September 16, 2025 • 30 mins
Michael Shaw, founder of the Mastery Mindset Library, is a psychology-trained coach with over 30 years of experience helping high-achieving professionals overcome anxiety and depression without relying on medication or years of traditional therapy.
Drawing from his background as a personal trainer, mental performance coach, and father, Michael developed a unique, belief-based approach to mental wellness that empowers clients to create lasting change from the inside out. He’s trained top business professionals, Hollywood celebrities, and even competed in U.S. Muay Thai in his 50s. Today, he’s recognized as a leading voice in transforming mental health through mindset, resilience, and purpose.
In This Episode
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Drawing from his background as a personal trainer, mental performance coach, and father, Michael developed a unique, belief-based approach to mental wellness that empowers clients to create lasting change from the inside out. He’s trained top business professionals, Hollywood celebrities, and even competed in U.S. Muay Thai in his 50s. Today, he’s recognized as a leading voice in transforming mental health through mindset, resilience, and purpose.
In This Episode
- Free session with Michael
- 20% off full year’s access to Mindset Library
- DM Michael the work Master at IG
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-trauma-therapist--5739761/support.
You can learn more about what I do here:
The Trauma Therapist Newsletter: celebrates the people and voices in the mental health profession. And it's free! Check it out here: https://bit.ly/4jGBeSa
———
If you’d like to support The Trauma Therapist Podcast and the work I do you can do that here with a monthly donation of $5, $7, or $10: Donate to The Trauma Therapist Podcast.
Click here to join my email list and receive podcast updates and other news.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Trauma THEAPIS podcast. My name is gamcpherson.
I interview incredible people who dedicated their lives to helping
those who have been impacted by trauma. Here we go,
so five four, three, two and one, our folks, wilcome
back to the podcast. Very excited to have as my
guest today, Michael Shaw.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Michael, welcome, Thank you, happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
So Michael, founder, excuse me of the Mastery Mindset Library
is a psychology trained coach with over thirty years of
experience helping high achieving professionals overcome anxiety and depression without
relying on medication or years of traditional therapy. Drawing from
his background as a personal trainer, mental performance coach, and father,
Michael developed a unique belief based approach mental wellness that
(00:47):
empowers clients to create lasting change from the inside out. Today,
he's recognized as a leading voice in transforming mental health
to mindset, resilience and purpose. All right, as my voice goes,
just a little bit about you before we get going, Michael,
share with the listeners where you're from originally and where
you are currently.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Well. First off, thank you for having me.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
You've created an incredibly valuable space for those of us
who want to learn and grow from our trauma.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Trauma.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
So I really appreciate you and employed you for that.
I am originally from New York, born and raised, born
in the Bronx, raised on Long Island, and I now
I'm speaking to you from my home in New Jersey.
I split time between New Jersey and Naples, Florida.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Awesome. Awesome. I'm born in New York as well.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Appreciate that. Yeah, I lived on Long Island.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Awesome. All right, So let's start. How the hell did
you get into this field? How did this start for you?
Speaker 3 (01:50):
Well, you know, I never set out to become a
mindset coach, let alone someone who helps people grow through
their trauma. My path start art in the fitness world
as a personal trainer, earning twelve bucks a session at
a small mom and pop studio, and that was in
nineteen ninety four, and within a year I became the
(02:13):
head trainer, and three years later I bought the business Wow,
And eventually I opened New York Personal Training in Manhattan,
which was my masterpiece.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
It was a fifth Avenue facility.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
I had forty five trainers, physical therapy, chiropolcitic and a
client roster that read like the who's who of Manhattan elite.
And from the outside, everything about me screamed success. But
inside I was still carrying trauma that I had never addressed.
(02:47):
And that inner work started after a devastating breakup where
I went through betrayal, heartbreak, and even losing my home.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
Well, let me pause you for a second. How old
are you with this we're talking about here?
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Now?
Speaker 3 (03:02):
I was forty at that time during that breakup, okay,
and so suddenly I'm a father trying to hold it
together for my kids, when while I'm falling apart inside
and it hit me that I had spent a life
building physical strength, but I didn't have the tools for
(03:25):
emotional recovery. And that's especially disorienting when your entire identity
is built on being the strong one. I was a
personal trainer, I was a competitive bodybuilder, a triathlete, a
multai fighter, and I was breaking down. And that moment
put me on a different path, not sets and reps,
(03:48):
but emotional clarity, structure, and reflection. And that's where the
real coaching started. And if I'm honest, the roots of
the work actually started much earlier, because I grew up
in a household where love.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
And trauma co existed.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
My parents absolutely loved us, but they had their own demons,
which meant I lived through domestic violence and psychological manipulation.
One minute life was normal, the next it exploded into chaos,
my dad's rage, my mom's control, and me stepping in
to protect my mom and sister. And that's where the
(04:31):
hero complex became part of my wiring. And then later
watching my daughter, who is a brilliant Ivy League at
the time, was a brilliant IVY League student struggling with
crippling anxiety during her college years, and that changed everything
for me. We'd spend entire days on FaceTime just to
(04:54):
get her out of bed, and it taught me how
to meet someone exactly where they are. It wasn't about
giving advice, it was about presence, and that lesson became
the foundation of how I coach today.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Let me just stop a second. First of all, I
want to thank you for sharing that. I mean, that's intense, Yeah,
I mean it's it's just to hear you sharing all
that is very intense, and it was very interesting to
hear you talk about your your business and yourself and
(05:36):
the external world of how you were kind of armoring
yourself and then go back to talk about your family
and that groundwork that.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Was laid there.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
I really appreciate you sharing that when you you just
talked about your daughter and kind of meeting her where
they're at. At what point were you when that was happening.
Was that after your own breakup?
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Yes, okay, that was probably ten years later, okay, ten
twelve years later?
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Yeah, okay?
Speaker 1 (06:12):
Was this shift and I realized not everything is just
happens in a second. But was this shift for you
from the external world in a sense, I'm being very
simplistic here to understanding that you needed to do some
inner work? Was Was that a hard for you? Was
that a challenge for you? Was just like Jesus, something
(06:35):
needs to be done? Talk about that?
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Yeah? You know it?
Speaker 3 (06:39):
Actually, you know, once once I worked through the initial
shock of losing the relationship I was in and the
reality of the betrayal in that relationship, and you know,
when you have a business and when you have children
(07:00):
and you don't have time to sit and lick your wounds,
you have to figure out what's next. But I've always
been a very introspective person, and I love to learn.
So it just became a new mission of why am
I here? How did I end up here? I had
(07:21):
seemingly done everything right? How do I end up here?
And coming from a background, especially a bodybuilding where you
learn how to make incremental gains, you know, you work
at something, you reach a limit, and then you make
and you use that experience to make a gain, I
(07:42):
kind of approached it the same way, and I said, well,
let me just as I did when I was a
beginner in the gym, starting from the very beginning. Let
me go back to the beginning and understand where I
come from, who I am, who I have been. And
that led to examining belief systems and where belief systems
(08:03):
come from, and does my belief am I stuck in
a belief system built from trauma? And do those beliefs
serve me now?
Speaker 1 (08:14):
And now did this involve like therapy traditional therapy?
Speaker 2 (08:19):
This was all me, This was all you, Okay.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
So what were your beliefs at that point?
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Well?
Speaker 3 (08:26):
So what I learned was that my beliefs were built
from that initial childhood trauma of living in a household
with domestic violence and having a hero complex right, and
and that belief system served me very well during my
childhood and even in my early adulthood in taking on
(08:50):
the responsibility of building a business and what have you.
But many of the beliefs in that belief system will
keeping me stuck there and putting out an energy that
kept bringing back the same type of result in a cycle,
which is what happens with belief systems and with trauma.
(09:12):
Until you go back and reconcile that trauma, you use
your adult eyes and you walk hand in hand with
your childhood self and you you look at you look
at the trauma and how you responded to it with mature, educated,
adult eyes, which is what I do when I walk
hand in hand with my clients and and we reconcile
(09:35):
with that drama. We tell our childho self, it's okay.
You know, it wasn't your fault. You did what you
had to do. But and we thank the beliefs that
got us to where we are. But if they're no
longer useful to us, we thank them with love when
we say goodbye.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
It's so it's so inspiring to talk to you, because
you know it's it's I learned a little bit about
you for this. I read your bio, read look at
your website, but it's so much interesting, more interesting to
hear you talk and walk through this process. I mean,
(10:13):
you've obviously been through a lot and done your own
inner work, and I find it very inspiring. So how
did what did you want to do with this new
what power that you had? In a sense, it's awareness
(10:35):
that you had.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Sure, So.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
There are many factors in that answer. What happened as
I went through my own rebirth reawakening is I started
a new relationship and I met my wife, who I've
been married to now for fifteen years. And it dawned
(10:59):
on me, you know, waking up one day that I
have the most incredible life now, Like I I my
life is filled with like laughter and joy and happiness
and and the self sacrifice and just rewarding and I
(11:20):
know how I got here. So I now want to
share this with other people and help them attain the
same thing. And so I repeat your question. So I
answered exactly.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
My question was what did I mean you you're talking
about you use the word rebirth. I said, there's obviously
a new awareness that you gained from all these different
experiences you had. What did you want to do with it?
What was that process? Obviously you started this new business.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Right right, so right, So what I wanted to do
was my definition of a true OUTFA is someone who's always.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Learning and always teaching.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
So that I went through this incredible journey and I
was able to really learn this process, I wanted to
share that with as many people as possible, so I
created the you know, my Mindset coaching business, which is twofold.
(12:23):
I work one on one with clients, and I then
also created this library where because I recognized that not
everybody can afford to work with a coach, which is
something I went through in my fitness and personal training
career as well. It's great, you know, and it's great
because as a business person, you work with very high level,
(12:46):
successful people, but there are many people there who need
your services as well but cannot afford it. So I
created this library where literally just about everybody could access
all of these lessons and go through it on their
at their own pace.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
No, just just to be clear here, so this library
is we are the video lessons.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
This is this is an online.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
An online collection of coaching lessons, hundreds and hundreds of
coaching lessons that I add to every day under every
possible topic from grief to mindset to goals to you
name it, emotional intelligence.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
Et cetera.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
Where for each each lesson, I give a video introduction
and then there's a downloadable lesson and that you you
work through on your own.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
Has has this change? I mean you obviously you're you're
you're you're describing a journey. You're describing a change from
some from one person who was you know, muay Thai
body building to someone else. Obviously there are different parts
of you, but I'm just it's a very interesting journey
(14:07):
you're talking about. Sure, do you sometimes look at yourself
and say, how the hell did I get here? Or
how did this other part of me? Where was it
all this time? It's just it's very interesting.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
You know, I really don't, because.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
I was very present in my evolution, so.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
I remember.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
How I was feeling and where I was at all
points in time. So it's not surprising to me. I
do go back and say and tell myself, I didn't
even know this level of love and joy and happiness existed.
Because we're so conditioned to set our sits on financial security,
(15:03):
material objects. Oh you know, as a kid growing up,
when we didn't have any money, I would sit on
a corner and I would look at all the cars
that would stop at a traffic light and be like, Oh,
I wish I could have that car. I'd be happy
with that Car'd be happy with that car. So you know,
you look at the house you want, and you look
at the car that you want. You think, if I
get those things, i am on the vacation I want.
(15:25):
That's happy. And I got those things, and then it
all blew up in my face. So I still have
those things now. But now no matter where I am,
no matter what I'm doing, no matter what car, it
doesn't matter. I have this internal satisfaction and my life
(15:48):
is so rewarding coming from everywhere because I'm living this
life where I know who I am. I've declared who
I am and you could see it. I wear it
around my neck.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
What is it I see I am?
Speaker 2 (16:02):
What is it so so I am?
Speaker 3 (16:06):
Is something that I teach that is called your I
Am declaration, So you it's it's a set of for me,
probably a dozen statements declaring to the world who I
am and which allow knowing that allows me to hone
in on my core values and live in alignment with
(16:30):
that I AM declaration and those core values.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
And if everything I.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
Do is in pursuit of those values and that declaration,
then then I'm living a life in alignment with my
true self and I can't be anything but happy.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
It's so easy to feel like we are living in alignment,
when in fact, oftentimes a lot of us aren't. A
lot of times, if someone was to ask, you know,
one what their beliefs are and like, oh, I guess
I believe in being healthy while I'm meeting my Krispy
(17:07):
Green Donuts.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
And do you know how many people I've asked what
their core values are and one of their core values
will be autonomy and entrepreneurship, and they're stuck in a
nine to five job they hate, or a corporate job
that they hate. And I'm like, well, you're not living
in alignment with your values. But I can't give.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
Up my job. It feeds my family, it feeds my
you know what I mean, It's who I am.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
But you're not ever going to be happy because you're
not living in alignment with your core values. It's I say.
I always use the airplane example. When you go on
an airplane and they're describing the safety to you. They
always tell you put your mask on first so you
can take care of whoever's next to you. You have
(17:53):
to take care of yourself first.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
You have to learn. You have to determine what those
values are. Those handful of values.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
Is it love, knowledge, empathy, security, humor? Those would be
mine easy.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
I know then I live in pursuit of.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
Them, and I can guarantee you anytime I'm feeling out
of sorts, something is not in alignment with that, I'm
acting out of integrity. It's called I'm not in integrity
or alignment with my values.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
It feels to me like a lot of our culture
here in America is built upon kind of the antithesis
of those values. A lot of we get caught up
in this, just like you were describing, you know, what
should I have, what should I be, when in fact,
(18:53):
many of us don't even know what our values are
or belief systems are. They've just come they've by osmosis,
we've adopted them.
Speaker 3 (19:04):
Well, I hate to sound like like like the old man,
but when you spend your your the majority of your
time scrolling on your feed looking at the highlight wheel
of other people's lives and comparing your everyday life to
their highlight reel and comparison is the thief of joy.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Ha ha. You know it.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
It's a destruction and it's a of of yourself and
it creates a false belief system or it or it
emboldens your false belief system or reaffirms it.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Who do you work with?
Speaker 3 (19:53):
So I work with? I mean there are segm There
are segments of people I work with. Anyone who feels stuck,
anyone who's usually tends to be a high performing person
but yet feels unfulfilled. And that comes in many shapes
(20:18):
and forms. It can come in the form of a
man in his forties who is successful in his career
but just cannot make his relationship work and is feeling
stuck there because he feels the responsibility for his family
(20:38):
and his children, but he's just not happy and he
cannot or a woman in a similar situation, or as
I mentioned before, somebody who is in their corporate job
and just is always feeling out of place and feeling
like they're pressing their nose against the window of life
because they actually have an entrepreneurial spirit and want to
(21:01):
be doing something else on their own. It's it all
always leads back to the same place of have you
addressed your trauma? What are your belief systems? We need
we need to examine those belief systems so we can
come out at the end of the day with a
group of beliefs that do serve you. So you can
declare to the world who I am, and you can
(21:25):
tell me with absolute certainty what your values are, and
then we can work on Well, that's simple. This you want,
you are, this, you value that. We're going to take
these steps so you can those two can be in
alignment and you will be happy and everyone around you
(21:45):
will be happier because you are serving them better because
you're you've served yourself.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
That's that sounds very easy to do. It's not easy
to do. I mean, it sounds very clear or you
just said, but I could just imagine. I know, it's
not easy to do.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
It's not easy.
Speaker 3 (22:06):
It's like anything else, you know what, Getting on stage
in a banana hammock and posing it in front of
thousands of people as a bodybuilder isn't an easy thing
to do either, right, Okay?
Speaker 2 (22:16):
And if you are someone who.
Speaker 3 (22:21):
Does not have a bodybuilder build, but you decide you
want to do that, that's a huge undertaking. That's a
multi year undertaking of weight training, conditioning, dieting.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
You know.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
So if you look at it, that's an impossible road.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
I can't do that.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
But if you determined that that is your path and
you take the first step, like I told you earlier,
it's just a progression. You're just constantly building on your
on your previous little tiny success, whatever that may be,
And every single journey is the same way.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
You need the.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
Tools that allow you to take the first step and
to recognize your success in that step and build on it.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
And listen.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
I'm going to keep with the bodybuilding example just because
it's simple, but we could apply it to anything. The
pinnacle of being a bodybuilder would be winning Mister Universe.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
I graduated high school. I was one hundred and twenty pounds.
I was never going to be mister Universe.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Okay, but.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
I did land somewhere between one hundred and twenty pounds
in Mister Universe. I did compete on stage. I did
realize this incredible goal of literally rechanging my reforming my
physical self, which was what gave me the confidence to
reform my psychological self. It was the same journey, just
(23:58):
a different goal. And every journey is like that. You know,
they say shoot for the stars. If you land on
the moon, you know you still travel twenty something thousand
miles or however many miles that is, And it's a
lot better than standing in the same place you wear
on the ground.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
What do you think, Michael, gives you the I mean,
I can hear it for me. I think I know
the answer, but I want to hear you articulated. What
do you think gives you the ability to do this work.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
To do the work of coaching. Well, it's my lift experience. Okay,
I didn't learn this through textbooks. I learned all of
this through lift experience, through breaking down, rebuilding and learning
how to truly meet people where they are and help
them move forward.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
How did you learn that, because that's not an easy
thing to do, even for trained therapists.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Well, you know, you don't come right out of the
box now and everything. There's a lot of trial and error,
and so you know how most coaches or therapists they jump,
They jumped straight into solving the problem. Okay, they've got
the blueprint, they have the system, they have the five
(25:23):
step strategy, and they assume if you just follow the formula,
everything will fall into place. Well, what I do is
I start by learning who you are before we ever
talk about where you're going. And that I learned from
making mistakes in my earlier in my career. You know,
(25:47):
I would make the mistake of assuming that the tools
were enough, whether it was fitness, mindset, or performance. I
had the science, I had the structure, but I didn't
yet have the sensitivity, and so I wasn't asking what
brought you here? What beliefs are shaping your behavior? What
pain are you still trying to protect yourself from? So
(26:10):
I was offering strategy without understanding, which is structure without safety.
And when someone has unresolved trauma that that doesn't create change,
it creates resistance. So now my coaching starts with curiosity,
not certainty. I don't assume your readiness or resilience. I
(26:33):
learned your emotional landscape first, so we can build something
that not only creates a better future, but it gently
repairs your past. And that shift, didn't you know, It
made me a better coach, but it also made me
a more present, grounded and compassionate human being.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
Well, I love that I could imagine that people come
to you with this idea of you know, they want
to get motivated, and they want to get inspired, and
and at some point they're like, what I got to
do with my trauma?
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Yeah? True, And.
Speaker 3 (27:19):
I'm not I'm not here to motivate, Okay. I'm here
to connect you. I'm here to take a journey with you.
I'm here to meet you where. I'm here to meet
you where you are, learn where you want to be,
revisit where you've been, and and and rebuild. I'm not
here to be a cheerleader.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
Michael. What's the best way for people to learn more
about what you're doing?
Speaker 3 (27:49):
Well, you can always go to go to my website,
Michael shawmindset dot com. But you can also I also
visit my visit my instagram. But you know, I wanna
(28:10):
tell people that I anyone who's listening. If if you
feel like you've hit your breaking point, just know this,
You're not broken.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
You're carrying.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
You're just carrying more than your system was designed to
carry alone. And strength doesn't come from pretending. It comes
from being witnessed, supported and challenged with love. And that's
what I do, not as a therapist, but as a
guide to revisit what you ask me before, and someone
(28:43):
some just someone who sees you, honors where you've been,
and walks besides you as you bi as you build
who you're becoming. And if this resonates, if you're feeling stuck,
if you're feeling overwhelmed, or you're just ready for more
purpose and clarity, then and the coaching that I've developed
was built for you.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
So if you want to find out.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
More about me or how to work with me, I
have created something as a thank you for listening and
guide to you for creating the space and sharing.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
It with the world.
Speaker 3 (29:18):
I have two very powerful tools that I usually reserve
for my private clients that I want to give to everybody.
And first is a free Mindset Mastery Breakthrough session, which
is sixty minute deep dive with me where we uncover
what's holding you back and we create a plan to
(29:40):
move you forward with confidence. And the second is I
want to give you twenty percent off of a full year,
full year's access to the Mastery Mindset training library. And
as I said, it's constantly updated resource. It's packed with
practical and empowering workshops that you can you and set
(30:00):
your own pace and to claim both either or both.
Just DM me the word mastery and okay, m A
S T e r y Mastery at my Instagram which
is at Michael Shaw dot mindset m I C h
a E L s h A W dot m I
N D s E T so go to Michael Shore mindset,
(30:21):
send the word mastery and I'll personally send everything over
to you.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Awesome. I appreciate that, Michael. We'll have that all that
linked up here at the show notes page at the
Trauma Therapist podcast dot com. Uh, Michael, I know you
say you don't want to motivate, but you're certainly freakin
inspiring and you're welcome back here anytime.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Ed Oh, I thank you so much. The spaceship created
is amazing. I love talking to you.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
All right, we'll be in touch
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Okay, thank you, take care, bye bye
Welcome to the Trauma THEAPIS podcast. My name is gamcpherson.
I interview incredible people who dedicated their lives to helping
those who have been impacted by trauma. Here we go,
so five four, three, two and one, our folks, wilcome
back to the podcast. Very excited to have as my
guest today, Michael Shaw.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Michael, welcome, Thank you, happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
So Michael, founder, excuse me of the Mastery Mindset Library
is a psychology trained coach with over thirty years of
experience helping high achieving professionals overcome anxiety and depression without
relying on medication or years of traditional therapy. Drawing from
his background as a personal trainer, mental performance coach, and father,
Michael developed a unique belief based approach mental wellness that
(00:47):
empowers clients to create lasting change from the inside out. Today,
he's recognized as a leading voice in transforming mental health
to mindset, resilience and purpose. All right, as my voice goes,
just a little bit about you before we get going, Michael,
share with the listeners where you're from originally and where
you are currently.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Well. First off, thank you for having me.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
You've created an incredibly valuable space for those of us
who want to learn and grow from our trauma.
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Trauma.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
So I really appreciate you and employed you for that.
I am originally from New York, born and raised, born
in the Bronx, raised on Long Island, and I now
I'm speaking to you from my home in New Jersey.
I split time between New Jersey and Naples, Florida.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Awesome. Awesome. I'm born in New York as well.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Appreciate that. Yeah, I lived on Long Island.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Awesome. All right, So let's start. How the hell did
you get into this field? How did this start for you?
Speaker 3 (01:50):
Well, you know, I never set out to become a
mindset coach, let alone someone who helps people grow through
their trauma. My path start art in the fitness world
as a personal trainer, earning twelve bucks a session at
a small mom and pop studio, and that was in
nineteen ninety four, and within a year I became the
(02:13):
head trainer, and three years later I bought the business Wow,
And eventually I opened New York Personal Training in Manhattan,
which was my masterpiece.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
It was a fifth Avenue facility.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
I had forty five trainers, physical therapy, chiropolcitic and a
client roster that read like the who's who of Manhattan elite.
And from the outside, everything about me screamed success. But
inside I was still carrying trauma that I had never addressed.
(02:47):
And that inner work started after a devastating breakup where
I went through betrayal, heartbreak, and even losing my home.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
Well, let me pause you for a second. How old
are you with this we're talking about here?
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Now?
Speaker 3 (03:02):
I was forty at that time during that breakup, okay,
and so suddenly I'm a father trying to hold it
together for my kids, when while I'm falling apart inside
and it hit me that I had spent a life
building physical strength, but I didn't have the tools for
(03:25):
emotional recovery. And that's especially disorienting when your entire identity
is built on being the strong one. I was a
personal trainer, I was a competitive bodybuilder, a triathlete, a
multai fighter, and I was breaking down. And that moment
put me on a different path, not sets and reps,
(03:48):
but emotional clarity, structure, and reflection. And that's where the
real coaching started. And if I'm honest, the roots of
the work actually started much earlier, because I grew up
in a household where love.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
And trauma co existed.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
My parents absolutely loved us, but they had their own demons,
which meant I lived through domestic violence and psychological manipulation.
One minute life was normal, the next it exploded into chaos,
my dad's rage, my mom's control, and me stepping in
to protect my mom and sister. And that's where the
(04:31):
hero complex became part of my wiring. And then later
watching my daughter, who is a brilliant Ivy League at
the time, was a brilliant IVY League student struggling with
crippling anxiety during her college years, and that changed everything
for me. We'd spend entire days on FaceTime just to
(04:54):
get her out of bed, and it taught me how
to meet someone exactly where they are. It wasn't about
giving advice, it was about presence, and that lesson became
the foundation of how I coach today.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Let me just stop a second. First of all, I
want to thank you for sharing that. I mean, that's intense, Yeah,
I mean it's it's just to hear you sharing all
that is very intense, and it was very interesting to
hear you talk about your your business and yourself and
(05:36):
the external world of how you were kind of armoring
yourself and then go back to talk about your family
and that groundwork that.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Was laid there.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
I really appreciate you sharing that when you you just
talked about your daughter and kind of meeting her where
they're at. At what point were you when that was happening.
Was that after your own breakup?
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Yes, okay, that was probably ten years later, okay, ten
twelve years later?
Speaker 2 (06:10):
Yeah, okay?
Speaker 1 (06:12):
Was this shift and I realized not everything is just
happens in a second. But was this shift for you
from the external world in a sense, I'm being very
simplistic here to understanding that you needed to do some
inner work? Was Was that a hard for you? Was
that a challenge for you? Was just like Jesus, something
(06:35):
needs to be done? Talk about that?
Speaker 2 (06:38):
Yeah? You know it?
Speaker 3 (06:39):
Actually, you know, once once I worked through the initial
shock of losing the relationship I was in and the
reality of the betrayal in that relationship, and you know,
when you have a business and when you have children
(07:00):
and you don't have time to sit and lick your wounds,
you have to figure out what's next. But I've always
been a very introspective person, and I love to learn.
So it just became a new mission of why am
I here? How did I end up here? I had
(07:21):
seemingly done everything right? How do I end up here?
And coming from a background, especially a bodybuilding where you
learn how to make incremental gains, you know, you work
at something, you reach a limit, and then you make
and you use that experience to make a gain, I
(07:42):
kind of approached it the same way, and I said, well,
let me just as I did when I was a
beginner in the gym, starting from the very beginning. Let
me go back to the beginning and understand where I
come from, who I am, who I have been. And
that led to examining belief systems and where belief systems
(08:03):
come from, and does my belief am I stuck in
a belief system built from trauma? And do those beliefs
serve me now?
Speaker 1 (08:14):
And now did this involve like therapy traditional therapy?
Speaker 2 (08:19):
This was all me, This was all you, Okay.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
So what were your beliefs at that point?
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Well?
Speaker 3 (08:26):
So what I learned was that my beliefs were built
from that initial childhood trauma of living in a household
with domestic violence and having a hero complex right, and
and that belief system served me very well during my
childhood and even in my early adulthood in taking on
(08:50):
the responsibility of building a business and what have you.
But many of the beliefs in that belief system will
keeping me stuck there and putting out an energy that
kept bringing back the same type of result in a cycle,
which is what happens with belief systems and with trauma.
(09:12):
Until you go back and reconcile that trauma, you use
your adult eyes and you walk hand in hand with
your childhood self and you you look at you look
at the trauma and how you responded to it with mature, educated,
adult eyes, which is what I do when I walk
hand in hand with my clients and and we reconcile
(09:35):
with that drama. We tell our childho self, it's okay.
You know, it wasn't your fault. You did what you
had to do. But and we thank the beliefs that
got us to where we are. But if they're no
longer useful to us, we thank them with love when
we say goodbye.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
It's so it's so inspiring to talk to you, because
you know it's it's I learned a little bit about
you for this. I read your bio, read look at
your website, but it's so much interesting, more interesting to
hear you talk and walk through this process. I mean,
(10:13):
you've obviously been through a lot and done your own
inner work, and I find it very inspiring. So how
did what did you want to do with this new
what power that you had? In a sense, it's awareness
(10:35):
that you had.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Sure, So.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
There are many factors in that answer. What happened as
I went through my own rebirth reawakening is I started
a new relationship and I met my wife, who I've
been married to now for fifteen years. And it dawned
(10:59):
on me, you know, waking up one day that I
have the most incredible life now, Like I I my
life is filled with like laughter and joy and happiness
and and the self sacrifice and just rewarding and I
(11:20):
know how I got here. So I now want to
share this with other people and help them attain the
same thing. And so I repeat your question. So I
answered exactly.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
My question was what did I mean you you're talking
about you use the word rebirth. I said, there's obviously
a new awareness that you gained from all these different
experiences you had. What did you want to do with it?
What was that process? Obviously you started this new business.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Right right, so right, So what I wanted to do
was my definition of a true OUTFA is someone who's always.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Learning and always teaching.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
So that I went through this incredible journey and I
was able to really learn this process, I wanted to
share that with as many people as possible, so I
created the you know, my Mindset coaching business, which is twofold.
(12:23):
I work one on one with clients, and I then
also created this library where because I recognized that not
everybody can afford to work with a coach, which is
something I went through in my fitness and personal training
career as well. It's great, you know, and it's great
because as a business person, you work with very high level,
(12:46):
successful people, but there are many people there who need
your services as well but cannot afford it. So I
created this library where literally just about everybody could access
all of these lessons and go through it on their
at their own pace.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
No, just just to be clear here, so this library
is we are the video lessons.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
This is this is an online.
Speaker 3 (13:13):
An online collection of coaching lessons, hundreds and hundreds of
coaching lessons that I add to every day under every
possible topic from grief to mindset to goals to you
name it, emotional intelligence.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
Et cetera.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
Where for each each lesson, I give a video introduction
and then there's a downloadable lesson and that you you
work through on your own.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
Has has this change? I mean you obviously you're you're
you're you're describing a journey. You're describing a change from
some from one person who was you know, muay Thai
body building to someone else. Obviously there are different parts
of you, but I'm just it's a very interesting journey
(14:07):
you're talking about. Sure, do you sometimes look at yourself
and say, how the hell did I get here? Or
how did this other part of me? Where was it
all this time? It's just it's very interesting.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
You know, I really don't, because.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
I was very present in my evolution, so.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
I remember.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
How I was feeling and where I was at all
points in time. So it's not surprising to me. I
do go back and say and tell myself, I didn't
even know this level of love and joy and happiness existed.
Because we're so conditioned to set our sits on financial security,
(15:03):
material objects. Oh you know, as a kid growing up,
when we didn't have any money, I would sit on
a corner and I would look at all the cars
that would stop at a traffic light and be like, Oh,
I wish I could have that car. I'd be happy
with that Car'd be happy with that car. So you know,
you look at the house you want, and you look
at the car that you want. You think, if I
get those things, i am on the vacation I want.
(15:25):
That's happy. And I got those things, and then it
all blew up in my face. So I still have
those things now. But now no matter where I am,
no matter what I'm doing, no matter what car, it
doesn't matter. I have this internal satisfaction and my life
(15:48):
is so rewarding coming from everywhere because I'm living this
life where I know who I am. I've declared who
I am and you could see it. I wear it
around my neck.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
What is it I see I am?
Speaker 2 (16:02):
What is it so so I am?
Speaker 3 (16:06):
Is something that I teach that is called your I
Am declaration, So you it's it's a set of for me,
probably a dozen statements declaring to the world who I
am and which allow knowing that allows me to hone
in on my core values and live in alignment with
(16:30):
that I AM declaration and those core values.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
And if everything I.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
Do is in pursuit of those values and that declaration,
then then I'm living a life in alignment with my
true self and I can't be anything but happy.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
It's so easy to feel like we are living in alignment,
when in fact, oftentimes a lot of us aren't. A
lot of times, if someone was to ask, you know,
one what their beliefs are and like, oh, I guess
I believe in being healthy while I'm meeting my Krispy
(17:07):
Green Donuts.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
And do you know how many people I've asked what
their core values are and one of their core values
will be autonomy and entrepreneurship, and they're stuck in a
nine to five job they hate, or a corporate job
that they hate. And I'm like, well, you're not living
in alignment with your values. But I can't give.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
Up my job. It feeds my family, it feeds my
you know what I mean, It's who I am.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
But you're not ever going to be happy because you're
not living in alignment with your core values. It's I say.
I always use the airplane example. When you go on
an airplane and they're describing the safety to you. They
always tell you put your mask on first so you
can take care of whoever's next to you. You have
(17:53):
to take care of yourself first.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
You have to learn. You have to determine what those
values are. Those handful of values.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
Is it love, knowledge, empathy, security, humor? Those would be
mine easy.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
I know then I live in pursuit of.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
Them, and I can guarantee you anytime I'm feeling out
of sorts, something is not in alignment with that, I'm
acting out of integrity. It's called I'm not in integrity
or alignment with my values.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
It feels to me like a lot of our culture
here in America is built upon kind of the antithesis
of those values. A lot of we get caught up
in this, just like you were describing, you know, what
should I have, what should I be, when in fact,
(18:53):
many of us don't even know what our values are
or belief systems are. They've just come they've by osmosis,
we've adopted them.
Speaker 3 (19:04):
Well, I hate to sound like like like the old man,
but when you spend your your the majority of your
time scrolling on your feed looking at the highlight wheel
of other people's lives and comparing your everyday life to
their highlight reel and comparison is the thief of joy.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Ha ha. You know it.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
It's a destruction and it's a of of yourself and
it creates a false belief system or it or it
emboldens your false belief system or reaffirms it.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Who do you work with?
Speaker 3 (19:53):
So I work with? I mean there are segm There
are segments of people I work with. Anyone who feels stuck,
anyone who's usually tends to be a high performing person
but yet feels unfulfilled. And that comes in many shapes
(20:18):
and forms. It can come in the form of a
man in his forties who is successful in his career
but just cannot make his relationship work and is feeling
stuck there because he feels the responsibility for his family
(20:38):
and his children, but he's just not happy and he
cannot or a woman in a similar situation, or as
I mentioned before, somebody who is in their corporate job
and just is always feeling out of place and feeling
like they're pressing their nose against the window of life
because they actually have an entrepreneurial spirit and want to
(21:01):
be doing something else on their own. It's it all
always leads back to the same place of have you
addressed your trauma? What are your belief systems? We need
we need to examine those belief systems so we can
come out at the end of the day with a
group of beliefs that do serve you. So you can
declare to the world who I am, and you can
(21:25):
tell me with absolute certainty what your values are, and
then we can work on Well, that's simple. This you want,
you are, this, you value that. We're going to take
these steps so you can those two can be in
alignment and you will be happy and everyone around you
(21:45):
will be happier because you are serving them better because
you're you've served yourself.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
That's that sounds very easy to do. It's not easy
to do. I mean, it sounds very clear or you
just said, but I could just imagine. I know, it's
not easy to do.
Speaker 2 (22:04):
It's not easy.
Speaker 3 (22:06):
It's like anything else, you know what, Getting on stage
in a banana hammock and posing it in front of
thousands of people as a bodybuilder isn't an easy thing
to do either, right, Okay?
Speaker 2 (22:16):
And if you are someone who.
Speaker 3 (22:21):
Does not have a bodybuilder build, but you decide you
want to do that, that's a huge undertaking. That's a
multi year undertaking of weight training, conditioning, dieting.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
You know.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
So if you look at it, that's an impossible road.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
I can't do that.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
But if you determined that that is your path and
you take the first step, like I told you earlier,
it's just a progression. You're just constantly building on your
on your previous little tiny success, whatever that may be,
And every single journey is the same way.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
You need the.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
Tools that allow you to take the first step and
to recognize your success in that step and build on it.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
And listen.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
I'm going to keep with the bodybuilding example just because
it's simple, but we could apply it to anything. The
pinnacle of being a bodybuilder would be winning Mister Universe.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
I graduated high school. I was one hundred and twenty pounds.
I was never going to be mister Universe.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Okay, but.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
I did land somewhere between one hundred and twenty pounds
in Mister Universe. I did compete on stage. I did
realize this incredible goal of literally rechanging my reforming my
physical self, which was what gave me the confidence to
reform my psychological self. It was the same journey, just
(23:58):
a different goal. And every journey is like that. You know,
they say shoot for the stars. If you land on
the moon, you know you still travel twenty something thousand
miles or however many miles that is, And it's a
lot better than standing in the same place you wear
on the ground.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
What do you think, Michael, gives you the I mean,
I can hear it for me. I think I know
the answer, but I want to hear you articulated. What
do you think gives you the ability to do this work.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
To do the work of coaching. Well, it's my lift experience. Okay,
I didn't learn this through textbooks. I learned all of
this through lift experience, through breaking down, rebuilding and learning
how to truly meet people where they are and help
them move forward.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
How did you learn that, because that's not an easy
thing to do, even for trained therapists.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Well, you know, you don't come right out of the
box now and everything. There's a lot of trial and error,
and so you know how most coaches or therapists they jump,
They jumped straight into solving the problem. Okay, they've got
the blueprint, they have the system, they have the five
(25:23):
step strategy, and they assume if you just follow the formula,
everything will fall into place. Well, what I do is
I start by learning who you are before we ever
talk about where you're going. And that I learned from
making mistakes in my earlier in my career. You know,
(25:47):
I would make the mistake of assuming that the tools
were enough, whether it was fitness, mindset, or performance. I
had the science, I had the structure, but I didn't
yet have the sensitivity, and so I wasn't asking what
brought you here? What beliefs are shaping your behavior? What
pain are you still trying to protect yourself from? So
(26:10):
I was offering strategy without understanding, which is structure without safety.
And when someone has unresolved trauma that that doesn't create change,
it creates resistance. So now my coaching starts with curiosity,
not certainty. I don't assume your readiness or resilience. I
(26:33):
learned your emotional landscape first, so we can build something
that not only creates a better future, but it gently
repairs your past. And that shift, didn't you know, It
made me a better coach, but it also made me
a more present, grounded and compassionate human being.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
Well, I love that I could imagine that people come
to you with this idea of you know, they want
to get motivated, and they want to get inspired, and
and at some point they're like, what I got to
do with my trauma?
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Yeah? True, And.
Speaker 3 (27:19):
I'm not I'm not here to motivate, Okay. I'm here
to connect you. I'm here to take a journey with you.
I'm here to meet you where. I'm here to meet
you where you are, learn where you want to be,
revisit where you've been, and and and rebuild. I'm not
here to be a cheerleader.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
Michael. What's the best way for people to learn more
about what you're doing?
Speaker 3 (27:49):
Well, you can always go to go to my website,
Michael shawmindset dot com. But you can also I also
visit my visit my instagram. But you know, I wanna
(28:10):
tell people that I anyone who's listening. If if you
feel like you've hit your breaking point, just know this,
You're not broken.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
You're carrying.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
You're just carrying more than your system was designed to
carry alone. And strength doesn't come from pretending. It comes
from being witnessed, supported and challenged with love. And that's
what I do, not as a therapist, but as a
guide to revisit what you ask me before, and someone
(28:43):
some just someone who sees you, honors where you've been,
and walks besides you as you bi as you build
who you're becoming. And if this resonates, if you're feeling stuck,
if you're feeling overwhelmed, or you're just ready for more
purpose and clarity, then and the coaching that I've developed
was built for you.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
So if you want to find out.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
More about me or how to work with me, I
have created something as a thank you for listening and
guide to you for creating the space and sharing.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
It with the world.
Speaker 3 (29:18):
I have two very powerful tools that I usually reserve
for my private clients that I want to give to everybody.
And first is a free Mindset Mastery Breakthrough session, which
is sixty minute deep dive with me where we uncover
what's holding you back and we create a plan to
(29:40):
move you forward with confidence. And the second is I
want to give you twenty percent off of a full year,
full year's access to the Mastery Mindset training library. And
as I said, it's constantly updated resource. It's packed with
practical and empowering workshops that you can you and set
(30:00):
your own pace and to claim both either or both.
Just DM me the word mastery and okay, m A
S T e r y Mastery at my Instagram which
is at Michael Shaw dot mindset m I C h
a E L s h A W dot m I
N D s E T so go to Michael Shore mindset,
(30:21):
send the word mastery and I'll personally send everything over
to you.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Awesome. I appreciate that, Michael. We'll have that all that
linked up here at the show notes page at the
Trauma Therapist podcast dot com. Uh, Michael, I know you
say you don't want to motivate, but you're certainly freakin
inspiring and you're welcome back here anytime.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Ed Oh, I thank you so much. The spaceship created
is amazing. I love talking to you.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
All right, we'll be in touch
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Okay, thank you, take care, bye bye
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