. I was saying.

Speaker 6 (35:47):
I was saying, a smaller Derek White because his pick
he's just really good pick and roll, really good catch
and shoot shooter. But it's a good pick and roll
of decision, make it really efficient. But he's not gonna
run a million is a game. So I see a
little smaller Derek White probably not as good as him
because he's a borderline store.

Speaker 3 (36:04):
But yeah, I think the problem with Derek White is
so much of it's wrapped into defense. My my thing
with Jace is like, if we're not going McCain and
not to keep it all six ers, I feel like
it's like Seth Curry, if a slightly worse shooting Seth
Curry a slightly more juice on offense, Seth Curry in
terms of.

Speaker 4 (36:23):
Like definitely more juice. Yeah, definitely more juice, like off
the dribble end. Like like if Seth Curry was a
slightly ware shooter, he's not an NBA player, Like that's
all Seth curryes.

Speaker 5 (36:33):
Wasn't Curry probably, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (36:35):
Yeah, Seth was really good at one point.

Speaker 3 (36:38):
It was.

Speaker 5 (36:38):
He had some amazing shooting seasons. I think he actually
led the NBA in three point percent.

Speaker 4 (36:43):
This year six Ers, a franchise record for the three
point percentage.

Speaker 2 (36:47):
He was on Game five that we lost in that building.
That's like my villain origin story of not getting on
ESPN that night. But I he had thirty five points
in that game. Fun fat, Yeah, Joel had like thirty seven.

Speaker 6 (37:02):
To answer your question about Derek Queen before Sean jumps
on me and I'll respond and I'll probably just duck
and leave once again. Look, I think Derek Quen's gonna
be an awesome player. And yeah, you can say it's
biased because I'm a Maryland guy and I'm gonna root
for him no matter what as a Maryland guy. But
I also watched almost every single Maryland.

Speaker 5 (37:20):
Game this year.

Speaker 6 (37:21):
He is He has skills as a big that are
just you every NBA team once right now. He can
put the ball on the floor, he can operate in isolation,
from the nail, from the top of the key. He's
a great passer, great touch, great.

Speaker 5 (37:34):
Feel for the game.

Speaker 6 (37:35):
Not a great three point shooter, but he five of
the seven Mae threes came the last four games of
the season, so he improved and you can see the
touches there. And he's got free throw shooter, so that
can project well that he can develop a shot. There
are defensive concerns, So when you ask me where do
I want to see him go, it's so the Wizards,
because I think that front court pairing with him and
Alex Sar would be exceptional. Because Derek Queen has concerns

(37:57):
as a as a defender, but when he's paired with
a great rim protector like Alex Sorrow, who I think
is a really he can be a really good big
in this league and showed flash as a great rim
protector as a rookie last year for the Wizards. I
think that's a perfect pairing. And we saw Derek Queen
on offense play with a rim running five like Julian
Reese was last year for Maryland. So I think Derek Queen,

(38:18):
wherever he goes, he's gonna have an exceptional career. But
I'd like to see him with the Wizards because I
think that's a good fit. And they just had him
in his backyard for the last few years. Well he
was at He's a from Maryland, went to IMG Academy
and then played ball at Maryland, so he's the Wizards
should be very familiar with him.

Speaker 2 (38:32):
I'll just say this before throwing at the Seawan. That
would be a Hindenburg level disaster taking Derek Queen six.

Speaker 4 (38:39):
But you can do it three for all I care.

Speaker 5 (38:41):
He's that good.

Speaker 4 (38:42):
He'd go eighteen for for oh, I could see as well.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
I haven't had him sixteen.

Speaker 4 (38:47):
Yeah, I don't think that's crazy. Mark Sam. We can
fully take the gloves off on our debate for Monday
when we really want to dig into this. But I
want you to marinate unlike this specific question a little
bit like what do you see his NBA role being?
Because that's what I continue to struggle with. Is he
a four? Is he a five? Kenny Garden? The perimeter
is gonna be good enough as a rent protector and
rebounder there? What do you projects like his NBA role?

Speaker 2 (39:11):
It's it's more it's Randalli ish.

Speaker 5 (39:16):
No, I hate that compare. I really hate. I've seen
that a lot because Randall.

Speaker 6 (39:19):
Randall's like a downhill bully ball driver and he's not
close to the passer that Derek Queen is.

Speaker 7 (39:25):
I I.

Speaker 2 (39:27):
Randalls are much better passing game.

Speaker 5 (39:32):
Yeah, it's not about the assist per game.

Speaker 6 (39:35):
It's about the passing instincts that Queen showed all season
where he just makes these.

Speaker 4 (39:40):
One point nine one point nine negative assists of turnover ratio,
never had more than five assists.

Speaker 6 (39:45):
In a game and had one or zero instincts They
see from like an opera and sengoon or like a
bonus guys like that who can both better.

Speaker 2 (39:55):
And it's hard to compare those guys. They didn't play
college day college.

Speaker 5 (40:00):
I think he did.

Speaker 6 (40:01):
I think he came over for college for a year.
Let's check real quick. I don't remember as much as
a prost he played at Gonzaga. He played a Gonzaga
Yeah wow. But to answer your question, what role will
Derek Queen played? To me, it's more as a four
with a great rim protecting five. Who that what you
saw with Meryland last year is like Derek Queen can
operate as a hub of an offense like you see

(40:22):
a Sabonus do sometimes, and sa Bonus is an undersize five,
and I think they see Sabonus play more than four, honestly,
with because their defense startles.

Speaker 5 (40:29):
Because of it.

Speaker 6 (40:29):
Maryland had one of the best defense in the country
last year when Derek Queen was playing the four, And
that's because when you have a great five, you can
kind of mask some of those concerns when he's guarding
on the perimeter, which which makes sense offensively, though, Derek Queen,
when he's playing the four as a short role playmaker,
if he develops more of a shot operating as a
hub of an offense when you have a five, kind
of hanging out in the dunker spot. I like that,

(40:50):
and then offensively can also play the five because he's
he's if he develops a shot, because he has those
passing skills, and you can kind of go five out
or him as the hub. There are defense of concerns,
don't get me wrong. I see those both as a
rim protector and guarding the perimeter. But I think that's
that's partly. It was a motor thing and energy thing
last year, and I think there's an opportunity for him
to grow in that area.

Speaker 2 (41:11):
But like Julius Randall was definitely like a hub of
an offense.

Speaker 4 (41:14):
For a Kentucky at Kentucky for the Knicks.

Speaker 5 (41:17):
Like hub of the offense. Okay, hub of the offense
for Julius.

Speaker 6 (41:20):
Randall's like he's getting a lot of the touches, a
lot of mid post catches and all that hub. Derek
Queen is like top of the key, like like nail touches,
and there's kind of a lot of cutting movement d
d It shows off him like you don't see d it.
Joe's off off of off of Randall, and I just
like Randall is not the pass like I understand the
averagelsis he's.

Speaker 4 (41:40):
A better than Derek Straight in the NBA.

Speaker 5 (41:44):
That will not be the case.

Speaker 3 (41:45):
I have Queen sixteenth, and I think I started with
him at like tenth, so I don't want to make
it seem like he's.

Speaker 5 (41:51):
Thirteen, fourteen, fifteen for you, Queen sixteen.

Speaker 2 (41:55):
I'll give you right above Queen. I have Clayton at fifteen.

Speaker 1 (42:00):
M on.

Speaker 5 (42:00):
That guy's tiny. You can't see over the defense.

Speaker 2 (42:03):
That's a fair concern. I have Jase like much higher
than Clayton.

Speaker 3 (42:06):
Like, Jason's small, so I do think that, like there
are times where small guards can play with special elite skills.

Speaker 2 (42:13):
But Meek Clifford I have fourteenth.

Speaker 5 (42:15):
I love, He's my favorite prospect in this drafts. I'm
not gonna argue that.

Speaker 3 (42:18):
Will rob Ones Will Riley I have thirteenth, and I
think there's fair concerns about Will Riley's defense. Will Riley,
like I get, I think I can like more accurately
defend all of my other kind of my other guys
above Queen. Based on stats, Will Riley's an eye test
guy for me where it's just like when I watch him,
I'm like, that's what a wing feels like at eighteen,

(42:40):
like he's like six', nine he's super athletic and can
like kind of handle for himself and get to the
hole and CAN i like the form shooting, wise even
if he didn't shoot that well in. College SO i
won't go like through my whole. Board BUT i don't
want to make it seem Like queen has no chance
to be a good, Player LIKE i don't think that
LIKE i think that there he definitely has a chance

(43:00):
to be a good. Player AND i think he's got
a special touch around the rim clearly for a. BIG
i think he's got more so than the. PASSING i
think he's got special ball handling ability for a big
in terms of not getting kind of like stolen doubles
aren't gonna kill him at, all even regardless of the
passing or so about like candling in the post WHERE

(43:23):
i differ and the defense is what the defense. Is
i'm actually like you could convince me more on the
defense than the. Hubs the hub stuff to.

Speaker 2 (43:32):
Me Queen, hube that's like a it sounds like a
you know, whatever a.

Speaker 3 (43:36):
Website BUT i, think, UH i don't, know but Gry,
QUEEN i don't buy like The shengoon hubs stuff even.
Random my, part my problem with the random comparison IS
i think if he was a special of the passer
as people make him out to, be AND i think
in high school.

Speaker 2 (43:55):
He was especially regarded as. PASSER i know that it's
not just the.

Speaker 3 (43:59):
Cysts based on, passing he'd average more than one point,
nine it's just per game he'd have more than A
he didn't have a single game with more than five.
Assists Like sean, said, LIKE i think we would have
seen that stuff pop out more in college than it,
did especially with how much he had the ball in
his hands At.

Speaker 2 (44:14):
MARYLAND i JUST i think the hub stuff is where
people go too far.

Speaker 6 (44:19):
Personally i'm just telling, you, like the vision and the
basketball instincts are. There like, like trust me WHEN i,
say like watching a guy like, that the vision and
the basketball instincts are. There so, yeah maybe the assists weren't,
there but he is a great Passion he's only go
to develop and do a better.

Speaker 5 (44:33):
Passer the guy's nineteen years.

Speaker 6 (44:35):
Old and the last Thing i'll say is you just
don't pass on biggs who are that Skill like those
guys usually work out in THE. Nba you figure out the,
defensive you figure out that positional. Concerns but bigs who
are that skilled in THE, nba you don't pass on
those guys who can, pass who can put the ball
on the, floor who have great touch around the, rim
great free throw. Shooters you just don't pass on bigs

(44:55):
who are that skilled because those guys usually work in THE,
nba and it's gonna be no different With Derek.

Speaker 2 (44:58):
Queen there Is i'll let you guys save it For. Mondays.

Speaker 3 (45:03):
Sam sam's gotta, Go Sam, oastry you can follow On
twitter at S Austree go follow this stuff over at the.
Score he'll be, uh he'll be doing prayer circles For
Derek queen to end up in THE dmv. COMING i
can't believe the draft is four days, away but four days,
away And sean And sam will be breaking it down all.

Speaker 2 (45:24):
Week i'm sure all things related to THE Nba. Draft
thanks so much for coming, On, sam appreciate.

Speaker 4 (45:29):
It.

Speaker 5 (45:29):
Guys we'll talk to you soon of.

Speaker 2 (45:31):
Course.

Speaker 3 (45:31):
Yeah one of our favorite guests, There Sam, austrey talking
all things.

Speaker 2 (45:35):
Basketball actually meant to ask. Him you probably know more than.
Me Is sam A phillies. FAN i.

Speaker 4 (45:41):
Believe, Yeah i'm pretty Sure i've.

Speaker 2 (45:43):
Never talked about he's not a big baseball.

Speaker 4 (45:46):
Guy, YEAH i don't think a big baseball. Guy But
i'm pretty sure he's All philly teams except for The
knicks of. Course.

Speaker 2 (45:52):
Yeah the next may.

Speaker 3 (45:53):
Think maybe The yankees. GUY i don't, know but, YEAH
i was. Curious i'll have to talk about to ask
about that next. Time but speaking of The.

Speaker 2 (46:03):
Phils on the other, side we're gonna talk all things
relating to the biggest series of the year so far
for our.

Speaker 3 (46:12):
Fightings here we are in Late june with the best
record not only in The National League, east but in
The National. League one game up on those Evil mets
From New york and we got two more to go,
here so two big games to break, down especially last
night and tonight coming. Up on the other side here
in soccer radio.

Speaker 1 (46:33):
Spreads total and all the prop that's in the. Tweens
it's The Gambler number one on your car radio preset.
Hand the new and Improved Diehard radio W yes AND
wd two Seven BREAK D philadelphia Is Fox Sports. Radio
The Gambler.

Speaker 8 (47:07):
First, days first, recipe suck a Fair welcome back to
the tough cover radio show right here On Fox Sports
The gambler talking about the, fightings The, phils the best
record in The National league all of a, sudden you,
know things were not looking.

Speaker 2 (47:27):
Good pretty recently.

Speaker 1 (47:29):
We, are.

Speaker 2 (47:31):
And you know The mets have had their. Slump it's
almost like there's one hundred and sixty two games in
a baseball.

Speaker 4 (47:37):
Season, yeah there sure are a lot of. Them SO
i do think like this, team we obviously had that
real low point WHERE i think it did get genuinely concerning,
here but it does feel like they found a little
something again THAT i think that these storylines within this,
Team Alec bohm looking significantly better at the, Play Bryson
stott finding some life, Here Brandon marsh tearing the cover
off the ball, Lately there's been a lot of encouraging

(47:59):
signs from top to. Bottom Trade turner is certainly playing
the best baseball that he has at A phillies uniform
to this. Point SO i think this is just a
bit of this team sort of looked themselves in the
mirror and said we're. Better we're all better baseball, players
and the way we've been playing of, late we're seeing
the results kind of turn around because of, it but
they called The mets at a good. SPOT i was
glad they kind of laid the hammer and kept it
rolling last, night and still think they can do some

(48:20):
more damage in this. Series so hopefully that's only the. Start.

Speaker 2 (48:23):
YEAH i think where we're at is that this rotation
is the best in baseball for a.

Speaker 3 (48:29):
Reason and when you have the best rotation in baseball
and the deepest ROTATION i can ever remember A phillies
team having by far even twenty, eleven.

Speaker 2 (48:39):
Like you were deep one to, four like you, Know
Joe blanton is the, five and so like you had
anyone after that when anyone missed. Time so this is
the deepest rotation we've ever, seen and that is going
to win you a lot of, games especially when your
bullpent isn't bottom. Five AND i think even if we
get frustrated with moments from strong moments and there at

(49:00):
the bottom of the bullpen's.

Speaker 3 (49:01):
Terrible Taiwan walker thinking about the sixth ning last night
was a, joke but there's concerns.

Speaker 2 (49:07):
There BUT i think that we moved the.

Speaker 3 (49:09):
Past they're not, like you, know the twenty Nineteen, phillies
the twenty twenty One phillies in terms of, that those
bullpens of the past being totally kind of stopping whatever
you want to do as a baseball. Team so all
the lineup really needs to do is.

Speaker 2 (49:27):
Be average to above, average and that's probably gonna win
this team ninety five games just based on how elite
the pitching.

Speaker 4 (49:35):
Is, YEAH i mean that's definitely. True like it's interesting
the identity and like the fabric of this team is
very much shifted. To it was so built around home
runs and offensive production and scoring a ton of runs
that it very much has shifted. To this is a
a pitchers driven team at this. Point the starting rotation
is the key quality of This phillies team this. Year
that's their identity is that they are going to be

(49:56):
a better pitching staff. THERE i still think pretty much
regardless of what happens across this entire regular, season that
is obviously down to what happens in the, playoffs AND
i don't think that there's anything that this team could
do to either prove those that believe wrong or guys
that doubt to change their. Minds so it is a
long grind for the. Season there's still like the. BULLPEN
i know you've been more positive about the bullpen probably

(50:19):
THAN i have overall. HERE i still would like them
to go out there and add some like they just
need more straight up. Bodies they just don't have enough
trustworthy guys at this. Point so there's still moves that
need to be. Made But i'm encouraged by what we've seen.

Speaker 3 (50:30):
Them, YEAH i just think, again like we've talked about,
it but there's only going to be four.

Speaker 2 (50:36):
Starter you, know maybe If nol is, hurt then we
can there's a chance That nol is not factoring into the,
playoffs but if he, is there's only four guys who can.
Start and you've got right now six guys who you
feel pretty good about, starting and you've Got Andrew Paynter
wining in the. Wings SO i think three of those
guys are going to be in the. Bullpen SO i

(50:57):
want to go get one bullpen.

Speaker 3 (50:59):
Arm BUT i think my p one of the, BULLPEN
i still feel this, way is just that they are
not going to stop this team from doing what it
wants to, do from winning ninety five. Games ish it
might you, know maybe a good, bullpen a slightly better
bullpen would get them to ninety. Eight maybe if they
were slightly worse than you, know bottom, five bottom, ten.

Speaker 2 (51:21):
Then that could be. Ninety BUT i think the bullpen's
not going to stop them from winning the division or
doing whatever they want to. Do so my whole thing
is JUST i think the bats might stop them from
doing what they want to do in the.

Speaker 4 (51:35):
PLAYOFFS i think so bullpen is the same. Case be Like.
Mick If mick abel is pitching that ending last night
instead of time On, walker do you feel? Differently would fel?

Speaker 2 (51:44):
Great? YEAH i THINK i think mixed stuff plays up
perfect out of the. Bullpen throwing ninety eight big loop and,
curveball you've got the change up like four or five
pitches For. Mick Like, Taiwan walker is a joke of
an option as a bullpen, guy AND i understand that
he did well as a.

Speaker 3 (52:03):
Starter it's a totally different set of circumstances to be
a starter than a. Reliever, now the reason THAT i
feel pretty good about it from The phillies perspective is
because we Have.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
Ranger who is a. CONVERSATION i think we actually have
to Have ranger has the bullpen, experience so you feel
good about him potentially being used in that. Way although
that might be IT i think that might be.

Speaker 4 (52:26):
Over he's, filthy, man. Filthy we're going to talk about.

Speaker 2 (52:31):
It it's. Unbelievable it's a really incredible. Development and then
you Have, lozarta WHO i think also could play up
out of the.

Speaker 3 (52:41):
Pen like his stuff is, electric even if you wanted
to Say, SANCHEZ i think his stuff is. Electric the
interesting thing, IS i can't see a scenario where Come
october we feel better About nola than any Of, Sanchez
zarda or A.

Speaker 2 (52:55):
RANGER i don't Think nola's stuff works out of the pen,
Necessarily LIKE i think he's a, starter and what he
gives you is the you, know he can always give
you six innings and all that stuff With.

Speaker 3 (53:08):
Nola so the interesting thing with him is even if
he comes back late and it's, like, oh we'll throw
him in the, bullpen, LIKE i don't know.

Speaker 2 (53:15):
If that works With, nola BUT i do think out
of the. Options and Then, painter If painter is what
we Think painter, IS i think it should make. Sense
out of my stance On painter was he should have
been the closer In. April BUT.

Speaker 6 (53:30):
I i to the.

Speaker 2 (53:31):
Mickpoint i've been bullish on this since the first. Start
put him in the pen now or at least once
you Get nola back Or.

Speaker 4 (53:39):
Painter, Yeah i'm certainly not against trying.

Speaker 1 (53:41):
THAT i.

Speaker 4 (53:42):
Could it's worth giving a look or giving it a try.
THERE i don't Think i'm as locked in on for
sure mckabel's the solution THAT i totally. See idee you
to you About. PAINTER i don't understand the hesitancy or
the resistance and to, me the best pathway for this
guy to get him some real playoff. Innings LIKE i
understand it's a different and you, know like routine and
approach or however you want to put it, There but

(54:03):
the end of the, day baseball's, baseball, man and if
he wants to be a high leverage pitcher for This phillies,
team which everyone, expects and that is the game plan
at this point in the, time that's the way to
season him a little bit in my. Mind SO i
don't like the resistance that they're clearly showing. There and
it also should be noted Like painter has gotten hit
up a little bit in the minor leagues these past
couple outings, there so it's.

Speaker 3 (54:22):
WELL i think he HAS i think either his last
outing or his last two outings have been.

Speaker 2 (54:26):
Better NOW i think HE i think he's even do.

Speaker 4 (54:30):
Not i'm not Saying i'm panicking about her, whatsoever BUT
i don't think he might be this this cure all
the WAY i think he'd sometimes talked.

Speaker 2 (54:36):
About pictures in.

Speaker 9 (54:38):
General it's like wings in THE, Nba, like yeahs are
generally not great right, Away like it is a developmental,
process like to get to where those guys.

Speaker 2 (54:49):
Are Paul schimes is a, unicorn. LIKE i think too
many people see that and see moments where there are,
young young starters who come up and pitch right. AWAY
i THINK i even think some of The japanese pitchers
have kind of skewed that because they come in at
like age thirty. Generally BUT i think.

Speaker 3 (55:06):
It's really hard to expect rookie pitchers to come on
to a winning team and make an. Impact Now i'm
kind of expecting it a little bit From, painter just
because of how talted he's been for such a long.
Time from WHAT i read About, painter the problem recently
has been that the fastball is really.

Speaker 2 (55:24):
Flat, yeah all year it's been really flat and. Hittable
the off speed still, good the velocities, there it's just
that there's Not he used to have a lot of
movement on his. Fastball now it's just kind of cruising
right in.

Speaker 3 (55:37):
There SO i think that's something that's probably, workable and
that's something that is probably something that can be fixed
if the velocity is, there the off speed's.

Speaker 4 (55:46):
There SO i do.

Speaker 3 (55:48):
THINK i, mean If painter comes up and gets roughed
up in his first outing or second, out like both
two of his first three, items whatever it, is it
has a five two.

Speaker 2 (55:56):
Era i'm not going to be, shocked, like, yeah that's
kind of probably should.

Speaker 3 (56:00):
Have happened with Mcabel and it's kind of WHY i
am bullish on Abel able doing what he's done at this.
Age IS i think it's ALL i connected a little
bit To jared McCain where it's like guards in THE
nba on guards in THE, nba don't come in and

(56:21):
do What jared McCain did in year. One it's almost
like starting, pitchers, like don't come in and throw you,
know seven, inning, shutout two starts in a row or
whatever it was over his first two. STARTS i and
by the, way this transition is nically my best man
of the day is The Philadelphia phillies today on the
money line three. UNITS i believe in. IT i believe

(56:42):
In nick to have a good start in the biggest
spot of his. Life so far here against The mets
and The. Phillies you look at the B vp numbers they.

Speaker 2 (56:50):
Hit they have Hit Griffin kining pretty well the guys
who have seen, him so hopefully the offense gets going
for The. PHILLS i think that the two biggest storylines
with The phillies lineup Is Brandon marsh And Alec. Boom
And i've been on this for a while, now But
Brandon marsh Since may, third since he came back from

(57:13):
his quote Unquote, alston he's hit three thirty. Seven he
has had four h NINE obp and eighty FOUR ops
over one hundred and fifteen at bats thirty nine. Games
phillys are twenty five and fourteen in those, Games Like
Brandon marsh at the end At april sixteenth was hitting

(57:34):
ninety five with a three eighty SEVEN. Ops here we
are In june, twentieth even taking away he's hitting two
sixty six with seven thirty SIX. Ops he has a
POSITIVE ops so it's positive batting average above the above
the average line, like and that's with one of the
worst potential two week starts any player had Across Major League.

(57:55):
Baseball and the same is true For Alec.

Speaker 3 (57:58):
Boom Alec boom since, fourteenth around the same time That
marsh was sent, Down Alec boone's hitting three twenty one
within eight twenty THREE ops in sixty one games and
two hundred and fifty two at. Bats and he's another
guy when On april twelfth he was hitting one fifty

(58:18):
one with a three thirty SIX. Ops here we are
he's hitting two eighty nine with a seven to FORTY.
Ops that's pretty unbelievable of a two month turnaround for
guys who we were kind of writing The phillies, EULOGY i,
think Especially.

Speaker 2 (58:35):
Marsh, yeah we were absolutely writing His Phillies phillies. Eulogy
people were regretting Trading Logan, ohapi WHO i think is
really cooled off.

Speaker 1 (58:43):
Now BUT.

Speaker 2 (58:46):
I think the biggest development of the last couple of
weeks or especially whatever whenever the losing streak kind of,
ENDED i think probably about about two weeks, Ago Brandon
marsh has made it so that that's one less spot
you have to go fifth at the trade.

Speaker 4 (59:01):
Deadline, yeah definitely huge storylines there and really impressive, turnarounds
and it takes some mental fortitude to even kind of dig,
that particularly a guy Like marsh, who as you, mentioned
like we very clearly we're talking About, okay it's just
not working. Out they need to have a new. DIRECTION
i do a little interesting, hypothetical AND i don't think
this is one that probably comes to light, here but
say The phillies were to trade for a, centerfielder a

(59:22):
guy that's an everyday center, fielder who becomes your left.
Fielder is It, marsha is It?

Speaker 2 (59:26):
Kepler Marsha mash, Absolutely, Marsh, yeah one hundred.

Speaker 3 (59:30):
Percent AND i think that's ACTUALLY i think a lot
of a lot of the, Season i've been, like you
can't be, picky you can't be choosy about who you.
Get you just have to get a right handed that
hopefully some. Power it doesn't matter what position he. Plays
you can move it, around shake it around. Whatever where
we are now With bryce's, injury he's not.

Speaker 2 (59:50):
Ever moving to the. Outfield here we are With.

Speaker 3 (59:56):
Schrebert you don't feel good about him out in the,
field And kepler has heated. Up BUT i don't take
couple more, seriously as a piece on the, Team brandon
marsh goes from being a bad center fielder to an
elite left.

Speaker 2 (01:00:12):
Fielder in terms of his.

Speaker 3 (01:00:14):
Fielding he he just can't cover the ground it takes
in center. Anymore he's clearly lost a step of speed
here since he's been here since twenty twenty. Two when
he came, here he was like a good center.

Speaker 2 (01:00:25):
FIELDER i think he's gotten much worse in the, field
but when he plays left, field he's been an elite left.
Fielder SO i think it's almost imperative if you are
going to get an, outfielder go get a center fielder
so you can officially Move marsh.

Speaker 4 (01:00:38):
Over, yeah, no that makes sense to. Me and by the,
way Shouting Nick castianos for requesting the defensive pamphlets to
understand his metrics a little bit better, there that was
an all time kind of hat tip move as you,
know as passive aggressive as you could. Get BUT i
love everything about the. Saga the castianis The Rob. Thompson
you did not seem to be as much of a

(01:00:59):
Fan Mark Henry, Junior so take me through my whole
thing was.

Speaker 2 (01:01:03):
Like and you were a part of, THIS i was
yelling at you guys on the.

Speaker 3 (01:01:06):
Chat it was more so just that things were going so,
great like we had won so many games in a
row or whatever it was at that.

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
POINT i don't remember it. WAS i guess it was
the did we lose the? Game castianos didn't.

Speaker 4 (01:01:20):
Play, no they STILL i think they still. Won that
we lost the, game he, complained the game he was benched.
FOR i believe.

Speaker 3 (01:01:29):
No ACTUALLY i Think i'd have to dive in here
and look at, it but either, WAY i think WE
i think we lost the game he was benched.

Speaker 2 (01:01:37):
For but, yeah so at that, Point i'm looking at
the schedule. Here at that, point we had won five.
Straight SO i just you guys were, like OH i.

Speaker 3 (01:01:45):
Love this top or showing, balls AND i was just, like,
YEAH i would get that if we had lost a
couple straight or we were playing five hundred ball as of,
late like whatever it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:53):
Was the vibes were so.

Speaker 3 (01:01:54):
Good we were winning so many, games like we just
had like Auto kemp had a big night and there
was feel good vibes with.

Speaker 2 (01:01:59):
That Ryan kirkering and just got like his first save
and he had.

Speaker 3 (01:02:03):
The postgame interview and they were celebrating his first, save
and it just felt like the vibes were so good
THAT i felt like anything negative or anything to change
whatever the vibes. Were AND i think that you, know
vibes are generally and like basketball or, football it's SOMETHING
i would probably laugh, At but in baseball season and
so long as one hundred six to two, GAMES i
really do think like that stuff, matters and momentum, matters

(01:02:26):
and like the clubhouse, matters and you have to be
playing for not only the, manager not only, yourself but
the other guys in the, clubhouse AND i think all
of that factors in in baseball more than any other.
SPORT i think WHAT i was saying was not, like,
oh we're gonna lose a bunch of games in a row,
now like the season's. RUINED i was just, saying anything
to distract from what's going on right now doesn't feel

(01:02:49):
like a good.

Speaker 4 (01:02:49):
Thing, yeah and for housekeeping, here they won the game
he was pulled out, Of they lost the game that
he was full bench for the Final, Yes and of
course he comes back and makes essentially the game winning
catch after which is.

Speaker 7 (01:03:01):
Just the.

Speaker 2 (01:03:04):
Game winning catch every right fielder in.

Speaker 4 (01:03:06):
Baseball, Sure, sure but that's sort of sort of part
of the whole argument in case here is that, like
like he has to make that, play and he, did
and that's The Nick casiana, Story like he's not a good.
Defender don't get it, twisted BUT i do think that
this guy takes it like personally that he's certainly improved
miles from when he first got To philadelphia for what he, Is,
like this dude started his career as A dh for a,

(01:03:27):
reason and he was A dh for The tigers and
for most of his career until coming To. Philadelphia so,
LIKE i think cass has some pride in wanting to be.
CONSIDERED i, mean he's never gonna be, Mobile He's we
saw j T romudo almost lap him from second base
yesterday on the base path because that's kind of pace
we're working, with AND i understand where the ball was.
Hitting all those kind of things were a factor as.

(01:03:47):
Well casianis is not a good. Defender he should not
be taken out of the conversation for like is impossible
to take, Out Like rojas is better defender than. Him
it's not rocket science to analyze, that especially late in games.
THERE i think we still don't know what was directly said.
Here but if we know anything About Nick, cassianos LIKE
i think it's on brand for him to make some

(01:04:08):
sort of comment. THERE i was Think Rob thompson for
a guy that the number one critique of him that
he like doesn't you, know stick up in the locker
room or have like, this you, KNOW i, guess like you,
know enforcer type mentality here THAT i thought he showed
a little something, there SO i thought it was fair
game in all parties and kind of like that it all.

Speaker 3 (01:04:24):
HAPPENED i guess my critique On thompson has never been
about the clubhouse BECAUSE i actually felt like that was
always his, Strength LIKE i feel like the guys loved.
Him so my critique On thompson is that he doesn't
ever talk to the, yump which people can if they want.

Speaker 4 (01:04:41):
To last, NIGHT i actually last night was definitely a
case where you should HAVE.

Speaker 3 (01:04:45):
I think that there's a mental game you have to
play as a manager WHERE i think you do have
to have air constant conversation with the, yump and, uh you,
KNOW i think speaky wheels get grease.

Speaker 2 (01:04:56):
Sometimes as bad as that is to, SAY i do
THINK i forget it's especially like, Basketball LIKE i forget
who it was on part of my take talking about,
it but there's a college coach talking About hurley and
he was saying how he Thinks hurley complains so much
that it helps them because, you as a ref want

(01:05:17):
to be so sure when you're blowing the whistle against,
him because you, know no matter, what it's going to
be an. Argument so you have to have like you
have to feel confident in whatever you. Call and he's
he would say like he would start yelling at the
refs coming down the, floor be, like stop listening to.
Him you're you're sane AND i are calling the. GAME

(01:05:37):
i think that's just human.

Speaker 3 (01:05:38):
Nature, Yeah AND i think that's just part of a
job as a manager is when your guys are getting,
screwed usually balls and, strikes you need to chime up
and you need to say.

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
Something.

Speaker 4 (01:05:49):
Yeah, NO i totally agree with, That AND i thought
last night was an example where they should have.

Speaker 5 (01:05:53):
That like the.

Speaker 4 (01:05:53):
Strike someone was inconsistent all, night like there was back
to back, something, yeah WHICH i. LOVE i love the.
CHAIRMAN i think he was chirping the third base something
for the check swing, there which was also insane because
he very clearly went around on that check swing, there
AND i thought it was a strike straight up anyway
in the first place on that pitch. There but Nonetheless
Wan soda managed or he ended up getting struck out

(01:06:15):
twice on that Same and you're laughing at My Wan
soda as a. Loser it, takes aren't.

Speaker 2 (01:06:19):
You, YEAH i think we have to bring this.

Speaker 4 (01:06:22):
Up he is a World he's a. Loser he's a
stone cold. Loser like the way that guy goes about his,
BUSINESS i don't think he's earned the right to to this.
Point Wan. SO i get he's making seven out of
sixty five million. DOLLARS i get that he is A
World series, champion he's one of the better players in.
Baseball but, dude the way that he just walks around
and casually and all this, stuff it really rubs me

(01:06:44):
the wrong. WAY i love that he's on The. METS
i love that this is a dude THAT i get
to hate for probably the rest of his baseball career
BECAUSE i just don't think he's in the same like
Like Aaron judge is a miles better baseball player Than Wan. Soto, yes, yes,
yes Where's Jan? Soda like do you think he's the

(01:07:05):
best playing. Baseball he's, No, no he's.

Speaker 3 (01:07:09):
NOT i Think judge is, better BUT i don't think
he's Like miles, better is WHAT i would. Say, OKAY
i don't think anyone can Be miles. Better he's a
career nine forty. Five oh Ps, scott he hasn't. Been
he's a forty two this, year so he hasn't been
quite himself the last two years he was nine eighty
nine and nine. Thirty he's got the best Eye i've
ever seen a hitter. Have he's just like the most

(01:07:30):
disciplined Hitter i've ever. Seen word Yeahs, Stott oh my,
god he's been a LITTLE i actually should go look
at his last week of two.

Speaker 2 (01:07:40):
Stats i'm.

Speaker 3 (01:07:41):
CURIOUS i FELT i felt better about his approach to.
Play but, ANYWAY I Jan soda is not a. Loser
Juan soto is like he's one of the best hitters in.

Speaker 2 (01:07:53):
Baseball he's. Not he's not a. Badfielder he probably shouldn't
be playing the.

Speaker 4 (01:07:57):
Field he this IS i think he. Encapsley it's The
New York mets is that it is empty, pockets empty.
Passion he's just a dude that he's paid a ton
of money to play baseball because he's very good at.
It he doesn't care about playing. Baseball he doesn't have
a motor in. Him he doesn't have this high level of.
Effort he's not a guy THAT i think it's going
to keep him up at night one way or, another
whether he had a good.

Speaker 2 (01:08:17):
Or a bad.

Speaker 4 (01:08:18):
GAME i think he's just like a soulless good baseball
player because he's incredibly as many had way more. PASSION
i Liked. MANNY i, MEAN.

Speaker 2 (01:08:31):
I think they're very.

Speaker 4 (01:08:32):
SIMILAR i can see. IT i can see. IT i
still think LIKE I i don't Think Wan soto has
like any heart. Whatsoever it's sort of What i'm getting at.
HERE i felt some of. It Like manny definitely did
The Prima donna type stuff and all the.

Speaker 2 (01:08:46):
SWAGGER i don't think a lot More Prima, donna like
more concerning stuff like. THROWING i feel like a Secretary
donna Flat. Stairs, yeah, yeah he more like actually concerning.
STUFF i Think wan is just like A wan should
not be playing the.

Speaker 3 (01:09:03):
Field the only reason he's, not the only reason he's
playing the field is because.

Speaker 2 (01:09:07):
He's not A he's not like a Total if you
look at like the advanced.

Speaker 3 (01:09:11):
Metrics he's like an average, Fielder, like but he's paid
to go hit thirty home runs and walk one hundred
and fifty. Times, yeah and have a nine one hundred
plus ops putting him in like the top, five and kick.

Speaker 4 (01:09:26):
A bunch of dirt in the batter's box and puff
your chest. DOWN i love this shuffles. UNBELIEVABLE i, MEAN
i just LIKE i hate.

Speaker 2 (01:09:34):
HIM I i think if he wasn't a MET i
don't think we would feel this.

Speaker 4 (01:09:37):
Way probably partially, true BUT i do think Like i've
fully shifted to like he's. Overrated he's he's he's a,
good not great baseball. Player, No, no he's the.

Speaker 2 (01:09:49):
Leite he's an elite baseball.

Speaker 3 (01:09:50):
Player he's A hall Of famer right, now like he's
a leader leader. League the only guys you can argue
are better Are show And.

Speaker 4 (01:09:57):
Judge those are definitely, Better BUT I i don't, know,
MAN i agree they're. Better like, Peek Bryce harper is
better than Current. Wancetta you don't think that's, True, No
Bryce HARPER.

Speaker 2 (01:10:08):
A couple of years.

Speaker 3 (01:10:09):
AGO i Love, bryce jan So Wan soda Is Ted.
Williams he's the Best i've ever seen a hit or
Have like this is a guy who just. BREAKS i,
mean he's Loved leaguan walks four, times he's currently leading
the league and walks even in like a year where
he's down clearly at eight forty.

Speaker 2 (01:10:27):
Two oh. Ps, yeah he's.

Speaker 4 (01:10:30):
Just like part of what made me mad last Night,
Wheeler like he wasn't pitching around, him but he walked him,
twice and like the when.

Speaker 2 (01:10:38):
YOU i think it's a genius and part of Like
Jacob young is betting six in This mets, lineup like
The Mets Jack, neil LIKE i Know homer last, night
but like they have some guys in that lineup WHO
i am not scared.

Speaker 4 (01:10:53):
Of i'm not scared Of Juan, soto is What i'm
saying right. NOW i like that made me mad last,
Night Zach. Wheeler AND i don't think he did it.
INTENTIONALLY i think he didn't quite have his control the.

Speaker 3 (01:11:06):
Second he probably went up three zero that WAS i
think there was was there two out spaces?

Speaker 4 (01:11:12):
Empty that sounds right about.

Speaker 2 (01:11:15):
That THAT'S i think he's, right like that's that's there's
no reason to not do.

Speaker 3 (01:11:20):
That BUT i think it's more of a statement on
the rest of That mets lineup outside of Like pete And,
wan and outside of, That lindor's like over his last
like twenty or something. Crazy, Now LIKE I lindor's stats
are like not that different Than trey's this, year like
if you line them up one to, one, Like lindor's

(01:11:41):
not M. Vy he was NOT Mvp lindor last year
even statistically that's a whole other.

Speaker 7 (01:11:45):
Debate But lindor's not as good as he was last,
season and outside of those guys like that lineup is
a lot to be.

Speaker 2 (01:11:53):
Desired SO i actually it reminded. ME i was watching
that last night AND i had a totally different. THOUGHT
i loved. It it reminded. ME i don't know if
you ever Heard Greg maddox talk About Barry.

Speaker 3 (01:12:02):
Bonds greg And wansda is Not Barry, bonds even after
EVERYTHING i just, Said Barry bonds is the best Athlete
i've ever, seen But Jan sodom it reminds me of
that that the way that wheel are treated that Because
Roy holliday agreed With Greg maddox on.

Speaker 2 (01:12:19):
This Greg maddox someone, asked how do you pitch To Barry?

Speaker 3 (01:12:21):
Bonds and he, said, Oh i've cracked the code on, this,
LIKE i know exactly how to pitch To Barry.

Speaker 2 (01:12:27):
Bonds you point to first, base he's, like you tell
him to walk the first. BASE i don't care what he.
CAN i don't.

Speaker 3 (01:12:34):
Care you just look percentage, wise he just has a
much higher percent chance to hurt you than the other
guy's in the.

Speaker 2 (01:12:40):
Lineup that's not exactly the same, soda because he's now
like a seventy home run. Guy he's more of a
guy who's gonna kill you on a, walker kill you
on a, double and he's always likely To he's just
so likely to get on base every time he gets.

Speaker 3 (01:12:51):
Up SO i don't have a problem with walking him at.
ALL i think it's more of a referendum on That mes's.

Speaker 4 (01:12:56):
LINEUP i think that's all. FAIR i still like whe
have to the first at batman finished the. Dude don't
be afraid of this guy is sort of my, message
and that's WHAT i want to see for the rest
of the series IS i don't want to pitch around.
One SO i don't think this guy is as good
as he's paid to. BE i think he's an overrated
soulas baseball player and a straight up. Loser THAT i
can't wait for rood against for the next fifteen.

Speaker 2 (01:13:16):
Years i'm fine With. Solas i'm. Fine i'm loser is
wrong because The World series.

Speaker 3 (01:13:22):
Champion if he's a, loser THEN i think like percent of.
It and he was also, like like the main the
best PLAYER i.

Speaker 4 (01:13:30):
KNOW i EVEN i even look back at the playoffs
stats in preparation for, this and he was, great.

Speaker 2 (01:13:36):
Really good for The yankees in the playoffs last year.
Too i'm pretty. SURE i don't know about The World,
series BUT i think at least like leading up to
get them to The World, SERIES i think he was
really good in the playoffs last a lot better Than.

Speaker 4 (01:13:47):
Judge, Yeah judge was horrible in the.

Speaker 2 (01:13:48):
Playoffs, yeah, Yeah he's always horrible in the playoffs. Somehow but,
yeah That i'm overrated and then not not good enough
for what he's paid is WHERE i take this. Year
he's so. GOOD i hate The.

Speaker 3 (01:14:03):
Mets, hey if we want to have an overrated, conversation
let's talk About Francisco. Lindor i'm all yours to have
an overrated conversation On. Lindor that guy is one of
the more overrated players in sports in my. Opinion Brandon
nemo underrated THOUGH i Like nemo actually as a.

Speaker 4 (01:14:19):
Player But Bobby Bobby Wood junior is better Than.

Speaker 2 (01:14:21):
Wansta he's having a really down.

Speaker 3 (01:14:25):
YEAR i would say coming into the, YEAR i would
have Put wits better probably overall player who so does
a much better, hitter but with it's a great, shortstop
so it.

Speaker 2 (01:14:35):
Does there's a, conversation what's.

Speaker 3 (01:14:37):
He told, Me i'm pulling it. UP i know he's
been a little, worse especially. Lately he's still eight thirty two. Up,
yeah he's been better this. Year he's been better because
he's a great fielder and he's, younger so you would
you probably take.

Speaker 2 (01:14:50):
Him the one Thing i'll say is Like soto's gonna
be this for ten.

Speaker 3 (01:14:55):
Years LIKE I he's gonna eventually be A Dh so
his job is is going to be go up there
and you, know use your. Eye and it's not like
he's like reliant on athleticism or power in any.

Speaker 2 (01:15:07):
Way he's like a pure Like manny A.

Speaker 3 (01:15:12):
Rod type, hitter where it's just like he was born
to go up and hit and did not swing a bad.
Pitches and part of What i'll say Is wheeler pitched
around him in that second at bat the first at.

Speaker 2 (01:15:23):
Bet What i'll tell you is do you want to know?

Speaker 3 (01:15:26):
Too part OF i don't necessarily know If wheeler was
pitching or he's not pitching around.

Speaker 2 (01:15:31):
Him once you go up, though.

Speaker 3 (01:15:32):
Too he was trying to get him to Chase Juan
soto doesn't chase baseball's that's that's like his whole. Thing
so maybe that might be A Wheeler we saw that
article come out last, week but he does not.

Speaker 2 (01:15:46):
Research anything about. Anything and he, ASKED i forget who it.
Was he were right your, left and, yeah he's been
around for a good bit of tom and.

Speaker 3 (01:16:02):
Maybe he just didn't. Know just funny he's Played soto enough.
Times but, YEAH i don't, know BUT i would probably
say that that at. Bat the first at BAT i
think was Just sodo being. Soda the second at bat Was.
WHEELER i think having an empty base with two out
seats Like i'm Not i'm not Letting son ruined my.

Speaker 4 (01:16:20):
Night, YEAH i think that's accurate. THERE i just THINK
i think we all just missed his spots a little
bit in that first one, too like he didn't really
have his pinpoint control last, night and particularly the one
that was ball. FOUR i think that was intended to
be a strike up top that he just got to
put a little too much. On So i'm not hating
On Zach wheeler for. It But nick gabele, TONIGHT i
want you to Look Wan soda right in the eyes

(01:16:40):
and throw three strikes his. Direction that's my challenge for McK.

Speaker 3 (01:16:43):
Gabelele around the, Edges, nick around the, Edges that's WHAT
i would. Say but real, quick and we got to
get to our quarterback rankings, Here but real. Quick Ranger,
suarez he has a one point one seventy RA.

Speaker 2 (01:16:59):
A taking out his first start back from, injury he's
he's been the second best starter in baseball since. That
since that, start it's either. SECOND i think it's.

Speaker 3 (01:17:07):
EITHER i think it's second in THE nl Behind, schemes
maybe third Behind schemes And scubals since then, overall but.

Speaker 2 (01:17:14):
And not necessarily news That wheeler is retiring after twenty twenty.
Seven he has said that when HE i got the
hiccups here when he signed the, Contract wheeler did say,
that so it's not breaking. News he did reaffirm it
here we, are you, know maybe a year and a
half later said the same. THING i think where we

(01:17:34):
are right. NOW i think you have to.

Speaker 3 (01:17:37):
Sign Ranger suarez AND i don't think they're going to
AND i think it's a. Mistake AND i think a
couple of months, ago EVEN i the Biggest ranger.

Speaker 2 (01:17:47):
FAN i have his. Jersey it's my favorite player on the,
team my favorite athlete in the. City it's not a.
Stretch Jalen.

Speaker 3 (01:17:53):
Heer it's probably something to say about, that but he's right,
there not no. Joking rangers right there With.

Speaker 2 (01:17:58):
JALEN. I i literally WHEN i WHEN i realize he's
pitching that, night WHEN i look at like that DAY'S
i Get julie Knowing i'm gonna get to Watch.

Speaker 3 (01:18:07):
RANGER i love watching him. Pitch EVEN i was, saying,
well you, know we Have painter coming, up maybe Even.
Able you're gonna have to you Have lizardo for another.
Year sanchez has been so. GOOD i was understanding that.

Speaker 2 (01:18:20):
You probably have to let him.

Speaker 3 (01:18:21):
Go but my whole thing was, like you have to
let him pitch this, year like this is the year
where this is part of this small window with this core.

Speaker 5 (01:18:27):
Where we can go in a.

Speaker 2 (01:18:28):
Title you have to maximize his, value even if you
just let him walk at the end of the.

Speaker 3 (01:18:32):
Year here we are now and next. Year now that
we Know wheeler's retiring after twenty twenty, seven he's a top.

Speaker 2 (01:18:38):
Three pitcher in. Baseball that he gives.

Speaker 3 (01:18:41):
You once we Lose, wheeler this is a different. Operation
it's it's going to be a much different. Operation SO
i think you absolutely you're paying.

Speaker 2 (01:18:51):
Try what you're paying. Them you're paying, price but you're paying,
Them you're paying exactly what you're paying. Them you're Paying
airing what you're paying. Him all these guys are making top.

Speaker 3 (01:18:57):
Dollar Maybe kyle will Be nick still is that's all
wasted if you're not treating twenty twenty six like a serious.
Year and my, stance, officially AND i Love, lozardo we're
officially out of stance where you have to Pay ranger Over,
lozardo because more than, anything you Have luzardo next, year,
right you can pit you can.

Speaker 2 (01:19:18):
Pay, ranger you bring them back for next. Year you
have them both for next, year and then you Let lizardo.

Speaker 3 (01:19:24):
Walk AND i think any any perceived value that there
is in Paying luzardo long term Over ranger is washed
away by the extra year that you would get with
both of them instead of Letting ranger WALK i AM
i explaining, That, well.

Speaker 4 (01:19:42):
YEAH i like. It i'm. In i'm A Ranger suarez
guy as. WELL i kind of have the, feeling and
this is my sense on, things is that The phillies
are very much out of like we're gonna see what
happens in this playoffs and then really go from. There
AND i don't think that directly applies To ranger as
much as like Like, shoreward there's been no progress AND
i don't expect there to be at this point in the.
GAME i think if it was going to happen, already

(01:20:03):
it would have as far as an extension conversation that
he's at least going to kind of test the open
waters that there's decisions to be made. About nicostiano is
going into the final year last, year like you, Mentioned
lozardo is one more season and then arbitration and all
those kind of situations need to work. Themselves, boom yeah
another one Who albarado team?

Speaker 2 (01:20:21):
Option.

Speaker 4 (01:20:21):
Yeah, so LIKE i think the sense of The phillies
is we've kind of had a couple swings at it
with this court at this, Point let's see how this
year goes and really evaluate what the next steps, are
AND i do think like they're them leaning more into
the direction of pitching is absolutely correct and what they
should continue to be, doing AND i Think rangers should
be a part of that. Vision so do hope that
is the. Case my level of optimism has, increased BUT

(01:20:42):
i still kind of more so lean on things of
some team's going to toss some twenty mili per year
in the. Way The phillies just aren't going to be willing.

Speaker 2 (01:20:48):
To my level of.

Speaker 3 (01:20:50):
Optimism from staying has not, increased but my demand for
him staying us that's Where I'M i don't think they're
going to pay, him AND i think you can just you,
Know dobrowski Picked Wizardo, dembraska not Pick.

Speaker 2 (01:21:03):
Ranger it's just that we moved to that across all.

Speaker 3 (01:21:05):
Sports gms have their guys that they went out and,
picked and he went out and made the trade For.
Luzardo rangers been here since long came here as a
fifteen year. Old he's been A philly for thirteen years.
Now Ranger sporez bleeds. RED i, mean that's that's just
what it. Is ranger needs to be A philly for,
life and that guy is born to be A. Phillies

(01:21:26):
born to, Pitch you're born to pitch under the broad.

Speaker 2 (01:21:28):
Lights assistants back park, yep AND i understand what you're.
Saying they have a lot of decisions to make up this.

Speaker 3 (01:21:33):
Year WHAT i think they'll probably do is they probably
Let ranger, Walk they probably Pay, kyle and they run
it back one last year with Boem nick And.

Speaker 2 (01:21:42):
Alvarado is the interesting. One but the other, GUYS i
think it's mostly the same team BECAUSE i just don't
think they are paying so many people so much.

Speaker 3 (01:21:51):
Money they can't just be, like, oh, well you, know
next year is a gap year And Nate miller And
Andrew grayer will fill in the guy. LIKE i don't
think they can have that attitude next, Year LIKE i
think THEY'RE i have to go pony, up so it'll be.

Speaker 4 (01:22:02):
Interesting i'm a little nervous about shore BRO i won't.

Speaker 2 (01:22:05):
Lie i'm. Not i'm.

Speaker 4 (01:22:07):
NOT i think this is just.

Speaker 2 (01:22:11):
Agent. Stuff they like going to the open. Market maybe
it drives up the. Price but Dem brow said it many.

Speaker 3 (01:22:18):
Times nebrowski said College rover is the best clubhouse person
he's ever been, around and with What kyle's doing on the,
FIELD i just can't. Imagine it's also like he's not
a guy that projects to like get much. Worse he's
not relying on, athleticism he's not playing in the, field
he's just.

Speaker 2 (01:22:33):
HITTING i, think, YEAH i think That dave is And david,
again this is the.

Speaker 3 (01:22:40):
Guy debrowski Pit nebraski brought this guy here and there's
no way he hasn't been two times better than What
dobrowski thought he was going to be bringing him, here
and he loved him and wanted him and had him In.

Speaker 2 (01:22:51):
Boston and brought him To. Boston like this is just
he is so through and through A dombrowski.

Speaker 3 (01:22:57):
Guy this would be akin to me to Like darryl,
saying you, Know James harden's not my guy, anymore which.

Speaker 4 (01:23:04):
Happened he did get, It, yeah he did say.

Speaker 3 (01:23:06):
That But James harden wasn't coming off like the best
year of his career Like Kyle schwarber.

Speaker 2 (01:23:11):
Is having the best career of his career by far right,
now and each year having the best year of his.
Career like on this, CONTRACT i have no Maybe i'm,
wrong And i'll be, Hey i'll be the first person
to be on here yelling and screaming about Letting Kyle schwarber.

Speaker 3 (01:23:27):
WALK i had no doubts and no. Concerns And i'm a.
Pessimist i'm usually the guy, who LIKE i Think rangers gonna.
WALK i, think no matter, WHAT i, think they've made that.

Speaker 2 (01:23:36):
Decision, Unfortunately BUT i really genuinely just don't See debrowski
turning his back on his.

Speaker 4 (01:23:42):
Guy, yeah and If Kyle schwarber starts Scheduling adida's camps In,
china we should be. Panicking i'll say That.

Speaker 3 (01:23:50):
Dave dombrowski is a. Liar now onto our. Quarterback we're
gonna see through this real.

Speaker 2 (01:23:56):
Fast. Here let's go from the.

Speaker 3 (01:23:58):
Top let's go from the, top BECAUSE i think we
probably are pretty. Similar are we the same top?

Speaker 2 (01:24:06):
Four we are in the same? Order?

Speaker 4 (01:24:09):
Correct Pat, Mahomes Lamar, Jackson Josh, Allen Joe burrow And Jalen.
Hurts is my top, five which is the same as.

Speaker 3 (01:24:16):
Yours, YEAH i think to me it's, inarguable and the
order is actually inarguable. TOO i think the only ONE
i will say IS i think we could make a
case For jalen Over, burrow But i'm not going to
make it right. Now BUT i do think there is
a cohesive case to be.

Speaker 4 (01:24:33):
MADE i was close to doing that. TODAY i gave
some real thought to.

Speaker 7 (01:24:36):
That so.

Speaker 4 (01:24:36):
AGREE i think that's. Opening but that should be the
tier of, five that is the elite quarterbacks in THE.
Nfl that's what should be. Acknowledged it's those five.

Speaker 2 (01:24:43):
Guys and even if we want to say it's a
tier of three and Then joe And, jalen or even
if you wanted to say it's a tier of. Four
my biggest, part of my biggest point of this, exercise
nobody outside of that top four is comparable To jalen
and What jalen's. Accomplished tier AND i will listen to
nobody tell me anybody outside of that top five is
better Than Jillen.

Speaker 3 (01:25:02):
Herds on the, sixth are we in? Agreement i've Got
Jayden daniels at? Six where Did jaden end up for?

Speaker 4 (01:25:08):
You jayden fell at? Seven for? ME i Through Jordan
love at.

Speaker 2 (01:25:12):
Six, Okay i'm totally fine with. THAT i have him.
FLIPPED i have loved. Seven you know how big of
a love GUY i. Am The James daniels thing for
me and the reason That i've been predicting that they're
going to have A texans this stroudish kind of regression.
Year the reason That i've kind Of i've kind of
changed my mind on that a little bit. RECENTLY i

(01:25:33):
do Think jayden's rushing just gives a team such a high,
Floor AND i will SAY i WISH i would have
just went in on it last. YEAR i said this
About washington last, year that like they were not going
to be a bad, team Like Jan daniels was going
to be as good as he's basically.

Speaker 3 (01:25:50):
Going to, Be, LIKE i don't think there's a lot
of maybe this is dumb to, Say LIKE i don't
Think jayden's going to be much better ever.

Speaker 2 (01:25:56):
Than he was last. Year LIKE i think that might
be the. Peak and for a guy Like, kim like
your peak years are early on because it's your peak athletic.

Speaker 3 (01:26:04):
Years AND i think that's what's really gonna matter With
jaden is how athletic he is in five. Years you,
know we've seen guys Like cam come into the league
and that's basically the best you see.

Speaker 2 (01:26:13):
Them AND i Think jayden might be the same. Way
now your two is basically the same as year.

Speaker 3 (01:26:18):
One LIKE i don't think he took enough damage last
year that's, gonna you, know change how he is this.
Year But jaden's just a guy with The russian gives
him a high, floor AND i gave him a nod
overlook just because of The.

Speaker 4 (01:26:30):
Russian, YEAH i think that's. FAIR i think we've put
the cart before the horse a little bit With Jayden.
DANIELS i believe in. HIM i think he's very. GOOD
i don't think he's quite knocking to getting the elite
quarterback conversation just yet him who is as impressive as
rookie year as you could possibly. Have BUT i feel
a little bit more confident making the bet On Jordan
Love right, Now.

Speaker 3 (01:26:50):
I'm gonna skip the next guy To we're gonna get
to him wherever he naturally comes up on your. List
but first, up did you rank Caleber? Man did you
take out the same GUYS i?

Speaker 2 (01:27:02):
Did or did you leave?

Speaker 4 (01:27:02):
THEM i left out the guys you?

Speaker 3 (01:27:04):
Did, Okay, yeah so we didn't rank six, starters so It's.
Caleb we felt LIKE i did this exercise With Shane
half earlier this. Week we left Out caleb because we
felt like we're gonna have to rank him like twenty
third or like pretty, low just based on what we've seen,
already and this is a one year, exercise and this
situation last year was just so messed up to even evaluate.

(01:27:25):
Him drake may barely, played so we didn't put him.
In Michael pennox barely, played so he didn't put him
AND jj McCarthy didn't, play so we didn't put him.
In Cam ward obviously first year starter this. Year and
then we didn't rank The saints'. STARTER i think it's
gonna Be Twas shuck who would be.

Speaker 2 (01:27:41):
Lost but, yes didn't not rank those. Guys but number,
nine we're skipping eight for.

Speaker 3 (01:27:48):
Now this was the guy THAT i kind of was
most interested to see WHERE i landed and where others,
landed AND i Think shane had him one spot lower
THAN i.

Speaker 2 (01:27:57):
DID i think What Baker mayfield did last year was.

Speaker 3 (01:28:00):
UNBELIEVABLE i think you can make a case for him
for six on this, LIST i really, do but he's
down at.

Speaker 4 (01:28:06):
Nine for, ME i Had baker at nine as. Well
the guy THAT i had at number eight is one
THAT i know you'll disagree with, here and that IS. C. J.
Stroud obviously a huge step back last. YEAR i just
totally can't completely wipe away what we saw as a,
rookie AND i do think that he rebounds this. Year
if we're making a bet on like guys THAT i
believe in to reach their, potential that Ce stroud's pretty
high on my list. THERE i think he snaps out of,

(01:28:27):
it has kind of a bounce back. Season it reminds
people who he.

Speaker 3 (01:28:29):
IS i, yeah it's not crazy at this. Point like these,
GUYS i would make a pretty strong argument for Obviously,
herbert but we'll talk about that. LATER i would make
it pretty strong argument For baker Over. STROUD i think
it's BECAUSE i.

Speaker 2 (01:28:46):
Think baker's year last year was probably better Than stroud's rookie.
Year i'd have to look AT i mean different. Situations
Obviously baker team is, better BUT i mean What baker
did last, year he was one of the five best.
Quarters he was.

Speaker 4 (01:29:00):
Great, yeah he was, great no. DOUBT i am A
i'm surprised That baker has turned out to be exactly,
this but shout out to.

Speaker 2 (01:29:07):
Him, yeah we talked about it on the show With.

Speaker 3 (01:29:11):
Shane maybe the weirdest quarterback career of all, time genuinely
number one Pick heisman in, college got drafted Over lamar
And Josh allen in the same first, round but still
like not regarded as a bust even like, That AND
i think part of that's because neither of them went that.

Speaker 2 (01:29:30):
High If Josh allen.

Speaker 3 (01:29:31):
Goes like, third do we feel a little bit differently
instead of him going a little later being a project
In lamargos thirty. Two but and then brings The, browns
one of the worst franchises in, sports to a playoff,
win and then immediately goes, downhill loses that, job goes To,
carolina gets cut in like week, eight has to go

(01:29:54):
TO la and save.

Speaker 2 (01:29:55):
His career on A monday night WHEN i think he
got to the team like two days, before didn't know
guys' names in the huddle as he was leading a
game winning drive and stage his, career get a chance
In tampa to Follow Tom brady who had just won
A Super bowl two years, prior and he's been like
putting up better numbers Than brady was putting up in

(01:30:16):
the same. Offense, OBVIOUSLY, nfl you, know goes more past
having every single.

Speaker 3 (01:30:20):
Year but it's unbelievable What baker's, done AND i think
it's one of the weirdest careers we've ever seen an athlete.

Speaker 4 (01:30:27):
Have, yeah, no for sure, There BUT i did Put
baker at. Nine that probably is a bit disrespectful based
on what he's. Done so it's not really one guy.

Speaker 3 (01:30:37):
Different, yeah one guy, Different so it's NOT i was
just making Strictly baker Versus strout BECAUSE i do think
last year was even stronger Than strout's first. YEAR i
Have stafford, Ten and this is the hardest guy in,
RANK i think because you want to include some staff
based things Like Matt stafford's stats are just like not

(01:30:58):
comparable to these especially the next Guy i'm gonna, Name,
like they're just not comparable to these guys and what
he's done. Recently but then you, know you watch him
go against The eagles in the playoffs and the driving
snow In philly and give us a better game and
give our defense more fits in trouble than any quarterback
did the whole season, potentially and you know we're A

(01:31:19):
Jalen carter being blocked away from that season ending On
Matt stafford throwing a.

Speaker 2 (01:31:24):
Touchdown, Probably so it's hard to Rank. STAFFORD i put him.
TEN i think like he's so clearly like a top ten,
Quarterback but it's hard to argue him over some of
these guys THAT i have behind him.

Speaker 4 (01:31:37):
Statistically, YEAH i Went stafford at ten as well for
a lot of the same reasons, there. Dude so on
the opposite end of, THIS i would Say Gino SMITH
i locked in for. Eleven here the stats blow you
off the page in a. WAY i don't think he's
quite that guy in the way that the number is indicate,
Here BUT i still think. ELEVEN i was completely comfortable putting.

Speaker 2 (01:31:54):
HIM i Love. Gino that makes me so. HAPPY i
Have geno.

Speaker 3 (01:31:58):
Sixteen BUT i, thought like WHEN i put that, out
like people are gonna be, LIKE i Have gino too,
High like people are gonna SAY i should Have gino
below Bo nix And tua And kyler and maybe maybe
Even San. DONALD i, think, LIKE i mean his team
got rid of For Sam, donald but, LIKE i think
a lot of people are going to be shocked that
you Have gino that. HIGH i don't mind it at.

Speaker 2 (01:32:18):
ALL i Love. GINO i Have golf eleven party. Twelve
where did those guys check in for?

Speaker 1 (01:32:23):
You?

Speaker 4 (01:32:23):
TWELVE i Had Jared goff and Thirteen brock, party so
not far.

Speaker 2 (01:32:26):
Off we've talked a lot About.

Speaker 3 (01:32:28):
Party we BOTH i, think were really impressed by him this,
year which is weird to say in the year that
was such a failure for san Fran BUT i.

Speaker 2 (01:32:35):
Thought he really showed a lot when he didn't have
all those. Guys he didn't have, McCaffrey didn't add, value
didn't have d he Had debo With fat you, know
forty extra palma on last, year moving around like AN o.
Lineman SO i was really impressed about what he was
able to create with maybe not elite talent around.

Speaker 4 (01:32:51):
Him, YEAH i feel far better about Brock party now
THAN i did this time last, year which is pretty
crazy to say about that, season but, YEAH i think
that's exactly the. Case he proved a lot to me last,
year so feel comfortable dropping him at. Thirteen fourteen is
one you do not. SEE i had eye on me
On Bryce. YOUNG i have a.

Speaker 2 (01:33:07):
Fourteen it's just, yeah that's too, high that's way too.
High AND i Loved Bryce. YOUNG i had him Over
strauvan the. Thing he had a nice eight game. Run
it's a little bit Like scoot.

Speaker 3 (01:33:16):
Though if you go look at the, stats it's like
it's not that he was averaging like one hundred and
eighty yards per game in that eight game.

Speaker 2 (01:33:22):
Run Like it's not like he was lighting the world
on fire like at. All SO i, MEAN i THINK
i think what.

Speaker 3 (01:33:30):
HAPPENED i talked about this on the show With shane
because Actually shane had him like twenty instead of twenty
twenty twenty two LIKE i have.

Speaker 2 (01:33:37):
Him and we were arguing about it BECAUSE i think
he just set the bar so low how bad it
was that when we saw, development we were, like oh my,
god he's really. Good BUT i think we went too
far On.

Speaker 4 (01:33:51):
Bryce he made some, throws, man though he made some
legit throws in that second. Half, DAK i do, ah that's.
Crazy dak is next up for what it's, worth, Though
dak Is Bryce young, Fourteen Dak prescott fifteen.

Speaker 3 (01:34:04):
For, me and you haven't heard And i'm not even Gonna,
YEAH i get, it you're doing Your herbert, bit but
true Where Trevor.

Speaker 4 (01:34:14):
Trevor was, Sixteen so head and right down for.

Speaker 2 (01:34:16):
THIS i thought you'd be On.

Speaker 4 (01:34:18):
TREVOR i, YEAH i, mean he he's another guy that
the crazies are out on both sides for. That people
will convince you That Trevor lawrence is the best quarterback
in the. World but everything's wrong with The, jaguars and
there's also LIKE i think we got to be a
little bit, neutral and like there was some really concerning
stuff last. Year he absolutely regressed and like looked like
the rookie Year Trevor, lawrence WHICH i was hopeful was

(01:34:39):
gone forever, there but he wasn't in the best situation.
Either So i'm still kind Of jerry's out for discussion
for me for what is the Real Trevor. Lawrence But
i'm certainly lower on him THAN i would like to
be at this point in his.

Speaker 2 (01:34:50):
CAREER i only have him one spot higher than.

Speaker 3 (01:34:52):
You and my thing With trevor is kind of like
the same thing you talk about With, Stroud like his
mid twenty twenty two to mid twenty twenty three is
a full season basically of seventeen. Games if you go
look at, that like seventeen games sample size spanning over
those two. Years it's hard to quit on, that and
that involves a playoff win and all that. Stuff but
we're running out of, time BUT i will run down

(01:35:13):
the rest of the. LIST i Have bo at, Seventeen
tua at, eighteen, Yep Kyler kyler at, Nineteen sam at,
Twenty fields at twenty. One you could tell Me bryce
is better Than. Fields i'm kind of there's some rushing
That i'm kind of attaching to.

Speaker 2 (01:35:27):
That Aaron rodgers at twenty, Three Russell wilson twenty, Four
Daniel jones twenty, Five Joe flaco at twenty.

Speaker 4 (01:35:34):
Six, yeah pretty similar here THAT i went Bow nix at,
seventeen two at, Eighteen kyler at, Nineteen Justin FIELDS i
put at. TWENTY i continue to be a believer and
this is big year for The Justin field to stock
another guy in. That one of the weirdest careers. Ever
conversation from a. Quarterback Aaron rodgers at twenty, One Russell
wilson at twenty, Two Justin herbert at twenty, three.

Speaker 2 (01:35:57):
Fine Russell wilson is.

Speaker 4 (01:35:59):
Insane Sam donald twenty, Four Joe flacco twenty, Five daniel.

Speaker 2 (01:36:03):
Six sam, Donalds, geez what do you do to?

Speaker 4 (01:36:06):
YOU i watched him in the playoff game is what
he's tend to.

Speaker 3 (01:36:09):
DO i Have donald twenty's he was really good for like,
fifteen they only.

Speaker 4 (01:36:15):
FIFTEEN i think he's Got Justin herbert. Disease, man you
can put him on their heat lt put the bright
lights of the playoffs on into a little different ball
game out. THERE i Think Sam donald fits that.

Speaker 2 (01:36:24):
CATEGORY i think everyone would fit that. Categy like you don't.

Speaker 4 (01:36:29):
Think That Jalen hurts don't fit that. Category, Yeah i'm
not saying a.

Speaker 7 (01:36:32):
Tough five, guys but Like tua, Does kyler, Does sam,
Does Justin fields probably, Would Bryce young probably, Would Aaron
rodgers And Russell wilson absolutely.

Speaker 2 (01:36:42):
Would at this, point we've never really Seen. Gino he
played one playoff. GAME i think they got pulling. Out but,
yeah like all he's got bo was.

Speaker 4 (01:36:53):
FINE i, think, yeah he wasn't, afraid he wasn't, afraid
he wasn't.

Speaker 2 (01:36:57):
Afraid he was. Fine he threw he.

Speaker 4 (01:36:58):
Threw that long touchdown for the first scoring game, game
Like bo's got some. Stones but THEN i think.

Speaker 2 (01:37:03):
The rest of the, GAME i think they didn't really
move the. Ball who they Play denver in the?

Speaker 4 (01:37:08):
In was It Kansas? CITY i think? SO i want
to Say Kansas city.

Speaker 2 (01:37:13):
One of those.

Speaker 3 (01:37:14):
Teams yeah they Play obviously they played a really good,
team but, yeah The herbert thing is where you just.

Speaker 4 (01:37:19):
Lose he's the. Worst he's the worst playoff performer of
any player in any, Sport mark unter. Junior he just
is statistically like he's games. Correct and what happened in
those two games there he blew a twenty seven to
zering lead at, halftime in which for all this the defense.
Blame if you score one one, score you win that.

Speaker 3 (01:37:39):
Game really necessarily defending when he's in the, playoffs but
it's just the guy won eleven games last year with
a terrible. Team the guy has put up years with
five thousand, yards with forty eight hundred, yards thirty eight,
touchdowns thirty one. Touchdowns he's played seventy nine. Games we
have to evaluate him beyond just the two playoff.

Speaker 4 (01:37:58):
Games and what does he have to show for those
seventy nine games is kind of HOW i. FEEL i
think he's.

Speaker 2 (01:38:04):
One he's had a winning season three, times like.

Speaker 4 (01:38:07):
Im we're we're treating these guys like he C j
Strouted jayden And daniels. Here he's been around for a minute.
Now he is exactly who he.

Speaker 2 (01:38:13):
Is he's twenty.

Speaker 4 (01:38:16):
Six, yeah, yeah that's a full full that's your athletic,
prime two years older Than Jayden.

Speaker 2 (01:38:22):
Daniels.

Speaker 4 (01:38:23):
True, Yeah daniels did the weird, thing the uh stuck
around in college and.

Speaker 2 (01:38:27):
Transfer every every. Player, now, yeah it's half the. League
Bo knicks might be, older be older Than Justin, Herbert probably.

Speaker 4 (01:38:36):
NOT i GUESS i continue to look at these is
which quarterback gives me the best chance to? Win and
there are twenty two GUYS i feel comfortably give me
a better chance to win football games Than Justin, Herbert Kyler.

Speaker 2 (01:38:46):
Murray but like, see he hasn't made the playoffs in three,
years like, two has one important. Game. Yeah the funniest one,
though is too like, two you can't do like. That
he's a. Loser he loses big, Games Justin, herbert.

Speaker 4 (01:38:59):
And then it's like they're. Similar they're.

Speaker 2 (01:39:02):
Similar tua is either worse than those games or just
doesn't doesn't play like he's just too. Hurt but we'll
Debate herber later. On we got we got plenty of times.
Debate history will be on my.

Speaker 4 (01:39:14):
Side you're a geno.

Speaker 2 (01:39:15):
GUY i think it's Something Jeremy horwaf legendary old tough cover.

Speaker 3 (01:39:21):
PRODUCER i haven't talked To jeremy a long, time but
shout out To. Jeremy he Loved. Gino i'll never.

Speaker 2 (01:39:26):
FORGET i think that Was, yeah it was that Was
gino's first year as a, starter that he was the
producer on the, show and he fell in love with
the he you, know THE i forget the line now they,
wrote they, wrote.

Speaker 4 (01:39:39):
Yeah in love With.

Speaker 3 (01:39:40):
Gino and then by the, time by the time you
were on the, show, Uh gino was kind of, ACCEPTED
i think as kind of like a.

Speaker 2 (01:39:46):
Starter but we've Watched gino go the, whole the whole round.
Happier it's almost like you put those producer headsets on
back in The Tough Car Radio. Show you gotta be
a geno.

Speaker 4 (01:39:56):
Guy that's. Right can't complain about. That, so, Yeah gina's
growing on.

Speaker 3 (01:39:59):
Me shout out to, Him Big raiders guys this year
on this. Show but that's gonna do it for The
Tuckert Radio. Show we're gonna talk some fantasy football next.
Week we'll see if you can Get Roy burton on
uh or we'll Actually i'm going on vacation next. Week
we got plenty of time talk fantasy. Football we'll TALK
Nba draft next. Week let's end this dang, Show Tough Cover,
Country let's run