March 21, 2025 • 49 mins
Ian Meredith is the founder of Arlington Motorcycles, building compact Electric Motorcycles for the Streets here in New Zealand.
We talk about Ians story, how he has been able to deploy Bitcoin as capital to realise his dream of building the company, and how proof of work figures into what he does as an entrepreneur.
I did have a test ride of the Arlington A1 which was pretty awesome. The bikes are certified for road use in New Zealand so reach out to them to book a ride and try it for yourself. You can even pay with Bitcoin.
Arlington Motorcycles - https://www.arlingtonmotorcycles.com/
Arlington Motorcycles on Insta - https://www.instagram.com/arlington.motorcycles/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
You know, ideally we want to getthem on a bike.
Once they get on a bike, then they come up with their own
reasons why they need to buy thebike.
So it kind of like sells itself.Hello, I am Cody Allingham and
this is the transformation of Value, a place for thinkers and
builders like you where we ask questions about freedom, Bitcoin
and creativity. Today I'm joined by Ian
(00:21):
Meredith, founder of Arlington Motorcycles, building compact
electric motorcycles for the streets here in New Zealand.
We talk about story, how he has been able to deploy Bitcoin as
capital to realize his dream of building the company and how
proof of work figures into what he does as an entrepreneur.
(00:41):
I did have a test ride of the Arlington A1 which was pretty
awesome. The bikes are certified for Rd.
use in New Zealand, so reach outto them to book a ride and try
it for yourself. You can even pay with Bitcoin.
I would like to know what you think.
Send me an e-mail at hello at the transformation of value.com
and I will get back to you. Otherwise, on to the show.
(01:04):
Ian. Thank you for having me here.
This is a pretty cool place man.This is friends of yours.
Yeah, this is actually one of our display partners for the
bike, so it's a pretty sweet setup.
Yeah. And it's a cafe, so it's like a
motorcycle themed cafe. So shout out to Billy and Nick
for letting us use this space for the podcast.
(01:27):
And thanks for having me. Yeah, no, that's of course
that's the Tuesday Club, a cafe just in central Auckland, and
we've got the Arlington A1 just here behind us.
Tell us a little bit about that.Yes, they're basically compact
electric motorcycles for CBD projects.
(01:48):
Their business has been going for like 6 years now.
So it's, yeah, quite a journey, but it's it's good and
rewarding, yeah. So this is your 1 here.
You rode in on it before. This is actually, this is
Tuesday Clubs, they, they display this bike.
Yeah, yeah. And we've just worked with an
artist to get some custom graphics on it.
(02:11):
Yeah, shout out. Another shout out.
But PS in Wellington, yeah, he works for weather and he did
that for us. So that's like the first time
that we've kind of collaborated with an artist.
Yeah. So can do quite fun things with
a nice surface like this. You know, because you've.
Got so this will be the better rate in here, right?
And you've got like 3.5 kilowattMax total power.
(02:33):
Is that or? A bit more than that.
OK, Yeah, yeah. What sort of?
I mean we can 4.5 standard but. 4.5 Sorry, yeah.
We can even push that up a little bit.
But nice. Nice.
Yeah. But I'm keen to talk a little
bit about Arlington and your electric motorcycle journey.
But maybe I thought we could start with the Origin man,
because we share a little bit ofa similar history.
(02:53):
Like where did you grow up, Ian?Yes, I grew up actually not in
the city. So I grew up in Central Hawks
Bay. Yeah, small town.
And so motorcycling's kind of, Iwant to say, I guess in my DNA,
you know, like when you grow up on a farm, then there's a lot of
dirt bikes around and stuff likethat.
So, yeah, grew up there, obviously studied in a city, so
(03:17):
studied in Wellington and carried forward that kind of
like motorcycle passion. And yeah, yeah, it's just kind
of always had it ticking along. So it was only years later that,
you know, got into this project,but there was always an interest
there. What did you study?
Design. Yeah.
So I studied digital media design, not industrial design.
(03:39):
So it's a bit of a pivot for me to go into product design.
Yeah, it's fun to to do these things.
Yeah, I mean, how was it growingup in Hawkes Bay though?
I mean, because that's sort of my story as well.
You know, there's some people, you know, don't really, I think
understand really what provincial New Zealanders like,
because most, most people do live in big cities, right.
(04:01):
And so there is something about these kind of rural towns that
it isn't our DNA. But I mean for you, what stands
out as memories of of Hulk's Bay?
To be honest, it's just like youhave to sort of you, you make
your own fun. You know, it's at least for me,
it's like 10 kilometres to go and visit your mates.
(04:23):
So yeah, you seem to be. I feel like it pushes the
creativity that I was always like, you know, in the sheer
making something, building something, yeah, keeping
yourself occupied. And so it becomes like a bit of
a positive thing as well, I think.
Like, yeah. I was having a chat with with
the the guys in the cafe here and I was saying the Tuesday
(04:46):
Club Cafe, they do workshops as well or the Tuesday Club I guess
does these workshops around likewelding kind of building stuff
and kind of coming back to that idea of like making things and.
Absolutely. It's so cool.
Yeah, growing up in rural New Zealand, it's like, yeah, if you
want to have fun, you've got to make it yourself.
Yeah, yeah. When I discovered like these
guys and looked on the website and saw what they're doing
(05:07):
outside, my mind was blowing. I was like, what?
It's like a cafe. It's like got motorcycles.
They do welding, they do all theother stuff.
So yeah. Yeah, I'll tell you.
I mean, I got good memories of sort of running around the farm
and mucking around and you know.And then you're saying we have a
similar story because we do. We, we both ended up kind of
like in big cities. I've stayed in Asia quite a bit.
(05:30):
You're sort of based in Japan now and reasonably big city I
think. Yeah.
Or I mean, I guess the greater Tokyo area generally, but yeah.
So how Yeah, sorry, sorry to askyou a question about how do you
how do you find like the the difference between rural and.
It was mind blowing. I mean, you know what it's like,
Ian, but my first time, you know, landing in Narita Airport
(05:54):
in Japan and just seeing a city that went beyond the horizon or
just seeing endless skyscrapers.It was really quite mind blowing
for someone from, you know, Hawkes Bay.
And that's sort of in a sense often thing, you know, we we
grow up seeing a lot of things because in Hawks Bay, you know,
you've got to you kind of, you have this vision, this kind of
(06:14):
1000 yard stair where you, you see what's out there, whether
it's hunting and fishing or justbeing on the farm or just
driving. You know, you've got to be aware
of your surroundings. But in a city you can't be too
aware because there's just so much stimulation.
Yeah. And so you notice that people
don't really see things. Yeah.
And I'm always like just I'll see someone through the crowd
or, or see, you know, maybe a shop I want to go into or
(06:38):
whatever. And it's just like I have this
vision of it. And most people don't.
They're kind of more in a smaller bubble.
And so that's something that really stood out to me early on.
And it can be a bit overwhelmingat some Man, you kind of so much
noise and like, yeah, millions of people floating past you.
Yeah, but what about? You, I mean, I'm fascinated by,
by both. I enjoy going back to my
(06:59):
hometown, obviously, but then yeah, I also really, really love
big cities. And that's yeah, I think that's
there's issues, right? But wherever there's issues,
then that's if you can solve like those problems, then you
know, that's, that's great. So, so yeah, that's kind of like
where this comes in, right? There's the traffic issues and
(07:20):
whatnot in big cities, but in. Well, even, I mean, to be fair,
I mean, Auckland's a pretty big city, right?
I mean, where we're staying, it's a bit of a drive to get
into town. And I'm like, man, it's, it's
interesting because I do have a thing for walkable cities or
cities that are maybe more friendly to that mode of
transport. And I think bikes sit somewhere
in the middle where, you know, places like Thailand, you know,
(07:44):
Bangkok, Taipei, these kinds of cities, there's a real like
motorcycle and scooter culture. Yeah.
I don't know. It's not quite the same with the
the motorways here in Auckland, though.
It's kind of like. Yeah, it's more we get that
question a lot. Like can you take it on the
motorway and stuff like that? Yeah.
It's more, yeah, sort of player versus player here, I feel like.
It's kind of like if people are based on this side of the
(08:07):
bridge, then they're more fascinated by once they're all
across the bridge, then I can't take it across the bridge there.
But so, so also your your originstory, you were studying down in
Wellington and I mean, I studiedin Wellington as well.
And it's sort of for me that growing, you know, coming from
Hastings, that was like the big city was to go to Wellington,
right. And and then, you know, further
afield from there. But you you got into Bitcoin as
(08:30):
well. So I am keen to sort of connect
these threads of what you're doing with your business and
then sort of, yeah, I mean they.You're all sort of intertwined.
Yeah, yeah. Tell us.
Yeah. So I mean years later I was
working in the industry and CBD of Auckland, working for a
design agency and it was I think2016.
(08:52):
So it was, it was kind of like bull run, some sort of bull run
time, right? And to be honest, initially I
was more fascinated with like Ethereum and I went through like
a, a bull cycle investing in it and then it going up, you know,
(09:12):
from $20 to I think it was like 12114 hundred or something like
that. And then kind of like crashing
back down. And I just remember thinking,
man, this was like my first exposure to a very volatile
market. And I just remember thinking
like, man, I didn't play that very well at all.
Like could have done better. And there was like that
(09:33):
emotional trading, yeah, issue which caused all that to happen.
So I sort of at the same time, Ikind of wanted to create a
product like there were these E bikes would be correct, but it
(09:53):
was more for exercise, right? And yeah, I was like, no one's
making like a cool motorcycle toRIP around the city.
So those things were kind of bubbling away both together.
So I ended up like leaving the design job and booking a ticket
over to Southeast Asia, Bangkok actually.
And yeah, rented a place set up over there.
(10:17):
And I wanted to kind of write a strategy to better manage
assets. But when I was on the plane,
this is where Bitcoin comes in. When I was on the plane going
over there, I read Internet of Money from Andres Anthropolis.
Yeah. And it was then I was like, oh,
shit. Like, yeah, Ethereum's like the
(10:38):
new shiny thing. But Bitcoin's very important,
and I think that it will be veryimportant into the future.
So my, like, my goals kind of shifted a little bit.
And I still wanted to write something to kind of manage my
assets, but it was more to like manage Bitcoin assets.
(10:59):
Yeah. So over there, you know, you
don't have to spend too much to survive.
So I like had, I feel, I think it's probably like a couple of
years chilling over there and like trying to write these
strategies and stuff like that. Next bull run came around and
things went pretty well in that one.
So like made a bit of additionalasset and then I was like, cool.
(11:24):
The reward was kind of like, hey, let's use some of this to
to start up. Let's, yeah, let's see if we can
build a product. And that's kind of like when the
honestly when the learning, learning how to try to run a
business started and that's a big learning curve.
(11:45):
Well, it's interesting though, this idea of like capital and,
and having capital to work with,because to start a business and
especially when you're manufacturing something, you
gotta, it's not cheap. You gotta, you gotta have money.
And yeah, we don't really think about this anymore.
Like, people don't really think about their savings as capital
to deploy. Maybe at the most, they think
(12:07):
about trying to buy a house or something.
But there's this long history ofentrepreneurship and small
businesses that rely on the ability to purchase machinery or
gear or even in this modern age,just something like your
computer is a piece of capital. And if you can't, Yeah, If you
can't purchase that, if you don't have the working capital
to do that, you're unable to do anything really.
(12:28):
Yeah. So that's really. 100% if I
didn't have the capital I wouldn't be able to and I'm not
saying I have had enough to get started.
Well, it's also what kind of capital you've got because it
sounds like this was mainly selffunded through, Yeah.
I'd say like 80%. Also we have team members
putting in sweat equity. So yeah, that's a big part of it
(12:50):
as well. But it's a little bit different
to taking money from someone. Outright, whereas in the strings
attached, strings attached, yeah, they will, you know, share
shareholders essentially will push you into maybe the
direction which they think is best, you know, so it's, it's
different, yeah. So when you when did you decide
to start Arlington? Then what?
(13:11):
When was this? I feel like I had the idea
before I left my design job, butI didn't have the resources, so
it would have just been an idea.And it was probably 2019 when I
was seriously into designing and, yes, trying to produce the
(13:33):
first prototype, essentially, yeah.
And then obviously COVID hit, soI came back to New Zealand and
started working because I was still over in Asia at that time.
Yeah, came back and started working with some New Zealand
companies for fabricating the frame and one up here.
Yeah, that's cool. And when did you get your first
prototype out? I had that.
(13:55):
It was. I can't wait.
It didn't take too long for the first one.
It was pretty rough, to be honest.
But yeah, it was, I'd say late 2019 because there was a
business competition in about 2020 and I had the prototype and
which was kind of cool to have something to show.
Yeah, yeah. That's kind of cool.
And you started hiring, you got a team now or like how's?
(14:19):
That I wouldn't say hiring, I'd say, yeah, the team grew.
And that's, that's an interesting story as well
because it's kind of like I was plugging away by myself for
quite a few years. I'd say three years.
And then eventually there's thisskill sets that you need and
there's almost like the people almost find you, you know what I
(14:39):
mean? Like, yeah, so one by one we
kind of got this this very important core people on board.
And yeah, so you know, we got anelectronics guy, we got an in
house industrial designer. So before that we were using
industrial designers from, you know, the factory.
So just bringing some of the skill sets in house.
(15:02):
So yeah, we still have a small team, but I think we're pretty
strong on the product side. So we've also got like a
fabricator in house and sort of like a strategy guy as well.
So yeah. Yeah.
And I guess where the products at today, like tell me, I mean
this with the A1 behind us, likeif people want to want to buy
one, like where are you at? Is, is in terms of say even the
(15:23):
approvals for getting that road,yeah, Rd. tested in New Zealand,
like what's that process? We've gone through all of that
process and yeah, we can put them on the road.
We sold one last week to a guy in Auckland who he actually runs
a creative agency and he wanted,like we did a bit of a custom
special one for him. So we can, we can, you know,
(15:44):
customize, you know, this one's got artwork that all that guy
wanted was like nice, yeah, satin paint job to sort of go
with this company. So we can do things like that,
which is I think sort of the advantage for us compared to
like a big manufacturer. Like they're not going to,
they're not going to do that sort of thing.
Yeah. So we can we take them through
(16:05):
the whole process of getting them on the road and getting
them exactly what they want, Yeah.
And we did the name Arlington. Oh, that's a good question.
Yeah, it's actually a road in central space.
So, yeah. And that's where I was testing
the original prototype. And it was, yeah, it was a very
good Rd. for testing. And I, yeah, it brings, brings
(16:27):
back memories. So I was like, cool, let's tie
it to this place. And it's, yeah, it's quite
interesting, you know, like bringing that rural mindset,
let's say, making things to solve like problems in big
cities. It's kind of like interesting.
Well, there's a real lineage, like, I mean, New Zealand's got
a history of like Burt Monroe and World's fastest Indian.
(16:50):
You know, it's pretty famous story of, yeah, basically
backyard shed innovation, right?Yeah.
And then taking, I don't that would have been like the 1960s,
right? Taking the his Indian motorcycle
out to the salt flats and the USand doing land speed records.
That's insane. And there was another guy as
well. I'm trying to think.
(17:11):
The Britain John Britain. John Britain, Yeah, that one,
like growing up seeing that motorcycle in Tea Park, it was
just, every time I saw it just blows my mind.
And then still to this day, whenI see it, I'm like, man, it's,
it's amazing. And, and somewhere like Central
Hawkes Bay, Waipokodo, you know,these kinds of places, like
there's just, there is that vibelike tinkerers and and that just
(17:32):
working away on stuff and it's kind of the news.
Everyone has like a shed, you know, And they're always.
Creating something, yeah. I mean, because I was just back
in Hawkes Barre a couple of weeks ago and obviously I live
in Japan, but it's just always pleasant to come back.
It's kind of unchanging in a way, and kind of quite far away
from the world. You can't, I mean, there's no
(17:53):
Amazon in New Zealand. You can't just go and order
stuff that easily. You have to either get it
yourself or, you know, bring it in somehow or, or make it and,
and it's just sort of a different way of doing things.
It's a little bit more real. You know you have to solve the
problems with what's around you,right?
Yeah, it's kind of, Yeah, Probably a lot of problem
(18:15):
solvers come from there and go off and do different things.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now that's cool man.
And so that's the story story ofArlington.
And then I guess I'm I'm really interested in just the story of
building a business where you'vedeployed your capital, you've
got a product that you're very passionate about.
It seems like it's this this keyword of proof of work comes
(18:35):
to mind. And and this is something that
is in Bitcoin, obviously in the in the the mining side and kind
of core to the the network itself.
But like how has proof of work made its way into your into your
work with your motorcycles? And I mean, in terms of actual
mining, like, well, no, no, it'sjust proof of work of doing
(18:56):
things. Conceptually.
Yeah. Conceptually, yeah.
Well, I mean, I think, I think I'd like to talk about the
design side and the risks of trying to like the normal design
process is you do a a lot of research and you talk to, you
know, a lot of people and sometimes quite often they're
(19:19):
already using products which aresolving those the problems that
they need to be solved. But like for something like
this, when you're trying to create a new sort of
subcategory, it's it's not as easy to go out and find like so
many people who are your target market.
So the way that I approached it was, hey, how about to build
(19:42):
something? And it could be completely
wrong. And what's the worst case
scenario is that I made a bike for myself, you know, and like,
nobody likes it, but I like it, you know?
And so the process was actually building something, getting it
out there and then starting to get feedback from actually
showing people like a physical product.
And yeah, there's pros and cons,but it's.
(20:05):
It's just a, it's certainly an easier way to like strike up
conversations with people when you have a physical thing to
show them rather than, you know,a step back.
You're still like a little bit conceptual still.
I think that's those conversations are more difficult
than when you actually have something that it might not be
100% there, but you're like, it's rating on it and you're
(20:27):
getting feedback. Yeah.
So proof of work, do things, getfeedback.
It's alright. And build, keep building, you
know, keep layering up. Yeah.
And then, you know, we've been going for like 5-6 years now.
So there's been a lot of changes.
There's been a lot of learnings.And I would also, Yeah, yeah,
(20:47):
that's, yeah. No, no.
I mean just like responding to that because you know, for me as
a creative as well, you know, it's easy to get stuck in your
own head. Absolutely.
And I think in this kind of modern world, and especially
with computers and software, youcan kind of get stuck at that
stage where something is just inthis kind of idea stage, but the
idea is, is always transient and, and that's formless.
(21:11):
And it is about doing the proof of work of turning that into a
real thing. And, and I've developed
processes over the years to kindof get myself to perform action
as opposed to thinking. And I, I, I, I do think this is
quite an important thing because, you know, things are
path dependent and once you start doing something, you
realize, oh, you know, there's, there's things you would never
(21:33):
know until you do it, do it absolutely.
And so, you know, instead of overthinking it, you just got
to. Go and do it right.
You can't. Let's start down the rabbit hole
there and there and yeah, you never know where they're going
to leave. Yeah.
And I think that's maybe something that we just kind of
psychologically in the modern world, we do lack a little bit.
There's this kind of neurosis offocusing on, you know, the
(21:57):
planning and, and thinking of it, but actually being able to
put something together in real world.
What what I call like base layerreality, you know, it's sort of.
Like that base layer? Base layer reality, like, you
know, does the thing go or not? You know, it's like, can you
solve the problem? And even if it's kind of hacked
together, yeah, if it does what it needs to do, it's like you've
(22:19):
built a solution as opposed to having it just on paper, right?
Yeah, I also got some very good feedback from someone.
There was the question asked like how many people do you need
to show your prototype to? And essentially the answer was
enough people so that the answers become all the same.
(22:39):
So like what they mean is there's no surprises.
So if if you talk to 100 people,but then you're still getting
like surprises every now and then, it's like, well, I didn't
expect that answer. You need to talk to more people.
So you talk to like 1000 and then you establish those like
common themes. And because you also have to
remember you're not creating a product for everyone, you're
(23:01):
creating it for your, your like keepers onus, right?
And so, yeah, you can't be like a yes man and put in every
feature which every person you talk to asks for.
But yeah, you focus on your keepers onus.
And hopefully that's the majority of, you know, as a
large enough group that you can have a large enough following to
(23:22):
create a business. Yeah.
Well, I think along those lines as well when it comes to
actually doing something, you know, like my experience, you
know, I've done a few photo books we were talking about
before and had did them through Kickstarter.
So I was able to crowdfund and, and then also doing like
exhibitions and kind of physically being able to bring
people together around a productand that it was like, it's been
(23:43):
very quiet. It's been very inspirational.
And even to this day, you know, I had a guy e-mail me around
some of the photo stuff I was doing in, in Bangkok because I
did a book on Bangkok. And it was like, man, this, this
work has like sent these ripplesout into the world.
Yeah, fantastic. Yeah.
I mean, yeah, I happened to havea look at them today.
That's that's how I brought themup.
(24:05):
So yeah, that was that was another ripple.
You know, I was like looking through and I was like, wow,
that's really cool. And you did it on Kickstarter
and it was very successful. So.
Yeah. Yeah, no, thank you.
I think, I think there's something about that man.
And I guess one of my themes I've been travelling through New
Zealand in this in the last couple of weeks, talking to, to
different people and coming up with this idea of like Bitcoin
(24:29):
businesses is, is a big thing for me.
Because I think the reality is that there isn't much surface
area to actually build purely Bitcoin things.
You know, there's maybe wallets,there's nodes, there's like
lightning services, there's there's a number of things where
you can build infrastructure, But the vast majority of the
real economy is simply Bitcoiners doing what they do
(24:50):
best. And I'm talking to more and more
people who have businesses that they're trying to sort of
supercharge with Bitcoin thinking or Bitcoin principles.
And you really stand out to me as sort of one of these people
where you've got a vision, you've got a product, you've got
an idea, you've got a long time preference.
And that's like that's quite powerful.
So like, what do you think aboutthe idea of like businesses run
by Bitcoiners? I think it's, I mean definitely
(25:14):
this business wouldn't be able to run without Bitcoin.
So it's kind of it's not even capital preservation.
It's like if if you're yeah, if you're run rate, what's it
called? Burn rate?
Burn rate. So yeah, if it's if it's low
enough, then you actually becomein a in a almost like a more
(25:35):
powerful position. So if you yeah, it yeah.
So it, yeah, you kind of have tobudget time a little bit.
So you do have to be very careful with your asset, right,
Because you can go out and you could spend everything and have
so many people. But yeah, it does shift you
towards like a longer term mindset like, hey, what can we
(25:58):
do to with what we have and, andbe a little bit sort of frugal
as well. Like you don't want to, yeah,
use all of your resource basically.
So yeah, I think that ties back to savings, right?
Like a lot of businesses that run on debt and whatnot these
days, but it's almost like the opposite.
(26:20):
Yeah, yeah. I think there's something about
the New Zealand psyche as well that really values like
bootstrapping, doing it yourself, it's kind of core
attributes. And I guess that contrasts a
little bit of my experience in like Japan, where it's like big
corporations, kind of faceless, the salary man, these kind of
stereotypes. And many countries in the world
have that, you know, larger countries have that culture of
(26:41):
like big corporations. But it seems to me like the
perfect size is to have maybe like three to five people
basically, you know, who can work together extremely closely
or even just a couple of people and have this like vision and
this passion. And then you sort of craft, you
carve out that space and then you can maybe grow it into maybe
(27:02):
a bigger organization. When it makes sense, Yeah, it
makes sense. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah.
No, I completely agree with that.
And yeah, I mean, the other way is obviously VC funding and
whatnot, whatnot, that recently we've seen that kind of dry out
late last year. And yeah, a lot of the companies
who went that way hired a lot ofpeople and then they've sort of
(27:25):
been falling over. So it's sad, but yeah, this
different pathways you can see, and I'm not saying that, you
know, everyone's going to go down the Bitcoin pathway, but
it's at least there's an option,you know?
So have you been able to leverage Bitcoin beyond just
using it as capital, but in terms of whether it's payments
or even as a like strategy for the company to like?
(27:46):
I have a reserve, to be honest, I could have done this a lot
better because I don't know, have you talked to people about
like have you had text conversations with business
owners around around this? I've I've heard people tell me
about the situation. Yeah, I mean, I can share, I'm
happy to share the situation with like Arlington.
(28:07):
So yeah, it's not like Arlingtonhas Bitcoin.
It's I have it personally and I keep on investing it into the
company. Right.
But the problem with if you're also kind of trading, then your
capital gains will get taxed like personally.
But for those watching, there's a better way to do it.
You can set up a company in New Zealand as AI think it's called
(28:30):
an LTC company, look through company.
And it just means that all of those personal gains can get
offset by company losses. So if as you're growing and
you're investing in your, you know, in your company, it kind
of can balance out, which I did not do.
I wish I did. Yeah.
So that's some some advice for someone who is going down a
(28:53):
similar path. Were you able to get some advice
on it like from? I literally only found out about
this this year, so it's kind of like a little bit, Yeah, it's
almost like too, too late. But we'll have a look at, yeah,
switching out, seeing what we can do.
Thanks for sharing that. I mean, I guess there is kind of
a conceptual idea of having say accepting payments via Bitcoin
(29:15):
or having a Bitcoin treasury in the company.
But what what you just said being a bit holding Bitcoin
personally and then putting thatinto your company as maybe a
slightly different process and maybe there's ways of
structuring that that it's maybeimportant to get advice on I
guess or it's absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But I guess on your road map though, like so people wanting
(29:37):
to pay for their. 100% we would accept it, of course.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I mean, I would love to, I'd
have to talk to the other guys in the team part in the future.
I would love to have, you know, like a little bit of a treasury,
like some of our capital, company capital and Bitcoin.
I think that would make sense. Yeah.
(29:58):
So hoping we can do something inthe future there.
Yeah, that's awesome. And again, thank you for sharing
that. But I mean, coming back to the
vision though, so I mean, you'vegot this, you've got this
motorbike, it's looking pretty awesome.
I mean, what's your vision then for like growing the company,
taking it overseas even? Like, tell me more about your
Rd. Maps I feel like at the moment
(30:19):
the next major step that we haveto go through is international
shipping. So once we can do international
shipping, once we can send theseto Australia, US, maybe Japan,
that'll be pretty cool. I think you know some of the big
cities there will be well suitedfor that will be yeah, great
achievement for us and I think that will yeah, I've talked to
other people selling in New Zealand and then also abroad and
(30:43):
that's that's yeah, there's muchbigger markets in New Zealand.
New Zealand, there's like a really tough test markets, not
even an easy one. It's like a difficult market to
crack. So yeah, it's you're kind of
starting with a more difficult one in New Zealand.
So yeah, we'd love to figure outour international shipping and
yeah, do that. Well, on that night, so I've
(31:07):
been having conversations with people again, I'm sort of re
jigging myself on what the situation is in New Zealand
because I haven't really spent that much time in Auckland ever
really. So this time round I've been
meeting with a few Auckland based bitcoiners and different
friends and that and that and just learning how they are
approaching innovation and business.
And certainly I, I agree with that sentiment that it's, it's a
(31:30):
hard market here, man. Like it's small, it's far from
the world. It's, you know, maybe not as
affluent as other parts of the world where you can sell into a
market and there's just people ready to buy.
You have to kind of craft the market yourself.
Yeah. But as you say, there's once, if
you can overcome those those hurdles, you can really do well.
And there's a few like pretty successful brands that are world
(31:54):
known that come out of New Zealand and a range of
categories. I I think that's why, because if
you can survive here and then expand, then it's easy mode.
Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You're doing the Hard Fit fest. And I just wonder if if that's
something that's not that well known because I do see there is
a bit of an island mentality where it's like New Zealand is
the world. And to be fair, Japan is a bit
like that as well. And it's like, how do you, how
(32:18):
do you kind of talk about what it means to sell a product
overseas to export? I mean we have you had advice or
sort of mentorship in that role in that space or?
It just comes, I mean, there's obviously the the main
challenges that you need to get sorted as like the certification
for the different countries right there.
(32:38):
Yeah, these it's not as scary asit seems, I would say.
And so I would, you know, say just jump in there and get
started and give it a crack. Yeah.
And then I guess the reward is worth it if you can figure it
out. Like I've talked to a friend
(33:00):
who's who makes combust small combustion motorcycles and he
makes them in New Zealand, NorthShore.
And his biggest market, he shipsto Australia and US primarily.
His biggest market is actually Australia that's bigger than US.
And so that's what he said once,once he figured out the
international shipping, it was difficult to do.
(33:21):
But once you pack it, the rewardis kind of like worthwhile.
But yeah, for me, like personally, I just want to, I'm
also excited about developing the brand in other countries
because it's like we're, we're putting in a lot of work and
effort into Auckland, which is great fun.
But like, how about we go to another big city and, you know,
get to work there, Yeah, Get people on their bike, get their
(33:43):
feedback. And you know that that's what I
would be pretty, pretty excited to do as well.
Yeah, and let's talk about E VS generally and electric
motorbikes, electric cars like, So tell me more about this
industry because I mean, I was having a chat with the guy in
the Uber the other day and he said all of the Ubers in New
Zealand will need to be E VS in in the coming months.
(34:03):
There's like been a dictate. I wasn't aware of that.
Yeah, well, something to that effect.
You're seeing more and more charging stations.
There's some really cool projects coming out of New
Zealand, even with. Charging, I mean there's like
jolts and they're doing free charging for for a while, which
is interesting because if we could charge a bike essentially
(34:23):
be free. Yeah.
Well, and even like my friends have Quitter which are doing the
fast charging and that's like getting world recognition for
that technology. But tell me more about just this
industry in general, like your high level thoughts on it.
I mean, I'll, maybe I'll talk inrelation to Arlington because
(34:44):
I'm not as familiar with the larger electric industry.
So I know there's like a lot of electric buses and stuff popping
up, but you know, what I like isjust the independence, right?
So we've designed these things so you can put them in the lift,
take them out to your apartment for. 50 KGS, right?
54 KGS. 54 KGS. Yeah, that's incredible.
(35:07):
Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. So yeah, thinking about how you
charge them, you like literally take them to your house, plug
them into a three pin plug and the cost would be like 2 1/2
power units. So they say like $0.60 or
something like that, 60-70 cents, essentially 1 cent per
kilometer. So for me it's about that like
(35:29):
independence of yeah, you know, that your travel is so cheap,
it's like ridiculously cheap. And then because you know, that
you end up like not taking like for me, it's a company vehicle
like a van. So I will not use that unless I
have to. And it's just fun, you know,
like because yeah, so I just like that side of it.
(35:51):
And then knowing that, hey, let's say if the electricity
price, you know, skyrocketed, well, it'll take like 1400 Watt
solar panel and, you know, say six hours of sun and then you're
you're up and running again. So, you know, it's kind of like
you don't really worry about what happens in the in the
markets in terms of, you know, oil prices or whatever.
(36:12):
It just doesn't matter. Yeah.
Well, I'll put it on that threadas well.
I mean, there's this bigger ideaof like the energy transition.
And I mean, there's a lot of different politics and
ideologies floating around. But what you just said, I mean
no matter what happens, being able to get from A to B on a
solar panel. Yeah, you know that you're
sorted. You're sorted.
I mean, do you think about the stuff, do you study kind of
maybe the bigger trends that arehappening and say the energy
(36:34):
sector and broadly or I? Mean obviously we we keep track
of like things like battery prices, you know, the trend of
battery prices, which are trending down, which is good.
We're always on the lookout for new, new battery tech.
It's kind of been designed so that if something does come out
like a way better battery, then,you know, we can take off the
cover and we can reconfigure andwe could put in that that new
(36:56):
technology. So yeah, we're always looking at
the new tech that's coming out and then just price trends and
things like that. Yeah.
Yeah. And how much do raw materials
figure into what you're doing interms of say, metal and steel
and save the batteries as well, like?
The batteries are by far the most expensive component of
(37:16):
electric motorcycles and like we're using like a full
aluminium frame, which is Oh yeah, yeah, why it's 54 KGS
yeah. But yes, it's great to see that
the trend is kind of going down for that those, you know the
cost of batteries because. Yeah, I was always under the
impression that it was quite hard to Weld aluminium, but
(37:37):
you've got, you see, you've got some nice beautiful welds there.
Is that just like? Skill.
Skills, yeah, Absolutely. Yeah, maybe it maybe it had for
me meaning my my aluminium welding is not great as well.
So I didn't Weld the bikes Yeah.So we Yeah, but if you.
Well, I always thought you had to bolt things together if they
were aluminium, but you've got, you've actually got some
beautiful welds there. So is that like done by hand?
(37:59):
We do try to minimise the welds because, I mean, you can use
robot welders, but the processeswhich are very efficient for
creating frames, it's like lasercutting and folding.
So we'd want to use a lot of that.
And then, yeah, there are, you know, as you can see, we do have
Wilds, but yeah, they're kind oflike quite easy as well.
(38:22):
So you need to think about wherethey're situated and yeah, how
easy it is. It's quite, it's quite
futuristic though, because aircraft uses aluminium, right?
And it's sort of there is a sortof this the the the lightness of
it would be a gain. I'm not.
Worrying about like tripping your frame and having like rusty
patches is like a big one. For me, I think, oh, really?
(38:43):
Yeah, yeah. So that's certainly an advantage
and you know just visible like stainless masses and so.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, if this was steel frame,
I mean, how much would it weigh do you reckon?
I mean, we have, I know some similar bikes which is I think
closer to AD. So it would be.
I'm not saying that would all bein the frame, they are slightly
(39:05):
bigger, but it would be a decentamount.
Decent amount more, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's incredible, man.
And I guess when it comes to some of the componentry in
there, like how have you found trying to source materials into
New Zealand source components that you're maybe using OEM,
like tell me about that process a bit more.
That's a big part of the job to be honest.
Yeah, over the years then just about every component on the
(39:29):
bike, we've we've gone through multiple suppliers to find
people that we're happy with. And you know, there's there's
obviously things that like the VCU that's PCB inside that's
kind of like the brain that's, you know, we, we manufacture
that. Yeah.
So it's just, it's an interesting process finding
(39:52):
because also we're not like the biggest company, right.
So it's different, let's say like Yamaha going and
approaching a supplier to us. Approaching so yeah, finding
out, finding out the good suppliers who yeah, we can we
can kind of like grow together and like in terms of hub motors,
(40:14):
there's basically like only two high end options.
So it's quite simple to choose some components because they'll
say, well, we can go with these guys or those guys and you know,
they're the best. So we go with them And then you
know, like battery, battery techis quite good as well because
you can go with essentially the best at the time.
(40:34):
So battery cells are, you know, very easy to source.
So this particular bike's using Panasonic, but you know,
there's, there's good sales out from Samsung and so you can look
at all the specs and you know how how many amps they give you
and whatnot to yeah, figure out what's best for the project.
Yeah. And what's been like your
(40:55):
biggest learning experience going through this whole process
like? I would say physical products
are much more difficult than like software, just straight
software products. Yeah, it's just the, the time to
iterate is longer, you know, so and that's the challenge to try
(41:19):
to get that faster. Yeah.
So that's the learning. But now we're on to the how can
we fix it? Like how can we, how can we?
Yeah, make things these things abit quicker, Yeah.
And I guess that's the question.I mean others have mentioned
like getting to scale is really the challenge.
And so you're going to work through that now like.
Yeah, absolutely. Would you call it like mass
(41:41):
production at this stage or are you guys still working through
some of those challenges or? We're working with suppliers who
are able to mass produce and have and work with like other
major brands. Yeah, like, yeah, so the road
map is there. You know, obviously there's the
(42:02):
other side of it, the marketing,the sales, but we're getting set
up so that, yeah, we, we can continue with our suppliers and
they can take us, you know, through the whole journey.
So and what's the on the sales side, what's that landscape look
like in New Zealand? Like do you need to go through
dealers or are you able to sell to the public?
Like what's that? This is a very interesting, like
I feel like this is where a lot of the work is happening for us
(42:25):
right now. OK, so we're travelling, you
know, like display partners, obviously Tuesday clubs one
we've got we've been in a coupleof other places around Auckland
and we are in yeah, a few other places.
So this idea of having a physical location where you can
go in and see this product, which I think is good for high,
(42:45):
high ticket items. So it costs a reasonable amount.
So it's good to be able to have it on show, allow people to walk
in and view the product, go for a test ride.
And but in saying that, you know, we, we do get a lot of our
needs from from social. So that's kind of the start of
the funnel. And then get them in, you know,
(43:06):
ideally we want to get them on abike.
Once they get on a bike, then they come up with their own
reasons why they need to buy thebike.
So it kind of like sells itself.And you are able to do that sale
directly to customers on new. Zealand, yeah, we, we, we can do
that as well. Yeah, yeah.
So we're kind of trying the direct customer and then also
going through our display partners and yeah, but we, we
(43:29):
always ask like, you know, how did you learn about Allington,
even if it's a direct? Because they might have been in,
you know, Tuesday Club, they might have seen it.
So we need to figure out how howit happened and, you know,
reimburse people who are responsible for making the sale
happen. Well, that's interesting because
I do think that maybe it's slightly different to like cars
(43:50):
where there is this kind of dealership model that's quite
common for new cars. The fact that it's slightly
smaller sort of maybe is closer in a sense to like a consumer
product where you can sort of goin and touch it and it's kind of
maybe a little bit more unique in that sense.
Yeah, it is still a vehicle. So it's kind of maybe a little
(44:11):
bit of a middle ground, right? Yes, yes.
You know you're not, you're not inside a whole bunch of other
bikes, right? It's just you.
You're the only. One for us it's it doesn't make
sense for us to be situated like, let's say in a motorcycle
showroom yeah, yeah. But then, you know, we did
exhibit at Auckland Design Week and you know, creatives love
(44:33):
this, this sort of thing, this new form factor.
And and then also like a displaypartner can be anything that has
brand alignment. So could be like a menswear
store or something with some nice clothes.
And we have done that. We did that with RJB design on
customs and yeah, that works as well because you have it in the
(44:57):
window, people go, wow, there's a cool bike and they go into the
store and then they might buy a shirt, you know, so, so those
guys are happy to display it as well.
So it's thinking about thinking about it in a different way
because there's so many options,right?
Yeah, yeah, that's cool. And I guess I mean, you shared a
little bit of your road map, butI mean, you're feeling like
Auckland is really the the home base for this, for the future
(45:20):
or? We've had a reasonable amount of
interest from Wellington as wellrecently.
So we do need to kind of do a bit of a road trip or maybe get
some, get a display partner there.
Yeah, we could imagine like in the major cities.
I think we should have a bit of a footprint, yeah.
(45:41):
It's also about. Christchurch as well, there's
been some interest there, so well, let's see what we can do.
And I mean, come back to sort ofwrapping up on, on the Bitcoin
side. So I mean, what's your outlook
for, I mean, your interest and, and Bitcoin, is there anything
that you've got your eye on outside of all of this that
you're sort of following in terms of tech or developments in
the Bitcoin world, Anything you've read recently that has
(46:01):
left a mark? Yeah.
I mean, yeah, I don't know. I feel like I would like to see
it adopted a bit more at, you know, you're starting to see
that sort of the country level interest.
So I would just, yeah, like to see more like use of it and the
(46:24):
Lightning Network and and thingslike that.
Because, yeah, at the moment we're all just holding it and
it's kind of like we don't, we almost don't know if someone
else is interested in this asset.
I was talking to a guy who was riding a scooter and he had like
a Bitcoin sticker on it. But if he didn't have that
sticker, then like, I would never have known, right.
(46:47):
So trying to get the technology,yeah, used a bit more out in the
forefront so more people can understand it.
You're probably, yeah, closer toit than than me.
So you'd be able to ask the question.
I'd love it. Well, I was just, I was just
going to say though, because in that product space, you know,
I'm really interested in some ofthe emerging tech coming out
around mining and just somethingseeing some of the ducting and
(47:10):
stuff you've got in here and I'mlike, man, you know, Oh,
absolutely. There's just the.
Bitcoin heaters and all of that stuff.
And yeah, just making use of thestranded electricity is
fantastic as well, I think. Yeah, Yeah, you could.
Yeah. There's all sorts of all sorts
of things that it's an exciting space.
(47:30):
Like whenever you have power, like electrical power, you kind
of have, that's another resource.
And do you choose to then turn that resource into an asset?
You know, it's a interesting space.
Yeah, yeah, it'd be cool to explore what those options look
like and especially that kind ofinterplay between, you know,
base layer reality, electricity,mining and.
(47:50):
Just and electricity is, is it can be quite difficult to store
it as well, right. So that's where the big
opportunity is. I think everyone's finding this
stranded energy and converting it.
Yeah, yeah. Lots of opportunities, but Ian,
it's been great to learn about your story, man, and to see the
bike and talk about what you're doing a bit more.
Is there anything else you want to share or anywhere you want to
(48:11):
send people if they're listening?
Yeah, I mean, maybe if anyone wants to reach out, ask me any
questions or just have a chat, you're just Arlington dot
motorcycles on Instagram is probably the best place.
I'm in that account at the moment.
So yeah, happy to chat about anything.
Yeah. And related to Bitcoin or
(48:33):
motorbikes? And you can book a test drive
through your website as well. So what's the website for us?
Arlingtonmotorcycles.com. Arlingtonmotorcycles.com So
yeah, get in touch and see some spec sheets, there's some info,
some photos and get in touch andand test rides.
Is that mainly like Auckland or you've got some in other parts
of the country at the moment? It's currently mostly based in
(48:55):
Auckland, but if you are somewhere else in New Zealand
and reach out, Yeah, reach out. We'll make it happen.
We'll figure it out. Yeah.
All right. Thanks so much.
Thank you so much for that. Yeah, that's.
That's great. Thank you for listening.
I am Cody Allingham and that wasthe transformation of value.
If you would like to support this show, please consider
making a donation either throughmy website or by directly
(49:17):
tipping to the show's Bitcoin wallet, or just pass this
episode on to a friend who you think may enjoy it.
And you can always e-mail me at hello@thetransformationofvalue.com.
You know, ideally we want to getthem on a bike.
Once they get on a bike, then they come up with their own
reasons why they need to buy thebike.
So it kind of like sells itself.Hello, I am Cody Allingham and
this is the transformation of Value, a place for thinkers and
builders like you where we ask questions about freedom, Bitcoin
and creativity. Today I'm joined by Ian
(00:21):
Meredith, founder of Arlington Motorcycles, building compact
electric motorcycles for the streets here in New Zealand.
We talk about story, how he has been able to deploy Bitcoin as
capital to realize his dream of building the company and how
proof of work figures into what he does as an entrepreneur.
(00:41):
I did have a test ride of the Arlington A1 which was pretty
awesome. The bikes are certified for Rd.
use in New Zealand, so reach outto them to book a ride and try
it for yourself. You can even pay with Bitcoin.
I would like to know what you think.
Send me an e-mail at hello at the transformation of value.com
and I will get back to you. Otherwise, on to the show.
(01:04):
Ian. Thank you for having me here.
This is a pretty cool place man.This is friends of yours.
Yeah, this is actually one of our display partners for the
bike, so it's a pretty sweet setup.
Yeah. And it's a cafe, so it's like a
motorcycle themed cafe. So shout out to Billy and Nick
for letting us use this space for the podcast.
(01:27):
And thanks for having me. Yeah, no, that's of course
that's the Tuesday Club, a cafe just in central Auckland, and
we've got the Arlington A1 just here behind us.
Tell us a little bit about that.Yes, they're basically compact
electric motorcycles for CBD projects.
(01:48):
Their business has been going for like 6 years now.
So it's, yeah, quite a journey, but it's it's good and
rewarding, yeah. So this is your 1 here.
You rode in on it before. This is actually, this is
Tuesday Clubs, they, they display this bike.
Yeah, yeah. And we've just worked with an
artist to get some custom graphics on it.
(02:11):
Yeah, shout out. Another shout out.
But PS in Wellington, yeah, he works for weather and he did
that for us. So that's like the first time
that we've kind of collaborated with an artist.
Yeah. So can do quite fun things with
a nice surface like this. You know, because you've.
Got so this will be the better rate in here, right?
And you've got like 3.5 kilowattMax total power.
(02:33):
Is that or? A bit more than that.
OK, Yeah, yeah. What sort of?
I mean we can 4.5 standard but. 4.5 Sorry, yeah.
We can even push that up a little bit.
But nice. Nice.
Yeah. But I'm keen to talk a little
bit about Arlington and your electric motorcycle journey.
But maybe I thought we could start with the Origin man,
because we share a little bit ofa similar history.
(02:53):
Like where did you grow up, Ian?Yes, I grew up actually not in
the city. So I grew up in Central Hawks
Bay. Yeah, small town.
And so motorcycling's kind of, Iwant to say, I guess in my DNA,
you know, like when you grow up on a farm, then there's a lot of
dirt bikes around and stuff likethat.
So, yeah, grew up there, obviously studied in a city, so
(03:17):
studied in Wellington and carried forward that kind of
like motorcycle passion. And yeah, yeah, it's just kind
of always had it ticking along. So it was only years later that,
you know, got into this project,but there was always an interest
there. What did you study?
Design. Yeah.
So I studied digital media design, not industrial design.
(03:39):
So it's a bit of a pivot for me to go into product design.
Yeah, it's fun to to do these things.
Yeah, I mean, how was it growingup in Hawkes Bay though?
I mean, because that's sort of my story as well.
You know, there's some people, you know, don't really, I think
understand really what provincial New Zealanders like,
because most, most people do live in big cities, right.
(04:01):
And so there is something about these kind of rural towns that
it isn't our DNA. But I mean for you, what stands
out as memories of of Hulk's Bay?
To be honest, it's just like youhave to sort of you, you make
your own fun. You know, it's at least for me,
it's like 10 kilometres to go and visit your mates.
(04:23):
So yeah, you seem to be. I feel like it pushes the
creativity that I was always like, you know, in the sheer
making something, building something, yeah, keeping
yourself occupied. And so it becomes like a bit of
a positive thing as well, I think.
Like, yeah. I was having a chat with with
the the guys in the cafe here and I was saying the Tuesday
(04:46):
Club Cafe, they do workshops as well or the Tuesday Club I guess
does these workshops around likewelding kind of building stuff
and kind of coming back to that idea of like making things and.
Absolutely. It's so cool.
Yeah, growing up in rural New Zealand, it's like, yeah, if you
want to have fun, you've got to make it yourself.
Yeah, yeah. When I discovered like these
guys and looked on the website and saw what they're doing
(05:07):
outside, my mind was blowing. I was like, what?
It's like a cafe. It's like got motorcycles.
They do welding, they do all theother stuff.
So yeah. Yeah, I'll tell you.
I mean, I got good memories of sort of running around the farm
and mucking around and you know.And then you're saying we have a
similar story because we do. We, we both ended up kind of
like in big cities. I've stayed in Asia quite a bit.
(05:30):
You're sort of based in Japan now and reasonably big city I
think. Yeah.
Or I mean, I guess the greater Tokyo area generally, but yeah.
So how Yeah, sorry, sorry to askyou a question about how do you
how do you find like the the difference between rural and.
It was mind blowing. I mean, you know what it's like,
Ian, but my first time, you know, landing in Narita Airport
(05:54):
in Japan and just seeing a city that went beyond the horizon or
just seeing endless skyscrapers.It was really quite mind blowing
for someone from, you know, Hawkes Bay.
And that's sort of in a sense often thing, you know, we we
grow up seeing a lot of things because in Hawks Bay, you know,
you've got to you kind of, you have this vision, this kind of
(06:14):
1000 yard stair where you, you see what's out there, whether
it's hunting and fishing or justbeing on the farm or just
driving. You know, you've got to be aware
of your surroundings. But in a city you can't be too
aware because there's just so much stimulation.
Yeah. And so you notice that people
don't really see things. Yeah.
And I'm always like just I'll see someone through the crowd
or, or see, you know, maybe a shop I want to go into or
(06:38):
whatever. And it's just like I have this
vision of it. And most people don't.
They're kind of more in a smaller bubble.
And so that's something that really stood out to me early on.
And it can be a bit overwhelmingat some Man, you kind of so much
noise and like, yeah, millions of people floating past you.
Yeah, but what about? You, I mean, I'm fascinated by,
by both. I enjoy going back to my
(06:59):
hometown, obviously, but then yeah, I also really, really love
big cities. And that's yeah, I think that's
there's issues, right? But wherever there's issues,
then that's if you can solve like those problems, then you
know, that's, that's great. So, so yeah, that's kind of like
where this comes in, right? There's the traffic issues and
(07:20):
whatnot in big cities, but in. Well, even, I mean, to be fair,
I mean, Auckland's a pretty big city, right?
I mean, where we're staying, it's a bit of a drive to get
into town. And I'm like, man, it's, it's
interesting because I do have a thing for walkable cities or
cities that are maybe more friendly to that mode of
transport. And I think bikes sit somewhere
in the middle where, you know, places like Thailand, you know,
(07:44):
Bangkok, Taipei, these kinds of cities, there's a real like
motorcycle and scooter culture. Yeah.
I don't know. It's not quite the same with the
the motorways here in Auckland, though.
It's kind of like. Yeah, it's more we get that
question a lot. Like can you take it on the
motorway and stuff like that? Yeah.
It's more, yeah, sort of player versus player here, I feel like.
It's kind of like if people are based on this side of the
(08:07):
bridge, then they're more fascinated by once they're all
across the bridge, then I can't take it across the bridge there.
But so, so also your your originstory, you were studying down in
Wellington and I mean, I studiedin Wellington as well.
And it's sort of for me that growing, you know, coming from
Hastings, that was like the big city was to go to Wellington,
right. And and then, you know, further
afield from there. But you you got into Bitcoin as
(08:30):
well. So I am keen to sort of connect
these threads of what you're doing with your business and
then sort of, yeah, I mean they.You're all sort of intertwined.
Yeah, yeah. Tell us.
Yeah. So I mean years later I was
working in the industry and CBD of Auckland, working for a
design agency and it was I think2016.
(08:52):
So it was, it was kind of like bull run, some sort of bull run
time, right? And to be honest, initially I
was more fascinated with like Ethereum and I went through like
a, a bull cycle investing in it and then it going up, you know,
(09:12):
from $20 to I think it was like 12114 hundred or something like
that. And then kind of like crashing
back down. And I just remember thinking,
man, this was like my first exposure to a very volatile
market. And I just remember thinking
like, man, I didn't play that very well at all.
Like could have done better. And there was like that
(09:33):
emotional trading, yeah, issue which caused all that to happen.
So I sort of at the same time, Ikind of wanted to create a
product like there were these E bikes would be correct, but it
(09:53):
was more for exercise, right? And yeah, I was like, no one's
making like a cool motorcycle toRIP around the city.
So those things were kind of bubbling away both together.
So I ended up like leaving the design job and booking a ticket
over to Southeast Asia, Bangkok actually.
And yeah, rented a place set up over there.
(10:17):
And I wanted to kind of write a strategy to better manage
assets. But when I was on the plane,
this is where Bitcoin comes in. When I was on the plane going
over there, I read Internet of Money from Andres Anthropolis.
Yeah. And it was then I was like, oh,
shit. Like, yeah, Ethereum's like the
(10:38):
new shiny thing. But Bitcoin's very important,
and I think that it will be veryimportant into the future.
So my, like, my goals kind of shifted a little bit.
And I still wanted to write something to kind of manage my
assets, but it was more to like manage Bitcoin assets.
(10:59):
Yeah. So over there, you know, you
don't have to spend too much to survive.
So I like had, I feel, I think it's probably like a couple of
years chilling over there and like trying to write these
strategies and stuff like that. Next bull run came around and
things went pretty well in that one.
So like made a bit of additionalasset and then I was like, cool.
(11:24):
The reward was kind of like, hey, let's use some of this to
to start up. Let's, yeah, let's see if we can
build a product. And that's kind of like when the
honestly when the learning, learning how to try to run a
business started and that's a big learning curve.
(11:45):
Well, it's interesting though, this idea of like capital and,
and having capital to work with,because to start a business and
especially when you're manufacturing something, you
gotta, it's not cheap. You gotta, you gotta have money.
And yeah, we don't really think about this anymore.
Like, people don't really think about their savings as capital
to deploy. Maybe at the most, they think
(12:07):
about trying to buy a house or something.
But there's this long history ofentrepreneurship and small
businesses that rely on the ability to purchase machinery or
gear or even in this modern age,just something like your
computer is a piece of capital. And if you can't, Yeah, If you
can't purchase that, if you don't have the working capital
to do that, you're unable to do anything really.
(12:28):
Yeah. So that's really. 100% if I
didn't have the capital I wouldn't be able to and I'm not
saying I have had enough to get started.
Well, it's also what kind of capital you've got because it
sounds like this was mainly selffunded through, Yeah.
I'd say like 80%. Also we have team members
putting in sweat equity. So yeah, that's a big part of it
(12:50):
as well. But it's a little bit different
to taking money from someone. Outright, whereas in the strings
attached, strings attached, yeah, they will, you know, share
shareholders essentially will push you into maybe the
direction which they think is best, you know, so it's, it's
different, yeah. So when you when did you decide
to start Arlington? Then what?
(13:11):
When was this? I feel like I had the idea
before I left my design job, butI didn't have the resources, so
it would have just been an idea.And it was probably 2019 when I
was seriously into designing and, yes, trying to produce the
(13:33):
first prototype, essentially, yeah.
And then obviously COVID hit, soI came back to New Zealand and
started working because I was still over in Asia at that time.
Yeah, came back and started working with some New Zealand
companies for fabricating the frame and one up here.
Yeah, that's cool. And when did you get your first
prototype out? I had that.
(13:55):
It was. I can't wait.
It didn't take too long for the first one.
It was pretty rough, to be honest.
But yeah, it was, I'd say late 2019 because there was a
business competition in about 2020 and I had the prototype and
which was kind of cool to have something to show.
Yeah, yeah. That's kind of cool.
And you started hiring, you got a team now or like how's?
(14:19):
That I wouldn't say hiring, I'd say, yeah, the team grew.
And that's, that's an interesting story as well
because it's kind of like I was plugging away by myself for
quite a few years. I'd say three years.
And then eventually there's thisskill sets that you need and
there's almost like the people almost find you, you know what I
(14:39):
mean? Like, yeah, so one by one we
kind of got this this very important core people on board.
And yeah, so you know, we got anelectronics guy, we got an in
house industrial designer. So before that we were using
industrial designers from, you know, the factory.
So just bringing some of the skill sets in house.
(15:02):
So yeah, we still have a small team, but I think we're pretty
strong on the product side. So we've also got like a
fabricator in house and sort of like a strategy guy as well.
So yeah. Yeah.
And I guess where the products at today, like tell me, I mean
this with the A1 behind us, likeif people want to want to buy
one, like where are you at? Is, is in terms of say even the
(15:23):
approvals for getting that road,yeah, Rd. tested in New Zealand,
like what's that process? We've gone through all of that
process and yeah, we can put them on the road.
We sold one last week to a guy in Auckland who he actually runs
a creative agency and he wanted,like we did a bit of a custom
special one for him. So we can, we can, you know,
(15:44):
customize, you know, this one's got artwork that all that guy
wanted was like nice, yeah, satin paint job to sort of go
with this company. So we can do things like that,
which is I think sort of the advantage for us compared to
like a big manufacturer. Like they're not going to,
they're not going to do that sort of thing.
Yeah. So we can we take them through
(16:05):
the whole process of getting them on the road and getting
them exactly what they want, Yeah.
And we did the name Arlington. Oh, that's a good question.
Yeah, it's actually a road in central space.
So, yeah. And that's where I was testing
the original prototype. And it was, yeah, it was a very
good Rd. for testing. And I, yeah, it brings, brings
(16:27):
back memories. So I was like, cool, let's tie
it to this place. And it's, yeah, it's quite
interesting, you know, like bringing that rural mindset,
let's say, making things to solve like problems in big
cities. It's kind of like interesting.
Well, there's a real lineage, like, I mean, New Zealand's got
a history of like Burt Monroe and World's fastest Indian.
(16:50):
You know, it's pretty famous story of, yeah, basically
backyard shed innovation, right?Yeah.
And then taking, I don't that would have been like the 1960s,
right? Taking the his Indian motorcycle
out to the salt flats and the USand doing land speed records.
That's insane. And there was another guy as
well. I'm trying to think.
(17:11):
The Britain John Britain. John Britain, Yeah, that one,
like growing up seeing that motorcycle in Tea Park, it was
just, every time I saw it just blows my mind.
And then still to this day, whenI see it, I'm like, man, it's,
it's amazing. And, and somewhere like Central
Hawkes Bay, Waipokodo, you know,these kinds of places, like
there's just, there is that vibelike tinkerers and and that just
(17:32):
working away on stuff and it's kind of the news.
Everyone has like a shed, you know, And they're always.
Creating something, yeah. I mean, because I was just back
in Hawkes Barre a couple of weeks ago and obviously I live
in Japan, but it's just always pleasant to come back.
It's kind of unchanging in a way, and kind of quite far away
from the world. You can't, I mean, there's no
(17:53):
Amazon in New Zealand. You can't just go and order
stuff that easily. You have to either get it
yourself or, you know, bring it in somehow or, or make it and,
and it's just sort of a different way of doing things.
It's a little bit more real. You know you have to solve the
problems with what's around you,right?
Yeah, it's kind of, Yeah, Probably a lot of problem
(18:15):
solvers come from there and go off and do different things.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now that's cool man.
And so that's the story story ofArlington.
And then I guess I'm I'm really interested in just the story of
building a business where you'vedeployed your capital, you've
got a product that you're very passionate about.
It seems like it's this this keyword of proof of work comes
(18:35):
to mind. And and this is something that
is in Bitcoin, obviously in the in the the mining side and kind
of core to the the network itself.
But like how has proof of work made its way into your into your
work with your motorcycles? And I mean, in terms of actual
mining, like, well, no, no, it'sjust proof of work of doing
(18:56):
things. Conceptually.
Yeah. Conceptually, yeah.
Well, I mean, I think, I think I'd like to talk about the
design side and the risks of trying to like the normal design
process is you do a a lot of research and you talk to, you
know, a lot of people and sometimes quite often they're
(19:19):
already using products which aresolving those the problems that
they need to be solved. But like for something like
this, when you're trying to create a new sort of
subcategory, it's it's not as easy to go out and find like so
many people who are your target market.
So the way that I approached it was, hey, how about to build
(19:42):
something? And it could be completely
wrong. And what's the worst case
scenario is that I made a bike for myself, you know, and like,
nobody likes it, but I like it, you know?
And so the process was actually building something, getting it
out there and then starting to get feedback from actually
showing people like a physical product.
And yeah, there's pros and cons,but it's.
(20:05):
It's just a, it's certainly an easier way to like strike up
conversations with people when you have a physical thing to
show them rather than, you know,a step back.
You're still like a little bit conceptual still.
I think that's those conversations are more difficult
than when you actually have something that it might not be
100% there, but you're like, it's rating on it and you're
(20:27):
getting feedback. Yeah.
So proof of work, do things, getfeedback.
It's alright. And build, keep building, you
know, keep layering up. Yeah.
And then, you know, we've been going for like 5-6 years now.
So there's been a lot of changes.
There's been a lot of learnings.And I would also, Yeah, yeah,
(20:47):
that's, yeah. No, no.
I mean just like responding to that because you know, for me as
a creative as well, you know, it's easy to get stuck in your
own head. Absolutely.
And I think in this kind of modern world, and especially
with computers and software, youcan kind of get stuck at that
stage where something is just inthis kind of idea stage, but the
idea is, is always transient and, and that's formless.
(21:11):
And it is about doing the proof of work of turning that into a
real thing. And, and I've developed
processes over the years to kindof get myself to perform action
as opposed to thinking. And I, I, I, I do think this is
quite an important thing because, you know, things are
path dependent and once you start doing something, you
realize, oh, you know, there's, there's things you would never
(21:33):
know until you do it, do it absolutely.
And so, you know, instead of overthinking it, you just got
to. Go and do it right.
You can't. Let's start down the rabbit hole
there and there and yeah, you never know where they're going
to leave. Yeah.
And I think that's maybe something that we just kind of
psychologically in the modern world, we do lack a little bit.
There's this kind of neurosis offocusing on, you know, the
(21:57):
planning and, and thinking of it, but actually being able to
put something together in real world.
What what I call like base layerreality, you know, it's sort of.
Like that base layer? Base layer reality, like, you
know, does the thing go or not? You know, it's like, can you
solve the problem? And even if it's kind of hacked
together, yeah, if it does what it needs to do, it's like you've
(22:19):
built a solution as opposed to having it just on paper, right?
Yeah, I also got some very good feedback from someone.
There was the question asked like how many people do you need
to show your prototype to? And essentially the answer was
enough people so that the answers become all the same.
(22:39):
So like what they mean is there's no surprises.
So if if you talk to 100 people,but then you're still getting
like surprises every now and then, it's like, well, I didn't
expect that answer. You need to talk to more people.
So you talk to like 1000 and then you establish those like
common themes. And because you also have to
remember you're not creating a product for everyone, you're
(23:01):
creating it for your, your like keepers onus, right?
And so, yeah, you can't be like a yes man and put in every
feature which every person you talk to asks for.
But yeah, you focus on your keepers onus.
And hopefully that's the majority of, you know, as a
large enough group that you can have a large enough following to
(23:22):
create a business. Yeah.
Well, I think along those lines as well when it comes to
actually doing something, you know, like my experience, you
know, I've done a few photo books we were talking about
before and had did them through Kickstarter.
So I was able to crowdfund and, and then also doing like
exhibitions and kind of physically being able to bring
people together around a productand that it was like, it's been
(23:43):
very quiet. It's been very inspirational.
And even to this day, you know, I had a guy e-mail me around
some of the photo stuff I was doing in, in Bangkok because I
did a book on Bangkok. And it was like, man, this, this
work has like sent these ripplesout into the world.
Yeah, fantastic. Yeah.
I mean, yeah, I happened to havea look at them today.
That's that's how I brought themup.
(24:05):
So yeah, that was that was another ripple.
You know, I was like looking through and I was like, wow,
that's really cool. And you did it on Kickstarter
and it was very successful. So.
Yeah. Yeah, no, thank you.
I think, I think there's something about that man.
And I guess one of my themes I've been travelling through New
Zealand in this in the last couple of weeks, talking to, to
different people and coming up with this idea of like Bitcoin
(24:29):
businesses is, is a big thing for me.
Because I think the reality is that there isn't much surface
area to actually build purely Bitcoin things.
You know, there's maybe wallets,there's nodes, there's like
lightning services, there's there's a number of things where
you can build infrastructure, But the vast majority of the
real economy is simply Bitcoiners doing what they do
(24:50):
best. And I'm talking to more and more
people who have businesses that they're trying to sort of
supercharge with Bitcoin thinking or Bitcoin principles.
And you really stand out to me as sort of one of these people
where you've got a vision, you've got a product, you've got
an idea, you've got a long time preference.
And that's like that's quite powerful.
So like, what do you think aboutthe idea of like businesses run
by Bitcoiners? I think it's, I mean definitely
(25:14):
this business wouldn't be able to run without Bitcoin.
So it's kind of it's not even capital preservation.
It's like if if you're yeah, if you're run rate, what's it
called? Burn rate?
Burn rate. So yeah, if it's if it's low
enough, then you actually becomein a in a almost like a more
(25:35):
powerful position. So if you yeah, it yeah.
So it, yeah, you kind of have tobudget time a little bit.
So you do have to be very careful with your asset, right,
Because you can go out and you could spend everything and have
so many people. But yeah, it does shift you
towards like a longer term mindset like, hey, what can we
(25:58):
do to with what we have and, andbe a little bit sort of frugal
as well. Like you don't want to, yeah,
use all of your resource basically.
So yeah, I think that ties back to savings, right?
Like a lot of businesses that run on debt and whatnot these
days, but it's almost like the opposite.
(26:20):
Yeah, yeah. I think there's something about
the New Zealand psyche as well that really values like
bootstrapping, doing it yourself, it's kind of core
attributes. And I guess that contrasts a
little bit of my experience in like Japan, where it's like big
corporations, kind of faceless, the salary man, these kind of
stereotypes. And many countries in the world
have that, you know, larger countries have that culture of
(26:41):
like big corporations. But it seems to me like the
perfect size is to have maybe like three to five people
basically, you know, who can work together extremely closely
or even just a couple of people and have this like vision and
this passion. And then you sort of craft, you
carve out that space and then you can maybe grow it into maybe
(27:02):
a bigger organization. When it makes sense, Yeah, it
makes sense. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah.
No, I completely agree with that.
And yeah, I mean, the other way is obviously VC funding and
whatnot, whatnot, that recently we've seen that kind of dry out
late last year. And yeah, a lot of the companies
who went that way hired a lot ofpeople and then they've sort of
(27:25):
been falling over. So it's sad, but yeah, this
different pathways you can see, and I'm not saying that, you
know, everyone's going to go down the Bitcoin pathway, but
it's at least there's an option,you know?
So have you been able to leverage Bitcoin beyond just
using it as capital, but in terms of whether it's payments
or even as a like strategy for the company to like?
(27:46):
I have a reserve, to be honest, I could have done this a lot
better because I don't know, have you talked to people about
like have you had text conversations with business
owners around around this? I've I've heard people tell me
about the situation. Yeah, I mean, I can share, I'm
happy to share the situation with like Arlington.
(28:07):
So yeah, it's not like Arlingtonhas Bitcoin.
It's I have it personally and I keep on investing it into the
company. Right.
But the problem with if you're also kind of trading, then your
capital gains will get taxed like personally.
But for those watching, there's a better way to do it.
You can set up a company in New Zealand as AI think it's called
(28:30):
an LTC company, look through company.
And it just means that all of those personal gains can get
offset by company losses. So if as you're growing and
you're investing in your, you know, in your company, it kind
of can balance out, which I did not do.
I wish I did. Yeah.
So that's some some advice for someone who is going down a
(28:53):
similar path. Were you able to get some advice
on it like from? I literally only found out about
this this year, so it's kind of like a little bit, Yeah, it's
almost like too, too late. But we'll have a look at, yeah,
switching out, seeing what we can do.
Thanks for sharing that. I mean, I guess there is kind of
a conceptual idea of having say accepting payments via Bitcoin
(29:15):
or having a Bitcoin treasury in the company.
But what what you just said being a bit holding Bitcoin
personally and then putting thatinto your company as maybe a
slightly different process and maybe there's ways of
structuring that that it's maybeimportant to get advice on I
guess or it's absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But I guess on your road map though, like so people wanting
(29:37):
to pay for their. 100% we would accept it, of course.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I mean, I would love to, I'd
have to talk to the other guys in the team part in the future.
I would love to have, you know, like a little bit of a treasury,
like some of our capital, company capital and Bitcoin.
I think that would make sense. Yeah.
(29:58):
So hoping we can do something inthe future there.
Yeah, that's awesome. And again, thank you for sharing
that. But I mean, coming back to the
vision though, so I mean, you'vegot this, you've got this
motorbike, it's looking pretty awesome.
I mean, what's your vision then for like growing the company,
taking it overseas even? Like, tell me more about your
Rd. Maps I feel like at the moment
(30:19):
the next major step that we haveto go through is international
shipping. So once we can do international
shipping, once we can send theseto Australia, US, maybe Japan,
that'll be pretty cool. I think you know some of the big
cities there will be well suitedfor that will be yeah, great
achievement for us and I think that will yeah, I've talked to
other people selling in New Zealand and then also abroad and
(30:43):
that's that's yeah, there's muchbigger markets in New Zealand.
New Zealand, there's like a really tough test markets, not
even an easy one. It's like a difficult market to
crack. So yeah, it's you're kind of
starting with a more difficult one in New Zealand.
So yeah, we'd love to figure outour international shipping and
yeah, do that. Well, on that night, so I've
(31:07):
been having conversations with people again, I'm sort of re
jigging myself on what the situation is in New Zealand
because I haven't really spent that much time in Auckland ever
really. So this time round I've been
meeting with a few Auckland based bitcoiners and different
friends and that and that and just learning how they are
approaching innovation and business.
And certainly I, I agree with that sentiment that it's, it's a
(31:30):
hard market here, man. Like it's small, it's far from
the world. It's, you know, maybe not as
affluent as other parts of the world where you can sell into a
market and there's just people ready to buy.
You have to kind of craft the market yourself.
Yeah. But as you say, there's once, if
you can overcome those those hurdles, you can really do well.
And there's a few like pretty successful brands that are world
(31:54):
known that come out of New Zealand and a range of
categories. I I think that's why, because if
you can survive here and then expand, then it's easy mode.
Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You're doing the Hard Fit fest. And I just wonder if if that's
something that's not that well known because I do see there is
a bit of an island mentality where it's like New Zealand is
the world. And to be fair, Japan is a bit
like that as well. And it's like, how do you, how
(32:18):
do you kind of talk about what it means to sell a product
overseas to export? I mean we have you had advice or
sort of mentorship in that role in that space or?
It just comes, I mean, there's obviously the the main
challenges that you need to get sorted as like the certification
for the different countries right there.
(32:38):
Yeah, these it's not as scary asit seems, I would say.
And so I would, you know, say just jump in there and get
started and give it a crack. Yeah.
And then I guess the reward is worth it if you can figure it
out. Like I've talked to a friend
(33:00):
who's who makes combust small combustion motorcycles and he
makes them in New Zealand, NorthShore.
And his biggest market, he shipsto Australia and US primarily.
His biggest market is actually Australia that's bigger than US.
And so that's what he said once,once he figured out the
international shipping, it was difficult to do.
(33:21):
But once you pack it, the rewardis kind of like worthwhile.
But yeah, for me, like personally, I just want to, I'm
also excited about developing the brand in other countries
because it's like we're, we're putting in a lot of work and
effort into Auckland, which is great fun.
But like, how about we go to another big city and, you know,
get to work there, Yeah, Get people on their bike, get their
(33:43):
feedback. And you know that that's what I
would be pretty, pretty excited to do as well.
Yeah, and let's talk about E VS generally and electric
motorbikes, electric cars like, So tell me more about this
industry because I mean, I was having a chat with the guy in
the Uber the other day and he said all of the Ubers in New
Zealand will need to be E VS in in the coming months.
(34:03):
There's like been a dictate. I wasn't aware of that.
Yeah, well, something to that effect.
You're seeing more and more charging stations.
There's some really cool projects coming out of New
Zealand, even with. Charging, I mean there's like
jolts and they're doing free charging for for a while, which
is interesting because if we could charge a bike essentially
(34:23):
be free. Yeah.
Well, and even like my friends have Quitter which are doing the
fast charging and that's like getting world recognition for
that technology. But tell me more about just this
industry in general, like your high level thoughts on it.
I mean, I'll, maybe I'll talk inrelation to Arlington because
(34:44):
I'm not as familiar with the larger electric industry.
So I know there's like a lot of electric buses and stuff popping
up, but you know, what I like isjust the independence, right?
So we've designed these things so you can put them in the lift,
take them out to your apartment for. 50 KGS, right?
54 KGS. 54 KGS. Yeah, that's incredible.
(35:07):
Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. So yeah, thinking about how you
charge them, you like literally take them to your house, plug
them into a three pin plug and the cost would be like 2 1/2
power units. So they say like $0.60 or
something like that, 60-70 cents, essentially 1 cent per
kilometer. So for me it's about that like
(35:29):
independence of yeah, you know, that your travel is so cheap,
it's like ridiculously cheap. And then because you know, that
you end up like not taking like for me, it's a company vehicle
like a van. So I will not use that unless I
have to. And it's just fun, you know,
like because yeah, so I just like that side of it.
(35:51):
And then knowing that, hey, let's say if the electricity
price, you know, skyrocketed, well, it'll take like 1400 Watt
solar panel and, you know, say six hours of sun and then you're
you're up and running again. So, you know, it's kind of like
you don't really worry about what happens in the in the
markets in terms of, you know, oil prices or whatever.
(36:12):
It just doesn't matter. Yeah.
Well, I'll put it on that threadas well.
I mean, there's this bigger ideaof like the energy transition.
And I mean, there's a lot of different politics and
ideologies floating around. But what you just said, I mean
no matter what happens, being able to get from A to B on a
solar panel. Yeah, you know that you're
sorted. You're sorted.
I mean, do you think about the stuff, do you study kind of
maybe the bigger trends that arehappening and say the energy
(36:34):
sector and broadly or I? Mean obviously we we keep track
of like things like battery prices, you know, the trend of
battery prices, which are trending down, which is good.
We're always on the lookout for new, new battery tech.
It's kind of been designed so that if something does come out
like a way better battery, then,you know, we can take off the
cover and we can reconfigure andwe could put in that that new
(36:56):
technology. So yeah, we're always looking at
the new tech that's coming out and then just price trends and
things like that. Yeah.
Yeah. And how much do raw materials
figure into what you're doing interms of say, metal and steel
and save the batteries as well, like?
The batteries are by far the most expensive component of
(37:16):
electric motorcycles and like we're using like a full
aluminium frame, which is Oh yeah, yeah, why it's 54 KGS
yeah. But yes, it's great to see that
the trend is kind of going down for that those, you know the
cost of batteries because. Yeah, I was always under the
impression that it was quite hard to Weld aluminium, but
(37:37):
you've got, you see, you've got some nice beautiful welds there.
Is that just like? Skill.
Skills, yeah, Absolutely. Yeah, maybe it maybe it had for
me meaning my my aluminium welding is not great as well.
So I didn't Weld the bikes Yeah.So we Yeah, but if you.
Well, I always thought you had to bolt things together if they
were aluminium, but you've got, you've actually got some
beautiful welds there. So is that like done by hand?
(37:59):
We do try to minimise the welds because, I mean, you can use
robot welders, but the processeswhich are very efficient for
creating frames, it's like lasercutting and folding.
So we'd want to use a lot of that.
And then, yeah, there are, you know, as you can see, we do have
Wilds, but yeah, they're kind oflike quite easy as well.
(38:22):
So you need to think about wherethey're situated and yeah, how
easy it is. It's quite, it's quite
futuristic though, because aircraft uses aluminium, right?
And it's sort of there is a sortof this the the the lightness of
it would be a gain. I'm not.
Worrying about like tripping your frame and having like rusty
patches is like a big one. For me, I think, oh, really?
(38:43):
Yeah, yeah. So that's certainly an advantage
and you know just visible like stainless masses and so.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, if this was steel frame,
I mean, how much would it weigh do you reckon?
I mean, we have, I know some similar bikes which is I think
closer to AD. So it would be.
I'm not saying that would all bein the frame, they are slightly
(39:05):
bigger, but it would be a decentamount.
Decent amount more, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's incredible, man.
And I guess when it comes to some of the componentry in
there, like how have you found trying to source materials into
New Zealand source components that you're maybe using OEM,
like tell me about that process a bit more.
That's a big part of the job to be honest.
Yeah, over the years then just about every component on the
(39:29):
bike, we've we've gone through multiple suppliers to find
people that we're happy with. And you know, there's there's
obviously things that like the VCU that's PCB inside that's
kind of like the brain that's, you know, we, we manufacture
that. Yeah.
So it's just, it's an interesting process finding
(39:52):
because also we're not like the biggest company, right.
So it's different, let's say like Yamaha going and
approaching a supplier to us. Approaching so yeah, finding
out, finding out the good suppliers who yeah, we can we
can kind of like grow together and like in terms of hub motors,
(40:14):
there's basically like only two high end options.
So it's quite simple to choose some components because they'll
say, well, we can go with these guys or those guys and you know,
they're the best. So we go with them And then you
know, like battery, battery techis quite good as well because
you can go with essentially the best at the time.
(40:34):
So battery cells are, you know, very easy to source.
So this particular bike's using Panasonic, but you know,
there's, there's good sales out from Samsung and so you can look
at all the specs and you know how how many amps they give you
and whatnot to yeah, figure out what's best for the project.
Yeah. And what's been like your
(40:55):
biggest learning experience going through this whole process
like? I would say physical products
are much more difficult than like software, just straight
software products. Yeah, it's just the, the time to
iterate is longer, you know, so and that's the challenge to try
(41:19):
to get that faster. Yeah.
So that's the learning. But now we're on to the how can
we fix it? Like how can we, how can we?
Yeah, make things these things abit quicker, Yeah.
And I guess that's the question.I mean others have mentioned
like getting to scale is really the challenge.
And so you're going to work through that now like.
Yeah, absolutely. Would you call it like mass
(41:41):
production at this stage or are you guys still working through
some of those challenges or? We're working with suppliers who
are able to mass produce and have and work with like other
major brands. Yeah, like, yeah, so the road
map is there. You know, obviously there's the
(42:02):
other side of it, the marketing,the sales, but we're getting set
up so that, yeah, we, we can continue with our suppliers and
they can take us, you know, through the whole journey.
So and what's the on the sales side, what's that landscape look
like in New Zealand? Like do you need to go through
dealers or are you able to sell to the public?
Like what's that? This is a very interesting, like
I feel like this is where a lot of the work is happening for us
(42:25):
right now. OK, so we're travelling, you
know, like display partners, obviously Tuesday clubs one
we've got we've been in a coupleof other places around Auckland
and we are in yeah, a few other places.
So this idea of having a physical location where you can
go in and see this product, which I think is good for high,
(42:45):
high ticket items. So it costs a reasonable amount.
So it's good to be able to have it on show, allow people to walk
in and view the product, go for a test ride.
And but in saying that, you know, we, we do get a lot of our
needs from from social. So that's kind of the start of
the funnel. And then get them in, you know,
(43:06):
ideally we want to get them on abike.
Once they get on a bike, then they come up with their own
reasons why they need to buy thebike.
So it kind of like sells itself.And you are able to do that sale
directly to customers on new. Zealand, yeah, we, we, we can do
that as well. Yeah, yeah.
So we're kind of trying the direct customer and then also
going through our display partners and yeah, but we, we
(43:29):
always ask like, you know, how did you learn about Allington,
even if it's a direct? Because they might have been in,
you know, Tuesday Club, they might have seen it.
So we need to figure out how howit happened and, you know,
reimburse people who are responsible for making the sale
happen. Well, that's interesting because
I do think that maybe it's slightly different to like cars
(43:50):
where there is this kind of dealership model that's quite
common for new cars. The fact that it's slightly
smaller sort of maybe is closer in a sense to like a consumer
product where you can sort of goin and touch it and it's kind of
maybe a little bit more unique in that sense.
Yeah, it is still a vehicle. So it's kind of maybe a little
(44:11):
bit of a middle ground, right? Yes, yes.
You know you're not, you're not inside a whole bunch of other
bikes, right? It's just you.
You're the only. One for us it's it doesn't make
sense for us to be situated like, let's say in a motorcycle
showroom yeah, yeah. But then, you know, we did
exhibit at Auckland Design Week and you know, creatives love
(44:33):
this, this sort of thing, this new form factor.
And and then also like a displaypartner can be anything that has
brand alignment. So could be like a menswear
store or something with some nice clothes.
And we have done that. We did that with RJB design on
customs and yeah, that works as well because you have it in the
(44:57):
window, people go, wow, there's a cool bike and they go into the
store and then they might buy a shirt, you know, so, so those
guys are happy to display it as well.
So it's thinking about thinking about it in a different way
because there's so many options,right?
Yeah, yeah, that's cool. And I guess I mean, you shared a
little bit of your road map, butI mean, you're feeling like
Auckland is really the the home base for this, for the future
(45:20):
or? We've had a reasonable amount of
interest from Wellington as wellrecently.
So we do need to kind of do a bit of a road trip or maybe get
some, get a display partner there.
Yeah, we could imagine like in the major cities.
I think we should have a bit of a footprint, yeah.
(45:41):
It's also about. Christchurch as well, there's
been some interest there, so well, let's see what we can do.
And I mean, come back to sort ofwrapping up on, on the Bitcoin
side. So I mean, what's your outlook
for, I mean, your interest and, and Bitcoin, is there anything
that you've got your eye on outside of all of this that
you're sort of following in terms of tech or developments in
the Bitcoin world, Anything you've read recently that has
(46:01):
left a mark? Yeah.
I mean, yeah, I don't know. I feel like I would like to see
it adopted a bit more at, you know, you're starting to see
that sort of the country level interest.
So I would just, yeah, like to see more like use of it and the
(46:24):
Lightning Network and and thingslike that.
Because, yeah, at the moment we're all just holding it and
it's kind of like we don't, we almost don't know if someone
else is interested in this asset.
I was talking to a guy who was riding a scooter and he had like
a Bitcoin sticker on it. But if he didn't have that
sticker, then like, I would never have known, right.
(46:47):
So trying to get the technology,yeah, used a bit more out in the
forefront so more people can understand it.
You're probably, yeah, closer toit than than me.
So you'd be able to ask the question.
I'd love it. Well, I was just, I was just
going to say though, because in that product space, you know,
I'm really interested in some ofthe emerging tech coming out
around mining and just somethingseeing some of the ducting and
(47:10):
stuff you've got in here and I'mlike, man, you know, Oh,
absolutely. There's just the.
Bitcoin heaters and all of that stuff.
And yeah, just making use of thestranded electricity is
fantastic as well, I think. Yeah, Yeah, you could.
Yeah. There's all sorts of all sorts
of things that it's an exciting space.
(47:30):
Like whenever you have power, like electrical power, you kind
of have, that's another resource.
And do you choose to then turn that resource into an asset?
You know, it's a interesting space.
Yeah, yeah, it'd be cool to explore what those options look
like and especially that kind ofinterplay between, you know,
base layer reality, electricity,mining and.
(47:50):
Just and electricity is, is it can be quite difficult to store
it as well, right. So that's where the big
opportunity is. I think everyone's finding this
stranded energy and converting it.
Yeah, yeah. Lots of opportunities, but Ian,
it's been great to learn about your story, man, and to see the
bike and talk about what you're doing a bit more.
Is there anything else you want to share or anywhere you want to
(48:11):
send people if they're listening?
Yeah, I mean, maybe if anyone wants to reach out, ask me any
questions or just have a chat, you're just Arlington dot
motorcycles on Instagram is probably the best place.
I'm in that account at the moment.
So yeah, happy to chat about anything.
Yeah. And related to Bitcoin or
(48:33):
motorbikes? And you can book a test drive
through your website as well. So what's the website for us?
Arlingtonmotorcycles.com. Arlingtonmotorcycles.com So
yeah, get in touch and see some spec sheets, there's some info,
some photos and get in touch andand test rides.
Is that mainly like Auckland or you've got some in other parts
of the country at the moment? It's currently mostly based in
(48:55):
Auckland, but if you are somewhere else in New Zealand
and reach out, Yeah, reach out. We'll make it happen.
We'll figure it out. Yeah.
All right. Thanks so much.
Thank you so much for that. Yeah, that's.
That's great. Thank you for listening.
I am Cody Allingham and that wasthe transformation of value.
If you would like to support this show, please consider
making a donation either throughmy website or by directly
(49:17):
tipping to the show's Bitcoin wallet, or just pass this
episode on to a friend who you think may enjoy it.
And you can always e-mail me at hello@thetransformationofvalue.com.
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