Trombone Timo tells us what a TikTok is

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In his first podcast interview, Trombone Timo aka Tim Maines as we've always known him hangs with Nick and Sebastian and describes his crazy world of trombone in social media.

We talk about how he went about building his prodigious following, his goals with his platform (you might be surprised), the power social media can have to galvanize arts organizations and how underutilized it still is!

We talk about his summers at the Trombone Retreat getting lost and causing a stir with small businesses and how we're not shocked he's doing what he's doing. 

Limited edition first batch JSV Signature Mouthpieces by Verus are now available for pre-order at Houghton Horns! Use limited time pre-sale offer code JSVPRESALE for 10% off at checkout! 

Also introducing special features with Patreon: www.patreon.com/tromboneretreat

Learn more about the Trombone Retreat and upcoming festival here: linktr.ee/tromboneretreat

Hosted by Sebastian Vera - @js.vera (insta) and Nick Schwartz - @basstrombone444 (insta)

Produced and edited by Sebastian Vera

Music: Firehorse: Mvt 1 - Trot by Steven Verhelst performed live by Brian Santero, Sebastian Vera and Nick Schwartz

Thank you to our season sponsor Houghton Horns: www.houghtonhorns.com

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's insane.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
Oh, listen to that deep voice.
Oh look, at me.

Speaker 1 (00:04):
I have a fancy little thing in the background.
What's it say on?

Speaker 3 (00:09):
Oh no, it's actually inverted.
So it says go practice which,speaking of which, did you
practice today, or hey, I?

Speaker 1 (00:17):
woke up 30 minutes ago.

Speaker 3 (00:18):
We're asking the question here, tim, sorry, I'll
never do that again.

Speaker 2 (00:23):
Yeah, you had to do that in the beginning.
I actually I love those memes.
I send them anytime.
I see those things pop up onsocial media.
I just send them to my students.
I don't care if it's 7 am.
Hey, nick.
Yeah, I just want to say I'msorry about your Detroit Lions.
Moving on, hello darkness, myold friend, moving on the pain

(00:45):
of expectations and being takenaway.
It's, it's, it's terrible.
They should be proud of theirseason.

Speaker 1 (00:52):
Ah yeah, life goes on .

Speaker 2 (00:55):
But also what the hell was your coach doing?

Speaker 1 (00:57):
You keep Dan Campbell's name out of your
mouth.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
Former Cowboy Dan Campbell hey Tim, I don't know
if you knew this is a footballpodcast, so are you prepared for
all your hot takes?

Speaker 3 (01:06):
Well, I was about to say that the UT Longhorns had a
great season.
We also had an unfortunate lastgame.
We lost at the very last secondbut we should have won, but
maybe next year it's been.
They haven't been good myentire undergrad or even my
masters until this year, so wewent through about three coaches
.
I feel your pain, nick.

(01:27):
I feel it.

Speaker 1 (01:28):
Let out your feeling I don't remember asking about
the Longhorns.

Speaker 3 (01:31):
Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:32):
I didn't ask about the Lions either.
We're talking aboutprofessional football, oh wow.
No that I watched that game.
Go yell Bulldogs.
Oh, is that the Bulldog Is?

Speaker 3 (01:42):
that what they are.
No one even talks about theBulldogs at the school music.
They might as well not exist.
You're not in the Yale marchingband.
Oh, I wish sometimes YaleSchool Music student will get to
play in the marching band, butthey never hit me up and I have
marching experience.
So there is an actual marchingband there is, and they have a

(02:04):
conductor with a batonconducting everyone, which is
very.
The Harvard versus Yale game isvery interesting to watch
because they both directors,have a baton, like it's
classical music, which.

Speaker 1 (02:19):
I find fascinating.
Does the Yale marching bandtake it seriously, or are they
like the Stanford marching band?

Speaker 3 (02:25):
I think they take it seriously.

Speaker 1 (02:27):
The Stanford marching band.
I mean they have people playingon sinks and stuff like that,
like literally.

Speaker 3 (02:32):
Oh yeah that we didn't.
I didn't see anything at thatlevel.
I was tempted to jump in when Ivisited way back in the day,
but then I didn't, and I thinkit was good that I didn't, but I
think anything for views.
I think the views would havebeen there for sure.
It would have sustained mylivelihood that much more.

Speaker 1 (02:51):
All right.

Speaker 3 (02:53):
So there's our intro marching band podcast.
Yes, sir.

Speaker 2 (02:56):
Football marching band you covered all.
It is the fifth position, whereall your dreams come true.
That's my new tagline.
You like that, nick?

Speaker 1 (03:12):
I do like it.

Speaker 2 (03:13):
Well, hello, timothy J Maines.
Your Timothy J Maines in myphone for some reason.
Is that your your middle name?

Speaker 3 (03:19):
The second oh, the second, but J A Y A, many, many
is J Like the name J.
Yeah, like.

Speaker 2 (03:27):
Blue J oh wow, that is how you tell the ladies.

Speaker 3 (03:32):
Well, I don't think that really helps when you have
a trombone in your hand.
But yeah, I guess I sometimesdo that.

Speaker 2 (03:41):
You just like as quickly as possible, like subtly
, show them how many followersyou have and act like you're not
trying.

Speaker 3 (03:50):
Surprisingly enough, that tends to scare people more
than it impresses them,especially because it's like
trombone and they don'tunderstand trombone and it's I
usually actually like back in aday.
I have a girlfriend now, butback in a day I would like I
would bring it up and then allof a sudden I'll stop hearing
from them like interesting, orthey'll be like oh, they'll be

(04:12):
like that's interesting and yeahwell, imagine it from their
perspective.

Speaker 1 (04:17):
10 seconds before you showed them how many followers
you had, they were saying, oh,that's the one that goes like
this with your arm, and so theyhave just solidified.
Ok, I remember what a tromboneis.
And then they see you have abunch of followers and like what
the hell, there's that manytrombone players out there.

Speaker 3 (04:34):
Yeah, and then, like with all the media, that Twitch
streamers and other usually theworst content creators tend to
trend on the news as well.
So there's that stigma, likeusually I have friends who would
introduce me as some kind ofinfluencer, which I hate, by the
way especially if they say somekind of influencer right.

(04:54):
No, well, they say like tromboneinfluencer, which is hilarious,
but also like even worse, andyeah, it's everything.
I will literally get reactionsbeing like oh, I'm like scared
of people like you.
Wow, what do you do?
Can I see your content?
Should I be scared?
But usually it raises a redflag.
Why do you think it scarespeople?
Well, the news they see ofother people doing just not okay

(05:18):
things, the you'll I don't wantto like name names out there in
the social media universe, butthere's plenty of people who
will start trending, even onmainstream news, like I remember
there was a Twitch event at NewYork and they literally
disrupted tens of thousands ofpeople.

Speaker 1 (05:37):
Yeah, that person got arrested Exactly, I think, put
it, I think he's in jail now Ihave no idea.

Speaker 3 (05:43):
I haven't followed up .

Speaker 1 (05:44):
Well, he was saying was he was going to give away a
PS5 or an Xbox one or somethinglike that.
Right, that what it was.
And it was down in Union Squareand there was like thousands
upon thousands of dollars worthof damage to buildings and cars
and stuff like that.
Because all these people showedup and then, yeah, he basically
got charged with inciting likea mob and then, because of all

(06:07):
the damage, that that alone Ithink is like a misdemeanor.
But if it gets carried to acertain extent, where it like
stops traffic and it causesactual like financial damage,
then it becomes like a felonyand that's what happened to him.

Speaker 3 (06:22):
Yeah, and never mind.
Like all the business, allthese businesses, like lost
during, like the stuff you can'tmeasure, as like damage which
really sucked and so that's.
But that's the stuff that peoplewho aren't familiar with social
media see in corporate news orjust like wherever they get

(06:44):
their news from, they usuallyjust see like the most iconic
negative moments.
So I think that's in people'shead, but also I think, you know
, there's like the personalitytrait as well as what's up, guys
, it's trombone, t-mobile andsubscribe like people like
associate, and I think what I'mdoing is not necessarily that,
but a lot of people associatebeing a YouTuber as that.

Speaker 1 (07:09):
So there's that to think about Back up about 15
seconds.
It's trombone, timo.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:14):
It's German, did you think it was?

Speaker 1 (07:17):
Timo, excuse me, I thought blue and the red, white
and blue.

Speaker 3 (07:21):
Wow, okay, cool.
Well, I went with somethinginternational, because Tim is
actually cannot be pronounced incertain countries, really,
actually.
Yeah, I know, in Japan, when Iwas at Pacific Music Festival,
there's people who literallyjust called me Timo, because
there's no Tim, they'll go liketeam yeah.
Like team.
But I even study a littleJapanese and there's nothing

(07:42):
that ends with an M like that,like Tim, when they do the U,
yeah Right.
So, oh, my God, I had a funtime.

Speaker 2 (07:52):
I had no idea you were such a man of the people.

Speaker 3 (07:55):
Oh well, that's what I strive to be.
In fact, I studied for twoyears because I was supposed to
go again and then the pandemichappened, so they pushed back a
year, and I'm like this is theperfect opportunity to learn a
little bit and go back.
And because the people inSapporo and Hokkaido were like
so kind, this is great, yeah, itwas just on.

(08:18):
It was like out of this earthreally, and so, yeah, I learned
the language for two years andthen PMF canceled again in 2021,
just because it was like moreof a cultural thing too, whereas
other festivals were able toopen up for them.
It was like a very strict, likewe cannot, yeah, you have like
foreigners into our country.

Speaker 1 (08:38):
I was supposed to go to Japan that summer too.

Speaker 3 (08:41):
Yeah, and I was actually like there was ITF and
Osaka Right, and I like finaledin two of those competitions and
I'm like let's go.

Speaker 2 (08:50):
Humble breath.

Speaker 3 (08:51):
Free flight and Osaka rocks too.
I'm like, are you kidding?
I would have just gotten a freeflight to Osaka and then just
fly to Sapporo, and then none ofthat happened.
And I'm really sad, but it'sokay because you want to talk
about it, you want?
To.

Speaker 1 (09:05):
Oh, no, I'm good Welcome to the Pandemic Fallout
podcast.
All of our hopes and dreams gotlost, one by one, from 2020 to
2022.

Speaker 2 (09:17):
Hey, that was this podcast, heyday.
That's where we really foundour stride.

Speaker 3 (09:21):
That's when I submitted the review on the
third.
I got featured on the thirdpodcast.
I'll never forget, Is that true?

Speaker 2 (09:28):
Oh right, you like Marshall Gilks?
You don't order again in oh my,you don't order again in.

Speaker 1 (09:34):
This is what he says.
You don't order again in tonic.
You order again in tonic.

Speaker 2 (09:38):
I'm trying to remember what your quote was.
Let me find it.
I remember you write I gotlocked and loaded.
It's called Google.
It's a passion.
It's asking today what thehell's going on.

Speaker 3 (09:51):
You just may find my pronunciation Well.
You know what?

Speaker 2 (09:54):
After getting mine wrong, by the way.
Pronunciation that's all youjust said.
Did you just pronounce?

Speaker 1 (09:58):
pronunciation incorrectly.
Okay, by the way, in Asia I'malso.
I have the same problem withyou, Tim.
Nick, it's Nick and sometimesit's Niku.

Speaker 3 (10:09):
Wait, which one are you?
That sounds even moreinteresting than Nick, to be
honest.
I would like that if I were you.

Speaker 2 (10:17):
Did you use like a fake name, right?

Speaker 3 (10:20):
Sure, possibly.
I think this was on Applepodcasts.
I think I was trying to besubtle and then put, like some
shark, fins on there.

Speaker 2 (10:28):
Did you?
Oh, was the subject of yourcomment.
Brian Santaro wrote this.
What does the review say?
Mr Shorts is one handsome dude.
His ingenious sense of humorcompliments Sa Bastion KSMR
level commentary perfectly.

Speaker 3 (10:46):
Yeah, that sounds about right.

Speaker 2 (10:47):
Yes, saris, this podcast sure makes you feel warm
and fuzzy on the inside.
Quick quest what fundamental?
Oh, you asked a question.
It was actually a seriousquestion.
Yeah, sending healthy vibesyour way.
It looks like you couldn't finda shark so you did a dolphin in
eyes.

Speaker 3 (11:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (11:08):
Yeah, appreciate that , five stars, appreciate it, wow
yeah that was right in themiddle of the pandemic.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (11:15):
The only dolphin in our group is Paul Pollard.
Oh, he is.

Speaker 3 (11:20):
Oh, and what reason.
Clean shaven.

Speaker 1 (11:23):
Well, he has.
No, it's moving on.
He swims like a dolphin.
Yes, there we go.
That's definitely the reason,and it's not something else.

Speaker 2 (11:35):
Wow, that's great podcasting Nick.

Speaker 1 (11:39):
Some things you keep in your private life.
John Sebastian Vera.

Speaker 2 (11:44):
Tim, you are in the family.
You are a trombone retreatalumnus.
How?
Many Did you go twice in person?
Yeah, and then I think you wereon the online retreat as well.

Speaker 3 (11:56):
Yeah, it's like 2017, 2019 and a summer retreat thing
, man.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:04):
I remember you sparring with Coetro on the
Creston or something on the livestream.
You're just enjoying it.
You're like, how well can Iplay this?

Speaker 3 (12:13):
Well, the Haie Flas did come out, so that was a
victory.
We're not going to talk aboutanything else.

Speaker 2 (12:19):
No, you sounded great .
And he was like oh man, I gotto really demonstrate.
Now I know it sounded reallygood.

Speaker 3 (12:26):
Oh, thank you.

Speaker 2 (12:27):
No, but we've known you a long time and once we
started seeing the stuff you'recreating, part of us was, like
I'd say, a little surprised, butalso not, because we knew your
personality the whole time andhow.
Just everything at the retreatwas an adventure with you.
So we just never knew whatwould happen.
We ran into you at Yale and wetalked about you, left a random

(12:51):
review in this little small townrestaurant and they got really
mad.

Speaker 3 (12:55):
Yeah well, the waitress was being a little
sassy with me and I thought theytotally deserve a two star
review.
Little did I know at the timethat when the boss of the store
sees that two star review, it'sthat employee that's going to
get the flack for it.
And so that was.
Did you name the employee?
I thought very possible, butthis was sophomore year in

(13:19):
undergrad, it was probably likea 16 year old girl like working
a summer job.

Speaker 1 (13:24):
Yeah, how does it feel that you probably made a 16
year old cry and almost alittle drunk?
Okay, she was definitely not 16.
I'm telling you, a lot of thosepeople working there are in
that high school 16 to 18 yearold range.
Oh dear.

Speaker 3 (13:39):
Well, I fixed the situation.
I took the review down and or Ichanged it to a five star
review and then it was latertaken down by the boss, and that
was right after I got lost.
After my audition I heard aboutthis.

Speaker 2 (13:52):
We'll fix it right now.
Dog and Suds in Montague,michigan, is a national treasure
.
We'll just say that that's ourfavorite places.
Was apparently Well they openedup another one, didn't they?

Speaker 1 (14:06):
They opened up like a food truck slash, like a little
brick and mortar.
They don't have as much on themenu but they have the hits.
Tim put them out of business.
Food Coney Dog is any time ofday, any meal.
They like Coney's.

Speaker 2 (14:19):
Michigan.
And yeah, and then you.
Sorry, then you got lost.
I just found you.
You just started walking aroundthe neighborhood after
something.

Speaker 3 (14:30):
Yeah.
So like I completely whiffedthe first few notes of Tuba
Mirum, which were like the veryfirst notes of the mock audition
y'all have, and after thatmoment I just was like I just
couldn't handle that level offailure, so I just immediately
stormed off.
After my audition I justsomehow knew I wasn't advancing

(14:53):
to the next round and I stormedoff and I just headed in a
random direction and I go tolook at my phone and this is
where I messed up.
My phone was completely dead soI had no opportunity to figure
out where I was, and the roadsat Montague are like miles long
without any other like turns,mind you.

(15:14):
So like I spent probably twohours and I even visited a local
middle school to ask a parentlike where the heck?
I was Not suspicious at all.
I'm just glad I look reallyyoung and like maybe a little
bit innocent, like aesthetically, because like I think, little
did they know who I become.

(15:35):
But at the same time, likesomeone was very graciously
helping me, they're like yeah,you look a little lost.
I'm like I am lost.

Speaker 2 (15:43):
And by the time I got back, I'm more waiting for one.

Speaker 3 (15:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (15:46):
I'm attending a Tramone retreat at a church I
don't know the name of, so whenI was playing the Mozart Requiem
.

Speaker 2 (15:52):
The response wasn't as good as I wanted it.

Speaker 1 (15:55):
I lowered my thirds too much.

Speaker 3 (15:58):
It was literally that I'm like back when my world was
just to a Miram and, yeah, bythe time I got back, none of
y'all were there and there wasno one there.

Speaker 2 (16:09):
You went to another dimension.

Speaker 3 (16:12):
I'm like asking someone for a charger and by
that time, like I eventuallylike made it to where you all
were.
I think there was a hang.

Speaker 1 (16:19):
I went to a brewery and that's a solid guess that
shows how on top of it we were.

Speaker 2 (16:24):
We were just like missing a student.
We're just like going on to thebar.

Speaker 3 (16:27):
You guys weren't even that surprised to see me when I
came.
I came and you're like, ohyou're here.
Like where were you?
As if I didn't spend the pastfive hours completely lost.
And there was an entire mockaudition that took place and I
didn't even know if I advanced.
So I was like that would beembarrassing if I advanced.

Speaker 2 (16:44):
Yeah, that would have been awesome.

Speaker 1 (16:46):
Well, that would teach you not to walk away.

Speaker 3 (16:49):
Right, and I never did.

Speaker 1 (16:52):
I had an audition in Helsinki While I was sure I
wasn't in advance and I walkedaway and the proctor came
running after me down the streetand was like where are you
going?
And I was like no way Iadvanced.
That was terrible.
And they were like you didadvance, you're in the finals.
And I was like what?
So I came back and took off mycoat and unpacked my trombone.

(17:12):
You're like five beers in.
I was on my way to the bar.
Luckily they caught me justbefore.

Speaker 3 (17:19):
That could help.
Maybe I haven't tried it, butit wouldn't.

Speaker 1 (17:23):
Well, I think it's a point of diminishing returns.
I was going to say it wouldn'thurt, but there's definitely a
point when it would hurt.

Speaker 3 (17:30):
We do not condone drinking before auditions, but
but I am curious.
Please let us know, Tim I thinkI'm going to frame this.

Speaker 2 (17:41):
I guess you found your host family's Facebook or
something and you used him tomessage us when you were lost,
like Larry Lundquist, and so I'mjust going to frame this Hi,
it's Tim, can someone pick me upfrom the church?
I got lost.
We didn't see it for a fewmonths.
Yeah, I'm feeling helpful.

Speaker 3 (17:59):
I forgot about that.
I don't know if you can read it.
Oh my gosh, oh my god.
I must have been so defeated inthat moment.
I still feel defeated, reallyWell from that moment From that
one mock audition.

Speaker 2 (18:12):
That meant nothing.

Speaker 3 (18:14):
Well, yeah, not like I don't want to carry it with me
, but just bring it up again,like it brings out those
defeated feelings.

Speaker 2 (18:20):
But that's why we do it right.
I mean, it's to make it feellike a real experience as
possible as we can, and you cantotally mess up and fall on your
face and it does not matter atall.

Speaker 3 (18:33):
Yeah, and the next time I took it I advanced the
next round and yeah, it was likesolid improvement.
I didn't win.
I didn't storm out and get losteither.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
Yes, what would have been really good is if you, in
the second round of theauditions, you stood up and said
play this in reverse and tellme if you can recognize it too.

Speaker 3 (18:55):
I, oh my god, that trend.
Honestly, it frustrates me howwell that does.
But you go to TMEA and then youdo that once and then all of a
sudden you have 15 million viewson it and you're like OK, cool,
Thanks, YouTube.

Speaker 2 (19:12):
Can we start some sort of riot at TMEA and get you
in trouble?
Get the news involved.

Speaker 3 (19:18):
I sort of did that last time.
Actually, I recruited like 50trombone players to blast a
theme in.
As I later found out, the quietsection Ooh.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
There's a quiet section.

Speaker 3 (19:30):
Yeah, I didn't know, and everyone's anymore.
I'm trying to sell stuff and Ican't hear my own voice.
Right now I'm like, trust me,this is for a fundraiser for the
fine arts and I still have toman.
That video is supposed to comeout, but I had a video editor
that kind of just sat on theirhands and promised me they would
get it done and it never gotdone.

(19:51):
So I'm struggling to now getthat done before the next one in
a couple of weeks.

Speaker 2 (19:57):
Tim is accepting applications for video editing.

Speaker 3 (20:00):
Like genuinely, though, just all I need is a
video editor that can justexecute the job without me
having to babysit them and belike wait a minute.
This is actually the bareminimum level of work you did.
Let's take it to the next level, and then I'm writing PDF
paragraphs and essays.

Speaker 1 (20:19):
I'm like I'm going to break this down for you, timo.
Those people exist.
They're going to cost a lot ofmoney.

Speaker 3 (20:27):
Yeah, well, the cool thing is I recently got into the
business of hiring my friendsto make content.
So when you see friends with menow, I used to not pay them
because it didn't make sensefinancially.
But now I'm at the point whereTikTok has a new monetization
program and YouTube isincreasing the amount of money
they pay creators through adrevenue.

(20:48):
That I found out I did thisthrough my time at Norfolk.
If I just hire four or fivemusicians and we just make a
piece of content, I'll actuallycome out in the green from my
investment and I'll have abusiness expense that I can
write off later.
So I've just been starting todo that a little bit, even just
on a very simple level, not highproduction, but just something

(21:11):
that's just fun and it gets themusicians paid, I get paid and
we also have a great time.

Speaker 2 (21:17):
Yeah, you're working with your friends, there's
nothing better and that'sawesome, because you just never
know, yeah, it can be awesomeworking with your friends, but
if you don't actually pay them,then because they know you, they
can be like oh, I'll just do itwhenever or I'll get to it.
And if you actually have, hey,I value you, you value me and I

(21:40):
trust you and I trust youunderstand like the vision I'm
going for.
Like that's the thing editingthese podcasts.
Like I've had to learn how todo that and I'm not at the point
where I fully trust someone tounderstand what we want and the
way I want it to be edited.
I know that's partly my fault,but like Same, I have to let

(22:00):
someone do it.
They really have to.
It's not just there's surethere's a million people that
are capable and understand howto do it, but do they understand
what you're going for?
And I don't have to babysitthem and they're not annoyed if
I have detailed notes orsomething.

Speaker 3 (22:14):
The worst is when, like, they charge hourly and
then they get rewarded for notdoing the best job.
I spent like almost half athousand dollars and I'm like
you got rewarded for me doingthat, but I agreed to the terms.
I had to put my foot in mymouth.

Speaker 2 (22:32):
Did you edit when you first started doing it?

Speaker 3 (22:36):
Well, yeah, I edit like 90% of the content at this
point still, and I'm stilllooking.
I'm not like actively looking,but I'm so open to somebody
helping me out.
It just has to make sense andthey have to be somebody who's
on the same wavelengths, and Ithink that's really hard to find
, especially in the likepodcasts, youtube ecosystem.

(22:58):
Is this like a very specificlike how do you clip something
from a podcast and like it'sactually interesting and it
looks good too, and then you canget an organic reach through
that?
Yeah, it's hard.
Yeah, maybe you'll get a millionemails from this now, or maybe
I, you know, I want to put itpast this podcast.
This is my first real podcast,which is super exciting.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
This is no kidding.
That surprises me.

Speaker 3 (23:27):
Yeah, I haven't been asked much.
We'll have you back.
Maybe they're all afraid of you.

Speaker 2 (23:30):
They're all afraid.

Speaker 3 (23:33):
I do get that impression or either afraid or
speculative.
What do you mean speculative?
I feel like Tyson was like whatI said before, what I'm doing
is very like not the normalthing to do and, as a result, it
can either get straight to yourhead or you can let it
influence you or make you beacting certain ways, and I think

(23:55):
that can cause some people tobe like who is this guy?
Who is he actually?
I don't know if I trust him.
That's something that I'm notsure I trust him.
That's something that I hope tobuild.
I hope to build trust as timegoes on.
What's my platform and whatnot.

Speaker 2 (24:12):
Well, I mean, I imagine it can go the other way
too.
When you have a following,there's probably a lot of people
that want to take advantage ofthat too, like in the opposite
way and come at you fordisingenuous reasons.

Speaker 3 (24:28):
Yeah, luckily I didn't have to deal with that
too much with my friends.
So it does change how peoplebehave around you sometimes and
I do notice that peopledefinitely and I noticed this
was other people who are doingthe same thing I'm doing in this

(24:48):
music sphere People payattention a lot and they
definitely analyze you in thebackground.

Speaker 2 (24:54):
But you have to let that go right Because you're so
public.

Speaker 3 (24:57):
At this point, yeah, you gotta let it go.
But I do notice, do people comeup to you?
Yeah, are they coming up to youand being nice to you just
because you have this platform,or it's because they want to
collaborate, and if they feellike they don't get everything
they want from you, are theygoing to retaliate against you
or something.
There's only that doesn'thappen really ever that often,

(25:19):
but it has happened once where Iwas just like, oh my gosh, that
was scary, that's moving, yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
And are there, like, are there hate comments that you
see every now and then there'salways people that say dumb shit
, right.

Speaker 3 (25:31):
Yeah Well, so most of the comments and I'm really
grateful for this are reallypositive and even if I don't
feel the best about the playing,the comments tend to be really
positive and it's just.
It's less about the playing andmore about just the feeling you
get, just consuming the pieceof content and however it's
presented to you.
There are always some hatecomments, although I think

(25:55):
that's just a sign that you'redoing well, to be honest, first
off.
But the hate comments there'sbeen a couple times and I won't
name names, but not even on mycontent, but there's been some
pretty famous musicians, atleast famous in, like, their
performance fields, will commentsomething negative and you're
like, oh, what, like, why areyou like this and this?
Hey, people who?

Speaker 1 (26:15):
do that.
Can you stop doing that?
It just doesn't help anybody.

Speaker 3 (26:20):
Well, I guess my main point is I would we all just
treat each other like morekindly and at least, even if you
have something to say, maybeyou can be like hey, like, maybe
that's not how you do it, butlike here, let me show you how
it's done and then you can doanother video collab or
something.
So I noticed that was anotherperson's profile, like some jazz
musician that commented ontheir video, and then I was like

(26:42):
I responded to it, being likeman, you should like collab with
us and teach us how it's done,because I just think that this
whole hemisphere of classicalmusic performance, jazz
performance it's still reallysecluded from like mainstream
media and I think we got to bedoing everything we can to like
break down those barriers.
Personally, and I really, withmy platform, I really hope to

(27:06):
connect the mainstream world andget them to just at least pay
attention to what we do, becausewe put so many hours and so
much effort behind our craft andsometimes we create these
videos, we create this contentto just like a very small
community of people and I wisheveryone can just have more
people interested in whatthey're doing.

Speaker 1 (27:27):
Well, that's a difficult task because for
multiple reasons the two areseparated, not only in the
people making the content slashmusic but the people who digest
in that that the two differentkind of realms that you just
broke down are different.

(27:47):
But not to say it's impossible,but the Venn diagram overlap is
small, as you said.

Speaker 2 (27:54):
Yeah, and those people saying things.
You have to know that says waymore about them than you when
they're making comments.
But it's the state ofeverything that, how people will
talk to each other when they'renot looking at them in the face
.
But one thing and you weretalking about it earlier that
made me think about this, whenyou were just being open about
how your mock audition didn't gowell so many classical

(28:16):
musicians were so obsessed withperfection, and that's our job
and that's how we get employed.
We're constantly comparingourselves to others and trying
to be the best version ofsomething, playing the same
excerpts, and it's a recipe formisery in a lot of ways.
And on social media, a lot ofclassical musicians are afraid
to do anything because you can'tnot be perfect all the time and

(28:38):
there's constantly peoplejudging you and you'll just
straight up post like youmessing up in a concert.

Speaker 3 (28:45):
Yeah, forget to take my mute out.
Oops, yeah, should have donethat?

Speaker 1 (28:50):
Was it you that did one where you stole your
colleagues mute?
Yeah, moller tube rehearsal,that's a classic one.
That's one of my favorite moves.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
What makes you feel, in a way, I feel like people
connect more to you when you'rewilling to show that you're.
Because I'll say that thisyou're a very talented trombone
player.
I know there's a lot of peoplethat just know you from some
goofy videos, but you're a verygood trombonist.
You've gotten to the treat veryeasily.
You've done very well.
Everyone that I've known that'splayed with you has been very
impressed.

(29:22):
But at the same time thatyou're like hey, like I screw up
.

Speaker 3 (29:25):
Oh, well, thank you so much.
I feel like I always I'm doingsomething to screw myself over
just by accident sometimes.
But I think having thatvulnerability out on the open
and just saying it's okay, it'sreally powerful for people and
also realizes like people alsorealize that, hey, this is like

(29:46):
something we're supposed to bepassionate about and we're
supposed to enjoy while making.
And I honestly found thatthroughout my own process of
posting that I'm realizing moreand more is, oh, like I can have
my own voice and relax a littlebit and just play like I want
to and play like myself.
And I found that throughtrusting that decision to do

(30:08):
that, I sound better and I soundmore like myself and I sound
less like I'm trying to besomebody else.
So I think, yeah, the perfectionthing is it's really there's so
many.
I know my girlfriend goes toNew World and they talk about
social media and everyone'ssuper afraid and or they don't

(30:30):
know how to get into it too.
And I don't think you need tobe big on social media to
support your own career and tostart getting students, to start
giving yourself the tools to beyour own self employed musician
in the 21st century, which Ifind can be a little tricky to
do if you're not networking withthe right people or if you're

(30:53):
not in not even like close tothat network.

Speaker 1 (30:55):
Realistically, sebastian and I are not that
much older than you, but when itcomes to technology, we might
as well be 300 years older thanyou, just because of like.
When we were at your positionin life, social media it existed
, but it wasn't the thing it istoday.
It wasn't a vehicle you coulduse to actually grow into

(31:19):
something like lucrative or away to even get students or so
like a tangentially lucrativeboth, I suppose.
So it wasn't talked about as aserious thing when we were like
the idea that it's being talkedabout in at a place like New
World.
I'm sure they talk about it atconservatories too to a certain
extent, and it's probably goingto only grow from here.

Speaker 3 (31:42):
Yeah, I think just now.
I think orchestras are startingto look at social media.
I know for a fact that the CEOof New World and in fact you can
see it in the New World'sposting cycle or a schedule,
where they're actually nowstarting to experiment.
They're starting to post morebecause they're realizing that

(32:04):
this is the easiest way to getyour craft, to get your
organization in front of as manyeyeballs as possible for free.
And I really love seeingorchestras post.
I don't care what the qualityor what the third take is or
whether or not it's optimizedfor the algorithm.
I love seeing them put theirstuff out there.

(32:25):
San Francisco Conservatory iskilling it on.
TikTok on Reels MinnesotaOrchestra is killing it right
now.
I'm seeing Boston Symphonystarting to do stuff.
I see New York Phil starting todo stuff and it's I love seeing
that and it's.
But it's something that's onlyjust starting to happen and I

(32:46):
think, like Nick said, likeeveryone in these orchestras
never grew up with social mediaor anything resembling it, and
so there's it's hard for theseorchestras still to promote
their orchestra because peopleare really they look at social
media.
I didn't even know likeprofessional string quartet
groups.

(33:06):
Like when I was at Norfolkthere was like some string
quartet groups that wereadamantly like we can't have
anything on social media unlessit's our best right, perfect
playing.
But social media isn't aboutthat.

Speaker 1 (33:18):
And so there's that disconnect.
They're treating it like likeit's like a recording, Exactly
yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yeah, it is tricky because a lot of the people that
run, say, a major orchestra.
They know their bread andbutter is their subscriber base,
which may be of an oldergeneration that may not use
social media as much, and sothey're like why should we
invest all this time in this forthese, maybe younger people

(33:44):
that might not show upconsistently or whatever.
But it's just again, you're,it's a free way to reach as many
eyeballs as possible.
I like the way you put that andmaybe you will develop a new
audience that you haven't.
My question is when did for you, when did this start becoming
like?
Because I knowing you, Iimagine I could have seen you

(34:04):
just starting to post funnyvideos because you enjoyed it.
I didn't think I.
I'm willing to guess that youdidn't just start out being like
.
I have a business plan and thisis how my TikTok will grow from
zero followers to bajillion.
When did it start being like?
Oh wow, I could actually dosomething with this.

Speaker 3 (34:21):
Well, it was December 2020 when I first started an
actual TikTok account andactually on the first video well
, second video, technically Iposted with me pranking my
friend with the straight muteduring the mall or two rehearsal
.
That was your second video.
That was my second video.

Speaker 1 (34:38):
I had no idea, I just I thought that was in the
middle of the pack.

Speaker 3 (34:43):
No like.
It was posted on Instagram andit got 700 views, some likes,
and I decided to repost it onTikTok because I was.
But the thing is I already havefunny videos like in my photos
library.
I already had some things toexperiment with and I always
knew in the back of my headpeople would tell me they would
go up to be.
You have a YouTuber personality.

(35:05):
That's how I feel around you.
Have you ever considered doinganything?
And I always say yes, but yada,yada, yada.
But because of pandemic I hadmore time, so I posted that
video me pranking my friend withthe straight mute and it got 3
million views, like within a fewdays.
And I was you're like what'sgoing on?
I the adrenaline that wentinside me.

(35:26):
And when I saw I was like areyou kidding me?
This is reaching this manypeople.
And then I posted meintroducing the orchestra at PMF
in Japanese, just as my nextvideo.
That got like 500,000 views andI'm like what the heck is going
on here?
And at that point, because Iknew I've always, almost
exclusively, consumed YouTubecontent, which I think gave me

(35:50):
the inclination and the know howto like how everything works a
little bit, so I just I juststarted making content and
following this one guy, robertBenjamin, on YouTube, who will
give you some like simple, cheaptricks on how to like and like
a schedule, like you got to beposting one to three times a day
and stuff like that.

(36:10):
So I just went gung ho becauseI had all this extra time and
that's when Nyan Cat started tohappen, where I just every day
played Nyan Cat a little bitfaster.
And that trend because at thispoint YouTube shorts was just
coming out and it was at thepoint where you couldn't just

(36:30):
hit, go to your phone and saycreate short, you have to put it
at a certain like.
Going to video editor, put itat a certain dimension and then
in the title and the description, right, hashtag shorts.
And if you didn't do that, itwould not count as a short.
And I remember this coming upand I was watching a gaming
channel and they were like I amabout to hack the algorithm.

(36:52):
If you have ever thought aboutbecoming a creator, this is the
single best time to do it,because YouTube is pushing
shorts like crazy.
And so I just went like crazyand so I put my Nyan Cat series
on YouTube shorts and thatresulted in about a week, me
getting 10,000 subscribers.
Yeah, I remember talking toRandy Haas during my

(37:13):
Northwestern lesson just beinglike, yeah, I just been playing
Nyan Cat.
And so for us old, what is NyanCat?
Okay, so it's a 2000 and one, Ithink, meme where it's a pop
tart cat farting rainbows.
It's just in the hat's ananimation on the screen and it's
just, it's a tune that goes.

Speaker 1 (37:33):
How do I remember that?
I remember hamsterdancecom.
That's way before your time.
Tim Sebastian knows what I'mtalking about.

Speaker 2 (37:40):
Usually Nick is very up to date with all the anything
relating to farting so that'strue.

Speaker 1 (37:45):
I consider myself a fartist.

Speaker 3 (37:48):
I love that, but yeah , it's a pop tart cat.
And I immediately moved on tothe Mario Cart lick after that
and people were fan of that andI think.
But the funny thing is it'slike at that time I still had
that.
I had that feeling everyoneelse has where I like I did not
post Instagram, I'm like I'm notgoing to tell people, I'm doing

(38:11):
this, I'm going to let peoplefind me because at that point
I'll probably already besuccessful and they'll have to
respect it a little bit, but I'mnot going to tell people.
And it took a lot of couragefor me to just be like, all
right, screw it, I'm postingInstagram.
And it took about a year sincethat point.
So I was doing YouTube andTikTok but I did not do
Instagram.
And then, after a year, when Iwas about to go to Music Academy

(38:32):
, I was like, all right, screwit, I'm just going to post all
my old content onto here that Iknow it does well Then.
So that's how I got establishedon all three platforms.

Speaker 2 (38:41):
Really I remember that because I remember like you
were doing all the tic-tacstuff and I'm like, oh, he's not
on Instagram.
And then you joined and we werefriends and you had just like
500 followers or something.
I'm like, oh, wow, it's justcompletely different platform.
And then it just shot up byposting all the same stuff and I
imagine there's a lot oftransference of people that
follow you on tic-tac, thatwould want to follow you on
Instagram.

Speaker 3 (39:03):
Yes, but they're actually like.
I find that they're completelydifferent ecosystems.
Some posts do incredibly wellon YouTube, but not well on
TikTok, and vice versa.
Like Instagram will doincredibly well for certain
reels and will really nuke someother reels For reasons I don't
understand, but I actually findthat these communities don't

(39:26):
really intermix too much.
There's people who follow me onall platforms, but I think
majority of people only see meon one platform.

Speaker 1 (39:35):
Right.
Well, I don't know if this istrue for you, but I know it's
true for you.
It's true for everyone todifferent degrees.
If you go around and ask agroup of 100 people, do you
watch all three platforms?
And they say yes, you have agroup of 100 people that say yes
, you're going to find thateveryone's going to have one
that they prefer the most, byprobably a large margin.

(39:57):
I know what I watch the most of.
Sebastian knows what I watchthe most of.
What does it go for it?
Tiktok, tiktok, for sure.

Speaker 2 (40:05):
It's a younger generation, right?
You give like a school concertin front of a group of like
elementary school kids andyou're like hey or middle school
kids.
You're like, raise your hand ifyou're on Facebook, and it's
like none of them, and thenraise your hand if you're on
Instagram, it's like some, andthen you ask about TikTok and
all their hands go up.

Speaker 1 (40:21):
Well, that's also an interesting thing right there,
sebastian, just saying who's on.
They could technically have anaccount, but consider themselves
not to be on Facebook.
Right, and that's part of theinteresting equation too, but
Facebook is definitely not evenin the conversation.
It's crazy, because theystarted the game.
Well, I've been.

Speaker 3 (40:40):
I have a Facebook too .
It's not as big of a following.
I don't know if you've seen it,but all I do is post memes
there and that's what resonatesmost, like my normal content
doesn't even trend as much, butwhen I post memes they're all
over, but there's like aFacebook shorts, right or reels
or something.

Speaker 2 (40:56):
What's it called?

Speaker 3 (40:57):
Yeah, there is, but I think it's a lot more cutthroat
.
I think actually like thepreview of your clip, like the
first three seconds where youcan actually see the real move a
little bit, actually dictatesmore how well your video is
going to do than the actualvideo itself and I think,
judging by like some of thecontent I post, it seems like

(41:18):
that's the case just because meplaying buckaroo holiday and
having the camera immediately goto someone cracking up.
I think that's why that's oneof the very few reels that
actually does really well on myFacebook channel and there's a
balance, right.

Speaker 2 (41:32):
I'd be curious what your inner dialogue is like,
because if you fully only thinkabout what is going to get the
most possible views ever, do youstart to lose what's the most
fun for you, like, say, you postsomething that you really love
and you had a ton of fun doing,and it gets barely any
engagement.
It's still fine, right.

Speaker 3 (41:53):
I'm so glad you asked that, because I'm actually I'm
right now I think I'm at thisfour-kno-road with where I can
take all my content and yetoptimizing for views is
definitely like a race to thebottom with yourself.
I mentioned.
This was like put this inreverse.
Every time one of those videosin the back of my mind, I'm like

(42:15):
this is so stupid, this is sodumb, but this does so well.
And I always, when Icollaborate with people, I
always want at least one videoto do well, so I use this as an
introductory.
Okay, let's get in front ofcamera.
That was super easy, right,let's do it.
Let's take another take, thenI'll post it and we'll get 11
million views on TikTok.
And I'm like, yeah, that soundsabout right and yeah, but in

(42:40):
the back of my mind, I trulywant to make more substantial
content and content that is lessof a cheap thrill for whichever
person stumbles upon my content, and I want it to be something
where it builds community butalso gets people hooked into

(43:01):
what I'm doing and have itconnect to more of my mission of
connecting the fine arts tomainstream media.
In the back of my mind, like Irecently did clapping music, but
I slapped the mouse pieceinstead.
I love that.
That did terribly.

Speaker 2 (43:16):
Oh, that's such a good idea.

Speaker 1 (43:18):
I like that yeah.

Speaker 3 (43:20):
I had so much fun doing that and I spent hours
making it.
I probably spent about six toeight hours like just moving
every tap to be something thatis rhythmically somewhat
recognizable, Cause it's reallyhard to and it hurt your hand
too.
Oh, my God, my pain.
You're probably bruised.
Yeah, I was.

Speaker 1 (43:40):
I'm like hitting the mouse piece over and over and
I'm like geez Well think abouthow much of your audience like
even if they're classicalmusicians knows what clapping
music is.
You know it's a niche piece fora niche, like an even smaller
niche audience, unfortunately.

Speaker 3 (43:59):
You're right, but it's on.
I saw a long form YouTube videoget three million views using
animation of notation and peopleseem to be really into it.
Now I do recognize that it'ssuper niche, so I was just
hoping that more people would beinterested in the just the

(44:19):
rhythm and all of it.
But it's just was something.
I spent eight hours making itand it got.
It was like on YouTube.
It ranks your videos how wellthey perform I don't know if
you're familiar and it was like10 out of 10.
It was the worst video you postin a while, got like 20K views,
which is, for me, it's justlike low, and so I'm like dang,
that's a bummer, youtube's justgive up, stop wasting our time.

(44:43):
Yeah, but then you postsomething like put this in
reverse takes two seconds, andthey're like we're gonna give
you 15 million views.
Also, every six months we'regonna just pump up this like you
count by another million andyou're gonna put in another
hundred bucks in your pocketjust like passively, and I'm
like, okay, sure, I'll sell mysoul a little bit just so I can

(45:05):
keep doing, keep taking risks inthese other adventures.
So I'm saying a lot, but yeah,it is like whenever you see me
do something that seems likeit's a really cheap and easy
video to make part of my soul'sdying for sure.

Speaker 2 (45:19):
Yeah, and also, if you put it in business terms,
you could argue you're in yourgrowth phase, like you're
building your core audience andthen, once you establish even
more of what you want, you cando more of what you want because
you've gained their trust in alot of ways.
But I always imagine like youget to a certain follower
account on YouTube and you juststart getting these like random

(45:41):
secret invitations to backalleys where there's some crazy
party behind golden doors and IfI had to any crazy parties
other than the how and horns.

Speaker 3 (45:50):
a little dinner, hey, we're gonna have them.
Yeah, we'll be there, but notyou, Nick.
Never, never, you're notinvited.
No, I do get a lot of scamemails and at first I almost
fell for one, but it's prettyeasy to suss them out and like
filter through all of that, andI was.
I'm fortunately in a positionthat I do occasionally get like

(46:11):
brand deals that are insanelylucrative.
I almost feel bad.

Speaker 2 (46:16):
You shouldn't you're helping, but you're helping them
Right.

Speaker 3 (46:20):
I just I'm like man.
It's just, I'm so grateful tobe doing what I'm doing and,
honestly, people tell me Ishould be getting paid more from
these brand deals.
But I just I'm like man.
I can't believe that I can justmake a video for one platform
that probably really doesn'teven matter, and the company is
just gonna pay for all of it.

(46:41):
And it's crazy where we live in.

Speaker 1 (46:43):
I've just been in a couple of videos with you.

Speaker 3 (46:48):
Yeah, and they did really well.
People loved you.

Speaker 1 (46:52):
I can act like a crazy conductor.
I'm pretty good at that andalso talking smack about trumpet
players is very natural for me.
That was one take, one take.
One take, that's what they callme.

Speaker 3 (47:06):
We're supposed to do another one in the future, so I
look forward to all of that.
We are Like we being me or youand oh well, brass, which I
thought was like.
I don't know if you.
I was told otherwise.

Speaker 1 (47:19):
The reason I say that is there is a world that Barb
Barb Josling came up to me andwas like, oh, we're gonna do
another video, Would you like tobe in it?
And I said sure, and absolutelyforgot.
So that's why I said it thatway, Cause there is a
possibility that I'm supposed tobe in it and I know about it
but forgot about it.

Speaker 3 (47:37):
Oh, it's okay, there's nothing planned out, but
we do want to get the Met Operaconductor involved and he's a
very busy man.

Speaker 1 (47:44):
That's that that you know, Yannick.
Oh, that one.
I thought you meant theconductor in the video, because
I was there.

Speaker 3 (47:49):
Oh well, you can also be Maestro.
We can have a battle of theMaestros.
How about?

Speaker 1 (47:52):
that I'll battle you.
I got size on them, that's forsure.

Speaker 3 (47:55):
Conductor versus conductor.
Exactly there we go.
Do it like street fighter style.
Oh, yeah, honestly, yeah, just,I can see a couple of like
conductor moves as like fightingmoves, almost like Harry Potter
, like there's like thingscoming out of the wand.
We have to do a Harry Potterthing.
Now that you said that,actually like I'll learn after
effects, I'll make somethinghappen.

Speaker 2 (48:17):
Use your bass drum.
I know didn't know if I wouldlove it.
Use your bass drum bone as abaton.

Speaker 1 (48:21):
Can you do the?
Can you do the the?
What do you call it?
The cheleste and not cheleste,so we call it, yeah, the
cheleste part from Harry Potter.
He played on the trombone, alllike the 32nd.
I was like oh.

Speaker 3 (48:35):
Well, actually I did that, but I tailed it with
Weezer at the end, so itmodulated the major key.

Speaker 2 (48:41):
Honestly, I did appreciate that, because not I
would guess that I was going toask you like, if you described
your core demographic likeslightly younger, like high,
would you say high school age, Ithink.

Speaker 3 (48:57):
I think the most enthusiastic group out there are
the younger kids, I think highschool, early college and middle
school, although when I look atstatistics, granted, it's easy
to, as a kid, have an parentalaccount and view stuff, but the
numbers tell me that about 50%are under the age of 23.
And then every the other 50% isactually older than that.

(49:20):
And I think it could either beparents watching or I do have
like a strong, likeinternational reach where I'll
get pockets of all throughoutthe world.

Speaker 2 (49:30):
Is there a random country that just is.
You can't.
If you step foot in thatcountry, they're just going to
go crazy.
Trombone Timo super fans.

Speaker 3 (49:38):
Maybe, like Spain or like the Philippines, let's go
on a trip, just see what happens.
You're going to.
You're going to see a TMEA.
How crazy it is, it's just likeout of this world.

Speaker 2 (49:53):
I'm excited we're going to have fun, what we can
do some weird there too.

Speaker 1 (49:57):
It's interesting.
Just again, we're not that mucholder than you but technology
wise, we were so much in adifferent world, at least like
where we were when you were.
We were your age.
There was just none of thishappening.
And Sarah Goldberg she workswith MAP at Julia Pre-College
and some of these kids when theysee her Sarah plays trombone on
.
Sarah plays trombone on yeah,sarah plays trombone exactly

(50:21):
they.
They have a little bit of starsyndrome when they see her.
And I would love for you tocome in, just randomly, come
into my brass class atPre-College.
I think some of these kidswould actually lose their damn
minds.

Speaker 3 (50:31):
I would love to make that happen.
Honestly, sarah and I were bothwe've attended the same string
quartet concert of all placesand that's where we like met and
I was like we're both just wait, are you?
Sarah plays trombone?
Wait, are you trombone, timo?
This is wild.
Like that even happens withlike other people in the
business, cause it's so small.
They're like oh my.

Speaker 2 (50:51):
God and you're like no, I actually have a real name.
It's team Exactly.
Yeah, throw them all off.
And yeah, I'm gonna have Tim'sgonna come talk to my Cleveland
Institute class, so that'll befun.
But yeah, I wanted to ask aboutthe well I was saying about
Weezer, which I very muchappreciated.
As someone who's grew up onthat those albums and like I've

(51:13):
seen them live, that was alittle nugget for us people and
our older millennials, as wejust-.

Speaker 3 (51:21):
Yeah, I actually when I did a sweet child of mine but
I like cut out every note and Iput the apple ear buds straight
up my bell.
That's when the older audienceslike they'll, like they see me
in person and they're like Ilove that.
That was amazing.
And that's not the one thatgets like a million views, but
that's like the one I guess thatdoes pretty well still and
that's the one that gets me thein person reaction, which is the

(51:42):
ones that I like the most, tobe honest.

Speaker 2 (51:45):
I think one of the first ones I saw was the Lizzo
one.
Can you cause it's so short,but can you explain the context
of like how that came to be?

Speaker 3 (51:53):
Oh my God.
So South by Southwest in Austin.
I was in Austin a couple ofyears ago and one of my
influencer friends I have twoinfluencers, friends that all
live in the same house in Boston, one's a fitness influencer and
one's a car influencer and theyjust came to South by Southwest
and these guys were justsneaking in to like essentially

(52:15):
every single event and they justbrought me along to this Lizzo
event.
Granted, I had a trombone on myback and security didn't even
really check for it.
I could have literally beenpacking heat, but I was just
packing a trombone.

Speaker 2 (52:28):
Hey, you were packing heat.

Speaker 3 (52:29):
Yeah, you were.
Yeah, once Lizzo heard thatslick trombone playing.
But there was a huge line tomeet for Lizzo at this
conference.
There was like there's so manyconference rooms with people
coming in doing their chat andwe just snuck right into the
Lizzo one.
We bypassed the entire line assoon as the event before
concluded.
We just intermingled with allthe people that were leaving and

(52:52):
then just walked right in.
I didn't even know who Lizzo wasand knew she played the flute.
That's the one thing I had.
I've seen her play the fluteand I'm like huh, there might be
some potential here.
But my friends were doing avideo on their own channel and
they really wanted to meet Lizzoor at least get a picture with
her.
So after the event they walkedup and they were trying to get

(53:15):
her attention.
Lizzo, lizzo, picture she getsa million of those.
So she wasn't paying attentionto those guys and at a certain
point I was just like screw it,I'm taking out my trombone and I
just hold a trombone reallyhigh in the sky and I'm like
Lizzo, it's a trombone.
And she was like surprised.
But then she was just like playsomething Meanwhile, like the

(53:35):
security guards are like glaringdown Like this was like a huge
security issue and I proceededto play Timmy trumpet, but I
completely whiffed the firstnote and it was probably the
worst performance on a trombone.
I didn't even know what I wasgonna play you had the spirit,
though I had no idea what I wasgonna play.
In fact, the second song, thedo-dee I don't even know what

(53:56):
it's called do-dee.
I didn't even know the notes tothat.
So, like in the audience, I'mlike if I'm gonna play for her,
I need to know these notes andI'm like how do you figure it
out somehow?
And yeah, that happened.
And then afterwards my friendswere like ecstatic and we got
the picture with Lizzo and butyeah, it was like the most ram
thing that ever happened in mylife.
And I got on Lizzo's TikTokactually that's amazing With

(54:18):
that.
That was pretty cool.

Speaker 2 (54:21):
So right before you're like, oh shit, maybe
she'll want me to play something, you just like, in your head
you were like I'll play this andyou just figured it out real
quick.

Speaker 3 (54:27):
Yeah, that TikTok brand, I'm like all right,
what's like a easy hit.
And she started getting down,started dancing to it, which I
appreciated, but yeah, that wasthe sloppiest performance.

Speaker 2 (54:37):
I felt so bad.
Oh, come on, come on, that's aperfect example.
It doesn't matter, it was likethe spirit of it, right?

Speaker 1 (54:45):
Whatever she was like play a Lizzo deep.
Cut no A side don't make theseslides.

Speaker 3 (54:51):
I didn't know any list of songs Exactly, so I'm
like what am I doing here?

Speaker 2 (54:57):
And what if your friend didn't videotape it?
Would your social media heartjust melt?

Speaker 3 (55:01):
Oh, that well, some.
Luckily there was a bunch ofpeople's cameras there, so like
I would have gone in the video.
But yeah, there are momentswhere I wish there was a camera
on for sure, and I always thinkabout them and they haunt me to
this day.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
Just don't turn to one of those people that what do
you call them, the streamers?
That, like literally your 24seven, just walk around with
higher else?
Yeah, oh my God, that's a deep,that's a deep cavern, you
should jump on the bandwagon ofdoing NPCs.

Speaker 3 (55:29):
Well, I actually really love NPC TikTok Really
yeah.

Speaker 1 (55:34):
So cringy.
Well, guys, I mean nuts, what'sNBC?
It's just fun.
What is that?
Someone, non playable character.

Speaker 2 (55:43):
Oh yeah, oh, those are awesome.
I like those.

Speaker 1 (55:46):
Yeah, thank you for the glusy.
Thank you for the glusy.

Speaker 3 (55:50):
Oh, not.
Oh, I'm not thinking of thelive streams.
I was thinking of like you runinto a Skyrim character and
they're just like mouthing words, and then there's text that
comes up.

Speaker 1 (55:59):
Oh, that's a whole different thing.
I'm talking about the livestreamers.

Speaker 2 (56:02):
Oh, the people that like pay money and they have to
react in the moment.
That's so cringy.

Speaker 3 (56:07):
I had a streaming arrow and I got bored, so I just
committed to one of those, andit did pay more, for sure, but
at the cost of your soul.
So, like we said, there you go.

Speaker 2 (56:18):
Hey Nick, do you want me to ask Tim a quick core
question?

Speaker 1 (56:20):
Quick core.

Speaker 2 (56:22):
Are you familiar with our core series?

Speaker 3 (56:25):
No, I haven't heard.

Speaker 2 (56:26):
Okay.
So on this new fifth position,casual whatever, this podcast is
so core.
You can just ask any questionon the internet to the world
that you're wondering, and so Ijust did some deep dive searches
on core questions involving thetrombone.
So here's the newest one Ifound.
I'm not sure who this is from.

(56:47):
Is there any way to play thetrombone high notes easily?
My friend says it's easy, youjust have to blow it.
That's what I'm doing, andstill, comma, it makes that
quacking noise.
It's not the trombone, it's mylips.

Speaker 3 (57:03):
That's a very correct assessment, because I was going
to say if you're sucking athigh notes, just take the
mouthpiece out of the instrumentand just buzz it Like you're
probably buzzing the wrong pitch.
I guarantee you're buzzing thewrong pitch and even if you are
playing the right pitch, there'sa way to play it really well
and there's a way to play itwhere you're just like doing

(57:25):
whatever and it's usually itgoes sharp.
Try to be flat.
I dare you.

Speaker 1 (57:30):
I dare you?
You answered that moreseriously than I thought you
would, I suppose.

Speaker 3 (57:35):
Yeah, see, this is the difficult things.
I'm really goofy, but then whenI get to lessons I'm like no,
like I'm very hard, and I getreally into it seriously, no, I
meant not because of who you are, but because that question was
so ridiculous.
Oh well yeah.

Speaker 2 (57:52):
My favorite is the first sentence that says is
there any way to play thetrombone high notes easily?
That's always like fifthgraders you just have to blow it
.
Yeah, the quacking noise isprobably not what you want.
But then he answers his ownquestion it's not the trombone,
it's my lips.
Yeah, exactly, thank you foryour lips.
Well, we solved that, quora.
Put it on the board.

(58:13):
Do you find it difficult tobalance?
Because you're getting is it acertificate or a doctor to yell
right now.

Speaker 3 (58:19):
It's.
They call it an MMA, which isMaster of Musical Arts, mixed
martial arts.

Speaker 2 (58:25):
Yes, exactly that is yeah.
We did talk about how thetrombone can be in a weapon.
So is it hard to?
Because I can't imagine.
I imagine some of these TikTokvideos you can just rattle off
real quick, but some take someplanning and a lot of editing.
Is it tough balancing being astudent?

Speaker 3 (58:42):
It's really tough.
Honestly, the toughest part, Ithink, is just because I'm going
to school, because I wasn'treally happy with my trombone
playing and I spent hourspracticing but making content
that distracts from the journey,from the process, and it drains
your chops and it drains your,drains you mentally.

(59:05):
And it's also hard becauseeveryone you shouldn't think
like this, but you can't helpbut think like this because what
you do is very public, thatyour friends are going to be
watching and you're going to besurrounded in a community of
people who all know who you areand will make remarks or remind
you that you're doing socialmedia.

(59:26):
So you're, you get in thisheadspace where you're like, you
feel like there's a lot ofpressure to to make something
out of your playing, to makesomething out of your craft, to
and just to like actually be apositive influence and not
something that everyone is justis hating.
So, yeah, it's hard.

Speaker 2 (59:47):
Who knew Tim was so deep?
Nick, I know you didn't think Iwas deep.
Hey, no, I didn't know, not atall.
Well, I have thought that aboutyou.
I was like because I alwaysheard the talent and you're
you're always just very outgoingand funny on stage, but I knew
there was a layer underneath allthat where you're very
thoughtful and I feel like noteveryone gets to see that part

(01:00:09):
of you.
So that's why podcasts aregreat.

Speaker 3 (01:00:12):
Yeah, well, I really appreciate being on here and
this has been a really fun timefor me.
Yeah, man, more of these if Iget invited or whatever, we'll
have you back.

Speaker 2 (01:00:20):
We see that that's our thing is figuring out how to
do this more, because the wholeword feed the beast right that
when you have an audience andthey want to hear things, it's
yeah, we also have.
I have six other jobs that I'mtrying to keep happy and I would
love to do this all the time.
I would love to let people helpme do it more.
I would love to post more onsocial media.

(01:00:41):
I just it's.
That's the challenge.

Speaker 1 (01:00:44):
If you feed the beast , you can be the feed.

Speaker 3 (01:00:47):
See when you have coworkers like that and you
should start a profile, nickI'll subscribe.

Speaker 2 (01:00:52):
Should we have a tick tock?
Should we have a tromboneretreat tick tock.

Speaker 1 (01:00:56):
The Sebastian.
Yeah, there's no way we shouldhave a trombone retreat tick
tock.
Why We'll do one video everysix months.

Speaker 2 (01:01:06):
Well, that's well, we can just hire someone Well let
me just say that convinced mewith Norfolk.

Speaker 3 (01:01:12):
Ok, here's the thing People don't realize you have an
archive of all the performancesand whatnot that you've done,
ok, so.
So with Norfolk, I got themfrom 500 subscribers to 7500
subscribers just by using oldfootage from their concerts and

(01:01:33):
I use more popular, morerecognizable tunes that would
catch the algorithm, because atfirst the hardest part is
getting that following at first,and then, when you start
posting other stuff thatdeviates from, say, vivaldi
people, all of a sudden you'regetting like tens of thousands
of views on really niche concertpieces that really no one has

(01:01:55):
heard of.
And yeah, I strongly like youcan.
Actually, you don't even needto make stuff.
You are probably alreadysitting on a treasure trove.
A lot of clipable movement,clipable moments, and it's just
like a matter of knowing whichones.
Even like you have probably away more, and this is what I'm
thinking about with all theseorchestras too and everything

(01:02:16):
I'm like.
You guys have all the footageand stuff and that could just be
like your foot in the door andthat's what can get you started
and then you can start creatingcontent.
That's also fun and you can.
Honestly, some of these peoplelike me like in one or two hours
I can get I don't know 10 to 20videos if I really put my mind
to it.
So like there is so long aseveryone gets together in one

(01:02:40):
spot at one point and they do itbanging out real quick.
But it's like the idea isalready set.
It's game over it usually doespretty well.

Speaker 2 (01:02:48):
Have you seen these new AI programs that will like
you, just upload all your videoand they'll just come up with
all these clips for you.

Speaker 3 (01:02:56):
No, is this for podcasting?

Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
Yeah, or just like whatever content you make and
I'm just like that's tempting,but I don't know, I'm skeptical,
but it'd be so nice if it comesup with headlines for you.
It comes up with it, optimizesit for every social media and it
comes up with like captions andman that is sexy.

Speaker 3 (01:03:16):
That's really interesting.
I like using AI subtitles, butI don't never had AI go to next
step.
I think that's more forpodcasts too, but that could be.

Speaker 2 (01:03:27):
I started using AI subtitles just for fun for some
of these podcasts and the viewswithin the first 24 hours
doubled.
It was hilarious.

Speaker 3 (01:03:39):
It's the algorithms, very basic and simple stuff like
that will be the difference ofa thousand and a hundred
thousand views.
It's just OK.

Speaker 2 (01:03:49):
OK, well, thanks for hanging out.
This was super fun.
Thanks for having me, Nick.
Is there anything that youwould want to say that we think
we got it.

Speaker 1 (01:03:59):
I think we got it all wrapped in there somehow into a
tight hour and 15.

Speaker 2 (01:04:04):
I can tell when Nick is done talking, he'll just
start looking at me and notsaying anything, so that can
mean a lot of things Right now.

Speaker 1 (01:04:12):
it means maybe I should have skipped that last
drink last night.
Usually most will slow.

Speaker 2 (01:04:19):
Most podcasts end with Nick being like guys.
I got to go number two in hisbath.
I mean, every meeting I'm aregular guy.
God, I was texting Tim.
I destroyed the Yale bathroom,by the way, oh my God.

Speaker 1 (01:04:35):
He told.
He told me that you told methat after I was done rehearsing
with Daniela, You're like I'mreally glad you rehearsed first.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:04:45):
Yeah, what we have, we had, we did.
We will try to get some NewHaven pizza.
And I don't like every place.
It was like Sunday brunch time,so every place was crowded.
Nick was mad that we had to goto a not popular place and then
he ordered pizza and it was likenot real pizza and there's
terrible.

Speaker 3 (01:05:02):
I'm so sorry.
Yeah, it's terrible.

Speaker 1 (01:05:06):
It's OK, I'll live.
Everybody, I'll live.

Speaker 2 (01:05:10):
So Tim and I will be at TMEA in San Antonio February
7th through 9th at the HoughtonHorns table.
Come say hi, I believe you'llbe there representing Brasswich.
Yes, cool, and I'll bereleasing my first, very limited
batch JSV tender trombonemouthpieces.
I've been working on them foralmost two years, tested by

(01:05:31):
world class trombonists in everyimaginal scenario.
I think they're magical Purityof sound, incredible response
and articulation.
We were searching for the HolyGrail of rich overtones, ring
and sweetness, paired with depthof sound, and we found it's
available for preorder atHoughtonHornscom February 1st.
But yeah, if you guys arearound TMEA, if you're not
familiar with TMEA Texas MusicEducators Association Convention

(01:05:53):
it's the biggest musicconvention basically in the
country.
It's bigger than Midwest.
It's insanity.
I'm really excited because thelast time I went I was like an
all stator in Texas and Ihaven't got to go as an adult.

Speaker 1 (01:06:06):
You had a full brain of hope and a full head of hair.

Speaker 2 (01:06:09):
Yeah, yeah, everything was fine back then.
Yeah, and just to remind you,the third coast trombone retreat
is happening this summer, june4th through 10th, with
international duo Peter Steinerand Constanza Huckvortner Did I
say that her last name right?
I hope so.
You said something and newlytenured principal trombonist of

(01:06:30):
the Cleveland Orchestra, brianWendell.
Final application deadline isApril 1st.
Visit tromboneretreatcom foreverything you need to know.
Trombone TMEA is the tromboneretreat, so that's all you
really need If you enjoy thepodcast, tell a friend subscribe
everywhere you listen topodcasts.
Follow us at trombone retreat onall the social medias and our
website tromboneretreatcom,where you can join our mailing

(01:06:52):
list.
Follow Nick at base trombone444and myself at jsvera on the
Instagrams and followtromboneTEMO.
See, he's smart, he's justtrombone TEMO everywhere.
Yeah, so it sounds liketrombone TEMO.
So if you can't spell that,then you're probably just gonna
not ever find them.

Speaker 3 (01:07:12):
Nope, nope, and that's okay because I'll find.

Speaker 2 (01:07:15):
You're not wrong, though.
Your videos will just appear.
Yeah, you've mastered thealgorithm.

Speaker 1 (01:07:20):
Yeah, okay, man.

Speaker 2 (01:07:21):
Shanyon poster.
We are, they just got toPittsburgh, hell yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:07:26):
Happy phone, oh the happy well ding ding.
Happy orchestra, oh yeah, doyou?

Speaker 2 (01:07:30):
remember that oh man Musical chairs was like.
What on earth is this?

Speaker 3 (01:07:34):
I might apply for that.
Yeah, happy orchestra room.

Speaker 2 (01:07:36):
The social media possibilities are incredible
there, though.

Speaker 3 (01:07:40):
I know.
I just I hope they have anotheropening very soon, if they
don't have one already.

Speaker 2 (01:07:46):
Awesome.
Well, we are proud of you, tim,and we look forward to hanging
out more, and I'll see you ingosh in a couple weeks.

Speaker 3 (01:07:53):
Yeah, well, thank you for having me.
This has been a lot of fun.

Speaker 2 (01:07:56):
So what I'm going to do is I'm going to act like your
bouncer and I'll be like oh, ifyou'd like a photo and
autograph with Tim, you have tobuy a mouthpiece first.

Speaker 1 (01:08:04):
Okay, I like that.
Yeah, exactly, well, thank youvery much.
Thank you very much.

Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
Please be patient.

Speaker 3 (01:08:14):
Oh, you're going to clip this and I'm going to get
canceled.
I did introduce myself inJapanese on one of my PMF tapes,
so that was good.

Speaker 2 (01:08:22):
Oh, did that help, we got it.

Speaker 3 (01:08:25):
Yeah, I don't know if it helped, but All right, dude.

Speaker 2 (01:08:29):
Well, I'll talk to you soon.

Speaker 1 (01:08:31):
Smash that button so we can stop it.

Speaker 3 (01:08:33):
Smash that subscribe button, hit that follow button.
That's a real pro saying that.
Well, that's a real pro sayingthat.